Imaginary Worlds - 28 Days of Black Cosplay

Episode Date: February 22, 2017

Cosplay has gotten huge in the age of social media, but when websites feature their ComicCon slides shows, they often don't reflect the true diversity of the fans. So black Cosplayers created their own hashtag #28DaysofBlackCosplay (although it was #29DaysofBlackCosplay on the leap year.) Harry and Gina Crosland of Pop Culture Uncovered talk about why they like putting an original spins on classic characters. Cosplayers Suqi and Brittnay N. Williams of the site Black Nerd Problems talk about finding their community, and having to call out Cosplayers who don't understand why blackface shouldn't be part of any costume. Special thanks to Monica Hunasikatti.blacknerdproblems.com popcultureuncovered.cominstagram.com/BrittanyActs instagram.com/mssuqiyomifacebook.com/BishopCosplay Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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You're listening to Imaginary Worlds, a show about how we create them and why we suspend our disbelief. I'm Eric Malinsky. So the beginning of my last episode, we heard from Sam Lai and his friend Mamatha Chawla about the challenge of dressing up for Halloween when you're not white. Here's Mamatha. Like, I literally cannot imagine myself as a character in Lord of the Rings, like even if I tried, which is hilarious because there's so many ridiculous characters in Lord of the Rings, but I can't imagine a person

of color. And that got me thinking about cosplay. Now, in case you're not familiar with cosplay, it's the term for when fans dress up as their favorite characters at conventions. And cosplay has gotten huge in the age of social media. Every year during San Diego Comic-Con or New York Comic-Con, all these websites will post slideshows of their favorite costumes. And one thing that I've noticed is that those slideshows

rarely reflect the actual diversity of people that I see in the convention floor, certainly in New York Comic-Con. In fact, what I see all the time, and almost never in slideshows, are black cosplayers dressed as characters that are not traditionally black. So a few years ago, I was really intrigued to discover this hashtag on social media, 28 Days of Black Cosplay. The movement was started by a cosplayer who calls herself Princess Mentality. Now, she declined to do an interview, but she did send a statement, which I asked cosplayer Brittany Williams to read. And she said, during Black History Month every February in an attempt to create a positive, uplifting, and empowering conversation around black cosplayers.

In the past, I've pushed for better representation and more inclusivity for people of color in the cosplay community, and was often told to stop whining and create my own space if I wanted it so badly. So I did. All I ever wanted was to create something that we as black nerds could use to lift each other up.

It makes me happier than words could ever express to see it explode the way it has. So I talked with Brittany and a bunch of other cosplayers about that hashtag and why it's so important to them. As you can imagine, the conversation went way beyond cosplay. That's just ahead after the break. Okay, so the first thing you need to know about cosplayers is that they're not just your everyday set of nerds and geeks. They're huge design nerds as well.

They love talking about the craft of making costumes. So, like, in fact, Brittany was in the studio with another cosplayer who goes by the name Sookie, and they kept breaking into shop talk. Like, here they are talking about a costume that Sookie's making of an anime character. If you have really good like bendable like Eva foam or even if you use like Instamorph,

you can make the star and the circular part. And if you have like a good amount of warbler, then that's perfectly fine. The staff part can be like a dowel or like a piece of like PVC pipe. She completely lost me at Instamorph. But I do know what they're basically talking about, which is the challenge of taking two dimensional cartoon characters or video game characters and figuring out how to depict

them in real life. And they're not Hollywood costume designers. I mean, they're on a budget. The materials have to be affordable, but look fantastic. The other problem is they have to maneuver through the real world in these costumes. Like here is Harry and Gina Crossland. They're a couple from Maryland that cosplays together. Just the Assassin's Creed costume that I created for Harry. I mean, just creating it is like three or four layers just to put on the actual costume. You have your shirt, then your vest and your jacket, your arm pieces, your boots.

Yeah. Then all these weapons you got to carry. You can't move in all this stuff after time. We have to worry about when we're at these conventions that we need to use the facilities. Yeah. So you got to find a way to make it so it's easy to get on and off without somebody being there. On top of everything else, just carrying your phone or stuff that you got to carry around all day. You got to make some kind of sleeve or pocket or pocketbook, whatever, to put this stuff in.

So those are practical challenges that every cosplayer faces. But Black cosplayers have to deal with a lot more than that. Again, here's Brittany and Sookie. My first dumb, annoying comment was said out of love, and I feel like that made it worse. So much worse. Yeah. It's like they mean well by it.

She meant it with love, and it was the first time I was prepping to do cosplay, or like for a convention that I was prepping to do it. And I made my list of characters that I wanted to be. And I was like, oh, I could be this and I could be this and I could be this and I could be this. My friend who was white, she she was like, well, you can't be those characters. And I was like, why can't I be those characters? She was like, they're not black. You could be these characters. And she named like three characters from shows that I did not watch who happened to be black. And like,

one is like, you could be Anthony from Utena. And I was like, I don't, I don't watch that show. I'm Sailor Moon. I'm not. And if I'm going to be a character from Utena,

I'm going to be Utena. I'm going to be the lead. I'm not going to be a secondary character. Like I don't, that's not what I do. Yeah. It's almost like assuming that you're only going to identify with that one minority character.

And I'm just like, that's not how it works yeah especially because they're usually like background characters if they're not the secondary character then they're like tertiary characters sidekick or something no i'm the lead exactly i'm sorry we did you not get that no that's not what we do here and it's so funny you said it because it's just like i cosplayed raven from teen tit. And it's just like I've actually had someone go, oh, why don't you just be Bumblebee? And I'm just like, um, as much as as much but as Bumblebee kicks, I love Raven. But I'm just and somebody just like, but Raven's white.

I'm like, first of all, no, she's not. She's not even human. She's Azerothian and she is half demon. She and her skin is gray. So your argument is fully invalid. Harry Crossland had a similar experience, but he took the advice in a different direction. He was talking with these friends at Baltimore Comic-Con named Trent and Mike, and one of them said, you should really dress as Bishop, who is one of the X-Men that's black.

And the people that we run with, we're all from different backgrounds and different races. Trent's white. The other guy, Mike, is black. And I forgot who the other person was. But Trent was really hung up on the idea. He said, dude, you got height, you got size, you should do it. I said, I don't know. I don't know.

Maybe. I think about it. So I thought about it. And I think maybe about two or three weeks later, I showed Gina the idea. Gina liked it and said, okay, well, let's run with it. Let's just see what happens. Either it'll be a big hit or nobody will care because Bishop is a character right now that you're rarely seeing in the comic books.

So when Harry finally debuted his Bishop costume, it was a big hit because overall fans do love seeing cosplayers who manage to pull it off and look like real-life versions of fictional characters. Bishop has actually become his calling card. Like, online, Harry is known as Bishop Cosplay. And the funny thing is, Gina just did her version this past year. I felt left out, actually, for him doing this bishop all this time. And I said, you know what? I need something to match him and try to do something that's not actually bishop, but similar to bishop. So I said, let me put a spin on it because I had this afro that I wanted to use. And I said, let me make a 70s bishop.

And Harry wasn't too happy about that one. And that actually, yeah, same reaction. People were like, whoa. And that actually, yeah, same reaction. People are like, whoa. But Harry is just as proud of his Superman costume, which has Kryptonian armor like in the movie Man of Steel. His wife Gina has a similar costume,

but it's Wonder Woman with Amazonian armor. The problem is, and this has happened amongst my own folk as well, when they see us doing these different spins, they've asked us, like, okay, well, are you the universe 24 version of Superman? Or are you the black version of Superman? Are you this version? Are you that version? I've had people ask Gina, are you Nubia, which is like one of the black Amazons, and so on

and so on and so forth. And I'm like, no, I'm just Superman. And, you know, there have been times I've actually gotten into debates with people like, well, you know, and they didn't want to come out and say it and say, well, you know, Superman is white. You know, they try and say, well, you know, if you did this or if you added this to your army, you could be that version. I'm like, I don't want to be that version. I'm the version that you see in front of you. So talking with these cosplayers, I noticed a few themes coming up over and over again. First, pride in their craftsmanship and wanting to be recognized for that.

Second, a desire to come up with your own spin on a character that stands out, maybe says something. And third, a yearning for community. That's why Brittany writes for the website Black Nerd Problems. So, Black Nerd Problems is a culture website. And I like to say that we report on the convergence between nerd culture and black culture. Sookie often wondered where those two cultures overlapped when she was growing up in Coney Island in Brooklyn. Not for nothing, like when people think of Coney Island, they automatically think of the mermaid parade, like the rides, the hot dog eating contest, the boardwalk and the

beach don't ever go in the water. But out of the like out of all the people that I've met there, I've probably met three or four other people that were into like nerd that were into like nerd culture and into cosplay and it's just like when I'm walking around in cosplay because I remember one time for New York City Pride I actually cosplayed as Rainbow Dash because why the hell not it was Rainbow Dash from My Little Pony friendship is magic yes that shows good so you're just like by the way friendship is magic yeah I'm walking through the neighborhood and I've had like so many people staring at me and one of them like was my neighbor. And they're all looking at me like, what the hell does she have on?

They look at me like with this stereotype because like I've actually gotten this all the time growing up. Like, yo, you're black. Why are you like, why are you doing all this quote unquote white people stuff? Yeah, I guess like my experience experience i've never had like i never ran into any black people who were like this is this is not what black people do like it's always been like i'm not into that but you are so okay whatever lucky i know for me uh the the scariest part of or the most nerve-wracking part of doing cosplay is getting from your home to your destination so like getting from home to the convention or from home to the party or wherever you're going and uh right now I'm living in Crown Heights and so I I did a casual cosplay at New York Comic Con last year of Stephanie Brown

Batgirl and so I'm just walking to the train and I noticed like people staring at me like who is this black girl in this bad blonde wig? And it's just it. But as soon as you come, as soon as you see other cosplayers, it's like you spend the whole time on your way there while you're by yourself, like on the train or in the car, in the cab and like your shoulders are up near your ears and you're like, OK, I just need to just let me see one more person. Just let me see one more person, because sometimes it feels like you're just going to show up at the convention and you're going to be the only one in costume. because sometimes it feels like you're just going to show up at the convention and you're going to be the only one in costume. So there's always like that fear. And as soon as you see like off in the distance,

somebody carrying some kind of like long staff, then your shoulders drop, everything, and you relax. And then you're like, it's fine. But as I mentioned earlier, websites often don't feature a variety of people when they do Comic-Con slideshows and videos. Because the thing is, when you have other people out there that have never cosplayed, that have never been to a comic convention, and they want to go, especially when they

are of a minority, when they're people that are nervous about their body type, when they see the video and all they see on the videos are young, skinny people, regardless of what color you are, young and skinny, and that's all you see, then that's going to make you less want to go out and cosplay. So what did you think of the hashtag

when it started, the 28 Days of Black Cosplay? Oh, I was all on it. Yeah. I thought it was the best thing ever. Sookie felt the same way. She started a revolution. When you think about it, she started one of the nerdiest, geekiest,

artiest, cosplay-iest revolutions in the Black community. And it's gone so far off the grid. And it's actually gone worldwide because there are cosplayers not just in the States. There are Black cosplayers in Canada, Black cosplayers in the states they're black cosplayers in Canada black cosplayers in the United Kingdom black cosplayers in the Netherlands and it's just so so beautiful to look at it's like a bet signal we can we call out to each other yes like say like you're someone in the middle of like the middle of nowhere in Wisconsin and you're like I kind of I heard I kind of want to do cosplay, but I don't know what to do.

I don't know. Do black people even do this? I don't know. Then just hit that hashtag. There you go. And most of these cosplayers, if you reach out to them and you say, hey, I love your costume. I love what you did.

Do you have any advice for me? Where did you buy this? Where do you get your wig? How do you style your wig? What products do you use? What kind of fabric dye do you use? Where do you buy your fabric? Just about every cosplayer is ready to give you tips and ready to share yeah i've never not

met a cosplayer that didn't give advice on how they did their cosplays yes it's beautiful networking like if you do cosplay hair and cosplay makeup and it's like somebody has like their hair and makeup on point they'd be like oh my god your makeup looks great or your hair is so good or your wig is so on point it's like, let me tell you who did my makeup. Let me tell you where I got my wig. Let me tell you who did my hair. I will give you her number right now, hunty. So the hashtag 28 days of black cosplay, actually last year was 29 days because it was a leap year,

has created this instant sense of community. But sadly, it also sparked a very predictable backlash. Harry says the ugliest comments are usually on bulletin boards or other anonymous websites. But he's been asked questions like, Well, you know, why you guys got to do 28 days of cosplay? What if we went and we took a month and we had to remind them, like, you got the rest of the year. We're taking the shortest month. And there's a larger battle they've had to fight.

A shocking number of white cosplayers have taken to wearing blackface when dressing as characters that are traditionally black. And those cosplayers will fiercely defend what they're doing without seeming to know much about the history of blackface. When you decide that, OK, I'm going to do Storm or I'm going to do Michonne from Walking Dead, and I got everything else right, I even got the wig, but now I'm going to color my skin, that's no. And whiten my nose. Right. Oh, yeah, yeah. There was a young lady in Germany who did that and who decided she wanted to get a prosthetic for her nose. Because I feel like this.

My skin is not your costume. You know, for as many people that actually want to die on that hill and defend the practice of blackface, I tell them, I say, well, I do Superman. How would you guys feel if I went out and I painted my skin to appear white and then got a spit curl? The most common argument they get from blackface cosplayers is that they're doing the same thing as other cosplayers who put on red makeup to play Hellboy or green makeup to play Hulk

or Gamora from Guardians of the Galaxy. You can do Gamora, like you can put on green makeup. Does that make it racist? Is that weird? Like if I put on green makeup or if I put on blue makeup or it's not the same. I need you to go on Facebook right now and go through your friends list

and see which one of them actually has green skin that was born of this planet. Right. That's literally what I tell them. Which one of your Facebook friends has green skin or has purple skin? I'd like to meet them right now

and ask them if they think it's racist. And if you can't find me not one person with green skin or purple skin or purple skin, I'd like to meet them right now and ask them if they think it's racist. And if you can't find me not one person with green skin or purple skin or blue skin, then I need you to shut all the way up. But they're actually really impressed when they see non-Black cosplayers play Black characters without Blackface. Like, for instance, I saw this Asian lady

do Michonne at Baltimore Comic Con. It was spot on. Great. I was like, and I told her, I pulled her aside, I said, ma'am, thank you so much. Sookie once saw a white cosplayer dressed as Mike Tyson. He was bald, he had the face tattoo and everything, and did a great job.

And when somebody was like, you have the great Mike Tyson cosplay, the guy said himself, yeah, I don't understand why people have the black face in order for it to be accurate. Having to constantly referee these issues can be exhausting. I mean, that's not why they

went into cosplay. They got into cosplay because it's fun. I mean, personally's not why they went into cosplay. They got into cosplay because it's fun. I mean, personally, I have great admiration for anyone who does this because I am way too self-conscious to dress up even in Halloween. But I love going to Comic-Cons and seeing cosplayers because it makes me feel like a mere mortal in ancient Greece walking among the gods and demigods of Mount Olympus. And for cosplayers who walk those halls and demigods of Mount Olympus.

And for cosplayers who walk those halls and see the faces of people like me who ask to take their picture, it can be exhilarating. Gina and Harry told me a story that sums that up pretty nicely. You build confidence by doing that. And I think that's why these people, I mean, that's why I do it, but I think why a lot of people do it. So I feel like a celebrity for a day. Even father who came to baltimore once he said y'all like a celebrity people just come up to you and want to take a picture i said yeah it feels good don't it

oh okay because that matter of fact that was the first year i did bishop we would um we were at new york comic-con that was the first year I did Bishop. We were at New York Comic Con. This was our second year at New York Comic Con. And I just kind of looked to my right. And Stan Lee and his entourage was coming because he had just got finished doing the signing. And they was taking him to his room. And they're walking along the side of the wall because, you know, it was kind of one of those things.

They didn't want to attract too much attention. So, you know, whoever his handler was wasn't paying attention because it was a whole bunch of bags thrown on the floor. So Mr. Lee trips, and he almost falls. So I catch him, and I'm like, you OK? And he looked over and said, I'm OK. He looks again. He said, great costume. That was a great Stanley impersonation.

And he kept on going. I'm just standing like, wow, thank you. As Stanley would say, enough said. Well, that's it for this week. Thank you for listening. Special thanks to Harry and Gina Crossland. Sometimes we don't go to the movies to actually see the movies.

We go to the movies to get the cosplay idea. That movie sucked, but the costume was awesome. Special thanks to Brittany, Sookie, and Monica Hunasakadi, who writes for Black Nerd Problems and arranged my interview with them. You might have heard her laughing in the background. You know what I was wondering in terms of cosplayers is the pose. Like every time I'm like, can I take a picture?

And they're like, sure. You have to know it. If you don't know your pose, I feel like that's the worst thing you can do in cosplay is like not have a signature pose. Because there's at least like two or three that a character has and if you don't do it, then you're just like, it's like, why are you even here?

What are you even doing? Imaginary Worlds is part of the Panoply Network. I tweeted E. Malinsky. You can like the show on Facebook. And I'll post images of the cosplayers we heard today on my site, imaginaryworldspodcast.org. Panoply.