If I Were You - 17: Jake's Parents

Episode Date: February 26, 2024

In this episode we get Mr. and Mrs. Hurwitz side of Jake's college history, then play a rollicking game of Hogwash or Ha Eun.Advertise on Segments via Gumball.fm.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This is a Head Gum Original. There Now here's one more effort For only positive motivations They swear! Second Another podcast Second Each app different from the last Second It's the Swiss Army Knife of Shoes

Now let's Meet your two emphatic hoes Second I need you to empathic hold To send me home Welcome to the show, Mom and Dad. Oh my god, it's so much fun to be here. Yeah, really great to be here. So you guys haven't seen Jake in over a decade. We wanted to bring you three. We've come to address my trauma. Jake emancipated himself a decade ago, right?

Was it 28-year-old? Yeah, you were like, you're already financially independent. Right. This is exciting to have you guys. One, thank you for coming all the way to LA for it. Happy to do it. Yeah. And two, this is like us getting this other side of a story that Jake told on a podcast weeks ago about his college experience or lack thereof.

Just a little joke to lighten the load. You were clinically depressed for a year and a half. Yeah, about a year-ish. No, not to dive right into it, but Jake was telling us about how you went to one college and then slowly phased himself out without telling you guys how you found out. I'm like, I wonder if your parents remember it the same way. And Jake's like, oh, we should talk to them and see their side of the story. Yeah. Then you guys were here and you know one thing led to another also I don't trust a troubled 18 year olds recollection of such an event versus his parents I assume you guys have a clearer memory of what happened. Yeah, because the way I remembered it you guys hate me

Yeah, as time goes on the memories sharpen they don Exactly, yes, until you die and then it all comes into focus for one last second. We should say this is segments, a podcast that, you know, constantly changing. This segment, I guess we can call it interviewing Jake's parents. Yeah. My mom has been on the show several times.

This is your third or fourth appearance, maybe? I think third. Well, all right. I think third, I think third maybe. Third but first on camera. Yeah. And dad, your first, your first appearance? I believe it's my first appearance.

I know I've been mentioned because I got an email from some guy in Finland looking for, you know, legal help. Yeah. Based off some mention on a show that some banker heard and told this guy I'm constantly shouting out your law practice in Helsinki specifically I don't know if you know the tax code over there. Yeah, he was like fortunately He was looking for us tax advice. Oh, okay, so right your alley. So really you're welcome I don't know if you ever collected on that we We did. 10% is kind of supposed to be split amongst Jake and myself. Yeah, I'll offset the 10% fee against what Jake owes me.

Which actually is a great segue to the story. As Jake told it, he went to, what was your first college, Moravian, right? Moravian. Moravian, yeah. And it was on a scholarship. Partial scholarship, partial financial aid. Yeah, yeah. And you would go less and less and less

to the point where you weren't going at all, but you didn't tell your parents. Yeah, I assume they wouldn't find out. I left two or three weeks early before school was over and I said that I'd finished all of my finals. Did you guys believe that? Um, yes. So he shows up on like April 30th and you're like, oh, I guess that's a little early, but what are we going to do?

We don't know this. Yeah. I, yeah, I think it was a little early, but yeah, I believed he completed whatever he was going to complete. We should tell you also have six children. So it's not like you're keeping tabs on just Jake. He's a lot of balls. But the triplets were pretty good. So you don't really need to look after them that much.

Yeah, they were not a lot of trouble. But also, I thought colleges would tell you as a parent if your kid had stopped coming to classes and it was flunking. Yeah, they're not allowed to tell you that shit. I had no idea. I'm like, grown up. They got a gun to the dean's head. Hey, call my dad and tell him I'm doing really well.

Did you guys get my grades from the first semester at Moravian? I don't recall that. I recall vaguely. I should say you're under oath right now. I have a vague recollection of getting, you know, something maybe towards the end of the second semester that you were not invited back. And you knew that before he got home? I don't think so.

Yeah, yeah. It was after I got back. I think it was somehow after you got back. It was also the way that I wasn't invited back, not that I lost my, I thought it was that I lost whatever financial aid that I had. I don't think that's step, sc… I thought it was that I lost whatever financial aid that I had. I don't think that step… I don't think they took that step.

I think you were just not going back. And is that how you found out or you found out from Jake? I don't recall exactly. I think we somehow gradually realized that he wasn't going back. And did you… were you on the same timeline as Sam over here? You're like, oh, I guess Jake's not going back. Yeah, we're on the same timeline, but I think I knew that Jake was struggling

a little bit more than Sam did. Did Jake open up to you about like the classes in for me? Not really. Or he would hide it like, oh, school's going well. Shut up, you're freaking. He sort of, he said school was going fine. Phone calls. Yeah, yeah, just like, yeah, everything's fine. He was very vague though.

Right, yeah. But most teenagers are. Yeah. Can't get. Oh, I know he, at one point said he didn't want to go back for the second semester. Yeah, but I made it sound like it was my Yeah, I'm gonna transfer Meanwhile with what record can you transfer?

But I think I was of a mentality back then is just if I you know if you buckle down and just did your job You could get you know through anything and maybe that was a bit of a reaction to having six kids and everything was very difficult and I was really of a mentality where just do your job and get through it. Even if you're a C student as long as you get to graduation. Yeah, if you work harder you can be a B student. And now it seems like I've taught you the valuable lesson that actually if you give up repeatedly then you can fail into success.

Almost upward. I think you may be giving me the valuable lesson that I should have listed a bit more sensitive. Wow. It's nice to hear. Then what happened in between Moravian and the next college? You know, Jake, we then I think we could call everything a gap year. We were able to sort of frame it in that way. It was just like a step back. And my assumption was always that he was going

to go to another better college than Moravian, even though his GPA was like 1.6 or less. I mean, he was going to take the classes at Southern, which is a fine, you know, it's a state school, but it was a decent school. And he was taking a couple of classes there. And so I was really very optimistic that if he did his work, he could get through.

And then at that point, he was writing for this school newspaper and had things published in the school paper. So I was very optimistic that he would get back on track. Figure it out from there. Yeah. And yeah, I feel like once I left Moravian, I had some level of, I don't know if you could call it success in writing for the school paper,

but I was proud of that and I was like, I could always point to, I'm not doing nothing. At Moravian, it was like I was actually doing nothing. I wasn't going to class. I was like calling you guys for money so I could go to Quiznos during the day. And there was really not really anything else going on for me there. But when I went to Southern, I didn't necessarily like my classes, but I did like writing for the paper. So if the classes weren't going well, the paper was going fine.

Right. And I think the fact that you were writing, I mean, I felt very aligned with you in that regard. I knew you were a really good writer. Now, what about high school? Because before I even went to college, did you think I was going to go to college? Because I was also a pretty bad student at high school. I believe I was kicked out of one high school. I was kicked out of one. One high school, two colleges. My expectation, I think I just sort of am conditioned

to thinking that all of my kids were gonna go to college. It like didn't even cross my mind that that was like. You guys both went to school. You got, yeah, which is that you went to, my mom went to Yale, my dad went to college. It like didn't even cross my mind that that was like. You guys both went to school. You got, yeah, which is that you went to, my mom went to Yale, my dad went to Columbia. Yeah, and like we didn't, I didn't have a choice. I mean, I couldn't say, you know, dad, I want to drop out of school.

Travel the world. I did actually say that at one point and there was just laughter. No, I think you'll be going to Yale, actually. But with Jake, I mean, my assumption was he would go to college despite the fact that his college counselor at his high school said he didn't think Jake was ready for college. Emotionally or intellectually? Yeah.

Either way. I remember we both felt really slighted by that, but in the end he was right. Yes, he was correct. Doctors said I would never walk again. And they nailed it. What was his name? I guess I should come out with his name just in case it's been... Well, yeah, I mean, yeah. Mr. Schroeder, right? No, it was Richter.

Mr. Richter. Okay. And he was a great guy. Fucking nailed it. So yeah, we're not throwing him under the bus. No, no, he was a great guy. And he just, like, he called it. He just said, some people aren't meant for college. And I think Jake might be one of those people.

Well, I feel like that would be one of those lucky people. Nowadays, it's all like medication and, like, more mental health about, like, why this student is acting the way he is. Was that ever considered back then in like 2002? Or is it like colleges and for him and we're off to the next thing? I think it was more the latter, like colleges and for him.

I did wonder why we had paid for a private high school and not an inexpensive- Well, because they got kicked out of public. Well, you got, yeah, but then we sent you to private because we just left with it and they would, what do you mean you got kicked out of public? I thought that I wasn't allowed to go back to North Haven. Because of the gun incident. No, that's the kind of thing.

I was skipping classes at North Haven. I guess I don't know if it was like they fully said you can't go back, but there was like some kind of, like Mr. Dall I talked to you about like that I'd be better, that it would be better if I went to a different school. Yeah, you, you needed, you, that was not the kind of like mr. Dalai talked to you yeah about like that I'd be better that it would be better if I wanted you needed you that was not the right place for you Yeah, you needed more one-on-one. That is exactly true. Yeah, but he wasn't actually thrown out Yeah, I don't know. I think you can't get thrown out of Public school unless you like they could just beg you to leave I Had enough like in school suspension that it wasn't really worth anyone's time. That's it. And you were expelled, I believe it. There was some point.

No, out of, yeah, I was suspended a few times. So Moravian comes and goes, Southern Connecticut kid status happening. Are you guys now like, all right, we really got to stay on top of Jake? Or like, he'll figure it out. How about you? I wouldn't say we were on top of him, but I think I was always optimistic that he would, you know, figure it out. And I feel like we, you know, supported him as he tried to do, you know, all the different next steps. That's nice.

Was there ever anger? Like, did you see this version of your parents back then or were you guys like, what the fuck is wrong with you? I don't, no, I think that I never felt like they were angry. I think if anything I felt like, um, I, I don't know, maybe I felt like bad that I was disappointing them at certain points. Yeah, yeah, I can't, I mean, I sometimes, I don't know that I felt disappointed. I worried, you know, you kind of worry what's gonna happen.

And if, had I known what the future held, I would, yeah, I turned out fine. Quite fine. Turns out you don't need college necessarily. But it's almost like going, you know, like when you accidentally go off a diet, not like, it wasn't like, I hate, like my parents hate me and I'm a total fuck up.

It's like, oh, things are fine, things are fine. Like, oh, I've had like cheat meals for three straight weeks. Like, okay, I'm going to school, I'm going to class, I got to see on that paper, that's all right. Oh, I didn't go for a week and a half. Oopsie-daisy, I hope this doesn't slide me out to college entirely. And then I think I felt, if anything,

I probably felt more like guilty than angry or like they were disappointed. I think it was, if anything, I probably felt more like guilty than angry or like they were disappointed. I think it was all projection from, from me. But you were afraid to tell them basically. Yeah, because I didn't want to get in trouble. No, you don't want to get in trouble. Did trouble from the school feel like trouble to you or like that's fine.

I don't care if my teachers are pissed at me. No, I felt like I could always, if I had time, I could find my way out of the trouble to some slight success that I could spin in my favor. Yeah, you just need to end on a high note. Yeah. Kind of like our videos back in the day. Right, exactly. How did Southern Connecticut state end?

I think similarly to Moravian, the first semester went fine. And then the second semester, I think I like maybe signed up for two classes, but very quickly didn't go to them at all. Yeah. And then I was like, I'm not gonna go to school this semester. I'm gonna like, I think that was when I was working at the candy store.

I was like, I think I'm gonna work at this candy store and go to school next year. And you guys were okay with that. Yeah, yeah. That sounded like a good plan to you. Cause it's like, A, at least he has a responsibility. I was succeeding at the candy store. They gave me the keys, they were letting me close up.

That was a fake key actually. It was a candy key. Yeah. Well the manager always closed up right behind me. And I could just use this ring pop to get in. Yeah, yeah, sure. I think there was sort of like, it was a gradual letting go of college at Southern.

Like, you know, you did okay that first semester, you were writing for the paper, we were feeling hopeful. Second semester, you kind of stopped going to class. And it just, it was like a slow pulling of the rug out from up here. Yeah. You say that you were feeling optimistic. Was there, what was the, what was like the low point?

What was the time when you were feeling like the least optimistic? Like, wow, did you guys ever turn to each other and say, damn, I really don't know if Jake's good. But five out of six ain't bad. I don't know why. We just got Michael. No, I don't think ever quite felt like that.

There's no like rock bottom going to jail and all this kind of crazy stuff. I think there was an incident at Moravian and correct me if I'm wrong about this, but one of your friends was going to Lehigh, which was right near Moravian. And you went to a frat party, and there was a fight.

And you got punched in the face, or you punched someone in the face. I don't know. Somebody else punched me in the back of the head. Okay. There was, and I was just thinking, maybe, I don't know, I was just worried about you, like your judgment didn't seem quite there. And also tennis team, you were on the tennis team, which to me seemed like this huge honor, you know?

And I was so proud of you being on the tennis team and you had your tennis uniform. Yeah, I actually stole that uniform. They wanted it back when I left and I took it. Right, that's very sweet. See it back when I left and I took it I would have been worried about that had I known that But I think it was that stuff where I would like feeling, you know proud like even going to a frat party at Lehigh I mean that sounds like a wholesome college activity, but then getting punched in the back of the head I mean, how did you know he got punched? I

Think I must have told you you told me you didn't go to the infirmary or anything. No, no, it wasn't that serious. Do you remember why somebody punched you? I think I like did something I think I was getting kicked out because of The way we were playing beer pong and I don't remember unbelievable and like you finally got upset. It was You're playing Lehigh rules You can't swap the bounces there. I Don't I don't remember why we got like it done something or made fun of somebody while we were playing beer pong And we were getting kicked out then as we were leaving. I think I did something to deface the frat photo Unbelievable. Yeah, not the frat photo. Yeah, those are those are serious

I thought you raised a better man than that. Yeah, so what happens after the second college after the second college? Then I went to then I enrolled at the new school. Mm-hmm. Well, that's in New York. Yeah at that point you were in New York though Yeah, so I I think I dropped out of I dropped out of southern. I worked at the sweet shop I volunteered at the hospital. So like on paper, I was still writing for the paper. And you got an apartment too. Yeah, and I was living with Steve over at Willow Street. So it looked like I had my life a little bit together.

And then I was like, all right, I've made it to the top tier of the sweet shop. I'm basically the manager there. The Candy Man. The Candy Man. The Candy Man. I became the logo. I think at that point I had started my internship for college, or not internship,

I was writing articles for College Humor. And I emailed Streeter and I asked if they needed an editorial intern. Streeter let me interview. I interviewed with him and Jeff Rubin at the Tribeca office. And I got the editorial internship at College Humor. So that was like, I'm gonna move to New York

for this internship and I'll take classes at the new school. Are you guys excited about that? We're like, I don't know about this whole college humor thing. I'm sure I was concerned financially as to how he was gonna afford you. I think I have an email from you that says you're proud of me, one second.

Okay, hold on. I can pull it up. Just do a Google search for proud of me. It's the only one of your inbox. It's in my starred emails, I saved it. Okay, he said, all right, this is, oh wow, all right. August 29th, 2007. It looks like this is me talking about,

this is me talking about enrolling at classes at the new school. Hey, Dad, I just found out the prices listed in the course guide aren't really that accurate. I guess the price is closer to 800 per credit, which they didn't specify as me asking for cash. Each class is worth three credits, so it actually adds up to be over $2,000 per course. I think I maybe said it was 800 per course or something.

What should I do? Register for one, maybe? And you said, I do not want you to take on more than you can handle. So, two is way too many. I said two is way too many. No, no, you said, if you can really handle two courses and do the work and complete the courses, I am okay with you taking two courses. But I also expect whether it is one or two courses that you be very careful with spending money, including the use of your cell phone, using my speed pass, etc. This is when I was using Dad's mobile speed pass to pay for gas.

So you ended up taking one class? Well, so then I respond, I can definitely handle two courses. I was just concerned about how expensive they were. If I can become a degree student in the spring, the courses will be slightly cheaper. Also, I will be very frugal this year. And this to this, my dad responded. Okay. Good luck I am proud of you for your success at college humor and for following up on the courses. Wow Do you remember writing that? Did not remember every single email. Yeah, but you remember that general gist. Yeah, like oh, he's in New York He's on top of shit. He's not gonna spend every single email. Yeah, yeah. But do you remember that general gist? Yeah. Like, oh, he's in New York, he's on top of shit,

he's not gonna spend too much cash. Yeah, yeah, I mean, it was always really, as I said before, I was always optimistic in thinking that he would figure, you know. So that's interesting, because I did not know that you guys were optimistic that I would figure it out. Was that blind optimism, or did he have something

that you're like, oh wait, there is something there? Um, well, I, you know, I think he was a smart, a smart guy. I was. And there is a smart guy. I think he really just had to get through whatever he had to get through to, you know, to be successful. Sometimes it is the classes and or colleges are not for you. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, I think at Hunter was where I finally took a creative writing course. And you loved it. And I did really well. That was the first time I did well in a college course. Yeah. And then I dropped out. But your teacher really liked you.

And I remember thought you had potential and yeah, that was exciting. Mm-hmm. That was the college that I dropped out of because things were going well at College Humor. I think I've said this already, but around this time when I was taking that class, Strader said that my internship was going to be paid, and then Ricky said that I can come in as

many hours as I want. So I said that my classes were all at night, and then I dropped out. Did you guys know that he was dropping out? No. You must have known because I would have asked you for money to register for the other courses, right? I feel. Spend it on Quiznos again.

I feel like if we, I don't know, I think maybe it's having so many kids or maybe just Jake being Jake. We just, if we didn't hear anything, if we didn't know there was a problem, we assumed everything was fine. And it was probably a little bit denial, a little bit of optimism. A little bit of distraction from other kids.

Yeah, that too, distraction. I definitely worried more than dad, I think. Just cause I couldn't imagine a path forward. But then when College Humor really kicked in, I couldn't imagine. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Was there a point where you're like, oh, wow, Jake's actually doing well. It's not just blind optimism. Probably NAPOD. It wasn't till Carnegie four months ago. I think it was when we went on a tour of the College Humor office.

Yeah. And I brought it. Yeah, the snacks. It was amazing. And you guys had free snacks. Yeah, that was incredible. Zero the spectra as far as the eyes could see. And then when people I knew started knowing who Jake was because their kids watched Jake and you.

Yeah. You know, I had friends who would bring their kids over to the house for a sighting of Jake. Wow. Did you guys like those videos? Because we've been rewatching some of the old ones and we were like, these are awful. They're fun. And you know, I thought they were great. Really?

Yeah. Even like the old terrible, unfunny ones, you loved them all? I loved them all in degrees. Some of them I loved like a lot. But you were never like, oh my god, this is kind of embarrassing. No, never. Never, never. And I mean, I think the content, I think humor now, it's harder to find stuff that's genuinely funny

and fresh and different. You guys created these characters. Well, we invented the funny man straight man dynamic. Yeah, totally did. That was the first YouTube video ever, really. And then everything took off from there. But my parents don't even like don't understand it. Just maybe the language barriers, they don't like watch the videos or if they did,

they wouldn't fully understand what they are. So it was funny to have Jake's parents, you guys watch them. And I'm like, I wonder if they even like this stuff. Well, I don't know. Jake may have inherited some of his sense of humor from us. Interesting. Because you said it skipped a generation, but my grandparents were hilarious. These guys are sticks in the mud.

So that's cool. So then by the time Jake and Amir and the college humor stuff rolled around, you're like, okay, I can finally maybe rest easy about the whole not finishing college thing. Yeah. I had to be partially that I stopped asking you guys for money at a certain point too, right?

Cause. Yeah, and you started giving people money. Yeah, that's another story recently. Yeah, yeah, but I mean even you, you're charitable, that's just you. You're very generous. Yeah, and at some point we didn't have to guarantee his leases. Yeah, that was great. Real finest of tests.

70 times rent or whatever the insane rule is. Yeah. Trust me, I have $190,000 in the bank. It's not gonna be an issue. Let me live here, Jesus. Yeah, God. There were a couple of times that I ran out of money in New York doing, you know, paying rent, but I don't think I told you guys that.

Oh no, I borrowed money for you one time when I was like 24 or something. Yeah, I don't remember exactly But I'm it was it was harder to send money somewhere too because it was before you know Venmo and everything yeah, wow union Right now the kids are fucking Venmo requesting their parents from college The money transfer yeah, I mean that's kind of interesting if I if I could have just done that without even talking to you guys I would that would have been really sad well they still would have to approve it on their app yeah I guess so you learn it you learn a valuable

life skill like tactfully asking your parents for money yeah it has to be like you so you read that email right yeah that was a good email congrats on the email email wise it was awesome regrets dorets? Do you have a few? Or hey, it all worked out. I think everyone did their best job. I have some. What do you mean about this in particular? Yeah, all's well that ends well in a way. I know, as I said, I wish I was more sensitive and I wish I said, you know, know a second semester don't go back to College, maybe don't go to Moravian go someplace local or take a year off

But I was you know too much you know you gotta You know go to you know straight the you know the intended path and you just got to get through it I saw I shouldn't have been like that. No, I don't. I think that's very, that's very sweet. But I don't think that, I don't think that I felt, I don't think that I felt that very intensely. I guess, I don't know, I don't know, maybe I did. That seems like the hardest part about parenting is like, when do you stop telling your kid to power through

and figure it out and when do you like say, okay, you can give up now. Right, sometimes you do want them to. Right, like I didn't want to go to Jewish sleepaway camp because I was afraid of like being away from my home for three weeks and now it's a 41 year old I'm like I wish my parents made me do that but then it's like if I'm crying and I'm at 11 years old I'm like I don't want to go to like Jewish summer camp like do I actually wish they threw me in a van and threw me into a Jewish summer camp and

left me there and I wish you guys made me play soccer for longer because I actually suck at soccer and Mike is pretty damn good Yeah, why do you think if you didn't let me quit soccer then you're pretty good now? You're you came back. It's all it's really all heart though. I don't really have any like But like so do you have like like is your mom kind of like do you have a good cop bad cop situation at your house with my parents? Or with my parents with your parents? A little bit my mom's like she didn't want us to like learn things the hard way So she's like, you know created rules like you have to do this

You don't you don't have to do this don't drive at night blah blah blah like taking the keys away Like it's not like let him do whatever he wants and he'll figure it out But then likewise I didn't you know drink or do drugs in high school, which seems like it was a good thing, but then maybe he could zoom out and be like, maybe he should have done more of that stuff in high school. Maybe it would have been more gratifying if you forced him to do the Jewish summer camp thing. Was your dad more strict or he was more lenient? He was more like, kind of, you do- Yeah, I think my dad was more listened to your mom and my mom had, the rules.

Because I think, Sam and I just had such wildly different approaches. And you can correct me if I'm wrong on that one, Jake, but I just feel like I was a lot of love and it's okay. And you're gonna be fine, honey. And dad was more... Call me for tax advice. I really think that's almost what I keep on thinking of because you're saying that you wish you were more sensitive or let me do stuff, but I think it was,

mom is very, very, very emotional and also will give more words of affirmation. She will, she'll share more. And I don't think you were necessarily mean, but you were just more quiet and reserved. You never really said anything that was mean to me. Like if you look at the, this bringing back the email. Yeah. But her email.

But I think they're maybe just me being young. I took the silence for disapproval because I was disapproving of myself. It's almost like the reflection of your silence is whatever I was gonna tell myself. Yeah. I think maybe if you did something that was, you know, that would have logically disappointed me, you probably could have sent disappointment. Yeah on my part Yeah, makes sense

But yeah, it all worked out it really did it really did I mean you're sitting on a nice couch right now. Yeah. Yeah posters are cool Everything is cool. We have a podcast which is pretty amazing Yeah, I guess I failed out of college, but you never thought that one day I'd have a podcast. The jokes on all of us. Should they stick around? Should we do another segment? Yeah, let's do one more segment. I wanted to run the poems I've been writing past you. Oh. Because I know Jake gets his love of poetry from you, or maybe it's from Sam. Not from me. Okay. Yeah, so I've been trying to write poems for Jake try to trick him into thinking they're real

award-winning poems and I Listened to this segment where Jake read a Mary Oliver poem an AI poem and his poem which I thought actually Was pretty decent. Thanks mom. I really did. I thought actually was pretty decent. Thanks, mom. I really did. I thought it was good. It was no programmatic algorithmic one that was spit out in less than a nanosecond, but it was still pretty good. Well, that one mentioned Mary Oliver by name, which was my shield.

Yeah, that was so strange. That was, yeah. It was. The kind that Mary Oliver walked through. I like the hot Oon poem. Yes, OK. So let's take a break, come back, and we through. I like the hot moon poem. Yes. OK, so let's take a break, come back and we'll talk about the hot moon poem. This episode of our show is brought to you by yet another podcast called See the Thing Is. Oh, yeah, folks, are you a millennial?

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for sponsoring this episode of our show. Yes. You've you to Squarespace for sponsoring this episode of our show yes well you've been using Squarespace for what 30 50 100 years at this point a thousand years you built the first website on earth that's right David com it was Michelangelo's David com it's uh yeah it's David and he's touching a mouse that's really cool actually yeah that's actually really good super bowl commercial keep that in mind for next year well if you want to build that It's really cool actually. It goes, yeah. That's actually a really good Super Bowl commercial. Keep that in mind for next year. Well, if you want to build that website or any website, you can use Squarespace, which makes it incredibly easy to drag and drop and professionally design something without

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And then when you're ready to launch, just use that coupon code segments for extra 10% off. Woo, thanks, Squarespace. Legends. on just use that coupon code segments for extra 10% off. Thanks, Wearspace. Legends. All right, we're back. One of my most, I guess, influential pieces was a poem I called Ha-oon, which I made about a Korean immigrant, kind of like I moved from Israel to America. Oh, don't make this guy don't make yeah, try to trick Jake into thinking it wasn't about me, right?

And it was called ha-oon you have it on your phone, right? Ha-oon. Okay by H. E. Kim But that sounds pretty real right it does right off the bat You don't think that's me tap Tap as Harrison hops scotched across kindergarten chalk towers. Clap as Harry graduates, now dancing across the stage in gowns and hats. Disguised symbolically at first, then veiling historically, Ha-oon sits now to mourn ha'oon than Harrison, than Harriet. Now that I've read it a third or fourth time, it's awful. But let's go on by length. Honestly, I thought it was better when you read it now. I'm like, okay, that was my best attempt

at a quote unquote real poem. Let's go, stands up, I stand back. First impressions, when you hear that, does that sound like it could have been an award winning poem or does that sound like a six-year-old Trying his hardest to make it sound like a real poem it it doesn't sound award-winning to be honest But that's fair Honestly, I don't even like it that but there is a middle ground between six-year-old and award

High schooler. Yeah high school writer, but it's it's like Like it yeah, dad liked it. Yeah, I liked it. I think it's a good poem. What about Sadie? Did you like his poem Sadie? I don't remember Sadie. Sadie was the ancestry one. Let's stick to Ha-Ooon. Okay, Ha-Ooon.

Oh yeah, so what did you think about that one? I actually thought it had... The flow was really interesting was all consistent with the character you created. Thank you. The language wouldn't be fluid so it was like kind of it was structured well for what it was. I thought that you're really reaching to give him a compliment. No, it's really true. I like the simplicity of the language. There was nothing about it that seemed overblown

or like you were trying too hard. Yeah, like using words that nobody uses just because I wrote a cool poem. But tell me, tap as Harrison Hopp scotched across kindergarten chalk towers. That's really good. That was my favorite part. I actually like Hopp scotched. I don't think it That was my favorite part. I actually like hopscotch.

I don't think it needed to be past tense. Is that fair? Watch as? Is it watch as or is it clap as? Tap as. Tap as, Harry. What does that mean? Like he's tapping and then he's, as a kid,

he's Harry playing hopscotch, written in sort of a flowery poetic language. Yeah. And then it cuts to his high school graduation and his name is different now Can I read it on your phone? I'm sorry to yeah, of course. I just want to pass this one to my mother He obviously doesn't want you to read it It might be weird when you read it. I just know that I didn't format it like that. Sorry. I No, no, no, no, no. I didn't format it like that.

It does, ooh, sorry, I lost the phone. Oh well. Classic Barrett. I'm sorry. It was classic. So embarrassing. No. You need glasses, honey. Not glasses.

Oh, thanks, honey. It's really good. These are a little, okay. Yeah. Move to tears a little bit, I think, reading it. It's kind of exciting. Now, what did you like about Hot Oun? I just thought the name progression was so cool.

It just told so much. I also thought it was cool, and it did tell you so much. And I feel like we've always had more of that practical connection versus Jake and Laura. I still like hopscotch across kindergarten, chalk towers. I really do, I love that little stanza. Okay, but then like he is one second just talking. And what did you love about me?

What else did H.E. Kim say in his quote? He, Kim. I get a little confused with disguised symbolically at first, then veiling historically. Oh, no, I'm not. I'm not confused. She figured it out. I get it. I just figured it out. Oh, you can't. What is this? It means nothing.

Because disguised symbolically is in his name. Yeah, he didn't want to be known as Ha'oon because, like, the kids would make fun of him. Right. But why symbolically? What makes it disguise symbolically? So letters themselves are symbols rather than that, right? I think Jake just didn't understand the poem and that's why he is tearing it down. Then veiling historically.

Veiling historically, like putting veils over his own history. Right, because that might have been his father's name or grandson. Yeah. I get it. And then the last line? Um. In terms of the last line, did you think I stuck the landing or was it sort of like? Sits now to mourn Ha'un?

Yeah. Then Harrison, then Ha... I think the last line is good. I think the first line is fine. I think the middle one, where he's just graduating, not enough there. Wait, so did you major in poetry at college? That's actually a really good question. I didn't in fact I was trying to prove to Jake that Despite his love of poetry, I could write something quickly that would move him and you still have the real poems

You haven't been able to yes, and it's something that Jake sort of has it's an intangible quality She's I'm reading a poem. He's like, that one moves me emotionally. I can't put my finger on why, but I know you didn't write it. This one did not do that. I think if the middle stanza was more about head mic. Actually, you're completely right about that, Jake's good with this stuff.

Yeah. It's top and bottom, great middle. Middle stanza. That's the problem. You could work on that though. That could, you think you'd so? Yeah. He doesn't have to graduate.

You're obsessed with school. Yeah. Because he's hopscotching at school. But they, I think. Then he's graduating. And you know what? It's the graduating across the stage and then sitting to Morne Ha-Un.

Yeah. If you want to like, it kind of condenses this history. Is he sitting at graduation or is he sitting later in life? I'm not really sure what's happening. It's kind of interesting. I think it would be hopscotch to maybe marriage or maybe the birth of a child. Oh, interesting.

And then to the end of his life. I think that's, you're trying to. But he's not there yet. So he should, why? I mean, Amir should continue working on it and develop the more middle stanzas. In real time, yeah. I think you need middle stanzas plural.

Well, at this point, Ha'oon is bunk. Do you guys want to play hogwash or Ha'oon? I'm sure you're familiar with that game. Hogwash or Ha'oon? Do you know how that works? Do you remember this one, right? You have to say the right word. No, you say, you actually choose whichever one you want, either hogwash or Ha'oon, and

whoever laughs is eliminated. Right. So, I'll say either hogwash or Ha'oon, then Amir eliminated. Right. So I'll say either hogwash or hot or hot. Then a mere than mom, then you, then Henry, then Harrison. Yeah. Hogwash. You can say either hogwash or hot. And the object is to just not laugh. OK, we'll give it a shot. I think your parents will win.

OK, let's try. Hogwash, hogwash, hogwash, hot. So Jake's eliminated. That was really good. All right, so it's a mirror of my mom's head. Playing that classic game, once again, if you're just watching, we're playing hogwash or hot-o-oon. Hot-o-oon. Hogwash.

Hogwash. You guys did great. I mean, there's nothing else to say. It's my mom versus my dad. Yeah, all right. Someone's gonna win. I think it will be me. All right, hug wash.

Hug wash. Hug wash. Hug wash. Hug wash. Hug wash. Hug wash. Oh, you got her. Damn.

It's a game that's sweeping the nation. It really is spreading. I thought I saw two high schoolers playing outside. I swear, I think I saw that for whatever reason. Oh, my God. Wow. Great job. Great job. Thanks for going down memory lane.

Oh, this is so much fun. It felt like we went to couples therapy, or parent therapy. way to end it. Great job. Great job. Thanks for going down memory lane. Yeah. Yeah. It felt like we went to couples therapy or parent therapy. Really worked through some stuff. It did a little in a good way. It really, really did. We'll get the other kids in here one at a time too, so we could sort of audit you.

Yes, we did. That's a good idea. Was anybody as time consuming as Jake? We're all, we all have our own issues. Jake had a certain, he was so popular and charismatic actually that that was almost a problem in and of itself. I think he- That was too cool.

You were a little, I felt like I had to somehow dampen. You did. You dampened it. You have to dull this light. I remember this speech that I gave for your bar mitzvah about you. And I said that you had a lot of like kind of power and that I wanted you to use it for good. And did I?

Yeah, ultimately. You really did. Ultimately, for sure. Yeah. That's nice. And did I? Yeah, ultimately. You really did. Ultimately, for sure. That's nice.

And we're back. Yes. Your parents are gone. They left in a huff. It was so weird. It was crazy to have them here. My mom threw her water at you. I guess we cut just before you said whatever you said to her. I hissed at her. Tossed her water at you. My dad tried to attack you. I had to hold him back. Did we, could we roll that? Or we weren't rolling on that. We weren't rolling on that.

We weren't rolling on that. Yeah, yeah. But uh, I feel like cooler heads prevailed slash not really. Angry heads left. Yeah, angry heads left. Yeah, now I'm fine. I'm scratched up. All night, my chest is scratched up. Right right I'm surprised it's not leaking through this on the theme of this lie We're actually gonna play a game Call to true send a lie good I got I got mine written down. You just thought up thought up two truths and lie off the top of your head Uh-huh, okay. We'll start with yours since you might forget them. Okay. I've been to 49 of 50 states mm-hmm might forget them. Okay, I've been to 49 of 50 states.

Anything? It feels true, but it might be like 48. So let's hear the other two. I once got 14 stitches. That feels true. I once pooped on the floor in a public restroom. So it's the first or third one is the lie. I'll say the first one's the lie. You've been to 48 or 47 states. What restroom do you think I pooped on the floor of? I think you had like some sort of diarrhea or bad situation when you were like nine or ten. Well, you should know that the the the point of two truths in the lie is to humble brag so I've been to 49 states oh I did get 14 stitches oh it's pretty cool and pooping on the floor

I did that too Hoorah! that's one thing I wouldn't cop too publicly really yeah that's a lie interesting yeah all right good game thanks let's see if you can beat this one Really? Oh yeah, that's a lie. Interesting. Yeah. All right. Good game. Thanks. Let's see if you can beat this one though. Okay.

These are three sport related ones. All right. I played- I thought they should be about you. They are about me. Okay, all right. The league leader in yards per catch was Yancey Thigpen in 1989. It's not you.

Oh yeah, sorry. These ones are about me. Okay. Yancey Thigpen. Yancey say I played flag football last Thanksgiving Doble I turned my ankle playing tennis last week. Hmm Interesting then why I never learned how to swim. I just kind of figured it out figured it out. That one seems so true for you. Oh.

Again, I played football last Thanksgiving. Yeah. I turned my ankle playing tennis last week. Yeah. I never learned how to swim. I just sort of figured it out. Turned your ankle, would that mean like I almost injured it but I didn't like it twisted it?

I like walked it off. Yeah. that's it could have been a tweak Yeah, that seems very in play But I do believe There was a tennis injury that happened to Cohen. So that maybe is just why it's top of mind Yeah flag football seems like the kind of thing that Billy Scafuri would organize for everybody Yeah over Thanksgiving because he's just a good nature, like a turkey boy. Like a turkey boy like that. The swimming, I just can't really picture you learning how to swim.

So you're saying they all sound true. No, I think the I think the lie sounds the most lie-esque. Which is what? Which is that you turned your ankle. Trying not to get emotional. But you're wrong. Really? I tweaked my ankle playing tennis last week.

You did? Yes. I sort of hit a backhand and then when I landed, I like had my ankle rolled and I felt to the ground. Interesting. A little sore but ultimately fine. It wasn't a full twist. Yeah, all right. Never learned how to swim is correct.

I never took lessons. I was just like, alright that looks like swimming and I can sort of figure it out but I'm not very good. You're old enough that you're like, okay I flail my body. Yes, exactly. Or I watched the Olympics and I was like sort of I could do that but I never like learned the technique with like twist to breathe. Twist to breathe. Like the fucking doggy paddle the breast stroke if you jumped in a pool now what's your I would die I would die in 15 seconds immediately inhale I fill my lungs up with water get on my back and go to the

floor so you didn't really play flag football did not play flag football it just sounds like something I would have done Billy Scott fury would have organized yeah I feel like he has done that before yeah maybe on Christmas but Did not play flag football. It just sounds like something I would have done. Yeah, it sounds like something Billy Scott Fury would have organized Yeah, I feel like he has done that before yeah, maybe on Christmas, but yeah, I was definitely not invited I haven't played flag football probably since seventh grade. Wow. Yeah, the look on your face when you guess the tennis retrospect I should have guessed the flag football because I definitely can't see you doing right like what position would I play in? It's too cold outside. I'm with my family. Yeah, you might play left out Like you're not like why receiver now like like everyone else is playing your left out left tackle

You're not Left out the line you were warming the bench that one was the lie. Yeah Are you okay? out of the line. You were warming the bench. That one was the lie. Yeah. Are you okay? There was a game organized and I was left out, but that wasn't my position, if that makes sense. Yeah, it does. Yeah.

It does. So that insult was added to injury. So that insult, I didn't understand it. Nice. Good job, you embarrassed me. Over my head. I don't feel shame. You tried to embarrass me, but it didn't work.

I didn't get it. This guy's too dumb to realize he's even being insulted. All right, good games. Great games. I'm glad your parents are here to get to the bottom of that. Me too. Did you learn anything? Yeah, it was kind of interesting just to see,

like I feel like a big part of my history was how much I disappointed my parents or how much I failed, et cetera, et cetera. But having them here and then kind of remembering, they did give me a lot of chances and really believed. Yeah, they were sort of optimistic Yeah, it was just really nice. Yeah. Yeah, in fact, it might have undone everything that you've done so far notice That you were you've been trying to prove them wrong, right? Yeah. Yeah, I never did anything watch this shit. Yeah I'm like, oh, you're never I never succeeded to prove anyone wrong

I actually succeeded because I just kept on getting propped up after mistake after mistake. Right. Which is great parenting. You sort of like, you stumbled but since you were on a hill you were just sort of like winning the race by accident. Yeah, yeah, kind of. So now you can quit because you don't have to sort of.

You should quit while you're ahead. Chase after their approval anymore. You already have it. Yeah, evidently. That's nice to hear. I was with your parents on. I'm sure they would actually admit to being disappointed in you. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha at a dinner table and call it a podcast. Yeah, retroactively.

I'm here for three weeks, let's do it. Okay, cool, thank you for watching, thank you for listening, however you're consuming this. Thanks a lot. We're also on our Patreon, patreon.com slash jay, making new videos every Thursday. That's right. And we'll be back here next Monday, of course.

And see you next week. If you have any segment ideas, let us know. Bye everybody!