House of R - ‘A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms’ Episode 4 Deep Dive

Episode Date: February 11, 2026

Mal and Jo are back with Dunk and Egg to dive deep into the latest episode of ‘A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms’! They talk about the trial of seven, Raymun getting knighted, and Baelor's decision to join Dunk's side.(00:00) Intro(06:25) Opening Snapshot(17:47) Dunk awaits his judgment(51:46) Baelor gives Egg some tough love(01:13:40) Baelor counsels Dunk(01:36:33) Dunk demands trial by combat. Aerion ups the ante.(01:49:30) The Fossoways side with Dunk(01:58:36) Daeron the Drunken. Daeron the Dreamer.(02:09:29) Dunk, like Jo, is always thinking of puppets(02:16:49) Steely Pate gives Dunk his shield and some encouragement(02:26:57) Dunk meets his side(02:34:24) Ser Steffon (Stevron?) flips(02:38:37) Raymun asks for his knighthood(02:52:25) The seven theory redux(03:01:06) Dunk appeals to the crowd(03:14:29) Baelor Breakspear does his best Oberyn impression(03:25:02) Book spoilers!Hosts: Mallory Rubin and Joanna RobinsonProducer: Carlos ChiribogaSocial: Jomi AdeniranAdditional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell and Jacob Cornett Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Greetings and welcome to House of R. A Ringerverse podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Mallory Rubin. Joining me today to remind us that one need not intend harm to do it. That's what we told Carlos and Jacob before we started recording in terms of the likely runtime today. It's Joanna Robinson. Oh, hi. Hello. Joe, we are here to dive deep. Profoundly deep, deep, deep, deep, deep. Deep, deep. Deep. Deep. Deep. Deep. Deep. Deep. Deep. Deep. into episode four of a Night of the Seven Kingdoms. And we're going to do that right after this. This episode is brought to by Whole Foods Market. Spring is here, so celebrate it with fresh, juicy, seasonal produce, and some very tasty limited time flavors.

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Every now and then someone's like, maybe this is the first pod they listen to it. How do you guys do it? Thanks for asking. And everyone else is like, guys, I've been listening to you for dozens of hours at this point in this show and years. All right, talk to Thrones. Back to its usual schedule. Sunday. Because there's not the Super Bowl this weekend. By the way,

the Patriots ate shit. And that was great. That was wonderful. Sorry, Arduna. I sent him the least authentic. I'm so sorry, pal note ever. It was a... This is miraculous timing. We're already off all topics. I know. It's impressive. So we will be back on Sunday night right after episode five, Is somehow already the penultimate episode of the season of television? Devastating. Devastating. With CR, with the crank daddy himself, Chris Ryan. Is that a private nickname or do we say that on Pops?

You say it all the time on Mike. Great. Great. I'm sure he loves it. Speaking of Crank Daddies. Captain Crank. And then we'll be back. It's Valentine's Day week.

Wow. Look at you. See, if Chris were here, he'd say, what a segue. Because that's the thing he likes to say, but he's not. So I said it. Okay. It's Valentine's Day this week. V-Day Quickie?

We're doing our third. Third annual V-Day Quickie episode. So that's a series, but we're kind of pairing it with another series. We're doing, it's like technically a best of the century so far episode. But we've decided what is time, what is this entry? We don't really care. So we're doing a Valentine Day special that has to do with like romance and sex stuff go. Sex stuff go.

You sent me categories, I believe 50% of them were sex base. We might modify that a bit. Do you have any additional ideas? Correct. Open to feedback. Correct. But we're going to do something sweet and romantic and slutty for Valentine's Day this week. Will we be breaking the whiteboards back out?

We will be breaking the whiteboards back out. Fantastic news. That is happening. And also, people are like, wait, I heard you were doing Buffy season 3 part 2. You're like, you definitely made the mistake you said you were never going to make, which was commit publicly on the record to a schedule for a podcast. I don't know if anyone noticed, but we had some technical difficulties last week. So we did decide to give ourselves a break.

Yes. And we'll be wrapping up Buffy next week, we promise. Spoilers. I can't believe you promised. I mean, we do indent in Dent too, but a promise on a Thrones podcast. I laughingly promised. Promise me, Ned. Promise me. Yeah, spoilers. How do we do it? How do we navigate spoilers on this here podcast? Listen. Yeah.

Do we like context from the larger Game of Thrones universe? Yes. Has anything that has ever been filmed and showed on television or Game of Thrones on the table? Yes. Anything from a song of Ice and Fire, that book series on the table? Yes. The Dunkin' Egg novellas. That's right. Only up through what the show has shown. So we will be giving context from the books. But if it's anything that comes in the near future for a dunk and an egg and anyone associated, that is going in our book spoiler section at the end of the podcast.

There is a sound that has traumatized the nation. Dare I say the globe. Thank you, Carlos. But they're not making the mistake of listening to spoilers they don't want to listen to. So that is also true. Fantastic stuff. Last question before we get going. Oh, please.

How can everybody follow along and how can they reach us? Well, listen, if this is your first podcast and not your 900th hour with us, why don't you just subscribe to the pod and all, wherever you get your podcast? Great idea. I think that's a great idea. You can watch us. We're both wearing blue knitwear today. That's a side to behold.

We are. Mine is like shedding a lot. Yeah. If you see dust moats, if you see like Angora moats in the air. Oh, here's one. Here's one. That's my. Okay.

So that's video worth watching on YouTube. Or Spotify. That's right. Right there in the Spotify app, video podcasts. Incredible. Hell yeah. I love it. Also, follow us on the social media platform of your choice.

Do it. Instagram, TikTok, Twitter, whatever. Particular nightmare you choose to engage with. That's your business not ours. And then last one, at least, of course. And we got a ton of great ones today. Did we not? Wow.

The bad babies were at the keyboard. Fine form. Rare form. Extra time. Because, of course, this episode of One of the Seven Kingdom posted on Friday because of the Super Bowl. Did I mention that the Patriots embarrass themselves in the Super Bowl? And did we record this deep dive earlier? No, it's Tuesday. As per you. You know what? That's okay. No, I know it's okay. Looking at the ocean?

Oh, I agree. It's definitely okay. Just saying it's Tuesday. It is. When will this go up? That's up to the tech gods to decide. But we're recording this Tuesday morning, Hobbes and Dragons at Jeeva.com if you ever want to email us. Great stuff. We'd love to hear from you now and always. Send us your thoughts on this television show. What else is coming up that they should email us about? I mean, Buffy. Ships, yearning, sex. I mean, fictional character sex for the few days special. I'll say this. I'm going to drop a hit. We're doing, we're planning to do a Nolan podcast. That's right. Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes. We are going to resume the Nolan. And we're just wanting you to bear in mind if you're like, which one? I'm going to say, oh, I don't know. Think of a major release that's coming out next month. month that we might be unhealthily obsessed with and think about what Nolan film might connect to that. And that is your hint on this podcast about what we're doing next. Great stuff. Love to be cryptic. Some might say needlessly so, but others might say I love a riddle. Cheers. Oh, God. We're doing great today. Yeah. Should we start? Let's do it. It is time for the opening

snapshot. All right. We have such, even by our standards for a 30-minute television program, such a robust deep dive. Today, we are really going beat by beat. We're really going beat by beat. We are going to try to keep the opening snapshot a little tighter today and just say, what did we think of episode four? If you haven't listened to Talk to Thrones yet, you haven't watched Talk to Thrones yet, give people a little taste of what we'll be breaking down, beat by beat by word, frame, by frame from here. Did you like this episode? I need you. Did you like it? Slow down.

Did you like it? I loved it. Same. I'm obsessed with it. I keep thinking about it. I cried multiple times watching it. I love hearing how much other people loved to. I know.

I'm really, really excited about it. On the naming front, and this is just the only thing I want to say, we've been tracking sort of the titles of the episodes and whether or not when we get an episode called Hedge Knight or the Squire and whether or not that character is actually a Hedge Knight or actually a squire, the seven. Which character was actually packing the hard salt beef? You always skip that one. Well, should you?

It doesn't help my thesis very much. But are the gods really actually here and involved in this? I mean, we have a lot of theory emails that we got from our listeners. thank you so much for engaging in the Are the Seven actually here a question? But like what divine justice is really at work here doesn't seem to be, I don't know, it doesn't really feel like if there are just gods out there that they're really involved in what Aryan is pulling here in this episode. And just inside of the George universe, such a deliciously compelling and rich concept that's something like a trial of seven combat in basically like the form of war at that point when 14. 14 warriors have

Unplunted real swords Lances of Morris Raymond is happy to point out You know, to invoke the gods In that capacity The areas where the characters Inside of this universe Look to the SEPTons

Invoked many times Across this episode Either directly or subtly Or a religion For some sort of cover justification, comfort When is that contradiction Impossible to ignore?

Wonderful title for this episode I love it. I also love that it was seven. The seven. Just seven. Seven. Great stuff.

You mentioned other people liking this episode a lot. I love this episode. This is my favorite episode of the season. I've loved the season. This is my favorite. This is like one of my favorite Thrones episodes period. Like I just thought this was fantastic.

Easily the one I've heard from the most for other people in my life being like, that was dope. And this is what we've been saying all season that we were just like really hoping in episode three with that reveal. And then in episode four with a like, you know, gathering of the teams and the Baylor moment that we get that, like, people would start talking up this show and hopefully hooking other people into watching it. I'm really, really hoping that the word is going to spread. I have not felt this profoundly about a Game of

Thrones story. Yeah. Genuinely since Jamie Knight of Brian is the last time I got this emotionally invested with love. What an appropriate association. I mean, House the Dragon, we have so much love for. Vassaris's long walk. There's a number of moments that really did work for me. But I haven't felt this just like my heart being like sort of pulled out of my chest with how emotionally invested I am and what's going on since 2019. So it's been a minute. Here we are. It was a long time ago. It was a long time ago. Let's hit some of the opening snapshot mailbag. Yes, really quickly. Submissions. Zipping right through. Okay. We got an email from a couple people saying this is their first Game of Thrones. thing they've ever watched.

Wow. I love it. But they're like listeners of our podcast and they're like, Game of Thrones has been too intense or violent sounding or all this stuff for me. But it seemed like this one, you guys talked about the tone being a little different. It seemed like this one could be one that I could get into. And then they're like, can I now watch Game of Thrones?

And then we actually heard from one listener who was like, and I tried to start watching Game of Thrones. And it's really brutal. Yeah. What do you think about this? I mean, I think there is enough sort of sweet and, uplift and emotional resonance with the brutality of Game of Thrones to make it something that we think about

fondly and, you know, it's not just like a shock in awe experience. There is just like beautiful language and absolutely just profound emotional connection to certain characters and character arcs. So, but at the same time, like, several of the people wrote in are like real Tolkien heads

and they're really feeling like... Professors always welcome. Well, they're really feeling like the Tolkien, the sort of Samwise Gamgee sort of energy off of this show and I understand. And a lot of Tolkien people don't necessarily, doesn't necessarily one-to-one translate to Game of Thrones. So, like, if Game of Thrones is not for you. They're not wondering, what was it, Erdogan's tax policy? No, they're not.

Like, George. So if Game of Thrones is not for you, I think that's fine. Yeah. But, like, we will always advocate for several seasons of Game of Thrones as some of the best television that's ever existed. But if it's too nasty and brutal for you, then, yeah, that's fine. Don't watch it. I never know how to guide people with things like this. Much like when we get mail-back questions, sometimes we hear from the bad babies about, like, when is an appropriate age for somebody to read something.

I never know. I feel like I have a genuinely really bad barometer for stuff like this. And so I'm always reluctant to try to guide anybody. But I think you captured it well. There is so much heart and cheer and levity and joy and beauty and wonder along with a lot of really harsh realities. But, you know, as we'll talk about today, I think one of the reasons that, you know, we got like the Baylor moment in this episode, one of my favorite moments in the canon. and I couldn't wait for this episode iconic.

But there's some heavy shit and some intention, some heavy ideas in this episode and like reminders. And in these novellas. Like that's something we've been saying from the start, that the tone is different, but this is not like child's play. Exactly. This is a grim world still. So what else do we have here? Okay. Jordan said, just wanted to say, since you recommend that it was safe to read the first half the hedge and I just wanted to give a friendly reminder there is a massive house of the dragon.

Spoiler. So this, my blanket take on this is. That is also true if you watch Game of Thrones. And this is just one of the realities of the way that George in the text, and then, of course, the adapters who are bringing these stories to the screen, sprinkle in connective tissue across the world. You may have no reason, absolutely no reason, to anticipate that you will hear about something from elsewhere in the canon by a century, two centuries.

And then there it is. Somebody says something. Usually Joffrey. You kind of have to, often Joffrey. You kind of have to make peace with that. I think that is like a difficult thing to navigate entirely. But you could just avoid it completely if you wanted. Good shot from Jordan.

Nicole, I could say this for later, but I just needed it here at the top. Nicole wrote this email. Really? I mean, really? His name is Humphrey Beesbury. Say his name. Will he die as he lived in scripted obscurity? I see you, Humphrey, Beesbury.

I missed you at first, but found you on a real. wine trying to count to seven. Yeah. Nicole sent that email. Nicole. Interesting. I just died behind the listeners. I am also outraged at the mistreatment of Humphrey Beesbury, Justice for the Bees.

Is he not making up for the. Very limited screen time, complete lack of any spoken words with the mustache. Is the mustache not doing his talking for him? What is he dyeing that with? Honey. This is why you're you. Honey does lighten your hair. I've done it.

Really? Yeah, when I lived in Hawaii, I would put honey in my hair to lighten it. Yeah. When I lived in Hawaii. A lot of flex. But just like, the Beesbury, of course, are using honey to love that. Not when you're in Lottie's honey colts in yellow jackets or also then. I'm still in that cult.

Okay. Nick wrote this, which felt very appropriate for the ringer, with the insinuation that Lord Ashford is offering up to his sons to throw their joust to help recoup the money he's overspent for his tourney, Lord Ashford has to be kicking himself or not having a heads up to properly market for the greatest fight card in the history of the seven kingdoms. Imagine the proclamation posted in every town. Targaryen versus Targaryen. Fossaway versus Fossoway, Apple Wars. Here we are. First trial by seven in over a hundred years. Don King couldn't have put together such a bout and Lord Ashford could, at the very least, break even, had he known what was in store for the

made event of his tournament. Incredible Don King reference in a bad baby email here on the House of R. You love it. And I understood it. Good. There we go. I was a big boxing fan? No.

No, just kind of absorbing a via asmosis. Yeah. Makes sense. I think that Dunk, knowing as he did from Plummer, that Lord Ashford was facing a dire financial circumstance, this should have been how he worked for more time. You know, because when it's like, we must tell. I'm traveling seven at dawn and it's like, what? Like, I need time for my pregame ritual.

I need to stretch. I need to hydrate. Also, I need to recruit. Need to do some recruiting, some rest perhaps, a nash. And if you have been like Lord Ashford, you need to get the- The draft kings, the Fandul, the like, you know. Fandle. Here at the ringer.

Fandle only. Sorry, Fandle only. Our partner. Fandle. No france except for the paid ad for Fandle. Partner. Got it. Sorry.

When Lord Ashford was. forced by Aryan to crawl under the table looking for a rogue walnut? You think you found any coin down there? I'm sure he did. He's searching every sofa in the reach. He just had it for a while. Trying to find a copper. Okay. And last not least, this is with love and respect. A moment to talk to our dear listeners about sending us AI slop. I just want to let you all know at home. I'm the one who reads all the emails. And I think people know pretty clearly how I feel about AI. And so when people send us like, AI generated art or in the cases we can, I'm not trying to single this person now, but someone sent a fully arranged version of Alice with Three Fingers. And it's the kind of thing that I've gotten in the past from people who have actually like sort of like put together pieces of music and sent like the files over via listener email and stuff like that.

Like when we get art that people have made, we're just like on the moon. It's so cool. You send me AI stuff. I'm not reading it. I'm not watching it. I'm not listening to it. It's going straight in the trash. I am unfortunately the gatekeeper of the email and that is my stance. So don't waste your time with it. That's all I'm saying. I'm just trying to save you time. AI is not, AI generated stuff is not welcome in our inbox. But you are always welcome in our inbox. And we love you very much. Hobbes and drag is at gmail.com. A astonishing portion of the Super Bowl commercials this year were brave. I heard.

I heard. Yeah. All right. On that note, is it sound? to dive? Let's do it. Damn fucking deep, like Sir Arlen level deep. That's a great gesture. Can you, Carlos, can you gift that? Thankfully, my water bottle and computer are probably blocking it. There's many angles in this room. It's true. All right, it's time for the deep dive. Are you looking for support in your weight management journey? Zepbound terseptide may be able to help. Zepbound is a prescription medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical activity to help adults with obesity, or some adults with overweight who also

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and worsen kidney problems. Talk to your doctor. Call 1-800-545-99-9 or visit zepbounds.lily.com. This episode is brought to by Paramount Plus. Beth and Rip are back in a new series. Ranch. Kelly Riley and Colehouser returned, and this time they're taken on Texas. As Beth and Rip build a future together, peace will have to wait as they face corruption,

danger, and a ruthless rival ranch willing to protected secrets at all costs. Legacy is a beautiful thing, but only if it survives. Dutton Ranch starring Colehous, Kelly Riley, Annette Benning and Ed Harris, now streaming on Paramount Plus. Let's start where the episode starts. Dunk awaiting his just. This was another, yet another episode with like a really compelling, really scintillating, either visual or auditory element at the open and close of the episode. And you're not talking about shits and farts and piss or anything like that.

We will talk about farts eventually because it is a Night of the Seven Kingdoms and so we could not make it through an entire episode without a very prominent fart. Yeah. Sarah Adina Smith, as we talked about last week. She directed last week's episode, this week's episode, and we'll be back for the finale. and I just think she's incredible, and I hope she's heavily involved in the next season. This initial glimpse of what just looks like the constellations in the night sky, and then we come into focus and pan a little bit and realize it's the glistening stone of this cell in which Dunk is waiting as prisoner awaiting his fate. And this idea of like only mere episodes and mere days for Dunk ago kind of justifying, this, the absence of the pavilion, right? Yeah, sure, trees leak, but the canopy of those leaves

is all I need, you know, from a falling star brings luck to those who see it. So the luck is ours alone to this grim circumstance. I was also thinking about the quote from the book when he sees the inn for the first time, right? And he says, when he was smaller, he used to wonder what it would be like to live in such a place to sleep every night with a roof over your head and wake up every morning with the same walls wrapped around you. So to go from that, like, how comfort that would be to like how trapped and harrowing it is. Yeah. You mentioned Sarah Deena Smith, who was just crushing it directing these episodes. The guest on the official pod this week, shout out Jason, shout out Greta. Love this insight into another element of the visual

scape in this sequence because we were both really captivated by that constellation effect. But here's what Sarah Deena Smith said about the window behind us. dunk. The window in the prison cell reminded me of a crown. Elipsies. Framing dunk as if he were a king, but more like a fool really than a true king, someone playing at being powerful. So the idea of that image behind him and how inspiring that was when she saw the setting, I just thought it was like a really cool little detail. This is so validating to me because there's a, there's an image that happens way later that I want to talk about for a second right now where I was like, am I overthinking this? And then when she said she framed the window that way, I was like, maybe I'm not.

And so it's like when he first, when he comes into the turning ground at dawn, right before he sees who's there. And it's not the shot where you can see his shield and the turning ground. That's a great one because like the sunset on his shield and the dawning gray on the field are sort of mirrored for us. And that's like a very beautiful image. But when he walks through the threshold onto the turning field, he's framed in this like, portal, there's like a stone portal around him and then there's like an Ashford Sun sort of Chevron thing behind him, right? And I was looking at it. I was like, this to me, and I'm, you know I'm not an expert, but I like dabble a little, that to me looked like a classic like tarot card framing.

Oh, I love that. And so I texted Diana, my best friend who knows the ship. Who is an expert? Right. And I sent him the photo. I was like, does this look like a tarot? card to you. And she's like, yeah, I was like, help me articulate why. So this is what she said. I love this. She said in the traditional rider weight tarot deck, there are a handful of cards that show a singular person doing one specific motion or gesture. They are often framed around a chair or a gateway or an arch, such that your eye is drawn to the single person rather than the art and the activity flurring around them. It also makes them appear as kind of a gatekeeper for whatever portal there in front of. Someone you have to face to get past. Someone or some concept,

you have to respect to get past. You can see it with the end. You can see it with the emperor, the high priestess, the herophant, the king of sorts. I think Dunk's pose really echoes the writer-weight art style. It's framing him in a similar way like he's posing to express one single facet of the human journey, maybe doubt, maybe confusion, maybe none of this. And they just wanted to make him look epic and medieval. And invoking the art style of ancient taro makes anything look epic and medieval. But I just like love that idea. Doubt confusion certainly. Right. And that like crossing a threshold, which we always love to talk about. But also if you think about, I don't think, no, it wouldn't be because he comes in on a horse. It's not the same portal that Baylor comes through. But this idea that, like,

all of the people on the field here have to get past this idea that Dunk is presenting of the true, you know, like, he's the one true knight. That's who he is. When I saw that, like, frame, I was like, the knight. Yes. That's who he is. And all of these other people who fail to live up to this or are trying to live up to this have to sort of confront that ideal. And again, Sarah may not have had any of that. in her mind. But like when I heard her say this window is a crown, I was like, then a doorway can be a tarot card if we wanted to be. So I just think, I think there are just so many stunning visuals in this episode. It was really cool, too, to hear her talk about the way that the shot,

we're going to talk for quite a while later about Raymond's Nighting and Dunk's Reluctance and how that ties to the long-running fan speculation and the Arlen Shrug we get. But Sarah Dana Smith talking about, I'm paraphrasing, but I think I have this right, that the crane camera just happened to pass above Peter Claffey and he looked up. And then she was like, this is perfect. So the combination of like very deliberate and intentional choices. And then what you find. Which is so meta. Yeah. For like the story that we're watching here, I just love it. I loved seeing that moment in the episode because if you watch the behind the scenes that they did where they paired episode two and three behind the scenes.

The moment where Peter Klaffi was talking about how the statues of the knights look like Wizard's Chess from Harry Potter, you can see the B-roll from the set of him kneeling in it's own. They had him kneel to pose like one, like he's right next to one of those statues for reference and you don't see it framed

in the episode, but I was like, oh, that's the moment where they're like, we need you to kneel in the exact pose of these statues that we have around here. And like, so the fact that like in that moment the camera caught him like looking up is beautiful. We love an accidental stroke of genius. Yeah, and especially because he's clearly wearing the armor from this moment in time,

but then you cut to Arlen from the past. It gets your mind racing in this delicious way that connects to this larger reminder that we're in Dunk's point of view that we've been talking about all season. Like, well, what are we really witnessing that is true and pure? What is his recollection? Where is he in the present? Where is he in the past? I thought in general this episode had a couple borderline,

dreamlike and hallucinatory moments to cut from after he leaves the Great Hall to all of a sudden one frame later he's in the rain moments like that obviously like you had called on the trailer pod that he would be holding the head of a puppet and he was like a very spooky very nightmare fuel even though Florian is a figure to inspire the oh a fool can also be a night we find a lot of heart in that but there's something so like disorienting and unmoving worrying about it. It's just a really visually delicious episode and a thematically rich one. Audio match of Tenzel's fingerbone snapping and Steely Pate's like wagon. Yeah, it's just really, really high-level stuff.

Great stuff. In general, just seeing dunk in a cell, obviously, for Theron's viewers, it's not a rare thing to see a character that we have become very invested in, just trapped in a prison cell, or characters we are not rooting for, trapped in a person's cell. Was somebody most top of mind for you? Was it Ned receiving Varis? his visits. Was it Tyrion in his sky cell or Tyrion and the cells in the Red Keep? Was it Circe and Marjorie and Loris? Anybody who came most of mine to you? I think for me it was Ned just because the idea of the madness of mercy, which is a famous Ned Association, feels very dunk core as well and very connected to this question from Baylor of like, do you need to intend

harm to do it? I love that. I think as we talked about on Talk the Thrones, Obron, so top of mine for us here. So I think like Tyrion and O'Brien. That's just a baby. I'm a beer champion. The grabbing the torch. Yeah. It's just the best. It's just the best. This rat has a name. We talked about the rat on Talk to Thrones. Naturally, we didn't miss the rat. We love a rat. We have Preston. Nope, he's not here. He's in Holland. It's like what I pointed out the way from the camera last season is like, quote. Yeah. Preston will be back for, uh. Preston will return for Avengers moved in Preston will return as well. Shanice, apparently, is the name that this rat has.

Talk about a quick shot in an image that gives us a visual association and a character beat as well. For Dunk, this is just such a tender, gentle moment. He's like, boy, I am alone. I had Arlen, then I had egg. Now I have no one. Let me pet. I just have three horses.

Now I have a rat. I love when he goes to Thunder and chest out later. To all lads. Right. And Raymond's like, are you talking to your horses? It's like, Raymond, you have no idea. You have no idea. Do they talk back to you?

On the rat front, I was thinking about how when he told Egg in episode three that his job in flea body used to be to get stuff for the bowl of brown. So like how many rats? Didn't like some of the specifics that he mentioned there. How many rats did he like maybe, you know, bring for it? And now he's just like, I don't have to do that anymore. We can just be friends. You're my only companion. Blood and cheese.

Personal fave, the rat. Cook, one of the great tales in Game of Thrones. Harenhall torture scene. That's a dismaying rat association in the canon. We loved our Laris theories during Hot Dian, hearing from the bad babies about that. So this idea of the rat, you know, Hot D has had a lot of fun with this, like as a visual representation of the filth and the rot of the realm, right? The secrets, the anguish, what are they witnessing when they scurry?

So there's something about just like the rat. as the only one to witness Dunk until Egg walks in, but also just then you're kind of like you're unmoored in a really fun way when Dunk is gentle and you would expect something horrible to happen there. I love that contrast. But then there is another friend because Egg comes in. And he's kidded out.

He's dropping a fit. As the kids say, he's a little royal princeling for all to see. Tard colors on the doublet. Something I found out this week is like the reason his like robe and cloak are so like insanely long and stuff like that is that they fit him knowing that he was, was like a growing boy and they're like, we just want to make this work for however he grows.

Who knows how he grows? Right. And the great news for them is that, you know, unlike the cast of Percy Jackson, Dexter seems to be growing, you know, in increments. No, Mike Wheeler, like, your son live and a half-collar up. His dad is kind of a short king, so I wonder if they, like, looked at that. We're like, we can keep this kid around for a minute. We'll see. Interesting. Dunn's face here. It's not just the finery of the garb, but, you know, just as was the case at the end of episode three, egg is telling the servants what to do. He is undeniably in power, and Dunk has to see it. He gets the tray of food, just ravenously tucks into the bread, and then egg begins to apologize.

He says, his uncle told him that he had to beg for Dunk's forgiveness. And Dunk is like the heir to the Iron Throne. And I love this because, you know, we talked through the family tree when we were covering episode three, the last couple pods. But there's something about the character saying it out loud like that, you know, a little like, A little of the last of us, you can't heal something unless you're brave enough to say it out loud, but also, as is the case for much of this exchange, dunk forcing egg to own what he did, right? You didn't just lie to me. We're going to talk about lies in a second here. You lied to me about being a Targaryen. Your uncle is the heir to the iron throne. Your grandpa is the king. Say that out loud.

Right. Let's just sit with that for a minute. So it's like, you know, two seconds in the show, and in the novella as well, but I love that. No, but all of this back and forth, right? Like, saying you never meant to lie, yeah, but you did about everything starting with your name. And, like, this idea, there's just so human in this moment. They're just like a man who's constantly insecure about being the fool, being duped, being too dumb to navigate this world. And then a genuinely a little boy. He's a prince.

He's a kid. He's a little boy. And so when he like tears up a bit. Oh, my God. Yeah. Which was incredible acting. But not like, you know, bawling his eyes out, but just sort of that, that shiny-eyed I've been caught and I'm, I didn't think I did anything wrong. Yeah, of course you did.

That's why you lied about it. You know what I mean? Like, I just think that whole exchange is so human and so. And Dunks hurt and his defensiveness in this scene. And then how quickly. in the next scene, he's defending egg. Like, he needs to say this. Yes.

He needs to feel all of this. But when push comes to shove, the moment that Baylor is just like a little on egg, he's like, he's a good boy. Yeah. It's one of those great, like, you can only be hurt this deeply if you really actually care about someone reminders. I thought the performances from both of them in this scene were really, really lovely. I think that Dunk sang, yeah, but you did about everything starting with your name is rich

and interesting to parse in a lot of different respects. I think that like the what's in a name focus has been present across this entire season, right? That conversation about Three Fingered Alice last episode, like was Alice really her name? Very tied to this idea of Tall Tales that become legend. Is Tenzel too tall? Not too tall for me? Like what does it mean to say to call yourself this thing or for somebody else to call you this thing from dunk to dunk to talk in the tall? All the people who helped him, as you noted earlier in the season, say that thing out loud.

stand up a little bit higher. Be tall. The guys gave you tallness. Be tall. Egg on to egg. And of course, yes, it is a lie. But it's also like... And to be clear, I mean to do too much PR for Egg here.

We leave the PR to Chris doing it for Aryan on these pods. But, you know, when all of this happens, when they meet at the end and he makes his mood, it's not like he's thinking, I'll tell him my name is egg and it'll be a sign of a But now days into their relationship, episodes into our experience with them, you have this beat where you're like, well, who gave him the name egg? As we talked about last time, it was Mastor Eman. It was his brother, the closest person to him in the world. There's an aspect of it now where it's like, actually you're calling me the thing that the people who love me call me. Like it can be a, it can, there can be a bridge to closeness there and to an embrace, which, you know, I just love these two so much. So I kind of want to think about it that way. But then, of course, there's the fact that EGon is not just a tag name. It is the king's name. It's the dark name. Not the current king, but it is the name of a Targaryen king. How many Aegon's have been king for, four,

Agon. So they are, of course. Four, four Agons. Four Agon the conqueror. Egon the second, who we are spending quite a bit of time with right now in House of the Dragon. Tom Glencarnie, yeah. We're not going to say anything right now about Aegon the third. That's not something that is possible to talk about right now.

And then, of course, Egon the fourth, the unworthy, who, made a few mistakes, including siring many bastards, the great bastards, whom he then legitimized on his deathbed, gave one of them, Damon, Blackfire, the fabled ancestral Valerian Steel Sword of House Targaryen, and then a little thing called the Blackfire Rebellion. I'll be out of it, lads, happened. There are plenty of other characters named Egon who never became king, but it's always a name that carries heft, right, that brings some sort of expectation either you as the person named Egon have or that other people have of you.

It's really interesting that the four son of the fourth son would be named Agon. You know what I mean? That's a real maker move where he's like... And it's agon. Totally, but it's like also a bailer move to not name one of his kids Agon. You know, Valar, Materas. Like the fact that as we've tracked across this season, we're in sort of a different moment in Targ history in this stretch of the family tree is interesting.

Yeah, like it shouldn't have been available almost, right? But it was. And so that tells us something about all of them. By the way, not that that stopped, like, Allison to Reneer. Of course not. Did it lead to any confusion? Maybe. You were offended that I put this in the dock, but I couldn't help myself.

One of, I think, the great moments in the television canon to point to for, like, okay, if your name is Agon, what are people going to do with that? Our guy, Chris's guy, Hobart Hightower in House of the Dragon, season one, episode three when Agon is like a baby still. Hell, hell, Egon the Conquerorab! Second of his name. It's like, bro, he's not king at that point. of his name. Are you kidding? But he was reminding people by invoking Conqueror that he was named for the

Conqueror, that it's the name of a king. And then, of course, that brings us through one of our shared favorites and the fandom's favorite passages from a Clash of King. This is the Clash of Kings. This is an alt-timer. This is one of the things that Danny sees in House of the Undying. Ragar connects to

you know, basically the main character of the entire story. John Tonsnow. Also named Egg Guy. Remember when people were speculating in real time? Like, what would John's name be? I had really talked myself into Jaharis at one point. It was like, of course it was going to be Agon, right?

What else could be? The man had her brother's hair, the passage goes, but he was taller and his eyes were dark indigo rather than lilac. Egon, he said to a woman nursing a newborn babe in a great wooden bed, what better name for a king? Will you make a song for him, the woman asked? He has a song, the man replied. He is the prince that was promised, and his is the song of ice and fire.

Hey, that's the news of the show. What did Ragar do? This is obviously all connected to the prophecy. I got a lot of great emails about, and we'll talk about across the pod and have been talking about. Mostly in the spoiler section, I think, today. Yeah, but just this question that we've been tracking across Hot D and just in general of like, who knows what? Who knows what? And then what do they do with that information?

So this idea that we love to bring up with Ragar of like, you know, he found something at the scrolls and said, I must be a warrior. Okay, he's like, I got a, it's my responsibility to like produce the prince that was promised, I guess. But I've decided there has to be three of them. So, oh boy, these characters. So much for my vows that I swore and swore. They make you swear and swear, though. I guess so.

So many vows. Dunkass egg, if it was a jeep. This is so sad. It's like a fool of him. Devastating. They both look miserable here and I felt miserable because this was. was heartbreaking. The donkey and linen was in particular, like, really tough. You were described for a donkey. Yeah. Brutal. Brutal. The fact that across all of these episodes,

don't is very much like, must you mock me? That's what he says to Red and Bany and Daisy in episode one. And like, is there any measure of a fool I fail to meet this recurring refrain that he is like worried that he's out of his league. You know, he's going to say elsewhere in this episode, basically like this not knowing my place idea is this thing that haunts him. There are these times in the adaptation because, as we've mentioned a few times, dunk in the book is a teenager, not a 30-something-year-old man, right? And so like, there are times when that

adaptive choice feels a little off. And then there's a time like this where, like, his insecurity about his intelligence, it's one thing if he's a teenager, but if he's a 30-year-old man who's been told by Sir Arlen, his entire life, you know, dunk the lunk thick as a castle wall. Yeah. He's, you know,

it's just something hurts my feelings much more about this, like, man being like, am I too much of a fool to navigate this world, you know. Holding Flory on the fool's head and his hands and thinking about hopefully the nightly aspect, just certainly the fool aspect. Plummer approaching him for the bet because he's like, you're a mark. All of it. All of it.

It's really sad. Egg explains him, I was supposed to squire for my brother Darren. He's going to have a really meaningful scene in this episode, stay tuned. But like he's a shit night. Then I found myself that he kind of. of rules. Darren is just so, such a good character. Really good. Remember during the trailer pause when I was absolutely panicked that we weren't going to get this stuff. You know when I Darren? And you were like, what the fuck is wrong with you? It's like literally impossible to make this show without

that. The fact that Egg calls Darren a shit night made me think about how he asked Dunk, was Arlin a shit night? And like, what does it mean for Egg to be a shit night? Not just like, oh, he knows all these lordly names. Now we know why. He knows all these knights. He's the heraldry, etc. But like the idea that somebody so close to him, he was supposed to squire for or he was supposed to learn from, is like, I'm actually just going to shave your head so we can hide out and I don't want to do this. Okay, but I got to shout out my guy, Darren. Because we love it. We love him.

We love Darren the drunken slash Darren the Dreamer here on the House of Ar. But I think what should be, I don't think it's clear in the story, but like they ran away and he's like, they'll never look for us right by the turning ground. And that's why they pick that in because he's like, they run away from Summer Hall and they could have gone anywhere, but he's like, we're going to go right. nearby, actually, because they'll never think to look for us there. And, you know, I mean, you know, it's... Maycar did. Macar found him. He did. He did. It's like, is anybody dropping golden dragons

for cups of wine that should just cost a couple coppers? Is that happening anywhere? Snoring in puddles of wine. Is anybody lifting their head and just saying, I dreamed of you, to strangers. Is that happening anywhere? No. That's like the GPS of the Westerosi period. I thought it was interesting. Egg does have a couple beats where he's like, I didn't, but he's never like, he reads the room effectively. He never pulls rank as like, I'm a prince, how dare you talk to me that way, or any of that. Right, yes. And he also was never like, hey, bro, like, yeah, I did lie and yeah, I leaned in and I pounced when the opportunity presented itself. But you're the one who thought I was the stable boy. I actually never told you that. And by the way, that's what Arian did to you?

I said I was from Kings Landing, but I said I wasn't from Pleasebogg. You know, like there's so many ways in which... Technically the CV checked out. There's so many little loopholes that he wriggled his little bald head through. So, you know. The novella, you know, obviously this is conveyed on Dunk's face and just the kind of the dismay, but also like the... There is much more in the novella because we're inside of his head to the full point of just him like feeling like such an idiot for not having realized to Egg was. is definitely more prominent in this sequence in the book, in part because he's like,

oh, they all have purple eyes. I really missed that, huh? But Egg does say to him. Yeah, why would he feel like an idiot? You've been calling him an idiot for like in our spoiler section for this entire season. I mean, every time we're in the spoiler section before the reveal, you were like, he's got purple eyes, dunk, you dumb, dumb. I mean, it is wild to not notice the purple eyes in the book.

Obviously, not a thing in Showland, and so it's a little bit more forgivable. But, you know, they made Darren's hair not full targ silver, but like a little blonde. in the show than it's supposed to be. He's not quite as light brown. But Egg, basically in the book, he's just like, I've got Aryan's hair. I've got Mekar's hair. Like, I got the real true silver stuff.

If I hadn't, like, if I didn't have a shaved head, there is nobody who would not realize that I was a Targaryen. Let's talk about this. Of course you did. That's why you lied, reply from Dunk. I have kind of like a larger question for you here, which is, I guess about us as readers and viewers, but also a little bit more about dunk as a character.

At this point, you know, we're going to talk later in the pod about the was-dunk-knited question and a lot of the textual evidence that's here in this episode and this stretch of the story. This is the part of the novella where he invokes in his internal monologue the words monstrous lie

when seeing a shared tie between him and egg on. Of course you did, that's why you lied. Like a lie is such an offensive thing to dunk. Eggs lie here, which hurts him. Darren's lie. This idea that Darren has lied about Dunk being the robber night. Dunk is a liar.

Yeah. And how is he reconciling all of these aspects of... How of my client, Dunkin the Tall? I would like to say... I say it would love. I think there's something to do with, like, Arlen teaching him about what the definition of a hedge knight is. And the fact that the hedge knight operates under their own moral compass.

It's not what the Lord tells. you to do, you do what you think is right. And so there are ways in which, and I'm just justifying a lie, but there are ways in which Arlen has emboldened him to think of, well, I know what's right and wrong? And so in what ways am I not? Or I also believe that he believed that Arlen did intend to make him a night. And then there's a way in which like, if I do it, I am it. Like if I show up and I win this tourney, then who can say I'm not a night? Yes. You know? And so, but I like that inherent conflict inside of Dunk. Me too. The most honorable character, you know, probably that George ever wrote. And the fact that, like,

his entire story is based on this very human flaw, I think, is delicious. I agree completely. And that's why I thought it was worth us highlighting that dissonance and that contradiction for a second because it is. And we've been tracking these aspects of Dunk and just in general, the characters who are, you know, positioned as the heroes in the story. It is just much more interesting than Dunk never doing anything wrong, never doing anything morally question. When he says this thing to AgCare, it is like, I know that lying is wrong because my moral compass, I have the moral clarity to know that. And yet, I have done this thing. And for the right reasons, because I want to be in a position to help people, but also, like,

I have my aspirations and I have my ambition and all of that is in the stew there. Last week, wow, you said stew instead of brew, wild choice from you. Last week, when he told Raymond that he was like basically still thinking about Plummer's offer. We highlighted that, right? Where it's just sort of like, it would be way more boring if he's like, no, that's wrong, like constantly. I would never consider it. I would never at all be inclined to consider the temptation of what I could gain from it. But that temptation and then what Dunk decides to do with the constant temptation that he's faced inside of these novellas is what is part of what's so compelling about him. Speaking of compelling, I thought that Dunk, that quick beat of him saying, because he sees him crying,

tearing up, as we noted. Dry your eyes, which was like not outright cruel, but definitely he's like, yes, you know, I am. But very fatherly, honestly. For sure, there's like a kind of like scolding like, dry your eyes. First of all, it just like makes us feel eggs age, right? Makes us feel how young he is, which is an important thing. And having him like sort of tucked in the corner with his like his little knees up and stuff like that. Yeah, flopping down to the wall. Yeah, just sort of like he looks so small, as he always does in comparison to dunk, but he just looks, yeah, so young. I love that paired with this dry your eyes is like dunk, oh, we couldn't, yeah.

Well, Prinsling couldn't be disappointed. And there is, again, that age aspect of, of, well, of course, this like nine-year-old kid was excited to go do this thing and then felt sad that he couldn't and, like, behaved in a way that, frankly, I don't think people ever age out of, which is like being selfishly motivated to do the thing that feels right to you. but with the tears part of it. So there's the like, okay, you are, that reminds me that you are a spoiled rich kid. We're going to get some real spoiled rich kid stuff for Marion.

And you don't, you've not lived a life where you always had to think about the way that your decisions impact other people. Now, part of what's cool about the time that Dunk and Egg have already spent together is that it wasn't the reason that Egg made the decision he made in the first place to go with Dunk. That was because he wanted to be a squire. He wanted to go to Asher Meadow. he wanted to be in the tourney.

But in just days, can I stay with you? I think I could be quite happy in a place like this. So even though he didn't know Dunk at first, the impact that Dunk has had on him and that this experience of being among the commoners and the small folk and hedge knights has had on him is significant and supreme and genuine.

It's also like a sour note version of their previous episodes teasing of like, oh, I really like soft foods and soft grapes. Lovely grapes. It's disgusting. You know, like that sort of teasing is now just sort of like, oh, we can't have the princeling sort of disappointed. Yeah. Boy, I fed a prince. I fed a prince. Salp beef. Oh my God. Yeah. And the, you know, I taught a prince the whipstitch. Wipstitch. And he was excited to learn it, wasn't he? the response that Egg had to seeing what Aryan did to Humphrey Harding and his horse last episode, also tears. And Dunk did not respond.

He was like, you know, lad. You got to be prepared. Bad things happen. I might, something terrible might befall. Me a mishaping is like, it's not a mishap. But he wasn't like dry your eyes, right? The tone here is driven by Dunk's personal hurt. And he's like, I'm going to make Egg feel some things here, right?

But we are just scenes away from Dunk. sobbing his eyes out with steely paint. It's just the rain on his face. There is a lot of rain. So I just liked the way that the tonal shift and what Dunk says to Egg really shows us how wounded he is and that that pain, and this is again just really human, the pain that he's feeling is driving what he says more than the actual reality of the circumstance. And the fact that he saw these commonalities between them, oh, you mentioned your dead mom, okay, we're both orphans. You said you're from Kings Landing. We're both from flea bottom. And those were ultimately like presumptions that eggling. into and allowed, but presumptions on Dunk's part because he wanted to see those commonalities. He wanted to have somebody like him in his life. He could change something for the way that Arlen had for him. Olads.

Someone to talk to that's not a horse. The dream. In case I forget to say it later, since we're talking about horses, let's just note that the reason that he finds thunder, because here in the show, he goes just back to his elm, right, his camp, Thunder and Chess Under there. But in the book, he's like wandering and he's just like, here's a horse make a sound. And he's like, that's thunder. Because in the book, and this makes a lot more sense.

Instead of just sitting in the rain under a tree, Raymond takes the horses to his tent. And since it is a nice warm tent with the horses outside. This is like a 99.9 out of 100 episode for Raymond, just an iconic showing pantheon stuff the best. Waiting in your cloak behind someone's tree in the shadows at their camp. very weird. Also, his laugh when Egg was like, yeah, my brother used to sneak into my room and threaten to cut off my dick and say he'd marry me and then killed my cat.

They're incestuous aliens. Dunk. That's like, he's like, yeah, he did because you guys are fucking weirdos. I wouldn't laugh at that poor child's trauma, but I'm not a Targaryen racist. Raymond. Oh my God. Raymond, Raymond. Egg apologizes again. His voice is just so quiet,

so soft, so small. And then Dunk says to him, it's just a bit of bad luck we found each other, isn't it? I was crying. Crush. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What do we love about a chance meeting, Joe? Like, this idea that we talk a lot about, like, free will and destiny, right? The idea that, like, it is exciting when characters make choices and exhibit free will and try to determine their own future.

There's a lot of that with Dunk. When fate is sprinkled in and something happens where it's like either by a happenstance or because it was meant to, this person came into my life. And we found each other. And we never thought we would. And then like what a meaningful, beautiful thing it was, you know? You think about, I mean, like our first meeting. Do you and I? That wasn't a chance meeting.

On the internet and at conventions covering the exact. at a Game of Thrones convention. What a wild crazy circumstance for us to meet each other. It's the opposite of a chance meeting. It's like a beautiful thing that we love in these stories and sort of like the underbelly of it here. I was thinking, I was actually thinking about this like obviously Tolkien, but like thinking about stranger things. It's like what if those kids had never met 11? You know what I mean? And it's just sort of like how many lives that impacted and how many people that changed that chance meeting. And there are, it's a great comp because there are obviously moments. for those characters where it's like, what if we hadn't found you in the woods, right? Or stumbled upon each other in the woods. Bob might still be alive. Damn, spoiler. Season two.

A stranger thing was just like a hundred years ago at this point. Yeah, I was just crushing to hear Dunk like lament and bemoan egg coming into his life when it is like, clearly as a gift. You know, yeah. Baylor. Your guy. Dunk shoveling the bread into his mouth and then. He's like, what's going to happen to me? And I guess like, well, Baylor wants to see you.

He's like, oh, the air to the throne is waiting for me. It's going to go now. Forget the bread, let's go. Lovely honey dip for the bread, wonderful spices on the goat, but why don't we go now? Yeah. I've fueled up. I got my calories. I carb loaded.

Okay. Baylor's reading? Yes. Guess what he's reading? Tell me. Shout out, again, Ashaya, freeze frame master from History of Western. podcast about Megor's trial of seven. He's reading up on the trial of seven in this history book here, which is interesting to me because it's like, it's Arian who brings up the trial

of seven. But like, you know, he wasn't reading about trial by combat. He was reading about the trial of seven, which like hasn't happened in a very long time. We'll talk about some of that history a little bit, a little bit later when we get to it. But like, Baylor was like, what are all the rules and regs and permutations if I bring up a trial by content, will Arian perhaps Magor a number one fan boy who like loves to read about it? the life of Magor the cruel. Yeah. We'll bring up the trial by seven.

Fun fact about Magor's trial by seven. Yeah. Went well for everyone. There's beesberry involved. There's always a beesbury. You can always kind of find it a beesbury in the corners of history. In the margins of history. Did he have any lines in that trial?

I don't know. Did he shout gods be good at any point? Honestly, probably. Was his mustache honey bleached? I hope so. He's to say. I hope so. I just love that.

visual of like, you know, we talk about Baylor and we think about Baylor and the characters talk about Baylor is a wise character, a chivalrous character, an accomplished warrior, a character who exhibits grace, but also a wise character. And so this idea of like, yeah, it's strategy, it's intention, he's prepping, he's in the moment trying to anticipate what might happen. It's interesting that he's reading about trial stuff, and I will say, because he's, I do think that the scene with Arian plays as like, oh. This is getting a little bit away from my. A bit more like, I was really hoping he wouldn't think of that.

Yeah. I was really hoping he was due to know about that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which is interesting if you underestimate somebody. But just this, like, visual of him surrounded by texts and tomes that he is not hand-waving, but spending time. Yeah, it's Lord Ashford's collection. And he's like, what can I learn in the sound time?

Yeah, he's like, I didn't bring my armor. I'm going to have to borrow my sons. And also, I didn't bring my mobile library. So can I pop into yours? Did it make you think of Renera just because we've spent so many scenes and hot-dy with her surrounded by these scrolls looking for any. Really fun to like, like, I really, in terms of rewarding freeze frames, these like scrolls and manuscripts like freeze frame moments, like the props department, the art direction on the show,

they're just like in there, just doing the work, putting the history down on the scrolls and illuminated style. It's really great. Dunk walks toward Baylor. He bends the knee. He kneels. And Baylor tells him to rise. And it is, we have gotten a moment where Baylor has agreed to dunk and said, no arm was done, sir.

Rise in episode two. And the tone is notably different here, and that just kind of sets the mood. But it's still like Sir Rise is... The respect is there. But it's nighting language. Absolutely. Kneeling in front of your sovereign and having him say, Sir, Rise, you know, like, encouraging him to request the trial by combat in the first place.

Like, all of this is through the lens of considering Dunk as a knight. How good of a night are you? Not just that he's already considering it. I'm just saying that there's, like, all these little moments throughout the season, and most specifically when we get to Lionel later, but like, we're Dunk was like kind of knighted along the way. You know what I mean? Yeah, well, that's the big, doesn't really matter if Arland didn't do it question when the soul of the thing is there, the lesson and the example, and also, yeah, all the mini nightings. It's guys delightful. Baylor's pretty somber.

The mood is tense. He somber as he tells Egg on to pour dunk a drink and then says, like, try not to spill it on them. Tough feedback. The cup bears get a lot of shit in general. They say, sure do. But they get to, like, really soak up and observe a lot of the egg is kicked out of the scene in short order here. But this is where, as you noted, in the show, Dunk comes to Egg's defense and is like, he's not going to spill, he's a good boy, he's a good squire.

Dunk in general in this scene is much more like combative than he is in the book. More assertive, more aggressive, standing, pushing, charging toward Baylor's wrong. Well, would you have done? Like, isn't this the right thing to do? Yeah, versus Baylor just like offering up that. Yeah, but like, I'm a Prince of the Realm, not a hedge knight.

It is those subtle tweaks are very interesting. In the text, It's in the earlier scene with just Dunk and Egg where Dunk begins to soften. We're both from Kings Landing still. The boy said hopefully Dunk had to laugh. Yes, you from the top of Egg on Hill and me from the bottom. That's not so far, sir. And then, of course, the quote that we've already alluded to and that we will be coming back to later,

Dunk looked at him thoughtfully. He knew what it was like to want something so badly that you would tell a monstrous lie just to get near it. I thought you were like me, he said. might be you are, only not in the way I thought. It's just one of the all-time passages and moments in terms of understanding dunk and what that points to about dunk and the nighting question. Yeah, the monstrous lie is just really one of the biggest clues that we have. It's truly, it's like real. It's the equivalent of the sound effect that Carlos puts in the pod when you're getting to the spoiler section.

It's like, can't really miss this. He knew what it was like to tell the monstrous lie. This rebuke here from Baylor is what softens Dunk. And it's kind of nice to see the audience for that, the affection back on public display, but just the gratitude on Egg's face, right? He's like, oh, not just you defended me, but I have you back. Right. It's just such a lovely little moment.

You've been doing a great job tracking, like, the lessons that Egg is learning and, like, what to think about what Makar has taught him versus what he's absorbing from Dunk. So, like, to see Dunk give him this grace in this moment. Yes. And to say, oh, you can be gracious even if someone has wronged you and put you in peril. You can be gracious. And then I think most especially when he sees Baylor right in at the end. And this question, you have it, I think conservatively a hundred times this note.

What Makes a Night? I did him last time, right? I might have to get this tattooed at the end of the day because I put it in. Yeah, what makes a night a night is your constant question. And the answering question I've been bringing up all season is what makes a Targary and Targaryen. And so for Egon to see Baylor come in at the end and say, oh, a Targaryen can be that. It doesn't just have to be Aryan.

It doesn't have to be Ameri. It doesn't have to be Amon like fucking up to the citadel, which is like a, you know, we love Amon. But like that's, he's abdicating his entire Targaryian identity to do that basically. And he's like, one can be a leader. What makes a night a night? What makes it Targaryen a Targary. What makes a leader a leader? You know, and these are all things that Egg is sort of learning on the go.

I love that, especially in this family, this group of people. detention from within, something that we'll be talking about a lot today, something we talk about a lot when covering the Targaryans across various points in the timeline. And so whether it is inside your own house and dynasty or across the realm, if you were a prince of the realm, like the capacity to forgive, it's a very like Jiharis idea, you know? I love that observation. It's really, yeah, to think that this could be such a pivotal moment for Ag to observe that is such a great show. on the like really this is an all-time line front. That's interesting that you really, I mean, it's, I love this one.

Say the line and then I will say what I do. This is Baylor replying here to what Dunk says in an egg's defense. B for B, word for word from the novella, one need not intend harm to do it. Yeah, I mean, it's a great line. It's just never stuck out to me as like, you have, you're like, this is one of the best lines in the entire canon of a song of my. favorite. Song of ICE and fire.

I've never really thought of it that way. Though like, I guess because George isn't often truck an unintentional harm. A lot of the harm that he trucks in

is very intentional. That's why I like it so much. I think it introduces a note of variance that feels to me like it really rounds and flushes out the world. And first of all,

I just, have I mentioned before on our now eight podcasts, 10, if you count the two trailer pods, about this very brief so far season of TV that Baylor is one of my

favorite character. So I just love Baylor breaks fair. Part of it is that, and I think this Bertie performance is, it's everything I was hoping it would be. It's just so great. So part of it is just like Baylor's wisdom, I think, is really on display there in a way that I love. But I think it feels to me like it conveys a elemental thronesian quality of like,

okay, malice, negligence, neither, both, like all of those things can wound somebody. things that we do, impact other people, and like sometimes in ways that we don't bother to think about or anticipate, sometimes in ways that maybe you genuinely never could. The idea that intention, I feel like I often quote the Steve Rogers, like, you know, safest hands are still our own moment from Captain America Civil War. We're talking about intention. And I feel like so often, my impulse as a reader or viewer is to gravitate to the other side of this. It's like, well, what does you intend? Was your heart in the right place? Like, then that's what matters. And I like that this idea, this line makes me think about the other side of it.

Like, in the real world, it's not that intention isn't important. A huge part of this story and the kind of like emboldening, empowering aspect of the hope that people find in it, that we find in it, the lessons that are on display from Dunk, Raymond, Baylor, and this episode in particular is like, actually you deciding to give a shit try matters quite a bit. But I think an impulse that feels truly Georgia R. Martian to me is that like it's not always that clean, right? You know, the real world is messy. The world of Westeros, the land of ice and fire is messy. And so like this novella and this show that's so full of hope and charm and wonder and lessons that we do need and that I think are probably at this time in our really fucked up world, especially, like something that people are finding a lot of, yeah, finding a lot of heart and encouragement in, which. I think is awesome and great and something that we were really looking forward to ahead of the season and we made some Andor comps on that front. It also reminds us like, I don't know, life can be really, really harsh and unfair sometimes. You know, one need not always intend harm to do it. It's like there's just a true quality to that that I like here. I agree with you and I think it's really interesting. But when I think of George R. Martian sort of storytelling, I think of spoilers for a song of Ice and Fire. Like, what Rob does. Yeah, sure. You know, and that's like, did he intend harm to do harm? not necessarily, but also like... A dent went to marry the three girl.

He was told what would happen, and he did it anyway. Sure. And I think that's markedly different from Egg on a pampered privileged child not thinking through the consequences of his actions. For sure, I mean. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

Baylor's got real, like, disappointed dad energy in this stretch, right? Tells egg, all right, you should have come to me. You should have gotten me. Fetching dunk was, No kindness, he calls it. It was not a kindness to dunk in terms of the circumstance that he found himself in here, but it was, of course, a kindness to. I don't think Tenzel would have survived the run to get Baylor. Yeah. And so it's this interesting aspect, not with Baylor in particular, but just in general of like Egg and Dunk, both being penalized, punished to some extent,

to some extent for wanting to help another real tough world reminder. But for Dunk, is he happy to be in the cell? Is he happy to be poised to navigate the circumstance? to hear what he's about to hear about what's going to happen. Of course not. But, you know, we've talked all season about the Briand Dunk ties. There is a like undeniable Breanne sank the pod about Renley in season five. Like nothing's more hateful than failing to protect the one you love aspect of like a hundred times out of a hundred, dunk will go help. If he had been given the choice asked if he wanted to, he ends up in that room, undeniably, right? It's just who he is at his core. We talked about this a lot last week. The fact that just something internal

reflexive instinctual takes over. If he had had the time to play out the string, he would have done the same thing anyway. It doesn't matter. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Then we get this really electric moment. Egg is like very sullen. He's like, well, I just wish the Duncan killed Aryan.

And Baylor leans forward. He's got some heat behind the words, and he says, Aryan is your brother. And the septans say we must love our brothers. I got like chills from this. What did you make of the religious note here? I think it's interesting that Baylor is presented as someone

with this, like, religiosity in a way that, like, and especially, like, when you get, when you get someone like Aryan invoking the Andals, an Andal tradition, when Aryan is the most, I think, probably like Targaryen supremacist of the characters,

the guy who thinks he's actually a dragon and is hiding behind an Andal tradition. The Andral tradition's all created in reaction to the dragon lords, you know what I mean? All these codes and all these, all these religious, are created in contrast to what the Targaryians are.

So for Baylor, not Baylor the Blessed, you know, but still that name. Yeah, for sure. To sort of lean into this idea of the faith of the seven. And, you know, when we think about House of the Dragon and Damon Targaryen wanting to get married in like Uber Pagan style to Renera because he's like, we're dragon lords, like, you know, blah, blah, this is what we lead to. And then we've got Allison being like the Light of the Seven, you know, her bullshit. religiosity. You know what I mean? And it's just like...

Still can't believe she removed the dragon orgy murals. I mean... Brutal. It's a tragedy against art, honestly. But I agree. But I think that this Targaryan in their flop era, Targaryen's not being able to lean on the dragons for their power, have to lean a bit more into sort of like, what are the other sources of power? One of the sources of power is the church. So aligning yourself more closely with the church, as some other kings in Targaryan history have done, right? This is something that makes sense for Baylor in this moment to just sort of like lean into piety. But as someone who is like thoughtful and a student of history and all the sort of stuff like that, like it makes sense to me that he would look to the septans who are

learned people and sort of study at their feet. But I do think it's interesting that like Aaron is your brother in the septans say we mustn't love your brothers. Not like he's a good guy or, you know, family, you know, even a Searcy, like, you know, family is the only thing that matters or anything like that. He's like, one who is an else is our enemy. The rules say this. It reminded me, it actually gave me like a Ned Stark moment, right? Like, one of the most famous quotes from Game of Thrones to Aria, who's like, Sansa sucks. And he's like, let me tell you something about wolves child when the snow falls and the white winds blow.

the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives. Summer is a time for squabbles. In winter, we must protect one another, keep each other warm, share our strengths. So if you must hate Aria, hate those who would truly do us harm. Septimordane is a good woman in Sansa. Sonsa is your sister. You may be as different as the moon and the sun. That was wrong.

You may be as different as the sun and the moon, but the same blood flows through both your hearts. You need her as she needs you, and I need both of you. God's help me. I love it. War was easier than daughter. by the way, but like, the same blood flows flows through both of your hearts. You have wolf blood, right?

And so it's like you've got dragon blood. Like, the blood of the dragon gets invoked a couple times. So like we might not be, we might not have dragons anymore, as Darren is quick to point out or whatever. But we share this dragon blood. It is important that we are of, we have to love each other. All time, Ned, quote, I almost got that tattoo. You know, the exact one Sophie Turner has.

dire wolf sigil with the one will dies for the packs of her best. But you have a matching tattoo with me instead instead of with Sophie Turner. Plenty of room on my body left. Wow. Cheap. One for me, one for Jason, and one for Sophie Turner. I don't know if Sophie will be third. I would like to think of it more as a friend head.

The dragon has three heads and it's Joanna, Jason, and Sophie Turner. I can mention for another tattoo. I think I'll get one this year. I know. I've been here. I've been here in Consta. ideas from you. I do have a lot. I mean, we're going to do our rings, our Lord of the Rings tattoo at some point. I have a couple ideas these days. Great stuff. I like that you, on the, on the Baylor

as a student of history front, incorporated that because I think that is also undeniably present here. You know, talked on Talk to Throne's about the, you know, no man is as a curse as the kinslayer reminder of just like, we side with egg, we get it. Ariens a piece of shit. But we have been trained inside of this world to think that this is like the foulest violation of nature. But then beyond that, this is great. Keep the hot tics coming. You're, you're killing it this season. I don't know if your brother's Aryan Targaryen. If it's the mad king, Arias, like, you know, maybe you don't need to love them. Maybe you don't need to love them. Some kin needs to be slayed. As we'll talk about a second, even Baylor has some things to learn.

But I like that this is clearly a position influenced by not only the needs of the moment and looking for the strength of those alliances and that support, but like the lessons of history populated and dotted across all of Targaryen history. You know, you've mentioned the Magar the Cruel of Seven and, you know, he's Arian's problematic fave. That was nephews, Aegon, Viseris, not brothers, but it's kind of like the one of the original violations. of something sacred original sin from which so much targ-fuckery stems. Of course, the Dance of the Dragons, which were all watching unfold in Hot D, Renira and the blacks

versus Egon and the Greens. This is a Targaryen civil war, but also one of our favorite things about the dance is like the strife inside of each of those factions. You know, those are some of the most delicious moments. Even when you have aligned against part of your family in a civil war, you can't get along

with the people around you on your side. It's just more interesting, but it's also like, This is who the Targs are. Your favorite, the Cargill Bowl, talking about a brother versus brother conflict. The height of television. It's your favorite. Blackfire Rebellion, as we've noted, a bastard brother, but still a brother, Damon Blackfire, the Black Dragon, versus Darren the second, the Red Dragon.

Blood Raven, bitter steel, the great best. They're all brothers. That's what Bat Ward that is still such a blight on the realm right now was. And obviously we have, you know, in the future of just the Game of Third. Thrones canon, non-targue examples, too. We've got Yaron and Balan Greyjoy, or of course, is he a ham, you know, Renli and Sanis. The list goes on and on. And during the dance, we had Laris and Harwin and what happened there.

So he's heeding lessons of history. Sometimes you have, and I say, love, like, Thrones Tourettes, where you, like, you can't say something about that. You're like, is he a ham? Is he a ham? I just love that moment. It's a great. Salt and salt and smoke.

Is he a ham? I mean, it was a reasonable question for Renley, I thought. But so, like, Baylor can feel those. dozens of history, the echoes from the past, the ripples from the past. And he's looking around him. And he's like, okay, Aryan just taunted my son Valar in front of everyone. You don't even need to be a student of history. The Blackfire Rebellion is just like days ago, essentially. Yeah, 13 years is nothing. And like, it's not really over, you know? And so it's just like, again, Chris had no good points on Talk the Thrones. But Aryan did? Nor did Aryan is my point. Chris has many good points,

but not when he defends Aryan Targaryen. But like, Viseris, we constantly held Viseris's feet to the fire and House of the Dragon for not doing a better job of like preventing all the shit that came after his death

in terms of like making sure that everyone is getting along in a meaningful way, not in a just sort of like now, now get along kind of way. And so for Baylor to try to take a more active role inside of his own family,

I think is admirable. Yeah, like you understand what is fueling this, this line to egg. He's like, my own brother clearly resents me. Darren is a fucking coward and a liar. Aryan is a monster. So there are these like warnings of the crumbling that could await or anywhere he looks, he can see them. Right. You know, on the Vesaris front, it's real like the opening note of House of the Dragon is the only thing that could tear down the House of the dragon was itself for a reason. It is because it is very key and very true on the eve of the dance.

Especially when there were dragons involved. Always true for the Targaryians. obviously all of this is like extra delicious given the choice Baylor makes at the end of the episode to ride in side with dunk. Sure, we have to love our brothers. Doesn't mean that we have to actually agree with them or choose to side with them. Like sometimes other things do matter more. Can I go back and say, when you say something like the only thing that could tear down the house of the dragon was itself? Yeah. Or Robert Barathean with a warhammer? Like, is that our doctrine of exceptionalism is from Robert Barthian with a warhammer? A little sprinkle of mixed blood there, you know, some dark

blood in there, sure. Some dark blood in there, sure. The only thing that could tear down the house the dragon was itself. Or someone with like... Hit him with a hammer. There's the throne's turrets. Just avoid the Trident, you know? Just avoid the Trident, guys. I was for you at the Trident.

Baylor just missed his egg. He's like, I need to talk to Dunk alone. And then, you know, this trial by combat idea, gestating, he asked Dunk, how good a night are you? How skilled at arms? Interesting. Because is that the, what makes a night-a-night answer to the question?

How good a night are you? How skilled at arms? Or how good a night are you? What are you carrying in here? But Dung's answer is not like super compelling on the how skilled-at-arms front. And like, we look at Dunky's huge. Sir Duncan the tall. We've not seen a ton of him.

And he hasn't had a ton of experience that we have gotten to witness. We see him knock an old man over in his training montage. We're down on Arlenna with ease in the flashback. And old men. destroyed Aryan. And put up a good fight against like six or seven guards. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Took a few people to take him down. To hold him back. Yeah. So that's encouraging.

But like when he's basically like, you know, I'm the tilted at rings. It's not what Baylor was hoping to hear. Outstomped Lionel in a dancing competition. He did. He got those toes. Quick feet. He got those toes. What chance do I have truly? This is something that Dunn himself has been asking. He asked Lionel this in episode one. He asked Egg this in episode too, and that's an important thing. He's not exactly going into this. Like, I can definitely win. Yeah, when he's like, I tilted it rings, he's like, Bailor's like, okay.

Oh, no, some great Baylor expressions. That was a great. That reaction there is amazing. In the initial, with the Lords assembled, the trial scene when it's decided that they will do the trial of seven, and he's just like, you know, the eyebrows race really, oh. So sort of like, yeah, you can go.

This is where we are. from the book, Dunk was strong and quick, and his weight and reach were in his favor, but he did not believe for a moment that his skills were the equal of these others. Sir Arlen had taught him as best he could, but the old man had never been the greatest of knights even when young shit night, egg said it, egg said it. Great knights did not live their lives in the hedges nor die by the side of a muddy road. That will not happen to me, Dunk vowed. I will show them that I can be more than a hedge knight.

Dunk is very aware of his training, his experience, his circumstance. He knows that he is single-A. The shit night. Suddenly in the show. And also not even a night. So, you know. What makes a night a night, though, you know? Have you thought about that?

This is the first I'm hearing of it. Baylor explains to Dunk what he's facing. Makar. Meika. Mika. Meekal. I miss that guy. The Harold.

He's the best. Maybe he'll do some announcing next episode. Get him in the broadcast booth. Yeah. To call the trial of seven. A Howard Cassell moment? Do you feel good about it? Cosell.

Yeah, very good. Very good. It's not very good. No, you can just say close. How good of a night are you? I tilt it rings sometimes. Oh, man. Great stuff.

Maycar found his eldest, Darren the drunken, drunk at a name. rather than being like, yeah, I did, I did, I did skyve off. I cut class. Like, I'm a prince and it's fine. You're not really going to be that mad at me. Are you dad? Yeah, sure. I know that you were hoping that your sons would add best. He's like a big, huge, huge, kind of ginger, huge hedge night. Kidnapsed. E-Soy. EG. EGON. Days ago, I've been thinking about doing something about it. Yeah, I have been strategizing. I've been making some plans. My pursuit. I needed to think.

We love Darren, as we've said. He's a very sympathetic figure to us as we will talk about more later when we get to his dream. Sorry if my lie got you killed. This is rough. Sorry if my lie got you killed. Aw bummer. I do love that when he's just like, it's possible that I've killed you with my life. So I am sorry.

Like I'm probably going to a hell without wine. Darren's a great character. I really think it's one of the best performances, like of a two scene. Yeah, like a two scene sort of moment. So good. Even in the most dire of circumstances here, peril all around him. Dunk asks about. Tansau.

Not too tall for him. Multiple times inside of this episode. He's going to ask Steely Pate. Stealth MVP of the show. How many MVP are you allowed to have in the show? As many is seven. I'm going to do an MVP of seven. That is my right.

It's Baylor or Steely Pate. Baylor is the MVP to me for sure. I think Raymond is Well, characters are performances Those are different things Hold my hand Yeah You're not allowed to have Raymond Foss away

I love him You can't have him And you know why I can and I will No Sorry The contradictions in the human heart Sorry

The only thing Worth writing about it and getting tattoos I rarely ever deny you anything But I'm denying you this What does Baylor say When Tansall comes up By the time Ariane is done twisting the tale

it will be high treason. Twisting the tail, like, he knows what Aryan is. Don, he knows what this is. And then this is where... Dunk gets a little head up. A little spicy. Right? Treason?

By puppet tree. By puppet tree. Puppet. Never hurt anyone. I'll say it again. The dragon is the sigil of the royal house to portray one being slain. It was surely innocent.

Perhaps, Baylor says, but far from wise, even in peacetime. Arian calls it a veiled attack on House Targaryen and excitement to revolt. Do you believe that, your grace? One truth is beyond dispute. You laid hands on the blood of the dragon.

What do you make of this? I mean, the way in which Baylor is telling him there are limits to what I can do here inside of these power structures, inside of my power, I need to preserve this idea that you can't lay hands on the blood of the dragon, that like we might be on our floppy. Maybe we don't have dragons, but we still have to say we're blood of the dragon or else why do we have the right to be kings? We don't. So I think Baylor is incredibly pragmatic. And I think, you know, and it's a little disappointing because you want him to just say like, stop. Send Ary into his room and, you know, stop this whole thing before it starts. That's what we would love to see from Baylor. But Baylor is more pragmatic than that. And so when he does show up at the end and we cry and the Game of Thrones theme kicks in and so like that, like this is a huge moment. but also, and I didn't see this in your characterization of the notes later when we get there, but like what I think is true and what I, and many people are saying, as that there's a pragmatic angle to it as well, which is like this is PR as well, which is like if it's all of the Targaryens against this guy who defended the small folk.

Sure, yeah, of course. That doesn't look great. So like, is Baylor acting inspired by this? exchange he's having with Dunk here to like, you know, reach into his heart and do what is true and what is right? Yes. Is he also like, and this is also a better look for us. Yeah. If it's a bit more even handed inside of this conflict. I mean, both can be true. But just just to say that he's like, like what we're saying about Dunk, it's not that Dunk is like constantly polishing his halo. He is and then he's also like, you know, thinking about kissing Tansell or whatever the case may be. Kissing. Definitely kissing. Kicking.

Thinking about kissing. Kisting somewhere. Baylor is the same. There are certain things we have to sort of maintain in order or else this whole thing falls apart because honestly the monarchy is a joke. So in order to keep this fiction afloat, we need to pretend that the blood of the dragon is sacred. Yeah. And I think that complexity is really delicious and the fact that like the everything we've heard from Arlen from Dunk, the soul of chivalry, like that is true. And that is very apparent.

but like thinking about his family's position, the pressure of that, he's the heir to the Iron Throne. Like it is incumbent on him to take that seriously. He has a responsibility to think about their positioning in the realm. So undeniably, that's in the Berto, as well. This is this idea that Chris asked us about on Talk to Thrones was that like, you know, does Arian have a point question in terms of specifically that, incitement to revolt, risk, and fear.

And I refuse to seed ground on this. And I will also say that, like, I think underlying my side of the argument would be that, like, later when Ariens, like, well, Darren was insulted, too, so we can't let that stand. When, like, he knows full well that Darren's fucking lying, right? So, like, all of this is him just weaving a tapestry of bullshit so that he can do whatever he wants to do. safe face, you know, crushed nuts and also

hedge knights under his boot, you know, or the hilt of his dagger. Yes. So I cannot You will not be co-assigning I cannot concede Aryan has any points here. On the Tancel puppet show front and what people might take from it,

you know, I think it was back in the first trailer pod that you flagged, like because as we've talked about many times in covering the season, the canon timeline difference of like George wrote the novella before all of the Blackfire history existed. So there's way more just the shadow inspector of the recent Blackfire Rebellion looming in the show than there ever could have been in the novella

because that history didn't exist yet. Because George had thought of it yet. And the showrunner Ira Parker and the show team they're able to incorporate that throughout. And so this like one need not intend harm to do it element of like, was that what Tancel and the puppeteers were trying to do? Like no? Could somebody in the audience have taken encouragement from that?

Is it horseshit that Ariane is saying that undeniably? Is it possible that puppet show, forget it, this fucking fiasco that is unfolding where they're all making asses of themselves is likely to lead somebody, Stefan Fossoe. In short order here is one example to say, like, the dragon house, where are there dragons? for the crowd for the rock hurling at Arian's head that everything they do there is like the propensity for someone to look around and say flop era. Monkey is bullshit. But like, I mean, Bittersteel is alive. I know you're not.

I know you're not saying that Arian has a point. No, certainly not. Like we just, I just, we can't. Certainly not. Have that attitude towards art. We can't say we have to sense like if someone inside of the, I know you don't aren't saying this, but if someone inside of the puppetry troop was like, should we not do the one

with the dragon, should we not do Serwyn when there are Targaryens around? Right. Like if I'm Tenzel or whoever is like, I'd be like, no, we're fucking doing Serrana the mirror shield. That's part of what's so hideous about Arian as a character. Ariane's the kind of guy who needs his very own halftime show because

he can't handle like, you know? Totally. So it's just like. See you track sports. I know so much. Howard Kosell did you say? So. But I mean, it's just sort of like that fragility. Absolutely.

And it's the Targaryen's own brutality or like, you know, because if you are Jeharis, the conciliator, like, you know, if you are the kind of king who's like looking out for the people, right. Your power isn't that brittle to misquote our guy. So, you know, it's just like. Yeah, Arian is like the worst kind of villain where he is a striver who is seeking validation and sees himself as rare, special, righteous, worthy, but is as insecure in that power,

and would never identify that in himself, would always cast that blame or project elsewhere. It is because my family has let me down. And I mean, they are, look at their hair. They're not as worthy as me. When someone to the crowd says Lord Ashford fucks his sheep. Yeah, great stuff. We laugh. We don't break his fingers.

You know what I mean? Like, but Aryan probably would have. He laughed. If it had been about the Targaryens, though. Well, then that's bullshit. Yeah, I agree. I agree. I'm team Aryan is a monster, not team.

Did Aryan have some points? The girl's finger was snapped in half dunk points out. No matter the cause, it is never wise to strike a king's grandson. Would you not have done the same? I might have, but I am a prince of the realm, not a hedge knight. don't all nights make the same oath to protect the innocent? What I really love, and we got an email

about this, but this language has been tweaked throughout this episode. Right, so you have this quote here from the book, right? The headshin is the truest kind of knight dunk the old man had told him a long time ago. Other knights serve the lords who keep them or from whom they hold their lands,

but we serve where we will for men whose causes we believe in. Every knight swear is to protect the weak and innocent, but we keep the vow best, I think. Queer how strong that memory seemed, right? So that's, like, very, very important for what is going on here. But the language that George uses, and he'll use it again later when Baylor shows up in the novella, is protect the weak or defend the weak.

And Ira and his writer's just like, they're like, why call Tancel weak? Why call these people weak? They're innocence, and that's the point. It's not that they're weaker. it's that they are because like that's disempowering to a certain you know and to say like the weak but the innocent she did nothing wrong she did a puppet show right yeah don't get did nothing wrong really he protected someone yeah and are they weaker inside of this bullshit power structure yes but like I like that they just nips that word out a couple times in this in this show and they were just sort of

like what matters is the innocence yes yeah and the power matters less than the innocence and ultimately that that's a tie to to the choice that obviously obviously very present in the choices that Dunk has made, but the choice ultimately that Baylor makes too is like, I'm going to stare into Aryan's soul when I say the guilty, and I'm going to ride out inside with the guy who did the right thing because he is the innocent, ultimately. I love that tie across the character set here.

We already talked about this, how this slight tweak in the positioning, this like, yeah, I'm not a hedge knight language, is something that Baylor kind of offers up on his own versus the prompting here from Dunk, We spend some time on this on Talk to Thrones, but worth hitting here again that this really just positions, it's a matter of degree. The exact words of the exchange are very similar, that Dunk is imparting wisdom here to Baylor, that he is providing an example. Which Baylor will quote at the end.

And I think it's really important. We've seen Dunk do this throughout, right? So, like, you know, he says this to Egg, right, about like, oh, we can't have the Prince Ling be disappointed, right? But also to Lionel right at the very beginning, right? That's easy for you to say you have a name and inheritance. One loss, I won't be able to ransom back my own horse. So from the beginning, Dunk has been a mouthpiece for the writers of the show to just sort of push back on the privilege that surrounds him. In a way that Dunk in the book is not really, that's not on his agenda.

And we've been chatting since before the season since the preview pods about this very active positioning for the novellas, but certainly the show. And this is a core thing for George, too, but the show is really leading to like, we're with the small folk. Like, these are the characters, and this is the point of view, and this is the kind of life that we want to root this story in.

And then it's like, oh, but here are all these Targaryens. And something like that where you just identified, something like this moment from Dunk. It's like, only Dunk, will he inspire other Royals to be able to see life that way?

Yes, and that's the great gift that Dunk can provide. But he has a history and a lived experience and a perspective in a point of view that is the same as the legions and the masses and is not the same as the kid in the royal doublet or as chivalrous as he is. And that's part of why he's a fabled character and even Dunks life because of Arlen's mythologizing of bailer. You know, he shows up like we

talked about earlier in the season, more in the novella than the show and just more like kind of common garb. It's like, man, of the people, brown hair, still the heir to the iron throne and the prince of dragon's son and the hand of the king. So for Dunk to be a little bit of the show and able to just like incept a little bit. And then through his lesson really lead. And also, it had to be dunk. This thing that we've brought up a couple times about the like the ability of the hedge knight to be in these rooms of power. I mean, it's an unusual story for dunk here. An ordinary hedge knight would not have had these opportunities to be alone with the heir to the iron throne as sort of like often as dunk is here. But like there are very few sort of lowerborn people

who are allowed to permeate the levels of power the way that like a Hedge Knight can because a Hedge knight acts in this sort of liminal space, right? I'm of you, but not one of you, you know, sort of thing. And so that puts him in this really interesting position. The other way in which inside the book, and it's good to have him voice these things because a lot of it is like internal monologue for Dunk inside of the book.

I'm thinking specifically of like in this moment when Baylor is like, Aaron wants your head, Don't worry. I'm not letting that happen. Yeah. But I can't deny my trial. But you could lose a hand or your foot. Like that's... Yeah. He already asked for some of your teeth. Them's the rules. So like, Dunk spends a lot of his internal monologue from here forward thinking about what his life would be like without a foot. And like, we see what this cruel world does to someone as rich and clever as Laris with a disability. And Dunk has none of that insulation around. him. He cannot live by his wits. Right. With love and respect to dunk, my guy dunk. Yeah. And he does not have wealth and privilege around him. Right. And so he's like, what would my life be like? Yeah. If I cannot be strong and be tall. Right. What else do I have? Like, my life is over if this

happens. And again, that's like, I don't think true in our world as the same way it's true in this world. And also, this idea that if you hit a king, you lose a hand, you kick a king, you lose a hand, maybe you think about Tyrion, slapping Joffrey and saying, and now I've struck a king, did my hand fall for my wrist? Do you know what I mean? Just sort of like... Perfect. Just as the cow pie to the cheek means. It's on our mind with Aryan. I mean, think of Jamie with what you just said too because he of course does have position, privilege, wealth, power, the strength of his family name, all of it. I was that hand. I was that hand. I was that hand. If your life is the life of a night, and especially for Dunk at this point at the beginning,

this pivotal moment. On the road, constantly traveling. I must risk all. And then what? It's over. Yeah. Right. On the, on the Tyrion front, real like, I mean, Tyrion and his season four trial, obviously on our minds in general because of Oberyn and the legendary I Will Be Your Champion Moment, which we'll talk about more when we get to the trial by combat history in a minute. But Tyrion also on our mind here in the trial because the like, I know I'll get no justice here declaration, right? So almost like conceding in advance here, the people in that room are not going to side with you. It's not going to going to happen. It's not. You asked Leo Longthorne to remember who Sir Arlen was and let you enter the list,

and he didn't have time to do anything but spit sour leaf juice at your feet. It's not going to happen, right? And so especially, again, this idea of like seven and the idea of something holy or sacred or just, you know, one of the associations is with justice. It's like, what is justice? If you've come to, if you're looking for justice, you've come to the wrong place, this is a through line across the canon. If you think this story is a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention. All timer. All-timer. Whether it's a better choice or a worse choice, Baylor says. I cannot say. It's going to be up to Dunk, right? And so I ask you again, Sir Duncan the Tall, how good a night are you? Truly. And this word is deliberately

being deployed time and time again. What chance do I have truly? We've heard it from Dunk many times. We hear her from Baylor. I love that you're flagging that. I think and myth and legend, but what's real? As someone who just spent a minute or two talking about like, this shot looks like a tarot card, I'm not here to like, yuck the yum of your sort of like, what is this mean question? I may or may not get to this like incredible email we got about the fart joke, but like. Yeah. But also I wonder, I feel like that's also sometimes just like a rhetorical trick that people use to make something feel oldie-timey. No question. But it's like...

Just tack a truly on the end? Definitely. But then in this show and in this, in this fictional slice of the world, where with this character set, this novella this season, so much is about, you know, the tales grow and the telling idea, right? The, like, role that myth and legend play to potentially waylay you, like the Stephens. Well, I'm just going to go get me, me my glory, you know, or the way that you can perhaps find inspiration in that and then can you. become that for someone else. Kind of just like a fascinating what's real. Are there no true nights among you?

Yes. Like, which is the line, I would say, with love and respect to any other ones we highlight of the season of the novella, et cetera, et cetera. At the end of the day, the truest night that we see. The line of the novella is not for puppets. I don't think you mean that. The end of the day, the truest night we see is dunk. Yes, no question. And what is truth then?

Because if he's not actually a knight, then the truth is... Should it matter if you were actually knighted or if you live the way that a true knight should. Yeah. Great stuff. Dunk does it. He's like, um, trial by combat. That is my right.

Somebody told me the words trial by combat, and I just thought I'd repeat them here. It's great. The cut to this scene, the folks who are assembled, so it's Dunk, it's Arian, it's Baylor, it's Maker. It's Lord Ashford, who is, of course, hosting this tourney.

And then Lord Tyrell, Leo Longthorne, who is the... Lord of the Reach, Ashford's Lord, Sowerloaf guy. Darren, not in the scene in the show, which I think was a fine and good choice because it just so much. It gives him a better entrance later.

But yeah, he's here in the book, and I think he says like one thing. Yeah, he's like, walnut crushing. This is such a great touch. We've talked a lot across the season about shorthand. What does it tell us that Dunk is

kind of animals, for example? Arrian, in the most important moment of another person's life. Just sitting there using his dagger held, a weapon of death and violence to facilitate his snack. It probably like Dunk could live for the rest of his life

on how much that dagger costs. No question. And he's using it as a nutcracker. No question. This snobby little rich kid needs his snack. That's what Sarah, Dina Smith said on the official part. And then like sending Lord Ashford under the table for the unbelievable. For the nuts. Just really good stuff. Thailand!

No time for amusement, Thailand. You still thinking of Brandon Rick on. Always. Walnut Association always. Star boys, always. Dunk takes a breath. He says this thing and we get this incredible

reaction shot of everybody. And then a little nod of encouragement from Baylor. So on the shorthand front, hearing this, trial by combat, that is my right. This is just like one of the big Thrones beats. This is the good shit for Thrones fans. It's fun. A lot of the things that happen,

just trial by combat in general, what Baylor does, to just remind ourselves that this was 1998 that George wrote this. He wrote this novella between the first and second novels. So it's like in many ways, like this is like, obviously we get some trial by combat of consequence and note

in the first novel A Game of Thrones. This is like early. Like, Baylor in the canon, Oprah's doing a Baylor impression technically, not the other way around. Fun to think about. But of course in the TV world, we're receiving this after years and years and years of seeing trial by combat play out on screen. And then like

many. He's not asking for a champion. He's just asking for the chance to fight for his life. Ready to do it himself. Ready to do it himself. Jamie to Ned in season one later, when I watched The Mad King die, I remembered him laughing as your father burned. It felt like justice. Notting to, of course, Rickard Stark versus Arias as champion, fire. Some kings need sling. Chill guy. Chill, you don't have to love all your brothers. Great stuff. Tyrion, of course, at the Erie in season one.

Braun versus Servardis, Liza, you know, got some milking in and then had time to say, you don't fight with honor. And Braun's like, he did. Out that girlfriend. Out of the Moondor. Barrack and the Hound. In season three, Thoros sang, show us the truth. Strike this man down if he is guilty.

Give strength to his sword if he is true. Obviously, most famously of all the mountain versus the viper. in season four, I will be your champion. A lot of great stuff in The Feast for Crow's text where Circe is preparing and writes to Jamie when I love the idea. I've always loved the idea that both Jamie's siblings at some point wanted and needed him to be a champion. That is not what happened in either case for different reasons.

And then, of course, in season six of Thrones, Tom and in the High Sparrow banning trial by combat specifically to fuck Circe. Yeah, it's like, we're going to do this. We're going to do the seven septans. And that went fine for everyone. It went fine. Absolutely great. It went fine. No problem. This is just great. I never tire of this. Maybe a point will come when we do, but it hasn't happened yet. Well, especially not here because we're getting trial by seven, which is...

Yeah, Aryan's like, I'm going to up the ante. Yeah, it's different. Great stuff. So what does this tell us about Aryan as a character? That he had no good points and that he's a chicken shit. I mean, he's too, he cannot go up against Duncan. Even if Duncan has only been tilting at rings, just kicked his ass. He will be the, he will be the, shit out of Aryan, right? So he can't do this. And so he's like, oh, trial by seven. As I read from my hero, Mega, the cruel. Loves that guy.

He's like, Megar had some great points. And one of them was trial by seven. And this, you know, like quick on his thing. Quick on his feet, thinking like the Darren cover and all this or stuff like that. And also making it a question of honor for the Targaryian families. I love even maker. It's like, that's fucking nonsense. But it's all bullshit, and it's all just, like, so clear because he's, the best outcome for Arian is Duncan can't get six other people to fight with him.

Right. Six, might as well be six thousand. Right. And it's highly likely because no one would even, like, vouch for him to be a night in the first place. Except he made some friends and influential people in the last few days. He did. Arien is a little behind on the nighttime party drinking and also daytime song and Tung of Warseeing. A little behind.

A little behind. I was thinking about this. You know, we talked about Robin Riesling and the scene with Egg. Because Egg gets Lionel Barathean and Robin Riesling to come back. Yes. Right? Yeah. And Raymond got the Humphreys, yeah.

And so the scene with Robin Risling is great because, like, Egg's like, I know. The mad knight will get him. Great. But also, like, the tug-of-war scene was important because Egg knows who Lionel Barathean is. Like, he wasn't in the party tent. So it's like we saw Egg directly interact. with both of the champions that he went and found. And he could, like, show up,

Blown Brathian, stinking drunk or asleep. And he's just like, remember when I won that tug of wool for you, sir? Let me tell you, your rendition of Alice with three fingers got me thinking. Would you like to hear my dissertation? Took me to a hit Spong one space, ma'am. Would you rather bloody up some Kingsguard? Left an impression. I kind of like the, because May Carr has been such a comedically,

successfully deployed character. He in the novella is doing a lot of the like, come on man, like don't play the fool stuff with dunk for not knowing this. But he in the show is the one who's like, what the fuck is this? Yeah. Great stuff. Oh, if it was the Andals. The Andals. Incredible.

So trial of seven, ancient, seldom evoked, brought across the narrow sea by the Andals. Jorah the Andal. Talk about Thrones tick. Whenever I hear it, end all right? I have. Jorre the Andal, I always hear it in my head. along with the Roynar and the first men, of course. The Andles brought knighthood and the faith of the seven both.

And so when we think about these associations between those two things, all very much in the mix here. Also, they cut down all the wherewoods and went to war with the children of the forest and killed a ton of them. So that was tough. Yeah, the anthels are not morally superior to the Targaryens as much as they like to think so. Turns out that almost everyone in song by some fire, the landed by some fire is firmly in the we have some notes.

Except for the gentleman four is. all they did was shove a piece of dragonglass very slowly into a man's chest. Don't worry about it. It went fine. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. Yeah, I think on the Aryan front, I love all that. I think it is interesting to show us that he is also a student of history.

Like, it's like giving me kind of in a much more nefarious and sinister way, a little bit of a like Connor Roy. Like, well, in my readings. Energy. Has Aryan tracked down? Any withered genitalia from prior conquerors he worships. I'm just asking. Errating his wine by putting it in the blender first? Maybe.

Would it surprise you? Maybe. Would it surprise you? Look at how he opened a walnut. Anything is possible. Last trial of seven. You mentioned Maycar. So this was 42 AC.

It is now 209 AC. That is how long it has been since a trial of seven was either happened or at least was recorded in history. there are such monumental events that it is not reasonable to assume that something would have happened that was not recorded in history. Why has it been so long? Because the last time it happened, the faith was like, Magar, your claim, we've got some notes, we're going to challenge you. Every single person involved died except for Magar, who was basically a vegetable for weeks. These are costly, costly battles.

We had several listeners ask, like, what are the rules of the trial by seven? And here's the rules. The fight only ends when all seven men on one side are defecive. defeated, killed, or someone yields, like the main sort of like... The accuser or the accused. Yeah. Aryan or Dunk would have to yield. Yes.

So either everyone fighting on Dunk's side is dead or everyone's fighting on Aryan side is dead or they're like very clearly beaten or Aryan or dunk yields. That's how this ends. And so Raymond's like, this is no fucking joke. Lenses of War. Yeah. Stefan's like, well, it's a nightly contest. You're not a night.

You're not going to have to worry about it. I like soft grapes and nice food. Fucking Stefan, calling Raymond, Raymond the reluctant in the novella. And then Raymond gets to talk his shit. I love Raymond. It's great. You don't get to heaven. Yes, I do.

God damn it. Nope. So this power move from Marian that is, I agree, definitely born out of a position of fear, right? There's the like, okay, well, maybe he won't be able to find the men and then it won't happen. But also, if it does happen, I am going to be able to surround myself with princes, the Kingsguard. There's also a question of like, is, because Darren has to fight now, right? Because he's like, it's not just my honor is Darren's honor. Yeah.

So Darren has to fight. Yeah. Maker has to fight. Sure. Yeah. Like, I've seen some people, many people are asking. Is Ariane hoping that his brother dies or his dad dies or something like that? And that all just like pushes him a little closer to the throne.

I mean, maybe it's entirely possible. He's just like added bonus. Yeah, he doesn't care what happens to anyone. I do think that the established relationship with his dad is like one of reverence, but born of fear. And even we get the little, we see the way that Maycar like pulls him out as like calling him an idiot. Darren said he was like footwipped, which. which is a hideous form of torture that is, like, banned by the Geneva Convention. Yeah.

Like. And, like, Raymond, we learned from him in a prior episode that he's like, he wouldn't have done that. Like, he wouldn't have done the thing that he had done to Humphrey Harding if his father didn't have been there. So they're terrified of him. On the one hand, yes. But on the other hand, I think Aryan's like, anything gets me close to the throne is an added bonus to me, you know? Well, and then there's also the, like, so there's the I'm afraid part. He would say, let me get people on my way part.

He would be happy to see Valar dead. That's for sure. Clearly. Yeah, for sure. Uncle Baylor, who hates him? Well, this is all, I mean, all of that fuels into just the larger way that Aryan thinks about legacy and legend, right? All of this potentially can just boost his stock and his standing as a figure of consequence. And if he can do it while shielding himself with swords that he doesn't think Dunk can match. It's an interesting tactic.

I'm going to talk about this again a little later. But like, I think this idea that, okay, to be part of a trial by. which hasn't happened in 160 years. Incredible. Linal's like, sign me up. Let's do it, baby. This is sick. Awesome. When Baylor shows up and then all of a sudden it's like Targaryen versus Targaryen and all of a sudden the air to the iron throne, the hand of the king is fighting it. This is like, now everyone knows their front road history in this moment at Ashford Meadow. That is what we are watching here. You know who's thrilled? Lord Ashford. But like you said, Feltin. Can I turn this into a bidet. Failed to monetize the event. Yeah.

You hate to fail to monetize. I love in the text when in response to the explanation that the Andals believed, which we get in the show too, if seven champions fought the gods being thus honored would be more like to intervene and see the guilty party punish this sheen put on it. Leo Tyrell in the book chimes in. He's like, or mayhaps, they simply had a taste for sword play. And I've always loved, I kind of wish we had gotten that in the show, but I always love that line because it's like, yeah, this is a fucking. bloodbath. This is like base violence wrapped up in something holy.

Let's see. Anything else we haven't hit in this scene before we move to the next? Just the way that Aryan deploys honor, you know, as like a farcical idea. Yeah. The Gaul to do that in front of Dunk. All right.

The Fassways. Dunk goes back to his elm. He's in the rain. He talks to the horses. Oh, lads. And Raymond pops out. Asked if he wants some food and we cut to some pretty disgusting meal time with Stefan. Do you think you have misophonia? Do you think in any way?

Definitely. No question. Yeah. But you chew gum. Yeah, for sure. Okay. Yeah. It doesn't bother you when I chew gum around you? I don't recall ever thinking you chewed gum loudly. Great. No. The way that Stefan was gnashin on that, honk a meat, though. Boy, all nights, vow to protect the innocent. Fenn Fenn says, even hedge nights, I assume. He can't help himself. Says, I assume. I am for you. The accent is thick on Stefan Foss way.

I am for you. So even this piece of shit who could not be more of a dick to Raymond here, to Raymond always, to dunk, to everyone he's interacted with, just like for a beat says something that is positioned as good. But it's all horseshit. And that makes it all the more, of course. powerful to reinforce the dunk is the rare knight who actually believes this, who isn't using these things as either paper shields or pathways to achieve me.

I have to say, from my very anecdotal evidence of people's response to this, most people were snookered by Stephen Fosway here. Sir Severon. Steveron killed me. Sorry, I said Stephen. Stefan Fossoway. Yeah. Like the way that he puts this theater on,

like really got the people at home thinking, okay, this guy sucks, but he cares when a puppeteer gets her finger snapped. He's on the side of right. And then it's like, nope, what? He's on his own side only.

The shit bag with the rose gaudy rose gold armor is a bad dude? That looks great. It does look great. Yeah, because you love Stefan Foss away. I do not. I do not Team Red Apple, but not Team Red Apple. Not Team Steffam. Nope.

We contain multitudes, all of us. This is the Dragon House exchange when Duncan's like, are you sure you want to side with me? Like you don't have to. The Dragon House is not going to be pleased, like if anybody opposes them, right? And Stefan says, Dragon House? Where are there dragons, Sir Duncan?

And then he talks about the Fossoy House's own history. We were here long before these others come to our shores and I'll warrant, we'll be here long after they are gone. So we talked about this last week. Yes. This idea that the Fossoways used to be lords and they lost their lordship, right? that they were like, that they are old house,

old old house, that they used to be so rich and powerful that the Tyrells married them for their money, right? And so that they are like disgraced. I think we got an email from someone or I saw a comment somewhere

where someone's like, well, it's because it's show confirmed that they were on the wrong side of the Blackfire Rebellion. But I don't think you get, the way that they've changed, I talked about the,

regional accents on Talk the Thrones of these two actors that they picked for this role. But also they've changed, we'll get to it sort of when Raymond and Stefan have their exchange later on the tourney ground. But like they've changed the nature of their language. It's rougher. It's lower, class than it is in the novella. You don't get that within 20, you know, like less than 20 years. Like I think they lost their lordship long before that. And there's, you know, we, I mentioned on Talk to Throne's or maybe last week, like, we might see the Fossaways

in House of the Dragon, like they might show up. I would expect to. Maybe. I mean, I don't know. Like, if they have time for it, they might do some Fossaway stuff in that. So stuff that they are part of will definitely happen. Whether they will be named. Whether or not we have time for to give Humphrey Biesbury

a line or the Fossoways any air time, I don't know. But like, they've been on the wrong side of conflicts before, you know what I mean? So I don't thing is Blackfire Rebellion-related. But anyway, they've lost, they are disgraced. And so the fact that, like, Stefan Fossoy is like, I want a lordship out of this, right? I'm turning coat here so that I can get a lordship from Arian who doesn't have the ability to grant lordship, by the way, um, is, you know, is this whole, like, we used to be somebody. Mm-hmm. To the who has the power

to granted, it would never occur to him that there would be a Targaryen on the other side of this. It is simply a, like, calculus of the royal house versus this hedge knight. Sure. It's about to get more complicated. But I do, I do, you know, we've been tracking the no dragons thing the whole time, but the like, seeking lordship, seeking favor, like, none of that is being calculated in your own ambition. None of that is the same as being afraid, you know? It's just a, it's a, what he does, he does not have points, nor doesarian, but it's a fascinating insight into the state of play. Singers, to make them immortal, he says, the answer is always more glory. This is how he's boasting that he'll easily be able to go wake other people and find them and get them

to decide to do the same thing, because his ambition, his self-interest is just so naked, and he assumes this is what drives all people. What do you make of the way that you asked the question on Talk to Thrones about, because we were noting the, and in talking about Stefan's armor, I recall the steely paint line to dunk about, like, I don't do that.

I don't do the fancy armor and the foreign fruits, like good, plain steel, much like Dunk. And so we have with their armor, but also what the armor represents about them, Stefan and Dunk as contrasts. you observed, like, well, how do we reconcile something like Lionel's fancy armor, right? There's kind of an interesting version of this here, too, with the tales grow and the telling aspect of this, because, like, glory drives Stefan in a way that is bad and wrong, and something

that we are meant to judge. But glory drives Lionel Barathean, you know? He's talking about the storm lords of old and what they had done and what he wants to do. He says in the novella and the show, this hasn't happened in a hundred years. Like, I'm not going to miss it. I love Lionel Barathean. I think Dunk is lucky that he's on his side. I think Dunk is lucky that the Baratheans don't really like the Targaryens that much. Complex stuff. It's very complex.

A very, very messy family tree there and stuff like that. But, like, I think it's very lucky that Lionel Barathean has some, like, chips on his shoulder about the Targaryens. Because I think it quite easily have gone the other way with Lionel. It's like him walking away from the tug of war. Like, I wouldn't put... Yeah. He doesn't betray Dunk the way that Steph. does here, but like, just because

Lionel showed up for him doesn't mean I think Lionel has like a strong moral code here, you know? There's like the, we'll talk about all of the knights who are on Dunk's side and why they're there and we will lament that we didn't get more time with some of them. There's a reason that Lionel, if there was only

going to be one, like had to be the one that we better understood his choice. A number of things that were the show benefits from from moving up his introduction and expanding his role. Stefan's like, not just I got all these fancy friends, but he's like, you're not going to die. I watch it promise. A Thrones promise. Never good. Never works out. Never good. And Raymond and the novella is just like, these guys that he

listed, like, I'm sure he knows them, but they don't know him. You should find your own champions. Raymond, like, throughout this conversation is like, what the fuck is, this is not very stephenworthy. Like, this is not, he's like, you should also leave. You should think about running away. Yeah. That's an interesting moment because Dunk's like, won't they kill me? And then Raymond's like, well, won't they kill you anyway? Like, don't we kind of. Dunk turns back on him in a second. Yeah. In the text on that idea of running, Dunk thinks to himself, he wondered if they expected him to saddle a horse and flee. He could if he wished. That would be the end of his knighthood, to be sure. He would be no more than an outlaw henceforth until the day

some Lord took him and struck off his head. Better to die a night than live like that, he told himself stubbornly. So the choice he makes here, like so many other things for Dunk, it's all entwined and connected to the way he thinks about all of this. Like, why is he here in the first place. I'm going to show them that I'm more than an outlaw, that I'm more than a robber, that there can be majesty and worth in the life of a hedge knight. So of course he was never going to run. He's dunk. He's sir dunked the tall. Plus he's like his father, not very inconspicuous. Where are you going to hide? Tall guy. Tall guy. Can't just shave his head like egg. And that escape notice. Even more noticeable, I would say. This is where he says the thing about

not knowing my place. Maybe the gods figure this is what I deserve. He says, and Raymond says, for doing what you were supposed to, for not knowing my police. So does this feel just connected to you to the larger question of a monstrous lie? The monstrous lie. Yeah. Yeah. And in general, just the idea of maybe trying to move beyond his station, which we love. We love to see it. Darren's here. Egg enters the tent. He pops in. Dunks like, egg. It's very sweet. He's like, I'm your squire. Someone's got to arm you, and I don't care that my family's on the other side. I'm your guy. It's very sweet. It's very wonderful. Then the mood shifts because Darren comes in and Dunk. It's just like, I'm going to pin you to a table with a dagger at your throat. They can't kill me twice.

This is something that like I thought was really interesting that. This idea that like, Darren seems so unbothered by this. Dunk just like pins him down and Darren's like, sure, whatever. But he's petrified of his dreams. Yeah. Well, and he says late, like he says in the end of this conversation, like I don't want it. I don't want to die. And I mean, who knows what other dreams he's having that he hasn't shared that give him some sense of the future and his role in it. Yeah. So it's a dreamer's always interesting. When and the how. We'll learn eventually that that is really why he's here to talk to Dunk about the dream. But first, they have to basically talk through what they've learned about the other side. Maker will be fighting. Darren is going to be there. He assures Dunk. Just going to ride out once, one gallon charge, then give me a little knock on the side of the head. I'll just stay there in the mud. Here's a line that they cut that we really love, right? My brothers have my measure when it comes to fighting and dancing and thinking and reading books, but none of them is half my equal at lying and sensible in the mud. Great shit. Darren rules.

It's great. It's great shit. I would have loved that line. I know. That is a good one. And the Kings are only the three that are here. Only the three that are here absolutely killed me. So funny.

Oh my God. Very funny. Darren is a comedic genius. And who are those three? Sir Donald of Duskendale, Sir Roland, Craig Call, hot Roland, as we like to call him here, and Sir Willow Wilde, who was in the background of one shot. So two of these guys, Donald and Roland,

Dunk had a moment with, right? He shared an experience with them, a little bit of bonding, and all of whom. The three who are here, just in general, the Kingsguard, as we talked about when we spent some time with them in episode two, Dunk worships. So, yes, there's the wallop,

there's the gut punch of hearing, oh, fuck. Like, I'm going to have to face the most capable knights and warriors in the realm, but much more than that, it's like, these are my heroes. They're supposed to be the embodiment of knighthood. How does that ideal match? And they're on the other side of me.

Yeah. And I believe I have done the nightly thing. So this conflict that we're always talking about how George loves to explore, what's the ideal and what's real and what happens when the characters have to stare that in the face? Like, what could, their dunk has, it's time and time again, all these characters who are reminding Dunk of these things. This is a subtler one, but it is one of those moments too. Like, if they're fighting against me for the thing that I have done that I know, what's right, it connects to that Arlen passage that you read, the truest kind of knight, he can be, the Kingsguard have to do what they're told, whether they think it's right or not.

And this is why, not just because of the great line-al-line about like blotting up their pretty white dresses, but like, that shining, pure white example of what a knight is, and then the grubby, grubby dunk, and the fact that dunk is, like, is the pure of heart one. I love dunk. and sorol and she's super hot. Yeah. Hot take.

I love donkey's great. They ask you, you know, don't who do you have? All right, we just ran you through the roster on the other side. What do you got cooking?

He's like, let me tell you about your stephen. Have you heard of him? Incredible moment where we just get to linger on egg in Aaron's pieces for a second. And they're like, uh,

great stuff. So egg is like, I love sports. You saw me at the joust. It's signing day, baby. I've got you. Let me go recruit. Let me go recruit.

Champions never sleep. I'm in the black. That's a Nick Sabin line. Obviously. A person I definitely know who he is. Yeah, eggs out there and he's got his black and red garb and he's like, I'm a princeling. Let's see what I can do. And this is where Dunk is like, I am going to be going against your family.

Do you really not care? We don't get to see this in the show and we don't get to see it in the book either because it's this great moment of surprise that egg went out and got these guys. But like I would have loved to have seen the egg pitch. What was the pitch? Me too. Me too. perhaps in a web episode presented by the Egg and Thunder show. Okay.

We broke the point of view rule once. Why not again? Take us into Egg waking Lionel up from the like piss-soaked, beer-soaked, drunken stupor that he's like found himself in the bottom of his tent, you know? I know. And the novella, we get that line that's like, yeah, and my boy, like, spilled a flag of wine over my head. It's like, I think that in the showland, Egg. walked in on something different. I walked in on something different.

And it left a mark in more ways than one. He's learning lots of lessons. Lots of lessons to be had. Thanks. Like, my father's going to be protected. Kingsguard are there. Darren just told you that he'd flop. Aryan, thanks for asking.

You can kill him. You can kill him. He put my cat in a well. He threw my cat down a well, even though he said he did it. Egg, cat guy, you love to know it. Yeah. You love to know it. And Darren's like, okay.

Yeah, he sucks. Used to say that he would cut my dick off and then he would marry me. Marry me. Raymond's like hilarious. Raymond is just laughing up the storm. Thanks, it's a great appropriate time to laugh. This is an iconic Darren line. His egg says he thinks he's a dragon in human form.

That's why he's so, so rotten the puppet show. And Darren says, a pity he wasn't born a Fossaway. Then he'd think himself an apple. And we'd all be a deal same. Do you think that earlier Sir Stever? Ron accused Raymond of having milk in his veins, like sort of the like sort of milky veins of an apple. Was that another apple pun?

It's entirely possible. I don't think they're capable of having a conversation without Apple puns every couple of sentences. So I'd say it's more likely than not. Darren has dunk for a private word. Tells me dreamed of him. Dunk's like, I know you told me that when I saw you at the end. And Darren's like, I don't remember that. I've been in my cups.

I've been in my cups. But then he shares more details. My dreams are not like yours, he says. Mine come true. An impressive talent for an unimpressive man, another one of life's little ironies. Real Tyrion, life is full of these little ironies. Carlos, let's hear what Alst Darren says here.

I have seen you, sir, and a fire, and a dead dragon, a great beast, with wings so large they could cover this meadow. Did fall on on top of you, but you were alive and the dragon was dead. Did I kill it? Dunk asks, that I could not say. So this is like the spine-tangling good shit. This is what I'm talking about. This is the what the hell does this riddle prophecy mean sort of shit that I love from George R. Martin.

Yes. We will obviously talk about this more in the spoiler section later. But here it's another example of, okay, what does a character do when they say this thing? What does the character do when they hear this thing? What sort of mark does it leave on Dunk, on Darren, on anyone else who hears this eventually? But in general, Darren the drunken, Darren the dreamer, the burden of these dreams, the crushing weight of these things that he has seen. He's not the only one in Targaryen history. No, I mean, like.

To be so afflicted. So, like, Dany's the Dreamer who we brought up much to Chris's confusion on top of the throne. Great moment. Right. That she is like, this is the inciting incident. for the Targetians leaving to come over to Westeros is her dream. Right. And you'd be inclined to put stock in prophetic dreams anyway, but if a dream saved your family,

if you were the only dragon riding house that made it out of the doom because of a dream, you'd be believing your own hype a little bit with this stuff. I am no ordinary woman. My dreams come true. Like, this is a, this is a DeNaris line. We've got Mastor Eamon. We've got Rhaegar. like all of this stuff is really important.

But I would say of all the dreamers, we talk about Phasaurus. To Allison season, when we talked about this, right? What is the power of a dragon against the power of prophecy? But I think Helena is the character

that we should really look at when we think about like who has been broken by prophecy. Helena and her like sort of babbled riddles. And just sort of the way in which she's completely been addled by this, you know, when we see her room in House of the Dragon

and there's just sort of these drawings everywhere. She's just plagued by these dreams. And that's like a bit of a show invention for House of the Dragon, but it's a really, really good precursor to what is going on with Darren here. That you can't have all of this information in your head and not be broken by it in some way. Yeah, I love to like track the parallels and similarities across the targs and also the differences,

like who experiences these prophetic dreams and like Egon the Conqueror says, Song of Ice and Fire. Like every ruler in our family from here is going to heed the import of these words. I'm going to etch it on a dagger. It's going to be right there. You're just going to have to hold it over some flames.

Fine. Don't worry about it. And the professor is always welcome. And who is going to crumble under the weight? And also whose relationship inside of the Targaryian family to the idea of dragon dreams is going to morph over time. Like you mentioned Viseris and his complex relationship to these dreams, his aspiration, his desire, like, I so badly wanted it to be true, to be a dreamer myself, right?

Miscalculating, misinterpreting. You have something like Damon looking at his brother within derision. Dreams didn't make us kings, dragons did. But then our guy, Damon, gets around those. wherewood roots in season two and is like, I have a new relationship to this now. I've been to Burning Man. Yeah. Yeah.

Their drugs are different. Oh, my God. So good. I mentioned on Talk to Throat is that one of the things that Darren says in the stretch of the book when he's talking about the Kingsguard, how they had no choice, they're sworn to protect the lives of the king and the royal family. And my brothers and I are blood of the dragon. God's help us.

that gods help us I've just always loved. But I think one of the best lines is the Storm of Swords. Alistair Florent, shout out, Salis. That's her uncle. I can't believe I've mentioned Celis two out of the last three weeks. Insane, frankly, to Davos and a Storm of Sword says, no good has ever come of dreams of dragons. No good has ever come of dreams of dragons.

So there's some more stuff we'll talk about later. I just go completely fine with Celise. It's going to be fine. She does great. She does great. Right. Dunk leaves this exchange with Darren. And, you know, like you, he's always thinking of puppets. And so he makes his way. It's puppet time, baby. This is just, this is great. Have you ever, okay, first of all, what a thrill to be right.

I'll never forget the feeling on the trailer pod when I was like, whose head is that? And you're like, I think I know, but I'm not going to tell you until the pod. Yeah. And then the way that you broke out, I'm always thinking of puppets. I just never forget it. There was dunk. Growing up, I lived like two blocks from the library. And right in Old Mill Park there, there was the Movali Followers Festival. There was a puppet show there every year.

And I was just like obsessed with this puppet show. It was like just like a really, really good puppet show that I would like go to every year. Yeah. Love. There was something in Baltimore. called Pumpkin Theater, if I'm remembering correctly. It was like theater for young old pumpkins, young kiddos. And perhaps pumpkins were also about in the production.

I can't remember. My grandma would take me to pumpkin theater. I think that's what it was called. And puppets were in my memory, perhaps apocryphal, but I think often involved. Very special. Puppets rule. And so I do want to talk about this for a second, right? Yes, please.

We hear the You Are No Night, You Are Florey in the Fool, that line, right? Zooky from the on the girl. Well, she's not dead, so not from beyond the grave. I will say she's one of our only female characters who ever talks. So it's the only way we get a cut to red and we get a cut to, you know, Gwyn. But not a lot of women are talking in this episode of television. Let's just say it, even with the horses. Couldn't have said, oh, lads, if sweet.

But it's still been there. So we have a woman talking about a man from a previous episode. in this episode. But anyway, I said this on industry, and it's true here too. Everyone has a hard on for Hamlet. So, like, we get this moment. Or Dunk is holding the floor in the full head, which is, like, very Hamlet, grave digger scene. Alas, poor York, I knew him, Horatio. And I think, alas, poor York, I knew him a ratio, a fellow of infinite jest of most excellent fancy, he hath Bored me on his back a thousand times. And now how abhorred in my imagination it is, my gorge rims at it here hung those lips that I have kissed. I know not all. How oft. Where be your jibes

now? Your gambols, your songs, your flashes of merriment. There were wont to set the table on a roar. Not one now to mock your own grinning. Quite chap fallen. So like I think that moment of like, thinking about your own mortality as you stare at the skull of something. thing, you know, which is what Hamlin is doing here. But like very specifically this idea of the fool, the head of a fool, right? York was the court jester. And so thinking about how alive York was, how, like, you know, David Fosterwall is like infinite jest. You say, I'll write that down. But like, how alive, how full of laughter and spirit and just like more brimming with life. Yes. Than most people they ever met. And now it's just a grinning skull that he's holding.

And this is, you know, food for worms is where we're all headed. Right. And so this idea of like, dunk on the verge of this very scary thing he has to do, where he can't think of a way forward where he doesn't surely die. Regarding his own mortality. And then regarding this head of this fool, but also this, am I the fool, right? Is every night a fool, am I the fool sort of thing? Right.

We talked about this last week, this idea of like, just the very idea of being a knight is to be foolish, to, and I think I forgot to say, but meant to say, Don Quixote, because, like, that is the epitome of, like, the foolish idea of knighthood, tilting at windmills. Like, to fancy yourself chivalric in this cruel world is a foolish endeavor in the history of literature, of global literature. And so, like, Don Quixote and his squire, Sanjo Panza, on donkeys, which Dunkin' earlier in this episode, but just sort of like that idea of like, am I, was I a fool to even get

involved in this? Am I a fool to think that there is justice in this world or there are ideals in this world? And do I have to do all of this while facing the idea of my own mortality at this young age of 30 something? But in the book, it's a teenager, you know? So like, I learned that there's no justice in the world, not unless you make it. It's, it's very true. It's very true. But like what I think is interesting is we've been constantly thinking about our babe, Brian of Tarth, right? She was worried about this too, right? She has this line in a Clash of Kings. The Fool He Promised Me is Like to be my own reflection in a pond.

You know what I mean? Like Brian was not immune from this worry of like, am I a fool inside of all of this? And then also like what will the history books remember of us? Right. There is this great line in a Clash of Kings when she's talking to Catlin about, this is Tales Grow and the Telling. Yes, for sure. Yeah.

Winter will never come for the likes of us. Should we die in battle, they will surely sing of us. And it's always summer in the songs. In the songs, all nights are gallant, all maids are beautiful, and the sun is always shining. This idea of just sort of like, they won't tell the truth of us. They won't say who I, Breanne am, a, by her own definition, ugly woman, or not really actually a night but a night. And what stories being woven around dunk inside of this very moment we find him in history. He has found himself at the center of a historic trial by seven featuring several members of the royal household and a couple of fossil ways, not to mention a Beesbury.

Just a wild come up for the Fasoids here. And like, not to a minute. Don't worry. No one will be mentioning the beast praise. What Alice with Three Fingers-esque song are they going to make about this one? Exactly. You know? It's gorgeous.

I love all of that. A donkey will be entering the chat at some point in the future, just on the donkey front. So that's exciting to look forward to. We won't spoil the specifics. Something I think about. When you're reading that Bram passage, like the glamour and the sheen, It makes me think of in season one, Robert, you know, wanting to share war stories and talk with Jamie, talking with Barrison. Like, they never tell you how they shit themselves.

Like, they don't put that in the songs. Ira Parker's like, I put it in the show. He's like, I'm going to put it in every episode. We're going to have diary on the first. And episode two is going to open with the piss. And then in episode three, a horse is going to take a very prominent shit. And then episode four in the most moving and meaningful stretch, the brute of bracken is going to let one rip. A real juicy one.

We are kind of a rhino. I feel like he probably had to like change after that. Swaps some small clothes. The Bruttebracken, he probably doesn't care. He's the Bruttebracken. All right. So here's one of your several MVP Steely Pate. Here he is.

I fucking love him. This is a great scene. He would have thoughts on all of this. He would be like, I'm about to tell you about these, the beautiful summer leaves, you know? Let me tell you like, okay. Death everywhere or no, what makes a fool of fool? The trees are green. Don't worry about it.

He's the best. I just love this guy. I would watch a Steely Spathe spin off and I would do it happily. I really want. I really want. Pulls dunk out of this puppet haze. We get this. That's the cut you mentioned earlier from the Tansel screams to the crunch. It's interesting. So like he's exactly as he's described in the book when he shows up in his like and is basically like his mackintosh with the, you know, his rain slicker with with a lantern. Yeah. Very invocative of. of the seven. Like, this is, this is a very godly sort of, uh,

look for him. Yeah. Also makes you think of Percy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Another legend.

Uh, dunk again, this is where I asked after Tansell and Steli Pate says, she and her uncle left for, for Dorn. Uh, shows dunk the shield, pulls it down and explains before we get to the, uh, response that Dunk has to seeing the sigil to seeing his device. He explains that he has.

reinforced the shield. A little bit of the Sir Arlen. Rim twice as thick. It's heavier but it's stronger. Heavier but it's stronger. I love that so much. It made me think about like the truth that Duncan is carrying

about the world now. Like isn't his life so much heavier than it was just like a week ago but isn't he stronger for it? Yeah. I love that. Dunk looks at the painting. He looks at the sigil. And it should be

this. And it's beautiful, we should say. It's gorgeous. Great word from Tintzel crushed it, honestly. She was right. In terms of graphic design is her passion, she took the prompt and executed it completely, and he is like the classic sending notes back being like, looks like death, actually. And she's like, I gave you exactly

what you asked for, precisely. He's like, great, I have some notes. Can we change everything? Oh my God. She's like, no, I fucked off to dorm. Bye. Sorry, I'm not around. First draft is the only draft. He's going through it, though. This should be this great, not like, a moment of, like, joy, but a declaration of an arrival, right? Okay, it was born out of necessity like so many things are for Dunk.

You must, you know, needs a sigil of your own, as Baylor told him, a device of your own in episode two. But instead here, it is a lament. It's another lament because he looks at this and he's forlorn. The star is fallen and the sunset herald's night. The shield is all painted up like death. And so all of these things, the Baylor guiding him to needing to do this, Arlen and the sunset, egg and the,

the idea of the Elm, Tanzal painting it, all of those things that we talk about, these different strands of the people who have influenced his life all being present here.

The naming. Instead of it being something to celebrate, it's something to worry over. It's one more thing that has been warped for Dunk in this moment. And Steely Pete comes through

and is like, my dude, the elms alive, man. See how green the leaves are. That's summer leaves for certain. We just shared a beautiful quote where summers evoked nights of summer.

Spring, A dream of spring. This is like the idea of the new dawn, the bloom, life, and possibility in Thrones. The next thing that Steeley Pate says in the text, though, is he says, coming this winter. Spring is coming this winter. This winter. And everybody will understand what that means. So don't worry about it.

Don't worry about the shield and don't worry about that log line. I've seen shields blazoned with skulls, he says, and wolves and ravens. Frankly, wolves and ravens, that sounds awesome and very much my shit. Yes. Even hanged men and bloody heads, they served well enough, and so will this. This is like borderline clear eyes full hearts, can't lose. It's amazing. And then I have a note.

Tell me, what's the note? Because I would say, Okinair guard me well and making Dunk fill in or else I'm dead and doomed to hell. He was really reading into the think about the Okan Iron part. It's really, it's real. It's real, it's real Eragorn before the Battle of Homes Deep when he shouts at Legolas, then I will die with him with them. And all the men around him are like, Who are?

You would? You're going to do what? With whom? Or else I'm dead and doomed to hell. And Dunk's like, is this helping? It is a great. It was fun to hear it. It's like, it was really good.

It was really, really good. But Dunk's like, or else I'm dead and doomed to help? Listen, even Coach Taylor had some things to learn. A lot. So this is where Dunk is crying. He dries his eyes. Ask what do you have a steely pate. And Joanna, what is,

steely, bait, legend, icon, Prince Among Men. For you? Tell him. A copper. A fucking copper. This guy, a couple episodes ago, was like 800. Okay, you've got some armor. Because I'm warming to you, 600.

This is so telling. This is so indicative. It's a champion of the people. I love that. So, like, you're about to hit a quote that I actually can't believe was cut out, and I have to wonder if it's going to be in one of the later episodes. Shocked to me. I was trying to think of the last time.

I was like, how could a line like this not have made it from page to screen? And I was thinking of like Percy and decided. I do have an idea, right? Okay, I will, I'll read it. Yeah. So many come to see me die. I thought dunk bitterly, but he wronged them. A few step further on, a woman called out, good fortune to you.

So this is him approaching the attorney field and basically all the small folk are, and I will get to this actually a little later on with like a theory that I read, but like all the small folk are coming up and sort of like wishing him well. Yes. Right. An old man stepped up to take his hand and said, may the guy. God's give you strength, sir. Then a begging brother and a tattered brown robe set a blessing on a sword and a maid kiss his cheek. They are for me.

Why? Why? He asked Pate. What am I to them? And Steeley Pate says, a knight who remembered his vows. A knight who remembered his vows. So here's a theory, an unfortunate theory I have. Oh, no.

In the, like, nighting, the really cool nighting month that we all love, the edit of. Yes. Raymond being knighted by Lionel. And then we see Duncan kneeling and looking up and Sir Arlen, looking down at him. I love when, I love in film and television when people look at each other from across time. Like, I just think it's really good. Dunk is in his armor at that point.

Yeah. There is a shot that was in nearly every single trailer of Steely Pate Arming Dunk, a month, like, you know, like throwing the tabard over his shoulder, which certainly little egg was not doing. So almost certainly Steely Pate Arming Dunk, which we did not get to see. And is described in detail in the novella, the armoring stretch, how Dunk is like becoming the steel. So that was cut. Yeah. So I wonder if that was part of that moment that he said it then. And like in the interest of like making this very like, like, I told you I cried. Like this very cool sequence of like what if we edit it all together

and it all just like becomes this sort of montage moment. Yeah. This this also goes to like in terms of like we would happily welcome all of these episodes to be a bit longer. Happily. A lot of people I saw on Reddit were saying that they thought that. that our guy, Humphrey Beesbury, like, Ira at the New York Comic-Con at the New York, at New York, at New York Comic-Con said that there was a character who had like 10 minutes of screen time across all the episodes and they were basically all cut out. And so a lot of people were like, was that Lime and Beesbury, did he have something to do in the tent where we saw him dancing? And like, did he just like have a few moments and they just like basically cut it all out? And Ira was like, it's a shame. It was a great performance, like, blah, blah. But we basically cut this entire character. down to nothing. And so, like, in terms of, like, tightening up around just getting to the end of this episode, yeah. Lime and Beesbury might have been part of it and this line might have been part of it. Or it's going to come up in next week's, like at the beginning of next week's episode or somehow, you know, you know, mostly because that is a, the facts are compelling. The evidence.

And I remember his vows is like, it's iconic. It is genuinely. We overuse that word, but in this case it's true. But it's like genuinely iconic. My hope is that it is not cut despite the very compelling case you just made and is merely on hold because as we talked about with Chris, I talked to Thrones, there is a tweak in terms of just the crowd as Dunk initially finds it. So they're not all like cheering for him right away. He goes out to silence. And so maybe we are building toward this moment.

Though, frankly, it would be more about like Baylor or Hylandman and Donk. Yeah. Like when Aryan side comes out. And Mika and all of them. And the crowd's like, yay, dad, right? And then they're like, and then Baylor comes out. They're like, yeah. So, you know.

And like you said earlier, they're like, we're here for history. But the way in which that quote matters so much to go back to that. line you loved earlier in the season when St. Leapate's like, oh, yeah, and everyone else here is come here to cheer you on. Yeah, sure you on, yeah. Like literally yes. I know. So, yeah. I know. It's a hot bummer. And I mean, this just connects a night who remembered his vows. I wonder if they felt like it would be inside of the episode, like, we're getting it from Baylor at the end with what he says when Maker's like, what the fuck are you doing? He's like, well, this guy is a night who remembered his mouth. There's a night who remembered his

else. Like, we kind of get it, but it is, there's something about, especially because of the small folk orientation and rooting of the story, like, there's something about hearing it from Steeley Pate that is, it's always felt so perfect. I agree. Oh, God. All right. Well, they better put that in. I love this show. They better put that in. Ira, it's not too late. Put it in. It's not in. Put it in. It's definitely too late. God damn it. Dunk meets aside. Shout out Sir Humphrey Harding, who's strapped into his This is incredible shit. Right.

And a fun fact. That's Arian's horse he's on. That's right. That's right. And Arian was thrilled and totally happy to hand it over. It's just compensation. Sorry I ruined your life. Killed your horse and smashed your legs.

Shut up like a baking dish. Here's my horse. So we're going to go through everybody who is here when Dunk arrives and sees Sir Humphrey Harding, Sir Humphrey Beesbury, Sir Robin Reesling. I can't say her icling. Sorry. And Sir Lionel. Barathean.

very quickly just who they are reminding if we need to, and then like what their motivations are. Because an interesting thing, as Dunk said to Stefan. Yeah, they all say it, except for Humphrey Peace Break. It is weird that he wasn't like, and he's my brother-in-law. And the septus say we have to love our brother-in-law. Could he just have that? The Battle of Humphrey, everyone is still talking about it.

So we got to like give him an encore here. What their motivations are? Because when Dunk said to Stefan, that's so Stamphron? the Dragon House is not going to appreciate this opposition. Like, how many of these characters have cover from that or are worried about that is just sort of like an interesting thing to think about? Like, this is a bold thing to declare for the side against Aryan, Mayakar, Darren, and the Kingscar. They don't know when they're standing here for Dunk that Baylor is going to write in. Right, but like Robin Misenings is like, guess what? I'm cuckoo bananas, so who cares, right?

And then the Humphreys are like, listen, is anyone going to begrudge us going up against Aryan when he did this shit to us? And then Lionel Barathean's like, I have the second biggest dick in the kingdom. That's right. And I'm going to probably sing you a song about it at some point. But I have the second big. Have you seen how big my antlers are? Very huge. Though does that mean he has a tiny dick?

Probably. It's compensating. He is compensating for something. His dick is probably bad. Oh, man. So Humphreyhearting, yeah, he's got the personal motivation. The debt is Arients, he says, and we mean to collect it. So a little bit of like, yeah, you're going against the crown here before bailor rides out.

But also like, I've got the cover of this is my personal vendetta. and this guy took something for me and I get to try to take it back. And Beesbury's like, ditto. Bysbury's like, same. Ditto but in law. Ditto but in law. So Robin, we did get a scene with.

We actually, I think it's like interesting that we got to have a scene with him but not Beesbury. I think you must be right about the cut material. It doesn't really make sense otherwise. Release the Beesbury cut, release the Steely Pate cut,

release AGO on going to recruit the troops. That would be great. I would watch it all. I would watch it all. There's probably some extra stuff with red and daisy and bayony that would watch. Why not?

More women talking? More women talking? Who wants that? Robin, of course, we saw him interact with egg and thunder at the beginning of episode three. So what he says here

is Sir Robin would die the king's faithful servant. But when the crown goes against the gods, Sir Robin goes against the crown. Very much like a man has to have his code. He's got his own code. Here's the deal.

Tell me. If I'm doing a trial, by seven ever in my life. Yeah. I won't make you fun on my side, don't worry. You won't have to make me. I'll do it gladly. Come on.

Yeah, but. What? Yeah, but what? You're too precious to me and I don't want you on the front line. I would be fierce out there. I would be fierce. She is tiny, but she is fierce. I would be fierce.

You were. You would be. I need someone who speaks in the third person on my side. And this is what Robin brings. Well, you have all those other spots. Carlos can do that. No, no, but I'm just saying that's my main point. Whether or not you're on my team, I guess you are on my team and you're very fierce.

That's great. That's great. I want someone who's cuckoo-upina is enough to speak about themselves in the third person. I think you really want that berserker energy on your side. I agree. It's nice that we got time with Robin in episode three, but particularly useful that we got to, like, get the established. Oh, he's mad enough to make a choice like this. There for the warrior, of course.

I like the, like when the crown goes against the gods, again, seven, playing so many different roles here, the warrior, part of the seven. But like this idea that the horror of what Arian has done is undeniable. Undeniable. And so he can invoke trial of seven. They can invoke the andal tradition, the gods, if there are seven, more likely to have a just ruling. But then somebody likes to Robin, who has forged this whole identity around wrapping himself up in the idea of justice and righteousness and religious fanaticism is going to be like, you know, actually you guys have that backwards. This is like a befalment. Great stuff.

And then Lionel. One of the strokes of genius of the season to give us more time with him. Really bears fruit here. Just makes it make more sense in so many ways. He and Dunk have a relationship. Could be. Okay. Could be.

Are you already thinking about the rose gold armor? You can't wait to talk about it. I do think that armor look great. I do. I do. Is he a fool? Yeah. But all that are nights and all that are fools for armor is concerned.

I think we know that by now. I was thinking about with Lionel being here. He's got his own reasons, this we'll go through. But what Dunk said about Arlen earlier in the season to Egg at the end of episode two, he's like he was a hard man to know. And just the fact that Dunk is out there, like having these moments with Lionel and bonding, and like he's not a hard man to know. Like he is allowing someone like Lionel to get to know him.

And that matters. Arlen had no enemies. But as we've talked about, did he have friends? Nobody remembered his name other than Baylor. That's just not going to be the case with Dunk. Everyone's going to remember Sir Duncan the Tall and the attorney to Ashroom Meadow. We already talked a little bit about this earlier. Anything else you want to say about Lionel and his relationship to legacy and how that's driving him?

No, I want to talk about the Rose Gold Armor. Well, you know, inside within every man there are many men and on many men there are many notable plates of armor. Do you think Lionel Barthian has had many men inside of him? No question. When Lionel and Dunk were dancing and sharing good cheer at the beginning of the season, what I saw personally was He did Rivalry Season 2. Yeah. I'm here for it.

I've literally seen that edit. I bet. Yeah. I don't really get edits unless you send them to me and you're not on TikTok anymore. So I'll send you. I'll need to get that in my reals. I'll send you Lionel. My Reels Algo.

Lionel and Dunk dancing to tattoo. I guarantee you it exists. Fantastic stuff. He is, of course, the character who utters, who the fuck is Sir Stevron? Yeah. We already loved Lionel, but if we hadn't already loved him,

this would be the moment that forever enshrined him in our hearts because that is just absolutely wonderful. And then, you know, Ag is like, because Raymond got the Humphreys, but Ag got Lionel, got Robin. And it's like, I could, if I wanted opening note that we talked about with Egg earlier, the, that's like smart-ass,

insolence, this is a titanic declaration of genuine allegiance. It is follow-through of the highest order. We're mostly talking today about Dunk, Baylor, Raymond. We cannot talk enough about egg and what he has chosen to do here. Yeah. It's amazing.

Sir Staphron. He flips, Joe. He turns heel. Dunk walks into the arena. The crowd is still. Tension in the air. Mr. Policeman.

And I gave you all the clues. Truly. Raymond's his entire time's like, my cousin's underhanded. My cousin sucks. My cousin sucks so bad. He likes to go up against wounded people. Constantly telling me I'm not ripe.

Called you a cunt. Literally the second he saw you. Mocked your hedges. Huge surprise. He flipped. Yeah, but this is such fuckery because Stevvron's showing up. at the last second

And saying, oh, actually you're going to need someone else Because I'm for Aryan. And like, so he has fucked Duncan so badly here because... And he's not trying to hide it. No, but he's just like the last... He's like, oh, sorry. Not only am I not fighting with you,

but now you're a man down. And if you're a man down... You can't do it. You can't even do it at all. I've lost. They're going to make me a lord though, so don't worry about it. Really wanted that lordship.

Really wanted that lordship. Um, told Sir Duncan to rely on you. That's what I'm saying. It's like, it's very foxy. It is. Yeah. It absolutely is. It's just incredible stuff from Raymond here.

This is an incredible Raymond run. I think that Sir Stephan's saying, you told Duncan to, to, you told Sir Duncan to rely on you as you've written here in his notes. Yeah. Versus you told him to rely on you, which is what it's written about. He definitely says, yeah, in the show. Oh, 100%. Very notable. Yeah.

That's great. I fight with Prince Aryan in the show. the accusers, like the kind of like chill that seeps into your heart and your bones when you hear that, George. This is vintage, George. But, like, you're just on a whirly gig of emotions here at the end of the episode, right? Because it's like, Sir, Stap, like, Lionel's there and the Humphreys there and Rizings there, great. And then Stefan's like, I'm for Prince Aryan.

And then Raymond's like, knight me right now. I'm going to fight with you. And then they're like, you're still one now. And then here comes Baylor. And then the bird of bracken parts. And then here comes right. It is. It's great. And then the Thrones theme plays. It's the best. Raymond being so beside himself here. The fact that Stefan has no shame, right?

He's just like, my self-interest is apparent. Why would I feel bad about this? I have no problem telling you that this is the thing I'm going to do. You told Sir Duncan to her line you. You traded your honor for a lordship the way that he spits on the ground. Raymond slams the helmet into him. Get him yourself about his horse named his horse named Roth. But in the book, there's this extra degree of like cavalier.

I don't even remember. than I said this to him, which is so fucking galling and insulting. You told him to rely on you, Raymond had gone pale. Did I? He took the helm from his cousin's hands. No doubt I was sincere at the time. Fuck this guy. Fuck this guy. And his really stupid armor. I think the armor looks great. Is it practical? We'll find out. But I think it looks great. Guard your tongue, Raymond, he says in the books. We're both apples from the same tree. And you are my squire. Or have you forgotten your bows. No, Raymond says. Have you forgotten yours? You swore to be a night. So another one of those lines and ideas. Oh my God. It's just so, so, so good. This novella in the show is so, so, so

good. Dunk forced to see in when this happens with Stefan, another moment, another scale falling from the eye moment were like, okay, nobody remembered Arlen. They wouldn't let me enter the list. is Dunknana ginger? He's like a strawberry blonde. Whereas I would say Manfred Dundarian and Sir Steveran are classic ginger.

It's funny because in the novella one of the people who he direct It's a little bit different when he makes this big speech He's making direct appeals to people as we'll talk about And Manfred is one of them And it's like the show had done too much work

On the Manfred Dendarian front That's not even try It's not even worry about it Oh man but it's like yeah He's got to confront How little honor means to most except for my guy. Is that squat?

I think you mean Sir Mavon Fossaway. Oh my God. This is the best. Night me, I will take my cousins. This is so hot. So good. Yeah, it is. And this is our number one, I would say,

evidence that Sir Duncan has not been knighted. Because it is clear in the book than it is in the show here that the reason he hesitates to Knight Raymond is that any knight can make a night and he's like, uh, I'm at a night and I'm willing to, uh, and I'm willing to lie about myself. Right, but I can't pass on to Rain. But now I'm going to like pyramid scheme this whole thing and the one which, what night is Raymond going to make it? It's just going to be bullshit nights all the way down, you know? So like, not the coaching tree that Doug wants. No, no. Oh my God. So he's like, uh, uh, uh, and then in both cases, the horn blows and Lionel's like, get out of here. I'll do it. I got it, man.

I got it. I got it. But I love that, like, Lionel's watching the whole thing happen with Stefan. Yeah. And so he, like, sort of wanders over. You know, it's like, yeah. So he's like, Paul. Yeah. So he just, like, wanders over.

He's like, I'll do it. And then, like, when he does it. Yeah. Sorry, I know I'm getting ahead. But, like, when he does it, Daniel Ling's has been so good as Lime and Barthian in, like, this whole season. But he's like a clown in his own right, you know? And then it's so serious.

Yeah. It takes a really. Yeah. That's a secret thing. good as lying about. And the difference between, like, Lionel taking it so seriously and being so sort of like honorable, dramatic about it.

And then Arlenz, Arlen just being like, The shrug. Incredible stuff. We're going to see that shrug in a second here. I can't wait. In terms of what Raymond is doing, now, you noted, this is a moment of consequence in history. So there's a part of this where it's like, I want to be a night. This would be pretty cool. But, like, let's

be clear, as we've already noted, likely to be a bloodbath. Guess who we heard that from this episode? Raymond. Like the stakes are clear. The prospect of something terrible happening to you is clear. He is swearing off a member of his own family, the senior branch of the apple tree

as we hear time and time again, this could not be braver. Like what Raymond is doing, it is one of the best examples and encapsulations of, loyalty, right? Because part of what he finds so galling and offensive and what Stefan is done is like, you gave him your word.

Does that mean nothing? Loyalty, which is, of course, a form of honor. So there's honor just in abundance. It is losing off Raymond here. Like, what Baylor does at the end of this episode, during which I cried, is a massive deal because this is, you know, this is heir to the throne. He's going against his own family, like, all those are stuff.

But, like, as we talk about levels of privilege, squire Raymond Fossaway. from the lesser branch of the Fossaway family tree being like, I'll do it. You know? Right. Like, that's like Frodo being like, I'll carry the ring. You know what I mean? It's just sort of like, though I do not know the way.

You know, Raymond has no armor. Small hands do it because they must. He's not a knight and he's just sort of like, I'll do it. And his exposure is so much higher than Baylor's exposure, even though like Baylor is quite exposed his hand at the king. King and Air to the Iron Throne, but, like, he's a seasoned warrior. The hammer. Incredible. Breaks fighter.

This is a huge, huge advantage for Duncan's team that Baylor is joining the team here. Like, this is just massive. Raymond's like, I did my best. I'll do my best, I guess. And we've seen him fight against Stefan at the beginning of the season. It didn't go well for him. Did not do great. So, you know, it's just such a moment.

Yeah, it's got it here. It really is. I read this line on Talk to Thrones, but there's a moment. This is from slightly earlier in the novella, but when Dunk makes out the curve of the Fossoy apple in the distance. And the line is, it looked like hope. It looked like hope. That's what Raymond is giving him here. It's just the best.

So Raymond Niels. Dunk reaches for a sword and he hesitates, as you noted, as we talked about with Chris on Sunday or Friday, whatever fucking day that was. What is time? Readers have spent years some debating, mostly believing, as we've talked about a lot already today that Dunk was not knighted.

We did get an email from a listener being like, it had literally never occurred to me before you guys were talking about in the pod. So like there are some people who read, you know, whatever. There are a number of different nuggets we already shared the monstrous lie line, which is a really big data point that we and other people point to.

But as you noted, this scene. There's also like the burning of the red years when it's like Who nighted you? What's going on? Et cetera. This scene is a really big one.

That was true in the novella, but it is ratcheted up here by incorporating that cut to Sir Arlen. Carlos, can we see the shrug? Watch this pot on your video app. Spotify. So good.

Is it full confirmation? No, but is it certainly a big indication? Yes. I thought that that was a fascinating choice to include that, both for what it tells us, but also because it means it's on Dunk's mind. We got an email from a listener, Lauren, about sort of like why some of the many reasons why Sir Arlen wouldn't knight Sir Dunk.

We just called him Sir Dunk because that's who he is in my heart. Anyway, why do you think Arlen did not knight Duncan? I mean, I guess my assumption just based on a moment like that, the shrug being in is that the show intends to answer that for us at some point. Like I would, I am, because again, it is not, it's not definitively confirmed at this point in the text, even though there's a lot of evidence. And we do know, skip ahead, if you don't want any trailer spoilers, I guess, skip ahead is like, there will be flash, more flashbacks than we've seen. It's something we know from the trailer. So, will we get more information on this? Right. Concretely. And so, you know,

I guess there are a number of possibilities is it, I, I think that we have, have gotten enough moments in the story and certainly in the show where Dunk is forced to kind of confront the less savory aspects of how Arlen treated him and the way that he behaved, that there could be a kind of lack of care that's possible. I think it could be that he intended to one day and just didn't. And then he died. Didn't mean to die from a cut. Didn't mean to die. I mean to die. I mean, he was just fucking up a storm until the last second. They were laughing, huddled in the rain with their hard salt beef and then he dropped dead. And don't get to bury him in a very shallow grave.

Very shallow grave. Do you have a theory for what the reason is most likely to be? I don't have a good theory, but I really do believe that he meant to eventually. Like, he's training him. Like, I do think he meant to eventually. I think there could be a real, there could be an intention and a lesson in like a, almost the thing that fans have latched onto and that we talk about a lot of like, well, does it matter? Isn't one of the key lessons of the story that the thing that matters more is,

the choice that you make, the way that you live your life. And that maybe that was something Arlen was trying to actually teach him by withholding that. He doesn't seem that deep to me, but like I also think that like, yeah, great point. I also think I understand what you're saying. I got the joke. Talking about it's a giant dick. Oh. Do you want to do the hand gesture again?

No, that's not. Uh, okay. So I think, I think this story is different if Dunk is. 17. Yeah. Yes. And it's like Arlen meant to make him a night maybe when he turned 18 or something like that. But like, you know, he's 30 something. And it's like, he spent a lot of timing. Like, I've got to get you. You got to, you got to sheet that sword. You got to dip that quill. Got to take you to a brothel so that you can fuck. But we're going to wait. We're going to hold off. I'm going to take a hard left turn from the sixth grade boy alley that you found yourself in. I mean, of all the shows where it's completely appropriate. true. All right. Our listener, Mikhail, wrote this great email, which I thought was so beautiful. While Dunk may not be slash definitely isn't officially a knight. The way the episode framed Lionel's knighting of Raymond read to me like the show offering our guy a kind of spiritual dubbing, the slow motion, the voiceover, the shots of Dunk handling thunder like a boss, and then from

above as if he's kneeling in front of the viewer, all seemed deliberate, formal, and most importantly transformative. Dunk has already been through a night of vigil and contemplation, albeit not in the traditional sense. Now in simple armor and stained tabard, the words of the absent oath wash over him and he takes on his new form. He becomes Sir Duncan, who doesn't just fight for justice

and honor with instinct and bare fist, but a man who can take the field of battle, stand up to a formal challenge, and offer an even greater one in return. And so just for people who don't know all the ins and outs of becoming a knight, when you're a squire to become a knight, in many versions of this,

you spend the night before you're dubbing in a chapel. This is like the night's vigil. So this idea of like dunk sleepless night in a jail cell is his night's vigil before this official dubbing. I just thought it was really beautiful. And like the show is definitely like, if not literally this. You know, just having him kneel there while Raymond is kneeling

and Lionel is saying the words is, you know. No question. In hand in hand with all those moments that Baylor says, rise their dunk in, you know. Yeah, I love that email. I love your, your observation earlier of tracking the little nightings along the way. I think it's possible that at some point, again, to be clear, we don't know, genuinely don't know if this will happen, because this is not confirmed either way in the canon yet. I think it's possible at some point that Dunk is like formally knighted and that that could be a very meaningful moment. Do you think later he's like,

and can you just do this and don't tell anyone? Maybe. I mean, it's possible. Like, You know, it's interesting, again, Brianna is always on our minds. Can a prince make a night? Can a nine-year-old and a... Can any royal make a night? I actually don't know the answer to that. A king can make a night. Yeah, a king can make a night.

But can a prince make a night. It's call up Darren the second. Okay. He's got time because he didn't come to Ashtra Meadow. Everyone else is very busy. It's true. Everyone else is very busy. But, you know, we've talked about this many times on many pods in the past.

We will talk about it in the future. One of our shared favorite moments. And it's obviously on our mind here when Lionel says, any night can make a night is Jamie and I, we love it. Season 8 episode 2, just... I think of it daily. Life altering truly. And so we want to be clear, we would not lose that moment for anything. It is precious to us and sacred to us. But, however, Brianne was a night before that. She was in all of her actions

and the things that she did. And so I kind of like the idea of like eventually dunk getting a in a kind of parallel, a formal moment that would be meaningful to him and would be beautiful, especially if he shared it with certain people who meant that much to him. But also that he would know and we would know, yeah, like thunder there, nodding along, that he was a night well before the tip of that sword touched his shoulder. Raymond, I should not. Do you doubt my courage? No, no, not that, but still, when he leaves, he's feeling as relieved as he was guilty. On and on the evidence goes, well, we'll keep talking about this as we as we cover future episodes and seasons. But Lionel's like, don't worry,

I got you. Everything that happens here for Raymond is great. Being knighted by the laughing storm is just all-time shit. Sick. Fucking awesome. That's amazing. With respect to tongue in this moment right here, this is like, Raymond's got to be like, this is pretty cool. Sir Steveron wishes. No doubt. Sir Steveron wishes. He's like, yeah, I know the laughing storm, do you? That is such a great thing for Raymond to be able to brag about to Steveron. The laughing storm doesn't know who the fuck you are, except that you're an embarrassment in a turnbook.

And he knighted me. He knighted me. We got chills watching this. The tonal shift from Lionel, as you noted, the slowing of the rhythm of the scene, the shift in the camera angles, the incorporation of Duncan Arlen with Lionel and Raymond.

We have to see it. In the name of the warrior, I charge you to be brave. In the name of the father, I charge you to be just. In the name of the mother, I charge you to protect. to the young and innocent.

This is so good. Will you ever hear or see this in your mind when you think about a knighting? Or will it always be Jamie and Brianna first? It's Jamie and Brian first. But this second. The second. And who knows what time will tell?

Also, I should mention, you know, like, we've mentioned a few times the way the Thrones' theme kicks in at the end. But that score, haunting and beautiful. Really, really good. Can we return to the seventh theory? Let's do it.

Okay, we got a bunch of emails for people. So to recap in case you didn't listen to last weeks. This is animated the bad babies. It has. Love it. They love a theory. If you, they know to hold it loosely, but they love a theory. If you were not here for the three and a half hours we spent talking about this show last week, this is a theory I picked up from a comment somewhere about this idea that like the seven are present here at the tourney. And and helping dunk along the way, much the way that like Athena disguises herself for Odysseus and sort of helps journey along the way. She shows up in many different forms inside of The Odyssey, which we will talk about soon. This year on this podcast.

Our listener Mikhail wrote in, I'm not going to say all of the ways in which they mapped, but casting Baylor as the mother, I thought was like a really interesting connection. Sir Lionel is the father. A lot of people think Sir Robin Riesling is the warrior, so does Sir Robin. But this is the kicker of this email. Duncan is the maiden, is Duncan, our canonical version. perhaps. Isaiah wondered, could Darren be the stranger? Outcast, wanderer, and related to death in the sense that his dreams predict or, you know, in that way, deliver death, which I really liked. John Michael, Jean-Michel said Sir Arlen is the father, potentially.

Certainly not the maid. Sean says, The Stranger is Steely Pate. My man sent dunk to joust and now face trial by combat without. a breastplate after talking all that trash on everyone else's over-decorating, but at least existing full-plate armor, dude should have to partake in the trial of seven for attempted murder. Listen, he spent a lot of time being like, mine'll serve you better if you take a lance to the face,

less time talking about what would happen if you took any sort of sharp object to the torso. It's just ringmail right here, okay? But it's double chain, so. Hannah said, do you think we're not learning anything about Sir Humphrey Beesbury because he's representing the stranger and dunk seven. Sure, let's go with that as the reason why. And then Amber said, fellow witches, you'll always get it for me if you say fellow witches.

Amber wrote the mother, I thought it's the prostitute, the one that told them to be kind to dunk. The look on her faces, Bailor wrote in, I believe made me think maternal vibes. I did like that we got a cut to red because especially on the precipice of the trial of seven and this really dire circumstance,

remembering that she was like, be kind to your body. Yeah. You've only got one. All right. And then this is the blessing of the seven theory, which is an older theory off of Reddit from Onaris Dracontos. Sure. I did my best, and it wasn't very good. VR listener of Vivian.

And this is not that characters, but that sequence that we were talking about that leads up to Steely Pate saying like all the people who come to greet Duncan on the way in the small folk on the way to the tourney field. Yeah. So this is what this theory reads. The Smith. The first aspect of the seven who are one to have blessed Dunk is the smith, an allegory of work and creativity he is represented in Steely Pate, indeed, a blacksmith who, quote, blesses Dunk by fixing his shield in exchange for symbolic payment, a copper penny. To emphasize the idea, Pete accompanies Dunk to the camp of the trial and calls him a true knight, or more precisely, quote, a knight who remembered his vows. The mother. On his way to the side of the trial, dunk crosses paths with a series of people who wish him well in the fight. quote, a few steps farther on,

a woman called out good fortune to you. End quote. The three female aspects of the Andal God are the mother, the virgin, and the crone. Since the woman is described as neither young nor old, the most likely hypothesis is that this bringer of good fortune represents the mother, an allegory of love and mercy. The crone.

After the woman, an old man approaches dunk, who invokes divine strength. Quote, an old man stepped up to take his hand and said, may the gods give you strength, sir, end quote. Despite being a man and not a woman, the fact that George R. Martin emphasized the character seniority suggests that he represents the crone, an allegory of the wisdom that should guide the faithful. However, it should be noted that even Sili-Pate is partially associated with

his aspect since he has previously described holding a lantern one of the cron's features. Right. The warrior. After the old man, Dunk meets a begging brother, a humble member of the faith clergy who blesses his sword, quote, that a begging brother in a tattered brown robe set a blessing on his sword, end quote. The focus on Dunk's weapon suggests that the character represents the warrior an allegory of courage and strength and battle. The maiden. After the begging brother, Dunk receives a kiss from a young girl, quote, and a maid kissed his cheek.

She evidently represents the maiden in allegory of innocence and chastity. The father. Dunk manages to find five allies. Raymond Fossoe, Robin Risley, Lionel Barathe, and Humphrey Harding and Humphrey Beesbury. One is missing in order for Dunk to be able to fight for his innocence, and suddenly Baylor, Breaks Spirit Targaryen, shows up as Dunk's sixth champion, not having his own armor available. The prince borrowed that of his son, Valar. Quote, then came a voice, I will take Sir Duncan's side. You're going to read this entire quote later, so I will let you do that. But he says, but he mentioned specifically his armor.

My son was good enough to lend me his. End quote. Baylor, the hand of the king, Darren the second, and his heir has a reputation as a righteous man and takes part in the trial highlighting the fact that he is a sire. He embodies the aspect of the father, an allegory of divine power and justice. And last one at least, the stranger. Dunk is a nobody. And yet six, a less, Nuestrius knights who, before the Ashraternity, he did not know in person, take his side, despite the fact that he did not think it was possible. Quote, six knights, Dunk thought they might as well have told him to find six thousand. He had no brothers, no cousins, no old comrades who had stood beside him in battle.

Why would six strangers risk their own lives to defend a hedge knight against two royal pristlings? End quote. The six providential champions fighting alongside Dunk represent the stranger, an allegory of the unknown and particularly of death. The favor granted to dunk by the stranger an ambiguous aspect of the Andal God, neither male nor female, both human and bestial, is revealed in his duplicity as both blessing and curse. It's great. Hot shit. I love it. Just hot shit from like over a year ago on the old Reddit.com. But just like, you know, this stuff is fun, really fun to me in terms of

like you can map it any way you want. But I love this idea that the seven are here and they are present and there is something as much of a farce as this trial is in the first place. There is some divine hand guiding the way for Duncan here to at least have six people by his side and a sword and a shield and some armor. Like, you know, that like Odysseus on his way home. Like horrible things happen to Odysseus on the way home. But every so often, Athena is here nudging him in wonder. direction or another to get the things he needs to continue his journey. And I just think that that is

such a cool idea that I love that we like first sort of raised last week that our listeners have wrote in about that people have been thinking about for years as it comes to this text. The best. I mean, we'll obviously, we'll circle back to it after we see how it all goes and map things on one more time. But I love it as well. And I love, I love much like with a prophecy or a dream the way that these symbols can fit in a number of different ways and that it's all valid. Like I have always, I, I, I'm excited to talk about this more next week, but like, I think the, the, as you just read, the framing of Baylor, the association with Baylor as the father is, I think, very apparent.

But to get an email characterizing Baylor's, the mother, like, actually is also very compelling and makes a lot of sense. I think to that last point that you were making the idea that the trial of seven. Love and mercy. Yeah. Yes, mercy, mercy especially. Like, I think that the terror is real. The sense that this is daunting and impossible is real.

And that's part of what the trial of seven brings. That smugness from Aryan that he is in a position to survive this, navigate this, do it at all. in a way that Dunk isn't. And the volume of it, the scale of it, the scope of it, is part of what gives them that. And to flip that and to make that a source of community for Dunk, it's just like such a beautiful way to think about it. I'm excited to keep tracking that theory and returning to it.

I think it's a great one. Fantastic stuff. None of the characters in, despite the book passage and the people in the assembled fitting many of those descriptions as you just read in the show none of the characters here in the grandstands are going to be listed. But Dunk has to appeal anyway. So, Raymond has replaced Stefan,

Steveron, but Dunk is still one short. And he learns from Aryan and then confirmed by Lord Ashford. It's seven or bust, ma'am. That's a dumb rule. I agree. You should be able to decide. But again, if they're like, well, it's all about the seven and the gods.

So, like, they almost are undermining their premise. And he's like, no. No, you can't. You can't. And so he begs a moment to address the crowd, right? He rides out. And this is different in the book, as I mentioned, because he is like, Sir Arlen, Sir Arlen, Sir Manfred, Sir Arthur, making direct appeals, invoking Arlen. But in the show, we've seen that already.

We've seen him go to all of these characters at the end of episode one, the beginning of the episode two, and ask them if they remember Arlen and they don't. And so in the show, this is this really brilliant little tweak where he's not. saying, do you remember Arlen? He's like, I know you don't. You've already shown me who you are. Yeah. And yet I'm going to give you one more chance, right? And it's this great moment for Dunk where it's like such a, it could be so defeating and crushing. But I felt such pride here because he's like learning and growing and adapting. And we're watching him on that journey. It's like a great little origin story moment. He was a good man, he says Marlon. And he taught me how to be a knight, not just Sword and Lance, but honor. A knight defends the innocent. That's all I did. I was not Sir Arlen's blood, but I have followed his example. As your sons will follow yours, who will stand and fight with me?

From I don't know the right words when he was burying Arlen to this. I think I love a speech on horseback. Oh my God. It's great. But it is not this day. My favorite, as you know. Death. His name is Mike.

Um, that's Theodin King. Death. Um, or, you know, it's out of fashion now because Mel Gibson sucks, but Braveheart, you know, like, they may take our lands, we'll never take our freedom. Like, it's a talent to do a speech on our respect. I feel like all of these speeches originate from, this is the second, but the last time I will, uh, reference William Shakespeare in this. But the St. Christman's Day speech. The Barge is always welcome. He is. But the St. Christmas Day speech from Henry V is like the epitome of, the pre-battle, let us inspire speech. And I was looking back at it.

And there's a couple, there's, you know, the whole thing worth watching, worth listening to if you watch Brenna do it or anyone do it. Who cares? But this idea of St. Christmas Day, the speech that he gives, that Henry gives here, is about, as he's siking up his army to go fight, he's like, we're fighting. on this day, St. Christen's Day. And forever in history, people will remember this day, St. Christen's Day, and they will remember what we did here. And they will remember who was here. And he says, familiar in his mouth as household words, Harry the King, Baylor, Head of the King, Bedford

and Exeter, Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester, seven. He lists seven names here, right? And he's like, be in there flowing cubs freshly remembered. This story shall the good men teach their son. So like this idea is like your sons won't, like when we see the brood of bracken, let go this fart. Yeah. He sits down and wraps his arm around his son. Right. And this is what Duncan is saying is like, I followed example as your son will follow yours.

Right. And so like this is what is true in the same Christmas Day speech is like. With the brackens, it's probably true, by the way. Right. What are you, a black one? So, like, I think that, I think what it's always worth remembering is this moment inside of, and you can agree or disagree, and largely I disagree that, like, war should be this enshrined. But inside of these medieval or Renaissance or whatever, text, like, this idea of, like, there's nothing, there's nothing more important than this, what we are about to do for honor, for duty, for love. for whatever it is.

We are warriors, we are fighters, we are putting our very flesh on the line, and it is going to be worth it for generations. Right. Every, this is, I'm going to paraphrase, every dude who's not here with us. Yeah. Everyone who's sleeping right now

is going to wish they were here. Right. Every year when St. Christmas Day rolls around. They're going to be like, fuck, I should have been there. You sitting there in the stands are going to wish you were down here on my team,

the seven fighting at this tourney at Ashford Meadow because it is going to be enshrined in history what we do here today, standing up for honor and for duty and for love. And the tales will grow in the telling of it as they did with St. Christmas Day, right? It becomes this myth. And you weren't there. You really had to be there. If you were Exeter or Gloucester, you were there. But if you weren't, you weren't there. You know? And so I just like, I love this speech. And I love thinking about what Dunk says here is so true he's greeted with jeers and with silence and with farts and we'll talk about that in a second

but like but like they're all going to be so embarrassed and who's watching who's in this stand it's not just the brackens the Blackwoods are there the Lannisters are there the Dundarians are there the Tullys are there every single family is here they have sent someone here to goddamn Ashford Meadow

and so they're going to tell the tale for generations in every region those puppeteers are going back to Dorn and they're going to tell you the fuck happened there, you know what I mean? Every single region are going to tell the tale of Sir Duncan the Tall and a bailor brace beer riding out onto the field. I mean, my God. I love that. It's always great when the bard appears. It is. He's always here. I think what I particularly love about that is there's a version of this moment where Stefan, Sir Speron, is giving this speech and is only hitting that note. Like, the glory.

The glory. Do it for the glory. Have you had a tough day? Try more glory. And Dunk is starting to see the world more clearly and make an appeal and understand, but he's thinking of it, first of all, through such a personal lens, but also still so rooted in the idea of what is right. So, like, I love that he's talking about Arlen, especially because we got the shrug. We got the cut to the shrug. And we're carrying that with us. We know Dunk is thinking that. But he's still like, on the morrow we're going to show them what his hand. has wrought now in totality. So what, like we've been talking about all season, is he seeing more clearly about Arlen, but what is he still championing? Where is the lesson that he's still heeding that he hopes other people will find power in two? And so the Brut of Bracken making a fucking farce of this moment is akin to him making a farce of Dunk's entire life, right? And so Brut of Bracken very quickly, like, if he had said, yes, I'm with you, the other side quakes, they're terrified because he is not only the brute of Bracken, Bracken's Blackwoods, we talked about him a lot across Hot D, but he killed Quentin Blackwood just a few years ago, 206 AC, in attorney in King's Landing in hideous and fabled, infamous fashion.

People know who he is. He is like a champion of note who can do horrible things. The fact that he of all people is the one who stands up, looks at a son and then rips this fart. Once more must you mock me kind of a note for dunk. But, like, he's not deterred by it. And the thing that he leans into then is that beat of, like, what is the true heart of this, right? So the, like, the Leanna Mormont, like, but you refuse to call indictment of who they are, has courage deserted the noble houses of Westrose. I will not believe it is so. Are there no true knights among you? It's more of the scales falling from the eyes, seeing them clearly not wanting to believe that's who they are, even though they've shown him time and time again that that's who they are. are, but it's like he's not just saying come be famous. He's saying a true night would know that this is right. Are none of you able to see that this is right, that what I did was right and what he did was wrong? Absolutely. And I think, I mean, and I don't think you're saying this, but I don't ever think of the Christmas Day speech is like just about glory and history.

I know you're not saying that, but like the we few, we happy few, we ban, of brothers. Like if you, if you spill your blood here with me today, then you are forever my brother and it does not matter where you rank in society. Yes. I'm not saying that about the bar or just the difference between how other people in Tong's spot would make the pitch. But I do think what's interesting about the St. Christen's Day speech is that it is, there is like that that note of upward mobility inside of it. I don't care who you are. If you fought with me here today, you're on the up and up. And, you know, you are forever going to have that, whether or not that was actually true in terms of Henry's reign is probably not the case. But anyway, also,

for the Brut of Bracken, I should say, his fans are a little pissed about this fart situation, because in the book, the Brut of Bracken is the only person who deigns to respond to dunk, right? He says, that may be, said the Brut of Bracken, who had least the grace to reply. But is your cause, not mine. I know you not, boy. So, I would say that the television adaptations are, you know, it's complex always, especially inside of the Bracken Blackwood feud. Say they tend to be more pro-Blackwood than pro-Brakken as a rule. I did think the email that got Pro-Listner Ash, who called it yet more blatant Blackwood propaganda. It was like really funny. Yeah, exactly. We probably don't have time for me to read the entirety of this incredible email we got from Max, who does like an Alice with Three Fingers-Level

dissertation on the fart. Just like, genuinely one of the best emails I've ever read from a bad baby is like incredibly good because he's like citing rabelais and a lot of stuff. But talking about Max move together this tapestry, I'm just going to do my best to summarize, taking us from the Game of Thrones theme that starts season one episode one with the like what you like to call the hippo spray, right, the shitting. Yeah. It's about to lie.

You can't. And then we wind up here with the Game of Thrones theme song without that association. But on that journey, what Max is arguing, and this is like a tradition of a certain kind of literature, is this idea. And like, I don't, I don't, I've not read the Rabelais source that he is citing here. But I have read Canterbury Tales. And Canterbury Tales is like hugely bawdy. And like, you know, people's, like, assholes and like women's lady gardens and like all, you know, like it's body parts are everywhere.

Shout out Josser. Yeah. And so, but it's the great equalizer. Everybody shits and everybody farts. And so this idea that like you can, you can make yourself the whitest white knight in the Kingsguard and you still have to find a place to poo. Right? Yeah. This is what I was saying last week.

No, I know. I know. I know. I'm not so here for this. And so I'm just saying like when the Brut of Bracken let's go this fart, Max's point was like, he's up there in the stand with the nobles. Yeah. And he farts too, and this is the great equalizer. It's the great equalizer.

And so it's like this idea of like it is revealing the humanity in all of us. And also associating like dunks expulsions, which are both in the shitting and then in the puking later due to like nerves and anxiety and a desire to be honorable. Yes. And then linking it to the fart in the Brutabankan who is just there for like for derision and humor. actually, Dunk's massive bout of diarrhea is more pure and honorable

than the bodily functions of the people around him. I probably did Max a huge disservice and summing up the whole thing. I love it. Gallant knighthood isn't something Dunk has to aspire to despite his having a body that shits and vomits. It's something that is always

accrued to him precisely because he lives by a code that recognizes every human and their excreting body is just as valuable as every other. Again, Red would chime in and say, take care of your body. You've only got the one. It's really good stuff. Thank you, Max. Yeah. We will always accept thesis-level dissertations on bodily functions,

and so will Ira Parker? I think that's clear. Absolutely. Will we get another piss or poop thing in the fifth episode? Probably. Almost certainly. Feels like a lock. I can't wait to find out what it is.

Feels like a lock. Taylor. He missed the Bruttebrack and farting. Do you think he was, I saw some great Instagram reels of people, like, pretending to be Baylor, like, waiting for his moment. He's, like, listening to the speech. He's like, here we go. This is going to be a really cool time to come.

Then he was, like, waiting for the fart. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Don't gets one more great line. Are there no true nights among you? That's my cue. That's my cue. Because, like, no matter what it's great. The gate does creak open, like, right then, it's great.

No matter what is true of, like, Baylor's time. it takes a long time to get into armor, plate armor, and a lot of people to help you. For sure. Especially if that armor belongs to your smaller son, so it's not quite your size. Pretty tight. So you have to like, jimmy yourself in there, right? Yeah. Um, thanks joke. Yep. I always get it. Except for sometimes I don't. Um, and, um, so this is something that Baylor decided on a while ago. He didn't decide. it because Sir Steveron decided not to keep his vow. Baylor decided this a couple hours ago at least. At the very least.

Yeah. Pre-game ritual. Let's see this, Carlos, before we talk about it. Just an incredible moment. Let's read the passage from the book because everybody thinks that it is Prince Filar. Across the field, Prince Aryan laughed. The dragon is not mocked, he called out. Then came a voice.

I will take Sir Duncan's side. A black stallion. merged from out of the river Miss, a black knight on his back. Dunk saw the dragon shield, and the red enamel crest upon his helm with its three roaring heads. The young prince, gods be good, is it truly him? Lord Ashford made the same mistake. Prince Valar? No. The black knight lifted the visor of his helm. I did not think to enter the lists at Ashford, my lord, so I brought no armor. My son was good enough to lend me his. Prince Baylor smiled, almost sadly. So again, he doesn't have his own armor.

He wasn't planning to fight, but he decided to do this thing, and he had to borrow his son's armor in order to do it. I love that mistake in the novella. It makes sense that we didn't get a like Prince Valar here because we haven't spent really enough time understanding who it is. But you can see that it's snug. Maybe he was the character that was cut. Could be. It's entirely possible. Dong's face here, egg's face.

Ariens face, of course. It's just like an instantly iconic, wonderful moment. and it's so good in the text. I loved getting to see this brought to screen. I got chills watching this. I thought it was fantastic. Ira Parker said, you know, in sort of a preseason interview, he was asked, I gotta say, these junketeers are doing a great job of like asking questions and then sprinkling them throughout the season.

So like, in the preseason interview, Ira Parker was asked about this specific moment. And he was like, this is my favorite moment of the season. He's like, I've watched it back a million times, like getting to use the theme in a specific moment. an unironic way here is just like it's fantastic light of my life I already liked the episode one theme music

cut to diarrhea as we talked about on those pods I thought it was very clever but to the way that your heart just surges then when you get the full pure true earnest right version of it here and it feels so earned it's just incredible and it's so good and like I really do wish that

that House the Dragon had come up with its own theme song I just like, I love this use of, it matters that it's infrequent. And so when it kicks him, we're like, oh my God, here we go, you know? Totally. Makar is not as thrilled as the rest of us are. We're all like, this is one of the all-time iconic moments. Mika. We're going to be talking about Baylor along with Oberyn and I will be your champion for the rest of our lives.

Mika, not so. He's like, have you taken leave of your senses? His armor is also sick, by the way. the man attacked my son to which Baylor replies, this man protected the innocent as every true knight must let the gods decide if he was right or wrong. So again, that question, what makes a night a night? Right.

What is right? What is wrong? Why do we do the things we do? We've talked all pod about why Baylor made this decision. But on the Oberyn confront that like, I will be your champion moment, but also like, what about what I want? Justice for my sister and her children. If you want justice, you've come to the wrong.

place, Tyrion says, I disagree. I've come to the perfect place. I want to bring those who have wronged me to justice and all those who have wronged me are here. That's not what Baylor's doing at all. Baylor's not going to be caught monologuing. That's not what he's doing here. That's not what's going to happen to him. And this is, this man protected the innocent is another place where our listener, Taylor, pointed out that, like, instead of defended the week, it's protected the innocent, which is. I love it. I love that he's really, like, earning the lifelong Arlen hype since the, the joust back in the day. You know, Sir Arlen often told me we heard Dung Say earlier. in the season, that you were the soul of chivalry and that one day the seven kingdoms would be safe in your hands. And all of those things we talked about earlier today, like the practicality, the responsibility, the burden of being next in line for the throne. There's also the aspect of this decision of like, what kind of realm do you want to lead? What do you want your kingdom to look like? And the choice that he's making here is a part of that.

I know Bertie's already your fave, but I just think he's cool. Can I read you this quote that he gave about this moment and about leadership? I would love you to. He said, I think there must be a deep thirst in most of us to realize that there is a space in a cynical world for heroes and for people who choose to do the right thing. And what an important time to tell stories about leaders who choose righteousness over self-interest. But it's not a given. And I think that I think what makes it exciting on a simple level is you don't know before until after. And that's what he says. You don't know before until after, as my granny used to say. And I love that phrase. You don't know before until after. As my granny used to say, he's not a good. man. There's no such thing I don't think. Goodness is as goodness does. We'll find out in each moment how we'll behave in the next. God. So this choice he makes. It's very much, it's going to sound like Tolkien, but actually it's kind of Hemingway. There's good in this world, Mr. Frodo, and it's worth fighting for, right? That's not a Tolkien line. That's a Peter Jackson line crib from Hemingway. But there's good in this world, Mr. Frodo, and it's worth fighting for is like,

when you see Baylor-Brickspere, when you see Raymond Fosway, when you see Dunk make these choices. And that's why this story is so, again, this is still Georgia Martin's brutal world. You know what I mean? But it's just like these choices that these characters make to do what is right. It allows you to believe that other people in your life could do things like this. And also that you could find the strength to do a thing like this. It's like really like a balm for the soul. I just think it's great. And now of all times, we need it. So, so good. We have a couple more listener emails. I just want to hit really quickly before we get to the spoiler session. Our listener Anna Grace said this thing that I really love the way she put it.

We talked a little bit previously about the way people look at Duncan when he's not looking at them. Yes. Plummer, Steely Pay, Red, etc., etc. Anna wrote, something about Sir Dunk the Lunk reminds people of who they want to be. The way it's coming across in the TV version for me anyway is that we're not getting Baylor or the legend come to say the day. We're getting a perhaps more human bailer learning from a hedge knight and putting that lesson into practice. show Baylor might already be a good enough guy, but there's something about dunk that inspires greatness. This idea of like, that's the end of her email, but like this idea that like, who does Steely Pate want to be?

He wants to be a guy who gives a knight, a shield and armor away for a copper because of someone who did the right thing. Who does Red want to be? Maybe like a woman who offers more kindness than she did derision a little bit earlier. You know what I mean? Like, who does Egg want to be? Who does Raymond want to be? Who does Raymond want to be? You know, it's just like.

Yeah. It's so great to think, too, about, and we get this obviously on the printed page, but one of the things that the adaptations can really cement for us is the way that those ripples play across time. And we have the full picture here of the influence that Dunk has had on all of these people. The history books in this moment will be like what Baylor-Briggspeer came in and did. And I will say, like I got, like we said at the beginning of the pod, just anecdotally hearing from more people about this episode, first word of almost every text was. Bailer, exclamation point. This is like, this is one of those moments that people are going to talk about forever.

But the way that the show slightly, as we've already talked about, slightly tweaking so that the influence that Dunk had on that. And then these things are all informing each other. It's just the best. And that's what, at its best, fire and blood and house the dragon does

is just sort of like, here's the story you didn't read in the history book. Here's what happened in the room behind closed door when Agon, even Agon was sent out. So the only people were there. Right, right. We're Baylor and Duncan And only they know what happened there

You know? Yeah Elishner Cody wrote him Say, regarding Raymond. Yes. Are we worried that he's not wearing any armor?

I mean. So, Steely Pate puts the armor on Duncan in, I guess, a cut scene or whatever. But he's also there kind of squiring for Raymond. Yeah.

He didn't have an extra but a chain mail would throw on Raymond? Well, I mean, we haven't seen the actual contest yet. My expectation would be Baylor rides off and dunk rides off.

They're not going to instantaneously fight. They should have a moment before the actual contest means where I would expect somebody to put some plate on Raymond Foss away. Put Elisa Helman on Raymond Fossway, dear boy. Okay. And then Kev says, I'm assuming this person's Kev based on their email, they didn't sign it. Okay, I'm confused on how the Kingsguard would continue the trial of seven with Baylor joining Dunkside when they be breaking some kind of bow battling against the air. So my answer to that is that's actually kind of the point. And we may or may not hear about that, but like, no, the Kings are.

cannot touch Bailor at Breakspeer. So all of a sudden, Arian side is a little neutralized by the fact that there's three people on his team cannot touch part of Dunk's team. Tables are turning. We'll see what happens. I can't wait.

I'm very excited. Very sad. There are only two episodes left, but very, very excited. Book spoiler time. If you don't want to hear about things that are going to happen, either presumably in the next couple weeks

in future season. or way later in the canon, it's your time to bounce. Carlos put a spooky sound effect here so that people know it's time to leave. Okay, did you go? Are you gone? Are you gone?

Great. Book spoilers. Can I rapid fire some emails really quickly? Let's do it. Nicole says, I just started book two of Duncanag and I can't believe Sweetfoot is not with them and gets no mention.

Please tell me the show will correct this grave error. I doubt it. We'll find out. Okay. But we are going to get a donkey next season. So that's something. This is a category I'm calling is insert literally anyone actually Blood Raven.

That's an amazing one. So Blood Raven, who is not in this book because I believe George R. Martin had not thought of him yet. But does have roles to play in the future. It does often show up in disguise. So you are well within your rights to ask, is that Robin sitting the tree watching dunk poop? Poop Robin.

Blood Raven. Use his proper name. Poop Robin. But our listener Garrett pointed out that the birthmark on the face of the fortune teller in episode three really made him wonder if that could be Blood Raven Blood Raven being a member

of the royal family who very ambitious very moving pieces behind the scenes and certainly associated with vision and prophecy Here's what Garrett said Who benefits more than Blood Raven

from the death of Baylor? Blood Raven is the next hand and he holds a position for years Arian who's unpredictable and actually insane is exiled and thus removed from the politics of Westeros, my question asked is, did Blood Raven have anything to do with this? In a future story, we seem glamour as a different person and the saying, how many eyes, does the Lord Blood Raven have? Do you all think the fortune tellers is soft launch for Blood Raven in the series, or Am I My Rocker? I think you should always ask yourself,

was Blood Raven actually involved in what was going on here. It's fun. Why not? I don't think that was Blood Raven, but I like it. Why not? Could be? It would make a little bit more sense to me that it's played by the same actress in the inn if Blood Raven's like, that's a lady's shape that I could take. I mean, the glimpse of Blood Raven that we got in Hot D is very visiony, you know? Yeah, but when Ryan was like, that has nothing to do with how Blood Raven will actually show up, I was like, then why do it? That was so weird.

Why show Blood Raven if you haven't cast Blood Raven and it's just going to be a different person then? Yeah. I mean, especially the show was already in development. So knowing that at the absolute. latest we'd be getting mystery night season three blood raven absolutely latest i bet we'll see i bet we'll see blood raven in season two somehow i bet it okay i think it's good it's very likely given the heavy blackfire the dagger emphasis yeah i think we floated this but yes we did um you know just

we've just gotten a bunch of emails lately from people being like especially in the wake of the prophecy and thinking about the line of the prophecy of all who know you will will rejoice in your death. And so thinking then about a king agon, a king agon who is even darker than we already were led to believe. Because King Agon, the unlikely, is responsible for the tragedy of Summerhall. That's just a fact. But the nature of everything leading up to that is much more of a mystery.

And so putting in this show, all rejoice. How does wondering last week, how far off the path has Agon gone? in pursuit of this and how influential could knowing the prophecy of the dagger and having the dagger be on all of that. I feel like there's no... I mean, there's just no question given the...

I guess it just depends on like whether or not how much George, who is now pissed at Ryan wants to like link what they've seeded in Hot D into his current baby because he's like, I told them to do this and I'm going to like reclaim

that in a way that I can control. But so, like, in the mystery night, this is obviously connected to Darren, but also to the idea of prophecy, as is the case with, like, the Ragar Scrolls quote, there are plenty of examples where now we come across them in the canon and we're like, oh, probably that was the dagger. So from the mystery night, this is egg and gives us an insight into the stock that he's

putting into the dragon dreams already as a very young boy. Someday the dragons will return. My brother Darren's dreamed of it, and King Aries read it in a prophecy. On a knife. Maybe it will be my egg that hatches. That would be splendid. So King Arias read it in a prophecy.

That's like, got to be this. It could be, but like, Rhaegard didn't read it off a dagger. As you have noted many times, George is constantly tweaking and updating. Who knows what that scroll was? Who knows? What if a scroll is also a dagger? Yeah. When is a scroll not a tracker?

Why not? It's got words printed on it. Okay. So. Justin said possibly the prophecy dies with him at Summerhall. Is that where we lose

the chain of custody? I don't know. I think Raygar. I think Raygar had it. Or he had a scroll. Which was a dagger. Which was also a dagger. What a story.

What a story. That's it for dagger. On the Summer Hall front, since we're there, let's hit the very notable tweak in Darren's dream. This is more summer hall stuff. So they added a line for the show. And the laying the track to Summerhall really continues here.

Frankly, at this point, it's going to be weird if they don't do 13 seasons and get us to Summer Hall, given the amount of Summer Hall forecasting we've gotten. But I've seen you, sir, and fire. And fire is added. So the prophecy is about Baylor dying. Right. Well, I mean, I think, yes. I mean, I think it's, I think, as you've noted many times, like any Dragon Dreamer prophecy, it can be applied to many different things. No, I'm just saying, previously we interpreted that this dream was just about Baylor dying and dunk surviving the trial of the seven.

And certainly that will still be an interpretation of that. Which is going to be a huge hot bummer for everyone who's like super excited about Baylor this week. I know. It's going to be a real all-time tour. It's like, oh boy. But and fire was added because we're just sort of like, you know, egg being like, did you use pollen to make that fire? Love the fire bits. You know, we're just like, we're just putting fire where we may.

So do you take it as, okay, it's like all of these things? It still applies to Baylor and Dunk. Surely there will be like a torch. A little bit of like Damon, white walls, dragon prophecy stuff there as well for Novella 3, Season 3. And then obviously Summer Hall. I think it is, I think it's Summer Hall. I think it's anything that happens to House Targaryen that like Dunk has his hand and foot in is going to be related to that. There's a funeral pyre.

Right? We've seen it in promo photos. There's going to be a bail or a funeral pyre. So there will be literally a fire. So if people want to be like, well, that was the prophecy, they can. And then people who know about Summer Hall are like, there's more fire to come.

Yeah. But like also, why not both? Why not all of the above? Why not all of the above? I like that, you know, the other targs. I mean, obviously, we've talked about the aim in line to Sam many times. You know, my brother's dreamed of dragons too and their dreams killed them every one.

Obviously, as the passage of shred, Egg becomes obsessed with this. But Mystery Night, when Duncan, Damon the second, John the fiddler, spoiler, he's like, he just gets another I dreamed of you. Like, this is just a thing for Dunk to that point about all the different moments along the way. This is very much like white, you were in white, head to heel, et cetera, et cetera, et we'll talk about that more as we get closer to that season. But the Targaryans are dreaming of Duncan and his role in history pretty regularly.

Yeah. pretty regularly as they go. I always like the foot. I like that we got the call out of, and you kicked them too, right? And Dunk's like, yeah, given, as you noted, the way that the foot kind of hangs over,

especially after what happens to Baylor. Sometimes they sit under that tree and I look at my feet and I ask if I couldn't have spared one, how could my foot be worth of Prince's life? Standing firm on my corner still that he's going to punt Ragar right out of, punt them like a football right out of Summerhole?

Like a little baby football. Why not? Why not? Since we're talking about the mystery night, can I read this passage that someone sent us about the idea of dunk as a stranger? This listener signed their email Lady Olena, so I'll give it to them. Oh, wow. From the mystery night, quote, Black Tom stumbled backwards, yet somehow kept his balance. Dunk bowled right after him, smashing him with the shield again and again, using his size and strength to knock,

Heidel halfway across the sept, and he swung the shield aside and slashed out with his long sword, and Hedl screamed as a steel bit through wool and muscle deep into his thigh. His own sword swung wildly, but the blow was desperate and clumsy. Dunk let his shield take it one more time and put all his weight into his answer. Black Tom reeled back a step and stared down in horror at his forearm flopping on the floor. Rough. Beneath the stranger's altar. You, he gasped.

You, you. I told you, Dunk stabbed him through the throat. I'm better with a sword. I think that from the moment of Baylor's death onward, dunk will. think constantly about the death that he leaves in his way. And the death that he brings wherever he goes. Yeah.

On that front, Dunk as like kind of the trial by combator worth noting here in the spoiler section. Every novella features trial by combat, frankly, in a way that I like think might feel a little weird at some point. But the fact that other characters are involved

is maybe fine. Obviously in season two, Sworn Sword, we're going to get Dunk versus Lucas Long in Shet's Stanfast. And then Damon versus Glendon, at Whitewalls. And then, of course, as we've already talked about a few times from, this isn't one of the novellas yet,

but from World Vice and Fire Canon, we know that Lionel and Dunk have a fabled trial by combat in the far future because Lionel's like, your fucking kids egg, fucked off and broke up a betrothal, and now I'm going to rise up against you. Lionel talking about wanting to bloody up the King's Garden and their pretty white dresses.

Great stuff. He and his boyfriend, Dunk, will... Well, how's that going to go for Lionel? Not well. Not well. Not well. On the not going to go well front, I mean, man, the septans say we must love our brothers from Baylor right before his brother's about to kill him. Him being just like crammed into that armor.

I know when he pulled this, giving us the pulling off of the helm in particular is like diabolical. Really tough. Diabolical. If you don't know, because I, we keep forgetting, but like people listen to this by their sex without knowing. But like, sickos. Mekar. Mika. Will stove his brother's head in from behind.

Yeah, by accident, as he's going to tell you. They didn't mean to. And, you know, there's a question of, like, would the helm have, like, protected him if he was wearing a helm that was actually fit for him and not his son's helm. But they'll pull the helm off and basically his brain falls off. If you're wondering what the gross, gooppy thing that's going to happen next week's episode is, I believe it's Baylor's brain. falling out. Someone might shit in their pants during the trial of seven, too. It's entirely possible. I mean, your guy, Bees does die by groin step. You better get him alive before they kill him via groin death. Yeah, I'm sure it's coming.

Yeah, be patient. You're going to get it eventually. He's not going to get to say a word. It's so sad. I wonder Phil even mentioned that he died. Oh, boy, bees. You seem so delighted. Okay. No, I do. You know what? I love Pete. I love the Peace Fair. You just tried to hurt me with Beesbury? I'm going to hurt you now. I'm going to hurt you now. Apple Wars? Apple Wars.

Raymond Fossoi claims the green apple. Raymond Fossoi belongs to me and not you. Everybody makes mistakes. Not you. Not you. Not you. What I do like is that Raymond Fossoi is like, oh, sorry, I was just repainting my shield. And I'm hoping that we're not going to get him fucking off to repaint his shield.

He's got to, at this point, based on the page of the show, he simply has to wait until after the trial. That would be nuts. But Fosway has splits and there's the red apple. and the green apple Fossoways. And Raymond Fossow is the founder of the green apple Fossowis, and so I think you have to acknowledge that he belongs to me and not you. You can't have every single...

I'm allowed to like him as a character. You can't have every single red apple that exists on the planet. And I've got one sour green apple. I don't want every red apple. I want... And I get Raymond Foss away. Honeycris, Pinkley.

Yeah. And I get Raymond Foss away. And you can have Stefan Foss away and all of the other red apple Fossi's. Stepraud? But you don't get Raymond Foss away. You know you don't. I'm allowed to like him as a character.

You're not allowed to claim him anyway whatsoever. You can't say our shared favor, Raymond Foss away. This is like saying I like, I was not to say this is like saying that because I wear a lot of orange for Syracuse and McLaren and of course the Orioles, I have to like the Ashford Cigil. And then I remembered that I literally said that. Yep. Fuck. Mine. Let's see.

What else quickly to wrap here? How many eggads have been king for? well, there's going to be a fifth and it's going to be this one. Agon the fifth, the unlikely. Five, agon's. I hope he says that when the Great Council chooses him. I hope that's his coronation speech comes. Oh, ma'am.

Incitement to revolt. Now listen, we are mere years away from the next Blackfire rebellion. We are mere years. Just observing it is canon. She's just saying, Arian had some points. She and Chris Ryan both are team Aryan. That's out of the table. Never.

On the Fosway front. This is not a Knight of the Seven Kingdom spoiler, but it is potentially what we were alluding to earlier. House of the Dragon spoiler because Tumbledin, that's where, I mean, the Fossoways are mixed up with, that's got to be what costs in the Lord's. We don't know. We don't know, but it could be.

And if Ryan Connell wants to give us more pieces of shit from the Red Apple Fossaway branch of the family tree for you to love and admire, then... Who says no? He can go for it. I would love to have a Fossi. way. That'd be great. What else here? For not knowing my place, I guess in general, just with Baylor, the fact that he suggests, like, a version of the thing that gets him killed is

just, you know, boy, so Georgian. For not knowing my place, I like that idea as kind of a primer for the, we did lament that when Dunk finds his elm earlier, there's like some flies, but we don't get a real, oh, a dragonfly. Thus, I think, diminishing the likelihood of getting a dragons or dragonflies contemplative moment at the end. But, you know, for us, as readers, obviously this transition to, okay, well, I thought I wanted this thing. And sure, in some ways I still do, certain parts of it, but Aryan, Darren, look at what that royal life and that fancy house led to. Like, maybe my place is actually the better place. And so if Egg is going to come with me, it's going to be as a Hedge Knight Squire.

But a donkey. And we're going to go to Dorn, because I want to try to find Tancel because she's not too tall. For kissing. For puppets. And kissing. For puppets. So you, I had put this in the spoiler section, but the, the Kingsguard Gambit, like, Baylor. I don't think that needs to be in the spoiler section, because that's just the rules. I'm just saying that's the rules of. I guess, yeah, it doesn't.

I had put it here just because it does, I assume he'll, like, explicitly say it. Explicitly say it in the next episode as he does in the book. But, yeah, this is a, it's an interesting, like, I think connected to what you were saying earlier. It's a moment where you're like, right, you're thinking through the tactics. You're thinking through all aspects of this. And so we'll obviously talk about that part of his character. More next week. Dragon and human form, obviously, this guy's going to drink wildfire and die.

I'd say you hate to see it, but with Ari and you don't. And that's it. That's it. We did it. I can't wait for episode five. I'm really sad the season's almost over, but I look forward to covering the Big Penultimate and then the Coda with you. With CR, we will be back for Talk to Thrones after episode five on Sunday.

Thank you to Carlos Chiroboga, Arjuna, Ramga Powell, Jomi Adanaron, and Jacob Cornett, who is here with us today. Great mustache. Do you think Jacob would dye his mustache with some honey? What do you think of Humphrey Beesbury? Jacob, do you have an opinion? Let us know. Let us know. Drop it in the comments.

We will see you guys on Sunday. We will see everyone on Sunday night for Talk to Thrones on Episode 5. We will be back before then, though, for Best of the Century so far, V-Day special. Here in the spoiler section, why did I wait till now? I don't know, but let's say, so like, what were some of the categories that you threw out at me? It was just sort of like steamy as on-screen moment, best yearning. Let's see. Favorite couple we actually got.

That's what the fan thick is for, the ship we never got, but that you still ride for. Surprising pairing you end up caring about. Most anguish-inducing declaration of love. Hottest sex scene. Sex scene that made you a romantic-sie fan or the romantic-s sex scene you're most excited to see adapted as a book category because we'll mostly do TV and film. Something about a musical company. accompaniment during a sex scene. Something about I have questions about the physics. You just went down like a description of love. A sex spiral. Yeah. Well, I mean, what else is new?

Yeah. So if you have any of thoughts about that, Hobbs and Dragons is Gmail.com, any of those categories. And we'll see. They might all change. Yep, they might all change. But you can email us. And the white boys will be back. And we'll see you soon. Bye.