Indiecast - New Albums By Bon Iver, Soccer Mommy, and Laura Marling + Is It Better To Put Out Music on Tuesday or Friday?

Episode Date: October 25, 2024

Steven and Ian open this week's episode with some Halloween discourse, which unexpectedly dips into some Kindergarten Cop discourse (1:43). Then they turn to the Fantasy Albums Draft (11:23), which includes two new releases on Steven's team, Soccer Mommy's Evergreen (15:45) and Laura Marling's Patterns In Repeat. They also talk about the careers of both artists, and the state of 2010s era singer-songwriters in the mid-2020s. They also discuss the upcoming Tyler The Creator record, which drops on Monday, and the benefits of putting out music during the week rather than right before the weekend (24:01). From there, they talk about the recent Bon Iver EP Sable, which is the most straightforward music he's ever made, and his influence on contemporary artists (32:58).In the mailbag, they address a listener question about cover songs. How many is too many? Does Vampire Weekend tip into "too many territory" on their current tour (42:22)?In Recommendation Corner, Ian stumps for electronic artist Kelly Lee Owens and Steven talks up the Nashville trio Styrofoam Winos (48:52).New episodes of Indiecast drop every Friday. Listen to Episode 212 here and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. You can submit questions for Steve and Ian at [e-mail], and make sure to follow us on Instagram and X (formerly Twitter) for all the latest news. We also recently launched a visualizer for our favorite Indiecast moments. Check those out here.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Indycast is presented by Uprocks's indie mixtape. Hello, everyone, and welcome to Indycast. On the show, we talk about the biggest indie news of the week, review albums, and we hash out trends. In this episode, we talk about new albums by Bonnie Bear, soccer mommy and Laura Marling. My name is Stephen Hayden, and I'm joined by my friend and co-host. He's going as a negative pitchfork review for Halloween. Ian Cohen, Ian, Ian, how are you? So in honor of the 20th anniversary of Jimmy Eat World's Futures, which took place last Saturday,

obviously a very important landmark for me, I revisited the pitchfork review of Futures, a 3.0 from Mark Hogan, and he called Futures like a rotten onion, revealing layer upon layer of foulness. So I think that's the one I'm going with. By the way, like Mark's my dude, but I just think it's funny that he was writing this kind of stuff. and he's usually the guy you go to to like write a 7.8 for a Tweed pop record. Yeah. I think you should go as the camp review. 1.6.

Or this flattered burrito of a centipede hurts. That'd be amazing. I think that that costume would strike fear in the hearts of indie musicians everywhere. Maybe you could go as a 8.0 emo album review that didn't get a best new music. That could be your costume. Yeah. I'm going to just wear the... the red flannel I already own and the red telecaster, which I already own.

And, you know, I got two capos. I'm ready to go with that. So are you going to wear a costume this year? What are your plans in that regard? Yeah, I mean, I'm going, I get, okay, I'm like reframing in the therapeutic way. I get to wear a costume to work. And like, if it wasn't for my job, I don't know if I would have worn one real Halloween costume in like the past 15 years.

There was one year in 2019 where I dressed up as a zero t-shirt era, Billy Corgan. I had like the bald head and the silver pants. Nice. Yeah, other than that, it's like strictly a work thing. And I can't say what I am being this year because one of my coworkers learned that I have a podcast after like four and a half years of us talking about music. By the way, she knows that because I sent her your Tom Petty list. Oh, nice.

Tom Petty fan. So it's kind of a surprise what we do at work. We all show, it's got to be a surprise because we dress up as teams. But yeah, if it weren't for work, I don't. And, you know, the process of buying items on Amazon that I'm going to wear and then return on November 1st. I don't think I'd wear a Halloween costume like in the past 15 years. I don't live in a place where there are a lot of kids or trick-or-treaters. You know, I celebrate Halloween just for the candy, but as like an actual process of dressing up and doing things. It's just not for me. So I dress up more as an adult that I did as a kid because I was raised by a single mom who did not take us trick or treating. So I didn't do that as a kid, which when I tell people that, it's like I, it's like I'm telling them that

I had cancer as a kid or something. Like they get very sad when I say that. And it is kind of sad, but it was just the way I grew up. I didn't even know what I was missing. I didn't know how to swim and I didn't know how to trick or treat. Those are the two big aftershocks of being raised by single mom. All of you people raised by single moms, you probably have similar blind spots because our poor mothers, you know, they're working 40-hour weeks. There's only so much they can do. So I understand.

But I dress up more as an adult because of my kids, either because I'm going trick-or-treating with them or because you're at the house, you're handing out the candy. and I haven't decided on a costume yet, but there's one costume I want to do, and it's a little obscure, but have you seen the movie Kindergarten Cop? 30 years, or 35 years even. So for those who don't know, Kindergarten Cop, a movie, I think it came out in 90. That sounds about right. Starring Arnold Schwarzenegger as an undercover cop who goes to a school, I think it's in Oregon or maybe Washington. because I'm trying to remember the plot here,

because the plot's very important here. He's going to the school because there's a kid whose dad is like this evil guy, and they're trying to catch the dad, and they think they're going to go grab the kid. But they don't know who the kid is. It's weird because I just re-watch this movie with my kids, and I don't really remember.

I already forgot about the plot, because it's really just about Arnold Schwarzenegger being with a bunch of like six-year-olds. And, you know, he says, it's not a tumor. Yeah, I was about to say, that's the it's not a tumor movie. Right. That's the iconic line. But it's just Arnold Schwarzenegger with a bunch of kids.

And like, there's a kid in the class that says, boys have penis, girls have vagina. Yeah, I remember that. Like he says that about 15 times. So you get what this thing is. But in the movie, you know, it's this kind of fun family movie. And then at the end, the bad guy comes. and because he's going to kidnap his son and he sets the school on fire and then he grabs his

son and he holds a gun to his head running around the school and then he gets blown away the kid or the bad guy? The bad guy gets blown away. It's like just an insane ending. I mean this is what movies were like in the 90s. You know, we couldn't just have a fun family movie. Schwarzenegger. It's like, well, he's the biggest action star in the world. So we have to have this stupid plot that nobody cares about and then have it end just with unnecessary violence.

You don't ever need to see a guy hold a gun to a kid's head in a family comedy. It's just the ridiculous thing. Anyway, this is a very long convoluted setup to my costume. I want to go as the bad guy. It from kindergarten cop. Because if you see in the movie, he's played by this actor Richard Tyson, who has been like in a bunch of movies. I think he's like a dumb and dumber. And he always has small roles, but he's like this weirdly intense, just total weirdo guy. And in the movie, he wears this like boxy gray suit, like an Arsenio hall suit. And then he has like a ponytail.

And so anyway, I want to go as that guy. That was the longest setup to explain my Halloween costume. him, but I want to go as that guy. Maybe I'll get a fake gun and I'll hold it to my kids' head. But just, you know, not a real gun, just a fun. For fun, you know? Because that's what people do in family comedies. I love how you're going to have to tell that story to every single person who doesn't

immediately recognize this tertiary character in a 1990s movie. It's like, yeah, you're just a random guy in an Arsenio Hall suit with a ponytail. It's like, well, no. Have you seen the movie kindergarten cop? And then it'll be like a 10 minute explanation for that. By the way, like my son, who's 12, he wants to watch the movie Halloween this year. Yeah, I think so. It's going to be his first movie, though, with Topless nudity.

So that's going to be a trip. I mean, yeah, there's the stabbings and all the murder, but there's also going to be naked breasts there. So that's going to be, I don't know. I don't know. It's kind of like watching nudity with your parents, except it's the other way now. Now I get to experience, because when you see a sex scene with your parents, it's so awkward. Now, he's going to have that with me, but then I get the experience the parent side, which is equally awkward.

Circle of Life. I was going to say, too, have you gotten the new Cure album yet from a publicist? I have not, but a lot of people have, and boy, we really miss the boat not picking that for our fantasy draft. It's like got it. It's, it might beat brat. Yeah, it's coming out the day after Halloween, November 1st, which Robert Smith. Yeah. He knows the assignment.

First album from them in what, like 16 years? Yeah, since 413 Dream in 2008. I saw them, I think, perform at Coachella. It was either 08 or 09, but it's been a long-ass time. There's, like, Robert Smith has, like, threatened to drop three, I threatened And it sounds like a threat from it. It's like, yeah, I'm going to release three albums in a year. And already he's talking about the next two.

But this one's real. It's coming out. A lot of people have heard it. There have been two singles that have been dropped so far that have been like extremely well received. Yeah. I mean, he's just going for the old school disintegration sound. Good for him. I mean, what else do you want from Robert Smith in 2024?

I've only seen one review. I saw The Guardian gave it five. stars and they said Best Cure album since disintegration which you know I don't know what that. Really they're saying it's better than Wish. Yeah which I don't know if that could be true. Yeah wish is fucking awesome. Yeah I'm a little

skeptical of that but it's like okay. I'm like I was like when I was 20 years old that's when Blood Flowers came out the last time Robert Smith said yeah this is like our completion of the pornography disintegration trilogy.

And I look back on it. It's like total fan service, pretty much like everything they've done since Wish. But I love how, you know, since we haven't gotten like a new YouTube best album since Octung Baby or a new REM album, Best and it's Automatic for the People, the Cure, playing this role. It may be, I doubt it's better than Wish, but if it's their best album since Descina or Blood Flowers, I mean, I guess that's only two albums. But I don't know. That one they did with Ross Rock.

Robinson had a really good song. I imagine we're going to do a cure episode in the not too distant future. But I haven't gotten the album yet. I've heard the two songs and I heard them debut a couple of songs which sounded new on the most recent tour. So I have a pretty good idea of what these songs are like. It's like all like eight minute songs with six minute intros. Right, which again, sign me up. That sounds great. Come on, publicist. Hit your boys up. Here. Seriously. Come on.

Like, who are you sending this to? Like, the Guardian people? Who cares? Yeah. Who cares? I'm just, I, I always trash English publications on this show. I should, I, look, obviously people care about the Guardian. But come on.

Hit up Indycast or else I guess we'll just do it the week after. Yeah. We'll have to wait until it comes out. But I'm excited to hear that album. You mentioned the fantasy draft. Neither one of us picked the Cure album. However, I did pick two albums that are out today. Evergreen by Soccer Mommy and Patterns in Repeat by Laura Marling.

And this fell pretty much as I would have expected. Soccer Mommy currently has an 80. And I'm hoping it holds there because I think there's only three reviews posted at the time that we're recording. I feel like this album screams like 7.8 to me. for pitchfork. I don't, 7.6 to 7.8. I think it's,

it would be my prediction for that. Laura Marling, 9, I'm sorry, 91 from Metacritic so far, mostly British publications chiming in. And she's money in the bank as far as the British reviewers go, which I expected.

Still, one point lower than blood incantation, like your pick. That has a 92 currently. Moved up. Godspeed. did as well. So we're getting those residual, residual bumps, garbage time points. I don't know, man. I don't know. I'm not feeling good. I'm not feeling good about this. God damn it. I'm like the

goddamn jets. I'm the goddamn jets and you're the, you're the chiefs, man. Yeah, I would, I would love to know who the Devante Adams is in this scenario. Maybe it's like you try to convince me to let you pick the cure or something like that. Yeah. God damn it. Well, Have you listened to these albums, by the way, soccer mommy and Lauren Marling? Not Laura Marling. I've seen the reviews of Laura Marling, and you're right in that, like, a 91 is expected. I was audibly upset when you stole that one for me. But I'm looking at the reviews, and it says it's one of her finest records and stunningly intimate,

which I feel is the sort of thing people say about every single Laura Marling album. Yeah, there's not any, like, impersonal Laura Marling album. You know, there's no like, oh, this is huge sounding and, you know, not intimate. I feel like she just, that's her zone. Studyingly intimate. That's her genre of music. Very accomplished as well. It's one of her finest of like her eight or whatever records and very accomplished.

The other ones like they got maybe 80% of the way there in terms of accomplishment. I love most accomplished. That is definitely, that is like one of the most obvious. Yeah. I'm trying to hit word count adjectives in the music critic bag. You've never dropped an accomplished in an review? Oh, I've done it all the time. Oh, yeah, yeah.

I'm not absolving myself on it. I know the tricks because I've done it myself. If you're writing about a wily veteran artist, you've got to drop the accomplished in there somewhere. This is like the seventh album in the catalog, because you're running out of things to say. And you can tell in these Laura Marling reviews, it's like, yeah, it's Lord Marling. It's good. She's intimate. And it's stunning.

And she's, you know, like, what else are you going to say? Yeah. And she's, and like, look, not to be blasey about this, because I think she is, I'm a fan of her work. I like her records. She, we talked about Nick Cave a few months ago. She is, in a lot of ways, like a British female Nick Cave in terms of just her consistency and how you can just bank the good metacritic score for anything that she does. I mean, I don't know this, because I've heard the record, and I like the record.

I don't know for me if it is more accomplished than her other records. It feels like it's in the zone of what she's doing. I tend to prefer the records she put out in the 2010s. I mean, she put her a record in 2015 that I think is actually maybe for her a little underrated, a short movie. I think that's quite a good record. It doesn't get talked about as much maybe as some of her other records. Maybe that's only like an 89 on Metacritic, I don't know.

But yeah, I think it's a good record. But you're right. I mean, you do run out of adjectives at some point when you're writing about the same artists all the time. Yeah, it's like you say it's their most accomplished album, one of her most finest. And yeah, good C in three years with the same exact review. But yeah, Sakharami, I have heard almost like a singles artist at this point. Like her albums do tend to make your end list pretty frequently and pretty high up. but I remember them in retrospect as having a couple really, really good singles and just kind of soccer mommy music, all caps, in that it's well crafted and not all that distinguishable from like the 10,000 other acts.

It sounds just like her. I thought the last time was a pretty massive letdown because she was working with one Otricks Point never. And aside from like a couple of like things that would compare to like late 90s electronic albums were like better than Ezra would have like, you know, trip hop beats. It really wasn't all that different. This one sounds like a return to form quote unquote. It sounded fine, but it more makes me wonder whether her and, you know, artists of that ilk who emerged in 2017 or so are like entering their like post-trouble will find me type era where they are like you said, kind of slide it into the B slot, like, you know, polite 80s, things like that where they're just like kind of establishment rather than like headliners maybe i'm wrong but

well i mean that for the national that's like a huge period in their career at least commercially so you know i know what you mean though in terms like where people start to feel like okay like it's good but it's not set in the world on fire i mean the interesting thing was with by the way that record you were talking about with uh opian uh is called sometimes forever came out in 2022. And it did feel like that record was her trying to maybe go to a different level in terms of making music that is like genuinely popular, crossing over to maybe more of a pop world. And like you said, I feel like that record came and went. And maybe, you know, it was still in that like post pandemic era. Like we were just kind of coming out of that a little bit. But it was like,

just like those like 2020, 2020, 2021, 2020, it's like a weird time to put out music. So maybe it got swallowed up there. But yeah, I mean, this new record, which again is called Evergreen, it does feel like a bit of a correction maybe from that where she's

going back to that Cheryl Crow 90s type sound. And, you know, I've always felt this way about her records where when I hear them, you know, talking about like clean or like color theory those early albums like when they're on i'm like oh this is pretty good again it's in that like adult contemporary lane like not just charl crow

but really getting deep into the weeds like into the duncan chic hell yeah like sean colvin you know lane Sean Mullins maybe let's uh let's uh you know maybe early john mayor yeah where i feel like there's artists that go in that lane but a lot of the time there's like a little bit of a wink, a little bit of acknowledgement of like, yeah, these are corny touchstones, but we're having fun with it. Whereas with soccer mommy, there's none of that. There's no irony with it. It is almost like a straight up replication of that kind of sound. And like, look, I have a soft spot for a lot of, barely breathing. Come on, man. Hit me with that at the CVS. I love that song. I love that song. But I don't know.

There's something about her records where I always feel. like, yeah, this is good, but it never goes into the great territory. And obviously, critics disagree with that because those early records were quite critically acclaimed. But I don't know. I, like, listen to this album. You mentioned her being a singles artist. What was the single from this record? I'm trying to remember, like, look. It was M. I think that was the name of it. M. And there's also a song called Driver. Right. that I've been hearing on my local NPR-ish station that plays new songs. You know, like every city has a station like that.

I've heard Driver quite a bit on that station. And that's a good song. It's a good song for that format, which again is like the modern adult contemporary format. But yeah, I don't know. She never, I don't think she's ever been like great. I think she's always been good. but I don't find myself

like yearning to hear this record when it's not on. It's like, oh, this is pretty good? And it's gone. It's like, okay. I will say this for Clean though. Like Circle the Drain is maybe one of the best singles of the decade.

I love that song. And Clean is a record that ages really, really well. Not because it like advances the genre in any real way, but when you hear so many other artists who sound like, 80 to 90% like that and can't hit it. It's sort of like with always where there was just

deluge of bands who were just trying to kind of sort of sound like always and then you look back on that record. It's like, oh, wow, these are actually like really great songs. That like actually excellent. I think that I feel that way about clean. Not so much about a color theory or the one that came out in 2022. I mean, it's, yeah, it just reminds me of like, you mentioned Duncan Sheik or Sean Colvin like the sort of albums I'd buy in CD back in 1998 and I'd grow to love more than way way way more than I expected just because I listened to them so much. Yeah. Yeah. It's but you know I think that it's kind of hard to have that sort of mindset in the current day because there aren't like huge singles on MTV. You can't

like in retrospect say oh dizzy up the girl that was actually quite a banger beat but like Because like nowadays, I think the album format is really what we talk about. So soccer mommy, good and not great, but like it takes a lot to be great. Yeah. And it's, you know, we've talked about this on the show before, but it's always fascinating to see a generation of artists as they age and to see who fades a bit and who continues to go on. Like you mentioned the national, you know, people can disagree on the quality of their

post, Trouble Will Find Me Work, but they've clearly gone the distance. You know, there's other artists from their time that you don't even remember. Like maybe they had two or three albums and then they start to fade a little bit and then they break up or they go away. Like I want to say the Walkman would be a contemporary of the National that faded a bit. I don't think that's a totally fair comparison because I think the Walkman have a lot of partisans out there. And I'm a Walkman fan, so I would include myself in that. But, you know, again, if you're going to, if you want to say that, like, Phoebe Bridgers is the national, is soccer mommy, like, the Walkman?

As far as that, like, singer-songwriter movement of the late 2010s, that was so big. Yeah, I don't know if that's true, but it's something worth observing a little bit. It feels right. And also, like, we'll always have the moment of Bernie Sanders saying the name Soccer Mommy, I think, during 2020 during those campaigns. You got to hear him say, rap boys, enjoy. Manor and soccer mommy. Real moments. Can you do a Bernie Sanders impression if I'm saying soccer mommy?

I have, it's like that Simpsons lines like Bart, Krusty has a bad back and laryngitis so he won't be saying anything or doing anything. I'm just not as like, I'm too self-conscious to do the accents like you do. See, I can't do it because I feel like it would become offensive if I think. It would turn. It would be anti-Semitic. Yeah, exactly. We turn into a caricature pretty quickly and I'd get in trouble.

So I'm not going to go there with that. Well, speaking of something you just were talking about how it feels like a lot of albums fade or artist fade. Before we get to Bonnie Vera, I wanted to bring this up because one album that's not coming out today is the new title of the creator record. What was this? Chomacopia? Chromacopia? Chromacopia. Yeah, I think I misspelled it in the outline. I spelled it as chomacopia, but it's called chromocopia.

If you got any odd future heads like in the chat, like, hit us up. I don't think we've done a lot of odd future talks, so I don't know if our audience will, like, hit us up on that flub. But I think it's chromocopia. Yeah, it is chromocopia. Again, I was typing quickly this morning before I had some caffeine. It's not coming out today because it's coming out. on, I think it's coming out, is it coming out on Tuesday? No, it's coming out on Monday.

The 28th, I think, so I think it's a Monday. Yeah, it's coming out on Monday. And I wanted to bring this up, not so much to talk about the record, because I don't think either one of us have heard this album yet. No. But I just wanted to talk to you a little bit about release dates. Because, I don't know, maybe people don't remember this. If you're a younger person, you might not have been caring about music when this was true.

but music used to come out on Tuesdays. And then I think it was sometime in the 2010s. I want to say it's 2015, because I think Taman Paul's current is like the album where I distinctly remember it changing. It's probably not that date specifically, but that is the album I associate with the shift. Okay, so about 10 years ago, let's just say the streaming era, it's been true that music comes out on Friday. And I remember years ago, I wrote a column complaining about this and talking about how I think it was better when music came out on Tuesday.

And the argument I made was that it actually allows albums to live a little bit longer because album comes out on Tuesday and people, you know, the reviews obviously come out before the record is released. But then it comes out on Tuesday and you can have a conversation about it because we're all, talking. It's during the week. And certainly in the media, you know, I feel like it was easier to talk about records after they came out because you weren't going into the weekend. It was like a Wednesday or a Thursday or a Friday. So certainly from a media perspective, I think, putting albums out on Tuesday, I think it kept them visible longer. Whereas when an album comes out on Friday, you know, you have all the reviews that come up before. People hear the record.

It comes out on Friday. And then you go into the weekend immediately. And by Monday, we're resetting for the next albums. And the records that just came out, they just get pushed to the side. And like that weekend is such a just discourse black hole. Everything just disappears once you hit Saturday and Sunday. Anyway, so I wrote this column. And I actually got some blowback from it from readers.

And I realized that I was making a very medium. e-centric argument. And at least from the people that I heard from, they seem to be saying, we actually like it when it comes out on Friday because now we have all these new albums to listen to going into the weekend, like when we're hanging out with friends or family, cookouts, walks, whatever.

So I don't know. I don't know what your opinion on this is. I mean, based on the response to that column, my sense was that a lot of people feel like coming out on Friday is better. because they have all this free time now to listen to all this new music. Whereas me as a, you know, working in the music writer salt minds, I have a skewed perspective on it, maybe. Do you have any feelings on that?

I mean, before I get into that, I first got to say that, like, this is the most excited I've been for a Tyler the Creator album maybe ever because I'm, like, thinking that this is maybe where people start to turn on him a bit, where he starts to, like, be come old head shit, like run the jewels three or like big toe, big toe rehab Eric ghost face. Because like I was shocked how low he was on pitchforks list. But like I've seen it so many times where, you know, a new generation plants their rap flag. And, you know, whether it's Wu-Tang, whether it's run the jewels, whether it's, you know, ASAP mob, like that stuff gets relegated to old head shit.

And I don't think the new single did all that well. But, yeah, because like the new editor of pitchfork is like 14 years. old. So for him, like he was born the year that they were on family or bastard or bastard or whatever it was came out because that was 2010 or whatever. Or Goblin. Goblin was 2011. But yeah, but as far as like Tuesday versus Friday, like I'm sure there was a reason for Tuesdays. I always thought it was cool when you could read the review on Monday and then get kind of hype to like listen to it on Tuesday. I do think that's something I would like to see again, especially as we get advances and like no like it's the who gives a shit anymore like publish the review

two weeks ahead of time like that gets people hype um but yeah for me personally as a music listener i feel like i'm a music listener more so than a critic these days i do like the friday uh release date because you know i can let all the stuff i need to listen to pull up and do my notes and you know go driving and so forth as a listener it is very much like friday um i'm I don't know if there was like a strategic, what, like, what was the strategic reason for a Tuesday? Was there one, like, from an industry standpoint? I feel like you would know this. I mean, I'm going off, there is a, I think it's related to, like, record company shipments.

Yeah. Like, when, like, the CDs and the vinyl would get to a store. That was just the day that made sense to drop it off. And I think there's probably something, too, about, like, when you were selling records, you know, to have it during the work week was probably like a bigger deal. Whereas with streaming, that's not as big. It doesn't really matter. Yeah.

It is more just, you know, that comes out the same day, movies come out. But, you know, like books still come out on Tuesday. So I think it's related to like shipments. Gotcha. In some way. But yeah, again, I, because I do think that the media argument does explain why albums don't last as long, or at least it's part of the explanation. Because like you said, in the old days, Monday, you'd have these reviews of records that were

coming out the following day. And that just queued it up for like, okay, we're going to have a week where these are the records we're going to talk about. It's going to be all week. And like listeners were on the same page as the media. Whereas now people are reading about records all week long or maybe for like two weeks that they haven't heard yet. and then by the time they hear it,

the media has already said everything they're going to say, and then you have the black hole of the weekend, and then you reset on Monday, and they talk about all this other stuff. So, and obviously the media is not the be all end all. Social media matters, and actually this year, I think, I feel like we've seen more records last longer than normal.

Obviously, most records just disappear immediately, but I feel like there's been like a good handful that have hung around. Certainly, certainly like Brat is the most obvious example. I think Manning Fireworks in the indie realm is a record that's hung around. Now he's on tour, so MJ Lenderman's on tour, so that's hung around. I think there's others. I can't remember them right now, but I don't know. And that's a reflection of people loving those records.

So that's like an organic type life, giving to those albums. Yeah, as we're recording, they just announced the Prima Vera Festival lineup and Charlie XX, Sabrina Carpenter and Chapel Rhone, our headlining. I mean, those are like the big three this year of albums that are just being discussed,

artists that are being discussed, but also the albums. So maybe there are records that stuck around more or maybe, yeah, but I do miss just Tuesday from a, purely selfish perspective, but also like the, uh, the, it also gives me the capability to review albums later than they came out. Like, I'm just about to turn in a review of an album that came out three fucking weeks ago. And I don't think that would have been, uh, possible in 2014. So I

materially benefit from this new, uh, paradigm. Well, speaking of albums that, uh, came out a week or so ago and that we're talking about a little bit late, let's talk about the new EP released by Bonnie Bear called Sable. This came out last Friday. It's four songs, although one of the tracks isn't really a song. It's like 12 seconds. I love that he just made that a separate track as opposed to just attaching it to the next song.

And I want to talk about this with you quick because one, I actually quite like this EP a lot. And so I want to talk about it for that reason. And also, I'm just curious how you feel Bonnie Bear. Veyr, like, where he's at right now. Like, what's the state of Bonny Vair? Because I was thinking about that listening to this EP. And it's interesting because, you know, the stock comment to make about this EP is that

it's a return to form, meaning that it is reminiscent of the early Bonny Bear records for Emma Forever Go and then the Blood Bank EP that came out after that. And I think what people mean is that this is more of a, like, folk. record, folk pop record. But I'm going to quibble a little bit with the return to form phrase because I actually

feel like this EP is like even more straightforward than those early records. Like this is the most straightforward music. I think Justin Vernon has made, at least as Bonnie Vair. Like he's singing in his normal register. I'm saying normal in quotes.

I mean, he's not doing the falsetto. Singing in his lower register. He's basically just a guy playing guitar on a lot of these songs. And there's like very little sonic manipulation going on. I mean, there's like a little bit, but it's like as close to regular singer-songwriter music as Vernon has made under this moniker. And it just reminded me how influential Bonnie Bear has been. Because there are so many singer-songwriters now that are doing the sad boy nature. guy thing, you know, and they aren't as adventurous as Bonnie Vare, but they are definitely

taking a vibe from, again, those early records in particular. And it just made me think like, you know, I don't know what Justin Vernon is at with Bonny Vair. I mean, he's hinted, like for years, I feel like at this point, of just putting this project to the side and maybe making music under some other guys. I mean, he's obviously worked with, with lots of people and he's had different bands and all that. But if he wanted to, he could make a record where he's like inviting Zach Brian to come on a track or like even like Post Malone. And I'm sure those dudes would show up to O'Clair with Bells on to record with Vernon.

I have no doubt in my mind. He could make just a sellout record. a total sellout record bring Noah Kahn get his ass in there all those people all those singer songwriters who do like just

bang up numbers on Spotify and I think he could just sell out so hard if that's what he wanted to do but I don't know I mean I'm curious if he's going to continue

this direction or if this is like the last thing he ever does is Bunny Bear because they both seem like equally possible at this point. Yeah, when I was, when I saw a Boni there, but I got to know, like, do you have the tendency to, like, say Boni there as like a guy or as a band? Like, do you say like Boni Ver like, oh,

their new album or do you say his new album? I mean, I, to me, it's, it's Justin Vernon. Yeah. And even though technically it is a band, but it's, they're a band in the same way Taman Powell is a band. Right. You know, it's like, no, it's Kevin Parker. is tape Apollo. Yeah. So, I mean, when I saw them perform, because there was like eight people on the stage when they played a pitchfork festival, 2023, I want to say. I heard some whispers. It seems, ones that seem pretty legitimate that they might not ever play live again.

And I could see that, you know, just given how complicated and increasingly electronic those albums have become an abstract. And I kind of conflated that with, like you said, the possibility of Justin Vernon putting this project aside forever. Maybe, I don't know, getting back to the volcano choir or, you know, whatever, whatever else is going on. Big red machine. Big red machine. Yeah. Or gangs, like GA. Gangs.

Yeah. The shouting matches? Oh, I don't know that one. I don't know that one. All right. I don't go as deep. Keep up, obviously. Oh, man, yeah.

We can do an episode on Justin Vernon's side projects very easily. Yeah, DeArmond Edison and whatever. They had a big box at recently. But, yeah, I mean, this is someone who, and again, like, I don't want to say that he's this, like, protracted music marketing genius. But I feel like Boni Bear is, like, really bulletproof, even if he was to somehow, like, call in all the favors and get, like, you know, Taylor Swift. like to come in and post Malone because they would all show up without a fucking doubt.

The thing is though, like when I heard this out, like it didn't. I mean, it's a return to form insofar as it doesn't sound like, you know, the, like, the albums that he made where you have to like get all the wingdings and whatever to write out the song titles. But it doesn't really sound like for Emma Forever ago as well. It sounds a lot more bold. It sounds a lot more. for lack of a better term, like traditional, like singer-songwriter guy.

You could say, if I didn't know any better, you could tell me that this was someone who was boni-ve-ever influenced. And, you know, this is one is an interesting proposition for me because I'm going to go out on a limb here, and I may have mentioned this in previous episodes,

but I don't love forever, forever ago as much as you might think, or at least as much as someone would expect based on my taste and my general demographic. So, you know, I'm a bit, just like Boney Bear, Boney Vair, that album, like, oh, but like way above everything else. And I also don't love Holocene, which is probably the most old school Boney Bear song. So, you know, I like this, but like, even if I don't love I, I, I, I, or 22 a million,

I'm more excited by him completely tearing up the playbook and doing something new, each album than I am of a return to form. So if he is going to do this, I'm glad it's an EP. I love the 11-second song. I don't know. Like, why would you do that? It's certainly not contract application. But, yeah, I think that wherever things go, like, whether people put this on their

year-end list, they forget about it by next week, like, Boney Vairs, like, maybe more than any other artist of that ilk. like if you include like Vampire Weekend and Tame and Apollo like this is the A-list stuff. Their reputation I think is the most bulletproof of all because even if people don't love the later stuff, it's respectable. And so I think the most interesting thing for him would be to make that sell-out record because it would be probably the only thing that would allow people to, you know, not turn on him, but like to see things in a different light. See, I was just thinking about how if this is the end of bunny bear or if there is going to be an end to bunny bear, Justin Vernon, you have to do like a Las Waltz concert. Yes.

Where, you know, you're going to have all the side projects play. So, you know, bring in Aaron Desner. You're bringing in like Ryan Olson from gangs. You're bringing in, you know, your boys, the Cook brothers, all those people. But then you're also going to bring like Taylor Swift and Kanye. You're going to have them together on the same stage. You know, like Kanye's going to be the Van Morrison. I was about to say, he's the Van Morrison and the Neil Young combined.

And maybe Taylor's like the Dylan showing up. But yeah, then to have all these other, you know, just Spotify singer-songwriter show up, has Zach Bryan show up. He's like the Neil Diamond, you know. Just having it at the Riverside Theater in Milwaukee, be a beautiful thing, man. And look, you don't even have to give me credit for this idea. Just do it. Do it on Thanksgiving, maybe 20, 25.

If you're going to retire Bunny Vair, go out with a bang. That's how I feel about it. It'd be a good thing. Yeah, that's actually like a really incredible idea. Say, yeah, it just came to me. I'm like, just got to do this. The Bonnie Bear last Waltz concert. Taylor and Kanye in the same stage could happen.

All right, well, it's now time for our mailbag segment. Thank you all for writing in to the show. It's great to hear from our listeners. You can hit us up at Indycast Mailbag at gmail.com. Ian, you should read this one because it's also one of your fellow dogs fans writing in. That's right. This is from Brian from Athens, Sycambe, woof, woof, go dogs. It's funny because my in-laws are moving to Athens, Alabama.

And then here are a good source. This is Athens, Ohio, which is where Ohio University is from. Shout to Chris DeVille. And there's in Athens, Alabama as well. which is where I think Brittany Howard is from of the shapes. And this dude wrote in before Georgia B. Texas, too. That's fucking right. Must have been barking his head off last weekend.

Yeah, like the hop-along album, Bark Your Head Off Dog. We need a new hop-along album. Are they still together or is Francis Quinlan solo artist at this point? I mean, yes, and also Joe's doing a bunch of Algernon shows. So who the heck knows? I think the world the world needs it. But anywho, Brian from Athens got a question about bands doing covers at concerts. So I think we're all cool with a band throwing out unexpected, well-considered covers in their sets.

Jason Isbell immediately comes to mind. Very Athens thing to say. But how much is too much? I love Vampire Weekend, but the news that they're doing, ironic? Covers as a big part of their set is kind of a turnoff and makes me maybe not one to pay to see that. I want more Vampire Weekend, damn it. Same reason I've never cared for the Detroit Medley at the Springsteen shows. I have to endure boring boomership to get to the good stuff at the end of the show.

So how much is too much for covers it shows and maybe what are some memorable ones you've experienced? All right. So, Brian, all due respect. It is funny to me that you would complain about the Detroit melody and then, or I'm sorry, Detroit Medley. and dismiss it as boring boomer shit. Like, look, I love Bruce Springsteen. He is boomershit. Okay, so this is all boomershit, my friend. You know?

And look, he's also, by the time he does the Detroit medley at the end of the show, he's giving you like three hours of Bruce Springsteen music. So, you know, just settle down. It's like a 10-minute thing. I think you're going to be okay. Now, regarding the Vampire Weekend set, what they're doing, it's a little misleading. you look at the set lists online.

Because what they're doing, basically, they're doing like a regular set, which is about two hours. And then they get into the encore, and if you look at the set list, there's like usually, I don't know, six to ten covers. And you're looking at that,

you're like, wow, that's like a half hour music. But the reality is that they're taking a request from the audience, and they might only be playing like 30 seconds of a particular song. They're, I think, very rarely playing an entire song. So that whole part of the set, even though, again, there's like a lot of songs listed, it may only last about 10 minutes. Again, 10, 15 minutes maybe. And having seen the tour, I think it's pretty fun. And just with Vampire Weekend in particular, they're such a sort of buttoned up band.

You know, everything is always very well considered, very impeccable. I think it's kind of fun that they actually do something Lucy Goosey a little bit in the show. So I think it's good. So I think it's I wouldn't worry about it if you're planning to see this tour. They're not actually doing all the covers. It's just a little fun thing that they're doing at the end of the show. So that's that. Personally, I really like covers. I like it when bands do that.

I wouldn't want to see all covers necessarily, but I always appreciate something different in a show, especially if I've seen the artist before. So just drop in like a surprise cover. Like when I, again, to bring up NJ. Lenderman, when I saw him play, he dropped a cover of a smog song. I was like, oh, that's pretty cool. Smog?

They're doing that. I think he was doing Werewolves of London at some of these shows. She's pretty awesome. Very in line with who he is. So I don't know. To me, it breaks up the monotony of the show. It can also give you an insight into the artist. Like, what is it that is inspiring them?

What moves them? And especially if it's sort of like a curveball cover. It's like, oh, wow, that's pretty interesting. So I'm pro covers live. I don't know how you feel about that, you know? Yeah, I mean, I think with Vampire Weekend or Bruce Springsteen these days, I think of it more as like an evening with Vampire Weekend, rather than, you know, vampire weekend touring God, only God was above us, you know.

And I just love that, like, yeah, Bruce Spring. Like, Bruce Springsteen is like boomer shit. And I guess technically speaking, maybe the Detroit melody is like, I don't know, like Martin Scorsese core or something like that. are like Joe Biden corn pop stuff. But, uh, yeah, otherwise like, um, yeah, let's go for it. Because I, I think when they're really tart, you either got to do like the vampire weekend or the Bruce Springsteen thing where it's a medley or it's like a built in part

of the show or like throw one in. I always like when, um, artists, uh, do a cover that is pertinent to the city if they happen to be in. My dream, you know, like I was always hoping that Japan droids at one point would self actualize and play Hooters and we danced in Philadelphia as a tribute. I love, you know, I also liked when they played, um, McCluskey's to hell with good intentions. That was a great cover of theirs. And they've been doing that since the beginning. Joyce Manor made, Weezers, you gave your love to me softly, a regular part of the set. So, um, I do like a cover,

especially if it's like a band that's like fun anyway. Um, yeah, I've never had an issue where there's that in between of like, oh, they're like throwing three covers in. I also like when, this happens a lot at Fest, which because it happens during Halloween thereabouts, where you'll get a band doing like a dress up and they'll like play like an entire alkaline trio album or something like that. I always like the stunt casting like that. We've now reached the part of our episode that we call Recommendation Corner where Ian and I talk about something we're into this week. Ian, want you go first? All right. So if I was more of like a knowledgeable electronic guy. I'd probably write a trend piece in 2024 about how a lot

of, you know, the regular mainstays of 2010's year end lists have undergone there. And I say this with all due respect, basic bitch phase. You can be a guy or a girl and be like kind of basic. You know, I'm putting this year's Fortet album in there, the most recent Caribou album where he a-I'd his voice to sound like a woman or the Jamie XX album. into that mini trend. I think like the real heads are kind of mad about that, but I'm actually enjoying them way, way, way more than I expected because there's less pressure.

And I'm going to include the new Kelly Lee Owens album, Dreamstate in there as well. I've really enjoyed her previous work, particularly her self-titled and the one that came out in 2020 in her song, which kind of have, they were like dream pop, but also kind of trancy electronic. And this time around, this album came out last week, it's going for like an ultra Miami, like Madonna, Circa Ray of Light, Healing Crystal, Electronica Pop thing. Where, you know, the guys I mentioned before, like they were all kind of drafting off Fred against success. This is maybe where like Peggy Goo is going. And look, it's not the most innovative thing.

It's certainly kind of a sellout record, which is fine. I think it's on George from the 1975. label. And that being said, really enjoying it. Probably going to listen to it more than, you know, the real groundbreaking electronic records. But yeah, this is just sort of like porch music for me, except it's like when I'm doing notes. So Kelly Owens' Dream State, I like this record. And also check out her older records as well. And the record she made as the history of Apple Pie from 2012. It's like this British indie pop band. real remembering some guy's shit.

I believe I wrote about that for Pitchfork. I'm looking this up quick. I think I reviewed this. Let's see. I know I did it. Let's look. I did. I reviewed it for Pitchfork, 6.7.

They had a second album. I did not know that. Yeah, wow. Yeah. And who reviewed that? Patrick St. Michelle. I'm not familiar with that byline. But anyway, Kelly Leones, I'm a fan as well. And apparently, I was not a huge fan of History of Apple Pie back then. But I got no memory of writing that, no memory of that record at all.

I want to talk about a record by a band from Nashville. They're called Styrofoam Wino's. And the record is called Real Time. And if you populate the Aquarium Drunkard Corner of, social media, you're probably familiar with this record. I've seen a lot of people talking about it. I would say that this record definitely falls into the silver Jews zone of literate, loose, and ragged countryish rock. Listening to this record, it really reminded me of recent albums. In recent, I mean, like, the last few years, there was that great record from Friendship that came out in 2022, really good Philly band. also a band called Flory, who was on my year-end list last year. Again, just really good lyrics and marrying it to this kind of like twilight, ragged, loose country rock type thing.

Very southern, but also like the brainyer side of the southern musical spectrum. I'm really trying to avoid saying M.J. Lenderman in this. recommendation because I feel like I talk about MJ Lenderman all the time, but Sterephom Wino's did tour in the past with M.J. Lenderman, and I would say if you like Lenderman, you're probably going to like this record. It's just really good songs, really good vibes, really like listening to this record, really good fall album. So check it out. It's called Real Time Bandist Sterephome Wino's. Good band. Good vibes. That about does it for this episode of Indycast.

We'll be back with more news reviews and hashing out trends next week. And if you're looking for more music recommendations, sign up for the Indie Mix Taped newsletter. You can go to uprocks.com backslash indie. And I recommend five albums per week and we'll send it directly to your email box.