Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - Shannon Sharpe’s “Shakedown,” and Why the Earth Isn’t Flat With Dakotah Tyler

Episode Date: April 25, 2025

Van and Rachel react to the latest in Shannon Sharpe's lawsuit and discuss his reaction (22:41), before breaking down Elon Musk’s decision to take a step back from politics to focus on Tesla (55:34). Then astrophysicist Dakotah Tyler (soon to be Dr. Tyler) joins to debunk Wiz Khalifa’s belief that the Earth is flat (1:07:21). Hosts: Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Dakotah Tyler Producers: Donnie Beacham Jr. and Ashleigh Smith Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode of Higher Learning is brought to you by MGM Plus. If you love high-stakes drama, Godfather of Harlem delivers. I can't wait to see it. I know it has Academy Award winner, Forrest Whitaker. He returns as Bumpy Johnson, facing his deadliest battles yet for Harlem's future. When ruthless newcomer, Frank Lucas arrives, everything changes. As power shifts and new threats emerge, will Bumpy forge an uneaseless? Is he alliance with his enemies?

Or will he stand tall as the undisputed Godfather of Harlem? Well, you can find out in the new season of Godfather of Harlem, new episodes streaming Sundays on MGM Plus. Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What is up? Harylern is on and Zyvan Lathen, Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. I'm on Magic Mind right now.

What does that mean? So Tom McLeod. Do you know Tom? I knew Tom before you knew Tom Is that true? I think so He's in over some magic mind What's that?

Is that a mushroom? It's some kind of mushroom thing That helps you Go to sleep Then also get you focus in the morning Is this his company? This is not an ad This is this company

So is it in gummy form? Is it in pill form? It's like a shot form Oh wow So you take it before you go to sleep So I took some magic mind Last night before I went to sleep And there's one formula

that is supposed to drift you off in the sleep and have you wake up sharper. And then there's another formula that you wake up for mental acuity and sharpness in the morning. Which one did you take? Took them both. At the same time?

One last night, Rachel, and then one in the morning. Oh, you said night in the morning. And how do you feel? I can't tell the difference. It's fine. No, no, no, no. I did sleep a lot better last night.

Do you have crazy dreams? I didn't. Then get rid of it. Why? Because I live for you. your dreams. Okay, yeah, yeah. I did. I had crazy dreams a couple of days ago. I dreamt that I was super short, but that I could jump, like, ridiculously high. See what I'm saying? Like, a couple of days ago, I dreamt that I was super short and I was very upset about it. I was in New York,

but it was- You were short king. I was really upset about it. I was in New York, but it turns out I was really in Chicago. Okay. I thought that I was in New York, but I was really in Chicago. Maybe. Because you were- And so I was super short, and I was really in Chicago. And I was really- I was really upset about it, but then I went to the basketball court and I jumped and I was over the rim throwing the ball in and then I felt better. So you were bow wow. You were like Mike. Like Mike. Like Mike. Shout out Bawa by the way. Like Mike. This is what I'm talking about. It really needs to be a segment. So if this is going to mute your dreams, I don't like it. Drink the one in the morning. Here's the only problem with that.

Do you know what my sleep score last night was? 50. 94. That's good. I don't want to... The magic mind. 94. So it works.

Shout out to Tom. Nine hours, six minutes of sleep. 58 beats per minute as far as my heart. Is that good? I don't know. Yeah. Well, for me, my heart gets pretty low when I'm sleeping. I have a low resting heart rate, but it was good.

As far as like me and the mental acuity part, I guess it takes a couple of days to kick in. What's the average? What's your average? average number for sleep. My average number for sleep, let's see. There's a whole... I know mine would be bad. I have to look.

There's a whole way that you can look at it on the oaring, but I'd have to look it up and I don't know how to... Okay. But you know why? This is important. Ever since I've been on Lexa Pro, which has been a while now, I'm not as sharp.

People probably can't tell. If you listen to the podcast enough, sometimes you can tell me, like searching for a word. That doesn't happen when I'm not on Lexapro. Do you, but you consistently take it.

I know, but what I'm saying is prior to me, Lexapro is a net good for me, but it gives me brain fog. Well, I mean, Lexapro isn't the only type of drug like that you can take.

Maybe you should switch it up. I know it takes time for it to like get through your system and it even out, but if it's making you foggy, maybe you should try a different one. I'm waning off of it, actually. I'm winning off the Lexapro.

Okay. Now, if the panic attacks come back, I'll be back on the Lexer Pro, but I'm weaning off of the Lexer Pro. I've talked to my doctor. I'm weaning off of it. Because sometimes I hear myself, and I'm like, oh, my God, man,

you're stopping, you're stammer and you're studying a little bit. The Lexer Pro is a big deal as far as that's concerned. And I never used to need coffee. Never used to need coffee. I just thought you enjoy it. See, like, I don't really need.

Lexapro? No, no, coffee. I don't really need it. I love the routine of coffee. I love waking up in the morning and having just like the smell of the coffee and like. It's a little commercial. Yeah, like making it up and stirring it and walking over to the cat. I just love the routine of coffee.

This is for your crew. The best part of waking up is cocaine in your cup. It's for Rachel's crew. Take that out. Don't start that rumors. Don't start rumors like that. I'm over here talking about my joy of coffee. I'm literally talking about my joy of coffee and how I love it.

And you want to throw in some... Is cocaine in your cup? Leave that in. We have HR issues on the podcast. Because I don't want somebody to clip that and actually think that's how I start off. I start off my board it with a cup of coffee and a bump. For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, Every choice matters.

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Bonus is non-withdrawable and expire seven days after receipt. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Manage your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions apply. See terms at Fandul.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash herms. We have to get into the show. About the name. About to Shannon Sharp, me.

Wow. Whoa, it's already a thing. A Shannon Sharping is already... I think it's a thing. You think it's a thing? It's a verb. Shannon Sharpie. All right, we have Dakota Tyler coming on later to talk about Flat Earth.

Sadly, we have to talk about it to entertain this. You guys made this happen. In the last couple of weeks, I've seen three or four different flat earth conversations. I hate that I have to do this to Mark. Mark Lamont Hill. He should have done more. You mean he should have done more? I was surprised Mark didn't push back a little bit.

Oh, who? Whiz. Oh, no, but that's not, they've been fighting that battle over on the JCP for a while now. Okay. And Mark's, you know, he's doing the work over there. Is he regularly on it now? Yeah, he's part of the show.

They need them. I mean, he's bringing a lot to the show. The show is, is, I would agree. The show is a lot better. with Mark over there. And it's a lot better with Mark over there, not just because Mark is elevating discourse

in certain areas there. It's because they're actually a lot more amelible to his ideas than you would have thought. I think a lot of people would have thought that there'd be tremendous pushback and all of that stuff. But it's sometimes the conversations that don't get happened,

that don't happen on these platforms when you have someone that comes from, you know, strictly academia, and then you have people that are very industry smart, but they're street smart. You don't see those conversations a lot. And a lot of times you think that there would be this incredible tension. And there is tension all the time.

Don't get me wrong. There is tension all the time. But for the most part, the conversations end up out of the wash being like pretty good. And you can tell he's getting through to a group that might not be as, because Mark is a leftist. Yeah. Might have not heard a lot of his.

perspectives before. So I didn't know he was on it regularly. Every time I see a clip now, he's there. And I'm like, oh, okay. Like maybe he's, you know, coming in once a month or something. Mark is, I think that's the genius of Mark. I think he can come in, have a conversation, elevate the conversation, and, you know, get people to not take his ideas, but kind of say like, okay, that makes sense.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, just it's about being open to a different perspective. Now look, this is what I'll say. What? I'm not talking about what happened. on the JPP. I'm talking about, listen, on night school, which is Mark's YouTube platform. It was last week

that for some reason Mark decided to platform a guy who had been trolling him on Twitter. And he had challenged Mark to a debate a couple of times and Mark decided to like invite this guy on and they were going to have a back and forth. Did you post this?

I posted part of it. Okay. Did you see it? No. I just saw you posted. I watched it, I watched the entire, the entire conversation between these two. And it is fucking hysterical. This guy was not just a flat earther, but he was, I think, a social anarchist in terms of the way he viewed government, which it's interesting that if you know anything about Mark or if you've read Mark, and I have, and I've known him for a while, then some of the societal observations that the gentleman was making, Mark is like not totally against them.

but the dude was so unhinged, a sigma, he was so unhinged that the conversation was just ridiculously entertaining. I know Mark would never do it. I think he should bring the dude on once a week. No. That shit was funny to me, son. Mark had to check him. He had to check him on that.

And Mark can be a little shit too, because he knows how to, he's very smart, and he knows how to get those little dizzes in there too. He handled it perfectly and beautifully, but I was thoroughly entertained. Let's just let that moment live in time. You probably can't make magic every single week or every single month. Because the dude was, the dude was.

The dude's been waiting for this moment is probably what happened. Yes, yes, yes. All right, Donnie, quick hitters. Quick hits. First one is stock markets. They rose yesterday after Trump suggested that tariffs on China could drop substantially as his administration negotiates trade deals with dozens of countries. So the economic roller coaster continues.

He blinked. He blinked. Were you shocked, you know, as the macro economist on this podcast, Van Lathen, macroeconomist. Yeah. Were you, did you think that this would happen? And maybe if you did, maybe not this quickly. It's impossible to know, it's, seriously, it's impossible to have thoughts.

on this because having thoughts on Trump's strategy with the tariffs would indicate that there's some rhyme or reason to how this is being rolled out. So it's very difficult to have thoughts. He could say that he's going to be nice to China now, have a conversation with Kid Rock, and then next week the tariffs are 300% right. So apparently in this situation, some business leaders from different retail chains came to the president and said, hey, in the summer you're going to see empty shelves and you're going to see high prices.

So you're going to have both supply chain issues with products being on the shelves. And then the products that we do have, they're going to have like incredibly high prices. So that, for some reason, made Trump back off things a little bit. I don't know why that's what hit. It's not like people haven't been saying that to him before.

Trump is an elitist to the point to where it doesn't matter if the small business owner with the Barrette factory, which I saw someone on CNN's Black lady and her daughter that started this Barrette company, it was a very beautiful story. They were talking about how this is going to affect them. It doesn't matter if those people

from see the shining sea say, hey, our business are going to be affected by this. He doesn't care about that. But if the big swinging dicks of the business world get them in the room, he'll listen to them. And you're looking at all of these governments, all of these administrations have elitism and oligarchy baked into them in some form.

But you're looking at it in the most direct transactional way that I think that we've seen as far as a president who makes policy based upon what important people tell him to do. Next, Donnie. All right. Florida Representative Byron Donald's had a town hall in which he was yelled at over and over again. Here's a little bit of it. Don't believe. Are you ready?

Are you ready for the other half of me? the previous president, President Biden. Oh, all right. So you don't want to hear a full story. You don't need a full story. Allowing me to educate and bring you the full story. And when you're ready, I'm going to tell you, because I don't let you to yell and not hear the full story.

Because when you're not listening, you're honest. Here you go. Is it true that he was talking not to his constituents, but to a group of Democrats? I'm not sure. He might have been. Donnie looked that up for us. He was at a town hall, though,

down there in Florida. So it could have been a more liberal group. I think that, I mean, it certainly appears to be a more liberal group, being that they had something. The way they were booing and yelling. Probably what he was saying. But look, I think the thing is this,

the legs, the stamina of the Joe Biden administration did this, I think we're at a right about 100 days of the Trump administration. I think the stamina of that argument has already worn out. I think that's done. I don't think people are going to watch their 401Ks evaporate, you know, watch prices go up, deal with Elon Musk being a part of their life, the most annoying man on planet earth, and go, oh, my God, Joe Biden did this.

So whatever. I don't think people are going to. Or even saying when he started talking about well, Obama did, it's like nobody wants to hear that. Obama was years ago. We're talking about right now. And I mean, which is part of the reason Trump got in office. It was about the what can you do for us right now. That's all people want. I don't think that they want to hear about Biden. They don't want to hear, oh, Barack Obama did this. What are you going to do for us right now? You know, it's funny. I think you're right. The funny thing is, you know, we criticize, I've criticized. The, the left for not having a concrete version of,

excuse me, a concrete vision of America. See, there it is right there. a concrete vision of America. I've criticized. I want to hear vision. I want to hear a plan. I want to have all of this. And then the Trump administration is in power right now. And there doesn't seem to be a cohesive vision. They seem to be floundering on immigration. The mass deportations that they promised the bloodthirsty xenophobes has not, they have not come to fruition. They are removing people who are illegally. And they're in a battle with the courts there. You have economic strife from the terrorist plan.

It seems their Trump mentions Biden. I think it's around six times a day. It seems like for all of the vision or whatever, the dystopian vision that the Trump administration promised, their most solid messaging is about how much they don't like Joe Biden. Yeah, that's what got him in office. It's just not sustainable at this point with the way that the decisions he's making are affecting the economy and just the citizens in this country, period. I do think, you know, the difference that they have that the Democrats don't have is they do have a leader in Trump.

And people are willing to do whatever he says, how he says it, when he says it. Even if it's being challenged in court, even if, you know, like it makes absolutely no sense. they are getting behind whatever Trump says. And that is something that the Democrats don't have. Last one, Donnie. Our last one, a Venezuelan immigrants in Detroit reportedly went the wrong way while delivering food and ended up crossing the Canadian border in

was taken into custody by U.S. authorities and deported to El Salvador. This is something that's super easy to do in Detroit, take that wrong turn. And I think it's not the first. Yes. In Windsor, right? You'll end up in Windsor,

But like, you can just go straight through. Nobody checks your passport. Nothing? No, you take a wrong turn on the exit and then you end up being at the border where then they check your passport and ask your questions about why you're trying to cross the border. And you can say I made a wrong turn on the exit and then that might lead to more questions. I've done that once a while ago and I've almost made that exit several times afterwards. But that one time was enough for me to be like, all right, I've got to watch where I'm going. So what happened that one time when it happened to you, what they do?

I got to ask questions about where I was going. I said that I made the wrong turn. They asked if they could search the car. I said, sure, because they had nothing in there to hide. They searched, and then they let me turn around. And they watched me turn around just to make sure I wasn't going to Canada despite what I said. So, yeah, that was like in 2008. I feel like security has changed in the almost 20 years since then.

So it's a scary situation. For sure. And I've read that this is not the first time that this happened. I think a couple of months ago or weeks, there was a man who was with his family and he was questioned at the border and detained for a weekend after it was determined that he was not an illegal immigrant. He and his family were released at the Canadian border. So madness. So he had only been here for a couple of months. May they were on turn And you know this had happened in March as well

I'm reading right now on the Detroit Free Press's site That a family had done this And they were on their way to Costco And they were detained by immigration agents For several days Before being released Now Now you know

This guy is Has been sent to El Salvador his deportation was not listed publicly, but they said that that could have been an oversight. You know what is interesting about these differing instances, you know, obviously the Garcia case, which has garnered a lot of attention and you had a U.S. Senator go down to El Salvador.

The American stomach for this stuff is, I think the administration overestimated how Americans were going to stomach this type of stuff. It was one thing in rhetoric, but it's another thing in practice. Well, there's a difference. Okay.

I'm just saying, sorry, not a good job, but I'm just saying what they said is not what they're practicing, and that's why Americans can't stomach it. You know, people don't want to see, I don't think people, I think everybody would like due process to be respected.

And you just hauling people without any type of rhyme or reason or not rooted in anything or, you know, fabricating a clothing item or a tattoo and saying that this is the reason that this is happening and just shipping people like animals out,

I would like to think that that bothers the American people. It's one thing when you say criminals or people who came, like, illegally, and then they go through a problem, and then they have to go back because they didn't do things the right way. It's a whole other thing to just say, like, I don't even look at you as a person and I'm sending you back. And I'm sending you back in the worst way possible.

Particularly some of the brothers that I know that I know that were, like, friendly or willing to listen to Donald Trump. It bothers them because they come from a place where law infringes upon their rights all the time. to where they're illegally searched, to where they feel like they've had stuff planning on them, they get railroaded in the court system. And look, not all of these people have sterling criminal records, but they do feel that the court system and the criminal justice system should work fairly.

And so when you say, hey, they just picked this dude up, didn't give him his day in court, and just shipped them off to L.C. Salvador, they go, well, you can't do that. That ain't right. Why would they do that? And the first thing I always get is, now, they couldn't have done that.

There has to be some other reason. And I'm like, no, man, this is the deal. And I'll stay on you for three days. Look what happened in this case. Look what happened in this case. This is the way it's supposed to go. Well, he was a gang member. I'm like, would you, for you,

would you appreciate someone saying that you're a gang member just because you have a tattoo? And if it goes through an investigation and the judge says, he's not a game member. And they say, no, he is. And they just ship you out of here. And they go, hey, but he's not an American citizen. I fought this battle.

I'm like, hey, my man, if you are here in America, you have rights. Yeah. And these are the same rights that protect you. Once again, I think that the administration is overestimating. I'm not talking about the die-hard maga people. I'm talking about a lot of the people who swung the election this time. I think that they're overestimating the stomach for this stuff that the American people have. I really do.

All right. Got to get into it. It's the only story that anybody's been talking about all week. Donnie? All right. Shannon Sharp,

following news of the civil suit that was filed against him, his lawyers shared a series of text messages that they claim clearly indicate the nature of their relationship

was consensual and sexual in nature and in many cases initiated by her with specific and graphic requests. Like what? Donnie, we need you to read.

Like what? Some of the requests. include a big black baby. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. The people need to get a big black baby in me. Yeah, no, no, no, no, hold on for a second. Hold on. You're rushing.

You're being like, you're rushing. Don't rush. Some people might not be up to date on the story. Right. They need to understand the gravity of the situation. Right. So please. So she was texting him and like set the move.

Like she was saying what to him? I'm just going to read what's in the rundown. Donnie, okay, listen, we're making a show here. All right? This is infotainment at its best. It's what we do here at higher learning. So just think about the mindset she was in, what was going on, and please just read the text messages.

You know, we don't have studios book for a couple hours here. All right. She says, I only got what's in front of me. So I'm going to read what's in front of me. Okay, go for it. And it is, I want you to put a big black baby in there. And he's like Another example

Read number two Says I literally ate so much food I look like I'm pregnant With your big black baby Oh my God Donnie Jesus Christ

Number three Number three I've always wanted a black baby She didn't say big this time Shannon After these text messages were released He also posted A video that was in response to the lawsuit

Let's hear that real quick. Let's hear that. To my family, friends, supporters, and colleagues, I want to speak to you directly and from the heart. This is a shakedown. I'm going to be open, transparent, and defend myself because this isn't right. This is all being orchestrated by Tony Buzzley, who was targeted Jay-Z. Tony Busby targets black men, and I believe he's going to release a 30-second clip of a sex tape that tries to make me look guilty and played into every stereotype you could possibly imagine. That video should actually be 10 minutes or so.

Hey Tony, instead of releasing your edit, put the whole video out. I don't have it or I wouldn't myself. You know what happened and you're trying to manipulate the media. The encountering question took place during the day at her invitation and now that appears to be a deliberate setup. Coordinated by Gabby, also known as Carly on Only Fanes. Gabby and Tony Busby want $50 million. What they're getting is sued for defamation and trying to take me down. My career is all about real talk and honesty.

I know my family and fans know exactly what this is about. And I'm going to be out there telling you whatever I need to say, just like I always do. I love all you guys. Thanks. Now, that video was actually, just so we have the timeline correct here, the suit comes out. Then Chan Sharp and his team release explicit text messages where they're indicating that they were in a consensual relationship. And she's talking about put the big black baby in me. And by the way,

Donnie left out some stuff. Donnie, find the baby batter stuff. Okay? And then, you know, once you find it, please read it. But this video that you just saw from Shannon Sharp was actually in response to audio that came from TMZ. That audio is of a conversation between Gabby and Shannon, where Shannon seemingly threatens her.

Yeah, let's hear it. Allegedly Shannon. But it sounds like Shannon Sharp. It sounds like Shannon. Let's hear that. Well, you're coming to L.A. tomorrow? Yes. Well, I don't know why you want to go out.

Don't worry about it again. Well, okay. Okay, what? Well, I'm not really interested in getting choked. So I guess we're going. Yeah. I might choke you in public. Like I chose small white woman.

It's not a good look, Shannon. Not a good look that you do with the shit you did to me. That's the second one. The first one is a piece of audio where she says, hey, I don't like you manipulating me. And then he gets exasperated from her saying that and goes. If you say that again, I'm going to choke the shit out of you next time I see. And then they've also been text messages released.

And those text messages show that there was a conversation that they had where she tells Shannon, which is what's alleged in this lawsuit, that no means no, Shannon. She alleges that they were having a situation, a sexual encounter. And Shannon didn't want to wear a condom. And then he forcibly anally raped her. anally penetrated her without her permission. And then she says no means no in that. And he responds, I'll call you later.

So those are all of the accusations, all of the allegations. This stuff had just dropped when we did the last podcast. We did not have the opportunity to get all the information. And so it seems like there's more stuff trickling out every day. Tony Busby, who's a lawyer in this situation, we talked about this before, said that there was, this has been in mediations. This has been in mediation for a while.

Tony Busby said that $10 million was on the table. and they rejected $10 million from Shannon Sharp. And his attorneys confirmed that they did offer. They offered $10 million. That they offered. That was rejected. So not Tony Busby. Shannon Sharp's attorneys confirmed that he offered.

They said that. They said that. And then Tony Busby, then the Shannon's people came back and said, yeah, that's true. Yeah. To my knowledge, Shannon Sharp has not said that that is not him in the audio recordings. it's being alleged. Her side put it out there. It is my understanding he has not denied that that's him.

Just have to say alleged just to cover the ass of how to be. No, no, for sure. Because I'm saying that to say when you talked about the text messages that were sent January 2025 about where she says no means no, it's important to note that he didn't confirm or deny that either. He said, I'll call you later. Yeah. He also has said that he believes he's anticipating more things.

to come, which I believe he can speak to that because this has been in mediation for a while. So I do think that his side is aware that her side has recordings, videos, text messages, which is why he probably wanted to settle. But he did say that there's a video that he believes that is coming out. There's only going to be 30 seconds of it. He's already claiming that it's altered. And he wants the full 10 minutes or so released. Yes.

Yes. That's important to say too. Right. Here's the thing. Okay. So a couple of thoughts here. The first thought is I don't think that Shannon Sharp will be back on ESPN.

I don't know how he could be. Yeah. I don't think that Shannon Sharp will be back on ESPN. I think that this is probably enough for ESPN to walk away from Shannon Sharp. It's strike two. For him. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, there's talk now about how many different instances of this that have gone on with him. Well, yeah. It's out there. It's written. There's other lawsuits that have been filed.

Right. That are similar in nature. Other accusations that have been made. Okay. So I think that ESPN is done. I think the audio of him threatening to choke her twice was probably enough for ESPN to be like, we don't want Shannon Sharp around anymore. For sure.

You have two different platforms. Nightcap, which is a nightly show that he does with Ocho Cinco, and then Club Shay, which is, of course, wildly popular, long-form interview show that he does. One of the shows was he's in free agency with. He's looking for a new company to come along. It's probably going to get a bit bad for it. And the other one, he's been doing nightly,

despite everything that's going on and not addressing it. Why are we talking about Shannon Sharp's career here when there's an alleged assault that has taken? in place. I'll be completely honest. I do think that with the amount of text message screen grabbing and the amount of recording of

conversations, that there is at least a part of this from this young woman where she wanted to get Shannon Sharp. I do believe that. Now, I don't think it matters. A lot of people are focusing on the text messages and the nature of the text messages

and using that as a reason to say, oh, she was trying to catch him up and they feel sorry for him. Or they're taking his side in this situation. I was looking at he won a Webby Award for Club Shea She and maybe something else. And I was looking at the comments. He posted it yesterday. And I was looking at the comments, all the comments. are uplifting to him, supporting him, we stand by you, she can't stop you, we, like, all of that, totally ignoring, basically making a decision off what's been put in front of them and totally

ignoring that they're making room for the possibility that there could be a victim. And I think it's hard for people to look at some of the text messages that were said, to look at the fact that she's young, not black, and an only fan's model, and come to the conclusion that this was a setup. But what people failed to realize is, let's, she might, I mean, she's not might, she wrote these things,

she might like things sex in a certain way, but that doesn't mean that she is asking for it like that every single time. And you can't assume because on Friday, you had sex with someone this way, that that means on Wednesday you get to have sex with them the exact same way. She's saying that she said no, if that's true. And that's the thing we don't know.

We don't know. And I actually do like the way Stephen A. Smith talks about this. We weren't in the room. We don't know the nature of their relationship. We have no idea what happened. We don't know if this was a plan, if it wasn't, if he did do the things that she alleges. We have no idea. So I think that's why.

when you say, why do we speak about his career, I think because he's a public figure, you kind of have to talk about, well, what happens next? How does this impact him as a public figure? Because none of us can say what's true or not when it came to what went down in their sexual relationship. What was consensual?

What was alleged to not be consensual? The reason why I think it's important to talk about whether or not this is coordinated is for a couple of reasons. reasons. One, because it exemplifies to me the breathtaking irresponsibility that Shannon Sharp moved with in this situation, the breathtaking irresponsibility that Shannon Sharp moved with in this situation. Okay. Shannon Sharp asked allegedly, apparently, this young lady for an NDA a couple of different times, she said no every single time to the NDA. He asked, he asked, asked her to sign NDAs three different times.

And she said no. This is what's in the document. She said no, three different times to sign an NDA. And he kept going. And he kept going. That's in the lawsuit. And he kept going. He kept going.

He said this so many times. Yeah. And I, you know, I whispered men. But it really, I think it's a mixture of, yes, being a man. It's a mixture of power. it's a mixture of fame. It's a mixture of being accused of certain things in the past and it not sticking. It's a mixture of being accused in the past, being maybe released from a job and bouncing back bigger and stronger because of your name or your talent and thinking you're untouchable.

That's the only thing I can reason as to why your logic doesn't kick in of you are asking for an NDA. she is telling you no. She's telling you no for a reason. Because why wouldn't you sign an NDA? If you want to legitimately be with Shannon Sharp. Yeah. Why wouldn't you sign it? If I dated a public figure and they asked me to,

and I was into them and they asked me to sign an NDA, I'd be like, where? Yeah. It hurts you in no way. Right. Unless you're trying to profit off of it. Right. She didn't want to sign the NDA.

They continue. Or can I just make space for this? Because I just said something wrong. Yeah. I said unless you want a profit for it, or if something happens, happens to you that you do not agree to, you want to feel like you can fight for yourself in the legal system. I need to make room for that. So by the way, the story is out there.

I've done the research. He pursued her. This happened at my gym. So I've been asking around the gym about that. That they met at the gym? They met at the Equinox where I see Shannon Sharp and stuff like that. As for that, that didn't happen. They move on. The relationship becomes, I guess it evolves to a

point where she thinks it's exclusive. And it's actually the Instagram recording of the woman that sets this lady off. A lot of people believe that Shannon Sharp did that to answer

questions about his sexuality, that set this lady off, and she gets so upset about it that she decides to break it off with Shannon or she, you know, fridges Shannon or whatever. And then Shannon doesn't deal well with that and becomes abusive is what she is saying. There's just so much in there. Number one, that entire stunt that I believe was pulled purposefully by Shannon Sharp, one of the cornyer things that we've seen done, that has gotten him sued twice because there's a woman that's suing him from that incident as well. Her name is Michelle, from suing him from that incident. And he's also being sued

by a woman who was in a relationship with him. So that whole publicity stunt has gone as bad as a publicity stunt has gone that I've seen in my entire time of being connected to celebrity news. And now this is a fruit from, I guess, the poisonous tree as well. Right. That's what I'm saying. So I'm saying both of those things. It's that type of publicity stunts terrible.

The way he responded to this is one of the worst responses I've ever seen in covering celebrity news. he did everything possible to actually paint a picture of himself as the person that she indicated him to be in the lawsuit. He shamed her. Then he docks her. Then he came out and gave her only fan's name. Then he did everything possible to paint himself in the light of controlling

domineering, like ogre. I don't know how people don't see that. And then he compared himself, I'm JZ, I'm hot. Then he compared himself to JZ. He tried to use the same tactic that J.Z used in regards to coming, going after Tony Busby, where these situations are not the same at all.

Jay Z didn't know the girl. In this situation, you had a full, you had, this was going on for over a year. Like at least two years it sounds like that you are having this relationship, text messages, videos, audio recordings, traveling with this person. And you're trying to deflect the attention off of you and put it on Tony Busby for a different case, which to me is very revealing at the same time. You say, and like, I saw somebody say something like this and I have to agree, I'm paraphrasing here, but it bothers me when you get called. up in a situation as a public figure and then you try to make it at a community cause.

This isn't about black men being attacked. I'm sorry. This is not how I see this. And people can come at me for that if they want to. This is Shannon Sharp, as you said, not making correct decisions. I don't know. This is alleged. I don't know what's true and what's not true. But this isn't a community cause where the black community needs to rally behind you because a black man is being attacked. I'm sorry, that's not what it is. And when he says Tony Busby, what he does is go after black men, that he has ditty cases that are still relevant. The JZ one was not.

The Dishon Watson case. Yes, he came after Dishon. Those cases were settled. It's not like, JZ is the only one that has been thrown out basically. Well, we don't know in the whole. That we know of publicly. Because he's doing this off public thing. Right.

And JZ is the only one that we know of that was thrown out because it basically ended up being a frivolous lawsuit. That is not the case with DeShan. And if you look at Tony Busby's prominent cases, they deal with him representing Texas politicians, white men. They deal with oil spills, chemical releases. You're going to back for Tony Busby. No, I'm not.

I'm going against what Shannon Sharp is trying to do because it's not rooted in anything factual. I'm sorry, it's not him. The black man community cause thing really bothers me. This is my deal. I get what you're saying. There is no possible way. The only part of this that actually makes sense

is the Tony Busby part as terms of the response to me. Because if you... Oh, no, no, no. If you are going to respond to this and say anything, you have to bring up the fact that Tony Busby just got dinged.

You have to bring... You have to bring that up. You have to... You... What I wouldn't have done was victim shame. What I wouldn't have done was...

docks her. What I wouldn't have done is any of the things that make me look like the guy that's being portrayed in the lawsuit. However, if I am fighting this, I am definitely going to say the same lawyer that brought this case is the lawyer that Jay-Z just proved brings frivolous cases against powerful people. That's not what he said. I understand that. But I agree with you. I'm not saying I understand, I said if I was Jay-Z, I'd be hot that you got to throw my name into it. My thing is that he said Tony Busby goes after prominent black men. That's

not necessarily true. It's true from the perception of people that I've been watching Tony Bus. His name has only come up with Deshawn and Jay-Z and Puff. And Diddy. But as I just said, Deshawn's cases were settled. They weren't thrown out. The other Diddy cases have not been thrown out. Just the Jay-Z thing. So I don't like

you saying, using Tony Busby to say this is a vendetta against black men. Oh, you made some mistakes here, Shannon. I mean, look. You made some mistakes here. This is the thing with that. If this put your big black baby batter in me in 2023, it's got to be black baby batter in 2025, right?

It's like, you know, what I don't like is guys who use, black people's cultural pain as a fire extinguisher or a guy of jail free card. I'm agreeing with you. I'm agreeing with you. And so, you know, I can't speak much to what Shannon's politics are or

anything like that. I don't want to. But it seems as if in this situation the best thing for them to do would have been to release a statement, a statement that asserts his innocence, a statement that, a statement that,

talks about the fact that there'll be more evidence forthcoming. They've known that this battle was coming for a long time. So she had been ready to say something whenever this was going to come out and handled it in a way that defended Shannon, but also maintained a certain integrity of who he is, which is my problem with this entire thing. I live in my imperfection. I want people to know it.

We talk about that all the time, right? So I'm never going to be the person that moves with a purity. I'm never going to do that because I think that you're just waiting to fall, right? You're just waiting to fall if that happens. But man, your excellence has got to match your action. For sure. When you're, we care about being hot, being talked about all of that stuff, it matters, right? We care about that, being trending on social media.

having moments, having people talk about you. But prestige has to matter. It has to matter who you are. And if you have the excellence that Shannon Sharp has had over the course of his career with being an NFL Hall of Famer, being a Super Bowl champion, all of those things that separates you from the crowd, from the group, and all of that stuff, and then you go on to pursue that in media, you're going on to have this big career

that's actually survived a couple of these dings. At a certain point, you have got to take yourself seriously. And I'm sorry, man. It is not serious at all for you to be in an exposed relationship with a 19-year-old girl.

It's just not, it's completely unsurious. I'm not trying to judge the decorum or the conduct of people and police them in their bedrooms. And I'm not trying to come off like wholly other now. I'm not. But I'm saying, fuck, man. Like, shit. Like, dog.

Like, for real? It's irresponsible. Like, if nothing else, it's irresponsible in the way he handled it. Let's say for a second that she was. trying to run him up, or she was trying to set him up from the beginning. Let's just say for a second that that's true. Think about what it means for a 56-year-old grandfather to be taken to the cleaners and duped by a 19-year-old girl. He thought he was above it.

He thought, I'll give her 10 million. She'll be fine. And she said, no. But what does that tell you? Because the $10 million that she was offered, is a win. That is a, like, $10 million is a win.

The fact that she doesn't want the $10 million and she's going for $50. I have to make space for this. I don't even know that Shannon Sharp actually is sitting on $50 like that. I have to, well, he would pay her over time. But I have to make room for this. If I was assaulted,

there's no dollar amount. That's the thing. So that to me... An argument can be made both ways. It could have been planned. And it was like, I know I can get more. Or this happened to me

and you don't get to just throw it away because I feel violated. I was assaulted. There is no dollar amount. You don't just get to throw money at me. Well, there is a dollar amount because she's asking for more money. I'm just saying you,

and part of that includes, you know, emotional distress and all of that. But you don't get to throw me away and throw money at me. And it sounds like she wanted people to know what happened to her in addition to getting the money. There's a reason why she wants

this to be painful for him. And if she's actually asking for $50 million, I say that there was a dollar amount, I'm not necessarily sure, she's suing for $50 million, should I say. I'm not necessarily sure that he's going to be able to produce that. And now she's actually heard his earning potential because he's not going to be able to go out

and get this gigantic podcasting deal. But all of this tells me that there's a reason that she wants to inflict pain on him. And look, I had a conversation with my, and this is for everybody else that could find himself in this situation. Once again, not judging, not being the moral arbiter of things, none of that.

I had a conversation with one of my uncles one time, right? And, you know, this guy I like to use crack. Okay. Use crack. We have a very opening on this conversation. And I said to him, I said, how, why would anybody be on crack? Like, why would you use crack? Like, crack is proven to, like, fuck people's lives up

and end them. Like, why would y'all use crack? Why is crack the drug? And you know what he said to me? He said, the question isn't why I use crack. The question is why y'all are still using it. He was like, for us, when crack came out, it was some new shit. It was the next drug.

It was, oh, my God, we was doing cope. We was doing PCP. We was doing whatever. Crack comes out. It's the new drug. It's cheap is whatever. We don't have no clue. He said the question is not why we did it.

The question is why y'all are still doing it. That's the question. And when you see situations like this, the question is why is shit like this still happening? Is why are these chances still being taken? Is why, how could you find yourself in this situation? I really think I explained it. If you've gotten away, because there is, he has been accused before, not exactly like this,

but of a, of a being forced, forcing himself on someone, he has been accused before. You got away with it, right? Nothing happened about it. Whether, I don't know if it's settled, it went away, whatever, nothing happened with it. You lose your job at CBS. What happens next? you go on to be bigger and better. Thinking you are untouchable or invincible is a disease.

And I really think that that is what is happening when you see it keep happening again and again. They think that they're above it, that they are more valuable to somebody's team, to somebody's corporation, to somebody else's business, whatever it may be, to somebody, to people, where they think it'll go, I'll survive it.

We don't know what happened here. These are allegations. But God damn it, if this is not a stupid fucking situation to be in, man. Stupid. Stupid fucking situation to be in. Like we, look, once again, man, bad messenger. Everybody is imperfect, but I'm not talking about imperfect. I'm talking about fucking stupid and odd.

Oh, look, I don't do, look, you guys, I don't do the police and what people like, but my nigger, you're 54 years old. You're like, you, you, you, you, you, you're 59 years old. Like, even, you, like, remember how you were at 19. I'm just saying, it's like, even if it's like 23, 24, 25, I'm like, you know, you on the, you on your Leonardo DiCaprio shit, but it is what it is. 56. Well, not when this would have happened. Okay. So, like, they would have met in 23.

She would have been 19 then. The crazy thing is people kept telling him to stop. We got to play the Cat Williams clip, where Kat was like... Cat, Monique. He said, you can be this on one day, and in two weekends, they will take you down. And literally, that is what is happening. Okay. last thing I'll say is there's a possibility that you,

he's been talking about it. He said, just last week, he said, that don't stop them young ones from opening up. I saw that. He said that to Funny Marco. There's a possibility that you like him that young because there's a control thing. Yeah. It's like what Trick Daddy said.

It's different. 35, under 35 is different than 19. Okay, but he said he wanted the 20-something-year-olds. He did say under 35, but he wanted the 20-something-year-olds because basically the older women, they know too much. Yeah. There's obviously a level of control and manipulation when you want somebody that much younger than you.

Man, your actions have to match your excellence, man. We could say I've, you know, talked about J-Z on here and how I felt about the Colin Kaepernick. But I will say this about Jay-Z, you know, if me and Jay-Z don't, me and Jay-Z, I don't know fucking Jay-Z, but if I have disagreed with certain things that have done, that he's done or whatever, I will say this. He maintains his prestige. For sure.

He maintains his prestige. He didn't always, right? He had a situation where it was him versus his sister-in-law and an end-law and an elevator, that looks really bad. You know what I mean? Hasn't always. Hasn't always. But the lessons that have been learned, he

maintains his prestige. For sure. When people talk about the fact that like, J.Z isn't the hot rapper, Nas isn't the hot rapper, but they're still relevant in terms of their place in hip hop. Because there's respect.

There's prestige there. There's an understanding of excellence and prestige and they carry themselves like the cultural dignitaries that they are. Doesn't mean we agree with everything that they do. But there's prestige there. There's a thing there. And you have to care about that.

You have got to care about that. And this is a lesson for like all of us. You have to care about that. This episode is brought to you by WeatherTech. Everyone knows Winter is the MVP and make it a mess. You don't need WeatherTech floor liners in the summer, unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner. Or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips.

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Made to keep up with whatever comes next. New sweetgreen wraps hit different. Order now at order. Sweetgreen.com. Let's go to Doge. Elon Musk announced that he's going to be focused. and more on Tesla and less on politics after he told investors in an earnings call that Tesla's profits had dropped 71% from this time last year.

Quote, starting probably in the next month, May, my time allocation to Doge will drop significantly. So I think I'll continue to spend a day or two per week on government matters for as long as the president will like me to do so. Tesla CFO said the negative impact on the vandalism. Hell nah. What's the name? Baibov Taneha. Bibab Tenea.

Donnie said. Be culturally... Donnie, you have to be culturally respectful to these names, okay? So don't just skip the name because it's a tough pronunciation. You're right. I respect to Neas. The negative impact, Tenea said. A vandalism and unwarranted hostility towards our brand and our people had an impact

in certain markets. Tears? You got any tears for Elon? No. I think Elon came to do what he came to do. And I think he is bored, maybe a little embarrassed.

And now, I mean, money is always the motivating factor for him. And his decisions and his recklessness have caused him to something he built, to plummet drastically. And I think he wants to get back to building that.

I really, I mean, like, this was his playground. I think he had a goal in mind. He got a position. He's been able to infiltrate the administration. He's been able to have access to the White House and to, you know, private documents and be a part of meetings in ways that no businessman has ever has. I think he came. He saw.

He's bored. Oh, I don't think that's what's happened. I think that's a part of it. I'm not saying that that's everything. But I absolutely think he's like, all right. Now what? No, no, no, no, no. I think he's a big kid.

I think he's, I mean, I'm not saying that that's not true. I think he's facing a lot of pushback from shareholders here. No, no, for sure. Right. 71% is ridiculous in terms of the losses that Tesla is posting right now. I'll think something else as well. Elon Musk hasn't found community. He hasn't found community.

He is, God bless you. Thank you. He's one of the, the neediest luminaries, Titans of Industry, captains of industry that I've ever seen. He desperately, desperately, oh, here we go again, go forth.

God bless you. He desperately, desperately, desperately, desperately, desperately wants to be loved and liked. And he thought that he was going to find that community on the right, and it hasn't happened. The decision to take up

with these people, right? The decision to be one of Trump's acolytes was, oh, was supposed to buy him the same loyalty that it's bought every other person that Trump loves. That it buys Pete Hexeth, that it bought, you know, Candace Owens for a long time. Dan Boy Gingo, whoever you say his name, whatever,

let me, I'm talking about names. Whoever these people are, they are untouchable on the right, right? Candace is actually kind of broke with the Trump administration over the Israel stuff, yeah. But for a long time, all of these different people, Teflon on the right, you have a home. And let's be honest, that same home doesn't exist on the left. On the left, you have a vast coalition of people that have different needs and different wants. So you are constantly litigating your place there.

Yeah. Which is good to me because that to me means that you don't get the opportunity to just rest on your laurels and just be part of a group or a cult that legitimately, you are pretty much criticized day to day based upon what it is that you're doing. Now, some people don't get that. You have a, there's a blue mag occult as well. But if you, it doesn't matter how much you've done for electric vehicles in the environment, if you fuck up and let a racist on Twitter, you're out of the club, right?

The club on the right seemed a little bit more durable for him. He wanted to buy his way into that. He wanted to be. And he did, and they still kicked him out. There are reports that he is arguing with the Treasury Secretary, that people don't like Elon around, that Elon is annoying them, that Elon is wearing out his welcome. Now, as an advisor to the president, a government advisor to the president, I think he had like 100 days that he could work or 120 days that he could work anyway. So he was going to be. Yeah, this summer I was supposed to end.

Right, however, but there were other ways that he could have stayed around if he hadn't worn his one. welcome out. That plus the fact that he is seeing a direct financial impact from doing this, that he has now become an annoyance to one group of people. He went down to Wisconsin.

They got their asses kicked there in a special election. So he wasn't able to buy that election. The entire thing, he wasn't, he's worn his welcome out there magnificently fast, way faster than he wore his welcome out on the left. Because it took years, it took an actual change from him in terms of his politics and his, his awkwardness.

That he probably is like, let me crawl back into whatever a hole that I was in before as an anonymous, not an anonymous, but a lower key rabble-rousing billionaire person. And let me rebuild confidence in Tesla. Tesla's done. It's over. It's over. Tesla now, the Tesla sign has become an insignia that is representative of something that is dangerous to a lot of people. Like, I drive a Tesla. I've had a Tesla for a while, right?

The car is gone. The car is going to be gone. I was like, y'all got rid of the car? We're about to. Like, the car is going to be gone. Because of this. Yeah, could never see. Like, now it's like, it's not a cool thing to.

be in the Tesla anymore. It's not a cool thing to be in the car. It doesn't mean what it meant before. It doesn't mean... It represents so much more, yes. It represented a future with clean energy. Sure. And it lets all of that stuff, at least cosmetically. I'm not sure what the environmental impact and all of that stuff was, you know, the batteries and all that stuff. But it doesn't represent that anymore. It represents a guy who gave a Nazi salute. It represents a guy who, uh, it represents oligarchy now. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it represents like a lot of things that are discussing and grotesque, that's not going to change.

Right, right. But that's not going to change. That's what happens. The people's response to Tesla is America in action. Mm-hmm. That they're saying, hey, we don't like this. And another thing about that, what a dumb, stupid miscalculation. You sold these expensive-ass electric cars to liberal coastal elites.

you don't even, they don't even have fucking chargers for the Tesla, like in Baton Rouge and stuff like that. There's some, but you can't even, this is a Miami, L.A., maybe Atlanta, New York Mobile, San Francisco Mobile, right? That's what it is. And then you turned around and kicked those people in the nuts. You know why? It's kind of similar what I said with Shannon Sharp. The stock in Tesla, while he was promoting. Trump went up because I had it.

It went through the roof. Tesla stock had been going down for years. No. Last summer, it was up. I'm telling you, it was up. Huh. And after the election is when things started to go down. I'm not sure about that, Rachel.

I'm, I had it. I know, but what I'm telling you is... I don't have it anymore. Tesla stock has been suffering now for a couple. Maybe I'm wrong about this. This is... Donnie? Let's do a who's right.

All right. Unless I'm mixing up 2023 and 2024. When did Tesla stock start to go down? We can get up right now. Tesla stock. It saw a massive rally in the fourth quarter. It fell in the first few months in 2024. And then it dropped after the election.

It went from 182 in May to 409 in November of 20. So there was a, the stock had started to fall, there was a rally, and then it fell again. Yeah. So I guess we're kind of both right. So I guess, I guess my point is I think he thought, because there started to be an uptick, that maybe he was good, he was safe. And I mean, he was drinking his own Kool-Aid. He really thought, and I mean, I would talk to people. There are people who were maybe conservative moderates who were excited about what the possibility of what Doge could be, of what Doge could be, of what Doge

could do. And then to your point, in what you were talking about with immigration, the rhetoric did not match the practice of it. And that's what Elon Musk underestimated. Also, you talk about him wanting community. He's just not like a likable, he's not like a likable guy. Like, he's, he's socially awkward. So it makes sense that he also underestimated the community that he would or wouldn't gain, because he just doesn't have, like, that's just not that person. Yeah, there's an incident where he walked out on stage with Dave Chappelle. People booed him. I forgot about that. Reportedly he was destroyed by that.

And, you know, he also had an issue where one of his children became trans. Right, right. Or came out as trans when it became trans or born trans, but came out as trans. And that bothered him to a point to where it just destroyed him. He cried and all that dumbass shit. It seems as if that he hasn't found his tribe. He's trying to create his tribe by impovered. impregnating every single woman that will allow herself to be impregnated by him.

And now he wants to step back into the shadows a little bit as he's also seen his finances take a head. But, I mean, look, they were never going to fully accept Elon Musk. It wasn't. And by the way, Trump tried to get them, Trump tried to get them to buy Teslas. He tried to get them to do it. Like the group of people who are going to buy Teslas and be loyal to the Tesla brand, that group is incongruent with the Trump supporter. Yeah.

It's an electric car. It's not a Ford F-150, all right? It's not even the same group of people. It was a really, really interesting cultural miscalculptial. calculation by Elon Musk. Tesla stock rose to 488 in December of 2024. Now it's at 239. That's at the beginning of April.

Right. This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable Internet means everything for your business. And even this podcast, that's why I trust Spectrum Business. They keep companies of all sizes connected with Internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone, TV, mobile services, plus 24-7 U.S.-based support. millions of business owners already trust Spectrum business. So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas.

For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matters. Tramphaya offers self-injection or intravenous infusion from the start. Trimphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject Tramphia, proper training is required. Tramphia is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis. Serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver

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I don't know. I'm not sure anymore. You're not sure? Yeah, I don't know. Are you starting to question? Dakota researches exoplanets and the evolutionary and the evolution of planetary systems. For UCLA, he did research at the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for astrophysics

and the NASA Goddard Space Flight Center. He played football at the University of Kentucky. Nice. From 2010 to 2013. What that is young? Dakota are you there? What's up? Nice to be here.

Thanks for having me. So you played safety at Kentucky from 2010 to 2013? Absolutely. Absolutely. Yep. I was a little hard-hitting safety action. Who is that? I can't see.

You see that right there? It's LSU, baby. I can't see it. It's LSU. LSU. Don't worry about it. Let me, yeah,

let me tell you something. We took some hefty losses in LSU when I was there. But we got some wins too. We got some wins too. So look, with Khalifa, who we love, as a rapper,

I love cushioned orange juice. Okay. You know, he has a song called Never Been, which has a Nintendo sample on it. And we can't get the original cushion orange juice version of that record because of the Nintendo,

and Nintendo won't clear the sample. It's a crue. crazy, like the game on Killeda sample. So I love Wiz Khalifa. But Dakota, PhD candidate astrophysics at UCLA, former safety. When are you going to get your PhD? When is that happening? Two weeks from today.

Wow. Congratulations. That's what I'm talking about, Dakota. Yeah, I defend in two weeks. Very excited about that. I will be going by Dr. Dakota Tyler. Do you. Can we start it now?

I will just call you Dr. Dakota. We'll do it now. Let's do it. Yeah, practice. But Wiz Khalifa was on the Joe Button podcast, and he was talking about flat earth theory, and he gave his reasons that's why he thinks the earth is flat. We want you to hear these.

Play it for it, Donnie. Is the Earth round? I would say no. What shape is it? I just believe that we live on a flat plane. Yeah, like a huge flat plane. Yeah. It's only because I've traveled so much, and I see like...

Did you ever get to the edge of the earth? No. It's not that. There's more, I think that there's more masses than just what we see. Just the earth. Because we lived, it was one thing before, and it's like spread out. So it's layered like a pastry? I wouldn't say layered like a pastry.

I would just say like, if this rug was the world, we would probably be like over there somewhere. And then there's just way more. There's other shit that we have discovered. Got it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Now you're alive? Take that. Okay. Okay. So Dakota, I'm going to ask you, all right? And let's do this. For the sake of this argument, let's treat flat earth theory like it's actually a thing. Dakota, why is the earth not flat? Why is it not flat? Yeah. You think, I'm assuming you think flat earthers are wrong. Why are they wrong? So the reason, it's pretty straightforward. And it's just that none of our observations are consistent with that. You would expect if something was true that when you looked out and observed the universe,

when I pull out a telescope and look at another planet, we should find every single piece of evidence in alignment with some Earth that's flat in a plane that could be described within the universe. And it just isn't true. No observations that we make are consistent with that. It doesn't make sense. Even observations that you can make for yourself won't be consistent with what you would expect. But I like that starting point, assuming that it's true, right?

That's what we do as scientists. I have a theory. I assume I'm right. I try to find observations that match that. And then more importantly, I try to poke holes in my theory and my observations to prove to the community that I'm actually showing something that's real and not relying on belief. He did use the word belief. He believes that it's a flat plane,

but he doesn't really have a lot of evidence that it's a flat plane. Why does this keep happening? I mean, I'm sure there are other scientific theories that people, you know, have conspiracy theories about, but this is a theory that seems to be very popular with prominent figures. He's not the first we've heard say this. Why do people consistently want to believe that the earth is flat? And is there any benefit in believing that the earth is flat?

I think that that's a really good question. And this really gets at the heart of a lot of conspiracy theories. People that pay attention to history, society, politics do not have a high amount of trust just blindly for the government. And that makes sense. I mean, as a black man in this country, I 100% understand. why you wouldn't just blindly trust authority. And what that rolls into if you don't have, if you're not studying astronomy,

if you're not studying any one of the fields where these conspiracies pop up, is that you just start to believe that they're lying to us about something because they've lied to us about a lot of things. And you get very, very vague. It's that they're lying to us. And you start to like lose sight of reality. But as somebody who studies these things every day,

it's not a matter of me believing what the government says, right? It's not like NASA is in my ear feeding me lines. I'm using a telescope in making these observations. And I think that it's an important conversation. It's a nuanced conversation because people that don't trust the government and authority for very good reason will now misapply that mistrust in areas where they may not have expertise, where they don't know all of the facts. But I think it comes from something that we all have, which is that you're not just going to lie to me about everything.

And I'm just going to believe it without thinking about it for myself. So, you know, I understand that. Interesting, Dakota. I've got me wondering who you're working for, who you're working on behalf of. You said before that there are observable things about our environment or in our environment that can lead a person to, see that the earth is not flat. What are those things? What would those things be?

One of the most straightforward ones, I'm here in L.A., so I go to the beach from time to time, and you can grab your cell phone. You can grab a little cheap pair of binoculars and watch a boat, literally sail off into the horizon, and when you zoom in, you'll notice that the bottom of the boat disappears before the top. It doesn't all disappear at the same time.

And the way that you explain that, you know, imagine that you're looking at this curve surface as a boat is sailing away from you. What you would expect as it traversed that curve is that the bottom would disappear before the top. That's a simple observation that anybody could make. You don't have to travel. You don't have to go anywhere. You just go to a beach. Aha. And let me tell you why I'm saying this.

I watched a flat earther be interviewed for this conversation with you. I'm on you guys. You guys are trying to trick us, Dakota. He said that the reason why that happens that way is because you can only see so far. And you, it's actually the fact that you can't see that far that makes it disappear. But if you put a telephoto lens on it and you look. looked at it, you would just keep seeing the boat and keep seeing the boat and keep seeing the boat and keep seeing the boat for as long as the lens would then observe the vote. Ha, Dakota, what do you say to that?

Yeah, that's what that person said, but that isn't true. You can do this test for yourself. You can do this for yourself. And you'll see that no matter how far you zoom in, it's not going to shrink, you know, it's going to the bottom will literally van derives. before the top. You can do a test that anybody can do for themselves. I've never heard of that.

That's so interesting. What do you think Wiz meant what he said, I've traveled a lot? And what? Like, what, what does he say? This makes sense. You know, we all have experiences

and people cannot tell us that our experiences didn't happen to us. If he's getting on planes and he's flying places, he's not getting the feeling, perhaps, you know, I'm putting words into his mouth a little bit, but he's not getting the feeling,

feeling that he's flying around a globe. And I mean, you don't get that feeling when you walk to your car that you're walking along a curved surface either. And I really think that that's pretty much it. It just doesn't seem like you're flying around a globe because it's so large that it seems flat. I mean, here's another test you can do. You get a basketball, some sort of ball, and take a picture with your iPhone and zoom all the way in as many times as you can. you can't anymore, screenshot that, zoom in some more. Eventually, you will get to a point where that ball, zoomed in enough, looks like a flat plane.

And if you imagine that you were a little pixel on there and you were flying in a plane, it would seem like you were flying in a flat plane. But that's just because the earth is so large that the tiny part that we walk on doesn't seem to have curvature. But once you step back and you see a picture of Earth from space, for example, you're like, oh, okay, you know, this is a round sphere. Why do planets and celestial bodies like, you know, other types of moons and things like that,

why are they spheres or circles or whatever? Why aren't they squares or stars or whatever? Yeah, that is. This is a really interesting question. It basically comes down to energy not being wasted in the universe. So you imagine some big huge mass, exists. And it sort of pulls on itself. We call it gravity. You can think about gravity in a couple different ways. But one easy way is that the center of that mass is pulling equally in all

directions. And what happens to something that you pull equally in every direction? It doesn't end up as a triangle or square. Because right, that would mean that you were pulling harder at the top than you were at the corner. But if you pull equally everywhere, then you end up with a a sphere. This is why we see spheres in space so much. Interesting. Is it bad that I don't care if the earth is flat around? No, I don't, I really don't think it's bad. It's not a, I mean, I believe it's round, but I'm just saying, it's bad. I don't really, no, like, I don't really, when people talk about it, I'm like, does it, does it make a difference in your life? It probably doesn't make a difference in

your life, but there's nuance there as well. Because if the reason that you, um, are, um, are, ambiguous about it or like the reason why you don't really know which way to go is because you are like misunderstanding and mistrusting science or evidence then I think that that could show up in other areas

of your life. Yeah. When you see, right? Because that's, I mean, how do you know to believe anything? Sure, sure. How do you know to believe doctors about this? How do you know?

And so you've got to, I do think that it's important to have a baseline understanding of why we trust the scientific method or even just scientific principles that you can apply towards finding truth for yourself in some other area. But yeah, like big picture,

you go through your whole life not know whether the earth is round or flat is probably not going to make a difference in your life materially. But it's a rejection of science that's alarming and it's been given a lot of fuel and fire. We had fucking figured this out. I never heard,

I'm sure there's always been a flat earth society and all of that stuff, but it was a fringe, kook situation that existed before then, before now. And now it's on fire again because of the motherfucking internet. Now let's move on. When in history, because we observed the earth as a sphere, long before we could get up in a spacecraft and go see the earth from space.

When did we first come upon the realization, that the earth was in fact round. Is this like Copernicus or something like this? Like, when was this? Oh, way before that, way before Copernicus. It was in ancient Greece. Don't remember the exact time.

But people were thinking about this. They were thinking about how could you do a test to see what the shape of the earth was. And one way that they came up with is, and it makes sense if you think about it, if the earth is a sphere and the sun is like out at some distance, you could measure the shadows of objects that are the exact same height at the exact same time. And if they're in different locations, because the sunlight is coming in from a different angle, right?

The sun kind of moves across the sky as the earth spins. Then you would measure different heights of shadows. And you can do some trigonometry, a little geometry. And then you could figure out how much curvature there was between those two places. So this was a test that was done in ancient Greece. This was done a very long time ago. Wow. Half that went over my head.

I'm curious as to what else. You said you go to the beach and you take your telescope out there. What else do you see? What do you see? What do I see when I take my telescope? I'm just now, now I'm going to take a huge jump. I'm just now coming to accept that we are not alone. Alien?

Yes. Do you believe that? Yes. But the caveat being that I don't think that they're here. I do think that they're out there, but I don't think that they're here because the distances are insane. Like you wouldn't believe how far the closest star is to us. It's hundreds of trillions of miles. And that's the closest star. So it's like, how do you, how would they get from there to here? I got some thoughts. Do you believe that? But do you believe that? Sorry. You believe that because of some of it's based in science or just because, you know, some people are like, it's impossible to think that we're the only people here.

No, you can make a really good statistical argument for that. Like, we don't know how common life is. That's true. We don't really know. Let's say that it's one in a trillion. Let's just say that that's out of a trillion planets, one of them has life. Well, we think that there are trillions of planets just in our galaxy. So if you just go off of that very conservative estimate,

then you would say that there's probably a couple other planets with life, statistically, just in our galaxy. And then, you know, there are other galaxies. So I do think that you can make that statistical argument. You couldn't say it's impossible, though, right? Like we don't have the data to back up saying that it's impossible. But that's what I think is well. I think that there's probably no way that we're the only.

life. Nothing comes in ones that I'm aware of. There's not one planet. There's not one star. There's not one galaxy. There's not one human. There's not one society. I don't know anything that comes in ones. So I wouldn't, I wouldn't guess that life was just us. Is it possible that they learned how to fold space? Is it possible that they learned how to, is it possible that Miguel Alcabere says that a warp drive is possible? He says if the math checks out, we don't have the engineering. Is it possible that they have the engineering? That can do that. Is it possible that they've learned any of these things, Dakota? That's, you know, this is where as a scientist, all I can say is we don't know how to do it.

That doesn't mean that it's that it's not possible. And we're not that advanced, you know. 300 years ago, we didn't have electricity. So, you know. Crazy to think about that way. It's so crazy when you say it like that. It's insane. We would like, we, we live in this. in this time that no other human beings have ever had. I think about that a lot. Yeah. You know, when we're, when I'm having a bad day or I'm struggling or I feel like I'm, you know, down on my luck, whatever, if you just think the kings and queens thousands of years ago didn't have AC, they didn't have refrigerators, they didn't have heating, they didn't have like running hot

water. We're, we're really living better than almost any humans ever have. And so I can only imagine in 5,000 years what, what are humans going to be doing? Maybe they'll be folding space for fun. That may be like a kid's app. Right. And, you know, just to waste the time, who knows? All right. But before we let you go, got Black Space Week is coming up.

That's what I've heard. Do you know anything about this? Yeah, yeah. This is an event put on by Black and Astro organization that I'm in. It's like a grassroots movement to connect Black voices in space. and the broader community. Because there's not a lot of black people in space, as you might, as you might guess.

And it's really important to build that community and have conversations like this because there is a lot of black people that are interested in space. So there's a little bit of a disconnect. Interesting. Did Blue Origin happen? Yeah, I mean, I think it happened.

Here's the thing. I don't think it's impressive as you think that it might be, which may cause you to be like, If I was going to fake something, you know, as a person with slightly above average intelligence, I would have faked something way more impressive. It wasn't impressive enough to fake. Okay.

I think they fumbled the PR on that, in my opinion. Before we let you go, Dakota Tyler, Dr. Dakota Tyler. Doctor. Astro physicists, UCLA. Almost fucked up to school. Kentucky Safety. the coach was I was there for Brooks

Joker Phillips I thought it was Stoops brother You were there for Stoops Yeah I was my last year Stoops was there Yeah so I was trying to figure out the coach before Stoops You're sure that the earth isn't flat

Yeah it's like As sure as you are that you need to breathe right after this breath to keep living. Wow. Wow. Okay. Whiz, Lord Jamar, all of you brothers out there, man, we get it, but the earth isn't flat. It's not flat, guys. Okay? It's like, you know, it's, we talk, I don't get as offended as a lot of people do

with the earth's flat thing, but we just, Dakota's here, he's black. He doesn't work for the CIA. The earth isn't flat. The earth isn't flat, okay? It's not flat and that's okay. The earth isn't flat and that's okay. Dakota, thank you for joining. Thank you for joining, man.

We're going to reach back out and talk to you guys when Black Space Week is coming up. For sure, yeah. Thanks for having me. By the way, you can follow me on all socials at DT StarKid. And I do talks to students. I do keynotes. You can check out my website, www. W. dakota Tyler.com and get in contact with me.

Thanks again for having. No problem, brother. Thank you for being here. Appreciate you for being here, man. Thank you. Tell you, Dean, Kels off, but do not stop learning. I'm Pan Lathan Jr. I'm Rachel and Lindsay.

Bye, guys.