House of R - ‘Stranger Things’ Season 2 Revisited

Episode Date: August 28, 2025

Mal and Jo are back together and in Hawkins to continue their rewatch of ‘Stranger Things’ in the run-up to the fifth and final season. Next up: revisiting Season 2! They talk about their original experience with this season and hand out some superlatives! (00:00) Intro (08:46) Opening snapshot (22:08) Best New Addition (31:03) Most Important Relationship (38:39) Funniest Moment (42:46) Most Emotional Moment (45:45) Scariest Moment (54:12) Goopiest Moment (57:51) Best Coming-of-Age Moment (01:03:16) Award for Honoring the Nerds (01:10:05) Ship Wars (01:15:38) Best Quote (01:18:03) Most Memorable Visual (01:22:01) Favorite Pop Culture Influence (01:24:49) Most Potent Use of ’80s Nostalgia (01:27:59) ’80s parenting: We have some notes (01:31:14) Sophomore slump miscalculation (01:33:47) The Fit (or Hair) Lord of S2 (01:36:17) Best Needle Drop (01:39:01) The Most Netflix-y Subtitle (01:41:27) Season MVP (01:46:33) The Most Enticing Endgame Setup Hosts: Mallory Rubin and Joanna Robinson Producers: Carlos Chiriboga and Jon Jones Social: Jomi Adeniran Additional Production Support: Arjuna Ramgopowell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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This episode is brought to by Whole Foods Market. Spring is here, so celebrate it with fresh, juicy, seasonal produce and some very tasty limited time flavors. New Whole Foods, Market Peach, Apricot, Rose, Italian soda. Perfect for a picnic or brunch, as is their trending mango, Yuzu chantilly cake. But if you're on the go, new 365 strawberry pretzels make a great sweet snack. That sounds delicious. Get savings with yellow sale sign storewide and everyday low prices on 365 brand items. Enjoy the fresh flavors of spring. Save at Whole Foods Market. Greetings. And welcome to House of Art. Wow. A Ringerverse podcast on the Ringer Podcast Network. I'm Mallory Rubin. Joining me today in the city of Los Angeles,

we've got chemistry, history, plus the real shit. Share. Trauma. It's Joanna Robinson. Wait, so you want to talk about episode seven of season two of Stranger Things already? Is that we meant by shared trauma? Yeah, that's what the entire pod is going to be about today, the lost sister, Callie, eight. What a thrill to be sitting here with you, Mallory Rubin. Can't believe it. Can't believe it. What an honor. A pleasure, privilege, a joy. I was told that we would be podcasting on the couch so that we could be entangled in each other's arms the entire time. No, specifically asked not to be on the couch. But just an absolute joy, not only to be with you in the flesh in person, to be with you podcasting,

welcome back, we've missed you dearly every second of every day, every moment of every week, every week of every month. But we get to reunite to talk about Stranger Things Season 2, revisited. Something we were supposed to do, it doesn't matter. A month ago. Part of the story is about like the nature of time and all that, so it doesn't matter. And then, Joanna. Mallory. It is a curse to see so clearly. Marie Balman taught me that. But what it does help us with is programming reminders.

Next week, it's happening. It's happening. We will be beginning our Buffy journey together. Last night, you and I talk about entangle on the couch. You and I spent five hours. Yeah. More than us tonight. On a couch together, watching Buffy Season 1 together.

And it was a dreamy experience. And I can't wait a podcast with you about it. Who else was there? Halo. Halo. Yep, he was there. Adam was in the other room. Adam was in the other room, but Halo is with us on the couch. Hello was dialed in.

He was watching. Thank you so much to everyone who covered for me while I was gone, I should say, and to you for picking up all the slack while I was gone. You did an incredible job, obviously, as always. If anyone listening or watching is wondering, Joanna, why don't you have a list of things that you love about Mallory Rubin ready? Well, do not fret. Oh, my God. I have that list ready. We're not going to do it today.

I'm going to wait until you and Rob and I are together on the Alien Pod so I can dish it back to both of you. Will you be coming back to L.A. next week so that you can do it in person? It's a good question. Something to think about. Something to think about. Something to think about. Do you want to just live in your backyard forever? You have a standing invite, as the kids say, and as you know, we will also, in addition to Buffy next week, be potting about Alien Earth.

So that's a thrill. That's exciting. We've got a lot of good stuff coming up. We're just hyped to be in the presence of each other. other. I've missed you. I miss you too. A lot. You're the best and I love you. Okay. Wait, something people should know. What? Tell me. What? While I was gone, you sent me a video every single day of you reading me a passage with Halo in Frame of one of our shared favorite books. Every single day, unless you were watching Buffy and then you sent me a Buffy update. Yes. There was one day where I sent you

I'm starting Buffy instead. And then there was another day where I just fell asleep super fucking early. Like we're talking 8 o'clock. We're never going to mention it. But you haven't lived until you received a personal video text of Mali Rubin reading from like Tolkien or Georgia or Martin or something else. And then, you know, tears inside my face. If I ever become active on book talk, you'll just always know that it started with me. With you, for you. And you were always for. You make a killing. You have such like a dulcet tones. I will say, tones. Did you hear a little Baltimore? We were doing a lot of Baltimore accent work on the drive over today. I think that my, my performance, especially in the early days where I was still shaking off the old COVID, was, you know, it was mixed day to day, but you know who never faltered and was given a star showing? Halo. Halo. He was. He was. He was the star in. You think everybody who is sitting here with us today is like, do you think they're going to talk about stranger things? Or do you think they're like, this is. this is the magic we've missed.

Maybe both. Maybe both. It's cat videos of its own kind. Yeah, no, let's talk about Strangeer Things. Let's talk about Muse. It's a tough one. Well, it's a good time to issue the spoiler warning. Before we talk about Muse.

Obviously, today's podcast is our revisitation of Stranger Things Season 2. So anything that happened in Season 2 could come up today. We're going to do this the same way that we did our Season 1 pod. A couple very quick prompts and table setters at the start. and then we have our superlatives, our categories, and once again, we have 20. We've just stopped trying to be like, let's do 10. Let's do 12. We're doing 20, and I've...

In my post, like, after having been gone, I had some surgery. I'm living life a little differently. Smuggles galore. Usually we wait until we're on Zoom for the recording to tell each other, like, ah, I didn't want a little smuggle city day. Told me this like 48 hours ago. Yeah, I did. That's why I knew you were serious about it. Smuggletopia.

I'm thrilled. I can't wait. The more things we get to highlight and share from Stranger Things, the better. So anything from season two, obviously anything from season one that we've already talked about and that people will have watched in the process of getting through season two could come up today. In terms of future seasons, same general approach as last pod. This is a rewatch in the run-up to season five. A final season. The final season. episodes so long, they've told the duffers they can't release the runtimes. Say goodbye to your family on three cherished holidays. You'll be watching Stranger Things. So because we're marching toward the end, we have a category at the end of the pod today

that we will specifically say, hey, we're going to be talking about season five stuff. If you don't want to hear this, skip ahead. Throughout the rest of the pod, we might occasionally reference or allude to something from future seasons, but like, think of it as like a sprinkling of a trail of raw meat along railroad track. One note on that. Yeah. And it'll be my only note for Steve the Hare Harrington, who otherwise is flawless throughout season two.

Flawless. Is he? A lot of handling of the raw meat to then touch the glasses. Take the glove off. I don't think that the kids and stranger things were rocking the level of Purell that I am here in 2025, you know? So that's concerning. No free ads, but, yeah.

No free ads, but Pirel, if you're interested. We are loyal customers. We really are. We are loyal customers. It hasn't stopped us from getting COVID, but. Oh, God. Joanna. Yeah. Any other programming reminders, spoiler warnings.

No, I'm just really excited. Housekeeping business at the top. We're doing season two, and we will be doing season three and season four as well before season five is upon us in November. And you told me that season three can be in top. entirely about Hopper's Hawaiian shirt, right? That's what you told me. I told you you could wear Hopper's Hawaiian shirt during the bun.

That actually is what you said. Should I? Yes. They got it at a JCPenny, right? I remember. I'll see what I can find. I feel confident we can find this for you. I got to tell you something.

I have never once in my 38 years worn a Hawaiian shirt. Not that I remember. And if there was ever an occasion to start. You know, a very popular giveaway at Candon Yards every year is the Oriole. Hawaiian church. So popular, in fact, that I believe this year they did the giveaway twice. Has anyone sent me one? No, they haven't. Something to think about. Wow. Something to think about. I know you know they're listening, so I look forward to you getting that in the mail soon. That was shameless. What else do we want to ask for? Oh my God.

I don't know. We've mentioned Purell, the O's, going down to the Aeveshin-hon. You did some Baltimore accent work. It's it. The gang's all here. I want to say something about Kran LaCroix. No free ads, but we're interested. We did want to do, let's get into it. Let's get into it. We're on a curiosity voyage. We need our paddles to travel into podcast, so let's get to our opening snapshot. Joanna. In, it could have been any month. I think it was in July. A month ago. In July, the first teaser trailer for Stranger Things Season 5 came out. And when we were originally planning to do this pod, it was much closer to that. We were going to talk about it in a little more detail. You know what?

There are going to be more trailers in the future. I mean, no promises. We'll see. But maybe we'll talk about future trailers in more detail. I think they called this one a teaser. And it was like two and a half minutes. Yeah, it's quite long. I know.

I got to say, I was like, if this is an indicator, a teaser two and a half minutes, I assume the full trailer will still only be like three and a half. But what if it's like seven? Because all of the episodes are three and a half hours. Exactly. I mean, oh my God. We still, though, wanted to quickly mention it. You had a great idea, which was to basically each highlight one or two things that just either gave you that little feeling in your chest or got you particularly hyped or maybe the absence of something that made you wonder.

What is your... Back in California, living his life, best life. Purple Palm Tree Delight. Purple Palm Tree. light if you're interested in sponsoring podcasts. Oh yeah. I mean, that would be a vibe. We'll see. For the New Year's, for the New Year's finale part. Okay. What is, what is most top of mind for you after checking out this teaser trailer? Um, I, your pick is kind of my pick, so I'm going to pick something else, but I'm excited to yes and the thing that you picked,

which I do think is like kind of the most exciting thing about the season five series. Which is the very quick shot of Joyce and Hopper sitting on the edge of a bed together. That's what we're both talking about. Absolutely. We have the same. We have the same. priorities for me to take a strong left turn from that. There's a lot of Holly in this trailer, Baby Holly, who is now in college. Baby Holly's an AARP eligible. He's a preteen. So Mike and Nancy's younger sister who we, like when we did our season one pod, you

know, we're talking about some like the lingering shots on Holly, like that they've done throughout the years and we've always been wondering, is there going to be some sort of payoff? To all of the deep trauma. And everything Holly's been through. And we get a lot of the Wheeler fam in the trailer. You know my feeling on this. Ted's spin-off when? Ted Death Watch when is my question.

Boy. Am I remembering that there's a shot of Holly and Karen, like sideways underwater or in a tank of some sort? It's worrying. It's upsetting. It's worrying. Karen's here. She was largely sideline in season four. But Karen is here, but Holly, it's Holly's time to shine.

So I'm excited for a new Wheeler. Incredible pick. Thanks. Mine is just, and it feels really right for today's pod, for the season two pod. Mine is Will buyers. There were a lot of shots of Will and a lot of shots of Will grabbing the neck as the hairs stood up and the goose flesh popped. That poor Nooshnop is like, please. Never write another stage direction that is Will weirdly grabs the back of his neck.

Some intense eye looks and shots of will over some sort of key line of dialogue, very tense moment. And like, again, we won't get into too many particulars from subsequent seasons, the three and four here. Yeah. But season two, you can't have season two without a really crucial will involvement in major aspects of the plot. And he just sort of recedes in the story moving forward. Because you and I both done a rewatch through season four and now we're going back and sort of re-re-watching. And I had the same experience where you watch, you re-watch season one, season two. And then Will is like fades and fades in three and four in ways that are interesting to talk about.

Like in ways thematically and the nature of growing up and all these other things that are thematically interesting to talk about. But I want a lot of Will Byers in the final season. And I was really excited to see how much of him was in the trailer. Yeah, he's like, as we've talked about and talked about when we first covered season four together, getting to cover a season of television together a second time is how you know you've been potting with someone for like a minute, which is a great feeling. Four years, maybe. Willis is responsible for a couple of the most like emotionally impactful moments to me in both three and four.

But in terms of like his connection to kind of the core plot and mythology, we got to bring him back to the four, I think. So I thought the trailer promised that and signaled that in a way that I thought. felt grateful. And we let, you know, we're going to talk about some of the new additions in season two. Like every year we add characters that we care about. Yes. But like, you know, again, to talk vaguely about season, but like, Eddie Munson, like, we were all insourced by Eddie, Eddie Munson, but I'm like, give my guy Will, give my guy Noah Schnapp, some more screen time. I think he deserves it. So, and a better haircut. The season two haircut is really something. I think it's the. The season,

two haircut is where the bang, like the shape of the bowl around the bang starts to just... I think it's the season four is the worst crime. You had a lot of comments on season four's hair. I do recall that. Yeah. But he's got a better haircut in the season five trailer, so that's... Oh, man. Great stuff. A lot of your jackets in the season five teaser trailer and notice that as well. A lot of radio station stuff. That's right. Yeah. I'm excited. Can't wait. Can't fucking wait. Okay. Season two. Let's do a little stage setting. Yeah, yeah. Take us back in time. What do you remember about is how it felt after the absolute sensation that season one was to anticipate, to be on the precipice of season two. Here's where I test everyone, including your love for me, which is like this is, this is, I talked about this in the season.

You can't test my love for you. Well, I talked about this in the season one podcast. This is like me at my most inseparable that like, by the time season two rolled around, season one had like been such an overwhelming phenomenon. You were like, I'm out. I wasn't out, but I was a little like, all right, here we go. And like, I actually think. it hurt the show a little bit, like sort of how frenzied people were after season one. I remember like the first image release from season two. We got the like the boys in in the Ghostbusters costumes like that. The idea of Halloween, all of that was really fun. And I liked the season a lot. But I think the like the frothing at the mouth for season two and like there are plenty of people

you'll still find that just think like season one was the best. And that I, it was like downhill the rest of the way. You and I both think season one is the best season, right? But I don't think we think it's as much of a drop off as some other people decided it was. And I really like season two a lot, actually. Me too. I like them all. And every time I revisited it, I-

Some major missteps, but I really like season two. There are a couple grave errors in season two, which we will talk about today. But yeah, I still have a lot of fondness and affection for season two. And I think revisiting it, one of the things, maybe I'll save this for, put a pin in this, we'll come back to one in season three. Season three, as you know, it's a season I'm maybe a little higher on than some other people. I love season three. You love them all.

I love kids. I love a coming of age story set at the mall. And I love a, I love a man. I love an orange tulis. I love a man with a mustache and a Hawaiian shirt, I guess. It's a thing I learned about myself watching season three. Season two is a more important and better season for advancing the mythology, the lore of the world, than season three is, even though I have more of like an emotional. emotional attachment to season three.

And so every time I revisit season two, and then there's just, we'll get to this in our categories. There are a few things in season two that are like, to me, God tier in terms of character pairings and a few developments with some of the characters and the introduction of, you know, we have a lot of new figures and we're going to talk about that more in a second. Some icons enter the mix. Obviously, I'm talking about Dart. Some others as well.

We'll get to them. And so that's very fun. And then there are some other people who arrive here who make less of a positive impression. Part of what contributes to that, Joanna, is that there's an additional episode in this season. This is a season with nine episodes. And one of them is, I think it's fair to say, not to step on future categories. Widely considered the worst episode of the series to date and the most kind of misguided. A big misstep.

We were talking, of course, about episode. Seven, the lost sister. And I was just telling Jomi before we started recording that both times I rewatched season two, I just skipped it and it makes no impact to skip it so that's just a true story of season two and not only is episode 7 of season two something you can skip

and an unfortunate misstep but it opens the whole season so every time we're watch you're just like oh yeah this is here but I there are some just incredible unforgettable aspects of this season there are if you choose to skip

episode seven the first time you're watching this because you've heard that that's the thing to do. Certainly it makes for a more cohesive viewing experience because six and eight or seamlessly.

There's a second of real time that separates them. You know, we get a, yep, Papa's alive. That's probably worth knowing. I guess.

You're caught up. Okay. You mentioned like the seasonal mood that Stranger Things puts you in when we did our season one pod? Summary vibes. Obviously, season three is just overt the essence of summer in so many respects. This season is set in the same time, right? We have our whole like anniversary effect aspect of the plot. It's one year after the events of season one, the trick-or-treating, the Halloween costumes instead of Halloween. But it also comes out on Halloween. There was a lot. That was part of how it was marketed, how it was presented, spooky season, get in the mood for stranger things. Did that have any bearing at all in how you're received it? Were you like, this is just not the time of the year that I want to be watching Stranger Things? Did that make no impact? I can't remember that making an impact.

Certainly better than the strange release strategies of season four and five, I would say. So I don't think, I don't think so. But I think it's fun to put it out in spooky season. Yeah. And then Netflix decided to start giving us like Mike Flanagan shows in October, your Wednesdays, except Wednesday came out earlier this year. So I like, I like, We're in the volume era, right? Volume 1, Volume 2. It's true. All the new characters, part of the delicate balance of not only expansion, as you noted, adding different plot lines, expanding the world, the scope of the world.

But then as part of that, you start to experiment with who's sharing screen time, right? It's not just like, oh, let's introduce to do people, and they're in an entirely different part of the show than the people you already have an attachment with, then two, you have to put them with people we already love. And so part of that can be electric, like, oh my God, here's a new. Max is in the group and we're thrilled. Sometimes,

this leads to the need to, okay, we're going to introduce eight, Cali. Gonna take 11 and separate her from the group and put her over here. Yeah, not only are we going to have her leave town for a couple episodes, but she's not even with everyone. She's with Hopper alone

for a while, and then she's not even with the other kids until the last two episodes of the season. A lot of Eggos, yet again, though. Sure. What's your stance on the triple-decker ego extravaganza? Anything you'd care to share with the group? I know how you feel about it. I'm anti-I-I-hmm.

I just don't like a lot of sweet stuff on my waffles, actually. I like a savory waffle. Savory waffle. Like a yokey egg. Sure. Sounds great. I don't like syrup and I don't like... At all, no syrup at all.

No syrup. Yeah. So this is like piles of whipped cream. Yeah. I mean, this whole thing. And it's just not for me, but I support everyone. What was your complaint about this that you told me the other night? A couple things. One, the waffles are not cooked nearly enough. The egos are too pale. Deeply untoasted. Too pale. Let's get a little crisp on those echoes. Yeah. We need some syrup. Apologies, but we need more of that. I love whipped cream on a

waffle or a pancake. Won't surprise you here. Love. The more whipped cream you can heap on any, like, breakfast item or baked good of mine, the better. I don't want Reese's pieces near my triple-decker, ego extravaganza, or near anything. Near your life. I'm not a fan of Riesis. I went on the record, had to muster the courage during the ET rewatchables, but it felt important, and I have no regrets. It's not a candy that I like.

Huppets and Dragons at gmail.com if you would like to get on Mallor's case about this, but you and I are alive on this. Not as bad as a free musketeer, of course. It's just a new git, man. Go on, Dustin. Okay, well, while we're talking about the introduction of new characters and new figures into the story, let's just transition right into our stranger superlatives because our first category today is Best New Edition.

Joanna, no shortage of options. You're going to go first. Here are just some of the candidates you could pick from. Okay. Max. Sure. Billy. Yes.

Dart. Are you vicking Dart? I know. Bob. Yeah. Murray. Yeah. Erica.

Uh-huh. The Sinclair parent. Dr. Owens, the mind flare. Yeah. We could be here all day. Dustin's mom. Dustin's mom. Muse.

Muse. Yeah. Via stocking and then a cuddle. Yeah. Toos. Tews. Are you picking twos? I'm not.

Okay, so you are picking DART. I have some complicated feelings about this. Is this one of the categories where you picked like nine people? I do have nine people isn't here. But no. It depends. I didn't even list Callie. Do you mean all of them as well?

New Edition impact on this season. Or do you mean new edition impact on the series as a whole? Take it. Take it in two different answers. Wherever you'd like to go. Also, if that's your excuse to provide us with two different answers, go fucking go for it. I need no such excuse. Here we go.

Sean Ashton as Bob. I mean, magic. Like, is this season, you know? And it's funny because I was like, I was, when I was rewatching it, having not seen season two for a while, I was like, oh yeah, we have to do this whole Bob and Joyce thing because we're delaying the hop, Joyce thing. And then my first rewatched season two, I was like, I just forgot how much Bob fucking rules. And then on my second time through it, I was just like, Bob is actually kind of my favorite part of this season. Not really, but like very high up there. So Bob for this season.

Okay. But overall, Max is incredibly important to me. So it's got, I mean. But I've got Bob honors coming elsewhere, so I have no notes on either selection. Max, in terms of this season, like, it's great that she's here and there's a lot to talk about when it comes to her. But they really develop her in three into four, you know. And like the Max and Lucas pairing is so crucial to my most emotional reaction to season four. So I think that, yeah, Max for the big picture, Bob for the micro.

I love that. Yeah. Do you think we should learn to skateboard in honor of Max? I'm 100% and I actually think we could. I've watched Instagram Reels. I don't agree. No, I've watched Instagram Reels of like women learning how to skateboard. Uh-huh.

Yep. I think this is available to us. I have routinely told myself that I think I could skateboard well, but I'm like. No, no, no, no. You can't skateboard well right now. Yeah. But basically there are classes where you like learn while you're, just like on the ground without the wheels underneath you learn the movements and then you get on

the board and you're like, oh, this is how I do it. Interesting. We can do this. Okay. Should we? That's how I've always thought about learning to surf, right? You kind of like sit, you just, should we also learn to surf? Absolutely. But we need a better tired excuse to do it. Let me say this on the skateboard. Netflix presents Joe and Mel learn how to skateboard. Should we just go right to like the 100 foot wave territory? That would be HBO, not Netflix. So I'm sorry to complicate the presenting idea. I should have worn vans. Should have worn vans today. In honor of Max,

didn't do it. Next time. Oh, well. Pair it with the Hawaiian shirt. Who would be injured first? Me. What bone would I break? Radius and ulna. Yeah. Yeah. Been there before. Well. Not skateboarding, but roller skating.

So I feel pretty sure. I broke my arm rollerblading and also biking. Look at that. So maybe I shouldn't do this. You said with such confidence. that we can't. I do think we can. I do want to say honorable mentions in this category. DART. Murray. Yeah, of course.

Great use of Murray in this season. Incredible. Yeah. You can't spell America without Erica. A great introduction for Erica in this season. Multiple Erica wins coming in season three without question. And then Paul Reiser as Sam is fantastic. Fantastic.

Fantastic. I'm excited to see what we learned. I still have some like, we talked about this a lot in season four, but like questions. And there's some interesting theory fodder with, I think, like... Her on Sam? Yeah. Just like his history and like his family. Should we do a Stranger Things Theory only pod?

Maybe. Like in November, like close to... Yeah, should we do that, like, live stream on Thanksgiving Day? Just get in the mindset of only podcasting about the strangers. We will show up our new skateboarding skills and we'll... It will do it on skateboards. Yeah. It's a good idea.

Eat some turkey and skateboard at the same time. We're in a similar headspace with this one. I... Elsewhere today in other categories, I will be honoring DART, Bob, for sure, Murray. I have a lot of Erica love coming in season three for sure. Today, I am going with Max. Kind of like, I want to say like an assist from Billy, who I do think is like a strong season two. I don't really disagree. You don't like Billy? I don't like Billy in this season. I love how he's used in season three and the payoff in season four.

I think it's impossible to separate like that now on a rewatch, you know, because we feel where we're going. But like just he's so loathsome, you know, and then you get the little, the, oh, what a sad. Oh, hurt people, hurt people. Yeah, exactly. It doesn't work on you. I just think they took too long to give us that information. Give us any, like, empathy. We needed, we needed him to be not as racist, not as like weirdly, bullies. Like all the things that he does that are like so hateful.

I do not root for building. No, no, I know. But like we needed some. But his presence in the season feels like useful. I feel like we needed some humanity in him a little earlier than we get. And then you're like, I should feel sorry for you, but you've been an absolute menace to society for most of the seasons. Think about how much earlier it would feel if you didn't have to go on a side quest. Guess what?

Good news. I don't in my rewatching screen. I think like the conversation we're having about. the specific balance of ingredients when you introduce new characters. Obviously, that's something to think about and take seriously across the entire ensemble of the show like this. No place is the delicacy of the dance more crucial than the party, right? The main group of games. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And to have pulled that off and nailed it with Max, where now, like, we can't even think about that central group without her. You and I were looking at some Stranger Things merch, and there was, like, some old merch on this list that. we were looking at and they had a shirt that had 11 Mike, Dustin, and Lucas because it was from like season one and we were like, you can't, Max has to be on there. There's no group without Max. It's like impossible. Max is so cool. Max is so funny. Max is sensible and smart. Max is like empathetic. Like I love the little Mike is such a such an asshole in this season, which we'll obviously get to. But I love that Max is like able to stand up for herself and challenge everybody like, guys, this is fucked up that you won't let me in the room.

me like shit. Yeah. Really good moment. Max is also then able to still find like the grace in her heart to say to Mike like Elle seems really awesome. You know, like Max just hits all those notes. It's only because Max doesn't know that Elle used to tell mees this stuff. It felt like a magnet pulled my board. That'll be when we learned to skateboard what I say except through your broken team. Just, yeah, I just will have fallen. El will not have been actually responsible in any. Anyway, quietly, one of my favorite Max moments is very early. It's the dropping the note in the trash can. Oh, that's so good.

I got it. But also just, like, her introduction to them, for them to go to the arcade, Who's Mad Max? To have her show up in the classroom and to have, like, when she sits in the, like, slouches down in her seat in the back. And all four boys, like, turn their heads to look at her. It's incredible. It's really good. I just turned this way away from the cameras, which reminded me of House of the Dragon.

Quote. Yeah. Memories. Remember. memories. We're being watched. Max, my fellow COD, my fellow child of divorce, you know, love that. Max is brave. Max is just there in the thick of it, like, ready to fucking roll and rock. I just think Max is awesome and I love her. And I'm glad she's here. We should say, Citi Sink is having a tremendous year. And I'm really excited to see what happens for season five. But she had an incredible Broadway run, Tony nomination. Absolutely crushing it. Great stuff.

Should we go to our next category, which is one I am going to predict we have the same pick for, but maybe not. We don't. We don't. Oh, interesting. Because you have a clip, and I already know what that clip was because I walked in when they were testing it. So do you want to go first? Okay. Our next category is most important relationship of all 20 categories that we have today.

This was the easiest for me to pick. By far, not even close. it is one of my favorite things about the show, period, across every season. And I think it is present elsewhere, but most beautifully rendered and meaningfully rendered in season two. Can we hear the clip? Use the shampoo and the conditioner. And when your hair's damp, it's not wet, okay? When it's damp, damp, you do four puffs of the fair faucet spray.

Justin and Steve. I mean, my favorite duo. Inarguable. It's not. There are a lot of pairings I love on the show. There are character groupings I'm very invested in. This is the top of the list for me. I hope that they got like kale salads for everyone in the writer's room.

The day that they figured out, they're like, okay, we want Jonathan and Nancy to go on a road trip together. Yeah. Like, Steve and Nancy are going to break up-ish at the beginning of this season. What do we do with Steve Harrington? A character we were going to kill off in season one. Unthinkable. Where do we put him? Yeah.

And whoever said, why don't we put him with Dustin? It's the best. Henderson. It's the best. Deserves a medal. I agree. The full medal ceremony, let's go right to the end of a new hope. Yeah.

Like, this is just, I feel like when we talk about Marvel, I bring up a lot, the infinity more magic of like Thor and the Guardians, you know, when you take characters and you put them together, and you're like, ah, yes, this just feels right. Like, that's what every moment. moment that Dustin and Steve shared together feels like for me. It's just absolute magic. I had a hard time not picking them for basically every category that was positive in its framing. I just love them. It's such an ingenious team up. The nature of how they, in the flow of the season, I always think it happens earlier than it does. It's not until episode five that Dustin is, and we'll get to

that scene elsewhere, he's at the wheelers. Coincident. It's coincidence that brought these two together. It's like happenstance. Steve gets out with his like bouquet for Nans. He's a fixed. Sorry, I love you. What am I sorry for? And like, Dustin's been yelling at Ted. And then it's just like, do you have, we have bigger problems in your love life. You still have that bat, what bat, the one with the nails. Let's fucking go.

And then immediately there's that, like, trunk shot of him opening the trunk and tossing the keys without looking to Dustin. Dustin. I rewound it like four times. It's so slick. It's so good. The dart hunt, the cow meet train track trail, the bonding, a lot. along the way, talking about how to woo a girl. And there's this, like, there's just so much comedic potential, but also, like, the potential for something really heartfelt in their experience

gap, right? Very vulnerable. It's really sweet. Yeah, because you go from, like, the kind of bravado of, like, you know, just, like, make them think you're not interested in to, like, this description of electricity, no, like, sexual electricity, right? Which will come up later. And then you have the, just, like, the tenderness of, like, she's just going to break your heart. You're too fucking young for that. He doesn't say fucking because it's stranger things, but I said it. And it's just like beautiful. He calls the boys dickheads later. Yeah. Oh yeah. I got that coming in another category, great moment. And then of course we get the hair care advice, which is genuinely like, I think one of the best moments in recent television history. It's just perfect. And then like the refusal, it's not just, oh, we had this great thing on these train tracks. Doesn't leave Dustin's side. Like when Nancy's like, well, I can't go. I'm like, Steve's like, I might be a shitty boyfriend, but I'm a pretty good babysitter. I'm not leaving these kids, right? And he stays with them.

And then the best touch to me is that it goes beyond that. He takes us into the snowball. Like that is just where it goes into that pantheon tier to me where it's like, oh, they're in each other's lives. Yeah. And I just love it. They're trauma bonded. It's very important. Drama bond.

Trauma bond. So yeah, that's my pick. Easy one. Who do you have? I can't argue with your pick. Yeah. It's very important. Yeah.

But I think based on, I picked my. My grouping. Okay. Yeah. Yep. Based on some of the conversation, side conversations you and I had about Will. And I will say, first I just had Jonathan and Will because there's the early scene when Jonathan comes in and asks him, like, do you want to be Bowie?

Do you want to be Kenny Rogers? You know, you're my best friend. There's just like this beautiful. And like thinking about season four and Will and Jonathan, like, it's very, yeah. Jonathan Byers is like, his stock has risen the most for me on this rewatch. I used to have a real Jonathan Byers problem and now I don't. I love him. But it's,

it's, it's Joyce and Will and Jonathan and Will and Mike and Will in the sequence that we get at the end when they're all just like, remember when this happened. I have that in another category. But like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

They're, their connection to him. And like Jonathan and that's true for all three of those, those characters in season one as well, right? Like, Joyce's whole thing is, I'm not going to give up. I know he's out there somewhere. You know, Jonathan really cares that. is missing. Mike is driving the search for Will and stuff like that. But that sort of the

plot hinging on this moment of I know you. I can find you in there. I can hold on to you. And especially given, I would say, the gentle critiques we just shared of season three and four, which again, like with Mike and Will, this is growing up and stuff like that. But when you're talking about slotting characters into different groups, separating Joyce and Will or, you know, separating Mike and Will in very significant ways that are more character-driven, you just don't feel that the way that you feel him as like the spoke at the center, you know, like, no, he's the hub at the center of the wheel, you know, and it's just like, matters a lot. So everyone, those three around Will Buyers would be my most important relationship. Can't argue it. I have both of the things you just talked about, the Jonathan Will conversation about.

being a freak and the let me try to pull you out of the mind flayers control both of those coming in other categories. And I'm to say that's so important. Bob reaching out to Will in this season as well. I have some notes for Bob on the advice. Something that, well, okay. And then something that completely disappears is like Hopper's connection to Will, which completely disappears in later seasons.

And so, yeah, it's here though in season two. It's very important. It's great. I always love, it's like one of the things that I don't find myself thinking about when I'm away from the season, but always really love and appreciate when you return to it. Just that Will, because we think so much of them as a group, but Will choosing to tell just Mike first what is going on, you know? It is like that cementing. This season is the first step into my long journey towards like really loathing Mike Wheeler.

But he is quite attentive towards Will this season. He's noticing when things are wrong with Will. Yes. I like the whole sequence with him and Will and Joyce, like in the house. Like, I like that Mike gets, like Dustin and Lucas and Max are over here. And I like that Mike gets slotted into this storyline over here. And Ted and Karen have no idea where their children are. They do act, I guess they're like, yeah, he's at Wells.

But by then he's not. Great pick. Fantastic pick. Love it. Let's go from the feels to the laughs. Our next category is funniest moment. What do you have here? This is, I think, the funniest thing that has ever had.

happen on a television show. I have a clip. Let's play it. Whoa. Jonathan, how was the pullout? I'm sorry? Yeah. Yep.

Yep. So, Jonathan, how was the pullout? For those who haven't rewatched recently, we should say after an evening of vodka, Jonathan is supposed to be sleeping. And water. And water. So it's fine. So it's fine.

It's fine that he's playing these high school students with booze and telling them to go fuck in his guest room. And Murray has been trying to urge these two because of their sexual electricity, their chemistry together. Jonathan was supposed to be sleeping on the pull-out couch. He was, indeed. That is not where he spent the night. He spent it with Nancy. And so, Jonathan, how was the pull-out? It's incredible.

A top-tier gold star line. I have a few backups, but that is my number one with a bullet. It's fantastic. We have a pattern developing. I have that in another category. I have your clip in another category. This is fun. Okay, I had kind of like a few contenders for this one, but I ultimately, I probably shouldn't think this as a clip, but I didn't.

So I'll just say it. But not as well as Steve the Hair Haring. as Joe Ciri, when in episode 8, The Gate, this always makes me laugh, when Billy is looking for Max, and he shows up. He's like, is that you, Harrington? And Steve, kind of in the shadows, walking from the front door out, says, yeah, it's me, don't cream your pants. Like, the way he says it is, it kills me every time. It honestly, it's very funny. It's very amusing and their dynamic is, you know, entertaining across the season, playing your feet. That, the way he says that, I'm like, he's going to be like a movie star one day.

Like, I remember thinking that, watching it, you know, he just is so good. I'm waiting. Do you think after, well, no, because he's made some interesting choices. Great on Fargo. Fantastic on Fargo. Yeah. Is a genuine music star now. That's right.

Yeah. So I don't know if his future is music instead of acting, but I hope it's both. Why not both? A musical? Is that what I just heard? Oh, my god. A musical? Okay.

And then my runner up here is also a Steve one, and it's what you mentioned earlier with the Dundon side kills me when this is in episode six, this spy at the junkyard when he says, because Dustin and Lucas are talking. He says, hey, Dick Ed's, how come the only one helping me out is this random girl? Yeah. It's just the best. Steve is so great. Couple follow-ups from me. Hit me. Jonathan saying or Nancy saying you'll be done at this time to Jonathan listening to the talking heads reading Vonnegut. And he's like, sounds like a nice night. And I agree. I agree. I agree. I agree. I agree. I think I would like to hang out with Jonathan, honestly.

100%. I mentioned this to you the other day. Doris from Hawkins Middle and Floe from Hawkins PD hate Joyce Byers who keeps calling. The eye rolled a little. Yeah. Doris from Hawkins Middle School was just like, it's Joyce Byers on the fuck. Really good. And then for the physical comedy of it, Dustin hiding dart under his hat and then talking to his friends with a baby Devadog under his ball cap. Sweet little dart. I mean, I have some, I think, well, no. Sweet little dart. It's complicated. Okay.

We'll get to it. It's complicated. It's complicated. I think Dustin's desire to have Dart as a friend and protect him and nurture him is lovely. I think picking up Dart from the floor of a school. bathroom and putting them on your head is I have some notes. Silkwood shower time for you. Our next category. Yeah. Most emotional moment. Yeah. Do you want me to go first? This is where I have something you've already picked. So I can, I can hit that since we've already

kind of talked about it. I have a clip for this, actually. I saw you win the swings and you're alone too. you're just swinging by yourself and I just walked up to you and I asked I asked if you wanted to be my friend and you said yes absolutely love it so that's what you were talking about earlier with your most important relationship like that moment in the spy shack

and I love that moment with Mike and Will most of all but all of it the whole sequence like you said the Tonka Truck yeah yeah and I told you we wouldn't be able to afford another one, but she was sad and you wanted her to have it anyway. Or like, Joyce talking about his drawing. Oh my God. And hanged in how pride, the rainbow ship. Yeah, the crayons. Jonathan talking about playing the clash. Or building Castle buyers in one night when dad left, like Mike's invoking this legendary D&D campaign. Like you said, it's just like the idea that the thing that they can use to pull will out of the mind fliers control is the depth of their

histories with each other and connection to each other. and then specifically like knowledge of each other and understanding of each other. Like, you know, Joyce isn't just like, I'm proud of you for anything. It's like a thing Will loves and is good at, right? The drawing. And like, I think the, that moment with Mike and the look in Will's eye where you can just feel that he is there and trying to reach him in. And that's when he starts to tap. That's when he starts to like tap the Morse code and say to them here and try to communicate and they kind of like ratchet it up into the next gear. It's just so good. And no matter how many times I watch that, it really does get me. Like it chokes me up every time.

It's just so lovely. And, like, you feel the authenticity of the bond between these people when you watch a something like that. And, like, that is ultimately what drives the story. So I just love it. What is your most emotional moment? Is it Dart's death? With love and respect to Dart, no.

It's Bob's death. Yeah. It's Bob dying, which actually, like, takes me by super. Like, I know it's happening every time. You know kind of when you meet the character that it's going to happen. But it's Bob dying and then the vicious way that the show just like goes back to his dead body being mauled. I know they're gnawing on him. It's horrible.

Yeah, the overhead lingering shot. Yeah. Bob who, I don't know. I have a lot more to say about Bob, but yeah. That is really sad. In terms of the pacing and timing thing, every time I rewatched, I'm like, oh, this is earlier in the episode in the penultimate than I remember it being. It breaks my heart every time he knocks over that. room. And then the look back at Joyce. Yeah. Pain. He's really feeling himself. He did it. He did the thing.

You did it. I know. Great pick. Scariest moment. Is it Dustin thinking three musketeers is a top three candy? Is that your pick for scariest moment? It's really close. Can you play this clip, please? Guys. Guys. Guys. Why is no one else wearing costumes? Terror. absolute horror. I mean, they look so, the boys look so good in their costumes. You have the great montage of them getting their photos taken. Mike's all pissy. Mike's pissy.

Lucas is doing incredible pose work. Like, they look great. They have their whole, like, fight about which one of them is which Ghostbusters. It's really, really good. And then Dustin's like, we're the only ones not dressed up. I do have a note for the boys. Tell me. Yeah.

I think all of them are wearing undershirts under their coveralls. It's not hard to, like, unbutton or unsit at the top of the cover rolls and roll it down and tie it around your waist. And then it still looks a little silly, but really you're just wearing a T-shirt and, like, the bottom of some cover-alls. Yeah. Like, that option is available to them. I'm glad they didn't. I'm glad they wrote it out. They didn't write it out out of, like, pride.

They were just like, we have no other options. And I'm like, you have an option. I like when Dustin and Lucas are, like, trying to talk to. Max. She's like, of course she likes Ghostbust, of course. Of course. Yeah. And my favorite moment in that whole stretch other than the moment you picked, which is perfect, is just the, when are these things decided? Yeah. It's a conspiracy. Yeah. And it does. It takes you back to feeling that way when you're a kid, right?

When like suddenly something's different about like how people behave in your age group and you're like, wait, what? Yeah, everyone dressed up last year. Yeah. Are we this old now? Yeah. You're on a real, you have set a high. high bar for scariest moment to pause in. Because your pick in the first pod was obviously just took the world by storm. With Jonathan Picking Nancy's picture. That's Jonathan's lowest moment.

Oh my God. Nothing but up for my God Jonathan from there. I've got some notes for Jonathan in season three. He's got some. Believe Nancy. Please. Exactly. Not a very good co-intern and not a very good boyfriend there.

I agree. But fantastic stuff. This makes me so excited for your picks for scariest moment in three and both. Well, okay, so this is something we will talk about when we talk about Buffy next week. But this idea of like taking the scary things of being a child or being a teen and making it into like literal monsters and stuff like that. You know, and that's what Buffy does so well. And so this is like that moment where it's like scary shit's happening. And also no one else is dressed up for Halloween.

No one else wore costumes to school. Great chip. Great pick. My pick is, I found myself unsurprisingly, perhaps, not picking a lot of L stuff today because... I have, like, no L stuff. Yeah. So I thought this was maybe an area to talk about L for a bit, because my pick is basically like the, there but for the grace glimpse into what L might be capable of, if not for her friends. Right? Like, granted, I'd like to... To be clear, yeah, I know, we saw her murder a lot of people in season one. We saw her snap some necks. We saw her pop some brains. I don't want to imply that it's been just sunshine and daisies. It obviously hasn't. But it felt different in this season because in season one, the violence and that like the capacity to inflict that level of harm on other people is very rooted in like self-defense, whether it's at the lab or at the school or wherever. And so this like glimpse of what it looks like to take this, the gift, right, as 8 calls it, and deploy it more recklessly and to see in a couple different aspects of the season we have like where you kind of like lose control in the fight, the fights with Hopper, for example, right?

Like the, oh, right, the ability to contain or wield this with intention. L is a kid, right, to be at that age, to have this power and to be at that age where you get upset, you get angry and suddenly every shard of glass in the room you're standing and explodes. What happens to the person who is 10 feet away from you? You could hurt them. You could kill them. Do you even know? There's that.

There's that kind of like, okay, more of the extension, as you said, for kind of like what it's like to grow up to change. Do you know what's happening to your body, what you can do, et cetera? But then when we get to the lost sister plot, this like, what if we were more actively trying to pursue, not, safety for others, but vengeance? What if we were more actively like going into a gas station and just robbing the place? I don't know what you're talking about since I don't rewatch this episode, but I'll take your word for it. What if we were just like ready to murder people? And of course it's a test that Elle passes when she knocks the gun out of Callie's hand. But, you know, makes us think back to something we talked about with a lot of fondness and affection in the season one pod. And actually

they flash back to in that episode, the great, it is a through line of the series, this idea and this tension, the Mike L seen in season one, like, you know, L's fear, am I the monster? And Mike, like, you're the hero, you save me, and you feel like the knife's edge that Elle is walking and how easy it would be to tip onto the other side. And I think something like Callie's lessons to her being rooted in, like, reach for memories that make you angry. Reach for, it's like the anti-Protonis. It's the anti-Kate Bush running up the hill. Like, it's the anti, remind yourself of the things that make you happy in the time. It's one. things that bring you joy.

Yeah. Yeah. So that's scary, I think, to see, like, okay, this is how it could go wrong for L. That's great. That's a great pick. I will say in the Hopper L fight, Dominion, and I have a lot more to say about a hopper in season three and fighting. But, like, in season two, when she uses her telekinesis on him, like, and the, you know,

she doesn't, like, hurt him, but, like, the sofa comes up against him, like, all this sort of stuff like that. Look it in. It's a really good, like, I have to grapple with my kid being able to stand up to me in this way. Yeah. Like, he's such a physically imposing guy and he's like a real brute in season three. But like here in season, I love it. I'm like, it's a lot.

But in season two, he's a, you know, his daughter never grew past. age of being just like a little small thing that you care for. And so Hopper, you know, throughout two and three sort of really trying to maneuver what it means to be the father of someone growing up and in this way supernaturally powerful, you know, is really interesting. Yeah, I love that he's like standing there next to Elle when she closes the mother gate, like to, and he's an action hero and a brave guy on the front lines. He's down in the tunnels in many ways throughout the season, obviously, but like to, and he's scared, he doesn't want her to over-exert herself, but to have to really say, like, oh, right, you are going to be the one always who can do the thing that other people can't.

And I really always like, I'm kind of like, wait, how has Sarah never come up? But also then when he starts to finally in the truck scene at the end, talk about Sarah 2L. And like, that was Sarah, that was my girl. And he says the thing he says about the black hole and like how he feels like a black hole. obviously an idea that really recurs in season four and how the black hole got her and like that he's a freed, very said this last pot, but like very like

Joel Ellie Sarah coded. Like the idea that like the thing you couldn't prevent with the person who came first guides every decision you make about this other person who's not the same. You know, it's just so, it's this is really interesting. Real mood shift coming here.

Perhaps. It could be anything. Mm-hmm. Goopiest moment. I think there's a clear winner for this. Interesting. And then like a really fun backup. Okay.

Tell me. Do you not think it's 11 going through the vaginal canal in Hawkins Middle School at the beginning of the season? I don't. Burthing herself? I don't, but perhaps only because I'd been inoculated by that point. after seeing all of the season one journeys through the portal canals. Like, I think... This one is goopier because there's like a membrane that she has to, like, penetrate.

There is. There's some, like, tendrils of membranes and the tree trunk in season one. That's a good pick. That's a good pick. I have some questions about that gate still. Oh, we have a lot of questions about a lot of games. I actually thought when you said that there's a clear winner, I thought you were going to say the moment. the moment when, with a pumpkin blade and examining the pumpkins.

Callahan. Yeah. That's my backup. And Gallaghan, when he's like, without, just like, don't touch anything without gloves. My detoxicking, Gallaghan's like. Yeah. Callahan's basically linking the goop at that point.

Yeah, that's my backup. That was my runner up as well. For my pick, I'd like to finally talk about Dart. Okay. Because we have to acknowledge that Dart ate muse. And so that is technically the pick for goopiest moment. And it pains me to say it, but it is. I can't, it's like so horrible.

Because he not only is like gnawashed on muse, but then does the classic turnaround pedal open, you know. Yeah. It's very distressing. I don't like seeing, as recently discussed on the alien earth pots, I don't like seeing bad things happen to cats. It distresses me genuinely. But it is an opportunity to talk about dart. And dart is a character I love. And I love the dart dust and bond.

Yeah. And I think something like I think a Three Musketeers is a bad candy bar, but I love this like, Dart is basically venom, right? Like chocolate and brains. You know, that's delightful. I love the Three Musketeers becomes this little bridge between Dart and Dustin. I think that's wonderful. Obviously, there's also some goop with just again, now I'll mention Alien again,

all of the xenomorph-esque shedding of the many skins. It's very goopy. When Dart makes his way back, it pains me so much when Dustin hits Dart to cast him into the cellar. Like it really makes me very upset. And then when he apologizes to him, when Dart makes his way back to him, when they're down in the graveyard and the tunnels, and all the other demo dogs are about to rush by. But like Dustin gives Dart this little piece of Nuget. And Dart stays.

And the fact that he can recognize him with like from the yellow spot on his touch, it's just all great. And it makes me so sad. And genuinely every time that we, like, pan DART's body and he's there next to the candy wrapper. And that's definitively, like, how we know it's him. It's just really heartbreaking. And I always, on the, like, on the lore front, I do always have a, he dies, right? Just like all the other demo dogs fall. So you're like, okay, he didn't like break free of the hive mind. But he was able to, like, make a different decision. It actually is, like, interesting to me when thinking ahead to season five, you know?

Like, I don't know. So I just love DART. I think he's great. I love the DART. Bond and I really wish that Dart had not eaten Mews, but, you know, it was a learning experience for him, I hope. I'm sorry you ate my cat is really an Alzheimer. It's rough. Are you looking for support in your weight management journey? Zepbound terseptide may be able to help. Zepbound is a prescription medicine used with a reduced calorie diet and increased physical

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in children. Don't share needles or pens or reuse needles. Don't take if allergic to it, or if you or someone in your family had medullary thyroid cancer, or if you've had multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. Tell your doctor if you get a lump or swelling in your neck. Stop Zepbound and call your doctor if you have severe stomach pain or a serious allergic reaction. Severe side effects may include inflamed pancreas or gallbladder problems. Tell your doctor if you experience vision changes before scheduled procedures with anesthesia. If you're nursing, pregnant, plan to be, or taking birth control pills. Taking Zepbound with a sulfonel urea or insulin may cause low blood sugar.

Side effects include nausea, diarrhea, and vomiting, which can cause dehydration and worsen kidney problems. Talk to your doctor. Call 1-800-545-99 or visit Zepbounds.lily.com. Next category. Will we be sticking with Dustin? Entirely possible. Best coming of each moment. I will roll the clip.

No. Out of all my brother's friends, you're my favorite. You've always been my favorite. Really? Yeah. Okay. Nancy Wheeler asking Dustin to dance at the snowball after. Yeah. It's the best.

Dustin shows up with Steve. Yep. With an incredible new hairstyle. Yep. Looking great. Looking great. But it's Lucas and Max all the way, not Dustin. He is crying.

Crying. On the bleachers. and trying to pretend that he's not. Nancy Wheeler, not my favorite character in one of her greatest moments. Historic and heroic. Sees him, comes over and asks him to dance, and he, like, is trying to pretend he's not crying, and I start crying. And then she says this lovely thing to him.

And I just thought, like, you know, being alone at the dance, no one's dancing with you at the dance is a real potent, like, middle school feeling. And then someone dancing with you and it feeling like, I'm safe. fine, everything's great, and Nancy giving him this gift of like, you're going to clean up. You just got to go to summer camp, my guy, and you'll be fine. I just thought it was a beautiful moment. Our trend continues. I have that pick coming in another category.

It's one of my favorite scenes in the entire show. I really, really love it. I think it's wonderful. Stacy can eat shit. Yeah. That's what I know for Stacy. Eat it and die, Stacy. Too bad it wasn't Stacy who got crumpled in the month's in trailer.

D.C. wake up. I don't like this. That's what we should have gotten instead. Wow. That would have been amazing. The fact that like everyone else then gets to look at, it's like, oh, a high school girl too. That extra just like, degree of cool. Who dated Steve Harrington? Nancy Wheeler? Absolutely magical. Great. Great stuff. Fantastic pick. I also have a Dustin pick, but it is a different Dustin pick. Dustin Heavy Pod, it had to be. He's an absolutely fucking leis And I have a clip as well. Can we see it? I broke the rule of law. So, I mean, if you want, if you want your girlfriend to take over my spot in the party, I understand. She stopped my girlfriend. I saw you two holding hands on the bus, Lucas. She was just scared. Maybe. But I could feel it.

Feel what? The electricity. Devastating and beautiful and just an incredible scene. And I just... Game is so... Good. Oh, my God. It's... He's really... fantastic. This is like really similar to my pick in this category from the last pod, but in a way that I love,

like, it's not like, oh yeah, we kind of like explored that. Let's like do something different. Like, no, this is part of what it is to be like a young person in a friend group. And for those dynamics to change. So not only do I love all of this like in the vacuum of season two, but I really love the people that everybody's in a different spot than they were in season one with how they felt about it. Like Lucas and Dustin both having a crush on the same girl, Max. who hasn't been there, right? You like the same person that your best friend likes nightmare. For season one, we talked about all of the tension with Lucas and Mike because of Mike falling in love with L and trying to incorporate L into the group and Lucas's resentment and Dustin having to be the one to kind of like explain that and why everybody felt the way they did. and now for Dustin to be the one on the outs and Lucas to be the one who was trying to bring Max a new member into the party and Mike to be an absolute dipshit about it.

A big jerk. An absolute asshole. A big jerk. When a mere year ago, he was trying to bring 11 into the group. Some rough stuff for Mike. You put the party in jeopardy. You broke the rule of law. So did you.

You told a stranger the truth. like the arguing into, like the excitement into the arguing into the heartbreak. Yeah. And then you're experiencing heartbreak where someone else who's really close to you is experiencing like euphoria, like the wave of possibility. That just feels so true to young life to me. And I just really, really, really love it. And then that extra element in that, the part of why I love that particular like line

and moment and clip so much is Dustin incorporating that the electricity. Like this lesson you just learned from Steve. He just taught him. It's like that's another way that their lives are changing, you know? And it's just like really magical. And to be clear, like I, as you've said, we agree. Like, I think Lucas and Max are just fantastic. And like one of my favorite parts of the show.

And Lucas is a, I think, is a huge riser, like, season over season. And is just, like, I think the Halloween screech and the dumpster stretch and tubular and stokker and, like, the opening up to each other on the roof of the bus. I like talking to you. Yeah. Talking to you. It's like all so wonderful and I feel so invested in their relationship. And then I still feel so like press fallen for Dustin. And that's like good storytelling.

Really good story. So yeah, that's my pick. I just love it. It's great. It's great. Next category. The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what you share with someone else when you're a cool award for honoring the nerds. Yeah.

What are you going with here? I feel like I know where you're going to go and I have a lot to back up what you're going to do. And do I feel any kind of way about how many of my clips have to do with Dustin? I don't. This is true of season one. It's true of season two as well. Great. Please roll that clip.

Thank you. I am on a curiosity voyage and I need my paddles to travel. These books, these books are my paddles. That is Dustin at the Hawkins Library. You've already mentioned that quote a couple times because you loved it too. Dustin, who has exceeded his checkout limit of books at the Hawkins Library. Me too. And actually, that stands in for the entire arc of Dustin being scientifically curious about Dart and wanting to bring Dart in,

not just to impress Max, as Steve accuses him of, but to like show the science teacher and, like, talk about all the things. he learns about various species and stuff like that, understanding photosensitivity and like all, you know, heat sensitivity, all these things. And so I think his scientific curiosity, his science brain, um, is something that I wanted to honor. He's obviously not like the nerd of the season though. So I'm assuming that is this is where I'll be talking about Bob. Yeah. This is where I won't be talking about Bob. Correct. Almost impossible to pick the clip. There are like 50 choices, but I have selected something that I think is a nice opening note here.

You can't, unless you know basic. I don't know what that means. It's a computer programming language. All right, teach you to me. Shall I teach you French while I'm out of gym? How about a little German? This is All-Star stuff from Bob. That's really good.

And Bob Newby superhero is, I am with you, one of the best parts of season two and one of the best parts of the show so far. One of the things that I love so much about subsequent seasons is like when we, look at the fridge in the buyer's home in season three. Super Bob is there. It's just so great. Our beloved Sean Ashton kills it and basically every single scene that he's in as Bob Newby, it's just perfect, brilliant casting.

I think, like, I'll speak obviously for myself as a genuine, passionate hopper joy shipper. But I think a lot of other people feel this way too. Like you are shipping hop and Joyce. And so we have to, when Bob enters the picture, not resent him. Right. Which is so hard to pull off. Like it's just amazing. And, you know, you see them dancing to islands of the stream to Dolly and Kenny.

And like Bob bringing Joyce a bologna sandwich at work or showing up at the general store to take her into the back room. And kiss her. He's like, God, I just like, I feel like I'm in high school. Like, it's crazy. Like, I just love all of that. And the reason that I thought this was a good pick, I mean, we can talk about Bob basically in every category, all the good categories. But the reason that I really wanted to hear in honoring the nerds is for a couple reasons.

Like, the fact that Bob is smart, Bob the brain, the fact that Bob is a problem solver. The fact that Bob was like the founder of AV Club. Like, my whole speech about Bob being the founder of Hawkins's AV Club is so... Thomas and Clark everything he knew. Like, that's how they honor Bob when he's gone to say like he was like the OG nerd who allowed us. to celebrate being nerds? It's like incredible. Mike did that speech is like he sees the brain teasers that Bob brought. Yes, to Will. He's like, nothing made me feel better when I was sick. And I was sick all the time. And like, I think the fact that he's into Joyce, it's like,

who wouldn't be into Joyce? But the fact that he's into the whole family and keeps telling Joyce that, right? He's like, she's trying to like warn him. Yeah. He's just like, I, Jonathan, tough, tough cookie, tough not to crap. But like, I feel like I'm breaking through to Will. And like, he wants to be there for movie night. He wants to take Will to school. He wants to let Will use his stuff. He wants to camcorder. It's just all fantastic. He wants to suggest moving to Maine. He wants this unusual different family that has its shit going on to be his family. Like, without question. And I love on the brain teaser front when he shows up, you know, he has that moment where he kind of pulls Joyce aside and he's like, we need to like worry about what. Talk about what's going on here.

Yeah. Well, it doesn't look well. You don't look well. But the fact that then he just like jumps into kind of piecing it together. and it's a puzzle and that's exciting and fun, right? Like, it's so wonderful. I just think it's like... When he has that moment where he's like, he's very concerned and he's like, wait a minute, that's lover's leg. I know what this is.

Sure, yeah. And just to piece it together and then he's like, try to figure out the scale. If you're before and you are, you know, he's not ready. He doesn't have the data he needs. Like, it's just all so great. He doesn't want her to go into the hole, but then he goes with her. He's at Hawkins Lau. Are you okay?

It's just the jitters, right? but like he's there and he stays there. I love that conversation that he and Joyce have about what it's like to be bullied, right? Like that's what I love about you. You punch back when he says that to her. It's like, I just like find it so touching. He's like, I don't know why they did that. Yeah.

Like why do they do that? Maybe it makes them feel powerful. I don't know. But hey, look at me now. I get the date Joyce buyers. So like then this pairs with your Dustin pick. How can that not be on our mind when Nancy's saying to Dunds? And like, they're all going to realize that, like, you're the one. You know, Dustin's another Bob, right? So I just find that wonderful and so great. And like, listen, did the Mr. Baldo advice end up backfiring? It did. I don't think. I believe it on the mind flare, not Bob. I feel like that would have. I think it would have. I think it would have. I love when he's like, I always thought stuff like this happened in movies and comic books, you know? But then he's like so ready to embrace it, open minds, spirit of imagination.

Bob, newbie, superhero. And then the fact that like knowing basic, paired with bravery, like, I'll do it because I can and I have to, but also because I'm willing to. Yeah. Oh, magic. It's just the bad. And you're like worried about Bob the whole time. The whole fucking time. And rightly so.

But when he leaves the gun behind, you're like, well, that's it. Oh, Bob. I know. The combo of leaving the gun and then knocking over the broom is. The broom could have happened to anyone. It hurts every time. Leaving the gun is. I don't think the gun would have saved him, but listen.

Bob, he's so special. He's really great. I love him dearly. Ah, okay. Next. Next. Ship wars. Yeah.

What do you want to talk about here? This is where I will be talking about Marie Bauman. Oh, actively encouraging two children to fuck in his home. Okay. So before we get there, then I will say, I, let's, let's, let's, I like that again. So before we get it there, I want to say, I don't like Jonathan and Nancy together. I like Jonathan.

I don't love Jonathan and Nancy together. I put in my answer, I ship Jonathan with Samantha, who's the girl that he met when he walked into the Halloween party. Kiss. Like, she would want to read Vonnegut and was in the talking heads with him. I like it. Okay. Jonathan and Samantha. Do you want Nancy to be with Steve?

Here's the deal. I don't care for Nancy Wheeler that much. I ship Nancy and I guess a gun, I don't know. I want what Steve wants, though. This is my journey in season four. Steve yearning for Nancy makes me want Steve to have Nancy because I want Steve to have what he wants. That's my demented mentality around that. Yeah, I have an interesting relationship with Steve and Nancy or Nancy and Jonathan.

Because I really actually quite like Nancy and Jonathan together, but I ultimately like care so deeply. what Steve wants and he is just so... I did have a moment in season four before we get the Robin reveal where I was like, Steve and Robin, I'm down. I'm down for this. And then, t'was not to be. That's okay. But... Scoops a hoy.

Ocean of flavor. Can't wait to talk about Robin next season. Okay. What a legend Robinist. Great stuff. You want to take us back to Murray irresponsibly playing teens with vodka? I have a clip. Let's hear it.

No. You're young. attractive, you've got chemistry, history, plus the real shit, shared trauma. I am so disturbed by this scene, but I also find every, much like the pullout pick, like every single aspect of it, completely hilarious and riveting. And Murray is so entertaining. Basically everything he says in this sequence is a riot to me. Like, you've told me a lot of shockers today, but this is the first lie.

That line, which I obviously love. The trust issues, your dad, like psychoanalysis. of Jonathan. When he's trying to figure it out in fancy, he goes, name, name. Johnson's like, Steve. It's the curse to see so clearly. It's just fantastic. Obviously, the pullout, a payoff the next morning is historic stuff. It's just, I think, genuinely very weird that he's like, hey, kids, go fuck. But, like, also... Esmerizing television. In my bunker. After I have given you a lot of vodka, don't worry, I will be giving you. road vodka too.

It's like nuts. But, and I think like the kind of path to that, obviously there's everything in season one, but just in this season, like, Jonathan and Nancy kind of talking and, you know, Steve comes in and he scoops Nancy up. And they start canoodling against locker and then we pan and John. It's just like walking away. George Michael's sad boy walking down the hall, you know? And then like the whole, you know, your bullshit fiasco at the Halloween party with

Here's my other note for Steve. Yeah. He's heartbroken. Yeah. He's upset. Yeah. He did abandon his girlfriend who was blind drunk at a party and she didn't even have like another friend there.

He didn't say, hey, new barb, because Nancy doesn't have any friends. She just has ex-boyfriends and boyfriends. But he's not like, hey, will you take Nancy home? Right. He just leaves her there. So do you not believe when Jonathan says that Steve asked him to take her home? That's Jonathan lying. for Steve.

Yeah. Which is a nice thing for Jonathan. I suppose, yeah. That's a nice, nice to, I would have been like, yeah, no, he left you. Do you want to go fucking Murray? Well, your sense of competition is stronger than Jonathan. When Nancy and Steve have the conversation the next day in the alley, and it's like, where are you slated to class?

And then Steve's like, that was your other boyfriend, Jonathan. Like, it's just, boy, active stuff on the ship wars front with those three. officially break up before Nancy had sex with Jonathan. That's the thing. Like, Nancy, they were on a brave-ish. They were on a break-thotter, right? I don't like it. Everybody thinks that Nancy and Jonathan are kind of like undeniable on the chemistry front, right? Like Owens, when they run their whole gambit to get him to incriminate himself at Hawkins Lab very easily on tape.

He's like, oh, how long have you guys been together? When they check into the hotel, there's the great, like, you know, gum smack in single or dumb. sequence. Like, everybody thinks that these two are going to fuck. They have the sweet moment, like, you know, comparing their hand scars. I always am like, I waited, yeah, only like a month. Tough moment for Jonathan there, I think. Yeah, only like a month, very tough. On the Steve front, I think when he tells Dustin that Nancy's different, not like other girls, it's just like he loves her. He's smitten. And then he, the thing is, Steve concedes ship wars at the end of the season. Like, he's like, you should go with Jonathan. Like, Nancy, it's okay.

Okay, you should go. He concedes for now. For now. Yeah, it just would have been nice that they had that conversation before she had sex with Jonathan. I agree. In the guest room somewhere. I agree. Murray Bauman did not care about that. Nancy, you suck. Murray Bauman did not care about that. Okay. Best quote. This is a meta moment. Oh, I don't know that it's the same. I don't know why you gasped, though.

Well, because of the description of meta, I feel like I know what it is, but we'll find out. I don't think so. Any, maybe. It's Max. Yeah. Oh. Talking about season one of Stranger Things. Yeah, of course. Okay, great.

What else could be decided? I don't know. Oh, I don't know. Shot As in saying, where's the X? Buried Treasure? Max says, after Lucas tells her what happened in season one of Stranger Things, she says, it's crazy, but I really liked it. I mean, it had a few issues.

I just felt it was a little derivative in parts. I wish I had a little more originality. That's all. So a fun little move from the Stranger Things writers. team acknowledging some of the critiques that people had of the show. I almost picked that for my funniest moment, but I decided to save it as the setup for our favorite pop culture influences category. Great stuff from Max there.

My pick is something that you have already talked about today. It is the episode one, Mad Max, moment between Jonathan and Will, after Jonathan comes in and sees the zombie boy drawing and asks Will, zombie boy is a new character. realizes like the will is being bullied, that this is what kids are calling him. I have a clip. The thing is, nobody normal ever accomplished anything meaningful in this world. Got it? I just love them.

Yeah. It's very sweet. They're great. Jonathan is such a good brother. And then they have that shared little moment when Bob comes in. He's like, Mr. Mom! Yes! And I love Kenny Rogers because they have the whole like Bowie or Kenny Rush.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love Kenner. It's just all great. It's like really sweet, gentle eye roll. over above. Do you want to be normal? Do you want to be just like everyone else? Being a freak is the best. A little stray in the middle of this really heartwarming exchange when Will's like, is that why you have no friends? I have friends. He doesn't. Oh, man. Yeah. It's just a beautiful moment and a beautiful, really crucial relationship that has given us a lot over the seasons. I love that one. Season four, Jonathan makes a friend. Argyll. That's right. And what a friend it is, Argyll, iconic. My backup here, I love the way that Hopper explains to Elle that. compromise means halfway happy. Like halfway happy. I always love that. It's so cute.

Her sort of grudging halfway happy. Halfway happy. Yeah. Halfway happy. Most memorable visual. One of my answers is like a sideways pop culture illusion, but I have so many of those when we get to that, so I don't mind blowing in here. I think Will at the door, the close encounters the third kind reference of like the

mind flare outside the front of the buyer's home will at the door. that is like a stunning visual to me. And my backup is when hop goes down into the tunnel and we flip into the upside down. I love whenever we do a flip like in with the bike writing in season four and stuff like that. Like it's really good. The snowball at the end. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Creepie crawlies. That's a great one. Yeah. All of the upside down visuals this season are cool. Like when Will all of the, oh, true sight. Like when he has those true sight moments.

Yeah. And just he's in the arcade and then suddenly the vines, the shift in the color treatment of the frame. Like, that's all really good. Hop gets his silkwood shower in the season, but like, should we be concerned about who has inhaled the most upside down? Yes. In that moment in season one, it's toxic, it's like, oh, it's toxic.

It's like, my kid was down there. Well, yeah, like, you've all gotten into the lungs at this point. Will was down there for so long. Yeah, I mean, Will had dart inside of him. So, like, you know. many tendrils of the mind flare making their way into Will's eyes and ears and mouth and nostrils. That's a memorable, visual in a startling way. That's spooky.

I kind of had a tie here. I had a hard time picking between two. I love Will the way that Will's map of Hawkins, the vine maps, the drawings. That was one of my considerations, yeah. Like, because for a couple reasons. One, similar to what we were talking about earlier with, like, Joyce celebrating Will's drawings. the fact that she's like, okay, you can't tell us, like, communicate in a way that I know taps into how you express yourself, right?

Joyce is like, do I need to fuck up my house again? I'll do it. That's the thing. Like, I love this as a kind of continuation of the Christmas lights. I'm going to communicate with you this way. Aspect of season one, like, it feels really, I don't know, like a way to kind of make it feel like an ongoing continuing conversation visually as well. I love the, and then you have this, you know, literal map of Hawkins and the idea of like,

this town this hellmouth. And then the buyer's home as a seat of all of this activity as well. So keep deploying it that way I always really love. And then my backup, or I guess like one B to the 1A is when L is closing the mother gate, first of all, just the size and scope and scale of the mother gate. Like it's this huge raw wound, right? but when you have that on the left, that bright, like, glowing pink on the left, and then you have this just little 11 here on the right.

With hop. With hop on their little platform casting out and, like, the idea of somebody so small, challenging something so big, obviously a thing we always love. And then I also like, too, when you can just see the silhouette of the mind flare. It feels very connected to me to that season one moment that we talked about last pod that I love when Dustin is describing reading the D&D definition of the veil of shadows when they visualize for us that idea

of how thin the veil is between the world I just always love that. So that's a really cool one too. Do you think season five will end with L and her handout screaming at whatever the threat is until it closes or pulverizes?

I was thinking a lot on this rewatch about some of the of your... They can't keep getting away with it. Your theories from like our original season four on about 11's fate, which feels... Oh, the Lyra theory? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Favorite pop culture influence on this season from any decade. Favorite, most notable. Yeah. The one you think about the most when you're watching, take it any way you'd like. I put all of my 80s stuff in the next category they're going to get to. So this is my pick for non-80s reference.

Will you play this clip? Please. If there's a power outage, the building goes on full lockdown. Can it be unlocked remotely? With a computer, sure, but somebody's got to reset the breakers. Where are the breakers? Breakers are in the basement. Three floors down.

Did somebody say Jurassic Park? Also, Jurassic Park comes up in the season five trailer. Overt. Overt. Overt. Ractors. Reference there. I just rewatched Jurassic Park.

But every time I've watched this season, I've just been, like, Leo pointing at the screen. like this is a Jurassic Park moment, reset the breakers. But yeah, I love a Jurassic Park reference always. Great stuff. Perfect film. Perfect movie. I was just thinking I'm due for a rewatch of the original after watching the very flawed rebirth. Also, on the Jurassic Park front, Steve gets clever girls in the junkyard as well. Yeah. That's a great one. Obviously, a lot of Ghostbusters, a lot of alien this season. I think I mentioned this on our season one pod.

I definitely mentioned this when like Chris and I were potting about season three back of the day. I surely mentioned it when we were potting about season four in real time. I've mentioned this on many ringer podcasts before. But when I watch this season, specifically the everything to do with the idea of the spy, I'm just like, this is Harry Voldemort, La Gilliman's horror crux, order. of the Phoenix Department of Mysteries, you think you have, like, access and insight, what if we turned it around? And, like, very painful things happened as a result of that. I've never seen, I don't know if the Duffers have ever, like, said if that influenced this

in some way, but this just, that just feels like what this is, kind of, like, beat for beat, basically. What if he figures out we're spying on him? What if he spies back? Like, that's just, that's, that's what that is. So, yeah, that's like, I think impossible not to be thinking about. I think there's other, I think there are other, I don't want to get into too many, like, spoilers for future seasons, but there are certainly are other, like, horrocks and horcrux

adjacent aspects to the idea of, like, the tether. Oh, absolutely. For sure. So that, I think, just further cements the idea that maybe the horrocks is in this idea of this idea of like a mental pathway and connection is on their mind. Yeah. And influencing in some way. Yeah.

Since neither of those were 80s picks, let's, let's hit some 80s nostalgia here. What is the most potent use of 80s nostalgia in season two? I have so many options. I think the Dragons Lair arcade game, the Don Bluth animated arcade game, and that like... Takes a shot. Like, unquestionable Don Bluth, like, look that is. so specific is is great. I think the Wheeler's being Reagan Bush supporters and Dustin's mom being a Mondale

supporter is... The payoff of panning Mondale for the first time is so good. It is really, really... Of course Ted Wheeler is a Reagan supporter. We mentioned Ghostbusters, aliens, Paul Reiser being here, of course. Goonies with Sean Aston being here. Hopper grabbing his hat, Indiana Jones style. when he gets rescued out of the tunnel.

This is 1978. It's close, though. Will does a body snatcher scream, you know, when they're burning the tunnels. That's a scary moment when he's like, convulsing and screeching. No, what's not? Great job. But biggest, and they've said this overtly, is gremlins. Yeah.

The dart, dust, and storyline is just gremlins, essentially. Great stuff. New get a plenty. Yeah. New get a plenty. batching it up. Is this where you want to talk about Margaret Thatcher? Okay, set it up for people who haven't rewatched recently.

So, actually, we can also save it for the next category because that's when I have the Ted Garrett. Okay, sure. Let's go back to it there. My pick here is just the, I love the deployment of the arcade. Yeah. And the arcade is a hangout. When Dustin gets pissed about to try.

I can slar and call. It's like over-price bullshit. Adam has some very funny commentary on that whenever we watch that. And then Max with the high score. Mad Max, of course, is the name. And then Max is the high score on DigDug, which I played today for the first time on an arcade cabinet. Gave it gave it a go.

I might have played it before when I was a kid and just don't remember. But got a little round in today. It seemed fun. I can see why Max really liked it. That was really fun last night when I was like watching Buff with you and you're like, Adam, set up the dig dug. I want to report on it. Yeah.

Because we haven't. He's just, yeah, he's always, why can't I get a turn, you know? It was fun. And I love to, like, you know, we've got D&D, obviously, in season one, we'll be more prominent again in season four. We have the arcade here. We'll have the mall in season three. We have, like, the neighborhood pool.

I love just these, like, yeah, like, this arcade in the, in the strip mall, this would be where, like, you bike to or where you asked your brother to drop you off, like, just like, what was the hangout spot for the kids at this period in time? I really like. So that's a fun one. Tough stuff for Keith. not only with the cheese dust fingers. It's acne and it's not contagion.

That's intense. But like trading favors for a date with Nancy. That's a good moment for Mike. Yeah, it's a good moment. Yeah, exactly. A very good Mike woman in season two. He's got a couple. 80s parenting, we have some notes.

Before you get to the wheelers. A lot of candidates as always. I got to put your guy in my crosshairs and say, 11 leaves the state and Hopper doesn't even know that it happened. He sends like one message over the CB radio to her. But he's not, not even late. He does the like over the rest. But like, why was your first, you get rescued from, a whole night has passed.

Yeah. You get rescued from the tunnels and your first thought isn't, hey, I got to go home. I know. Yeah. It's bad. It's so bad. It's bad. deeply bad. That's bad.

Well, you know, he's like, she's grounded. At least the wheelers have lies, but at least they have like theories about where. Nancy calls in and is like, oh, yeah, just having fun at Allys, you know. I guess Nancy does have a friend, Allie. That's right. Yeah. But if Alie even exists. Anyway.

Nancy has the haunting memory of Barb driving her to family dinners. don't worry. I love KFC. Steve meant it, I think. Oh, I love KFC. Ted and Karen Wheeler, they just don't care where their kids are. And the thing is that it's, it's multiple days. It's not like, oh, yeah, Allys. It's like, I'm going to stay at Alley's again. Okay, how many nights or days in a row? I'm at Will's. I'm staying at Will's. Oh, yeah, no, my mom said that. Mike was at Will's. Maybe they, oh, Jonathan, okay, maybe they caught a matinee. Like, how long between, I just love when Dustin shows. up there and he's like, your line has been tied up for two hours. This is when we have seen Karen sitting with the checkbook on the phone.

Invoking Margaret Thatcher. Yeah, we don't know what that's about. Remarkable stuff, hysterical, a little detail. And then Dustin asked Ted, who Karen, like, do you think it's Nancy Reagan? She was like, well, maybe if it was Margaret Thatcher. Or is it Princess Die? Like, what is she like, I wish it had.

I've been Margaret Thatcher and said. It's been a two-hour conversation. Could be all of it. Could be all of the above. Is Mike home and Ted who has been ordered to the door by Karen? Turns his head and screams. Karen, where's our son? Hilarious moment also from Ted.

I love Mike's face in response to this when Ted is using his like baseball analogy, right? Like, you're not three strikes. I'm like, you're on the bench. It wouldn't even be on the team. And Mike's like, are you saying like you want me like not to be in the family? family slash dead? Like what is going on?

Is Nancy home? Karen, where's Nancy? Our children don't live here anymore. Didn't you know? Just great stuff. I agree with you. I have some notes on how Hopper parents Elle in this season. Yeah.

It's not his best. It's not his best. I'll give a follow-up to Max's Mom. Billy's Dad. Billy's Dad. Brutal. Brutal.

Team Dustin's mom. Wonderful. Love her. Team the Sinclair's. They're fantastic. This and Claire's are fantastic. Fantastic. Sophomore slump miscalculation.

Feels like there are two contenders here. The dip for Mike and the lost sister. I have a third. Tell me. Overcalculating how much we care about Barb. Incredible pick. Barb, your number one enemy, but everyone on the internet was like, justice for Barb.

So they were like, oh, we got to make a lot of season two about finding justice for Barb. And it's like, you and I don't care. When I think about Nancy and Jonathan going to Murray's, I genuinely think about, like, the vodka, the pullout joke. They're there because of barred. The whole arc of the season is about Barb. I do find Nancy's, like, guilt over the withholding of the truth and where that has, like, the kind of continuation then of the loss and suffering of pain. Like with Barb's parents selling the house and Nancy's guilt, Nancy going, excusing herself from the KFC dinner, going and the bathroom and then there being a photo of Barb in the bathroom. I'm sorry, it's where we have to

draw the line. I don't want to photo of Barb in the fucking bathroom. I actually think no family photos in the bathroom. Barber otherwise. It's a good rule. It's a good rule. I thought this might be where you shit on Mike, but this is a great pick. This is why you're a legend. I'll have have way more time to talk about that. Mike's really going through and he misses Elle, you know? The pain of young love lost. Okay. I'm sitting there with his walkie every night. Sure. Tragic. This is where I had, of course, Chapter 7, the Lost Sister, which I think, like, again, miscalculation in general, I do think the placement in the season is, like, outright unforgivable to break up the spy and the mind flare six and eight.

It's nuts. Like, we're just in the thrust of the climax of the season. Yeah. More broadly, just, like, separating Elle the way that she has separated from the rest of the kids, for the bulk of the season. Real mistake. And yet, I will say, I'm glad that the miss here, the whiff,

and the way that this was received did not stop them from going back in season four to play with the, like, who were the other kids? Yeah, but you will notice that they just yada, yada, yada. Quick little over Kali in season four. Yeah. But yeah, but it did stop a misguided spinoff. So there's that.

Yeah, thank God. The fitter hair lord for season two. Are we returning to Farrah Fawcett? Want to come back to a clip you've already heard before? Let's do it again. I do. I do. Use the shampoo and the conditioner. And when your hair's damp, it's not wet.

Okay, when it's damp. You do four puffs of the Farah Fawcett spray. It's remarkable. Honestly, a moment that deserves revisitation. I agree. Honestly, I think we've crushed this assignment. The payoff then, as we've already mentioned, of Dustin showing up to the snowball with

his new hair. The best. On Cleop. Also, you know, Steve in his risky business, Tom Cruise's look. Very, very good. Very good. The hair advice in that sequence is why it's fabled. But it's also my pick yet again for, I just think Steve's whole look there is iconic.

The skinny jeans. The jacket. The Nike's again. This gray jacket is sensational. Absolutely. And the nail bat poking over. the shoulder, the sheets, the gloves. I can tell that Joe Keri in the off season practice posing with that bat.

There are so many shots of him with a bat slung over his shoulder, like looking over his shoulder. He's just like, yeah, I know I look hot as shit. Like, look, I don't want to overstate things, but you know how when we talked, we did our Back to the Future pod earlier the summer? What a blast that was. 40th anniversary. Check out that pod if you haven't. And we talked about how like, you see Marty and you're just like, right. This is going to be forever an iconic look. Yeah. No one's quite at the mark But that's kind of what they're pulling off here.

I agree. And it's amazing. No one can touch Steve in this category. It's just sad to happen. I do think we would be remiss if we didn't observe and note the number of times that characters in the show are commenting on how tight Billy's jeans are, though, are commenting on his ass.

Look at his touch. Look at something else. The unbuttoned shirt, his hair. The SIG. Post-cag stand at the Halloween party. He's got the leather jacket, no shirt, and his entire torso is just like glistening, one presumed with regurgitated beer, fine. But like, nonetheless, glistening and then the tight jeans.

It's a lot. You know who's a fan of how that teen boy looks? Karen Wheeler, put a pin in that when we're coming back to it. It's just a great payoff. You know, she did ask Ted to open the door once again, and he did not oblige. And if he had, a lot of things would have been different, Ted. Best needle drop. Speaking of Billy, I'm going to give it to Rocky Lake a Hurricane the Scorpions for Billy's entrance.

Nice. I love that song. I think it's really well deployed for a character that I think ultimately doesn't work perfectly for me this season, but will work better in subsequent seasons. And I just love that song. That's a really good pick. This is where I have the snowball. Time after time. Our Queen Cindy Lauper.

Everything you already said. Your charity time travel theory about season five, Stranger Things. Exactly. It's always on our minds. I just, you know, we talked about it. It's just beautiful. And, like, I love all of the different characters who are featured in the Snowball.

Like, I love when we cut outside to Joyce and Hop. We've had the moments earlier in the season about, you know, the strength of the cigarette. And then how it takes them back to when they were kids together in school. and like tough, a dip on the risers slider scale. It's a dip for Mike and L in season two from season one, the highs of season one. But like, when the police kicks in and then like, you know,

and Hop too, because he's, he has aired, as you were just talking about in his guardianship in some ways, despite his good intentions and the reasons. And so like for him, when he's sitting with Owens and he gets the birth certificate, Jane Hopper, and he's been the one all season who's like, don't be stupid. We've got our don't be stupid rules. Stay inside. And he's like, you're telling me it's going to be a year before it's safe. Like, well, I need one night. Like, I need to let this kid go be a kid.

And then she walks in and look on Mike's face and they dance. And Max and Lucas share a kiss. And like, it's just all so sweet. Obviously, we already talked about it. And you picked and celebrated the, the just beautiful, the beautiful gesture from Nancy, I just, I think even more devastating to me than Dustin literally crying on the bleachers is that. one pan prior when he's just standing alone after striking out a couple times, like looking around and seeing everybody else paired up and like, boy, it just takes you back to feeling that way when you were a kid or an adult. You kind of never stopped feeling that way. And it's really beautifully captured there, you know? So I just love that scene so much. We already mentioned the islands in the stream dance with Joyce and Bob, which I love. And then obviously like a runner-up.

Jim Crouchy. Incredible stuff from Hop to like the snap, the wiggle, his his anthem, get the tunes pump in to clean up the cabin, and then let's just say it now. I don't mind spoiling for season three. This song comes back. It comes back. And we will be talking about it then because it's one of the best moments in the season. It's a very good moment for an incredibly toxic character. He's my favorite and I love him.

If this had Netflix subtitles, wait, it does. What's your subtitle of the season, Joanna? So the reason we created this category is because in later seasons of Stranger Things, flesh descending wetly, they go absolutely bananas. This is not true in the early seasons. The captions are sort of dull. That being said, I've picked just chittering because anytime anything, and I've said

this to you before, anytime something chitters is an absolute no for me. This goes back actually to reading Jurassic Park. Anytime something chitters, I am out. There's a lot of chittering on Alien Earth right now. I'm thinking of you. Okay. Well, can't wait to get all gooped up for. that. A lot of chittering.

So I'm just going to give it to chittering. Great pick. You abhorror a chitter. You abhorror a crevice. Yeah. But you love an ocean vista. It's true. Okay. This is an actual sequence of subtitles. Okay.

This is from episode four, Will the Wise. And it is when Hopper is digging the hole. Okay. On his way down to the tunnels. Okay. These are all presented to us in brackets. It's one word in a bracket. And here is the sequence.

Quote, squelching, panting, yeah, grunting, air hissing. I knew grunting would be in there. Bubbling. Interestingly, also the subtitles for my Jim Hopper fanfic. Can we find out on AO3 right now? Don't tempt me. Is your username on AO3

rage issues in a Hawaiian shirt? Rated E for explicit. Can you give us a give us that again so we can make sure to search for it. Squelching, panting, grunting, air hissing, puppling. I have no notes. It's really good. No notes.

That's really good. Okay, we have two categories left. Our season MVP's adult and kid pick and the most enticing endgame set up or question for season five based on this season. Do you want to actually do the MVP's first and save the season five? last in case anybody doesn't want to hear that. Okay, who were your MVP's for this season? Kid? Yeah, probably pretty obvious after everyone's listened to this pod, but maybe not. Oh, it's not Dustin. I'm just going back to the well. I'm saying Noah Schnapp. It's Will.

Oh, you're doing performer again. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is a really good thing. This is Noah's best season. It is. And he's really, really good. And I just feel really sad that he just has to grab his neck for, like, the next two seasons. But, like, possessed Will. It's fantastic. We talked about him, like, screeching. flopping on the ground, but like all the hospital stuff and then the, and then the Spy Shack sequence. Oh, yeah. He is excellent in the season. And the season kind of doesn't work unless Will is this good. He's really good.

Yeah. I almost, it's, I'm really glad you picked that because I kind of wanted to pick that and intended to. And then I just had this moment where I was like, I don't know, I'm just going to keep picking my favorites. Sure. I just, I just, I have major points to Will too. But I just have to, it's for me, on the kids front, it's just is Dustin. Steve the season. I kind of, but Will is right there, and I'm glad you're honoring him.

How about for adult? I have a question for you. When we do these categories in, like, season four, does Steve get, like, promoted to adult category? I think this is a good question. At what point do we stop? But maybe we'll have to introduce a third tier. He's a guy with a job. I know, but also, as Robin will point out, like, how many of your friends are children?

How many children do you know? A question we could ask of Murray as well, you know what I mean? I mean, indeed. Adult? Yeah. I'm going to go to Sean Asson as Bob Nuby. That's a great one. I think that's a great one and a right one.

I pick Joyce here in season one. I know I will be picking Hopper here in season three. Yeah. Like, no question. It's the safest Vegas took it off the board of the entire rewatch for us. I also picked Hop here. In part because I felt like I wasn't really talking about him like elsewhere today and that this can maybe be just a grab bag.

But we ended up hitting most of it as we went anyway. I just think he's just think. he is really crucial to the season. And a lot of the things that, like, you mentioned early in the episode, the way that he is just such a part of, like, Joyce's life and Will's life and that shared journey for them. Obviously, like, he makes a lot of mistakes and things go wrong with him and L, but just that that relationship is very crucial to the story overall. Like the- where did the Hopper Will relationship go? Like, he shows up for all of Will's appointments. Like, you know, he picks, he scoops Will up off the bed and, like, like, you know, he picks, he scoops Will up off the bed and, like,

like, you know, carries him out. They basically have to sub because Mike and L are reunited in season three, sub his focus. Yeah. To being like Mike oriented. I guess. Yeah. You know what? Everyone's joking about the runtimes.

And I'm sure when it comes to like watching 12 hours of over, for two episodes that are 12 hours in a holiday, we're going to be like, why are these so long? They got a lot of stuff to like spend time on and focus on again. So maybe it's good. I just feel like they forget these things sometimes. And sometimes they remember. or like L's relationship with Joyce. You know, like sometimes they remember. And then sometimes I feel like they forget that like Hopper and Will had a, he saved

him from the upside down. Like they're connected. And now it's just like Mike and. And especially in this season, it's so impressive because again, like because Bob is so there and present and they are establishing something really meaningful with Bob and Will, but they can still do it. It's a good, like, yeah, it's a good reminder and lesson. Like you don't have to always make the tradeoff.

Do it all. Do it all. That's one that shows that it's best. sometimes doing it all leads to a triple decker. I go extravagance, though, so maybe it's not always that it's best. It's something to think about. We would be remiss if we didn't mention when he reads Anne of Green Gables to Elle. Very important.

I mean, that's just, that's a meaningful thing. And I like, you know, the positive kind of end note thrusting us forward, where he is learning to, after the conversation, like this, sometimes I feel like I'm just some kind of black hole or something and talking about Sarah and apologizing for keeping the information. about Terry, about 11's mom from her. That sweet little moment they share about like Elle's look, you know, bitch in. And I don't hate it, by the way, the whole look.

It's kind of cool bitching. And the way he smiles, he's like, okay, sure, bitching. And like, accepting that she's going to be on her own journey. And she's going to be on her. And part of that is discovery. And like, who am I and who do I want to be? And that if he's going to be in her life and going to be this father to her and just like, source of love and support that he has to accept that he doesn't get to decide that for her.

And maybe she should go to school and not just watch soap operas all day. Maybe learning one word a day out of the dictionary is not a substitute for an actual education. It can be your word of the day. Well, you know, listen, rightly you pointed out when we covered season four that we find out making diaramas of squirrels instead of speaking complete sentences. So there are consequences. No, I love the sweet squirrel, you know. It's true. All right, if you don't want to hear anything about season five, we'll see you for our season three pod whenever that is.

Thanks for being here today. All right, if you want to hear about season five, it's time for our last category. What's most on your mind here on the old upside down or Vecna front or any other front based on what you watched in season two? Like, did you find yourself saying, wait, I have like a real question about this thing on a reworn? watch of what it might mean for the end, any theory fodder that was running through the mind.

What was most top of mind for you here? Two things. Tell me. I already mentioned this to you, but I'm going to do it again off air. Now I'm going to do it on air. Dustin being in a bus in a junkyard with demodogs coming in and the demadog just like easily getting could have, if not called away, get in through the hatch on the top of the bus. And then Dustin and Eddie spent all this time reinforcing the.

trailer in season four and forget to do all of the fucking vents so the bats get in. Dustin, you already did this and fucked up once. What's happening? Do you think that he just missed his dart so badly? That he's like, that he's like repressed these lessons as he's repressed his trauma. Let me just. Could it be that? Lead my friend to his death by bat.

Okay, so there's that. Also, I just think I think Will. Like, what is the payoff going to be for... Yeah, that's mine. Will inhaling a metric shit ton of upside down dust and all the other things. The will, and like just in general, kind of the like particles and the particle-driven control of the hive mind. The sympathetic sort of, yeah. Like, I was thinking again, too, we talked about this in season four and we speculated, but haven't mentioned this, but now we're in the safe to talk ahead.

I do like all of the kind of like set up for the Russian-centric bots. Oh, then we get in the season. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's pretty well done. In season four, we're in Russia and we go through their, like, lab and their specimens. The swirling particles, like, okay. So obviously we have some interesting stuff on a rewatch that's top of mind for us. It was just, like, you know, thinking of Vecna discovering what we now think of as the mindfly.

and reshaping it and the spiders and the way that we, everything we learned about Henry and the spiders in season four, Will describes the mindflare's influence bustly. This is in Will the Wise episode four. He says, and he returns to this later in season two, it's almost

more like a feeling. I was like so struck by that on a rewatch after everything we go through in season four with Henry. Like, is the nature of the magic and the hive mind control just Vecna's feelings? Like, pain and his rage. And then what does that, what's the upshot of that, right? Like, what does it mean for somebody's ability to challenge it, countermeasure? What does it mean for maybe somebody

being able to break free of it? How much of this is like a kind of passage-esque, like, kill the one, kill the many, which they talk about. You know, we get obviously D&D, the great, like, hop, like, it's a kid's game, you know, and Dustin's defense of the manual. And then like, yeah, no, yeah, it's just, but like everything they talk about, right, this is the description of the mind flier, a monster from an unknown dimension so ancient, it doesn't even know it's true home, et cetera, talking about the destruction of our world. You know, season four, obviously, the ruptures and the cracks that open in Hawkins and the state of peril that Hawkins is in. Like, if we kill it, we kill everything it controls, we win theoretically. Okay, so that should apply to

Vecna. We have the whole evolution over the seasons of like, they think at first Vecna is the mindflare's general. Really, of course, it's the other way around. So, okay, if you take out Vecna, you take out the whole thing, or do you, this gets back to the Horacrux idea, like, they burn the mindflare tendrils and particles and smoky essence out of will. I'm like, what, how much of a role is heat going to play in season five? But like, that is what stays behind, right? That's what's left in Hawkins, what Al closes the gate. And so that basically sets up the plot of season three. Can they do a kill the one, kill the many?

If there's like a Horcrooks-esque anchor for Vecna in the form of the hive mind, like which direction do you think they're going to go with that? Right. Is it and is it, is there going to be something of like, because Will can still feel him. Yes. In later seasons. Yes. So, yeah.

The old back of the neck. So like is it is Will, like, do we have to kill Will? Right. in the hairy way. So does Will have to die? We talked about this a lot in our season four pods where I'm just like, I don't know, you can't have, I guess they have a couple of gay kids on the show now. But I'm just like, I don't know if Will's whole plot is like a metaphor for being queer and then they're just like, and he has to die. I'm like, I don't think so.

I don't like it. Yeah. But, you know, or does he have to endure a lot of pain or injure himself somehow? How, like, is there, you know, something that isn't like, Harry, like, a permanent death or whatever? Yeah. Does he have to be, or does L, as you've theorized? Like, who has to be basically willing and ready to make the sacrifice, but maybe can return from Kings Cross? Right.

Like, Will says one of the things we hear in the Will Mike. Get a little CPR, perhaps. It's like he's reaching into Hawkins more and more. Obviously, we know from season four, that is true. That is what's happening. The more he spreads, and from here, too, the more connected to him, I feel. To your point. Like, we talked about potentially, like, is Vecna the big bad of the final season, or is it 11? Is it Will? Like, you know, is it, is it one of these two kids who have been infected or impacted or connected to Vecna?

Is it going to be a photo of Barb in the bathroom? Could be. Could be. Do you think that photo of Barb is in the bathroom in the upside down? Was it there before Will was abducted or not? I mean, I have to. I have to hope that the upside down is free of this. It's a blight of Barb's toilet photo because it's thankfully mercifully locked in time. And I have to assume they only put the photo there after she died. They're like a bar. They're like a bar.

They're like a bar. In a barb in every room. Like maybe there's just a barb in every room and in their household. I don't know. Maybe instead of selling that house, they should raise it. That's terrible. Okay. We did it. Anything on season two that we didn't get to in one of the categories that you wanted to mention or that stands out to you?

I just want everyone to remember that Jonathan does not shoot with Polaroid. That's just a very important thing that I think we go. Someone else has been here. Great stuff. Oh, Jonathan. Boy, special stuff coming from Jonathan in season three. All right, we did it. What a blast. We don't have an exact date yet for season three, but we're going to continue the journey. We'll do season three later, early fall. September. I mean, it's what? It's late August. So sometime in September. So time of September, season three, and October season for... Twice. Two parts, right? Do we need to split it? Can't we just treat it as one season?

We don't have to obey Netflix's weird rules. I'm just going off what we had on the original calendar. That was before one of us was out for several weeks. We can adjust. And that'll take us right to the new season. Wonderful. Can't wait. All right.

We did it. Guess what? We had more help today than just this one random girl. We had a lot of help today. We had it easier than Steve Vanherer Harrington. Carlos Chirboga is not in the studio with us today because he's got double pod today, but he will be on the edit. On the edit. And he helped us with clips.

And he was, of course, as present as the tendrils of the mind flair in every aspect of this. John Jones, here with us today helping us out. Thank you, John, Arjuna Ramallah, as also MFA. MFA. John. And Jomey and Denner on the social for this episode. We will see you. Sorry, I didn't mean to step on Arjuna.

The best. I'm going to do my Vakna voice. Arjuna. All right, I'm going to work on it before season four. I've got some time. I've got some time. To learn on a skateboard and work on your Vakna voice. Arjuna.

Yeah, that's not happening. All right. Next week, Alien Earth Episode 5 and Bofy the Vampire Slayer Season 1 can't. Wait. See you then. Bye. All. Pay off your home. Travel for life. Drive a Ferrari. In celebration of the world premiere of the Monopoly, Big Board Buckslot machine by Aristocrat Gaming, Yamava Resort and Casino and San Manuel is giving one person a $1.6 million dream package. The biggest prize in Yamava's history. Club Sorano members can earn daily instant prizes and secure a spot in the finale May 29th. Don't pass go and own it all. Only at Yamava, celebrating its 40th anniversary.

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