Indiecast - A New Vampire Weekend Album + An Old Modest Mouse Album

Episode Date: April 5, 2024

This week's episode opens with Steven and Ian remembering the old Pitchfork "stunt" review of Jet's 2006 album Shine On (0:27), which was dissected this week in an article by The Ringer. While stunt reviews are kind of dumb, Steven and Ian still miss them a little. The guys also explore the indie-rock guest stars on Beyoncé's new blockbuster album Cowboy Carter (7:11), including Adam Granduciel, Jonathan Rado, and some dude from The Stills.From there, they review the great new Vampire Weekend album, Only God Was Above Us (12:49), which manages to change the band's just enough while retrenching with some classic themes. They also look back at Modest Mouse's Good News For People Who Love Bad News (28:06), which turns 20 this week, a crucial album in the mainstreaming of indie rock in the aughts that might also be... not that great?In Recommendation Corner, Ian talks about the band Cindy Lee while Steven stumps for the latest from Phosphorescent and the Philly band A Country Western (52:36).New episodes of Indiecast drop every Friday. Listen to Episode 183 here and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. You can submit questions for Steve and Ian at [e-mail], and make sure to follow us on Instagram and Twitter for all the latest news. We also recently launched a visualizer for our favorite Indiecast moments. Check those out here.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Indycast is presented by Uprox's indie mixtape. Hello everyone and welcome to IndieCast. On the show, we talk about the biggest indie news of the week. We review albums and we hash out trends. In this episode, we talk about Vampire Weekend and the 20th anniversary of Modest Mouse's biggest album. My name is Stephen Hayden, and I'm joined by my friend and co-host. He's the person responsible for pitchfork stunt review of Jets.

Shine on? Ian Cohen, Ian, Ian, how are you? No, that's not true. I was responsible for the never-published review of their 2009 follow-up, Shaka Rock, where the same chimp solves a complicated puzzle in a lab setting. They just weren't ready for the truth that I was going to give them that, you know, songs like KIA killed in action and she's a genius were really the true genesis, or the true apotheosis of Jets' genius.

See, I wasn't familiar with the sequel to the chimp, pissing in its own mouth review of Shine On, which by the way, in that intro, I couldn't remember the name of Jet's second album. I wanted to say Get Born because that's the first record. It's the one that matters. Yes.

If we want to say a Jet album matters. That's the one that has some cultural footprint. I actually own Shine On. I don't think I've ever listened to it. By the way, you know what the first single of that album is, Shine On? No idea. It's called Put Your Money Where Your Mouth is. And they somehow don't manage to mention that, I think, at all in the big ringer piece that ran about it, which, you know, just the name of that song, it brings a lot to the, it paints a rich tapestry.

Well, that's also the name of an Oasis song from Standing on the Shoulders of Giants. That's on that record. So Jet, once again, ripping off Oasis. We're talking about this because the ringer did a story this week on this review that Pitchfork ran. I guess that was 2006 of the second Jet Record called Shine On. Of course, the first Jet record was Get Born that came out in 2003. That's the album with Are You Gonna Be My Girl, Cold Hard Bitch? Look what you've done.

and other timeless classics. That's another one. Roll over DJ, yes. And this piece in the ringer, written by Nate Rogers, very interesting, you know, just getting very granular with a very specific moment in pitchfork history and digging into the identity of the author of that review, which was credited as Ray Suzuki.

and Ray Suzuki apparently was just a catch-all pseudonym that pitchfork reviewers used back in the day when they did these stunt reviews where again it's not like a real review it's sort of like a jokey review in this case again it's a video of a chimp pissing into its own mouth and it was interesting reading that piece I had two takeaways the first takeaway is that Rogers interviewed

the drummer from Jet who seems like a very cool guy, very level-headed. He had a good attitude about the review. So I thought, oh, cool. The Jet guy's cool. Apparently his brother is the lead singer. Yes. Yeah, so they're a brother band.

I didn't know that. I didn't know that there were two, I think it's Chester. Cester. Is it Cester? Is it Cester? But is it pronounced Chester? I think you're overestimating. You're overestimating my Jet knowledge.

I mean, yes, just because I do have a copy of their 2004 album Rare Tracks, which captures demos and live versions of Get Born. That doesn't mean I know how to pronounce their names. Well, did you know the single from Shine On or did you look that up? Like, I can't say I've ever heard a Jet song besides the ones from Get Born. And even those are just ones that I'm like only familiar with through like iPod commercial or like just my imagination. Like I get them confused with Buck Cherry songs a lot.

I'm just saying like, did you know that was the single or did you have to Google? Oh, I absolutely had to Wikipedia that. Okay, okay, because if you knew that that was the lead single, I would be totally amazed. That's like Rain Man level indie rock knowledge. But my second takeaway was that, well, I think stunt reviews are, you know, basically stupid and they don't really, you know, there's no insight to them or any. I found myself like missing the era of stunt reviews. Like the idea that a place would do that occasionally, just to totally shit on a record. I kind of would trade a hundred reviews from this year that read like college term papers.

Yeah. For like one stunt review from like 2006. Yeah, there's a playfulness to it. And it's also, it's a shitty thing to do. but it's also irreverent and it's kind of fun. And I just miss that era when music criticism didn't take itself quite so seriously. You know, and I wouldn't want a ton of stunt reviews. I think that would very quickly wear out its welcome.

But I don't know, we're just like in a very humorless era of music writing. And reading that story, it just made me think, oh, I kind of want that to come back at least a little bit. Yeah, we're going to talk about this with like Vampire Weekend as well. It's like reflective of a time when even like, you know, you could make fun of acts like Jeff, but you could also like sort of make fun of even the biggest indie bands because that was like a time when you could at least acknowledge that even the biggest acts of that time. We're like kind of actively annoying in some ways that people could agree upon. And so we're going to talk about that when we talk about like Vampire Weekend.

I think Modest Mouse as well. But, yeah, I don't want to see a stunt review. Like, I can't imagine that being pulled off successfully at all in 2024. But, yeah, it's just like a lot of these retrospectives on pitchfork. It's kind of an elegy for, like, a time that, you know, no one really wants to relive. But, like, because, like, there's absolutely no way you can do it again in 2024. Well, and also in the age of social media, I mean, you see. see stunt reviews all the time. Yes, absolutely. People dismissing albums with like a photo or

a meme or whatever. So for a publication to do that or a website to do that, it's really redundant. It's one of the many things that social media has ruined in the modern era or fixed, depending on your point of view. We should talk quick about the Beyonce record that came out last week. Cowboy Carter, her country elf. Although I've seen people say it's not a country album. It's a rock record. So maybe it's like an Eagles record. It's a country rock record or something.

But it's 27 tracks, 79 minutes. You know, I made this joke on Twitter. It's 38 minutes longer and one track shorter than Alien Lanes by guided by voices. A lot of people messaged us about this album. You know, we normally probably wouldn't talk about this record. but people certainly reached out to me because they're like, Adam from The War on Drugs is on this record. Like he plays guitar on,

apparently there's like a Miley Cyrus duet called, what's, it's called like Two Most Wanted? Yeah, I guess it's Two Most Wanted. There's a lot of like stylization with like a couple of eyes in a row. Like it's kind of like a conscious rap album from 1998. But Yon's like getting kind of raucous with it. so Adam's on that track apparently Jonathan Rado is on that track as well I think Sean Everett certainly produced he produced it I think I assume he's the one who brought in these indie rock

ringers into the album and yeah it just made me think you know like this Beyonce record it reminds me of the White Lotus in that you have a large cast of celebrities being brought into this very popular and prestigious franchise and they're just put in this very sort of luxurious, well-moneyed environment. And they're being put on display in that way. I mean, there's a million other people on this record. I mean, like, Jay-Z, of course, is on the record, Ferell, Dolly Parton's on the record, Willie Nelson's on the record.

Like I said, Miley Cyrus is on here. Post-Malone shows up. I don't know. Have you delved into Cowboy Carter yet? Yeah, I actually appreciate, like, hearing the, fact that it's 27 songs in 78 minutes because, you know, with like Renaissance and like I'm like yeah, I'm going to listen to it, you know, like how like I'm just going to go on a walk in the morning. But, you know, it's sort of like, yeah, I don't feel like, I'm going to let this

marinate for a while before I dive in. But yeah, I cannot believe like the, that might, you know, the reason people might have emailed you is because of like, you know, Adam, Jonathan Rado. I got hit up because, okay, like there's a scene that's been mean. the lot of the Simpsons were like Stampy the Elephant made like a peanut factory like you know many of you never thought it would happen but I insisted we spend two hours every morning training for it

there is a member of the stills on this record yeah Dave Hamill not even like the main guy yeah there is a guy from the stills he plays on like 16 carriages like the single which is really fucking fascinating

because you know not just because there's like a non-zero chance that Beyonce had to hear animals and insects before hitting the studio. But this guy, you know, after the stills broke up, he went on to work with like the exact type of people you'd expect, like Gord Downey, Sam Roberts, you know, Canadian quasi-Indy Heartland Rockers. And then the next thing you know, he's like producing half of a 070 shake album on good music. And nobody explains how he gets from point A to point B.

By the way, look the guy up on, he looks like an L.A. session dude. He does not look like the guy who played such wonderful guitar on Changes Are No Good. Yeah, that's pretty much the only thing that, you know, really interests me about this. But I also, this is a sort of record where, you know, thanks to the fact I'm no longer, like, a staff writer anywhere, like, I don't have to listen to this. I can just kind of give it a while before I revisit it because, you know, you just get hit with this deluge of all the reviews. Like, no, don't call it a country out, but, no, actually. it's the truest country album. The only take I really, really absorbed was that of Azealia Banks.

Did you see that? Her review of it? Yeah, she, I forget what she said exactly, but yeah, she was... Need more KT. Tunstall up in this. That was her main takeaway. Right. That's right. Yeah, she's like, yeah.

Get KT. Tunn style on here. Which, man, Azealia Banks, she needs to write a book. I really hope she has, like, a memoir in her because she's so funny. And she is like one of our greatest cultural critics right now. It needs to be, if she does write a book, it needs to just be like a notes app post. It can't be like, it cannot be like actual like pen and paper. She needs to do it in the format in which she has proved her genius, which is like Notes app or Instagram stories.

I would read that. Yeah. I just feel like the legal read for that book would be very extensive. Take a long, long time. I'm just amazed that there is one degree of separate. between Cowboy Carter and Logic will break your heart. This shows the genius of Beyonce because she's just drawing from all these different areas. And it's like, it's something for everybody.

You know, even like the Indycast crowd. I'm going to bring in the war on drugs. I'm going to bring in the stills. So it's not even just like Steve or Ian will like it. You got us both on board at that point. You got to tip your cowboy hat to Beyonce on that one. Good, good for you. Let's talk about Vampire Weekend.

Their fifth album, Only God was above us, is out today. Getting great reviews. You pick this for your fantasy team. It currently has an 88 on Metacritic. The pitchfork review came out on Thursday, 8.6, Best New Music. Just getting great reviews. I'm in the middle of writing a column about this record. It's going to be out early next week.

I got a little, just deluge. I wrote a massive Neil Young column that's out this week. You can go read it on Up Rocks. I wrote about my 100 favorite Neil Young songs. It's like 11,000 word column. Perfect for those of you getting into Neal, going on Spotify, now that he's back on the platform. A lot of music to check out.

There's two things I want to talk about with this record, and I'm curious to get your take on it. the first is when Vampire Weekan comes out in the late Otts, a signature part of their sound is this very clean, almost surf rock guitar sound. And I'm pretty sure I read Ezra Keating talking about this. That in some way, that guitar sound was a reaction against what was going on in 90s rock with grunge and even what was going on into the aughts with the strokes. you know, that very return of rock New York sound.

Ezra was like, we're going to go in the opposite direction. We're going to have a very sort of clean guitar sound. And that is going to play into the overall aesthetic of this band, which was really kind of reacting against that return of rock thing, that rock sort of puritanicalism. You know, Vampire Weekend has always been a band that's drawn from many different areas of music, hasn't been judgmental about rock or pop or hip hop or whatever.

So that's a big thing with them. On this new record, the thing that really jumps out is the use of distortion and noise. Like that clean guitar sound that is such a signature part of Vampire Weekend is really nowhere to be found on this record. And I have to say that for my own personal palette, that is very appealing. Like, I'm a Vampire Weekend fan, but the noisiness of this record, relative to other Vampire Weekend records. I mean, this isn't, you know, this isn't like Sun. youth in the 90s or anything. But for Vampire Weekend, this is a pretty noisy

record and kind of a chaotic record, while at the same time being as well produced and crafted as any other Vampire Weekend record. That jumps out to me. The other thing that jumps out to me is that Vampire Weekend, on the last two records, this album and Father of the Bride, seems like there's a very conscious decision

about not courting the musical zeitgeist. you know like early on in vampire weekend Ezra Kaineg was very canny about I think positioning Vampire Weekend at the center of what was going on in pop music in an indie rock and on Father of the Bride and on this record I think there's a just as a conscious attempt to not court that

father of the bride you know you could almost describe that as like that record being influenced by the crunchy sound of the 90s you know fish jam band that kind of stuff. Whereas this record, I think, is like the Grand Royal Magazine side of the 90s. You know, that Beastie Boys, New York, hip-hop and punk music commingling and creating this sort of hybrid music that was looking toward the 21st century,

but in retrospect, sounds very 90s. I think that aesthetic is definitely on this record. and I just feel like Vampire Weekend, I mean, Ezra is so smart about this stuff where you would expect Vampire Weekend to have a natural fade being, you know, I think Ezra turns 40 next week. So he's at that age now like where indie bands of that vintage start to fade. But he's really leaned into it. You know, like, because there's things he could have done in this record to position it more toward the mainstream of what's going on in music right now. You know, he could have had Jack Antonoff produce some of the record. He could have had, you know, Phoebe Bridgers show up and do a duet.

You know, he could have had, like, ice spice show up. You know what I mean? Like, he could have, like, brought in signifiers of things that are going on now that would have affected the way this record would be perceived. But instead of chasing that, it's almost like, oh, I'm going to lean the other way. And I'm going to create this bubble around the band that's, separate from that, where if we're not part of the zeitgeist anymore, it's not because we're older, it's because we're choosing that to be. And I just think that's such a brilliant decision.

I don't know if he's working on that level of calculation, but the result is the same. I think that that is the direction that they've headed in, and I think it's a really smart thing to do. So I don't know what, I just was monologuing about this record. I'm curious if any the things I say, any of the things I said resonate with you and what are your thoughts on the album? Well, I mean, with the Grand Royal thing, I was just like talking to my many friends in real life the other day about just how much, you know, Butter 08 and Brand Van 3,000 and Luscious Jackson I hear on this record. We're going to have to have a remember-sum Scrant Royal Guys episode in the near future. But yeah, I do think that this does kind of hit at this,

I think with Vampire Weekend, there's always been this kind of like utopian sort of idea about like, here's where like the best musics are. And, you know, with Father of the Bride, there was the crunchy part where you mentioned with like fish, but also I would say like wowie-zowie-zowie-era pavement. I think there's obviously a big overlap between those two. And I think that Father of the Bride is going to have a, you know, wowie-zowie-zawi-type reputation going forward where it's like kind of the curveball pick for the best Vampire Weekend record. But, you know, I think that, When I first heard the singles, like Capricorn, Gen X, Cops, it just, like, my initial thought was that this was going to be kind of like a trouble will find me or I don't live here anymore type record where it's no longer a band that's like creating the zeitgeist, but just doing like a kind of a master of their domain on the outside piece of it. but I like this record a lot more after having heard the entire thing.

Because, yeah, I do think that Vampire Weekend is a little bit, like, post-peak in the sense that, you know, when they release an album, it's not automatically slated to be an immediate contender for, like, album of the year. But so much of this record is about the, like, just what it's like to be in a generation that's like just now being kind of, of shoved to the side of like recognizing that you're you know this this line that I feel like they use in a lot of their albums like being like too old for one thing but not young enough to feel another thing and I just think that that describes I hate to use the word we term voice of a generation because you know that's pretty reductive but when I listen to a song like capricorn or gen X cops it's like yeah this is what it feels like to be you know on the verge of 40 where you want to be engaged in culture, but you're also being sort of forced out and how to reckon with

that. Also, I'm surprised at the fact that you haven't mentioned that Ezra says the word Wisconsin on this record, which is, you know, that's definitely, it's the first time I've ever heard feedback on a vampire weekend, the first time they've ever made Nate Minut's song, and the first time he's ever said the word Wisconsin. There's a lot of, they're still finding new wrinkles in their sound five albums in. Yeah, well, I'm sorry, yeah, I did bury the lead. I think that is the most important part of this record that Ezra Kating says the word Wisconsin on this record. But no, I think you make a great point about this record existing at a moment in their career where it could have only come out at this time.

And it's interesting because I feel like when this record was first announced and the singles came out that people were looking at it as, oh, this is them returning to what they did on their earlier records. You know, Father of the Bride was this. very expansive California sounding record and now they're going to make New York music again. And they are doing that on this album, but they are not sounding like those first three records. This is a record where if you play a song from it in 10 years, people will know immediately what album it's from.

In a way that I don't know if you could say necessarily about the first two records, as great as they are, those two records feel very much of a piece. to me in the same way that like is this it and room on fire fit together you know those albums feel like they're kind of one unit in a lot of ways and then you've got modern vampires of the city which is this very stately again self-conscious i think statement type album about mortality and and what it means to be alive that you know as you move into your 30s this record is doing the same thing as you suggested about your 40s, but again, I feel like it has some of the playfulness of Father of the Bride combined with the New York aesthetic of those early records.

And again, this use of distortion that I think, again, is very unique to this record. I don't know. I wish this band made more records because the gaps between the albums, you know, it was six years with Father of the Bride, it's five years with this album. I would expect that this band is not going to get back to making albums every two or three years again. You know, it might be seven or eight years before there's another Vampire Weekend record. But the combination of that noisy element and the craft of this record, because again, it isn't like they made a lo-fi record or some fly-by-night we're playing live in the studio type thing. You can tell that,

this is as well thought out and methodical as any other Vampire Weekend record. And you alluded to this earlier, this is something I'm writing about right now, the five-album stretch that Vampire Weekend is in right now, the five-album arc. You know, like, I've talked about the five-album test in the past. And if you can't tell from the tone of this conversation, I think that they do pass the test. And I feel like Ezra Koenig is very,

one of the few artists or even people that care about that test more than I do or more than anyone else does. Maybe even more than he would admit. Not only is it thinking about the craft of the production and the songs, but he really thinks about how albums relate to one another in ways that I don't think many artists do. And it's one of those things that could come off as a little too self-conscious or a little too calculating. But the execution is so good that I don't think that gets in the way. Yeah, like one of the things that is either really endearing or also like just phenomenally fucking aggravating about this band for, depending on where you stand,

is that they never make a wrong move. Like everything they do is like so considered in a way where you're just like, ah, I see what they're doing. And you know what? they pull it off. Like, it's really hard to overstate just how audacious this band is, you know, with this record, with

so much self-reference going on with, you know, musical themes and lyrical themes and just from the jump, like, I don't think, I mean, five album tests, like that, they pass that, like, so thoroughly. It's like Mariano Rivera, like 99.9% Hall of Fame vote type passage.

And, you know, I, like, you can make the argument that, like, their debut album and I'm trying to remember where you put this in your debut album's column but like I can't think of an album a debut album that was more like audacious and fully formed than that one you know like just in terms of like knowing what you are just flying against so much of what's cool and they just always make the right step and I love how this album you know after the confrontational second LP the self-conscious masterpiece the sprawling one is like this is like this is like legacy building, sort of in the same way that we talked about like the Sufyan album from last year, Javalin, where it's just like, this is all the modes that they do. You know, it could be a great introduction to their catalog, which is obviously not as sprawling as that of like Sufyan. I'm just, yeah, I don't know if I would want like more frequent albums from them because,

you know, like maybe it would like dilute the impact. But yeah, it's just like they just, they're so fucking. good. It's like frustrating. Yeah. Even like Father of the Bride, which you could look at as saying, well, this is their messy album. Or this is the album

where maybe there's too many songs. But then you listen to it and you're like, no, this is, this has the appearance of a messy album. But like every piece of detritus is put in the right place. And when you describe it that way, like you said,

it sounds aggravating or it sounds like, oh, this is too, uh, it's too well considered, you know, it's too thought out. But again, the execution is so good

and it's so thoughtful that it just works. And even this record again, like this is like, this could be like the, the noisy going up the rails fifth record, you know, that a lot of bands make,

but they, they make that record because they're not in full control of what they're doing. Whereas Vampire Weekend, makes the sort of shape of that record, but they are in control of what they are doing. And everything on this record is there because it's supposed to be. So, yeah, again, I think one of the best albums of the year so far,

I really like it a lot. I think it's one of their stronger albums in their catalog, although if I were to go step by step through their catalog, which I'm in the process of doing for this thing I'm writing next week, I probably could make that case for every record. You know, every record is maybe my favorite. So, kudos to Vampire Weekend. Kudos to you for drafting them.

We were both reluctant to draft them. Yes. And how foolish are we? It's like picking against Patrick Mahomes in the playoffs. Yeah. You're like, well, he can't win again. He's not going to win this year. You know, the receivers are dropping balls.

They're not as good. And then you feel like an idiot because he picked against Patrick Mahomes. Let's talk about Modis Mouse. 20th anniversary. The man named dropped by Vampire. weekend on step. Yes, very good. Very good segue there between segments.

This weekend is the 20th anniversary of the fourth Modest Mouse record. Good news for people who love bad news. And this was the fourth record from Modis Mouse, but it is number one in the hearts, I'm sure, of many people who discovered this band from this record. And that would be many, many, many people, because this album is one of the crucial records of the aughts in terms of mainstreaming indie rock. You have this band Modis Mouse that at the time it was frankly miraculous that this group became as popular as they did.

You know, I think you can look at a band like Death Capt for Cutie or Jimmy E. World and be like, I understand how they could become big because they write catchy pop rock songs that are very easy to like. Modest Mouse comes from this indie rock background. Isaac Brock is a very distinctive singer-songwriter. They just didn't seem like a band that would ever hit it big, and yet this record went double platinum in the early odds. Floodon was a huge hit. It was performed on American Idol. It was performed everywhere.

Saturday Live, I think they played too. Yeah. And it is one of those albums that, I think, again, it's hugely important in terms of mainstreaming indie rock. It's also, I think, a line of demarcation in Modest Mouse's catalog. And I'll just start with myself. I love Modest Mouse, but I always qualify that by saying that I love the first three records. And in particular, the Lonesome Card of West, I think is a masterpiece and one of the great records of indie rock of the last, what, 25, 30 years. I think the Moon in Antarctica

is also a great, great record. And then with this record, their big hit, I mean, at the risk of sounding like an indie snob, this was the album where I checked out. Like, I actually liked the song Flood On. I think that's a good, catchy song. But this record overall, I think, has a lot of filler on it. I think aside from the singles,

it's kind of a forgettable record. And for me, this is, the beginning of Modest Mouse moving away from what I really loved on those early records, which was the chemistry between the three musicians. And you really hear that on the Lonesome Crowded West. Isaac Brock, drummer Jeremiah Green, Eric Judy. The way those three played together, they had such a unique instrumental blend, such a feral energy. I just think that's such a huge part of those records. Jeremiah Green isn't on this album. He doesn't play on good news for people who love bad news. I think it's maybe the only one that he doesn't play on. And that's a huge deal.

One of the great indie rock drummers of all time, I just think him missing from this record, it has a material effect on the music, but it's also symbolic, I think, of what happened to this band. As they moved into the odds and they started adding a bunch of different musicians and it started to feel more like an Isaac Brock solo project than a actual band. Does any of this resonate with you? Do you agree with this? Are you a fan of this album? Yeah, absolutely.

I love this album, like, to, I love to talk about this album because I don't think there's a record of this stature where I've seen more divisive opinions about it. Like, there is no consensus about this one because it could be, you know, I think of it in the context of, like, you know, hot fuss, which came out around this time or the, you know, the first Franz Ferdinand album. you know like mainstreaming of indie rock and uh you know like for some people it's like a real gateway album like there's probably so many 90s equivalence of this um or it could be like the part where like modest mouse got shitty or it's like the last good modest mouse album before they got

shitty and like i feel like i've held all of those opinions at some point in time because Modest, like, float on is such a fascinating case study because, like, just imagine Modest Mouse's career if that song doesn't exist. Like, imagine that they make the same record, but, like, Ocean Breathe Salty as the successful single. Like, how big are they without just that song? Because I can't call Modest Mouse on one-hit wonder, but they are sort of like, and I bring up, like, you know, M83 or Future Islands or even Jimmy Eat World.

for that matter of, like, bands who have more than one hit, they have many successful albums, but they have one song that is so easily identifiable as the reason that they can still play amphitheaters to this day. You know, like, Modus Mouse is doing tours with, like, Weezer instead of being, like, built a spill or, like, Yola Tango big. Yeah, it's interesting. I think, you know, they probably would be another one of those Pacific Northwest bands that still tours but isn't playing amphitheaters or arenas.

I mean, yeah, I think they would be in the same lane as built a spill. Maybe more towards pavement, like, because pavement is definitely more popular than built to spill because modest mouse was already like pretty popular before that fourth record came out. They were definitely like one of the bigger indie bands, I feel like at that time. Although when you, like I remember interviewing the. band when I did an oral history of the Lonesome Carter West. And hearing them talk about it, it sounds like it was still pretty modest in that band business-wise, you know, before the fourth

record dropped. So maybe my perception of that is distorted a little bit. You know, they would be less popular without float on, but would they seem cooler 20 years later? Because I feel like people talk about built a spill or pavement with more affection than they do with Modest Mouse. Modest Mouse kind of gets grouped with Weezer sometimes in that side, you know, where, yeah, people love this band, they're an

important band, but they don't have quite the same cachet as a band like Bill to Spill that everyone just loves, and they've never really been popular enough to be annoying. You know? Yeah. So I don't know what, I mean, for your bank account,

you'd rather have float on. Right. But in terms of your reputation, maybe it's more of a mixed bag. Yeah, because I mean, this band is like massively influential in just the way like people play guitar and like, you know, just the kind of dirt bag country sound that they did. You mentioned the filler though on this record

and this is like in terms of like going back and revisiting this record and like refamiliarizing myself with its contours. The one thing that I never ever seem to remember is that this album is only 48 minutes long. Like Modus Mouse albums before this were long as fuck. And this is the one I remember is having a lot of filler. You know, like, I look at the track was like Black Cadillacs, one chance.

I don't remember these songs. Yeah. Towards the, it gets real, like, forgettable towards the end. And I'd never really liked how the good times are killing me either. But like, yeah, world at large, float on, you know, ocean breathed salty. That could really fool you into thinking this record is. better than it is. But yeah, it's like, it's 48 minutes.

Like, that just doesn't sound right. Yeah, I'm, I'm shocked. Actually, you say that it's only 48 minutes because it doesn't feel like 48 minutes. It definitely feels like a longer record. And to your point about the early Modest Mouse records, they don't feel as long as they are. I think Lonesome Carter West is like almost 70 minutes. Yeah, it's Cowboy Carter, like Cowboy Carter, major player in the Cowboy scene. Has anyone made that joke yet?

Yeah, someone made that joke. I think multiple people. I mean, 10 minutes of that is Trucker's Atlas. So that definitely extends the record, but, you know, Truckers Atlas could be 25 minutes long and I would love it. I mean, and again, it's because of Jeremiah Green playing just a sick drum part. And I'll just reiterate what I said before. I think that the magic of Modest Mouse for me was that original three-person lineup.

And as they moved into the odds, it just became like we're adding musicians, you know, Johnny Mars coming into the picture. picture later on in the aughts. And it just loses something for me. Because as much as I like Isaac Brock's songwriting, I think that the instrumental power of that band was their superpower. And it just starts to get diluted around this time. And that's where I check out.

Yeah. I mean, I have like warm memories about this album just because like I have warm memories about 2004 in general. And, you know, I will defend, you know, we, the, what the fuck is it? If that 2000, we were dead before the ship even sank. I like some of the songs on that record. Like that's one where you get the same opinions about this record, but even more extreme.

Like some people would just think, yeah, this is like the biggest piece of shit record I've ever heard of my life. Other people's like, oh, it's actually pretty good. Or I like the songs with the shins on it. Yeah, just a real... And younger people too. Oh, absolutely. Because there's a generation for whom, like those are the two big, modest mouse. records because those are the ones that came out when they were in middle school and they don't

maybe care as much about the 90s stuff. And that's an insane opinion as far as I'm concerned. Even if I was born later, I would go back to the 90s and be like, these albums are clearly better. But anyway. Yeah, go ahead. Get high as fucking your college dorm listening to Moon in Antarctica and like come back to me.

Like, come back to me with that opinion. I know that you may have heard, you know, you had a. Good news for people who love bad news on your, like, mint green iPod. Like, unless you've, like, gotten high to, you know, a third planet in your dorm, like, I can't trust your opinion overall of the modest mouse discography. Well, on that note, let's get to our mailbag segment here. We've, I feel like the mailbag segment, it always gets cut off, which is sad because It's great to hear from our listeners.

It's just like last week, the fantasy album's draft, it went long, so we couldn't get these emails in. But please continue to write us. It's great to hear from you. You can hit us up at Indycast Mailbag at gmail.com. Do you want to read this first email? This is kind of a saucy one. Yes, I like this.

This comes to us from Jacob, and he tells us that he's curious, to hear our thoughts on band saying they're from, quote, cooler places than they actually are. I went to, and this is Jacob talking, I went to elementary middle and high school with Marissa and Tenasi from mannequin pussy, the latter of being the founding guitarist no longer in the band. While I'm happy for their success, I get a little irked hearing it over and over there are a Philly band. We are from Westport, Connecticut, about a three-hour drive from Philly. One of the wealthiest towns in the whole country, pink polos, boat shoes, country club,

kids getting BMWs for their 16th birthday, all that kind of thing. I particularly remember Tenasi acquiring a refined taste of music at an early age from their family's private chef. Do we need to get like our... Do we need to get like Up Rocks legal up in here? Yeah, we should just say allegedly. Let's put allegedly in there. What do you guys think of this?

An inevitable marketing technique or a bit of poserism? Brings to mind another Connecticut band that immediately claimed Brooklyn as their city of origin, MGMT. I am a congratulations truth or a... well. Love the pod, Jacob. So Jacob, this has reminded me of my friend Jake Longstreet, if you're listening out there. He's also from CT, and he's talked about how there's not a lot of bands from Connecticut. And you got John Mayer, you got Goose, and I think that's it.

I can't think of any other examples. And maybe the reason why there aren't any bands from CT is that they move away, and then they don't claim CT as their home state. Look, I think this is a little unfair, Jacob, on your part, because I think it's generally accepted that the city that you're from is where the band met and started playing shows. To use a famous example, REM is associated with Athens, Georgia. But like, none of those guys are originally from Athens, Georgia. It's just that they went to school in Athens, Georgia.

That's where they met. R.E.M. played their first gig in Athens. And they're known as an Athens band. So I think for the members of Manacin Pussy to claim Philly, I don't know their history exactly, but I would imagine that maybe that this is the city that they became a band. So Philly, I think, it's okay for them to claim that as their hometown. One thing I think is kind of interesting here in the 2020s is that,

it does seem like fewer bands are moving to the big city to become a band. You know, like Philadelphia in the 2010s, that became what Brooklyn was in the aughts. Like people moved to Philly, and they didn't move to Brooklyn anymore because there's a lot cheaper to live in Philly. You could be a band there. There's places to play shows, places to rehearse. There's a lot easier to be a band. But I don't know, maybe it's because I've interviewed a bunch of people lately that, that aren't in big cities.

Like I wrote about Liquid Mike. They're up in the UP. They have no plans to move to like even Minneapolis or Detroit. You know, you've got Wednesday, the big indie band from last year. They're very proudly in Asheville, North Carolina. I recently wrote about two artists that moved from Philly to different towns. You had Wexahatchie. That used to be a Philly band.

Now she's in Kansas City. You had Rosalie. She was in Philly for like 15 years. Now she's in North Carolina. So maybe people are going to be waving the flag. Maybe this is the decade of Westport, Connecticut. Maybe that's going to be the new hotspot city. But yeah, I don't know.

I think it's okay to not say your actual hometown as the place that you're from. Yeah. And first off, Jacob, put some respect on hate breed. I mean, that's like the Connecticut band, at least in the middle spaces. Or the world is in the world. a beautiful place and I'm no longer afraid to die started out in Willamantic, you know, more commonly known as Heroin Town. But, you know, they eventually moved to Philly and they became a Philly band. Yeah, I don't think that it's like for cool points or whatever because like

saying you're like a Philly band is about as descriptive as saying like they play guitar. You know what I mean? I'm actually more interested in a band if they're not from a city with like a music scene. I would love to hear them talking about how growing up in Westport or a place like that influenced their life choices. But yeah, there's a difference between like where people are actually from and the city, you know, in which they became a band. Like, yeah, MGMT met at Wesleyan, but, you know, they moved to Brooklyn. Like, same with like Das Racist. You know, the national, they started in Cincinnati, but, you know, then they became like a New York band. Like that's where they, you know, for themselves.

And so, but like I would, you know, the thing is now, whenever I hear about a band from like a city I've never heard of, like I'm so listening to that. Like if you're an emo band from like Ames, Iowa, you know, shout out to Stars Hollow, like I am definitely going to listen to that rather than like, you know, when people say, oh, it's a Philly band. Like I just expect them to be like ripping off spirit of the beehive, like 90% of the other bands do there. So I don't think it's as deep as Jacob suggested is. But nonetheless, I just love the tea that Jacob is spilling here on mannequin pussy. Yeah, maybe we can get the private chef on the show. Apparently, he's a big musical connoisseur. Maybe we can get mannequin pussy's boyhood chef on the show.

Let's read our second email. This email comes from Andrew in Chicago. I was just in Chicago. I was in Chicago last week with the family. stayed downtown by the John Hancock building. Very nice. Went to a bunch of restaurants, walked in the city, very lovely there. My cold that I've had forever, it went away temporarily when I was in Chicago.

And then I came home and I was immediately congested again. So I don't know what's going on. I'm allergic to Minnesota now. Hello, Steve and Ian. I'm a big fan of the podcast and also y'all's writing. I've been reading your work for the past 15 years. Thank you, Andrew. Very nice.

Your recent episode discussing Waxahatchy's Tiger's Blood reminded me of my favorite Crutchfield project, Allison Crutchfield's 2017 album, Tourist in This Town. I think that album is criminally underrated in a true highlight of 2010's indie rock, remembering some ladies. I love it. Good to see.

So my question, Who are your favorite musical siblings and music's past and also modern indie rock. Yeah, Allison Crutchfield, tourists in this town. Like, you know, it's interesting when that record came out, there was still like the inkling of a possibility that like Allison was going to have like more juice going forward. I think there was like kind of a more muted response to, you know, into the storm,

the Waxahatchie out from that year. And also shout out to swear. And they had some jams back in the day. I feel like Steve's going to have like a much more roe. robust answer to this question because, you know, there's so much awesome history of brothers in classic rock bands, you know, in the 90s and so forth. I mean, nothing tops the Gallagher brothers in my mind. And I also think it's cool that the nationals, the national has two sets of brothers. Plus, Matt's brother who made the mistaken for strangers documentary. I got to be on brand.

Give a shout to the Kinsellas, of course, Mike and Mike and Tim and also Nate the cousin, you know, the first family of Midwest emo, but I'm gonna go to, I don't know if this is within the spirit of the question, but my favorite brother's combination, they've never been to the same band is that of the Yorks, which is, you know, Tom York and his brother Andy of, I mean, this is like real remember some guys, Brit Rockheads, the unbelievable truth. I just need to, like, I want to know more about this relationship, you know, just about like how Andy York feels about his station in life, you know, because it's like one thing if he was just someone who picked a different career path, like accountant or teacher or something along those lines,

or if he was like a musician who made like very different music than Tom York. But I don't know if you've ever heard this ultimate unbelievable truth album. But, you know, they signed, they got signed a Virgin and they make music that's like pretty similar to Radiohead. Like in a way where you can see the vision of Virgin. It's almost like that band Inhaler that's signed to Interscope right now with like Bono's kid in it. But, yeah, I want to, like, I want to give the oral history of this record. Like, I want to hear from Tori Amos who actually took this band on tour with her back in 1998, you know, just to like see what it's like, when you think about like what she went through in the industry, like now she's babysitting Tom York's little brother's band. Also, I see there's no pitchfork review of the unbelievable truth one album.

I got my next Sunday review pitch. if you're listening, you're going to get hit with this. So I just love the dynamic. But, like, I don't know how if they talk to each other. I don't know if, like, Andy is, like, super bitter because his band never took off despite having that leg up. Just such a, like, just such a fascinating contrast in career paths. Uh, that I just, like, I just love that story more than, like, any sort of, like, traditional, you know, the brother who's the basis of the drummer, like, fighting after the, after the show. Yeah, we have to do a special episode just devoted to the unbelievable truth, just digging into their catalog, talking about the arc of their career. I like to imagine that there's someone out there who just loves the unbelievable truth and doesn't like Radiohead.

It's like, no way, man, I'm planning my flag for the unbelievable truth, man. Fuck Radiohead. Fuck Radiohead, man. It's all about Andy York, man. So, look, the short answer is Oasis, is my favorite. favorite brother band. I mean, come on, there's no mystery about that. But I should say, like, I've written books about two brother bands. One, of course, is the Black Crows. I wrote that book with my friend Steve Gorman, the former drummer of the band. Chris and Rich Robinson, you could say

they're the, like, they're the American Gallagher brothers, except they're not as funny, but they do argue a lot. And also Radiohead as brothers. You have Colin and Johnny Greenwood in that band. And, of course, easy to forget him. He kind of fades in the background a little bit, but you got a brother dynamic in Radiohead. Going back to the 60s, of course, you got the Kinks. They might be my second favorite brother band. I mean, Ray and Dave Davies, famously combative.

You got the Beach Boys, of course. You've got CCR. You've got the Allman Brothers Band. I mean, it's right in the title band. Going into 80s and 90s, indie rock. and alternative rock, you've got the Jesus and Mary chain, you got screaming trees.

Good pick. You got the breeders, got two sisters in the same band, identical twin sisters even. Guided My Voices for a time has had Robert Pollard's brother Jim in the band. So that's a brother band.

And then I also got to shout out the fiery furnaces. The brother's sister duo there. And that's a very interesting dynamic. They were sort of like what the white stripes were pretending to be in terms of being brothers and sisters. Brother and sister, that's what the fiery furnaces were. So, yes, a rich history of siblings in music and playing in the same band.

I would love to hear more about Jim Pollard. I mean, I trust your judgment on that. Like, I'm sure there's been like a billion different brothers who have like passed through the ranks and guided my voices. But Jim, I still love the fact that it's Jim. Yeah. It's like Robert. Oh, yeah. brother Jim, sure.

I mean, he was like a pretty important part of like their early days and he would come in and out of the band. I mean, but he's co-written songs with, with Robert. And when I did my oral history of alien lanes, I wanted to interview Jim Pollard and I couldn't get him. He was really the only crucial person that I couldn't get either on the phone or via email. I mean, I think my impression of Jim, Jim Pollard is that he is even more Ohio guy than Robert Pollard is. like even more just jock, beer drinking

regular dude type person and that's probably why he didn't want to talk to the media. Doesn't trust the media, I'm sure. And hats off to him. I respect the decision. We've now reached the part of our episode that we call Recommendation Corner where Ian and I talk about something

that we're into this week. Ian, want you to go first? Yeah, so we've covered the, Remembersome Guys beat. We've also covered the Remembersome Ladies' beat. And somewhere in the middle of that is the band Women. They were a Calgary band from 2008-2010. Public strain is probably a future in the EKS Hall of Famer.

But, you know, they notably broke up. I don't think there were brothers in that band, but they were very combative group. And they splintered into preoccupations. And the project that I'm talking about today in Recommendation Corner, which is Cindy Lee. So I want to make sure I get this correct. it is the women frontman Patrick Flago performing in drag. You know, it's like kind of this 50s, 60s, like, girl group sort of persona. So they have this new project out.

It came out this week called Diamond Jubilee. It was supposed to be a triple record, but now it's just a double album. It's not on streaming. You can hear it on YouTube or buy it from their GeoCities page. Wow. Yeah, I know. This is like for the real. heads. Also, if you know where to find it, there's like a download link going on, but it's waves.

And so that means it's like 1.8 gigs. But what this album does, it's like a real, it's a real trip. It's a real immersive album. It goes through like a bunch of eras of, you know, like pre-beetles rock, like 50s pop, girl group, but there's also 70s psych music. There's soul. There's low-fi. All done up with the production aesthetic that you might remember from women album. it's a real throwback to like 2010 stuff like early unknown mortal orchestra or dirty beaches if you want to remember some guys yeah we're we're taking it there and dumb dumb girls even and i mean it's been a couple days i'm like nowhere near getting to the bottom of this record and it's also like pretty unwieldy, but I respect the audacity of it.

If any of the things that I just said sound even remotely interesting, you'll love it. I'm very curious to see if it gets like some sort of, you know, critical bump because I know that there are some places that absolutely love this project. It's just, and it's, but it's just so unwieldy, but like, I just got to respect the hell out of it. It's a real fun listen. Man, dirty beaches. Now that's a name I have not heard.

in a long time. You know, a band I was listening to a lot this week, and this is another just like late aughts throwback, Blitz and Trapper. Oh, yeah. I went through a real blitz and trapper phase. I'm still kind of in it. Like, their album, Fur, great record. Really good.

And there's some other albums from around that time that I like a lot, too. But that's not going to be my recommendation corner this week. I'm actually going to squeeze two albums in. I guess I've already squeezed in three. But I just want to do a quick shout out to the phosphorescent record that's out today. It's called Revelator. It's the first phosphorescent record in six years. And look, if you've listened to phosphorescent, you know what they are. It's this combination of folk, Americana, and electronic music. Very beautiful. This record is in

that same vein. If you like Boucho, you like Sel Avie, you're going to like this record. It's in that wheelhouse. It's a really pretty album. I also want to talk about an album called Life on the Lawn. This is by a band called a country western, and they're from Philadelphia. As we were saying earlier, saying a band from Philadelphia isn't terribly descriptive, but I would say that if Philly Band is a genre, then this is a total Philly band. I mean, they are just making good, old-fashioned guitar-based indie rock. You got a little bit of that 90-slacker rock influence. You can hear some pavement in here.

You can hear some Yola Tango in there. Some got to my voices. and look, they're just working that sound really well. Not remaking the wheel by any means, but this is an album I've been listened to a lot this week. I think it's a really good album. It's one of the better albums in this vein that I've heard lately, and look, we talked about this recently

when we were talking about Waxahatchie. This is the kind of album that people might say in a somewhat derogatory way is just musical comfort food. But I would argue that because there are so many bands trying to make this kind of record, that if you can make a record like this and have it stand out at all, you've actually done something really difficult. And I think that they pull it off with this album. I've been enjoying it.

Again, the band is called A Country Western, not to be confused with Country Westerns, which is a band from Nashville. This is A Country Western. The album is called Life on the Lawn. Yeah, this album has a house on the cover, so you know I'm going to like it. And it reminds me a lot the cover of, you want to remember some guys, Andrew Cedar Mark,

the former guitarist from Titus Andronicus, released a couple of good records, specifically Home Life. Check that album out. It's a pretty similar cover. Kind of similar sound too, but yeah, this is a good record.

Man, we dropped like seven or eight recommendations in the recommendation corner here from the past and the present. So you got a lot to listen to this weekend. Thank you all for listening to this episode. episode of Indycast, we'll be back with more news, reviews, and hashing out trends next week. And if you're looking for more music recommendations, sign up for the Indie Mix Taped newsletter. You can go to Uprocks.com backslash indie, and I recommend five albums per week, and we'll send it directly to your email box.