History That Doesn't Suck - The Unlikely Union: "A house divided against itself cannot stand."

Episode Date: September 29, 2025

Professor Greg Jackson shares a personal message about our politically divided times and announces more tour dates for his live show: The Unlikely Union.  This show is not recorded for the podcast. Go to HTDSpodcast.com/live-shows for more information and dates.  Prof. Jackson’s national tour has already been to half of the 50 states, so-called red and blue states, big cities and small towns.  What he’s encountered is everyday people, regardless of their political stripe coming together to share in the telling of the extraordinary history of the first century of our nation. That period from fiery revolution through bloody civil war is– not despite of, but because of its ugly and all but insurmountable challenges– a consoling reminder that we have been through far, far worse times and much greater division than is even imaginable today.  And it's a cautionary tale. Our great strength is our union and our great peril is our division.  The words of the Republican candidate from Illinois for the US Senate spoken in 1858 ring true today:  "A house divided against itself cannot stand." You're damn right, Abe. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

With Amex Platinum, you have access to over 1,400 airport lounges worldwide. So your experience before takeoff is a taste of what's to come. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Conditions apply. It's Monday, September 17, 1787. This convention has been hard. Locked in Philadelphia's hot, sweltering statehouse, disagreement has been sharp. Some delegates have full-on rage quit.

Barely more than 40 of the summer's total 55 delegates are still here. Alexander Hamilton is the only New Yorker left, and Rhode Island never even sent a delegation. So at this point, the choice of every man left to sign and thereby personally endorse this Constitution's proposed form of union could be its making or its undembourg. doing. In this moment, elderly Benjamin Franklin wishes to say a word. It's been 33 years since he published that join-or-dye cartoon, done in response to the military challenges, then faced in the Ohio Valley by this convention's president, George Washington. He's too old to speak at length, but Ben hands a written speech to his colleague, James Wilson, who proceeds to read the old Renaissance man's prepared words. I confess

that there are several parts of this constitution which I do not at present approve, but I am not sure I shall never approve them for having lived long. I have experienced many instances of being obliged by better information or fuller consideration to change opinions even on important subjects. The older I grow, the more apt I am to tout my own judgment and to pay more respect to the judgment of others. you assemble a number of men to have the advantage of their joint wisdom you inevitably assemble with those men all their prejudices their passions their errors of opinion their local interests and their selfish views from such an assembly can a perfect production be expected it therefore astonishes me sir to find the system approaching so near to perfection as it does on the whole sir i cannot help express any wish that every member of the convention who may still have objections to it, would with me on this occasion doubt a little of his own

infallibility. And to make manifest our unanimity, put his name to this instrument. No one here thinks this proposed federal union is perfect, and many criticisms are for opposite reasons. William Patterson thinks the federal government is too strong. Alexander Hamilton thinks it's too weak, but it's closer to perfection than the articles. It's a more perfect Union, with only three refusing the other 39 remaining delegates put their names to it, filled with threats, shouts, and a few flying fists. The ratification process is anything but pretty. And I'd like to tell you a story. Hello, my friends.

This is Professor Greg Jackson. And welcome to a special mini episode. What you just heard was an excerpt for my live show, titled The Unlikely Union. That was a scene from the final day of the constitutional Convention in September 1787, 238 years ago as of this recording. The words were by none other than Ben Franklin, aka the First American, who was, as you heard, appealing to his fellow convention delegates to find the common ground on which a solid civil foundation for the nation may be built. I played that scene for you because it's an

important reminder from the past about how to conduct ourselves in our current fraught political times. We are greatly divided in our politics these days, and that's nothing new. We have always carried with us our prejudices, passions, errors of opinion, local interests, and selfish views, to quote Dr. Franklin. So I share this with you on this occasion, that we must all doubt a little of our own infallibility and make manifest our unanimity. I firmly believe our union is our greatest source of strength. It was very unlikely that these constitutional convention delegates would find unanimity. They were from 13 disparate, distinct former British colonies that just a decade and year earlier united to declare independence on the basis of natural rights, life, liberty,

and the pursuit of happiness, and a radical principle that governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed. It was unlikely that we could come together time after time during a crisis. But time after time, we did. We made manifest our unanimity because we have so much more in common than in disagreement and so much more to gain when we work through our disagreements respectfully, peacefully. A horrific act of political violence happened on the campus where I teach at, Utah Valley University. It has understandably sparked national outrage. I get it.

And while I've always condemned political violence and always wanted to see elevated, informed discourse in the public sphere, those are some of the very reasons for which I started this podcast after all. There is, of course, no academic substitute for the experience of feeling and seeing condemnable, cruel, and cowardly political violence in your home. A place where previously this is,

type of thing was unthinkable. And then to see your home become a play theme for the most partisan commentators, I confess I've never felt anything like this. And it only drives my conviction all the more that we must not retreat to our corners, that we must not allow bad faith, commentary, and social media algorithms to stoke fear and outrage. Above all, we must not swallow that toxic rhetoric and spiral down a dark hole where we begin to assume that our fellow Americans in another city or state,

value life and liberty less, love America less, and want anything less than a more perfect union. And I'm here to tell you just how false those sky is falling narratives are. That's not been my experience out on the road, meeting fellow Americans across this land. On my national tour with the live show, I've already been to half of the 50 states, so-called red and blue states, big cities and small towns. What I've seen, as everyday people, regardless of their political stripe, coming together to share in the telling of the extraordinary first century of our nation's history.

That period from fiery revolution through bloody civil war is, not despite but because of its ugly and all but insurmountable challenges, a consoling reminder that we have been through far, far worse times in much greater division than is even imaginable today. And it's a cautionary tale. Our great strength is our union, and our great peril is our division. The words of the Republican candidate from Illinois for the U.S. Senate, spoken in 1858, ring true today. A house divided against itself cannot stand.

You damn right, Abe. And I'd like for everyone hearing this message right now to consider that. I know that the H.TDS audience takes the lessons of history seriously, and I urge everyone to take those lessons to your conversations with your friends and family, especially the youngest ones who need positive role models and challenging lessons today to help them become responsible citizens and leaders for tomorrow. Here's something else I know about the HDDS audience. You're curious, smart, and don't all share the same political stride.

I know that last part because I've met many of you on the road and some of you have volunteered information about your politics. I don't really need to know that. but knowing it anecdotally tells me that HTDS is a big tent with room for everyone. And that pleases me immensely. I know that our common bond is a yearning to learn about the people that came before us, good and bad, that we want to walk in the shoes of our fellow citizens from past times so that we might gain insights for today.

So, my friends, my fellow Americans, If my live show, The Unlikely Union, passes your way in coming months. Please forgive me for feeling an even deeper conviction than ever as I invite you to bring your family and neighbors out for a night at the theater, that town hall of inspiring ideas. We've just announced a slew of new dates, which you can find on our website, hdDSpodcast.com. As I've said, this show is meant to be experienced together. It's not recorded for the podcast for that very reason. You'll experience me storytelling on stage in real life with live music and video.

Come out and join me. Come out and meet your neighbors. Dates and cities are on our website, htdspodcast.com, or click the link in the show notes. I aim to eventually get to all 50 states, and I hope to see you on the road. Until then, I hope you'll continue and join the tale of the United States entering World War II. Next week, we carry on as the nation debates whether it should or shouldn't fully enter the war. We'll follow FDR out into the Atlantic for a secret meeting with Winston Churchill. Listen to Charles Lindbergh testify in favor of isolationism in Congress

and experience General George C. Marshall's intense military exercises as he readies the U.S. Army for war. It may or may not enter. Join me then as I'd like to tell you that story.