Indiecast - 10 Years Of Arcade Fire's 'The Suburbs'

Episode Date: July 31, 2020

Arcade Fire stunned the world when they took home the Album Of The Year award at the 2011 Grammys for their sprawling third album 'The Suburbs.' It was the first time the band took home an award at the ceremony, and left many people wondering, "who is Arcade Fire?" On the first episode of Indiecast, Steven Hyden and Ian Cohen dive in to the Canadian outfit's discography, zeroing in on 'The Suburbs,' a decade after its release.⁣✅ Subscribe to our newsletter for weekly music recommendations in your inbox: http://indiemixtape.com⁣🔔 Check out Indie Mixtape on YouTube: https://uproxx.it/mrln2hd⁣🎧 Follow the official Topsify playlist: https://lnk.to/IndieMixtapeSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Indycast is presented by Uprocks's Indy Mix tape. Hello everyone and welcome to Indycast. This is our first show, so thank you for joining us. Every week on this show, we will be talking about the biggest indie news of the week, reviewing albums, hashing out trends, and occasionally, like in this episode, talking about some of the most important indie albums of the past. My name is Stephen Hayden, and I'm joined by my friend and co-host, Ian Cohen. Ian, how are you?

I'm doing great. And I think maybe the question that we need to answer before we move any further is that I feel like we argue about this stuff on Twitter. So why not record it for a change? I mean, I think we're giving the people what we want. You know, there's only so much you can get into like 280. And yeah, I think that this is just an opportunity for us to, you know, give the people what they want in a more drawn out. conversational sort of way. So I'm stoked for it. Well, actually, and of course, too, like, we're two long-time music critics in a dying industry.

We have to find a way to survive to feed ourselves. So why not get in on the podcast Gold Rush? This is what hustle sounds like. The podcast, millions of dollars will be raining upon us. Watch out, Joe Rogan. Exactly. That's right. Joe Rogan, he's not dispensing indie rock opinions. This is a market that's wide open to be exploited by people. So before we get into our episode today, I think we should maybe introduce ourselves for those who may not know who we are. My name is Stephen Hayden.

I've been a music critic for many years of written for places like the AV Club, Grantland, New York Times Magazine. I'm currently the cultural critic at Uprox. and I host a lot of podcasts. So, you know, if you're not sick of my opinions yet, hopefully you will not be sick of my opinions by the end of this episode. Ian, what are you doing here? What are your qualifications? Well, I've been doing this music critic thing,

probably since around 2005, been getting paid for it for a shorter amount of time. But in my, I guess, 12 years running, I've been writing for pitchfork, spin, stereo gum, Grant Lynn, the Ringer. I mean, a dozens probably websites that popped up, had a good amount of venture capital into it, and then folded in about a year, year and a half. So I think that almost gives me more experience to talk about indie rock as it played out over the span of the 21st century because, I mean, what is indie? but, you know, just a bunch of trends that kind of come, go, and then 10 years later, you look back on it.

It's like, oh, yeah, I remember, you know, redacted website. Right. Or redacted genre or redacted, you know, group of bands. Well, that expertise is going to come in handy with today's episode because, as I said earlier, you know, normally on this show we're going to be talking about the latest news in indie rock, reviewing new albums and all that sorts of things. But for our first episode, we're going to be looking back 10 years at one of the biggest indie rock albums of the early 21st century, which is the suburbs by Arcade Fire. The album turns 10 years old on August 2nd. And before we talk about this record, it doesn't seem like 10 years have passed since this record came out, although in a way,

the world is so different now that it was then. But I don't know if I'm just older now. Things don't seem to age as quickly as they once did. But yeah, this anniversary snuck up on me a little bit. It feels 10 years old and it also feels 40 years old. Like I think that there's, anytime there's an anniversary happening, like, time just has such a weird function in this realm. Because like something that came out in 2015 can feel like it happened in an eternity ago, whereas something like Kid A, which came out 20 years ago, has been just in the lexicon for so long that it doesn't feel quite that old. And I think the suburbs fall somewhere in between. Like my life is very different than it was 10 years ago.

And yet something like this has such an impact and casts such a long shadow over everything that's come since that it does not quite feel like it's aged. But then again, the whole thing is about, you know, aging and, you know, moving into adulthood and parenting and all that such stuff. So I think it was it was waiting for people like you and. I to look back on it 10 years from now. It was like an inherently nostalgic thing. Yeah, absolutely. Well, let's give a little background on the record before we dive into our thoughts about it. As I said, this record came out on August 2nd, 2010. It debuted at number one on the U.S. album charts, as well as in the UK. It went on to win the Grammy for Best Album of the Year in 2011. And this record really solidified Arcade Fire status as an arena

a rock band. Of course, they had been building their status through their first two records, 2004's funeral and 2007's Neon Bible. But with the suburbs, it really seemed like this was going to become the biggest band in the world. And it's funny looking back on it, because I remember like when they won the Grammy thinking that, oh, this is going to mean something momentous for indie rock. This is the moment where Nirvana tops the charts with Nevermind. and changes the culture. You know, arcade fire now, they are poised to do the same thing in the 2010s. This will be the decade of indie rock.

And, of course, that did not happen at all. What the suburbs now appears to be in retrospect is the peak moment of Otts era indie rock, the culmination of like all of the trends and the wave that we saw in popularity for indie bands in that decade. And after that, it seems like the wave crashed, not just, just for Arcade Fire, but for Indy Rock in general. That's how I see it anyway. I'm curious to talk about that with you as we get into this episode. But before we talk about that, I really want to talk to you about this because you actually reviewed the suburbs for Pitchfork back in 2010. And I'm just curious, like, what do you remember about that record's release and writing about it at that time?

I think in order to kind of understand where I was coming from while, you know, going into the suburbs, like every bit of mythology surrounding funeral, like I was all about it. Like, I mean, I had to wait a few days before, like, buying it at the record store because the pitchfork review for funeral, meant it sold out everywhere. And I was listening to it on my disc man during power outages. I mean, like whatever corny thing people say about funeral, I embodied it. And so, you know, Neon Bible, it was something of a disappointment for me. It just couldn't be the greatest album of all time. And so when I went to the suburbs, I mean, I didn't quite know what to expect. Like I was kind of ready for arcade like, okay, arcade fires. Like I thought it would be like

the strokes, you know, or like Interpol, like the third album where they just kind of, I don't know, just kind of fade off into the distance. But, and none of the singles really kind of stuck with me. I'm like a very album-oriented person. But I mean, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I, I think one of the themes that will probably end up tackling a lot here is like when you write about an album, it gives you a far different experience than if you're just like an observer of the record. And the more I got into it, the more I started to sense it's like themes of like nostalgia and just like being kind of stuck because the suburbs was, it came out at a time where I was like very much

in a position to hear it. Like I hated my job, was in a relationship that was. It's just like not working and thinking about, you know, what it might have been like to be like back in, you know, the suburbs of Philadelphia as opposed to like the suburbs of Houston. And it just in a lot of ways, I kind of acknowledge it's like kind of a dumb record in the sense that like arcade fire is kind of like very heavy handed and they oversimplify things. I mean, but it just hit. And to this day when I hear it, it's like it just hit me in a very vulnerable spot. and I think that's very reflective, very much reflected in the album review itself that I wrote where you can kind of sense I'm like being very diaristic about it all.

But nonetheless, I mean, like what I remember is that that was like one of the first reviews I wrote that like people who weren't like very much ensconced in that world like paid attention. Like, whoa, you reviewed. Like that was like a big deal. So that that was kind of cool. But yeah, the record just meant a lot to me in a way that, um, it's a little embarrassing in retrospect, but it obviously resonated with a lot of people who felt the same way. Yeah, I mean, I remember at the time feeling very mixed on Arcade Fire, and in a way, I still am mixed on them.

I remember when Funeral came out, that record had a lot of hype. As you mentioned, the Pitchfork Review had a lot to do with it. I think they gave it a 9.5. 9.7. 9.7. I would say the most impactful album review of the 21st century, as far as, like changing the trajectory of a band. And I think that ties into a lie of why we consider this to be the culmination of

indie as opposed to like a classic rock band making a Grammy, you know? Right. I mean, yeah, the, I guess the status that we bestow on Arcade Fire and that review in particular is tied in with the idea of Arcade Fire being a band who seemingly came out of nowhere and this one review comes out and it seemed like overnight they became like a huge band after that. And I think that it simplified a little bit. I don't know if it was entirely because of that review, but it had a lot to do with that review.

And I know for me personally, that's the first time I ever heard of Arcade Fire was reading about it on pitchfork. And I think at the time, you know, it's kind of hard now to imagine like any one outlet having that kind of power just because media in general is so spread out. It's so spread out like the suburbs, if you will, right now. But my feeling on Arcade Fire then was that this was a band with incredible peaks. They could have very stirring songs that just blew you away the first time you heard them, like wake up being a song like that, for instance.

And then they had songs where you could tell that they were trying to blow you away, and it just fell way short. And it ended up being almost obnoxiously dumb, as you said before. And to me, like, funeral and more so, Neon Bible have moments where both things are true.

There's incredible songs on those records, and there's some real stinkers on those records. And what struck me revisiting the suburbs for this episode is that I feel like, in terms of Arcade Fire, this was an album where I feel like they were a little more nuanced than they were on the first two records.

There are moments on the first two records. this record that are relatively subdued, that act as sort of like a contrast point with like the bigger peaks that exist on the record, whereas I feel like on the first two records, it's really like a one-note experience. And I think that's what draws me to the suburbs. Now, I should say that, like, again, I mean that relatively speaking. I mean, this is still, by any other standard, a very bombastic record. And listening to it again, it kind of reminded me a of the wall, the Pink Floyd record. Just in terms of the recurring musical motifs,

I think the suburbs is consciously constructed as like a classic rock concept record. And just thematically, it reminds me a lot of the records that you would hear classic rock bands make in the 70s about teenage alienation and rebelling against this idea of like corporate interest intruding on your life or the government intruding on your life and robbing you of your individuality.

You know, that's something that is very classic rock and it's something that's also very, I think, particular to like Ats era indie that when we look back on it 10 years later, like you don't really see stuff like that in the music culture as prominently, you know, as it was then. And it maybe ties that album to its era a lot. Like when you revisit the record, like, what do you think of it now?

I think that's exactly what you said. You know, the first two acts, albums were very heavy-handed in their own ways. Like every single song on those were a matter of life and death. And I think that's to a lesser extent on the suburbs. Now, you can't hear songs like Modern Man or Ready to Start as being particularly nuanced. I mean, Arcade Fire does not operate with nuanced lyricism, particularly about the state of the world.

But, yeah, that's what works for those two songs in particular. And yet when I look back on the suburbs, you know, when I listen to it as a whole, all 60 minutes of it, what stands out to me 10 years later is that there are quite a few songs that I've forgotten about. You know, not bad songs by any means, but let's think of deep blue or the first half light or the first sprawl. These aren't songs that people will go to an arcade fire show in 2021 or 2022 and think, oh, I cannot believe they didn't play Deep Blue. But I think those really help out with establishing the, you know, for lack of a better term, suburban sprawl of the suburbs, you know, that they're not swinging for the fences for every single song.

And, you know, some of these songs can just be kind of those. aimless drives around the suburbs that when Butler sings about, you know, there's, there's more room to breathe on here. Now, you know, granted, there are some songs that are actually bad on this one. Like, I think of Roco Co as an example of like a song that predicts everything that would go wrong for the band on everything now. I think when Butler's heavy handiness works when he talks about like emotions and their personal relationships. But as far as like cultural criticism, he's just not very good at that. And RocoCoCo is a much longer song than I remember as well.

So always got to skip that one because it gets you right to empty room, which I think is one of the more underrated songs. And also one that kind of sounds like emo bands in 2020. So obviously I'm into that one. But what you said about, you know, arcade. Fire as being classic rock. I think it's always difficult to think about arcade fire within the context of indie rock, you know, like what Arcade Fire mean to Indy Rock, because even from the beginning,

they were, you know, they sounded like modest mouse, funeral sounded like bright eyes, funeral sounded like neutral milk hotel, but they operated from a very classic rock. Like, we want the world. We want to play stadiums. want to win Grammy's operating principle. Whereas, I mean, we're talking about like the culmination of indie rock. I mean, if we recorded this episode last year, we would be talking about the 10-year anniversary of what was then seen as the culmination of indie rock with bands like Animal Collective

and Grizzly Bear and Dirty Projectors and St. Vincent, all acts that came from this art rock or avant-garde beginnings and popularity came to them. There was the one time, I would say, there was a true merger between, you know, what could be seen as like Pitchfork or Gorilliverse Bear or Stereogum and the greater critical narrative. You know, if you look at Pazz and Jop, basically the same across the board. But arcade fire, I think with the suburbs, their classic rock, I guess what you could call their desire to be classic rock really takes shape because their ambitions are matched to what they,

you know, they describe this album as Depeche Mode meets Neil Young. And there are aspects of that. But, you know, there's also a heck of a lot of you too. there's a heck of a lot of Bruce Springsteen. All of these very broad populist ambitions that they had since the beginning, but now they finally had the sound to match. And I think if we were looking for an indie rock record that could win a Grammy album of the year, not like alternative album of the year,

this one is specifically engineered to do that because it has all the, those characteristics of, you know, bands that regularly get five stars in Rolling Stone, but they're a young band. So you can hear the suburbs as being their answer to the Joshua tree or, you know, their answer to darkness on the edge of town or whatever, you know, whatever works for those specific touchstones. I mean, I was thinking, like when you were talking about all the classic rock influences that the suburbs have, you know, you're talking about YouTube, Bruce Springsteen, Neil Young,

people like that. Back in the aughts, it wasn't outside the realm of conversation to talk about those artists being influential on major indie rock bands. Like, there was that wave of bands around, like, the mid-aughts or so that, like, we're proudly talking about Bruce Springsteen being, like, a core influence of what they were doing, like, whether it was Arcade Fire, the Hold Steady, the National, you know, bands like that, that at that time were at the center of indie rock. And clearly that's not the case anymore. I mean, the bands that are still around from that time, you know, many of them have kind of graduated to this legacy band status, but like no one talks about them as being

at the vanguard of what indie music is. And this idea of a pretty straight-down-the-line rock band that has a stern look on their face and is strumming acoustic guitars and belting out these anthemic songs. I mean, to me, like the suburbs represents the end of a very end of a very much. that being like an indie archetype that was recognizable and was critically lauded. You know, I think the reason why I look at it as a culmination in a lot of ways is because, as I said before, like, when, I mean, I don't want to like put too much weight on a Grammy. I mean, the Grammys are obviously stupid and like I hate the Grammys.

I don't like paying attention to them. But having said that, I do remember at the time when Arcade Fire won the album of the year, and then they ended up concluding the show, I think they played month of May after they there was a feeling among a lot of people that like you know this is it was 20 years after never mind at that point like when nirvana broke through and that old narrative of like the outsider band that infiltrates the mainstream and takes it over and then there's this wave of bands that comes after it that's something that rock critics had talked about when the strokes came about in 2001 and then the white strides came about and there was this idea of like oh like

the new garage rock revolution is going to take over music, which it did in the media, but it didn't really take it over in terms of record sales. Like the strokes didn't come close to doing the kind of numbers that Lincoln Park did, for instance. You know, like this idea that like the strokes killed new metal is just demonstrably untrue. I mean, new metal bands continue to sell big records. So I feel like that narrative was still in play with arcade fire that like, oh, a rock band can save music.

Like that idea that critics talked to. about. And looking back, it just feels it, it feels like, where else could it go? I mean, like, the, like, arcade fire wins a Grammy and there's nowhere to go for them. And as far as like, it like they, they didn't really represent anything new, I guess, in the same way that Nirvana did. Like Nirvana was a band with like, in a lot of ways, very punk ideals, very, um, countercultural. like they were very countercultural whereas like arcade fire was like kind of centrist from the beginning you know they they they just so happened to be on merge records for a while and in some ways I would say that arcade fire did really push things forward but I would say that they weren't

Nirvana so much as maybe and you're going to hate me saying this pearl jam where a lot of the bands that did come and come through in the in the next decade and could headline Coachella, you know, like I don't like, Mumford and Sons isn't exactly the same thing. But, you know, like maybe like luminaires or just the bands that like could, I guess, be top liners on Coachella like were modeled after Arcade Fire in some way in the sense that they were like also really earnest like acoustic guitars and maybe some like accordion or whatever but um i think in some ways that it sort of set the stage for that but um you know there's really nothing revolutionary about that band itself that like wanted to change the way things

work um as opposed to nirvana and by and also like by 2011 i mean how could any one person change, you know, the entire industry when so much of it is being decentralized. I think, like, the reason Arcade Fire could win a Grammy for album of the year, not alternative album of the year in 2010 or 11 is because it just, like, the landscape itself was just so depressed. It was like, you know, the years where like Michael Jordan wasn't in the league. And so, you know, someone else could, someone else could win the championship, which makes it, you know, that's still a major accomplishment, but it's not.

It's not, you have to consider context for it. Like, well, I just want to say, can I just say, I love that analogy because that means that Arcade Fire is like the Houston Rockets of, uh, of Indy Rock because, you know, Houston Rockets were able to win titles because Michael Jordan wasn't around. And, uh, the Butler brothers are from Houston. And there you go. It's about the Houston suburb. So it all comes around.

I mean, yeah, I want to go back to what you were saying about like comparing Arcade Fire to Nirvana. because I don't think it's necessarily like the fault of Arcade Fire that the rock revolution didn't happen or the indie revolution didn't happen because of the suburbs. I think you're right in that it had just more to do with the culture at the time. Like the world had changed. And like this and I think that narrative that we were talking about, that Nirvana narrative that like outsider band that takes over the culture, it was already flawed in 2001. You know, like we like the media really wanted the strokes to be that band. And even now, even now people talk about, like, the strokes killing new metal.

Like, that's something I have seen people right. And that's not true. Like, there were huge new metal bands even during the reign of, like, all those, you know, the strokes and white stripes and the hives and all that. And, like, I mean, new metal kind of ran out of gas on its own a little bit. Although corn is still around and, you know, making successful records. Well, if you look at Nirvana back then, too, it's like, you know, Metallica is still did big numbers. Guns and Roses did big numbers. And that still continued for a while. So, I mean,

it, it just killed off like, you know, Warrant or, you know, White Snake or whatever. But in the same way, like, you know, after the strokes happened, like there was still, like, Lincoln Park was still like a much, much bigger band. So, yeah, it's just, I guess the lesson here is just, there's always a sense of, like, a band that comes along and restores. stores order, but it's an order that, you know, doesn't really hold as much weight now in, you know, 2020 or it didn't hold as much in 2011 so much as like 2020, you know, like, no one's waiting around for like a rock band to save them. Right, exactly. And again, I feel like Arcade Fire might have been like the last band where people could credibly make that case.

Because you don't really hear that narrative anymore. No one in 2020 is writing about some up coming band in the context of them, you know, bringing indie rock back to a certain level of prominence. I think it's accepted. You must not read a lot of British magazines then because, like, it's always like, idols is changing rock music or like, shame is bringing rock back, you know. Right, exactly. Yeah, that's a whole other animal. But yeah, yeah, yeah, the British press, God love them.

They continue to wave the flag. I'm happy for that. Getting back to the suburbs, you know, another thing that struck me when I was listening to it is that the themes of the record are very, again, unique to an indie culture that I think really started to change after this record came out. I think of a song, like, ready to start, which has one of the most quotable lines from this record, which is, uh, was a businessman, uh, the lyrics on that song are so dumb, but like it makes me want to run through a wall, you know? Right, right. It's like, like, yeah, like the kids in art school said they would. It's about like, you know,

business interest, you know, taking your soul, this idea of selling out, you know, which is something again, we don't really talk about anymore, that idea has been put to bed in a lot of ways. I also think of the song Suburban War, which is one of my favorite songs on the record. And it's something that I really connected to when I heard the record, because what that song is talking about is tribalism and how music defines the different tribes that exist in youth culture, or at least it did when Butler was a kid and when I was. a kid and maybe that was true for you too, Ian. But that's another thing that I feel like, like that tribalism of music, that idea like you're a punk, you know, you're a metal head,

you know, you're into like, you know, preppy pop music. That also seems like an idea that was just about to die like after this record came out, like with the dawning of like the streaming age essentially. You know, we don't really talk about tribalism in that way anymore. Yeah, I think there's just so many little things about this. record that like speak to me and speak to you because I think we come from a similar place that Win Butler does. But I wonder like a kid who hears this record now, like that proverbial 18 year old who's heard about the suburbs, maybe they're listening to this podcast and they've never listened to the suburbs before and now they're going to give it a listen.

There's so many things on this record that just wonder like, is this going to sound dated to someone who like didn't grow up in the 90s? I really believe that might be the case. It might, but I mean, we always say the same things about, like, I don't know, like Pink Floyd or the sex pistols or what have you. And, you know, tribalism may not look exactly the same as it did, you know, when we were teenagers where it was so overt. But I think the feelings of, you know, alienation and, you know, feeling a part of, and, you know, there are tribes, but it's not as, you know, clear cut as like, or, you know, indie or pop music or whatever. Like tribes exist. It's just that I don't really know what they are.

But someone's always, like someone who's 18 can probably relate to, you know, in a song like ready to start. Like I think in some ways like, you know, when Butler's kind of mocking the idea. It's like I think he's being kind of sarcastic in those lyrics. Right. Oh yeah, definitely. But nonetheless, it's like, you know,

someone in high school about thinking about their integration. into culture like integration into capitalism or like taking a certain kind of job or I think the themes are so strong that um anyone who's like 18 just like kind of feels this uh sent a me again like rate of star is a very me against the world sort of song and I think that any like that is a very very teenage feeling so people can relate to it it won't have the same cultural capital that it once did, but I mean, and I don't think it will, some, like some of the cultural context will be dated, but I think the underlying themes, because like people are going to live in the suburbs and feel like there's always something interesting happening just, like just out of reach

and, you know, the feeling of wanting to get out of the suburbs and not being sure of themselves and like social clicks. I mean, that stuff will always exist. And I think that people will be drawn to that without knowing, you know, what it was like to be a ban on merged records in 2010, you know? Right. I mean, I think another big piece of context with this record, as we look back on it 10 years later, is the changes in Arcade Fire's trajectory before and after this record, because obviously, I think we can separate the different eras of Arcade Fire, kind of like on either side of the suburbs.

You have, like, the first two records that feel very much of a piece. and are so aughts. Like, there's, I mean, I was watching clips of Arcade Fire's performance from SNL in 2007 when they played intervention and like Win Butler smashed the guitar on television. And like, they were introduced by Dwight from the office. And it's like, you know, I was trying to think of like, how many different aughts-era signifiers can we have in this performance. So you have those records.

And then you have the records that came after the. the suburbs. You have Reflector, which came out in 2013, and you have everything now, which came out in 2017. And, you know, I know from personal experience that there aren't Arcade Fire fans that love everything now, and I think there's even more people that love Reflector. I mean, for me, those two records, like the Post-Suburbs output, is extremely flawed. Like, Reflector, I think is sort of like an interesting misfire. There's some really good songs on there and some really terrible songs, whereas everything now I think is like in All Out Turkey.

I mean, that record is terrible, I think. But to me, like, I feel like the connecting thread with those post-suburbs records is Arcade Fire trying to figure out, like, who are we now? Like, how are we going to be a band on this level, you know, being an arena-ri- band in an era where there's like not a ton of arena rock bands anymore you know the things that we were good at are now maybe considered passei maybe we're a little tired of doing that but this other thing that we want to do we're not totally good at that either i i just feel like confusion is what defines like those post suburbs records i think that they kind of knew exactly who they wanted to be

which was like octang baby era you two um you know zoo tv era u2 and um they're just so obviously going off that playbook, which in some ways is a strength because no one else is really trying to do that, you know, as overtly. Like maybe some bands are operating on a similar level of cultural import, but they're not doing like, hey, we're going to make our, you know, electronic dance album. And then we're going to get into our irony phase. And I think what they're, you know, what they're, and I think when we look back on like Arcade Fire, they were never really, like, they were very popular, but I don't know if they were like trendy, you know? I don't think they were ever, like, I think there was always something kind of uncool about

them to the same extent that like you two was just always hated by the punksmen. Like people like just kind of really bristle that their ambition. And I think Arcade Fire was always a man that just really wanted it more than others. And, but, you know, in the 2010s, it's like they, they wanted to be an arena rock man, but like kind of it i think we're just looking at two records that go against a lot of their strengths which you know are earnestness like a lack of subtlety and just these big emotional like cathartic outpourings and this stuff isn't really translatable to like making you know what they want to do as far as like dance music or um it just kind of looked silly um and you know they're always kind of

silly, but like they tried to be kind of cool, which they're not. And then they tried to be kind of ironic on everything now, which they're not. And I think that's where the strain starts to happen. Now, don't get me wrong. I mean, like, everything now is, I heard the title track on like the radio in San Diego, which, you know, that's alongside like, you know, imagine dragons or theory of a dead man or whatever. And like, I didn't hear any arcade fire songs on the radio prior to that. So in some ways, it was a success. in getting them to a certain level, but, you know, I don't think they really sustained that. Yeah, I mean, it's interesting thinking about them in 2020 because, you know, you made a point earlier about talking about bands like the Lumineers and of Monsters and Men, or like, even like Edward Sharp in the Magnetic Zeros, if anyone remembers Edward Sharp out there. I lived in L.A., of course, I remember Edward Sharp and Magnetic Zeros.

I mean, you know, again, these very bombastic, messianic, anthemic indie bands where you had, you know, a lot of members, they were wearing old-timey clothes, there's like, you know, interesting facial hair going on, this sort of collision of like back to the land, almost like a hippie aesthetic, and then like just corporate rock sheen, you know, like this weird juxtaposition, which has proved to be very commercial. I mean, is that the lasting impact of this band? Are there any other signs that this band has been influential on 2020 music? I mean, you are the guru of emo rock right now. Do you feel like emo bands coming up now? Listen to Arcade Fire, like draw any inspiration from what they're doing? I've put forth this theory before, but Funeral is like basically a 2010, 2011-era emo album. I mean, there's eight guys, there's Glock and Spiels, there's the guy who

can't sing and the female vocalist you can sing one guy's wearing a helmet they just look super uncool um and i think funeral definitely does have that it but even that's become kind of a pass a influence in that realm um you know going into 2020 but as far as like arcade fires like impact on the on the current scheme of things like i just can't really assess it you know i think they do exist in their own little kind of sphere, like where, you know, they can release a new album and it'll be popular. But like, are, they're more like the strokes now or something like that where they, they're clearly like past, I don't know. I think what would have, I think what, what will happen with them is that their next down will be like probably a U2 type move where they go back to basics,

like the all that you can't leave behind. And it'll get like, you know, it's like arcade fire, back to help us through, you know, the quarantine like you two saved us for mine 11. But I don't think they'll, they just kind of exist in their own bubble now, which is, you know, it's through some fault of their own. But I... Yeah, I mean, the one thing I would say is, like, there's always the chance that there's like this group of people that were, you know, between the ages of like 11 and 15 when the suburbs came out, which would mean that they're just starting to make their records now.

And maybe we're going to see a wave of, like, Arcade Fire boosterism. Because there's always this thing, like, where you feel like certain bands are really popular for a while, then they fall out of favor, and then they come back because there's younger people that love them when they were kids, and then they bring them back. So I'm curious to see if that happens with Arcade Fire. I don't know if that will happen, but I mean, they were a really popular band in the odds. And they were the kind of band that I feel like if you were a certain kind of kid, they were probably your favorite band for at least a couple years.

So I'm curious to see if that happens. But yeah, you're right. I mean, I do agree. I think the Strokes comparison is apt. The Strokes being a band that a certain segment of people who were a certain age when that band was really important, they're kind of with the strokes forever. You know, like they're always going to care about the strokes. And I am one of those people, by the way.

I find the strokes endlessly fascinating. And, you know, Julian Casablanca is will be. put out, you know, his, like, shitty Leonard Cohen imitation album when he's 70, and I'll be there like, oh, this is, like, really interesting. Like, I'll be, I'll be scribbling notes on his, like, mortality album that he makes, you know, 30 years from now. And yeah, I suspect that Arcade Fire is the same, that there is a generation of people who found this band to be incredibly important, and they're always going to be with them. I don't know if they're that band that, like, transcends generations, like a radiohead, for instance. I think Radiohead has proven that they

had fans that loved them in the 90s, and then they put out in rainbows and the a different generation of people. And then the next decade, they can still headline Coachella and, and people gravitate to them. Maybe Arcade Fire are more like the killers, like, but I don't know. It's, I know there was a discussion about, like, you know, what are they, like, where are they like now? because, you know, they're on a level, I would say, below, if you want to look at, like, 21st century indie rock, I think they're below Vampire Weekend. I think they're below LCD sound system on, like, the totem pole, which is, you know, kind of, kind of amazing to think about this band that won a Grammy, but like, doesn't have that

kind of juice. But I think they just are, unlike, you know, Vampire Weekend and LCD Sound System, much, much, much worse at brand management over the past decades. Well, yeah. And they haven't had that album that came out that could hook a new generation in and the way that I think Father of the Bride did for Vampire Weekend. I mean, I think they were able to make a record that brought people in. And maybe the next Arcade Fire record will be that. I mean, you know, I feel like we've been hard on Arcade Fire in this episode.

I will say that they are one of the great live bands of indie rock in the last 20 years. Unbeatable. Like even everything now, like I've heard of the Everything Now shows, even if they're playing. playing like half empty arenas. I heard they still bring it. Yeah, I mean, I saw the suburbs tour and they, I saw them in Chicago. The National was opening. This was like high violet era. So this was like a very 2010 era show. And they were great. They were, again, like, there actually have been like quite a few indie bands from the aughts that were able to make it into arenas. Some of them have actually had managed to.

stay there. Some have not. But I think Arcade Fire without question is like the best. Oh, but I mean, they were they were doing that from the start. I mean, I remember seeing like the funeral shows that like the variety playhouse in Atlanta where it's like 750 like a 750 cap room and it's just like this band like they can scale for real. And, uh, I mean, some of the reflector stuff didn't come off great live. But I mean, I would still see them like if they were, you know, if such a thing were possible, you know. Right, absolutely. And again, with the suburbs, I feel like you and I feel similarly about this, that we still like the suburbs. Like, when I revisited it for this episode, I still enjoy it. It's probably the arcade fire record that I would reach for first if I wanted to listen to this band.

And I think now when I listen to it, I just look at it as like a fascinating snapshot of that moment in time. and that decade that preceded it, the aughts of what indie rock was. And it's interesting to compare where we're at now with indie music to what this record was when it came out in 2010. Yeah, I mean, when I listen to like modern man, I am back at that desk at like eating lunch at 1115 in the morning because I'm just like so sad about like the state of affairs. And I think that's, you know, like I think a great thing. Like it's a real testament to how powerful it is as far as like. like not only a snapshot of time, but the endurance of it and of its themes. And that it is honestly like the first arcade fire album I will read for if I want like

an arcade fire experience. But yeah, I just also think it like I think of back of it is like this is where things started to chip. Like this is why the 2000 like this is why decade list should start like 2001 to 2010 or 2011 to 2020 because there always seems like the zero year of a decade closes out the last one as opposed to being the beginning of a new one. Like this is where this is where the 2000s ended as far as I'm concerned. And it ended with a bang. So congratulations to the odds. And then we started a new decade. So in this part of the episode, we're going to be doing something called Recommendation

Corner where Ian and I will talk about something that we'll talk about something that we're really enjoying at the moment. Could be an album. Could be a music documentary. Could be a music book. Could be a great Twitter follow. I'll go first. You know, I find that lately I've been going back and seeking out albums that came out

around March and April because I feel like that was a really crazy time. Obviously, that was when the pandemic was really blowing up here in America. And it was really easy to lose track of album. that were coming out because you were worried that any cough that you had was a sign that you were soon going to die. So, like, I found myself not really caring as much about new music at that moment. So I've been going back, revisiting some albums. And one record that I've really connected with is, it is what it is, which is the fourth

record by Thundercat. And if you know Thundercat, it's the performing name of a singer, songwriter, and bass is called Stephen Bruner. He's most famous for playing on other people's records, including albums by Flying Lotus and Erica Badu. He was also a major player on Kendrick Lamar's to Pimp a Butterfly. This is his fourth record, and when it was reviewed in April, it got pretty good notices, but I feel like it just sort of came and went, even though his third record, which came out in 2017, called Drunk, was a very acclaimed album.

But this album, it just really connected with me, I think, in the summertime, because this is like a hazy, funky, like psychedelic R&B funk record. and it falls in line with Thundercats other records, but this album feels even more sort of disjointed and raw and murky. And it's the kind of record that I feel like if you listen to it once, you're maybe going to miss the point of it. It's not something that has like that one song that is going to latch you in and make you want to stick around like the other Thundercat records do. But I really like the murkiness of this record.

And I think over time and over listens, it's really hooked me in. I'll even say, too, that if there's any indie jam fans out there, that Thundercat, to me, should be put into this category because there is something jammy or jam-band asked about what he's doing. I know, for instance. Absolutely. And I've interviewed Stephen in the past, and we ended up talking about, like, Frank Zappa, like, for half the time. so he's a zap ahead, so he definitely has that in his DNA. So it definitely has that sort of like muso aspect to it.

There's like a lot of weird type signatures, a lot of virtuoso playing. But there's also like a real sort of melancholy soul to it and a real sort of idiosyncratic point of view that I really love a lot. So if you're having like a socially distance barbecue this summer, if you're by yourself and you're maybe drinking too much and feeling a little woozy, put this record on, I think it'll be a great accompaniment to your state of mind. What is your recommendation, Jan? July for me, like, it's funny because, you know, everyone would, like the reputation of San Diego is like, oh, it's like perfect weather all the time.

And it's like, only 78 degrees. But like in June and July, like, it's June gloom, but it also kind of carries over to July. And I find myself always in July, like gravitating more towards dream pop. Like something that kind of captures this. It's bright. It's kind of carefree. But also there's like this murky overlay to it. And you know, July is dream pop.

August is chill wave. I can explain this in another hour long episode if you really want. But yeah, I always like I look back on like mixes I make for myself that occur in July. And there's always like this heavy dream pop sort of thing. Like there's a theme going on with it. And the ones that I've discovered lately is, you know, I find myself going back to the old radio department albums. Radio department is kind of like a one-man band operating out of Sweden.

And every couple of years, you'll get some people saying, like, this is the most underappreciated band. Like, this is the most underrated band. And I don't know how much, like, I really agree with that. I think they're properly rated in the sense that they're kind of this cult act that some people like really really really love and like that's their thing and then other people just haven't heard of um but the one that really like stuck with me like happened in 2010 like clinging to a scheme like that was i think the big american breakthrough um and you know another 10 year old album

but the ones i've been looking back to uh lesser matters the one that came out in 2003 and um it's it's raw it's like more shoegaze it's more noisy it's more distorted But it's one of those, it's like a situation where there's a band you really like. And it's so rare to be able to say like, oh, I haven't listened to this one because everything's like super available. And you could just go stream at any time. And I'm always excited when there's a band I generally really like, but I recognize it's like, oh, I haven't listened to their older stuff yet. And I think what struck me about this particular album, Lesser Matters, is that when I think about like how music's going to progress, in quarantine.

You know, 2020 has been a great year because a lot of stuff's been recorded before quarantine. But I think I'm not trying to like predict there might be like a dream pop sort of bedroom indie sort of trend. But when I think about like the kind of music that can be made in quarantine by indie rock bands who are a little more noisy, a little more shoegazy. It's probably going to sound like this where it's, it's all the distortion happens within the computer and it's still like very quiet vocals and use drum machines rather than drums. So I think every couple of years there's like this dream pop shoe gaze, you know,

Renaissance because there are always going to be like emo or hardcore kids who age out of that stuff. It's like, we listen to shoe gaze now and like, yeah, we're really into radio department. I think radio department is actually like Joyce Manor's favorite band of all time. So, yeah, if you've only heard radio department from like Heavens. on fire, I would highly recommend going back to the 2003 album Lesser Matters. I think that's really where, you know, it feels a little more special because it's not as exposed as the other one. So that's what I've been into lately. Well, good recommendations from us both. And if you're looking for more music recommendations,

sign up for the Indie Mix Taped newsletter. You can go to uprocks.com backslash indie. And I recommend five albums per week and we'll send it directly to your email box. I feel good about our first episode, Ian, I think we are on our way here at Indycast. I think we are too, man. All right, guys. Well, everyone, thank you for listening to our first episode, and we will be back next week with more Indycast. Take care.