In Search Of Excellence - Brandi Love: Building A Career In Adult Entertainment | E81

Episode Date: October 3, 2023

Welcome to another episode of In Search of Excellence! My guest today is Brandi Love, one of the most famous and successful adult film actresses of all time.She has starred in more than 800 movies and her videos have been streamed more than a billion times. She has been nominated for and won 12 adult industry awards and is the author of the book Getting Wild Sex from Your Conservative Woman. She is also the owner of Traffic Stop Media and a real estate business together with her husband that renovates distressed properties.We are talking about her childhood, college years, finding her soulmate, first employment, and getting into the adult business. Tune in to hear Brandi’s fascinating life story!Time stamps:09:13 Brandi Love’s backgroundHad supportive parents and a great childhoodHer first passion was ice skatingAthletics and fitness in collegeGraduated with General Business degree 18:14 Meeting her soulmateMet her husband during her first year at collegeThey became inseparableMonogamous relationship and jealousy 20:39 Going into the corporate worldManaged a bagel storeLearned everything she didn’t learn at collegeShe was full of life and great with people 25:37 Cold calling and getting rejectedThe only job that made her cryHer husband helped her to understand how important that experience was 26:57 Working for Harley-DavidsonShe was a tomboy and bought her first motorcycle at 17Moving to North Carolina and getting a job at Harley-DavidsonShe was the only female and no.1 sales person every monthVery motivated and passionate 32:47 Dealing with jealousyHer husband was very successful and traveled a lotOne comment made her jealous and suspiciousThere is no plan B advice 39:41 Starting a wine label companyHaving a daughter and her husband having a heart attackDecided to have their own companyStarted a wine label company 45:23 What is porn?The definition of pornographyThe dividing line between porn and not pornNakedness on Instagram 51:25 Statistics about the porn industryThe global pornography industry brings $97 billion a year46 million Americans regularly visit porn sitesPeople don’t talk about pornography 59:35 The transition from the wine to the adult businessBrandi and her husband got an offer to build their adult content websiteStarted their first company in the adult businessThey already had an open marriageAt 18, won a bikini competitionDanced for a few years at a men's club 1:07:25 Approaching the adult industry as a businessCreated a business planBuilt a website, took photos, and uploaded themLearned a lot along the way, especially about marketingPersistently wrote letters to Howard SternGot invited to Howard Stern’s showTheir business took offSponsors:Sandee | Bliss: BeachesWant to Connect? Reach out to us online!Website | Instagram | LinkedIn

Sex is the number one and number two most pleasurable thing you can experience globally. It doesn't matter where you ask this question. It doesn't matter what language or what gender you're asking. It's number one and number two. It's wild. My life has been a wild ride. I think I've lived two lifetimes and I'm still only halfway. There's a lot of haters. There's people out there who simply don't like different groups,

that don't like who you are, what you've chosen to be or do. I'm so excited because I'm like, you two have a great sex life and you're going to be happily married for a long time. Welcome to In Search of Excellence, where we meet entrepreneurs, CEOs, entertainers, athletes, motivational speakers, and trailblazers of excellence with incredible stories from all walks of life. My name is Randall Kaplan. I'm a serial entrepreneur, venture capitalist, and the host of In Search of Excellence, which I started to motivate and inspire us to achieve excellence in all areas of our lives. My guest today is Brandy Love. Brandy is one of the most famous and successful adult film actresses of all time. She has starred in more than 800 800 movies and her videos have been streamed more than a

billion times. She has been nominated for and won 12 adult industry awards and is the author of the book, Getting Wild Sex from Your Conservative Woman. She is also the owner of Traffic Stop Media and also owns a real estate business with her husband that renovates distressed properties and then either flips or keeps them. Brandy, it's a true pleasure to have you on my show. Welcome to In Search of Excellence. Thanks for having me. I'm excited. Okay, so you were born in Dearborn, Michigan, the great state of Michigan where I'm also from, and you said you grew up in a normal family, a cool family with cool parents. What were your parents like and what kind of values do they instill in you when you were a kid?

I had a great childhood. I wouldn't say it was perfect. Very few people can. So that would be unfair to say. But I was very loved. I was very cared for. I was given every opportunity to learn, to excel, to be adventurous. Every athletic thing that I wanted to do, my parents supported me. So what kind of things athletically did you do? Well, I started ice skating when I was four years old. What rink did you go to?

It's called the Park Rink. They would flood the park and we would all ice skate. And I would have my little dual blades and pushing a chair. That's how it started. And I ended up ice skating until basically where I would have made the decision to go into the Olympics to try to train for the Olympics. I was the one skating at five in the morning before school and I would go to the rink after school. And the only thing that, that deterred me from that was going into high school, boys, of course, and then sports. I wanted to play soccer. I wanted to play tennis. I ran track and I did all of those things. So I probably my first passion was ice skating. And

my issue was maybe lack of focus, but I loved everything. So I was good at almost everything I wanted to do. I was never great. You were competitive. You wanted to win. We're going to talk about that in a little while. But what was your dream when you were growing up as a kid? Honestly, as a kid, the one I remember was being an Olympic ice skater. I still watch the figure skating aspect of the Olympics. So I still have a love for it. It was a huge part of my childhood. And I think it's what taught me discipline. So you're in high school. You mentioned boys. You like boys. Was that one of your primary focuses? Or did you have a lot of girlfriends? I wasn't. No, it was never a primary focus. I always remember having a boyfriend. I was a serial monogamous dater. I never dated. I'd have a date and then I would be in a relationship for six months to a year. So a 3.2 or whatever the GPA was or whatever grades you had to get, you couldn't run.

And I was going to run. You were fast. I was. I was pretty quick. Actually, yeah, I was pretty quick. So that was, thank God for sports. That's probably how I got into college. You went to Plymouth-Salem High School.

We played you Detroit Country Day. We usually got our asses kicked. I think you were. We were really good. We were really good. Yeah, you were on the schedule, but it was never fair. I think we're a Class C school. You were a Class A.

So better athletes, bigger school. But when you were there, did you do things besides skate and go out with your friends? Was there a focus you wanted to be in in life? Did your dreams change from when you were a kid and you no longer knew you wanted to skate? Well, you know what's funny? I still ice skate. I still have my original ice skates from when I was a competitor, same size foot. So I will still go just for fun. That's a passion that's never changed. You use the same skates? Yeah. They're like jeans. You don't get rid of them when they're perfectly worn in. They're a few decades old. There are better skates today. There are better skates today.

There aren't? No, but they're still the best boots in the world. Best blades. They just it's classic. So I'll never get rid of them. OK, so you're focused on getting good grades. You had to have a 3.2. Tell us about how you ended up at CMU. I know your mom went there. Your dad, of course, went to a better school, University of Michigan. Yeah, great school on earth. Yeah, I didn't get my dad's brains. What was what was the motivation to go to college and what was the thought when you were there? I know one of the things you said that you said is you wanted to get a 3.5 and work out every day for two hours a day. You're a fitness nut. Yeah, I still am. I love fitness. It's part of my life. But in college, I was probably a little bit too extreme. I really followed like muscle mag and I

trained like I was a bodybuilder, even though I had no aspirations of being a bodybuild extreme. I really followed like muscle mag and I, I trained like I was a bodybuilder, even though I had no aspirations of being a bodybuilder. I just loved the look and I loved the discipline. I never had the, uh, foundation to get big enough to compete. I thought I was all big and tough and they're like, you're puny. You're going to get crushed. So thank God bikini modeling and figure modeling came along. So that became more of a kept me healthy. And I didn't compete in college. Very quickly, I realized what I said earlier is that I was good at a lot of things that I wasn't going to be great.

Knowing that, I was like, OK, that's not going to athletics isn't going to pay for my life. That's not going to be a career for me. So that's where the refocus became business. I took the passion part and made it about business, knowing that that would that would allow for a financially viable future. You want to go at some point to be a bodybuilder. And were you building bulk at the time or just you want to be trim, lean and mean? All of it, which is impossible, which is the issue.

So I was always balancing. What am I going for? I get too bulky and I didn't like that. Then I trimmed down. I'm like, oh, I need more muscle. I'm still kind of that way. I think that's a female thing. We're never satisfied.

You're focused on business than the college. You focused, I think, on business administration and you had another major, but you didn't graduate. I started with dietetics and sports nutrition. And three years in, I realized that that was going to be not only extremely difficult to get accepted into the sports nutrition program at CMU, which was excellent, but that the salaries were capped. I started a little late doing the research on what does this mean in five years? What does this mean in 10 years? And I was not happy with what I was seeing. So I went with a general business degree, which was a very wise move

because they use it every day. And you graduated. I finished up my final year at FAU because my husband and I got married and moved down to Florida. Let's talk about meeting your husband in college. I know what you guys were up to. Where did you meet? And then what happened after that? It's very cliche and it's so funny today, but he was a bouncer and I was a bartender. That's how we met. Who approached you?

Who asked who out on the first date? Well, I definitely let him know I was interested. I mean, there was eye contact and I didn't know what he looked like except for from here down because it was a crowded room. I was on the dance floor with my girls and I saw this gorgeous human being in the corner and I couldn't stop staring at him. And I'm like, I don't know who that is, but I have to find out. And so I was week after week, I would go to this club because I knew he'd be there and try to make eye contact and ask questions. And it got back to him. And thankfully he kind of did the head nod when I was on the dance floor and I'm like, okay, you know, I walk over there. It was instant. It was literally instant. He gave me his phone number in a matchbox, which like a true dork, I still have. It was the beginning of, um, the rest of my life to be fair.

And what year in college did you guys meet? And then my first year. So you dated all four years. He met a freshman. That's's always difficult he's three years older than me so i was the freshman just coming up and i'm and fair fairly for him he was like we dated it went zero to 60 and he pulled back because you know i'm still getting my i'm still getting grounded in college and he's there he's ready go. We broke up for five or six months. Felt like a lifetime. And you still love them the whole time. Yeah. He broke up with me. If I remember correctly, there was a family tragedy and we just, you know, things we got separated and we met in a hallway back at CMU and it was like a double take. That was it. We

were married like nine months later. So from that point on through the rest of college, you had a monogamous relationship with your husband and you never even thought about what you ended up doing at that point. We're going to get into that. We were both jealous. So absolutely not. You were jealous. So when you talked to another girl at the time, you were like, hey, man, I'm not happy with that. Don't look at her. Yeah, no, I didn't like that. And he was the same way. Okay, so he graduates three years before you do.

And then you go into the corporate world. You did a whole bunch of things. You're super motivated. You love business. You managed a bagel store. I did. And you worked at a staffing agency and then tell us about those jobs and then tell us about harley-davidson the bagel store was awesome

it was really really fun i hated getting up at four in the morning to let the baker in but um it taught again taught me discipline it taught me everything that college didn't to be fair the real life stuff keeping the books getting employees to show up on time. I managed all of that, doing bank drops and balancing the books and ordering product. For the bagel store. And I think I was 21. It was a lot, but I loved it. And I was recruited from that job by the staffing agency owner, who I just saw basically every day.

She'd come in for her bagel orders, and she's like, hey, I've been watching you. And I'm like, well, that's creepy. What do you mean you've been watching me? It was a compliment. My work ethic, and I was never not there. You know, I wasn't the one calling in. You could always count on me. She noticed. And she offered me a

really great job that, again, took my business acumen to the next level because that was a hard, I was knocking down doors for the staffing agency to get corporate businesses to take our employees. It was a lot of rejection. And it thickened my skin, to be fair. I do a lot of coaching, a lot of mentoring. I have interns every summer, usually between 32 and 36. They want to light up the world. And it's hard to get a job with our program in the summer. I don't think there's one out there. I'm talking about the kids who work at Goldman Sachs. And that's their dream, who would get up and get to work at four in the morning. I mean, that says a tremendous amount about you. Why did you do that? You must have been the only person in your class out of, I assume, thousands of people who took a job at a bagel store getting in at four o'clock in the morning. You'd have to go to bed at what? Seven o'clock, eight o'clock at night. You really need sleep. I don't remember. But my, you know, my husband did have a corporate job. So,

you know, there was a few years there where we were like ships the night and that was really hard on us. But I, I took the job because one, we'd always have our evenings together. You know, his was more nine to five Monday through Friday. He had some travel, but it was stable. And by taking this management position, one, I loved the idea of being a manager. I wanted to know what that was like. I knew that I would obtain a tremendous amount of onsite education. And two, I was like, ooh, this was down in Florida. We moved to Florida right after we got married. I was excited to have the afternoons because I could go to the beach, lay out. So I'm home at 3 o'clock. Everybody else is still two, three, four hours of work.

And that was the motivator, if I'm being honest. Go to the beach. Yeah, get home early and have an actual evening to do what I wanted with and to spend time with Chris. It's interesting. Go to the bagel store. When I first moved to L. LA, I lost my job. The only job I could get was in Costa Mesa. And I drove, I had to get to work. I usually would leave at 5.30 in the morning.

I'd hit the bagel store first. I'd wait for the bagels to come out. Because we're the only thing open. It's the only thing open. And I remember I get two Sesame Street bagels with cream cheese. And by the time I got down to Costa M to make the sesame seeds would be in my teeth, throw my card. And I used to see Suge Knight at the bagel store three mornings a week.

He was with this dude. He would leave his Bronco wide open Bronco with the music blaring. Who's going to say anything? And and and for the six months that I had that job, I would see him. But it's it's interesting. The first person you greet in the morning, that I had that job, I would see them. But it's interesting. The first person you greet in the morning, that's your mood, right? On my way here, I went to Starbucks.

This guy, David, was at the counter. I mean, he was just full of energy, smiling, excitement. I mean, it made me happier when I left the store. It's contagious. It's contagious. So you must have had great people skills at a young age. This episode of In Search of Excellence is brought to you by Sandy.com. S-A-N-D-E-E.com.

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if you weren't great with people. That's fair. And I would say naturally looking back, I think I was more of an extrovert when i was younger than i am even now which is weird considering what i do um but you know life can do that to you i was very young um wild-eyed i love i still love people but uh i definitely did have a zest for life and for people and adventure i I'm a very curious person. So those things kind of get you into conversations with all sorts because you're, I'm open to hearing, I'm open to listening and learning. Always have been. You talked about calling people, getting rejected all the time. I think getting rejected from cold calling skills is one of the greatest experiences

I've ever had. I've never had a job that made me cry. That one did. Yeah. And thankfully, my husband had done it as well. So he was tough as nails. And he was like, you got this. You can do this. You have no idea how much this is going to help you later in life.

And it's true. Everyone should have to do that. So it's funny you say that. Normally, what I tell people is my dad told me something a long time ago, and he said, if you go up to someone 100 times and the first 99 people say no, and the 100 person says yes, you'll forget about the first 99. Now, I say that I clean it a little bit. Yeah, sort of.

I mean, I clean it a bit, but I was kind of a gawky, nerdy kid. And I remember I said, there's this woman that I really like. Her name is Robin, Robin Bolton, if you're listening. And I want to take her out. And she went, go out with me and said, hey, you know what? Go up to 100 girls and said, hey, do you want to have sex with me? And they all say, no, you'll feel bad. But when the 100th girl says that she wants to have sex with you, you'll forget about the other

99. So I've now told the story. I haven't whitewashed it. And there's, there's the story. It's true. So, all right. Tell us about Harley Davidson and how you got there. Do you like bikes or they just recruited you for a job you like? I had a i had a um my first bike was a kawasaki ninja uh my parents disliking of course i i was very much a tomboy and not i don't i always wore dresses and i loved girly stuff but i also love to get on four-wheelers and throw mud and and and play the sports with the boys and i I don't know, probably part of my personality is if somebody says, you probably shouldn't do that or girls don't do that.

I went, oh really? And I would go do that. So, you know, my grandmother wanted me to play the piano. I wanted the saxophone. Girls don't ride motorcycles. 17 years old, I bought my first bike. So I think there's a little bit of a rebellious streak, if I were to just guess in me that that was just part of my adrenaline rush. It was exciting. It was fun. I didn't know any other women that had motorcycles, so I enjoyed that very much.

And we had moved out to Colorado from Florida for Chris's job. Well, actually, we were able to live anywhere because his job required travel. And we decided, my father had taken us out to Colorado Springs to this beautiful retreat. And we fell in love with the area. And we moved. We came home to Fort Lauderdale at the time, packed up, drove out west and lived in Colorado. What part of Colorado? In the Springs. We lived right in the Springs. And that's where I got the bagel job.

After about two years, we wanted to come back east. We're just East Coast kids to our core. It was beautiful. We had an adventure, but we wanted to come back. And I started looking at, your listeners are going to laugh because nobody does this anymore, but I was looking at the Help Wanted ads in the back of a newspaper. For Raleigh, for North Carolina specifically, because in our minds, born in Michigan, married and moved to Fort Lauderdale, now we're out west.

We're not going back to where we've already been. We needed something new. Smack dab in the middle is North Carolina. Didn't know anybody. Didn't have family there. It just geographically made sense. So that's where we were going to move. And I had some newspapers sent to me.

I'm looking through the Help Wanted ads. And instantly my eyes light up. And Chris is like, what do you see? I said, Harley Davidson is hiring. I didn't even know what position, it didn't matter. I circled that and I started calling. I was going to get that job. And I had like, I think four phone interviews, sent them my resume.

And they agreed to hold the job for me because it was going to be about two weeks before I lived there. They held the job for me and I had that job for years. What, what was the job and what were you doing? I was selling Harleys. So you were working in a dealership and you would, someone would walk in, you'd have the Harley t-shirt on or the black Harley jacket on. No, I dressed honestly more like this. I just dressed like me. And they didn't have a uniform. It was a sales job. There were three or four of us on the floor. I worked six days a week. If they were open, I was there. Because if you're not there, you don't get the deal. And if I talked to you on Monday and knew you were coming back on Tuesday or Wednesday, if I'm not there, the other salesperson blows the deal. You didn't get a cut or split when that happened?

You close it. That's how it worked. So I was never afraid to work hard. You said there were four salespeople on the floor? What was the male-female ratio? I was the only female. There's a pattern here. Yeah. Well, I'm curious. the Harley riders, would they rather buy from a beautiful woman or a Harley rider who works in the store? Well, we would have to ask them to get to the bottom of it, but I was the number one salesperson for every month I let, I worked there. Amazing. It didn't hurt. What, what do you attribute your success as a salesperson to? I didn't, it did not, it did not work against me that I was the only female.

But I also, I was extremely driven. I knew the product. I loved the product. And I was excited to sell them. I was selling a dream. I mean, to be honest, anybody that walks into a Harley dealership already wants one. They just didn't know they were going to leave with one. That was my job. What was the commission on a bike back then? And do you remember the average price? Because Harley's are very expensive bikes. They are. And we sold ours for even more. Because you had a short supply and people had to pay a premium? Correct. And I worked for Ray Price Harley Davidson. He's a famous drag racer. So we really had a lot of perks. He got more bikes than most.

So we actually had inventory. Everybody else was on lists. Like you'd call for a Harley and like, dude, there's like 12 pages of names. But we'll get you on the list. We'll take your 500 bucks, call you when it's ready. Our people, you come in the door, I'm selling you that bike. Like you can have it today. There was no waiting list. So it was, um, I was, I was just, I'm motivated and they were very smart in that, like for the first 10 bikes you sell a month, you get $150. It doesn't, I mean, it was

more than, it sounds so little now, but I, it was a lot. But what I cared about was after 10, because now you get 250. Over 15, you would get 500. So my goal was to get to 15 as quickly as humanly possible so that every bike thereafter, I was making real money. Everything we do is about sales. And I stress that to everyone I meet and mentor. It doesn't matter. Everything we do.

From the Starbucks gentleman, David, when I walk in the door, to meeting someone on the street, to managing people, and to being managed as well. All right, so let's move on. I want to talk about now, you are at Harley. Your husband is the youngest VP ever, I think, at a biotech company. He's 24 years old. And he's traveling all the time, 250 days a year, 150 days a year. Yeah. The first like eight years was a tremendous amount of travel. So walk us through your relationship at the time, what you were thinking in terms of your long-term

plans, and then talk about how it took a little bit of a turn with a wet t-shirt contest, I believe, or something. And I think we need to back up for a moment because I think at that point you already had a daughter. Yeah, the timeline. It's wild. My life has been a wild ride. I think I've lived two lifetimes and I'm still only halfway. We've always had an exceptionally strong relationship. I mean, it sounds cliche, but I met my soulmate. There's no doubt in my mind that he was made for me and me for him. So even when things were difficult in the sense that he was gone a lot, we supported each other. I did what I had to do. He did what he had to do. And when we were together, we were a family. You know, I always saw him as highly motivated.

He's incredibly intelligent. I mean, you don't get to be the VP of a biotech company at that age by being lazy or incapable. You know, 24 years old, having board meetings with doctors and VPs of hospitals. So both very driven. We're both type A, both very driven. So I don't know that in the early stages we thought about our financial future. We just love to work. We love to earn. We love to build. So yeah, we just, you know, 50, 60 hours a week from the very beginning, regardless of what job we had. That's just the way it was.

And very monogamous, very secure. 100% monogamous. 100% monogamous. I take back the secure part because when he was traveling, I mean, I married an absolutely devastatingly handsome man. So as a woman who he's traveling all the time, I was the, I was insecure. And I wasn't at all until one girlfriend said to me one time, husband's really fine. You're not worried about him having chicks in every city. And I'm like, what? Like I'd never considered it because our relationship was so perfect. And that one caller friend, it's not a very friendly thing to say, but it changed me into a very insecure and jealous person.

That one comment. Yeah. So I became a little bit of a psycho checking his phone and looking for things to catch him on, which was so not me. He knew you were doing it, it caused a lot of friction in the relationship? Well, first he thought it was funny because he knew he was being loyal. He thought this was just a phase and it didn't go away fast enough. So it became unfunny. And of course it causes a rift because when you're not doing anything wrong, but you're constantly being accused, you're going to resent. There's going, there's going to be a lot of emotions that come up. So yeah, that, that was a problem. And ultimately it, it came to a

head and we did the best thing that we could have done in the moment. There's some other pieces, but we decided to see a marriage counselor and that changed our lives back on track. And the thing I remember so much about that, this was after our baby, which added another dimension to that. But this, I don't know, maybe the fourth or fifth time we went to therapy, we only went like six times. They basically kicked us out and said, you guys are good. Like, you're good. But like the second or third time, they stopped and looked at us and said, wow, I don't, I'm sorry. I just need a moment.

I've never had a couple be more brutally honest ever in a session. And we looked at each other and then looked at them. We're like, isn't that why we're here? It was a very pivotal moment because we are that honest, which is why I believe we're happily married 28 years later. What was the, if you could nail it down to one piece of advice the therapist gave you to overcome your jealousy, what was that piece of advice the therapist gave you to overcome your jealousy what would what was that piece of advice there is one that i'll never forget it was have no plan b's never ever ever and we made a pact it was like a pinky swear it's like it's a pinky pact in the car never never never never no plan b's i will never leave you. You'll never be alone. I will never deceive, backstab, betray. And that was it. So once the no plan B was accepted by both of us,

the world became our oyster. It's our playground. And it's he and I against the world. As an entrepreneur and a founder and a venture capitalist, that's what you want to hear. There is no plan B. I'm going to make it. I'm going to win. And I think that's a great lesson for all the listeners out there, the viewers. Don't have a plan B because if you're thinking about the plan B, you're not going to... You're not 100% vested. You're not 100% vested. You're always looking over your shoulder or your brain is clicking if that doesn't work out. You always want to have the mentality, this is going to work out no matter what.

And it's interesting. You brought that up about in the sense of a relationship. But you're a thousand percent right. I approach almost probably every single business endeavor the same way. There is no there is no fail. This if I'm getting involved, if I'm choosing to invest my time, I am investing in you. I'm investing this business. I am not going to

let it fail. And of course they do. Sometimes businesses just don't work out. But what comes after that is even better. That's been my experience. The things that do fluff away and weren't meant to be the actual business go away. And the next thing from all the lessons is like oh my god that's what that was about it's even better 100% I believe you learn more from your failures than you do your wins and I've always said that as well I mean we sometimes we get lucky on the way up yeah things should never work and they do work and sometimes the things that you think are gonna work they'll be a dunk are the worst things worst deals I've ever done, worst founders that I've ever backed. So you never know.

But I think it's important to learn from your mistakes. And not forget them so you don't do them again. Try not to make them the same time. Try not to make them the second time. So tell us, when did you have... Are you looking for your next great gift to surprise a friend, colleague, or loved one? Bliss Beaches makes the perfect gift. This best-selling bright and beautiful coffee table book by Randall Kaplan features stunning drone photography from exotic beach locations around the world. It's the perfect housewarming gift, a great addition to any home or office, and a fun

and creative alternative to bringing a bottle of wine to somebody's house for dinner. Bliss Beaches is available for purchase on Amazon, where it has glowing reviews and a five-star rating. Get your next amazing gift and order a copy of Bliss Beaches by clicking the link in our show notes. Is Crystal traveling? She was born in 2000 and still traveling. And it was around her first birthday that he started looking for another job. It's's hard it's really hard when you love your family and you're watching your children grow from photos you know and and i her first steps is the one that really did it first birthday was tough to not be there and then when she took her

first steps he has video of it but he's like that it. I want to be home more. That's a big one. Yeah, it was huge. And it was for him too. He'd put in his time and we were lucky to be in a position where we could afford to venture off into our own company, which we did. So you started a wine label company at that point called Creative... Grapevine Greetings. Grapevine Greetings. Tell us about that. And then your husband had some health problems as well. So walk us through there, because I think that's a good transition to where we're going and what you did, what you do today. Yeah, I'm trying to remember. I think the health issue came first. He was traveling. There were times he'd be on the road 21 days doing his laundry and laundromats

on the road and he would come so young they just kept pushing and he kept giving you know he just kept giving and he was closing a contract deal in las vegas at a hospital thank goodness and he had a stress-induced heart attack, probably just no sleep, working all the time, you know, and I flew out there, got him home. He's okay. He's doing great. He has a few things that followed from that situation, but we looked at each other and we said, it's time. Like, we need our own company. This corporate America is going to kill you. I was at home raising our daughter at the time. I was kind of itching to get back into the business, not leave her, but be able to use my adult time, my brain and do something. It just seemed like the perfect opportunity.

We love wine. We gift wine. We receive wine all the time. And that's what created Grapevine Greet greeting is one night we went and pulled a bottle from the cellar and we didn't know who gave us this bottle. We looked it up and it was a gorgeous bottle of wine, like amazing. We know we didn't buy it. So we didn't know who to thank when we drank it and it was so amazing. So we said, wouldn't that be a cool business to have like greeting cards for wine bottles that like not an actual card but like you could stick

it and we just kept going the brainstorm kept going and we created labels that look like a greeting card that had a you know famous quote and something about wine and whether it was a birthday an anniversary Christmas and and there was nothing on the market like it so our very first business didn't have infrastructure out there there was no on the market like it. So our very first business didn't have infrastructure out there. There was no marketing. Nobody knew what it was. So not only did we have to create the product, we had to figure out how to educate the public as to what it even is.

So we went for it. We really went for it. And it was awesome. It was an awesome experience. All right. So now we're going to switch topics and we're going to talk about the porn industry. I want to talk about the definition of porn. And I'm going to look at dictionary.com.

And here are the two definitions of porn. Sometimes referred to as porno and pornography. Sexually explicit videos, photographs, writings or the like. Produced to elicit sexual arousal. Television shows, articles, photographs, etc. are thought to cater to an excessive, irresistible desire or interest for something. So is the Victoria's Secret ad pornography? What about the millions of beautiful models and sexy photos on Instagram, many of them wearing only skimpy bikinis, and in some cases, almost no bikinis. Or what about the most recent Instagram post

from Kendall Jenner, who I think is gorgeous, and who has 294 million Instagram followers? It's a very sexy picture on the cover of this month's issue of W Magazine of her in a thin white tank top where her hands are under her breast, almost lifting it up like she's about to take it off, and can be interpreted as something very, very sexy. Is that porn? Well, based on the definition you just gave, it's exceptionally subjective,

which if anybody has seen Larry Flint's movie, that is the case that defined it. And I don't know why we want to keep going back to that because it's been defined. It is an art form. It is and can be subjective. And thank God we live in a free country. So it's more of a form of freedom of speech. So do I think that a woman holding up almost about to reveal a nipple is pornography? No.

But that doesn't mean you don't. However, I would fight for the right to be able to post it. It's interesting to me because under that definition, and I looked at other definitions besides that one, and they're all the same pretty much. And under those definitions, almost everything we see is porn. On Instagram, on the cover of female magazines and ads for jewelry and all the most serious magazines, all the men's business magazines, all the women's magazines. So what's the dividing line between porn and not porn? I think most people would not think that's porn.

And at some point, there's some amount of nudity. And it's nudity alone that becomes porn. Or is it the nudity and the action that becomes porn well i think the media does a really funny mind trick on everybody that it it spews information to everyone knows that sex sells now i don't mean the actual act of but human sexuality hence why half-naked women are on the magazine covers and it's the same media outlets that say, oh, sex is bad. It's a total it's total hypocrisy, yet we're not going to stop using it because it's numbers. You look at Instagram. That's a really good point.

And I have issue with how this goes down, because if Instagram's terms and conditions say we're a PG, you know, family oriented, all ages are on here, too much flesh, you're going to get banned. These are all legitimate things, you know, too much flesh. They've got algorithms that can take them down. But I've seen things that I'm like, whoa, like, are you kidding me? That's not flagged. But then a person in a one piece bathing suit is. So unfortunately for the adult industry, yes, we can push the limits. There's no doubt a lot of people in the adult industry push limits.

But it's not the adult industry posting most of the content you're describing right now. It's Kardashians. It's other famous, and I'm not mad at them. I think they're beautiful too, but they can get away with string bikinis, nipples almost showing, body parts, way more flesh than an adult entertainer. If you are an adult entertainer, you are instantly labeled. And I've had photos flagged for having bare feet. Bare feet. That's not a joke. Win against community guidelines. People know you.

The companies know you already. They know porn stars. So you get a footfall and you're going to get a flag. Yes. And there's a lot of haters. There's people out there who simply don't like different groups, that don't like who you are are what you've chosen to be or do and they will mass report even if the photos of you if i'm in this and they will take it down because of the mass reporting on instagram it's amazing how many beautiful women i see and they are basically

naked they're they may be topless but they have a little blur or a little tassel right over their nipple. And so therefore... That's what I would call pushing it. But you see it regularly. And they're not flagged or taken down. Well, some of them do get taken down. But some of them, I know, we had a friend of a friend who is a beautiful woman. And she has a lot of followers.

And she was doing that. And it was up for three years or something. And they finally took it down. So it's interesting to see what's on there. All right, so let's talk about some statistics now about the porn industry. And I'm going to go through a whole bunch of them. And I think our viewers and listeners won't know many of these. The global pornography industry is $97 billion a year, $10 billion in the United States,

bigger than the NFL, NBA, and Major League Baseball combined. 46 million Americans regularly visit porn sites each month. Our population there is 332 million. That means 14% of our population is watching porn regularly. For ages 18 or over, 18% of the adult population. 33% of Americans seek out porn at least once a month. 70% of men aged 18 to 24 visit pornographic websites at least once per month. 46% of men seek out porn at least once a month. 20% of men and 13% of women access porn at work. 75.8% of Americans have at one point watched porn online.

Approximately 35% of all internet downloads are related to pornography. Around 25% of search engine requests are pornography related. There are over 4.2 million adult websites, making up 12% of all websites. Internet pornography makes up about 20% of total e-commerce sales in the United States. Around 1.7% of adult women have worked in the pornography industry at some point in their lives. Yet, 66% of young adults age 18 to 24 rarely or never talk to their friends about porn. 55% of adults 25 and older say viewing porn is wrong. 32% of teens and young adults say viewing porn is wrong.

And 31% of young adults say porn is bad for society. Sex toy retailer Adam and Eve conducted a survey and discovered that 36% of people lied and denied watching online porn. So what is going on here? I don't issue for sure. I think Americans in general are some of the most sexually repressed. You go to Europe. I bet then I don't know, but I bet the numbers are a lot lower because they're sexually liberated they have nude beaches there and they're not walking around with people gawking and staring it's the human form it's beautiful bodies are gorgeous sex is the number one and

number two most pleasurable thing you can experience globally that it doesn't matter where you ask this question it doesn. It doesn't matter what language or what gender you're asking. It's number one and number two. So the fact that we seek to watch it and to feel an orgasm, which is like the best high you can possibly feel, though it may last for a short period of time, we're always seeking it. So none of those numbers surprised me. And I think the people that are denying it, for whatever reason, have been taught to feel shame or guilt over experiencing their own pleasure and having a sexuality, which if it weren't for sex, you and I wouldn't be sitting here. What's interesting also is the statistics on porn,

most people watch porn, right? I would agree. But we don't talk about it, right? We certainly don't talk about it at work. I mean, that's not appropriate. You do. You do. But I don't, and people in my world, I only do. Especially now you don't. Especially now you don't. You get me too'd or canceled or fired or sent to HR at a minimum. Sued. Yes, probably. Probably. But with close friends sometimes, you know, you're having a few beers, you make a few jokes. But, you know, you're at dinner with another couple.

No one's really talking about that, right? Oh, what did you do tonight? Oh, I watched a great sexy porn movie with my wife. I've never had that conversation ever with anybody. And those are my favorite conversations because we roll in different circles. It makes sense. But you can imagine, I will be in the airport and a couple my age, maybe a little younger, will approach me, a couple. And the wife's like, I got Brandy. We love your work. And I, those are my moments where I just glow. I'm so excited because I'm like,

you two have a great sex life and you're going to be happily married for a long time. Literally. That's what I, what I think when a couple says that because they're open, they're sexually adventurous, they're joy filled. They're having a ball with one another um the word porno pornography it's it's got a stigma we all know it and i don't mind using it doesn't bother me it's semantics but it is adult entertainment it is a form it's an art form it is entertainment it is meant to be entertainment they were you, we as actors didn't go out to go, oh, this is going to be a great educational film.

We didn't do that. The adult industry knows why we're there. It's it's fantasy. It's for fun. It's to add a spark. It's to you need 30 seconds to get to sleep. We got you. It was never intended for viewers under 18.

So, you know, but then in our society, again, you tell somebody they can't, what are they going to do? They're going to find it. And in the world of the internet, it's become increasingly difficult to safeguard your kids. You know, and even if your home is locked down, they take their cell phone to school or one of their friends' parents isn't watching. And, you know, so. Do couples come up to you in an airport with their kids in tow and say oh hi brandy no never their children no and i've only probably

had two experiences in my life where i've been with my family and somebody um you know they beeline and one of the things that's difficult i I guess, if you want to call it that, being an adult entertainer, the walls come down because it's such an intimate relationship. If you're viewing me for 10 years and you know my films, it's not like being, you know, J-Lo or Jennifer Aniston. There is a wall with adult entertainers. The viewers don't feel that wall because it's such an intimate moment we're having, right? So sometimes they will focus on you and not pay attention to the fact that you're with your family or it's not a good time. And in those cases, I simply say, you know what, I really appreciate you being a fan. I really do. But now it's not.

What's the percentage of male versus female who come up to you and say, hi, strangers, hi, Brandy, love what you do, or hi, I want to meet you, or hi, I want to take a picture with you? It's changed through the years. It's still predominantly male, but through the years, more and more women have become comfortable. And I'm shocked by some of the emails I get from young women when I say young, anywhere from 20 to my age. And sometimes it's getting to where they're like, from young women, when I say young, anywhere from 20 to my age.

And sometimes it's getting to where they're like, how do you keep your love life on point at our age? How do you, what's your diet like? They get into my fitness routine because they want to look their best at my age. And so it's interesting, even though I'm an adult actress, I have access to conversations and affecting lives way outside the realm of adult. You mentioned before sex is one of the one or two. What's the second? Or you're saying it is number one and number two. Sex and masturbation.

So I kind of coupled them together. But number one and number two. Sex is number one. Masturbation is number two two, is the most pleasurable activities known to humankind. You're working in the wine business and you're shooting a video for the wine business. And the videographer comes up to you and says, Randy, have you ever thought about doing this? What is the this? And then what happened after that? It varies. It's how exactly how it happened we were not um developers i didn't know how to build a website the internet was is e-commerce was just

getting started in in a large format and we didn't know how to build a website but we needed one so the company we were put in touch with to build out the wine label business after knowing us for like two weeks and working diligently side by side to create this website, that's when they said, hey, have you guys ever considered doing something in adult? And I remember thinking to myself, I didn't say it out loud, but I'm like, we watch a lot of adult entertainment. What is he talking about? And I guess we just have that kind of demeanor. They felt they could throw that out there. And we said, well, exactly what do you mean? You know, like an adult website, like you guys would be great.

We want to do that. What we found out was they were adult affiliate managers on top of working for this company that builds out websites. I didn't even know what that meant. So we went home, started the research, understanding what does he mean by a business? I always kind of thought there were porn pixies, like they're fairies. They're these beautiful people that just look awesome having sex and I get to enjoy it. I never thought of it as a business.

So that started a journey down three-year, five-year, seven-year plan. How do you make money? What are the costs of starting a website? What is the marketing and advertising? We didn't sleep for days because we got so excited about this. And they wanted to be a part of this, which they had the back knowledge. We had the business knowledge. And that formed our first company in adult.

When it came time to pick a model, I raised my hand. I just thought it was that natural. I just said, well, I'll do it. I trust me. I'll show up. I'll do the work. I know I will. I don't want to invest all this money.

You're looking at six figures. Even back then, to properly prepare a website and get your hosting and all of that set up, I'll do the work. This could be really fun. Like I got excited. Diddy. So some guy who don't know that well, basically says, hey, Granny, you and Chris are great looking people. You got... I don't think they said that, but I appreciate that. Okay. Okay. But that's what they're thinking. That's what they're thinking. Because if you're ugly, they won't be asking you to create a home website so so you have you have physical gifts and you have wonderful figures and they said gosh this would be interesting and of course he works in the business so why not ask right if you don't ask you don't get and and then you you said

all right i mean did you consider no taking off your clothes naked? I'm not talking about just topless, but full frontal nudity in front of someone else who wasn't your husband. Was that awkward to think about? Well, I grew up a dancer, classically trained ballerina tap jazz. I was always on stage. The ice skating, you, the skater, the whole arena is looking at you. So I never really had a fear of being watched. And a little to my, I didn't know, but I'm as much voyeuristic as I am an exhibitionist. The idea of the taking off the clothes, it was going to be a matter of either total fear or total exhilaration. And in my case, it was exhilaration. And so the viewers understand Chris and I had played with the lifestyle, that whole no plan

B thing. When I said that the world became our playground, that was literally a side effect for us. Like we didn't just run out and start having sex with strangers, but we started to research the whole concept of the lifestyle. And cause we no longer had fear of losing one another. The fear that the jealousy went, it literally went away and it became fun, like the whole concept. And so we had some experience in the lifestyle when this moment happened. So the adult concept wasn't far fetched. It's not like these people went into a church and said, hey, anybody here want to do a porn site?

He had it. He could tell that we were adventurous. So at this point, you and Chris had decided to have somewhat of an open marriage where you were having sex with different people? It was always us together with other couples. Okay. Never. At that point. Never. At that point. And you were watching each other while the sex acts were going on in the same room. Okay. Was it heterosexual at that point? A hundred percent. A hundred percent heterosexual. Okay. And so how long had you been doing that at the point in time where you said, all right, I'm going to do this or I'm interested in doing this?

Well, it was never about me saying that. It was an us decision. I would never do anything against my husband's will. If he wasn't into it, I wasn't into it. It became something that we were turned on by. The whole concept was fun and exciting for us. So we decided to pursue it. Many couples make home movies. They watch the movies. Had you guys made your own home movies before? Probably. I don't remember. It was thousands of movies ago. And we still do. I mean, so much of my OnlyFans is Chris and I. I mean, there's other content, of course, but he does live cams with me. We shoot content together. So the difference is now we share it.

That's the only difference. But, you know, that is a funny thing is you think most couples in our country probably have a homemade sex tape. But because I share mine, you're bad. We've got Pam Anderson. We have Paris Hilton. We have Kim Kardashian. Exactly. I would never shame those people for doing that. But we do as a society. And in some ways, I gain financially by that. And by the way, when I mentioned those people, I think it's horrific that someone took something private meant for them and published it online. financially by that. And by the way, when I mentioned those people, I think it's horrific that someone took something private meant for them and published it online. I think that's

beyond horrific. I agree with you, but we're also assuming that that's how it took place. Let's assume that it did take place that way. I think it's horrific. I think it's horrific. Nobody should do that to somebody else. I agree. What's private is private. It should be kept private. Should be. So wasn't there something about wet t-shirt night going before this, before you started this? Before I even met my husband, again, this is that exhibitionist part and not being afraid of being

on stage. I thrive. I love that energy. I did a bikini contest when I was 18 years old at a local bar in Plymouth, Michigan. And I was probably the youngest contestant. I don't know why I thought this would be a great idea. It just sounded fun and exciting. And I ended up winning and my best girlfriend at the time. And I went on a fully paid cruise to the Bahamas. So that, that, that like when I danced for a few years at a men's club, it was so natural for me. I loved it. It was just another stage performance. So you were dancing at what we call the strip bar.

A gentleman's club, yeah. Gentleman's club. No touching allowed. It happens, right? Yeah. No touching allowed. Right. Okay.

That's funny. Because, uh yeah touching usually is allowed you go to a different room for the touching right a vip room that's correct vip room okay so um what is so interesting about your story i mean there's so many things i mean this is just fascinating i i love your story. I think it's incredible. You said something when you started out, you looked at the business aspect first. You didn't say, hey, I'm going to go make a bunch of sex tapes and figure out what's going on. You said to yourself, this is a business. And before you even got going, you created a three, five, and seven-year business plan, pro forma. Yeah. I mean, talk to us about that. I think, personally, that's very unusual. When I learned that about you, that shocked me.

Do foreign actresses and actors create business plans before they get in the business? Probably not. I mean, I can't say for sure. But also understand that I came into this industry at 30 years old. I had a strong foundation, a wonderful marriage, a happy family. I'd worked in corporate America. Chris came from corporate America. We're both well-educated. It's how we approach everything. So for me, it was a natural thing to approach the adult industry the way I would any business. The only difference with adult was I literally got to be me, like fully exposed, raw, wild, untamed me. And the business was the infrastructure, having the performer and knowing

how we were going to approach this. Then I just got to be wild. We could wear our hair how we wanted, wear clothes, not wear clothes. That's what was so exciting about the adult industry. You know, you make your own hours. You are your own boss. You work as hard as you want and you take a day off. For me, it was the perfect business. Something that I knew I wasn't going to do for a month or two.

It wasn't going to get me through school. I'm through school. It was a, I could do this until they push me off the stage. Like they're going to have to tell me, B, it's time to go. Like seriously, it's time to go like to the retirement facility because I love what I do. And I can't imagine not working in this industry, in this capacity. What was on the pro forma? Well, let's back up for a second. Would you have gone into the business if the pro forma numbers didn't work? No. That would be bad business. So you penciled this out. And what were some of the line items in the pro forma? Revenue? I mean, did you have to calculate how much you're... It was a basic P&L. I mean, because there was so

much we had to learn about the adult industry. Neither one of us knew. We learned how to, we kept adding items, of course, as we learned. But it was a basic P&L. Expense item. Yep. Because it's a new business, you don't know. We didn't have any income. We could forecast it based on other businesses that we were able to pull data from, but it was an unknown. But there was no plan B. We were going to make it happen. I mean, technology has changed so much that we're going to talk about that in a few minutes, but

what was the revenue model back then? How were you going to create your own videos, put up your own website, and then make money? Just that. We built a website, took photos, and posted them online. Were you charging people for it? Oh, yeah. Yeah. I totally get what you're saying it was your basic um solo model site which is it's gone now but back in the 2000s you join a site if you like if you liked me you go to brandylove.com and you paid your 29.95 and all my content was yours access to me emails whatever videos you wanted to watch it was a totally different format back then now we have the only fans concept which is typically a nominal fee and then you pay as you go you buy what you

want you don't buy what you don't want um totally flipped so i i know both sides but um yeah it was it literally was if you build it i'm not gonna say it that I'm not going to say it. That would be rude. You got to say it. You got to say it. If you build it, they will come. And they did. Thank God they did. And I think I didn't have a marketing degree. That was also self-taught. Just from watching what's working, what's not working. How do you drive traffic from here to there? That's when we started buying real estate online. We own 2,000 domains and we learned how to use those domains to drive traffic to where we wanted. Neither one of us went to school for that. That's just you realize, okay, how are they doing that?

And you just start researching and figure it out. So, yeah, that's literally how it started in the marketing. My first lesson in marketing was Howard Stern. I didn't know anything, but I knew that man had more traffic than anything else I knew of. So I made up a story and I literally started writing letters with pen and paper. I know nobody does that anymore, but I snail mailed him letters every day for two weeks, every day, every single day, even on Sunday, sat in the mailbox till Monday and he'd get to on Wednesday. I was determined to get on his show. And I said that I wanted to know why Playboy wouldn't shoot me. You got to try, but I knew they wouldn't. I know'm not a playboy-esque type model but i thought

that would get to him that i wanted to be rated like tell me why playboy won't shoot me did you send them photos or tapes of what you're of what you're doing yeah photos photos and my dot com the research it and i was coming down 401 in in north carolina the highway and i get this call from baba buoy his his guy and i i literally had to pull over. Cause I was like, I knew it was him. I know his voice. And that Friday I was in New York filming for E. I was on the last show that E the E channel put out. It was the last one that Howard filmed and it changed my trajectory. So, so much here that I want to get into, but were you nervous that

Howard Stern, the greatest radio personality, most popular in the country, maybe even the world, frankly, was going to actually read a letter? He must get a lot of fan mail. I was fine until the evening before our flight. I had worked myself up. My nerves were so jacked that I got sick, really sick, like flu-like sick. I'd lost my voice. And it was from just, it was over panicking, honestly. I seemed fine from the outside, but inside I was running and trying to figure out how I was going to handle this. What is it going to say? And I showed up, I got on that plane and I showed up and I'm sitting in the green room. And I remember just sitting there and I'm praying, I'm praying so hard. I'm like, Lord, just give me three minutes. Give me three minutes of my voice.

Cause this is my shot. And I knew I like at that moment, and I was miked up and I'm ready to go. And there, I can hear them coming down the hallway. I'm like, please, I'll be better. I'll be better. Just give me a voice. Walked me down. They're like, you good? I'm like, I'm chloroceptic. I mean, I basically drank it.

And I get out there and he asked me a question and I had a voice. I could answer. I was raspy, but you could understand me. And I just remember like, all right, we're on, here we go. And, um, I got, I was on for like, I don't know, maybe five, six minutes. I don't, I don't remember. Maybe 10, maybe two. I don't remember. It was a blur. And, uh, he marked me up with markers. It was hilarious. It made fun of my hair because I'm from Michigan. I had my big aquanet hair. It was hilarious to me. And we left and somebody asked me a question. My voice was gone. I couldn't speak for about four days after that. And our service crashed for months.

Howard Stern traffic. He put me on the map. He literally put me on the map. We were doing okay. We're like, ooh, we made $1,000. This is huge. Howard Stern comes in and your website's making $50,000, $60,000 a month. We were all just like, oh, I'd never seen numbers like that. I knew the adult industry was viable. I just didn't realize it was.

That's back in 2004. Akamai Technology is a company that I co-founded. Thanks for listening to part one of my amazing conversation with Brandy Love, one of the most successful adult film stars in history. Be sure to tune in next week for part two of my amazing conversation with Brandy.