If I Speak - 87: I’m losing interest in my fiancée. Should she make more effort?

Episode Date: November 4, 2025

Come and see us live on 25th November in Manchester with special guest Lanre Bakare, author of We Were There! Tickets are available now from Contact Theatre. Inspired by a famous pop psychology quiz, Moya and Ash tackle a quiz about the culture that shaped them, from celebrity crushes to memorable quotes. Plus: advice for […]

Hello and welcome to, actually, let's be real, a really stressed out edition of if I speak. Both me and you have got the cortisol and the adrenaline and, and, Like, Moyer looks gorgeous, but I have some real, like, that's not makeup under my eyes. That is pure sleep deprivation. To cover the sleep deprivation. Oh, guys, your girls going through it. Your girls are going through it. We've got individually, stress is galore.

I don't understand. Why is everything always happening at once, as horse e-bucks once said? I, so, right, I mean, the thing I'm going to say is that I'm not ready to bring my stress to the pod yet because it literally just happened. It involves other people's experiences. And so I don't want to get all into that until I'm sort of certain that things like are a bit settled. But I'm fine. Everyone is going to be fine. It's fine. In terms of like why does everything happen at once? I was thinking about this when when everything was going down the other night. And I was just like, this is just adulthood. Like, adulthood is a box of problems and it's problem

whack a mole and you whack one problem on the head and the other one's like, surprise, bitch, you know, I thought you see the last of me, but a bit of a, I just think that's what it's like. And this would be an interesting sort of podcast theme in itself. I cannot think enough to provide an answer right now, but how do you carve out time for fun and play when life is problem whack-a-mole? There's no fun and play right now. I know that life is wack-mole because I've shut down all the fun-and-play stuff and I can't engage with it until the stress is sorted. I'm in bunker mode, as I'm sure you are too. Yeah. I've got to go bunker because it's like until these fundamental building blocks are sorted?

You know when it gets to the point where, like, what if I just gave it all up and moved to the late district? And then you remember you can't drive, so that's actually not an option. But I would be there if I could drive by now, because honestly, why is everything so stressful? Okay.

And because of that, we're going to have a light episode. We're going to have a really lovely light episode. This is what I was going to say. which is that like when I was sort of stress texting the if I speak WhatsApp group to be like this thing's going on and I'm not sure how long it's going to take or if it's going to end in catastrophe or if everything's going to be fine. Moja was like I will do a fun episode and it's a different kind of episode it's structured really differently from what we normally do so that for me by the way was like what the fuck just felt that was that moosa I'm not going to you know

what, different problem. I'm not getting into it. Not my, not my monkeys, not my circus. This is my monkeys, this is my circus, but sometimes just don't look at the monkey. Don't look at it, don't look at it, okay, right. Just wait till the monkey's got its little claws in your face. You don't need to look at it or engage with it before then. Okay, right. But when you were like, oh, I've got a fun episode idea, for me, that was like seeing the helicopter rope ladder descending down. I was filled with such gratitude. Yeah, I was, I thought, you know what?

Sometimes we have to do episodes where we're trying to think of like cool and original things to say. And not always do we need to have cool and original things today. And sometimes we can instead do what I've got plans. Should I reveal it? Boom, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum. Which is a quiz, but a slight twist on a quiz. It's actually, so I basically, and I will admit, I had the help of chat GPT. Oh, le schach.

Le schach, Mr. Scha. But only in like four, like coming up with kind of questions, then I tailored them because I was like, I can't adapt on my own, well, I could, but tell me bloody ages. So, you know 36 questions that lead to love? No, I do not. What? Ash, this is like 101 shit.

This 2015 cod psychology, TikTok, getting to know you, like now they love it. This is before TikTok, but TikTok would go crazy for it. So, 2015, I wasn't into COD psychology at all. I was just into uppers and vibes cartel. That was what I was doing. I feel like you were probably reading a lot of political theory as well, though. Yeah, in between.

Yeah. So I wasn't. I was doing nonsense shit. So it was actually probably 2016. So anyway, 36 questions that lead to love. It originally started out, I think, as some sort of study. I think it was a psychological study. Yeah, but then the New York Times.

Yeah, 2015, 9th of January, 2015, the day everything changed. So it started some sort of study, I believe, based on a modern love essay. And it was, this modern love essay was about how this study is basically meant to see if you can create intimacy between two strangers, right, by asking them the 30. questions and the person the modern love essay did it with someone and then started dating them I think they broke up but the point was this essay went viral because it's like wow these 36 questions do lead to love and then obviously the new york times published the 36 questions and since then they have become a staple in fast-tracking intimacy and i used to play them at

afters I used to play them at afters when everyone was very vulnerable and they probably did fast-track intimacy but so did all the other stuff we were doing and it wasn't lasting. I'll tell you that for sure. But they are really fun to do

so long as you're doing it with like a friend. If you try and do them with a new romantic partner I do think it just creates a crazy vibe where either it's really awkward or you get in too fast, too deep. I don't think you can fast-tracking to see. However, I have adapted these with the Halpertrach TBT for a culture.

Culture, 36, questions. But there's initially like 15 because we don't have like loads of time. I have extras. I have extras. But we're doing it, instead we're doing a culture slash music, get to know, Ash. But then you will also be answering the questions.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'll chime on some. But we want to, I'm going to do it so that we can discuss more about the formative pieces of culture that shaped you. Incredible. Incredible. Incredible. Which I thought, you know, you'll have lots to say about, bring back some interesting memories and you won't have to come up with some grand new theory about how we relate to another person. Thank God.

Thank God. And because we're doing questions, I don't think we need to do ice breakers. Let's just jump into it. Let's just go to the fucking question. this is this is the um you know in a tv show where they have a set sort of like format and then one episode just goes rogue and follows like one character for the entire episode yes and it's always heralded as the best of the season because it's broken with the traditional format this is this is that episode so this is this is forks you know this is whatever forks is

what's forks it's the episode from the bear where you follow richie when he's polishing I don't watch the bear. I don't watch the bear. I don't watch the bear. But yeah, sure. Or it's the episode from industry that I can't remember. Anyway, right, without further ado, this is what ChattyPutee is called my quiz.

The Pop Culture Connection Quiz. 30 questions to learn someone's story. Do what they love. Question one. This is also the 36 questions in stages. So you get like the light ones and then you get the heavier ones and then you get the really deep ones.

however I have adapted this so it's not really crazy okay question one what was the first TV show you remember being obsessed with obsessed um okay I have lots of like TV show memories so I can remember there was a TV show which was like some kind of dating game and the men and the women would line up by a swimming pool and then someone would come down the steps to some music which was like bop bap bop bop bop bop bop bop and then they would push the ones that they didn't like into the pool now I wasn't obsessed but I definitely saw that when I was like four or something

and in terms of obsession I have to watch this and if I don't watch this I'll you know picture fit it was probably Buffy the Vampire Slayer which was on BBC 2 really it was on BBC 2 and it was after the Fresh Prince and the Simpsons, and then you would get Buffy. The Simpsons was on BBC 2? It was on BBC 2 back in the day.

I remember being on Channel 4. Before it was on Channel 4, it was on BBC 2. And so that was such a hot trio. Yeah, I mean, there's three years, but those three years, I was talking about this with my partner. We were talking about listening to music as a teenager. And he was convinced that the Libertines were putting out music in like the 90s. And I was like, no, it was just earlier in the indie period, which for you feels like it was, you know, decades and decades ago.

But it was only like three years before the Arctic Monkeys. And he was just like, no, no, no. Yeah, it was like 2000, what, four? 2002 was up the bracket. And then 2005 was whatever people say I am. But skipping ahead, right? The thing I'm saying is that. Those years feel so compressed.

So the difference between it being on BBC 2 and BBC, and Channel 4 feels like huge. But it's not. So yeah, probably Buffy. What impact do you think that had on you? Buffy being a formative, obsessed piece of culture. One is that it probably trained me to speak in a really irritating way when I was a kid because I was trying to emulate the sort of quippiness. I did that with Gilmore Girls.

Joss Whedon, the evil you have done in this world. And he's done a lot of evil And he's done a lot of evil And the second thing was What did it do? I think the quippiness was the main impact What about you? What was your first TV show?

My first TV show that was obsessed with Probably the Teletubbies No, what was I really obsessed with that? I can remember There's one that I still talk about to this day That I was really obsessed with And it was a children's TV show I was obsessed with a lot by the way

I loved Mona the vampire That was it Okay so the song Which was like Mona the vampire Hey Mona Show us your fangs Hey Mona That was a real classic obviously

Rugrats Love that shit down Rugrats so great I also really liked What was the other one that was similar to Rugrats I liked things where children were treated with respect as adults. When they existed in adult, like, they had adult worlds.

And that was the funny thing about Mone and the Vampire because a lot of the time they were in these, like, sort of, in their minds, they're like living in an adult world, doing adult things. Not like big adult, which is a weird movie. But like being treated with like respect. And then they're reminded that actually they're just children and humbled, humbled accordingly. but there was a comedy show

that I still talk about to this day that was so formative I need to check if there's a comedy question coming up because I think there might be yeah and this goes for another question later but I'll talk about now called stupid and it was a sketch show

it was a sketch show it was on BBC One it's called Stupid and it was good for one season and that one season was when they had Marcus Briggsstock the comedian playing King Stupid and he was a king who could make people do stupid things on earth

but the sketches were really funny and sharp and they had like it was like a Pixar movie in the sense that they had adult themes so for example one of the sketches was about a scoutmaster who'd got divorced and he would always get the scout boys to go and harass the fancy man as he called him which is the guy that his ex-wife

hooked up with and they'd be getting their like scout badges and throwing bricks through his window and then there was really stupid people were like devil finger which is where this kid had this kid had his finger and they'd press a button and he'd be like I can't control it like don't look at it and he'd be like devil finger and start poking which is the stupidest thing in the world made me and my sister die and then one day met a person called had cow bite but it was a lot of stuff where they were just doing like really ridiculous things but there was also like sharp dry ironic human mixed in with it which is my perfect perfect mix of

humor. So that was really, but no one, no one remembers that's that, that's sketchy, but it was one series. One series. The thing is, before, before Buffy, I was a casual viewer of like children's stuff, right? So you'd watch it because it was on. So Mona the vampire, Arthur. Arthur was great. Arthur was great. Arthur, phenomenal, phenomenal. And also, I really loved Francine. She was so down to earth, of course. And then you had, and her with Miffy, was it Miffy, yeah, Miffy. Muffy. Muffy was a perfect parent, because it was like so many of us had the more spoiled but ultimately golden-hearted best friend. And then you were like the hard, the hard, not like,

no, we can't do that stubborn but also soft in the middle. I really love that. Yeah, yeah. Arthur, so great. But it was only with Buffy that I remember going, I'm following the plot over a series. That was the first time I had that experience. When you're like actually plugged into a narrative arc

rather than stand-line episodes. Right, this is a music question. If your life had a theme song today, what would it be? You know, okay, I'm talking about how I feel right now in this exact moment. You know, in that episode of industry, white mischief. Oh, and Rishi is in the club, and it's really stressful because he's got all that money, which could be... This is his standalone episode. And it's his standalone episode.

And they use a song which has got, I think it's by Algiers, and it's got vocals from Zach Delo Rocha, and it's so stressful. I know what you're talking about, but I wouldn't have known it like out there. But yes, yes, yes. It's like such an intensely stressful song.

Like, I can't listen to it because it reminds me of how I felt watching that episode of industry. Which is so stressful. I think right now, if you're, because I don't think my life has a theme song. There are lots of songs which like, make me feel like it's an expression of the exact point in time that I am.

Like when I was, when I did question time the other week, I was listening to Shinskay Nakamura's entrance music to like get myself really hyped. And I was like, yes, I am Shinske Nakamura. Your left field choices are amazing. Because these are like, this is like a real head's choices. These are like, I mean, this is like proper shit, as opposed to what I would think. This is how my brain really works. This isn't how, like, oh, how do I want to present myself to other people?

It's like, no, I was listening to Shinskaynaka Mirro's entrance music. But that super stressful song is where I am right now. What about you? Okay, well, I'm going to do my whole life. And they both, both these, one of these songs is like less egotistical than the other. But one of them is the one that really my ear, I do feel. Yeah. So the less egotistical one is hand in my pocket by Alanis Marissa.

I got one hand in my pocket. The other is playing about people. But she's like, I'm drunk, but I'm sober. I'm poor, but I'm kind. Love it. I'm shod that I'm healthy. Yeah. Oh.

She's got pipes. She has, but also Alainz Monsonsov actually very easy to sing karaoke. Because she always sings, she sings low. She sings in a belt. so when you're singing like ironic it's like that's really not that high and ditto hand in my pocket

when she goes yeah it's literally just like yeah yeah like it's not a hard one to do and the other... Okay it's not hard for you but you can actually sing no no no no I can't sing high I'm like a contra alto and I fuck my voice from like belting when I'm younger so I can't get very high I've got a very limited range which is the same thing that I think Taylor Swift suffers from Katie Perry also

actually got a surprising limited range which is why she sounds bad lie but she's trained her voice up um other people who sing really low adele she can go falsetto she can belt a little bit but she's got her nodes which mess up her voice and she's actually a lower singer than you think there's a lot of singers out there who don't have like huge amount of range anyway alanis morissette perfect karaoke song what's the big one that she has that i always do at karaoke it's not handed my pocket it's the other one it's not ironic no it's the scratches down my back you ought to know you want to know that that that core sounds like you'd be really hard to do it's not at all because it's a mid-range just

belt you can actually just yell it anyway there's a little tip for you the second song hand in my pocket the second song listeners i'm sorry the second song is successful by ariana grande the second song is successful by ariana grande how does it go the lyrics go it feels so good to be this young and have this fun and be successful And it's actually the most egotistical, sort of like, oh, it's so good. I'm so like, I've got everything I want, blah, blah, blah. But it's kind of how I feel a lot of the time, even though I've gone about being stressed and I go on about being busy and all this thing.

It's like, it is the ultimate girl boss song, I'm afraid to say, and it is like pure Cheryl Sandberg lean in. It's not a song that puts me in a pretty light. It's not a song that makes me sound particularly like a good person. But it is a song every time I hear it, I think, wow, I feel. feel that I'm, like, deeply in the fibre of my bones. I get that with, um, Kendrick's verse on like that. And there's a particular, there's a particular bar where he's like,

think I won't drop the location. I still got PTSD. And I was like, yeah, that's me. Like, I'll drop the location. I've got PTSD, but also it's just big me. It's just big me. It's just big me. Sometimes, yeah.

See, I got a theme song out of you that wasn't just like, oh, stress. It's like, sometimes we do, if you're in the public, you probably have a bit of ego and there's probably songs that play up to that. Sorry. 100% There's guys

and you guys will have it too if you tell us your theme song send them in I want to know your theme song I want to know your theme song right next question who was your childhood celebrity crush and ChachyPT has added no judgment

but I refute that deeply there's judgment here The first the first person to whom I entertained feelings of desire or romance was Aladdin.

No, so get that. Me too. Right there. As fine as a man can be without nipples. Yeah. Oh, a sensational animated character. Fuck the Robin Hood fox situation.

I was all up on Aladdin. I had taste from it early. Like, yes, well done. Yes. Taste. Who was your first, shall we say, like human, like non-animated person? Um, actual human.

I know who my sexual awakenings were. because I remember them really distinctly. And I ask this question to a lot of people, like, who was your sexual awakenings? One was Robbie Williams peeling his skin off in Rock DJ? You're like, he a freak. Yeah, he a freak.

Oh, another one, and this is where I think I get some of my queer bank allegations from, but I do think everyone exists on like a queer spectrum and queerness is more about, about how you choose to practice it in your life, et cetera, et cetera. And unfortunately, as I'm not practicing, a practicing queer person. I don't claim it. But an early indicator of latent queerness, et cetera,

was one of my key sexual awakenings was reading about Melby having a threesome, a lesbian threesome. Oh, and you were like, God damn. And I was like, what are these feelings? What is this? Hasn't yet manifested into anything particular. But I definitely, I have an inklings and leanings. I just haven't enacted any.

I acted on my inklings and let me say it was very disappointing. No, I mean, I've tried. Oh, I've had a go. I mean, it hasn't like, the inklings that I get from reading and watching haven't actually, when it happens in real life, when I've had a go, a real go, like a proper go, haven't come to fruition. And that could just be the person, that could be the time, I don't know. I think that there is something about, especially like,

kids who are like quite bookish and developed these like very very rich inner lives and like worlds of imagination and stories and blah blah that like there exists an aspect of your sexuality which is only ever interior and it's like really like rich and detailed and nuance but the point is is that like it can never exist in reality and I think it's because like maybe you you experience so much of your form. years through books and culture that like you sort of primed your brain to be an erogenous zone you know what I mean and it's just that actually makes so much sense as well when you think about how many of our emotions we experience in our heads rather than our bodies so maybe

once I unlock feeling things then we can get it down with the persuade but maybe not who knows maybe maybe not who knows all to play for but yeah I don't remember if I had a proper celebrity a childhood crush. I think Aladdin's a great one. I think my first non-animated one was, and real heads will know, young Jeff Hardy. Who? That has a reminder of Jeff Goldblum.

Google. I'm Googling right now. Young Jeff Hardy. No. You really were a wrestling fan, won't you? I loved wrestling. I'm getting it. Okay, okay.

I'm getting it. And his special move was jumping off of ladders. I'm not going for me. I'm like, every time I like climb a ladder these days to like change. a light bulb or something, I hear the theme music in my head. His special move was just like full on jumping off ladders. Yeah, he's cute. He's cute.

Who else does I fancy? He's kind of, he's not cute for me, but I think he is, I can see the appeal. Yeah, yeah, it's like 1997 Jeff Hardy. Like, it's not, it's not any later than that. I think I did just fancy a lot of men in boy bands. I know for a fact that I like, also I know the way that I sublinated how I fancy people. Like, I fancied Harry Stiles so much when I was like. Really?

Yeah, loads. and then he got famous in one direction and I stopped fancying him as soon as they got really big because I was like, he's out for my league. He's too looking for me, which is what I do with men now. When I'm like...

I never fancied anyone in boy bands. Like that just, that never happened. That's because you're cool. You're fancy wrestlers. I fancied wrestlers. I also fancied boys in bands. So Julian Casablancus from the strokes, actually the entirety of the strokes.

God damn. Alex Turner definitely for me. Kelly from Block Party. I fancied Will. Oh yeah, he was hot. Good food. Sadly, obviously not batting our way, but very hot. That's fine.

I definitely fancied Will Smith. Freshman, I was on a lot. Yeah, but also he was because he was really funny. It was like gangly and funny. Yeah, it wasn't even the funny so much. He was just like, yeah, maybe it was the funny. Who else did I really fancy? I fancied.

I didn't fancy. see Duncan. I fancied Simon out of blue. Oh, Simon. He was a male model. He was gorgeous. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He was gorgeous. Um, I'm trying to, because I remember just who I fancied in my teen years. And I remember, and I remember, from Milan. No, I'd never watch Milan. Did you know, I never watched Milan. What? Moulin's fucking great. Captain from Moulon is like, you know, Captain, Aladdin, Aladdin for the streets, Captain from Moulon for your parents. He has a wrestler build as well. He's very big shoulders, right? Yeah, yeah. That would make shoulder yeah i'm i think i remember when like i don't have a type per se but i remember when

an archetype that i particularly like started kicking in around my teen years and its platonic form was initially robert sheenan oh i know exactly what you're talking about um rascals so funny no no rascals it's it was rascals with troubled rascals who are so fucking funny um And also with the dark curly hair. You know that there are going to be, there's going to be some people listening to this podcast who's hearing, like, you go, I like troubled rascals who are kind of funny

and they're going to be like, it's me. Well, then, DMs are going to be a light. They're never a light. And I'm, this is actually something bad that's happened this year particularly. Where are the funny men? Where are the funny men gone? Where are they, they're all in relationships.

They're already hooting up a storm. They've met their person to heat with. But I've, I'm not, I'm not getting, laughs, guys. I don't need a partner of decided. I just want to laugh. I want to laugh. Just want to laugh. Anyway, I've got another question. Right. Next question. Right. Right. Number four, what movie have you watched more times than you can count? Battle of Alge's. Can you actually tell us a bit more about this and when you first saw it? Right. What is it for people who don't know? Because, like, me, I don't really know what it is.

Battle of Algiers is an incredible film by Gilo Ponticovo. And it is about literally the Battle of Algiers and the urban guerrilla warfare that was undertaken by the FLN who were fighting for Algerian independence. And what is so incredible about it is that one, the face of the actor who plays the lead Ali LaPont is incredible. He has the most made for screen face and a sort of broken boxer's nose, completely captivating. Two, it shows the sort of shape of a movement and all these different people getting involved. And my favourite sequence in the entire film is when there are three women who take bombs into

three different locations. So one is like an airline office, one is a cafe and one is the milk bar. And it first starts out as women looking at themselves in the mirror and, like, getting ready. And it's done with, like, such love and, like, a little bit of eroticism. And then you realize what it is they're getting ready for. And they put the bombs in their bags and they go and do this thing. I could talk about Battle of Algiers for fucking ages. But the other thing that I love about it is that Ali Le Pont gets radicalized in prison

when he sees an Algerian freedom fighter be executed by the French. And he's executed by a guillotine. And when the guillotine comes down, that's swosh. it kicks off the plot of the film and there's something about that in the way in which then the politics of the film and the guillotine being the engine

of this like political revolution in the way that it then mirrors what happened in France in the 18th century is for me spectacular, spectacular filmmaking. I remember watching it for the first time and being like, I've just seen my favorite movie. How old were you?

Like when did you? in my 20s, in my 20s. Okay, so old enough to like really absorb what it was, you were sick. Old enough to really, really absorb it. But it totally took me by surprise. Like, I wasn't expecting to feel about it the way that I did.

So I've seen that film more times than I can count. So you know when fucking Leonardo de Caprio and off that after another is like, I can't believe he's watching that? I was like, it's me. I, because I, obviously that didn't really sink in for me, shows I'm not a proper revolutionary at all. Well, I've never claimed to be.

but that shows you are died in the world built in the spirit of revolution the fact that that is literally your favorite film it's my favorite film but that feels like such a cliche especially now it's like in one battle after another I'm like oh people are going to think I'm just hey I do that I do that when do you watch it like when wait when do you watch the film like when do you come back to it oh man like um so I watch it when I just feel like my sense of of political purpose needs a bit of a shot in the arm. I watch it when there's like big news stories. I watch it when I'm ill.

I watch it when someone says, oh, I've never seen Battle of Algiers. I'll be like, I'm showing it to you. I like re-watch it with a particular friend of mine and we get really, really drunk. Like, there is never, if at any point you got asked you want to watch Battle of Algiers, my answer is yes.

I'm really thinking we should do like an if I speak, Barbenheimer. because the film I will say for the one like watching countless times could not be more barbenheimer compared because mine is pride and prejudice 2005 so we're doing what the battle of prejudice so we have to do the battle of prejudice where it's like and I have to watch your film I think because I think I do need like a battle of Algiers education which pride and Prejudice? 2005.

So this is Kira Knightley. This is Kira Knightley and Matthew McFadden because I, you were always attached to the Pride and Prejudice adaptation that you see first. And my mum took me to see that when I was, I came up to 2005. I must have been 10. 10. And she also gave me the book when I was 12. So she was immediately like, read it as well.

And as you read it more when you get older and it gets funnier and funnier. And now I'm like, yeah, it does. It's so jokes. I'm like, oh my God, this is so funny. But back then, obviously, the first thing that I knew about Prime Pressure was the visual because that's the easiest to take in as a child, and it's just really stuck with me. It's so romantic. It's so romantic. They don't kiss, which is amazing. You have bewitched me. Body and soul.

Body and soul. I love you. Most ardently. Most ardently. The last time I watched that, I did a screening for my friends who hadn't seen it, just like you did with the Battle of Algiers. and we watched it and at one point

I just put my bowl of crumble down and I went I can't do hinge anymore I was like I can't everyone just everyone was hooting because it was like such a raw I can't do it anymore but the other thing I love about that

is it's so countryside and obviously I'm a country nowse and I think the sin Joe Wright is a genius for cinematography he had a real run in the early naughties with like Prime Prejudice Atonement and the beauty of the colours

he uses and the way like the dual tone of kira nightly's green dress in atonement oh oh the colors the paleness of sir charion and her pale-based dresses as a child like that fading into the background oh it's the flashlight of the horrible benedict cumberbatch's face in the dark in that one really really traumatized scene oh my god the way he communicates through like color and setting is just fantastic but the fact that private is in the country obviously i deeply identify with Lizzie Bennett, the way that you deeply identify with the revolutionary protagonist, the battle of Algiers. But she's a country mouse in that, and she's in Beat District,

which I went to Standage Edge and I stood on it, not just for Prime Prentices, we were up there, but like, oh, I fucking love it. I love it. You fucking love it. I fucking love it. Anyway, next question. Next question. Right. Ooh, what music did your mother play or your family when you were growing up.

Oh, I mean, this is a great one. So I understand it better now I'm older as well. So there were different elements of it. So one was when my mom was a single mom, so this was between the ages of one and 11 for me. Like they couldn't go out clubbing. So her and my aunties, so I'm doing quotation marks for people listening, which basically means ethnic minority women of a certain age,

who you are not related to. Like, they would have these parties where, like, they would put on, like, an incredible spread. There'd be a huge crystal bowl of rum punch, which was, like, the Holy Grail, because as kids, you'd, like, sneak, you'd have to wait until everyone was distracted or you could sneak down and have some, because it was so sweet. How pissed did you get? We were fucking gone.

Because that stuff's lethal. So, so lethal. It's like Ray and Nephew and Mount Gay and, like, every. thing. Like there was more than one kind of rum in there and it was so, so sweet. And there would be a division between the upstairs and the downstairs. So the upstairs was the kid's domain, right? So we would be playing Gold and I, like Mario Car, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, winner stays on. That was the rule. And my, he wasn't my blood cousin, but he was like a cousin to me. He unfortunately passed away a couple of years ago called a Bonner. He had decks and he was the

first person I ever knew who both had decks and was into UK garage. So he would be playing like bound for the reload like over and over and over. Is that where you got your garage education? That's where I got my garage education was up in a Bonner's room with him on the decks and when we were like playing golden eye and shit. And then downstairs it was Odyssey and Parliament and Marvin Gay As in like Native New York Odyssey Yeah Which is one of my creative songs

Ooh And like you'd come down Right so first it would be Kids go upstairs no screaming no bleeding Right It's time for the single moms to have fun But then when you'd come down Because you'd want to like sneak a like sausage roll

Or a samoser or like get the rum punch Then like all the moms are a bit merry So they'd like pick you up And they'd plant like these bronze lipstick kissing on you and stuff and then let go let go I want to go back upstairs um so there was that that was party music so lots of funk lots of soul um and upstairs was yk garage and then in the car my mom would listen to tracy chapman so much and that i now maybe understand what it was she was feeling as like a single mom in her 30s with like just this like work grind and financial pressure

and sort of like going, how can a carve out time to like be a woman and be an adult separate from my kids and listening to Fast Car? Yeah. Which is such a bleak song. I, I got to be on a now and along. But it's like she ends up in the same place at the end.

Yeah. She marries a, it's kind of like the good luck babe of her time because she's like, you end up just marrying this dull man and back in, you know, the supermarket and he's drinking too much. You didn't get out.

The fast car never... Oh, what was it? What was the... What fast car? Body's too old for working. Yeah. I don't look like his. It's like mine's too young or something.

But she's singing... Because at the start she was with these dreams and she marries this guy and then he doesn't live up to the dreams and she's stuck in the suburbs with him. Which sucks. Your mum wasn't stuck in the suburbs. She was in the thick of it with all her friends. So that's actually a nice thing.

She got out. She did get out. But I think that was how she accessed her sense of melancholy. But what about you? What was the... Music growing up? My mum was on the... The Marvin Gay is the middle of our van.

Yeah. And then she was on the... What Marvin Gay, though? Oh, she played all the Marvin Gay. She loved Marvin Gay. I didn't really inherit it until later. Like, I like Marvin Gay, but I hadn't... She's obsessed with him.

So it was like... You have to get a bit older for Marvin Gay to realize the genius of Marvin Gay. cannot be a girl, you must be a woman. Yeah, I think, yeah, you do. But she went to see Marvin Gay loads when she was younger. It's like, when I say she was obsessed with Marvin Gay, she's obsessed with Marvin Gay. And I know my mum listens to the podcast, but she also has said directly to me,

just look at me, like, there is a thing there involving black men. And I have said the words fetish to her before. And she hasn't like denied that there is a leaning, okay? That's the most diplomatic way I'll have a putting on. But she always loved black heritage music from when she was younger, even in the countryside. And then she went to university and she got like her first Caribbean boyfriend. And then it was off the races.

But she saw like Marvin Gay, she saw Bob Marley. She also liked music like Santana. She played a lot of Santana. So growing up, we had Bob Marley, Marvin Gay, Otis Redding, Tina Turner. Also, she was obsessed with Tina Turner. She went to see her on her 2000 tour. to the musical like that was her that was her

Tina's legs that was her yeah my mom fucking loved Tina like when Tina died my mom was the person I called and what else does she play oh Lauren Hill very distinct memory she played Lauren Hill your rhythmic's really distinct memory of those ones because those ones that I

Otis Reging I particularly internalized Lauren Hill I particularly internalized Tina I really like I have a lot of Tina's albums now that I love but like Lauren was my girl. She was like, I was singing to Zion as like a tiny... Oh, Desirene makes me want to get pregnant. It's like, I don't want kids, but to Zyne makes me want to get pregnant.

No, my one was X Factor because as I said to my therapist the other day, when I, I have a memory of like listening to X Factor in the car with my mum and I had like such a clear idea, I was like, just like you had with your mum, I was like, oh, this is how she feels about my dad. like this is how she feels about the situation and I don't know if that's true or not but it was lodged in my head about five years old and didn't leave hasn't left to this day

so I feel very yeah there's like but there's so that album obviously is like an incredible album miseducation and it spanned so many emotions so big cool but yeah my mum really like the Fugees I think she liked Lauren Hill but she loved the Fugis right

ooh this is a fun one which fictional character do you quote the most without thinking. Thomas Cromwell. Oh, so Thomas Cromwell, who is obviously not fictional, but Thomas Cromwell, Hillary Mantell's, all the time. So there's this one moment where him and his dead wife's sister,

so his sister-in-law, who is still married, they have this little interaction and there's some Fruson, and he goes, you know, now there's a conversation I shouldn't have had. And I say it all the time. I'm like, no, there's a conversation I shouldn't have had. Like, in my head, there's a sequence. And I think about this all the time when I think about politics. And I think about the difference between serious political operators and

unserious political operators. And let me find it. Let me find it and read it to you. Because I genuinely think that the Wolf Hall trilogy is the best examination of power and political power. Okay Once you have exhausted the process of negotiation and compromise Once you have fixed on the destruction of an enemy

That destruction must be swift and it must be perfect Before you even glance in his direction You should have his name on a warrant The ports blocked His wife and friends bought His air under your protection His money in your strong room And his dog running to your whistle

Before he wakes in the morning You should have the axe in your hand And that's how I think about politics You should have the axe in your hand You should have the axe in your hand Who's the axe going to fall on though for you right now? Anyone, anyone But this is, okay right

Here's a spicy political take Okay, go This is what I think is wrong with your party And the leadership figures and the operators Is that All of them go off half cocked And they make things public before they're ready they're constantly using these it's i mean it's very um labor in lots of ways

which is they're constantly using supposed principles as a way to express factional beefs with other operators and i'm not saying that conflict is bad or factionalism is bad or you know one side can't you know shouldn't be trying to win over the other i mean that's politics but i'm just like none of you are thomas cromwell none of you are thinking before before i make my move before he wakes in the morning I'll have the axe in my hand. But also just not thinking about a cohesive political operation

that actually has shared policy. It seems like a disparate group of people with very different goals who haven't got enough bridging them to come together to make a real movement for the people and seems like a top-down thing led by people who maybe shouldn't be leading it.

But what do I know? What do I know? My favorite movie is Prime Prejudice, 2005. What's a fictional character you find yourself quoting all the time? Donald Trump. Who, sorry, he's made, he, that, that character, Donald Trump is, did exist at one point as a real breathing human for maybe like 25 years of his life and then he became a

entertainment figure and a fictional character and the Donald Trump who is president of United States is a fictional character. Sorry, I'm down 10 toes on that. Ashley, you have something to say. I have something to say, which is if you watch wrestling, you will understand Donald Trump. and I like if you go back so like one he actually like was involved in wrestling he had a battle of the billionaires with um alleged prolific sex offender Vince McMahon um but two if you so the way he speaks is captivating you cannot help but watch but it is unlike any other political speaker that you know um is famous for being able to hold an audience's

attention and i was trying to work out why that was And then I was doing my thing of like, you know, watching old wrestling promos from like the 80s because that's what I do for fun. And there's a famous one if you look it up. It's if you put it into YouTube, Dusty Rhodes Hard Times promo. When you watch it, you will go, this is how Donald Trump speaks, not the accent, but the cadence and the sort of like whimsical association of like images and way of talking about. other people you go oh you learned to talk from 80s and 90s wrestling yeah that would make so much sense that makes so much sense he's a fictional character and that's so many public figures of fictional characters look at what's her face Lorraine right was it her or was it Colleen I

can't remember which one decided to say that they were fictional character for tax purposes Lorraine Lorene Kelly she's a fictional character for tax purposes um so Donald Trump unfortunately I do quote him what's your favourite Donald Trump quote. This isn't fit into conversation as easily, but it's absolutely how I feel when I'm being perceived. Get those lights up!

Get those lights off! It's too bright. Like, that one is my favorite because when people are looking at me or like perceiving me really deep, but I'm like, get those lights off. That's a huge one.

The one I say the most is many such cases. Oh, many, many such cases. I think I probably say sad. I'm like, sad. Yeah, sad is a big one. Bigly. I use some time to,

I love Bigley. Bigley. Just lots of Trumpisms have made their way into my parlance. There is another character where I only use one phrase, but I have used it a lot. And I noticed myself using it at work the other day, which I talked about on the podcast, Dennis Reynolds. I used from, it's always sunny. Oh, the implication. But I didn't, it wasn't the implication I used.

I realized at work I was like, and then we have to. and I said something about, like, demonstrate value. And I was like, where's that from? What, like, management speaks that from? It's not from management speak. It's from the Dennis system. And I was literally using the Dennis system as a functional thing, a functional thing at work. And it was great.

And it did, it did work, but it was, yeah, it's not great. Not the greatest thing to be using. Anyway, so Dennis Reynolds is supposed to acquitted. Right. I think we've got time for one more question. so you've got to make it your best one. Oh no, don't say that. Maybe I'll do a part two at some point

where I get to these other ones. Let me choose my last one. Okay, no, maybe we've done that. This is too hard, Ash. Now you've done. I'm sorry. What piece of media made you cry in a way that surprised you?

Oh, there's loads. Oh, okay. Sorry, I mean, there's just loads. I mean, like, I do a lot of, What surprised you? What surprised you? Because there's crying and there's being Because I can think of when it surprised me why I cried.

Okay, well I've got one which happened just a couple of weeks ago. So I was in Manchester for the World Transformed and for the closing party a choir sang the Internationale and Palestine youth movement were supposed to sing the song in Arabic. So we're going to go through like lots of different languages.

but because a comrade had been murdered in Gaza that were like, we can't sing. So those lines were just hummed by the choir. And I started crying from the minute people started singing. But then with the humming, I was racked with sobs. I mean, like, my partner had to, like, proper hold on to me because I was, like, shaking and crying. And the reason why I was just, like, so many people have died for our cause. So many, like, thousands, if not millions of names.

nameless comrades and communists died for our cause, which is like the cause of Marxism, and continue to do so and we'll never know their names. But we exist in a relationship, a fellowship with them, even though we don't know them. The Internationale, you know, it's the human race, it really do. I don't think I actually know the International over at well. I've always heard it about it. I've heard it sung like a couple times. I always say Chau Bella sung at the moment.

By like all sides. What's going on there? Oh, so Bella Chow is sort of like, I think it's been appropriated by the right in the sort of like ironic way or like, you know, to call other people fascists. Bella Chow's great. It doesn't make me cry, but I heard a busker doing it

the other day with strings in Glasgow. It's everywhere. That's a really good one. I'm not going to say mine one because my one's too shallow after that. No, go on. Go on, go on, go on. Okay, this is because it surprised me. So I cry all the time at things, okay,

in a way that isn't surprising. I have empathy. I do this. This surprised me. I remember going to see La La Land in 2016. No, 2017 it must have been. And I cried and cried and I was hysterical. And the reason I was hysterical is because I'd taken my then boyfriend to see it.

And my editor had given me tickets to the sort of like first big screening in Lester Square because she couldn't go. It wasn't the premiere, but it was like a big, it was before it came out. And I took my then boyfriend. And the reason I cried and cried and cried is because when I was watching it, I was watching it, and I was thinking, I have to break up with him. Oh. I was thinking, and it really surprised me watching it,

because I hadn't admitted those things to myself, and I hadn't been able to be honest with myself, and I watched it, I thought, he loves jazz, just like the main character. And then I was thinking, and I'm ambitious, and I was just like, our lives are going in different directions. And then I cried, and all the way home, he was like, why are you crying so much?

It's just a movie. And I was like, it's not, they could have made different choices. Yeah, so that's a big one. Okay, that was at least part one of the If I Speak, pop culture connection quiz. I feel that was really fun. I really liked it. You've got to shoot me over the questions and then I can put them to you in a follow.

Okay, I'll give you the other half. Or maybe you can get Chat ChagipT to produce some new ones. See if it does anything different with the same prompt. Well, I'm just going to keep putting it back through, like, chat ChiquetT. And we're going to end up with this sort of like hallucin. massive. It'll be like a, what's it called, a Kronenberg, a word Kronenberg, a wordenberg. A wordenberg. So close, so close and yet so far from anything that could have been a good gag. All right, shall we? Shall we try and like scrape together the last fumes of our energy and put

it through the system for a dilemma? Oh wait, we've got two things to say. Before you even say that, we've got a, you know how you're in Manchester recently? Yeah, and I've really warmed to Manchester, by the way. Tell me about how much you like Manchester, Ash. I, look, I've long had beef with the city of Manchester, but I'm ready to squash it if you are, because I actually think maybe you're really great. I actually really like the Sea of Manchester now.

All it took was the International A, hummed. All it took was the International L.A. I also quite like Manchester, not as much as I like the other cities. like, I really like Sheffield now. Oh, Sheffield's great. I love Sheffield. Lovely.

But keep giving Manchester their flowers, please. Yeah, I like Manchester. I do think that it's interesting the more Manchester becomes Londonified, the more you're like, yeah, Manchester slaps, actually. Yeah, that's fine. I do think Manchester's becoming

sort of like glossily Londonified in the financial model it is pursuing, which is why it's got huge amounts of boom at the moment. Will there be a bust? And if so, who suffers? Just questions I'm asking. Subscribe to the Mill for more. Subscribe to Mill Media.

But it's great you like Manchester, Ash, because we are dragging you to Manchester. On the 25th of November to do a live show. We're doing a live show. And we've got a very special guest. Which you can find out about if you go and click the ticket link. Do you see what that is? That's called what I will say about the special guest is that I um so I heard him speak

because I was on a panel with him over the summer and I just think that he's one of the most astute and diligent and thoughtful readers of British culture and British political culture and British social culture that's currently writing like what a what a dude yes A dude, indeed. A dude indeed. You can find who the dude is. By going to the link in our episode description and buying tickets to our live show

on the 25th of November. We will be at Contact Theatre, Manchester, and there will be a social afterwards. And somebody told me that CMAT is playing next door on the same date. So maybe we'll get CMAT to come along. Who knows? Oh, wow.

The second thing is, at the Manchester live show, We will be selling our bagu, our beautiful capacious bagu. But if you cannot make it, you can buy the bagu by going to navarra.com and there's a special if I speak section where you can purchase the bagu in red or white. And if you purchase enough, we will release them all merch of different types. Right. Ash, problems.

How do we send them in? I'm in big trouble. This is our regular dilemma segment. And if you're in big trouble, small, medium, molecular. vast, send us an email at if I speak at navaramedia.com. That's if I speak at navaramedia.com. And just to say, if you send it in, please do so expecting that it will be read, right? Obviously, we might not get to it because of time, but don't email it as a therapeutic exercise.

Write it as a therapeutic exercise, but do not hit send unless you are ready for it to be read out. May I read it out? Okay. dear ash and moya i come to you humbly to place myself upon the altar of your judgment and i hope i do not become one more reason for moya to hate men i 25m have been dating my fiance 26 f since we were in school which for the majority has been a very happy relationship and last december we got engaged we have had our concerns like any relationship but we have always found a way to speak about our concerns in a constructive way. I couldn't ask for a more emotionally safe and supportive relationship with someone who I consider my best friend as well, as up until recently, the person I could spend the rest of my life with. However, what can I do if the issue I'm having isn't something that the other

person can control? For a little while, I have felt a waning sense of attraction to her, and more worryingly, an increasing interaction to others. For a while, I was able to brush it off as the natural ebb and flow of a long-term relationship, and I've previously bounced back over the few years when I've had these feelings. However, recently I'm struggling to have any strong feelings for them, both in attraction and possibly even love. An example of this is that we haven't had sex more than a couple of times since the end of August, and when we have, I don't feel like I'm enjoying the intimacy with her in the way that I used to. She definitely is missing this, but I always find a way to reason my way out of it. If this was anyone else, I probably, I would probably

know that this isn't right anymore. However, I know that she is amazing in so many other ways. She's intelligent, driven, kind, whilst still being able to bitch about people. She's considered a close friend of all my best friends, but I also think I would be doing us both a disservice to stay with her if I don't feel attracted to her anymore. She deserves to be with someone who loves every part of her, and not someone who is constantly having doubts. As my attraction has waned, I also feel less attached to her emotionally. And I feel like it's, I feel like it's only time until I feel like I'm lying when I tell her I love you. Whilst we aren't looking to get married in the near future, I'm worried that pushing off

these feelings any longer is only going to run the risk of a messier divorce or resentful marriage if I let these feelings go on any longer without addressing them. If I was to intellectualise this lack of attraction, I'd probably say that there's a noticeable lack of effort in the past year. I like to make an effort to look nice, both for myself and for her, but she almost always wears jeans and a t-shirt. I know that this is probably affected by her low body confidence and that she would prefer to be comfortable. When the time she makes the effort to wear something she knows I like becomes fewer and fewer, it compounds with my already waning attraction. She might dress up a bit more for a special event, but that will

rarely be for more, that will very rarely be more than just dinner. If I suggest we go out for drinks just the two of us before or after, she would usually prefer to just go straight home. This has turned our relationship into what feels more of a roommate relationship as we don't seem to date each other anymore. I acknowledge I could be putting in more effort for us to go on dates, which I've been trying to do more of recently, but it still feels like she'd rather be at home eating takeaway and watching YouTube or scrolling TikTok, as she also doesn't seem interested in watching movies and TV shows that I like and think she'd enjoy. I also feel like she makes no effort to look after her health.

While I know that she has a lot of joint pains which make it hard for her to exercise, she also shows no interest in fixing that issue. When I've suggested working out together or go into an exercise class, which would be easier on her body, she doesn't tend to show much interest past the first try, which she often wants to end early. By the way, I think this woman might be me. Oh my God.

This consistent lack of effort to look after herself also makes me worried that it will lead to a downward spiral where her health gets worse, which makes it harder to improve her health and limit. our lives in the future. All that said, I feel a very real lack of attraction and interest when she's being affectionate with me recently, which probably says more than any of my overthinking that I do when I can't sleep. I suppose my question is, am I being shallow? Is it wrong for me to expect both of us to make an effort in looking good for the other person? Am I throwing away a real relationship for cynical reasons? I tend to think that I probably am,

but even if I am, it's probably a good reason to leave anyway, as she deserves someone who loves every part of her. It's loving a person for who they are but getting hung up on the lack of physical attraction, a reasonable issue. When speaking to my best friend who loves us both deeply, they tend to think that I can't help who I'm attracted to. But I felt getting an outsider's perspective on the matter might be helpful as well. I hope you won't judge me too harshly for my straight male bullshit. However, please let me know if I'm worse than a bear. No matter the outcome, I hope to speak about some of these things with her and do everything I can to give this relationship the chance it deserves. If it isn't getting better, I'll probably

suggest we see a relationship therapist because she deserves that much at least. Love the pod. Thanks for reading. A dedicated listener slash chauvinist pig. This is so hard. This is really hard. It's really hard. It's really hard because what this listener is saying but trying to say in a nice

way is that their partners has probably, I'm guessing, their body has changed and they feel like they're not attracted to them the same way. Yeah. Um, but the question is, there's like three questions within that, which is should you leave someone when you're not physically attracted to them for a bit? Um, because do you have any right to say to put that on them and be like, hi, I'm not attracted to you at the moment because your

body has changed? I don't know. I don't, I don't know if we're allowed to do that, but then the thing is like, you either say it or you leave. We're meant to communicate or you leave. Um, the other thing is if they did, if their body did return to whatever it was when you were more attracted to them, would you still be attracted to them? Or is it that you have actually fallen out of love with them? Does it, like if your body changes and you're still in love with someone, does that actually impact it that much? I'm thinking about past relationships where I was with people who sometimes, I guess they're like, let's say, look, I'm just going to say weight would fluctuate a bit. And my weight would sometimes fluctuate, but I guess we're always

like conventionally quite fit, but I would still be attracted to them and still, even when I noticed changes, I was still attracted to them and I was still in love with them. You guys have been together for a very long time as well and you're very young, but I'm a lever. So my instinct is always kind of leave, but I do think you should go to a relationship therapist and work through all the difficult feelings about this because I think the choice you're facing here, either communicate and say, I'm feeling these things and part of it as I'm not physically attractive. That can kill someone. That will ruin their lives and give them a complex so crazy they might not recover for a long time. But then the other thing is you bottle it up.

You know, you're bottling it up and you're not saying anything and then you might just leave without giving a real reason. And you also might regret it if you don't work it through with a third party. You can help you make sense of whether what you're feeling is a blip or something else. I don't know. I'm really, I really don't know. Ash, what do you think? So what I think is this is that Moy is totally right to say that really what you're trying not to say is that your partner's body has changed and you're experiencing a lack of attraction to her and you're worried about getting locked into a relationship that's basically sexless or near to sexless for the rest of your life.

And I actually think that you need to possibly separate some of these things. And I'll tell you why. My body has changed since I first got with my partner. I was 26 when we first met. I'm now 33. My metabolism is different, right? My body is different. And how we, not just how we have sex,

but like what sex is for us has changed as well. So at the start, it's this like crazy, hungry, I can't keep my hands off of you. And you have this urge to show off for your partner. Like really show off. I mean, God, I'd wear matching underwear. Now, God love him if he can get matching socks out of me. But what sex is doing is that it's this, it's an expression of love.

And it's not trying to create in the sort of like white heat of an initial connection, a bond. It's nurturing a bond. It's tending to a bond. It's expressing that bond. It's feeling that bond. It's different. And personally, I really like it when me and him go on dates and we go out for drinks and stuff like that, but not for the purposes of sex, because the minute that enters the frame, it feels a bit pressured.

Dates are time for play, for play and conversation and all the rest of it. But actually, the way in which sex happens is very much within the context of us having created this sense of safety for one another. and I don't know if this is true but I suspect it might be a special one that it is the very sense of safety and the domestic which is for you a turn off at the moment I don't know they've been there for nine years and they've proposed in December

it's I mean look you've been together a really long time but I sort of wonder if like you know in a way in a way when we dress up for our partner, right? Sure, it's signaling, like, hey, I'm dressing up for you, but it's also like, hey, hey, hey, I'm a different person from who I am normally, right? Dressing up is the introduction of novelty. I mean, you said she's always wearing jeans in a t-shirt. Can I just say, jeans and a t-shirt can be the sexiest thing on the planet, right? Like, goddam a jeans and a t-shirt can be the sexiest thing on the planet on men and on women.

Right? And those who fit nigh the category. This is an inclusive. If you've got a baby tea in the right jeans, let me tell you. And I wonder if it's because that seems ordinary to you, right? And you're saying, oh, you're not dressing up enough for me. I think really what that is is like, but there's not the novelty. There's not the newness. There's not you trying to be new for me. You know, like, it's not a given that dressing a bit slubby.

it will kill eroticism, right? Like when I'm wearing like my worst trackies, which are covered in bleach stains and my partner can see my belly. He's like, yes, I can see belly in the schlubby trachies. That's how the eroticism works. So I think that the problem isn't necessarily that her body's changing.

I think it's that the domestic pattern that the two of you have is killing eroticism for both of you. and that's the thing that you need to get to grips with because that's not necessarily always going to happen and I think that a couple's therapist can help you puzzle these things out and help you come to some conclusions

both of you of whether marriage is the right thing for you and whether lifelong commitment between the two of you is the right thing I think you need to think about why you proposed as well like what led you to that decision surely there was something it was only it wasn't even a year ago how can you know is this just a freak out at the prospect of now really putting it into legal a legally binding format even though you've been together for nine years

looking down the barrel of the rest of your life I mean the thing is is that like you know getting engaged does create a kind of crisis like it like it does and I experienced it my partner experienced it. I mean, I was quite surprised because I knew I really wanted it and then it happened and I was like, oh my God, what the fuck? Because you are like going,

what are our lives together and as individuals going to look like? Like I'm carabinering myself to you for eternity. Like, what does this mean? Like, that is a kind of crisis and I think that all couples experience that in some way. but I think that it sounds like your fluctuations in attraction or this feeling of diminished attraction's been going on for a long time

and I do you think that you need to get to grips with it I think the thing you need to remember is that like her body shape can change and it might not fix it and the more you make it about how she dresses or like what she does with her body it might be that that ends up being way more alienating for her in terms of her own sense of eroticism. You know, obviously, doing certain things for your partner

in the form of play, in the form of, like, sexual performance is fun, sexy. But if you're thinking about your body as like, well, if I don't do this, he won't be attracted to me. It's very alienating. And, like, you might have more sex, but she might not enjoy it as much. I'm always like a breakup, but I think you should go to the relationship to therapist because even if you do break up, I think you need someone to, like, I do think you need someone to guide you both

and if you just leave her high and dry after nine years it's going to be very difficult so at the very least I think you should go to the relationship therapist I think that one of the things that comes through and how you've put together this email special one is a real sense of like guilt and shame

and you're like am I a bad guy the thing is is that guilt and resentment often really like they feed each other they really really feed each other in relationship And the only solution to that is to create channels of communication where these things which feel so unsayable can get said. And give her agency. Give her some agency. Right now it's all you like deciding for her or trying to protect her by not saying anything. You're not giving her any say in this and it's a two person relationship. But it is so hard. I mean, I'm very against like people being that young and just locking in having never been out there. But also if you leave, just know. that you should not be leaving

because you think that there's going to be this smorgas... Actually, I don't know. You're a man who's dating women. There is a smorgasbord. But... Who knows? You might never have a smorgas board. Don't bank on the smorgas board.

Yeah. Or this smorgasbord ever being as emotionally like safe and supportive or mirroring what you've managed to build with someone that you've known literally, that you've literally grown up together. It will never be the same as that. If you leave, it has to be for other reasons. Not just because you want to go stick your slong elsewhere. Oh my God, Moyer.

I don't think that's also not a reason not to leave sometimes. Like, I think exploration is quite an important part of human life. Anyway, as I said, I'm a lever. Get your ass into therapy is what I say. That's the main thing. I think you should both get in there. Okay. This is the end of the show.

Shall we get this wrapped up? Yeah, let's wrap this up. Thanks for listening, special ones. Come see us on the 25th November. London special ones. We've got something for you two. Let's just say. a festive something so look out for that okay right thank you i've been more like McLean you've been

stressed as fuck goodbye bye