House of R - Build the Best Spider-Man Movie Draft

Episode Date: June 12, 2023

It's time to thwip into a new draft with the 'House of R' crew! Mal and Jo are joined by special guests Ben Lindbergh and Jessica Clemons to build the best 'Spider-Man' movie (33:27). From villains to mentors, accessories to antagonists, everyone will do their best to cross the vast Spider-verse to build the best movie of them all! Hosts: Mallory Rubin and Joanna Robinson Guests: Ben Lindbergh and Jessica Clemons Senior Producer: Steve Ahlman Social: Jomi Adeniran Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopal Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I'm Yossi Salick, and I'm the host of Bansplain, a show where we explain cult bands and iconic artists by going deep into their histories and discographies. We're back with a brand new season at our brand new home, the Ringer podcast network, tackling a whole new batch of artists, from grunge gods to power pop pioneers to new metal legends and many, many more. Listen to new episodes every Thursday, only on Spotify. For adults with Crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis symptoms, every choice matter. Trimphia offers self-injection or intravenous infusion from the start. Tramphia is administered as injections under the skin or infusions through a vein every four weeks, followed by injections under the skin every four or eight weeks. If your doctor decides that you can self-inject trumphia, proper training is required.

Tramphia is a prescription medicine used to treat adults with moderately to severely active Crohn's disease and adults with moderately to severely active ulcerative colitis, serious allergic reactions, increased risk of infections or lower ability to fight them, and liver problems may occur. Before treatment, get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms, or need a vaccine. Explore what's possible. Ask your doctor about Tramphia today. Call 1-800-526-7736 to learn more or visit Trimfairadio.com.

The playoffs are here, and you can predict the action all the way to the five. with Fandul PREDICT. Predict the spread, total points, and even the game winner. Sign up and get a $25 bonus. Offered by Fandul prediction markets LLC, a registered futures commission merchant. 18 plus. Bonus is non-withdrawable and expire seven days after receipt. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors.

Manage your activity with our consumer protection tool. Restrictions applies. See terms at Fandul.com slash predict slash bonus dash offer dash terms. I mean, I've looked worse. But after everything, I still love being Spider-Man. I mean, who wouldn't? So no matter how many hits I take, I always find a way to come back. Because the only thing standing between this city and oblivion is me.

There's only one Spider-Man. And you're looking at him. And welcome into the Ringerverse, here on the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Mallory Rubin, and it is my absolute pleasure to invite you not only back to the Vision's Academy, but also to join us on the Ringers Nexus podcast feed for all things fandom. Joining me today, as always. We've never found the right band to join so we started our own. It's my house of our co-host, Joanna Robinson. So what's up? Thwhip, baby! So excited. It's draft day, Mallory.

It's draft day. Not the incredible film draft day. It is a draft day for us. Sadly, Kevin Costner is not here. He's not making a lot of appearances these days. And he is certainly not here on this draft. But who is? Though it is still true that nobody went to Bo Callahan's birthday in case anyone's wondering.

Joe, plenty of people at this party. It is not just up us today because... You might be wondering for a draft for a house of our party, what's a podcaster got to do to join this spider team? And Ben Lindberg and Jessica Clemens are here to find out. They are our fellow drafters for today's Build the Best Spider-Man movie draft. Ben, Jess, welcome. Hello.

So excited to be here. Apologies in advance for my voice. My wife and I have been exposed to a radioactive toddler. It has given us zero superpowers. It has actually sapped our powers. But I've been on vocal rest all weekend. I'm ready. Aw.

I'm incredibly nervous to be here because I've only heard how aggressive mal is during these drafts. Mellow. And I hope I chose right. I hope I chose correctly. This is my first draft. I assume it's like kickball rules. You choose the strong is first.

And I'm just going to try going to. in. I'm going to go in as fast as I can. See, I've been hopeful that Mal might be on her best behavior here. And by that I mean her least lethal, cutthroat sadistic behavior in that this is Jess's first time on House of R. And the first time you invite someone to your house, you try to be hospitable, right? You try to tidy up a little, present your best face. So might Mal possibly pull some punches here? Or does that go against her nature?

I don't know. It seems like Jess has come in with the right competitive. of spirit. I feel like once you invite someone into your house, you were comfortable enough to show them who you actually are. I feel like the second time. But the first time you might dust, you might put some clothes in the bin or put something in the closet.

You want to look presentable. So just the full exposure and full force of draft Mal on your very first appearance on this podcast, that could be daunting. But Ben, I find your attempt to neutralize Mal at the beginning, like really admirable but laughable. appeal to her better nature before the draft actually begins. I don't invite a lot of people over as you know. So this isn't really a thought exercise that I've engaged in actively before.

You know, pretty comfortable in pajamas hanging out with my cat. I am on my best behavior today. You know, I'm feeling mellow. I'm feeling like this is an exercise in shared celebration, much like the hype draft. You know, sure, is there going to be a competitive spirit among the group? of course, it's a draft, but we are seeking to build the best Spider-Man movie from the component parts that we adore, that we cherish, right? So what if it's just a love fest the entire time?

Could that happen? Maybe. I think so. Why not? No? Ben, do you remember the, like, and I hope you do because you're currently crushing it, but like the year draft that we did early this year? Oh, yeah.

Right? The high draft for the year. Yeah. I won that draft. Do you remember? No, I think Ben won. If you look at the record. If you look at the vote.

Yeah, does the vote counters the history count? Anyway. This is a democratic report. You might remember. Whether the things we drafted turned out to be good. That's the real victory. Oh. That's not what the point of the draft is.

It's to win. It's already getting contentious. Do you remember how Mallory at that draft was like, this is a love draft. It's just going to be hype and things we loved. And then she was instantly ridiculing Sean Fentasy. And good old, He had a baffling first pick.

Absolutely confounding to this day. I remain befuddled. Sean draft daddy fantasy, which is what Mallory had called him and had texted me the other day, is not here to absorb the blows for us. So we'll see what happens to us. As soon as the draft starts, the symbiote takes over Malachi. She starts just dancing and swaggering down the street. Exactly. I have a little voice in my head shouting about the lethal protector right now.

Here's the thing. While I won the hype draft, I got absolutely obliterated. on the Build the Best Batman movie draft. So that's part of it too. I'm looking to bring a different energy to the second version of our Build the Best X shared experience.

But my pals, my fellow drafters, before we actually set the order, before we run through the rules, before we make our picks, before we compliment each other for 90 minutes about what a great job we've all done, some quick programming

reminders. A lot of stuff going on on the ringerverse. On Wednesday, two of the people who you'll be hearing from today right now on this very podcast will be back with another podcast. Ben and Jessica will have a video game pod on Diablo, on the Gallum debacle. Tough one for the Gallumheads. Tough one from Mallory's hype. Anything else that you want to tease about the impending video game pod coming on Wednesday. Talking some street fighter, breaking down some fighting games. Maybe we'll devote the entire episode

to our reactions to the footage of Marvel Spider-Man 2 shown in across the Spider-verse. We'll see where it takes us. I'm excited. It's going to be very fun. And maybe we won't spend 30 minutes talking about Ghalem,

but I have a lot to talk about. I've got a lot to talk about. I've got a lot to say. I would listen. I would listen. On Friday, the Midnight Boys, Poo-Poo!

We'll have their instant reaction to the Flash. And then, a couple days after that, the Mint Edition crew will be back to talk about the newest Pixar film, Elemental, and then just a couple days after that, the whole Ring ofverse crew will be kicking off our secret invasion coverage. It's already almost secret invasion time. Joe and I will be back with our House of Our Deep dive on the Secret Invasion premiere next Friday, June 20.

Wow. Joanna, that's a lot. How can people follow all of that? Yeah, listen. Okay. I'm so glad you asked me. First of all, you want to follow us on the socials, like all major social platforms, right, TikTok, Instagram, Twitter, at ringer versus where you want to go, or at the ringer, you know, either way.

And in case you want to remember what happened in the House of our 2023 hype draft, I just, you can go on Twitter and see that Mallory picked the Mandalorian and Dial of Destiny, both the instant classes. It's a hype draft. It's not a predict the eventual quality draft. But that's what the actual coverage is for. If you have any opinions about democracy or how drafts should work, you can email us, hobbits and dragons at gmail.com. That's hobbits and dragons at gmail.com. If you want to send Jess a welcome to the ringer letter, it's hobbits and dragons,

Gmail.com, we'll make sure she gets it. We are so thrilled to have her here. Last programming reminder. It's the same as always. It's the friendly neighborhood spoiler warning. It's a tough one today because it's just all of all of Spider-Man. Today's podcast, today's draft will feature at some point potentially plot details from every theatrical Spider-Man film since 2002's Spider-Man. We may dip into some comics canon, some adjacent MCU or Sony Canon could potentially come up today.

If it is Spidey-centric, if it is Spidey Proximate, it is fair game today. But you knew that. You're listening to a build-the-best Spider-Man movie draft. What did you expect? Okay, a little pregame before we get into the rules. Why are we here? Why are we doing this? Well, we all just saw and loved across the Spider-Verse.

We're having a blast talking about Spider-Man, talking about why we love Spider-Man movies, talking about why we love Spider-Man stories. And, well, I think we would all agree that not every Spider-Man movie is quite as successful as into or across the Spider-verse. There are bits and pieces of each of these movies that we love, that we have held onto and thought about over the years that we have rejoiced when they have come back into our lives on the big screen. And particularly in this multiversal movie moment that we are in with across the Spider-verse with No Way Home Before, where there's a lot of like mashing up of elements of various

Spider-Man properties. This is really top of mind for us as an exercise. Will this be confusing at some point today? Was it during the build-the-best Batman movie draft where if memory serves, Sean asked midway through the draft, what is the point of this? exercise. Yes. Yes, it will be, but we're here to have fun. Damn it. And we're going to try to do exactly that. So before we dive in, I want everybody to share with each other, with our beloved listeners, and try to share in a way that doesn't tip your eventual draft strategy, if at all possible. What Spider-Man means to you? What is your relationship to Spider-Man films, to Spider-Man as a character, to Spider-Man as a story telling staple? Let's see.

start with our guests today. Ben, you want to kick it off? What does Spider-Man mean to you? He means a lot to me as a native New Yorker, a nerd, someone who still does not drive and is not licensed to do so if you put me behind the wheel of the Spider-Mobile. Didn't you get your license in Sonoma when you were running a baseball team? I got a learners permit, which has since expired as it was several years ago. I have vivid memory of you needing to learn how to learn how to drive when you were running a it didn't take. So I'm no better or more qualified

behind the wheel than Peter Parker despite being a grown-up and a dad. But again, that goes along with being a native New Yorker, though not from Queens specifically, but I identify very strongly with Spider-Man for all those reasons. He is funny. He's flawed. He's relatable.

Maybe the most relatable of all the heroes. And also, I have a lot of admiration and love for the Spider-Man movies. because, and I made this point on trial by content recently, but so much variation in directors and producers and stars and styles, live action, animated, it runs the gamut. But these movies are largely very entertaining at a minimum. And I'm not sure there's a franchise with this many movies where the quality is as consistent or the floor is as high, right? Because there hasn't been a bad Spider-Man movie, really.

we could argue about what the worst one is, but there hasn't been a fantastic four or Batman-and-Robin-style bomb of a Spider-Man movie in there somewhere, which is one of the reasons why there are so many of them. So even the worst ones you can enjoy, and the best ones I think are clustered so close together to the top that I don't know that there's a clear consensus

about what the best one is. You could make a convincing case for several of them. So I think it's unusual, if not unique, among franchises that have been this prolific, especially centered on a single character or a single concept for a character with many incarnations. I'm trying to say it without giving away my thing.

Okay, I got this. My brain's a thesaurus. I'll think of other words that kind of sound like it. So growing... Oh, no, don't say that. Okay, growing up with... I was a teen during Andrew Garvey. Spider-Man specifically, really young for Toby Maguire.

And so when I liked the Andrew Garfield Spider-Man, I remember getting so much hate for liking the Andrew Garfield Spider-Man that I was like, oh, let me go look at all the Spider-Man. And I was like, these aren't bad. And I felt like I had to stand up and fight for Andrew Garfield Spider-Man a lot. And through that love of loving Andrew Garfield Spider-Man, got me to love Toby and go back to watching all those when I was older and then going into Tom Holland Spider-Man. And I think it's just gotten better sense. And I just love how much they're diving into different versions of Spider-Man because there's so many.

And I'm not going to read every comic in which Spider-Man variants are in there. So they're trying to bring it to the big screen where we can, like, see it and like it. And it speaks to us. I didn't give away any of my hints. That was cagey. Okay. All right. Intriguing.

Joanna? Well, thank you for asking me, Mallory. I will, as well as Ben, cite the excellent trial-by-content podcast that I was not a part of, but Ben filled in admirably for me about various spider men and people. And a point that I loved on that show, and I think it was Neil Miller who made it, was this idea that, like, not every generation, but like the last three generations all have a spider person that maybe, you know, they grew up with that they identify with. and the idea that those spider people have characteristics of that generation. As we know, a reason this property is rebooted so often is because of quirks and the deal between Sony and Marvel. So it is unusual in that way, as Ben pointed out. And so because we were just constantly having spider people, we constantly have this prism that reflects where the culture is, where we are, where comic books are, et cetera, et cetera.

And, like, you can't, you can't discount how fundamentally important the Toby McGuire Spider-Man films were for, like, the future of all superhero films in general. As much as you can't discount how still important across the Spider-verse is, like, the fact that it is just, like, run through, shot through with relevance is incredible for a franchise. And I'm so thrilled that we get to talk about all the different facets. Obviously, there is one correct answer for every category. and I will be naming it. But other than that, like, you know,

there's just, like, so many good runners have. I love it. I love it. I agree. You know, I think that Spider-Man's stories

feel at once, like, eternal and, like, there's this great shared through line and tradition in a Spider-Man story,

the coming-of-age tale, something that feels like quintessential and archetypal and classic and very relatable, as Ben said, but also that each reboot can feel fresh,

whether it's through the performances or the particular figures or who is paired and how and in what way, the aesthetic, et cetera. And part of what's really fun, I think, about this particular franchise for a draft like this is like you really could go with any number of strategies. And sincerely, like this is not a bit. They would be valid. Like you could recreate something that you already have a deep affection for and a connection to. You could try to bring people something that they've never seen. seen before because both of those things and everything in between is like something that people love about Spider-Man's story and like what particular spider person or villain or setting or school or age or power set or suit like connects to you. Well, maybe there's an answer that's fixed forever and maybe that changes over time. And like that's one of the great joys of falling in love with a superhero and a comic book story. It tells you something about yourself,

right? So Spidey does that for so many people. so many youngsters who are trying to figure out like how to fit in or how to navigate some sort of changing circumstance in their life. There's just like a joy to the world and the character that is, even though we have not ourselves been bitten yet by radioactive spiders, that feels like, okay, I get it. I know what it's like to be Peter or Miles or Gwen or Spider-Noir or Spider-Nor or Spider-Ham or whomever. Do you all like after you see a Spider-Man movie, when you see spiders in the real world? Do you have a different response to it? Like, does it shift from debilitating fear to like, well, should I, should I reach out with my hand or expose the back of my neck

and see what happens? Is that a thought that goes to your head? Absolutely. Absolutely not. Not a damn day in my life. Have I ever saw this spider? No. No. Oh, no. I still do not like spiders. Actually, it makes me hate them more now because what if the one is radioactive? What if one really hurts me? Also, I'm already giant. I'm already at where I want to be physically. I don't need to get bigger. And when I say bigger, I mean, like, tall as hell, really strong, accidentally knock a hole in a wall. So no, I don't like spiders. I think this movie made me hate the more. I remember reading that when Andrew Garfield was preparing for the role, you know how a lot of actors they'll go kind of method. If they're playing a doctor, they'll embed themselves with doctors.

They'll try to learn what a doctor's life is like, Andrew Garfield studied spiders. I don't know exactly what that entails. Classic. He wanted to make realistic spider-like. movements. So I would guess that he probably came away from that feeling more sympathetic towards spiders. I mean, spiders, there are allies, right? Not just when it comes to crime fighting, but also when it comes to annoying insect fighting. Some of us have seen the film arachnophobia and we will never like turn on a lamp the same way, step in a shower the same way, like, forget it. Forget it. No. What do you think Jeremy Strong would do have asked to play? Oh, my gosh.

How would Jeremy Strong prepare? He would weave his own web shooters. He would weave his own web and then sleep on it. He lives in like the forest and a little hammock of spider web. Exactly. Oh my gosh. Gossamer. Beautiful.

Okay. Should we run through the categories? We have four drafters today. We have six categories. Here's what they are. Spider person. We will each. should be selecting a franchise's spider being. So to be clear, more than one of us could in

theory select a Peter Parker, but Jess already mentioned Andrew, let's just stick with him. Only one of us can pick Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker. So we can't pick, I am selecting Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker from Amazing Spider-Man, and then someone else says, I am selecting Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker from No Way Home. Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker can only be selected once. Okay. A given franchise, though, of course, can have more than one eligible spider person. The Spider-Verse franchise obviously has legions.

So you can pick more than one character from a given movie or franchise, but the same character can only be selected once. Villain. Once again, you must choose the specific performers version, not just the character. So you'd have to say Catherine Hans Doc Ock from Into the Spider-Verse, not just Doc Ock. So more than one Doc Ock could, in theory, be selected in this draft, but only one person can pick Hans, Olivia. Okay. Plus one.

Flexible category. This could be a love interest. It could be a guy in the chair. It could be a sidekick. It could be a partner. Any companion, basically. Now, again, you must pick the specific version. so Emma Stone's Gwen Stacy, not just Gwen Stacy.

Another thing that we should clarify is that certain characters will be eligible in multiple categories, but again, the character can only be selected once. So if somebody selects, tough to give examples. Dipping. Let's just stick again with Andrew Garfield. I love how much Andrew's getting mentioned in the podcast. What's a very pro-Andr-Garfield crew. If somebody selected Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker as their spider person, then Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker could not later be selected as a mentor or a wild car.

Okay. Only one selection. Once someone's off the board, they are off the board. God. Oh, God, I'm going to lose. You're going to do great. You're going to crush it. All your heart.

God. Next category. Mentor. Now, this is distinct from plus one, though there could be certainly some overlap in how you think about the categories. This could be a guardian. This could be a teacher.

This could be a relative. It doesn't have to be a family member, but it can be. And again, it's possible that you could argue for a character in either category. Any category is eligible for Wildcard, which we'll get to in a minute. So just make that part of your strategy.

And when you were selecting your pick, make sure you specify which category you are making the selection for. Because you can fill the categories in any order you want. If you want to start with accessory, go with God. Which brings us to accessory. Okay, this is the one that's going to require the most explanation here. This was the one that we had a little bit of pre-recording discussion over. Your spider being.

I was saying spider person, but what's brought in it to spider being? Maybe spider cow will be the first overall pick. Who can say? Probably depends on whether or not I get a. the first selection. Your spider being will automatically come with a suit.

Here's what we have decided collectively. It will be their first proper suit from their first appearance. As Joe put it, we're not talking onesies. The first proper spider suit that that character wears. If you want

your mash-up movie to feature another suit and it can be from any film franchise from any character, you must select that supplemental suit as your accessory. But you do not have to select a suit as an accessory. An accessory can be a different bit of drip, right? If you're thinking about fashion beyond just your fighting suit, it can be an invention, a gizmo, it can be a camera. It can be anything at all. This is a very broad category. I can see he's getting into some quibbles here. That's so cute. Do you mean Peter Parker's camera that he uses for his job of the

Dealing people, that's adorable. Maybe you want your spider person to be well-rounded with an internship or a job. Who could say? I love it. Love it. Depends again, what kind of movie you're trying to make? Not trying to be this person. I'm going to be this person for a second. So if I chose Miles Morales, am I choosing the Stan Lee costume he got, or am I choosing the spray-painted black costume that he got?

Because it's the first one here appeared. Yeah, let's use that example. So I think by the rules that we landed on pre-recording, the suit that Miles would be wearing in your movie is the debut, right, in the final act of Spider-Verse where he comes out with the spray-painted suit. Yes. Okay. Okay. Everyone in agreement. Everyone in agreement. Okay. Fantastic. But if you want him to look like he's bleeding from his armpits, you need to upgrade him to the across the Spidepressure. To a cross-suit. And if somebody else who didn't have Miles wanted to select the Stan Lee costume shop, garb, they could do that.

That's cute. Okay. You shouldn't do that now. They could do that. And it would be beautiful, just like that moment was in the movie. It always fits eventually. Damn it. And finally, our sixth category, wild card.

This can be anything. So you can double up from another category. You could pick another plus one. You could pick another mentor. You can pick another spider person. Or you could pick something else completely. didn't fit into any of the other categories. Do you want to pick a score? Do you want to pick a director, et cetera, et cetera? Do you want to have a specific setting, a specific school, or a specific

New York? Think about Wild Card in whatever way best suits your movie. And again, it's completely fine to just double up from another category or to use this to bring another element into your film that wouldn't be firmly established in a quick screenshot on Twitter otherwise. Any questions on the categories before we quickly run through our other rules? I think I'm clear on the categories. Joe, will you be drafting Paul Giamatti's rhino and building the Amazing Spider-Man 3? I think you know how much I feel compelled and drawn to anything involving Paul Giamani. So it's very possible.

That would be great. The third movie from Garfield we never got. I could see you constructing that. I mean, you know, I like to. But he should. Redemption. Redemption for Rhino. Really?

For redemption for what two bodies is doing in those scenes, really. I love a far-head tat. No? I've given some consideration to a strategy that seems so devious, so dastardly, that it could get me imprisoned by the Spider Society and banned from future drafts. But I won't know if I can pull the trigger on it until I'm on the clock. You can't draft James Cameron's theoretical

Leonardo DiCaprio of Spider-Man. All right. You have to draft from canon. Not that devious. No. It has to be a movie that was made. I understand that. Sorry to go from McGill,

but it would be a canon event. That brings us to the other rules. Let's talk about what is actually eligible here. So all global theatrical release standalone Spider-Man movies are eligible, not just live action. Obviously, the animated movie that we all just watched and loved

is the impetus for this podcast. So that means you can draft from the following 10 films. Spider-Man across the Spider-Verse. Spider-Man, No Way Home, Spider-Man, Far From Home, Spider-Man, Spider-Man, Spider-Man into the Spider-Ver Spider-Man, The Amazing Spider-Man, The Amazing Spider-Man, Spider-Man 3, Spider-Man 2, Spider-Man. Got it. Spider-Man must be in the title. You cannot draft from movies that include Spider-Man but are not standalone Spider-Man films.

So that means movies like Captain America Civil War or Infinity War or Endgame or Venom or Morbius, with apologies to Steve on the Morbius front, are not eligible for this exercise. Though to be clear if one of those characters like Venom appears in one of the 10 eligible films, that character is eligible for conclusion. So that sounds confusing, but I think ultimately it's pretty clear. If we have anything come up in real time, we'll talk it through. no limit to how many selections you can make from a given movie or franchise. It's up to you and the strategy that you want to employ.

Again, if we need a ruling at any point on a pick, we will consult our June on. Steve, when we finish, it will go to the public. The listeners will vote for their favorite draft on the ring or verse Twitter and Instagram handles. What is the best build your own Spider-Man movie? look like that's up for each of us and all of the listeners to decide. And of course, finally, it will be a snake draft. Steve will determine the order using a draft randomizer.

We will let him explain how he is going to determine the draft, but none of us know yet where we are picking. We are about to find out. And then we're going to dive in. So before Steve sets the order, any final questions on rules or approach? I think we got this. Yeah, I'm ready, although I will say here's a problem. Or maybe it isn't a problem. Maybe it's a challenge that will bring out the best in us. But in a way, I feel like we are not only competing with each other, we are competing with the existing classic Spider-Man mashup movies that are out there. Whereas in the Batman movie draft, you were essentially making a Batman multiverse movie, which didn't already exist or didn't before the flash if we want to count that. But we are going up against cinematic classics, the Spider-Verse movies, and No Way Home, that have mixed and matched

in the way that we're going to. Amy, Kevin, call us. We're ready. We're ready. It's true. It's a good point, Ben. I think that gives us a firmer and more clearly established measuring stick, but also, like, it makes this feel a little bit more valid than the Batman drafted in some way. Like, maybe anything that anybody says so they could actually happen in an eventual Spider-Man movie, which is weird, but really fun to think about. Okay. Steve Arama. Steve Rina.

So, before we began our recording, I asked Joanna Robinson, what is the coolest way that we could possibly determine the order of this draft? And she said roll a D4. Yeah. That's exactly what happened. As we all with us. Exactly what happened. We're honest on Mondays.

Wow. This is Jay Jonah Javison level of a journalistic integrity from me, Steve. Slander is spoken and print it's liable. But today, we are going to be rolling a D4 to determine the order of this draft. So Joanna Robinson, pick a number between one and four. Three. Mal, pick a number between one and four. That's not three.

Two. Ben. One. Jess? I think I'm, am I three? I'm sorry. My heart is beating so, my heart is beating so hard. Wait, wait, I picked three.

So just is four, right? Yes, justice four. All right. So with the roll of the dice, three is first. Number one is second. Esther. It's four. It's third.

Fucking nightmare. And with that, we have our order. Absolute disaster. Okay, wait. So Joe is one. Joe drafts first. Ben drafts second.

Jess drafts third. I draft fourth. And I'm on the turn, so I'll go then fifth. And then Jess, you'll be back up at six. We'll go in a snake the rest of the way. Correct.

Okay. Just walk me through. Let me just say that at the beginning, when I said there's a clear worst pick to have. It was four. I disagree. I'm despondent. I disagree.

I'm pivoting in real time to something that I think will be bold and fresh. I'm going to embrace it. I'm excited. This is what happened with the hype draft where I got number one and I took everyone's number one pick and it was great and then it was just absolute slaughterhouse for me and the rest. I think it helps me a lot around you. But we'll see. If the first round goes the way that I'm anticipating, it's I have to do something.

thing. I have to do something bold, but I'm prepared to. And so that's, that's just the way it goes. Oh, boy. Okay. Joe, Ben, Jess, Mal. I think that if we wanted, we could ask how Steve determined who got to pick the first number. Like, where was that draft randomizer determined? But you know what? Who has the time? All right. Should we kick things off? Should we build the best Spider-Man movie? Let's do it. This episode is brought to you by Weather Tech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP and making a mess. You don't need WeatherTech floor liners in the summer unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips.

Yeah, you'd be pretty happy about those WeatherTech seat protectors. So just to be clear as the mud, you're inevitably going to step into the summer. You don't need WeatherTech unless you plan on doing summer. Visit weathertech.com today. This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable internet means everything for your business. And even this podcast, that's why I trust Spectrum Business. It keep companies of all sizes connected with internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone, TV, mobile services, plus 24-7 US-based support. Millions of business owners already trust Spectrum Business. So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. episode is brought to by Nass Energy. Every ounce of dirt, sweat, and gears, every checkered flag and trophy raised, every lap, every race, every hard-fought place. They're all jammed inside every can of Nass Energy, high-performance energy for burning the midnight oil in the garage and pedal to the metal

human horsepower for the streets. Go ahead, crack open a can of Nass Energy and get after it. Joe? Shock us all with the first pick. No, honestly, I thought that I was breaking. to go last. And so I was ready to pick something. And then I listened to Jess, try not to give her hand away, but either she's like playing like dimensional chess or it's just playing like with an open and honest and naive heart. And I think it's the second. I don't want to take Andrew Garfield from her, which it seems like something that she

seems to care about. But I was prepared to go for Andrew. I'm going to go with Tom Hollis Peter Parker. Whoa. Okay. I'm genuinely surprised. Okay. Wow.

Wow. Okay. That's a good Peter. That's a good Peter. That's a good. It's a great pick. Yeah. I'm just surprised.

That's tough. Yeah. That's a Volter pick. I might have gone with that pick actually. It sounds like you two are surprised, but that might have been my number one also. I'm surprised that Joe. Yeah. Went with that pick.

Yeah. That's fair. Yeah. Any, any, any. Any reasoning, Joe? Any explanation? Thinking about all the other components that I want to arrange, I just feel like Tom, and especially when we're talking about that like coming of age, I mean, I think there's two clear great coming of age picks and someone else will get the other one. But I just think that like for all the other

components that I would like, no, are there, for all the other components that I would like to slide into place, I think Tom fits the best. We love. love Tom Holland. Phenomenal Peter Parker. So, yeah. Yeah, he's my Peter, I'd say. I like a coming of age story, which is why I like Spider-Man in general, right? And it's funny, Jess earlier mentioned that she was a teen during the Andrew Garfield

Spider-Man movies. Andrew Garfield was not a teen during Andrew Garfield Spider-Man movies. He was not even particularly close. Tom Holland is the only one thus far who actually has been a teen when he's. started playing Spider-Man, which I do appreciate. I like a Spider-Man story that feels like Spider-Man meets Freaks and Geeks. And I guess there are some actual cast members from freaks and geeks who have been intimately involved in Spider-Man Homecoming and other Spider-Man movies. But I like it what it feels like a true high school story. And I think he may be the only one who

has actually pulled that off for me. You're not supposed to be making jokes. Please do it. It's a good for your enemies today. I thought we were going to each other for the next 90 minutes. That's what I was told. No, no, no, no. This is a best friend's draft race and I love it.

I love this. I love this. Harmony. We need like a lot of swips to the temples here. Come on. Love. Love. I mean, I also love Tom Holland's Peter Parker,

but once another drafter selects Tom Hollins, Peter Parker, it is your moral obligation to annihilate the pick. I'm speaking from the heart here. So, Marl, you have like hours,

hours of podcast record supporting Tom Hall and Peters Parker. I think it's a fantastic pick. I genuinely, I love the pick, sincerely. I think it's great.

I'm shocked you made it, but I think it's great. Love to be surprised. All right. My first pick, I could go in several different directions here, but I guess,

don't be a coward. Do the thing that you said you were going to do. So, no, Mallory, stop. Be bold. Ben, pick the top seed.

Come on. I have a very bold idea that I'm not sure would survive an appeal here, and it might actually go to Stephen Arjuna. Can I draft Toby McGuire's Spider-Man as a villain by virtue of evil emo Toby in Spider-Man 3? I just love that, but I'm not the producer. Here's what I love about the strategy. taking Toby off the board before somebody else can pick him as a spider person, I just think is,

I'm fucking awesome. I agree, but I think you are leaving, now you are screwing yourself on the Spider-Man category and leaving Mallory to, the Spider-Man category. Doesn't leave me with one of two picks I would not have otherwise been left with? Maybe, but that's not why you should do it, then.

Oh, sure. Sure, sure. No, I genuinely do think that's valid. Why wouldn't it be? I just don't think Ben, I just don't think anyone's going to pick Toby until you come back around.

That's what I think. It is possible that he might not be picked. He would definitely be picked before making it back to you. Yeah. And it sounds like... He's not making it back to you. You got to do it here.

Yeah. I mean, I still need to go get a Spidey if I take Toby in this category, which is a problem. Oh, God. Ben, don't do this. Don't do this. All right.

Not like this. I'm not going to do this. I'm not going to do this. I liked it. I think it's great. I have another way I could go. Shameful cowardice. Might still be bold and devious.

Pick it on the loop. Pick it on the other side. We won't be there on the loop. It will. Promise. It might be. Here's what I'm going to do. In the Batman draft,

there was a number one pick that was kind of the consensus, I think. And that was about the best villain in that franchise in the Batman movies. And I think there's a similar kind of. consensus when it comes to the best villain in a Spider-Man movie. What are you doing? And so I'm going to take Wilm Defoe's Norman Osborne here. I have to say this is a delightfully astounding start to the draft. I can't believe that this is happening.

Wow. Okay. Walk us through it. I just don't see how you could dispute that he is probably the best villain in Spider-Man movie history. Now, it's a deep category. And Maori draft guru Rubin will always point out that one should consider positional scarcity when it comes to drafting. That's what makes this, I have to say, baffling. Baffling.

Like, Ben, this is best friend's draft. I adore you. I want to support you. Shred him. He's a fighter person. I think. Let him live. Let him live.

He's made a good decision. I think the listeners will support me. I think they're going to see Norman Osborne's smiling face. It's a great egg. And they won't respond to that. He is a character who died and yet appeared in several subsequent Spider-Man movies because he is such. And to borrow some malterms, iconic and indelible screen presence, that you can't kill him.

You can't remove him from this franchise. He steals the show in No Way Home, at least on the villain side of things, right? You put all the villains together, and that's when he really shines when you see that he was the true authentic Spider-Man villain all along. Goblin appears in every Spider-Man franchise in some form. I just think you can't go wrong with anchoring your movie with Spidey's number one nemesis. Okay. Ben saw hundreds of hours of ringer draft canon events and just took the goblin glider right to the heart of the defined strategy of positional scarcity.

You have to respect the boldness. You have to. Just threw like a pumpkin bomb in your own draft, my friend. Shodd's number one Heath Ledger, Joker picked in the Batman draft, a similarly deep category. I do think that was different. I think the standing of William Defoe's Norman Osborne is, if not quite the same, similar. More will be revealed in time. But just to undermine your point right now, I will say that I don't even have him number

one of my personal villain power ranking for this draft. Damn. Damn. Damn. Oh boy. Okay, Ben. You know what?

You came to play. She's crazy. I don't know if I came to win, but I came to play. Joanna is dismayed right now. We had like one shot, one shot to neutralize Mallory. Jess, you're up. And I'm choosing, and I,

And this is, this is, sorry, I'm following the steps. This is the, the best friend, the mate, the cool person. No, you can pick what I pick. Any, no, any category you want. This is just your number one overall pick. So if you want to pick your spider person, you can. If you want to pick your mentor, you can. And you're confused because you're like,

why did Ben draft the villain first? You're like, why didn't do that? Surely it must be mandated that we all pick from different categories, but not so. No. Go back to what I said and take it all out. Because Ben, that was a ridiculous pick for her first. pick. I'm so sorry. I don't think anyone's going to jump on that.

But I think someone will jump on, oh, God, which one's more important to me? My heart is racing right now. I got to take Catherine's hon. Dococ. I got to take Catherine's Hahn. Doc. I got to. I don't even understand what we're doing. Villains. I got you.

I'm okay. There's a run on villains. In the first show. I have to take my Catherine Hahn's dog. And you will understand why as I go further. Okay, so you have a strategy. As I go first, I have a strategy. Okay.

Rolling down to number 10 on my villain ranking to cross that out. You'll see. I mean, she's a great villain. You will see. She's a great villain, but you'll understand my theme. And I, what I gave you earlier when I said how Andrew Garneiled is important to me is number two out of the reasons why I love Spider-Man. The number one will come. through at the end of this dress and I will show you why Spider-Man means a lot to me.

And I support it. No disrespect to the pick because people were just piling on mine. But if Norman Osborne is not Mal's top villain, I will say that Catherine Hunts, Doc Ock is not even my top doc, which is no disrespect to her performance. But if I'm about to do what I think she's going to do, then I think it's really cool. Yes. There's a larger plan here. Just you wait.

I just had to make sure because it doesn't work without her. And I need her. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, I see what I go for. I like this. I like it. Okay. I respect this.

I don't see what Ben is doing quite yet, but I look forward to finding out. Ben is drafting the most beloved and indelible Spider-Man villainable time. Okay, Molly, here you are. Speaking of beloved and indelible. Sincerely, I have had some surprises and drafts. My dear friends and colleagues. I can't believe this. I have never, I can barely speak right now.

I'm like quivering. I'm so bad. Joe's killing me. Joe's face. Not only do I get to make one amazing pick here. I get to make two on the turn here. Holy fuck. Okay.

Composing myself. With my first selection, the number four, astoundingly, the number four overall pick, the final pick in round one. I will be selecting my spider person. I will be selecting

Miles Morales, Spider-Man. Avianna of a blad! Okay. My name is Mallory Rubin. I was bitten by a radioactive spider. And apparently for like two minutes, I've been the one and only person drafting because I just got to take Miles

with the fourth fucking pick. Oh, please. Oh, my God. Mine will all come together. You just have to wait. But it will be there. I'm not, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not, I'm not known for my, my patience, I got to say. I just need you to know that the maniacal cackling that you're hearing right now is your fault.

Literally. Literally. Miles off the board. Oh, my goodness. Incredible character. Incredible Spider-Man. Incredible visual palette. I now get to be in the spiderverse in my movie.

This is just thrilling in a way that I can barely believe. and to build on the joy, to build on the jubilation, I will be selecting my plus one. Villain can wait because, as mentioned, multiple times it is an exceedingly deep and varied category. I will be selecting to pair with Miles Morales, my plus one,

Sendea's MJ, from homecoming, far from home and no way home. You know, I know a couple of magic words myself, starting with the word, please. But I don't even know if I'm going to have to say please when I ask people to vote for my team at the end of it based on how this is going.

Just like to thank my fellow drafters. I'm unfaced. Don't involve me in this. Don't involve me in this. Don't involve me in this. I need to do with this. now. Absolutely delighted. I'm still in a really good position. Actually, you didn't take anyone that I was going to take. I was just, I was thinking that this is shaping up for Joe to be able to do something

fairly remarkable at two, three, I think on the turn. This has been us. Just a, wow. Boy. Okay. Jess, it is back to you for your second selection. I'm so mad. I should have taken to die when I had the chance. Should have taken to die when I had the chance. Um, I'm, I'm, going to choose, I got Doc Ock, I'm going to choose, which is wild as hell, I'm going to choose my mentor. Is that okay? Can I choose my mentor? Absolutely. Absolutely. Which, again, I don't think any of all will probably take, but it is our own favorite, quick, quick cameo appearance, Charlie Cox, Matt Murdoch. That is my mentor. I'm taking it. Now I don't know what you're doing, but I'm still really into it. I'm waiting. I'm waiting. I'm waiting. Charlie Cox, Matt Murdoch. Once I reveal who the other, I have a full template to tell you, explain why. I'm excited. But I now have my doc, Catherine Hans, Doc Ock, and my mentor is Charlie Cox's Matt Murdoch.

Are you making a comedy? That hurt my feelings. No, I mean, that's like a compliment. You're picking a lot of comedic performance, comedically inclined performers. No, I'm choosing something as politically driven as possible. And we'll get there in a minute. We'll get there in a minute. We'll get there in a minute. Oh, okay.

Okay. Now I feel like I'm back. Good, good. Okay, we are back to Benjamin for your second bit. well, as predicted, as foretold, Toby did make it back to me. So I will take Toby McGuire Spider-Man as a spider-man as a spider-person, not as a villain. Wow. Evil Spider-Man is now off the board as well.

Andrew falling to Joanna. This is collectively a shameful failure. Don't be so sure. We'll see. Not until she selects Andrew. But I am taking Toby to pair with his nemesis, William Defoe's Norman Osborne, the timeless battle between those two will be renewed. They have a lot of history.

We will be exploring that history in my film. This is like... She's about to say something so mean. Well, no, I... This is like interesting to be on the other side of this because I selected many picks from the Nolan franchise in the Batman draft. And Sean said to me,

can I ask you, why are you making a movie we've seen before? And I would like to now ask you the same question. Why are you making a movie we've seen before? I will deviate. I will deviate from those films. But those were fine and successful and trailblazing films.

That's what you want to do. In your draft, if in the second round you could say those were fine, you gotta do it. You gotta do it. This is Mallory learning from her experience drafting Bain, which she thought was really gonna get her somewhere. I love, that was a dark correlation for me.

Oh, honey. I stand by the take. That was one of the drafts where I went with my heart, not appealing to what I thought people would vote for. No, she was like, people love Bain And we were like, people love to make fun of Bain. It's just a great performance. I respect coming at it through your heart

because I think that's what I'm doing right now and I'm going to learn that like I need to appease people at the next draft. But this draft, I think I'm coming too deep from the heart. So it clearly might not win. But I respect it and I get it. I understand it. Maybe not Bain, but a little bit.

To be clear, what I said the original Spider-Man trilogy were fine films. I meant fine, not fine. Yeah. A more positive complimentary way. Fine films. Oh, yes. Yes. Whether or not, Toby is your preferred Spider-Man. I think every subsequent Spider-Man owes a debt to Toby for establishing the character in the movie canon for demonstrating that good movies could be made out of Spider-Man, that it was economically and creatively viable. And I think there's a lot of love out there still for him.

me, right? Joe, it's you on the turn. You have two picks back to back. Yeah. I am like brimming with power right now. Okay, so, like, Mallory's, like, trying to adopt draft Daddy Sean's position of, like, why I make a movie that we've seen before. And I agree with you.

But at the same time, it's not going to stop me in the mentor category from picking Robert Downey Jr.'s Tony Stark. Why would I leave that on the table for anyone at all? Yeah. So, great grab. Tony's in my draft as my mentor. Great pick. Great pick.

The question is, yeah, I mean, I guess I just never dreamed that I would have this opportunity, and so I have to take it. So in my plus one, I'm going to go with the lankiest, the lankiest, most emotional spider person there ever was. Andrew Garfield's amazing Spider-Man. I love you know, Mallory knows how much I love Andrew Garfield. Jess and I can talk about this for hours. Let's go talk about Andrew Garfield, Spider-Man. I love him so much. I so love Andrew.

Love his comeback in the culture from No Way Home. Huge, huge emotional moment for me and for him. And, yeah. So here it is, my all white straight male drafts up far. I, no, no, I, uh, yeah. Oh, man. We got room. We got room.

We got room. Oh, I have plans. I have plans. But yeah. Oh, okay. Incredible. Okay. Wow.

Tony. Oh, is it back to me? Is it back to me? It is Ben. Oh, damn. Okay, go Ben. Wow. Back to me already.

Yeah. Zippy draft so far. Yeah. This is moving quickly. All right. Okay. For my next pick. I will be selecting my plus one, I believe, and I will be taking Ned Leeds.

Yeah. There you go. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I guess you could quibble with whether separating Tom Holland and Ned Leads, whether the friendship, whether the bromance will be quite as effective with Toby behind the mask in the costume and Ned in the chair. but I think if we can age adjust here,

if I'm getting the younger Toby, who appeared in the first Spider-Man film, that I think it'll be more age-appropriate. I think they will bond. Ned is, I think, the best spider friend. I was considering taking Andrew Garfield as Peter 3 in plus one just to spite all the Garfield lovers on this draft if he had fallen to me. So it was wise for you to take him there, Joanna.

I can't believe he fell that far. I thought he would go third overall. I'm four. Me too. Me too. I was sure of it. More so than all of the crushes, more so than all of the love stories. I think the true love story of the Spider-Man movie franchise is Ned and Spider-Man.

I thought you were going to say Ned and the Emperor Palpatine Lego, you know? Somehow. He is a big Star Wars fan. Also played into my pick slightly here. Yeah, you guys could build the Death Star together. That's beautiful. You could both sit in the school library and pretend. that you were looking at porn to cover for your friend.

What are pals for? So might he one day turn into Hobgoblin and the love and friendship will curdle? I suppose that is possible. But to this point, it is pure. It's friendship. It's love. He's dependable. He's good with a computer.

I want Ned Leeds by my side in any adventure we could concoct here. And of all your Hobgoblin options, I feel like this is the best one, honestly. Oh, God. All right. What is, okay. Back to you, Jess. Did everyone, did everyone choose their plus ones? Am I allowed to ask that?

Am I allowed to be like, everybody has a plus one except for you currently. Yes, that's correct. And everyone has a Spider-Man except for me. Okay. Yep. So I'm not losing now. It's only up from here, baby. My plus one.

My plus one. My plus one. Yeah, yeah, you took Zendai's MJ away from me. Whatever. I didn't need her. I didn't need her. We don't need her. If she's listening on this podcast, I love you.

I love you. I need you. I need you in my life. But right now, I had a backup in case because I knew she was really good. And this backup, I'm not trying to shoot myself in the foot, isn't as good as her, to be fair. But it's very fun regardless. It's very fun regardless. And I don't think anyone was going to take it.

So I waited last. I guess. My plus one to my Spider-Man that you guys don't know yet is Max Dillon, specifically Max Dillon, not Electro is Max Dill. I want Max Dill when, before he's Electro, when he is the nerdy scientist and he keeps getting pushed around. That specifically is the plus one. It is not Demon Electro yet.

This is Max Dillon we're talking about. Jamie Fox. Now, again, it will make sense. It will make sense, I promise. The reveal at the end is going to be spectacular. Unless the plan becomes clear. It better be. The suspense is mounting.

We're building to a great third actor, sixth act, and the final pick. My goodness. I can't wait to give you the Spider-Man and you guys be like, Jessica, what the hell is this? Jessica, what the hell is this? It's a bold new strategy. Okay. Max Dillon. as the plus one.

So everybody has a plus one now. Okay. Back to me. On the turn. So I have two picks in a row. Once again, astonishing. I am about to select my villain who,

as I teased earlier, I had someone other than Green Goblin ranked as the number one overall villain, as I suspect. Many spidey enthusiasts do. I will now. be selecting with pride and joy. Alfred Molina's Doc Ack.

Avianna from Laude. The power of the draft in the palm of my hand. I just can't, I can't believe Doc Ock is still here, this Doc Ock. The reason I didn't choose Doc Ock, it was very specific where after I saw him in No Way Home, I was like... No longer a villain to you, right? Yeah, and he's also not that... I was like, oh, I want Miles to go up against someone

that's hardcore as hell. Like, what? And then I'm like, Doc, OK, sure. But... He's no Norman Osborne. He's 1A to Norman's one. That I would want to go against. This is, I think, part of what makes

Alfred Molina's Otto Octavia is such a compelling character, ultimately. And I think this is a through line across many of the more interesting and engaging spidey foils, including to give credit to Ben here, including Ben's pick. I think this is something that they both share, which is a connection to our hero, right? So the fact that across a given property, a given Spidey might have some sort of admiration or respect or interest in Otto's research, auto's work, scientific pursuits.

And then what happens when things fester, when they sour, when someone that you trust or admire ends up being your foe? Well, you'll all get to find out in the movie that I'm making. And then, hey, what if there's a redemption quest? We love a character on an arc, Joe.

We say that all the time. So the fact that in Doe Way Home, Doc Ack was as much friend as foe, is ultimately two. this character's credit. This gives me the ability to try more things and to play in more arenas.

Who wants something that is neat and tidy? You know, the goblins screaming at himself and shouting in the mirror pointy fangs and no. Give me something a little more nuanced than that for my film. Okay, Mallory.

And then... You can't love her of gallum. You can't love him. But screen goblins. Thank you for proving my point. But yeah, I think that is true. I know, and this was something I was actually worried about with the draft. Would I be able to achieve some sort of balance across the different franchises?

So far, I've got Spider-Verse accounted for. I have the MCU films accounted for, and I have the original films accounted for. Hey, same here. So I'm feeling great about that. I will now, with sincere joy in my heart once again, be going back to the MCU for my mentor. And I can't believe that I beat Ben to this pick. I just can't believe it.

My team, my movie, my squad is about to have the hottest aunt around. Aunt May, Marissa Tomey, welcome to the family. Bring those high-wasted jeans. right on over to the movie we're making. Deeply surprised that you beat Ben to Mercer Tomei. I am, Lord. Ben, I thought you could sense that with your bed tingle that I would make this thick if you didn't.

Just can't believe it. What a wonderful character, right? The MCU's decision to make May, look, with a lot of love and respect in my heart sincerely for the elderly among us, to make May young and cool and hot and independent fit queen drip lord on May. Dayton breaking happy's heart, helping Peter packing up the suit when Peter needs it like there but also doing her own thing.

I'm just not sure how much mentoring she does for Peter actually at the end of the day. But she's deeply hot and if you want some chicken larb, like you know where to go. I lorpe you. And I larp that I got to make it. Pick you up from the airport. Great. But like as far as advice is going, I don't know that it's coming from May. I think that this is, I'm glad that you said this and this is part of actually sincerely

what I love about this character as a mentor. Like whether it's Peter in those films or Miles and MJ here in the movie that I'm making our heroes need support. They need people who believe in them. They don't need people who are stifling them and suffocating them and trying to thwart and inhibit their own potential. Marissa Tomey's Aunt May is exactly the kind of mentor

that my movie needs. Oh my God, I just love a zag when Mallory Rubin, number one, Tony Stark Defender tries to start throwing subtle shade at Tony Stark. No, that wasn't necessarily about Tony. I love Tony. I love Tony. As you know, I'm a, I'm a staunch believer that the Peter Tony dynamic is really to those movies credit. I love that bond. Love Ant Tomay. Good pick. I enjoy the gender swap of the great power, great responsibility line after. And the true

or more comics accurate version of the line as well. So there's that. My movie is going to be authentic to the source material. Thank you. I appreciate Doc Ack as well. If Norman Osborne had been selected, then I would have been happy to take him. I think that's really a throughline of Spider-Man villains. Not only what you mentioned, that they're sort of a darkest timeline version of Peter, at least in Doc Ock's case and in Norman Osbournes, but also there's a sympathetic, tragic element to a lot of them, right? They didn't start out with bad intentions.

They had great intentions, and then their inhibitor chip got fried, and then things went a ride. But with a lot of these guys, they started out with either a good intentions or just stumbled into the wrong radioactive area or anti-matter surrounding or whatever it was. I would also have- At day at the office, who among us? Yeah.

High on my villain board, probably higher than the consensus also would have been Flint Marco and Thomas Hayden Church's Sandman who shares that same sort of, you know, just wondered into the wrong. I love your defense of Sandman. I love it. I love Samman. Try like content. The real enemy is the health care system.

Right. Yes. Just try to take care of his kids. Yeah. We've all been there. Beautiful. Yeah. Yeah.

I knew you'd have at least one as a father of daughters and a son of a mother moment on your body. There it was. Yeah. A great girl dad. Sam, man. Love it. Okay. Next pick.

It is back to Jess. It's me. It's you. It's me. It's me. It's time. It's time for the reveal. Oh.

It's the reveal time of my Spider-Man. And this, I wrote my notes to why this is true. So I'm sorry if you see me look down a lot. It's because I'm looking at my notes because I need to make sure it's said out loud. I love Andrew Garfield, Spider-Man. Yes, I do. But the real reason I like Spider-Man is because Spider-Man over the time has been, it's Peter Parker. It's Peter Parker.

It's the same kind of story. And you need to keep it fresh. and they have been keeping it fresh to their due. And I love how they're keeping it fresh. But across the Spider-Verse does it in a way that includes so many people that don't normally get to see themselves because Peter Parker is the same man. And so I chose Spider-Punk Hobie Brown because this is a rebellious film. This is going to be a rebellious film.

And this is why I chose Catherine Hahn. Not only is he 70s punk and she is 60 science hippie, they both have the same mission of rebelling, kind of in their career. and in their education. And I think they're two sides of the same coin. What we loved about Killmonger and what we liked about Black Panther, where were they two sides of the same coin?

They just had different outcomes, different impacts on the outcome, which I think is the same between Hobie and Doc Ox, Catherine Hahn. I think they're both just so important to their mission. They just like freedom. They want to make sure they can do it under their own guys, whether hers is working for Fisk and his is working for the Spider Society. So I think these two enemies would have that conflict

of being the same kind of person. So it makes sense why I would choose Zendaya, but I ended up going with Max Dillon. I ended up going with Max Dillon. And I think because Max Dillon would look up to Hobie as kind of a mentor of being like, hey, just be chill, be cool about it,

you're fine, don't listen to these people that are really mean to you, something that he needed in the film. And this way, maybe he wouldn't become a villain, or maybe Hobie would help him follow a career as Electro as a good guy somehow. I don't know. But I do think Max Dillan would be a good one.

Why I chose Charlie Cox. Instead of becoming friends with Gwen's dad, becoming friends with the cops, the police, go to like the real person that can get you a lawyer, the lawyer of the MCU, who is a rebellious person, who literally puts crime and justice into his own hands. He's like, oh, I don't like how the courts are doing this.

I'm going to go handle it on the ground myself. So I think him and Hobie doing that together have the same mission and integrity of just being like, hey, you know what? No, this guy was wrong. We're going to go give him a what to. Now, M.R. 4, streetwise, vigilanteism all the time. No, because sometimes you're beating the wrong ass. But I think Hobie does come from a good heart and a good spirit, and so does Charlie Cox, or so does Matt Murdoch.

And I think their mission to fight would be so great. And it'd be kind of what we got in the comics with Peter Parker, sometimes coming to Cross Daredevil. We would just get it with Hobie Brown. So that is why I chose ultimately Hobie Brown. We want a Warriors movie. You're going to get one. We're going to get a British 70s punk Warriors movie. with this right here. That's really fun. That's really fun. Love it. Great.

Love it. Also, now you're the only one of us with like a central spider person who hasn't starred in a movie already. So you're making, you're making something new. Yeah. I like it. If they're listening to this podcast right now, I just want, I want to, I want a credit on it. I want a credit on it. Cody Ziegler, if you're listening, I want to credit on this.

But I do love Hobie. I loved him so much as soon as he was revealed in the movie. I love an anarchist, a socialist. I love them. And so watching him, I just want to see more. And so I'm building a world for him. That's it. That's it.

I feel like I should preface this with a mal-style expression of disbelief that this pick is still available to me. And I will say that with joy and jubilation in my heart, which are very rarely in this character's heart, I will be selecting J.K. Simmons's J. Jonah Jameson. the only character in the Spider-Man franchise. That's a good question. I could take him in any number.

I think you could make a case for him as a villain. I already have a villain. Could make a case for him as a mentor. He does give Peter his first job in journalism. I guess, yeah. But I will be taking him as a wild card. Wild card. Okay.

J. Josephson is the only character who is so iconic, so associated with one actor. that he cannot be recast. He can either not appear in your film, or he can come back, but be bald instead of having a flat top now. If you're going to have Jay Jonah Jameson in your movie, then it is going to be J.K. Simmons, because he is so inextricable from that character.

He so embodies that character. He brought that comic's character to life in such a way that he is irreplaceable. And you could make a great case for him as a villain, I think, in some ways. He is a greater antagonist to Peter Parker than many of the villains that we've already named. But at times, when he's not in his Alex Jones online video mold, he sometimes has better impulses, and those can be appealed to. He does not pay well if you're an enterprising journalist.

He has not done a lot to increase confidence in the fourth estate. So as a member of the media and the press, I wish he would be a better representative for us in popular media. However, there is no character more memorable to the point of being unrecastable than J.K. Syvins's J. Joe and Jameson. It's a good pick. I thought it's one Joe might make at some point. However, I once again am compelled to note that you're just taking the slingering and putting Ned into a Sam

Ramie movie that is otherwise unchanged. That's okay because, I mean, I kind of think, I mean, given the temperature on Franco these days, I feel like that is the, that's the spot that was most in need of a recast. So it's a great job. Right. Thank you. That was your, so the first wild card pick has been made with that one. Okay.

And it's about to be joined my one. Okay, so I've got two right here. Go on the turn here. Yeah. Yep. So easy for me. All right. I'm going to actually start with my.

My villain. My villain, we were talking about how we like two sides of the same coin for villains. We like to see that dark mirror Mallory. You and I talk about that a lot, blah, blah. We love a symbiote suit. I'm going to pick Tom Hardy's venom in my villain category here. Amy Pascal's like, yes, that's all I want is for Tom Hardy's venom to fight Tom Holland, Spider-Man. Thank you so much, Joanna Robinson.

So there we go. a lot of quips to go with a lot of thwips. Really excited for this. Which brings me to my wild card. I have no notes on the pick, sincerely. And I am, it is with great joy, jubilation in my heart. I am honestly staggered and astonished that we have gotten this far. I can't believe in it.

Wait, do you know what I'm going to pick here? I have to assume, because there's one character who I just can't believe is still here. I don't know. Same, I'm assuming. What is it? Who is it? No, you would think because then that would add some diversity of my pick, but that's not what I'm doing. No, no women.

Oh, my God. No people of color. Good. Thank you. Thank you for the clarification. It is my bright parts only lineup of Spiner people. Oh, no, no, no. I am picking Chris Evans as Steve Rogers, who appears in home package.

Wow. On the TV, right? I've got Captain America and Iron Man and Venom in my... Oh, but they're eligible. Technicalities. But are you making a Spider-Man movie? Yeah, I am. I absolutely am.

You're not making an Avengers movie? I have two core spider people and a classic Spider-Man villain in my movie. So yes, do I have to event two top-tier varsity A-plus Avengers-en movie? my movie? Yes, but I also have two top-tier Spider-Men in my movie and Venom. Okay. Yes. Will what role will Cap be playing in your film? Will he be also trying to mentor Peter and then causing strife with Tony and a lot of infighting is going to break out or like, what is he just going to sit on the moon? What's Cap up to in your film? Oh, they're going to be talking about, like, they're going to be enjoying a movie marathon together.

and Peter Parker's going to be like, have you seen this old movie? Here are all my movie references and tap writes it down. And he's going to be like, no, I need to put it in my little journal. Let's watch it together. Incredible. Okay. Bold. I really think you're just jealous that I have, Captain America.

I'm not. You did get really good people. I'm out of going with the All Avengers drafts, but I decided not to. It's not all Avengers. Stephen Strange is not invited to this party. is still out there. He could be your accessory. A wizard is your accessory?

Steven's not invited. No. That's so sad that none of us put Dr. Strange on our thing. I mean, Ben has to pick a mentor. He could take him right now. Oh, so sorry. Oh, so sorry. But I will not.

I will be the first to select an accessory. Am I the first to select an accessory? You will be. It's kind of a thin category, I guess you could say. So maybe it's surprising that we haven't already drafted an accessory, or maybe it reflects our lack of it. of enthusiasm for the options here. When you think about Spider-Man, you don't necessarily think of accessories immediately,

especially if we're counting suits and web shooters as kind of the default goes with the Spidey. So there are fancy suits out there, and there are other Stark devices that are available to you all. Not a pretty old suit, though. You sure you don't want to pick another one? It's true. It's classic. However, I will be selecting the dimensional travel watch from the Spider-Verse films because it, It opens up so many possibilities for me.

If this turns into a franchise, I can have an unlimited number of settings. This is like filming on the volume, except even more convincing. I can go anywhere at any time. Always goes well. So I sure it'll be fine. Except I will be on location. I won't need to be on the volume. I can go to the universe that looks like the location that I want to use as the backdrop for my film.

This obviously will save me some money when I'm budgeting for this film because, again, I can just slip into another universe whenever I want. If I need to do a scene change, no problem, just use my watch. I can change my setting. And it means that I can move freely between live action settings and animated settings. I can port my Ramey Spider-Man figures from standard old Earth into all sorts of variant earths with the beautiful comics-inspired background and art. And we can just traips around the multiverse.

And I can bring my familiar characters into unfamiliar settings and expose them to all sorts of encounters and backchrops that they have not seen thus far. And they'll all be fish out of water because I am mostly drafting non-multiversal figures here. And I am exposing them to the multiverse, which will be shocking and they will have to adapt to these new surroundings. It'll be fascinating to see what they do and what my writers come up with once the strike is over, of course. And I'm very excited about the potential here. I've opened up an infinite number of worlds of possibilities for my franchise. Love it. Great.

Thank you. Beautiful. Back to Jess. Okay. This kind of flips the script for me, but for my wild card and tell me if I'm not allowed to do this, I want to add a plus one and I want it to be Miles Morales's prowler. Is that a possibility?

Ooh, interesting. I guess it remains to be. seen whether he could qualify as a plus one, right? But it might need a ruling on this one. It depends on what he's against. I'm really into it. I'm really into it. I think so because... I mean, it's different actor.

Yeah, like, it's of a piece with multiple peters being eligible for selection, right? So I think that's fine. Yeah, I think you can do that. We just have to specify Miles G. Morales is the prowler. We don't know. Yeah, we don't know yet. And the reason I'm putting him as a plus one is because there's a, the scale for even who Hobie is is kind of unbalanced, right?

So it depends on what you would consider good or bad, wrong and right, evil and not evil. So I think with the prowlers, Miles and Miles, why I've chosen him as a plus one is mainly, A, we don't really know what he's fighting in Earth 42 right now. But we know Earth 42 is a pretty crazy wild place. So we don't know what side he necessarily on. we don't we just know that the prowler is bad so we don't know if miles is bad bad yet but i could also see hobie and him being friends like as he's transitioning into becoming a bad prowler and then he's like oh he's gonna die and this is going to be my canon event but that is why i chose miles morales's

power plowler love it okay okay so it's max dylan and miles morales Wild card is a fascinating place right now. The Wildcard picks so far are Captain America, Jay John Jameson and Miles Jameson and Miles J. Morales is the prowler. It's exactly what you want out of a wild card, honestly. Okay, so it's back to me, and these are my final two picks, right? This is it on the turn here. So I know definitely what I want to do with the first one,

which will be my accessory. And I had two picks at the top, tied at the top for accessory. and took one of them, the dimensional travel watch, and got to give credit where it's due. That was a one B. I believe you told me earlier in this podcast that you're not supposed to give credit words due. Well, I just am complimenting you

and following through all my words at the beginning of the draft to be kind. Though I will now, I will now insult you and say, did you need to do it when the kind of inherent proposition of the exercises that were in the multiverse? Just throwing that out there for people to chew on.

I would not say that that's... Chew on it! Chew on it when you're voting. I'll spit it out after that you do need. Just spit it out. What you do need is the ability to innovate,

to craft, to make and shape. And so, I will be selected. is my accessory, the Stark Industries Fabricator, with which I can make any fucking thing I need for anyone in my movie at any point. I can go all far from home and make another suit on the jet as I'm rocking out and misattributing classical songs. I can make inhibitor chips if my guide dogok is, you know, going through it. I will be able to craft whatever.

I need at any point. And I don't see how that can't be the top pick in accessory. Could I, in fact, even make my own dimensional travel watch? Probably. Probably, Ben. I don't know that. I don't know that Tony knows how to. Stark Industry doesn't know how to do multiversal travel.

Thank you, Joe. Thank you, Joe. Like, over a fucking popsicle. Time travel's different from dimensional travel. Well, he also needed an airman to do it. So, if you want it, if he wanted, if he wanted, if he did he mean it? He tried, he studied it a lot and never got there.

Okay, these are notes for jokes. She's the one who picked Tony Stark as her mentor. I didn't pick Tony Stokes so that he could multiversal travel. If you want a multiversal travel, call Dr. fucking Stephen Strange. I just have the, I just have the tools. I do enjoy that Dr. Strange has not been selected because I think we could all agree that he's a terrible mentor.

So that's great. I have a conundrum here for my final pick at Wildcard because I'm just going to talk it through and be honest and workshop it with my palace here in real time. Here are the different things pulling on my mind and my heartstrings. I want to use Wild Card to introduce a new element entirely into the draft. I would like to select something in the musical universe. perhaps, or a filmmaker, perhaps, or I'm not going to stop giving away the other things I'm thinking of. I'll save the final one in case it's the pick I actually make. But I am genuinely blown away that Spider-Gwen has not been taken yet. I know. And I don't think we can go through the draft.

Spider-Gwen and Gwen Stacey. Like, neither of the Gwen's been chosen. I agree. I'm just going to put this out there again, in the interest of radical transparency, when I said it, at the beginning of the draft that I thought four was the toughest spot. It was because I thought that the first three picks would be in this order. Miles were Alice at one. Got him got him at four. It's fine. Tom Holland's Peter Parker at two and Andrew Garfield's Peter Parker at three. I had with apologies, no interest really in taking Toby at four. And so the thing that I was getting ready to do was to take Spider-Gwen, to take Gwen Stacey, Haley Steinfeld's Gwen Stacy's Spider-Woman in the first round as my spider person and build a movie around Spider-Gwen. And so I still have the chance to take

Spider-Gwen here. Is this a fun love triangle between some days? And exactly. And that's how I was just going to say, Joe, and introduce, could they all just be wonderful pals and make a great team? Could there be some romantic tension? You know, Miles had in across the Spider-verse, the Hobie-centric jealousy. Let's give, let's give MJ and Gwen a little taste of it, right? Who's going to win my? miles at the end. It physically hurt me to draft Andrew Garfield and not Emma Stone. And I just have to say that like, it's the power of Chris Evans that Emma Stone is not in that wild card.

Guys, I'm going to do it. I'm taking Haley Seinfeld's Gwen Stacy. I'm taking Spider-Roman at the end. I just can't believe it. I was really considering doing either upside down rain kiss. Just that's like a thing. Which I hope someone still does. Think it belongs in a Spider-Rod movie?

Drafted Toby. I guess the No. Oh yeah. I think he gets the I think he gets the key. I think he gets the Toby kissing.

Jay Jonah Jameson? I don't know. Ned. You're not being a very romantic movie so far. Oh, I love it. Yeah. Beautiful Ned. Darling Ned.

I feel great about my draft. I feel unbelievable about it. Ned has a lot of game. That has a lot of swag. Oh, yeah. Remember that it's just the, the, the, the, the, the, World win romance.

Betty. Yeah. On a flight. Wonderful stuff from Ned. Okay. My team is awesome. I feel great. Back to Jess.

My accessory, again, like I said earlier, coming from the heart, not my brain. Coming from the heart. I don't even know why. I chose for an accessory. The cloak of levitation.

The reason I chose the cloak of levitation is because what did we, yeah, and what have we seen Hobie be doing this entire time? Snatching, stealing from close friends. So I want to see Hobie steal the cloak of levitation and kind of indirectly, I kind of got a third plus one. I love it. Right? I'm into it. I love it. We haven't seen Spider-Man paired with the cloak of levitation in a Spider-Man movie, but we've seen Spider-Man pair with the cloak in a what-f episode.

And of course, the cloak of Levitation is in a Spider-Ram movie because of Dr. Strange, who is not an eligible mentor in anybody's mind for the draft, but you take the person. I'll take the case. I'll take the cloak however can say.

Eat shit, Dr. Strange. The clothes are invited. God damn. This is good. God damn. It's fun to think of the differing frame rates with the cloak. That's great.

Oh, super fun. Yeah. Great. Wonderful. Okay. Jess, your team is complete as well. Fantastic. Ben and then Joe for the final

two picks of the draft. Yeah, so only my mentor remains. Got a lot of different directions I could go here. You should hate Dr. Strange now with the understanding that you wouldn't have as cloak. No cloak. No cloak. No cloak. No cloak. No, I will not take strange.

I've already got the dimensional travel watch. I don't need the sling ring or anything. I'm good. So I think I want to pull my mentor from the Spiderverse, and there are a number of ways I could go. I mean, Happy Hogan still. out there as a potential mentor, Roger Harrington, still out there, who of course, you know, Peter's always been more than a student to him. It's been like a son and a little brother at the same time. Please take Roger Harrington.

Love Roger Harrington. Shout out to freaks and geeks again. But I narrowed it down to a few potential mentors from the ringerverse. And I thought, of course, of each of Miles's parents who frankly make those movies for me. Yeah. The only problem is I didn't draft Miles, and I feel like it would be a little weird for me to draft one of Miles's parents. I just, you know, let's go. To mentor a Rio.

Tony. Toby McGuire. Yeah. I'm just not sure that that works. As much as I love Rio's speech on the roof and across the Spiderverse, I mean, that just highlighted a movie to me, maybe. The speech from Miles' dad, when he is. tied up in his dorm room and he can't respond, just heartbreaking, heart-wrenching, but I can't pair one of Miles's parents with a spider person other than Miles.

And so I will be selecting with my last pick as my mentor, Jake Johnson's Peter B. Parker. God. That would have been the other one that just killed me if we didn't pick them. I was trying to keep mine. I was trying to keep mine as diverse as possible, so I didn't really want to put Peter B. Parker on there once I got no offense Joanna. Oh no, no. We all know what I did.

We all see what I'm done here. But I like Peter B. Peter B. I felt bad because I was like, Peter B needs to be on here somewhere. Is it Peter B with May or is it just Peter B? With May Day? It's just Peter B and Ben.

You need to carry that with you. That you've taken Peter B. You a young father have taken Peter B away from his infant child to make your movie for the sake of IP and the Hollywood machine. You have torn a family asunder. Maybe I'm drafting Peter B. Parker from into the Spider-Verse before May Day appeared on the scene. Can you walk us through the mentor dynamic between Peter B and Toby's Peter Parker? Like, what are these scenes like?

And then what is Ned's role? This is fascinating. There's an obvious difference between mentor and. And plus one, in this case, at least, you need both. And look, as much as I like the age-appropriate Spider-Man, the Tom Holland actual teen Spider-Man, Toby is not quite there. But he is the most convincing nerd to me. I think probably Tom Holland is the most convincing high school student. Toby is the most convincing nerd.

And so he's going to need Jake Johnson, you know, to provide some of his new girl charm. I think and give him some game, right? He's, you know, he's got the bartending acumen. He's wooing Jess, right? I mean, he is going to be the one that Toby's going to go to for advice on wooing. So this is just about dating advice. Got it. Partly about dating advice.

But to be clear, you specify that you were selecting Peter B from into the Spider-Verse where we meet him, weeping in sweatpants because of his breakup. And this is who you are deploying for relationship advice. I spend a lot of time in sweatpants. And so I... Guys, Ben's got a good team. Join me here in annihilating him. The tone, the reception has really changed since early in the draft when I was being ganged up on.

Suddenly, sounds like I'm the favorite. I think Joe and Jess don't know. I would not say that. I think they don't even feel like they need to comment because they're not even... They don't think your team warrants a response. I think he's over estimating the nostalgia for the Ramey films. I think so. The people will respond.

Which is interesting. No one is. I was going to say, it's interesting that you're doing the nostalgia and Mao's doing, I don't want to say, what do you want to call? The new fans. Yeah. Yeah. Right.

I have every franchise represented except for the amazing Spider-Man franchise with, which with love to Andrew Garfield and Emma Stone. I feel fine about. Yes. I could say the same, yes, about my selections. But look, you brought up this web, I mean, I would draft the sweatpants before the iron spider suit personally if we're talking about what I would want to wear in this scenario. Comfort over nanotech.

Definitely. So the pillar of the podcast, of course. Yeah. And as much as I like the young coming of age, Spider-Man, even though the age that they're coming to in real life varies dramatically. I also like the old seasoned, wizened spider-man, right? Wizards. Old-seasoned. That's been the subject of a cobblended.

He's like 30 years. Ancient, ancient by Spider-Man standards. I mean, can we even imagine? Peter B. Parker swinging? I mean, look, there's an old man Peter Parker in the comics, right? So I like some separation in age. How quickly you forget the lessons in the woods, you know? Mm-hmm.

Yeah. So leap of faith, much like your draft strategy, I might note. Yeah, look, I mean, my devious plan originally. What on earth did we tell you? tell you. I know. You met. I know. You're like, Mallory is so nice.

And then you do this. And you're like, is she? The Batman one was, I think the Batman one was a bad example because Sean would straight up just be like, no. What are you talking about? Mowell? And I was like, oh, okay. But Mal, you've been eating everyone alive on this.

I'm having a blast of you with Malice. To be clear. Just by your winning team. Attitude. My winning team. My winning team. My championship. squad, green lit for sequels already. Sequels of plenty. My initial hope was to somehow corner

the market on Spider-Men, at least, by just drafting as many spider people as possible in as many categories as possible, which is why I was considering Toby as a villain. You could also, I think, includes Toby's Peter 2 as a mentor, right? And so you could have him or Peter 3, Andrew Garfield's Peter 3 is a plus 1. And I got Peter B. Parker here as a mentor. So you could, squeeze a lot of Spider-Men into. How many people have multiple spider

people on their team? Let's see. I do. Three of us, right? Yeah. Yeah. I only have one. That's okay.

You got the prowler. You got Mileses-Morales. That's pretty. Yeah. Plus, you've got fucking daredevil on here. I know. I did. I have a dare devil in mine.

That's amazing. Pretty fantastic. Well, that's the final pick of the draft, which is Joanna Robinson making the final selection in accessory, the only remaining open slot. Joe.

And as we all know, based on, I mean, Jess barely knows me, so maybe she doesn't know that this is unusual for me to have an all white male draft. But it is. Hey, you're setting it now going forward, I will only expect this from this. Commit to the bit.

No, we all know that the accessory category is where women belong. And so what I was doing, my first thought was that I wanted to draft Jennifer Connelly's Karen, but then I realize I get her with my suit, actually. So she's already here. That's already one AI woman involved,

but I'm going to go ahead and grab... So is the enhanced combat mode and instant kill that you can't control. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. Well, learn to control. Learn to control. Yeah, training wheels. I will be

selecting Edith E to the D to the I to the T to the H. So you've decided to make an eye. Iron Man movie and that's fine. No, I have two fucking spider people in my draft, Mallory, and an iconic of Ironman.

Spider-Man. Tony. What are you talking about? Tony Stark built this. Oh, awesome scraps. I'm so sorry. People like Iron Man movies. This could be a...

That could be the winner because people do love Iron Man. I'm so sorry that I've got two of the most popular. film characters of all time Captain America and Tony Stark in my Spider-Man movie. You want to make sure

to get the power to control nuclear weapons back into the hands of a teenager. It's great. You're making the exact same mistake that Tony made in the first place. I'm sure that Quentin Beck while not officially casting your film

is just around the corner waiting to pick them up in the bar. Oh, I'm so sorry. Do you not want Jake Gillenhall in your movie? You're saying you don't want Mysterio in your film. movie. He would fit in yours.

I would love it. I would love it. Still on the board somehow. Yeah. I mean, look, you've made one tactical mistake, I think, which is that Mal could obviously fabricate and manufacture the edith device. I can make it on my own. That's true.

Yeah. I don't know that that's a mistake. Just because she could also make yours. Yeah. Thank you. We have not established that. We have not established that the watches within Tony Stark's manufacturing powers. On the Mysterio front, I'm curious, who is, is everybody, like, most surprise didn't get selected?

I think that Mysterio and Vulture being here is a surprise to me. Who stands out to Talyton's Vulture, to be clear, who was high on my list, yeah. Not Italian Renaissance Vulture, who was also wonderful. My backup accessory was going to be Vulture's exosuit, but then I was like, I don't really want it. It's too clunky. But then my second, my other theme to my other draft were all people that didn't have super powers. We're all people that were just like Spider-Man by not being bitten. And I put Mysterio as the villain in that bracket because I was like, this is a guy that doesn't have powers. He's just a

weak, weak man. For me, and this is a real fuck you to Miguel O'Hara, no Uncle Ben needed in any of these spider films. Right. Right. Uncle Ben, real core, core concept to a Spider-Man film, not invited. Talk about for the canon of it. Yeah. Not invited. Oh, none of our movies It comes to fruition then If there's no Uncle Ben dying We also snubbed Queen Kirsten Duntz And MJ

The original MJ And Emma Stone I'm comfortable with the Yeah, I was like it sucks and die literally Leaving that MJ out is fine with me But Emma Stone I miss Emma

You were a queen Yes we did it I'm thrilled I'm thrilled I'm so happy I would put Bryce Dallas Howard's Gwen and mine Maybe

She's fun Okay keep going So sorry. I literally immediately was like, I like Emma Stone's Gwen, but I also like Bryce Stone's Howard's quick appearance. I thought someone might take Kingpin from Into the Spider-Verst to get the collier.

Yeah. It's on my list. Yep. On my shirt list, for sure. Considered the spot. I didn't want to put Fisket in mine since I put Charlie Cox. Mm-hmm.

Right. Thought about Uncle Aaron as a possible mentor or villain. I thought about the Amazing Spider-Man remote door lock, which is a tech that I would. love to have to be able to lock and unlock my door without getting out of my chair would be wonderful. But you can build that. Did anyone strongly consider taking a score or a soundtrack?

Joe, I thought you might. I thought about it. I really love that as like an opportunity, a concept. But I just didn't feel like I had time to waste on a concept here. No room for concepts inside of an Iron Man and or Avengers movie. I mean, no room for concept when in the wild car can either. take a score or fucking Captain America. So I think I chose correctly.

Jesus Christ. Oh, man. Did anyone consider taking a director or screenwriters or specific New York? Did anyone consider taking Europe? Anything like that, a location? I took every location. So I felt like I was covered with my international eventual travel. You took a watch that someone else could turn off potentially.

But yes. Sure. Or break. Any location. This is just Mallory's. Malarys, don't bring up anything you picked that you liked, because Mallor will just try to pick at it. Just try to tear it down.

I complimented a lot of picks today. I think it was more complimentary than usual. I wanted to stay in universe with my picks, though, I think, instead of bringing in behind the scenes creators. Some diogenic sound in the Spider-Verse films, you know? Miles is singing along. Alas. Alas.

Okay. We did it. We've drafted. And it goes to the people now to vote. You will be able to find this poll on the ringerverse Twitter and Instagram. When exactly? Who can say, soon. Soon, the top of this week.

So go and vote for your favorite draft. This was a joy. Any final thoughts before we part? My draft won't make sense unless you listen to the podcast. If you gotten this far. If you gotten this far. Looking at the images on Twitter. will look so confusing, I guarantee it.

But if you listen to this podcast. I love that you put this together. I'm going to love looking at your draft. Having done this weekly untrial by content, I'm here to tell you that a lot of voters don't listen to the podcast at all, and that's going to be interesting fun time for them. They're going to be so confused. I'm excited.

I think Spider Punk at the center holding it down really sets the tone for, you know. I think that makes sense, but then they're going to be so confused why it's Matt Murdoch. He's like his mentor. I think Max Dylan is going to be the real question mark, honestly. But I'm excited for you to make your case. I think they're just going to be like, whatever. Jessica's weird. She chose Max Dylan.

She chose Max Dylan. Love it. Did anyone consider building a movie around Spider-Noire? I actually seriously thought someone might do that. Yes. Yes, I did strongly consider that. Yeah. I do think, I mean, taking Peter P. Parker, he could, I think, deserve a little more spotlight.

But yes, noir deserves more scree. time. So that was one way I considered going. But I'm pleased with where it went. I commend my picks to the people. I'm confident that they will make the right decision. Joe, did you consider Scarlet Spider at any point? No. No. No. All right. That's a wrap. It is a time now after this wonderful draft to caffeinate fuel up. Time for some coffee coffee with room for some cream cream. Remember to vote for your favorite draft from today's Build the Best Spider-Man movie, House of Our Extravaganza. Thank you to our plus ones and our mentors. Steve Allman for producing this episode.

Arjuna Ram Gapal for his additional production work on this episode, Jomi Adan for his work on the social for this episode. And thank you, of course, to Jessica Clements and Benjamin Limburg for joining us today. Remember to head back into the Ring of Verse on Wednesday for more. War time with Ben and Jess for their video game chat about Diablo and all sorts of other gaming happenings. And then on Friday, pop back once again for the Midnight Boys Instant Reaction Pod on The Flash. Joe and I will be with you next week for our deep dive into the secret invasion premiere. We cannot wait. Until then, go easy on our drafts. We had a terrible teacher.

All pay off your home, travel for life, drive a Ferrari, in celebration of the world premiere of the Monopoly, big board buck slot machine by aristocrat gaming, Yamava Resort and Casino at San Manuel Manuel is giving one person a $1.6 million dream package. The biggest prize in Yamava's history. Club Sorano members can earn daily instant prizes and secure a spot in the finale May 29th. Don't pass go and own it all. Only at Yamava, celebrating its 40th anniversary. You win? Details at yamava.com must be 21-20. Please gamble responsibly. Monopoly is a trademark of Hasbro. Hasbro is not a sponsor of this promotion. You can't reason with the sun. Trust us. We've tried. This summer, it's time to put

that angry ball of fire on mute. Columbia's Omnyshade technology is engineered to protect you from the sun's harsh rays that can burn and damage your skin. The sun is relentless, but so is our gear. Level up your summer at Columbia.com to spend more time outside and less time slathering on allolotion. You're welcome. Columbia, engineered for whatever.