Indiecast - Our Favorite Albums Of 1999

Episode Date: November 6, 2020

With Wilco’s 'Summerteeth' reissue coming later this month to (belatedly) celebrate its twentieth anniversary, Steven and Ian are looking back to 1999. While it might not have necessarily been a more innocent time, it was certainly a simpler time where teen pop and nu-metal ruled the radio waves and alternative rock was starting to become plain old indie rock.For the new episode of Indiecast, Steven and Ian revisited some of their five favorite albums from the era to determine what still holds up today. While Hyden’s top five albums walks that line between alt-rock and indie rock with albums like 'Summerteeth' and Nine Inch Nails’ 'The Fragile,' Cohen was more focused on the emo rock scene, remembering albums from Jimmy Eat World and American Football.In this week’s Recommendation Corner, Cohen the new album from Philadelphia band The Goalie’s Anxiety At The Penalty Kick. Hyden, on the other hand, is still looking to the past to sing the praises of Foxygen’s 2013 album 'We Are the 21st Century Ambassadors of Peace & Magic.'See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Indycast is presented by Uprox's indie mixtape. Hello everyone and welcome to Indycast. On this show, we talk about the biggest indie news of the week. We review albums and we hash out trends. In this episode, we're going to be talking about our favorite albums of 1999. My name is Stephen Hayden, and I'm joined by my friend and co-host, Ian Cohen. Ian, how are you? I just hope that people recognize, like, I want to call what we're doing on this episode, like, heroic.

Like we are the heroes right now because I actually watched this documentary called 537 votes, a great documentarian Billy Corbin who did cocaine cowboys, I believe, and Screwball. And it talked about the 2000 election and how that took like 35 days or longer to resolve. And I just tried to wonder, it's like, because I've been, I don't know if I've been on Twitter like constantly in the past couple of days. And I thought to myself, like, how did I get through like 2000? And I guess the answer was, A, heavy alcohol usage and B, just like caring about like bullshit. Like I voted already. I really could use a distraction like a Rolling Stone list right now.

Like, and all like I noticed that like the past couple of years like music publications or the music industry kind of shuts down a little bit more around election day. Like I need nonpolitical. right now I had already voted. Right. Like I would love to see a dumb list of some sort right now. And

I don't want to say what we're doing is dumb, but I think what we're doing is reading the national mood and recognizing that what people want to talk about is the resonance of Moby's play. Right. Well, exactly. I mean, and by the way, the reason why we're doing 1999 is that the reissue

of Summer Teeth, the landmark Wilco record, comes out to day. And of course, Summer Teeth is one of the landmark records of 1999. So we just thought, well, yeah, it would be fun to just talk about 1999 in general on this week's episode because, yeah, 2020 is pretty intense right now. I think we could all, you know, stand to hop in the time machine and go back to the last year of the 20th century, the last year before that Bush v. Gore election that you just referenced, which I think was one of the early signs that this century was going to not go that well. Let's just put it that way. It was like, yeah, that was the first election where the person

that didn't win the popular vote won the election, or at least of like modern times. And that's just become a habit, it seems like, in recent years. So excited to get into 1999. Before we get to that, of course, we have our mailbag segment. And we're getting so many great questions, by the way. And I just want to thank everyone who has written to us or, you know, shouted this out on Twitter. It's really great to hear from you. I feel like we have the smartest listeners in the podcast game. We're just getting great questions. I agree.

Thank you so much. And also the best-looking listeners in the podcast game. So thank you for that. Our question today comes from, and I'm sure I'm pronouncing this name incorrectly, Callum. It's C-A-L-U-L-L. I see that name on like the internet a lot, and I don't know anyone with that name. So I've never, like in person. So I've never actually had to say it out loud.

I haven't either. So, you know, my apologies if I'm mispronouncing it, just know that I mispronounce lots of names because I'm a moron. So it's on me, not on you. Anyway, this question, I often think about an article you wrote, this is talking to me, Steve, in 2017 about Beck, specifically the surprise some younger music fans feel when they find out how huge and innovative he was considered in his prime. I'm fascinating. by these artists who go from biggest band in the world status to diminishing if dedicated fan-based status or sometimes complete obscurity in a comparatively short space of time. Other examples could be the wallflowers, counting crows, or any number of bands that were apparently

going to save rock and roll in the 2010s. A lot of the time this change in fortunes could be blamed on a changing music industry, internal band disputes, or an evolving musical landscape that no longer cares about these bands' genres. My question is, do you guys have any artists who stand up to you as particular victims of this change of fortunes? Or are any artists that continue to amaze you at just how massive they once were? I, for one, am looking forward to the day when I have to explain to my children

why Mumford and Sons were the biggest band in the world in the early 2010s. Yes, that will be a very interesting conversation, I'm sure. Thanks, guys, and that's from column. So I have a good answer for this, I think, but I'm curious to hear what you have to say first. Who would you say, like, in our lifetime

that you remember critics were all over this band, they were really considered important and now it seems as though they've lost that status completely and like the kids can understand they don't understand why this person was considered important yeah I mean that's a great question

and also I just think it's interesting that he mentions the wallflowers and counting crows because I think it kind of splits this conversation to two ways and also Mumford and Sons because those are examples of like bands who had massive inescapable radio hits

and we're never taken all that seriously critically. I know Canning Crowe's had some pretty legendary pans back in the day. But I think what we're kind of formulating here, I think Beck was a great example because back in the 90s, he was someone who every single move was watched. Like when he did something, it was indicative of a larger trend. And I don't, I'm not sure quite yet who that is. I think that's more something you might see in hip hop. you know, like Lil Wayne right now, kind of, or like Kanye, I think that they've kind of reached that status.

But if we're talking about like rock bands, I think the answer to this one has to be Arcade Fire. Because they were, like, they were big, like headline Coachella twice type big. Like they're a band that, you know, might not be as ubiquitous as the wallflowers are counting crows back in the 90s. But nonetheless, like about as popular as you could get as an example. of an indie rock band. And honestly, I don't even know right now if they could outdraw Interpol, even though like Interpol has kind of soldiered on making these like cult, these like kind of like as kind of a cult band.

But nonetheless, I would say like Interpol's cult is larger. I think they have an aesthetic that speaks to people. Like they goth or goth or goth adjacent. Like Interpol has that lockdown. And they're big internationally too. Absolutely. They have a big following in Mexico. I mean, they announced their last record at a press conference in Mexico City.

So they'll, I think, be able to tour for a long time. Absolutely. Did you hear that arcade fire song that came out this week, Generation A? And I think this is why they came up to me because funeral, like I could have a five-episode arc about how much that record meant to me. We already did the suburbs. Neon Bible is also important. But nowadays, it's like I can be. I don't check for the Arcade Fire solo records.

And the fact that they have like a new song or like are promising a double album, like none of this interests me in the slightest. Well, I listen to their new record when it comes out. Absolutely. But even on the Reflector Tour and especially on everything now, they were kind of getting legendary for having these half-filled stadiums. And so, or hockey arenas. And I think that it'll be tough to grow.

I think if people listen to funeral, they'll be able to grasp like why they were so important or Neon Bible or the suburbs. But I also think that they're kind of kind of being an example of a band that like really fell off as opposed to a like if we're talking about like acts that were once like considered like super innovative and now are just kind of like seen as part of the like just kind of part of the periphery. That I'm not quite sure yet.

It might be someone along the lines of like grimes maybe. But otherwise like I think. arcade fires my answer as far as I mean just getting back to that song like generation A which by the way this was a song that they played on the Colbert show the late night late show with Colbert Stephen Colbert I think it was election night they played it they did awful song off speaking of speaking of fell off it's like Colbert it's like in that article you wrote about the that rally that him and John Stewart did it might be hard for people to assess like how important those two were in their particular lane.

Yeah, yeah. So anyway, my answer for this is the white stripes because they're a band that I feel like, I mean, I still feel like they're pretty popular. You will still hear Seven Nation Army in every football stadium everywhere. But I don't know, there's something about them where I feel like in the year, like, 2000, 2001, around the time of like white blood cells and then going into Elephant, I just feel like they were considered not only like a hugely popular band, but like an important band.

And like when people, for instance, compared them to the strokes, I feel like a lot of people gave the edge to the white stripes. I mean, I feel like, you know, the sort of authenticity argument that people would have, you know, certainly back then, favored the white stripes. They were a band that had a build up to being popular. They had roots in, you know, the indie rock scene of the 90s before they really blew up. But now I feel like the white stripes don't get talked about as much. And like the strokes have totally overshadowed them as far as like a band from that like return of rock movement of the early aughts. And when I talk to younger people, they tend to have like a negative impression of Jack White.

I think largely because of his solo career and how he's had all of these moments in the last several years like where he's put his foot in his mouth and interviews. And you know, he just comes off as this sort of like cranky old man reactionary essentially, which I don't think is entirely fair. Maybe this is where the Jack White Rehabilitation Tour begins On this podcast I think that to some degree He gets a bum rap from people Who are a little too hard on him

Especially like if you Set aside some of those sound bites And just like watch him perform Like he was on SNL a few weeks ago And I thought he was great I mean he's Whatever else you want to say about Jack White He's an electric live performer

I think he always sets aside Any criticisms if you just like Focus on the music But yeah I just feel like In his solo career, he's turned off, like, I think, younger generations who might not otherwise, I feel like those people might have checked out the white stripes, but because of Jack White and how he's acted, they're less likely to do that, which I think is unfortunate, because their catalog, if you're going to compare it to, like, bans of their generation, I think is as strong as anybody's.

It's certainly stronger than the strokes overall, more consistent than the strokes. And I say that as a big strokes fan, but I think it's true. It's funny because like the strokes, like Julian Casablancus has also had a very scattershot solo career. But the voids have like a young following. I mean, I know this because I've written mixed things about the voids and like very young fans have written into me. People who actually don't even care about the strokes. And but they love the voids. I mean, I think Julian Casablanca is maybe because of that, that's helped the strokes.

It seems like because the people that love the voids. I don't think it's just strokes fans. I think it is like a younger audience. Yeah, I think that because when I went, I remember going to some like festivals in 2012, 2014, there was one FYF where the strokes in Interpol were headliners, and I think this was like 13 or 14, and just amazed at the number of strokes shirts.

Because I think that, you know, compared to the white stripes, the band that was also very image conscious, the strokes have a more kind of timeless idea of cool. Like if you were to look, I think what resonated about them in 2001 and what will continue in 2015, 20. I think a younger generation will like look at them and look at their logo and say like, this is a cool band. And that will, that, there's something timeless about that. Whereas white stripes, you know, as you said, like they're weirder.

They're a little more experimental. And, you know, Jack White. But they were also more popular, I think. Like at their peak The white stripes were more popular? That's... I think so. I really think that like toward the end of their career

Oh, absolutely. Yeah. They were more popular than the strokes because they had more radio songs. I mean, the strokes window of like mainstream exposure is actually like relatively narrow. And even like, is this it? Like didn't produce songs as big as the biggest white striped songs. Like there's no stroke song as popular as Seven Nation Army or even like, even like fell in love with a girl.

I mean, like, the... Icky thump I heard a lot on the... Even Icky thump I heard on the radio quite a bit. I really think that if the strokes... I'm sorry, I think if the white stripes, you know, they break up in 2011, if Jack White didn't do anything after that, I think the white stripes would have a different image now. And in a way, I think you could argue that the white stripes would age better just because

it's a man and a woman. It's not just five dudes. and like the Meg White aspect of the White Stripes makes them maybe seem a little more progressive in a way than the strokes do. I don't know. I just feel like Jack White, because of the way he's acted

and the way he's annoyed people, that's diminished the white stripes. And also like the way Jack White bothers people, he seems like kind of a crank as far as like, you know, wanting like analog recording. Like a lot of the things he says

are like kind of boomerish, you know? Right. Like he appeals to that sort of crank sort of thing. Where as to strokes, they seem a little bit more modernized, even if they do project this kind of timeless image, you know? Yeah, even as weird as Julian Casablancus comes off in his interviews and all that stuff. He just seems cool.

Yeah, and again, I think because of the voids and some of the things he's done also just showing up on other people's records, it's just made them seem maybe, yeah, like more hip to younger audiences, I think. Or they don't take themselves. or they don't take themselves as seriously. Right. Yeah, I mean, Jack White, it's very easy to turn him into like this raucous caricature. Like, if you want to do that, he's giving you the material to do that.

Again, I don't think that's totally fair, but I think that's been true. So good question there. Thank you for that. And again, if you guys have more questions, please send them to me. My email address is steve. Dot Heiden at Uprox.com, or you can reach out to either one of us on Twitter. and we will get back to you. Let's segue to our conversation about 1999.

This is a very interesting year. As I said before, obviously, this is the last year of the 20th century. It's a year that I associate in terms of the popular culture with new metal and teen pop. I feel like those were like the two kind of big commercial genres of this era. But you also had this thing where, you know, the alt rock of the 90s was really, I think, dead at this point. And you're really seeing this ascendant form of indie rock, which is kind of replacing alternative rock in a lot of ways. I think, like, some of the records we're going to be talking about here today have, like, a mainstream appeal that isn't quite as broad as alt rock, but it's not as niche as, like, you know, the indie of, like, the early 90s or 80s. Yeah.

It's really going to be the indie that we see in the aughts, I think, starting to emerge in 1999. The sort of, like, indie that's going to be played on, like, the NPR station in your town. but isn't going to be on commercial radio, you know, but it's still going to be selling like a decent amount of records. This is also the year of like Woodstock 99 and Columbine. So you have like darkness sort of permeating on the edges of the culture. But I don't know how you feel, but like I generally have like pretty positive feelings about 1999. It seems like a more innocent time, which I, you know, it clearly wasn't because you have like school shootings going on.

You have like riots going on at music festivals. But I don't know, it does seem like the calm before like the 21st century storm when I think about this year. Yeah, I mean, it was a more innocent time because I was like also 19 years old. And at least as far as the music goes, I think that the way we're going to be talking about 1999, or at least mine, is going to be somewhat fictionalized that. Because like in 1999, if you want to talk about like why it was more innocent, like my top 10, if I were to, to make it in 1999 would just be like a bunch of like rap albums that I listened to like half of the songs like I would buy CDs for no reason whatsoever and just like I mean like I think of like silk the shockers made man or things like just these like very like frivolous purchases but at a time

where I didn't have two nickels to rub together but nonetheless like oh I heard a timbaland beats on this one I got to own this or oh Swiss beats is on that one um and I I really can't access what it felt like to spend $18 on an album that I was new. I was going to only listen to like nine songs. Right. Yeah. I mean, I feel like, yeah, that phenomenon is just so distant. It's so hard for people to grasp.

Like, wait a minute, you're going to pay, like, you don't know if this album is good or not. And you're pretty sure it's not going to be good because it's like 75 minutes long. But you're going to, you, and you are dead broke. but nonetheless you're going every two, by the way, you had to go to a record store on Tuesdays to get the new album. Although it's interesting because 99 is also the beginning of Napster. Oh yeah. So that world that you're describing of like the 18-hour CD where you're only going to listen to like, you know, a couple songs. That is also starting to come to an end this year.

So yeah, there's like changes in the air, but it still feels like, because like the internet was already existing at this time. but it wasn't as central to the world as it is now. So it still felt like you could have a life. I mean, you said this earlier, like with the 2000 election, there was no social media. So, like, it was easier in a way to kind of take yourself out of the drama of the moment and just live your life. And then you'd go home and watch cable news or something.

Yeah. That was the version of that. But it wasn't as immersive as it is now. Yeah. And I think in general, like, when I look back on 1999, as it happened with the stuff that we're going to talk about, it really does seem like a more gentle, kind of optimistic time.

Like the kind of dread of Y2K hadn't quite set in yet. I think we'll see that in like a lot of the albums that came out in the year 2000. But 1999 indie rock, that was like a big Beach Boys and Beatles sort of year. Right. Yeah. And even like that's an indie rock. But when we look at like the critically acclaimed albums

from that year when you look at like midnight vultures or moby's play as i mentioned all these things that have this kind of positive technological sheen to it um it i forgot that all these like darker things that you would mention happen in 1999 because i think in general between that and like the rediscovery of prince you know vis-a-vis viz of the 1999 um good times generally speaking yeah yeah again yeah i think you're right i mean i think that these things do take a little bit of time to seep into art, you know, because the music that we're going to be talking about, I mean, a lot of these albums were made before 1999 or early 99. And that dread that you're talking about that I think did exist in the culture at that time.

It wasn't maybe going to manifest itself until art that was coming out in the following year. Although I do think that, you know, it was already showing up in films. I mean, you had Fight Club came out in 99. You had like the Matrix came out 99. These films that were very critical of mainstream society, consumerist culture, this idea of like sort of stripping away the phoniness of the world and getting to like the truth underneath. Like that was definitely something that people were going back to time and again. But yeah, let's look at the critically acclaimed albums of this year. You've already mentioned a couple of them.

I was looking at the Paas and Jop list, the Village Voice list. Speaking of explaining to the kids, Steve, what? What is a Pazanjopolis? Well, yes, there used to be this alt weekly called The Village Voice that every year... There used to be Alt Weekly's. Now, an Alt Weekly is a newspaper that is alternative and distributed weekly, and you would see... Never mind. I mean, at some point, I mean, we're going to be mentioning a lot of old-timey things in this episode.

So the kids, you might just want to have Google ready. If there's some sort of, you know, if there's some term you don't understand, you can just Google it. We need an Indiecast explainer. Like one thing that we post on the internet that like explains like commonly used terms. So anyway, the Village Boys, there was this all weekly. They would do a poll of music critics from across the country asking them for their favorite albums. And then they would compile it into this survey called Paas and Jop. It was the most comprehensive way to figure out critical consensus in a given year.

And in 1999, the top five albums were number five, Mulever. Variations by Tom Waits, which I knew you would laugh. Never changed. Never changed. I happen to really like that record, actually. And I would say that if you are a person who has heard of Tom Waits, but you are afraid to delve into his catalog, mule variations is actually a pretty good entry point. It's like one of his more accessible records.

At times, it almost sounds like a late period Springsteen record. It kind of has like a more of like sort of like a rock. thrust as opposed to like the I guess how would you describe it drunken vaudevillian quality of Tom Waits records. Hobo core. Hobo core. Number four, the soft bulletin by the flaming lips. Circling back to our question, the flaming lips to me in a way could also fall under that

category of like bands that were once critically adored that now, I mean, I guess the flaming lips still get good reviews, but I don't know. shockingly resilient as far as like a live actor just like a presence you know like I think shockingly resilient although the quality of the music you know they put out a lot of material that I could not care about but I mean 2013's the terror that's a good album yeah yeah they you know they're pretty hit or miss the soft bulletin is is not a record that I've put on uh I can't remember the last time I listen to that record I loved it in 99 I I saw them on the Soft Bulletin Tour, which was an amazing show.

But yeah, I've definitely fallen off on Flaming Lips over the years, but maybe I'll get back into them someday. Who knows? Number three, Midnight Vultures by Beck. Beck taking it on the chin in this episode a little bit. I despise this record. Despise it. This is interesting to me because Midnight Vultures,

I feel like it's the record that, like, there's a certain kind of Beck fan who will, say that Midnight Vultures is a better record than sea change, or like his more singer-songwriter oriented stuff. Because I think his, like those records, I think there was a period where maybe his singer-songwriter records were getting better looks. And of course, I guess Morning Phase, that record, one album of the year. And that's him working in serious sea change territory.

But yeah, then there's the Beck fan who will say, no, that stuff is bullshit. the real shit is Midnight Vultures. I've personally never really connected with Midnight Vultures. I tend to find it, I find it to be kind of a sticky record. And it's one of those records where you're like, does he really like this kind of music or not? Like, is he making fun of this or is this like... I think he genuinely...

I think he genuinely enjoys it, but the problem is that it comes off like a tenacious D-type record where they truly love... D-O and whatever, but like there's a certain like 1999 irony to it. And also Jack Black, I think, was in the sex laws video, hamming it up. And Deborah, like, is just a song that if you put this, people think it's, oh, it's funny because he's singing in a falsetto and it's kind of, or like Hollywood freaks where he's like kind of doing like rap and like prince like funk. But he's like, I, I appreciate him taking chances, but it's virtually unlistenable to me. Not mostly because like this

thick 1999 irony that some would say like oh i when people say like oh nine 11 killed irony like people couldn't be ironic like i think this is what they were looking at as far as things that would age poorly and it's funny because you said oh the serious beck the one that's like grammy nomination beck grammy winning back yeah grammy win it well yeah i guess the other the most recent one or whatever it was called got the grammy nom but like ironic schicky beck that was also just as beloved. So you really can't, Beck could not lose in that time. Well, you know, and as our listener pointed out, I wrote about Beck in 2017. And one of the points of my piece was that, you know, I think Beck represented this idea of, I think it was really prevalent in the late 90s that

you could combine all these kinds of music into like one thing. And that would be the thing that made unique. Whereas I think now people do that organically. It's not something that is like sort of front-loaded into your persona that like you're this magpie type person it's just sort of a given that you're going to be combining hip-hop with rock yeah jazz and pop whereas with back that was like his whole personality basically that like hey i'm going to put blues slide guitar over a dust brother's beat and you know that's going to blow people's minds and i think the thing with beck you know my issue with him is that i feel like he's pretty good at everything but not great at any one thing.

Like, I don't think he's a great songwriter. He's not a great rapper. He's not a great singer. You know, he's pretty good at all those things. But it's almost like, if you want, like, a funky record, why listen to Midnight Vultures when there's, like, so many other examples of that kind of music that are just better than that? You know, it's almost like the general interest newspaper, you know, like how people

are like, well, why would I read the sports page when I can just go to, like, a sports website or why would I read your political page? You know, it's like, that's a very sort of 20th century thing that was outmoded once you could just go on the internet and get like the expert version of whatever you wanted. Anyway, that's my theory on Beck. Maybe we'll do a Beck episode at some point. The number two album on the Passingopolis was Magnetic Fields 69 Love Songs. I love this record.

I'll say this right now. We're going to share our top fives. from this year. This is also on my list. And this was a record I hadn't heard for a long time, and I got back into it, actually, like, right before quarantine. I was in Nashville, and I found a copy of it, and I bought it at Grimys, the Great Records Store. Great record store. I've been there, too. In Nashville. And I really loved it. I was just marveling. I mean, I love long albums.

I love big, ambitious records, and I was really knocked out by the songwriting on that record. I mean, it's just, I think, a great achievement. And I don't know if he's really come close to topping it ever since. Magnetic Fields, great band of the 90s, by the way. I think their 90s output is great, and after that, I tend to lose interest. But that is, like, I think the pinnacle of their catalog. Massive blind spot for me. I kind of don't dig his whole vibe as far as, like, being kind of this arch singer,

songwriter, but like maybe one day I'll have a magnetic fields deep dive. That's just I've never, like I've just a total blind spot for me aside from a few songs. I mean, he does have this, you know, artiste type persona, I think that can be maybe a little off putting, you know, this idea of like, I'm the modern day Cole Porter, you know, like that was his thing, I think, in the 90s. But he writes great hooks and he is a really good lyricist. So, you know, he delivers on his pretensions. So I think you have a right to be pretentious if you can back it up.

And I think he does. Talking about the Stephen Merritt of magnetic fields. Number one, and you've alluded to this already this record, Moby's play. Yeah. It's the number one record

on the Fazzen Jop list. Moby, that could have been the answer to our listener question, too. I mean, it's amazing to me. I mean, you know, putting this record at number one. I mean, this is like a pretty good record, but was this like a reactionary thing

against like early 90s indie politics in a way putting inside number one just because like this album was infamous because every song was licensed for commercials. That was like a big story with this record. I just wonder like we're critics thinking like, hey, we're going to stick it to indie snobs by putting Moby at number one.

I don't think that's it because like the interesting. thing is that Mobee at 1990, I thought like people had really turned on him because he, he was very well, like very renowned in the early 90s for his more like techno-leaning work. And then he did Animal Rights, which was kind of a rock record. I thought his like stock had really gone down. And I was kind of shocked to see how renowned play was at the time. Because it seemed to me, like even myself, 19 year old at the time, it's like this seems very safe, like kind of, troublesome at the way it uses its source material.

And believe me, they were, I don't know if they were trying to like get back at like indie-leaning ideals. I mean, but actually, I think it's worth mentioning if you look at the singles list from 1999, here are some of the songs that are in the top 10. This is like the critical brain trust. All-Star, like the smash mouth song, All-Star. That was top 10. Like critics list saw that as a top 10 song.

live in Lovita Loka and at and smooth the Carlos Santana Rob Thomas collaboration. Ball with the Baugh is number 11. People act like, you know, like critics, like trying to like put themselves in the shoes of like pop analysis is like a new thing that started in like the mid 2000s. Look back at any Pazin job from the 90s. The singles list will tell you like you do have to keep your. ear to the radio and kind of put yourself in the position of a listener. It's like, oh, yeah. No Scrubs, by the way, was the number one song of that year. Which I think is defensible. Yeah, no, that's great. That's great song. Wasn't it like smooth by Santana with Rob Thomas?

Top 10, top 10, man. Yeah, ball with the bar. Like people look at that. It's like, oh, this, like, they didn't have, I don't think, 2020 style writing. It's like, what like, what does All-Stars say about us in 1999. Like, I want to dig, maybe there's like some, if I go to micro, if I go to like the microfeish in the library and look at like the all weeklies, maybe then I'll see like a really hardcore analysis of smash mouth. I just like, I like to imagine like 1999 music critics at a screening of Shrek and hearing All-Star and them just very thoughtfully rubbing their chins. The song is trenchant. The song speaks to us. In defense of smash mouth. But I mean, what would be number one now?

Like, because I don't think that the, I don't think any of these things make the top five now. Like, what would number one be? Yeah, I mean, I was just looking at the top five. There's no women in the top five. I don't know if there were any women in the top ten. So that definitely speaks to, you know, what music criticism was like. I think Fiona was in the top ten. Yeah, the Fiona Apple record win the Pond.

Yeah, win the Pond, blah, blah. blah, blah, blah, blah. There's a bunch of words after that. Which is a great record. That's one of her, that might be her best record. It's definitely in the running for her best record. That seems like it could have a shot at number one. I was looking at other albums that came out in 99.

The Destiny's Child record, the writing's on the wall, I think that would definitely be number one, not number one, but like, or it could be number one, but certainly in the top five. I wonder, like, if the Britney Spears record, her debut Baby one more time I feel like with pop leading critics

I could see that record doing really well Yeah I don't Machine did really well that year The Battle of Los Angeles I think that That to me

It's like weird I like never really listen to that album Despite how much that I you know As a teenager vived out to evil empire And the self-title And I think that one would still

Resinate Because it I don't think that album has as much baggage as the first two. Like, I don't know if Paul Ryan was still into the band during that time. Because, like, their politics got much more specific in 1999. Like, so I think that one holds up pretty well. And I think a lot of this, like, summer teeth, I think, would also be up there. But, yeah, also maybe Eminem's a slim, shady LP.

I mean, it's kind of a, obviously a problematic record. But nonetheless, like when you look at like the impact That like or also Jay Z's volume three my per I think that might have been my personal favorite at 1999 at the time Because that was just the like peak of like Swiss beats timbaland Neptune's Uh production like the it's it's it's an insane production credits on that one Where do you think mule variations would have ended up? Probably number 11 I think the same people who are like voting for mule variations variations in 1999 are still at it.

I think I would vote... They might be like the five guys who are still voting for Pa's and Job in like 18 and 19. I would, uh, I think I would vote for mule variations just to troll you specifically. Just for my own amusement, put mule variations at the top of my list. It's a good record, though. I do like that record. So now we've reached the point where we're going to share our top fives. And I, you know, we're already running late in this episode. So I think we both, we kind of have to blow through our lists here rather.

of the breaking heat of the country. People know how I feel about mine. Yeah, exactly. So why don't you share your top five from 1990 first? So my top five, I mean, if you know anything about me through Twitter or what have you, or just have read basically anything I've ever written, you know that Jimmy World's Clarity is like my favorite record of all time. So I'm going to put that at number one for 1999.

Number two, and to give you a sense of just how. important this year was for, I guess you would call it like second wave or Midwestern emo. The first American football album is number two, like my second favorite album of a year. So, yeah, like they're just, I had a real good time last year writing 20th anniversary pieces. The number three album, I would put this memorment plans, emergency and I. Now, I think this one's important to point out because I think 1999 is when I started reading pitchfork and I think a lot of it had to do with emergency and I this is an album that kind of gets overlooked when you think about like the trajectory of that site I think that was one of the first

albums they really put their stamp on and when I think about like genre melding for indie rock in 1990 I think this is as good as it gets there are some parts that are kind of embarrassing now where he kind of like wraps or like has drum machines but he wraps on it it's sort of kind of See, I'm going to say, like, this band's a blind spot for me. I don't know if I've heard that record. Yeah, I think that dismemberment plan was a type of act because they were from D.C. and on DeSoto Records and produced by Jay Robbins of Jawbox,

that they're kind of like, are they emo or not? I think bands that are influenced by disemortment plan in 2020 are definitely emo, but back in the day, they probably weren't. I don't know how kids would receive this album now, but in 1999, it just seemed very, it was very groundbreaking, but also like emotionally it's just emotionally jarring album. Perfect album to describe

like what it was like to be you know in your late teen's early 20s just getting out of college and like wondering like how to just deal with life. The city from that album is a definitive like if you want to think about like what I consider to be perfect indie rock

the city is a song like that. I have number four get up kids something to write home about Superchunk is a surprising blind spot for me given my taste to me something you're right home about is like the best super chunk album ever um that's it it sounds all it's almost exactly like it but like kind of pop instincts and also has that kind of sappier uh midwestern sort of lyrical content um that like valentine um you know action and action these are songs that dominate uh an 18 year old's

mixtape making list in 1999. Number five, I think you and I are in a court about that one. Built to Spills, keep it like a secret. Like a quintessential major label indie rock album. This is one I bought because of like a lead review in Rolling Stone. And this is when I was starting to get a sense of like what it really meant to be like indie rock or critically acclaimed because, you know, Wilco built a spill vaguely aware of them because they weren't on MTV very much. I think I saw the out of sight out of mind video once but I didn't hear

him on the radio but nonetheless like how are these guys still getting like big reviews in Rolling Stone? It's like oh this is what it this is critically acclaimed music. There's like this sort of just left of the center world of rock that maybe I should like get

more into and this is you know that keep it like a secret was an album that really pushed me towards the person I am today. By the way the top five I mentioned, Bill to Spill is probably the only one I was really listening to in 1999. The others came later.

So, I'm going to share my list in reverse order just to amp up the drama of revealing my number one. Because I like to have some showmanship when I'm revealing my list. At number five, I put, Build to Spill, keep it like a secret.

But since you already mentioned that, I'm going to take that out, and I'm going to put in the three EPs by the beta band. just for the sake of mentioning more records from 1999. Yeah, number eight for me. Like, I think that's an example of like the kind of genre-mashing band that existed in 1999, along with them, like super furry animals, for example, that, like, seemed very utopian back then.

But nowadays it's sort of, not, it's quaint. Well, and I think of them as being like, they almost have like a jam band aesthetic, except they're playing with electronic music and indie rock. And yeah, I really like that record. a lot. It holds up very well. Holds up real well. Number four, speak kindly of your volunteer fire department by Robert Pollard and Doug Gillard. I was definitely listening to this album in 99. This is one of the many Robert Powered side projects. Of course, the Guy of My Voices record. The Guide of My Voices record from that year is

do the collapse, which was their big sort of major label record, them trying to move into that built-to-spill arena, I guess, which was Maloney. at the time, I think that record holds up pretty well, but this Robert Pollard and Doug Gillard record has one of my favorite Robert Pollard songs of all time, Pop Zeus, just an incredible song, love that record. Number three, 69 love songs by the Magnetic Fields, which we've already talked about. But yeah, if you haven't listened to Magnetic Fields, definitely get into that band. I think their 90s output is great. 69 love songs. It literally has 69 love songs on it, spread over three discs for all my CD fans out there.

But that is a great record. Number two is The Fragile by Nine Inch Nails. Ah, yes. This is a record I've actually written a lot about it. I wrote about this in my book, Twilight of the Gods. I actually called this the last classic rock record. Because I feel like this record has a lot of the hallmarks of, like, great 20th century rock records. It's a double record.

It was sequenced in partnership with Bob Ezrin, who was the prehistoric. who was the producer of the wall and like all these Alice Cooper records. And it just has like a density of sound and vision that you don't really hear in a lot of records anymore. I mean, this was obviously an album made on a major label budget by a guy who had years and years and years of time to pour into it. And I really think it's the Nine Inch Nails record that people are going to remember as being the great Nine Inch Nails record. I guess maybe this and pretty hate machine. Downward Spiral to me is like the, I think that's the one that is the definitive. Like I think the fragile is like kind of the contrarian's choice, at least like 90s.

Well, but like I think if you look at Trent Rezner's career overall, I think this is the album that's pointing toward what he's going to become later in his career. Absolutely. When he starts scoring films. And I will, yeah, I mean, look, I think those, definitely downward spiral is a huge. record, very huge record in 1994. I just feel like the fragile to me is like his magnum opus. I really think that like everything that is good about Trent Rezner, it culminates on that record. And I came very close to putting this as my number one record of 99. It's definitely the album that I like writing about the most from this year. And the one, and really like one of the

ones I like listening to the most. But of course, at number one, I had to put my baby, Summerteeth by Wilco. At number one, it was a record that meant a lot to me at the time. It still means a lot to me. Now, one of the hallmark records of Wilco's career, one of the records that, like, you know, it's part of their sort of magical run, which I guess depending on your preference for Wilco, either ends with Yanky Hotel Foxtrot or Ghost is Born or Sky Blue Sky. I mean, I think people disagree on like what the endpoint is. I would extend it to Sky Blue Sky, personally, being there to Sky Blue Sky. But there's no argument about the greatness of Summer Teeth, if you're a Wilco fan. This is also the period where Jay Bennett was, if not a co-leader of Wilco,

he was making the most substantive contributions to that band at this time. I think certainly from a production standpoint, Jay Bennett is all over that record. But also as a songwriter, him working with Jeff Tweedy and teasing out the more pop side of Jeff Tweedy's songwriting, Jay Bennett had a huge role in that. It's also an incredibly bleak record. She's a Jar via Chicago. Lyrics that are pretty dark and even scary at times. But just a fascinating record.

And I have ordered the reissue. So by the time this airs, hopefully that will have come in the mail. And I look forward to not watching the news this weekend and just listening to that box set and immersing myself in summer teeth outtake. So that's going to be a good time, I think. Yeah, that's also one of my favorites from that year as well. I think you mentioned the production.

It's kind of a running joke about how loud the production is on summer teeth, especially compared to the Jim O'Rourke stuff that they did immediately after. And I think about, like, as far as Jeff Dewey is a pop artist, I know he mentions in How to Write One Song, like he basically wrote Can't Stand it while on a plane because like the label said Oh we need a hit and he comes up

With that song on a plane Like what have you ever done on a plane That's like that productive you know Well I once watched Guardians of the Galaxy 2 and cried at the end So I think that's the most momentous thing I've ever done on a plane Yeah well that's why we are not Jeff Tweety

And that's why we're hosting indie rock pod Not yet at least I'm taking this book and running with it you know, I hope maybe, maybe one day, like, we'll be discussing my songs on Indycast. Just got that cross-promotion sort of thing. All right, we've now reached the point of our episode where Ian and I recommend things that we're into right now. We call it Recommendation Corner. Ian, why don't you go first?

All right, so I assume that anyone who's stuck around for a recommendation corner for, for me, like, knows how I feel about the record setter album that's dropping today. You could find me on Twitter raving about it to the point. where it almost seems like redundant to mention it here. But record setter, I owe you nothing. I would highly recommend that if you like basically anything that I've talked about so far in this episode. But otherwise, I want to give a little bit more time, especially if we're talking about

1999 indie rock to a band called the Goleys Anxiety at the Penalty Kick. They're a Philadelphia band. I believe there are six or seven members. One of them plays Glock and Spiel, strings, horns. They're on Count Your Lucky Stars Records, which went on a bit of a bit of a bit of of a hiatus, but were one of the essential labels of the emo revival, for lack of a better term. They put out the first Foxing record. They Empire Empire, the guy, the people behind that band started it.

And so it's great to see them back in putting out like really excellent albums that kind of, it's so funny about like this band and so many other ones that you would lump under emo revival because they speak to like indie rock trends of 1999 like basically if you listen to indie rock from this era and like the 1999 to 2004-ish era and think man they don't make them like this anymore like they totally do and this band draws more on the uh their new their new album ways of hearing it's uh it came out i believe last friday and it goes more towards the early modest mouse like kind of that raw, like that raw stretching out to six minutes, modest mouse. Also, Carissa's weird if we want to like talk about like Pacific Northwest type bands. But if you were

to hear this band completely free of context, you wouldn't call them emo at all. The problem is they have this name that was taken from a Vim Vendor's film and people assume they sound like the world's a beautiful place and I'm no longer afraid to die. They kind of do. But if you're into more of like a Pacific Northwest indie rock of like early modest mouse early Carissa's weird um this is an album that's really going to scratch that itch no in a way no other album i don't even think is even trying now so kind of a hidden gem it's an album that i've recommended to like people who i think might be into it and they're always into it so if any of those bands i mentioned so far speak to you the goal is anxiety the penalty kick uh ways of hearing new album out

fantastic stuff. Sounds really good for this time of year as well. So the record I'm going to recommend is not a new record. This album came out in 2013, but it was pointed out to me to revisit this record by a Spotify algorithm. I have to own up to that. Listening to Spotify, I think one album ended, and then it brought up a track from this record. And I was like, wow, I haven't heard that in a long time, and it sounds really good. And I just got really back into this album this week. It is, we are the 21st Century Ambassadors of Peace and Magic. by Foxygen.

And this is a band that I feel like had their moment in the early 2010s where they were getting a lot of good press. I have to say that, like, I actually reviewed their first EP, take the kids off Broadway for Pitchfork. And it's like maybe the only semi-momentous review I wrote for Pitchfork.

Most of the records I repeat for them were totally forgettable. I would always get a sign like, you know, the seventh Johnny Marr solo record or something like, just like garbage. But anyway... That's a good name. But this record, the 21st Century Ambassador's record, this was their, I think, real breakthrough.

This was the album that got a lot of attention. Absolutely. And to me, the thing I always loved about Foxygen was that they were a band that would take the building blocks of classic rock radio, everything from like the Beatles and the Beach Boys, you know, two touchdowns we mentioned earlier to, you know, stuff from the 70s, like electric light orchestra to like more, I guess of like the garagey rock. stuff that you would associate with bands of like Brian Jones Town Massacre. And they would combine them in ways that I thought were always really interesting where it wasn't just like a straight up pastiche of like one band. It was like taking like five bands and taking them apart and assembling them in like a different kind of order that you wouldn't expect. And there's a quality to it where if you love that kind of music, just listening to the way Foxygen can kind of scramble up those

influences is always, I think, one of the pleasures of their records. It is, I guess, more of like, I guess, the meta-music nerd aspect of those records. But beyond that, these guys just wrote really good songs that are catchy, that hold up really well. The song, No Destruction from the 21st Century Bastard's record, great song. The song, San Francisco, just a beautiful kind of throwback 60s-type pop song. And the other thing about Foxygen that made them fascinating in the moment was just how chaotic they were, especially as a lot. live act. They had a train wreck aspect to them where they could be the greatest band on Earth or they could be the worst band. And it made them exciting to follow. Of course, it also made them

terribly volatile and I think ultimately caused them to flame out. Although the next record, which is called And Star Power, it's a double record, I think has a lot of great moments on it too. Of course, now, you know, we've mentioned this person's name before on this podcast. Jonathan Rado has become a really great producer. He's worked with Father John. Misty, he worked on the last Ways Blood record, that awesome album, Titanic Rising. And you can hear echoes of Oxygen and the work that he does with other artists. So he's definitely carrying that forward. It's nice to see that he has, I guess, overcome the wildness of Oxygen's youth to have this upstanding career as a producer.

The other member, Sam France, he seems to maybe be still stuck in chaos. us, so to speak. But this is a great record. If you've not listened to it, you know, since it was, since it had its moment, I guess, seven years ago, I encourage you to revisit it. I think it holds up really well. Yeah, my history with Foxxon, I reviewed the last, if you want to talk about, like, the niche of, like, reviewing the seventh Johnny Mara.

I actually reviewed the last Foxygen record. And that was just like a real cash bowl sort of thing. But I actually interviewed them the day before that review for this out, like the 20, 21st century came out. I interviewed them and they were completely out of their minds, but like also kind of fun. And yeah, they, they just seemed like this sort of band that was going to kind of aerial pinkish sort of flame out in a way or just like kind of carry on to like a cult of weirdos. No Destruction, really resilient sync history. It just pops up in so many movies and TV shows.

And, you know, San Francisco has also great song. That's one that all, like, I think they kind of made that song intentionally to be like a West Anderson, West Anderson pastiche. But yeah, it's been, I don't know, and Star Power seems like Stephen Hyden Katnip to me. Like, ambitious, like, sprawling double album. Absolutely. Like, glan rock and whatnot. But pretty scattershot record, but, like, that's one of the, if you give yourself over to it and just. You know, it's one of those, like, experience type records.

In the same way, like 69 love songs, if you're just like, hey, I want to immerse myself in a record, a record that's just going to give me a lot. And Star Power is definitely one of those records. But I would say that, like, if you just want to listen to one Foxygen album, you're the 21st Century Ambassador as a Piece of Magic is the way to go. I think that distills what they do in its best package. And then if you love that record, get into the other records. There's lots of other albums to explore.

Maybe the later records aren't as good, but I think the early stuff, holds up, so I recommend doing that. We have reached the end of our episode, our trip to 1999. I'm sorry to have to deliver you back to 2020, but, you know, hey, let's all hang in there. I think we'll hopefully be okay. Thank you for listening to this episode of Indycast. We will be back with more reviews and news and trends and all that stuff next week. And if you're looking for more music recommendations, sign up for the Indie Mix Taped newsletter.

You can go to uprocks.com backslash indie, and I recommend five albums per week, and we'll send it directly to your email box.