In Search Of Excellence - Jimmy Carson: Excellence is a Mindset | E13

Episode Date: December 7, 2021

Randall Kaplan is joined by former professional hockey player Jimmy Carson to discuss his early and long-term success in the NHL, his experiences as a first-generation American, his post-professional life as a father and husband, his success after he retired, his views on being part of the biggest trade in sports history, and much more.Topics Include:The influence of Jimmy’s parents and his ancestry.  The American Dream and what it meant to Jimmy and his family.  The role of mentors in shaping our success.  Growing up near Olympia Stadium and attending his first Detroit Red Wings games.  Moving to Canada at age 16 to play hockey.  Being selected as the second overall draft pick by the Los Angeles Kings.  Being traded to the Edmonton Oilers for Wayne Gretzky.  Jimmy’s keys to success.  And other topics...Jimmy Carson is a former American professional hockey player who played for the Los Angeles Kings, Detroit Red Wings, Edmonton Oilers, Vancouver Canucks, and Hartford Whalers. In 1988, he became the second teenager to score 50 goals in a season - the first was Wayne Gretzky.  He scored more goals as a teenager than any player in NHL history – 92 goals.  After he retired from hockey, Jimmy has built a very successful career in financial services - something he planned during his early days in the NHL.Sponsors:Sandee | Bliss: BeachesWant to Connect? Reach out to us online!Website | Instagram | LinkedIn

I don't care what it is. You wanna be a yoga teacher, or if you wanna be an investment banker, or you wanna be an actor, or you wanna be a pro athlete, it all requires work ethic. And you have to go that extra mile to be prepared, to be knowledgeable, to expand your knowledge, keep your knowledge, put in the grunt work.

Just because you achieve a certain level doesn't mean you're some superstar and you can't do the things that got you there anymore. Welcome to In Search of Excellence, our quest for greatness and our desire to be the very best we can be, to learn, educate, and motivate ourselves to live up to our highest potential. It's about planning for excellence and how we achieve excellence through incredibly hard work, dedication, and perseverance. It's about believing in ourselves and the ability to overcome the many obstacles we all face in our lives. Achieving excellence is our goal, and it's never easy to do.

We all have different backgrounds, personalities, and surroundings, and we all have different routes on how we hope and want to get there. Today, my guest is my great friend, Jimmy Carson. Jimmy is a former professional hockey player who played 13 seasons in the NHL. He was the second pick in the NHL draft in 1986, was named to the all-rookie team in 1987, and played in the All-Star Game in 1989. In his second season in the NHL, he became only the second teenager in NHL history to score 50 goals in a season.

The first was Wayne Gretzky. He scored more goals as a teenager than any other player in NHL history, 92 goals. In the hockey world, he's best known as the player who was traded from the Los Angeles Kings to the Edmonton Oilers for Wayne Gretzky in what was one of the biggest trades in the history of professional sports. Jimmy has not only had a great career in the NHL, but not surprisingly, he's had a great career after hockey. He's a great guy and a great friend. Jimmy, welcome to In Search of Excellence. Thank you, Randy, for having me on.

I'm really looking forward to our conversation. It's a little hard to believe, but we've known each other now for 21 years. It started one night when I got a phone call from my great friend, Gail Stalsmith, who said there was a friend of a friend who wanted to meet me. And I want to provide a little context to this. At the time, Akamai had gone public and our company was worth more than $30 billion, and I had done well financially. There are a couple of profile stories about me in Detroit and elsewhere,

and a lot of stories about the company. And I had a lot of people calling me and emailing me asking for things and to get together. This was a friend of a friend, so I figured this was for sure another one of those. And when I asked Gail who it was, she said some guy named Jimmy Carson. I said, the hockey player Jimmy Carson? She wasn't a sports fan, and she replied, I think he used to play hockey. I've been a huge hockey fan and a Detroit Red Wings fan all of my life. So I said, yes, I want to meet him. And that's the beginning of our relationship.

21 years ago. How did it go on your end? Well, you're refreshing my memory, but that's very accurate. I remember having a colleague in the Detroit area who was living next door to, I never met, is it Gail? I never met Gail. And somehow was talking about, I was asked one day by my colleague, have you ever heard of Randall Kaplan? And I said, no, that name doesn't ring a bell. And then he started telling me that kind of the big story, you're from Detroit area and you moved out and you founded some big technology company and you're out in LA. And I had been going to LA quite a bit back then. And

my wife was from LA. And somehow I said, wow, he would be a great guy to meet at some point. I don't know if it was the first conversation or the second. I said, you know, I go out to LA a lot. I'd love to meet the guy and just network and see what, you know, I always admire people who've done great things and taken risks and et cetera, and hardworking people. And he's like, yeah, I'll talk to my neighbor. And the next thing I know, the kind of the wheels were in motion and somehow we got connected as far as, you know, I called you or I emailed you or something. And then I came out to LA and we kind of had our initial conversation slash meeting. And we've been friends ever since. I'm glad Gail gave me a call.

And Gail, if you're listening right now, thank you. I want to start off by talking about your childhood, your family life, and your journey to becoming an NHL all-star. Let's start from the beginning. People hear the name or read the name Jimmy Carson, they would not associate your name with your Greek heritage. Tell us about your grandfather and when he came to the U.S. and why. So my grandfather, so my real Greek name that, I mean, was changed in the 20s was Kyriazopoulos, which is a nice big long Greek name. My grandfather and grandmother were both born in Greece. And my grandfather was a chef on a cruise ship sometime in the 1920s. And the cruise ship ended up in New Orleans. And he jumped ship, literally. And he got to Detroit because he had a distant relative in Detroit.

And then he was a very hard worker. And like most Greek immigrants at the time and a little bit now, he became eventually a restaurant owner. And he owned a restaurant right across from, for you hockey fans, the Olympia Stadium, which was one of the original six stadiums and was kind of the heart of Detroit. For you Detroiters, it was Grand River and McGraw. And I actually have pictures of the Olympia being built, taken from my grandpa's restaurant. So years continued. The Red Wings became a big deal in Detroit.

And many years later, Gordie Howe and Ted Lindsey, you know, all-time NHL greats would tell me that, oh yeah, we would all go eat at your grandpa's restaurant. And they said, they'd say, we remember your dad and uncle as like little tykes running around. And one of the things I'll never forget, Gordie Howe specifically told me was two things. He said that, I don't know if it was featured in Sports Illustrated or not, but when he was talking about his first game, excuse me, his first NHL goal and the buildup and what was like the pregame routine. And he mentions that he ate at my grandpa's restaurant, which I thought was pretty cool. And then the other thing that both he and Ted Lindsey told me, who I got to know over over the years especially when I joined the Red Wings was that Jack Adams who was the big general manager president of the team and everyone feared

him he would like impose punishment to the players if they weren't performing well or whatever and he was just in a bad mood so you can't go across the street uh over to Carson's restaurant and I remember Gordie Hall telling me oh yeah Jack Adams would punish us by not letting us go to your grandpa's restaurant. So my grandpa, who I never really got to, he passed away in 75, but he had been ill, he had a stroke. So I didn't really have a relationship with him. But I'd heard so many stories over the year that he became friends with a lot of these, maybe not friends going out and stuff, but friends like seeing him in his place all the time. So that was kind of my initial historical connection. And then my grandma and grandpa having established themselves in the Detroit area. And back then Detroit was booming. Like that was the Model T days and Henry Ford doing the assembly line, et cetera. I mean, you're from Detroit,

so you know a little bit of Detroit history, I presume, like that Detroit was rocking back then. And he eventually sold that restaurant. He got another restaurant, a bigger restaurant, kind of by the GM headquarters. And then, you know, from then, always had tickets at Olympia and Red Wings and kept that connection. So that's kind of the initial Greek component, as well as kind of my very first entree to anything hockey related. I remember you took me one day. I met you down in San Pedro, and we went to an authentic Greek restaurant. I love Greek food. I love...

Do you remember that? Papadakis Taverna. Oh, yeah. What was super cool about that is there's a Greek tradition, apparently, where you take a plate and you throw it at a wall. And you're telling me, go do it. And it's a hard thing to do, to actually take a plate, it's going to break, and throw it at a wall. It was super fun. What's that tradition about? Well, I think that was more the tradition of that restaurant. But I mean, historically,

a lot of the Greek villages and islands, and we still have a family home. So what I didn't tell you was my mom. So other side of the family, the grandparents I just mentioned were on my dad's side. My mom was actually born and raised in Greece and came over like at 22. And she came from the island of Rhodes. So I don't know if you spend any time on any of the Greek islands, but the island of Rhodes is in the South Aegean. Historical in the sense of one of the ancient seven wonders of the world, the Colossus of Rhodes was there. And it's a very historical place and interesting story here. So my grandma on that side, they lived on a little tiny island in the Aegean as well. Well, during World War II, the Germans came in and literally the stories I heard were

just heart-wrenching. They just dispersed from the island. She was a widow with seven kids, my mom being the youngest. They dispersed and they ended up going all these little different islands literally to try to survive. And they weren't alone. Everyone was doing the same thing. So they ended up in Rhodes, which is the biggest of the islands.

And back then, they bought a lot. When I say right on the water, I mean right on the water. And back then, the poor people or the disadvantaged were buying and living on the water. The wealthier people were living inland with a bigger lot and a fence and a lawn and a yard, et cetera. And because they didn't want the migrant fishermen and the drunks in the middle of night. And so that's where my mom grew up, was literally right on the water in the Aegean Sea overlooking the mountains of Turkey. Well, as the decades started to progress, living on the water and having waterfront property suddenly became a nice thing to have. So they've kept this property.

And then about 20 years ago, they knocked down this old dilapidated house and put up a three-story building. The first floor is like a restaurant and a shop. And then my aunt's family has kind of the middle, and we have the top. So we have an amazing view. They call them houses. I'm going to call them apartment right on the water on one of the Greek islands. So we've gone quite a bit. We try to go.

It's a great thing culturally. And I love going there. I speak Greek. I was raised with a lot of heritage, et cetera. So we try to keep that going. I'm waiting for the invite. I love Greece. One of my favorite places, my wife and I, the make or break a trip was to Greece. So we can talk about that later. But let's- I didn't even answer your question. So you're talking about the plate. So historically, you'd go to a club or whatever. It wasn't so... Yeah, there was some plate throwing, but a lot of times you'd have a shot of ouzo or something, and then you'd break the glass. But that's not as common. But this restaurant, they played on that kind of inner village

party thing. And you're right, you would go throw a plate or throw a cup or whatever. And then if you remember, they'd turn all the music on and people were dancing, flipping off wall. I mean, it was just a very exuberant, fun evening. I'm a numbers guy. And I like thinking about profit margins and things like that. And I remember thinking, how much do these plates cost?

I mean, you could add another five to $8 per person per meal. Yeah, there you go. Let's go back to your family. What were your parents like? So I talked to my mom. So my mom came over and, I mean, she was a tremendous, you know, she's still living. She's a tremendous mom.

And she didn't work. She basically was, you know, a stay-at-home mom. I have one sister, 14 months younger than me. And she kind of did all the motherly, wifely duties. My dad grew up in the Detroit area. He went to University of Michigan. And then he ended up, he was a lawyer. And he did a lot of state law, some immigration etc and he passed away three years ago but he i had amazing parents for supporting me but you know my dad never missed one practice or one game like not one like everyone knew like he never missed and no matter where it was he was my biggest fan and sometimes he was the one who gave me the truth serum when I thought I played well or whatever.

And he would be like, not that over intimidating dad, but just he wouldn't sugarcoat it and just say, hey, if you want to get to the next level, you need to do this better or whatever. But listen to your coach. You always say that. Listen to your coach. But, you know, your work ethic wasn't where it should have been today or whatever the situation was. So I had amazing parents, very blessed, very thankful, and huge, huge support. So I've actually tried to emulate their parenting skills with my four kids in trying to give the truth serum, but being very supportive. You had a little bit of an unusual background because you grew up in a privileged environment.

Your dad did well financially. That was very different than probably 99.99% of the people that you played with throughout the years. No question about it. I grew up in Grosse Pointe. I went to a prep school called University Liga. And, you know, I was going to be that kid that was going to go to college and be an investment banker or be a lawyer. Being a pro athlete was the farthest thing from, I'm sure, my dad's mind in my mind. It just suddenly I started playing in some of these amateur hockey leagues and then hockey wear.

So I don't know if you know much about the CompuWear program, but they really revolutionized hockey, in my opinion, in the United States, and especially in Detroit. The owner, Peter Karmanos, who owned the Hartford Whalers and became the Carolina Hurricanes and is an NHL Hall of Fame famer and American Hockey Hall of Fame, etc. He's Greek. Him and my dad knew each other. And they were very good friends. My dad did a lot of legal work for him, etc. But they were friends, first and foremost, and had some family connections. And much like you were referencing Akamai and kind of a big deal, well, he went public in the Detroit area in 1992. And that was a big deal in Detroit. Everyone knew copyware. Well, he not only

was very driven for success on the computer software side, we would go to these tournaments and he's just like, you know what? And I won't use the exact words he used because he was a very intense, still is, I still see him occasionally, very intense person. He's like, you know, we go to these Canadian tournaments and we're just as good. There's no reason why we can't have a factory of American hockey players out of the Detroit area playing in the NHL on a regular basis. And people laughed at him. He said, oh, come on, that's impossible. And he said, well, I'm going to show you. So he created CompuWare, CompuWare Hockey Club. And I was on like one of the first teams ever. And we were traveling both countries, the United States and Canada. And we started really picking it up and winning tournaments and making a name for ourselves

and the program and individual players. So that was an interesting kind of start was once you'd start getting some exposure, you know, back to the original question, I'm at this prep school, I'm going to go to school and do whatever, investment banking or law. And, but now you're getting this exposure

and you have scouts coming at you at 14 years old from the Western Hockey League and Ontario Hockey League and the Quebec Hockey League and the Quebec Hockey League. And they're like, you've got some real talent. We want to draft you. And I'm like, what are we talking about here? So just to fast forward back then as an American. Before we do that, Jimmy, can we go back? I'd love to talk about when you started playing hockey. When was the first time you put skates on and then definitely want to move to the

progression, copyware, how you did in the leagues. But if we could just take a quick moment back. So back to the privileged background aspect. So this school, University of Liggett, had their own hockey rink. How many schools had their own hockey rink? Well, this school did. And we had, as one of our gym classes was skating. So if you remember earlier in the conversation, I was telling you how my grandpa owned this restaurant across the street from Olympia. Well, he also owned a lot that was a car wash, but subsequently became a parking lot. So now I'm a young kid. My dad is a lawyer, but he, my grandpa got ill. He had a stroke. So my dad would, was kind of in charge of this parking lot. So he would go down for every Olympia event.

And it was about 15 minutes from our house where he would bring me along. So here's, I'm this little tyke, five, six years old going to Olympia stadium and the Canadians were in town. Or it was a, I remember one time it was a kiss concert. I mean, everyone, the Beatles played there. Elvis played there. You had the NHL, you had Harlem Globetrotters, you had whatever you could imagine. So this parking lot was literally across the street. So it was always full. So my dad would take me, he would drop me off at the door. I knew the usher. I knew the popcorn guy. I had charge accounts with all these guys, the popcorn guy, the ice cream guy, the Coke guy's lap. And then my dad would come in after about

period or two, I'm five, by the way, five or six years old. And then a year or period or two, and then he'd come grab me, he'd settle my debts, you know, $2 for the ice cream guy and $1 for the popcorn guy. And then he'd take me home. So of course, I have this real love of hockey, just because I'm going to the Red Wing Games. So now I go to the school where we're going to learn how to skate in gym class. So that's where I first got my spark is, okay, I'm going to these Red Wing Games. I love watching it. So now I'm going to go try skating. And I was pretty good in skating. And then the next step was, okay, I'm going to go play on a team, house team. So that's kind of how it all started. One of my first memories as a kid, my dad used to take me to games at Olympia and then Cobo Hall

after that. And I grew up a lifelong fan as well, going to a few games per year. But Olympia was amazing. Old school building, brick building, square rectangle shape. It was just awesome. So it was originally that in chicago stadium and madison square gardens were all built for boxing so they went straight up like this so if you were in the top level the upper the mezzanine or the upper deck when you look down i mean you were looking straight down at the ice where like joe lewis in detroit and some of the stadiums after that they went way back like that so they could get more fans in. Now the newer stadiums have gone kind of a little bit more straight up. But yeah, it was amazing. If you go to that upper deck, you were like staring straight down at the ring.

So you're six years old when you started playing and you're playing at Liggett. By the way, as you know, I went to Country Day. We had a very good hockey team. We recruited. We played you in a bunch of sports. We split a lot of the sports. And I don't remember how we did on the hockey front, but the team played at Cranbrook, which is another local private school. I think Liggett, Cranbrook, Country Day were the three best.

But hockey was a very big part of our high school days, going to all the games. Oh, yeah, for sure. Yeah, that was a big rivalry. Those three schools were, you know, in the prep school league, they were the big competitors. They still are to a certain extent. But I never actually played for the school team. So they wanted me to later years when I got into high school years. But so, yeah, six years old, I start playing.

You know, house was kind of the first few and I was really excelling and I started playing up. And then we I transitioned. But now this is where the computer story comes in. A couple of years later, Peter Karmanis is starting his computer hockey program and I start playing for him. And then I play for him all the way through until I left to go to junior hockey. You were 12 years old at the time. And I think you had a coach there, the late Gene Alfie Turcotte, who was a former player in the NHL, Michigan hockey pioneer. And he had helped develop a lot of great professional players. Two little factoids here, and I'm going to call him Alfie.

I guess that was his nickname. Well, I'm going to correct you. Alfie's a son. The dad is Riel. Oh, Riel. Okay. Riel was the coach. So Alfie was a couple years older than me, and Alfie was a super...

So he was on an older CompuWare team after this CompuWare program got going. Alfie, Palafontaine were the two big names, and Al Iaffredi were the big names on the older team. Me and a couple other guys were on the younger team. I mean, there was 10 teams, but there was midgets and bantams. But Alfie's dad, Riel, who created Riel Turcotte Hockey Sick Handling Schools, he was my coach at 12 years old. And he was from Montreal. He was French-Canadian. I loved the Montreal Canadians and Guy Lafleur. And that was all my... And he came to me at 12 years old and said to me, he pulled me aside one day and I loved him. He was such a great influence. He recently passed away. And his son was Alfie and his grandson was second pick for the Kings last year, I believe.

He was. And you and he were the only two Americans selected in the top 10 of the draft. You in 1986 and he in 2019. So I believe it was your coach who told you and gave you the confidence where for the first time he said you had a chance to play professional hockey. And what did that do to you as a confidence booster for someone like him? He had to work with so many professionals. And here he is, your coach, and telling you you can make it to the bigs one year, one day. So Rial Turcotte, the gentleman I was just referencing, was my coach. He came to me. He played at Michigan State Hockey. He was coaching all these different players. He had a stock stick

handling school. He was very in tune, knew a lot of scouts in Montreal, et players. He had a stock stick handling school. He was very like in tuned and knew a lot of scouts in Montreal, et cetera. He came to me one day and said, you are one of the most, I think he told me, he says, other than my son, Alfie and Palafonte was just coming to the program. He says, other than my son, Alfie, you may be the most talented player I've ever coached. And he says, you can make it to the NHL if you work really hard and you have a good frame of mind. So that just boosted me so much because I knew that was the first time I thought in my head, you know what? I want to be a pro hockey player. It went from like,

I'm pretty good and the team is good and we're having fun to this is now going to become a more serious endeavor where, yeah, I was still a kid, still having fun playing this is now going to become a more serious endeavor where yeah i was still a kid still having fun playing doing all the fun stuff but it's like okay i need to i can't skip a practice i can't you know i gotta train in the summers i have to be dedicated if i'm going to try to get to the next level it just elevated that inner drive from this is fun it's an activity but it's serious i can do this so you need to sacrifice you're 15 and you light it up you have 159 points 85 goals 74 assists and 65 games not too shabby there at that point we're just playing with everybody you're playing with and scoring at will?

Well, I'm not sure if you're referencing junior hockey or midgets, but the, so I had a big decision. So this will answer your question at home. So I had a big decision to make. So I'm playing through the computer program and I get to my midget year, 15 years old. I had a very good year. We were doing like 10, 11 tournaments all over Canada, all over, or not less the US, but all over Canada. So now I'm getting recruited by the Western Hockey League, the Ontario Hockey League, and the Quebec Hockey League, and US colleges. So Michigan State, Michigan, Minnesota, one of the Minnesota schools, Harvard. But I had two years to, I don't know if waste is the right word, but I had two years to I don't know if waste is

the right word but I had two years to get there before I'm going to college I was just finishing my sophomore year of high school or I could go to junior hockey which that's a big risk if you get hurt and you don't play etc it was a risk and so anyways we got the tour of the western teams i ruled that out really quickly as if my dad is like way too much traveling you'll never go to school i mean you're like the geographical territory of the western hockey league was huge and then ontario and then quebec so quebec pat lafontaine all-time nhl great and local Detroit great. He had just gone to Montreal Junior Canadians, Verdun. Well, I was enamored by Montreal. I was enamored by the Montreal Canadiens. So the Montreal Canadiens owned the Verdun Junior Canadians, and they made a strong pitch for me.

And Serge Savard, if you're a hockey guy, you'll know that name. He was the GM of the Montreal Canadiens at the time. He was literally royalty in Montreal and hockey circles. He'd won, I think, 10 or 11 Stanley Cups as a player. And he was running the Canadiens now. And he said, we want you. And he was the second person who told me, other than some scouts, you can definitely play in the NHL. And we want you in our junior program. we will take good care of you and we will

help you develop, et cetera, et cetera. And that just that personal attention kind of sealed the deal. And then there were some other factors, too. But then I left home at 16, roughly, and I had two years of junior hockey in Montreal. You're 16. You're living in Canada. You're 16, you're living in Canada, you're playing for the Canadiens junior team and you're living with a French-Canadian family. What was that like? Did you speak French at the time? I had been taking French class in school

back in Detroit at Liggett, University of Liggett, and I knew rudimentary French. I knew more how to conjugate verbs than I knew how to speak or understand, but I really made it a point to immerse myself and I only spoke French with them. And I loved it. For two years, I mean, we had a tremendous family and they had a boy and a girl. The boy became like a little brother.

The daughter was like three. I think the son, his name is Yannick, he was like 11. So he idolized me. And I would bring him to the locker room and bring him around. And these Canadian towns, the junior hockey town, it's a big deal. It's almost like an NHL team. I loved it. And I started to learn French and understand

French and tremendous cultural experience. And I was so happy I went that route, not only from a hockey point of view, but also just, you know, the life experiences and living with the French Canadian family at 16. Would your parents come visit you? Watch you play? Yeah, often. They would, back to that supporting me me they would come a lot and it was a kind of a big joke because uh being from an ethnic family especially the greeks like they're all in cooking and making sure their kids get fed so my mom was always worried to make sure i was eating enough and making sure so she'd be bringing all kinds of food and it worked out great. And then it got to be, she was teaching the people that I lived with Greek recipes and then they were teaching her French Canadian recipes. So it was a lot of fun, but yeah, they came out a lot.

One of my closest friends, Rick Rivera, has four kids, three sons, and they all played hockey. One of them, Nikki. So there's Jake, Luke, and Nicky. Nicky has a chance to make it to the pros this year, but he and his wife, Dana, go to most of their games. They're flying every other weekend somewhere. And the grandparents went as well. Baki and his wife, they would go and they would fly crazy every place that they could. And this was a regular thing. I often wondered, they sacrificed a lot of their weekends, but they were super supportive parents. They have a great relationship with their kids. And I always thought that was something I really admired. I thought it's great. When you have parents who are going to each game, your practices, the parental love,

I think, is very important to your development as an athlete mentally from a confidence perspective. Randy, no question. I'll go back to what I said earlier. I mean, my parents were amazing. There was no weekends for them. It was whatever our schedule was. Like if there's a hockey thing, it wasn't even an issue. We're going to like the hockey.

Now, granted, the summer times we would go, like I told you you we'd go to Greece a lot and we would do stuff like that but when it was hot like when we had activities that was the social life so being a parent now with four kids they're at various ages but I know there's a lot of times where I would say wow I can't believe my dad did that because I didn't really want to go to the 7 a.m. practice, you know, wherever. I'd rather go out the night before with a few other couples and sleep in. So you've got two years with the junior Canadians. You have 116 points. The first year, you have 153. The second year, you're having fun. And by then, you're one of the top prospects in the 1986 draft. And you're expected to be the number one or number two pick overall. And Detroit, our hometown Wings, had the number one pick this year. They were the dead wings. And the Kings had

the second pick of the draft. And there was a bunch of chatter in Detroit if they would take you. But I think they were saying from the beginning, they planned to select Joe Murphy as the number one pick, which they did. And the Kings picked you with the number two pick. Did you know the Kings was coming and how many other teams did you talk to? What were the interviews like? Yes. Coming from Detroit, everyone was talking about, oh, they should draft a hometown kid. And there was a part of me that wished that, but they were like the president at the time, Jimmy DeVilano, or the GM, was very clear about it. We are drafting Joe Murphy.

So I kind of gave that up. I didn't. It was more of a media thing. Oh, why don't they draft the hometown kid, blah, blah, blah. So I didn't really even think much of it. In hindsight, I think it was the best thing that could have ever happened for me personally, just the style of play, et cetera. So as you're going through this process, you start having some interviews. So I get a call from the Los Angeles Kings. They want me to fly

out and give me an interview. So I look back how naive I was. I'd never been to LA. I knew nothing other than Hollywood and TV, really about California, let alone LA. So I remember flying in and they picked me up. I knew LA wasn't a huge hockey town. So imagine I grew up in Detroit, even though they were the dead things, it was still a good hockey town and had a great long original six history.

I go to Montreal where hockey is the religion, like hockey comes before everything else. And you live and breathe hockey every moment. And that was the atmosphere I was in for two years. And now I'm going to LA where hockey and the LA Kings are probably about 37th on the list of activities and things to do in LA. So, but nevertheless, to me, it was NHL. It was very exciting. I got there and I remember that was the heyday of the Lakers and the Lakers were, it was showtime, Magic and Kareem and James Worthy, et cetera. So I was excited to go to the forum, the fabulous forum at the time, I think it was called. Not really as much for the hockey.

I only knew like Marcel Dion and LA Kings, but I mean, I wanted to go to a Lakers game. And then I got a tour, Rodeo Drive and Santa Monica and just kind of all the hot spots and I'm sure the touristy things that they bring people in. And then I got to meet Rogi Vashon. He was an all-time great. So he was the general manager. Pat Quinn was the coach. Phil Meir, longtime NHL guy who I still see in Detroit. He lives in Detroit. And Mike Murphy. I got interviews with all of them. And they showed me the NHL locker room. And it was, you know, I'd see Marcel Dion. And it was, I didn't meet Marcel at the time, but it was, I knew Marcel from Detroit, as I told you earlier, I was going to all the games.

And it was a real controversial move when he came to LA. But, and then I'll never forget, I came up and I met Dr. Buss, Dr. Jerry Buss. That was very interesting, you know, but it was just all kind of surreal. I wasn't even 18 yet because my birthday is July 20th. I was very interesting. But it was just all kind of surreal. I wasn't even 18 yet because my birthday is July 20th. I was turning 18 that July. So here I'm 17 years old and I'm having a private meeting with Dr. Jerry Boss and talking about the Kings and the Lakers and magic and all that. So yeah, it was very interesting. I got interviewed by a few other teams, New Jersey Devils, et cetera. And I remember we went to a Mets game with some other prospects

and then, but yeah, but I had no clue the Kings were, were gonna, were gonna draft me, but interesting story. If you want to hear how I first heard about the Kings drafting me, this got a lot of publicity back in the day. I kind of forgot about it until you asked me the question, did you know? So we were staying back then, all the NHL drafts were at the Sheraton. Well, they were at the Montreal Forum, but they were like, everyone stayed at the Le Centre Sheraton, which was the big Sheraton in town in Montreal. I knew that place very well because my parents coming in almost bi-weekly or almost weekly sometimes, that's where they would stay most of the times. I was at the Sheridan all the time.

So here we are for our draft, and we're at the Sheridanadiens suite, Serge Savard, come on by, this is nice. We're going to try to get you, but we're too low in the thing. No way you'll be there. So I was talking to him. So we go back up to the room. Night before the draft, I'm hearing all kinds of noise in the room directly adjacent to us. And it clearly was deliberations on an organization talking about who they're going to pick and what their draft and whatever else is going on. And I remember very distinctly hearing Pat Quinn's voice, like a very booming voice. And I'm like,

that's the LA Kings. So I remember for about 10 minutes, putting my ear to the door with the cup. And I remember them deliberating if they're going to take me or not. And they all said, yeah, we're going to take them. And I went in the other room and I told my parents, I said, I'm going to the Kings tomorrow. They're like, what are you talking? You don't know. I said, they're next door. And I just heard him say, they're going to take me. So anyways, that's a true story and he can believe it. And it was 20 years or so ago or longer, the reporters were all asking me, how did you first hear about the Kings? And I remember telling that story and they were like looking at me like that was weird. I said, nope, that's a true story. So this was back in 1986 and the Kings were coming off of a season where they had only

won 23 games. They had missed the playoffs three out of the past four years. And you said, I think at the time you had mixed feelings about this a little bit. But on the other side, you had a lot of upside to coming to a team that had missed the playoffs and needed substantial improvement. Okay. When I say I had mixed feelings, the mixed feelings were,

there was a little part of me that wanted to go to Detroit because it was number one overall and it was hometown. But that was more of a pipe dream because they were very clear they were not going to pick me. They wanted Joe Murphy. So I got over that very quickly. I go to Montreal. I would have loved to been drafted by the Canadians. Hockey town, crazy. What I had mixed feelings about was LA was not a hockey town. They were a dormant organization, at least in my mind. I knew nothing about them. They were never making the playoffs. All I knew about them was they had a half empty stadium, or I should say half full stadium, glass half full, and they had Marcel Dion. Other than that, I knew nothing about them. So here I am,

I get drafted by him, and I'm still so excited to be second pick overall NHL. But the mixed feelings were like, wow, is this going to be as exciting as if I were in a real hockey town? That's kind of what I meant by the mixed feelings. But in hindsight, it was a great place to go. It was a more offensive division. They needed some help. And we you know, it was, we were an up and coming team. Tell me about the night before and the day of your first game, your life dream is about to happen and come true. Did you sleep at all? What were you feeling when you were putting on the uniform, lacing up the skates, you're in the locker room and you're stepping onto the ice

for the first time. So in order to tell you that I have to just build it up a little bit. So I get to LA and I meet this young rookie, Luke Robitaille, and me and him kind of hit it off a little bit. And the next thing I know, Marcel Dion comes to me and Luke, and he had already talked to the organization. And he says, hey, I want you guys to live with us. And I said, wow. And really, Luke lived with Marcel, and I lived right next door. And I remember Marcel told me, well, I'm going to bring Luke in with me. His English is so-so, and I want him with us. I said, oh, that's fine. And he had arranged with his neighbor for me to live with his neighbor, but literally right next door.

So here we are in training camp and I'm going to practice with Marcel Dion driving. And I was just like, this is insane. So like an all-time great player, someone I idolized growing up, and he's now, we're going to lunch together and we're going to practice. you know i'm hearing him complain about how early the traffic and the 405 and crenshaw's always so damn busy and you know you're just like normal stuff and it was such an amazing thing so now we're building up we're getting the training training camps over and now i made the team luke made the team and now we're getting ready for our first game we get in the car we're going we're going to the game with with Marcel well I'm a nervous wreck I kept looking at Luke and he's just like like we're just like this is our first NHL game and you of course there's butterflies now we had

played some exhibition games but still it's your first NHL game it's like the real deal very nervous I remember Luke got a goal his first game I got an assist I think I got a goal his first game. I got an assist. I think I got a goal my second game. Once you got kind of got on the scoreboard, alleviated some of the jitters, I just kept saying, prove you belong, prove you belong, prove you belong. Just every shift, prove you belong. That was my model. You killed it that year. You played in every game, 79 points, NHL All-Rookie Team, candidate for Calder Trophy Rookie of the Year. And that went to Luke. And Luke was the 171st pick of the draft. He had 84 points that year in 79 games. Let's talk about that for a quick minute.

I went to Luke's retirement party, and Marty McSorley read his scouting report, which says something like too small, lacks hand-eye coordination, not big enough to play, and not fast enough to make it. And there he was. You guys are both rookies. And he lit it up. What's the story about that? I mean, you hear about Tom Brady, the six-round pick. And here's Luke who finished the highest scoring left wing in NHL history. So Luke and I were rivals. So going back to junior hockey, we were rivals in junior hockey. We actually played against each other for the championship, and we were both known, and there was another couple guys,

but we were kind of like the two stars of the league for that one or two years. So, and we were, our teams were rivals. He played on the hall Olympics. I was on the Verdun junior Canadians. And so we would play them like seven, eight times a year. So I got to know him kind of grudgingly on the ice. We, there was a lot of, uh, what do you call it? Media attention paid to us for different reasons. He was French-Canadian. He was kind of a hometown guy. I was the American following in Pat LaFontaine's footsteps who was going to be a high pick. And then that year, the all-star game for the Quebec League was in Hull. And I remember just going up to Luke and we were talking and his English was okay and my French

was okay. It was just kind of one of those things. You knew each other and we, we developed a bond. So now we show up at training camp together while I knew him right away, he knew me. So we kind of were talking and we got, we hung out a little bit in, in training camp and very quickly we became friends. And I never view, I know the scouting report said that, that, and he was slow and he couldn't, but I saw him play junior hockey and he lit it up and he did very well. So I never really, I just didn't think much of it. I just thought, yeah, he's going to be fine. I didn't think he'd be that fine, but I, you know, like no one knew he was, uh, the thing about Luke was he had such tremendous enthusiasm. He, nothing got him down.

He had a great work ethic. And I think for Luke, looking back, and I don't want to speak for him, but from my point of view, I think going to LA was also a great move for him. You know, you're an entrepreneur. You talk a lot of times, you're looking for an investment opportunity or a business and they say it's location,

location, location, or the right idea. I think that's true in pro sports, because if you go to the wrong organization and you don't get the ability to play, even though you're the exact same person, the same work ethic, the same physical skills, you don't get that opportunity. Sometimes you just don't. Luke and I have actually talked about it. We've known players who played one or two years in the NHL that if they'd gone somewhere else, they would have a great career. I think the stars align and Luke started shining right away. And being with Marcel, I think was great. He and Marcel were line mates year one. I had Dave Taylor, was a great all-time NHL player and was the captain of the team.

Yeah, Luke was, he was just so enthusiastic. And right from the get go, he fit. The Kings did way better with both of you. They finally made the playoffs and you were the fourth seed. You lost to the Oilers in five games, the first round, who of course were led by Wayne Gretzky. But we're going to get back to Wayne a little later in the show. But were you happy with your performance as a rookie? Yes, I was thrilled. thrilled early on you're nervous but then all of a sudden for as an offensive player you start getting power play time you're like you're getting a lot of key minutes key opportunities and suddenly you're being considered

as part of the nucleus and you're producing and of course there are a lot of times where you're you know this game I was horrible or you know you have your doubts but you're producing. And of course, there are a lot of times where you're, you know, this game, I was horrible or, you know, you have your doubts, but you're still, you know, an 18 year old kid in my case. And the coaches are like, hey, kid, you had a bad game. Don't worry about it. This happens. Like, hopefully you'll have a decent career and you'll play a lot of more games.

And then you have those exhilarating times where you go, you know, get a goal and free assist and you're the first star of the game and the team wins. And you're thinking, wow, this is in the NHL. I can't believe it. And you have those highs and lows. But yeah, there were definitely more highs. And suddenly you're like, wow, I can definitely play in this league. And this is a great spot.

So we'll talk about your second season for a second. You had 107 points your second season, 55 goals, 52 assists. At this point, I think you're 19, one of the best players in the league and probably one of the best players in the world. And team makes the playoffs again. You lose again in the first round to the Flames. At this point, you're settling in. And before we move to the rest of your career, I want to talk about the ownership of the team, which is players I know is really important to you and to the team's culture. I want to start with the late Jerry Buss, and then I want to talk about Bruce McNall, both larger-than-life figures and both visionaries. Let's start with Jerry. Well, so I don't really have a lot of personal stories of Dr. Buss other

than he was the owner and he was there. And then we started hearing rumblings during the year. There's this guy, Bruce McNall. And I would read the LA Times or whatever. You'd read a little bit. And then all of a sudden, it was like, oh, there's negotiations. Dr. Buss may be selling the team. So you don't know. I mean, I'm a rookie in the NHL. Your team's going to get sold. You don't know. You're thinking about your next practice or game. And then all of a sudden, they call a meeting and there's Dr. Buss and this other guy who had never seen. And the deal was that Bruce got, I think he bought 25% of the team with an option for another 24%. Long story short, Dr. Buss was on his way out to only focusing in on the Lakers. And Bruce McNall was becoming the sole, from minority to sole owner. And even when he was minority, he was in that locker room every day. He started befriending us. He was the presence. He was the gregarious guy. And he was bringing in

Rob Lowe and all kinds of celebrities into the locker room on a regular basis. Right. So Bruce, as you know, another larger than life figure, he also came from nothing and built a fortune in the coin business, then sold antiquities, then branched out into movies, and finally into professional hockey. Tell me about Bruce and what he was like, your relationship with him and the team and his relationship with the fans. And then we're going to talk about afterward what happened to him. So Bruce, right away, was not a typical owner. And I didn't know that at the time, by the way, other than I had Dr. Buss, but he very much got involved. He was in that locker room at all times,

before the game, after the game, maybe in between periods, you'd see him scoot by. He was there. Now, of course, as a player, you're dealing with your coaches, your training staff, but now you have the owner come in before the game and say, hey, Jimmy, come here. I want you to sign this for me.

Hey, Jimmy, I'm going to come in afterwards. I'm going to introduce you to someone and stuff like that. So I developed a pretty, I'd say closer relationship with him. I know Luke did as well. I can't speak for a lot of the players. I don't, you know, but I think he had a few people that he was kind of conversing with more than others. It then became more like in the off season, hey, why don't you come to my office? I'd like to buy you lunch. I'm going to show you what I do.

And I remember somehow he had mentioned something about Ronald Reagan. He goes, you want to meet him? I go, yeah, sure. I'll meet Ronald Reagan. And he's like, yeah, hang on. Hey, call the secretary and be like, assistant, hey, call President Reagan's office and get Jimmy an appointment to go meet him. Stuff like that. He's like, you know, one time I asked him, hey, I'm looking for,

I don't know, his tickets for something. And he's like, oh, how many do you need? Like he was always just kind of like, he was just that larger than life, trying to please everyone kind of guy. So I got a good relationship with him. I actually invested in some of his coins. He told me about it way back when he started getting some players involved. And hey, why don't you, if you're interested, you know, I got this, I got that. And then at the end of my second year, he says to me, hey, come hey, come to my office. So I go to Century City. I go through. And he is making a real name for himself.

Like he becomes the NHL chairman of the board of the NHL. And he's talking all kinds of stuff. And he's like, you know what, Jimmy, we need to sign you to a long-term deal. He says, go buy a house. I'm 19. Okay, go buy a house. I'm 19. Okay, go buy a house. And he goes, oh, my wife, Jane, she's an interior decorator. She'll outfit it for you.

Here's Jane's card. Call her. She knows you'll be calling. You know, like, he just moved quick, quick, quick, quick, quick, quick. He says, you go find a house and tell me when you got it. And then we'll start negotiating a long-term deal. And Jane will come. Jane will outfit it for you.

And this was all I could do. And I remember buying a house in Redondo Beach. And Jane, his wife at the time, they've since divorced. Very nice lady. Very accomplished. She basically helped me outfit the house. So here I am, a 19-year-old kid. just finished my second year, got a beautiful home in Redondo Beach, fully outfitted.

And I'm now going to go home to Detroit for the summer for about a month and then come back for training camp. And we had started negotiating a longer-term contract. Right. We'll talk about the contract and the future after that in a few minutes. I do want to talk a little bit about Bruce and his career and some of the things that happened to him. So he was Mr. Hockey for the league, really the representative of a league, loved the sport, loved the players, loved Hollywood. In terms of Hollywood, he owned a

movie studio that at the time produced some of the largest movies, biggest movies, including The Deep and War Games. And then the studio got in trouble. It was run by a guy named David Begelman. And I think there may have been some fraud involved. And next thing you know, David Begelman has committed suicide in the Century Plaza Hotel and Bruce was in trouble financially. And what happened at that point next? Well, okay. So the bullet points were, as I remember them, Bruce had three kind of businesses.

He had an ancient coin business, which really got him on the map. He had the movie, whatever, making movies. And then he had horses. He had Summa Stables, I think it was called. I think it was at Numisvatic Fine Arts. I forgot the, the movie company and then Summa Stables. So he had, I think he had like, he owned Seattle Slews breathing rights or something, the triple crown winner. And then he started, he bought the Kings. So of course, at the time, I didn't, I don't know when the financial troubles hit. It was none of my business. I mean, I've read his book and he's told me stuff, but at some point, I think it started a year or two later, but I, what do I

know? He started having, I think, financial issues. And then that's where I think the legal issues arose from and trying to keep everything afloat. What he did was he needed to borrow money to improve his own financial situation. So what he did is he created fake invoices for the coin and then took out a loan of, I think, $100 or $200 million against these fake invoices. The collateral wasn't there. He made it up. And to get himself out of this financial trouble, he had arranged to sell the team to Sony. And it was 48 hours away from closing. And he was basically going to wash his hands of the whole thing. He'd put the money back. He would sell the team, but he would not be in financial trouble. And of course,

one of the auditors noticed something, and then his world unraveled. He went to prison for fraud. This was a guy who was on top of the world. He was living his dream. He had come from poverty. This was a guy who at one time, this is pre-NetJets world, owned seven jets outright and four helicopters. And this was a guy who regularly had sting over for dinner, who played the piano for he and his two kids and for Jane. So he goes to prison and he keeps all of his friends. He's in prison in Northern California, but he had everyone still coming to visit him. You really find out who your friends are when you're down. Gretzky came to visit him. Magic Johnson came to visit him. The CEO of Disney came to visit him. And it was such a distraction to the prison.

They moved him to Milan, Michigan, which is in the middle of nowhere. That's where I would go visit him. That's where you would go visit him, as did a lot of people. I mean, it was hard. You're playing hockey and you want to go there. And from what I understand, it was a bit of a drive. So Milan is, I think it's pronounced Milan, Milan, Michigan, federal penitentiary, you know, Metro Detroit, you know, Ann Arbor is it's like 45 minutes, I think south of Ann Arbor. It's from my house in Metro Detroit, it was about an hour and 40 minutes. So funny story, I probably visit them three or four times. So I go to visit him. I've never been to a federal penitentiary.

And I go there and I drive an hour and 40 minutes away. And he knew about it, that I was going to come. And I get to the screen you and whatever they're doing. It's very intense. And they're like, you can't go in. I'm like, why? Well, you have khaki pants on. That's the rule. The prisoners have khaki pants.

I'm like, well, you can't come in. That's the rules. They said, don't you have any pants in the car? I said, I don't know. I just wore my pants from home. I don't have other pants. So I remember going and I'm like, oh my God, I felt so guilty. I thought Bruce is going to think I stood him up.

So I'm calling people I know my God, I felt so guilty. I thought Bruce is going to think I stood him up. So I'm calling people I know in L.A., get Bruce a message. I said, can I get him a message? No, he'll figure it out. I'm like, oh, my gosh. So finally, I got him a message that, you know, there was a wardrobe malfunction. There was a pants issue. So years later, I was talking to Mike Illich, the owner of the Detroit Red Wings, who he passed a few years ago. Wonderful person. I became pretty close to him. And he was a friend of Bruce's too. Well, he told me the same story. He's like, Jimmy, I told him, I go visit Bruce.

He goes, Jimmy, I went there. I was so nervous. I went there. Now this is the owner of the Red Wings, Little Caesars Pizza, a big mogul in his own. He gets there with khaki pants and they won't let him in. So he goes back and he goes, I was so shaken up. I wrote, he said, I wrote this two page note to Bruce saying, I'm sorry, I just can't do it. I can't come visit you. But the moment you're out, I'm going to visit you. So I got stopped there because of my khaki pants.

So I never wore khaki pants again. So back to Bruce's prison term. Interesting story here. So Ken Starr was the attorney general during the Clinton administration. Clinton had been investigated for the Whitewater investigation with he and his wife. And at one point,

Ken Starr asked for the flight logs. In his first presidential run, Bruce actually owned the plane, the 727 that he loaned to Bill Clinton. And Ken Starr wanted the flight logs. And Bruce said, I'm not giving you the flight logs. So fast forward to a couple of years, Ken Starr shows up unannounced at Bruce's sentencing hearing. And Bruce's guidelines for what he did, I think, was a three-year prison term. And Ken Starr shows up and tells the judge, this defendant helped cost the American taxpayers $80 million. And the judge threw the book at him. He got five years in prison, the maximum sentence. Kind of a crazy story there. I met Bruce through you in 2001. He had just been released from prison. He was living in a halfway house. And you said to me, Randy, you should go meet him.

He was a great guy. You would enjoy each other's company. And I had read about him. I had read, here's a guy when a huge downfall was on top of the world. And I'd read in the Los Angeles Times, he has all these people coming to visit him, which says something about him. He's a great guy. He treated people well. And so I said, sure, I'd love to meet him. And you were 100% right. We became good friends. I got to know Bruce very well throughout the years. And I thank you for the intro. And I want to thank you now. When I got to know Bruce, whenever the Red Wings were in town, my ex-wife and I and he and his girlfriend, Dana, would go to the games with him. And what an experience this was.

We had VIP access to everything, which meant we went into the Staples Center through the private entrance, and we were walking around the tunnels of Staples Center before the game, which I'd never seen. I thought that was so cool. And it had been many years since he had owned the team, but there were a lot of people who worked there who had been there a very long time. And every single one of them who had been there a long time came up to Bruce, say hello, give him a hug. And at some point, I want to get some pizza and some cotton candy. So we walk into the main concourse. And the next thing I know, people

started rushing over towards us. And I'm not exaggerating. It was like we were Drake or walking with Mick Jagger. There were 50 people, three people deep, following us as we were walking, yelling, Bruce, Bruce. But people shoving programs and Sharpies in front of them, sign this. It was really great. Here he was years later, the guy that brought hockey to Los Angeles, and the fans absolutely loved him. And so did the players. We stayed after the games. We waited for the players to come out of the locker room, and we were hanging out where they all parked their cars, which I think is super cool. And they would all come up to him. They would hug him as well.

And it's interesting. I've been around a few other owners of professional teams over the years, and I've never seen any owner or player have that kind of affection with one another. So it says a lot about him. And it was fun for me. It was like I was walking with the biggest celebrity in the house. And it was really funny. There was one guy as we were walking, and the guy had a tray full of beer. And he was coming the other way, and he sees Bruce, and he starts backing up. And there was just a throng of people around us. And Bruce accidentally knocked the guy. He had like four beers in the tray, and the beer flew everywhere. A little bit on Bruce, but probably around 10 different people.

And Bruce and I were looking at each other. We were laughing our asses off. It was funny. But there's a second story which I have to tell as well. So I was sitting again with Bruce, my ex-wife, his girlfriend. We were at a restaurant in Brentwood called Toscana. And we were talking about, hey, what are you doing now? And he'd been in the movie

business. So he's back to being a producer. He had a partner. And I said, hey, Bruce, what are you working on? He said, I'm working on this movie called Alpha Dog. It's starring Sharon Stone and Justin Timberlake. I said, Sharon Stone, I said, why aren't I in that movie? And I get up, I go to the bathroom five minutes later. I come back and he said, you have't I in that movie? And I get up. I go to the bathroom five minutes later. I come back. And he said, you have a casting call Monday morning. This is a Saturday night. And I look at him. I say, ha ha. Yeah, right, Bruce. And my ex-wife says to me, he really called. And I said, Bruce, are you serious? Monday. He said, yeah, Monday. And I show up on Monday. I knew nothing about the movie business, was never in a play,

took an acting class in college. That was it. And I show up. They tell me where to show up. I'm in this office. And there's all these young kids there with scripts in front of them with the agency's name on the cover, CAA, William Morris. And they're pacing around. They're nervous. They're flipping through. And here I am. I'm looking around thinking, I don't have 90 minutes to be here. I really can't wait here. I had a job and I got to go back to work. But meanwhile, I finally get called in. I'm sitting there. I'm with the casting director. And we're sitting in the office, we're shooting the shit. And he said, oh yeah, you're a Detroit fan, hockey fan, Bruce, cool. And then in walks Nick Cassavetes.

He was a big director at the time. He had just come off the movie, The Notebook. This was a huge deal. This was his next movie. And he sits down, he flops himself on the chair and he says, so you're a friend of Bruce? Yeah. I understand you want to be in the movie? Yeah. He said, all right, you're in the movie. I said, just like that? Just like that. So he sends me, I don't even get a script at home.

I'm waiting for the call. I'm waiting for the call. I finally get a call. Come and show up in this location. I showed up in the location. I took a bus. I played a police officer who was taking a missing person report from Sharon Stone. The movie was about a middle-class drug dealer who was kidnapped and held ransom for his younger brother who was killed. And this is a true story about Jesse James Hollywood. Family grew up in the

valley. And I was to play a police officer. And I get there. I take a bus. You go to a parking lot. They shuttle you over. I take a bus. Nick said, come find me when you're there. Someone checked me in. He said, you have to. So I get into a police uniform. I had no idea what I was doing. They gave me a gun in the holster, obviously a fake gun. It looked like a real gun. They said, whatever you do, don't take out the gun. And so I had no idea where to go. I was nervous. Really was completely out of my mind. I said, where's Nick Cassavetes? And people are looking, say, well, he's really busy right now. I said, yeah, well, he needed, he told me to come find him. So we were shooting in a neighborhood

in the valley. And I go up and I see Nick and there's a bunch of people near him, right? They're surrounding him. He's a director. He's setting up the next scene. And I go over to him. I'm in a police uniform at this point. I've got the hat, the uniform. I have some fake name on my tag. And I said, excuse me, Nick, you remember me? And he looks at me sort of funny. Oh, Randy Kaplan, Bruce's friend. Yeah. So he said, okay, here's what you're going to do. He told me at that point what my role was going to be. And he just yelled out. He said to me, you have a pen and piece of paper. I said, no. So he just yelled out into the air, pen, piece of paper. And someone put the pen and piece of paper right in front of his face. And this was a neighborhood. So there were police around to guard the scene. So he calls over one of the police officers and he said, okay, Randy's playing a police officer.

He explains it. He's taking a missing person report. What would you say? So he said, give me your name, date of birth, social, et cetera, et cetera. So he said, Randy, write this down. I'm scribbling as fast as I can. So he said, okay, go over into the house. You'll be there. We'll wait for you. And I go over to the house and basically I'm sitting in a room. There's 10 cameras, 50 boom microphones. I'm on a couch. I'm actually on ottoman in front of the couch. And so there are all these people on the couch wearing name tags. I'm in there for an hour. They're doing the lighting. And I go over and I say to this guy who looked like he was in charge, I said, excuse me, excuse me. I said, why don't I have a name tag?

He said, no, no, no, no, you're in the movie. And I went back and I said, okay. I was too afraid to say, well, what does that mean? So at some point, maybe I was there 90 minutes now, they call in, they said, first team. So first team meant the actors came in and these people who were the stand-ins left. And now I understood what they were saying. And Sharon Stone sits down right next to me on the couch. And she had stone face. She was looking straight ahead, did not acknowledge me at all. And I'm sitting there thinking, this is unbelievable. It's on my bucket list to be in a

movie. Here I am. And I'm thinking, my boys in Detroit will never believe in a million years where I am. And so I'm thinking, I'm so nervous. I have not recited a single line in my life. Sharon Stone is sitting next to me, one of the biggest movie stars in the world. And she ignores me. And I'm thinking, I said to her, you know what? I'm going to introduce myself. So I turned to her and I say, excuse me, Sharon. And she turns to me and I said, hi, I'm Randy. Nice to meet you. And she nods her head and didn't even look at me. She was looking straight ahead. And Nick comes in. He said, is everyone ready? Everyone's ready. And I was going to start the scene. So he said, action. And I knew that meant we were going to start the scene.

And Sharon, you could see her start trembling. So I sort of waited. And her face, I mean, this was long delivery. She was waiting and waiting and waiting. And she said, where's my son? And I put, excuse me, we got to go back name date of birth social nick says cut cut cut cut what's up well you got to wait for the answer name give her the answer date of birth social and we do it again and at this point she starts yelling at me where's my son and i'm

sitting in the chair holy shit i start leaning start leaning back. And again, if someone yells at you, your reaction is you got to pause and kind of wait. And the eruption was I was not really prepared for that. I didn't have a read through. I messed it up again. And Nick says, cut, cut, cut. And now Sharon's pissed at me. And I'm thinking I'm going to get tossed off the set. And finally, I calmed down and it all went well. And I did a good job. And I'm thinking, I'm going to get tossed off the set. And finally, I calmed down and it all went well. And I did a good job. And at some point, Nick comes over and he whispers something to me. He said, Randy, he said, forget that Sharon Stone right next to you. He said, do you have an ability to piss people off? And if you know me, it's sort of a

laughable question because I definitely have the quality I can piss people off. And he said, forget she's Seren Stone. I want you to go after her and I want you to piss her off. Be aggressive, interrupt her. And so it was sort of fun. I was getting coaching for all of this and off I went. I was aggressive with her. It was super fun for me. I absolutely loved it. The thing went down. And the funny thing about this, this all happened, obviously, because of Bruce. I had something on my bucket list. I got paid that day, I think, $600. And I got to tell you, I still get checks today, residual checks. And I don't want to brag, Jimmy, and I owe this all to you. I probably should give you a commission on this. So here it goes.

I made $1.57 last year, and I made $2.84 the year before. I've gotten residual checks for $0.04. So thank you. I really do owe you a commission for all of this. And it all comes from your introduction to Bruce. There you go. Yeah, I mean, look, everyone who knows Bruce has a lot of stories. I haven't seen him in a couple of years.

Every time I do go to LA or I mean, back before COVID, when going a few Kings games here and there, I would try to say hi to him or whatever. And, you know, I think it's one of those stories of a lot of great stuff and probably some ugly stuff. But he's, you know, he always treated me very well. And for the most part, and we all have great stories about him and I wish everyone well, and I hope he's doing well. And I'm not, I'm not sure exactly what he's doing, but I know he's worked hard to try to make a comeback and carry on with his life.

He's a great guy. You know what else he did for me? Very generous. I think I, you know, I started an event called the Justice Ball. It benefits an organization called Bedzetic Legal Services. Bedzetic helps 12,000 people a year obtain free legal aid, poor, sick, elderly, and the homeless. And at the Justice Ball one year, we started doing a silent auction. And I go to Bruce. And sometimes, you know, you want these one-off things. So he donated a dinner with him going to whatever hockey game that he wanted to and spending a night with somebody. I mean, how generous is that? Who does that? And I really appreciate it. He's just been a great friend. The item went, by the way, for $14,000. So can you imagine being a hockey fan and bidding on that type of thing? I don't know if you remember this, Randy, but after we had met,

I came to the Justice Ball and I brought Luke and the B-52s were playing. And you were all excited. He said, we got the B-52s, Love Shack, whatever. And so we flew out and I called Luke and I said, come on, let's go to this thing. And I introduced, so, you know, on a personal note, I want to just compliment you. One of the things I've always admired about you is since I've met you, you're like, I didn't really know you like pre-Ockham Eye and they never really met anything to me. Like, okay, you did well, you had whatever the money stuff, all that stuff didn't really faze me what I what I admired was, I could always have a conversation with you. And you were very in tune, you weren't coming at it from a point of like, I've done this. So you listen to me, it was very much you would you would treat everyone, you know, like when we would chat very respectfully. But I admire your work ethic. So the few things that I've known you've done over the years, and I can only imagine what you did in the Akamai days, which like I didn't know you really then, pre-Akamai to get there, is I've seen what you've done with the Justice Ball because you are a master of

preparation and hard work. And whatever you do, you'll be successful in. That's very kind. Too generous, but thank you. There is a footnote to the Sharon Stone story, by the way. A good friend of ours, her best friend and I are good friends. And we were invited to a charity event at Sharon's house. She's very charitable. She does amazing things for people. And so my wife, Madison, I went to her house and we spent a night with her and I had a chat chance to talk to her. And I said, by the way, do you remember the movie Alpha Dog? And I said, of course I do. And do you remember the guy who played the police officer? She said, by the way, do you remember the movie Alpha Dog? And I said, of course I do. And do you remember the guy who played the police officer?

She said, yeah, vaguely. I mean, she didn't know where this was going. I said, well, that was me. And that was a really fun thing for me. So yeah, I remember you. I don't think she had a single clue, but I did get to meet her and it was super fun. And she's a gracious person.

So that was the footnote to that. Let's get back to the career. You had this conversation with Bruce in the office. You're talking about a long-term deal with the Kings. Bruce tells you you're one of the building blocks of the future. And then August 9th, 1998 happens and you're involved in one of the biggest trades in professional sports history. It's a blockbuster trade that sends you, Marty Jelinas, three first round picks and $15 million in cash to the Edmonton Oilers in exchange for Wayne Gretzky, Martin McSorley, and Mike Kruszelnicki, a trade that many people believe really changed the history of the NHL. At the time, the Oilers were coming off of four Stanley Cup championships in

five seasons. And Wayne Gretzky is considered the greatest player of all time. He had spent his whole career there. And the backlash here is just enormous. It triggered death threats against Peter Pocklington, the owner of the Oilers at the time. Backlash against Wayne Gretzky because his new wife, the actress Janice Jones, people wondered, is he coming to Los Angeles for her? And the trade upset so many Canadians that I think one elected official demanded the government try to block it. Pockington was burned in effigy. Gretzky was called a traitor by a lot of his countrymen. And Janet Gretzky was branded as the Yoko Ono. So let's go for the trade.

I want to hear all about it. What happened here? When did you find out? Tell us everything. So I told you, I buy this house in Redondo Beach. Bruce's wife outfits it for me, et cetera. I'm 19. I leave LA.

Bruce's last kind of talk to me was, hey, let's start talking about a long-term deal. You, Luke, and Steve Duchesne, who was also an All-Rookie member, you are the future of this team. We have a great future. So I go home, excited, pumped up, training. Probably around third week of July, I get a call from Bruce, which I thought was odd. He calls me, hey, Jimmy, what's going on? This and that. He goes, I really need to talk to you. It's important. I'm like, Oh, what's up? He goes, I got really good news. I think we're going to get Wayne Gretzky in a trade. I'm like, what? Like that's unheard of Wayne Gretzky in a trade. Like who, Hey, you don't sell Wayne Gretzky. You don't trade Wayne

Gretzky. You like, he just, it is what it is. He goes goes the bad news is they want you to go I'm like oh so you're saying I was thinking I had bad news for me but maybe not bad news for you so he's like I'm doing everything I can to keep you out but I don't know I was like you know of course back then no cell phones it was like oh are you kidding me he's like no I'm not. He goes, I'll do my best to try to keep you out. So of course, I didn't think that was a very strong endorsement of your staying. But I didn't think the trade would happen. I couldn't envision that he was going to actually pull that off. Until three weeks later on August 9th at 8 a.m. in the morning, I get a call from Bruce. And he goes, and I could tell right away when he,

hey, Bruce, what's up? It wasn't that gregarious, fun-loving guy. It was very somber. He goes, Jimmy, I don't know how to tell you this. And I'm really, really sad. Or I don't think he was sad, but sorry. He goes, but we just made a trade with the Edmonton Oilers for Wayne Gretzky. And you've been traded to the Edmonton Oilers. I'm like, what? I was just shocked. And he told me on that call, he says, don't worry, I'll try to get you back.

And I thought, oh, you know. So, you know, your whole persona brand of, you know, first two years in the NHL, you've grown into this being an LA King thing, living in LA, creating some roots there. And now you're just uprooted and not just uprooted for any trade, uprooted for a trade that, like you said, like there's a resolution in the Canadian parliament to rescind the trade on national security interests. He's a national treasure. We cannot allow this to happen. Peter Jennings and Tom Brokaw, it was a leading story everywhere. Literally, as soon as I hung up with Bruce, I don't know how they did it back then if they timed it. The moment I hung up, within three minutes, I had people knocking on my... I was at my parents' house, my parents' house

wanting to interview me. And I mean lots of people, print reporters, ESPN, CNN, sports. There were cars coming down the street with the big satellite dish, you know, like the trucks. And I'm just like dumbfounded. Like now it's just the media avalanche is opening up. And, of course, that's minor compared to what was happening in L.A. because there it was just 10 times everything was going on. Wayne was flying in and this and that. So it was just a whirlwind.

And I didn't hear anything from the Oilers for like two more days. I was traded for maybe the next day. I don't know. It felt like two days. And then I got a call from Glenn Sater saying, hey, Jimmy, how are you? I'm sure by now you know you've been traded. I said, oh, yes, I'm well aware. So then they flew me in. But it was just a surreal feeling because it truly was the largest trade in the history of sports, I believe. And it did revolutionize hockey. It really created hockey on the West Coast, the expansion, the Ducks, San Jose, Arizona, like that whole. It just expanded the footprint of hockey in the United States. And the exposure just increased dramatically.

Did you hear about Wayne's perspective at the time, how the whole thing went down? I heard snippets, but nothing that I could say firsthand. I heard everything from he was really upset with the Oilers because he was in Bruce's office and Bruce was negotiating with Pocklington. And Bruce shushed him and said, don't talk and put it on speaker. And he heard Pocklington saying not flattering things about Wayne. I don't even know if that's true or not. I heard that. And that's when Wayne said, that's a pull the trigger, Bruce. I had heard other things that Wayne had wanted to be traded and was going to go to Vancouver and that there was a deal all set for that to happen, maybe even the Red Wings. And then Bruce got in the mix. So to be honest,

I don't even know if it's really true, if Wayne really wanted it or he was pocklinton just trying to, you know, he was having financial issues of himself. So people always tell me, wow, what does it feel, you know, all these interviews over the years, what's it feel like to have, be the main player in the Wayne Gretzky trade i said actually the main player was the sack full of 15 million dollars that was the main player but it was surreal so what i had read and i read this in several sources in the press and i assume it well you never assume the press has it right but two hours after the oilers won the Cup in 1988, his dad, Walter, told him that the Oilers were planning to deal into another team. And

I think his dad had known for months about the news, but kept it from Wayne. And as you said, Pockington was struggling big time. And he did shop the team to Los Angeles, Detroit, and Vancouver. And Wayne at first didn't want to go or didn't want to leave. And he insisted that Marty McSorley come and Mike Krushnitsky come. And McSorley, as you know, was the enforcer. Don't mess with Wayne or you're going to get your ass kicked by Marty. And at that point, I think Glenn Sather, the coach of the Oilers, he tried to stop the deal too.

And then when he found out that Gretzky was involved in the negotiations, Gretzky changed the attitude and he wanted to come to the Kings. I think Bruce, so I do not know if this is accurate, but from what I've read and heard, there was a deal with Vancouver that Wayne said no. There was a potential deal with the Red Wings that Wayne was open to. But then Bruce put the full court, you know what kind of charming guy he is. He flew him to LA and he wined and dined him and this and that. And we could change hockey together and blah, blah, blah. And I think he wore Wayne down. And then it was a decision of like, okay, if I'm going to get traded,

I'd rather go to LA. But like I said, it's all speculation. I don't know. So the trade happens. You're now in the frozen tundra and it's a disappointing season for the Oilers. They finished third in the division. Then the playoffs come around and the Oilers are eliminated in seven games by the Kings in the first round. So the irony of that, what was that like? You're playing against your old team where you never wanted to leave and you're playing against your buddies. You guys were actually the favorites, and you were, I think, leading at one point, 3-1 series lead. And then Gretzky did his thing, and they lead to a comeback

and win the series 4-3. What was that like? That had to hurt a little bit. Yeah, well, backtrack a little. So it was an interesting season because like you said they were you'd go to games and you'd see the owner of the team being burned in effigy in the rafters and every single media story was about how could they do this and wayne gretzky and this and that so it was it was a constant drumbeat of negativity of but we actually had a decent season and then we tailed off at the end.

But then we, we went into the playoffs. You got to remember, there is a lot of good players, like all time, great players on the Edmonton Oilers, Mark Messier, Grant Fuhrer, just to see, you know, Yari Curry, Kevin Lowe. I mean, we're talking all-time excellent Glenn Anderson, great players. So we had played the Kings a number of times. I think we probably led the season series against them. It was always bittersweet for me whenever we'd go back to LA. Remember that home I was telling you about in Redonda Beach? My sister, who was going to college in LA, she took it over.

She was going to college in LA, she took it over. She was going to college living there. She invited a college roommate to live in there with her who ended up becoming my wife. I would just show up to this beautiful house I'd spent two nights in. I would sleep there the night. I said to my sister, I said, okay, I just want the house when I come in to play the Kings, which was four days a year. Then we'd play them in the playoffs. So it was always very bittersweet. You knew all these friends and people, but you're out of, you're out of the loop. It was a different team, a different Jersey color, different. It was, you know, the Gretzky show.

And we were up three, one. And then the big story was Bruce McNall brought Ronald Reagan in to the locker room and he gave them a win one for the Gipper speech. I don't know if you ever knew this. This was a big thing at the time. So this is game game five. So we're up 3-1, game five at the forum and win one for the Gipper. And they come out and beat us. So now we go back to Edmonton. And I remember that we were all laughing hysterically as the Oilers, Peter Pocklington tried to, to one up. I don't know, one up, but he tried to like, he felt pressure

to do something because Bruce brought in Ronald Reagan. He brought in, I forgot his name, Yuppie, the mascot for the Montreal Expos. We were on the locker room, like right before we're going to go on the ice. And here comes this mascot from the Montreal Expos comes in and he was like laughing and we were all looking at ourselves like what is this so anyways we lose a close game game six and then we went in and they brought in Reagan again win one for the Gipper and they beat us in seven so it was like uh you know it was one of those made for Hollywood moments where the Kings win in seven against the team that Gretzky came from. So you make the move. And obviously, Southern California, very different than Edmonton, Canada, which I think of is sort of the frozen tundra. I have a friend who lives there who said

it's obviously very, very cold there. But just coming as the other main player on side of the Gretzky trade, that has to be absolutely the worst place you want to be. Forget the geographic location, but the expectation and the pressure to perform must have been absolutely enormous. Yeah. And I got in trouble with one time I got interviewed and I said, you know, it's been a real tough, and I use the word reverse culture shock, because I grew up in Detroit. I played junior hockey in Montreal and I played in L.A. So now I'm in Edmonton, smaller city. And people took offense to that, saying that I was making fun of the city or whatever, which I really wasn't.

It was actually a very nice city. And the people, I still have very good friends from Edmonton that I talk to on a regular basis. Edmonton was a nice city, but it was just so much smaller than I was used to. It was like a small suburb almost of what's like a big city. And take that city in mourning, every conversation is about hockey, every conversation is about Wayne and four cups in five years. And wow, we're in third place. And I was the symbol because I was the only American on the team and the player traded, the main player traded for Wayne. So I just, it was a, it was a very difficult situation. The players were great. Like I said, some of the greatest players in the history of the NHL.

But Wayne was a friend. They grew up with him. They won cups together. They came in the league together. Were in each other's weddings. And I was a newcomer. And it was tough on all fronts. I read the fans didn't really like you or accept you that much.

You weren't what they wanted. Obviously, you weren't Wayne. I assume you could feel that. Were you ever booed when you played there? No. So I'll take a little offense. Not offense. I'll take a little differing view on that.

The fans were fine to me in the sense of like, you know, I actually had a good year. I scored 49 goals that year and a hundred points. Yeah. And I enjoyed the hockey, like the pure hockey, like the way they played hockey was amazing. Our practices were 35, 38 minutes. We just went, they were the best practices I ever had. The most intense, the players were amazing. Like it was a great hockey atmosphere. The asterisks in all this is the Gretzky trade. Like you're right. I'm not Gretzky. And I scored 49, but Gretzky scored 92. It was just, we're on a four game winning streak. We won four cups in five years with Wayne. It was a very difficult paradigm, not paradigm, but it was a very difficult position to be in. And I try not to make excuses.

And just, you know, as hockey players, you just try to play the next game and that's it. But it was just kind of annoying and pain to always be, you know, have that negativity. Unless we won the cup, it was going to be a disappointment. Then you had a knee injury there. How did that happen? Very freak. It was the start of my second year there. We were in Calgary. It was, I think, our last exhibition game. And there was like the last shift of the game or the last minute of the game. I would put my foot on the bench and Glenn Anderson, an all-time great, he had his foot on

the bench. So imagine like two feet on the bench and we're, I'm ready to jump over, but we're both looking at our guy. We don't really know each other's foot is there. We're just kind of like being lazy and putting our foot there, waiting for our guy to come and then jumping over. And there's a minute to go last exhibition game. Well, we just happened to both jump at the exact same time. And as we're doing that, our feet got tangled. And my leg, my knee kind of came underneath. So I'm coming with a leg underneath from the top of the boards. And I land right on my leg like this. And I tore my PCL, posterior cruciate ligament, which is very common in car accidents when your knee is bent and you get slammed and very common for like NFL linemen. Like the ACL is the more common one.

Everyone knows what an ACL is. You know, the basketball player or the soccer player gets extended. Well, the PCL is this way, NFL linemen. So that was the injury. And I just remember thinking, are you kidding me? Like a minute to go on this useless exhibition game and you get a pretty serious injury. So you were out for a while. Yeah. I was out for about a month or so, but that was the time when I got traded to the Red Wings. I asked for the trade. Right. You asked for the trade four games into the second season. And now here you are traded to your hometown, my hometown, Detroit Red Wings. By the way, I was super psyched when I heard about the trade. You're traded with another player in a fifth round pick

for Adam Graves, Peter Klima, and Joe Murphy, who had been the number one pick. The Wings had selected in front of you in the draft and as fate would happen, these players then helped Edmonton win the Stanley Cup the final season, their fifth in seven years. At this point, did you care? You're home and you're with your family and you're with the team I assume you always wanted to play for? I love playing for the Red Wings. It was great. And we, you know, like it was totally different. So now here you are, very well known now in the city, big hockey town, and a lot of friends and family at every game. And now the Red Wings are an up-and-coming team. Like we were like winning president's trophies for the most points in the,

in the regular season, but then we would not do so well in the playoffs. And then of course, a few years later, that's when the Red Wing dynasty kind of emerged, but this was kind of the building blocks of that. I was there when Sergei Fedorov got there. Obviously Steve Eisenman was, was the linchpin. Nick Lidstrom, I assisted on his first NHL goal. So literally, I saw these guys come in, like major players. So yeah, I mean, the trade happened and the Oilers win the cup. Was I upset? No.

Would I have loved to have been there and won a cup? Absolutely. But sport's a sport. So you move on. What can you do? So you have Goodyears in Detroit. And then Bruce was right. You come back to LA, you're traded for another future Hall of Famer, Paul Coffey. And here you are now. The irony of this is you're playing with Wayne Gretzky in LA. Yeah. So I had some decent years in Detroit. I was

scoring 30 goals or so. and I had some injuries there, but it was a totally different scenario. You have Iserman, you have Federoff, you had me. I wasn't getting nearly the ice time I got, but then I was used to, especially in my early years with the Kings, but it was tremendous. I really enjoyed my time with the Red Wings, and you could see that that team was starting to build up. And then, of course, they created years later, they created a nice little Red Wing dynasty. But yeah, so I get a call. So I become, I don't know if friends is the right word, but I became pretty close to Mike Illich, the owner of the Red Wings. And a quick little side story from Mr. Illich. He told me many years later, he bought the Detroit Tigers as well. He told me, hey, I want to tell you something. I said, what's that, Mr. I? Everyone called him Mr. I. And you want to talk about how Bruce was beloved by his players? So was Mr. Illich. He was beloved. All the players loved

him. He was very good to his players. So he told me, he says, you know, now you got to understand, he grew up in Detroit and he is Macedonian, which is very close to Greece, Macedonian Greek. And we're both Orthodox. I'm a Greek Orthodox. He's Macedonian Orthodox. And he came to me one day, he goes, you know, I learned many years later that we share the same birthday. And I'm like, we do? He goes, July 20th. He goes, of course, you're a lot younger than me. He goes, if I had opened that program at that draft table, and I had seen that we shared the same birthday, and that you were a local hometown kid, and you were an Orthodox, that's what he told me. He goes, I would overruled my scouts and picked you right on the spot. So I thought that was a funny anecdote from a, from an NHL owner.

He was a tremendous owner, but he pulls me in one day. I remember he's kind of like the Bruce calling me in the middle of July to tell me that you may get traded. So Mr. Illich calls me up. He goes, Hey, can you meet me down at Tiger stadium now he just bought the tiger so he owns the red wings and the tigers i'm like oh wow that's interesting and he pulls me in and we go to his suite at old tiger stadium and we're in there and he he you were chit-chatting and he just kind of asked me he goes he says to me do you would you want to be traded i'm like no i love playing here in detroit he well, you're not getting

as much ice as you're used to. But he says, you know what? He says, but I got to tell you, Bruce is just lighting me up every month. He's like, keeps asking me, hey, do you ever want to trade Carson? I'm here, you know, whatever, whatever. I had not really thought about it because it's like three, four years after Bruce had said, I'm going to try to get you back. So I said, well, I said, I really don't want to be traded. But if I had to be traded, I said, LA would be fine. And he said, you sure about that? I said, yeah. I said, I mean, you know, he says, I'll be going somewhere where I think I'd be wanted. And three, four months later, he calls me up. Mr. Elledge calls

me up and says, okay, we're trading you. He says, to LA. Remember our conversation this summer? And I'm like, yeah. He says, okay. He says, you know, that's just a trade that I think will work out good for both sides. So, yeah. So, now I go back to LA. And if you remember, that was the first real run the Kings had.

We went to the Stanley Cup finals and we lost to Montreal. And the city just exploded in intensity, in Kings mania, in hockey mania, Stanley Cup mania. It was insane in a good way. And we were all looking at each other and thinking, wow, LA is a hockey town. You were a huge part of that too. I mean, in the first round, you had five goals in six games against the Flames. Yeah, that was exciting. I mean, so when I got there, Wayne was hurt. He had had some back injuries

and there were some rumors that it may be more severe or serious, but it turned out not to be. I mean, I think he was pretty serious at the time, but he came back and early on, yeah, I had some success early in the series, in the playoffs game and then we lost the next four games and over or no three games in overtime and then uh yeah we won the first one we lost three in overtime then we lost the last one in Montreal and to this day that's the last cup that's been

won in Canada because they're all the Canadians always complain we haven't won a cup in Canada forever and that was it. It was 1993. So you played for the Kings a few years and then you finish your career. You went to Vancouver, you went to the Hartford Whalers, and then you finished with the Detroit Vipers. We talked about the moment you first put on your skates, you're driving to the game, you're nervous, you step out on the ice. What was the last game like? Did you know you were playing your last game? And what was it like when you took off the skates and took off the uniform? As an athlete, it's very mixed emotion because, so you're playing in the NHL for a number of years and you've had some success and then some injuries come and you've

got to realize, you get to a certain age age you realize that every new draft pick and every young kid at training camp is there for one reason to take your job and you get to that certain stage where you're like okay you know I think I still can be one of the top players but you know there's a lot of people nipping at your heels so once I went from the Kings and then Vancouver I was was there for a brief spat. And then Hartford, which ended up being the Carolina Hurricanes, which kind of a roundabout for me, was Peter Carmanos, the owner that I told you about in my amateur days. So yeah, I played for three very unique owners that I knew personally, and Bruce McNall, Mike Illich, and Peter Carmanos. But I knew at that point, after Hartford, I went and played in Europe, in Lausanne, Switzerland, which was a tremendous experience. And you knew like your NHL career was on empty. And the question was, some people just,

they're willing to go to the minors, and they're willing to, you know, try to bounce back and hang on. And I went to, so in Detroit at the time, the Vipers were an IHL team. They were getting a lot of people kind of the tail end of their career. So for me, that was just a lot of fun. And we played good intense hockey and we actually won a championship in the, in the IHL and we were were getting it's where the pistons played and they uh they just recently knocked the stadium down which was amazing because the stadium still looked like it was brand new but they moved to little caesar's arena downtown

so we were getting 10 000 fans a game you almost felt like it was a mini nhlt but you weren't playing with the at least i wasn't, with the hope of, okay, if I play well, I'm going to get back to the NHL. It truly was playing for fun, enjoying yourself, getting an extra couple of years of competitive hockey, and using it as a bridge to get to your next, at least for me, to a next career. So let's talk about your next career. When I got to know Bruce and I got to know you, it was clear one thing. You're highly educated, very motivated, very thoughtful, plan for your future. Bruce told me you get to the Kings and you're sitting in the forum room

and guys may be in the forum club and guys may be drinking. They're going out late every night. You didn't drink. You're at the Wall Street Journal in the Forum Club and in the locker room. So you were really... And part of it, I assume, was the family upbringing as well. A lot of professional athletes go bankrupt shortly after we've all read, shortly after they're done playing. We all know the statistics. We've heard about them. When did all that start? I read somewhere that you earned a certification to be a financial rep, I think six years before you were done playing. Talk to me about planning for the future, knowing you wanted to have a second career, and being ready for it when it actually happened. So a lot of people have always said,

yeah, he always read the the wall street journal which is true i love learning about markets and business etc but i was also reading the hockey news that's what i would say yeah so i this was like an add-on to me i i was intensely involved in hockey like what like following all the stuff but i knew and my dad kind of told me like listen this is gonna end it doesn't matter if you're gordie how Howe or Wayne Gretzky or Sidney Crosby or Luke Robitaille. Your career is going to end. And it could be a one-year career, a 10-year career, or a 20-year career. At some point, that's going to end.

And what are you going to do? What do you want to do? And it's not just a money issue. I know a lot of former players who have done well financially and they've maintained, you know, certain standard of living, but they feel like they're not really contributing to society or contributing citizen, whatever, whatever they're feeling. They feel like, okay, what am I going to do today? What's my purpose? So I thought it was important to start planning a little bit while I was playing in the off

season. So I really like financial markets. I really like learning about business. I like entrepreneurship, et cetera. So I just started getting various licenses in the off season, which evolved to a Series 7 in the insurance world and estate planning and in the investment world and in securities world. And I just started kind of knocking those out in the summertime. And then I actually started kind of doing a tailor-made internship with some financial

companies in the off-season just to kind of learn the ropes. Because I knew someday when I was done, that I thought that would be a good route for me. You're interfacing with people, some of the experiences you may be discussing are experiences you've been through as a, you know, being an athlete, people were coming to you saying, you should do this you should invest you should whatever and i just went down that path and you know it's 25 years later i've been you know it's been a excellent run and very fulfilling and been successful at it and uh i love helping people and love being involved it's kind of the one thing about pro sports you miss is the camaraderie of being in the locker room and being part of something. Here, you're still part of something, but you're helping families and you're helping some entrepreneurs that fulfill certain financial goals.

And you're part of their team in some respect. So, yeah, it's been a great, great ride and I enjoy it. And the thing that it's given me is the flexibility to control my time so that when my kids were growing up and had sporting events and other activities, I attended 97% of them, 98% of them because I could control my schedule. And to me, that was the most important while still making a living. I mean, I don't want to say for sure. It was unusual. I'm sure there must have been a few other people that did it. But to me, it was just very important. I just took the approach in the offseason.

Yes, you trained, you got ready, but I didn't go golf. I studied. And it was just kind of the way I was wired. And I don't think that's better than anyone else. That was the right route for me to move on because what I didn't want to have happen and even though most of this discussion today has been hockey related I remember telling my wife and other people close to me I don't want to spend the rest of my life looking back I'm proud of looking back and I have some interesting stories and unique experiences. But I want to be as

excited about the future. And I knew people who I like and respect, but everything they talked about was back in 82 in Buffalo, or back in 84 in Boston, we had this game. And that's all fun and nice and good. But I wanted to be more interested in developing new experiences and memories. I can't imagine there was another player in the NHL during the entire time you played. I think you started when you were 26 years old, getting your securities licenses to prepare for your future. That must have been incredibly unusual. Yeah. for your future. That must have been incredibly unusual. Thank you. We have. And I know we've talked about hockey, but I want to talk about your career and your future and some of the things you've done before this. But I do want to say that, obviously,

sports fans want to meet with people who played, especially people who are great players like you. I remember getting a phone call one day from Mike Dunleavy, who had been the coach of the Lakers and the Portland Trailblazers. I think he was the NBA coach of the year in 1988 or 1989. And he wanted to come in and talk about he was working at a financial firm and he was trying to sell me in insurance policy. And I thought it was very effective to do that. We've seen a lot of professional athletes now do the same thing. And I think it's easy entry point to do, but I think you have to know your stuff when you go in and have the meeting. And I remember when I met with you the first time we were talking about, I want to test you a little bit. I had a

career in finance and I had a lot of background in that. And the thing that impressed me is you clearly knew your stuff cold. You were articulate, you were well-spoken, and you had a lot of substance to you. And I think that's, I'm sure that's one of the reasons why you've done extraordinarily well in your career. That's a great point because I made a vow when I got into my second career. I know other athletes that have done this, but they were just rainmakers. They were just there to use their background in sports to get a meeting with someone. And then it would be like, I'll bring the expert in. And I remember saying to myself and following through is,

I want to be able to talk the talk when I'm in front of an estate attorney, or a CPA, or a CFO, or whatever it was. So I started studying and getting various designations and really learning so that, of course, I won't have all the answers. But if I'm going to be part of someone's team, I want to be able to be a contributing member of the team, not get the meeting and then always bringing other people in, kind of a middle man rainmaker. And that's how I've just always fashioned myself is like, I'm going to really study and learn the ins and outs of a particular subject so that I can speak intelligently, knowledgeably. And when I may not know everything, not try to BS my way through it and say, I'll get the answer or perhaps need to bring someone in. So that was just kind of my approach to it all. I remember you asked me to make an introduction to the law firm Honigman Miller, it was called at the time, now just Honigman.

And David Fulton is the CEO of the firm, as you know. And I didn't even hesitate because I knew, and I would never recommend anybody in a business setting for a meeting if it wasn't worth that person's while. And I knew David would love you. And I was highly confident. And I think that was a good intro for you. And I know David has enjoyed getting to know you as well.

Yeah. I mean, a lot of people who aren't Detroiters, like Honigman is the elite law firm in Detroit. And David is legal royalty in Detroit. And I have really enjoyed getting to know him over the years. And he's quite a player. And you're right. I've had a few matters with him over the years and met him in the law firm. And they're real players.

And back to what I was saying earlier, I wanted to know that if I'm in a room with David or any of his partners and we're discussing something pertaining to one of their clients, that I know what I'm talking about. So what do you do on a daily basis? You're a financial advisor, you sell insurance.

I know you used to have a partner. What's your structure today? And what do you do? So in the financial services world, I'm involved in kind of two areas. One is risk-based products. So anything to protect life insurance in the guise of someone's estate plan or a buy-sell agreement for a business or a key man, key person policy, just a few examples, long-term care. That's one area.

And then on the other side would be anything that has to do with accumulating wealth and distributing wealth. So it's usually going to be with individual families, higher net worth, but I deal with all types of people. I have a group of maybe one, three other people that kind of work for and with me. And we get a lot of referrals. I have my network of people and we get referrals from various places. And that's pretty much my day is dealing with people and reviewing portfolios or talking to someone about, you know, they need a buy-sell agreement because they have this company that is valuable. And if something happens to one of the partners,

they want to make sure that their families are protected, et cetera, et cetera. So that's just kind of a general thing, you know, that is day to day. You know, when you're dealing with people's wealth and people's financial matters, other than health, probably wealth is the second, is you have to act very ethically, you have to act very, it can't be an afterthought, you have to be very precise and very meticulous. And you have to be prepared. That's the way I approach it. And the good thing is the vast majority of my interactions, of course, COVID has exacerbated this, is on the phone or Zoom these days and whatever. We still do some in-face meetings, and I think that'll pick up once the vaccines and everything else is more universal. But once again, I can control my time a lot of it,

you know, most days so that I can do this with you. I can plan and, but trust me, when we're done here, I'm, I gotta get done. Is it safe to say you've made a lot more money post hockey than during hockey? Yes. I'm sure that's an understatement. And I think it's a great lesson

for people that have what essentially is a short self-life as a career. I have advised numerous professional athletes, football players in particular, a couple of young ones recently have signed huge contracts. And athletes today are getting smarter about their future. They're saving more. I think the leagues today have financial advisors that they set you up with coming into the league. And I think it's a different thing today than it was back then. A lot different. Back then, you got nothing.

You were on your own. The contracts obviously were not nearly as big. But even then, the contracts we were signing, I remember the players that played in the 70s or 80s, they thought they were exorbitant what people were making in the 80s and 90s. And of course, players in the 80s and 90s are looking at what's being played, getting paid now and thinking, oh my gosh, that's incredible. But you were pretty much on your own back then. I'm not totally versed in what's going on now, but I think you're right. You have a lot better chance of being able to be introduced to someone who can help you. I want to talk about one of the coolest moments of my career, which you were instrumental

part of. It was, and we're going to leave out a couple of names here, one in particular. But it was 2007. And I had a friend of sorts who was an extremely wealthy investment banker. He had made a few hundred million dollars in his career and had recently retired. And this guy was a pure hockey fan. He had tickets to all the Kings games. And his dream was to own a team in the league. And he surprisingly knew nobody in the hockey world, but I had a few friends there. I had you, who was retired. I had Luke Robitaille, who's an amazing guy, incredible guy who I'd met through you, and he had retired a year or two before. And I was also friends with Tim Laiwiki, who was my neighbor and at that time was the CEO

of the Kings. And through you, I also met this guy named Boots Dalbiagio, who was my neighbor and at that time was the CEO of the Kings. And through you, I also met this guy named Boots Del Biagio, who was a venture capitalist in San Francisco. He owned 10% of the San Jose Sharks at the time, but he wanted to be the main owner of a team and he wanted to run it. So I put this lunch together and you come out for this and we're all sitting there. And why don't you take it from there? Well, I will, but I got to give you a little backstory to this because I met Boots, who he ended up having some issues of his own, kind of like Bruce did. But Boots was charming. Young guy, came from wealth, smart, as far as I could tell. He and Luke were very close. And I met him through Luke. And he wanted to buy the Pittsburgh Penguins. His best friend was Mario Leone.

Right. And there was a casino referendum in the state of Pennsylvania. And they were giving three license, I don't know, two or three licenses. And Boots thought that he would have the best in to buy the Penguins from Mario, who at the time wanted out because he had all this money from deferred comp. I think the Penguins had gone bankrupt. He was a large creditor. He, you know, and for the longest time, the NHL was kind of not flatlining, but it was just kind of muddling along. And I think Mario just wanted out. And Luke knew Mario, Boots knew Mario. I think, I don't know how Boots met Mario, but they were really close. And Boots was going to buy the Penguins, but he needed a casino operator, a casino guy. And when Luke was in Detroit, I had introduced him to a really good friend of mine and client at the time, who was pretty much

the guy responsible for casino gaming in Michigan, like a major player. And I said, oh, I can call my friend. So literally Boots calls me. Luke says, hey, Penguins, Boots. And the next day I get a call from Boots. He's on a plane, I think his own plane. The next day, this is Memorial Day of 2004, I think. I don't know. And so this is a few years before what you're going to reference. And they spent a year negotiating to buy the Pittsburgh Penguins.

The guy I introduced to Boots, and they were like right at the finish line. I think they had basically got a deal done, except the Penguins selected Sidney Crosby first overall. And then the deal was off. And then the rest is history. The Penguins in the NHL skyrocketed up. So Boots got shut out of the Penguins and was still hungry for an NHL team. So I had met Boots through you. I actually had lunch with him once. He actually flew in on his plane. He flew into Santa Monica. We had lunch and we talked about hockey and that was our first one-on-one lunch. But here we are, we're sitting there

and this lunch actually leads to my friend of sorts invested a very large amount of money. And this lunch led to him being a major owner of the Nashville Predators, which is pretty cool for me. I mean, you're helping arrange this cool lunch and you're a hockey fan. You're putting this whole thing. And so Boots was already, if I remember correctly, he was after the Penguins situation struck strikeout. He went and got or he got involved with the Predators and your friend. I think they did it together or Boots was first and brought him in. I don't remember the specifics, but yes, that's true.

That luncheon is kind of what was the spark for this. Well, it's like anything else. It's networking. It's making introductions and putting the right people together. We were a material reason, the three of us, you, Luke, and me, for the purchase of the Nashville Predators to a new group led by Boots in 2007. And I remember, funny enough, Jimmy, you, Luke, and I were sitting down one day and we were talking about, hey, this was a big deal. I mean, this team cost, I forget what it was, $100 million.

My guy put in $30 or $40 million. And we looked around, where's our commission on this thing? You know, I think of a lot of things over my career that you think about things that you were a part of that one little lunch, one little talk. And then all of a sudden you look back and say, that's kind of where it all started. Like that little nugget gets planted, and then it just grows. I'll tell you a funny after story there. So as you know, I started the Justice Ball, and then I started an event called the Imagine Ball. And the Imagine Ball benefits the homeless. It keeps families together. And I was involved. I started this

event with my friend, John Terzian. It's grown into this really cool thing. Kendall Jenner has been there, but this was our first year. It's really hard to raise money your first year for something. So I called this guy who I hadn't talked to for years and I was blunt with him. I said, in return for the favor of me introducing you to your partners in order to buy the Predators, I would like you to donate $10,000 to a charity of my choice. I never had asked you for a commission on this deal. I was happy for you, but now I want you to do something for me. And not only didn't he do it, he basically yelled at me for putting him in an investment

that didn't go well. With respect to Boots, the footnote there for the listeners and viewers who don't know, Boots Del Biagio went to prison for fraud. He was sentenced to eight years, and he did something very similar that Bruce McNall did. So unfortunately, that didn't work out. And as another footnote to the Kings, the owners that bought the Kings from Bruce, they also went to prison years later for fraud. So this weird set of circumstances, a bunch of people on teams went to prison. I will say one thing about Boots.

I did not know him well. Every interaction I had with him was very professional, and he was a very nice person. And same thing. I don't know all the specifics. If I had to guess, I think maybe he tried to overstretch a little bit to be an NHL owner, where I think if that original Penguins deal had gone through, I think he had the wherewithal for that size of a deal, which was still a very big deal. But like everyone, I wish him well. I'm assuming he's no longer in prison, and I hope he's doing well and gotten back on his feet.

I had the same relationship with him, I think, that you did. I did not know him well. I met him three or four times. I always found him to be respectful, smart, and a very good person. In fact, I mentioned this in one of my other podcasts. I think it's important. We all have friends, as you know, who have ups and downs in our careers. I know you know a lot.

I know a lot. I've had many ups and downs in my own career and my own life. I think it's really important to be there for your friends, even people who you don't know well. These people are down on their luck. They're depressed. I know several people who have gone to prison, and I had sent Boots a note. I heard he was going to jail, and I had a cell number, so I said to him, said something like, hey, Boots, it's Randy. I want to give you some encouragement and I wish you a lot of luck and I'm here if you ever want to talk. And I've done that to numerous friends as well. And it's funny, there's very few people who are there for you when things are down.

Everyone loves a winner, but when things and there's no one there, your friend group gets very, very thin. So I think it's important to give people encouragement. People make mistakes. These people didn't kill anybody. They had serious mistakes in judgment. I totally agree with you. And look, we all make mistakes and we all have ups and downs. And like I said earlier, I wish everyone well, and I hope he's doing well as well. Let's talk about money for a second. What was your first contract? How much was it? Sort of funny because your dad may be one of the few players who maybe made more money than you. It's sort of like Bill Lambert, who played for the Pistons. You remember him. And the joke was in the league, he was the only player whose dad made more than he did. But let's talk about your first contract. What did

you make and what did you do? Did you splurge or buy yourself something special? No on the splurge. That I can tell you right off the bat. To be honest, I'm trying to remember. I think it was like a $100,000 signing bonus and like $125,000 or $150,000 salary with a bunch of bonuses built in. But I'm not totally, I think that's accurate. That sounds like pretty ballpark-ish. You're a conservative guy. I know you said you saved almost everything you made in your career. And I think that just goes toward the training and planning for your future. Well, I mean, I don't want to make, I mean, we, I married young. I mentioned earlier in our talk here, my wife's from Southern California and we married and we have four

beautiful kids and we've had a wonderful journey. And, you know, we would go to Europe and we would do stuff together as a family. I always wanted to be at my kids' events. And we tried to be the best parents and provide the best we can and been very blessed in that regard. But I also wanted to do it within the overall picture of when I was playing hockey, that's going to be short. You're moving to a new career. You need to plan. So you can do both, in my opinion. You mentioned a few mentors before in your career. I love mentoring people. You know, I have a large summer intern program. We have 36 interns each summer. They learn from me. I spend a lot of time with them. I have guest speakers every week. I know we try to get you in there

at the end of the year, but you're on your way to Greece. But it's very important for all of us, I think, to have mentors who we look up to. Who were some of yours and how did they influence your life and your career? Well, I had a lot of mentors, family members and non-family members. I remember looking at my four-foot-ten grandma from Greece who literally, in Greek, Yaya's grandma, she would sit and tell me stories of what it was like for the Nazis and Germans to come in. And I'm thinking, here's this lady with seven kids as a widow. And literally, she's telling me stories of her three sons. The two sons were similar in age, they had one pair of shoes, and they had to switch off days that they were wearing shoes and that she would say that there would only be enough food for every

like the family and she may get a bite or two of bread but she said that was okay and you would hear like and she would say these stories so nondescriptly like that was just kind of a normal thing and you could see the pain in her eyes of like remembering some of those. And I used, I was one of those, I was just like, I actually learned how to speak Greek because of that. That's she didn't speak English. So I would like quiz her. So I, that was a role model to me to think, wow, that like any problems that we think we might have, you know, like a deal didn't go well, or you get traded or you're, you didn't score, you got benched, or whatever it is. You just think like, is that really even in the same ballpark of what someone like that went through?

I had a couple teachers. We mentioned Rial Turcotte coaches earlier on. He was a mentor. Of course, I'd say my dad was a huge mentor. Let's talk about your family. You have an amazing family, your wife, Paula, Charlie, John, Andrew, and Mia. Right before we got on today, I was doing a quick Google search. I watched the YouTube video of you coming back to the Kings and you were on center ice and they had a day that honored you and your wife and kids are next to you and talked about all the great things in your life. But what was most important to you is your family, your four kids and your wife and kids are next to you and talked about all the great things in your life. But what was most important to you is your family, your four kids and your family.

Let's talk about that for a minute. What it's like being a father to you. You're incredibly devoted, I know. And tell me about your family for a minute. I'm very honored and blessed. Four beautiful kids. Paul and I have been married. We got married in LA in 1992.

And she came from, like I said, she's from LA. And we live here in the metro Detroit area. We have three boys and a girl. You mentioned him, Charlie. Charlie's working in private equity in the Chicago area. And he, I would say, is most like me with respect to interests. He loves following markets and he loves talking business. And it's great to see him. He was a basketball player. He played four years of Division III college basketball. My son, John, is a senior who you chatted with recently. He's a senior

at University of Michigan. He's biomolecular science. I look at his, his book, I'm like, get a headache just opening the book up, but he's very science. My science kind of brain, you know, loves anything in the science world. He's very, he's a beautiful kid. He was a great soccer player. He had offers to play college soccer, but he's very athletic. But his dream was to go to University of Michigan and study. So besides that and a frat life pre-COVID, that's what he's been doing there. And then my son, Andrew, who's 20, going to be 21 in June. He's an excellent pitcher. He's going to be pitching for Michigan State Division I starting next September.

He's very athletic, and his dream is to get drafted and potentially play in Major League Baseball. He's working very hard there. And then last but not least is our daughter, she's a sophomore and very athletic she plays soccer and basketball and it's funny yesterday she was she was talking to me about a play and and she said i accidentally like ran this kid over i think i hurt her she's very physically she just loves playing i always laugh i said well i played many years in the NHL. I don't think I had more than two checks.

And you're knocking people around. But yeah, she's very athletic and a great kid, too. Yeah, very blessed. It's an honor of a lifetime to be their dad and Paula as a wife and to see these kids grow. Mention your kids and your family because you're a model family. You're a model dad. You're a model husband. I've always admired that about you.

You talk about your kids with pride. Whenever we chat on the phone, you always talk about your kids. I get your holiday card. Good looking family. And so I like to hear about your kids. People listening to this podcast, one of the reasons I think that people listen to podcasts and my podcast is they want to be motivated for their future. They want to know what made people successful. So I want to ask you, what are the three to five most important ingredients of success in your view? That's an interesting question and one I've

actually thought about over the years. I think that question can be answered a lot of different ways, but I'll answer it for myself. I'm a person of great faith. So I know some people aren't, and I don't look down at those people. But for me, faith is very important to know that you're part of something bigger, that it's not just your world and your success that is what everything revolves around. So in the way I was raised, in the way I believe, I believe that our purpose on life in this life is for something bigger. So to try to do good things, help other people, and as you said earlier, be there for someone who may be down and to try to be as successful as you can, not only for the joys of success, but also to try to be better in this world or helping be at charities or institutions you believe in or other people. So faith with that, that bigger picture. Then I believe second for me would be family. So you got your faith,

you got your family. What does that mean? Well, we all have families, but for me to want to be successful, I'm doing it because there's people I love and there's people that are counting on me and that I'm trying to do the best I can. And it's not just a money thing. It's not just trying to be able to buy them a car or send them to a good school, is to show a good work ethic, to show what being a good citizen is. And when you mess up, fess up, mess up, fess up and try to be better. No one's perfect. And then that dovetails into work ethic. So faith, family, work ethic, if you I don't care what it is, you want to be a yoga teacher, or if you want to be an investment banker, or you want to be an actor, or you want to be a pro athlete, it all requires work ethic. And you have to go that extra mile to be prepared, to be knowledgeable, to expand your knowledge, keep your knowledge,

put in the grunt work. Just because you achieve a certain level doesn't mean you're, you know, you're some superstar and you can't, you can't do the things that got you there anymore. So that's the way I kind of, kind of view work ethic. And then I think there's a sense of, of just being thankful, that being thankful for what you've accomplished and where you're at and not be jealous if someone has more than you or someone's supposedly doing better or whatever. Be happy for them.

Back to my four-foot-ten grandma from Greece who escaped with seven kids during World War II, she used to tell me, the more you give with your heart without an agenda, the more you'll receive. And it doesn't mean you're gonna receive a big deal or money or whatever, but you're gonna receive blessings. You're gonna receive good wishes.

You're gonna receive, you're just gonna have a good sense of being about yourself that if you're helping people to the best of your ability, it may not even be something huge. It may be like someone's not doing well. Just pick up the phone and encourage them. Say hi to them. Talk to them. And then sometimes there are bigger things. Those are kind of the tenets of my life that I tried to live by and go from there. Regardless of age, if someone comes to you and said, Jimmy, what's the best piece of

advice you could give me to further my career? And it only had to be one. And I'm talking about there's young people listening and watching today. There's older people like us listening and watching today and even people a few years beyond us. What's the one piece of advice you would give to those wanting to better themselves? I would say network and learn. Network, if you can get yourself involved with other people within your industry or outside and learn from them, meaning everyone has gone through ups and downs and everyone has gotten to where they've gotten on their own path, but everyone has certain universal truths for the most part. Like I said earlier, work ethic, learn from your mistakes, try not to duplicate your mistakes, humility, be humble, et cetera.

I think would be, I don't know, I just visualize that as network and learn. All right. In closing, we've covered a lot here. Before we end, I want to ask if there's anything you want to share with us that we haven't talked about. And of course, I want you to give yourself a plug. Randy, I just want to say, I know because you're too humble to admit or to discuss it, is that you've made a big difference in a lot of people's lives through what you've done with some of your charitable endeavors. And I think especially your mentorship programs. I know a little bit about what you've been doing with young college kids and trying to help them on their paths. And you have a lot of life experiences that you've lived and you're very meticulous about the way you like to do things. And I know that

your knowledge being imparted in these kids and others has made a big difference. So I appreciate our friendship. I appreciate the time to be on this podcast. I wish you a lot of success. And I'm sure I'll be a regular listener with your other guests. And thank you so much for the opportunity. It's been great having you. I appreciate the generosity of your time. Thank you. Until next time. Okay, Randy. Be good.