House of R - 'Rings of Power’ Season 2, Episode 7 Deep Dive | House of R

Episode Date: September 26, 2024

Friends finally unite! Also, Mal and Jo return to talk about the latest episode of 'Rings of Power’. They delve into the epic battles, heartfelt reunions, and emotional payoffs as we lead into the upcoming season finale. They begin with their opening snapshot (03:27), as well as their scene-by-scene deep dive (10:49), and give us their look ahead of the finale as well as Wig Watch™ (01:47:12), as well as their book spoiler section (01:47:55). Hosts: Mallory Rubin and Joanna Robinson Senior Producer: Steve Ahlman Video Editor: Stefano Sanchez Additional Production: Arjuna Ramgopal and John Richter Social: Jomi Adeniran Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable internet means everything for your business. And even this podcast, that's why I trust Spectrum Business to keep companies of all sizes connected with internet, advanced Wi-Fi, phone, TV, mobile services, plus 24-7 US-based support. Millions of business owners already trust Spectrum business. So visit Spectrum.com slash business to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. This episode is brought to you by WeatherTech. Everyone knows winter is the MVP and making a mess. You don't need Weather Tech floor liners in the summer unless you hit the beach or go camping. Then you'd want a cargo liner.

Or a road trip goes sideways, ketchup goes rogue, ice cream drips. Yeah, you'd be pretty happy about those WeatherTech seat protectors. So just to be clear as the mud, you're inevitably going to step into the summer. You don't need WeatherTech unless you plan on doing summer. Visit weathertech.com today. But perhaps the else need only remember that it is not strength that overcomes darkness. But light. Armies may rise, hearts may fail, yet still light endures, and is mightier than strength.

For in its presence, all darkness must flee. of R. I'm Joanna Robinson, joining me today. Oh my gosh, she's my favorite person in the whole world. It's Mallory Rubin. Hello, Mr. Mouse. Oh, my God, perfect. Hello. We are here today to talk to you about the Rings of Power, Season 2, Episode 7, the Penultimate episode. It's a battle episode, baby. We're here to talk all about it. This is the deep dive. That's what we do here. Before we get into that, though, let's just do our standard program reminders, which is like, Listen, the Midnight Boys, Poo-Poo! They're covering Agatha and Penguin.

Yeah. They're doing a lot over there. There's a lot going on in the Regan Nurse Feed. We are doing the Rings of Power and then Agatha the very next day. That is just something that we're doing with our lives that feels totally sane and normal. So listen, follow along. And Mallory, how can they do that? Thanks for asking.

Yeah. Listen up. Follow the pod. Follow the house of our on Spotify or wherever you get you. your podcasts, follow the ringerverse on Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts and follow the new ringerverse YouTube channel because you can get full video episodes of Housevar and the Midnight Boys on both that new YouTube channel and Spotify. You can watch us on Spotify. Correct. While you've got your phone in your hands, follow the ring of reverse on the social media platform of your

choosing. We are on Twitter, Instagram, TikTok, and then you're already there ready to type. send us an email. The inbox is open. Hobbit to Dragons at gmail.com. The folks are sending dissertation. It's like that time of the season and the Rings of Power and people are sending just like

very lengthy emails. And they're tremendous. And we won't be reading any of them in full today. But they're all tremendous. I read them also. Please continue to send them. And then spoiler stuff. We're obviously, we're spoiling up through

season two episode seven of the Rings of Power. Nothing beyond that, nothing about the finale. And we're presuming, you know, the basics of the Lord of the Rings and the Hobbit. But there's some stuff that we're sort of going to keep in a separate section at the bottom. That's sort of like a speculation section almost more than a spoiler section at this point. But we'll see you down there if you're feeling particularly skittish, like perhaps a little mouse. Okay, that's it. Let's go to the opening snapshot.

This episode of the Rings of Power was written by the showrunners themselves, Jady and Patrick, and directed by Charlotte Brandstrom. And I just want to call out something that we haven't mentioned this season. Every single episode of this season is directed by a woman, which is, I think, pretty cool in its own right, but I think especially cool in something like this, which is a big action-heavy battle episode. And, like, sometimes some people in the world think women can't do that.

But here's Charlotte and she did it. And it was very amazing. So, you know, I just think that's a cool thing that the Rings of Power has done. Love it. And more importantly, perhaps, maybe not as important. Did we like this episode, Mallory Rubin? How did you feel about episode seven? I really, really, really liked this episode.

This is one of my favorites of the season, which I was not necessarily expecting because the big battle episode of season one, episode six, was easily my least favorite episode of season of season one. Yeah. And this was, I'll again, reserve final judgment on power ranking the episodes until the season is complete and I get to revisit them. But this is probably one of my two favorite episodes of the season

along with episode five, I think. We'll see if that holds up. But I think right now. And the reason is that it wasn't just a battle episode or it was the kind of battle episode more accurately that we really enjoy, which is one that is steeped in character, the dynamics and relationships and history

between the characters, the emotion that is driving them to do a thing. We were able to spend so much time in this episode with the relationships that drive the show. We got to briefly see Elrond and Galadriel together again. We had the most meaningful thing we had been waiting for all season, which was the reunion of Elrond and Sunny D. Baby Duran himself. Oh my God. Which led to.

And again, we've already issued our spoiler warning for the episode. So now we're just getting to it. A sequence that has shattered me and rocks me to my fucking core. She, like fundamentally rewritten my DNA is how I would describe the end of this episode. Which is broken, despondent Elrond. In the mud. On his knees in the muck as the couple of dumb. doesn't remaining elves bravely charge and he cannot bring himself to stand.

He can only sit and repeat to himself Duran welcome. The Saran-Kalabrimbor stuff in this episode was quite a rich and a meaty text that I can't wait to talk about. So the battle, even though it was a grand spectacle, felt to me really secondary to these moments that we got to weave in and out of with the characters we care deeply about. So I thought it was a very successful battle episode, a very successful pen ultimate episode for the season. I am like Elrond on my knees in tears confronting the fact that we only have one episode left. But I really liked this episode. What did you think? Yeah, exactly.

I was trying to think about, you know, is it too early in the episode to make a Thrones comp? But like, you know, thinking about all the battle episodes we've been through on Thrones and what we have liked and what we haven't. And I always come back to Blackwater is one of my favorite cutting back between Sonson and Sersie. and the battle, that sort of stuff. Or Hard Home, which is actually just like only a battle just right at the end of the episode. Right. Yeah, so this idea of sort of leaving the action

to check in with other characters, but I like, it's so special the way that this episode is structured in that we're not leaving to go to Numenor and we're not leaving it to go to Rune. We're up in Aregian or we're down in Kazadu, or whatever Galadriel happens to be doing at the given moment in Adair's camp, etc. So we're all circling the battle.

And I thought that was extraordinary. A lot of great stuff for our guy, Elron. I, like, cried when Elron and Doren got to share a scene together. I thought this was the scene between Caliborneboro and Galadryl, I think, is Galadryl's best scene in the entire season. And, like, rivals any of her scenes in season one, I think. It was just, like, a mode for Galadryl that I was, and I thought Morfith was really just very much bringing it in that scene.

I love that a lot and just a lot of rich themes to go along with you know, trebuchets and hill trolls and, you know, ravagers and all the other stuff that's in this episode. And we haven't even mentioned what a tour to force it was for our guy, Glug. Glug had a lot to do,

but it was a lot of the same stuff. It's a lot of the same stuff. Gluck looks uneasy and displeased is the threat of this episode. So, yeah. Okay, a few quick things before we start the deep dive. I listened to John wrote in to let us know because we were asking sort of what a group of, what's the group name for bats?

Yeah. We got a couple answers, but John put them all together, which was a group of bats can be called a colony, a cloud, or a cauldron. Oh, my goodness. Which stuff go! Oh, my goodness. That's what John wrote in the email, which stuff go. Thank you, John. It's sensational.

And then I was being kind of a snarky little brat last week when there's the line in last week's episode, does it show us things that will be or things that only might be? And I assumed that was just a mirror of Galadro reference. So I sort of sarcastically said, does that remind you of anything? And then just a million of our listeners wrote it to let me know that that's a line from Charles Dickens at Christmas Carol. So that's not going to be the last time of this pot. I talk about how narrow some of my reference views are sometimes. Anyway, that's from a Christmas Carol. Actually, yeah, let's just get to it here.

Are Ned Stark comps with Elendiel, I stand by from last week? Absolutely. But I think what's true is that in the sequences in Thrones, Ned Stark's story, Ned Stark in the prison, in the black cells, all of that is George R. Martin drawing from probably a similar text that Jody and Patrick are drawing from. Our listener Patrick Ruinan to mention the 1954 play, A Man for All Seasons, which is about Thomas Moore, the Catholic martyr who stood up against Henry VIII. And he was like, it's Catholic baby, it's Tolkien time to do Catholic.

But anyway, there's a scene and a man for all seasons where Thomas Moore, Linguishing in prison, his daughter, Margaret, comes to visit him. And there's a lot of similarities in this idea of, like, the whole man. There's just one line that I was sort of reading the scene to look at the comp little closer. And there's one line that stuck out to me where Thomas Moore says, and you could sort of hear Alendio might say this. Thomas Moore says, when a man takes an oath, he's holding his own self in his own hands like water. And if he opens his fingers, then he needn't hope to find himself again. Beautiful stuff. A wonderful play. And I haven't seen the film, but a wonderful film, I'm sure, as well. But that's a great shout from Patrick. And I'm sure

was on JDM, Patrick's mine. And everyone else is when they put that episode together. Should we deep dive? Let's do it. Let's deep dive. We start with our guy Caliburnmore, enjoying a sunny cup of tea. a calm moment. Birds chirping. In the eye of the storm. How did you feel about this beginning, Mallorban? I thought, you know, should I perhaps,

we're a French press household, so we love a coarse grind. You know, should I look into some mutual French press coarse grind that is actually Sauron's goopy black blood, TM, in order to know this piece, even if it is a falsehood. Because this looked great. This looked like a lovely way to take a break during a hard work day.

And so I knew concern and also I knew envy. Yeah. Couldn't be me. Never could be me. Sitting in the sunshine, enjoying a cup of tea in the middle of the workday. But I love this for Caliborboar, even though he is actually being tortured in a prison of his own mind. We get like a, we're forging. We're doing a forging montage.

You love a forging montage. And then, yeah, as you point it out, the grinds, the coarse grinds of the mithril are actually goopy black sour on blood, T.M. And many of our listeners called this one. We got many, many emails over the last week saying, do you think you're two big question marks? Where did the mithril come from? And why did Sauron cut his hand open?

Might be related. Why look? They are. So, yeah, this is, I was just trying to, like, because we see it. spill out of the vial later. But when he's like scooping it in his little spoon, I was just trying to envision that as just like, you know, a glop of tar blood. It's like hot fudge that you're scooping on a Sunday.

Yes. Wonderful stuff. Exactly. I think when Tolkien was envisioning the blood that runs the veins of the Lord of Lies, he was like, it's hot fudge. Yeah, it's a topping. Crucial element in the mix here, much like, hello, Mr. Mouse. which is a crucial element in the mix of this episode.

And I want to say it as often as we can today because Kella Brembor in an absolutely dismantled, decimated state throughout this episode, who was fun to get so many of the trailer shots that we had seen him looking in the mirror, him absolutely choke sobbing, the fire, the rings that we tried to count in the trailer

being dropped into the fire, all of it. Hello, Mr. Mouse just absolutely killed me. I couldn't have loved it more. And then Anatar walking in and like have you fallen and audiences everywhere saying only for you, baby girl. Like this is just such a delightful opening to this episode. I loved it. I feel like that's two episodes in a row then that Kelly Brimbor has like the line of the episode because last week it was, I am well. Fittigued.

Just fatigued. Hello, Mr. Mast. Oh, Kelly. What good old Brimby says? he's on the floor. Sauron walks in, have you fallen? And he says, the floor is hardly the place for the greatest of Elvin Smith. Of course, we've heard this title for Calibrandmore since he was first introduced by Gil Gallad in Linden in season one.

But it is, like, it is, I think, important. He says it's sort of somewhat derisively here. And it is important that it's the same phrase that Galadryl uses to sort of claim him. Yes. when the elven guards later are, you know, clapping, and want to clap him in irons and are saying, calling Anatar the Lord of Ara... They've already taken Lord of Oregian from Kellebram Boar,

and she's like, this is the Lord of Reagan. This is the greatest of Elven Smiths. And on this idea of, like, the influence of Sauer on making you forget yourself, I thought that, like, use of identity was really important to bookend in this episode. Yes, I also thought it was notable that in addition to that reinforcing a key aspect of Kelly's identity, I'm struck by the way that I've been calling him Kelly and you've been calling him Brimby.

This is really truly an ideal partnership. I couldn't tell you why in the notes today. I know. You went Brimbo and Brimbo. Love it. I think I was thinking about Bilbo a lot. Absolutely loved it. But just the fact that Galadriel in this moment of confrontation is saying,

the same things that we've grown accustomed to hearing from Sauron is like striking. Oh, he's still in her head. I see, I see. Okay. Caliborne Moore is saying like, oh, my God, this has been the best time of my life. He sounds manic talking about this era of creation. He says these weeks, and I couldn't exactly tell if he meant this entire season since he first showed up in the rain with a wound on his back. or if he thinks he's been in this sunny mind prison for weeks for Jamie's rings,

because surely it's only been ours. So what do you think he meant there? I think that given his later, I marked this candle and not an inch has burned. I'm not going to really put a lot of stock in his assessment of time, period. Yes. But it is, from a meta perspective for us, you know, it is something we've been talking about across the season. How long is it taking characters to get from point A to point B?

How much time has, in fact, passed? And so it's, it is like, oh, wow, did something this consequential in the history of the, of this fictional universe, like, happened this quickly in this version of it? Mirr High Tower Weeks. Mirr High Tower Weeks. Mirr High Tower Weeks. He also says, he talks about the Rings sharing the quote, secrets of their song.

Yeah. Which really struck me and it made me, you know, there's a lot of talk inside of this episode and inside of this season in Kellebram Bore's sad story about this, the hubris of trying to become the capital C creator. And this is something that Tolkien was very adamant. There's one creator, Godfell C creator. You could be a sub-creator.

But the idea of sort of like the secrets of their song and that idea of song and music and the creation of the universe and Louvatar, which we talked about, at length in our Tolkien music episode. That's sort of what it pinged for me here when he said that particular phrase. I thought it was striking to that last week, you know, we had a great time talking about the earrings of men. Why do you still defy me stretch? But that is such a shift, right?

From lamenting the fact that this link, this communication, this understanding that he is seeking to forge is eluding him into, you know, I'm just here to let them share the secret. of their song and they are singing, boy, are they singing. That felt like, okay, we are feeling the past, whatever the actual passage of time there is, we feel the progress in that distinction. Yeah, always like with some black goopy hot fudge blood to make a bond. Now, listen, I, this is a podcast full of bold ideas. Hmm. We like to live dangerously. Sure. Should we let Sauron take a pass at our respective Google calendars? Because I have to say, once again, what Calibor is describing here sounds great to me.

Focus that I have not known in years when the world is still, but the ideas can flow freely. Genuinely, Sauron, come on in. You're invited. Let's give it a go. It felt a lot to me, okay, you know, so the bad version of this is, sorry to keep bringing up Game of Thrones, but in the Thrones finale when it's like...

Absolutely never have to apologize to me for bringing up Game of Thrones. But what's more important than story? It felt like a sort of eye-rolling thing for a writer to write. This feels very much, like, close to my heart a thing for a writer to write. Like, I can actually focus. The whole world goes away, and I'm just in the flow. And everything's going well. Yeah.

I feel like JD and Patrick put their full hearts into that part. For sure. I also just genuinely, there were a lot of, like, really, I thought, sincerely heartbreaking moments for various characters across this episode. and this was one of them, obviously, for Kellebrumbore, because the fact that he is in this prison of mind control, and like a part of him, as we will hear him voice, a part of him knows that something is wrong,

that he needs to break free, he will, he's going to track the clues, he's going to break free inside of this very episode. And yet, there's a part of him that is full of appreciation for this prison that has allowed him to achieve the greatness that he sought. And, like, that's why, you know, we love him. character on an arc. I'm not sure if it's come up before on the pod, but we do have some

here today to say, to reveal that we love a character on an arc. And so when you build tour later, something like, we'll obviously talk about all, you know, we're going to go beat by beat, chronologically through the episode, but when we get to, like, the severing of his own thumb, the

moment where that is his sacrifice and he is willing to, that's the end of the forging, I have to assume, right? Or at least a great, an impact on the greatest of Elton Smiths, but like, the thing that is most important to him is no longer whether he can do something that would have made Féanor jealous. And like, that's an incredible thing that we've built toward over the course of the season, but then continue to build toward inside of the episode. That's true sacrifice, right,

in that moment. Absolutely. I also, what I love about Charlie, both the Charlies, but like Charlie Vickers' performance as Sauron is how, and we've mentioned this before, how you will infuse actual, what feels like real sentiment inside of something that Saron says. So when Saren says, it will be a sad occasion. I have so enjoyed our time together. Yes. I kind of believe him to a certain degree, you know? And so, and that's so much more interesting than a sarcastic or mustache, twirling version of that, just to infuse a pathos inside of this relationship, which to me has been the most, far and away the most successful thing of this season. Far in a way, the most important thing for them to nail.

And they've just knocked it out of the park with Kellebram Bore and Sauron. It's been extraordinary. Had to crush it? Amazingly, they have. I shouldn't say amazingly. It has been amazing to watch, but I'm not surprised that they've crushed it.

The fact that that is rooted in truth, even though he is perfectly willing to sacrifice anybody ultimately who stands in his way, is because Kellebram Bore represents not only a means to an end, but a thing that he, as we have heard articulated, couldn't achieve. And so he has, is there jealousy? Is there envy? But there's, there's admiration. Yeah. Right? There is like the thing that he keeps diluting himself and it's seeking to dilute other people into believing, which we hear him do in a frankly astonishing fashion in this episode.

Just trying to build a peaceful better world. Why won't you all let me? Just trying to heal. Just trying to heal everyone. Just try to create a perfect peace. Just perfect it. This is part of what, like, Kella Brumbour is a, is a, is a, part of what allows him to achieve that. And he is learning, right? Like, he did seem pretty happy smithin in Numeroynour. And so to learn and study and soak up this knowledge,

even like we hear Duren elsewhere in the episode, like stealing the seven secrets of smithing. Like, he wants this knowledge. And so the admiration then is entwined with basically how everybody is a pawn fan. It's fascinating. I love that. Burmbee says all things must end. And Sauron says,

A pity, is it not? And I regret to him for you, I have a little dissertation on the concept of pity in Tolkien. We're going to talk about that in a second. But this idea of all things must end, I think is also important to talk about because that idea of all things must end stands in contrast to these things that we've been watching people

try to grasp a hold of, be it the elves trying to sort of beat back this like fading the leaf rot in linden or uh or the dwarves hanging onto a mountain that is no longer hospitable to them uh livable possibly you know um and so i mean just because we know what happens in cause of doom but like that that need to hold on is unnatural uh in the world because all things end that's that they matter because they end. Tolkien in one of his letters wrote that the main theme of middle of his whole entire Middle Earth endeavor was quote fall mortality and the machine and he also wrote quote the mystery

of the love of the world in the hearts of a race doomed to leave and seemingly lose it the anguish in the hearts of the race doomed not to leave it until its whole evil aroused story is complete that's evil aroused with a hyphen in the middle of it just in case you wanted to jot that down somewhere. Thank you, Tolkien. Do you think that's actually how they officially pitched strings of power and specifically how Brandon Hotsar on who fucks? Evil or else? Evil aroused. Hear us out. Galadro will be evil aroused and so will the audience at home. It worked. All right. So this idea of pity, I was just really taken by the thematic use of pity

inside of this episode. Obviously, it's something we've talked a lot because there is that line in both the book and the films that we love when Gannel says it was pity that stayed Bilbo's hand when it came to punishing Ghalem when he first discovered the ring and said the pity of Bilbo, quote,

may rule the fate of many. So that's like a very key concept. And Frodo says it again once they throw the ring and the fires of Mount Doom. He's like, remember the thing that Gandalf said about pity and Ghalm? Turns out it was true. So I picked up this book and did not read all of it because it's quite dense and long,

but it's titled Pity Power and Tolkien's Ring by Thomas Hillman. It's very nerdy and very academic, but really, really fascinating, particularly as it pertains this idea of, like, Tolkien's Catholicism and this idea of pity, like a pity that is not a condescending pity, but pity that is compassion for your fellow man. And so, and this idea and something that Tolkien did a lot when he was talking about pity, like in his letters and his various writings is he would pair it with the word mercy, pity and mercy pity being the sort of like internal feeling. Mercy being the outward act that goes with that feeling. And I think it's really interesting the case that this book makes that the idea of pity in Tolkien's mind, that idea of compassion, is the diametric opposite of whatever the ring represents.

And in the first draft for Lord of the Rings, in that scene with Gandalf and Frodo, it didn't read, you know, ruling the fate of many and all of that stuff that's in there now. It read as, pity is what saved Bilbo from the ring. Quote, he would not have had the ring. The ring would have had him at,

once he might have become a wraith on the spot. So if he had not offered pity and mercy to Gallum, the ring would have taken him immediately versus Smigel, of course, who does do a murder as soon as he gets the ring. He's just sort of like, Murdertown, USA, time to go. So the point that Helman makes here, which I think is so fascinating, is this idea that like, this is a quote directly from the book. He says, if pity won't rule the fate of many, the rings will for that is what they were made to do, that idea of rule. rule. Is it pity that will rule the fate of many or is it the one ring that will rule the fate of many? I just think that that is a really, really fascinating thought. And something that it made me think about, because the through line of pity in this episode, Saron says it here. It's said a couple of times elsewhere. But the action is really through Galadriel as she relates to Adar and Galadriel as she relates to Kellebrimbor, all three of which. have this experience as like a former saraholics, essentially.

And I got me thinking about like us. Yes. No, we're not in recovery yet. I know we're not. You're right. Under the influence. But what I think is interesting is like rings of power, we've got the nine, we've got the seven, we got the three, we don't have the one yet.

The one ring is not a thing yet in this world. And so I think what the showrunners are doing, the writers are doing is, and maybe this is an obvious conclusion, but Sauron is the one ring in this case. And so the corrosive effect that he has on people, and we've made this comp sort of loosely before, but the corrosive effect that he has on someone like Galadryl or Adar or Calibirmbor is the same as the corrosive effect the ring has on Frodo or Issyldor. So like all the ring bearers in the books, Cecilur, Frodo, Bilbo, Smigel, all talk about the first thing they note about the ring

is how beautiful it is. Perfect, fair and pure, bright and beautiful. And so I don't think that it's a coincidence that it's hot Sauron who fucks at all because that idea of the beauty is what Adar says, the beauty of the season, he says, I saw it his servant's face, Sauron's face,

and it was beautiful. looks great right is exquisite Jacques Loudon what a beautiful face thank you so much

for sharing so I just think this like the ring bearers a Sealdor smiegle

Bilbo Frodo and Galadriel Adar and Kelobrimbor and maybe Merdoni if she had

made it through this episode RIP Brutal yeah we're going to talk about that

it puts them all in a fellowship of of a kind right they've all experienced

something that other people can't understand and the way that Adar talked to Galadryl in last week's episode when they were talking about what it's like after Sauron, right? And he says, for a while, he even makes you believe that his powers become yours, irresistible power that makes every desire to fulfillment seem inevitable, an ocean of color against which everything else feels forever thereafter. And Galadriel says,

a dull gray. How can we not think of Frodo? And Frodo, not just, sort of naked in the dark that that passage that I read in a previous episode. But this idea of there's no going back, right? There's no real going back though I may come to the shire. It will not seem the same for I shall not be the same. I am wounded with knife, sting and tooth and long burden. Where shall I find rest? And so what we have to think about when we think about what Galadriel finds of this episode when she connects with Adar in his camp and she watches him mourn his Uruk

and she cries for him. And we were talking about this, you know, a bit in the previous episode, contrasting her interactions with Adar last season to her interaction this season. Yeah. But that idea of pity compassion for what you consider your enemy, mercy for your enemy.

Right. Or for Calibirmbor, who's not our enemy, but certainly, like, one could say, does Calibranborg deserve punishment for what he let happen to Eregian? In some versions of the story, but in, I think, Tolkien's world, he would say, is he not punished enough? Where is your mercy for someone like Calibranbor? You know? Yeah. Absolutely. Anything you want to say about this idea of pity and mercy?

Oh, boy. That was beautiful. Wonderful. Love every second of it. Could have listened for hours. You know, this is like you said, a cornerstone idea, like a foundational idea. I think to that nothing less set up there. Listening to you talk about that, I was thinking of a lot of the larger Tolkien life, the biographical details and nuggets that you've shared throughout the season

and that of course part of what maybe a modern audience or listenership, readership, whatever the case may be, thinks of as, you know, the capacity to extend and prolong and save, which in many respects are great and our lives are better because

of them, that there can be this dark underbelly of this insistence that like everything can always go on. And we talk across a lot of different stories, whether it's, you know, we talked about this a couple weeks ago, like the Voldemort Palpatine-esque,

like need for the unnatural, eternal life, or whether it's something like regular people in the good place, getting to the point where they say, actually, like, if this goes on forever, then nothing means anything to me anymore. And, like, you know,

so I was thinking about a moment, like Papa D. King Duren in the seventh episode of season one, it's interesting to like through this context to think of him as a character who voices in like his lecture to Sunny D, but the fire embraces the truth that all things must one day be consumed and fade away to ash. And how even in a moment where we were frustrated with him and rooting for and pulling for his son, he has now then morphed into a character who has like maybe lost sight of this one bit of wisdom.

I mean, listen, a murder who's like... The guy who's free with your axe is just exceedingly tough. I control the sun. I don't know. I don't know what you think, but the sun is mine to control. Exceedingly tough. Trouble.

And then in terms of like the, in terms of the characterization and framing, of Anasara Hot Saaron, Who Fawks, Halbrand as the stand-in for the ring. I think this feels like a very natural pathway toward, again, when we talk about like spoiler warnings on the pod, we're like, we're not going to pretend that you don't know that Zaron for just the one ring.

Like, that's the core of the world here. So, you know, thinking back to like how, obviously many people listening to the pod have read the books, but I think for a lot of people, their introduction to the story. It's the prologue. It's the Galadriel voiceover and the prolog in the Peter Jackson films where this idea that the Dark Lord and the Ring are the same

is hammered into our heads like this alloy that Kelibrimbor is beating into the rings, right? And into this ring he poured his cruelty, his malice, and his will to dominate all life. Well, let's keep that in our mind. as we watch Kellebrimbor ladle his blood into the nine and like think about then

what still awaits with the one, right? How we're scaling and building like we've been tracking across the different rings of power sets. And then again, and when Gandalf is talking in the movie, no Frodo, the spirit of Saron and Dort, his life force is bound to the ring

and the ring survived and then later in that scene. They are one, the ring and the dark lord. So like this feels again like, acknowledging in a way that we know what the end point of a thing is and helping us really luxuriate in how we got to that eventuality. And like on the pity front, I mean, I think everything you said was beautiful and wonderful and I love it. And like, I'm very interested to check out the text that you have been thumbing through. I, one of the,

obviously like the Gandalfroto, pity sequences the iconic one, but it is fun to like, you know, do the old word search that we love to do. And the frequency with which it recurs across all of the texts, but like, to your point, sometimes it is in these like very,

kind of like pantheon level entry passages about the choices that characters make and how pity plays a role in that. And sometimes it is like really, really just a character looking at another character, observation, and that compassion that moves them. And I always love then when we build from Gandalf's explanation to Frodo and then Frodo's in two towers, for now that I see him, I do pity him kind of like clarity that is building. How could Bilbo have felt this way? I don't understand now. I do understand. And then the gut punch

of Sam seeing Frodo that way in Return of the King. Sam. Sam knew before he spoke that it was vain and that such words might do more harm than good, but in his pity, he could not keep silent. Then let me carry it a bit for you, Master. He said, you know, I would and gladly as long as I have any strength. Like, just the fact that Frodo has moved into that position, where he is the one who others look at with pity because of what the ring has done to him is just so harrowing. You make it, you make such good points here and I think, I think the, the, again, people might have come to this conclusion many, many episodes ago, but like, I think the revelation I'm feeling here is not like, not as much Sauron is the ring, but Adar and Galadryl and Kellebrimbor are ring bearers that were passing Sauron around amongst characters like a piece of jewelry.

And I think, especially in this episode when, as you mentioned, Calabrimbor, Lops his own finger off, which is, of course, a Frodo, a thing that happens to Frodo, like that this is the price that Calabrimbor has to pay is the same, amongst other things that Frodo has to pay. I think that coding is sort of like unavoidable at this point. I love that. And then it makes us think of because Bilbo, the great passage,

the thing we talk about all the time, it's like how pity can lead. you to strengths, right? How you can find in that pity the ability to give that grace to somebody else that you might not otherwise have been capable of doing or inclined to do. But then in terms of how you're grouping that character set, which I love and find very stimulating, then we have to think about because these are characters who we are seeing confront great challenges and trials. And in some circumstances, failure or peril. And so then it makes me think of how Gandalf uses, invokes pity, when he's offered the ring

because he thinks pity would be the downfall, right? And it's often presented as the boon, again, from fellowship, do not tempt me. Do not tempt me. Or I do not wish to become like the dark lord himself,

yet the way of the ring to my heart is by pity. Pity for weakness and the desire of strength to do good. Do not tempt me. I dare not take it that even to keep it safe unused. The wish to wield it

would be too great for my strength. Oh, Gandalf. The last thing I want to say on the, I love that. And thank you for your Gandalf impression. The last thing I want to say in the pity front is Tolkien often connects it with healing. And I think, you know, and obviously this is what Sauron says. He wants to do to Middle Earth. But it is something that a character like Galadriel, who is, you know, Adar is not going to be in the Lord of the Rings.

Cala Brimbor is not in the Lord of the Rings, but Galadriel is. So this is the sort of like arc that we are maybe perhaps most invested in. How does she go from this version to... I'm most invested in Elron's hair, obviously. The title hair. But so this idea of healing and pity. So like at the end of Return of the King, when in the scouring of the shire, which Peter Jackson decided was not important enough to include in the movies, And Saraman survives to wreak havoc that blight of industry on the shire.

And, you know, when the hobbits come back to sort of unmask him and they go to kill him and Frodo's like, no, don't kill him. Right. Quote, he has fallen and his cure is beyond us, but I would still spare him in the hope that he might find it. He doesn't make it out because of warm tongue. He dies anyway. But the point is, Frodo offers him pity, photo offers some mercy, and then the land begins to heal.

The Shire is healed on the heels of this act of pity and mercy, which I think is really fascinating. So this is just something to track this quality of pity. It is, as Mallory said, like a cornerstone concept. The book is fascinating. Again, it is very dense and very nerdy. But like this person has thought so much about this. and I really admire that.

Okay, let's go back to the evil arousal of Anatar and for Mordania. Gladly. Oh, man. I would just like to admire the shot of Anatar walking unbothered with his like flat iron wig blowing in the breeze. And by breeze, I mean, deathly fireballs raining down on a reggae. And I just thought that slow-mo catwalk moment was incredible for him. And also genuinely. laugh out loud funny to me as he's lying to them and saying that Kellegrinbore refuses

to permit a counter attack. And he says, he says the river will protect us, which was like so great because, of course, as everyone surely recalls, Gil Gallant actually said that. Two rivers and a wall. What could go wrong? It's fine. Totally fine. Oh, Gil. We get a little, we're thinking about Faramere a bit, of course, when Anatar says, you know, talks about Merdania proving her quality in the movie. It's Denethor sarcastically in the books. It's Sam earnestly talking about Faramir, showing his quality. Okay.

So the river gets damned. The brilliant move from Adar. All of the war stuff, I think, is actually really well done in this episode. Just like an inventive, fun, big set piece stuff to have happened. So he blows a hole in the side of the mountain to create. an avalanche to dam up the river so that they can just walk across the glondyne, I guess, into

Oregon. One does not simply walk into Oregon, but I guess Adar did. Oh, man, they took down that cliffside with a fucking quickness, man. A palm. A plumb. Just a few catapults. Boom. Easy work. Charlie's face,

Anatar's face, Sauron's face, when all this is happening, where he's just like, just like a little, like faintly troubled, a little quirk of the eyebrow of this, like, massive event that's happening. And then he does this thing that I found fascinating and I do not think is a mistake. He's talking to the, you know, the elf captain or whatever who shows up in this episode. And he's talking about what's happening in the river. And then he gives them a command. And his, it's like he lost track of the character. He slips the Anatar mask. He puts on the commander, Halbrand, king of the

Southland's voice. Steve, will you play this clip? Calabrimbor was more mistaken than we knew. Prepare for ground assault. It's Galadrylian. That is just, that is pure Hal Brand. I love it. Yeah.

I love it to do that. It tracks, right? Because as we will see soon, like, forgot to put the ruby in the hammer, let the mouse stay on the loop. Like he's, Sauron is distracted. Stretched a little thin. He's got a lot that he's trying to control

with his little hand. Blood sugar after all of the goop went into the nine. Who can say? Maybe he needs like an orange slice? I don't know. In case you were worried, Arondir did make it. He did run all the way up the map of Middle Earth and made it in time for the battle. So congratulations.

I did. I had a moment of like, I did have a real pang in my heart for him as he looked at the city under siege. Because of course we should remember not only, you know, his personal history without ours, the person who robbed him of Bronwyn, et cetera, and the happiness in his life. The only, like, kind touch that he had known, as we heard him say in season one, is the thrust. But, like, he's from Balarian.

Like, the destruction of an, of an elven realm, this is going to hit, like, cut to the bone for him. And so just thinking of, like, what this must have called up for a rondeer here was, I thought that was effective, just in the glance. I love it. I love it. let's go to Casa Dune, shall we? Just shout out Disa.

My babe always looks good. She and Mordania deserve more than one dress, but they, alas, each of them only has one dress, which means they are begowned even in action. And Disa has that, like, badass thigh slit. So she's just sort of like thigh out, a weapon at the ready, ready to defend the minds here, as Narvi's like, guess what?

King Dern has lost the plot entirely, so we stand with you. Sunny D. We're team Sunny D. All the way. Oh, man. This was, you know, Mordania doesn't have need of a new dress in the future, but yeah, Disa. Disa does. Yeah. We can freshen up the wardrobe. She's looking, looking ready. She's a princess of Chazadeu. Give her a second dress, you know. They were very focused in the shopping on, like, the mushrooms and the tuning crystals and everything else. So maybe that's the next trip to the market. Though I don't know. Some other stuff is going on here. There's a few things going on. Really quickly.

Okay. I lost my entire mind, of course, when Narvi's like, there's an elf here. And I was just like, yes. We know it's coming from the trailer, but still we were just like over the moon. Quick answer to our listener, Kyle, who is asking, how far is a reggae from Kazahdum? I don't understand why it takes some people we used to get certain places. But during and Anantara bounced back and forth like there's a commuter train. They're right next door.

Areguyen and Kazadum are right next door to each other. So this is one of those travel time things that I'm like, this one makes sense. Yes. Yes. Not everything does, but that one definitely does. So, yeah. Mallory, please describe for me what it was like the shot of Elron in front of the friendship tree and the look over the shoulder that we got here.

I just, I honestly just like broke down in tears. I did. I had, I was moved to tears a few. different times in this episode, but this was the first. And the way that, first of all, just a look on Dern's face, like when he realizes that Elrond is there, that, you know, who Narby is talking about. And then when he opens, like, the chambers to his private quarters and finds him there framed in front of the light of the friendship tree, which, of course, like, Elron gave him and it makes us think of their long history together and how in moments when

this was very on my mind and is particularly on a rewatch. Like, when their relationship was tested, when Duren spent years and years and years, like Elron forgot about me, he still tended that sapling as it bloomed and grew, and he nurtured it because of what it represents to him, which is not only like the light of the elves, which is, of course, what has to be on Elron's mind,

I think, staring at this. Duren helped me last time. His father didn't want him to, and he did it. He made the choice. The Mithril healed blight. He'll do it again. And for Duren, it's like, this is the embodiment of the everlasting nature of their bond, which can only, no matter how often it is challenged, grow.

And so they were like, please let that still be true, right? Duran will come. The music, like the scoring of this scene was squooning. Swooning is a perfect description. And like Elron said, my heart sings. to see you old friend it's so like not even in like a shipping way just like it's just

so romantic the way he shot the way that Robert like Robert Arameo looks over his shoulder the way it's lit the music it's just this like this moment that they made us wait seven episodes for it's a very brief scene but

such a powerful depth of feeling between them I loved it I loved it some battle action stuff that we can sort of yada yada over. I just think it looks great. And the orcs looks very scary. It does look convincingly like there are a lot of works there.

And that sometimes, Rings the Power sometimes bumps up against this. I think because a lot of their scenes are set outside. So when it's like 12 Newmanorians on a rocky outcrop or like 12 elves on the cliff of Linden, you're like how many people are here really? But the orcs, the way they shot this battle, the way the Charlotte Branson and her DP shot this battle. It felt full. It felt full of orcs and it felt full of like real people in makeup orcs, not like CGI orcs. So I thought it was incredible. Yeah, absolutely. The ravager not quite as

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Order now at order. Now at order. Sweetgreen.com. But yeah, I agree. It felt like a very full camp. And so when Adar is like, you can't possibly hope to beat me and contend with my numbers, you're not like, wait, what are you talking about? You're like, is he right?

Yeah. You might be. And obviously, like, building toward that final. stand when it's again, it's like 12. This is like 29 L's or something. Very few. Very few. Duren, I need your ex.

Oh, my God. Devastating. Truly. Thanks to General Mouse and Candle stuff. Do you want to say hello Mr. Mouse again? Hello, Mr. Mouse. The only contender for equally hilarious moment was Anatar's reply here.

captivating. I just like died. Again, the Charlie's are on one in this episode. Let's actually hear a little lengthier response from Sauron to Kellebram Borer's breakdown here. You welcomed my instruction. You practically

begged for it. Now a mouse scurries by and you fly to pieces. Mouse scurries by and you fly to pieces. Also, the candles aren't melting. I went out of my way to show you that. So it's just Mr. Mouse. Yeah, the gas lights all the way up to 11.

The, the, what he does here when he's like, I gave you exactly what you wanted. I'm holding back the storm. I am the one holding it down for you is grade A top tier, uh, Jared the Goblich King from the Labyrinth, uh, level of gas lighting. I did all of this for you. And it's just like tremendous work from Sauron. I, I loved it. But he's like, he's, you know, a mouse goes by. says that, but like, in short order, he is snarling.

Proof your worth now. I want the nine. Like, the mask is slipping. Absolutely. And to the slipping point, it's like, he almost like blinks when he realizes I fucked up. Yeah. I made a mistake. I got sloppy.

Like, I let Mr. Mouse just cycle in and out. A little loop. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, we've been trying to parse and assess what is like behind some of these facial expressions or the tears when he was like the down in mortar at the beginning of the season. And so this was a great moment of like he's not infallible, right? Like he makes mistakes and he has to kind of confront that in real time as he is orchestrating this great

puppeteering act. So that was really fun. And then yeah, again, like using the truth rather than the lies as he's gaslighting. You feel that again here because like you welcome my instruction. You practically beg for it. Like true. That's true. You know, Calibornebara couldn't wait for an excuse to not let somebody else go Gallet or otherwise give him instruction. Like he wanted to do something amazing. It's very similar to the rundown between Galadron and Sauron at the end of last season, you know, when she was like, absolutely. You wanted to leave Numeroy's like, you wanted to leave Numerant.

Like all, you know, all of that stuff is like. I begged you to let me be. Yeah, totally. This is all on you, you know. The other similarity to that scene, which is very top of mind watching, this is like the shift in the vocal register for Anatar, Halbran, Sauron. Like, when he is... I have many names.

Tell me your name. I've been awake since before the breaking of the first silence. And that time, I have had many names. Like, when he is saying here, I am the one keeping the storm at bay, it's just this season's version of that moment. And I'm like, honestly, I hope we get another one in season three. Like, I hope we keep having a character on the other end of that reveal. and having to confront that reality.

I have many names is like his great stuff. Favorite cashphrase. I love, there's a ton of great Anatar Sauron Choreo in this episode. There's like the moves, you know, dodging elven weapons later, dodging Fianor's hammer here. Love that it's Fianor's hammer that like breaks the spell. I think that's beautiful. But just like the casual dodge, just the casual twist of his body to avoid the hammer. you know, all of the hand stuff, all the magic hand stuff that he does.

So waiting for us to see him do some other magic hand stuff. Yeah, of course grind. You love a course grind. So like, the fact that Charlie Vickers has said that they were instructed that the elves never looked down because they are so assured of their ethereal floatiness and how that like drove him crazy because he was like, I almost tripped and died on my long elven robes as I was walking up and down the forge staircase all season. And if you watch it, it's so funny, he's like just looking straight ahead, but also a little bit

like he's afraid that he's going to fall. It's pretty great. Yeah, we get the true creation required sacrifice reveal. Sick, twisted, incredible. Charles Edwards just absolutely leaving it all on the table with his hysterical reaction to what's happened to Reagan. What the forge actually looks like. He seems a little actually more upset about his forge than he does the city, if I have to be

honest. That's a note I have for Kellebert Moore. He really does. You're totally right. He really does. This is so good. Yeah. We, again, because a lot of these little moments, like the shash, like shaking sobs were in the trailer.

Like, sometimes it's when you actually see it it doesn't quite match because you 've anticipated it, but this was, I thought this was bliss watching him. The gasp when he sees himself in the mirror. And the other thing is, like, I loved, it's a different version of the same thing we've talked about elsewhere in the across the series so far, you know,

when we're mixing in footage in the map during wandering day, just like these creative touches in the show. So the veil is lifting for him here. But at all, even though we have awareness that he does not possess as viewers to the, but it's up to this point, even so, the veil is pulled away for us as well. And like when we watch him go from outside back in and he's, he looks different to us too, right? Like, coated and soot and bloody. Bleeding fairly from the head. Yes. What happened to you? Prudal. I mean, does that happen when like part of the forge collapsed on him?

And he was just sort of like, hello, Mr. Mouse. He's like, did no idea. He has to assume. He's like, been sustaining serious head injuries for, for me of weeks. Yeah, I don't know us how long. Yeah. On the topic of Gallup and four injuries, this is terrible. But this is the moment where I will reveal to you that the second time in the

episode where he walks outside, goes down a stairwell, and is immediately blasted into a fall and, like, inclusive state by a flaming boulder hitting him. Yeah. I was, like, cracking up. Not because my heart wasn't breaking for him, but I'm just like, Kelly. What else? You can't, you can't let this. You just got the boulder to the stairwell thing, like a few minutes ago. Can we get him?

A helmet? A helmet, baby. I don't know. All right. So when he goes outside, he's like, ranting and raving and rambling to the elves about the fact that Anatar is Sauron, love Sauron's face when he holds up his hand and the blood is red. He's like, oh, you mean this? What are you talking about?

And then Mordania, she of the golden hair and the one dress goes over the ramparts and has a hideous end here. And I want to just pause really quickly. I don't want to read the whole email necessarily, but Emma wrote this incredible email about like sort of violence in Thrones versus violence in Rings of Power, violence in Tolkien. And the point she's making is that Tolkien bases his works on like courtly stories where every action is connected to justice

or lessen to impart. There's some morality attached to it. And so she starts listing things that happen in Lord of the Rings like Denethor on fire or Boramir, sacrifice or Frodo being wounded by the ring race or Thaedon killed. These are all either acts of like redemption and bravery or a punishment for a sin. And she's like in contrast, in Thrones, death is waiting for you around every corner and it does not care what you've done or what your moral fiber is. It could hit you at a wedding. It could hit you when you least expect it.

She was comparing Muriel's survival in the trial by abyss to Oberyn's death and trial by content. It's like Miriel is virtuous, so the, you know, the valor are looking out for her, but there are no gods in Westeros looking out for the innocence in Game of Thrones. I thought it was a brilliant, like, elaborate comp, and I really liked it. And at the end of it, she's like, and so P.S, the reason that Valandial's death sticks out is because it is not connected to a sin or this, like, redemptive act. It just feels like a nasty, brutal Thronean death. And I would say the same for Mardania here. It just feels a little like off to me.

I don't like again, I don't, I don't mean to like overstate the, the violence stuff this season, but I just think that it's it's interesting because it keeps striking like a sharp note for me. I don't know. What do you think about how Mordania goes out here? I mean, I'm brutal.

I was thinking as well of our ongoing conversation about the level of violence in the show. And this was a, there were a few things in this episode that were exceedingly violent, which is, I don't know, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I don't mean to sound like, um, a bloodlust, like a crazed maniac here, but I think to me, it feels like appropriately placed in this slice of the story, because the, the, the fact that, like, Merdinia's death, it shouldn't have happened and didn't need to happen. And it actually only, like, you know when he says that she'll be duly rewarded earlier,

he's just like, I'm basically waiting until I can kill you in a moment that, like, benefits me the most, right? And so it heightens that, again, sensation that everybody is just a pawn on his board. Yeah. But, like, what actually is the cost of what is happening here? The cost to the land and the cost to the people in it, like, it can. feel sometimes. Very abstract. Now, I'm not saying you need to see like a woman pushed her death and axed in the face in order to feel the consequence of the creep of evil.

But like you're like, oh my God, if Sauron came to your realm and you were swept up in thrall to him, people who used to look to you for protection could just, this could happen to them. This would happen to them. I think that's a fair. case to make. I definitely do. And I think that like I have complained in other battle up not not just Thrones but like other shows, battle episodes when no one dies. And I'm just sort of like, come on, this is a battle like a character has to die. Here it's Mordania and Tian like another, you know, an elf archer who we don't really know. There's not like a, I don't know. Anyway, that brings us to the other elves. They arrive,

they make their ride. There are ton of Helms Deep comps throughout this episode. It is very Helms Deep. coded, not just because we're trying to bring a wall down, but a bunch of other stuff right out with me. Got a hold until the dawn. All that sort of stuff is in here. So when the elves arrive, even though they're already obviously elves and a reggae, but when the other elves arrive, when the Lyndon elves arrive, you know, we're probably reminded of what happens in the Peter Jackson films, not in the books that Haldeer and the Lothorian elves arrive at Helmsdeep. How do you compare, that is such a like score change and they arrive and they're so regimented and so robotic. You're just sort of like, oh shit, the elves are here.

That's what happens in two towers. How does you feel about sort of the cavalry, the literal cavalry arriving here in this moment? I liked it. I think like, so the closest comp inside of the series so far, I agree with you on the Helmsteep would be like the numinorian. versus arriving when it seemed like all was lost in the Battle of the Southlands last season. And so I think in both of, and again, I was not a huge fan of that episode

for various reasons, but the thing that both of that episode and this episode, the arrival of cavalry have in common is that there are a lot of characters in the cavalry who we are deeply invested in, particularly here. Like, I don't know that you can match actually Elrond at the head of the surging, charging force for like, other than Duran being right there next to him

when this first happened, there would be nothing that we would be like, oh, my God. Like the character who, like, I care about most is here to save the day and you just know that something terrible awaits. And I thought like riding toward this pointed arrowhead of light riding toward the darkness and the shadow and the visual symbolism of that.

And then the slow creep of the, the crate that we know they're keeping Galadriel in and the reveal and the blade against her neck and this reminder that we have in our head from episode four, promised me Elron, you will put opposing Saran above all other considerations, even my life. Like, Helm's Deep, the Battle of Helm's Deep is like cinema at its finest, I think, right? And it's not a very, like, rare opinion. This is like a Hall of Fame. It is known exactly, a Hall of Fame battle episode, battle sequence in film.

And so I don't think anything in this episode can compare. And I actually think it shouldn't necessarily try to. Like some of the stuff that feels too similar to me, it's like, you know, that's the positive negative interference thing. Like try actually to give us something really different instead of something that is similar but can't measure up. Yeah. But this is an example of something that's more potent because like the people who are arriving our characters were deeply invested in the comp there for Helm Stevens.

The Gandalf arrival, obviously, which like then they're playing on our expectation that is going to happen here. And then it doesn't, and it's like fucking devastating. Brutal. Gil Gallag's here. Clatin is favorite color, which is gold. He loves to wear gold. This is one critique I do have of sort of the battle dynamics because...

I bumped on this too. Gil shows up, like, you know, Elron and Gil are both of the head of the charge. Oh, and I guess forget everything I said about horses last week because the elves have a gillian horses. So let's just pretend I never said that. But Gil is there and he's like, hey, I'm here. And then he's nowhere until he arrives later. And later, when he arrives, Elron says, this is no place for the king. And that makes sense in some versions of battle, the king would stay behind.

You know, and then some heroic kings will be at the head of the charge. So it makes sense that Gil wouldn't be charging it. It's just weirdly shot because he's there at the front of the cavalry and you're like, I'm going to see Gil fuck a lot of people up. And then he's just gone for a long time. But I do want to note, he's here in his famous shining armor. We got to talk about the Ballad of Gil Gallad, which we talked about on the Tolkien music episode. Quote, his sword was long.

His lance was keen. His shining helm afar was seen. The countless stars of Heaven's Field were mirrored in his silver shield. Now, Gil's like actually gold's my color. But we just want to note that the. his lance that he carries here is called eglos, and I love, we love a weapon with a name. So I just want to shout out the name of that episode.

But yeah, to your point, the arrowhead of light headed towards the dark, and then the really sick-looking line of dark of the Uruk and the line of light of the elves, you know, all centered around Galadriel in her little box was extraordinary. Yes. Adar says what we've all been thinking, which was like, hey, isn't Elrond a diplomat and not a general? But I think the idea...

So good. This is so good. I think the idea is that all the generals went to Mordor. So Elrond, like Gilgall is like, we are... Oops. We already sent all the commanders to Mordor. What can you do with these handful of elves and a thousand horses? Yes.

I like to think also that in addition to that, Gil, just like the... co-hosts of House of R really loves to commit to a bit. And so he's like, I made you commander to piss off Galadriel and make her feel like by punishment.

And so, like, you should probably just keep being the commander, huh? But I thought that Elron's response to more suited to wielding a sterol

than a sword, you've never seen me wield either. This is to me the stuff of legend. Genuinely. Like, I just, I,

my really like when I'm thinking back in the season like I am lamenting that we didn't get more Elrond oh yeah like I it just he is it is so good it's just so good the performance the writing of the character the relationships with various other crucial figures in the show you've never seen me wield either like talk your shit Elrond I love this energy this is fantastic and he's about to show like his his psychological warfare diplomacy skills in a second which is great stuff from Elran. Before he does that, Adar is trying to do the same thing

he did to Galadro, which is proposed a fellowship, right? Oroken elves together. Why not? And he tries to sort of curry favor with Elran by bringing up his four mother, his ancestor, Melian of the Valar. And I thought we might do like a mini little lore breakdown of Melian

of the Valar. And it goes a little something like this. Basically, she's a she's a ma'ar she's a she's a spirit like a holy being a god and uh she fell in love with a mortal have you heard that story before uh so she and her husband single have a child called lucian who you might have heard of who has sex with baron who you might have heard of who have a child called d'or who you might not have heard of who with nimloth who is also the name of a tree but is also an elf

have Elwing, who was Elron's mom and also a bird. So that is the sort of lineage here. No nuts. From Dingle Amelion through Lutheran and Berne and Lutheran, down to Elwyn, who is also a bird. So I think it's really interesting to just consider why this name drop is here. She's very important in the mythology because three, her, because Barron and Lutheran,

Elros, all of those people, we're talking about elves and mortal men. We're talking about half-elven characters, etc. So, her divine, godly blood that does not look like a hot fudge Sunday

was passed down through the lines of elves and men. So from her comes the divine blood that runs through some of the lineage of men, and some of the lineage of elves. And fun fact about

Emelian of the baller and her husband, Thingle, when he first saw her, he was like, this a babe is so hot. He was struck dumb by her beauty and they just stood there

for some years. They just stood there and looked at each other for some years. Thingl was an elf and he was just sort of like, this babe has, quote,

the light of Amon in her face. She is so the trees grow up, grow up around them. They're just standing there. Fingle misses his ride to Valinor because he has met this hot goddess in a forest, relatable content. He misses his ride. His loyal brother stays behind to look for him. His loyal brother is Kierden, who, as we mentioned in the beginning of the season, is forever staring off into the distance because he's. his dumb brother fell in love with the goddess and missed the boat. And then they all miss the boat.

So that's how that all sort of moves back around. Now he's just shaven with a seashell. Yeah, you know. Not making his way into the bulk of the episodes of this season of television. It's a tough come down. And we would like to see more of Cured in next season as well, please. I think a reason, another reason to just shout her out is she was gifted with foresight of war. Shout out, Melina of the Valor. She was gifted with foresight of war.

similar to sort of Elron, this like, I see the bad things coming and nobody is listening to me vibe this season. She and her husband, along with dwarves, built a fortress that held back the dark forces, so that idea of working with dwarves,

fellowship, etc. And they created this kingdom, Dorea, which she protected. It's called the girdle of Melian. They protected this whole realm. And it's similar to what Elron will do in Rivendell, protect.

Rivendell, what Galadio will do in Laflaure and protect, like, wrap their arms around this space with the power that they possess and shield it from harm. And that all comes from his ancestor, Melian, who was very hot and sang like a

nightingale. So, yeah, great stuff. Well, I love that Adar complimented. Like, you got her looks. Yeah, you're pretty hot. Just like, I would stand in a forest and stare at you for years if I could. Okay. What does Eleron do to Adar here, you know, without scroll or sword in hand, Mallory Rubin?

So a quick just note on the, when I was saying a few minutes ago, like there was something about the violence in this episode that really struck me. It was Elrond. And how often he said incredibly violent things. That was just like, I found like deeply. Like, deeply. impactful. You know, even just the death to our foes' nature of the charge. And then here not before you have painted the sands of the

Glandoine black with the blood of your kin. I wouldn't have blinked hearing Galadriel say that to Adar in the shed last season, you know, that's not a geographically proximate place for her to have said that exact thing, but you know what I mean. I was like,

Elron, wow. And then the, I thought most intense one was later when the Uruk, horrifyingly, slices the throat of Elron's horse, and Elrond goes over to him, stabs him, and says, Die. Die. And then catapults him into a wall. Yeah.

That was just harrowing. And then, of course, that all builds toward Adar, with the mic drop at the end of the episode, have you forgotten your rumel never make war? war in anger. And so, like, even though that's stitching together four moments from across the episode, like I wanted to note it here because I think as we are inclined as Elrond superfans and admirers to tout his political savvy, right, and his ability to, like, read a room and maneuver through a situation, all of which I think is on display here, as well as some very complicated

emotions that we'll talk about momentarily. he's driven by his rage here. He's driven by like something that is maybe, that is deeply human, but also I think maybe uglier than he would want to be guiding him. And so that is just like, I thought that was very rich across the episode.

And I think that that sort of like this idea, it reminds me a lot of, sorry to make a Star Trek comp, but it reminds me a lot of like, Spock who is half Vulcan. This is half, he's half elbin. And so Spock, when we talk, about Spock and we talk about his rage,

his emotions, his anger that other Balkans don't have because they are sort of like serene and calm. So this idea taunting him a bit about his more human emotions when we have seen from the very beginning of season one, Elrond put in a box because he is half Elvin.

He is not full-blownsies Elvin. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. In terms of what he does. Yeah. He's like, are you prepared to spend their lives so freely? Are they? And then he makes meaningful contact with Glug. They look at all the orcs.

They mutter Glug, very engaged. He's on task. He's locked in. Active listening. Active listening. I would say unclear if it's less active viewing in terms of the loud and visible removal of the flak brooch. The fastener pin that Elrond will place in Galadriel's hand, which Glug is definitely.

definitely in his sight line when that happened. So, like, did he choose not to reveal it when he said he's not armed? Is he, like, fighting his time because we're building toward going to do a coup? I thought it was he's definitely going to do a coup. He is one hair's growth away from a coup in all this episode. No doubt. It's just like cut to Glug looking uncertain is like a lot of this episode. But, um, I think the way that that was shot, it was meant to be like obvious to us, but stealthy that he takes the brooch off. I thought it was a little smooth gesture that he makes. It was like loudly clenching echoing through the tent. I'm like, oh, Ron, come on. I didn't hear the sound design. Maybe I was just like, I heard it and then my mind went blank when in the gamut to get the cloak brooch pin in her hand,

he lays a smooch on Galadryl. Now, when we have been saying all season, we would like characters to kiss, this is not what I meant. Okay, talk personally. Tell me what you thought of this. I didn't love it, actually, personally. The kiss specifically or the whole interaction? I mean, on rewatch, I will say it. When it first happened, I was like, what are we doing?

On rewatch, because there are these very passionate, close friends, and it seems like occasionally the show is trying to, like, flirt with something more between them. but I might talk in the spoiler section, I guess, about why I have some questions about that. A huge question and note as well. Yeah. I have some questions about that. We can save that for there.

So we'll save that for that. So here I was just sort of like, what's happening? I mean, I knew it was all part of the gambit, but I was like, what's happening? But on rewatch, I did enjoy Morphith Clark's Galadriel's face of like, okay, I guess it's one way to cause a distraction. Sure, El-R-R-on. So, I don't know.

How did you react? Um, okay, I have the same, we'll save the exact thing we're talking about for the, for Ring 2, but I had the same like, oh, wait, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, I have a, I have a note. I have a note. Response. Because if you don't have that knowledge and you don't have that note, yeah, that, like, you would be forgiven watching this and being like, they're in love, like, you know,

especially the way that he has been this sort of like, jealous boyfriend role all season, and like jealous of her connection with Sauron. Totally. Sort of, you know. It's a little hard to talk about without saying the thing that we're saving for ring to, but like accounting for that thing. I don't know. Okay.

I'll circle to, I'll hit the kiss first and then I'll talk about more broadly my feeling on this moment. Ring two thing aside, is it like impossible that Elrond has feelings for Gladriel? No. I mean, I really think that's how Robert Arameo is playing it. Yeah. And so, like, I don't know, there's a part of me.

I sometimes think, like, our friends are, our friends are always in love with each other, maybe, you know? Like, there's some of that. It's just like when you care that deeply about someone, like, where is the line? But I think the kiss and the romantic nature of it aside, because that does not. work for me given things we know stuff. I found this moment

overall to be unbelievably emotional and moving. The tears in Elrond's eyes as he walked toward her and then like this was actually, I mean, Elron and Durn is kind of a, it's just like, God tear.

Yeah. But this was the thing that hit me next hardest when he whispered with tears in his eyes forgive me and she said when? I thought that was incredible. Take the kiss out of it.

I know you need the kiss for cover, but just that moment. Yes, I agree. There is so much history and passion and pain wrapped up in three words whispered in their language to each other. And I like thinking, too,

about what, forgive me for what? And there are so many potential answers. and maybe they're different for him than they are for her, you know? Like, I think the least, like, the thing that's least at play there, honestly, is, like, for the fact that you might die. Because I think he trusts that she will use the brooch to escape and is very capable, but also he does know that she is actually, he doesn't want her to die, but she's ready to. She wants to do.

She is ready to, yes. Yeah, I think, I think it's for not being able to win. Is it? I think it's for how I treated you all season. Yeah, and even going back further, like, for when you insisted that Sarum was back, like saying put up your sword and trying to convince you to get on that boat. And then, yeah, everything, all of the horrible things, the like Tom Shiv on the balcony things that we have sent to each other this season.

Like things when you were confronting losing somebody, you really are like, I don't know. And then the last thing that I loved about it was just like, it felt a little bit to me, the emotion that's playing between them. And the thing that feels so, just so forgive me, like, for where they are in time, for what is happening around them. Like, this is a little bit there. I wish it need not have happened in my time. So do I and so do all who live to see such times.

Yeah, yeah. Like, this is that for them. Yeah, yeah. They don't want to be doing this. They don't want us to be their life. I think the thing I'm bumping on. I agree with so much of what you just said. And I think something that Robert Arameo has always been good at,

even when he was playing Ned Stark, young Ned Stark on Game of Thrones, is just intensive emotional connections. Yes. And, like, conveying intensive connection with even the slightest material to work with. It's a genius that he has. And so we feel so strongly about Elrond and Duran. I, you know, I think those opening scenes with Elrond and Galadryl in season one are also, like, among my favorites as well.

We talked about them in our, you know, in our preview pod. And so I like, I like all of that. I think that I guess I object to. and I think this is actually more Peter Jackson's fault than it is, rings of powers fault. Yeah. As if we're holding all of that as canon, then Galadryl has like a romantic-ish connection to Sauron, Gandalf, and Elron.

Because that's what happens in The Hobbit. And I'm just like, find literally one other woman. It's like kind of how I feel. Totally fair. It feels very black widow in the leaner days of the Avengers lineup to me. Um, totally. Uh, okay. So Elrond's like, I will ensure that Reagan's Wells hold for one more night.

Again, quite Helms deep-coded to me. And then we get Duren speech. And guess what, guys, we're going to hear the whole thing. I clip the whole thing. Play it on loop for an hour. You can skip ahead if you're a coward. But why would you? But real ones will listen.

Steve hit it. Warriors of Kazat Dune. At this moment. The great tale of our age is being written, and it falls to us to decide whether it'll end in tragedy or triumph. Sauron the Stoneheart, who stole the seven smithing secrets from our forebears, has returned, forging rings to enslave us and all of Middle Earth. The elves cannot defeat him, not without us, and Sauron knows this. He thinks, by stoking our greed, he can turn our hearts to ash,

and sweep us from the field, without a fight. But we are stronger than he knows. So there is something. All dwarves prize far more than riches. More even than this mountain we hold dear. Fight with me so all the world can see. That dwarfing loyalty is a force.

stronger than any sorcery. More powerful than any army. Deeper than the bones of the earth. With her friends, our cousins do. I have no notes. One of the best things I've ever seen. This was so good. This is beautifully written.

An incredible speech. Owen Arthur. just slays this, absolutely murders this. I thought Peter Mullen's speech as Papa D earlier this season was good. Now it, with love and respect to Peter Mullen, looks like absolute dog shit compared to this. This is just transcendent. Yeah. Just incredible.

I loved every second of it. Rivenving. Yeah, a couple things I want to note. Sarah on the Stoneheart, who stole the seven smithing secrets from our forebears. I think this is just, I've tried to figure out what he's talking about. here. I have no other lore information for you. So, Hobbs and Dragons gmail.com, if you know something more than

I do here, but perhaps he's just talking about the smithing that has gone on this season. The way that he says the elves cannot defeat him not without us, the pride in his voice when he says that.

And then the thing that the elves, that the dwarves chant at the end, which is not just because of doom, which is what they said to, Papa D, they say Baruchazad, which is in two towers. This is a Gimli moment, quote, but a small dark figure that Nun had observed sprang out of the shadows and gave a horse shout, Baru Kazad! Kazad, I'm Manu.

An axe swung and swept back. Two orcs fell headless. The rest fled. Shout out Gimli, the goat. Baruchazad means axes of the dwarves. Axes of the dwarfs, Baruchazad. So I loved all of that. And then also, like, obviously we're not talking about Hobbits here, but a thief that you

love to talk about is the way in which your dark lords, your Voldemort, your whewers, will underestimate people at their peril, will not pay attention to them. So what Doran is saying here is, like, he thinks he's got us with this gold shit. But that's not going to stop us. it just reminds me of the quotes such as the course of D's that move the wheels of the world. Small hands do them because they must while the eyes of the great are elsewhere. So this idea that like... I mean, I do think that Sauron is taking the dwarves into consideration.

That's why the seven exist. That's why I'm pretty sure the Balroghito stuff is that like I think we're meant to think that like Sauron is urging the Balrog on from a distance. He's got a lot on his plate. no wonder Mr. Mouse is looping. God. Yeah. But so obviously, like, he's accounting for them,

but he's not accounting for how much Doran loves Elrod. Maybe. I don't know. Doran will come. I don't know. I feel devastated. But I believe in this moment when Durran gives the speech. I'm putting a lot of faith still in, in Chekhov's Dwarven tunnel

that Galadriel calls out and uses. in this episode coming into play in the finale, God, I hope. I couldn't have loved this more. I think I had the same like, eat shit, Papa D, sit down. You're not allowed to speak anymore

both because you've gone under murders free with your acts and are killing your own, but also because your son is clearly better at this than you reasons. And like, I think to that point about Sauron underestimating and seeing as a weakness what can ultimately be a sort of

source of strength or seeking to make a weakness, like what could be a source of strength, is just so satisfying to hear during, especially given, like, that he is a part of this friendship we hold so dear, to hear him champion it here. And like to see how good he is at this, to see how great he is at this. And the fact that he's better at it specifically because the, when Poppity is making his stump speech a couple episodes ago, she's talking about he's looking inward. Yeah. Right? What's happening here?

What's happening in this place? What's our future? And so he's making the same mistake that Sauron is. And of course, part of that is what was already in there. And part of that is what the ring is doing to him and weaponizing and amplifying that was already like lying in weight. So you have Sauron seeking to isolate and divide. Kellebrambor alone in his tower.

Mordania brought into like an arm grasp. right, and then you have the counter. And I love specifically thinking of this is something you can forge, because we're in a story about forging rings, but you're forging fellowship too. So fellowship, like countering with dissent, with isolation, by sewing mistrust. When Kelliborne Moore goes out there and is finally able to speak the truth to everybody around him,

they think he's a babbling idiot whose mind is shattered, even though everything that he's saying is real, because they have been primed. not to believe him, primed to think that he is like, is basically like beneath their lair respect at this point now. And so if you choose to forge fellowship, that can be stronger, as we will see in a wonderful trilogy, than any ring you might forge.

And like you pair that then with him invoking a very Sam-esque idea of like writing the tale of your time, participating in real time and something you know will be a part stitched into this great tapestry. This is real like this is the stuff, Lionel. This is great. It's all the same story. The great ones never end.

Okay, will you fight with our friends? That's, I mean, it's just wonderful stuff. Okay. So we're just going to breeze past some battle stuff that happens. There's a painful at our glug exchange where, again, Chris, stop me if you heard this before. Glug looks uncertain and fairly muteness. You told us.

You loved us. With all that is left with my heart too much to let you become sorrow and slaves. I really feel for Adar in this episode. Yeah. I really also wanted Gluck to be like, I wish you loved us enough to not let us become dead then. You're really becoming a thing that he's full Anakin like Obi, like you're just becoming the thing.

You're sworn to destroy. Is loving us putting us under the foot of a heel troll, is loving us letting him use us as a meat shield to fend, off Arrondier's arrows. So Galadryl instigates what I would call quite shoddy escape attempts from the camp. Her one lock of blonde hair just falling out. I'm like...

Yes. As we've established on recent pods, the most canonically remarkable hair in the universe. This is like real Sam and Frodo, you know, putting on their orc arm. and just marching through Mordor and like winding up having to stage a fight to not get caught in line.

Just like clanking in their oversized armor and great stuff. But yeah, Adar is doing this funereal right in flames. They returned to darkness, which I thought was like a really interesting sort of like counter of Gandalf's threat of go back to the shadows.

You shall not pass. Turn up. Lame A wooden. She's got tears. when she's watching him cry over his children. And I think that's a really powerful moment.

I think so what you were saying earlier about the pity and the compassion and the linking and the uniting of these characters who are opposed, it's more tragic, ultimately, that it's one thing if you just never learn to see the heart

inside of somebody or to understand why they do the things they do or what is driving them. But the fact that they actually feel this pity. Yeah. Feel this empathy for each other. On some level, understand that they are fighting a common enemy,

but then still cannot, like, find a path to true allegiance. It's just, it's much more devastating than if they had just been like, let's kill each other and stayed in that place that they were in in episode six last season. And I think something Rings the Power is really good at doing is twisting the knife,

just like it knows how to twist the knife emotionally. Arrondio shows up, to rescue her just to make a time. Just as Mallory had hoped he would. Oh, man. Yeah. She says to him, there is a dearth of Elven Heroes is nice. It would be a pity to lose another.

And my brain, my 80s, 90s, addled brain supplied the Princess Bride line. There's a short end of perfect breasts in this world. It would be a pity to damage yours. Thanks William Goldman for that line. Fantastic. Shit is happening in Kazah, Doom. a, man.

They're going to lose that beast. I'm on Balragito watch 2024, I think we're getting a Balrog in the finale. I hope so. And I would like to apologize to the people who were like it wasn't the watchers in the water,

watcher in the water, it was the Balrog. I think it probably was supposed to be the Balrogue. All signs are pointing Balrogito away. So, um, here we go. Oh, man. What do you want to say about,

I mean, obviously, yeah, Duran is like, Elrod, what about Elrond? What do I do about my best friend? And the I Need Your Axe conflict for Duran that we sort of saw coming, right? Because his father has asked for a couple times. At this point, it's like the whole kingdom is asking for his axe. And he has already sworn it to Elrond.

So this is like, take me instead stuff. I just can't bear to see Duran have to make a choice like this. it's not just friend or family, right? Because for Duren, friendship is family. That is the heart of the character that we have spent two seasons with. Elrond is as much of a brother to me as if he'd been fired in my own mother's womb. But that is what he said to his father. How dare you?

In episode seven last season. He believes out with every ember of his being. being. Now, that means that we want him to go help Elrod. That is what we want. But when he's like, Disa, is she okay? And Narvi's like, she sent me up here. I don't know. We're like, I've got a lot of blood in my eyes. I'm not sure. I'm soaked in blood from your dad doing a murder. Yeah. We want him to go help Disa too. We don't want to sacrifice Casa Duma in order to go help Elrond. We want him to be able to be able to. to somehow do a thing, a thing that feels impossible. We want him to be able to do both.

We don't want him to have to. The fact that he is now in a very real moment of having to make a choice that has routinely by other characters been presented as a false choice. You got to pick one or them, like us or them, right? But for Duren, it's a real choice right now

that he actually has to make absolutely gut-wrenching. It's just a huge moment. and to think not only about the emotional toll for him and for Elrond, Duren will come, Duren will come, Duren will come. But what the consequences of a choice like this are. Well, no one think of our emotional well-being? I think that's the real question.

Well, will no one think of us at home watching Elrond in the mud? Thank you for saying this. I'll forever change. And we'll never be the same again, so it's fine. What do you want to say about this scene between Brimby and Anatar? who says he just wants to heal Middle Earth, you guys. I mean, we've heard this from, I don't know that we need to go that much into it

because we've heard all of this from Sauron before. We've heard it from Adar talking about Sauron. The Morgoth tortured me stuff is, is canon, we knew, but is somewhat new. It's a little bit of a twist on sort of what it says in the Simaurelian about Sauron just doing all the same evil. I mean, nothing is evil in the beginning is how this show's,

It's important to know how Sauron became Sauron. He wasn't always this way. He was once a godly smith. But there's just a real lack of responsibility taking from Sauron and what else can we expect from the Dark Lord himself. Yeah. It made me think back to not only like some of our favorite scenes, The Log in episode six or the moment of the reveal in the finale,

but then at the beginning of this season, both something like him saying in the flashback, always after defeat, The Shadow takes another shape and grows again in the way that he is, we can clock that this is something Saran is always telling himself, right? I can reinvent. I can take another pass.

Get me a new wig. I've got a new plan and a new name and a new accent. I had a drink on a carriage and I'm no longer goop. I'm like incredibly, I've got all, look at this chest hair and these curls. It's wonderful. It's wonderful. But then how like that idea is both in harmony and in conflict with, I was thinking again

of our guy, Big D, whose name still, neither of us can pronounce from the first episode of this season. It's Dermann, Dermann, Dermann, Dermann. Dermann. Yeah, Dermond. Dermann. Dermann. And that, like, I've done evil.

What of tomorrow you have to choose it again and how, like. And how he's like, that's like, that's. sounds exhausting. Yeah, he's like the thing I'll choose again tomorrow is to tell myself that this was the right thing. Not to actually do the right thing. This is so fascinating. And again, to like circle back to that pity idea when Calibrimbor says you really are

the great deceiver, you can deceive even yourself. Yeah. You know, Calibor has no reason to extend pity to Saran who has ruined his beautiful forge among other things. But like he does. I think he does in that moment. moment. He's just like you can just even yourself. You have just constructed a narrative where you're the victim and you're just trying to heal the world. Morgoth wanted to destroy. You want to

perfect. You're just a healer. You're just a guy trying to heal middle earth with fascism. It's fine. Just obey me. Be my son. I will be your slave. I don't do anything for you. Brimby tried to drop the rings of the fire, which we have, you know, we've been waiting for since the trailer. But the rings come out cold because this is what happens with One Ring. We were primed for this at the beginning of the season when we had that sort of burst of frost when Sauron was killed-ish at the beginning of the season. And we talked about this idea that in Tolkien, evil is cold.

The One Ring is cool to the touch from the fire. And so are the nine. And then Brimbiah chops his own thumb off to get. get out of the shackles. And it's devastating. This moneymaker. Whose will is the mightier? Is that,

is that, would you put whose will is the mightier up against, you've never seen me wheeled either? Which would you say is the sassier response from an L? I'm still,

I'm putting L-Rond at the top there. That was, that was an all-timer. Whereas I felt mostly just extreme life-altering desperation. from Calibrimbor here. I'll be it guiding clarity. Okay.

So he goes outside, gets blown up again, as you said. Brutal. Just take a look around, my guy. And he's getting apprehended. This is Galadryl shows up, and she's like, that is Lord Calabrimbor. I will roll all the R's to intimidate you and get you to back down. And this story says, yeah, he says, part of me knew, part of me saw.

I blinded myself to what he was. And she says, so did I. And it's just this incredible moment of fellowship between Hillebramore and Galadio. No one else can understand. I mean, maybe Mordana, but she's been thrown over the ramparts. So it's just Galadryal here to offer him understanding and sympathy and pity in this moment, pity for each other. And then we get the speech that happens at the we dropped at the beginning of this podcast episode. Yep.

Which I felt like it was, time was of the essence. And I felt like, hellmomer was like, wait. I have a speech to make about light. Please pause at your flame from the city so that I can talk about the light. But it was a beautiful school that absolutely loved. Charles Edwards delivered it beautifully. That was incredible.

It was like, you take them, you take them. It's got you, yeah, yeah, no, they're in a pouch. I put him in a pouch and everything. Go. And then it's like, let me talk about light. Need some hustle here. Need some hustle when you're going down the stairs. Oh, man, Kellebrimbor.

So, yeah, I thought, like, in terms of what Galadryl is admitting there, I was thinking back to the second episode of this season, when, like, she was saying, Saran used me, yeah. And under his hand, I was played like a harp to a melody, not of my choosing. But here's the difference, right? And Elron's like, he plucked you. It wasn't direly. Sarah looked inside you and plucked the very song of your soul note.

by making himself not to be exactly what you needed. He flubbed the shit out of you, Galadro. Let's be clear. I still say, if only, if only. But like, that's a big difference, right? And how she's framing it to Elrond and what she is letting out to Calibirmbor here. And like you're saying, it's because she sees on, they don't have the, I mean, yeah, they know each other. They're both kind of a big deal.

They've spent time together ill-advisedly forcing the three, etc. But they don't have like the emotional connection that Galadriel and Elrond have. But they are bound by this shared experience. And so like the weight that you feel lift off of her when she says that out loud feels like a very important thing ahead of whatever comes next. I love that. Gals got the nine. Arrondier and Gilgallid and Elrond together take down this hilltrol.

It takes a village, take down a hilltural. I do want to shout out Elrond getting the opportunity to issue a trademark signature. Destroy it in the thrust of battle. He got to rip off a destroy it. Great stuff. Can't wait to see that again in a new context. I will say, Arondier, you know, highs and lows this season, but like all the action stuff is killer in this episode. He's wonderful.

anytime he's just sort of like twirls into frame and does stuff with his bow and arrow. It's actually just incredibly wonderful. Speaking of Arodier, Adar Stasm, he goes down, he's still moving on the ground. First time through, I was like, is he dead? But he's still sort of wriggling around on the ground. So I'm not ready to pronounce him dead.

But Galadroa is the nine. But Adar has Nenya. Adar has her ring. and we'll see what he does with that next. I did enjoy Elron's completely transparent attempt to be like, I didn't bring it. I wouldn't have brought it here. It can be so stupid as to walk this into your tent.

I left it home. I gave it to Cairdon for safeguarding. I wanted him to like pull a hacks and it's like, you know, you don't keep anything valuable in the safe. The safe is in the pool. I didn't bring it here. The episode closes with some of you. music that how did you feel about the musical cue that closes this episode?

To me, the episode ends with not the, I thought frankly, jarring actual musical number. And instead it ends with the music that plucks the strings of my soul, which is Elrond repeating. Turin will come. Turin will come. Turin will come. Turin will come. Oh, my God. The look on Adar's face is he snatched Nenya.

and said, have you forgotten your Ruhma'll never make war in anger? This was the first time all season where I didn't think Adar looked hot, and that felt deliberate. I was like, this is not for me. Also, lest we forget, Kieridan told us the beginning of season that Ruhmel was a drunkard. So I just need you-hammered all the time. I just need you to know that when you take his word as gospel. Okay. Man.

Wig watch. Do you wear weeks? I just want to shout out Gil Gallad's battle wig. the waves. He didn't put it up. He left it flowing. And the waves were just like nice and must from all the killing. And so I just shout out that battle wig.

That's great stuff. Any hair stuff you want to shout out? I just think until we leave this mortal coil, we should find opportunities to mention to each other and our listeners that when Duran finally laid eyes on Elrond again, he mentioned his hair. Tidal hair. I mean, what a gift. It is a gift.

Wonderful. It's truly wonderful. Just like, they're doing a Peggy Sharon Carter thing. Galadriel is Elron's mother-in-law. What is happening here? He's got to marry her kid. He's going to marry her daughter. Yeah.

I mean, I don't think we're not going to see, like, her daughter isn't already born. We're not going to like see her be born in the course of, and if she does, it's going to be like a weird Jacob imprinting on Renéz. May moment, I suppose. So, yeah, Galadalus is mother-in-law. So we have some questions, comments, and concerns about that. Now, you know, if you're living as long as the elves live, maybe that just doesn't mean anything. It's complicated. Yeah. It's like, yeah, I fucked your mother once. For old. I fucked everyone. It's been millennia, okay? You should have seen my hair. It was tidal wave. It was very good. Before I grew it long and flat ironed.

Oh, no. Okay. The, uh, checking in with Elrond's godly relative is interesting timing because he's about, per canon, he's about to found River, not Riverdale, a terrible show, uh, Rivendale. Idyllic place. He gets straight from this battle to leading the Elst to Rivendale. That's what happens like next. So, uh, finally time for me to build my. my leg of step.

I love that. All right. And then just some like listener email stuff to round out this episode. A lot of people are suggesting that perhaps the stranger, aka or praise your Gandalf, will get his wand,

his staff from the tree in the middle of store bill that we spent a lot of time talking about in last week's episode. I love it. Okay. Yeah. John wrote in to say, also wouldn't it be nice in a very Sam type of way

if seeds from this tree in Storatown were brought to the Shire and eventually became the party tree in the Shire. Yeah, you love it. You love to see it. My heart! We get several emails attempting to please Gandalf and Middle Earth in Second Age without breaking canon. And I will maybe go through those in next week's episode. Not a lot of time for Gandalf in this episode, or is he Gandalf?

Who's to say? But it's going to be tricky or they don't care. Either way. That's where we are. canonically, and we mentioned this in this section a few weeks ago, Duran does come. The dwarves do come to rescue Elrond at the Battle of Oregon. So this is just a particularly brutal cliffhanger of, you know,

do you think they're going to show up at the top of next week's episode, or like, how long are they make us wait? Good question. I would prefer literally minute one. That would be my ideal outcome. Um, he like, well, Dernus, like, walk up and,

and see that Disa, like, just has, like, one sandaled foot on King Duren's throat. And she's like, I've got this handle. Go see to your boyfriend. You gave a big speech. He gave a huge speech. You can't, no backsees on that. Um, okay.

I, I love when, uh, there's like a popular theory going around and we get so many emails, uh, from random people about one theory or another. So the, the, is getting all stuff from the tree and, Storeville is one. Is Poppy Smeagel's ancestor? Because in the text, we got a lot of emails about this, actually.

And Lucas wrote in specifically to say, to put in a quote from the book, which says, talking about, you know, the stores and all of that, the most inquisitive and curious mind of that family was called Smeagle. His grandmother, desiring peace, expelled him from the family and turned him out of her whole phrasing. It was ruled by a grandmother of the folks. and wise and old lore. So a lot of people are like,

is Poppy the grandmother who turns Smingle out of her? Oh, my fault. Okay, last one at least, we also got a ton of emails about this. So this is a popular theory going around as well, I guess.

Is Kemen the mouth of Sauron? Not one of the ring ranks, but the mouth of Sauron. How would you feel if one of the most punchable mouths we've ever seen just gets sort of locked in for all of time? Yeah.

Feels right. I'm open to a number of unfortunate outcomes for and doomed fates for Kemen. Whatever we can do to make sure that guy is a bad time. He and his mom, his mom and we both agree that Kemen should come too ill. Okay. That does it for season two, episode seven, a tremendous battle episode. A really great episode of television, I thought. I don't think about Jordan's speech for a really long time.

I'll be thinking about El Run in the Mud for a really long time. And we'll be back next week. to the finale. No. I don't accept it. And I won't allow it. She's going to be like in the mud being like, two more episodes will come.

Thanks to the whole entire Dwarven village. I don't know why I said Dwarven. You know, just like rousing speech. Many hands make light work. Thanks to Steve Allman for his work on the soundboards, production work on this episode. Thanks to Jomi and Dinneron for his work on the social.

Jomi is putting clips of us on Instagram, talking about all number of things that may be incorrect, like why there are no horses in the Middle Earth, Arjuna, Rand Gapal, for his production work on this and all of our episodes. And thank you to the video team, which today is Cephano Sanchez and the editor, John Richter on video production and T. Cruz on video production. Thank you to all.

And we will see you next week. Bye.