Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - 'South Side' With Diallo Riddle and Kanye Loves Hitler

Episode Date: December 2, 2022

After welcoming Ashleigh Smith, the newest member of the pod, Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay discuss LeBron James’s comments about the non-coverage of the Jerry Jones controversy (20:16), and Kanye West's praise for the author of 'Mein Kampf' (37:09). Plus, writer and producer Diallo Riddle joins to discuss his underground hit shows 'South Side' and 'Sherman’s Showcase' (54:04). Hosts: Van Lathan Jr. and Rachel Lindsay Guest: Diallo Riddle Producers: Donnie Beacham Jr. and Ashleigh Smith Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, yo, yo, thought warriors. What is up? Higher learning is on. It is I, Van Lathen, Jr. And it's me, Rachel and Lindsay. Rachel and Lindsay. Rachel, I'm in Atlanta. Hey, wings.

Wings. Wings. You know that's my food. Right after pork chops. I love me some wings. So have some for me. Let's get something out of the way. First of all, I'm not having any wings.

I'm really in a good groove of my diet. Thank you for, trying to throw me off track. Can I tell you all something real quick? Make me feel bad, yeah. I'm going to be real with you guys. This time next year, I'm going to be like Brian. I'm lifting so hard.

Good. I'm going. I'm in there, man. I'm doing, I might be the fattest nigger who can plank in the whole gym. I might be the best fat nigga at planks. How long? In all of L.A. How long you go? I can hope, yo, I can do, not only can I hold a plank for a

minute and a half, right? Okay. Damn. But I can do the planks where they take the viper, you know, like the, you know what the, the viper thing, the, uh, the little, it's like a circle with handles on it at the gym. It's like a circle with handles on it. You hold it like. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah. So I can do the planks for a minute where they put the viper under me and I, one hand, I move it, and I move it. Oh, oh, oh. Man, I'm, um, hashtag fat strong baby that I'm in there doing like I'm in there like I got respect from Shannon Sharp I got respect from Magic Johnson I'm feeling good working out that's what's up I'm proud of you we have somebody new jump on now Ashley hey no no no face

turn your camera on face welcome hey what's up what you actually actually is our new producer here on higher learning today. Yes. Ashley is from, dude, why would I, tell everybody about yourself. I'm from Denver,

native here, born and raised, one of the few, new podcast producer here, trying to come through to L.A. as much as I can to hang out with you guys. Yeah. We'll see.

Good, because Donnie never does. So that'd be good. You're already, you're already one up. Okay. Look, band is in Atlanta right now. Shut up, Donnie.

It won't come see you. It won't come see you, Donnie. You're right. Call him out. Let me ask you something. Ashley, where did you go to college? I went to college in Oxford, England. Tell the people.

Talk your shit, black lady. Oxford English. She went to Oxford. Yeah. Yeah. She went to Oxford. We don't have no ITT Techians in this. shout out to everybody

and went to ITT Tech. That was so classic. Yeah. Wow. Ashley, stay on real quick. I've ever told you guys my ITT Tech story real quick. So my cousin got out of jail.

And his mother was like, you promised that you would go to ITT Tech when you got out of jail and that you would go there and then you would make something better of yourself. So he's like, damn, I'm trying to get out of him. I'm trying to hustle, get back on my hustle or whatever,

whatever. She wanted me to go to ITT Tech. I got to go to ITT Tech, whatever. So there's like this orientation, little class that you do. It's a technical college in Baden Roos, a little orientation class that you do. So I went with him. Maybe like 14. He's maybe like 21.

And they should have used this as an ITT tech commercial. Is it ITT tech or DeVry? I can't remember. But they should, it's either one of them. I can't remember. But they should use it as a commercial. Let me tell you how. Because when you go there and you do the,

the little orientation, they make you like put together, they make you do something technical. They like to give you this little board and they make you like solder this little thing. And then at the end of it, you press this little button and your LED light lights up. Like you build a little light. It's very easy to do. But they say, hey, this is kind of what we're going to be doing here. And you're going to learn how to do stuff. Obviously, everybody in the class made their little thing light up.

Everyone did. everyone did everyone made that little thing light up when this nigga made his shit light up he thought he was fucking nicola Tesla like you could it was so inspiring he was like moved he felt like he had invented fucking fire guess what he does now

what's what my cousin does now what he's an electrician he went on and he finished at the technical college I can't remember which one it was now he finished at the college He never spent another fucking minute in jail. He found his calling. And now he is the guy that knows everything about electricity.

As a matter of fact, forever build a house and have him come out here and put the electric stuff in there. So that's a story about technical college. It has nothing to do with you. Once again, I have. I love that story. But happy ending.

There is a good happy ending. You do not have to lie to kick it. I love happy endings. Y'all remember that commercial? Yes. Was it the guy who was yelling at you? And he was like, who, why are you sitting on the couch? It's Everest.

Why do you sit on the couch? Get up. My question is, where is that motherfucker now? I need to see what he's doing. I want him on the podcast. I absolutely want him on the podcast. Find the guy from Everest. Ashley, your first task, find that guy.

Your first mission, if you so choose it, is to find him. So when you went to Oxford, were there other, Negro Americans or blacks of any kind there? I met two. Two blacks? Yeah, from Colorado, weirdly enough. And you guys were all ladies? Yes.

And I was walking past them and I heard their accent. I was like, hello. You were like, oh my God, niggers. And you just turned around and you ran over there. Basically. So like out of how many? Two out of how many? Thousands.

Thousands. Yeah. Wow. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Did you guys start a singing group? So it was like the third day and they had to go somewhere.

I had to go somewhere. And I never saw them again. So I have no idea where they went. So wherever you are. Ashley. Thinking about, yeah. Singing group. That's like a real story.

That could be like pitch perfect Oxford. Let me ask you a question. Okay. So did you make friends at Oxford? I did. You know, it took a second. But yeah. Cockcloids?

Uh, yeah, yeah. So what you're trying to tell me? Spicy ones from Europe. Spicy. So you, what you're telling me is that. Yes. You saw two black ladies, you let them pass. Yes.

But as soon as you saw Becky, Amy, Savannah, you were like, I got to move to the next level in life. So these are friends, I got to make an Oxford. Well, they're more like Elizabeth Cades because they're British. Ashley can hang. We're happy to have you. We're going to be getting deep, deep into your personal life and the things that you like. I'll do my best, Ash. I'll do my best.

Hopefully, hopefully, you know, hopefully you get on here and you're embarrassed yourself. That's the way that we do it. Okay. Then I'm going to do great then. All right. That's Ashley, everybody. That's Ashley. All right.

Um, it's been quite a day, Rachel. Has it for you? I mean, not really for me. Well, it was kind of quite a day for me. So I took the red eye out last night. Oh. Because I got to do some stuff while in here, Atlanta. So I took the red eye.

And I had the middle seat. Whoa. Whoa. Were you flown out? Uh, yes. See, here's the thing. Where's a Ronde? Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

But here's the thing. It was a late one and there was nothing in first class. There was only one left in comfort plus and it was a middle seat and I didn't want to sit kind of in the back of the plane. So it's kind of like my decision. Okay. It's kind of like my decision. I didn't want to sit in the back of the plane. So it was like I'd rather be in comfort plus.

I might have had the most uncomfortable flight I've ever had before my life. First of all, I bought this thing from Amazon. which is like this it's supposed to be this this inflatable pillow that you can put your head in wait wait you put your head in the front not in the back okay

you put your head in like this and you like and you hold on to it I looked like the biggest fucking idiot in the history of aviation so you got pictures no I didn't I threw that motherfucker away when I got out the plane

So I sit down and I sit down. Donnie, pull up a picture of this inflatable thing. Like it's an inflatable pillow that you blow it up and then you hold it. You put your arms in it and you put your face in it. Right? You put your face in the, in the, there's a little hole in the top of it. And you put your face in it. Right.

And you're supposed to like hold you up so you could go to sleep. I thought that's going to work since. No. You've seen it. This is it. Turn around, let me see. Wait, this is not it. This can't be.

Hold on. Let me get a bigger picture. This can't be it. This can't be it. That's it. No. Okay, hold on. I'm making my background.

There's a picture of somebody. Y'all, please turn on the video right now. There's a picture of somebody doing this. I can't believe you flew like this. This is your own fault. Yeah, that's the thing. It's just, it's like, I'm not going to be able to concentrate the whole podcast.

Yeah, that's the thing. So, so first of all, let me tell you how this goes. I get on the plane, I get on the plane, and I sit down, two people, they're nice, left and right. They're a couple. They're taking the aisle seats because I'm in the middle, in the middle, right? There's three in the middle. They're taking the aisle seats, so they left the one in the middle to whatever plebeying was going to come in there and sit down in the middle. seat.

Okay. I'm telling, like, they asked me, they go, okay, what are you there? What are you going out to Atlanta for? The Southerners. And I go, oh, I'm going to watch LSU play in the national championship game. And they go, huh. And I'm like, what? In the SEC championship game, they go, huh.

I go, what? They go, well, we're Alabama fans. And I look over at the guy. He's in full crimson and white. So it's fucked up from right then, right? Because now I had a rapport with these people, but now I got to say something. I have to say something smart. Okay.

So I looked at him. I go, tough break, man. Maybe you guys can try again next year. He's like, try again. Huh. beat y'all like eight years in a row. it's like, well, it's not eight years in a row.

It's this year. You know what I mean? You don't bring the thing on there inflate it. You got to blow it up while you're on the plane. Okay. So you get there and you got to sit down and this is your head goes into the little thing at the top. Okay. Your head goes into the little thing at the top. You put your arms in the middle of it.

Right. And then you're like this. Okay? You're like this. And you, you, and you try to sleep. So I pull out, it comes with a little carrying case.

So I take it out of the carrying case and I'm blowing it up and the stewardess right away comes over to my seat. What are you doing? I'm like, oh no, this is a flable pillow. She's like, oh, okay. I'm like, what the fuck? And what, what are you going to say?

No, I mean, I would have been a little nervous too. What are you doing? That's not normal behavior. People don't do that. The guy next to me goes, is that going to take long? And I'm like, actually, I don't know. Fucking gump.

I don't know how long it's going to take. So I blow it up. I put on interstellar because the Hans Zimmer Cornfield soundtrack puts me to sleep. Okay. So we're in the air now. I'm hugged over in the thing. You know,

I got my head in the little, the little deal and the whole nine you know what I mean and what happens the fucking thing runs out of air I wake up back hurting there's a leak in the air thing

I looked over I'm crunched over that's how you're supposed to be in it that's how you're supposed to be I couldn't get it to work that's how you're supposed to be there I couldn't get it to work so I gotta watch

I gotta see. That's how you're supposed to use it. That's how you're supposed to use it. I couldn't get it to work. And so, and so now I got this thing, right? It's half inflated. It's like,

it's like the, the row is super tight. Even though we're in comfort plus, it's still like, it's not used to what I've been flying. You know, I've been flying, I haven't flown this way in a while, you know. So it's still,

like taking up mad space and people are getting grumpy like people yeah I would have been upset too people are getting grumpy you know what I mean and I can't get comfortable it's 11 o'clock and I still haven't been asleep like I can't get comfortable I could not fall asleep

so I had a very rough flight then I get in here and in booking it I forgot that you can't check in to your hotel at like seven in the morning. You know what I mean? So I'm here. The hotel is very nice.

Like I'm here. You can't check into your hotel at like seven in the morning. And it took a guy coming like, hey, yeah, I know him. I'll find him a room. We'll find him a room. Like, fuck. And I came in here and I try to sleep,

try my best to go to sleep. No, Bowesman had to go to the vet this morning. It was stressing me out. I know. Because Kalika and I were supposed to do something today. Bozman's going to be okay. Copper had a similar issue. I was trying to tell her about it.

Listen, I don't know who in their right mind would see this and press purchase on Amazon. I don't know how you thought this would be comfortable. First of all, she looks like she's suffocating. Sufficating. Is there an opening where she can breathe? There's an opening.

There's an opening in it. I thought it made a lot of sense. Because when I sleep on a plane, I normally sleep with my head. If I want to sleep and I'm not, if I don't have the lie flat seats, When I've slept in, I either sleep with my head on the window or I sleep with my head on the seat in front of me. So, like, I sleep like that.

I can't sleep going back when I'm on the plane. So I thought that would work. It was, I wrestled with that thing for at least an hour. It doesn't look comfortable at all. I, these need to be banned. And I feel like they will be on a no-fly list very soon. This is the van. This is the funny.

So it's in the room with you still. No, I threw it away. Oh, man. Yeah, I got off the plane. I was so, and then I got off the plane. So I stand up on the plane. I'm all disheveled. You know what I mean?

Because I'm like, I maybe, maybe those off for like one second. I got one earpod in my ear. I can't find my other air pod. Everybody has to exit the whole plane until I find my other airport. It's just, it was just like a, at least the flight was. smooth. I can't stop. So now I'm here.

I'm glad you're here. I hope you got a little bit of a nap. I'm glad. I got to do stuff with LSU and figure it out. Wait, is that what you're there for really to do stuff with LSU? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, that's really cool. Yeah.

Do stuff with LSU. So LSU flew you in a middle seat. Texas would never. It's not LSU technically. Technically, it's an organization. it's an organization. And by the way, I made the decision late. How's that sound?

I made the decision late. Like an excuse. Well, how about this? Let me tell you what it is. You know why Texas would never have to do that? Because money bags, Texas long horse, $1 billion endowment, they would just send the PJ out.

Actually, more than a billion, with 10 billion or something like that. They would just send the PJ out. Send the P. No, y'all definitely got more money than us. Definitely, that's for sure. I was recently nominated for, and I'm hoping I get it, for outstanding alum, under 40 at Texas. Hope I get it.

The NWACP Image Awards? No. At the University of Texas. So you wouldn't accept the Image Awards? I didn't say it. They don't even have. That's not even an award. That's not even an award.

Don't do me. Don't do me. I hope your day gets better. That is cool. So you're going to the game? Yeah, I'm going to the game. That's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, that's, it's at the, Mercedes-Benz? Mercedes-Benz, I've never been in there before.

Oh, you'll like it. It feels like, unlike SOFI or even Cowboys Stadium, it feels like a real stadium. Interesting. Yeah, you'll like it. Let's look up the University of Texas Endowment real quick. We do, we do, I'd say twice a year, we do this. Really? Yes, you've done this one.

Because you compared it to Southerns. Let's do it again. I told you about the time Van Jones got mad at me because I made a video. He was very upset. And I was just talking about it. Oh, that video was amazing. Yeah, man.

Okay, let me get this back on. I'm going to let y'all know. There's a lot of bullshit in the show today. It is. Yeah, some of it I'm just like, I don't even know how I can talk about it. But we're going to try. We're going to try. Damn.

Did I say a billion? It's $42.9 billion. Fuck! Y'all got it. Nah, bro. Y'all got to get, nah, bro. Y'all got to play reparations, dog.

I, we did this before. I'm sure we've done it before. I don't remember a billion dollars. I think it agrees. $42 billion, bro. Y'all got a, we had a better football year. Also, basketball teams number two right now.

Oh, they balling. Oh, them niggas hooping. No doubt if I got, that's a guy. That only increases the hits out of it. Right. All right. The big deal of the day,

it was kind of a tie between two big stars. You know what? Let's actually start with LeBron on the other side of it. How about that? We'll start with LeBron. Let's start with LeBron. The playoffs are here, and you can predict the action all the way to the final with Fandu Predict.

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don't look now. The Lakers are playing better? What are they now? They're still well below 500. But they're competing in every single game. and finding their stride, maybe? Yeah, stand in what you're saying. Stand in it.

Yes, it's true. Okay, so the Lakers beat the Trailblazers 1-28-209. LeBron James had a fantastic game. And after the game, he wanted to address what he thought was some hypocrisy in the media. This is what LeBron has to say. I was wondering why I haven't gotten a question from you guys about the Jerry Jones photo. But when the Kyrie thing was going on, you guys were quick to ask us questions about that. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on.

And I don't even want you guys to say nothing. When I watched Kyrie talk and he says, I know who I am, but I want to keep the same energy when we're talking about my people and the things we've been through. And that Jerry Jones photo is one of those moments that our people, black people, have been through. America. And I feel like this black man, as a black athlete, as someone with power and a platform. When we do something wrong or something that people don't agree with, it's on every single tabloid, every single news coverage, it's on the bottom ticker, it's asked about every single day. But it seems like to me that the whole Jerry Jones situation photo, and I know it was years and years

go and we all make mistakes. I get it. But it seemed like it's just been buried under like, oh, it happened. Okay, we just, we just move on. And I was just kind of disappointed. I haven't received that question from you guys. Appreciate it. Rachel? I don't, I am not well versed in the things that LeBron has been asked in post-games, post-game press conferences.

Obviously, I think that things that were related to basketball, all, there's no question he would be asked about, controversies, things he's done, said, whatever, involving other players, other teams. Without a doubt, he would be asked those questions. I don't know if he's asked about other social justice issues that aren't related to, not even social justice, but just like other issues involving that affect black people in post-game press conferences. I don't know. So I'm not even saying, correct me if I'm wrong. I'm admitting I have no idea. I don't know if as an interviewer, I would have, it would have, maybe it would have crossed my mind,

but I don't know if I would have asked LeBron James that question. And I was, I'm glad he addressed it and I'm glad he answered the question. And surely as somebody who's extremely influential in sports and arguably one of the greatest basketball players, I would want to hear his opinion, and he does use his platform to speak out. But I don't know, dare I say fair for him to say, hold on, I'm trying to figure out why nobody's asked me this question. It's about a football team. Jerry Jones, I don't really, it doesn't really relate to me.

So I wasn't shocked that nobody asked him that question, even though I was glad to hear his opinion on it. And people might be upset with it. that, but I don't think it was really fair for him to say it, to be honest with you. What really relevant to him? It is, yes, black people, yes, it is. I shouldn't say it's not relevant to him. It's just not necessarily a relevant question after a post-game, post-game conference

for an NBA game. Hmm. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is why I love LeBron James. LeBron James knows us. This is one of the savviest things I've seen an athlete.

do in a long, long time. Why? LeBron just flopped. This was a mental... LeBron flopped. LeBron, like, this was a actual flop. LeBron, you know how you, like, you barely get touched on the court? You're like, ah, you flopped.

LeBron flopped. He just flopped in that press conference, and it was the right thing to do. It was. When people flop on the court... I agree it was a flop. When people flop on the court, it's not like they're not. They're trying to get the call. They're trying to help their team.

They're trying to help their team. A flop might be weird in the grand scheme of the competition. But for your team, a flop is good. LeBron just flopped for us. He just took a charge. He know damn well. You know what I mean? Like he, this is what LeBron did.

LeBron wanted to talk about that. He wanted to talk about it. Yes. And, and he wanted to hold the media accountable for the way the media portrays black issues for the way the media has treated this Jerry Jones situation. Sure. For all of that. He wanted an excuse to do that. So he took a charge.

He flopped. He flopped. If we wanted to intellectually break this down. there have been other things LeBron has talked about, right? But most of the things that he's talked about have been things that he's been actively involved in. So he talked about the Colin Kaepernick situation, right? But he was kneeling.

He was doing all of that stuff, right? And it was the biggest story in sports. In this situation, to compare why they're asking him about Kyrie to why they haven't asked him about Jerry Jones. It's like Kyrie is an ex-teamate of LeBron's. Kari, it plays in the same league as LeBron. It was the top story. in the NBA for at least a week, maybe a week and a half, maybe two weeks.

So there's no way not to ask him. In terms of this, I don't know too many football players that have actually been asked about this, if we're being honest, because the power dynamics in the NFL and the NBA in terms of the way the athletes speak, how they talk and what they're allowed to express are different, which is why I'll say again, everyone owes a debt of gratitude to Colin Kaepernick, Nessa, and Eric Reed, because they challenged, they challenged, okay, that status quo and that arrangement, if you will, in the NFL, and they sought to upend it, and they got nothing back for it. I digress. But what I'm saying is, in this particular situation, I mean, I like that energy.

I like that energy of calling that out. but the funniest part is he asks why and then he's about to get a response and he goes no because he didn't want to really have that conversation what he wanted to discuss was the issue itself sometimes you got to take a charge sometimes you got to flop a little bit we needed a couple of free throws and i and i like that and by the way lebron also knows that he got to get back in the barbershop. There's a lot of people that didn't like the fact that he said what he said about Karee, that he was sort of as definitive about it as what he was. And so LeBron, he need to get back into barbershop a little bit. And he just, that was kind of like looking at some of the people.

That's like a little dab. So he's very savvy. He's been doing this for a long time. When I saw that last night, I was like, oh, here we go. I was well played. Well played. Well played. LeBron. Well played. This motherfucker. And he's right. And he's right. But that's not all that people talked about. You see Jay Williams in his conference. Jay Williams has a demand from Jerry Jones. Rachel, as a Cowboys fan who represents Jerry Jones here on the podcast. I want to see what you thought about. He has nominated himself to be representative of being a representative of Jerry Jones on behalf of all black people. That is what that is what Stephen A. Smith has done.

Now he's tried backtrack. So you asked me about Jay Williams, though. Right. Donnie, Stephen A. Smith is interesting. Donnie, give me the audio. Your reaction to all of this. Do you mind if I just have a moment, Stephen A, I look into the camera.

Sure. I just want to specifically ask Jerry Jones to denounce racism. I think it's very important with where we're at in this time in history right now. I didn't hear him do that with Colin Kaepernick. His silence was heard all over the country as related to George Floyd. And here was another opportunity where, frankly, Stephen A, I felt like his answer felt to me it was above approach.

Right. He was above the matter. In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends. Jerry Jones, our friend. I think that's very important. And I say that because I don't condone the 14-year-old kid during that. Like, I agree with you. We're on the same page, 14-year-old kid, curiosity. But sometimes in life, there's good people and there's bad people. And what happened on his commentary when he was addressed about this, which he had multiple days to think about, the direct quote was,

I don't know that I or anybody anticipated or had a background of knowing what was involved. It was more of a curious thing. Why is Jerry, why is Jerry Jones absolving the hundreds of people who were around him who had different intention? Why is he speaking for everybody's intention? When you could tell that maybe he was curious, but there were a lot of people there who weren't curious. There were a lot of people there who were racist, and that's okay to say. what was even more concerning for me is that

when Kyrie Irvin post a pick of Hebrews to Negroes we automatically come to the table by saying you need to denounce anti-Semitism but Jerry Joe's didn't he didn't denounce racism okay so I like this too

I like this energy there are a couple of differences here number one Jerry Jones was asked about it and he said he wasn't there to be racist he was just there to be curious if it would be the one thing if Jerry Jones would have been like, I don't want to talk about it. I'm not whatever, whatever, whatever. I know who I am. Whatever, whatever.

Then it would have been absent. So Kyrie did react a little poorly. But I like this. They should all denounce racism, right? Like, we never asked them to deny racism. For me, look, we being messy and I love it. This is what we got to do. And I'm so glad they led Jay Williams come on and talk about it.

about it. Because in my opinion, and we talked about this last week, they were letting Stephen A. Smith run with the narrative. I mean, he went on the other day talking about, I know people in black media have had some things to say about me. And then he directed everybody to go to his No Mercy podcast to listen to what he had to say. And he said it was black on black. And he was going to dress us. I didn't go listen. I don't have time for that. So I, but I appreciate them having Jay come on to change the narrative. Because he was saying what Stephen A. Smith should have said. And I think that's why Stephen A. Smith was very quiet in it.

And he kind of tried to backtrack of like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's not what you said. You said you were very fond of him and you were pissed off that that photo was used. And Jay Williams goes on to say in that clip, or just his, that overall segment, that you're not getting the bigger picture of it all. And that's what we talked about. It's not just about the photo. You didn't read the article because it was bigger than that.

The photo was just used. used to explain other actions of Jerry Jones. So I am for everything Jay Williams said. And I'm so glad now on Twitter. They're saying the doors are going to be locked on Jay Williams tomorrow when he tries to enter the first six studio. Nah, he'll be there. He'll be there.

Jay won't step away from a coofy. I'm going to get, Jay is my man. I'm going to send Jay a coofy for Christmas because Jay didn't radicalize Jay. We should have him. Come on. We should have him. I asked for him. I asked for him.

Jay is my man. They didn't radicalize Jay. I will say this. So the reason why I think I don't want to piss anybody off, but I have to say it. So I think that I need to hear Jerry Jones denounce racism, and I'll tell you why. If Jerry Jones is in fact a racist, and he's not doing a fantastic job of convincing the world that he's not. He has a direct effect on hundreds of black people. not just the players on his team.

And this is kind of the difference, right? So a player like Kyrie Irvin, a guy like Kyrie Irvin, has a tremendous influence to normalize misinformation, bad things, anti-Semitism, all of that. So we have to make sure that people that are, that have that particular type of influence, have the right information to go off of and are aware of what their words mean.

That's absolutely true. That's very true. And we are reminded of that when it comes to black athletes, entertainers, singers, and all of that stuff. But when we talk about racism and inequality as it exists for us, it's rarely an influence. It's very structural, right? It's very structural. It's not that your favorite singer is a racist. It's not that your favorite comedian is a racist.

It's that your boss is a racist. Sure. It's that your principal is a racist. It's that the police are racist. Is that black women go to the doctor and have a, to deliver babies 12 times higher to die? It's that the medical system is racist. It's a systemic thing that puts up barriers around your life. And so for a guy like Jerry Jones, it's insanely important to know whether or not he is a racist.

because he is going to directly speak to the earning potential policies made and all kinds of other stuff that affect black athletes and thereby black families. So what Jay is saying, and I love the fact that when I say we're being messy, I mean, we're like, we're not taking this shit. Fuck it. It's up. Whatever happens, we win it. So I get that that's the energy right now. And I'm, you know, I'm not saying it's exactly the same situation. But what I'm saying is he's right. he's right because of the ability to cause harm that somebody who owns the team and is the strongest most powerful owner in the league can have tell you something else about Stephen A. Smith. Stephen A. Smith was talking about these owners on the show and he said Bob McNair, God rest his soul. I don't know if you guys know who Bob McNair is, but Bob McNair is the owner of the Houston Texans that during the Kaepernick thing said that we can't have the prisoners. are running the, we can't have the inmates running the prison. It's not funny.

It's not funny. Stephen A got a chill, man. He set that on his podcast. No, he said it on first take. I was watching this morning. Stephen A got chill. Roland Martin was fantastic on first take, by the way. Hey, Donnie, we got to book Roland Martin.

Got to have the OG up here. Donnie just run the audio. Said he loved Hitler. They gave him an award. I'm just saying, I don't like Nazis and I don't like what some of the mafia's are doing either. I like Hitler. Donnie, run some more.

I've said it, the most Nazi-like activities I've seen, and the Nazis, in my view, were thugs that shook people down to a lot of really bad things. But they did good things, too. We're going to stop dissing the Nazis all the time. Okay. Donnie, give me another one. Well, that's right. You're not Hitler.

You're not a Nazi. You don't deserve to be called that and demonized. Well, I see good things about Hitler also. I love everyone and Jewish people are not going to tell me you can love you know us and you can love what we're doing to you with the contracts and you can love what we're you know what we're pushing with the pornography but this guy that invented highways invented the very microphone that I use as a musician you can't say out loud that this person ever did anything good and I'm done with that I'm

done with the classifications Every human being has something of value that they brought to the table. Keep going, Donnie. No, you're explaining that, like you said, you love the Zionists. You don't agree with some of the things they're doing, even though you don't support a lot of what's happening. Seriously, I've really studied a lot of history. Plus, I had family that was there. And so, I mean, I don't think Hitler was a good guy.

I get the Hugo Boss uniforms amazing. But, I mean, just because you're in love with the design, you're a designer, can we just kind of say, like, you like the uniforms, but. that's about it. No, we, we, no, there's a lot of things that I love about Hitler, a lot of things. Hey, Netton, what did you think about that, Netton? This is insane. You are an insane person. How could you say something? It's okay, so? Let me ask you, you like the Azog battalion. They openly how Hitler. They're the leftovers of World War II. They support Zelensky and attacking Russia. So you like the Azog will tell you. I love

everyone. My point is you are. Okay. If you guys didn't know that is Kanye West, he was on Info Wars with Alex Jones and the rest of the

platformed deplorables. And he got into his Nazi back. First of all, to everyone that thought that I would get on this podcast and make up anything that I heard at TMZ four years ago, go fuck yourself. People came at you about that?

A lot of people were like, van, that's not true. Go fuck yourself. All right. It took it out. Didn't feel like it was my place to get mad for somebody else's community. Even though at that particular point, maybe I should have reacted differently. It's a lot going on in my life right there. I'm not a perfect person.

But the reality of it is called them on that too. They took it out. I didn't talk about it. It is what it is. But go fuck yourself. I wouldn't make anything like that up. Number two, and this is the only thing I'll say about this.

This isn't about Kanye anymore. It's not. Not to me. This is what it's about. Kanye West is a blessing. Yay West is a blessing. It's a blessing. okay so I get a lot of feedback from a lot of people and the feedback that I get I actually got a really

beautiful message I read it um I read it right here because I think that it was actually it actually came from a good place I'm not going to call out the person that sent this but I think this message came from a good place to appreciate your perspective and I truly am a fan I am not nor would I ever consider myself to be a yay fan, primarily because of his behavior. That being said, mental illness is an underreported aspect of his downfall. I have a close family member who I have seen devolve over the course of the last five years due to schizophrenic behavior. I say behavior because he refuses to seek help and believes the whole thing is a conspiracy.

I request that you invite a psychologist or a psychiatrist to your podcast to discuss the impacts of these illnesses on the brain and thought processes peace. I thought that that was a very well-put message. And at least for me, a part of this narrative and a part of this entire sort of saga that we haven't talked about enough was the fact that Kanye West is unwell, whatever. Kanye West is unwell. He's going to say whatever he wants to say. It's harmful.

It's dangerous. The rhetoric is normalized into some of the worst forces that the earth has ever seen. It is what it is. It's not about him anymore. The reason why Kanye West is a blessing, Ye West or whatever is a blessing, because he's helping me decide who the fuck I don't want to be around no more.

Okay. Keep going. What do you mean? He's helping me weed out people that are doing black flips to excuse and explain things that are fucking nuts. When I say nuts,

I mean, he's not playing chess. He's not playing checkers. What he should be, he's not playing chess. He's not playing checkers. He's not playing anything because it's not a fucking game. Right. When you're talking about Hitler, when you're talking about the Nazis, when you're talking about the final solution,

when you're talking about the brand of racial identity, right, that arose from Nazism. Nazis aren't dead. They're not dead. All of that stuff mutated and sort of gestated there in Germany and went on to still be a force in the world. And it's something that people still deal with. It's about violence. It's about intimidation.

It's about the inherent eugenic belief that someone is better than you. It is something that started here, went there, and is now the world over recognized by symbols, be it an eye across, be it a boot, being a pair of boots. be the shaved head for the neo-Nazis, be it whatever it is. So I'm telling you is this, if you can't, if you can't fix your mouth to say that that is wrong,

that Nazism is wrong, that Hitler is wrong. If you're that deep, to where you want to find a way to excuse that, there's nothing to talk about with me. And I'm glad I am happy that I am able to analyze and see people with that amount of inconsistent logical ability

with that amount of bullshit lurking and murking around in their blood. There's absolutely zero reason to praise Hitler. None. Nothing. I don't give a fuck about none of it. There's not one reason to praise Hitler. There's not one reason to excuse Hitler

he's not one reason to love Hitler. No. Are you, are these personal friends that you know? Because I guess when you say that it's a blessing because it's really helping you see people for who they are, are these personal friends of yours? Because I guess, go ahead. Finish your thought, Rachel. Well, no, I was just going to say because publicly I'm not, I don't really see a whole lot of support or people excusing him or the point where I'm like, they're helping. me know who they are. I'm not seeing it. So that's why I'm asking you. Is this personal for you?

So I think it's a good time to get into this because it's a, it's a narrative that, that, that, that, it's a narrative that we deal with a lot on the podcast with the fact that I know am around people that people will consider to be problematic. Um, I want to give this a little oxygen right now. Okay. In a real serious way, as honest as I can be. It's difficult for me to divorce myself from people who I think don't have some of the information that they need. All right. And there are many reasons for that. One reason is, and I'm not leaning on this as a crutch, one reason in a real way is the relationship I have with my father.

My father was a smart man, a very, like, like a savvy man. Like he could read people very easily, but he was incurious. Like the things that he knew were the things that he knew. And he had a very, a very firm grasp on what he thought was real and what he thought didn't make any sense.

I, on the other hand, the definition of curiosity. And a lot of times I would see in real time, like his mind sort of, of considering something. Mm-hmm. Or, I mean, it wouldn't even have to be about anything serious. Like my dad would tell me that some kid that he knew or some guy that he went to college with

or some dude that grew up in Baton Rouge was the best basketball player of all time, right? And he would tell me all of these things. And he'd be very serious in a real way. He's like this. Because in my father's eyes, his world was what he was able to see and touch. Sure. And the best guy he ever saw was. was this dude.

And I remember watching the game with my dad when I could really understand the NBA and describing in the game everything that Michael Jordan was doing. Like offensively, defensively, the sets they were running, the triangle offense, and I watched my father realize that basketball is a more complicated game

that he thought it was. There's not just guys in shorts chucking up the ball. He understood all of that stuff about baseball. He knew what he knew. And I have relatives. like this. People that for whatever reason think that their part of the world, be it Marrily, Louisiana, be at Baton Rouge, that everything that they needed to know was encompassed in that. And because I went out and sought other things, I was constantly being

somebody that was being like, no, this is how it is. So, or this is what I think it is. I'm not saying that all of these people were too smart to make up their own, too dumb to make up their own minds. I'm saying that like different perspectives would come. And my sister was this same way. Like, we were a different generation of kids but all these people I knew them and I knew that they were decent you know what I mean

they were they're just not bad they're decent and some of them you got to push them all the time like the ITT story I tell Lord that that's a real thing like you'd see the light bulb come on

with some people when they when their world can be expanded and so for me being really from South Baton Rouge, Louisiana, just the people that were around me, they just weren't perfect. But they leaned on me to like, I was like almost like a newspaper for some of these people in a way.

Oh, Van, know about that. Van, tell them. You know what I'm saying? And so I'm in a different space now and I'm in a different phase now in my life, obviously. And I don't have, and I'm not, I'm not important enough to be able to go around and have to change everybody's perspective. But a lot of times when I see people and they have bad ideas, I don't necessarily think that they're bad people.

I don't necessarily think that they're unredeemable people or people that I don't even want to be around. That's fair. So sometimes, yeah, I see other parts of them that are incredibly valuable. But I will agree that at a certain point for my own health and for my and for the life that I've carved out and want to live for myself that there are lines that have to be drawn. And if you're asking me, do I know people personally who have today tried to make this make sense? The answer is yes.

Can I ask you another question? Sure. When, and I am not trying to find a reason in what these people are doing, but when they're, when they're trying to make sense of it, similar to the DM that you read, is it that people, because I don't think that this is okay to do anymore, I think there was a, time when you said, and we did it on the podcast, Kanye West is suffering for mental illness. I think that we have gone way beyond that point, not saying that he doesn't, there might be not, mental illness might not be an issue, but we're beyond that point at this.

When the people are making excuses, is it based on mental health? And that's what we're writing it off as. So I'll tell you a little bit of what I heard today. Obviously, there were some people that talked about how unwell Kanye is. We know that he's unwell. At this point, The only people that were platform Kanye are people who are already, I don't know what Tim Poole and them were doing. I'm not as familiar with him, but I didn't know he was kind of on that. But the people that were platformed Kanye now are the people who the Alex Jones is and the people who are looking for this type of energy. I say that to say this. Some of the people were telling me about is it that much different to praise Hitler as it is to praise Hitler as it is to

praise Washington or to praise Jefferson or to praise any of the other bloated slave-owning criminals that started America, right? Isn't it any different to praise them than it is to Kanye West? You know what the answer is? Not really. I concede that point. I put it in the post on Instagram. Thomas Jefferson was a man who raped a black woman for a long time.

whenever you have sex with a slave, it's raped to me. It's rape. He allowed his children to live in slavery. George Washington was one of the most brutal slavers that we've ever seen. These men did not respect the life of black people. They looked at us ass cattle, all the eugenics, all of that stuff that is inside the DNA of American society because it was inside the DNA of the founders. That's all true. Who the fuck is erecting?

statues for Thomas Jefferson and George Washington. We've been litigating the history of the country and how we should approach it for years now. So I don't know if a motherfucker ever saw me on President's Day say, yo, shout out Big George. Yo, CJ, what's up? I don't know if people have ever seen me do that, but to go to the links to try to dig into Adolf Hitler and find something to extrapolate out of the musings of a madman. to try to see if we can somehow rescue Hitler from the history that he absolutely wanted. Hitler is remembered exactly the way he wanted to be remembered.

Precisely the way he wanted to be remembered. Right? Yeah. That we now have to rescue Hitler from history because Kanye West is doing it. You niggas a dick roddus. you niggas are stupid and I'm done with it I don't want to have a conversation about it

I don't want to try to intellectually like have that situation I don't want to do that at all what I want to do now is draw a line in my life between the serious and the unsirious and I'm actually happy that I get the opportunity to do that I was going to play the dick riding thing

but then I I was like, why was your sound on? I thought you wanted to say something. Are you guys? On the other side of this, we're going to be talking to the writer and creator of two different shows that are fantastic that you need to be watching right now. Sherman Showcase and Southside Diallo Riddle, one half of Diallo and Beshear, the writing team is going to be on higher learning to tell you why the most underrated comedy. in the world right now is super duper black. We're going to talk about another side of this break.

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Did you see him pop his collar before you came out? Oh, Diallo, don't do us like that. Turn your mic on. Diallo, don't do us like that. Diallo came in here ready to go. No, I feel bad, man. I actually feel bad because I'm in my office. I feel like when I go from home,

it's so much more interesting looking. I didn't realize I haven't ever hung up art in this Warner Brothers office. It was embarrassing. Flex on us again. That's two flexes. Donnie, let this run. Donnie, let this run.

Call it as well. Call it as well. I'll take the comic book to the wall. That's very nice. That's three flexes. Did you write that comic, Dialla? Not at all. No, I did not. Okay.

You guys, we have, all right, listen, I say this all the time, but look, we have somebody really special on the show. I'm, mini story, mini story. I first get to L.A., and I see this sketch, these two guys, and they're talking about this movie, right? And it's like funny as fuck, but it's funny in the way that I laugh. It's like

it's got all the inside cultural jokes that are completely accurate and relevant, but it's also got this sort of highbrow sensibility to it to where a cinema file would know it, right?

And these two guys are doing this and they have the sketch comedy group. And so I like actually send this guy a message. Like I send him a message on Facebook. I'm like, yo man, this is so dope. I just got out here and the motherfucker wrote me back. Because he was mad easy to get at. The motherfucker wrote me back.

That guy is Diallo Riddle who is an amazing writer, actor, producer, performer who just done so much stuff start I remember some years after that you and Bashir your writing partner first of all I appreciate you joining us on higher learning today you guys are on Jimmy Fallon and then now you have two shows

that are two of the best shows on television Sherman Showcase and Southside Diallo Riddle joins us today on higher learning my brother how are you I'm good man I'm good I'm so you know I think of you now in so different a way than like, you know, like to me, like you're now, you know, just this dude who's done so much. But it did occur to me.

I've never, I don't think of you as that guy who wrote in because you like the message anymore. You know what I'm saying? Like, it's just like when a friendship is really old and you forget, oh, that's how we came into existence as friends. Like, it's just, man, I'm honored to be here. I'm just really, and I'm honored Rachel. I don't think we've ever met before, but I'm on it, you know. We haven't. Yeah.

We have it. You'll remember how we met. You'll remember this moment. I was so afraid when Van was telling that story that you were going to say you didn't, you don't remember that. I was like, oh God. This is so excited. Well, because you know what? We put a lot of effort and heart into those, it was a joint venture between HBO back when they were in the same family as AOL. I think it was all time Warner back then. And, you know, we were used, but you know, we were used to doing sketch comedy for like $50 a night that we would split. And we would usually eat that profit by buying like, you know, wigs and makeup, you know. So when we first got that thing, our budget, I will never forget our budget was $1,500 a week, which might as well have been a nine-figure deal

from Netflix for us at the time, because we were like, we're loaded, we're rich, and we're left in our life. And we took all that money, we still spent it. We wanted to make sure that our sketch comedy was in the vein of, like, Chappelle's show, and I don't think P&P was on the air yet.

We got to remember, like, 2007, 2008. Yeah, so like we were just, you know, we were so happy to have, anybody pay, you know, the little bit of money that we could use on costumes and cast and stuff that we were just thrilled. And I look back at those videos now, like we had Robin Fidi. Yeah. We had, we had so many people going on to just do way more. I remember our first sketch group at the time. It was me, Bashir, Robin Thidi, Wyatt Seneck, Nefertari Spencer, who's on both of our TV shows nowadays. And like, we just, you know, we was just hungry.

You know, he was just the young dudes fresh out of college, just ready to, you know, pull out the old Canon 5D, you know, camp because you didn't have phones that had, you know, 4K on them back then. So, yeah, that was us. That was us. Can you talk about how the two of you met? Because was it, was it a choir? Was it an a cappella group? You and Bashir. Sorry. So, okay. So I think I know where this is going. We met, so we were both members of Coomba, which was the black gospel choir. at Harvard. And whenever you're at a white school and the black kids get together, you inevitably choose a African sounding name for whatever group you form. It doesn't matter what you guys do. But we were like, okay. We did a Timbuk two step us. And anybody could join. You didn't have to be Christian. You didn't even have to be able to really sing. We had like 50 members. It was big. But Bashar and I, you know, we figured out pretty quickly that we had the same sense of humor and that's when we formed an offshoot that was going to sing secular music like jodicy, shy, silk type, you know, songs. And that was called brothers.

Because we're really inventive and I hope nobody. These are really happy with what they're called brothers. And if you had a coffee shop in Boston, we would show up and we would sing to the people drinking coffee. You know, we would sing like, you know, Usher Raymond, you know, these are my confessions type songs. and that's what we did. Bedtime music. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Secular music. That was what we call it.

So you and Bashir have been working together for so long, and I'm seeing you guys are both like on top of the industry right now. I'm seeing Bashir pop up. Oh, that's news to me, bro. He always does this. Y'all, he always does this. I have watched, literally watched the world discover both. Southside and Sherman Showcase.

I've watched it. We need to go intergalactic because we need a few more worlds to discover both shows. We need a few more worlds. So let me ask you this, though. Like I would, I would, when I would see people talk about the show, I would send you, hey, bro, like, especially during the pandemic, people were watching it. They were talking about how funny, specifically Southside was. Season 3 of South Side is on HBO Max, premieres on disembay.

I would show you this. Do you feel like the world has actually really discovered this show yet? No. You don't. No, I don't. Listen, I think that we're like right now, I would say both shows to a certain extent, maybe Sherman Showcase even more than South Side, are still like freaks and geeks. You know, it's this term that we use in the business when I show, like anybody who's seen it,

and especially people in the industry, see the show. They're like, this is brilliant. This is phenomenal. You get great write-ups in the New York Times, the damn New Yorker, L.A. Times, Washington Post. Everybody loves your show. And, but when you talk to the network, they're like, well, we're still hoping to get a couple of more viewers engaged. You know, like that's, that's, that's, I still feel like we're like that underground hit. That's, that thing that, like, it's like when people go back and talk about

90s hip-hop and suddenly everybody knows about a tribe call quest, but when you were there, like, only people who were into hip-hop were really in a tribe call quest. A lot of your white friends, you know, they were stumped, you know, when you would bring up tribes. They knew about Snoop and Dre and eventually about Biggie, but like, you know, they weren't all chicken for Jungle Brothers. I feel like our show is like the native tongues. I feel like those of our shows are like the native tongues of TV because I feel like people who watch them like them, but, you know, we're not in a place like, okay, Sherman Showcase,

we're on IFC. To be on IFC, even just 10 years ago, was to be in the same category as Portlandia and the early seasons of documentary now. And I feel like, you know, to be on IFC today, like I feel like, I feel ridiculous when I get on Instagram. I'm like, hey, y'all, check out Sherman Showcase. It comes on 10.30 in New York, but it's actually 7.30 in Los Angeles. And it might be at 9.30 in Chicago.

So just figure out when you can watch it. But when you do watch it, go to that certain TV that's on your wall. You can't pull it up on your phone. That's impossible. What are you talking about? It's not the future yet. Like, I just feel like we've had to really sort of like deal with being on linear cable at a time when most people, myself included, we've cut a lot of cords. And so we have to

sort of wait until these things start streaming on Hulu. But by then, the linear cable people have sort of like moved on to whatever. They're on to interview with a vampire, you know, as if the Anne Rice estate needs more money. Like, it's just an interesting time to be in TV. I have kids now, and they spend a lot of time watching YouTube videos. And if you have kids who watch YouTube videos, you realize that these are people who literally are watching other people react to something they saw on YouTube. And I'm just like, can you kids watch something with a script? Like, can you guys please watch something? Because we're just in a world now. We're like, you know, it's just an interesting time to be in TV. I think that's what Sherman Showcase is doing with. HBO Max,

a lot more people know how to find that, download that, get that. So I feel like Southside does have a larger audience. And also, let's just be honest, Southside, as opposed to Sherman, which is a lot more like our HBO show that originally brought you into the mix. You know, HBO Max and Southside, we're doing a show with characters. They're in a neighborhood and an environment that I think that people understand.

And I think that we go out of our way to be authentic about that. So I do think Southside has a few more viewers, but I know for a fact that we would always, anytime people tell me that they love Southside, I'm always like, great, tell five more people because quite honestly, we can always use more people watching either show.

I know that was long-winded. It was true. It's true. Catch me, you know, at a time when I just finished talking to some network people, and I'm just like, you know, all we can do is do the best show that we can do. After that, it's sort of more on y'all to, like, inform people and let people know that these shows exist. That's what I want to piggyback on that. I was going to ask you, like, it's two-part, because I want you to talk about since Southside is about to come out.

December 8th. Tell us a little bit about what we can expect on the new season. Oh, man. But I also want to say with talking to networks and networks saying, you know, like, oh, can you get a few more people engaged? Do you ever feel pressure? I don't want you to get in trouble. But do you feel any kind of pressure that they try to make you do something different that's not what you originally want or wanted for South Side. Do you feel any pressure that they want to change you to make you get more in?

No, on South Side, I will say we've never felt pressure to make it a show. They've never been like, hey, how about some? you know, a hot young 18 to 34-year-olds to, you know, turn up the heat on the show. You know, like, we've never had to deal with that at all. We've always done exactly the show that we wanted to do. In fact, you see it from the very first frame of South Side. We were never told, oh, you have to go out to these Hollywood actors to draw in viewers. And then after that, you can populate the show with whoever you want.

No, literally, there's a reason why the show stars two guys who you've never seen star on anything else. This is literally Bashir's brother and one of his, one of his, friends from childhood. And they are super talented. You know, they can star on other shows. Oh, they are hysterical. But we were never told, oh, go out to these three or four Hollywood approved actors. We think part of the appeal of the South Side is the fact that you have people who are from the South Side, who you've never seen do anything really outside of this show. And I think that that's what makes it special because it's a show that, you know, uses real people from the South Side, and they might be the funniest people that, you know, just from the hood,

just from people that we knew growing up, but like, they're funny people. And we were like, let's turn the camera on them, you know, like, if you talk to a lot of comedians and you ask them, who's the funniest person you know, a lot of times they won't mention another stand-up or some comedy actor, some comedy writer who they know. They'll be like, you know, it's my dude who's a mechanic back home in, you know, Lansing, Michigan. You know what I mean? Like, we went out of our way to go to the actual South Side Chicago and find Chicago. Chicago-based, and specifically Southside Chicago-based actors and actresses, and give them the chance to shine because there's a certain cadence that comes out of Chicago that we wanted to throw a spotlight on. So I want to ask you about one scene in particular that I knew was going to go viral when people started watching the show.

Oh, here we go. I think I know what you're going to swing up. Let's do this. So there's a scene where from a hysterical episode where there's a. an older lady who was an activist back in the day. Yep. Rachel, have you seen this? No. Oh, my God. This is a lady, she's an activist back in the day.

There's a character on the show, the lady. Dorothy Brown. Her name is Dorothy Brown on the show. Dorothy Brown. That's the character name. That's the character name. And, you know, she wants to buy her building, but she doesn't want to put her out. Anyway, they get into the argument.

and this older lady starts going in on Coretta Scott King. I remember when I first watched it, she was like, and the things that she was saying had nothing to do with anything. She was like, Corridic Scott King didn't have a good sense of you. Wasn't funny. No, she said she was not funny. She said she wasn't funny.

And I tell you right now, the bitch wasn't funny. I'm like, oh my God. When that thing hit Twitter, when that scene hit Twitter, I remember smiling. I'm like, I knew it. And I remember somebody put, nah, man, what is this? hello, hello, hello, hello, hello.

And I'm like, I said it to you, I was like, this is South Side and this is, it's not just that type of thing. It's trying to sell popcorn outside the movie. It's like, it's, it's all of the things in the show that make the show super relatable, but I'm telling you guys, it is the funniest fucking thing going right now. So let's talk about that scene

in the mission statement of Southside in general. I always say you can't really control who your audience is, but you can write towards a particular audience. And I will say that Southside, probably more than any show that I've ever written for, we really do come at it with the point of view, and I know that we have so many non-black viewers of Southside, but we really do write it like,

what's some stuff that would make your black family laugh at the dinner table that you may not even want, non-black people laughing at. You know, I remember when we were writing that scene, I didn't, I wasn't crazy about it. I'm from Atlanta, Georgia, like, to say, you know, that's in okay's hometown. Right.

I should also say I'm the only writer on this show who's not from Chicago. Everybody else is, and that's why I think it comes across. It's so authentic. But when that show, when that joke got pitched, I remember there was a big debate in the writer's room of like, is this okay? because we know that, you know, literally neo-Nazis can take that one line that she said

and loop it over and over and over. And are we okay giving this to the world when we know that not everybody writing this is, not everybody reading, not everybody watching this show is going to be black. And we had a long debate about it. And Bashir and I actually had a sidebar that got a little bit heated because, again, I'm from Atlanta. I don't like to do anything that's going to cast as Persians. But at the end of the day, you know, we both.

decided, you know, well, look, nobody ever said that Corrana Scott Kigg had to be the funniest person. Right. That's the thing. Like, that's the thing, right? So, and by the way, Dorothy Brown is supposed to be a very caustic and bitter, you know, woman who feels like history passed her by. So we were like, would the character say this? Would her character say? Yes. Because the same way they're like, I would never murder somebody in real life, but I might have a character who kills somebody on a TV show. So that was,

was what we ran with. And what was funny to me was that when that episode first came out, it didn't create a whole lot of buzz. I think sadly because, again, we never had the level of viewership, I think, that the show deserves. But at some point, like you said, somebody on Twitter got out there and saw it and then posted it. And then I'm getting all the people who, I forget what that sector of the universe is called, but basically, um, they, they kind of hate on anything that, uh, that sort of, and so like, They definitely came for me. And not Bashir, because Bashir is famously not on social media.

They came after me. And they were like, you're a terrible. You're a terrible person. How can you say that about our Kings of Queens? And I just think that, look, man, I'm not even here to defend that line today. I think that at the end of the day, we try to write something. It was the same thing like in coming to America when the guy says that Martin Luther King, Jr. Punched him in the chest, right?

Yeah. There's nothing. There's nothing to defend. Like, it's funny. We know that Marlona Luther King, Jr. didn't kick the man in the chest. It's funny. He was walking around Memphis kicking people in the chest.

Yeah. Like, we, like, there's nothing to defend. Dialo, there's nothing to defend. Dorothy Brown is also a fictional character. Guys, nobody ever said this in real life. Right. You know, like, we're not, we're not here to, we're not here to make fun of our icons

and our cherished leaders of the past. I think, if anything, it's what made a room full of black people laugh. And I think, look, it's always going to be dicey when you are doing humor that, yeah, you may not want to look out and see, you know, a bunch of people who aren't black who haven't been through what you've been through laughing at something. But I also think there's a sort of universality of comedy. Like, I always think, I always go back to the Seinfeld episode where everybody wanted the loaf of marble rye.

Uh-huh. And, you know, they end up chasing them. And he's with the marble, right? I didn't grow up as New York. I didn't grow up as Jewish. But I got why that was funny, because it was so culturally specific. And I feel like that's the one thing

that we do on South Side. We keep it very, very culturally specific. I'm reminded of another episode that I thought might get us in trouble. And we were actually vindicated in real life where a dude dies, a character dies. And then at his funeral, he basically, he's at the funeral standing up

as if he's in the club. You know, we did this episode. and then a couple of months after the episode came out, it happened in real life. It happened. This rapper got shot. And for his wishes, per his dying wishes,

his funeral was in a club, and he was decked out. He had on the fresh Jordans and the chains. And it was just like a episode. They were like, oh, snap, Saasai doesn't predict the future, you know? Like, but no, it was because Bashir's mom in real life

was handed a flyer for a funeral, but the funeral flyer looked like it was for a night at a nightclub. And so we, We had no idea what was going to happen with a dude in real life. At that point, when we wrote that episode and shot that episode, it's just that by paying attention to what makes our people laugh, what's happening in the culture, and just being a fly on the wall for our own community,

we predicted some things that we could have never known we're going to actually happen. I think that's why the show is enjoyable, because we basically have a room full of black people trying to make each other laugh. And so the humor really does come from a pure place. Yeah, because like the world we live in now, you know, it's, it's scary. You know, you don't know if you're going to get canceled. You don't know if you're going to, you know, offend people. How do you protect that?

Because I mean, we, even on this show, we have a lot of non-black listeners. But Van and I are very much still stay true to who we are. Like, how do you protect that to make that comedy? Like you said, everybody in the room is laughing. but then also know that people listening to it, maybe they shouldn't be laughing. Maybe they might take it the wrong way. How do you do that?

I'll say two quick things on that. One is that I fundamentally believe that you kind of have to do what's true to you and what makes you laugh and just put it out there. Does that make sense? Like, I think if you spend any time self-censoring, if you spend any time sort of like worried about who, might get their hands on a joke, you're not going to end up writing anything that's good. I think that we just, we write what we think is funny.

And then we just kind of put it out there. And that's sort of like across the board. And I also, I'm sort of controversial when it comes to, I actually don't believe the Castle Culture is a thing. I don't. I think it's a boogeyman. I agree. When people tell me who, you know, oh, I actually ask my son, because, you know, he's, my

The oldest kid is on TikTok now. He's 13 years old. And he came up to me and he was like, Hey, Dad, do you think this is funny? And it was like a black comedian, but the black comedian was making some jokes based on some really old stereotypes about like, you know, fried chicken, you know?

And I was just like, honestly, this isn't funny, Simon. And before I had the chance to tell him why I didn't like it, he was like, oh, do you think this guy's going to get canceled? Now, this is coming out of a 13-year-old mouth. And I was like, son, I was like, I have a problem with you. walking around worried about who's getting canceled. I was like,

tell me who you think has been canceled. He was like, Dave Chappelle and the woman who wrote Harry Potter books. And he was rolling off. He was rolling off. All these people who have been canceled. He's,

Dave Chappelle, J.K. Rowling. I think he might have said Joe Rogan, which I didn't even know my kid knew who Joe Rogan was. I was like, son, you realize everybody you're naming is a bazillionaire.

Famously wealthy. Super, duper wealthy. I was like, I think that cancel culture is sort of a bogeyman and a tool of such that when people say things that like people

say, hey, that's not cool, they immediately like sort of self-victimized and say, hey, are you going to cancel me now? Like I just, I haven't seen anybody, if anything, I feel like people have like sort of build a fan base by saying things that they think will get them canceled. So in some ways,

I feel like it's almost like a profit generator. And I think it would be very easy for me to like write something to get me canceled and then and I just don't know. I just, I think it's a bummer subject. So I'm going to move on from that. But I think to your, to your larger point about like, do we self-censor, do we,

no, I think we write what we think is funny. And then we just ride with it because honestly, I don't think that me and my writing partner are weirdos. I personally think if we write something that we think is funny and edgy and, and, and just really just kind of humor that you haven't heard before, if we're laughing at it,

I think there are other people out there who will laugh at it. And that's why I think that our humor does come from an often unsafe place because it's hard to laugh at something if you've heard it a million times before. That's why I didn't like the thing that my kid brought me. I was like, these stereotypes have been around since the 70s. I mean, like, you know, I want humor that I haven't already heard a million times. And that's why I think that we don't worry about that. We just worry about, is it funny to us?

is it something that we haven't seen before? Okay, then let's do it. And let's have fun doing it. And so far it hasn't, it has not hurt us. Sell us on the show. It is plug, plug, plug, plug, plug, time. Not sell us on the show. Tell people where they can watch it,

how they can watch it. We have to make this season, the South Side, this season of Sherman showcase the biggest seasons ever. Man, I always say that the shows are the biggest advocates for themselves. You know what I'm seeing? And with South Side, especially like if you've never seen it just all you got to do is just get HBO

max you probably already have it just watch the first episode I guarantee you you will stick around for both two both seasons that are already up there and season three is going to be joining it going to be joining those two seasons next week I guarantee you it is raw it is hilarious it is unexpected I mean like without giving away any spoilers we have an episode this season that I feel like is shot and sort of done in a very Christopher Nolan way because he did The Dark Night in Chicago. We were like, how can we do our own version of a Christopher Nolan episode of Southside? I think we accomplished that.

We have chance the rapper back. We've got local, you know, personalities from radio like Leon Rogers is in an episode. We've got, I just feel like we've sort of gone out of our way to never give people the expected. I think that if you're looking for, you know, edgy. sort of like, you know, humor that just doesn't stop delivering. I mean, we intentionally, when we edit these episodes, we always make sure that you can't get every joke upon the first viewing. And I think that's why people, somebody told me last night that he's watched,

what episode do you say he watched? It might have been the day the Jordan's drop. We have an episode in season one where the cops are all gathered at the police station. They're like, all right, nobody can go, you know, nobody can go on vacation time or go home early because, as you know, today is that day that we all fear. It's the day that the new Jordan's come out. And we have to be doubly prepared. Everybody's going to work a double shift today because you know Chicago's going to be crazy.

And that's, I think, episode four of season one, like this dude told me online he's watched it, you know, twice a month every month since he came out, you know. And he says he always gets like new levels and stuff. Like we've been compared to the office. We've been compared to, what's the other show? they always compares to. But I don't think there's any show. I don't think that we're like the office. I think that, yes.

You guys have, you strike a tone that's very unique. Yeah. It's very unique. Yeah. I can see why people call us a workplace comedy, but if you've seen more than three episodes of the show, you know that we'll go anywhere, you know, in on the south side of Chicago.

And even outside of this, we have a whole episode that takes place in Roscoe Village, which is not the south side. You know what I'm saying? Like, we're the most Chicago show. I think because we treat the south side of Chicago, sort of like the way Springfield is treated on the Simpsons. It's a jump-off point.

And at some point, yeah, you'll see certain characters every episode, but they could be doing unexpected things. There's a whole episode this season where our characters make it out to the South suburbs, which if you know anything about Chicago, you know. So you get out of it. Yeah. Yeah, it's like, you know, it's a totally different vibe.

We have a whole episode about Chicago house music this season that I really love because I think that, you know, And I was happy to see Beyonce come out with the house song. Like I would love for black people to, you know, sort of get back into house music. That is dance music that we, you know, created at a club in Chicago called The Warehouse. That's why it's called House Music. You know, like, I'd love to see us get more into dance because there's sort of an exuberance that you feel when music gets up to 120 BPMs. Like, you know, we have a lot of fun with the show.

And I know that I'm being verbose, but I really want people to check out the show. So it's Southside. It's on HBO Max. And please watch it. We will watch it. And Sherman Showcase. And Sherman Showcase. So here's where it's a little confusing.

The first season of Sherman Showcase is on Hulu. There's a thing that says season two, but it's really just our, it's our Black History Month special, which I also think is a very amazing hour of TV. It was sort of like an hour-long special that came out in 2020. But if you want to see the latest season two at Sherman Showcase, download at AMC Plus.

It migrates to Hulu sometime top of next year, but download AMC Plus and you can get a whole new season to Sherman Showcase. It's a really good show. It takes almost no time to download it. You can also get AMC Plus, I think, through Amazon Prime. So if you have Prime video, look us up, and you can download us there as well.

Diallo Riddle, one of the funniest men in the entire world. Thank you for joining us today on Higher Learning, man. We're going to check back in with you. Because there's more stuff I want to talk to you about. I know, man. I feel like we've only scratched the surface. Oh, we've only scratched the surface. We're going to bring you back, man.

But look, I appreciate you. I'm sorry. Is that a child of God hoodie you've got on, Rachel? It is. You mentioned Chance the Rapper and I was like, I just happened to be wearing. Chance's wrap. I got the art in the back. I'm a big, I'm a big chance fan.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Listen, chances on both shows. He's on Sherman's Showcase this season, and he's back on Southside. I'd be surprised. I'm going to put this out there. I think he should get the Emmy for Best Guestar appearance because his episode of Southside this season is insane.

And I feel like that brother is going to get, if people watch the show, he's going to get a lot of props. Big time comedy, big funny, he crushed it. He killed it. And I'm just putting that out there. Shout out the chance. Speaking of the Tuesday, Dialo, we will see you.

Thank you for joining us today on Higher Learning, my brother. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. This episode is brought to you by WeatherTech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP and making a mess. You don't need WeatherTech floor liners in the summer, unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner. Or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips.

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slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. Rachel, I just want to really talk about real quick, white mess real quick. Well, not really white mess. It's kind of like interracial, interracial mess. In a racial mess. All right. I don't want to do it. We have to do it.

I know where we're going. I want to check out. I'm going to tap out. Ashley's coming in. Donnie, jump on real quick. I'm here. What's up? So.

they fucking at Good Morning America apparently they fucking what's this guy's name T.J. T.J. Holmes. T.J. Holmes. T.J. John Holmes. So it's like T.J. Holmes and what's the white lady's name? She's blonde. Amy Roebbeck. Roboc. Roboc. Amy Roboc. Amy Roboc. He just couldn't help himself.

He just couldn't help himself. He's right there. You know what I mean? It's in the morning. Craft service comes. They're standing right next to the place. It's coffee. Hey, how are you? How was your weekend?

I went to Martha's Vineyard, though, did you? Yeah, what do you like to do at Martha's Vineyard? I don't know. I like to go down there to the beach, lay on the sand. Sometimes like the sun tickle my body. He's like, what? She's like, yeah, yeah. You know, if I stay out there long enough, I get a little moist.

He's like, oh, my God. He does Dr. Umar just out of it. his brain and they're going. I don't know if people know, Rachel's sinking down because she knows these people. I don't know them. I don't know what's going on, but this is the thing. I don't know what I read. Amy and TJ apparently were spotted on a romantic vacation together somewhere. I didn't even see the pictures. I just saw everybody talking about my, everyone was interested in what was going on between the thing. T.J., he looked like Barack Obama cousin and he do he's got a very Obama S thing and it looked like to me he was in that

vanilla bean he was a vanilla bean vanilla bean ice cream oh oh oh donnie's got some audio for us go ahead welcome for what you need to know GMA 3 and it's Friday Eve oh who's looking for it to the weekend uh me yeah yeah of course of course we are Welcome, everybody. The JMA3. What you do. Wow. I hadn't heard that.

Oh! I bet you all looking forward to the weekend, you nasty motherfucker. You nasty motherfucker. Your little fast ass. I bet you all looking forward to the weekend. God damn, Donnie, run that again. You can cut. Donnie, run that shit again.

Donnie, run that shit again. You can cut the sexual tension with a. used condom. Like, Donnie, like, put, like, good afternoon, everybody.

Welcome to what you need to know. GMA3 and it's Friday Eve. Oh. Oh. I was looking for to the weekend. Uh, me. Yeah.

Yeah. Me. Yes. Of course we are. Of course we are. Welcome everybody. Welcome everybody. See you.

You, uh, track. Did you hear how his voice got super aggressive when that body, he lost. He always sounds like that. Welcome everybody. To my.

dick. Welcome everybody to my beige scepter. Boy, I bet he was telling his boys because I bet he was telling his boys. He's like, bro, hey, bro. I bet he was telling his boys. He's like, hey, bro. Bro, I'm telling you, man.

In that thing, dog, this weekend is going down. She'd come around here looking crazy, bro. She looked good. I got me a little thing. A little thing, Rachel, but these are your friends, right? I am friendly with both. I'm good friends with T.J. All I will say is what's being reported is that they had separated from their spouses.

And, you know, this is what's being reported. They had separated from their spouses. And now that they're, then the pictures came out. So they separated from their spouses. And maybe, okay, so they're separated from their spouses. So they went on a little nasty asses. They went on a little hot ass. with hot asses.

They hot together. I don't know anything about this. I know they've been friends for years. They've great on-camera chemistry. They have a successful show. I don't know any truth to what is being reported or not. Both of them. Leaking all over the set.

Just slipping all over it. Let's wrap. Like leaking all over the set. Just slipping all over the set. You can just see it. Slip, slip, slip. Look at the joy you get from it. Leak, leak.

You love the peak mess segment. You love peak mess. It's just funny. And now you've created a new one. Yeah. Like, now this thing about the, he bought the car,

he bought to dress totally different. And they go, I guarantee you. Now that this is out, what does that look like, man? Next week he's going to be in a hoodie. He's going to be straight up.

He's going to have some sarok. And now he, we know who you are, bro. We know. Shout out to him. Shout out to her. Man,

live your life. See? Y'all always try to, y'all try to be prudes they ain't being prude over at good morning in america good morning all right good morning after america that's what they're doing all right you know you rachel you know it's getting freaky over there right tell billy bush to chill so he's not a part of that show he's not he look freaky too though all right mailback mailback mailback time time to read your letters

and then we'll reply to them. Oh, it's mailback time. Write us with your queries and we'll chime in. All right. The first one comes from Not a Real Person on Reddit. That asks, what is your dream retirement destination? Do you have one? Anguilla.

I was just going to say out of this country. Somewhere out of this country. That's where it is. Anguilla, beautiful, man. I need to be by water. It's peaceful at night. It's calming. Somewhere out of United States.

So there's two. There's either Anguilla or big-ass ranch in the middle of Louisiana like John Dutton. You want to be in Louisiana? We haven't even talked about this. Yeah. During my flu days,

I started watching Yellowstone. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I'm not caught up, but I am already in season four. Yeah, your friend is a fucking troublemaker. Okay, let's not talk about Laramie. She's a fucking troublemaker. I don't want to hear it.

Fucking troublemakers. No, I'm not, I'm not there again. But you know what I have to do? I don't know if you watch the other shows, 1883 or whatever. I have to do 1923 tomorrow. I'll tell you how it is. I'm into it. All the white people that they want me to watch on the Yellowstone Network.

I'll watch them. I'd like to add something to the me. bag hold please this is a question specifically for you van my cousin tremaine listens to the show sweet every single episode nice and he has a specific question for you let's do it and i'm a terrible cousin because i can't find it and i'm good and i want to freestyle it but we know how that goes yeah it is the question has to do with thunder cats Okay. And here it is.

From Tremaine, what would you like your Thundercats cast to be? If you had to cast someone for past or present, who would you cast? Freaky. I love this question. I mean, it can be someone who's no longer with us when I say past or present. No, I'm not doing that. Okay. So Panthro right now, I would have played by Wesley Snipes.

Okay. Yeah. Panther, I'd have played by Wesley Snipes. Lion O, for me right now, would be the hardest to cast. Chattara, I'd have, I've thought about Chitara. So there's this girl. Her name is McKinsey. McKinsey. She's, she was in fucking McKinsey Phillips. Is her name? No, not McKinsey Phillips.

That's the, that's the other thing. What is she in? She's in, uh, the Marquisie. She's in She's in the Martian She's a tall lady McKinsey Davis She's from Black Mirror

So I'd have her play Chattara She's tall lady She's 5 foot 10 I'd have her play Chattara Panther would be Wesley Snipes Lion O

Kevin Hart could play What's the little Creatures name? I don't know Thundercaps Oh yeah Snarf. Snarf.

Snarf, snarf. Kevin Hart could play snarf. Who could play Liono? Donnie, help me out with Liono. So with Lionel, I'm going to go. So let's put parameters around this. Lionel, I'm going to go 32 years old, maybe younger. Because if she's 35, so Lionel, I'm going to go a 30-year-old,

Lino. I'm looking at Lino. Maybe it should be like a, it shouldn't be, it should be a new face. Maybe a new face for Lionel? I think so. This is a Star making a Role. It's a star making role. We have to take somebody that's done some stuff though, right?

Like, Liono's got this red hair. Yeah, Lionel, you know. It should be that one guy who plays Superman, Henry Cavill, Cavill. That was that name? Yeah, so that's a, that's a, that's like a terrible idea. Oh. So you can. Big.

Yeah, he's big, but that's not. Well, Ashley, I was going to say carrot top. Jesus Christ. You know what? How about this? How about this? How about this? Because this is a great question.

Let me chew on this for a second. Because I got to think of Mumrah too. I got to think of everybody. I got somebody from Mumrod that'll kind of be good. Let me think about this. Let me chew on this. I want to hear the Reddit's, uh, no, I don't. want to hit the Reddits. I do want to hear the Reddits. I want to hear everybody's thoughts.

I don't want to hear everybody's thoughts because I want to influence me. Don't tell me. I'm on a Monday's podcast. I'm going to give Tremaine my perfect and, um, and, um, an amazing, uh, Thundercats cast. Ashley, now that you've done that, now you have to come up with a Thundercats cast too. So what about me? You know what? You know, you need to cast. You need to cash Rajabix. That's who you guys.

Okay. Rajat Beaks has star potential. And you know I'm right. You cast Rajah Bex. Me and Ashley, because Ashley's got the right idea. She's like, Henry Cavill's already Superman,

so we can't have him to be Lion-O. But she's got the right idea. You need somebody with that cut of the jib. Like with... What about Will Jol? No, because he's Adam Warlock. And I don't think he works, but he actually kind of does work,

to be honest with you. He kind of does work his line up. He actually fucking looks like a line. That's one thing. He's got a cat face. He's got a cat face. He needs to think about like he does. It's the eyebrows.

He kind of, I'm not going to lie. That's not Donnie. He got a cat face. He could be lying. I remember Lionel to me, I like Liono, but Liono is not like the best part

of the Thundercats to me. You know, and then we got to cast them all. We got cast Wally Kit, Wally Cat, everybody. We can think about them, you know, whatever.

Could Timothy Shalamee be Liono? No, he's too small. Okay. that's a great question. I'll come back with my full cast next week. That's a great question. All right. One more. Okay. This is a company question, but it's not from a company person. Jen on Instagram asks, this is a statement. She demands share your Spotify wrapped. My Spotify wrapped was all sleep podcasts. No bullshit. It was all podcasts that help you go to sleep. Oh, that's nice You know what I mean?

Like Spotify has these great podcasts Sleep time Sleep time napy time Go to sleep Sleepy to sleep sleep sleep Sleep sleep So when I looked at it It was all dreamscapes

The Wolf of Sleep All that type of stuff like that And then like my most play artist This week This year on Spotify Was it was Drake So you do like the album The new album

It's not it's just Drake got It's not even that I like the album is that Drake has so many songs. It's not even fair. I didn't even, you know, I didn't listen to honestly, nevermind. And I didn't listen to,

I didn't listen to honestly, never mind, not really. And I haven't really even listened that much to the joint. He just put out with 21 Savage. And he still, that's what I'm asking. He still was my most played artist this year.

Still. It's crazy. It's crazy. All right. Yo, thank you to Diallo for joining us today. You guys please watch the outside. Donnie, if you don't mind, if people just want to hear the audio of the, the intro, no, not the intro, the audio of the, the Corretta Scott King scene.

Let's throw it in there for them. Even, even just audio, it's funny. Okay. I don't know if we can even do that. Dorothy Brown is such a fantastic name. It's a great son. You could never be my favorite civil rights icon because it's Corretta Scott King. She is a genius.

She's beloved. She is a queen. Fuck, Corretta Scott King. Now, you may know where it's King, but I just know where it's Reda. I always thought she was so funny. What a bitch never made me last one. I said one more motherfucking thing about Coretta Scott King.

I will bust him broad daylight, bitch. I don't give a fuck. All right. Take the deep caps off. But do not stop learning. I'm Van Lathan Judy. I'm Rachel and Lindsay. Bye, guys.