Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saunders, MBA - Interview with Michael Clanin, Certified Financial Fiduciary® with Safe Money Solutions Discussing Business & Estate Planning Structures

Episode Date: May 28, 2026

Michael has been in the financial and insurance business for over 20 years. He works with clients in the areas of Tax-Free Wealth Creation, retirement planning, lifetime income solution, legacy planning and business and Estate Planning. He is an advocate for the safety and protection of his client’s hard-earned retirement money.Michael is committed to delivering outstanding professional service to his clients and acting with honesty and integrity. He takes great pride in building long-term relationships with his clients to achieve their financial goals during working years and during enjoyment years.Michael’s mission is to help clients avoid losing money in the market, and instead build wealth safely, securely, and most importantly, provide lifetime income streams that will be there throughout your enjoyment years and then finally transitioning assets onto next generations more tax efficiently and possibly Tax-Free.Michael is a former educator, so naturally, his approach in working with clients is through guidance and education. He enjoys spending time with family, traveling, hiking, biking, and reading.Learn more: https://safemoney123.com/Influential Entrepreneurs with Mike Saundershttps://businessinnovatorsradio.com/influential-entrepreneurs-with-mike-saunders/Source: https://businessinnovatorsradio.com/interview-with-michael-clanin-certified-financial-fiduciary-with-safe-money-solutions-discussing-business-estate-planning-structures

Welcome to influential entrepreneurs, bringing you interviews with elite business leaders and experts, sharing tips and strategies for elevating your business to the next level. Here's your host, Mike Saunders. Hello and welcome to this episode of influential entrepreneurs. This is Mike Saunders, the authority positioning coach. Today we have back with this Michael Clannon, who's a certified financial fiduciary with safe money solutions. and we'll be talking about business and estate planning structures. Michael, welcome back to the program. Well, Mike, thanks for having me back again.

You are welcome. I remember before we had a really warm, flowing conversation. You just make things very, very clear. And it's really powerful to be able to have a message that's delivered where people get it and go, ooh, I need to learn a little bit more about that. So I'm excited to learn about this because I would venture to say this could be a three-day weekend seminar and still not be, you know, scratch in the surface. So I know we're going to talk high level, but talk a little bit about some of the main pain points or concerns that business owners face or even high net worth clients regarding the business and estate planning type structures that you're working with them on.

Yeah. So, I mean, I have clients and a lot of my clients are business owners or these high net worth clients. And you probably know what their biggest pain point is, Mike. I mean, along with everybody else, it's the taxes. Yep. Right? I didn't get it out before you started. Yep.

Yep. I knew it. You know, so that is, that is a big pain point that, that, not only are they facing this year, but every year that's getting bigger and bigger and bigger as their business is growing. And even to the, for as long as, you know, went up to the point when they want to sell that business. They're going to be hit with large, large capital gains. Right? So the biggest thing is, is where do we stop or what are solutions that can stop us from donating more to the IRS than we need to?

That is a really well-phrased use of terms, donating to the IRS because on one hand, I want to donate money to worthy causes, but the IRS ain't one of them. Right. And you know my other term that I've used in the last one. That's a new one I started using. But it's how do we divorce the IRS as much as possible, ethically, legally and morally? Yeah. Pay our fair share and no more. Yeah, I think that's a thing that a lot of times people, you know, hear when you have these conversations like, you know, oh, well, we need to skirt the IRS and pay no taxes and go off. Nope. We want to pay as much taxes as we're legally obligated to, but if there's a deduction on the table, I want to know about it. If it's legal, moral, and ethical, I want to know about it. Yeah, who wouldn't, right? And these things that we'll be talking about are not new. It's just new to people because they haven't worked on professionals who even have access to what I have access to. You know, I'm one of 15 people, not only in the United States of America that can offer this, but in that. the entire world because this also works worldwide. Wow.

So that's, yeah. So when, you know, I'm privileged to be able to offer this to my clients because they're, they're professionals, whether it's CPA's attorneys, they don't even know about these things and they've never been trained about them. And, you know, again, I want to put it out here, right? I'm not an attorney. I'm not a tax professional. And that I'm just a glorified educator, you know, using different.

vehicles to accomplish the things that my clients are trying to accomplish. You know, and that's a great point because if you tried to be all things to all people and be the expert and everything, something's going to implode. So you work within the confines of a team, whether it's your experts in legal and tax or the client's team. Maybe they go, oh, I've got a guy. Good. Let's bring them on board and bring them up to speed because we just want to make sure all the pieces are working together. You know, when I hear, what we've been talking about here, pain points, taxes, got it. It sounds congruent to say business owners because there's always the things you hear about like, oh, if you're a business owner, you can

write off for access. But a higher net worth client that might not be a business owner, sometimes people go, oh, but some of these things won't work for me because I don't own a business. Are there still some opportunities if you are a W2 corporate employee, but more high net worth? Yeah, I mean, I'll tell you what, these business structures, business and estate planning structures. So the estate planning, of course, is on the personal side. The W2 is not going to help, right? Because you're getting paid personally, you know, through your Social Security number.

Anything else, whether, you know, a business, if they're getting a K1 distribution, you know, capital gains, royalties, dividends, interest, anything like, you know, anything like that, that's where it's going to be. come into play. And I think I mentioned on the last episode, you know, these business and estate planning structures can save clients upwards of 80% or more in what they're paying in taxes this last tax year. You know, what would you just get done writing that check to? Right. Check to IRS, right? That donation. What if you, what if there was a way that you could have kept a majority of that, If not close to all of that in your pocket, in your business, in your in your possession to create even more well.

Yeah, that's huge. So you mentioned about how proprietary this is and how you're one of a very few in the country or the world. Why would that be? In other words, is this like literally part of a, I don't know what you call it, but a system or a set of processes? is because when you hear the word, you know, legal or state planning, you know, you can go Google a lot of stuff on that. But you're saying yours is so much high level and deeper that not not everyone out there, even if you are an estate planning attorney, can offer this because of the way that you guys have structured it, right? Right. So, so, yes, it is, yes.

So it's, you know what? I was very fortunate, right? I was at the right place, at the right time. And guess what? Somebody thought of me, meaning a colleague of mine. thought of me that I would benefit this from this personally, right? So I was, so I was a consumer of this before I started being able to offer it. And that's just because that relationship that I had with that person was able to connect me to the law firm, the CPAs on this side where, you know, I'm a distributor, I guess, is the easiest way to say it.

You got licensed to provide this high-level proprietary process. No, I'm not licensed. It's just a service. It's a system. It's a system. It's an ecosystem that as long as we work inside this ecosystem, and we'll talk about the benefits of that. But as long as you work inside this system, okay,

you're going to not only save potentially a lot of taxes, or defer taxes indefinitely, but you're also going to have asset protection and everything from all outside forces. And we'll get into that, I'm sure. Yeah, I definitely want to get into that. So it makes me think of something too. And I know we briefly touched on it, but legal, moral, ethical, you know, I think when people hear some of these things like structures or legal or trust or whatever the case is, it's like offshore and shady. And I saw a movie. about that. So let's kind of knock that 800 pound gorilla off. You know, talk a little bit about the ethicalness of this and, you know, is it proven and does the IRS approve of it and all that?

Yeah. So this follows all tax law, IRS code. In fact, Mike, this is not, like I said, this is not a new structure. This was actually created back in 1952, an attorney who had lots of friends, because he lived in Texas, lots of friends in the gas and oil industry, right? They were getting hit with royalty taxes, right? And once they, it's all about repositioning how you are set up as a business, right? And the money mechanics of moving money around. It's not about where it starts. It's where it ends up is going to determine who's getting taxed at what level and all of that. Okay. So as far as this going back to this, yes, it was the first ever copyrighted trust structure. Okay. Legal structure. So of course,

what does that do? It triggers IRS, right? They came in an audited these structures, right? Two weeks a gentleman came back from the IRS, and not only did he say, does this follow all X codes? He actually purchased it himself because he saw the value. Wow. Now, it was copyrighted in 1999.

So it had been around since 1952, but it hadn't been copyrighted until 1999. Again, like I said, it was the first ever copyrighted trust. So, you know, here's 70 years later, right? And that. So, yeah, I mean, it has a history. It has precedence.

It's never, you know, it's been audited. There's been never been findings. It's all, you know, all kosher. So when they know the name of this trust, being the IRS, okay, they kind of, they don't push it. farther because they know as long as we're working with the right professionals that's keeping it in compliance right the attorneys the CPAs enrolled agents that are doing the tax return because he still do tax returns it's a 1041 tax return however this is not necessarily a taxable entity as long as we work inside the structure mean we keep the money inside working inside the structure

we're not pulling it out okay well with and again i want to be really careful and clear. Let's dive into the details. Nope, because I don't even want to get into the details because we just want to know super high level. But you've said the word trust before. And I think that sometimes people go, oh, trust, I've heard this or I don't need. What sets this type of trust structure apart from others? Yeah.

So let's talk about that because here's the thing. I tell people every day, all trust are not created equal. Okay. Okay. Here's the thing. All attorneys are educated under statutory law and legislative law. Okay. This is the only trust structures that are under contract law. So which means this trust is actually a spendthrift trust. But what that means is this does not owe its existence to any act of legislature. And because it's a contract, we have the right to contract. And in American law, government cannot impose a tax on a right to contract. And that's actually under U.S. Constitution Article 1, Section 10. But here's the thing. The biggest thing is, because it's a spendthrift trust, it's not a creature of legislature. So therefore, it is not subjected to

all those strangling legislative controls, rules and regulations that are applicable to corporations, right? C-Corp, S-Corp, LLCs, partnerships, or any other legislative entities. So it's almost like when, like you said, when the IRS sees this or when they come in, when this comes in, they see this type of setup structure and they know, oh, wait a minute, let's flip to page 4,312 in the code. we now need to follow these rules because it's there, it's allowed, it's just a different type of a structure.

Yeah, I mean, so really, you know, the governing law is it's a private, it's under private contract law. Okay.

So that, the contracts is between the person who sets it up and the one that's putting assets into it. Mm-hmm. Okay. Versus statutory law. You guys, Most trusts out here have to pay monies out and have to pay taxes.

And the taxes are at the highest tax rates. There are different provisions within this structure that gives the person, first of all, when individuals move things into those others, they actually lose control of those assets. Okay. But the other side of it is because it's still tied to their social security number, those assets can be pulled back out. So even if somebody has a, let's just say, again,

I'm not an attorney, okay, but let's just say somebody even has a revocable trust. They can still, the courts and judges can still see inside of those. And if there's a judgment, they can force that person to pull those assets out. Why? Because it's tied to them personally. And then that's how businesses and livelihoods, hoods and legacies get wiped out.

Okay, because. And people think that, oh, set up a trust and you'll protect everything and be safe and you can never be sued and my business is protected. And that might not always be the case. It depends on how it's set up. Well, right. I mean, let's just talk about, you know, entities that are registered at the state level, right? This is what all business owners are doing, right?

They have LLCs, S corp, C, court, or partnerships or any of the other things, right? They're subjectives to the state legislature. But when, because of that, those entities can a person still be sued, right? Anything that's tied to your social security number, meaning people think they have to own things personally. And what this trust structure is doing is saying, no, you do not want to own it personally. because when you hold things personally, they're exposed. They're up for grabs in lawsuits, divorces, judgments, all that, okay, creditors. So just because you put it under the umbrella of a specific type of trust,

it still could be pierced because you think you're fine, but in reality, there's still a dotted line connection. Right, right. So whether it's in a trust or not, I'm even just saying if they help hold it individually outside the trust, right? And I'm not saying all trusts are not good, right? I'm not saying that. There's places for them.

But a lot of those are specific situations, you know, like land trust. Revocable trust is the most common. That just avoids probate. There's no tax advantage. There's no asset protection. You know, there's Medicaid trust to keep people from spending all their assets, you know, so they can, you know, keep some for their spouse. But the thing is, anything that's registered at the state level as an entity, a business, can a business get sued?

Of course, right? Yeah. But here's what I hear every day. Well, I have an entity. It protects me personally. No, it doesn't. Because they're going to go after your business. But once they uncover what you own personally, they can go after that too.

That's why he said. Businesses and, you know, your personal wealth can be wiped out overnight. Okay. Where I'm trying to put a client in a position where nobody can get to anything. Why? Because this structure actually has its own EIN number, but because of the way it's under contract, it acts as an individual. It has all the, it has all the rights of an individual. So like if I want to buy something, a property, a business, right?

A person can do that and a business can do it. Well, so can't this entity, right? But if I ever got sued, if that business ever got sued, guess what? And it's owned by this structure, even if they win, they're not getting anything. Wow. Nothing. The only way is if it's being set up and there's fraud that, is intentional to be created.

Like they're creating the structure to commit fraud, right? Avoid something. It could be a void lawsuit, a divorce is already filed, right? I mean, anything that you're trying to hide these. We're not trying to hide assets or, you know, we can avoid everything. It's not illegal to avoid as long as you're taking the tax code and the law into consideration, right? And you're following by all those. Yeah, rules, right?

Yeah, follow the rules. Make sense. Follow the rules. It's kind of like what you said previously that I thought was so powerful. Own nothing but control everything. So talk a little bit about how that works as we wrap up this. Yeah, so, oh, yeah, so this was coined by John D. Rockefeller. And people have heard this, but they really don't understand it.

Okay. In my opinion, in my opinion. What he is saying just kind of what I told. I mentioned people think they have to own things personally, meaning they are egotistic, right? We think we have to own things, okay? But what Johnny Rockefeller is saying is, you do not want to own things personally tied to your social security number

or EIN numbers. Okay, because it's all at risk. So how do we create something that alleviates all that? So first of all, not to get in the details, but when somebody uses their social security number to create the EIA number for like even a legal structure, they are a grantor. Okay. It's tied to them still. Okay. When we build our, when we set up our structures, we use a third party.

So a lot of times I'm my client's third. party settler. That means I'm using my social security number to apply for the EIN number and create the structures on their behalf for their beneficiaries. So if that entity ever got sued, that structure, everybody can see inside the structure, not even a judge because of the way written. Wow. And that. So, and what makes this trust structure unique is it is the only one that holds the assets

that are, that come into it in an escrow. It's, it's considered to be held in escrow. It's the only structure like this that has that. And that's what's the proprietary and copyrighted. There's a lot of people out there. escrow from my days in the mortgage industry. Escrow just means it's yours. You just can't get it just yet.

Yeah. Right. And so own nothing. So get things out of your name. And we sell your assets, your home, your cars, your brokerage accounts, move your brokerage accounts. We change ownership and we sell the asset. Okay.

But here's the thing with business. owners. This is what I want to kind of end with. When business owners, let's just say that we've already talked about if they were ever sued and this structure owns their business, they're not getting anything. But the other side of it, when this business owner goes to sell that business for hundreds of millions of dollars, there's certain things inside this structure, the way it's designed and using the tax code that is not considered income. Capital. gains. That could be on brokerage accounts. People who are investing in properties, when they go to sell those, there's no capital gains. Don't have to deal with 1031 exchanges. But here's the thing,

business owners, $100 million dollar business, they're going to pay minimum $20 million in capital gains. If it comes, if that money, if that's owned by this trust, they'll indefinitely until you actually pull money out of this environment, which we We show people never to do, right? We want to work inside this environment. So capital gains, K1 distributions and not considered income, interest, dividends, royalties. Oh, and rental income. So those property owners, this will allow you not to have to pay taxes on rental income.

Because this trust cannot be forced to pay taxes because the way it's set up. It defers taxes in perpetuity, okay? indefinitely, infinity, until you actually pull monies out, which you don't, because the trust can buy any assets. It can invest in any business, opportunities. Wow. You know, so many of these points we've talked about here, obviously are such that you can't just go Google set up and, hey, AI, do this for me.

You know, never, ever could you do that. You need to have that team. You need to have that trusted guide like yourself. So if someone is interested in having maybe a second look at their structure, what's the best way they can learn more and reach out and connect with you, Michael? They just need to go to Safe Money, 123.com. Safe meaning you can't lose, right? That's what we're trying to do, right? We want to be the winners.

So you can't lose. Safe Money, 123.com. That's the easiest way. You can book an appointment on there, has my contact information and all that. excellent well thank you so much for coming back on this has been real enlightening for us yeah i loved it thanks you've been listening to influential entrepreneurs with mike saunders to learn more about the resources mentioned on today's show or listen to past episodes visit www www.