IMO with Michelle Obama and Craig Robinson - IMO Live: Choose Yourself with Natasha Rothwell

Episode Date: September 10, 2025

Natasha Rothwell joins the podcast for a live taping at Martha's Vineyard African American Film Festival. She discusses her Emmy-nominated role in The White Lotus, finding her comedic path while living in Tokyo, and how being “neurospicy” has shaped her approach to life. Plus, Michelle and Craig play matchmaker!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

I think in my 20s, I thought that romantic love was more important than any other kind of love, platonic, fraternal, familial. While it's something that I want, I know it has to match this amazing life that I've worked so hard to build. That's a great point. You know what I mean? That's a great point. Yeah. And when you remember that point, would anybody be upset if we introduced you to somebody?

What do you introduce me? God is good. This episode is brought to you by Rivian and Progressive Insurance. Well, hey y'all. See, this is really like being at home, being here in Martha's Vineyard. It is. Well, welcome my big brother, Craig Robinson, to the happiest place on the planet. Martha's Vineyard.

If I had known it's like this, I'd have been here before sooner. I've been trying to get you to adjust your attitude and get here more regularly. Wow. Appreciate you all. Thank you very much. And to Stephanie and Floyd and all the team at the film festival, you all thank you for putting this together. When we started IMO, you know when I come to the venue, I don't like to work. But I thought there's no way we could do this and be doing lives and not bring it here

to my favorite place on the planet. So thank you all for coming out and for the film festival team. How you doing? I'm good. How are you? You're looking snazzy. Yeah, well, I'm going to talk about my snaz in a minute. Okay, all right.

You're quite pleased with yourself. I appreciate my sister, because whenever we come out here, she sort of lets me run free, because if I try and go places with her, we end up not being able to go anywhere. Oh, poor you. So she let me drive her car.

Because y'all, I can drive here on the vineyard. So, you know, you all have heard, if, for those of you have heard the podcast, you know, we were gifted Rivians. You didn't know that. It's pretty nice. Makes it all worthwhile, doesn't it? She let me drive hers. around the island, and I got to take some pictures. And, you know, I might have to adjust my vacation plans.

You should, you know? You've got to make this a regular stop. So we're counting on it. We are counting on it. But you do look nice. You like my fit? Yes. Do you like my fit?

You do look nice. This is the Oak Bluffs collection. And we want to thank Ralph Lauren for our sponsors of today's event. I am wearing Ralph Lauren neck to ankle, by the way. It's all. And this is, y'all, ladies, this is a leather boostier. I started to wear it without the shirt. She didn't have the nerve, though.

But it's cute, y'all. This fits really nicely. And I think I'm quite cute in it. She's very cute, very cute. I'm not as cute. but I'm harder to fit because I'm 6-6. I got long arms, long legs. They sent this to me right off the rack.

Off the rack. So keep that in mind for those tall folks out there, too. This is a great campaign. Well, the beautiful thing about this collection is that it highlights everything that we know is beautiful about this island, about oak bluffs. The campaign, if you all haven't seen it, the video, many of our young people,

the young people from the island help create that ad, and it's a real celebration of what is best about this place. You all, maybe you know, but Barack and I have been coming here for more than 35 years. This has been, before we were the Obamas, and we've lived probably everywhere on the island. We raised our girls here, Sasha is here. All of, you know, this is a special,

place for us because as you all know this is where we come to enjoy being us and I think if you have kids and kids of color as you all know having them be able to be on this island where they can be free and they can roam and go into Oak

Bluffs and be in town and hang out without anybody messing with them and have some freedom. I love this island and if my brother gets a little more sense he will come more often himself. We have been coming now for the last five or so years and it's been

off and on, yeah. It's been, it's not, it's been every year, every year. My son's here, he likes it here. He was sleeping by the pool today. But no, it's really, I mean, just downtown, downtown Oak Bluffs, downtown Egerton. I'm slowly learning that each place... Slowly learning is the way around. We went on Barnes Road and Craig was like, is that the airport? I was like, yes again.

It's still the airport. But if you don't come here regularly, it can be confusing. And he's so surprised. It's like there's an airport. It's like, this is where the airport is. It wasn't that I was surprised. I was surprised that we were back that direction.

It's an island. At some point, you're going to get back to the same direction over and over. again. You see what I have to put up with? You know, I am the oldest. Well, anyway, we've got stuff to do, right? We have a guest for you all. And I am excited because I feel like I know Natasha already from everything she does on TV. She is an Emmy-nominated actress, writer, executive producer,

and of the series How to Die Alone. She's also known for her roles on Insecure, which the Robinsons and Obama's watched. And our kids watched it too with us, and it was great lessons to learn for my young men. And most recently, she's in White Lotus. It was, but in White Lotus. Go ahead, clap it up.

Now, I have to confess, I didn't know she was in White Lotus because I didn't watch White Lotus, but in preparation for this, now I can't stop watching White Lotus. You watch it too, though, don't you? I watch everything. And she also has a company,

Big Haddy Productions, that develops bold, inclusive stories that center around underrepresented voices, and she was recently announced to produce, write, and star in the adaptation of the viral TikTok story called Who the F-F? Did I marry? Can't wait for that one.

So without further ado, let's get Natasha out here, please. Natasha Rothwaite have been so excited to talk to you. We've been talking about you for weeks and weeks and weeks, and I feel like I know you. I told Natasha, she is now a cousin. It's like, cousin Natasha. So welcome, welcome to IMO. Thank you for being here.

Welcome to the vineyard. Yeah. This is my second time. Okay. When was the first time you were years? Well, this is my first time like all over because it's with you. So this might as well be the first time. You see how nice she's being in Natasha?

She hadn't been as much as I've been here. Well, how has it been? Have you been able to taste any of the fruits of Martha's Vineyard? Are you in and out? I got it yesterday, so I plan on doing a lot of tasting tomorrow. Yes, you've got to get a lobster roll. I've got to get the lobster roll. Some shrimp.

I'm going to drive by the airport. It's fascinating. No, actually, one of the best place to get fried shrimp is at the airport. Oh. There's great food at the airport. in the airport area. A great breakfast at the airport. Oh, no.

What do you know about the breakfast? Same. Uh-huh. Because I'm always coming in to see you. That's how I know. One of my favorite scenes in this season of White Lotus, and for those of you, you guys have had to have seen White Lotus.

But Belinda returns, and we love Belinda. We do. Can you talk a little bit about what Belinda is now doing? in White Lotus before I talk about my favorite scene. Well, season one, we see her, and she's with Jennifer Coolidge's character, Tanya, and she gets lied to. And so this is kind of her victory lap. She gets to come back, go to Thailand, learn more about the craft of massage, has a little fling, and gets to...

I don't want to ruin it for people who haven't seen it, but if you haven't seen it by it, now that's all all. The man who is responsible for killing Tanya, she's able to hustle a little $5 million out of that.

Yeah. Yeah. But not only does Belinda get a groove thing on, but one of my favorite scenes is because this is this luxury resort and the scene where you're having tea or lunch by yourself

and you spot a black couple. Yeah. And most of us know when you're doing something really nice, somewhere special, and you see other black people? Yeah. And you got that... We know each other.

I love that part. I pitched that to Mike. He's such a collaborative writer-director. And season one, we started working together because he's very aware that he's not a black woman. So in writing the character, I wanted to infuse that authenticity. And when we were working on season three,

I was just like, Mike, there has to be a moment where Belinda sees someone who looks looks like her and almost seeing what's possible for herself because she's there under work, you know, circumstances, but that couple's there just for them. And so just to have that look, make the cut, because you never know when you shoot something if it's actually going to make the cut. I was so thrilled. And so many people bring that moment up because it's just authentic to the experience. Well, it tells the whole, a fuller story of what it means to be black. We leisure. We travel. We leisure.

And we leisure all up and down Martha's Vineyard, don't we? Yeah. And that's one of the beautiful things to see that, you know, we got to make sure the rest of the world knows that we are traveled and exposed and we do things besides serve other people. That's right. That's right. So, so glad to have you here.

But I want folks to get to know you, know you, because you've got an interesting background. I didn't realize that you were a military kid. That's right. Traveled around. And I don't know if you know, but as First Lady, I spent a lot of time lifting up military families just like yours. And I just want to thank you, your family, for your service.

Absolutely. I'm always curious about how that experience has shaped you as a person, because you moved around a lot. I moved around a ton. Do you view yourself as a military? kid. Absolutely. I'm an Air Force brat. My dad retired as commander at Fort Dix in New Jersey and clock it. But moving around, you know, I went to two high schools, two middle schools, two elementary schools, and it's all I knew, but the nucleus of the family that was home.

So it really hit home for me that it's not a place that's home, it's the people. And that has always stayed with me. And I do think that that upbringing uniquely prepared me for the life of an artist because I pick up and move all the time. I was in Thailand for six months and shot in London for five months before that and then Toronto five months before that. And so being able to move some place, connect, establish a family and create memories and to let go of that and to move on, it's all I know. So it definitely prepared me for my life as it is now. But I think my adult life has been one of trying to find roots, you know, like to plant myself someplace. And I still get a little antsy.

But I'm in L.A. right now, and that feels like where, you know, the roots are. And, you know, just listening to you, you kind of describe yourself as an introvert, right? Very much. I mean, we wouldn't be able to see that in you. Oh, I am. What kind of, were you always that way? you, were you that kid in the family? Like, for me and Craig, Craig was the outside.

Outside. He was always trying to be outside. And it took me a second to be ready to deal with other kids, because kids were a hassle, you know? Yeah. She was an introvert. Yeah. Until I decided, I need to go outside, right? Because nobody's here, so let me get outside. It's just me.

You got to go outside eventually. You got to go outside eventually. No, I'm an introverted extrovert. I know how to show up publicly, but it is a draining exercise to be around people. Oh, a lot of people are relating. Yeah. So I recharge alone. I love my me time.

And so as I've gotten older, I have to be really conscious about who I'm spending that time with, because that's an expenditure of energy that I've stored up. And so if I'm going to go out, it has to be worth it, right? The juice has to be worth the squeeze. And not everybody's worth the squeeze. That's something I've learned as I've gotten older, but I'm very neurosy. And so for me...

Oh, tell us more about that. I have ADHD and a little toe on the tism. I don't have, like, my neuropsychologist was just like, you got toe on a tism, but you're not quite there. But I have a unique way about seeing the world and having the language of that as an adult has been immensely helpful because when I was younger, I mean,

I didn't get diagnosed until last year. And so my life up until that point has been understanding that I've been spicy but not knowing the exact flavor. And now that I do, it's allowed me to tap into communities who are also ADHD and, you know, explore symptoms of being on the spectrum.

And, yeah, you find the community, and it's been easier for me to advocate for my needs because I no longer think it's just a moral failure that I need you to repeat yourself. You know, it's now, oh, if I'm in front of you and you're giving me verbal directions, I may need you to repeat yourself or give me written directions or instructions.

And I can now do those things with a sense of pride as opposed of shame beforehand because I thought, you know, if I were only, you know, more disciplined, if I was, you know, if I paid better attention. So the diagnoses definitely helped me stand in my power because I do feel like all of the spiciness in that whatever you possess is a superpower. Yeah.

Hope you're enjoying our special live episode taped here on Martha's Vineyard. You all heard me talking about how I've been tooling around town and my sister's R1S, which Rivian Giffithed us. And I have to tell you, Mish, I had such a blast. I drove around the island. I stopped off at the harbor where all the personal boats go in and kind of showed the Rivian off a little bit and had a couple of guys toot their horn. Like, nice car. There are a lot of Rivian drivers on the island.

Yeah. And then we went by that hotel that's where you can see the lighthouse. Harbor View Inn. Harbor View Inn. That's it. And hung out there. And I thought about going in to get a cup of coffee, but I didn't want to leave your car out there by itself. I appreciate that.

But the best part was I was in. downtown Edgartown. And you know how hard it is to park on those little narrow streets? Narrow streets, little bitty spaces. Man, so we were right across from the bookstore and lo and behold, this guy pulls out. And I'm like, I'm on parking there. And I start parallel parking. And I'm using all six of the cameras, right?

And I'm worried that I'm going to scratch up your car. And I was like, you can't borrow your sister's car and then scratch it up. You can't get the first ding on the car. No, no. But I-exceptible. I squeeze that baby in there. Perfect. There's like three inches in the front, three inches in the back. And the guy behind me was waiting patiently. And as he goes by, he slows down and he gives me the old thumbs up. Like, nice park job, buddy. You think he just wasn't happy to see Arrivian?

You think it was your parking job? No, it was totally the parking job. Okay, fair enough. But I got to tell you, when Aaron and I have been riding around town, we absolutely see what you see when you, why you come here so often. Yeah, finally. I mean, this is a beautiful place, and it's the perfect place to own Arrivian because it's family, fun, and activity.

I mean, the girls, when they come here, the first thing they do is get in that. that car. They go to the beach. They use the, you know, the ice bucket. They're, you know, the cooler in the front. They use it more than me. But this is, this is the place where Rivians come to thrive. And we're so happy to have our Rivian here. This is beautiful island, beautiful community. And people enjoy their cars here. We'll be coming back and we'll be using it. too. We've had a blast this week on Martha's Vineyard and have loved exploring the island in

the Rivian. Go learn more about Rivian's full lineup of Adventure Ready, All Electric Trucks and SUVs at Rivian.com. So Natasha, you, go ahead. Yeah, clap it up. Yeah. So now that

you've been diagnosed and you look back on your upbringing, how did that, at what point, do you think that came into play in you becoming an artist? A huge amount. Well, one, when I do look back, it is, it's tinged with grief because there's a huge part of myself when I was younger

that really felt like I was working so hard to mask. The energy I expended to show up and not be trouble for you. the teacher, like, you know, cause an issue. But also, I recognize my strength in that as well because I was able to manage. I do think that having the diagnoses now and looking back, it's clear to me that, you know, for boys, the ADHD of it, it's external, but for a lot of women, especially black women, it's internal. So I had a vivid, robust inner world. And so when I put pin to page, it was like the faucet got turned on. And I could, you know, I would write these characters and I would be able to

tap into these vivid, um, world building, you know, exercises that I, you know, luckily I had theater departments and in my elementary and middle schools and high schools. And so, um, it unlocked that in me and gave me permission to be that free, with my thinking. And so it really made sense of me as a person, the creative arts. And I think for a lot of people who experience the world differently,

I do think that arts are an amazing place to sort of find your voice because there is that freedom to explore. And it is so powerful, absolutely. Natasha, for you to share your story, your diagnosis as an adult as a black woman, because our community, sometimes we, you know, we don't, we're afraid to own the neurodiversity

that runs throughout the entire population, but because of sometimes our beliefs that we don't, we don't want to embrace that. And I think that it's so important for black parents, black families, to understand that, you know, our kids do come in all shape, sizes, and colors. And it's, there's no, there's no shame in being able to diagnose it. treat it, parent it properly. Yeah. And if we're not talking about it. That's why I try to use my platform to talk about not just the ADHD,

but I also have anxiety, depression. Triple threat. Way to go, we're on. Achiever. Because I think that, like, one, you know, name it to dis-shame it, you know? And so for me, I have to be able to talk about my experience. And so many people have come up to me, especially women of color, are just like, oh no I have anxiety, depression too.

And I was like, amazing. Are you on spectrum? Let's talk about it. I think the more we talk about it, it becomes less of a stigma. We just stigmatize it by living our experience. And so if that's one thing I can do with the form I've been given, I'm happy to do it. Absolutely. You also have parents that have been married for four to seven years.

Fort of seven years. Fort of seven years. That's wonderful. They're on a cruise right now. Oh, tell him we said, hey. Oh, my goodness. They are so, like, I've done some things in my life. This is, my parents are just, like, they're just like,

this is the most important thing you have ever done. So they will be thrilled. We're going to take a picture, send it to them. Oh, my goodness. But 47 years of marriage growing up, one of three siblings. Four. Yeah, I have three siblings, yeah. Okay.

What have you learned from your parents' parents? long marriage. What does that talk you about love, about what you want in life? I mean, it's not the entire reason, but I would say it plays a part in the reason why I'm happily single now because I've seen love that is worthy and I know what I want. Yes. Everyone take a pause on that. Yes. And in 47 years, I'm going to try to not to get emotional when I talk about this, but their love looks different. We got tissues. Now you got tissues.

Their love looks different now. It looks like, you know, my mom knowing my dad's medication when he forgets. It's, you know, my dad holding my mom's purse while she's picking up his, you know, prescription at the doctor. It's, it's, they know each other intimately and they love to support each other. And it's a beautiful thing to observe, but I do think that it, when I was younger, I pounded oppressive. I was just like my other friend's parents were, you know, divorced,

and I was just like, I just want permission to go wild. And they're just like, now we good. You got no excuse. No excuse. But no, it's an amazing model to have, and it's work. I've seen the work. Like, they don't, they show their work in the math problem that is love. They're just like, we talk to each other.

We have hard conversations. And yeah, they're just wonderful role models. But yet, you feel fully empowered to embrace being single out here. A hundred percent. A hundred percent. I am childless by choice. I don't want kids. And I have two amazing dogs.

And I have a beautiful house that I nicknamed my Peace Palace. And I have so much love in my life. And I think in my 20s, I thought that romantic love was more important than any other kind of love, platonic, fraternal, familial. And as I've gotten older and being single, it has highlighted and elevate the other kinds of love that is in my life. And it's abundant. And so if I hyperfixate on romantic love, I ignore the rest, my life is hollow. And so I'm really, I feel like my life is full and romantic love while it's something that I want. I know it has to match this amazing life that I've worked so hard to build.

And you know what I mean? That's a great point. Yeah. And remember that point. Would anybody be upset if we introduced you to somebody? What's he doing? Introduce me. God is good.

God is good. That's right. To answer your question, I would love to be set up. Okay. Okay. So what, do you have somebody in mind? That's not your business. You married.

You married. We're going to be at the airport having a conversation. She married, even though a lot of people think y'all ain't married. She married. Let me handle my side of this discussion, please. Okay. Oh, my God. It's Christmas.

But I like this conversation about owning being able to love yourself, especially as women, especially as black women, because sometimes, and we could talk all about this, sometimes we don't have the choice to be chosen, you know? And I am, you know, I am tired of so many amazing black women waiting to feel worthy because somebody hasn't chose them or they haven't chosen somebody. And I'm trying to instill in my daughters right now

that marriage should be a choice. And sometimes we send, subliminal messages to our kids. They could be doing great things. And it's like, well, are you dating anyone? Yeah. You know, or you could be conquering the world and it's like, well, you're going to have a baby. Right.

You know, all the while sending the message that who you are isn't good enough until you are partnered, paired off and pregnant. Yes. I do not, and I do not believe that romantic love is a prerequisite

for living your life. I And I think so often And you know my parents are 47 years married They're traditional you know And so for them It took a minute for them to understand That like no I'm buying my house myself You know like I'm doing these things because that's living my life

I'm going to vacation when I want a vacation Yes But there was a point in my life where I was like I remember when I lived in New York City It was very romantic thing to walk across the Brooklyn Bridge And so when I moved there was like I'm going to save it for a romantic date And it's going to and then like

luckily that was around the time I started therapy and by the time I left New York I took my damn self across the bridge. Really? Yes. I had a great time and that was eye-opening because I do think that there is this idea of waiting and that your not enoughness will persist

until you have someone else to see you. See yourself. See each other. Like there's no reason why joy can't be present now with where you are. This segment is brought to you by progressive insurance, a brand who believes that everyone should have the access and opportunity

to own a home. What are some of the first that we were able to accomplish in our family? What were some of our first? Well, I was probably the first first lady in our family. You were the first person to get drafted by the NBA in our family. Yes, I sure was. And the first to actually play professionally overseas. Right. Right. We were the first in our family. to graduate from Ivy League schools. You were the first person in our family to live abroad. Oh, that's a good one. That's a good one.

We are the first people in our family to have our own amazing brother-sister podcast. Yes. And that has been an amazing first for us. That's been a really fun first. That's been a really fun first. And it feels like it's a first that the whole family can celebrate. Because, you know, everyone is giving us ideas and opinions. Yes.

And it has been really fun spending time hanging out together. And, you know, it feels like we haven't been together in a long time. And we've just been apart for about a couple of months, which was no time. That was nothing in the past. And the thing about being the first is that sometimes it can be a little scary. Like starting this podcast, even though we're having a lot of fun, we've never done this before. And there was a little trepidation about how is it going to work

or people going to enjoy it. Are we going to have enough to say week after week? Can we get guests? Can we get guests? Will anybody come and talk to us? So the first come with a lot of fear, but a lot of excitement and a lot of reward. So we recommend being the first.

And for a lot of folks, that first might be buying a home, something no one in their family has done before. Home ownership is more than just buying a house. It's about creating opportunities. That's where Progressive comes in. Through a $7 million commitment to housing initiatives in 2024, and the recent creation of a down payment-payment assistant program called the U.S. payment. Progressive is helping people attain their first homes, maintain them through life's challenges, and build generational wealth. Homeownership isn't just a milestone. It can be your first step in changing your family's financial future. If you're ready to make your first move,

visit progressive.com slash open the house to find helpful resources and educational tools for every step of the home ownership journey. Progressive Insurance is here to help you open the door. So I've heard you talk about, or I should say, I've read you talk about unlearning how to be a people pleaser. Yeah. When you hear the umps out there because there's quite a few people pleasers. And sometimes culturally you have to be a people pleaser.

Sure. But tell us how you went about systematically unlearning that. It's a daily practice. I mean, I grew up in the church, and martyrdom is the best thing you can be. You know, like you can be a needless wonder and be praised for it in the church. And I think for me, it was recognizing that in my deference for other people's needs, in my recognizing and being attuned to other people's physical and emotional needs, I have to put myself at the top of that list.

And inserting myself into that conversation was very difficult. It came, I mean, it got so bad when I was, this was when I was a teenager. I was a vegetarian for 12 years, but now I love a burger. They're delicious. At the time, I was visiting a friend's house and their mom made like chicken enchiladas, and I ate the chicken while being a vegetarian, because that's how bad my people-pleasing was. I was so scared to be an imposition, and my needs are not an imposition. Yeah.

And it was recognizing the importance of honoring my needs and the company of other people, not just when I'm by myself. And I do think that being able to articulate my needs and standing and backing myself has been a huge part of the process. No, I don't want the chicken angeloise. Like, thank you. Thank you so much. But also I think there's this fear.

that if you make someone unhappy, you're responsible for their joy. Can you say that again? You feel like you're responsible for others' people's happiness if you aren't pleasing them. And that's on them. That is on them.

And so it definitely, it's a process because it's like a phantom limb. Even though I've let it go, I can still feel it creep up. But now I can recognize it in real, time and really pause. I really, if folks are struggling, pause before and check in with yourself. In the authenticity of who you are, is this a decision that I want, that I need,

before you say yes to something, before you do anything. And I've definitely taken the mantra in terms of like my life in Hollywood. There's no in the middle, it's either a hell yes or a hell no. And that has also helped me to be like, I really want to do this. I have to check in with myself. but stillness has been a huge antidote to people-pleasing because I'm able to put that stopgap into, you know, being quick to make sure their feelings are okay.

So you are an introverted people-pleaser. My therapist is well-aid. And you work in Hollywood. I do. Pick the right place, right? How did, you know, how did your, sort of life lead you into what you're doing now? What was that path like for you because you've had some interesting stops a long way? I had no aspirations for Hollywood. I thought I was going to be a

Broadway theater actor. I thought me and Audrey McDonald's would be best friends. And I just loved performing so much. I went to college for acting, but I would write my audition model. So writing was a huge part of my process as well. And again, to get spiritual with it, I knew from that moment of, you know, walking across that stage of my degree in acting, that was walking in my purpose, that I knew that I was doing something I had been called to do. And it was scary, you know, I was very, very broke in New York, and then it's very scary to leave New York to go to L.A. but I do feel that every, when I look back at my career, each one of those doors I didn't open myself

and that I was really listening to my creative self as I was putting pen to page or auditioning for something. And I'm grateful for that because it's a career that's very unexpected and nothing that I could have planned even if I wanted to. And I also had to sort of reimathing. dreams for myself because my dreams were too small. Really? What were some of the, how did you talk a bit more about that? Yeah, I think, you know, for me, I was just like, oh, I'd love to do a play one day, you know?

I didn't know I would be, you know, creating my own show. I didn't know I'd be a writer on ESA show or B Kelly. I didn't know White Lotus was in the future or Wanka or anything else. So when I achieved what I thought was big, I was like, well, damn. I need to be like, what do I really? want. And when I realized that my career had given me a position of power and influence, that's when I created my production company, because I know that I am drawn to, even before I had decision or agency in my career, I was drawn to characters and stories that centered marginalized voices, that uplifted the stories that were usually relegated to the sidelines. So I was like, oh, yeah, that's how I dream bigger for myself. I create a company. I help us. I help us.

other artists who have stories to tell and give them that platform. And that's been a huge dream realized that I'm still in the process of realizing. And I think for me, it's, again, pause, taking a step back and being really deliberate about the things I decide to do. Because time is short. And I want to make sure I invest the gifts I've been given in a way that will continue to yield. So can you talk about deliberate? How on earth, now you all probably don't know this, but you spent time in Japan.

Mm-hmm. That was what jumped off the page to me. I was like, what? And this wasn't in your moving around as an Air Force brat. No. You went there to do what? Can you tell us about that whole situation? Yeah, I was in.

my 20s and I had finished college. I was working in D.C. acting and working at Willie Mammoth Theater and studio theater and really trying to figure out D.C. And I'd finished that and I knew I wanted to go to New York, but I didn't feel like I had lived a lot of life. And so I was like, oh, I want an adventure. And I was trying to go to London and be on my Black Bridge of Jones. That didn't work.

I had trouble getting a visa there, so my search for adventure moved further and further east. And I know Japan has like the Jet Program, which is their big teaching English program, but I didn't do that. I found a tiny, tiny-ass school that wanted someone with a theatrical background to perform conversations with students.

I was like, well, I'm an actor, and I can do that. And part of my hustle gig in D.C. was being a teaching artist at Arena Stage, So I had taught kids. And so I said yes to this program because they would sponsor my visa and fly me out. I would have to fly myself back. I would have to figure out rent

and all that kind of stuff. And I jumped on it. And it was a part-time job. And there's a Tokyo Comedy Store, which is equivalent to boom Chicago for comedy folks. It's like this comedy theater at the Crocodile Club in Tokyo. They found out that I was like a ringer for improv comedy and they're like, would you

be a part of this program? So I did that part time and taught part time and was black in Japan. It was crazy. And this was English in Japan. Yeah. Yeah. So you did improv. English and English. Yeah.

What was your biggest joke? What landed? What landed? What made them laugh? I will say, I don't remember a specific joke, but I'm so appreciative of the experience because the audience was filled with expats, not just U.S. expats, but like English speakers from all walks of life all over the world. And so I couldn't come to them with my like funny DC comedy, like, you know, summer intern on the hill joke because they wouldn't get that. They understood universal humor.

They understood when the, you know, the employee has a higher status than the boss. That's funny. So it really taught me about like what is universally funny and how do you? you communicate that across language barriers. But yeah, I don't remember any specific jokes, but they loved it when it was just like, you come in with the broom and someone is like, you know, looking like they're the boss

and then you hit them in the head or whatever. If you exert power and subvert expectations, that was a big laugh always. And being black in Asia, right? That's wow. I mean, that's a whole situation. We've spent time in Asia, and I can tell you, you know,

even with Secret Service or whatever, we, you know. Can I tell you? Quite an experience. You were a part of my Japanese experience. Oh, tell us more. Because I was there in 2007 into 2008. And so I was in my apartment, and my dad had the phone to the television to get the results of the election. And so I was there listening because I couldn't get it on TV.

So I was up late and he had the phone there. And when you won, I just remember the next day I was riding my bike to teach, and people were just like, Obama! You couldn't tell us, Obama. That's why I'm here. I'm here, Obama. That's why I'm here.

True story. That is great. Did they treat you better? They did. I would go in the shops and they'd be like, Obama songs? And I was like, hi. Told you we were cousins.

Told you we were cousins. Now, how did your folks feel about it? You know, black child in creativity, you know, coming from the church, where they like, girl, you got a plan B? They didn't have a plan B. They were so supportive. And I was originally, I made drama where there was none. I originally majored in journalism because I thought that's what they would want because

a theater, you know, majoring in theater they wouldn't like. And I wrote all the time, so it made sense. And after my first semester, I remember I came home during the Christmas break and sat them down and came out as a Thesbian. And they were like, hold your head. Oh, baby. No, we're still on track, we're still on track. We'll like her. We'll like her.

And the first thing out of their mouth was just like, well, we were confused about the journalism thing. We knew you'd love to act and we want to support whatever you do. And so it was wonderfully supportive. Has there been a thing that you've done in your career that made them think, oh, this is, now we get it. This. Oh, man. Not Issa.

Sorry, Issa. You didn't count. No, Saturday Night Live was good for them. Oh, yeah. When I wrote for them, they were just like, they were, you know, fans of the show to, So to see my name on the credits, they were really excited. Tell us about you. Oh, I'm sorry.

Yeah, she's Bogart in the whole discussion. I'm sorry. I understand. She's in her favorite place with one of her favorite people. I get it. I get it. I get it. But I'm going to ask a couple of questions here.

Okay, okay. I'll stand down. So writer, actor, producer, which one do you like to do most? I don't have a favorite, but, you know, dance with the one that Brungia. Acting is such a huge part of my identity. And I do think, I had this conversation recently with Issa and Yvonne and Jay, we were all chatting. You know, so much of what we've done since then we've had to write and produce ourselves.

And that's just a lot of work, which we love to do, but it is sort of a sweat equity you put in. And so while I love that, it's amazing to go to White Lotus and just show up and do acting. and go back to my room and, you know, leave it there. So it's been fun. What's been the difference? What's the difference being in a black writer's room? I mean, that's a, you know, a address. Yes.

I went to Insecure after S&L. And at SNL, at the time I was the only black writer. in a 40-year-old institution. And I remember, and Prentice has told this story, who was the co-show running with Issa, the first day I remember raising my hand to talk.

And Prentice looked at me and he was like, why your hand up? And I was just like, oh, I just, I don't, because there were so many, it was very hierarchical at S&L where it was just like, if you're a freshman writer, You can't talk at this tape.

Like, there was a lot of rules that you had to sort of weren't told to you. You had to figure it out. And he's just like, no. He's like, you're at the table. And I remember just leaning back. And I was just like blown away by like the openness of the space. And after the first writer's room, I went to my car and sobbed. Just cried because I felt so seen.

When you walk in and there's already hot sauce and cocoa butter on the table. Oh. Say no more. Say no more. Say no more. Say no more. How did you wind up getting the insecure gig? What was the, you know?

I FaceTime with Issa from Brooklyn, my studio apartment. I was wearing what I call a human mullet. I just had fancy clothes from the waist up and pajamas on the bottom. And we FaceTime and we just connected. And so I got hired as a writer. And two weeks into the, or a month, into the writer's room, Kelly was created on the page, and we would do readings in the writer's room of the character.

And I was so focused on writing because it was my first scripted room after S&L. I didn't have any crosshairs on being on the screen. I just knew that when she would cast the writers to read the scripts aloud, she'd always cast me as Kelly. And one day she called me into her office with Prentice, and I was just like, oh, Lord, I'm in trouble.

I made one too many days. I'm done, and they're like, we want you to play Kelly. And again, I cry a lot. I cried because I was, I went from some place where I was screaming to be seen to another place that saw all of me and acknowledged all those parts. So that's the thing I credit for Issa is that I, she wasn't just like, okay, you're a writer to stay in that lane. She's just like, whatever you got I'm going to use.

And she used that part of me and that talent. And Kelly changed my life. Oh, my Kelly was my favorite character. I mean, really. I mean, was there a bond? I mean, was the girlfriend energy real? I know it always doesn't translate. Doesn't have to translate off of the screen, but just curious.

I mean, we love Issa. Lisa's been on the show. She's my girl. Love her to death. She's so real. She is so real. There's no, there's no manufacturing. that level of authenticity. And I think that I move through the world with that level of vulnerability.

And so to some people, chagrant, it can be kind of cringed to be this, you know, vulnerable, but I very much don't care. It's been wonderful to rely on each other, especially in Hollywood, because we can reach out and, yo, I'm at Fox and they're sending me this in my contract. Is that what you got? No, actually asked for this. And so there are resources as well as just being, friends. So it's been wonderful. And now you are two-time Emmy nominated. Can you believe twice?

I can't even. You're the only black woman nominated in this category this year. So congratulations. Thank you. Thank you so much. Truly, so proud. So so deserving. Thank you. So what does it feel like?

Is your life changed? Yes. Yes. I love that. Tell us more. I, and this is, this sounds so like Pollyanna, but it, I've already won. Do you know what I mean? Like, the nomination is just an acknowledgement for my peers that I've done good work. So do people really feel that? Or do you really want to win? Listen, I want hardware like everybody else. I like that. I like that. Let's be real. But I'm satiated in knowing that I've done a good job. And I think that the moment the award becomes more important than the work, I've lost the plot. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, beautiful. That's so important in all walks of life.

100%. All walks of life. Yeah, because that is fleeting, famous fleeting. That's also other, like, I did not know I would be a famous person. I had no desire to be. I just knew I would say, this is from the time when I was in high school doing theater. I was like, I want to do good work with good people. That was my, like, that's what I want.

And that being my true north has got me. here and I'm not changing that. What in your background makes you that way? Because I'm sitting here and listening to you talk about collaborating with all these different people. But I think you have to have a certain personality and a certain upbringing to be a natural team player. Yeah. Where does that come from? I mean, I think it comes from a lot of places. I think a military background, you know, that definitely has the focus. I think I've always love collaborative things. I'm one of four, you know, where you little unit, dysfunctional, but we love it. And I think for me, I get joy in that process. And that's just

always been true. That's why I've never attempted stand-up. People often confuse me for Michelle Boutteau. They're like, you just stand-up girl? I love it. Because I prefer improv, and sketch where it's just like, let's all get together and see, like, the best idea wins. It may not be mind. And so I genuinely get joy from that. And I think that like, you know, growing up the way I did and yeah, I just think that there is a, yeah, it's kind of indescribable when you see someone else light up because of something you did and then that sparks something else. There's this connectivity that makes it really present. And especially in this crowd, especially with young people, I have a young creative child.

I think a lot of young creatives, especially kids of color, young people of color, with all that's going on in the world, they wonder, is there still room for this? Is this still relevant? And I want you to talk a bit about that because I think how not to die alone, the projects that you work on,

your perspective of telling a story that doesn't get told. I just want you to speak to not just the audience here, but to all the young artists out there who might doubt that their voice matters, especially as the industry is changing. And I'd love for you to speak to that. Absolutely. It's so funny, when Insecure was on the air,

we were very on social media as a writer's room and as the actors and interfacing with audiences and, you know, being a plus-sized black woman on the show, I would get, you know, plus-sized black women hit me up and being like, well, that's not my experience. or that's not the version that I want to see. And my response was always pick up a pen.

Yeah. Pick up a pin because your perspective is just as valid and necessary. And I think now more than ever, as I limply gesture to the state of the world, we need to be inserting our voices into the narrative in a way that makes sense for us. It's such a personal thing to tell a story. And there's the quote, write what you know, right? And so you know what you know, I know what I know. And I think it's so important for also young creators to know that in their pocket is a phone.

That is a movie studio. Do not wait for someone else to give you permission to live your dream. Yeah. Do it now. I mean that. One of the biggest mistakes I made, I used to not call myself a writer until someone else did. And I had outsourced my power to someone else. So if you're a writer, right, if you're a director-director,

if you're an after act, shoot something. And it's going to be probably shitty. Because you make bad things, but you're, you know, it's, it's a, be prolific, not perfect, right? Create work enough that your bad gets good, your good gets better, and you're better is the best. And I think that there's glory in the attempt, collaborate. Yeah, there's, there's so much space at the table. and don't ever think that you have to get, you know, permission to come to it. Pull up a chair.

Pull up chair. This episode of IMO is brought to you by progressive insurance who help people move forward and live fully. Owning a home can be one of the most powerful ways to build financial security. But for many, especially first generation buyers, it can feel out of reach. That's why I appreciate what Progressive is doing. In 2024, they contributed over $7 million to help individuals and families break the cycle of renting by providing support, offering educational resources, and developing tools to build long-term financial stability through home ownership. Their work goes beyond just insurance. Their opening doors.

Through their newly created up payment program, Progressive is helping first generation homebuyers move closer to the dream of home ownership by offering eligible applicants a chance to receive a down payment assistance grant. You know, owning a home for me made me feel grounded and also set me up for the future. And as a coach, when your life is dependent on wins and losses, it's really important to have the comfort of a really nice home to come home to, especially for your family. Home ownership is one of the biggest investments you'll ever make, and Progressive wants to help more people take that life-changing step.

Learn more today at progressive.com slash open the house. This episode is brought to you by our friends at Rivian, and they're fully electric, full-sized SUVs and pickups that are designed for all of life's adventures. I have really enjoyed driving around in the R1S that Rivian outfitted our family with. I can't believe there's a full-size all-electric SUV that actually fits someone as tall and long as I am. We've done a lot of travel in the Midwest this summer, and a couple of the features that I like are, number one, they're easy to find charging stations. The Rivian app helps you with that. And here's something that's really cool. If you're not in your vehicle, there are

cameras that record any movement around your car. What's also really exciting is that Rivian just launched its all-new R1S Quad. It's Rivian's fastest, most capable vehicle yet. Four motors, one per wheel, for precision and performance on any terrain. Engineered for sharp corners, wild trails, and maximum adventure, from distinctive accents and badging to exclusive new wheels, Quad is built to stand out wherever it takes you. So when you get a chance, go check out the all-new R1S quad and all of Rivian's amazing vehicles now at Rivian.com. We're going to be jumping to the listener question, but I do want to, because this is one project. I really don't know why the F did I get married. What's the backstory to that? Because that's your next project, right?

Yes. Who the F did I marry? Oh, yeah. Who did. Yeah. To Risa Johnson, she, I mean, she put up this TikTok series on Valentine's Day. And I started watching it, but I couldn't get through the whole thing. Well, I will say a cheat code for it. Someone brilliantly put it on Spotify so you can listen to it. Okay, I'll do that. So it's a nice little, like, put it on and go on a walk. But it's one of the most radical acts of vulnerability that I've ever seen

because she goes into detail about how she married someone who was a pathological liar. and I didn't know anything about it either. I was minding my business in Thailand, doing Belinda, and my family, we got this cousin text chain with 25 of us, and they put some fan art in the text chain, and they thought it was real because they don't know. And it was a cover art for who the F did I married with me next to a very chocolate man.

And so I was like, what is this? Because I'm getting tagged in it, and people are making fan art. I was like, what is this? So I took a listen to it, and I was so moved by her story, not just for the salaciousness of the details that she recounts, and not just the fact that it got a half, like it got half a billion, 500 million impressions.

I was blown away that she fearlessly was telling the story and still believed in love after that. And so I was just like, oh, this is a beauty from ashes story. This is a phoenix rising from the ash. And there's power in that. And there's this beautiful woman who, after everything she's been through, shared her story to help someone else. So that's how we connected.

And when the rights to the story became available in Hollywood, and this just goes to my sort of walking in purpose, it was a six-way bidding war. And my big haddy productions, we're kind of fledgling. You know, there was like the Shandas and the Lee Daniels. Everyone was throwing their hat in the ring. Because to get 500 million people to sit down and watch something, Hollywood sits up and takes notice.

And so I just, I got the opportunity to FaceTime with her. And we just connected. And my team was just like, should we connect with one of the bigger pods? And I was like, no. I was like, you know, if it's meant to be, it's meant to be. And we be Shonda, y'all. We got it. So I love Shonda, but I was also just like, this is crazy.

Yeah, yeah. Is she sure? But I'm so thrilled to be able to, you know, produce the story and also play the role so that way it can also... I mean, it's in line with the mission of the caddy, of centering that marginalized voice, lifting it up, and hopefully helping people

at the end of the day. And yeah, hopefully we'll be on set this time next year. It's going to be good. Congratulations. Thank you. Congratulations. Well, the fans of IMO know that we have a listener question now.

We have some great listeners that send in some really great questions. So I think we have one that is perfect for you from Sophia in Los Angeles. Okay, you ready? I'm ready. As a 28-year-old navigating ADHD and career uncertainty, I've struggled to find stability. Without a clear path or support system, it's hard to feel grounded. I want to build a future where I feel secure in my career and in a place I can call home.

What advice would you give to someone trying to build long-term stability when everything else feels up in the air? I know that's how our questions go. Yeah, no, but that's a great question. I will say, you know, and what is the caller's name? Sophia. Sophia. Sophia wants that long-term stability, wants that career trajectory. And in looking at the end result, it can get overwhelming because it feels very far away.

And one of the things that helped me, when my dreams felt too big for the plate that I had, was to break it down into manageable chunks, to ask for help. And also not focusing so much on reaching up, but reaching out. And what I mean by that is all of the people that are on the grind with you, or the people that are going to be there later. And sometimes you're just like, oh, I just want this person that's up here to help me, but there's people that are in the trenches alongside you.

And building that community is so important. That's what got me through my very broke ears in New York was, you know, commiserating and working along other people who were as hungry and ambitious as I am. And because their appetite met mine, we could encourage each other to keep pushing. In terms of the ADHD of it, had I known then what I know now, I would absolutely try to reach out for resources and medication that can be helpful if that is something that

you want to do. It's been instrumental in changing my life. I think that Sophia's on the right path. She's stepping out and asking questions and trying to get that help. But I think that, yeah, make sure you find your community. You're like minded people that are on the grind with you. Because it does make the load lighter. And a lot of the things that she's talking about, it's like future forecasting, which is like the anxiety talking. And a lot of that can be remediated with counseling and, you know, through medication.

Yeah. So what I would tell Sophie is like try to chill out a little bit. Have grace with yourself. You know, give yourself a lot of grace. be okay with not knowing anything at 28, you know? It's like, it's in your 20s and way into your 30s, you're trying a whole lot of stuff on, you know? There isn't a future trajectory always.

Maybe there are the people out there who are lucky enough to say, when I was 10, I wanted to be a doctor, and it was actually true. And then you grew up and you were a doctor, and you actually liked it and were good at it. For most people, that doesn't happen. I thought I was going to be a pediatrician until I took biology. And I was like, let me try law. So I want young people to have more grace with themselves

and understand that life is really a journey. And if you've got some of the core tools of preparation that your parents are telling you to have, because they're right about that, you're going to be okay. Yeah, and don't be afraid to suck. Suck a lot. Suck a lot.

A lot of sucking happens out there in the world. Hey, oh. We'll edit that out. We're going to edit that one out. Didn't come out right. It's not what I meant. Craig, what do you think? Craig, what are you?

That's why it's good to have my big, brother. I put my foot in my mouth and I'm like, Craig, why don't you? Yeah. Clean that up. Sophia. Yeah. No, I think you all have hit. Your thoughts?

Now I'm scared. Now I'm scared to say anything. I think Sophia's question, I get a lot, and I would just add one last thing. It's making sure that you don't have to be perfect before you do something. And I think that that can be such a hindrance to people because they feel their ADHD is a roadblock or they feel like their resources or access is a roadblock. Do it anyway. Do it anyway. Yeah.

Yeah. Natasha, I think you hit it on the head in the discussion prior to the question is fall in love with the process. It's so hard to get young people to understand how to fall in love with the process, whether it be art, whether it's medicine or whether it's sports. We live in an age where people want the final product because they can see. the final product these days. When I was young, when we were younger, you couldn't really see the final product. Right.

Because there weren't many people doing the stuff we wanted to do. So you had to like what you were doing. So I would pass that on to Sophia before I would tell her to suck. On another note,

Natasha. You were supposed to help. I tried to help. I brought it back. You took it back. What? What shows do you watch on television? I really love the pit. Oh, okay. It's exceptional television.

John Wells, who was one of the creators. If you don't know, it's one shift in an ER. Every episode is one hour in real time. It's genius, producerially. You have one set. Your actors have one look. It's just smart. and it's just great writing.

Severance I'm really into. Did you like second season? I did. I have notes. I have notes, but I did enjoy it. I think it's such a beautiful world he's built. He's really a wonderful world builder. And I watched the office biblically. It's my go-to.

It's criminal how much I watched that show. We had a whole dinner conversation about how the office is the foundation of Sasha and Malia's life and they go to it all the time. They are huge fans as well but it's a great show. It's a great show. Any embarrassing TV that you watch that...

Love Island. Oh yes. No girl! It is, it is, just every once in a while, it's good to just turn off my brain. I think... You know, you need it off. You just need it off. It is amazing. The smartest

women that I am around my sister, my wife, my daughter, and my nieces, and now Natasha. These shows are a sociological wonder, I think. As someone who writes characters and performs, it is a character study on human behavior. I watch it like, you know, an animal planet show where I'm like walking these young... Because they're aliens, right?

I agree. They're all these, like, tiny symmetrical, hairless wonders. who are like chuncting each other for sport. I'm like watching it like, yeah, David Atenborough. But I do think we have this discussion all the time. I think women, I don't know, we grew up playing sociological games. Boys were throwing a ball. And we were all like, okay, you're the teacher, this is the scenario.

You're angry. And something's going on. No, no, you're not coming in. And reality TV. is like real life child's play for girls. It's role play. We want to know. We want to go deep. We want to understand.

And you all are like, who won? Yeah. That's right. That's the real reality. That's it. Well, Natasha, it has been a thrill. I mean, see why she comes? Yeah.

Glorious. Natasha, you are, you are smart, funny, honest, vulnerable. It shows up in the work that you've done and I can't wait to see everything that you will do

and please tell your parents that you made them proud. Oh my God. As always. You all, let's give it up for Natasha of you. Ratonogne. Rothwell. Thank you. Thank you so much. You'll have to bring your parents next night. Yeah.

You all, thank you all. Good night.