How To Fail With Elizabeth Day - S10, Ep3 How to Fail: Alexandra Burke

Episode Date: February 17, 2021

Alexandra Burke shot to fame as the 2008 winner of The X Factor. She became the first British female solo artist to have a million-selling single and went on to have a successful career as both a recording artist and a performer: her lead roles in the stage adaptations of The Bodyguard and Sister Act met with rave reviews.But behind the public profile were private battles: her beloved mother was dying, she was subjected to racism in the music industry and her story was frequently misreported in the media. Alexandra joins me to talk about managing this difficult duality and what it taught her about her own strength and resilience. She tells me about never thinking she's good enough, learning how to set boundaries, losing herself in relationships, failing to put herself first and the grief of losing her mum. We also talk about how, in the wake of the Black Lives Matter protests of 2020, she chose to speak out about the racism she endured and the impact this had on her.I'm not sure I've ever connected with someone as instantly as I did with Alexandra! She's an amazing, vibrant, warm-hearted soul who understands that being open about her failures is actually the key to self-growth. This is one of the most emotional episodes I've ever recorded. I'm so grateful to Alex for the beautiful gift of her vulnerability. Listen to be moved (and perhaps have some tissues nearby).*Failosophy: A Handbook for when Things Go Wrong is out now and available to buy here.*How To Fail With Elizabeth Day is hosted by Elizabeth Day, produced by Naomi Mantin and Chris Sharp. We love hearing from you! To contact us, email [e-mail]*Social Media:Elizabeth Day @elizabdayHow To Fail @howtofailpod Alexandra Burke @alexandraburke  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hello and welcome to How to Fail with Elizabeth Day, the podcast that celebrates the things that haven't gone right. This is a podcast about learning from our mistakes and understanding that why we fail ultimately makes us stronger, because learning how to fail in life actually means learning how to succeed better. I'm your host, author and journalist Elizabeth Day, and every week I'll be asking a new interviewee what they've learned from failure. Alexandra Burke is a singer, but not just any singer. After winning the X Factor in 2008, Burke became the first British female solo artist to have a million-selling single. Anyone who watched that series, and I certainly did, will remember Burke for both the staggering quality

and tone of her voice, as well as her professionalism and ability to nail a dance routine. She is arguably one of the best all-round performers the show has ever produced. In the final, she duetted with Beyonce, who later described Burke as a superstar. Her debut album, Overcome, sold over 850,000 copies and she went on to earn three Brit Award nominations. More recently, Burke received rave reviews in the West End for her lead roles in the stage adaptations of The Bodyguard and Sister Act. Pandemic permitting, she'll be touring the country in the West End for her lead roles in the stage adaptations of The Bodyguard and Sister Act. Pandemic permitting, she'll be touring the country in the theatrical version of My Best Friend's Wedding at the end of the year. She's also currently writing and recording her fourth

studio album. But it hasn't always been easy. Her mother, Melissa Bell, who was one of the lead singers for Soul to Soul, died in 2017. Burke threw herself into work to cope with her grief, signing up for Strictly Come Dancing and eventually coming second. The rehearsal room has become my sanctuary, she said at the time. It is a happy place where I force myself to leave my grief at the door. Last year, prompted by the wave of Black Lives Matter protests across the globe, Burke opened up about her own experiences of racism in the music industry, revealing she was once told to bleach her skin. She refused. Her strength of mind and purpose has seen her navigate these sometimes choppy waters with grace, but the media has not always understood her.

I've become quite vulnerable, she said in an interview in 2018, and I've realised vulnerability is a strength, not a weakness. Alexandra Burke, you could not be speaking more my language. Welcome to How to Fail. Oh, wow. I mean, if you you I just want to say thank you for that lovely introduction oh it was really beautiful thank you very very much there's a lot that you've just said there that actually I put in the back of my mind and I like tend to forget about as time goes on and you've just said a lot of things I've gone oh wow yeah it's just made me choke up a little bit. So thank you. Oh, Alexandra, listen, it's such a delight. And actually, I really enjoyed researching that introduction because it reminded me so vividly of watching that X Factor series. I remember the duet with Beyonce, obviously, but I also remember you performing the Christina Aguilera song, Candyman.

Oh, Candyman. And doing, I mean, doing this incredible dance routine and singing at the same time. And it still blows my mind. You know, it's funny you bring up that particular song because that was the song I didn't want to sing. And I remember being given the choice. It was big band week and they said, right, you're doing Candyman. And I was like, right you're doing candy man I was like have you heard the lyrics I was like I don't want to sing this song I just remember Simon actually because Cheryl was my mentor but Simon kind of was overseeing every single act as well and I just remember him saying to me if you do this song it can change your whole life because you sing and you dance and I just want to put both together with a band he goes it's just it's what you do and I just thought oh if he believes in me then I'll give it a shot and

actually it's one of my favorite performances I mean take away from performing with Beyonce but standalone that one definitely is I've got to say one of my favorite performances and I still have the Alexander McQueen dress in my house and I only took it out the wardrobe the other day and looked at it and thought, I can't believe I have an Alexander McQueen original dress just in my house, just chilling upstairs. It's unbelievable. Do you have Beyonce's phone number? I don't. I don't. But there are ways that I do contact her and she is a very special incredible humble woman very oh that is so nice to hear so are you still in touch with her yeah like when she comes over to the UK and she does her tours and stuff I go to see her shows if I'm around and stuff like that

and when I was in the States as well I'll never forget the time when I was recording in the studio and she just casually popped in with a glass of white wine in her hands and offered me one I thought oh no I'm not gonna drink while I'm singing but it was really sweet and I just got really flustered and nervous around her but every time I've seen her since she's always been so welcoming and has always made me feel like I'm just like a normal person even though I'm her biggest fan and I really do act out when I see her because I start sweating and start getting really nervous. And she takes no notice and she treats me like I'm just a human. And it's great.

What was it like for you experiencing that level of sudden fame? Because that is the thing with the X Factor. Although I know it wasn't an overnight success, which we'll on to you later, it's perceived as an overnight success. And you're suddenly under loads of pressure to do lots of very public things. What was that like for you? Well, I was only 19 when I auditioned. I just turned 21. And I really have to thank my mum for the experience she went through with Soul to Soul, is why I was able to handle certain things. I consider myself as one of the lucky ones because I had a mum that was in the industry. So really, I had like one up on certain artists that are starting out because I had a mum that's

gone through stuff and had told me, if this happens and that happens, this is how you handle it, get fixed skin, et cetera, take things with a pinch of salt, blah, blah, blah. So I had a very get thick skin, et cetera, take things with a pinch of salt, blah, blah, blah. So I had a very great, really amazing support system. I still do. But back then it was just vital to have that. And I really do feel sorry for people who don't have those kind of people in their lives when they're starting out in the music industry, because it can be intense and it is very intense. But I think for me, I was singing live with bands and in pubs and bar mitzvahs, weddings, funerals you name it from the age of nine so to have an audience in front of me was kind of normal for me

but to have the fame that came with it I've never really enjoyed it if I'm honest with you because I'm such a private person I enjoy being at home I enjoy having family quality time like quality time with my friends I love just going on long dog walks. I love doing very normal things. And I'm very lucky to actually have a career and doing something that I love. But the fame part of it, I've always been quite afraid to really just be me because I'm being watched all the time. to really just be me because I'm being watched all the time. So I've always been scared to just be myself and always felt like I've had to be someone who I'm not at times, you know?

And that's what scares me about fame is that sometimes you can't truly feel your authentic self. And I definitely felt that when I was younger, but it's since definitely changed now that I'm in my 30s. This is quite a weird thing to say to you, but many, many years ago, I was sitting in the Fulham branch of Starbucks in Southwest London.

And I used to go to cafes to write my novels. I also write books. And I think I was writing my first ever novel and you came in. And you were immediately recognized by everyone in Starbucks and you handled that with such grace I mean I use that word in the introduction for a reason and you were really you had lovely energy and you were really kind and you said to everyone thank you for the support and then you went out with your latte or whatever. I just think, you know, first of all, kudos to you for managing that,

but also how difficult it must be to be that kind of famous where you can't just go into a cafe to get a coffee. Like you have to think about everything. Well, you know what? I'll be honest with you. So you can probably tell by now I love to talk and I love meeting new people. So when I meet people on the street or meet people whenever I just talk to people, people find me a little bit weird and that's okay because I will

just talk to anyone, but it's just like, I love people. So for me, that's probably, I feel like I'm very lucky that I can just talk to anyone. And my mum's taught me how to be that way. But yes, you do have to think about things that when, like even now I mean the only thing that's really saving me right now when I walk out in the street is the mask and then when I talk behind that mask people go oh my god are you are you that singer and I go yeah I'm the singer but which one do you think I am and they went Alex Hodge but this was just in Tesco's the other day by the way and I'm just describing one time but I mean and then I just have a conversation with a random stranger and then I'll just like follow them on Instagram and sometimes they'll message

me and I'll just stay in touch. I'm really weird like that guys. I'm really sorry, but I love people. I love meeting new people. I think it's great. I mean, I can feel your warmth coming through the airwaves and we're talking without seeing each other, but I definitely get that sense from you. But let's start with your failures because they're very self-aware failures and they encompass so much of what I really want to talk to you about actually first of all how difficult did you find it to come up with these failures oh very very very very difficult I remember when we got the email and I was told oh Alex you've got like a couple of weeks to do your failures. And I thought, oh, I've got ages. This is great. And then I didn't really think about it. And then when it got down to crunch time and I was writing them, I thought to

myself, maybe I should write a little bit of information for you just to understand why I'm saying these failures. And so I started, you know, writing down how I felt. And I've just so you know, I've kept a journal since 1999, if not before. So I and I have all my diaries here. So I'm used to just like writing down my feelings. And I haven't written in my journal in a couple of months, like, I would say about six months, because actually, I've been going through my own personal things. And I just felt like I've not been able to be brave enough to write in my journal recently. And then when I was writing down these failures, it took me to a really weird place emotionally a little bit mentally and I had to stop and I had two friends in my house one of my

friends is a support bubble and just helps me out with some things so I can help my auntie out and he came over to drop some shopping off and I sat with them and said to two of my friends I went what's your failures in life and I asked them and I felt to myself I needed to talk about it so I started talking about mine and it just brought me to tears so I'm really praying I don't cry or in this interview now because I don't want to cry and I think like you've always said in all of your interviews that you've done with everyone you've said it's about growth and it's about learning about yourself and how you can move forward so these failures aren't a bad thing. But for some reason, it took me to a very emotional place.

So if it takes me there today, it takes me there today. But I'm feeling like it's quite a nice thing to talk about it. Honestly, I feel like there is no more generous act than showing authentic emotion. And so if it does take us there, that's fine. And I'll cry too. And I'm sorry I'm sorry that yes totally I'm sorry I took you to an emotional place but I'm also extremely grateful and I think lockdown as well you know we're talking during the third lockdown and it just brings a lot of stuff up when especially as you are,

you're used to traveling around and touring and going here, there and everywhere. And suddenly, we're all in our own homes. And we are left alone with the chatter of our internal minds. And that's a really difficult thing. It's hard. And what I did do in last year, when I actually stopped touring in February, I decided to take six months off for my own mental health that was only meant to last until August last year and then go back on tour and I thought during that time I'm going to work on me and work on the things that I know will make me happy and one of them was getting a life coach I've been speaking to my life coach once a week consistently I've stopped for the past couple of months because she's just had a baby, bless her heart.

But she's been someone that actually has helped me tremendously throughout lockdown. I feel like she's made me a little bit stronger. And I'm just grateful that I took the courage to do therapy because I never thought that I could do it. And it's taken me some time since my mum passed to actually acknowledge grief and acknowledge my pain and acknowledge everything really well you're speaking to someone who has fortnightly therapy so I completely understand where you're coming from good for you for taking that choice your first failure it slightly breaks my heart to read it out loud but your first failure is thinking that you're never good enough.

So tell us about that and what happens when you think that. Or what's the first time you remember thinking that, thinking that you were never good enough? Don't apologise at all. Oh my gosh. Sorry, I just... No, don't be sorry. I completely understand. The way you wrote it to me is so raw because this is a failure or a self-perceived failure that seems to spread its roots into so many areas of your life and what you've been through. And I wonder if part of it I mentioned earlier like you won the x factor and are one of the most amazing winners of any x factor ever but you actually went up for a previous series didn't you and got through to the final stage but then when I was silly old

didn't take you through no I can't believe it you were always so together um but I suppose that's interesting it did that make you feel that you weren't good enough and that then you had to put in extra effort I'll be honest with you it all stems from my teenage years I think it stems from going through that period actually when I was on X Factor at 16 was very tough because I wasn't my mum and I didn't have a relationship so we weren't speaking for about two years which was very tough because I wasn't, my mum and I didn't have a relationship. So we weren't speaking for about two years, which was very tough for any young person to go through. And we just used to not really see eye to eye at times because my mum always wanted the best for me. And she sacrificed a lot for her children. And I went on to have what I thought at the time was a good relationship. It

was a very bad and toxic and abusive relationship. and that's where it all really started from 16 years old so going from that into x-factor to being told you're too young and this is not for you and then still just grafting and doing every gig that I could possibly get when I was younger to working in pubs clubs etc just to make some money and it wasn't a lot back then but I just kept trying and to get the experience it really does start from there and it feels like it's filtered into relationships as well and when I say that I mean love relationships where I've been through recently a couple of relationships where when the breakups sadly happen and you know everything happens for a reason and I really live by that but when the breakups sadly happen I won't say who it is but I've been told from an ex-partner

once sat me down and said I just can't be with you because you are famous you have too much attention around you but thanks so much for letting me live rent-free in your house and I was like oh okay and that was a really long term relationship. And, and that's just one example. And it just makes you think to yourself, or it makes me think to myself, I just think, well, am I good enough? Am I enough for someone? Oh, my darling, you are, you so are, you are so more than enough. And that's the issue, is that when you are with someone who is less than, who isn't worthy of you, that's where they'll go with it because you are complete in and of yourself. You absolutely

are. You have so much to give. And I find it so cruelly unfair that you haven't met someone who knows themselves well enough to support that and embrace you but that's on them yeah and I do feel like I'm sounding really upset right now it's because I'm talking about it and but I feel like where my head's gone in the past year for example with having a life coach she's really helped me realize that I am deserving of love and that I can I can have it and it will all happen at the right time and I'm a very spiritual person and I always say that God's time is the best timing um and every relationship is there as an experience and a learning curve and I've been so fortunate that I have amazing people around me to help me when I'm at my lowest and because all the time it feels like I'm having to put a facade on like I'm having to put a mask

on and pretend I'm okay all the time and I've learned recently that actually I can be honest with people and say that I'm not okay and say if I am or if I'm not and not feel ashamed of how I truly feel and um it's taken me to get to my 30s to really understand that but I'm grateful for it very very Alex it's taken me until my 40s so you're already winning in that respect so much of what you say like rings a massive chord with me because I think that a lot of my drive comes from an attempt to prove that I'm worthy of love and it's a whole different podcast episode like where that comes from in my life but I think that that has made me someone who works extremely hard because I will keep trying to oh my gosh get that yeah in that way I'm so that as if by magic yes

that's my that's my mother facetiming me oh wow so sorry I've declined it's okay I didn't even hear but I think there's that level of it where you're just trying to prove that you're worthy of attention and then with you because I know that you're the eldest of is it four or you've got four siblings I'm the second from youngest oh sorry yes good research well done me but I think also for you that thing that you say about not having a relationship with your mother I guess that at that particular point in your life you had to grow up really fast oh and so quick yeah and that thing of having a facade must come from then it does it really does and you know what it's like my mum gave me really good schooling when I was younger in the sense of taking things with a pinch of salt and not taking things too personally.

And when I was much younger and, you know, like it's difficult at times to be the strong person all the time and to be the one that provides and to look after people and stuff like that. And it takes its toll on you. For me, I've got such a massive love for what I do that I don't stop thinking about music. I don't stop thinking about dreaming of touring and singing on stage and having a microphone in my hand. And music just means so much to me because of where it's come from. It's come from my mum, the woman that made me. And to see her success and to see her have four kids and to still have a career and travel the world like I wanted everything she had if not more and this failure when it comes into my music I touched on it when I spoke about my experience in the music last year on Instagram I was sat

down and told you're never going to be good enough because of your color you're never going to sell a certain amount of records because you know you may not appeal to a certain audience and I was told to bleach my skin and you're never going to perform on the Brits because they wouldn't have a black artist perform on the Brits. The most you're going to do is just one x-factor and that's the biggest it will get for you and all of that is bullshit excuse my French. It's just ridiculous because I was never brave enough to say that 10 years ago when I was told that I sat there and thought well if that's the case I'm just going to work really hard so that

I can achieve everything you've told me that I can't and you know granted yes I haven't performed on the Brits before but I've been nominated and that in itself is a huge honor and all the little things about not selling music well that's rubbish too because I have sold so all the little things that I was told that you can't do this and you can't do that well no I have proved you wrong in some kind of way because I've worked really hard to try my best to achieve things that I'm proud of but if it wasn't for my family if it wasn't for my mum in particular for my amazing beautiful friends and the team I currently have around me I don't know where I'd be mentally if I'm honest with you I don't know where I'd be because keeping that strong face and keeping

that strong spirit up don't get me wrong I'm a very positive person but it's very difficult to keep it up when you are feeling at your lowest but also you know and being made to feel literally like you can't be yourself yes you're too much of something in this way or that way. I find it so depressing and flabbergasting that this was only 10 years ago that people were talking to you in these terms. And I feel angry on your behalf. And you sound really mature and measured about it. But do you think, think were you I'm guessing you weren't allowed to be angry no but where did you feel anger and where did it go I think for me

so it takes a lot to really pee me off like you could really do a lot to me and I would just sit there and go okay great no it doesn't yeah it doesn't work one of my best friends Nalini who we basically now live together because of lockdown. She's with me right now. She's just put her foot in my face to try and annoy me and it's not working.

So, you know, it really doesn't work. But I think there was a point where I was angry and I'd be honest with you, it only occurred in the past year because I bottled it up and it only occurred when the Black Lives Matter movement happened.

And I felt myself angry around all of that because first of all with everything surrounding George Floyd and you know everything that happened there I thought of my brother my dad my nephews my cousins you know I thought of them and it could have been them then it stemmed into people direct messaging me and going we know you've been through something and you're not telling us the truth and I was getting hundreds of dms of people saying speak up speak up speak please just tell us what what went on with you and I ignored them and I thought I'm not speaking up what have I got to talk about no not at all and as the days went on I found myself crying all the time upset just watching the news and getting really upset at the things I've gone through and then think and like talking to my brother and it's sparking up all of those emotions again and then one day I was on a zoom call writing a song and I felt this

urge something spiritually happened to me and I can't quite understand it, but I do to a degree, I felt like somebody was screaming in my ear going, speak up about your experiences, stop hiding away from it. And I felt it was my mum. And I remember just being on that Zoom on the computer and went, I'm really sorry, guys, I've got something to do. I've got to go and just close the computer, ran upstairs, put my phone into the phone holder thing, put it on airplane mode and just started to speak for 15 minutes. I just went for it. And it wasn't planned. I didn't have any notes. I didn't think about what I was doing. There's a lot I didn't speak about. Even my brother said to me, you missed this out. And I said to him, that wasn't the point. The point of

it was, was for me to just release. And I really feel like the anger went when I released it. In that 15 minute video I put on my Instagram, the anger left me and it was a burden I didn't need to carry anymore. And since doing it, I felt at ease with myself. I've forgiven myself for holding onto it and not speaking up. I've forgiven myself for not speaking up sooner. And there's a lot of forgiveness in and around that video that I've just gone, now I can move forward and be me and if people don't like it tough my mummy always used to say to me you can't be everyone's cup of tea in the moment you try to be you've failed everyone's gonna like you you know I love that for you I love that look for you and I wanted to ask because you mentioned personal relationship like romantic relationships

yeah do you feel able to be yourself in a romantic relationship and I only ask you this from a place of my own experience which is that I didn't feel able to be myself until everything imploded in my life when I was like 35 and I got divorced and everything but I think we're quite similar in this respect and I wonder whether you spend a lot of time trying to please the other person in the relationship so this is the first time I've been asked this question and it's the first time I'm ever answering this the truth is there's probably only one relationship where I felt like I could be myself in my whole life and that's when I was engaged when I was with my ex-partner Josh it's the only relationship I've

been in where I felt like I could be myself and I have not experienced that since because I'm always pleasing the other person and always making sure that they're okay and everything's okay for them I completely don't even know who I am because I'm not even thinking of me. And that's, yeah, it's, wow. Yeah. Yeah. I think so many women, particularly of a certain age, are raised that way, not necessarily by their parents, but by society,

to be nice and kind and pliant and thoughtful, whereas boys are given more scope to experiment and be mischievous. And one of my former guests, Glennon Doyle, said this amazing thing that stuck with me that young girls are taught to look outward for permission, when actually they need to be looking inward for permission approval for like self-knowledge and I think it's a really hard thing to do and you should not beat yourself up about it yeah because I've never been asked that before and never thought of that before it's made my brain just think and then I'm thinking of I've dated a couple

people in the public eye and actually the only relationship where I felt like I'd be myself is the only time I kept that relationship private and because I kept it private I could be me the moment it's in the public eye from my experiences so far I've never felt like I could be myself and it's a shame because actually I love love I love love so much I love to love I love I love love and I love the idea of marriage and kids and the whole dream and I love it all and I had this big old plan in my head that by 30 because Beyonce did I'm gonna do the same thing and have kids and make sure I'm married and make sure I'm settled. I put so much pressure. And I think a lot of women could probably relate to this. But I put so much

pressure on myself to deliver that. And I wanted to do it for my mum. I wanted her to be there. I wanted her to see it. And it never happened. I don't have any sadness in and around it not happening because I know it will happen in the right time. But I do have sadness a little bit in the fact that I actually haven't been able to be my authentic self in majority of my relationships. And that's quite a hard one to digest for me. But it sounds like you're doing such amazing work on yourself.

I'm trying. I really am. Yeah, honestly, I feel it. When you emerge from lockdown, sounds like you're doing such amazing work on yourself I'm trying I really am yeah honestly I feel it like when you emerge from lockdown I feel it will be like an Alexandra Burke where the two circles the like the sphere of your public life and your private life will like come together and overlap finally so that you can kind of be yourself in every sphere of your life. Honestly, I feel like the fact that you've had the courage to realise that that needs to happen is the biggest step you can take towards that. I want to tell you something, and I won't name the show until we stop recording,

but I basically filmed a show in October, just gone. And I broke my ribs because of it. I've only just healed properly. I had a really sprained ankle. I came back home broken. All I can say is I came back from that show a lot stronger. And I really feel that that particular experience I had in that week completely changed everything for me. So I think if you were speaking to me in September, this would be a very different conversation versus to where I am right now because of what I went through for a week.

It literally was eight days, sorry, and my life was upside down in a great way. And I would love to speak to you about it more when we're allowed to. Okay. That's so interesting that it literally took your body being broken. Yes. For you to realise that your spirit was being broken. Yes. My eyes opened up so much in that week that it's like I had an outer body experience it was insane and when I sit and think and talk about like only my family and close friends know what I'd done but I think about and I go my body was completely in pieces for me to realize that

I deserved a lot more I wanted to ask you specifically about the language that the media uses, particularly when it comes to their portrayal of strong black women. And I noticed something as I was, again, researching this interview, that some of the language felt really uncomfortable for me reading it now from a 2021 lens. There's a lot written about almost overconfidence, tipping into being a diva, finger clicking. All of that felt to me really icky because it's loaded from my perspective anyway, which is one of ignorant white privilege, but it seems quite loaded to me. It seems like they were trying to say or imply something slightly different. And I just wondered what you thought of that. When it comes to me reading stuff about me in particular, I can only really date it back to when it really hit me was when I was doing Strictly Come Dancing. And when I was

reading certain stories about myself, that I was being a diva, that I was throwing chairs across the room, that I'd hit my dance partner, that I was aggressive, that I was overconfident, that I was arrogant. I could not believe what I was reading week in, week out. Now, don't get me wrong. The first couple of weeks were fine. Then as soon as it hit about week three, week two or three, it was week after week. And it it was literally let's just get Alex that's how it felt and that's how everyone that strictly felt because we don't talk about it quite openly and I couldn't believe the lies and this particular journalist actually knows me and I can't quite work out where it all went wrong for that person to write such absurd things about

me and there's a thing with any woman, doesn't matter your colour, any woman being strong, you are perceived to be arrogant. You are perceived to be not relatable. No one likes you because you're strong. Now, the word diva really comes from a strong female singer. It's a strong singer. We call people like Mariah Carey a diva because she's a strong singer. Whitney Houston, Ari Franklin, Dionne Warwick, you know, Gladys Knight, you name them. I'm quite an old school girl, so I'm naming all the old school people. But they are divas and they're amazing because they're fantastic singers and they are powerhouses. Unfortunately, now the word diva and the meaning is someone who is not very nice and someone who that's overly confident or

whatever that may be to whoever and and that's the word that people associate with me and I get it often so I would be walking in the street and I'll give you one example of a young woman that stopped me in the street and she said my daughter's a really big fan of yours do you mind if I get a picture and I said oh my god of course yeah so we had a picture and I started speaking to her daughter and asking her how school was going and what her favorite subject was and stuff and the mum turned to me and tapped me on the shoulder and went I'm really sorry I've just got to tell you something and I said what's that she went I thought you were going to be a bitch I said sorry she goes everything I've read about you is absolutely horrible and I thought you were going to be an absolute complete and utter bitch to me my daughter and actually you're really nice oh my god I just burst into tears and I've had that a few

times because I can count them it's been so many times different occasions where they've gone oh the press are really wrong about you aren't they or they say little like little comments like that and I just stand there and I just go, you don't judge a book by its cover. That's all I can say. And I just say, you can't really judge anyone until you've met them. And this is another thing that stems back to me always trying to people please, because I've always been bashing it, you know, not always been bashing the press. Don't get me wrong. Not everyone's done that to me. There have been lovely articles about me and people have, you know, interviewed me before

and been really beautiful in the words they choose and stuff so everything's not negative I'm only speaking of the negative things but the positive outweighs the negative 100% but when I get comments like that I sit and think to myself why is this and it only really hit me when Strictly happened and really it took its toll on me and I remember tweeting to this particular journalist and saying to him please can you just stop because you're destroying me mentally you're destroying me emotionally and I really just don't understand where you're getting your lies from and he replied back and said I've got good sources and I thought no but you're lying you're lying I haven't thrown a chair I haven't hit Gawker I haven't done any of that where are you getting this from and it still breaks me to this day because I'm like why are people allowed to print these kind of things because it destroys people

and it did destroy me mentally like it really really hurt me and I and I'm not trying to play the pity party because I'm not but going through losing your mum yeah then trying to find an escape which I didn't strictly i'm forever grateful for to then going through reading weekly how horrible i am how bad i treat people when it wasn't the truth oh i'm so sorry so i just kills me because people should be held accountable for the hurt they've caused on other people they should be and i felt helpless in the sense of there was nothing i could do about it it was my word against a national paper that i couldn't control yeah i'm so sorry that That is so, so tough.

And I sincerely hope that, as I think it will, this interview will right a lot of those horrible wrongs. I'm going to move on to your second failure now, which is also a really emotional one. And again, I just want to applaud you for going there. Some people, Alex, just come up with, like, I failed failed my driving test but I'm glad that you've gone there which we can do if you'd rather swap one out but this one well this one actually links really beautifully to what you were expressing there which is that you put work first and you felt that as a result, you lost valuable time with

your mum. Yes. Yes, man. I mean, there is no one that I really know that likes work as much as I do. It sounds really weird. I love to work, whether it be five in the morning or 11 at night I would just keep going and that's actually something that's not healthy at the same time I have been touring for the past five years it's been non-stop like because of these lockdowns and because of everything that's happened I've actually been able to put wallpaper on the walls in my house that I've lived in for nearly 10 years and that's how busy it's been that I've only just started unpacking boxes been here 10 years and only just about finishing this house I've got one more room to do and it's still not finished but that's because I've always worked and put it

first and as a result of putting work first I've missed out on birthdays with my nieces and nephews with my brothers and sisters with my friends with you, I've sometimes made myself feel like I'm an awful friend because I've missed out on everything. And sometimes I'm just too tired to even talk on the phone sometimes. And so I sometimes have to take naps in the day because I know I've got to sing at four o'clock. So I've got to steam my voice. And when you steam your voice, you can't speak for an hour. And I'm just so strict with the gift that God's given me that I don't want anything to jeopardize it. You know, I want to make sure I can pay my house and pay my bills and look after my family and provide. And when they need something, I want to be that person that can just be like, oh, it's fine.

I'll handle it. I can do it. And that sometimes hasn't served me well. When my mum fell sick, basically it just all happened very suddenly. And we weren't expecting her to spiral so suddenly as well like everything was fine one minute and the next it was just like it was two different people my mum was the strong woman that could speak and then all of a sudden she had a stroke and it was more to it than that but we've not really talked about it as a family out in the public so I can only keep information down to only what people really know out of respect to my family but it was two different people and when I said to my mum I'm gonna quit the tour I'm on

at the time was sister act and I had eight months left and I sat her down and I said and she was in hospital and I said right mum I've got nine months left and I'm gonna quit and you want to know what she said she said quit she said sorry first of all i didn't raise a quitter you better get your black ass on that stage tomorrow and i went sorry what she went yep you heard me you better get that black backside on that stage tomorrow people have paid to watch you and i looked at her and went jesus mom really she went it's only nine months come on let's just get the tour ever and done with then we'll have time and so I'd done for those nine months that no one knows, and you're the first person I'm telling, I would perform. I'd have my phone on the stage

with the stage manager. He'd have access to my phone and was giving me updates during every scene, every quick change about my mum and if she was okay and if anything was happening with her that I had to leave the show and then I drive from wherever I was Manchester Sheffield name it sleep on the hospital floor back to London see to my mum bought a blow-up mattress bed see to my mum with my family stay the night go back and do a show oh my god wherever I was in the country and I tell you it was like three four hours drive and royal free hospital i haven't been back there since or in the area but i cannot tell you how amazing they were i cannot tell you how amazing the nhs nurses and doctors were when they told my mum you have 72 hours to live and she couldn't communicate with us they sat us down

and said that she gave us another eight months she gave us another Christmas she gave us another birthday each she gave us Mother's Day she gave us her birthday and then on the last day the last day of my show I finished in Blackpool I drove home I was driving back I get a call Alex you need to come to the hospital now so I revert the car I get to the hospital

and she passes in my arms within 10 minutes of me being there so I lost those 9 months I regret going on tour in my arms, within ten months of me being there. Oh, my God. So I lost those nine months I regret going on tour. I regret it so deeply because I had so much more time in my car and on the road than I did with my mum. And that really burns me because I should have just gone with my gut. I should have listened to myself. I should have just listened and told my mum look you're the priority and let me just quit this

tour let me be with you but instead i listened to her which she wanted me to do and she didn't want me to let anyone down she was very adamant that you can't let your fans down the thing that's her been her thing since i won x factor is you cannot let your fans down. That's been her thing since I won X Factor is you cannot let your fans down. They are the reason why you are who you are. So they came first. And my mum, she wouldn't have wanted it any other way. I'd done what I could. I'd done my best.

I drove from every show. I slept on the floor. I was there. I was there. I'd done everything I could possibly do. But putting work first first that is something i now won't do at times so when i know i need to give myself time back i'm not very good at it yet i'm still learning but i will stop and maybe read a book or stop and meditate or stop and maybe do a

yoga class and give myself something or go for a dog walk or see my nieces and nephews and not hold it off till the next week because you just don't know what tomorrow is going to bring if you can hold off work for a day it's not going to hurt you and I've learned that and it's really taken me a long time to stop putting work at the forefront because basically what that does is it covers every emotion I'm going through that's what it's doing I'm hiding what I'm going through because I'm working so much and I truly regret doing that for the past 12 years since when the next fact it's been 12 years. And I put work first, I put work before my family, work before relationships, work before everything so that I'm in a position to provide for others. That's all I

care about is helping others. And when I say that, I mean my family. Yeah. Alex, I'm so choked up just listening to you talk about that. And I just want to say, I'm so sorry for your loss, for your grief, for the trauma of that. I also wanted to thank you for sharing something so honest and beautiful. And if I may, when you said that I regret putting work first it strikes me that you were putting what your mother wanted first yes and that that's another way of looking at it yeah yeah that actually that's probably the way I should word it because

that automatically made me feel a little bit better by you just saying that because it is what she wanted and I'm sitting here right now talking to you with a picture right in front of me because I'm in my studio my studio basically has my mum everywhere because she's my my inspiration so I'm staring at her as I speak to you and it is what she wanted it is what she wanted and it was what she asked of me and I mean do you do you think because I think you know I like you I don't really believe in regrets in the sense that I do believe most things if you give them enough time teach you necessary lessons but what I do regret sometimes is as you say the time like

feeling that I haven't used time in quite the right way or wishing I had more time with someone who died but is there anything that you felt like you hadn't said to your mum is that part of the regret or do you actually feel like all that time you did spend with her you said enough and you yeah she knew that you loved her oh she knew oh my god my mummy knew she knew because uh oh just thinking about the love I have for my mum makes it just puts the biggest smile on my face because there's no love that I've experienced like it like that love from my mum and me to my mum was unbreakable and I think for me the regret is I lost two years when I was 16 because we didn't speak for two years and yes we resolved that and we became the best of friends and I I really believe, if I'm honest with you, I really believe that God gave me the opportunity

at such a young age to be able to give my mum the life she deserved. And when I say that, I mean down to the car she was driving. And I'm talking a couple of materialistic things, but this is coming from a woman who raised four kids as a single parent and toured with soul to soul and worked to put food on the table and clothes on our backs and when we grew up we'd go to my mum for a little example mummy we really want that new gap jumper that's out and she'd go to the chapel market in angel and buy a fake one because

we couldn't afford the real one she'd make sure we had what we wanted as kids it may have been some fake clothes at times and she was never ashamed to say it but my mum deserved everything so she knew because I'd do anything for her I'd do anything anything she wanted anything she asked for mummy got and it brings me joy that I was in a position to be able to do that so I'm very lucky and that's why I say to myself you know I was 29 when my mum passed away and I'm so lucky to have had that strong role model in my life for 29 years and how I put things into perspective is I go sadly some people lost their parents when they were young I was lucky to have my mummy for 29 years. That's a long, beautiful time. And what we shared in our memories and what we created together,

money couldn't buy that. And as a family, all the things we were able to do together, it was magical. And that's why I really feel like God gave me a beautiful opportunity at a young age because he wanted me to give my mum something back because she gave us kids so much so I live with that and that makes me a bit happier and it makes me go actually she knew I loved her she knew I'd do anything for her and I often speak about my mum like she's still here just because she is all the time she really is yeah and in you and in your talent and yeah yes and it's funny because the older I'm getting is the more I'm sounding like her vocally like every time I sing everyone talks about how much

I sound like my mum and the last time I performed like I basically started a foundation in my mum's honour in her name and it's called the Melissa Bell Foundation and we raise money for underprivileged kids to attend Sylvia Young School because it's a school that my mum wanted to send me to so badly, but we couldn't afford to. So we've already put four kids through school and then the pandemic happened so we couldn't do last year. And then this year we're trying to do other things for kids through my mum's foundation.

But my mum believes in the younger generation and wanted to make the younger generation big. And she always believed that there was potential in every child. So she started doing lessons and stuff. I built her a studio in her house. She started doing vocal technique lessons, singing lessons in her own garage, which was a studio in the house that we have in Islington. So what we've done as the foundation is we're just carrying it on. That's so cool. And for anyone who doesn't know, Sylvia Young is a stage school, isn't it? That's yes. Is that the right terminology? Yeah, it's a stage school and they are one of the best.

And Sylvia Young herself is a remarkable woman. And it's just an honour to be able to get kids that wouldn't ever have the opportunity to go there to be able to experience it. And one of the kids, Tafari far rise his name we put him through the summer scholarship the foundation paid for everything and he got handpicked by sylvia and he now attends that school full-time he got a scholarship a full-time scholarship and it's amazing so my mum's legacy is still living on because we're trying to help the younger generation fulfill their dreams and to become something within the arts and it's beautiful because that's what my mum would have wanted

do you mind my asking do you have a relationship with your dad i do i do thank god i do i do it's only been the past 12 years just before i won x factor my mum and dad weren't in a very good place and i remember sitting him down at 19 before it went live on live tv and I said to him right dad I'm going to be on this show called The X Factor and I have every intention of being in there for as long as I can be in there and if that's the case I need you to be a part of this family again and I need you and mummy to make up and I never will forget sitting there in my mum's kitchen and my mum kind of like arms folded tutting and going oh Alex really it's never gonna work and me going no mum I can make this work and I remember sitting down with

the kids and with my dad and I just said to him and he won't mind me saying this because it's what's changed all our relationship I remember sitting there saying to him dad I don't need you anymore I'm 19 Shanice my older sister doesn't need you anymore David my older brother we don't need you anymore my younger brother Aaron needs you he's at the right age to still need his father and it would be great if we could work as a team and you could just be a dad that actually communicates and I know your mum always argued but we want you guys to be friends so you need to do it before x-factor and he said so when does it air I went three days and he looked at me and went okay well there we go i'm gonna step up to that plate and he did and he did and we have a beautiful

relationship my mum and my dad had a great relationship in the last maybe five years of her life maybe a bit more it took some time because my mum was a very stubborn woman bless her but she came around and i never forget the day when i sat in my living room and i because my mum was a very stubborn woman, bless her. But she came around. And I'll never forget the day when I sat in my living room and I saw my mum and dad talking. And they're going on and nattering about when they were in love in Jamaica when they were younger. And they were laughing. And I'll never forget that day because I remember going to myself,

this nearly wasn't achieved. And I was just so pleased that when she went, that they were on great terms, beautiful terms. Yeah. All because of you. Well done, you. Well, I tried. Stepping up to the plate there.

Thank you. Your final failure really feeds into actually everything we've been talking about, which is your failure to put yourself first. And I wonder if that stems from a belief that it's a bit indulgent, almost like self-care. We all think of kind of a bubble bath, but actually it's quite, it goes deeper than that. But is that why you struggled with it? Yeah, I've really struggled with it because of guilt. I'm such a giver and I love to give. Like I said earlier earlier I love to love I love everything about talking to strangers wanting to help people like my dream and I know this sounds really stupid and I used to say this to my mum when I was younger she said you know what's your dream Alex and I used to go

I just want to save the world I just want to save everyone she used to sit down and go well I actually can't do that and I used to say to a book i can try i can try like i can really try and like you know i'll be up even down to last night when i was watching the news and seeing about the free school meals straight away i emailed islington council and i was like well how can my mum's foundation help and how can we provide tablets for children and how can we you know provide school meals and how can we pay for this and I've not had an email back yet so they're going to get a call but my point is the urge in me to want to help others is always there the urge in me to want to help myself is not there it makes me feel guilty for even taking five minutes to myself and doing therapy and having my beautiful life coach she's taught me about giving time to myself

and so when I was you know talking to her weekly I used to say well this is me giving back because I've invested in myself to help myself mentally and you're helping me and she goes oh yeah but it's more than that you need to have a little list so I've created a little top-up list that when I'm feeling low I have this little list and I'll just, you know, pick at something, whether it be a bubble bath or whether it be dancing need to learn the power in saying no the power in saying I'm really sorry I can't or not even being apologetic for it I've been told just by saying I can't do that and when I can or if I can I'll let you know and I those words don't fall naturally out of my mouth so I'm learning to be kinder to myself, not judge myself so much, you know, be gentle with myself. And it's a learning curve. And I haven't mastered it yet. I really haven't.

I'm still in the beginning stages of figuring it all out, really. Do you think what you're doing in some ways is learning how to parent yourself? parent yourself oh so okay right yes i say yes because you know what since my mom not being here i've been so lost she was the one that i would turn to for decisions for advice shoulder to cry on everything and since her not being here i have my auntie but i don't want to burden her i have my dad i don't wish to burden him i have my siblings i don't wish to burden them i have my best friend sitting right next to me i don't wish to burden her so in a way i'm just trying to figure it all out yeah just trying to take each day figure it out like figure this thing called life out without her without my mum and how have you managed to say no more if indeed you have because that is something that I completely understand is a struggle.

It's a struggle. I think since doing the show that I told you about in October, now it's become a little bit easier, to be honest with you. It's become a little bit easier, yeah. And to the point where I spoke to one of my friends, Sabrina, the other day on FaceTime, we had a love con, about a four-hour catch-up, as you do. And she said to me, because I hadn't filled her in about anything, and she said, about a four hour catch up as you do. And she said to me, because I hadn't filled her in about anything. And she said, God, there's something really different about you. You seem way more together. Your head seems clearer. And I said, really? She

goes, yeah. And I said, I feel it. She goes, something in you has switched where you're not tolerating certain things anymore. And I went, has something has really switched and those eight days have made it easier for me to go no I can't no sorry I can't I can't do that because it's either not for me or something doesn't feel right or actually I can't for example be in this moment in this relationship right now because I'm worth more. Yes. Yes, Alex. That's why I'm so excited for you. No, that's yes. You're single by choice because you have acquired enough data about what you are now worth. And the only person you're going to get into a relationship with next is going to be someone who meets you at your level because you're putting that out there now because that's your owning

your own power and I'm so proud of you yeah for doing that thank you so much and it feels good and I know that I was saying I'm lost about my mum and I'm always going to be lost about my mum to an extent but I felt a certain strength in the past three months that no one could take that from me and I'm working on myself with my life coach I'm working me. And I'm working on myself with my life coach. I'm working on saying no. I'm working on myself health-wise because I want diabetes to stop with me in my life now, like in my family, because it's hereditary

or everything we've gone through. Every woman has died of kidney failure in our family. And I want it to stop with me. I want it to stop. I want to break that chain. And I'm determined to be the healthiest I can be be as mentally strong as I can be and be happy and know my worth and know that I won't stand for anything less than greatness I won't stand for anything less than happiness I won't stand for anything less than joy, passion, love, and being vulnerable. That's okay. And I'm allowed to be, and I can show some weakness at times and not feel like it's shameful.

And you know what? When somebody wants to commit to me the way I will commit to them, because I give everything in a relationship with the next person that God brings to me, which may be two, five years from now, who knows? I'm happy to wait knows I'm happy to wait I'm happy to wait because I want that trust I want that love I want everything that comes with a beautiful relationship and yes there'll be ups and downs and that's fine but when you're a team and your best friends you can conquer life together 100% I mean I want to go out with you, so. Let's go. Let's do it. We can, as soon as it's all over, we're going out. I know.

Honestly, like having heard you talk over the last hour, I cannot wait for your next album. I just feel like clearly you're going to put a lot of this in that, as you always do. Yeah, I will do. And that's going to be exciting. I will do. And I won't be afraid to open up and I won't be afraid to be myself.

And you know what? Talking to you, you've made me actually open my eyes up to a lot of things. Because sometimes, you know, you can think about these things and talk about it in your own head and not actually physically speak it out loud. And certain things that we've just addressed today, you've given me some strength, Elizabeth. So thank you. Thank you. Alexandra Burke. I cannot thank you

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