IMO with Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson - Harness the Hustle with 2 Chainz

Episode Date: September 9, 2026

This week, Grammy Award-winning rapper, songwriter, actor and entrepreneur 2 Chainz joins the show to discuss growing up as an only child in College Park, playing basketball, and the business of trapping. Plus, 2 Chainz goes deep on what it meant to reconnect with his father late in life. In this episode: Dr. Kathleen Jordan, Chief Medical Officer, of Midi Health Have a question you want answered? Write to us at imopod.com.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

I don't remember things that don't mean a lot to me anymore. Like, if I'm out, I mean, hey, how are you doing? I'm, whatever, whatever. Okay, I don't really need to remember this name. I don't have to, like, waste room in my mind to try to remember. You know what I mean? But then it was like, that sounds like getting old. Nah, it's getting wise.

That's it. It's getting wise. You don't need to remember nothing that don't mean nothing to. How's somebody? Can you, Craig? You remember, man. You're like, well, I don't remember that. I remember important stuff.

If it's important, I know my daughter got a prom this weekend. And I need to make sure she got her left everything she needs. I don't need to remember. You left them with all the resources. Yeah, I left them with everything they needed. The car, the driver, everything. This episode of IMO is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Hey, how you doing today?

I am doing great. I am so excited. Our guest today, I mean, a bunch of people just, their minds will be blown. Yeah. On a whole different level. We've got two chains here today. We got two chains.

And I know a couple of brothers living in my house who are going to think I'm like the coolest dude. Yeah, because they, I have no credibility in my own house. So my nephews don't think that I'm cool. No, no, your nephews think you're cool. They don't think I'm cool. Oh, but you're with me. Don't they think you're cool? No, that doesn't count.

See, this is what I'm saying. That doesn't count. That doesn't count. Well, why don't we just... Just get right to it? Let's get right to it. So our guest today is Two Chains, who is a Grammy Award winning rapper,

songwriter, actor, and entrepreneur. He is known for his platinum-selling music that has garnered more than 11 billion streams, as well as his business portfolio that spans restaurants, hospitality, tech, and beyond. His New York Times best-selling memoir, which is sitting right here next to me is called The Voice in My Head is God.

Everybody should go out and grab one of these. It is a great read. It's a truth teller. A truth teller, but it's a fun read. And without further ado, let's bring out our new pal, Two Chains. Two Chains! How are you?

How are you doing? I'm blessed, man. Thank you. This is an honor. You were busy, dude. A little bit. A busy. You got a tour going on.

You got a prom going on. You got college graduate, getting ready to go to college. Not, well, not college, high school graduate, getting ready to go to college. You're juggling a lot of stuff. So this is my daughter. I got it. I don't need your help until I need your help. When really, we could have fixed this in the first place.

So my daughter now is on her second prom. arm dress. Made no sense. The first one came, I never even knew this. The first one, she ordered from overseas. The man at the door said, he need money for terrors before he can even give. I didn't even know you paid a tear at the door. I didn't even know that.

You probably don't. I just so fishy. He came here. He said, or I could just take the box with me. So now this is my daughter's dress from Lord, I don't know, rush. I don't know where she ordered this dress from. You get the dress, you don't even like the dress. But you really getting the dress based on a picture, which I understand.

And then you get another dress that you love. So I'm happy about that. And then today, you go get some lashes. And I've never heard of this. You get all your lashes done, but then you don't like them. So then you got to do, you know, so I'm just really going through that. It's a complicated. Well, hold up.

Let's back up for a minute. When did you start getting prom dresses without going to the store and trying it on? Wake up, Rip Van Winkle. Come on, man. They, they, yeah, they. They're tapping and zapping and stuff. It's different, man. You know how they'll be using, you know, AI in a minute to put the,

they probably already are to put different dresses on with the different house style. So, you know, kids, we all have them. We all love them. And, you know, that's that. Here's the thing about that, though. The fact that she's a self-starter, right? That she does want to do stuff on her own. That's true.

You know, that can't be mad at that. That's a good sign. Can't be mad at that. That's a sign that mom and dad did something right. Well, two chains, we want to get into all your history. And we really want to talk about your bestseller novel. And congratulations. You told me you didn't even know you were on the bestsellers list.

I mean, I knew when I knew. But I didn't know when other people knew maybe, you know. Because I just really had my head down and a very hectic schedule. Maybe a little bit more ramped up than when I'm promoting a project. Definitely if it wasn't more ramped up, up, it was in different, on different platforms that I normally went to. And, I mean, it just paid up, I guess, my transparency, my honesty, of course, my devinerre, you know, intellect, other things.

It just came shining through. Your vulnerability does. It means a lot for you to embrace your story and to be able to tell it in such a clear, you You know, it's just you bring clarity to stuff in a very special way. What was the process of writing your first book like? So I came up with the idea to talk about intuition and how it's like my gut feeling and this divine guidance that I've been using for a very long time and really hadn't talked about it or shared it in any music, any platform, any interview. It was almost like this secret sauce that I had, right? For example, when I started working on the book, I found my father was incarcerated, a good part of my life, which we talk about in here.

And so I found a stack of his letters. I don't know how I found this, but they were from 2003. And they were around the holidays. My father's birthday is on Christmas. So these letters were from like Thanksgiving to Christmas. Now when I read them, now they're over 20 years old, but now when I read them now, I have a way different understanding for some of the things we were talking about from the things that they were eating, the language that he was using. comparing, you know, the things that he was saying as far as like, he wasn't calling himself an inmate.

It was another term he was using what they ate on Thanksgiving, what football game was going on reading all this. But it was something that I noticed on the back of, and I've always noticed this, on the back of every letter, it was God is love on the envelope. I've ripped the envelope. I read what's inside. But it was on the envelope the whole time.

It was said, God is love. And it really hit me one day that maybe that's just what it is. It's that simple. God is love. If you got love and it has God in. And so I started, that's when the title came, the voice in my head. It's got to be God. You know, you hear God, you're made in the image of God.

God is inside of you. So I'm thinking, you know, duh. I'm like, it just felt like it hit me. So then I got really excited and started using a bunch of my, like, musical resources. to put the book together, even with the audio part. Of course, I read my own book. I love reading. I added, like, production.

So on some of the scenes that I describe, you're here tire screeching or you're here sirens. And it's just, I just made it really fun to do put together. A little bit of that comes from somewhere. Can you tell us about your mom who I got to meet on FaceTime? Yeah, yeah. Just now. She was gardening.

Yeah, she was out of the yard. She didn't know how to flip a phone around and show me her. You're not supposed to FaceTime women without telling them, but I was like, you know. She didn't seem like she minded. But she, look, when you left the room, she's like, you got to see my yard. I got black mulch. We on that until I'm like, Mom, you know you're going to need some more that black moorch, you know. It's cool to have yard talks with your mom.

You know what I mean? Like, you know, that black moorchie ain't going to last all summer. You better get some, because we had the, I did this for you already. I crawled so you want to, I got hay now. So anyway, we just had that conversation. But my mom is, she'll be 76 in July. Her and my oldest are born on the same day. It's insane.

And growing up with my mom, he's always been there for me. She's always been there for me. She's always been a supporter of anything that I've done. But a lot of my growth came from the nature aspect of just being outside, playing sports, riding the bus, meeting friends. It just, you know, like my life, my elementary was different from my junior high school. I played on all these teams. I even went to college.

So all of these are like chapters in the book of life. Yeah. And you, in all of those situations, I assume, gave me this resilience and stuff like that. You know what I mean? Gave me a perspective. You got coaches that if, you know, they are a good coach, they could act as father figure sometimes. They have, you know what I mean?

So just like those things, when I look back, teachers, it's some teachers that know how to be impactful, you know. So in my upbringing, there was a lot of that too. It wasn't just my mom. My mom was there. She didn't abandon me or anything like that. But a lot of the, my teachings really came from, like, people outside my family. We are definitely going to talk about hoops at some point here.

But I am. pretending to be my sister now and I want to know what was little two chains like like your first memories and what that was like

what the smells were what you ate how you grew up when you were little yeah when I grew up my mother and father were together

I want to say to maybe six or seven so I can actually remember some of those times My daddy had a yellow Cadillac with a yellow leather And he had a black Cadillac He had two Cadillacs He wore cowboy hats

He was a hustler My mom Every since I can remember dabbled in real estate Like property Loan management, loan officer, whatever Me, always the only child And my mother

Tell you that she didn't She don't tell you this With a smile on face That she didn't want to have me Like this is my dad's idea She didn't want to have kids She didn't want to have kids Yeah

Interesting And she said I hurt Really, really bad And my dad didn't want Help a dog Yeah So She say he like

Push and she like You come She turned into the X You come push And she says So, you know, I've been asked for like a brother or whatever. So she said, you know, she went on and told me when I was young, like, baby, you heard me so bad that I had my tubes tie, clipped, and burnt. How do I know this exact phrase that there had you and burnt?

There's no way. I'm like, man, you didn't think she was like that day. I didn't want to see you. I was mad at your dad. But obviously, you know, when it became just me and her. We became best friends. We became locked in. And those memories are just like, you have those survival stories,

but it's not like any other, nothing that you can't, a hurdle that you can't come across, man. You know what I mean? We had encounters with the law. We had encounters with, you know, maybe the neighborhood that we were staying in. And what age were, is just, was it just the two of you? From probably eight, nine on, you know.

You know, and my mom, we stayed in, so when I explain certain things that are urban, on this show, I would talk about, like, the word trap, right? It's something that you hear. And don't feel like you have to, you know, just, you know. Just be me, right? Yeah. It always works. Right. Exactly.

You know, we know what you're talking about. You're talking to us. Yes. You're not talking to the audience. Okay. So a trap, that's good. It's not a lot of audience in you. It's right.

So the trap The trap is a place where people come and they solicit They buy things from this place It's normally an apartment complex They come and buy most notably drugs Or whatever they come from that place

What I would like people to understand is that my mother lived in the trap like in paid rent or Section 8 or whatever the heck we had in the place where people would come in, college students, get whatever they needed, league, whatever, whatever. So I lived in a neighborhood. And so I say that to say that the neighborhood, it just automatically influenced you like any other neighborhood.

And my examples are that if I was born in Hawaii, I would be like a surfer. Yeah. I promise you, like I think the whole neighborhood was like, let's go California. You be the best server. Yeah, I'd be like, be five, you know. And if I was from Colorado, we'd be like, Craig, let's go skiing this weekend.

But I'm from a place where this is all they did. And when I try to explain, like, you know, who I am and what I am, it's actually knowing that I'm staying at a place and my mother is paying rent at a place where people come and they solicit and they buy drugs and they want stuff. And now normally in a neighborhood like this, if the older people in the neighborhood, If they notice something, if they notice like a bright light and a kid, they'll tell them, you stay away from this. Yeah. They didn't notice that with me.

Right. So they told me, you need to come on out here, and you need to do this to help take care of your family. So for a long time, what I was doing didn't feel like it was wrong at all. Yeah, yeah. You know, it didn't feel like it was wrong. I did it in my neighbor. I did it in school. I just hustled.

I trapped. I did that. And that will put. that will grow you up faster than a lot of things. You know what I'm saying? Just period. The loss of innocence at an early age really help develop who I was when you're at 14, 15, you're learning how to do money orders at the time to pay this Georgia Power Bill,

whatever it is. And you're responsible for this. And also, I'm someone who just enjoy school. So I wasn't going to drop out to try to, which was, like a trend when I was coming up. A lot of kids, like, I ain't going to school. I enjoyed dressing. I enjoy the women. I enjoyed learning. I enjoy literally learning. I didn't make a seat of college. I talk about that a lot, too, like on purpose. Just like, let me say I feel to be normal. Let us see. This is what y'all be doing. This is what you mean? It was, you couldn't do better than this.

Yeah, like, you feel average like y'all, but for the most part, I enjoy school. I'm like, love. I'm like, love. in school, but still, like, got this dark side where I'm up all night. I'm outside. I'm sitting on an abandoned car. But I'm reading my book for tomorrow. You could do it with your eyes closed. Yeah, I'm still reading. It's the most quick.

I can see it right now. I'm sitting on the back of a car, street light. I'm reading somebody. Let me get this. I'm doing this. And then people the next day, like, the teacher, they ask the question. I'm like, ooh. And they're like, man, you don't.

You didn't read. I know. I know the answer. I can't wait. Yeah. Music to my ears. But you know, I hear you talk about this and who you were. See, this was the part about me.

Like, you said no adult saw the special in you enough to tell you not to be in the trap. But you had to have known that they were wrong. Now, you had to go out there and do it because that was the way of life. And you could do it because you could pretty much do anything. If you put your mind to it, you know, you could ski, surf, whatever. Whatever was before you, didn't the instinct tell you I'm better than they think I am? One of my favorite parts of traveling is seeing how locals actually live. You can hit all the famous touristy spots, but I always remember the little neighborhood

coffee shops or restaurants or parks even more. That's the stuff that sticks with me long after you get home. I was back in one of my old neighborhoods for a visit. I was able to take my family to some of my favorite spots. We went by a couple of restaurants I love and the bookstore I frequented. And that's why I want to tell you about listing your space on Airbnb. If you're traveling at all this year, listing your home on Airbnb is not just a practical option for your space.

It can also be a fun opportunity to show off your neighborhood. You can earn a bit of extra income all while providing an authentic local experience for travelers from all over the world. And on top of that, listing with Airbnb means your home won't be sitting totally unused while you're away. Triple win. Every time I travel and opt for booking a space on Airbnb, I always end up discovering parts of a city I would have never found otherwise. It's the little unique touches that really add up and make a trip truly memorable. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how much at Airbnb.com slash host. This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance, a company committed to helping people

move forward and live fully. Mish, I've been thinking about how overwhelming big life decisions can feel these days between the endless stream of information, social media, and that constant fomo the kids talk about. Do you feel like people are overthinking things more than they used to, or is it just harder to make a choice when we have so many hours? options. No, I think it's a little bit of both. You know, I think with so much information coming in, we just have so much more to process. And, you know, there's only so much the human brain can take in. And then, yeah, we feel inundated with choices. We feel like there are too many options, but most importantly is having a strong team. You know, learning to let go that I can't make every

big decision, you know, by myself and I shouldn't. So I surround myself with really smart people that I can count on. I let go of a lot and trust that they're going to, you know, do their job and bring me the information that I need to do my job. So I've just learned that it's, you know, it's no victory for me to do these things alone, making these big decisions alone. As the kids say, facts. For me, knowing I have a solid, circle to talk things through is usually what helps me get clarity. Progressive knows that big decisions at any stage of life can feel daunting. That's why having the right support and resources makes all the difference. Progressive's up payment program falls under their broader Open the

House initiative, a multi-year effort focused on helping more people achieve homeownership. Right now, they're expanding the up payment program offering up to $13,500, $1,500,000, $1,500,000. each end down payment assistance to at least 200 eligible first-time buyers. They've already committed more than $16 million since 2024 to help make home ownership more accessible. At the end of the day, Progressive wants people to feel seen and as individuals whose needs matter. Because this is your life and it should be taking seriously. Learn more about the up payment program and Progressive's commitment to first-time homebuyers at progressive.com slash open the house where home buyers can access more housing resources and support to empower them in their housing journey. This episode is brought to you by Duluth Trading Company.

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but I still might need to pop inside every now and again to do some recording like today. They're here for the people who work their butts off just like they do. Duluth Trading Company, shop online or visit one of their 60 plus stores nationwide today. What happens is when you're immature and young, sometimes people doubt it can sleep into you. Yes, yeah. You know, I can't sit here and say that my self-confidence has been at a high level my whole entire life. I have felt like I had something different apartment for sure because I attracted people. Like I could sit at lunch table by myself and everybody want to come eat around me.

This is eighth grade. So I saw that part. But someone can project some doubt on you. And you can feel that sometimes. You know, you may listen to it sometimes. But when I became up, because I'm around people, you know, my upbringing. I used to hang around older people too. Like, I didn't even feel, you know, when I was 15, like, hanging around a 15-year-old would have been,

like, there's no way I could have hung around a 15-year-old when I was 15. I'd already went to juvenile. I was already, like, I was already, like, I was already. You're a grown man. I remember telling the kid that I went to somebody house, we like, grown kids, whatever that means. And I'd say something about Santa Claus, these people don't kick me out there. I was like, this man is like, he might be twangely. Well, there you still think.

So this lady, I never get it. Jonathan, if you're watching, I hadn't even been over. I go over there and we talk about this, and Mama looked at me so mad. And my dad had been nothing told me. My daddy one time sent me to the trunk to get some, all the gifts in the trunk. And then we stand in an apartment complex. So I say, we don't even have a chimney. Right.

I'm like, this ain't even. This doesn't make sense. You know, it just hit me. I'm like. And you're thinking everybody should be able to figure this out. Yes. I'm like, I mean, we can. You know, if you want to play along with it, cool.

But, like, you're serious? You really believe you. So I'm like, I say this. No folks sent me home, you know? So when I'm coming up, I'm hanging with people two or three years older than me just because I feel like if I'm in a 10th grade, hanging with seniors or someone out of school, it's more of my speed or whatever. So when you graduate and you just out of school, not doing that,

it's easier for you to project someone on me as a sophomore or junior because you ain't really doing that with your life or whatever. Or you working at a warehouse or whatever you're doing. You know what I'm saying? Let's go back to when you said you're talking about how in most communities, people would see somebody like you and say, hey, you don't need to be going over there. You got too much going for you. That was me. You and I are not that different.

Wow. I just had the folks in the neighborhood because we, me shall tell you, we grew up in the same type of a neighborhood. It was, I'm older than you are, obviously, but I want our listeners and viewers to know that because people might think we're like close to the same age. He's old. He's 60, 100 years old. That was supposed to be a joke.

I get what he? But so they steered me away. They were like, Craig, the same for you. You come up to the courts, gang guys playing, everybody's playing, you'd be on this team. Stuff's about to pop off, Craig. You better go home. Let's get you out of here.

Let's get you out of here. you somehow didn't have that and dealt with all the stuff you dealt with, but you circled back around on your own or with the help of some other people. How did you circle back around? Because you circle back around and was a good enough student, straight A and B, you know, A and B, like you said, good enough ballplayer to be recruited, which I want to talk. What AAU team did you play for? I play with Team Georgia.

You know, play with Team Georgia. I'm sure I saw you play. Yeah, Coach Outlaw. Yeah, yeah. And then, like I, like, team sports help kids, y'all. Like, team sports, I've been seeing stuff go viral. Like, don't put your kid on the air, you know, that stuff. Like, man, with social development with, man, you, you, man, some kids, you know,

some parents got more groceries at their house. It's just, it's just like, it's a part of, like, for me, it was, it was definitely a part of, of my upbringing. And then another thing, when I was playing basketball, it was a God-given talent. Like how my son has God-given talent, and I'm taking them to train three, four times a week. It wasn't like that with me.

I just came out. I started playing when I was seven years old for MLK in the line. They had an eight and under team. I started playing when I was seven. By the time I was nine, ten, I remember by the time I was 12, I was like, I could hoop. But what happened was when I got in high school, I was doing the one foot out.

one foot in thing. So I was still playing ball, but I was still trying to like hustle for me and my mom, whatever the excuse is. You know what I mean? And I did that. I did one foot in, one foot out all the way until I started doing music, literally.

And it took me that long to realize that you can't do both. You have to let something go. You have to shed off. You can't have one foot in, one foot out and do this. And like, it's just not going to pay off. So with basketball, even though, I got 11th grade, I had boxes of letters from D1. You know what I mean?

It was like me and my other guy, D.C. We would get letters after, you know, it would be so cool. Coach would come out. And I remember lavender, northwestern letters. I remember Tennessee, that Tennessee Orange. I remember Memphis. I remember the tiger. I remember these schools.

I'm getting these different letters. South Carolina, South Carolina State, Maryland, Maryland, Eastern Shore. And, but I'm still one foot out. I'm still like, I'm living. literally having days where I have a friend and I say, hey, you go to the court today. I'm going to stay here and I'm going to sell drugs all day. And did you have your one foot in, one foot out because you weren't sure if you could make it?

Or was it a survival thing? It was absolutely survival. So you have to have one. I had to do this. I had to have one. I had to do this. And then like when you, when you, it becomes like a brotherhood thing. This may be too much information.

But you start... No, it's never too much information. You start going in on packages with your friends. You're like, me and Craig, you know, we're going on the package and now this is ours. And you know what, Craig, man? You know, I hope yesterday, man, you go. I'll stay here and handle this spot. And, you know, you go now, now, Greg is not better than me.

And I'm supposed to be the basketball star at the crew, but I got to give them like a day off to go do some... And then the next day, it's crazy how organized it. The next day, crazy. You know what? You know what, man, I hope, man. You go on out there with the boys. I stay here and I'll sell the stuff that we went in on there. This happened to me.

I'm talking about all the way through college, all the way through college, all the way through. I start rapping. I'm still one put in, one foot out. And it was this one thing that happened. One thing that happened. And it was, I went on tour with Little Wayne. And after two months of being on tour with Wayne,

when I came back to Atlanta, I went cold turkey. People thought I was... Man, stop playing. Anyway, they did that for like a week. And I was just like, I don't do that. I don't do that. I don't do that.

You can't be... It hit me. I had to actually see, like, oh, this is how you become a super... I had a studio at the time. Yeah. I had a Porsche. I had that.

But I was still like doing... Kind of having the same concept. Going on the road, leaving this with somebody. Yeah. And just same concept. Just... And my, this ain't, literally.

What did you see? What was Little Wayne? What did you see with Little Wayne? Structure, discipline. Very habitual. Same thing. Over and no. Show, food, work all night.

Yeah. Work. Work. Get some good news. Thank you. Work. Show, work. Make sure the family good.

Do this. Work. Again, no extra, no, nothing. And it's just like. a level of professionalism. Man, and I hadn't, I'm a great at observance too. Like, I learned a lot of stuff from just watching too.

I learned how to drive a fire speed of stick from watching my cousin. I used to just be like watching. Now, granted, the first time I took the trash out, I couldn't get over the speed bump. But I learned a lot from observing. So when I'm with him, and I'm just seeing how he moved, I'm talking about it from having a chef

so you don't have to eat bad, right? You don't have to eat, right? So you got a shell, you got somebody that can drive you somewhere. So you don't have to, because a lot of times with creators, we write a lot of stuff in our head or thinking stuff. So just driving could be a problem. You just be like, I don't miss my exit. I don't miss the time. I'm on the one way.

So just having those things. When I got back, man, I got all that stuff. I mean, I got me a shell. You know what I'm saying? This is what I'm in. You know what I mean? Because you got to put the right stuff in you, put the right stuff to come out of you. You know what I'm saying?

I started just making things more convenient. and I started being able to focus just on this and my whole life changed. At what age did music sort of you start thinking? And I know it's one foot in, one foot out, but you were thinking music might be a way for me. That's a good question. Oh, another good question.

That's a good question. That's a good question. The reason that's a good question is because most artists you see, they started very young. And I had a childhood. I actually like I had a childhood. A lot of rappers can say, they was on age.

So I had a childhood. So on one of these podcasts, I can't remember, they made me call like a teacher. Like I had to call a teacher on the spot, right? It was very informative. It was one of the most sweetest things that I ever heard about myself because she's never told me that her name is Ms. Love. And when I got kicked out of school in my 12th grade year for selling cannabis.

So six teachers wrote letters to get me back in school. I remember Ms. Love's letter. clear about not letting a child go to waste and how much I mean or whatever. So I called him as love. And she remembered the letter and she remembered what the other teachers said at the time. And she said that I made her teach differently after I left.

And she threw up a scenario that I don't even remember when, you know, they used to ask us what we want to be when we grow up. Yeah. Fire, man, police, whatever. And she said that I said, I'm going to work for myself. And she said, I don't think, you know, I don't, yeah, I basically said entrepreneur, but I'm not even sure if I had this. The word.

This word at the time. But I knew for a fact that the thing that I was hearing, and I didn't want to do that. So, you know, we would say basketball player just to get them off by I tell. Like, yeah, basketball, you know what I mean? But deep down inside, I didn't feel like I was going to the NBA. Like, you feel. That's what I'm trying to tell you. Like, you know inside, like, if you're around here, like, you're up age and you've got, like, I think I'm a, like, you know inside.

Yeah. So I'm not going to the NBA, but I know I'm not going, like, being traffic at 7 in the morning on the way to work with, like, a coffee thing. I've never seen that. I never, I never saw that in my mind. I'm not going to be, like, running late, grabbing a briefcase, like being in traffic or coming home. Like, I never with a coffee. Yeah, you know. I never, I never.

I never saw that image. So it's older, I'm hanging with older guys once again. They rap. I'm just around and interested. Like, this is so cool. Watching again. Yeah, once it again. They're rapping.

They're rap. They taking photos. You know, I don't, just selling stuff at this car watch. You know what I'm saying? But I'm watching these guys. And they say, so then sometimes I would like play around, like, kind of try to like freestyle. And they were like, man, you ought to come to the studio and, you know, lay some ass stuff down.

I'm like, okay. So I'm learning again. I see how you do it. Mm-hmm. And like the second time I ever recorded, I got so much great feedback that I told myself, huh, you might be able to do this for a living. So who gave you the feedback? It was just like, so we put this, we put a compilation that I was called Playoff Circle.

We put a project out in a, in a neighborhood. And then I also took it down to college. school of Alabama State University. And this is CDs. CEDs. Oh, yeah, we were just talking about CDs. Remember this, the young people? Yeah, CDs, you know, we would try to sell CDs out the trunk,

$5 just trying to make, you know what I mean? And I swear to you, people would say, you only a rapper? Man, I got it. It was almost like, bro, I'm, I'm thinking, like, I know I'm going to die laughing. What? You're on here? Boy, come on, boy, I can't wait. I ain't going to lie.

They start coming back. That was so. I started being like Here we go You know So I started hearing And so I got all the friends That's been rapping before me

And then you know They would talk to me like Oh man What made you say this Or made you come that way And I was just like You really just kind of like Talk about your life right

You know what I'm And by this time I haven't been through so much I'm like well I can do this I can do this one now You know Had you ever kept a journal had you ever, did you, you know.

I don't even write rhymes. Yeah, yeah. I work every night, so I don't, yeah. I write every night. I mean, I work every night, try to record every night. So I go on, I go through my whole day. This is how I'm thinking about. This is how I think my mind worked.

I go through all day, and it just takes these little secret screenshots. And then I'll hear a beat, and then it'll just make me say something about Michelle Obama for some reason. You know what I'm saying? Okay, put me in your next rap. Yeah, it just be, it just be. Just remember this. Screenshot. It's just to be something.

And so a lot of my creativity comes from just being literally outside my house, moving around, going places, going out, seeing stuff. And but I saw something where somebody had a journal. And although my handwriting sucks, I was like, it would be cool to, like, just be able to jot it down. Shot stuff down. But right now, I use. Okay, so we go to the gym. We work out on our muscles. We do this right here.

What's a brain exercise besides like a crossword puzzle, right? So for me, my brain exercise or my brain push up or pull up is that I remember this stuff that I'm putting in my head. It's like I still try to remember, use my mind. Like, you know what I'm saying? And I talk about my brain a lot like gigabytes and how I don't have as much room left. Yeah. So I don't remember things that don't mean a lot to me anymore. Like if I'm out, I mean, hey, how are you doing?

I'm, whatever, whatever. Okay, I don't really need to remember this name. I don't have to, like, waste room in my mind to try to remember. You know what I mean? Like, hey, nice of you. But then it was like, T-Chase, that sounds like getting old. Nah, it's getting wise. That's it.

It's getting wise. You don't need to remember nothing. We don't need to remember nothing to tell. How's somebody can you, Craig? You remember, man. You're like, well, what the thing. I'm going to remember that. I remember important stuff.

If it's important, I know my daughter got a prom this weekend. And I need to make sure she got her left, everything she needs. It's like, I don't need to remember. You left them with all the resources. Yeah, I left them with everything they needed. The car, the driver, everything. But I'm not wasting my storage. Yeah.

On something that just don't mean that to me. Yeah. Yeah. So you rely on the storage in your head. Yeah, I try to work my, I try to use my brain. And do you still do stuff every night? Yeah. Wow. I mean, I do stuff. It may come out. It may not.

But I feel like creators, we're so delusional. We go to the studio. No, nothing. Just a speaker and an engine, you know, like news. And we go in there and we, we tell ourselves, we're going to make a song that's going to change our life, people's life. And we go in there, we swing hard every night. And sometimes it's a file.

Sometimes it goes, but we're musicians, like myself, people don't write for me. So I have to go in there and create, but like most people, if they write for you, you just come in and I just say this over. But if you're in there doing your own work, you're one of the most delusional people on the face of this earth. You just like, okay, buddy, he's like, press record.

You know what I'm saying? And then you hope an hour or two from lay like, this is scary my own thing? So that's very, you know what I mean? So that's very delusional for real. That's a delusional job to have. Kids, they keep wanting to be a rapper. Think about that.

Going to work every night. Like, okay. We need one. Well, you've done pretty good with your delusions. Yeah. This episode is brought to you by Tyler Perry's Why Did I Get Married again? If you haven't checked out the series, Why Did I Get Married, now's the time. The first two are on Netflix right now, and this next one is going to be so much more than just a movie.

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because every dollar you don't spend on them is a dollar you haven't spent on them. How did you meet Keisha? I met Keisha in college. She was standing up. Alabama State. I would ride with my boy, Twan. And she was sitting up there on a hill. But she in school?

She was in school? A little pretty little bow-legged thing, Miss Obama. I said, man, he told me, he said, man, I named Keisha. She's from Atlanta, too. I said, for real? And she just had this complexion. It looked like, it looked like she would have on makeup, but she never wore makeup.

And then we started dating, and then she would go to church. How'd you approach her? Like I'm him. Like, hey, you're ready for this ride? I'm not sure what the words was, but I approached her. And she went, she bit. And, you know, at this time, I'm in school. I'm still, like, obviously, like, hustling.

I'm like, I'm in Alabama, but I'm, like, well-known in Atlanta, you know. And her mom at the time, you know, man, her mom are very cool and close now. But at the time, she, like, I don't know if this is the guy for you, you know. So then I, like, I bought Keisha Carr, you know, did something like that. get around. Pay a little cell phone bill. So the mom, like, I'm not going to pay your stuff. All right, cool.

I got it. So I had my own place and she had her own. And then eventually it didn't make sense. I'm like paying two bills. So we moved in together against like older people, you know, like shacking up and all of that. How old were you? We were in college.

So while you were at school, you moved in together. We went in college. And then she would go to church. This would really seal the deal. She would go to church and take note. and then like highlight the notes and then like look at them later on like it's like it's a class

like later on during the week. I have a I have a spiritual background as well. You know, I very much believe in God, you know, and going to church all the time is something I don't normally do. And especially now I can't. Last time I went to church was

Mother's Day maybe a year or two ago and Lord before the church was over. It was a photo line down. I'm like, and then they didn't tell my mom. She just saw me in there and did that same look When we FaceTime it, oh my God! I just snuck in there in the back. But with Keisha, we met then, you know, great friends.

We laugh every day. People ask me to see, like, we laugh every single day. It's something that we're just going to laugh about every day, became close, built this union, had this little family. They all look like her, so that's a good thing, you know. That's a good thing. And, man, you know, really ain't skipped the beat. I want to say that everything has been perfect. obviously because nothing can be perfect, but I'll never leave.

Like you did, right? Like you said, you pick a good partner. Yeah. And I say this all the time to young men, you know, it's like, don't pick easy. You know, pick somebody that's going to help you win, right? Because if you were picking your pickup basketball team, you would get somebody that could do everything. You're not going to pick somebody that just shoots and doesn't dribble. You know, everybody's got to be able to shoot, dribble, score, defend, right?

And some, I think some men, you know, you cute. And it's like, well, that, you know what? Cute ain't, they ain't going to help you when you, you know, trying to raise good kids. You know, she got to have sense, you know. She's got to have her own hustle. She's got to have her own confidence. That means she has a voice. And it may not be easy.

She might not just yes, you to death, you know? So, you know, excellence is hard on both ends. And some guys want easy. And easy doesn't help sometimes, you know. And it sounds like Keisha is a all-around player. Let's note, and two chains, thank you very much. You got my sister to use a basketball analogy. It was really good.

I mean, it just, she said, when you're picking a team, you want to win. It was a good. It was really good. And if you watch this show, anytime I do that, it's like, why are you always talking about that? Yeah, you don't rubbed off or that was a good one. That was a really good analogy, too. Like, you got to pick the right 10 you want to win. And I don't wear her on that.

And even from a family aspect. So now I'm going to be my sister. So talk about your fashion because I'm, you know, I'm trying to. You know, tall, tall, you got to, you know, we are already. That's already a little, oh, dub you in the column, you tall. Yes. You know, I'm saying, you tall. You should be able to look good and everything.

Yeah, so you're tall. Now it's about finding out as we age and body does different little proportions and stuff. It's about you finding out what kind of lay on you the right way and make you feel comfortable. You know what I'm saying? And is it tight baggy? Is it sweats? Is it a t-shirt? You know what a day?

And for me, I'm tall, dark, handsome, smart, all those things. And I have just always been. into fashion. Ever since I was a kid, I've just always been in, I've always cared. Like, a lot of people, like, don't, you know, care with it. But I've always just cared. Today, I went, you know, a little green, a little pop. That little brown, too. I mean, that was a creative, that's a creative color choice. Right there. I gave myself a high five. I went in the mirror. I was like, this is good, because I know it was coming on your shorts. I didn't want to be. I didn't want to be, you know what I'm saying?

Yeah, I know. I know. But they sent something out to me. Don't be wearing jury. to make noise. I said, who jury that is? Because my jury don't make noise. That stuff comes like the bubble gum

machine if it's making our kind of, my stuff don't. I said, they must be sending that to some other rapper. I'm going to separate myself early on.

My stuff don't make that kind of noise. But, you know, it was just a day. It's a beautiful day out here in sunny California. So, you know,

I did about 40 push-ups this morning. Hence the. Say it's like, we're going to let the, we're going to let the gun. guns out. It's light.

It's like, but it's like, I'm going too much. You can do this at the foot of your bed. And, and, but I,

the voice, it's crazy because I listen to the voice in my head when I'm putting clothes on. I, I listen to it for everything. It probably could be annoying to an average friend,

but I listen to it for everything. Like, man, you, listen, I'm just, it's telling me to do this. It's, my, I can see my closet in my head.

I can, it's just like, it's the widest thing. So with, with this, I guess, circling back to the book, I use, or this voice is just a part of most decisions that I make. So the voice literally, literally told me to put this on today. And I guess it worked out. Right again.

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helpful guides, too. Learn more about Up Payment and Progressive's commitment to first-time homebuyers at progressive.com slash open the house, where homebuyers can discover more about housing challenges and access resources and support to empower them in their housing journey. I've always admired people who bet on themselves, the friend who starts roasting coffee in their garage, the side hustle cake decorator, my wife Kelly, she loves flipping my old sports merch online. It's very fun to watch. Inevitably, anyone who wants to sell something online comes across the big question. How do I actually do this? That's where Shopify comes in. Shopify is a platform built to help people start, run, and grow a business. You own

your storefront, your brand, and your customer relationships, but Shopify helps put your products in front of people wherever they're already shopping. From Google and YouTube to social media, the shop app and more. The hardest part of entrepreneurship is usually taking that first step. The tools exist. The customers are out there. Sometimes all that's left is deciding to go for it. Take advantage of the fact that this is the easiest time to start your business in history. head on over to shopify.com slash IMO and do something that millions of people wish they could have done. Well, I know you brought a song for us to listen to, but before we get to the song, we have a listener question. Okay.

That we tend to. We try to offer some help. We try and give some advice, some help. Some opinions. That's the O in IMO. And this question's from Leo. I've been interviewing for jobs for the past few months in the last few months. opportunity I got pretty far in the interview process before being told I didn't get the job.

My self-confidence has definitely taken a hit and now I either overthink everything or avoid trying altogether because I don't want to fail again. I keep wondering if this says something about my abilities or if I'm just not cut out for what I'm aiming for. Even though I know logically that failure is a normal part of growth, I can't seem to shake the feeling that I've fallen behind or let myself down. How do you reframe failure in a way that actually helps you grow instead of letting it chip away at your confidence? And how can you get back to taking risks

when failure starts to feel more discouraging than motivating from Leo who's in his 20s in Ohio? First of all, I would tell Leo that that is normal to feel, to have some type of feeling if you don't get something that you wanted. I can also tell Leo that, that he was qualified enough to be on their radar, but may not be what they needed at the time. I can also tell him that a company should not let him know what his value is.

that the company could that, you know, they didn't define his full potential. They literally could have been looking for something else. And also, the confidence comes when you show up for yourself. It's not about the wins. You got to like, when you make these promises to yourself and you really, like, follow up on your promises,

I think that's how you build confidence. And, yeah, you will qualify. So you got to, that's me, about the civil. line. You got to take optimism even from the nose. So even with that, you were qualified, you were on the radar. So it's not a complete

loss. It's a lesson. And it's something that's also it's some experience that you can take with you. It's something that you can look back on and say, you know, I don't know if it's like how you came to the where you own time,

the small things. I think you started looking the smaller things when you don't get something that you want. You know what I'm saying? You take that and you just add to it. Like, really, the failure part is something that just don't be on resumes. Like, everybody that you see up here has failed before. Everybody that you look up to has failed before. We just don't like, life is about highlights.

That's how social media has. So you're looking at, even the people that you look up to fail more than you, man. Me, I fail more than I can even count. And so you know that the people that you look at, up to fail too, but they didn't let that, you know, be permanent and they didn't let that define them at that moment. At 20-something years old, are you serious? You know how much stuff and how much growth and how much opportunity and the way you don't get that opportunity is by being down on yourself, feeling sorry for yourself and just staying in the house. As long as you get out,

long as you mingle, meet and Greek, man, God just might have something else that's better for you. But you can't quit and give up right now. Like this is a part of it. of life. It has to have these little moments that discourage you. It's like, it's called life. I know, like, people don't get it. But like, that's a legit part of life. Like, this little discouraging part, the let me down, feeling, that's so much part of life.

But you come out of this way stronger than you come in and you learn and you don't, the fact that you will consider lets you know that you have a place in trying to do whatever

you're trying to do. Well said. That's my opinion. That is a beautiful opinion. That's my opinion, y'all. It is. It's good when it was. Leo, you're 20-some years old.

I'm about to quit. Like, don't do that. Boy, boy, for real. What? Don't. No, man. You know, and you'd be excited. I read your book, man.

I prayed it didn't work, you know. Don't, don't do that. Like, it's something in there. Even the whole experience of going through that. You got to take that and add it. to everything moving forward. Like the whole experience, the whole process, you know. It just honestly, it's character building.

That's what it is. The failure is good for character building. That's how I got here, I think. Yep, losses. Losses, helps build character. Yeah, it sure does. And you, you know, life is like a big muscle. And, you know, you got to build it up.

and every failure is like a push-up. Okay. You know, it's a rep. It's a rep. You know, and the more reps you get, the stronger you get at life. And you don't get the strength without the reps. You know, you don't use another basketball analogy. You got to practice your shot.

Yeah. You know, for every shot you take, you're going to miss something. If you consider that a fail, then you stop practicing, you know. So a lot of us. get through because we build up the muscle for life and then we have a muscle for failure too because you got to learn what's your process for getting through failure we all figure it out the older we get you know and some of it is is like you said is disappointment it is you know okay that's the first step in your process is to be disappointment that's normal maybe to play in quitting you know

maybe you tell yourself that because you mad that's normal all that's completely you know it's like that's good. And that's part of your process. But you can't stay in that phase. You better be moving on to the, okay, now let me give myself together. I pouted it for a day, you know. And I was ridiculous in thinking that it was just me. You did that. You know, what was you? Now you move into what's your plan. You know, now start thinking about what you're going to do. You know, first of all, I got to start thinking a different way. I got to turn that around. So, I think we at this table, we've just been old enough. We failed enough that we know that it's going to take a second. But we will come out of it. And then you, you know, now you know how to do it. You know how to fail. Yeah, you've done that.

You've done it. And everybody's got to get good at it. And the more you do it, the better you get at it. And then the fear goes away, you know, because it's the fear that keeps you from the opportunity. Fear and doubt. When that gets involved, it's hard to shake that.

Yeah. Because we can't hear that either. Only you can hear that. And Leo's so young, I'll say one thing. And this is for the parents out there. Don't protect your kids from having failures all the way up until their 20

so that their first failure feels like a catastrophe. That's better than me and her. That's it. We protect them. from that. Oh, my God. Then when they get it, it's just such a traumatic experience. They told me no.

Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Never heard that before. You hear that, Keisha, that's why they don't want to ask me now. I'm going to make sure they know what no feels like. You know what I'm trying to do. This is what no feels.

Actually, Daddy. Nope. You know what I used to say that the girls tell me that. You know, Mom, you used to tell us no. It would be like, why. Because you need to know what no feels like. Yeah, you need to feel that. Especially for kids like ours who, you know, there's no natural no.

Nepo babies, man. We grew up with a lot of nos. It was just no, we can't afford it. No, you can't have that. That was the true answer, no. It was the craziest thing. I have an aunt. I have an aunt.

And she used to say, y'all can't go outside. It's too hot out there. Y, y'all can't go outside. It's too cold. That's like, yo, when is a good time to go outside over here? Because, you know, if it's weather, period, I can't go out in the rain. I can't go out. It's too hot.

I can't go up. It's too cold. But it's like, man, they just had to tell us no. Well, you can't go out there too hard. Preparing you for life. These kids run up and down. Prepare you for life. Yeah, it's the little things.

It's the little things. But you brought us a treat. You're going to make me cry. No, so this next song, I wrote this next song for my dad. So this song that I'm going to play for you. I'm going to play a piece of this song for y'all. It's the hardest and easiest song that I've ever recorded my whole entire life. in my whole entire life.

It was the hardest and the easiest. It's a song, it's called Pops. It has the Luther Vandross, dance with my father's sample. And I talk about, you know, what I didn't really get to finish telling him. My father passed in front of me in 2012 in the hospital. And I put the song out because,

after opening up this portal and doing this book, I realized even in his absence how much he meant to me and how much he's still a part of everyday activities

and my way of thinking. And so I put this song out. It's been out maybe a week and I've been getting some very long text messages from men. I didn't know men very, very long, but I've read them. And it's been some good features.

feedback on. It's just like a song for the fathers. I know we have so many songs about our mothers because that's just like Black Boy Joy at its peak. But like I had to do something for my father like I just had to.

You know, for real. All right, well, let's listen to it. To dance with my father again. I know a lot of men out there don't express themselves. I miss my pops because to me he was a hell of a man. He taught me how the boss cook and shoot at a can. Don't know if I can drive the little grange.

I went to my father, father house parked up. I asked my granddad where my dad locked up. He said he went to court, they kept him and let him go home. Now I'm out here all alone. It wasn't the first time. Ain't crying over spilled milk. Hollered me when he's settled, what you need, pimp. I'm getting older now.

I'm just trying to bill with you. I can't wait till I can chill with you. Okay You gave me your release date I'm coming to get you Black Expedition Me, my mama and Keisha told Pop she's stand with me

And he thought about it Got him a suit, cell phone And got him a whip That when I I'm ready for the whole thing Yeah man Yeah so my dad He's been going to prison

It really sucks So I'm gonna tell these two little instances And I'm just tell you It just makes me feel a certain way. So my dad, the last time he went to prison, he was like in the 60s, legit. So I just went to part up on my granddad. They were like, your dad, you know, your dad went to court,

and they came. I'm like, really? I was a man too old to keep getting in there. Truby, you know what I'm saying? So my dad got to prison. I don't know, maybe two or three years. So I'm like, by this time, I got a house. I got my own house.

And I'm doing the rap. And I've been writing him telling them, I'm doing this rap thing. But he's not really getting it. And I'm really not probably explaining it well because I'm not a superstar. But you know what I'm saying? But I'm still hustling too a little bit

and I'm doing my rap thing. So when he get out, me and Keisha and my mom, we go pick him up in prison. And he got like stuff he wanted to do soon as he get out. He need a cell phone. He need a suit. He just need, you know, he need a bank account because he got some money, put all this stuff.

So he gets out. You know, I'm moving in with me. Like, so the first seven years, we stayed together. And like the last seven years of his life, we stayed together. So he's, you know, he's staying at the house. And my pop started, like, hanging with my friends. At the studio, I'm telling you about when we hustling and all this, I would literally get there.

My pop car already be there. When my friends put him to the side, you know, your dad is, he's back hustling again. I'm like, this is just crazy to me. You know what I'm saying? Like, he's taking it, getting this little package, driving out of time with it. And so when my daddy got out, I bought him like this. It was like 3500. It was like a Ford tourist, like a whatever.

I go on the road and I come back and it's this Cadillac in my driveway with a red boat. I'm so naive. I don't know who car this is. It can't be. So I'm walking to how. Akees who caught out of here? She said, I still don't get it. Of course, she's mad because Pop ain't paying no bills.

And he in here coming back with new Cadillac, CTSs. And I come up, man, who car this is he? Like, it's mine. What a car bought you? He snaps on him. Well, I'm sending something here. I'm riding around on fourth door, but I think this is. Boy, I've been in jail.

I'm trying, you know, he gets on me. Like, I'm trying to live. I ain't going to be living too much long. I was like, hey, brother, congratulations on your car. You know what I'm saying? He gets his car. He gets his car. He gets a black one.

He trades that didn't get a white one. Pop doing good. Got his own. He's doing very, very good. And then he goes through, I don't know. He went to, like, Alabama for like two weeks. Did not tell me why. I just said, I'm straight.

Don't come looking for him. When he gets back, my dad always kept his shirt off. Like, he, so he has this long, um, the heart on this side. He has his long incision from, like, on his chest. He's laying down. So I'm looking, I'm like, where do you get that from? He's like, had a little procedure done. Oh, my goodness.

I'm like, it was weird. But so he had this red pillow, heart pillow. pillow that had signatures on it. I'm looking at the pillow. They're like, you better not come reading. They have nurses saying all this little stuff about them on this pillow. So fast forward that I have a friend that's a doctor. And for some reason, this little red pillow came up.

And she says, basically, that's not a good sign. In order to get that pillar, you have to go through a real procedure. Like this is like, you don't just get this from going in. And usually people who get that Don't live that much long. I lose this friend. Not friends with him. I don't think we talk.

You're talking about, you know. Get mad. Get back. Popstar, going through whatever he's going through. He ended up being in the hospital. So I talk to him. I say, I'm in there with him for like, I don't know, a week or two.

And maybe a week. It was a week. And I had a show in Savannah, Georgia, which is a couple of hours from Atlanta. Georgia. I sent my whole team and I said, I had been living, staying in the hospital with my dad. I said, if he says, cool, I'll be down there later. I'm in the hospital with him. I say, hey, pops, I got a showdown of Savannah. He said, oh, man, you know, he says, I ain't about to die no time soon. This is where it came out of his mouth. He says, I ain't about to die no time soon. So I said, oh, okay.

And then the next thing he says is, because he's sarcastic, he says, the dope man is my mom. role model because I had a song that said The Dope Man was my role. So when he say that, I'm like, oh, man, I give him a fist pound. When I give him a fist pound, he says, Do it Big Eps. That's our last night. I never, I can see the fist in my head. I remember fishing him down. He said, do it big Eps.

I go do the show in Savannah. When I come back, the man on a, a breathe, I never talked to him again. He breathed on some. So I come in, I, what's happening? They said, around 2 o'clock he started losing. It was just weird as hell because he just told me at 10 and 11, that boy, I come back. And so this way, it got really hard for me. He's trying to take the tubes out his mouth.

And if you take the nurse is saying, if you take him out, you could die this way. So they want to do what? Handcuff him to the bed. I know this man don't want to be handcuffed because I just know he don't, right? To this day, and I can't really even put myself there, I can see him looking at. I can see him looking at me saying, Don't do that. If you don't have him take the,

but he can't say he just, but I see him looking at him, I'm reading his. So I say, take him off, man, take it off. And they say, you should. Take them handcuffs. You know, literally real,

I've never seen it for real handcuffs. Like he doesn't, you know, take him off. And it's a natural reaction, I guess, because some in his throat that go back and try to get, man, Mr. Obama,

I do this, like four or five times. Put the handcuffs back on. Take the handcuffs out. Just don't even know what to do. I'm like, you know, I tell you all, I'll listen to the boss of my head. At this time, I don't have no. I'm looking at it.

I'm trying to look. I'm looking. I'm like, I don't know what to do. And it was just that emotion. Yeah, yeah. Something I never just want to recreate. But that emotion, eventually, you know, he started losing oxygen. And the nurse came in and did everything they did.

And, you know, she comes out and she says, you know, if we keep doing that, he's not going to be with a vegetable. He won't be able to, you know, he won't be able to, you know, cognitive this. And we already broke a couple of his ribs. And I don't care. And, you know, she'd come out the next time she said, listen, I lost my father, too. I don't want to hear it. You know, I knew where she was going.

Yeah. And it's just me. I don't have my mom. You know, so I'm mad at my mom. Like, why you didn't come up here? Keisha is asleep. And I had to just, like, deal with that whole thing alone, just a hymn. going from...

Yeah, making that call. Instead of going from zero to 60, it's like breaking, going from 60 down to zero. You know what I'm saying? Just being a part of that. And so that's why I felt like it was appropriate to align that song

with this book because I use a lot of his lessons and some experiences that we shared together in there. And so, I mean, I come up with this idea. I'm like, man, I really like that Luther song. And it makes it feel like... You know, me and my dad never danced together or anything like that.

But we smoked together. We hung out together. laugh together. And so I did that song and my mom was like, my mom, like, what you're trying to do? You know, that was my husband. Now you're trying to make me cry over here and stuff like that. So it's been like, you know, a little joke in the house. And then I played it for my kids.

Having met my dad, the other two kids did not meet my dad. So like my 10-year-old son, like, oh, man, that's the whole story right there. You know what I mean? So it's just something that I feel like, I feel like, I feel like. I feel like it'll do well because it's relatable, but I didn't necessarily do the song for it to be a hit. Be a club banger or nothing like that. Yeah.

That wasn't. This is your fourth therapy. Yeah, it was. I mean, it just flowed. It just flows straight through. The second verse is, it flows the same way. It just flows straight through. And, yeah, so this song is, you know, I would say, consider it my.

Well, it's another thing that, you know, it's like, even normalizing how you found out about your, I mean, that's a crazy way to find out that your father was dying, you know, that he never, ever fully told you that he was having heart failure. And so you didn't have time to process, you know. So, of course, you're going to be like, he was just alive. Yeah, he just told me.

He was just fine. It's like, how could this happen? What y'all? You know how it is. Y'all killed them. You know how black folks. I'm gonna sue this off. Y'all have built you.

They say this hospital ain't. I knew I shouldn't. Just everything, man, when it really just be their time going in, like, a lot of time, like, I've lost. So it's, it's, you lose, you lose, you, I've lost people with that situation. My dad was like the boys don't cry type of dude. Yeah. You know, what you're crying, this holding back to you. just about the pass out holding back tears around him.

And then just like when that happened, man, it just was bad. Everything that was back. I need a windshield white. I literally could not see. I just remember sitting in the car just being like, because he's really like my best friend. I asked my dad questions that I want,

I asked him something because I know he wouldn't judge me, that I wouldn't even like say to a friend of mine, you know what I'm saying? So anyway, that's been missing. That happened and I buried, well, he got cremated, but we had his funeral on July 4th, 22. 12. So it's been a long time. July 4th is my oldest daughter's birthday. Really? I was in

some church just booing away. I don't even remember how I up of it. They say people and this is the thing. I learned this man dead. They're talking about, yeah, man he played football. He played football. Hey, we did. You know, you just be hearing stuff coming in and I'm hearing them people talking. I heard

because he never, he was one of them people that, you know how the dad is was so hard back there. They couldn't really say they couldn't tell you they was proud. He's just bragging all these. other folks. I'm like, this man, never told me this study. Like, boy, your daddy

used to come to the house and, boy, and I'm just sitting there just like, so that was, like, it was an experience that I never, I wouldn't wish that on nobody, but it's inevitable. You know what I'm saying? It was inevitable.

It had to happen. And it definitely made me stronger. And we appreciate you sharing it, man. It's a... Man, you are... I think I got something for y'all, though, because it's a thing. I got this book that deals with art.

And I got the song. that I just played. And where is this Ernest around? I might have something for y'all. I wanted to leave y'all with something like this before I go. Oh my God.

Yeah, so this is art too. And I think I wanted to share this with you guys because Father's the day is a pissing. Oh, dude. Yeah. So. Oh, man. Yeah, man.

So. You're trying to make me cry. Hey, bro. They say it's therapeutic to get. one out here and there. So I think this is dope. How'd you get that? She's from LA, too.

Ubami. She's from LA. Favorite favorite, favorite photographs. I mean, he looks like the guy that did centers a little bit with his mustache. Ryan Coogler. That's what you want to.

He kind of looks. But at the end of the day, I wanted to give you guys something because honestly, I never thought I would be on a platform like this from my book. I never, it never crossed my life. Man, that's you're too kind, too kind. You are, you are one of one.

Thank you. You really are. I mean, this is one of our favorite pictures. This is one of our favorite pictures. You can see why, he got everything in it. Mm-hmm. That everything in it. Oh, my gosh.

Wow. I'm going to be teared up. Thank you for that. Thank you for that. You're welcome. Man, it's, it's been a gift to spend this time with you. Thank you. You know, this was a gift. This was a gift to us.

It's going to be a gift to everybody who's going to see this. You are a special man. Congratulations on everything. You know, and just keep being you. Thank you. You know, keep sharing your wisdom. You're going to help a lot of people, you know, in another format. You're already to do that through your music.

And it's just been a real pleasure. Thank you. Thank you. This back-to-school season, spend less on your kids with Amazon. You know, one thing nobody prepares you for when you have kids is how quickly they go through school supplies. I cannot imagine when I was growing up going through backpacks as quickly as my kids do nowadays.

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