Higher Learning with Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay - The Importance of the Nationwide Protests Over George Floyd's Death

Episode Date: May 31, 2020

Van Lathan and Rachel Lindsay discuss the scope and importance of this weekend’s protests after the death of George Floyd while in police custody. They talk about their own experiences with the protests in Los Angeles and Miami (0:21), explain why these protests feel different than past actions (17:12), and give a call to action on how to move forward (26:12). Then they dive into President Donald Trump’s response (34:48), Joe Biden (43:43), Amy Klobuchar, and why it’s OK for politicians to admit they don’t have all the answers. Finally, they discuss how they’d like to see police reform and why it’s important for celebrities with a platform to speak out right now. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I am Van Lathan. What's up, guys? I'm Rachel Lindsay. Um, your voice seems strange. Before we get into anything about the podcast, um, or about this week's episode or, or kind of how we're going to share our reflections of what's been going on the last couple of days, why don't you first just tell me how you're feeling? Oh my gosh.

I feel like I'm in therapy right now. That's the question. This is the one question. We could have talked about anything, but don't ask me how I'm feeling because I literally might. I'm already going to cry. I I wake up every day

with just like almost like with anxiety like a panic attack like I wake up heavy I feel it it consumes me I can barely function just with everything

that's going on right now and how is it affecting and how it's affecting us yesterday my voice might be a little strange strained because yesterday I went and I protested and it was

it was a great experience it's not my first time protesting it was peaceful it was beautiful but I kept thinking this thought because this is what happened yesterday have you ever seen the movie The Help? Yeah there's a part in that movie

where Viola Davis's character is talking to Skeeter I can't think of what her real name is the white lady and she says to her, she says, every day, every year I can't breathe, but for y'all it's just another day of bridge. That's how I felt yesterday with protesting. So I'm protesting. I have my husband.

I have our friend with us. And I heard beautiful speeches. And it was beautiful to see so many people in unity marching and protesting for what they believed in. and the injustices that we're facing in this country. And then when the protest was over, of course, you see one thing on the news, you see one thing when you're actually there, and we can get into that later.

But I'm walking, we're walking back, and we're crossing over this bridge. I'm in Miami, for those of you don't know, and we're walking into Brickle. We're like 10 blocks away from where the protest is, and I'm seeing people completely unbothered. Don't even realize what's happening, 10 blocks. 10 blocks away people are fighting just for people to value our lives and to treat us

equally across over a bridge and it's just another day to pull out the yachts. It's just another day for you to have drinks with your friends. And it hit me so hard and it's just such a harsh reality that we, what we deal with and what other people don't have to deal with because it doesn't directly affect them. And that is, that's the emotion that I'm bringing into this podcast. Sorry, You just asked me how I felt. I could have given one word, but that's really how I'm feeling right now. No, that's precisely what I'm sort of getting at.

Like, that's precisely what the question meant. The question meant, this is the time for you to be able to share exactly what's going on in your mind and your heart. It's funny that you would say that. I was talking to a friend as I wrote around in the Valley yesterday because I was somewhere with a different friend after I left Mid-City. and it occurred to me that I had to get home. It occurred to me that like, yo, I had literally,

I felt like I was 15 again. You know what I mean? Because like when I was 15, you know, like I would lose track of time out there, party and then all of a sudden I'd have to come back home late and I had this little special trick I would do where I would like get undressed outside of the house and then hide my clothes in the backyard.

So. I do this too for different reasons. Right, right. and hide my clothes in the backyard so that like if my dad walked in and he saw me, he would see me dress like I was sleep and I'd be like, listen, yo, and it's weird because when I would break curfew and I would do that, I would always like, you lean into something with concern. If your dad wakes up and he catches you up at 2 a.m., you go, father, are you sleeping?

Okay? Dad, like, there are things that we can do to make sure that you're getting a restful night's sleep. I care about you and I want to make sure that you have enough energy to get up and go to work. So I felt that same thing. I felt that same quickening, like get home, get home. If you don't get home, something bad's going to happen. If you don't get home, the cops are going to pull you out of your car and perhaps you'll

become the next hashtag that's going on because with the way things are right now, there's just no way for you to know what specifically is going to happen to you or around you one moment to the next. It's living life. in between the margins of this fear and trepidation, and it feels different. But what you just said, while I was on my way home, I noticed it too.

I was on the phone with someone and I was like, you know what? In the valley, they couldn't care less. Not at all. Like, I'm seeing people. I saw somebody walking their dog and they were smiling. And I saw some people taking a selfie. And two things went through my mind.

One was how could you be that way during these times? And the other was I envy them. I feel that. I envy someone that's so far away from the pain that I have to feel. Like, it's part of my cultural imperative to feel this pain because this pain sparks me to action. Yeah. But, you know, if we lived in a world where things were better functioning, and I'd be happy to give it away.

I don't want to give it away now. I don't want to be oblivious. I don't want to be disconnected. I don't want to be away from the strife and the pain and the struggle of my people. It is part of me. It is part of them. It is a reality. And we have to deal with it.

But in seeing that, I was like, damn, that must be nice. I have the same feeling as you when it comes to the envy. More so of, I have a really. well, except for that one experience, haven't really been out, but just seeing people on social media. Just living their lives, all these adventures, as if the world isn't just in the middle of this civil unrest right now. And I'm like, you thought for a second, what would it be like just for an hour at this moment to not have to think about that? But then at the same time, ignorance is not bliss in this situation. I don't want to be, I don't want to be that person who can live their life above what's going.

on. And I am thankful, I mean, one, both of us, we know we're proud to be black, but I am thankful that I am aware and I am knowledgeable and I can use my platforms to put action behind what's happening. So to that, I do want to give a small PSA to one group of people out there. Okay. Listen, I understand that some of you, it's your job to post your butt. I get it. I have no Just listen to me. I have no problem with you posting your butt. We see the pictures.

It's not like we don't see them. Hell, sometimes, you know, quiet as is kept, we might like them. You know what I mean? We like it. But do us a favor right now in these current times. Just post your butt and go. That's it.

And this is what I mean. Who do you follow? Just hear me. out here. Don't post your butt and then say in these really super stressful times. Yeah. I just like to kick back with my fashion Nova stretchy joggy pants, cold fashion over for 30% off. I need to feel comfortable and being sexy is what makes me feel comfortable and empowered. And if you want to feel, eh, no, wrong, you're offending me. It's not for fashion Nova, post your butt, post the fashion Nova picture.

I understand that you have an affiliate deal with them. That's okay. Not trying to stop your money. I know it's getting too towards the first of the month. You got to make your money. You're offending us by trying to couch it. It doesn't have anything to do with what's going on. Post the ass and pass.

Who did it? I'm not going to even call them out. I'm not going to call them out. I'm not going to call them out. I'm not going to call anybody out. I just saw too many things. Let me just give you something beautiful to look at while the rest of the world burns. Hell, though.

Post the butt. Get out of town. That's it. Now, this is what I will say about last night's demonstrations all over the place. Because I think last night, particularly we are recording this on Sunday. We're going to get into how we got here. But before we get into how we got here, I'm going to give my thoughts on what happened last night. So being from Louisiana and being from South Louisiana and being from a place

where there is widespread social and economic disparity based upon racial and economic lines, we have a ton of cancer. Right below where I'm from is a place called Cancer Alley. The environmental conditions in South Louisiana are putrid. There are tons of plants. The food is bad. The food deserts. All of these different things kind of join together to make it a very unhealthy place to live.

I know this. It's very true. Cancer Alley, especially for the black community right there in South Louisiana, near about where I'm from. So I've known a lot of people that have been stricken with cancer. A lot of people. Probably a disproportionate amount of people,

not just cancer, but huge masses that grow. I myself have a two-cinemite mass in my chest. that we had to get checked out a couple of a couple of weeks ago. So when you see someone go through cancer treatment, you start to notice the way a disease works. And the first thing about a disease is acceptance. Meaning you go to the doctor, the doctor says, hey, there's something that might be wrong with you

or something that is wrong with you. The first thing you have to do is accept that that's a reality. When you accept that that's a reality, and I've seen people who have fought a cancer diagnosis. Like, how could this be happening to me? I'm healthy. I run. I play football at LSU.

There's no way that I could be stricken with this. And they ignore it for the first. That's the fastest way to ensure that the cancer kills you. Okay? The fastest way to ensure that the cancer kills you is to ignore it, because then you don't do anything about it. Then it goes on for years and years unchecked. it speeds your way to the grave.

And not only do those cancers kill you, but they start to kill people around you with grief. They start to kill people around you financially. They start to kill people around you just because now that you have cancer, somebody around you, they might realize that they need to go get screamed. Because maybe this is hereditary. Maybe this is something that we should all be looking out for. So one person ignoring a disease, as severe as this, affects a lot of other

people in a lot of different ways. Racism is that same disease. White supremacy is that same disease. Income inequality is that same disease. And for a long time, the prescription to the disease, as it was explained to us, was to say, hey, you guys are the ones that continuously bring up racism. You guys are the ones that continuously harp on it. If you guys just don't talk about it, we'll move on from it. America will move on from it. A disease does not get better from ignoring it. The only way to effectively stop it in its tracks is to treat it. And the longer it remains untreated, the more violent it could be. Now, once you've decided that you're going to treat the cancer that is infecting your body, the next stage is, for a lot of people,

chemotherapy, whatever it is. It's chemotherapy. It's, you know, it's radiation. It's, it's, you know, it's whatever it is, right? I've seen people go through this. A lot of times that can seem worse than the disease itself. It has a violent effect on people. It is the hardest thing in the world to watch somebody go through chemo. They look unrecognizable. It is if some kind of demon reaches into their chest and pulls their lifeblood out of them. They don't look like anything that they resembled before then. That is what last night looked like. Last night looked like an America going through chemotherapy or a disease that has afflicted the country for a very long time. It looked like an unrecognizable America, a sick America. It looked like an America that

you're not sure whether or not the treatment is actually worse than the disease itself. but I can tell guys right now, people that are listening to me, as crazy and as out of hand and as too far as what happened last night was everywhere. And it did go too far. It did get out of hand.

There are outside agitators. It seems weird to say now, and I would love for it to stop. I want it to stop. It is probably something that had to happen. It is probably something that had to happen. happen in order for people to understand just how serious and just how much despair exists in so many communities around America?

I 100% agree with you. And something that you said when you were giving, when you were comparing it to cancer and you said that we ignored it, I would take it a step far and say, it wasn't even that we were ignoring it or we were told to ignore it. We were told it was cured. If you listen to people talk, they would say, I don't see color. Racism doesn't exist. We've had a black president.

We've had black people in high offices. As if it has been cured, which I think was an even bigger problem because as we see, it wasn't. It isn't. You see this civil unrest happening right now. This reminds me of a conversation I had with an Uber driver. I'm one of those people who loves to talk to their Uber and lift drivers all day, every day. And I was in that way. A three star rating.

Like terrible. Yeah. I have an impeccable rating. Sure. They love, I love conversation in it. Because I just feel like they've just been waiting to talk to somebody all day. So I was in L.A. one time.

And my driver was really just talking. He was talking about the homeless problem in L.A. And he was saying how vast it was and the disease that is running rampant in the homeless situation in L.A. And I was, I was agreeing with everything he was saying. And I said, how do you think it will change? because he was just talking about the wealth gap and the disparity between, you know, the haves and the have-nots.

And he said, have you ever seen gangs of New York? And he said, remember when they were just in the streets, I mean, they were killing people, but they were, you know, it was just this whole civil unrest within that city. He said, that's what's going to have to happen. So when I saw not just last night, but even the night before that, and I saw what was happening, it reminded me of that conversation. of people feel like there is nothing else that they can do but this. Not agreeing with what they're doing,

but they have just been pushed to a point where they don't know what else to do because they feel like they haven't been heard. Well, not they feel like they haven't been heard in centuries. And that's what we're seeing played out on these streets. And just now you're seeing people actually start to recognize it. And that comes out in so many different ways. And there's so many ways that we can tackle that. we continue to have this conversation today.

But now people are maybe starting to understand why people are resorting to the behavior that they are, not condoning it, just understanding the emotion behind those actions. Yeah, I mean, look, the thing that I would be afraid of right now, if I was, I guess the status quo would be the diversity of what I saw. I saw a ton of diversity in terms of who took to the street. streets in Los Angeles yesterday. I saw a level of solidarity that has escaped prior demonstrations like this. Now, obviously, you know, there's an aspect of, of people who ended up fucking up mailroads last night and fucking up different parts of, you know, that that exists outside the

scope of activism. But even when you speak to that, though, it's unfair and stupid to dismiss that as just opportunistic sort of activity. And the reason why it is is because I want people to understand something. There's a lot of things that are folding back onto the country right now. One reason why Beverly Hills was specifically hit yesterday. The reason why Beverly Hills was specifically marched into yesterday is because of a worship of excess that has infected America specifically in the last like 15 to 20 years. The reason why they hit the Alexander McQueen store yesterday and they didn't hit it in 92 or some other stores like that, 92 when people ride it or excuse me, when people took to the streets. I'm not going to sum these people up as riders.

The reason why they hit it yesterday, not before, is because today they knew what it was. So because these brands have been thrust into our face as examples. of what it means to really be a person because you're not, because like, you're not nothing if you don't have a Gucci belt. You're not nothing if you don't have Alexander McQueen. You're not nothing if you don't have an automar. You're not anything if you don't have any of this other stuff.

Because we keep getting slammed with that. Because Instagram keeps telling us that. The way to go claim your justice is to get some of those things. Back in the night in 92, you had to be fucking ridiculously rich to even understand what any of that stuff was. Now you just don't. But, Van, Van, I would take it a,

step further because of what I experienced yesterday when we were protesting. And to add to that, I was in the minority as a black person yesterday when protesting in Miami. There were two protests. One was in a predominantly white neighborhood. One was downtown. I participated in the one downtown. I was in the minority as a black person, which was very nice to see. I mean, we were all standing there in unity. But my point is to you saying about Beverly Hills, I don't even think it's the brands. I think it is going into these neighborhoods to make you uncomfortable so you feel bothered the way that we are. It's what we were talking about at the top of this show. I crossed over the bridge to people who had no idea what was going on.

They are unbothered sitting comfortably in their yachts and in their penthouses. I ran to the front of the march that was happening because they were about to go make a right, which was into the hood, instead of making a left into Brickle. And I begged them to go, left over the bridge because they need to see us. People need to see what we're doing. Not us. We know, we know what's wrong. We experience it every single day. They don't. And what was interesting was, you couldn't make a left because the police had lined up to where you couldn't go over to where the millionaires and the billionaires live. They directed us right back into the hood. And that's where, and that's where the protest, the direction that it went in, which I thought.

I thought I saw you tweet something about Beverly Hills being protected as well. They tried it, but it didn't work. The reason why it didn't, the, they tried it, but it didn't work. The reason why it didn't work was because they didn't go into the residential areas of Beverly Hills that I know of

in terms of yesterday, obviously there's still news trickling out, but I didn't see anyone. But in terms of the business parts of Beverly Hills, they wanted to make their presence felt there. They wanted to make their presence felt on the streets. They wanted to make their presence felt towards those brands. They wanted to make their presence felt it was a, it's sort of a rebellion of sorts,

not just in terms against white supremacy and the status quo and police violence, but about all the lies that they feel like America's told them over the past generation. All of it. The safety and security of being rich, the opulence of wealth, all of those things were sort of on trial yesterday. Listen, I've had several talks. I had talks with officials from the city of Los Angeles last night that wanted to,

that want to put together groups in order to kind of talk to people to kind of quell some of the demonstrations and I guess the loss of property last night. I'm torn. I'm torn because I don't want to see, young black kids out there engaging in lawlessness, tearing people up. I don't want to see small businesses, you know, lose their futures and lose their presence. And we have to make sure that we are honest. There are a lot of small businesses run by people who look just like

us that are suffering during this. And that's just a reality. Now, what we are going to do is put together some sort of fun to be able to give those people some assistance. And if you're rich and you're tweeting about all of these injustice and stuff like that, I expect you to pay it forward a little bit and make sure that a sneaker shop or some place that some little boutique that got their window smash can afford to rebuild after this. And we're going to be calling on people to do that. At the same time, you don't cure the disease unless you sit in the treatment.

Unless you get in tune with your body, you fall inside of yourself and you understand where people are coming from. So in order for me, like, Like, I can't look at the chemo and tell somebody to stop it just because it's uncomfortable to look at. You have got to keep doing what it is that you're doing to make sure that people understand how serious you are. Now, like, I'm not going to call for any violence, destruction of property or loss of life. It's just too much for me. At the same time, when I said the last time that we talked on Twitter before that something felt different,

about this, I wasn't giving you lip service. This feels like a sea change. And there's going to have to be bravery in order to see it through and to maintain the momentum of actual change. And it's not going to be pretty and it's not always going to feel good. Well, what I would say to that is, one, when you're talking about, you know, the cancer comparison again, and you're talking about how people need to sit in it and experience it. I also feel like there has to be some type of plan of action with that treatment so you can achieve the end goal, which is to be cured, to get better at the end of the day. And so my thing is, is I understand you being torn at the same time is I see people who are so

outraged, this young generation, so outraged, so upset by what is happening that they don't know how to channel that anger. They don't know what to do with it. And that's why you see them acting out in this way, which you understand, even though you don't agree with it. So who steps up as a leader to give them a call to action into how they can channel this emotion that they're feeling and put action behind it? That's what I think needs to happen that I'm not maybe in a unified way saying.

I don't know who needs to do it. You hear like, I can watch the local news and I see it happening, you know, people telling them what leaders saying what you should do in the community and how you can make. it better, but on a larger scale, I'm not seeing it. And I think that's the direction that's lacking that people need. Because right now we have the perfect storm, which is why I also think you say it feels different. You've got COVID and you've got the events that have happened in May. People are out of work dealing with quarantine, social distancing, not having human contact, and they're sitting in their homes, they're watching the news, they're on social media,

and they're seeing what has happened with just this month, Amad Arbery, Rihanna Taylor, George Floyd, and not even what's happening locally. I got a lawyer friend in Texas who's fighting a case right now against the Midland Police. Ty Anders is what's happening right there, where I don't know if you saw the video of the 90-year-old grandmother being knocked down in her own yard.

I mean, there's so much that is happening right now. People are upset. It's this perfect storm of that's why I think people are acting totally different. and we are affected on so many different levels right now by what is happening in our country. I think on CNN they refer to it as two viruses. I just, and I'll ask you this question and we can discuss it, but what do we do? We set this in our very first episode, where do you go from here? What do you do?

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which means the first thing you do, is you be mindful of the moment that you're in. So you allow yourself to feel what you're in. You allow the rage to happen. Sure. And I don't want to change the channel on that too quickly. I want to, you know, we're sitting in the country right now. Like we're talking here in America.

We're both Americans. The only reason why we're in the country that we're in right now is because of rebellion. And that's a very important point. I know that people have heard that, but I want people to understand that specifically what happened in terms of America, right? So what happened was you had a system of imperialism that dropped people off here. After a couple of generations, those people had their own way of thinking. Those people had their own way of looking at the world. Those people had their own way of attacking and approaching what it was that they wanted out of life.

After a time, they felt like the people that were governing them weren't on the. the same page as them, weren't giving them enough of a voice to say what they wanted out of their future. Their culture had deviated in a way away from what was happening across the pond. And at a certain time, those people said, yo, if we're buying into the system that you're propping up, then what we want is representation. We want to be heard. We want to be seen. And after a while of feeling that they were getting taxed without represented, they threw all the tea that they could muster into a harbor in Massachusetts. So the reality is that what you're seeing right now is almost more American than any other way of attacking a problem. It's the birth of the country.

It is the way the country was founded. what Colin Kaepernick, by the way, attempted to do. He attempted to actually, what he attempted to do was to give a more contemporary version of civil disobedience. The civil disobedience that Colin Kaepernick attempted was optimal. That was the evolution of civil disobedience. What you saw last night was the throwback. That's the old school radio station of civil disobedience.

Colin tried to evolve it and say, I'm going to do this peacefully, silently, but loudly. And America, the economic structure of America, a lot of the social structure of America, told him no. They said, we don't want it that way. They said, that doesn't work. They said fall in line. And what happened last night was what you get when you give those directives to people they're trying to be evolved and civilized and actually peaceful.

You know they were wishing for the days when we were just taking a knee. That would love for everybody that left their house and took a knee last night. It would have loved it. But unfortunately, it was given to them peaceful protests everywhere. beautiful protests everywhere. Protests that actually included, you know, a lot of non-blacks even then. And it was rejected. So now we are where we are.

As far as the leadership right now, it's a call, a specific call to action to anyone anywhere that has a platform or has, like anybody anywhere. We need to be figuring out what's next, how we're moving forward at what's going on. But we don't need to step on the gas. That's the biggest thing. This isn't any other year. It's an election year when you have leadership in the office that isn't addressing the issues that are at hand.

I mean, this is what adds to the perfect storm of it all. You know, one of the ways to make a change is a systemic change. And that is with voting, that is with affecting things locally, state level, national level. And this is the year where you can do that. So I think part of the call to action has to be picking back that up, that momentum we had when we were saying vote or die. That is so relevant again right now. We turned out in record numbers when that campaign was going on right now.

That's the kind of momentum we need. And I agree with you. I'm not saying that, you know, you want to turn it too quickly because you don't want people to lose what they're feeling. I'm saying, I don't want this to fizzle out. I don't want George Floyd's name to go in the list of other names that are a half. I don't want that to happen. I want people to continue to be hungry for a change. And that's what my fear is, is that it's just going to die down. Okay, one officer was arrested. Okay, so now let's get the other three. Three officers are arrested. Now we're good. No, we're not good. We have to keep moving. We have to keep going. And so who's going to step up and lead us through that? Platforms, people with platforms is the number one thing right now. I feel very, I feel, I have an audience. I don't know what your audience looks like. My audience on social media does not look like me. And I feel very called.

Y'all can't see Vanner. You got to. I'm just saying, I'm just saying because you got a lot, what you got the Hannah B's that follow you? Or is that what you're saying? No, they hate me. They hate me.

What's your audience? What's your audience look like, Rachel? Tell me right now. My audience doesn't look like me. My majority of my audience is white. white women. And I have a lot of people who are looking at me.

They write me, what can I do? What to do? I want to do better. I admit that I've been living privileged. I've been acting like it's not going on. And so I feel like I feel the burden to use my platform to continue to speak out to use this podcast. Do you ever get you? Do you get messages like in your DMs from people that follow you like,

Rachel, I really want to help the colored people. What do I do to help the color? Not color. Rachel, I really. really want to help you and your fellow Negroes. What do I? Between the lines. No, but I do.

I have a lot of people who say, I used to think of it this way. I heard you say this and now I see it totally different. So I'm never going to turn away from that. And I feel like my purpose, one of my purposes for doing, being a part of this franchise, I never knew anything about before is for a time like this,

to speak to an audience that I never really would have had that opportunity to before. And so I forgot why I even went down this track talking about all of this, but I know it had to do something with change. I know it had to do something with leadership change, voting. I have no idea how we got here. No, I mean, I think what you're saying, I'm going to help you find your tongue right there. Thank you.

Like Avon says to Marlowe on the wire. Shane was flying. I'm going to help you find your tongue. What you're saying is that you feel like you have a platform. and you speak to a specific audience and audience that might not be necessarily in tune as much with some of the cultural issues and problems that you're going through.

And that's very important in making substantive and concrete change in the fabric of America. Does that sound like kind of where you were going? That was beautiful. Thank you. Right. And so what I would say to that is this. Two things. Number one, I love the voter die campaign when it happened. But when the voter die campaign first happened, we elected George W. Bush.

So not only do we have to turn out the vote, we have to be intentional. And I think if you spoke with Puff about this, he would talk about some of the mistakes of it. We have to be intentional about not just voting, but what we're voting for, and specifically what we're voting out. And we have to look at the ramifications of the last election,

how they affect America. For example, I'll tell you guys right now, I'm not going to dedicate this podcast to bashing or even, fuck bashing. I wouldn't give a fuck about bashing. But I'm not going to give a fuck about bashing. But I'm not going to give, dedicate this podcast to even addressing the current administration because, in my opinion, everything about them that needs to be said has been said. And the only thing that left that needs to happen is action.

And I'm about that action. I think a lot of people are about that action and mobilizing to affect change in Washington. But the president is not, from what I understand, at this point, it is 1.14 p.m. Pacific time here in Los Angeles. and from what I've read this morning, the president is not today going to address the American people. That is absolutely terrifying.

That is terrifying cowardice and incompetence. That is ridiculous, outrageous, horrible, bone-chilling, terrifying incompetence and cowardice from that position not to address the American people.

I don't know if the president is going to go on to do that, but not to address the American people in this particular historic moment that we're in, not to offer anything or to say anything is absolutely startling and offensively cowardly. So he has addressed the nation. Let's just take it back.

He might not have stood up at a podium in the Rose Garden and said and addressed the nation to say exactly what's happening. He said stuff here and there, but not to what he's going to do, a type of call to action, what a leader would do in this moment. But he has addressed the nation. He's called protesters thugs. He has said when the looting starts, the shooting starts. And today his national security advisor got on national TV, Robert O. Brian and said that 99. something percent of police officers are not bad and we have a few

rotten apples. He got on TV and said that there doesn't need to be systemic change, that there's not systemic racism in the U.S. police forces. That is the national security advisor speaking in who is a part of the Trump administration. That is Trump. William Barr is supposed to be doing a federal civil rights probe into what's happened in Minneapolis.

When your national security advisor believes that there isn't systemic racism and police force, what do you think is going to happen with that? That is Trump speaking. I don't need to hear from Trump. I'm like Don Lemon. I don't need to hear from Trump at this point because you have spoken out in multiple ways through your administration, through your tweets, and through the very little things that you've said

when you promoted Maganite on your way to go watch a rocket launch. while the country is in civil unrest. We are on the brink of a civil war right now and you're watching rocket launches. He is speaking out. He reached who he is. Yeah, it's not that I need to hear from the president. Let me clarify.

It's not that I need to hear from the president. It's not that I want to hear from the president. It's just that it's shocking to me that with the entire country on fire, you don't. What that tells me is that what I already knew, Donald Trump is not a patriot. Donald Trump does not care about America. Donald Trump does not care about

even some of the individual capitalistic systems that he says that he cares about because those were the ones that by and large were being destroyed last night. The fact that there, listen, there's a certain level of incompetence where I keep saying this, where evil,

there's a certain level of power, I should say, where evil and incompetence are indistinguishable. You can be so powerful that just being incompetent, a cowardly hurts as many people as if you were the devil. And it's the thing. And we're approaching that. We're approaching that with absolutely a complete, not just a lead, no leadership, a vacuum of leadership at the top.

And if there were any sort of decency or any sort of plan prior to this, you'd see this probably being handled better now. But it's interesting. And it's so crazy. It's like, between men and women, this is always like a big thing. It's like, this is slightly controversial. Oh, I can't wait. Slightly controversial. Slightly controversial.

I once had a conversation with a man I respected a lot. Am I going to tell you exactly. Use past tense. I still respect them. But this kind of changed it. he was telling me about some of his infidelity or the mistakes that he had made in his relationship. Okay. And he said something then that I don't agree with, but that I understand.

What he said was that I asked him, you know, why do you lie so much? He goes, I lie because I do the wrong things. And he was like, if I did these things flagrantly in front of her face and embarrassed her, that would mean that I didn't even care. And he goes, in a weird way, I care enough to lie. Now, as a 25-year-old guy, I thought that was some really deep shit. I was like, oh, shit. I care enough to lie, dog.

I'm going to get that tattooed on my back, man. That's a dog, you all like, a ghetto Socrates in this motherfucker. Like, I care enough to lie, blew my mind. Now I realize that being a comprehensive man, it's about maybe not having to lie and not putting yourself in those positions. But I say all that to say, though. that there is something to be said about just showing your face when you don't have anything substantive to say. There's something to be said about getting in front of people and going,

I don't have the answers, but I care. I don't know what to say to America, but I hope things get better. One of the reasons that I liked Bill Clinton, despite revisionist history on the Clinton administration, now and sort of what the Clinton administration ushered in, the 94 crime bill, all of that stuff like that. Maybe not the best long term. But when I fell in love with Bill Clinton politically is during a choose-your-lose special, MTV used to do this when MTV News was really speaking to the youth. They were talking about all these different things, was get-to-know candidate Bill Clinton,

or maybe he was president by this point, I don't remember. And Bill Clinton was asked a question. The question was, do you think, because gangster rap was the big. big scary thing in urban America then, in black America then, do you think that gangster rap contributes to violence on the streets all over America? Do you think it

contributes to the crime rate? Bill Clinton took his mic. He looked into his, he looked into the camera and he goes, I don't know. And in my life, I had never seen a politician that was confident

enough that cared enough, that was cognizant enough and attached enough to an issue like that to say, I don't have that answer, but I care about the question. It takes a real leader

in a moment to be like, I'm not sure, but I'm standing right here in this conversation with you to let you know that I care about it. Now, it was probably also Bill Clinton that told me I care enough to lie to my wife. Those things are probably, I probably, you know what I mean? It's probably, I'm not, I'm not deifying President Clinton right now.

But what I'm saying is that sometimes, and this is for anyone in the leadership position, sometimes it's not about the answers. It's about the presence. Are you present with us? And to know that there's absence at the top is almost scarier than to know that there's incompetence at the top. But that's why I feel like we should talk about Trump because if you are serious with us, and I'm back talking to my audience, if you really want to make a change, then you're going to pay attention to what's happening and what's not happening in our country. And you're going to

figure out how can I vote for the person that is going to make that change. So you have to start listening to these politicians and listening to what they're saying and what they're not saying. So you can make this systemic change. And President Trump hasn't said much of anything. Joe, Biden has. Now, feel what you want on Joe Biden, but he actually did a wonderful job addressing the nation and speaking towards

what's happening in our country and specifically in Minneapolis. And I myself am listening to what he's saying and I'm holding him to it. He specifically talked about police reform. I am holding him to it and I think that this is what people need to realize. You need to vote for the person who's going to make the change. But then

once they get into office, you need to hold them accountable and demand that they actually make those changes because I think that's where we also fall off, right? We got the person we wanted in office and then that's it. And then an eight years goes by and you look back and you'll say, what did they really do for us?

Yeah. I mean, you're right talking about, I saw Dr. Cornell West talk. Oh, yeah. Cornel is beautiful. Cornell is beautiful. Look, these are like, like Cornell, that was crazy too. They're like Cornell. The thing I like about Cornell is Cornell fires indiscriminately.

So if you weren't up on your shit, hey, President Obama, come get this paddling. So it's anyone. Look, I agree with you. I think that the Biden campaign is missing some opportunities, if you ask me. But I know why they're missing them. And one reason why they're missing them is because they've got a loose canon that you cannot trust what he is going to say when you put a microphone in his face. He's just, he says, he says, weirdo shit. it. And so I get that. I think what I want from politicians now and, you know, politicians and

activists are not the same. What I want from, yeah, like what I want from politicians now is actual action. So let's talk about something right now. One of the people that, um, Vice President Biden was vetting to be his. VP choice was Amy Klobuchar. What I would like to hear what I would like to hear right now is them publicly say that they are no longer vetting her. Exactly.

They won't do that and I understand that but it would be fantastic to me with and we'll talk about and maybe you can illuminate for the people why Amy Klobuchar is completely out for me. I'll let you kind of download that information to them. Well, I'll just say that Amy Klobuchar

she used to run the county that's an issue right now that is in charge of the prosecution of disgraced officer Derek Shabbat. Hennepin County. And she had the opportunity to prosecute him back in the day because if you also don't know, he has 18 prior acts. I don't know if they're specifically against people of color, but 18 prior act grievances filed against him and nothing, he's never been punished for what he's done. And she had the chance to prosecute him and she passed on it. Now, what you also need to know about Amy Klobuchar is she likes to stand on the platform that she's tough on crime. Well, that crime just can't be against citizens.

It also has to be against the police officers that are committed. Talk yo shit. And Derek Chauvin, as we have seen, did it blatantly with a smirk on his face, knowing that cameras were pointed at him and could give zero fucks. And he also has 18 prior acts against that he committed against other citizens. So Amy Klobuchar is out. she's toast. And to me, you bring up a very valid point. I don't think it's difficult at all for the Biden campaign to say, guess what, we're not going with her. Because everybody else is saying it. Everybody else is saying it at this point. It is very key. And now I'm getting upset because I listen to the speech that Biden gave. And I listened to him talk about police reform. And I listened to him talk about what he wanted to do. And I actually quoted something that he said that goes along very nicely with what you said about him not saying something about Klobuchar. He said, and I quote, with silence, we are complicit with perpetuating these cycles of violence.

So if you're going to be silent in one regard, then you're, that to me, you're, you can't, you can't quote that because you need to be speaking out on what Amy Klobuchar did. And you need to say that you want to disassociate yourself in your administration, your future administration, with her, period. So the reason why that won't happen is a couple of reasons. Number one is politics as usual. as I understand it, Biden's wife is pretty good friends with Amy Klobuchar, so they've known each other for a long time. I personally think that prior to this and prior to Biden's gaffe on the breakfast club, Klobuchar had an inside track to the vice president position. I really think that they were seriously considering her to get it.

Oh, I 100% agree with you. So, number one, she should come out and publicly say that because of her record, she is going to focus on different things and not going to be. in the driver's seat for that. But see, the problem with any of this stuff, not the driver's seat, but not in contention for that or in consideration for it. The problem with any of this stuff is it requires sometimes that people care a little bit too much about actual people. And it also requires something else that politicians are incredibly bad at that they demand from the American people, which is accountability. See, your record demands that you're accountable.

There is no other job. Can you imagine being a neurosurgeon, right? A neurosurgeon, and you have 18 different instances where someone says you put a nerve in the wrong place. You know what I'm saying? You're a neurosurgeon, right? You're doing shit on people's brain. Right. And a dude, and like, 18 different times somebody goes, you know what?

I could remember game six between the Sacramento Kings and a lot of times. Angeles Lakers before I came to you. And now, all I have are memories of cricket. Like, you replaced my basketball memory with cricket. Can I do something about that? Or you've just fucked up if you're

a baker and you make 18 different times somebody says, you fucked up the birthday cake. Whatever you're doing that many times, you are completely unprofessional and out of line. Is there any other

profession in America where that many complaints can be lodged against someone. And like, what's the other one? The president of the United States. Boom. Love it. Love it. Because we complain against him all the time. But what I'm saying is that

what I'm saying is that this police officer this was, he evolved. He felt like he was so untouchable. Nothing was going to happen. There was a blue shield behind him to a point to where he knelt on a man until he died.

We have to address policing in this country to make sure that they are out to protect and serve and that they haven't become a power cult that thinks there are something separate, different, above and able to enforce unjust authority on the American people.

And we have got to make that a priority going forward in our country or we're going to lose large parts of American society. Agreed 100%. And that's That's why I cannot believe we have the head of NSA on there say that there's not systemic racism in the United States police forces.

When you have a Michigan police officer who just, they just found out that he had a framed application for KKK and a Confederate flag hanging up in his home. You right now, in the last 24 hours, you have seen the police use their power in the wrong way, plowing over protesters, opening their car doors, knocking them out, kicking them them, pulling down their face mask and spraying pepper spray in their faces, throwing up the white power sign on TV and in front of cameras as they are dressed as police officers that are sworn to protect and serve us, but yet they're aligning themselves with white power. I mean, there is such a problem and the reform isn't getting rid of a couple of bad apples. That is not the reform that I'm looking for. And I know most people aren't. The reform that needs to happen is that punishment needs to be in place. There needs to be rules.

There need to be laws where you mess up one time. This happens. Two, you're out. You're done. It just needs to be that simple. Because as you said, in any other profession, you are held accountable for your bad acts. You don't get this many chances to mess up. And that's like 18 times.

There is a pattern. This isn't a coincidence. 18 times isn't a pattern. who you are. Why wouldn't you think you could get away with anything else? Why wouldn't you? 18 times, you're invincible. That's how you feel at that point.

And he thinks he's above the law. Right. Which until this incident, he was. He was. The reason why he thought that. And so listen, I want to, so when people here are talking about that, what people are going to say is police have a hard job.

They do. They do have a hard job. Police have a hard job. It can't be harder to be an American citizen than it is to be a police officer. It can't. It is a, it is a,

it is a, it is a job that is steeped in public service. Normally this would be the point where I would say it's not all cops.

There are some good cops and we're not talking about all the cops. I'm gonna tell you guys something right now. I'm never going to say that again. I've said that in the past because I've had

officers in my family. I've known good police officers. I've had good police officers. I've had good dealings with some police officers. I can't say that ever again anymore. Fuck my family members

that are police officers. Not fuck them, but fuck the idea of using them to shield a system that is obviously broken. It's not enough to be a good cop anymore. You have to be an involved cop now. Yeah. You have to be

a cop that is involved. You have to be an invested cop. A cop that is involved and invested into changing what's going on in your industry. It's not enough to walk your beat, to care about people. All of those things are admirable and all of those things are awesome if you're doing them. But now, if you want policing in America to be better, if you want Americans to feel like they're a part of society, you have to be an activated police officer, an involved police officer,

an invested police officer into getting rid of the criminality that exists inside of your industry. We've seen this before. We've seen other industries have to root out systemic problems inside of their industries. Baseball, we're on the ringer here. It's a sports platform. Baseball had to come together and from the inside out say, you know what, the PD's things, the PD things has gone too far. In order for us to address this issue, it has to happen.

from within. And players have to change their mentality on performance enhancing drugs if we want it out. Police officers have to change their perspective on policing if the police departments are going to change. And we have to from the outside put enough pressure on them to demand that change from within. It's not just about the good cops. It's about all cops now. Policing has to change. But here's the thing. If you back to you're the first state that you made that you feel like you can't say anymore, that not all cops are bad cops. If you really are a good cop and you are really bothered by what's happening,

then you should feel burden that you need to be involved and speak out just for your, it's the integrity of the office of the profession. You should want to wear your uniform and you should want to be better. And you should hate the fact that you're a job that you like and you care about is being tarnished by the bad act. of certain cops. That should be enough in you that you want to step out and say, how can we do better? Because I'm not that type of cop. And I don't want to be affiliated with those type of cops. That, that to me is, you're right, don't take a knee with us. Don't post

a video. Don't show us what you're doing. Like, take action. Get involved in your union. Get involved in some police reform, some type of legislation. You have to act on it to not be affiliated with the negative image that we have of police right now in our country. I want to do something before we get out of here. This is like it, like, we, it's something positive.

It's something, it's something, it's something pretty positive. I want to do something before we get out of here. Um, just to let you guys know, this episode of higher learning was one, we weren't actually scheduled to record until tomorrow.

Yeah. But we've, uh, y'all see Rachel on here crying. And like, like, like, Rachel,

Rachel on here crying. Uh, so obviously this was something that we felt like we had. to get up because there's just so much to get off your chest and so many conversations that need to be started and had, and this podcast is going to be one place for those. So we wanted to make sure we were in the moment with everybody else that's feeling away. I do want to address something that happened last night and address a homeboy of mine. Over at CNN, Don Lemon.

Don Lemon rattled off a bunch of names of people last night that he felt like he wanted to see more from in all of this situation. I feel what Don was saying. We need the visibility of people like Oprah and Ellen and all of those other people that he was saying. He wants to see him on the front lines. He wants to see him more visible. He wants to see him more readily accessible to people who are out there risking their safety and their freedom. I will say this, though.

There are people on that list that I know personally. He mentioned Tracy Ellis Ross. He mentioned Anthony Anderson. Yo. these people are down, help, and have always helped and been there. I want to stress to everybody out here. Everybody has different jobs about the way they go about doing what they're doing. Before he hugged President Nixon and really put a stain on his reputation for a long, long time,

Sammy Davis Jr. was known as one of the people that bankrolled the Civil Rights Movement. It's one of the people that was there bailing people out of jail. One of the people making sure that they had, we talked about this on the last podcast a little bit about things you can do to help out activists. He was one of the people that was doing that. And so we all don't attack a problem in the same way. In the Army, people have specialized jobs. You have infantrymen.

You have snipers. You have people that tanks. You have doctors. But the entire goal is mission accomplishment. whatever your specialty is is less important than accomplishing the mission. Some people are going to be on the street.

Some people are going to be in the boardroom. Some people are going to be in the courtroom. Some people are going to be putting pressure on corporations. Certain people are going to do different things. What we shouldn't do is try to squeeze everyone into the same container. And we have to have grace amongst the community for each other and what our prospective jobs are.

That's all I would say about that. This is the only, thing I'll say to that. I agree with what you're saying. I think that because we are so in search of a leader that it may be unfair, but people right now need to see you doing something. You can call it unfair, but they need to see it. I will say this, if the Amish community can come out, is completely detached from the world can come out and say that we stand with you for Black Lives Matter, then I think some celebrities can as well. They need to.

They need to be visible. They definitely need to be visible. I just want to make sure we give everybody fair enough chance to do different things. 100%. I'm just getting your perspective. Here's the thing about the Amish community. I knew it was bullshit. I got to be honest with you.

Rachel, I knew it was bullshit. They went to see witness. They went to the movie theaters to see witness. I'm telling you, I'll be honest with you. I always thought about it, right? I always thought about it. You know what I'm saying?

I always thought like, because I would see different documentaries and it would be on Amish people that want to break out. And I would think to myself, well, how does an Amish person that wants to break out even know that documentaries exist?

True. If you're cutting yourself off, how do you know? You don't have no Netflix. How did the Amish find out about this? I don't know how they find out, but shout to the Amish people because they helped with the Underground Railroad too.

Ombuds people have been down for the cause. That's different. Because for the underground of the Amish and the Quakers and all those, that's different. Because when you come, when the Underground Railroad is coming through, you can talk to Harry Tubman,

you're Amish and you go, yo, why does that black woman have a shotgun? Who is that? And then you talk to her. But like the George Floyd situation, somebody, at some point, the Amish, they had a hashtag up there. The hashtag,

It's technology. How do you, they bullshit. I'm telling y'all. I don't care. I loved it. I loved every moment of it. I love to see it too. If they can step out, then so can you.

And I think that's Don Lemon's point. They saw witness in theaters. They went to, they was like, yo, this movie is about us. We're going to see it. They finally drove there in the car. I've never seen a horse and buggy at the movie theater. They drove there. No, why would I see a horse and buggy in a movie theater?

Okay, moment of truth. I'm from, my dad is from South Texas, okay? Beville, South Texas. There is a huge Amish community there. So you see people saddle up in a horse and buggy all the time and go out to the store. Right. To the movies.

If they go to the movies, that's technology. You're lying. You're lying. You're lying. You're lying. All right. We're about to get out of here. You guys, we didn't want to do,

this is not a full episode. This is an episode where we're bearing our hearts, bearing our souls, kind of talking to everyone. Rachel, you got any more knowledge to drop on people before we go? No, I would just say, just a piggyback on what you said.

We are just getting started with this, but there's so much in our country right now that this podcast is about the culture, so we're always going to address what's happening and how it affects us. But in the future, we will have a lot more lighthearted episodes as well as we talk about sports

and entertainment and current affairs, politics, what may be. need it, but right now it's important to address what's relevant. Right. I'm out of here. Look, kids, cover your faces. Cover your face not only from COVID-19, but cover your face from any camera that might see you out engaging in civil disobedience against the system.

Be good to one another. Be responsible to one another and love one another. Thank you for learning with us. Keep your thing cast on. We'll talk to you next time. Be safe.