Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Reacting to the Washington Football Team Harassment Story and the Response to Nick Cannon

Episode Date: July 17, 2020

Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay discuss Nick Cannon’s anti-Semitic comments and the reactions to them (1:20), the Washington Post story on the sexual harassment within the Washington football organization (35:42), the news that Tory Lanez allegedly shot Megan Thee Stallion (49:53), and Tucker Carlson’s head writer being outed as a racist (1:03:20). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Manage your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions applies. See terms at Fandul.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash terms. Yo, yo, yo, yo. Welcome, Thought Warriors. Put your thing caps on. It's time for higher learning.

I am Van Lathen. And I'm Rachel Lindsay. Rachel, you got, you look like your camera ready today. I'm noticing that, like, you're, you know, you got a little bit more going on up there with the makeup situation. Is that a compliment? I'm going to take it as a compliment. Thank you very much. I did have to do an interview on camera today.

So you did an interview on camera. It's interesting. And you got all done up for the interview. Okay. But we do this podcast and you really, you don't get what's the difference, I guess. Well, don't you think it's a vibe? Like when I come, that was for extra TV. So that's going to be on TV.

So I needed to be. You like how to put that in there? Yeah, it's great. You're doing big things. You know, you and Andy Cohen, the extra TV. You're doing a lot of big things. No, thank you. Oh, yeah, go ahead.

So that's going to be on TV. I needed the lashes. I needed a little bit of a jush on my face. When we do this podcast, we're chilling, we're relaxed. It's got that at-home feel. We want people to feel like they're sitting at the table with us at home, having a good old time. Listen, there's no easy way to get into the first topic. There's not.

There's no easy way to discuss this. There's no easy way to talk about this because this is a multi-layered discussion. that has to do with history, the future, the present, things that are true, things that aren't true, and what sort of happens when we wait into the meeting, the delta of all of those different rivers. We are talking about Nick Cannon. And this was a topic that you guys, and we really appreciate when you guys jump into the DMs. I know. It's very, I enjoy it.

We appreciate when you guys jump into the DMs and give us things to talk about and tell us what you would like to hear us discuss. And obviously, Nick Cannon's entire situation was at the top of the list. Quick recap. Nick Cannon, a couple of weeks ago on his podcast, Cannon's class, did an interview with a gentleman that I know as Professor Griff. Now, if you don't know what Professor Griff is, he was a member of Public Enemy in the early mid-90s.

I'm not sure exactly at what point. He was in public. enemy, but at one point, Professor Griff was kicked out of public enemy or removed from public enemy or left public enemy because he had made some statements that people thought were a little bit too hot. He had made some statements that were deemed anti-Semitic. And Chuck and Flav were like, were done. Professor Griff maintained sort of a reputation as a scholar on racial issues, and as sort of one of the guys that you would go to and talk to if you are of a certain mind talking about racial conspiracies, political conspiracies,

things of that nature. Nick had Professor Griff on the podcast, and there was some talk on there that was pretty indefensible. Okay. They specifically got into what Nick Cannon said at that time he felt like were the innate differences between black people and white people. He seemed to intimate, didn't seem to intimate. He said that our melanaded skin is black people gave us an extra added dose of compassion and humanity that white people are lacking. And he gave what he feels

like are historical reasons, culturally historical reasons why that happened. We mentioned the caucus mountains, all kinds of things. He also made statements during that that talked about, you know, some tropes involving Jewish people, of course, invoking the Rothschilds and talking about centralized banking and things like that, that have offended a great many people in the Jewish community and made them feel as if Nick Cannon is an anti-Semite. This is on the hills of the controversies surrounding Deshaun Jackson and Stephen Jackson last week. Now, we could play the sound of Nick Cannon, but I don't think we're going to do that. Yeah. I think that most people that are tuning in and listening to us right now know what was said. The question is, now that Nick Cannon has, well, we should say also, following that, Nick Cannon, who does Wiling Out on MTV, which is a part of CBS Viacom, was fired from CBS Viacom.

all sort of involvement with them is done, at least as of now. So that means that Wailing Out, which he apparently doesn't own, now will either die or move forward without Nick Cannon. And he was also involved in Nickelodeon because he had been a big part of Nickelodeon. That's all gone. All those things are gone. Initially, Nick offered up what some people thought was a half-hearted apology, but then also demanded ownership of Wile and Out. It seemed like he was trying to stand on something. And that's not to say that he's not standing on anything now,

but it is to say that now he's offered several way more deep. And I would say contrite apologies. Yeah. All over his Twitter. Now, because of this, I feel like because of those apologies, Nick Cannon has not lost his job with Fox as the executive producer and host the mass singer. They announced that he will be back. And he has taken a little time away from his radio show.

That's what he said today, which he has a radio show out here in Los Angeles, in order to kind of do the research and the learning that he feels like he needs to do. And he has what he says is a lot of help from the Jewish community while he is doing this. That is the whole spiel. That is everything. What are your thoughts on all of this? So I see a theme here when it comes. of these celebrities who are or sports figures who are speaking out and saying things that are

anti-Semitic. And when they say it, they say it with their whole chest and then they come back when they start to retract these statements when they get the backlash. And what seems to be in every single one of their apologies or their statements is that they didn't know, they need to do more research, they didn't understand it. That is the problem, and that's a theme that we're seeing with all of them. And I'll be honest when I think, and this can go towards anything. If you don't grow up around a certain culture, around a certain environment, if you're not surrounded by those type of people, then it can be, you have to go out and seek that information

to understand it. I didn't grow up in a Jewish community. I didn't grow up around Jewish friends. I didn't go to high school, to college with them. And they really weren't in my work environment either. So there's a level of understanding that I didn't have before all of this that I do now. And that is because I've seen what's happened and I've done the research and I've tried to understand what it means to make anti-Semitic comments. What anti-Semitism means.

I don't think people who come maybe from the same background that I did. understand what that means without doing the proper research. So when you think of saying things that are detrimental to Jewish people, you think of in grander terms of, oh, don't say anything about the Holocaust or anything in regards to that. But it's much bigger than that. It cast a wider net. And I would suggest that everyone go to the Anti-Defamation League website and read the definition of anti-Semitism. And then you understand why reckless terms like this, why stereotypes that are used against Jewish people are anti-Semitic. And it's really important that we educate ourselves and understand that. And that's for any culture. Before you speak, especially when you have such big

platforms, don't do so carelessly because you perpetuate this thinking that people may have against a certain group of people, and it's wrong. It is absolutely wrong. And what Nick Cannon said is wrong, and we have to hold him accountable, and we have to hold these other celebrities accountable for their reckless actions. I'm not saying don't forgive them. I'm not saying people can't change. I'm not saying don't accept their apologies, because I do believe that Nick Cannon's last apology was very sincere. But the theme and the common denominator is the lack of knowledge. So don't say with your whole chest, something that you haven't even researched. And as we talked about on the last episode, we live in an error where people don't research and figure things out on their own.

They take a headline, they take a tweet, they take a post, and they take that as fact. Don't even take what I'm saying as fact. Go out and research it for yourself. That's my take. Yeah. So there's a couple of things here that I want to discuss as it relates to the Nick Cannon situation. And then I want to talk directly to the listeners that we have that might be Jewish. after that. I remember when I was a kid, I was maybe like the sixth or seventh grade, Rachel Shapiro was writing on the, on the blackboard. And she was writing something. I can't remember what it was that we were reading. And she was writing on the blackboard and she wrote the name of God. But she didn't write God. She wrote G underscore and then she wrote D. And I'm like,

like what's going on? And Jason Cuncelor, who was in class. with me, it was like, well, Rachel can't write the name of God like that. She can't do that. Now, that was the first time that I realized what it actually meant to have a cultural difference with someone. Meaning, even though I understood that I went to my mother's Baptist church and my father's Catholic church and there were different customs, it was the same Jesus. and when they would explain to me what the differences were, my mom would just be like, your dad and them are into some weird stuff.

They like to get up early in worship Jesus. We like to do it at 11 a.m. And that's what she would say. She would be like, they like to kneel. We like to sing. It's the same thing. Don't spend too much time on it. But like as I got to know people,

like around the time that I was like 12 or 13, these guys who were in my classes with me, they started to give our mitzvah. And I remember going to bar mitzvahs and seeing what was going on and then actually going back to my house and being like, yo, I don't know if you know, but when they turn 13, like the city stops and they have a gigantic party. And all I got was a fucking football. Is there some way that we can like maybe get on par? You know what I mean? So I say all that to say that there was an understanding that came along to your point with sort of growing up with some of those kids and being around them all the way up and through high school and then actually even all the way up into working at TMZ around Harvey and Evan and all those guys.

And there was an understanding that of what a horrific thing the Holocaust was. I'm going to speak specifically to the Holocaust as it relates to what Nick Cannon said and the reasons because of it. When you start talking about and talking and speaking in certain tropes against Jewish people, remember now that these things are very real things that have been used to kill millions of them. Right. And to wipe out entire families and to starve people and to put people in ovens and all of those things like that. So I understand the sensitivity and I understand how the lessons learned from what happened then and what happened in the past and pogroms all over the world and situations like that is like we have to stamp this talk out early. Yeah. See I'm saying? So like as soon as we hear it, we got to come down on top of it, cut its head off because we, the talk.

that might have started in Germany somewhere in 27 or 28 or 29. That then leads to a guy taking hold in 33. That then leads to that same guy turning an entire nation against one group of people. You know what I mean? And convincing an entire nation that we'd be better off if we exterminated these people, worked them to death, starved them to death, and then things like that would happen. So that's kind of, and I say that not just, I say that to the, to the brothers and sisters that might be listening to this and might go,

why are they going so hard on Nick Cannon? Like, even if he is wrong, there's no hate in his heart. Well, the reason why they're going so hard on Nick Cannon is because it feels like the beginning of something if you really listen to what it is that he was saying. Yeah, no, I mean, I think you have to go hard because even though somebody doesn't have hate, doesn't mean that it's not problematic. That's not, it's not dangerous. Right.

And in light of all this other, talk that's going on. And let's be honest, since the Trump administration, we've seen more attacks on Jewish people than we have in a long time. And so it's very important that you nip it in the bud. You can't let this float out and permeate into the atmosphere. You have to nip this now. And also, I don't, I don't want to say that, I don't want to say that Nick Cannon was made an example out of because he wasn't, he did something wrong and it needed to be addressed. And I think that That's what a lot of, like you're saying, when you don't want our black brothers and sisters who are listening to say something, I think that's what a lot of them think this as, that, oh, they're making an example out of him. No, it's not the case.

You need to understand that what he did was wrong. It's a problem. And like you said, you have to cut it off when it starts. Now, like I've interviewed Nick Cannon before. I know Nick Cannon. I believe Nick Cannon would be a good dude. not believe Nick Cannon be a good dude Nick Cannon is a good dude

Yes There is there is There is there is danger in the words that were spoken Especially when you start talking about what people have Inside of them in Aitly So remember that eugenics and all of those things like that Were things that have been that used That were used to subjugate control and kill black people

I was just about to say that yes So when you start talking about Whether or not a people are basically at their core servile or subhuman or stupid those are excuses that were used

historically to keep us in chains, to rape us, to kill us, to do all of these things, right? I do want to say something else, though, to people who might be looking at the response of the black community to this, large parts of the black

community, not the entire black community, it might be confused as to why there seems to be so much support for Nick Cannon. There's a reason why. Have you seen this? Have you seen the support, Rachel? I've seen more support than anything else. Right.

From black people. I've seen, and I'm not just talking about public figures. I'm just talking about just black people. Yes, I've seen a lot of support. Why? Why do you think that is? I don't know. And I mean, I can guess because a part of me is I don't understand why we get it, why they're giving him support.

But then the other part of me is like, is it like an OJ? When OJ was going for trial and he had been charged for murder, it was if you watch the documentary, the five-part documentary that ESPN does, or not even that. Well, that plus the O.J. Simpson versus the people, or the people versus O.J. Simpson, excuse me, you see that he was never going to be convicted by black people. They were never going to let it happen to him because of what had been happening in L.A. because of the young lady who was shot by the Korean woman in the store. Natasha Harlins. Thank you. They were never going to let them take, and by them, I mean, you know, non-Blacks, take another one of their black figures. So when I look at what's happening with Nick Cannon, I guess I would apply that same thought. It seems to me that that's why people are doing that because Nick Cannon is such a big force in the black community. And you've seen him from a kid to now, not only as a super talented person, but also give back to the black community and also really create jobs for the black community as far as the outlets that he's created. with his talents.

And so I think that there is this, it's innately within black people to protect our own. Because if we don't look out for ourselves, who's going to look out for us? So I think that's what the response is. I said I didn't know and then I just gave a whole thing. So I guess that is what I feel.

The reason why I asked you is because you do know and you know that innately and you know that because there's something, there's lost trauma, right? I grew up in a place to where you can look around you and see people wasting potential. Like you can look around you to the left, to the right, your uncles, all these people, right, wasting potential.

Then what happens when one person manages to get to where you feel like they should have went? What the neighborhood instinctively does when there's a good basketball player or kid that's really, it was done to me is, yo, get out of here. stop doing this, stay away from this, go someplace where you can make good on what you've been given. And when black people, black men specifically get to a certain perch, it's difficult to watch them fall. Because you've seen the fall so many times before they got there. And also, we know so much of what's been done to black people in this country has been intentional that there's a part of you that whenever a black man falls, you feel like there are

forces that are working against him purposely. Yeah. To marginalize or undercut his influence, especially if that black man is too good to black people. It seems like a weird and peculiar consequence to black people, excuse me, not consequence, a weird and peculiar coincidence to black people, sometimes, some black people, I'm not speaking for all of us, that a black man gets to a certain perch and he seems to almost always have issues, the harder and the more pro-black he becomes. So we start to feel like, okay,

we're waiting for them to take a shot at him. We're waiting. And a lot of people might, a lot of people listen to this and going, y'all feel like this about Nick Cannon, really? America's Got Talent and the Masked Singer and you guys feel like it's a way that you're like, when you hear the statements, you know that you can't defend them.

You know you got to condemn them. but at the same time you're like, damn, Nick, why are you putting us in this position? Yeah. Because we want you out here and we need you out here because we need all of us out here. And we're back in this spot of emotionally, politically, and intellectually having to get into conversations that, no, we really shouldn't be having to get into. And I think that the lesson to be learned is something's, Sonny Hosten said, they might have been talking about Nick Cannon. I don't remember who they were talking about on The View, but this whole cancel culture

doesn't mean that, okay, Nick, Nick Cannon did something absolutely wrong. And he should be reprimanded for that. And he was by CBS, Biacom, CBS, let him go completely. But does that mean that we cancel him completely? No. It means that you hold him accountable. That's what Sunny said. There should be accountability culture, not cancel culture.

So you hold him accountable for what he said. And Viacom has done that. But does that mean that we should cancel him, period, on every single thing that he's done? No, because this is a man who made a mistake and now he's recognizing it. But we have to hold him accountable for that, and we are. But that doesn't mean that we forget him and every single thing that he's done at the same time. Yeah. Now, listen, once again, you know, and remember,

if you're listening to this, and it's not easy, right? It's not easy to hear us talk about this and for seemingly us to give Nick Cannon a soft bed to land on. I'll put it to you like this. A lot of the pain that the people in my community, black people have felt over a long time, it doesn't feel like there's any allies. It feels like we're begging for people

and you get different groups, including the Jewish community, to say, hey, you know, there have been times, a lot of times when we've been out there with you. They have. Well, like, we've been out there with you. Well, we've been out there with you down in Mississippi. Some Jewish students lost their lives doing good work. You know, we've been there with you. But there seems to be a point specifically after the civil rights movement where black Americans,

remember all of the leaders that we had that were going to take us into the next phase of this thing. Dr. King's, Malcolm X's, Megra Evers, you know, Dr. King was going to turn his attention away from specific civil rights to the economic plight of the poor people of America. And that is specifically when they got Dr. King out of here. Yeah, that's about to say that. But, you know, after that, in heroin in the 70s, in the pimping culture, and then crack, which by the way, the U.S. government had a part in putting crack

that is actually not a conspiracy theory, that is reality, and putting crack in Los Angeles neighborhoods. And there doesn't seem like there's been anybody there for us. And so what we've been told and what we've been telling each other is, okay, since there's no one that is going to make things easier on us economically, politically or socially in a systemic way, then what we have to do is make sure that right or wrong, we take care of one another.

And then that butts up against sometimes the morality or the immorality of things that happen. When you hear people sometimes defend specific rap lyrics that obviously have a ton of degradation in them and all types of stuff like that. Or defend other mistakes that guys have made. It's because it's just hard for us to throw away successful people because there's such scarcity of them. them. And we love these people. So I don't want anyone to feel alienated by the response that they've heard, although I know it can be alienating. I want everyone to try to understand what's really happening right now. And I think that's a really good point. And I don't think if you listen to the way that we talked about this subject, which as you pointed out, is not easy.

What this podcast is about is about learning. We call you Thought Warriors. And the point is, of course we are condemning Nick Cannon for what he said and admit, because it is, anti-Semitism in the way that he conducted himself in that podcast. But the point also of this podcast is to give you the perspective of black people. And it's more of an understanding as to how black people think and to understand the response in a situation like this with Nick Cannon than it is more than anything else. It's not a defense. It's a level of understanding. And if you're tuning into this podcast, that's what we hope to give you. It is about the black culture. So why would, if you're tuning in, it's an opportunity for you to understand why black people think the way

that they do. Same way that if we're trying to understand a level of what it is that Jewish people go through, I wouldn't look at it as you being defensive. I would look at it as, okay, they're trying to get me to understand their perspective as a Jewish person. No, I mean, look, everyone, there's something that Americans don't do enough. And people don't do it enough because it's hard to do. It's called pain investment. Payne investment. Okay. So when I was a bigger guy,

right? When I was a bigger guy, like my friends would crack jokes. Crack a lot of jokes. I, you know, crack jokes and get off on me and shit like that. It's all kinds of jokes. The jokes never stopped. Care to share a few? I never told the, I never told

the story about the girl and when we were driving in New Orleans and stuff. I never told you that story? No, you did not. Oh, quick story. Quick story. Sidebar, guys. Quick story.

This is how hard it was to be fat in my career. So we are overweight. Shout out to all my fluffy followers, all of my people that are just fluffy and happy and getting it. Y'all look damn fucking good to me. Y'all sexy as hell. And don't let anyone, you don't owe this world a thin body. If you want to get thin for your health, if you want to get thin, because you want to fit into that that's the kind,

but you don't owe this world a thin body man. Live your life. Seriously. Three years ago, I would have been telling you how fine you were. Okay? Now I can't. I'm married. There you go.

I'm saying. Exactly. So, quick story. When we talk about pain investment, quick story. We are driving down, we're driving down to New Orleans to meet these girls. These are girls that went to Xavier University down in New Orleans. Okay.

And at this particular point, like, my homeboys, I was big at this point, 360, 370. But all of my guys, they weren't just thin guys. They were like really good looking. Like, it was the crew. We called ourselves the player proof proof. It was the crew. Stop. Player proof.

Player proof motherfuckers, my dogs for show. Ooh-hoo! He used to have parties. But I used to do that parties. I'll let you have your moment. No, go ahead. Go ahead. Yeah.

But so we're driving down there and we pick up one girl that we're going to go get the rest of her. How big is the car? What are y'all riding? It was my boy Ryan's, what do you call those? The Toyota joints? The forerunner. Okay. So it was my boy Ryan's four runner.

So he's driving. And I'm in the passenger seat and Ian is in the back. And then that's just three of us. So we're going to go down there. We go down there. We get this girl. We get in the car and we start talking. Everybody in the car is talking.

And me or her are vibing, right? And vibing to the point to where Ian go, like Ian even looks at me. Like I can see him look at me like, yo, dog, she's feeling you, man. Whatever. She was beautiful. Like, there's nothing more beautiful, nothing more beautiful than like a black woman in her fucking season of being bad. like just like everything but she was gorgeous lips fingernails all of that stuff I was really into it right I look at all of that shit um

so we're going back and forth when we talking and she's like wow you're so smart and whatever and every once in a while as a fat boy you break through the one every once in a while somebody falls in love with the charm and the charisma or whatever whatever story's taking too long anyway so we get to uh we're about to pull up at the bar and then she starts talking about the fact that the cash money guys were in there the week before. Oh, oh. Right. So it was juvenile and Lil Wayne and all of these guys and Manning Fresh and Baby.

All the hot boys. Okay. Right. I've never told this story on the podcast before. No. You sure? I'm such a cash money records fan. I would remember this.

Okay. This is a defining moment in my life and in my crew. That's why I'm paying investment. So she then, like, she then, so she then they start then, then start talking. and talk about, you know, which one of her home girls chose up and got with a cash money guy or one of the girls was messing with a little way now. We are all like, oh, whatever.

Box. That's the you're rolling with. Whatever. Whatever. I say they're an independent woman. Anyway. So, and Ian was like, well, who did you choose up with? And she goes, well, I got chosen by Manny Fresh.

And he was like, that's probably the best one. you know what I mean? Like, man, he was producing, making all the bees. Like Big Thomas was doing that thing, that's probably the best one. And she goes, no, no, no, no, no, no. I could never. And Ian goes, why? She goes, I would never fuck a fat man.

Happened. Real story. So, obviously, us being 21, 22 years old, my niggas lost their minds. Laughed. I mean, going, because they knew what was happening. And then they knew what was then. happening to me in the front seat of the car.

They knew what was happening, right? And they were laughing so hard, she was like, what's wrong with y'all? And then, then she got it. And I never remember, like, she made it worse because she looked into the rear view mirror and she mild. She looked into, like, the little mirror like that. And she milded. She, like, touched me on the shoulder.

And she mild, like, I'm sorry. Oh. It was very upset. What did you do? I sucked up. Played it off. Yeah. I sucked it up because it's van, baby.

I'm like, ha, ha, you know what I'm saying? Hey, it's van. Yeah, yeah, it's me. It's van, baby. Hey, make a joke. Ha, yeah. I got titties, whatever. And so, like, you know what I'm making, I'm just trying to, I'm being a, I'm being a jester.

I'm being the jester, right, to get to, to get out of it. And so anyway, so anyway, like, we had the night, cool. I push my feelings way down, way down. And then the next day it was bothering me. And I just, I remember looking at my friends and being like, guys, that hurt. And it was like, what do you mean? I was like, bro. Like, that was, it fucks me up even right now talking about it.

I was like, bro, that was embarrassing, dog. Like that hurt. It hurt. And I looked at them and I was like, I need sometimes for y'all just to try to be me if y'all love me for real. If we really down. I need y'all to just try to see. I'm not asking for people to like, I'm not asking for people to try to like, like, coddle me or anything like that because I don't need that. But I just need every once in a while for y'all to protect me if you love me like you say you do.

And I know it's all jokes and it's all games and it's all fucked up, but like, I'm lonely. You know what I'm saying? And we had that conversation, that is essentially what people are asking other people to do for them. So like if you go to the Wisenthal Museum off Pico here in L.A., the Museum of Tolerance, if you go down there and you see it and you see what's going on and you take the time to just invest a little bit, into what other people have suffered and gone through, there'll be a little pause in you. Just whatever, even when you're reading something on your own,

like even when you're reading something, like I'm reading a book by Chomsky right now about Israel and Palestine, right? Chomsky is a big time critic of Israel. But when you read the book with the historical context of it, it helps you understand the humanity of people making decisions and even when they're wrong, why they might make some. on both sides of that. And you just got to try to do that.

And that's with everyone. We definitely need people to do it for black people. We definitely have to do it for other groups as well. We have to. But if you don't try it, you're just going to be like my homies in the car laughing or carrying on and you're not going to know the damage you do it. I feel bad for laughing.

It's fine. I got tetties. I went from laughing to me so bad. So bad. No, it's fun. I mean, I was in, because I just saw the whole thing happen. But no, what did you call it, though? Pain what?

Pain investment. Pain investment. Like, and it's not something you have to do. Don't, you don't have to get sadistic with it. Just when you hear all of this stuff, fine. Have your emotion. Be defensive, be whatever it is that you're going to have your little human feeling. It's human feeling to rally around people in your tribe.

That's human. But in your quiet moments, in your moments where you have a little time, just take a second, take a tick, and go see what they're talking about. Yeah. This episode is brought to you by Sweet Green. The day doesn't ask for permission.

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Totally what happened to you in the car. Totally what happened. But you know what happened though? What happened? She danced with me all night. I got the guilt. I probably could, if I was a different type of guy, I probably could have got guilt something else, but I had too much pride to do that. Yeah, you don't want that. Yeah, you don't want that.

You don't want that. I had too much pride to do. Looking back on that, I should have done it. Anyway, um, uh, now, uh, you know, there was a lot of Dwayne Wade got caught up in that. It was a whole deal. I know. A lot of going on. But as we started this podcast, moving on that for a second, we, we encourage everyone to continue that dialogue going and to educate and educate, to educate and be educated on those things. As this podcast was dropping, we actually started recording a little bit late because a bombshell story hit the Twittersphere. Is that why we recorded late?

Yeah, I asked for 15 extra minutes. Oh, I just thought you just like needed some personal time. No, so I could read the story. I just thought you needed a moment. Right. No, Daniels, the Washington Redskins are in the center. Excuse me, not the Washington Redskins. I apologize.

I recognize that I said that. I shouldn't have said that. So for a Washington Post article, they talked to over 40 ex-employees of the Washington franchise, 40x employees they talked to. And it turned out that 15 women over the course of some years have alleged that there was sexual misconduct in the form of both advances and harassment that seemed to be a part of the culture of the Washington football teams. sort of DNA. It was part of what they did there. And the stories are kind of wild. Did you get a chance to read the article?

I did get a chance to read it. When you hear stories like this, aren't you like, and mind you, thought warriors, this expanded. This didn't just happen in the year 2020. This has expanded over decades, at least more than 10 years. Yeah.

Multiple members of the organization, too. Yeah. When I hear this, I think, how in the world did this not get out? That is what I don't understand. When I hear, and I think that's why this can continue for so long because you do it, you get away with it, and you think, oh, I can keep going after it and doing it again and again and again and you get cocky and you just think you're bigger than the issue and you

won't get caught. We see it time and time again, but I cannot believe this hadn't come out before. And what you also should know, if you weren't paying attention to Twitter yesterday, Twitter was teasing that a story like this was going to come out. I didn't believe it. And what Twitter was saying isn't what's actually in the actual story, but they kept saying that there was this big story that was about to come out with the professional team that plays in Washington, D.C.

So I just kind of brushed it off like this isn't happening. And then right before, like you said, Van, we did this podcast. It happened. Okay, so here are my thoughts. I am a sports management major. went to college for government, hated it, because polyside government, whatever, knew I wanted to go to law school, heard about sports management and I was like, this is for me. It combines all these different degrees, but with the element of sports intertwined in it. I left college. I went to work for the NBA in New York. I loved it. I wanted to work for a professional sports team. I worked for the Milwaukee Bucks when I was in law school. So this hurts me because I know what it's like to be that young woman who has so much ambition, so much heart, has their, gets their dream job, even if it's at an entry level, sales, marketing, communications,

whatever, you get your dream job only then to come into a culture that makes you feel like you're not big enough to speak out or makes you feel like this is the norm. And then it just keeps happening to every woman after you. You think you're doing your part because you rise in the company and then you tell the next woman to watch out. But all you're doing is perpetuating this culture within the organization, even though you're a victim in all of this. It saddens me because all you want to do is work. But you feel this pressure as a woman in a male-dominated industry. And I felt this as an attorney as well to be one of the boys.

To not cause a problem, to not ruffle any feathers. You just cool with it. You brush it off. You don't let it go too far. You don't let them cross the line. You just are like, oh, that's how they are. But this inappropriate behavior mounts and mounts and mounts. And as I was reading this story, that's what I saw. And I felt so badly for these women who felt like they didn't have enough power to speak out. Felt they needed to continue in this way to hold on to their jobs. And I just want to shout out the 15 employees and the 40 women who were brave enough to tell their stories. knowing the possible backlash that could come against them in this industry. Because people do talk and it is small. And I'm saddened by the people who have been turned away from wanting to work in sports. There were a couple of stories like that. I'm just saddened by the people who had to hold on to this secret or as one story told,

two employees would on their lunch break, cry in the bathroom together and share their stories because nobody else, they were afraid to tell anybody else who were afraid they wouldn't listen. We've got to do better in these male-dominated, industries and protect women and make women feel comfortable enough to be themselves and feel that you appreciate them for what they bring to the table mentally rather than what they can physically bring to the table. Being told to wear a lower top, a tighter dress, it's completely inappropriate. Women are so much more than their physique. And it's about time that we recognize that. And just because it's sports or legal or whatever it is that's male-dominated,

It doesn't mean that you should belittle women and make them just an object, um, uh, object them to the, to, to make them less than what they really are. Yeah. Well said. Well said. Well said. With a lot of power too, I felt you. I've, I've seen it.

I've been a part of it. It's happened to me. So, and we should say this was, this was widespread. This had to do with people who were involved in the organization. I think the one time voice of the Redskins was involved in this. And there are, uh, you should. read the Washington Post article after you paid a dollar to get past the paywall, which we want the goddamn information.

You know what I mean? And you're going to hit me up for $10? I guess I got to read it. So shout out to Apple Pay. But, yeah, I think, and this is kind of where the situation comes back to Daniel Snyder and the leadership of the organization. There was clearly a climate there. And the climate, there was one part of the article where,

some of the women that were giving their stories were saying that they were invited to a sort of informal meeting of women who had been working with the organization for a long time. And they were giving different tips and things like that. And one of the tips was to avoid a certain stairwell because if you go up that stairwell, guys will look up your skirt. And one woman was saying that there was one guy who was a trainer who was looking up her skirt and he was leaning over to do it even after she saw him. So he was just like, fuck it. Like, I'm here and I'm going to take a gander. And she was like he was that brazen with it because the reason why something like that, why someone would be that brazen is because they must think that there will be no consequences for their actions.

And that is when it becomes dangerous because that's when it becomes normalized. All of the things that we're talking about that oppress people, keep them down and keep them scared are most dangerous when they become normalized. Back to what we were talking about before. Hitler was able to successfully normalize anti-Semitism in Germany. The people went along with it, man. And so because they did, now you have a situation where you're looking at somebody and not human. And that's kind of what I got out coming from the article,

and the saddest part is that when you look at some of the so they have text messages that are in there and if you read the text messages just sort of in a vacuum you might think oh well she's being playful she's not really being playful because she wants to she is trying to cope with the environment

that exists there trying to be cool trying to be cool I've seen black guys do it before I've been around homies and I get around them and their white friends and we play in golden eye and stuff like that and all of a sudden the N-word start flying I'm like yo who the fuck y'all motherfuckers think is in and then you know

band chill I'm like chill what like chill how I'm like nah uh-uh no fuck it no no no I'm done I'm leaving no like I'm out because I don't have to bust somebody ass but what I realize what I realize is that

when I'm not there in order for him to be around his crew, that's the way things have to go. He's normalized that so he can be a part of it so he can get whatever benefit that comes from it. And maybe they're just his friends. And that's sad. It's sad that women feel the need to go along that and to dehumanize themselves just to do what they've always wanted to do. We hope that those ladies get justice, whatever justice would be. This is a very precarious time to be Daniel Snyder, the owner of the Washington football team.

There were some people that were saying that this story might, you remember what you wanted to say. I did remember. What is it? I wanted to hear from Doug Williams. Wow. I guess I just, he's in the front office. He's a black man.

And I get Louisiana. And I guess I. Yeah, family friend. Yeah. I have no problems with him. I'm not saying that he's a part of it. I'm not saying that he's involved. I just, I guess this is the show.

We talk about black culture, knowing that there is a black man in the front office, when black men really don't hold a lot of front office positions in the National Football League. I guess I just wish I could hear his perspective. Like you said, this is an environment. It's a culture. It's been going on for a long time.

And Dan Snyder, there's no way he didn't know something about it. So I'm just very curious as to what Doug Williams' thoughts are, what his perspective is. And I almost feel like I need to hear from him. He needs to say something. Because he's pretty vocal and opinionated. I need family friend, you know, just kind of, what's up? Bring him on the show.

I ain't seen him a long time. That's okay. You know, how you left off. You know how we do it. Yeah, my dad would say stuff like, listen, this is what's funny about like old country guys, right? My dad says that Doug Williams is the greatest quarterback that ever lived. No, don't get me wrong.

Doug Williams is good, right? He Doug Williams is great. Won a Super Bowl, all of that stuff like that. But dad's like, nobody in the world throwing football like Doug Williams. I'm like, what about Peyton? Uh-uh. You give Doug Williams what Payton Manning had and watch Doug Williams. I'm like, Dad, okay, is Doug Williams?

It's so funny, we should call my dad right now. Be like, Dad, is Doug Williams better than Tom Brady? Hell yeah. That white boy can't do what Doug can do. I didn't seen Doug stand and throw a football from New Orleans to Mississippi. On the fly. So my dad is convinced because he knew Doug and called passes from him. My dad is convinced.

Doug Williams, greatest ever. And remember, country dudes in places like that, they always know the greatest guy ever, always. Always, always. Like, always, always. Like, talk about Michael Jordan. I tell you what, at Michael Jordan ain't as good as Jared Richmond.

Jared Richmond playing Shady Grove High School from 1969 to 1973. I hadn't seen him do all kinds of things. And Michael Jordan ain't got nothing on Jerry Richmond. Always. Always. It's so true. Always.

So I just listen. I don't even bring up Doug Williams to my dad because he's going to start asking all kinds of crazy questions. Like, I can't, Newton can't do nothing like Doug can. Anyway. You should, you should bring them on. But I hope that this is a lesson to other organizations. Like, get your shit together. Do it.

If you got something going on like this, you need to fix the culture of your organization. So not even to protect your, not even because you don't want this to come out, just because it's the right thing to do. do. Make all your employees feel included. How about this? How about coming to terms with one fact, which is that if you have women in leadership positions, your organization will most likely function better. The absence of women in leadership positions in America is hurting the growth of the country in several different sectors. Men, you've had your time and you've had the monopoly on leading the country and finance and politics and all of these things. Guess what? It's fucked.

Like we are starting to lose to other countries because there are other places, people in other countries who've embraced the role of having more diversity in the leadership. I guarantee you that the real tragedy in the Redskins organization was that there are women who could no longer work there that would have made it a better place. They haven't been to the Super Bowl since like 1992 or 1993. They've been perennial losers. They're a dysfunctional organization.

Yes, they are. And they have all of these women who are completely capable and ready to do stuff and they're trying to look up dresses and grab asses. Be professionals. Just the way you're phrasing it. What's the same. Be professionals and get the fucking job done. Now we got to get to the bullshit. For the second week in a row, like we were just about to talk about the bullshit.

We're about to get into the bullshit. There's the bullshittiest of bullshit things now. This is crazy. For the second week in a row, we have breaking news during the podcast. Tori, it looks like Tori Lanes is the one who shot Megan Estali. Now, I don't know if you guys heard, but maybe. Megan the Stallion was shot Sunday morning in Los Angeles. She released the statement.

At first, you know, Tori Lanes was arrested during this entire thing for carrying a concealed weapon. And it was, Megan the Stallion revealed that she had been shot during this whole thing. At first people thought he was arrested. She was with them. Are they having sex? Then after a while, people thought, after a while when she said she was shot, people were wondering, well, yo, who shot? Megan the Stallion, was it based upon past disagreements she might have had with very possible, very powerful people in Texas? Now, according to an organization that I know very well, that's normally right about these things,

it's being alleged that Tory Lane's open fire on Megan the Stallion after an argument with them leaving this part. at Kylie Jenner's house. People are saying that it says here, sources say Tori opened fire from inside the vehicle and hit Meg in the feet twice. I didn't see it was twice. And then the LAPD pulled them over. Now, when Meg was talking,

she basically said the narrative that has been reported about Sunday morning's events are inaccurate and I like to set the record straight. On Sunday morning, I suffer gunshot wounds as a result of a crime that was committed against me and done with the intention to physically harm me. I was never arrested. The police officers drove me to the hospital

where I underwent surgery to remove the bullets. Apparently, what weird to understand or believe is that the person that was intentionally harming Meg the Stallion is Tori Lane's? This is crazy to me. You got, because what the article is saying, if true, if true, if true. The article's saying they wanted to get out

of the car and an argument ensued. And so he shot her in the foot. Twice. Twice in the foot. It doesn't make any sense. And I'll tell you what else doesn't make any sense. He was arrested for possession of a concealed weapon. He was not arrested for causing harm to Megan. If Megan is saying that he shot her, then they would have her statement. And I would think that there would be some type of charge against him. Now, allegedly, there's some cell phone video out there of the shooting, but the police don't have it as of yet. This is a wild story. And I don't know why there would be self- phone video of Tori Lanes. I mean, I'm trying to imagine this man.

So he takes out a gun and says, you ain't going nowhere and shoots her in the foot? Look, don't I don't want to say they were on something, but my God, like, what the fuck is going on? By the way, I'm sincerely hoping they're wrong. Sincerely hoping that they're wrong.

And it's not like this organization hasn't been wrong before, it happens. But like, sincerely hoping that they are wrong, because what in the fucking hell could make him bust on her inside the car? What argument?

Like what? This is the wildest shit ever. This is one, this will go up there. This is a 2020 special right here. It's not a 2020. It is. Unolved mysteries. Unsolved mystery. No, I mean the year 2020.

Oh. This is a, like, what was the last time you heard? But like, do you understand? how wild this is? This is like, Plaxico Burr is shooting himself in the leg type situation.

You were like, what? Why? How? Stop. Now, I don't know how much you guys are Tori Lane's fans,

how much you know about Tori Lane's. Tori Lanes is a guy who brings a lot of hubris with him, who has had a lot of, like, beefs in the past. But there's never been anything violent about Tori Lanes. There's never been anything,

I can't remember Tori Lanes ever like, Um, isn't he a hot head? He's definitely a hot head, but there's difference between a hot head and a shoot you head. Those are two different heads. I mean, maybe he didn't aim at her. Maybe it just discharged. Maybe he had it out.

I don't know. But there is a record of him being a hothead and getting into it with other celebrities. She put out a whole statement. So I'm actually a little surprised that maybe she's not giving us a little bit more. one story was false. So she came out to say it wasn't glass that cut my foot. It was bullets. So if this story is false,

maybe she'll come out with the truth. If she's silent, maybe this is the real deal. Now remember now, we're saying that even what I just said when I think about it now doesn't make a ton of sense and I'll tell you why. I just said that maybe he was shooting down to scare her and then it got away, right?

The reality is that she said in her statement that someone committed a crime against me intentionally to hurt me, intentionally to hurt me. Interesting. She was saying it without saying it right there. In fact, this is Torrey Lane's. She was trying to tell people, Tori Lane shot me. And maybe she didn't say it out there because maybe she's saving that for the police.

Well, let me tell you, if they found a concealed weapon in his car, it'll be very easy to determine if those bullets came from that gun. Right. And at the moment, we only know that there were three people in the car, her friend, her, and Tori Lanes, and the chauffeur. So four. So if that's what happened, if the bullets come from that gun, I mean, I think we've solved the case at this point. We just don't know the intent as to why you decided to pull the trigger. That's crazy.

Y'all, stay home. Like when I was talking about, we got some bullshit. This is really some bullshit. Yeah, this shouldn't even be happening. Like, it should be a slow news day for us instead. Question for you. If it comes out that Tori Lane's shot Meg the Stallion, is it over for Tori Lane's his entire career?

Well, I gave the example of Plaxico, and I'm not sure we saw him after that. And he shot himself. I don't know how. he could continue after this. I mean, Megan is beloved. She's the highest thing right now

when it comes to rapping and you, and then in an age, where we're talking about not valuing black women and you're going to take out one of our own, somebody who's representing for us, that's not acceptable. Like, he's going to be canceled. I'm not even quite sure white people

really know his music like that. It's us. And there's no way black people are going to support him if he attacked Meg the Stallion. She's a jewel. If he, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if it comes out that Torrey shop, Meg, he's done. You would you, would you, would you, would you, would you listen to Torrey Lanes ever again if it comes out that he shot Mendes? I don't really listen to Tori Lanes. No, it's not that, no, it's not that I don't fuck with my.

I, I've interviewed him. I've, I've interviewed him before. Let me see your feet. Are they cool? Does he have a issue with feet? I'm confused. Obviously, he'd been shooting people in the feet before. How did I not put that sequels?

I mean, obviously, your feet are fine. Your feet are fine. fine. He didn't beat him. I put a couple of holes in him. No, you straight. We were on TV. This was at the Real when I was doing guest hosting for them. Right. Lovely person meeting him because we both have the Miami thing. We were like, oh, you live Miami. Okay. But I'm not really a big fan of the music. I love the music. I interviewed him on the Red Pill. Tori came with a whole crew of guys. He was cool. He gave me his number. I've texted Tori several times. He has never once texted me back to him. any of the text that I've said. That's a true story. And it's funny because there was something going on that night.

Me and him had vibes so much. I was like, yo, man, I might be friends with Tori Lange's. It might be cool. And the manager goes, hey, if you want to come to that thing tonight, take my number. I was like, why? Tori just gave me his. He's like, nope. If you want to come out, take my number and hit me.

Because Tori is never, ever going to return the text that you sent in. And he never has. he might return it now. I might text on my, yo, dog, you need some pale money. You might tell your side of the story on the podcast? What tell your side of the story? Hey, by the way, we don't know. These are all allegations.

Meg hasn't identified her shooter as of yet. The police haven't gone on the record or released the statement or any information about who was the trigger person in that situation. So we're telling you what we got. and up to the minute and tomorrow in the next day and the weekends

we always give you something coming in the weekend you should probably know who's on the other side of that guy. Yeah, this should be really, really easy to solve. I mean, unless the bullets came from a different gun and there's a person we don't know about, they got away.

I think a lot of people you know, if there's a lesser, if I can look at the silver lining in this, is that she is okay. it was her foot and not her knees, which people give awards to, you know what I'm saying? It wasn't a knees.

It wasn't a knees. She said she's going to make a full recovery, so the knees is going to be, because she got bionic knees. Yeah, she has those knees insured, for sure. Stop and that big-ass thing. Now, who are you going to vote for for president now that Kanye West is no longer in the race?

Wow, that's a tough one. So, I don't know, I'm a little bit shook now that he, you know, he announced that he was running, He pulled out. He came back. He pulled out. I think I'm going to have to go with Joe Biden. Joe Biden.

Yeah. Are you afraid to say that? No. Afraid to say that I'm voting for Joe Biden? Yeah. No, why would I be afraid to say that? I'm going to Joe Biden. Some people really don't like to say who they're voting for,

even if it's obvious. You never come across that person? Like, they really like to keep that private. Almost always white. Almost always white. Okay. My father, who is not white, But we do know he's a federal judge, has never told us who he votes for.

That, you know why, though? That makes sense for him because he got his job via presidential appointment, right? Yeah, Clinton. Go ahead, Bill. That's what I'm talking about. Your dad's met Bill Clinton before? Yeah, he has a picture of the two of them shaking hands. Where?

Where was the picture taken? In his office, in the old office. And Bill Clinton's office? Mm-hmm. Has your dad ever traveled with Bill Clinton before? He has not. Don't you, don't you do that. Don't you, don't you make it?

Bill Clinton's like, hey, come on, I got a jet for us to travel on. It's my friends. It's my friend. We got a jet for us to travel on. Come on, get on the jet. Next thing you know, we were looking through the manifest of the jet, and it's your, what's your pop's name? Sam Lindsay.

Sam Lindsay is on there, back and forth from Texas to Florida to a ranch in New Mexico. You let me find out. You let me find out. Sam Lindsay is on traveling with Bill Clinton. My dad is never going to come on this podcast. You better be nice to old Sam. Okay, I'll be nice to Sam because I don't know what kind of charges. I'm going to catching Texas in the future.

I might, you know what I'm saying? Who knows? But no. So Sam is, Sam is cool. Sam Lindsay was not on Epstein's yet. It's a joke. No, absolutely not. It's a joke.

It's a joke. But no, Kanye West is out. He's out of the race. He's not on the race. He's not a part of the race. anymore. Look, man, you guys, we are talking about this because it's important to keep you guys informed on stories that we've covered, but this is a big fucking waste of time. He was never going to go through with it. It was never a thing. And there's a part of me that believes that even if there

was an inkling in his head that he was going to seriously run, that somebody got in his ear and convinced him that that was something that he should not be doing. I mean, if he was really having an episode, which is what the sources were saying, that People magazine article, then, I mean, maybe someone did. Maybe someone didn't. Maybe he's just, you know, kind of come down a little bit. But yeah, anybody who was taking that seriously, you got to come on now. Come on now. But I mean, but that, I think we talked about this, about Kim giving her support on Twitter, which I think that's just a safe face, but whatever. That's, anyways, Kanye's not running. Thank goodness. We can stop talking about that story so we can

focus our attention on the two people who will be representing their parties in the actual election. Well, we can turn our attention to the one person. There's another person who doesn't need any of my attention. You know what's less surprising than Kanye West dropping out of the presidential election? What? That one of Tucker Carlson's writers is a racist. There should be another word used, actually, for what he is.

Why do you say that? The things that he was saying, the years that he spent on this forum where he was spewing out bigotry and these homophobic comments and the hate and not even just commenting, creating actual post to garner attention to his beliefs and to create, he had a following. People loved him on there. He was revered under this pseudonym Charles the 12th. Is that what it was? I believe it was. Yeah, we should say it is. The writer's name is Blake Neff.

Yeah. And he is the top writer for Tucker Carlson. If you guys don't know who Tucker Carlson is, in the absence of Bill O'Reilly and Glenn Beck, Tucker Carlson has filled that primetime spot for Fox News. And during that time has gone on in a relatively short amount of time, in my opinion, to become. I would say the number one most powerful name in primetime cable news.

He has the most popular show by far. Yeah. And he is a firebrand. His top writer is a guy named was a guy named Blake Neff, who was like Rachel said, going on different sites and spewing racist vial. One of them, he responded to a user who said in 2018, who said, would you let a jet black Congo inward do LASIC eye surgery on you for 50% off. Neff rode back. I wouldn't get LASIC from an Asian for free. So now, on June 5th of that same

year, I guess, or maybe of this year, Neff said, Black dudes, D-O-O-D-S, staying inside playing Call of Duty. So this year, it's probably one of the biggest factors keeping crime down. Then on June 24th, he commented, honestly, given how tired black people always claim to be, maybe the real crisis is their lack of slag. all right. So he is, at least under that pseudonym, pretty brazen about his racism. Now, so let's talk about the specific danger of this. The Tucker Carlson show, Tucker Carlson in the way, is maybe a more powerful political voice than even President Trump is. He, in a lot of ways, is a place where President Trump gets a lot of his political theory and marching order. we've been told that President Trump watches, it's been, excuse me, reported

that President Trump watches Tucker Carlson show all the time. Tucker Carlson seems to be the tip of the spear in large sections of conservative thought in this country. The guy that is writing the copy that Carlson is talking, speaking to that group, is this guy.

Fucking yikes. Yeah. Yeah. And I think what's even scarier is that he wasn't even fired by Fox News. He sent in a letter of resignation because CNN was going to out him with this report. This, as you said, is the most watch program on television. And this is a guy who has bragged about anything that you're reading on the teleprompter of Tucker Carlson, I wrote. So he's reading the words of a racist, a white supremacist. I mean, it's beyond racism. These aren't little things that he's doing. He has, he takes, in his spare time, he practices racism. That's his hobby. That's what he does. And so you have to think about that. And what people also need to understand, too, is that when they looked at the chat and the things that he had been posting, some of them emulated the things that Tucker Carlson was saying on air.

That's how influential he was. Tucker Carlson has gone on to praise him about how brilliant his mind is. He helped Tucker Carlson write his book. This is a man who was invested in Tucker's life. And so I think that is why you got the response that you did. So this story came out last week, Thursday, Friday. Something like that. Yeah.

And we were told that Tucker was going to address it on Monday. day night, which he did on his show. Now, here's my question to you, Van. What did you think about the way that he addressed the fact that his top writer is a white supremacist? Well, that was pretty

part for the course for me. That was pretty expected. Basically, to paraphrase, sum up, whatever, give you the cliff notes on Tucker Carlson's response. His response was basically that they condemn racism of all forms. They don't like to come

down on people for the way that they were born, only for the qualities that they have, and they condemn everything that Blake said and that they are, that Blake no longer worse there. But then he also caution people to not beat their chest and, you know, get too gleeful over the fact that Blake is no longer there because everyone has made mistakes. And if you're, if you try to make like you're too holy, one day is going to be your turn on the guillotine. Now look, be honest with you. I didn't care about Blake Neff before this.

I don't care about Blake Neff now. If Blake Neff gets another job somewhere else, and he will. He will. If Blake Neff gets another job somewhere else, I'm not going to start a change that order petition. I'm not going to grab a picket sign. I'm not going to do any of that stuff, right?

I don't live in a world where I believe that they're not people that harbor those same ideas in their head that are writing that shows all over the place. Okay? So as far as coming down on Blake Neff and all of that stuff like that, now, Blake Neff did some stupid shit, said some stupid shit, and now he's been dealt with. Fine. Good for him. Why I will say is this. What should be troubling to people is... or not even troubling, it should be vindicating in a way that this was found out.

Because when you're watching Tucker Carlson or anyone like him and you have a feeling, is that racist? Yeah. Does he just have a differing viewpoint than me? Or is he saying something intentional and very, very purposefully racist and bigoted? the answer to that question you'd have to assume now is yes. Yes. Yes.

And now that you know that at least that it has been, you're free to make your own decision about whether or not that's a show that you would want to support going forward. And I just have to say, and of course this is an assumption, but my gosh, it has to be a pretty good assumption. If this man was this entrenched in his, in racism, there's no way that in casual conversation, these type of things didn't come out with Tucker Carlson. There's no way that you didn't know the ideals that Blake Neff held.

And just for your own reference, you should know that Tucker Carlson on his show has said white supremacy is a hoax. He has said the Black Lives Matter movement is not about Black lives. And he has warned his viewers to remember they, in reference to black folks, even though he tried to say that that was Democrats, will come for you. He said, remember, they will come for you. That was in the same sentence

in referencing Black Lives Matter. And you should know that when Neff was on this form, he would make jokes about Sandra Bland, George Floyd, Michael Brown. And these are some of the sentiments that were echoed. They're echoed from that to Tucker Carlson's show. You need to understand that.

So I would just say, to piggyback on what you're saying, Van, now that you have all this information, take it the way that you want. want, but I totally understand what you're saying about not getting too upset about it because in the words of Dennis Green, they are who we thought they were. Yeah, so do your thing. Whatever. Whatever.

Blake Neff, I hope you twist your ankle. But open your eyes. But open your eyes. See how it is. See how it is. Is that a ringer hoodie that you're wearing? Oh, yeah. You like that?

So, wait a second. When did you get a ringer hoodie? Before I started working for The Ringer, one of the times that I was on a podcast, I asked if there was some gear and I picked up some gear when I left. Okay. I was shit. This was more like manifestation. Like one day, I'm going to work for the Ringer. And here we are.

I want a fucking hoodie. I have nothing. I don't have a Ringer hoodie. You right here, you wearing your Ringer hoodie in my, wow. Loud and proud. I actually was going to wear a while and out sweats. shirt and I was like it's probably not a good time. Not going to be a good deal.

Probably not a good time. Mm-hmm. Now, do you have an unexpected ally of the week? I do. I do. Do you? I'm going to let you go first because I never really have one, but yeah. You never have one.

Okay, so this was, it was hard for me to come up with one. So I feel like I'm going to give mine to the man who said two simple words. to, I believe it was a Missouri senator when a Missouri senator suggested that NBA players should be allowed to put terms that are pro police and military, I believe, on the back of their jerseys in addition to the Black Lives Matter.

And I'm talking about Adrian Wozianowski. A name that I always have trouble saying and I normally just say Woege. He is an ESPN NBA insider. And this says, decided to copy numerous people on this email, as he said, this is what the NBA should allow players to do. And Woj simply responded, fuck you. That was it. I've never met Woz before. Only talked to him when I used to do ESPN radio. Never in a million years would I have thought

this is what his response to be, would be. But let me tell you, I loved it. Now, unfortunately, he has been reprimanded by ESPN and he's currently on suspension for his actions and he has apologized and said that he should have handled it in a more professional manner. But Woj,

I want you to know that on this podcast, higher learning, we deem you an ally. And I just want to thank you for those two powerful words that you gave to that senator. I was really,

that's a great unexpected ally of the week. I was really going to go off the deep end here. And I was going to make Mitch McConnell my um way wait how are you going to bring that back into the realm of being an ally how how sway just a ally for humanity because you know he said wear a mask and it's very important for the country to get the messaging right messaging from the gop on wearing well don't look at me like that i was going to do it but you know what i can't fuck mitch mcconnell man you can't because you can't you can't for doing what he already should have done it's right

It's taking him four months to tell people to wear a mask. I'm not. When it's too late, you're still encouraging kids to go back to school. Don't get me started on that. It's just too much. It's hard for me that the woes one was good. I got to take unexpected ally of the week more serious. I was like, you know who I'll call the unexpected allies of the week?

All of the native and indigenous people that hit me up this week. this this week. I had a particularly spirited conversation with one young lady and it got tense. It got tense because I got my feelings. I'm going to shout her out. It got tense because I got my feelings. Wait, what? Yeah, she hit me up and she goes, there's one thing that you guys missed. And I was like, oh shit, tell me what we missed. And I think from right then, me and her were kind of jousting a little bit. We ended, what's the name? I need the name. We ended kind of in a cool spot. but for a second there it was tough because listen I'm down for all of the talk but then at the same time when someone does hit me up I didn't act like a bitch baby too

I just start going but I'm an ally don't hold me accountable I'm an ally don't hold me accountable her name is Ashley Lusenden and her name on Instagram is slashly She works over at Berkeley or she is this is right here. She tells me. She's a co-chair of the Native American Law Students Association at Berkeley Law.

She does a lot of activism and community engagement with the native legal community and native communities at large. She says, I think there are a number of points that y'all miss on the team name discussion and would like to chat to you about the different feelings within the community because it's not all the same. Let me know if you're interested. And my response was, what did we miss? Ashley, I'm sorry. I apologize. I was having a bad day, a bit of stressful week. I was like, yeah.

And then after she goes and tells me what you missed, I came back like, so we didn't miss anything. I'm like, because we asked if those things are considered offensive. And so, but after a while, we went back forth until he came back at the end. So, Ashley, I'm sorry. I'm going to open my heart up and try to be a better ally, try to be a better advocate, and do the work myself. She also said she was disappointed that I didn't go and do the reading myself. Ashley was in a bag.

She was in her bag. She was disappointed I didn't go do the reading myself. We should do the reading ourselves. And I pledged to do that. So, boom. That's my unexpected ally. Shout out to Ashley for holding us accountable. You should.

You should do that. Somebody sent me several articles about, it was more about Florida State and how they have been working with the natives in that area about how to properly do things when it comes to being a seminal with the state. So I found that interesting too. I love that y'all listen. I love that y'all send us stuff. We don't know everything.

We definitely don't. Y'all keeps sending van stuff because I love when he's in his feeling. Right. The learning isn't just for y'all. It's for us as well. Before we leave, I'll say this. I know we talked about some weighty stuff at the top of the podcast. It's hand-holding time.

It's not saber-rattling time. Everybody find a way to hold hands. I'll try. You try. Everybody try. Put the sabers away. Hold hands. There is a group of people that wants to make sure that we are silent and that we are unmotivated.

And if we look hard enough, I think we can identify those people and realize that they are not us. Okay. Rachel, you got anything for them? No. That's it. Well said. Get well soon, Megan the Stallion. Thought warriors, we will talk to you the next time. Take your thing caps off, but don't stop using your heads.

I'm Van Laithen. I'm Rachel Lindsay. We out.