How To Fail With Elizabeth Day - S8, Ep4 How to Fail: Scarlett Moffatt

Episode Date: June 24, 2020

Scarlett Moffatt was working at the checkout in Asda when she and he family got the chance to be on Channel 4's Gogglebox. She rapidly became the show's break-out star with her brilliant one-liners. Television fame followed - she co-presented with Ant and Dec, won 2016's I'm A Celebrity and now hosts the official podcast for Rupaul’s Drag Race UK. But with her overnight celebrity also came increased scrutiny and criticism. She joins me to talk about becoming an accidental famous person and dealing with online abuse (she will now reply to trolls with the phone number for the Samaritans). Scarlett also discusses her shifting relationship with body image and her own struggles with anxiety and low self-worth. This is a woman who has worked hard all her life - from her first job at 14, putting sweets into Pic n' Mix to being employed in sales at the Carphone Warehouse. When she went on I'm A Celebrity, she had only just managed to clear her student overdraft. With the fee she was given from that show, Scarlett paid off the mortgage on her parents' house. She talks to me about the value of hard graft, being bullied at school, a bicycle accident that left her with Bell's Palsy and using humour as a defence mechanism. This episode also contains what is quite possibly the greatest Tom Hardy anecdote you will ever hear.Thank you Scarlett, you are an absolute gem. Those school bullies were wrong about you. They always are.*I've written a new book! Failosophy: A Handbook For When Things Go Wrong is out in October. It's a practical, inspirational and reassuring guide to the seven principles of failure I've developed since doing this podcast. Packed full of contributions from loads of former guests, as well as listener stories, it is also beautifully illustrated by Paul Blow and I would love it if you wanted to pre-order a signed copy here.*You can listen to Scarlett hosting Rupaul's Drag Race UK: The Podcast here.*How To Fail With Elizabeth Day is hosted by Elizabeth Day, produced by Naomi Mantin and Chris Sharp. We love hearing from you! To contact us, email [e-mail]* Social Media:Elizabeth Day @elizabdayScarlett Moffatt @scarlettmoffattHow To Fail @howtofailpod      Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by card, other conditions apply. Just a note before we start, this season of How to Fail with Elizabeth Day was recorded remotely under lockdown. Health, wellness and maintenance of mind are so important right now. Personally, doing a bit of yoga every Saturday morning has made me feel more chill than I do the rest of the week. But I found that what

you wear can really make a difference to getting you into that headspace. And the brand that always gets me there is Sweaty Betty. I first discovered them at university when a friend of mine actually called me Sweaty Betty, because when I work out, I do actually sweat, I don't glow and I fell in love with the brand because it is so long-lasting and durable. The quality of their product makes me feel empowered and strong and the brand itself is all about love of movement but it doesn't take itself too seriously and Sweaty Betty is a big believer in balance which is something we all need in current times. I would love for you to try Sweaty Betty and to have the same experience as me so for a limited time you

can use the code howtofail or one word for 15% off. I highly recommend their power leggings which when I'm allowed out of the house is what I wear for spinning because they are so hard working and they give you a second skin feeling and a high stretch and they come in dozens of different prints and colorways. So thank you so, so much to Sweaty Betty Day, the podcast that celebrates the things that haven't gone right. This is a podcast about learning from our mistakes and understanding that why we fail ultimately makes us stronger. Because learning how to fail in life actually means learning how to succeed better. I'm your

host, author and journalist Elizabeth Day, and every week I'll be asking a new interviewee what they've learned from failure. Scarlett Moffat is an accidental famous person. In her early 20s, she was working as a checkout operator in Asda in her hometown of Bishop Auckland when a friend told her about a new television program called Gogglebox. She thought she might as well try out for it because, as she recalled thinking at the time, it's 50 quid and a free takeaway. What's the worst that could happen? Scarlett became a breakout star with her hilarious one-liners and no-nonsense put-downs. Her ascent was swift. Two years later,

she won 2016's I'm a Celebrity, Get Me Out of Here, and she went on to present on Ant & Dec's Saturday Night Takeaway. Her authenticity on screen and her honesty about her flaws brought her love and criticism in equal measure. She recently revealed she had once called the Samaritans after online trolls sent her abusive messages about everything from her weight to her teeth. Before I went on Gogglebox, I could never have imagined how hard it is for women in the public eye, she said. I thought celebrities lived in a different world. But one of Scarlett's undoubted qualities is her resilience. She now hosts the official podcast for RuPaul's Drag Race UK, has over 2 million followers on Instagram, and is widely acknowledged

to be one of the nicest, most down-to-earth people you could ever hope to encounter. She wrote me the loveliest email about appearing on How to Fail, including not three, but six failures I could choose from. And if that's not a mark of true generosity, then I don't know what is. Scarlett Moffat, welcome to How to Fail. Oh, thank you for that. Oh my God. Do you know what? Because I am a massive fan, I feel like I've imagined what my introduction would be and that was that was lovely thank you was it okay did it live up to expectation

it really did thank you I should have said that as my ringtone now I loved that you referred in a recent interview to your tv career as being like going to the university of television is that how it is that how it feels yeah because I feel like without even realizing when I was on Gogglebox I was constantly critiquing the TV and realizing like sort of what I liked what I didn't like and yeah it felt like in such a short space of time, I just was sort of like doing everything. So I was sort of doing like location filming and filming in my house. Then I was doing shiny jazz hand studio floor filming. And it did feel like, wow, this is crazy. I know you don't live with your parents, Mark and Betty, anymore, but do you still, as a family, gather around to watch TV?

Oh, we are like the Georgie Von Trapps. It is ridiculous how much time we spend. That's like a massive thing for me because for some reason it's seen as uncool to spend time with your parents, but they're the people that always have your back. My mum is the funniest, most sarcastic person I know, to spend time with your parents but they're the people that always have your back like my mom is the funniest most sarcastic person I know so they're just the people I like to spend all my time with really. And did you imagine that Gogglebox would be the launching pad for your

career in this way or was it a complete surprise? Because it was sort of a favour to a friend. It wasn't like I ever set out to sort of be on this fame bus, so to speak. It still doesn't feel real. And now I just feel like that tiny opportunity that I said yes to has just completely catapulted my life into a different place to where I know that it would have been. And are you grateful for it or are there times when you wish that it hadn't happened? Do you know what every day and I think even when I've had bad days which some days are for you like not getting out of bed as well I just think look at what you've done and I do feel grateful every day and I sort of have a little bit of imposter syndrome sometimes I'm like when is this all going end? I'm going to get found out soon.

They're going to realize I'm not a proper TV presenter and I've got no actual skills. But then equally, I'm like, I just have fun. I'm so happy to be doing the work that I'm doing. And I get really excited because I still live up north. I live just in a little village near Durham. And I get on the train to London and I feel a bit like Miley Cyrus you know when she's Hannah Montana like she's got the best

of both worlds when I'm up north I'm sort of in me wellies walking my dog up the fields and then I go down London and I'm in studios and I get to go to premieres and stuff. It's really cool. It's good. Is it important for you to still live up north, to keep your feet on the ground, to use a massive cliche, but how important is that just from a mental health perspective? Yeah, I feel it's a time to just have a break. When I lived in London,

although it is such an amazing, amazing city and my dad calls it the centre of the universe, even though you're surrounded by a lot of people, I did feel quite lonely. I sort of felt like I didn't quite fit in. I think because it is quite showbiz and everybody's very career-orientated, and I sort of am not like that.

I know that's strange because of the job that I've got, but I just wing life, really. So it's nice to be able to come home and just pop around my friend's house. Most of them finish work at half five, so we get to go for tea whenever we want. When I lived in London, I used to say to my friends, oh, should we go out for food? And they'd be like, yeah, yeah. And then they'd get the calendars out and be like, oh, I'm free next Wednesday,

or I'm free a week on Tuesday. And I'd like oh no I'm in now. One of the failures that you sent me it was your failure at your maths GCSE but you said that that failure actually led you onto Gogglebox so tell us how that happened. Yeah so I was quite academic at school I got good grades I sort of again winged life my mum was like you need to stay in and actually study and I did I've just got a really good memory I feel like I look at something once and then I'm like oh I've remembered that but maths you can't really wing maths you've got to actually know how to add up and do fractions and all of that so I did it twice at secondary school my maths GCSEs failed miserably but I knew I wanted to go to university so I had to retake it at college and there was only six of us in the class one of those people was Tommy

Turnbull which I know is a fantastic name best Best name ever. It's like something out of like a Disney book. Circus ringmaster. And welcome Tommy Turnbull. And we got to become friends and weirdly lost contact at uni like everybody does. And I went on a night out in Darlington and bumped into Tommy and I was like oh how's your maths going we just made some Pythagoras jokes and stuff and then like was happy that we both got into university and he said oh I'm a researcher now and I was like oh what are you researching thinking he was a detective or something but that's like a tv term which I didn't realize and he said oh I'm trying to find and cast people for this show called

Gogglebox I went oh what's that he said you watch the telly and I went yeah and he went no no that's it you just watch the telly I was like oh my god they'll make programs about absolutely anything now that sounds shite I literally said that sounds so shite and then Tommy was like you know quite a lot of people like do you know any families that will do it so I rang so many people and no one wanted to do it and Tommy was like will you and your mom and dad just do it because it's just to make it look like I'm doing my job properly and then before you know it the camera crew was there they showed us like photos of celebrities and we had to speak about them me and my dad got into an argument because I thought David Cameron was Piers Morgan okay I got really confused with the pictures I don't know why because they don't really look

that similar but I was going off on a tangent and then yeah the next day Gogglebox called studio Lambert and were like would really like you on the show. And it was my dad that was like, oh, what's the worst that could happen? £50 and a free takeaway. And I was like, yeah, you're right, actually, it'll be fun, won't it? And that's the beginning, really. And when you were doing Gogglebox, were you still working at Asda during the days? Oh, what job did I have then? I think actually, I was working at the three-star you know the mobile phone shop which was inside a super drug I think that was the job that I had then and then maybe I went back to Asda I've had that many jobs that's actually also one of your one of your six radius it's all a

blur but yeah I had a nine to five job and when I knew I was going to go into the jungle and I'm a celebrity, I actually was working in an office. My name was sort of in speculation in the newspapers. People were coming up to me going, Scarlett, are you going in the jungle? It says in the sun that you're going in the jungle. I was like, well, no, I'm sat here. Of course I'm not. I'm processing all of this data.

Yeah, I'm not going in the jungle. And all the time, I knew for about eight months processing all of this data. Yeah. I'm not going in the jungle and all the time. I knew for about eight months that I was going in. It was so surreal. That reminds me of the amazing actress, Vicky McLeor, who's been on this podcast. And she said that when she was in Shane Meadows' This is England, which is what made her super famous. She had a day job back home in Nottingham as I think it was like a fire warden safety lecturer and she would have people recognize her because I think what lots of people don't realize is that you can't make a living being a celebrity from day one can you we did Gogglebox I think I did it for three and a half years. And it was just for fun. It was sort of a

side thing. We all still needed to go to work and everything for it. Yeah. And you've described yourself a couple of times now as someone who wings life. So did you ever have a clear career plan or was it a lot more like, I will just take whatever job comes along? along well I went to university to become a primary school teacher and although I do like kids not that much I realized quite quickly 30 of them every day it's quite difficult yeah hats off to teachers because even just planning lessons is so time consuming. So that was the plan, to be honest with you. The plan was always to be a primary school teacher.

It's just so difficult to get jobs as well, especially at the time there was like a recession on. I live up north, so it was quite difficult to get a job. So at that point, I was sort of just taking any job I could to make ends meet, really. I think when I went in the jungle I was finally out of my overdraft right because I just was living in my overdraft since I started university really I want to get on to I'm a celebrity but tell us because it is one of your failures about all the jobs that you had in your from the age of 14 to 21 you said yeah my dad's always told us that you know you only get out of life what you put in always had jobs it's just I found them really

difficult to keep hold of I just get really bored my first job was putting the sweets in pick and mix bags which is difficult when you're not allowed to eat the sweets. So difficult. Imagine being 14 and just being surrounded by cola bottles and fizzy strawberries knowing that you can't touch any of them. It was like torture. Then I worked in retail. I worked in Topshop, Burton's, Oasis. I worked on a checkout at Asda which was my favourite job. I can't explain how fun.

Stressful but what a fun job you got to meet so many lovely people it was nice because there was a couple of oldies the little silver foxes that would come in and sometimes you'd be the only person that they would see during the week so it was really nice because I'd make a massive effort to I'd sometimes get in trouble for that actually because I'd talk for quite a long time to people and they'd be like come on Scarlett hurry up I worked as a shop girl I've worked behind bars handing out flyers I was a qualitative analysis in university I don't even know what that is but fine it's just data it's just which weirdly I'm not very good at maths so I don't know how

I winged that job in fact I do I got my friend Sian to actually write my CV for me so that's probably why phone shops but I did actually the phone shop one is funny because I mean I was only 22 at the time so this is why I'm blaming my young age on this story but I actually quit dressed as a builder so my wait explain that again so my friend it was her 21st birthday and she wanted to go to York or saw dressed as builders like hard hats high viz and then they just wouldn't let me have the day off and I was like please it's my friend's 21st she's never going to get this first day again and I just decided to go and I rocked up dressed as a build and I was like I'm really sorry but if you're not going to let me have it off I'm going to have to quit and they

were like right well I guess you're done and I was like I guess I am and then I just walked out with my hivers on. Was it a good birthday? Yeah it was was worth it to be fair. Great. And you also did three seasons abroad in Magaluf. What did that entail? Yeah, that was an eye opener. I feel like I'm from a little village and my friend lived over there. She actually was an au pair and she was like, come over. It's really nice. She lived in Parma and over. So I stayed with her and then it was a bit wild it was a bit wild I feel like even though I went to university I was still quite sheltered I think because I went to York University it wasn't the wildest of places but people just leave their inhibitions at home when they go on holiday it's like rules don't apply so we use some kind of tool rep or just sold shots literally and sometimes we even

sold shots in places that didn't even have a bar so me and my friend Ali would go to the local shop and we would buy they were sort of shots in test tubes and we'd just go we'd just go around hotels and hand out the test tube shots that's amazing because what you describe it as a failure but actually the way that you're talking about it what strikes me is how entrepreneurial you are the like alan sugar i was like the alan sugar of magalov 100 but also the fact that you have grafted all of your life and you have found work when potentially that was quite difficult and you're not proud about the kind of work that you do is it very important for you the value of work yeah since I can remember

my mum and dad have just like work they left the house early I'd go to my nanny's to take me to school at half seven in the morning and then they'd come back at six on a night and I just think it does give you a real sense of achievement like being 14 and I know it was only £3.50 at the end it was only an hour's work but that first ever £3.50 that was put in my hand and I was like no one can tell me what to spend this money on this is my money I earned it that's just a lovely feeling and I feel like that's something that's just stayed with us and I feel like that's something that's just stayed with us and I enjoy that it's not even about the amount that you're in I think it's just that sense of achievement really and do you think that you're someone so I often think okay if everything went

wrong for me and I lost everything and I lost my work what would I do and I sort of draw up strategies for the worst case scenario and I feel like maybe I'm kidding myself would I do and I sort of draw up strategies for the worst case scenario and I feel like maybe I'm kidding myself but I feel like I'm someone who could attempt at least to try and find some kind of work like I don't mind what I do really do you think you're that kind of person as well that you would find a way through yeah I just think there was a thing recently in the paper I think it was a woman that worked on Emmerdale and she was sort of between jobs and then she got a job working as a security guard at B&M and she was getting grief over it and I was like hang on she's going to work you

can never ever put someone down for going to work whatever that job is they add into society they're helping someone has to do all of the jobs so yeah I wouldn't really be bothered really I'd find the fun in whatever I find it fascinating that you said there that when you went on I'm a celebrity you finally cleared your overdraft and I know that part of the appeal of I'm a celebrity for the contestants is not not just eating kangaroo testicles but it is the feed that you get. Do you think, having experience of being paid £3.50, working as a checkout operator in Asda, that the money in television and in celebrity is kind of mad and out of whack? Yeah, I don't even think on the scale of what people get paid on I'm a Celebrity I definitely wasn't up there on the sort of the pay scale but I used the money to just pay my mum and dad's

mortgage off because I was like how else are you ever going to get that amount of money it is crazy and I think the current sort of situation that we're in now you realize sort of how ridiculous certain jobs are paid when there's people risking their lives like my boyfriend's a police officer I've got friends who are nurses and doctors and it is insane just tell me a bit about I'm a Celebrity because I adored you on I'm a Celebrity it's actually the last full series that I watched and I watched it because of you and I was so thrilled that you won because you were so authentic and so yourself and just a star but what was it like? I mean I really enjoyed it I think I'm the only person I was talking to Depp about this and he's like I'm sure that you are the only person that enjoyed

all of it I think because I was just so grateful to be there and when people were moaning I was like come on man like how many people would want to be in this position and I just sort of treated it like a detox spa you know you're living off natural food you're sleeping under the stars yeah you've got a pop a kangaroo bollock in your mouth every now and then but there is actually worse things to be fair but I think for me I just was really happy to be there and sat with people like Larry Lamb and he and his stories and having Carol Vorderman wash my hair I just embraced every minute really. Are you still friends with some of your co-stars yes do you know what we are actually all friends so we still have a whatsapp group

called the jungle chat and yeah we try and go to each other's events so like safe jordan's got a diversity tour coming up we'll all try and go and watch him or sam when she's doing all of her sports chat we try and do things so it is nice and when Larry was back on Gavin and Stacey we were all chatting about that so it's nice yeah we all support each other which is good. Do you ever get starstruck Scarlett? Do you know what I used to I feel like I used to piss my knickers really sometimes I'll be like oh my god I think the time where I really freaked out was when Tom Hardy came up to me and said oh Charlotte can I have a photo and I went shut up yeah and I went what really loud and he was like can I have a photo and I went

yeah do you want me to take a photo of you and he was like no of you and he was like me and Charlotte watched you in the jungle and we loved you on Gogglebox and I was like what you watched telly I think I was just shocked that Tom Hardy watched the TV and then it was it Alan Carr's chatting man and his agent came in and said oh Tom would like your number he said like you're really nice and him and Charlotte would like you to come round and play chess or play board games or go for food one time I was like chess that was the invitation okay random but fine yeah I mean it's with Tom Hardy and Charlotte so I was like yeah whatever tiddlywinks I'm up for whatever and so I passed my number on and he texted me like oh this is

Tom's number and I was like oh my god I then took a photo of my outfit because my mum asked me to send a photo of an outfit and I accidentally sent it to Tom when he was in the next room and I was I literally started crying like no I was so mortified I was like I've ruined it I've ruined my chance of becoming friends with him. I start crying. And he then sent the photo back doing the exact same pose as me in the mirror saying, whoops, was meant to send that to my mum too. I was like, oh, yes. He saved my embarrassment.

So, but no, I feel like now, I was so lucky doing Ant and Dec Saturday Night Takeaway. I got to meet so many amazing people. And you slowly realize that actually everyone is just human you can still admire people and really enjoy the work that they do and admire the talent but yeah i think i've learned now that everyone's just just a person did you ever go around to tom hardy's house for chests well we actually weirdly went to Disneyland Paris so him and Charlotte and two little ones and me my dad my little sister and my cousin and yeah

they did like Jedi training together and stuff that's the sweetest thing I've ever heard it was fun crazy but fun oh I love that, we'll come back to present day, but I just want to take you back in time because one of your failures and the one that we're going to talk about now is that you were in an accident when you were 11. And I know that it had a long lasting impact on your life. So tell us what happened.

Yeah, so my mum was saying that she was going to my auntie's house and to be honest I learned how to ride a bike quite late in life I was always a little bit scared of bikes so I feel like inside me was like don't get on a bike it's like I always knew and I was 11 and I said oh can I come round and I'll bring my bike and mum was like oh don't bring the bike she even told me not to bring it and I was like you know a tweenager I was like I know better I'll bring my bike and as I was riding round there was a boy racer in a car swathed around the corner really fast and bumped the back of my bike and I just literally went flying off my bike.

Do you know, I didn't actually have a helmet on. So I feel so lucky that all that happened is I sort of split my chin open and I smashed all my front teeth and they were my adult teeth. I have never felt pain. Like it literally felt like my teeth had went through my gums. And I remember just running in my auntie's house and just, I had my favorite Tammy girl top on and I remember just running in my auntie's house and just I had my favorite Tammy girl top on and it was just covered in blood and my mom was just screaming and my friends

outside were picking shards of my teeth up taking it to my mom like here's some of the teeth and yeah I got like an emergency dentist appointment there wasn't really a lot they could do because I was so young and my gums were still like moving and around and everything they had to take the nerve out of my teeth which meant that I had my front teeth were black and there was literally nothing they could do about it because I couldn't have nerves in my teeth so you can imagine I wasn't the prettiest of kids anyway I mean I had a proper mono brow I could eat an apple through a letter box anyway with my teeth and then going into school and having these little black teeth and dentistry

wasn't what it was back the same as now so when I did eventually get caps I sort of looked like I had polystyrene teeth I mean I can laugh about it now but it is one of those sad times because I look back now and things like I mean I never smiled so I have no photos with my great grandma Frida who sadly passed away I have no photos with her smiling which really upsets me now because I think oh it's so vain to think even at 11 I was so self-conscious because I got called back but I've never been on a bike since I still to this day have failed to get back on a bike it fills me with massive dread I feel like I've probably got some like PTSD around it but yeah I just can't get back on one is that why you chose it as a failure because

you wish that you hadn't cared as much although it's such a hard age though not to care because it is the age when you're 11 it is the age when people are just seeking ways to differentiate themselves and also seeking a way to like be comfortable in a tribe of people who look the same as you so it's a nightmare yeah and shortly after that honestly I had sort of a bit of bad luck really, because I got Bell's palsy. They think it was probably off the trauma of that. So it's sort of where the half of your face doesn't move. It's not like having a stroke, but it sort of has the visual effects of having a stroke, which is why now my face isn't like perfectly symmetrical but I'm not bothered about it now but at the time it was so horrific I felt like I didn't really play out anymore and and I sort of just become

a bit of a recluse really Jacqueline Wilson the author soon became my best friend that I felt like Tracy Beaker and the illustrated mum were were like my actual friends I know that sounds sad but books were like a massive help for me as a teen but I think what I learned from sort of never getting back on a bike again was it's sort of all right to fail sometimes you just fail at stuff and you've just got to accept it. Like, I think there's so much pressure in. I could have easily just got back on my bike, literally, not even metaphorically, literally could have just got back on my bike and rode off into the sunset. But I just didn't.

But I've done plenty of things that I'm proud of since. So I don't worry about it anymore. Do you think that those years of feeling like you didn't want to go out and feeling like a bit of a recluse taught you a lot about compassion because you were a very compassionate person and I wonder if that's because you felt like a bit of an outsider? Oh thank you yeah I think so I mean I did get bullied because of it and my dad always always said to me, bullies are like sandpaper. The more they wear you down, the more polished you become. And I think that's really true.

And I just would never want anybody to feel how I felt. And I think that's maybe why, I'm not a comedian, but I try and make people laugh. Because I think laughter is the best medicine. And I think if you can make people laugh and have a giggle you sort of forget about your worries really so I think that whole time did really mold me into the person I've become now and also I mean the only people I lived with at the time because my little sister wasn't born till I was 16 was my mum and dad so they did become my best friends and still are and I think that's why we

have such a good relationship and people can see that through things like Gogglebox and when we did the British Tribe Next Door and things. You talk there about humour and you are exceptionally funny but there is there is that old saying like if I don't laugh I'll cry and I wonder if you think that you developed humor as a kind of defense mechanism because massively yeah oh great carry on massively I mean at 11 I started watching things like bottom the young ones Norman wisdom will here so I feel like I've always been this old lady trapped in a young person's body if I was calling myself then no one else could really hurt us like if someone was to say oh look at the state of your eyebrows I'd be like god I know I'd give Helga Pataki a run for her money no one can say

anything to that no one can have a comeback for that because there's nothing else to say it same as when my little sister started secondary school I said oh look if anyone starts calling me just join in like don't feel like you have to defend this because that was my biggest fear that she would get picked on and especially because of like my job and things I was like I hope people aren't nasty to her because of me day one it happened and it never happened again because some kids said to her and oh your sister's stupid da da da and Ava just went god you think you know you want to try living with her she's a nightmare like no one said anything after that because there's nothing to say really so yeah humor is a good defense mechanism and this is a very very weighted question for all women but particularly women in the public eye how do you feel about the way that you look now having grown out of that phase of awkwardness

having got the caps on your teeth and now living in a world where you are kind of publicly recognized how do you feel about it I feel like over the past I would only say six months I feel like I own my body again I know that sounds really bizarre but I just sort of felt a little bit like I was always on the outside looking in I felt like I didn't really own me anymore because everything's publicized and everyone has an opinion on how I look. I felt like I was getting my hair done for other people. I was really picking out outfits thinking, right, will this get slated? Will people call me for this? Have I got too much on show? Have I got too little? I'd really overthink things constantly.

And I sort of just kept wearing bland things all the time and stopped wearing fake tan and stuff because I just thought don't do anything to sort of get attention about the way that I look whereas now I just think that's so stupid I am who I am if I want to wear eyelashes that are so heavy I have to tip my head back to open my eyes then I can if I'm like a size 16 and all that like in today's standards that's not the norm so to speak and I just think well I'm really happy what I see when I look in the mirror I like and I go to the gym and I work out and everything but equally I also like pizza so I just don't judge myself as much anymore and I don't even think just for sort of people who are bigger I just think it's just hard being a woman whoever

and whatever shape or size you are because I just feel like I wish the papers would just come out and say this is the perfect size you will not get called any names or trolled if you were this size but it frustrates me because a lot of the time it's women writing this stuff and it's like no let's big each other up let's not put each other down because it gives everyone else an excuse to well I think you're absolutely gorgeous and thank you I think it's very interesting that you use that phrase that you feel like you own your own body again. And I totally get it because women in the public eye have their bodies owned by comments made by other people. There's such an objectification that it almost feels sometimes

that the woman herself exists separately from her physical body. And I know that you have been on a long, long journey with this, but how have you got to the stage of acceptance? What was it that made a difference for you? I honestly think actually it is my little sister, because my little sister's 30 now. Sorry if I cry at this, I will really try not to. sister's 30 now sorry if I cry at this I will really try not to but a few months ago I went into a room I was like oh what are you doing and she was looking at herself and she went oh I have hip dips and I was like what the hell are hip dips and she said oh it's where your hips go out further than your legs my little sister is so slim she's really slim and And I just thought, oh my God, I can show her that I'm bothered by what people think because it really, really upsets us. And I just thought, well, that's probably what

my mum feels when I'm pulling myself to bits as well. And I just thought, that's awful. I don't want my little sister to feel like that. I don't want my mum to feel like that. And so I started giving myself compliments every day, which I did feel a bit of a wanker doing it. Like I'd wake up and I'd be like, oh, your legs look nice today, Scarlett. And I'd even laugh. But the more I did it, I just felt really better about myself.

And even now I'll do stupid things like I'll put a TikTok dance on and I'm having such a laugh doing it. And people will come and say like, oh, you've piled weight on, you look fat. And I'm having such a laugh doing it and people will come and say like oh you've piled weight on you look fat and I'm like if that's what you're getting from watching that you need to find a hobby or just hug someone because I actually feel sorry for people that feel like they have to put others down now I've started if I get a troll on Instagram I've actually started inboxing people giving them

the number for the Samaritans and saying like you know everything's going to be all right because I think I have never been in a place where I felt the need to comment on another person's picture slating the way that they look so I can't even imagine what state of mind they are to do that to think that that's sane so yeah I've started just sending people the number for Samaritans has anyone ever replied to you yeah do you know what every person and they've always apologized and said you know like oh I'm really sorry and like I'm not happy and a lot of them say they're not happy with themselves and that's why they do it because I just say like why are you doing this like what are you gaining from calling me names? I'm aware that I'm not this.

Like, it's like when people comment saying you've put weight on it and I'll just comment back saying, I know. Like, I buy my own clothes. I have to buy a size up now. Or like, I have mirrors in my house. So I'm well aware. Like, if you think that that's hurting me, it's not. And I think that's what I've done.

I've sort of spun the comments around. So I used to see your comments saying like you're really ugly and I used to look at my face and be like oh god yeah they're right and then now I'm like well that's just your opinion so now I just I don't overthink anything anymore and I do read comments because I sort of went off reading comments for a little bit but then you miss the good things as well so I've started reading the comments again too. for a little bit but then you miss the good things as well so I've started reading the comments again too. You mentioned the Samaritans there and I talked in the introduction about how you got to a point with all this where you called the Samaritans yourself using a fake name what got

you to that point? Yeah I just felt it was like a really sort of hard time where it didn't matter what I'd done what I achieved or if I did a show that I was really proud of or you know just something that I was really proud of it would just get spun into the way that I looked really and I was just getting trolled so bad and it got to the point where I didn't even want to go outside I didn't want to do any work so I was like god I'm just from this tiny village. I just feel like the luckiest person that I've been given these opportunities. And I think because no one sort of prepares you. So when I was crowned queen of the jungle,

I didn't realize at the time that that was the peak. No one sort of warns you. Like the only way to go when you're at the top is to go down and I think I rapidly felt that I was like oh okay so you don't just get good press all the time and you don't just get good comments all the time there is sort of a negative side to all of this and I think I just really let it get on top of us and I didn't want to tell my mom because I didn't want to upset her. And it got to the point where I was like, I just don't want to go outside.

What do I do? I sort of felt like I wanted to disappear, but I didn't know how. And so I just kept ringing the Samaritans and it really helped actually. It's weird because it's speaking to a stranger. So you feel like you can just offload and no one's judging you.

Yeah, it really really helped and then I actually got the courage to tell my mom and to seek professional help with speaking to a therapist and I do meditation now which is something I never thought I would do like I never ever thought that I would meditate I think because I just always assumed that it was for hippies but it's not it really really helps so if anyone does feel a little bit crazy especially during times like this meditation massively helps you just put a perspective on life and it just makes you see more clearly I read somewhere that when people go on love island, you will quite often message them and say,

I'm here for you if it all gets too much. Is that true? Yeah. I just feel like, especially with reality shows like Love Island, because it's a massive amount of fame, like it's crazy fame when they get out, everyone knows them. There's been stories in the paper of the past. And I just wish sort of I had someone when I came out of the jungle to say, this is normal. So I just felt like I could sort of do my bit by messaging them. And then they knew that the help was there if they needed it. And I was just like, look, here's my number. If ever anything gets a bit much or you think, is this the norm or what do I do?

Then I'm a safe space. You can say whatever to us do you think there needs to be more support for people who go on reality tv after they come off I feel like it really should happen before I feel like it would be nice to think that they were really sat down and someone explained to them this is how it could go because I think especially when you're younger you feel like once I'm on TV then my life's sorted but then no one sort of says when work slows down or you know if you're perceived in a bad way you know not everybody is perceived in the best light that of them or people you know struggle during stressful situations where they've been filmed constantly so I feel like yeah it would be good to say like these are all the positives but equally

are you prepared mentally for if it goes wrong because then I feel like people would really sit down and think right is it worth it and I know that you knew Caroline Flack and I also was lucky enough to meet her and she was an absolutely lovely person and yeah I was horrified by her death and I wondered how it had affected you and what you think if anything can be taken from that tragic loss yeah I message Caroline just keep checking saying like hope you're all right and things and weirdly now I still even sort of send love heart emojis to her I know that now because of the current situation with the horrific corona virus sort of the be kind campaign has gone a little bit quiet. But I would like to think that when life goes back to normality, people really choose the words wisely and people

don't just jump on a bandwagon. I feel like social media allows people to voice opinions. And I just think that's fine. We're all entitled to opinions but I think if it's a negative one and it really affects someone you don't have to put it out there I think if I have an opinion of a program and I think oh that's not very good obviously on Gogglebox I'd say oh that's not very good but I wouldn't sit and go oh well her eyes aren't very nice or she's a bit fat like because that's got nothing to do with anything. I think it's fine. What's up in your friends and saying like,

oh, Scarlett's put a bit of beef on. That's fine. But you don't feel the need to actually at that person on Instagram and say those things. Just keep them in your head or voice them with your friends and family. I think when you're getting it from all angles, if you're getting grief from the press and online and Twitter and social media, and there's nowhere to go, it's just so sad that people feel like there's no escape.

And I just really hope that people choose the words wisely and they're just all a bit kind. I just feel like life would be so much easier for us all if we were just a little bit kinder yeah thank you thank you for saying that your final failure is related to that I think and it's your failure to fit in and you talk about how as a child you had lots of different phases so tell us about the phases all to the expense of my mum and dad bless them going to work using their hard earned money to change the first thing that I was think in the space of a year I tried to put myself in the chav box because there was lots of popular kids who were sort of chavs we say up north it was like this sort of cult of wearing Fred Perry and Timbaland boots and going to raves,

which I hated. The boots were so heavy and you had to dance around bopping away. It was so tiring. I hated the music. I just kept making excuses to go to the toilet all the time. I'd just sit on the toilet just to get away from the headbanging music and then I realized that yeah I couldn't do that for much longer so then I sort of went in the pop princess box I got my mom to get me this really oversized fake fur coat that I wore with brown cowboy boots with a silver heel and it had orange diamantes all over it it was horrific and I'd wear sort of spray-on jeans they were that tight like I remember just lying on my bed trying to button them up I think one time actually just safety pinned them because they just would not fasten

at all and listen to Aqua, Barbie Girl, Dr. Jones things things like that. Realized that wasn't me either. Then joined the emo crew, which was an interesting phase. And we would go into this wood place called the barrier and all just sit and tell sad stories and horror stories and wear a lot of eyeliner. And I just realized that I just wasn't born really to fit in with any particular crowd and so I just sort of did my own thing and it didn't mean that I was a bit of a loner for a while like I'd go metal detecting and I was really into conspiracy theory so I'd tell people at school about aliens and Roswell and crop circles and stuff and you know before you knew it I actually had my own circle of friends and Sarah we've been friends since school now since we were

like 14 and I'm godmother to her little boy and we lived together at university and yeah we've been friends like god 17 years now which is nice and I would never have become friends with it if I hadn't have just realized that I failed miserably to fit in and it's best just to be yourself and how much has RuPaul's Drag Race reaffirmed that message for you that actually it's not about fitting in as you say it's about finding the truest version of yourself as Ru would say if you can't love yourself how the hell you're gonna love anybody else Actually, it's not about fitting in. As you say, it's about finding the truest version of yourself. As Ru would say, if you can't love yourself, how the hell are you going to love anybody else?

Yeah, I just love RuPaul's Drag Race. I feel like whoever you are, you watch that and you just instantly feel part of something. If you don't feel like you belong anywhere, you watch that and you're like, oh, you realise that you don't have to belong in a particular type of box you can just be you and they're the things that make us unique and that actually people love the most because it would be boring if we were all the same I love everything that RuPaul's Drag Race stands for you can just be the weirdest best version of yourself and be unapologetic about it which I've started to be

now it's just took a while it's just took 29 years to be fair you're only 30 so I don't think it's taken you that long well well I'm not 30 till October so I'm sorry I'm so sorry you don't have to apologize you don't it's these lines on this forest no it's not at all and you just said 29 years there and I just totally ignored you because I'd read somewhere that you were 30. So what date in October, Scarlett? 17th of October.

I'm a Libra. And are you going to have a big party? Well, hopefully. It depends sort of what happens. Oh yeah, because we're talking during lockdown. So we're recording this remotely. Yeah. But all being well,

hopefully you'll have a big party. hopefully a huge one go on holiday somewhere even if it's butlins I don't mind just to be away with my friends would be nice go back to Magaluf sell some testy yeah sounds good Scarlett you've been so lovely about this podcast. And I just wonder whether I could ask you quite a big question about failure, which is what you think your failures have taught you? Oh, that is a big one, isn't it? I feel like just to be unapologetically myself, I've just learned in life, you realize as you get older, again, that is very cliche, in life you realize as you get older again that is a very cliche but you just care less like I just really care less about what people think and as long as you're kind you don't have to worry about anything else that's all that matters as long as you know you're a kind person then the rest just

wing it that is the best place I could possibly hope to end on. Scarlett Moffat, unapologetically yourself, you are a complete dream. I'm so, so grateful that you came on this podcast and spoke with such humour and insight into the human condition and long may you reign. Thank you so, so, so, so much. Oh, thank you so much. I can take this off my bucket list now thank you. Health wellness and maintenance of mind are so important right now personally doing a bit of yoga every Saturday morning has made me feel more chill than I do the rest of the week but I found that what you wear can really make a difference to getting you into that head space. And the brand that always gets me there is Sweaty Betty. I first discovered them at university when a friend of mine actually called me Sweaty Betty, because when I work out, I do actually

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