Inside Conan: An Important Hollywood Podcast - Dana Gould

Episode Date: June 26, 2020

Comedian and writer Dana Gould stops by to talk with writers Mike Sweeney and Jessie Gaskell about his start in comedy voicing a video game Gecko, what it takes for comics to have a successful late night set, the time he had a panic attack onstage, writing for The Simpsons, and the horror story of his career that happened during an appearance on CONAN. Got a question for Inside Conan? Call our voicemail: [phone] and e-mail us at [e-mail] For Conan videos, tour dates and more visit TeamCoco.com

And now it's time for Inside Conan, an important Hollywood podcast. Welcome to Inside Conan, colon, an important Hollywood podcast. I'm Mike Sweeney. My real name is William Michael Sweeney, but that's right. Just for brevity's sake, I'll go by Mike Sweeney today. We usually put initials next to the writer's name when a bit is going on the show. I remember the first time I saw WMS next to one of your pieces and I was like, who the hell is that? Oh yeah. Well, they use all three of my initials. This is so ridiculous. Because when I was hired, there was another writer with initials MS on the show.

So I had to become WMS. His name was Mike Stoynoff. He was a star on the show Blossom. What? I never watched Blossom. Because you weren't a teen girl. Although I dressed like one. And he and I would go out for lunch in Rockefeller Plaza,

and people were fainting and screaming and pointing at him. People stopped in their tracks wherever he walked. It was hilarious. I'm glad I hadn't watched his show, or I'd be too nervous to talk to him. I know. I'm Jesse Gaskell. And you? Also a writer on The Conan Show.

Don't be coy. We have a great show today. I don't know if there's time for a guest after talking about my initials, but we'll try to squeeze him in. His name is Dana Gould. Dana Gould. Super successful stand-up comic and writer. He's written for The Simpsons for years and many other television shows. And he also has had a very memorably bad appearance

on The Conan Show, which we get into. And we'll give a small editorial note here that this was recorded before we all went into quarantine. So we were in person. A gentler, simpler time. So let's get right into it. Here's Dana Gould. Here we are with Dana Gould. Hello. How are you? How are you?

So nice to see you again. Nice to see you. Yes. We've known each other for too long. Yes, but in a very superficial way, would you say? Kind of like seeing each other in a comedy club and like, hey, hi. Hey, how you doing? Yeah.

But I'm very close with Brian Kiley, so I feel like we're close. Yes. And Brian Kiley's a writer in Conan. Yes. Has he has been for 26 years. Since 94, yeah. So, often confused for Bobby Duvall. Yes. Brian

Kiley often signs autograph for Ed Harris or Bobby Duvall. Right, right, right. That's his curse. But it's great to see you. It's great to see you. Of course, we were excited to talk to you because you've had a connection with The Conan Show in addition to being a great comedian and an extensive career writing for television as well. But we would love to start with your Conan connection. I have a couple of Conan connections.

To Conan the Man, we're both from Irish families in Massachusetts. Oh, wow. Both worked – You might be Massachusetts. Oh, wow. Both worked. You might be related. Could be related. We're a little more down in the dirt than Conan's people. They're pretty good. He tries to make it sound like he grew up in a rough and tumble family.

Fighting for the drumstick. But a gritty part of Cambridge. Yeah, exactly. It's like the sketchy Color Me Mine. Right, right. Brookline, which I think is over the border from Cambridge. No, I grew up out by Worcester. I grew up in the-

Oh, okay. And then we both wrote on The Simpsons. Yeah. Right, right, right, right. So we have that weird connection. And then, yeah, I first did the show in the very early days. I guess 96 for me, maybe. Oh, yeah.

95 or 96. Yeah, yeah, that's early days. I started doing comedy. I was very young. I was 17 when I started. So you know I was great. Look at this young feller. And I would look at old stuff now and you just want to cut your head off.

Yeah. I would say don't look at it. Yeah. Well, I had to. I was literally cleaning out the garage. Like, what? Oh, God. A VHS?

Well, this is, yeah, this was, it was an article because I was the voice of a video game in the mid-90s and it was an article. I just thought this morning, that's why I'm thinking about it. Comedians have a new place to ply their wares cyberspace oh god and then it works yes cyberspace is still out there what was your cyberspace video game that was called

gex it was very popular there was three of them I still get people that come up to me with cartridges for forx the Gecko Lizard. To sign the cartridge? Yeah, me and a very funny writer. Or play with you. Yeah, play the game with me. Hey, you got two hours?

Me and a very funny writer named Rob Cohen, who you probably know. Yeah. We wrote his – he was wisecracking. He was sassy. And yeah, we wrote all the dialogue for that. Oh, wow. So that was really funny. But shows like Conan and The Tonight Show, they were always elusive to me.

Right. Because as a stand-up, I'm not really made for that form. You know, like I'll have one bit that's six minutes long. You're more like pre-form kind of. Yeah, very structured, but I don't have a lot of lines. I don't have a lot of like a lot of ba-ba-bum-bang. Like you or Kylie or just like Gatling Gun. And I'm not like that.

I'm a lot more looser and story-oriented. So it was very difficult always for me. Which you were kind of ahead of your time, it seems like. I mean, that's where a lot of stand-ups have gone. Yeah. I mean, I came out of the L.A. alt scene in the early 90s. That whole thing started with, you know, Jeanine Garofalo went to the improv.

And Jim McCauley, who booked The Tonight Show, Jim McCauley saw you. He said you weren't that good. And she was like, well, yeah, I was trying out new stuff. Right. I had my notebook with me. Right. And I'm like, well, why are you trying out new stuff at the improv?

Not in L.A. or New York. Right. How was that in Minneapolis? Yeah. Well, that was originally the point of the improv was to try out new stuff. The people in Minneapolis are paying. Right. I want to make sure it works.

And that was exactly the conundrum. And so she put it very well. She was like, we need a place where we can bomb. So we started to go outside of comedy clubs into like there's a place on Beverly Boulevard called Big and Tall Books. And they had a little cafe and I was like, we're going to do a comedy show here. And the premise was you couldn't do anything that you had done on stage. It had to be new. Oh, wow.

So you wrote it that day because you procrastinated. Right, of course. And that's the origin of taking your notebook on stage. Right, right. It's because you wrote it that day. It later became a symbol of if you memorized your act, you're a hack spell out. It's never what it was. There's nothing wrong with doing your job and memorizing your show.

What year was that? This was 90, 91. Okay. 89 to 90, 91. And the same thing was happening in New York City. In New York at the same time, yeah. Same thing. So just walk us through.

So it would be the way people would get booked on late night shows was their booker would see them perform. A lot of times, yeah. And you really was like, back then it was called your TV seven, because sets were seven minutes long back then. This was, you know, woolly mammoths roamed the earth. Right. This was a very dangerous time. Huge bubbling tar pits in the streets. And then the booker would come to a comedy club

and they'd have a lineup of like seven comics yeah that would each do their seven minutes that yeah and you know jim mccauley would come down you know they'd play and you'd know the imperial march from the empire strikes back um yeah and it was and it was you know you know line line line line line line line line line and never really took that seriously because I was so far away from that kind of comedy. I was very young. Where were you living? Were you living in San Francisco? By this point, I had moved to Los Angeles.

I went from Boston to San Francisco to Los Angeles. What part of LA? I lived right behind what is now the ugliest building in Western civilization, the Peterson Car Museum on the Miracle Mile. Yeah. It's like if Guy Fieri was an architect. Yeah, it really is. It looks like a bee's-

It's based on his hair. It looks like a bee's nest that's on fire. Yeah. It is an, I think the word atrocity applies. Yeah. It's certainly an architectural atrocity. It's a lot to take in. Yeah.

It's an orgasm of ill-considered ideas. It's probably the most dangerous intersection now. It's a lot to take in. Yeah. It's an orgasm of ill-considered ideas. It's probably the most dangerous intersection now. It is a terrible Yeah, because people can't believe that that's really a building.

It's really an atrocious They experience blindness. Yeah. What I did in terms of my comedic style I pushed two people together. I love George Carlin was always

my comedy hero and I was grotesquely influenced by his writing style. But when I started to do the uncapped shows where you really had to come up with stuff a lot, I was really influenced by Albert Brooks and his early albums. Like, George Carlin would talk about cars for 17 minutes, and it would be 35,000 brilliant observations about cars that you've never heard put into that order. Albert Brooks would talk about buying a car. And it would be four hours and it would be just as fun. Right, right, right.

And I really got into that sort of storytelling. And that allowed me to write a lot of material. And it was funny. And that was really how my style worked. But it wasn't conducive to doing late night spots. Seven minutes. Right, right. And at this point, it was Letterman.

Conan was at this point writing on The Simpsons. Right. He didn't have a show. And Janine Garofalo and Jeff Garland lived in this house next to Fairfax High School where we had a lot of parties. And you'd see everybody. And I really wanted to get on Letterman, and I could never, ever, ever, ever get on Letterman. And I knew that they saw me and they liked me, but I would never get the show, and I was really like, ugh. And it just galled me.

They could string people along, I think. Like, hey, I like, you know, keep it up. I want to see you again. Yeah, really good. And there would be nights when, because, you know, there would be nights where they would come to see five people. Right. And I would annihilate. Right.

But I didn't realize I was not what they were looking for. Right. And they realized they knew the limits of my style in their format. Right. Which I only kind of did. Here's the point of this terribly long story. No, but I think it's interesting to talk about the type of comic that, as you're saying, is geared towards

a talk show. The best example to me is Stephen Wright. Yeah. Stephen Wright or Mitch Hedberg, rest in peace. Those guys, they're sent down from heaven. They just make necklaces. It's like every joke is a pearl and it goes on a string

and your set is a beautiful necklace. And, you know, the way my sets would be, it would be when I finally figured out how to do it for what I do, it would be one or two like joke lines that I've come up with. To this day, I struggle with them, trying to put together a set to show to JP. Right. And I'm like, no, I have, you know, two like joke lines that open a set. Right. Because you need to open your set with something fast. So they know you're doing comedy. Yeah.

Do you think that's still true? The old feeling was TV's a cool medium. It is. It's a cool medium. So comics, like comics who are super expressive in a club, and it really is great for a live kind of theatrical. On TV, it doesn't come across the same as a comic who is a cooler, lower key comic. So do you think that's still the case? I do think that's still the case.

And here is what I think it is. Because in those formats, all the late night talk shows, you're standing on the stage and the camera is between you and the audience. So the people who are watching at home don't see, if they watch a special talk shows, you're standing on the stage and the camera is between you and the audience. So the people who are watching at home don't see – if they watch a special on Netflix, they're watching you perform in a theatrical setting. Right. In the case of Conan, you're in their living room. Yeah. And you need to behave as if you are in someone's living room.

Yes. Take your shoes off. You're a guest. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you need, you know, like Bill Maher really clearly like learned a lot from Johnny Carson in the way that he, and Johnny Carson got it from Jack Benny. Right. Really knows how to be in your living room and do what he does.

Yeah. And it's absolutely true. Bill Maher was always kind of Bill Maher. Yeah. In that sense where just kind of the lower key and very unflappable. Yeah, very unflappable. And just not really like not caring, oh, it's a good crowd. It's not a great crowd.

He always, when he was a comedian. Yeah, and it's such a gift. It's such a gift. To be able to just like, if something doesn't go just, hmm. Yes, to be that self-contained. Yeah, yeah. And where I always. Because your real audience is at home.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's really true. And I was obsessively wanting to be on Letterman because all of my, you know, the comedians that I idolized had done it. And this was, again, before, this is early, early 90s. Before Netflix.

Before, before, before, well, before Conan and before, you know. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Johnny, it was Johnny Carson and David Letterman. Right. And I never got on the show. And for some reason, Robert Morton was my bet noir.

He was the executive producer. Yeah. He was the guy that would book the show. He was the guy that would book the comedians. And he would always see me and smile and knew my name. And I was like, okay. After Bob Morton left, I got the show right away. Oh, that's great. Yeah. When Rob Burnett came in I got the show like right away. Oh, that's great. Yeah, when Rob Burnett came in.

Right. I got the show right away. That's fine. Morton. Yeah. So there's a guy named Frank Gannon, right, who took over from – Yes, yeah. Yeah, to book.

Yeah, and then I got it when Rob Burnett was there. Oh, okay. Running the show. And I don't even think I got it because of what I did on stage. When I did the show, Rob said to me, you know, I did a night at Stitches, which is a comedy club in Boston. And he said, you were the only comedian. You were like the only regular comedian that was nice to me. That's probably why I got it.

That goes a long way. It does. Being a nice person is its own reward. It doesn't hurt. So what happened years later? So anyway, so years later, my fiance and I, soon to be my fiance, later my wife, currently my ex-wife. Okay. You're soon to be ex-wife.

Soon to be, yeah, soon to be ex-wife. We were going on vacation to Tuscany with a bunch of people, and we're staying at Morty's house. Robert Morton, who by that time had moved on in his career, he had a house in Tuscany. And my fiance was a big agent in town, and another big agent. We're all going to stay with Morty. It's like, I don't know if this is going to be comfortable. Yeah. Yeah.

I can't stay in this guy's house. He's your nemesis. It doesn't sound really relaxing. Yeah. And I was there for like 30 seconds. Right. And he was the greatest guy in the world. Oh, yeah.

Right, right, right. greatest guy in the world and you realize you you spend so much time in life wondering what people who aren't thinking about you right are thinking about yeah and and it was literally one day like i just he was so charming he was so lovely he was so funny it was so many great stories and and then at one point he was like well you did you do the show? And he was stunned when I told him that I didn't do it underhand. Oh. And clearly was not acting. He's like, no. Right.

We loved you. Yeah. Yeah. It's just like, it's not about you, Dana. Right. Not about you. No, I know. It's a great lesson.

I mean, we're always- Well, I hope you guilted him into some free meals in Tuscaloosa. Oh, no. He fed us like kings. It was amazing. What were you saying, Jessie? No, just, we're always- Well, I hope you guilted him into some free meals in Tuscaloosa. Oh, no, he fed us like kings. It was amazing. What were you saying, Jessie? No, just that we're, yeah, I think we spend so much time in our own heads assuming, like, oh, that person did

that because they hate me. Right, yes. And then, yeah, you find out that it's like they've got they're thinking about their own shit. Yeah, and I- It has nothing to do with you. Yeah, and I had to, you know, and then, you know, as my career progressed and I've had shows on the air that I'm that I've written and and I had to, you know, and then, you know, as my career progressed and I've had shows on the air that I've written and that I produced, you know, TV shows. And you have to cast and you don't, you can't hire everybody. Right.

You know, and you feel awful. Right. You know, and you feel awful. And when you would be in that position of casting and hiring people. I'm in it now. Yeah. So, how do you probably feel? Yeah.

I would love to, I would love to have you in. You know, I can't. You just have to get a house in Tuscany. There's 13 roles. There's 13 people here. I can't,

you know, I'm, you know, I'm friends with more than 13 people. Yeah. Yeah. It's awful. And it's so funny.

So finally I did, and this is another great lesson about show business. I finally did Letterman in 1996. I think I'd already done Conan. Okay. And so the fear of that format had abated a little bit. And they really went through my act and combed it out. And it was like, well, Dave doesn't like third references that are liquid.

You know? Oh, boy. Please don't talk about anything in the central time zone. Right, right. You know, they really combed it out. And I did the show, and it was completely fine. You know? It was so fine.

Right. It was a bee's nest of adequate. Right, right. You felt straightjacketed a little bit? Yeah, I know. I felt like I was in a coffin. And, you know, felt straight-jacketed a little bit? Yeah, I know. I felt like he was in a coffin. And, you know, it was fine.

He was very lovely. No one would think that I had bombed. I did well, but it was just there was nothing about it that was special at all. After you'd been looking

forward to it for so long. Yeah, and it was summer. You know, I got out of the theater. Most of my friends who lived in New York were not in town. They were, like,

on the road or something. And there was a lot of traffic, so I just walked back to my hotel, changed, went to the movies by myself that night and flew home the next day. It was just like, I did it. I did my life dream. Yeah. And that was it. And it was really, yeah, it doesn't, it's, yeah. Right, right. Yeah, I was on TV for five minutes at midnight. Yeah. But what was great about Conan's show when I first started doing it was, and it was Frank Smiley.

Frank Smiley. Yeah. And Paula Davis. Yes. Back then would go and watch. Yeah, and they trusted me. Comics. And they were, you know, I could, you know, because the format was looser and it was much more forgiving.

Yes, yes. And I was like, and I was, you know, kind of at the peak of my powers at that point. You know, I was like, I'm just going to tell this one story about trying to buy a car. Right. You know, does it have the, I can swear on this bike. Yeah. It's like, you say fuck?

Like, no. All right, we'll see you. Right. Yeah. And it was great. And, you know, and I had a, you know, it was really, really, really, really great. Oh, good.

You know, it's when you feel like I'm not a huge success. I've had a nice career. You're having a nice career. Having a nice career and people like me. But I was never like, you know, I'm still in the clubs, Mike. But I remember my first album and I was flying to New York to do Conan and promote my album. And I was like, okay, this is it.

That sounds pretty great. Yeah, no, that's how I felt like, yeah, this is, I'm here. This is showbiz. I'm here. Yeah, yeah, like exactly. Like, yeah, all right, I'll take that. I'll do that. And it never, I never lose it.

I remember the last time I did Conan, the only time I get nervous is when I'm backstage waiting to go on. On a show. Yeah, like to do a stand-up. Waiting for the curtain to open to walk out to your mark and start. I always think there should be like a Temple Grandin style tunnel funneling comics to the stage because that is the scariest part. The seal has been

broken on Temple Grandin references. Let's get busy. And they hug you as you go through and they hug you tightly. You're blindfolded and then yeah, they hug you and push you on the stage. Abattoir would be a good name for a comedy club. It would end

the irony. Yes. But Albert Brooks told a story about he was doing the Ed Sullivan show, and he was on the phone. I think it was live at that point. Yeah, I think that show was live. Or he was on the phone with a friend of his. Literally, he was on the green room, and they were getting ready to introduce him.

And his friend said, you've got to get off the phone and go do your thing. He's like, and he hung up, and then his friend saw him walk out on television. Wow. Oh, wow. And I always, and to be that cool about it, to be that nod in your head, that the trick that I learned is that I just pretend I'm him. Or I just pretend like when George Carlin was hosting The Tonight Show. He's on the show like 7,000 times.

He was just like sitting backstage waiting to go on, and then he's going to go do it and do a set, introduce Steely Dan, and drive back to Malibu. And I will literally just pretend I'm someone else. Like, what was it like for Carlin doing The Tonight Show in 1974? Right, right. And he's just hanging out, waiting to go on, smoking. Yeah.

Everyone's smoking inside. And then the next thing you know, you hear your name and you go out. So now you smoke. No, I smoke. And I'm a coke addict. It helps. There are always those comics who seemed unfazed by, you know, the red light of the camera coming on or just any club situation. They're like, meh, you know, and I always—

Sociopaths. Yes. I just wanted to hang out with the extremely insecure community. Well, this brings us to the horror story of my career. Your fear is that you're going to go out and forget your bit, that you're going to go out and go up on your line. On a TV, when you're doing a TV show. When you're doing a TV spot. When you're doing a TV spot.

It's the only fear. Like, I'm not, yeah, it's the only fear. Terrifying. And there's no reason to forget it other than now would be a terrible time to forget it. It's like, you know, it's like, you know. What's the worst thing that can happen? Now I'm going to do that. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

Like, you know, it's like, you know, you know, don't throw up during sex. Why did you say that? That's a new one. I'm going to add that to my list. Who would say that during sex? Don't throw up. What? You know, they'd always have bullet points.

On cue cards. Yeah, cue cards. And it's just like for people that don't know. I'm assuming everyone listening to this podcast knows. It's a cue card with, you know, if you're doing a set, it's like, divorced, wedding ring, roller coaster. The little bitch. Shark fin. Little nose for yourself.

This is next, this is next, this is next. Because when you're used to telling a long story and it's all disjointed, they pull apart all of those connective threads that lead you in. Like I do when I perform now on the road, I do an hour to 90 minutes depending on how much time I have available. I only need to know the first joke because that one leads to the second, which leads to the third. It's like acting in a play. Yeah. You know, I don't need to have it.

You know it's. Yeah, because, well, you're going to tell me the line, and I know the answer to that line. And what's awful in a play is when either you screw up or the other actor in the scene screws up, and their line throws you off what your line is, and then you're both drowning. Yeah. That's god-awful. Yeah, no, I don't know if you've ever been in that situation. I've read about a lot of it. That's not what you're supposed to be saying. I'm going to have a stress nightmare tonight.

Well, and you're also looking at each other and there's an audience here and you're in suits and you're hot and you have a microphone taped to your neck. At least you have company in a play. At least you're sharing it with someone. Yes, you're sharing it. Stand up.

So the set you were going to do on a show, it's taken out of context and probably cut down yeah it's the greatest hits it's the greatest hits of your current and it's all

you know you really whittle it down which is necessary for that format but you really whittle it it's like you know it's like an album cut

and a single you know a seven minute song is whittled down to two minutes 50. And I would always have bullet points that would lead me through it. And this one time, I don't know why I was just so fine with it. And it was, I was doing Conan a couple of years ago. It was a weird day on my way to the studio. I got pulled over and I didn't get a ticket. Like the guy let me go. Yeah. And it was just like, everything was just like a little.

So you felt untouchable. No, no. No, just the opposite. Everything felt off. Right, right. When you get pulled over, that's like, well, I wasn't planning on it. Right, yes, yes. And I'm going to the show and then.

So now all of a sudden you're wary about everything. I'm just weird. And for some reason, and to this day I don't know why, they said, do you want a bullet point? No, I'm fine. Which I've never done. And I don't know why I did it. Who are you channeling? Yeah, I don't know.

So JP offered the bullet points and you said no. Yeah, or usually you ask for them and they go, or either way. Right, right, right. It was the only time I'd never did it. Yeah. And I walked out and they introduced me and I pretended I was George Carlin in 1976. Right, right, right. Put out your cigarette.

I walked in, I did like one or two bits and then I just did not know what was next. Oh my God. I just dropped the thread. Oh. And you get a beat, usually it takes a beat and then it comes to you. Right. did not know what was next. Oh, my God. I just dropped the thread. And you get a beat. Usually it takes a beat, and then it comes to you. Right. Ocelots! Right, right, right, right.

Your big ocelot chunk. Nothing. Oh, God. Really nothing. And everything got... Well, then it just probably gets worse. Everything got... A panic attack.

Really slow. And I looked up at the audience and thought, my career is over. Oh, no. This is what it's like. And it was an out-of-body experience. I was like, this is what it's like. And the minute you acknowledge it's happening, you're dead. I bet you can remember every face in that audience.

And at one point I went, I don't know what's next. Oh, my God. I had to say it. Yeah. Oh, did you say it out loud? I said, I don't know what's next. And I bet that got a laugh. And that got a laugh.

And then, bam, it came back to me. Oh, no, I'm fine. Yeah, yeah. And I did it. And then I got a laugh, and then bam, it came back to me. Oh, no, I'm fine. Yeah, yeah. And I did it. And then I got through it. And literally, when it was done, Conan walked over, and you can see me going, it's like I hit somebody in the crotch. Yeah, yeah. I feel like I would-

I'm so sorry. I would rather have run over someone. Sure. You know? Yeah. Anyone. And Conan walked over to me, and I I said that's never happened to me before and he said

it was very sweet he goes thank god it happened here yeah that's true it's true you were among friends had me shot

and you can't tell because they they pulled it up they pulled it up yeah do they cut to an audience what if they had looped it no

can you just change the camera shot yeah it was very clean even in that pen I knew to get in clean yeah No, it's a reaction. Can you just change the camera shot? It was very clean. Even in that pen, I knew to get in clean. Did part of you want, can I get the original uncut? No, no, I don't ever want to look at it again.

It's awful. It's awful. Because however long that time was, it's just going to feel longer. No, it's like I did that. I was in a very bad car accident. Like there are things in my life that are just like moments that I don't want to think about it. Oh, my God. That's up there? Oh, yeah.

With the car accident? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. A bad car accident. Yeah, I broke a couple of bones. Oh, my God. And I broke my ribs on Bobcat Goldthwait. What?

Until that story. That's another story. That's the our accident. His bones are more solid than yours. We were trying to merge into a two-headed super comic. You have celebrity bone breaking. Yeah, but then so I did everybody was nice, but I literally did. I felt

like I'd run over somebody and everybody was like, oh, nobody cares. And Kylie was like, oh, it doesn't matter. No one will ever know. But's like, oh, nobody cares. Nobody cares. Yeah, yeah. And Kylie was like, oh, it doesn't matter. No. Yeah. I was like, no. No one will ever know. But to me, I was like, no, I failed.

Right. I failed. Of course. This is my job. How could I? So how did you deal with that? You just. I just felt awful.

I felt awful. And I was talking to my manager, whose father was Peter LaSalle who produced The Tonight Show. My manager is Tom LaSalle. And he's very familiar with – I would think so. Format. And when I told him what happened, he went, oh, God. Oh, no.

He didn't. You wanted him to make you feel better. Yeah, he did. Oh, God. It's really terrible. Oh, no. There's nobody. He's like, oh, no, you're finished.

No words. He had the same reaction I did. Oh, Jesus. I'd rather tell me you killed somebody. Oh, no. But I was really, really, really, really happy when I did the show again. Right. And didn't do that again.

Bullet points that time? Oh, yeah. Well, I bet your brain. I just hold the card. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah? Oh, yeah. Well, I bet your brain – I just hold the card in front of me. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And yeah, because I think there's sort of like a gunslinger. Yeah, I don't need it. Right, of course.

But then he's like, well, he has them. That's the one time. Everybody else has them. What can I have? Yeah. Because I'm a gunslinger. Because I'm a gunslinger. Yeah, and I don't know.

It is just one of those things where I can't. I was actually stunned when they booked me again. Oh, that's true. Because I was like, oh, yeah, but, you know, it's like if I was rational, I wouldn't be a comedian. Right, right, right. That's a great point. No, it's normal to think. Oh, I think your brain's always assuming, oh, I'm going to do something today to ruin every.

Yeah. 100%. 100%. All the time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like, oh, finally I've done something. I can really build, build a negative.

Yeah. Like I was like, there's no, yeah, there's no getting around it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I'm sure Conan and everyone is just like, oh. Oh, yeah. Anyone who performs.

Oh, everybody's right. Oh my God. Yeah. They're by the grace of God. And everyone's done that. Yeah. Oh my God. It is like, oh. Oh, yeah. Anyone who performs. Oh, my God. They're by the grace of God. And everyone's done that. Yeah. Oh, my God. It is like the dream.

It's like, you know, I'm sure you've had the dream where you're on stage with the Rolling Stones and you're holding a guitar and you don't know how to play. Yeah. Yeah. Right. I'm their roadie and I don't know where the guitars are. I haven't. Much lower stakes. Well, yeah.

My girlfriend who's, you know, she's not a girl. She's a woman. Okay. All right. I hate that. Real stickler. Say your lover. We like to say lover.

My lover. The keeper of my magic. Yes, exactly. G-Y-K. Spell the K. My adult female social companion slash cohabitant. She has the same attitude towards fighting that I have, which is it's not necessary.

Right. And it's miraculous. No, it's miraculous. It's miraculous and it's great, and I couldn't be happier as a human being. But things are piling up on the surface, right? You're not physically. You're still passive aggressive.

No, the only time I ever get shit is when I do something in a dream and then she was like I was stuck in a hurricane and you wouldn't help me because you were playing poker with a witch oh my god

there's nothing I can do about it that's really funny you know and she yeah no she this morning she was I had a dream

I was on stage and I had to play the drums and I didn't know how that's your fault too that was also your fault who doesn't know how to play the drums you hit the thing

it's something you've done it's unequivocally terrible Who doesn't know how to play the drums? It's something you've done that's unequivocally terrible. It's the evidence your brain has been looking for that you actually are terrible at what you do. You're not invulnerable. Because normally when you go on stage, you can be sick and you go on stage and you're not sick. Yes. The second you get up there, you're all of a sudden. Yeah, you're fine. And then you have all this energy for an hour afterwards.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And then you're sick again. And then you're sick again twice as bad. Worse. Yeah. Much worse. I had a panic attack on stage. Oh, wow.

And it wasn't that time. Tell us. No, that was in 1991. Oh, my God. And I was working like a dog, and I didn't have the best emotional state. I wasn't talking to a man in an office with a couch, tamping it all down. You weren't practicing self-care. No, I was not practicing. And I didn't have self-care.

I was raised in a house full of drunk people. Yeah. And that's sort of self-care. Yeah. Yeah, but I, well, no. That's what it used to be. You're absolutely right. You're absolutely right.

And I didn't drink. Right. And I was the only member of my family not practicing that form of self-care. Are you talking about siblings drinking too? And parents. Four siblings. You're Irish. Parents are a given. I'm not now trying to... But it was literally every adult

I knew. My dad was a bartender. Oh, get out. My brothers were older. I mean, literally, I didn't know people that were older than I was who weren't usually drunk. Wow. So yeah, literally, I didn't know people that were older than I was who weren't usually drunk. So, yeah, no, I went off into the world with an empty toolbox. So did you, I'm sorry, but you started comedy when you were 17.

Yeah. Did that also include you leaving your home? Yes. Ah. Yeah. Wow, that's quite a departure. No, and yeah, and I didn't have any tools. And I know, like, I'm still very good

friends with people that I knew from that period of time, like Kylie, Tom Kenny, who's now the voice of Spongebob. I've known Tom since those days. I was with him last night. Bobcat Goldthwait, same thing. Kozlowski. Yeah, Koz.

Yeah, I love Koz. You know, I was a train wreck and they and they are they are all like yes you were yeah yeah 100% 100%

you were tough to hang out with yeah I was I 100% was I just so what happened I was just a raw I was a raw nerve of a person right

yeah right a lot of wow and so eventually I wasn't taking care of myself and you would do these shows in San Francisco in those days

it was the like the peak of the comedy scene and the peak of my being the new hot guy. And I would do these runs of two weeks. I would headline Cobb's Comedy Club for two weeks. And it was 10 shows a week. It was Tuesday to Sunday. Wow.

Two shows Friday, three shows Saturday. Wow. And Cobb's was the big club. The big show. And you're doing an hour. You're doing 10 three shows Saturday. Wow. And Cobbs was the big club. The big show. And you're doing an hour. You're doing 10 hours on stage a week. Wow. And you just depleted.

And it was the second Saturday of a two-week run. And I just walked on stage and just started to have. And I'd never had a panic attack before. Yeah. And my heart just started to hammer. I thought I was having a heart attack before. Yeah. And my heart just started to hammer. I thought I was having a heart attack. And you were like 23 years old. Oh, my God.

No, but you were young. Yeah, no, I was 26. Wow. I was 26. Yeah. But I was already a well-seasoned headliner. Right, right, right, right. And I literally had, I just walked off stage.

Wow. And I walked off stage. Wow. And I walked off stage. How long had you been on? 10 minutes. But it was the first show and I had three that night. Oh no.

And I was just like, I don't know how I'm going to, and I literally, my heart just, you know, you get tunnel vision, your heart starts hammering and I just walked off stage

and the club owner said, who's on stage? I'm like, nobody. And I just walked into the. And the club owner said, who's on stage? I'm like, nobody. And I just walked into the men's room and just kind of for a couple of minutes. And then I kind of passed and I went back on stage. Oh, you went back on. I did.

And I just said, you know, I made up a. Diarrhea. I said I had to pee. I said I had to pee. I would rather have a heart attack than admit to diarrhea. Please. And the crowd was forgiving? Yeah, they were great.

No, I remember exactly what I said. I said, sorry, I just time go to the bathroom. And your choice is I leave for 30 seconds or I rush through the show. Right. And they were fine with it. Good recovery from a panic attack. But for me, it was awful because, you know, and this is a hundred years ago, but the invulnerability of being on stage was pierced.

And, you know, I've been doing comedy for nine years by that time. And that's when I started to get stage fright for the next two or three years. Oh, really? That's when I would have stage fright. Yeah. Because you never know, you feel like you're at the mercy of it. Yeah, you're at the mercy of it. And there was never a warning for it.

Yeah. And then I had to kind of deal. I worked with it until 1994 when I had a bad episode and ended up finally getting medicated for it. Right, right, right. And the shrink said, he goes, well, there's a reason the only member of your family who's not getting drunk has this issue. Right. Because you can medicate with a sledgehammer. Right.

Or you can medicate with a scalpel. Right. It's either one, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I, you know, I just started taking Zoloft and it's fine. That's great. Yeah. But it was.

You seem great now. No, I'm pretty functional. But it's. No, but. I'm pretty good. But it's pretty functional. You know, it's awful when the place where you feel like you're invulnerable. Right. And you're reminded, no, you're not.

Right, right. You know, it's a terrible, it's a terrible feeling. Well, can I ask you a question? This is neither the time nor the place. You're right. How dare you? Got him. How dare you?

Calumny, sir. Calumny. I'll put it down on paper. I'm just curious when you transition, or for a while you were writing for The Simpsons, and all your experience with stand-up and all of your highs and lows of stand-up and triumphs and scary parts.

How did that all come into play? There's a lot of things. Writing on a TV show. Oh, yeah. When was The Simpsons? It was an animated show. Oh, okay. When did you write on The Simpsons?

It's a foreign import. I was on from 2000 to 2008 seasons, 13 to whatever, 21 or something. And what had happened – yeah, I started off young and then in the 90s, like the mid – like 94 to 2000, I was a hot young comic. You know, working and I'd have a pilot hot young comic you know working I'd have a pilot every year you know and I was

you know I was guested on every sitcom like if you ever watch like any sitcom from the 90s it's just a matter of time before I show up

knock knock knock who is it oh my god Roseanne Seinfeld the nanny any eventually I

always the same character yeah no yeah always a neighbor baby face smug dick Nanny. Eventually I – Always the same character. Yeah, no, yeah. Always a neighbor. Baby face, smug dick. That's always me. Smug dick. Yeah, no, I was literally killing – I was Fragile Frankie Merman on Seinfeld. I was Jerry's childhood friend that gave him a van that he didn't want,

and I got sad and went into Central Park and dug a hole and hid in it. And that was the famous Seinfeld's van, son of Sam. You know how they sound alike. For sure. And I still get that. Oh, wow. I still get fragile frame. Yeah, yeah.

But, you know, I had a lot of pilots, you know, Dana. And, you know, yeah, I had. They just kept adding exclamation points. Yeah, I had – They just kept adding exclamation points. Yeah, exactly. The favorite one was Linwood Boomer, who – I came up with the name as a joke, and he insisted that we keep it. And I was like, no, this is a terrible title. And he's like, no, it's great. And it was the aptly named Nice Try. Bobcat had a special called

Don't Watch This Show. And we both like, yeah, we were wearing our self-esteem on our sleeves. But those titles seem like you're protecting yourself. Yeah, absolutely. It's a no-lose situation. I told you not to watch it. Totally. It's why comedians

tank auditions. Right. Because they're not in control like they are on stage. Totally. It's why comedians tank auditions. Right. Because they're not in control like they are on stage. So they go like, no, no, no, you're not going to tell me I'm no good. I'll tell you I'm no good. Right, right, right. Watch this. Robert Schimmel, rest in peace, told a story about an audition where he walked in and said, where do you want me to fail from?

And the director said, you just did. Oh, wow. And that was it. Oh. Wait, literally that? did. Oh, wow. And that was it. Oh. Yeah. Wait, literally that? I think so, yeah. But I know having now been on the other side of that process.

Right. They want you to be the person. They want you to eliminate any doubt from their mind. Yeah, and they want you to be the person because they're not there. As a comedian, especially, I think. I'm not an actor. I'm a comedian that learned how to act. Right.

I learned how to act long after I started professionally acting. Nice. Long time. Nice reading. You know, they want you to be – they're not judging you. They want you to be the person. So they're done. If you're the guy, I can go home.

Right. Exactly. Yeah. But it's a terrible – and auditioning has very little to do with acting. One is an art and one is a craft. I forget where we were going with this. Why didn't I bring a cue card shot? I know, I know.

I needed bullet points for this story. Well, you told the Schimmel story. Yeah, I told the Schimmel story about like. You were talking about pilots. Oh, the Sixth Sense. Yeah, you're talking about, yeah. You were talking about pilots. I was talking about, I had a lot of, yeah, I had a lot of pilots.

Yep. Always working with another writer and, you know, like Linwood and I came up with Nice Try. Linwood then went on to create Malcolm in the Middle. Then Jace Richdale and I came up with Dana. And then Jace went on to The Simpsons for a long time. Right. And then I, you know, I thought, well, I'd like to just try one. And I'd like to try to write one myself.

The Simpsons. Yeah. I'd like to try to write one myself. The Simpsons. Yeah. And it happened at a very interesting time. It was in the late 90s. I had just gotten engaged. Uh-huh. The comedy boom that I had surfed was just abating. Right. It was just kind of going fallow.

Right. I wrote this pilot, and it got picked up to get made. I wrote it, and then Jay Kogan, another Simpsons writer, came and we shot the pilot. It was called World on a String. It was a great premise. It was basically Seinfeld in the world of Pee Wee's Playhouse. Like it was a hyper reality but a very conventional sitcom set and a hyper reality. Yeah, it was really good.

I'm very proud of it. It's up on my Patreon page if you listen to my podcast. Which I only put up because Jake Hogan was just on my show. But I found that I really enjoyed writing. And I got a different sense. I'm telling you nothing you don't know. But I had a different sense of you, I'm telling you nothing you don't know, but I, I, I had a different sense of, uh, a satisfaction from it. And it is different. Yeah. I mean, obviously, cause it's

not just for you performing. Yeah. And it's just, and you can do something that seems like hard, like all of these pilots, like I was the young comedian. So we're going to set you up with an adult, you know, whoever it is, and you're going to set you up with an adult, you know, whoever it is. And you're going to come and watch you. And then you, they'll go away and do what an adult does. And then it will be handed to you. Type it into a word document. Yeah, exactly.

And we'll push you. But meeting a showrunner. Yeah. That's a weird marriage in a way, isn't it? It's almost like speed dating. It's awful. You have these meetings with the, and you have to see who you hit it off with. Yeah. It's almost like speed dating. It's awful, yeah. You have these meetings and you have to see who you hit it off with.

Yeah, it's terrible. And they were great. I mean, I'm friends with all of these people. Right. It's still a scary kind of proposition to go into, I think.

Yeah. Oh, it is. Yeah, and back then it was just like, because it was the height of Seinfeld and Friends and Everybody Loves Raymond and King of Queens.

It was just, if you're a comedian, it was just a money cannon. Yes. You know, they would just aim a money cannon at you every year. Right, right. So I wrote it, and I really enjoyed writing it. And then I was just about to get married. My fiance and I had just bought a house. The comedy boom was just abating.

And George Meyer, who was a guy I knew from – would come to these shows we would do, these alt shows called UnCabaret. And he was always there and I was one of the big figures in that scene. He knew my wife, who was an agent. And she said, yeah, Dana's looking to maybe do some writing. He really enjoyed it. And they said, would you like to come to The Simpsons and do a day a week just punching up jokes? Oh, wow. What a dream.

That's the dream job. Here's how clueless I was. But here's how clueless I was. Well, I can only do it on Monday or Tuesday. Because then I've got to go on the road and be a star. And they went, okay. Oh. And so, and then one, you know, I worked, I'd go on every Tuesday and I learned how the show worked.

And the algorithms of the jokes. Right. Because it's not, it's very specific. Yeah, there is a formula. And the formula is what you think is the punchline of the joke is actually the setup to the better joke. Ah, right. Oh, yeah. And then after a couple of months, one day, Mike Scully, who ran the show, came in and said, hey, I think your contract is up.

And I literally started to gather my stuff, like, I'm so sorry, Mr. Scully. And he went, you want to just come every day? Oh. And I said, yeah. And he went, all right, I'll call your agent. And then he looked over his shoulder and went, sucker. And I was there for seven or eight years. And by the way.

It goes fast, I bet, right? It does, but Mike is really, because I have since gone on to run shows. And I really learned how to do that with Mike. And then Al Jean, who came in after Mike. Because when you're a writer and you're being creative and you're also in a place of authority. Right. I've seen people really like being in charge.

Yes. I'm the boss. Yes. And Mike and Al were both – they wore – they wear the authority very easily. Right. It's like they're really there to be funny. Right. Yeah.

You know. Their ego is checked. Yeah, their ego is checked. And I really took that into my career doing that. And I'm very grateful to them for setting such a great example. Yeah. Because it is when you're running a show, it's like, yes, you're a comedy writer and you're also managing a chain of convenience stores. Yeah, it's two completely different parts of your brain comedy writer, and you're also managing a chain of convenience stores. Yeah, it's two completely different

parts of your brain. Yeah, and it's all day on the phone, and trucks, and personnel issues. Yeah, managing personalities. It's herding cats. And not being able to gossip about all the great stories you're hearing.

I know. Because you're in charge. Being an adult. Exactly. And, yeah, so I was very grateful to that. And in my time on The Simpsons, you know, I got married. And, you know, when I left the show, I had, you know, children and a house. And, you know, it's like I became an adult. I walked in.

Right, right. And I walked out a grown-up. Oh, yeah. Well, because you And I walked out a grown up. Oh, yeah. Well, because you had this career doing comedy. Yeah. And kind of, yes, you're always working and all these great things are happening. But here was like almost maybe your first steady job. No, it was my first real job.

So you laid down all these foundations. Yeah. But what I did do was I stepped away from my standup career. Right. Right when the second comedy wave took off. And specifically, I remember when Patton and Brian Posehn and Zach Galifianakis and Maria Bamford were doing the comedies of comedy. I was like, they're doing my – I should be on that. Why aren't I in that?

Right, right, right. And I just had to go, hmm. Because you were a homeowner. Yeah, and I had kids. You wanted to have kids. Yeah. But I just had a homeowner. Yeah, and I had kids. You wanted to have kids. But I had a parking space. I had a badge that got me onto the lot. I had an office.

So you stopped doing stand-up? I never stopped doing it. The longest I did was – I didn't go on the road at all because you work at the Simpsons 50 weeks a year. It's like working on Kony. You don't have like a five, six-month hiatus. No. You take two weeks off as a vacation.

Right. And you're there all the time. So I couldn't go on the road. Yeah. I would do sets. But it's different. Yeah, and I was tired. Yeah.

Yeah, I would do sets, but I was tired and fat. And you had this other focus now. Yeah, and I just became an adult. And so I kind of had two stand-up careers. Because then after I left the show and went to go back to it, I wasn't sure if anybody knew who I was. I didn't know if I could just call into the room. Am I going to have to audition at the improv again? I just didn't know. But you think, oh, yeah, I had a body of work.

I had albums. Right, right. You just assume, well, no one remembers. It's been a body of work, I had albums and you just assume, well, no one remembers. It's been a couple of years. Fortunately, they did. But I remember going back and doing Conan again the first time after the break. Yeah, it was huge for me.

That was like, okay, I'm back. Yeah, yeah. And you had earned your way back there. I had earned my way back and I did feel like I was myself again. It really started, not doing stand-up, really started to eat at me, especially towards the end.

Like after the kids get settled and they're in school. It did start to eat at me. I felt like I was at a party and someone said, are you Dana Gould? And I said, I used to be. And my wife said, it's time for you to go.

Did she really? Leave the show and go. Get back out there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's time. It's time, yeah. I was really lucky that I kind of was able to go back. Yes.

Do you feel like working on The Simpsons and learning, like you were saying, all these ways to write jokes for that show. Learn how to write period. Yeah. Yeah. How has that affected or not affected your second renaissance as a comedian? Yeah, I think it's, you know, I'm a much better comedian than I was before. Yeah, that's cool.

Yeah, just being around minds like that. Right. People like George Meyer and Tim Long, Matt Selman, and these writers at the show that are just so sharp and it seems very intimidating. Trying to make

other comedy writers laugh is the hardest thing. Well, that was the great thing about The Simpsons 2 is like you're in a room and it's the same with you guys. Oh, yeah. Thank you. Thank you. No, not now, 2 is like you're in a room with – it's the same with you guys. Oh, yeah. Thank you.

Thank you. No, not now. But like when you're in the room, it's like you're in the room with 12, 10 or 12 really funny people. Yes, we are. And the room jokes are at a high level. Yes. You can never, ever air any of those. No, no, no.

Everyone would be out of a career. I walked into a writer's meeting this morning. I came in four minutes late. There was already a riff that you could tell started the second the meeting started because it was already off in some... Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sure, sure. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I will... Trying to play catch up. 9-11 happened while I was at the Simpsons, and the staff ended up at my house, and we ended up watching it all. We didn't not make jokes. Yeah. Of course.

On the day. Wow. Yes. In between Tower 1 and Tower 2 falling. Yeah, in between towers. There were plenty of jokes. But the weirdest thing happened. My wife and I had gone on vacation to Bora Bora, which was surreal. So nice.

They named it twice. Yeah. And we come back, and I'm like, God, I'm so relaxed. This is the most relaxed I've ever been in my life. Let me mark the date so I know how long I've been in this world. September 10th 2001 oh my god

okay good back to work tomorrow so relax and that was still the last time you've been back turn on the television yeah

so the day happens and we realize I call and I was like no no it's coming some people are here already but they're leaving and I was like

well we're just here and I was kind of centrally located so everybody comes over my wife goes I go they're all going to come over. And she goes, we don't have any food because we've been on vacation. Yeah, yeah.

Right. And we'd be like, oh, crap. And now you're hosting a party. So I run. Yes, yes. I run to, we live behind the Chateau Marmont. Oh, yeah. I ran to the Rock and Roll Ralphs on Sunset.

Oh, yeah. And it was, now it's the morning. It's like 11 o'clock that morning. Yeah. And it's a ghost town. Yeah. Because everybody's watching television. Everyone's glued to the television. And I run into Ralph's, and it's empty.

And I get a bunch of like hot dogs and potato chips, and I'm checking out. And this guy. They have a cookout. And the guy in the room. A 9-11 cookout. He went, oh, man, you're having a party. I was like, what are we? We're just watching the disaster, that's all. Oh, my God. But it was, yeah, man, you're having a party. We're just watching the disaster.

That's all. Oh, my God. But it was – yeah, no, it was really surreal. Yeah. It was really surreal. But, yeah, they're brutally funny people. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and then when I get out, when I left, I thought I was a much better writer than I went in. And then I got

a job acting on a show called Mob City, which was a, written and produced by Frank Darabont. It was the first thing he did after The Walking Dead. And it was set in the, because I was, you know, I figured I'd write a show and I'd be, I didn't know what I was going to do. I was, I wrote a couple

of movies because I was, my wife by that time had a giant TV exec job and I was home and hanging out with the kids and writing movies and doing stand-up and kind of loosey-goosey and then I get cast in a show playing a 1940s LAPD detective.

Like a serious online run. And I'm just like, I was on Seinfeld. So I call a friend of mine, Todd Stashwick, who's a really great actor. Oh, Todd Stashwick. Yeah, he knows that. He used to be on Late Night in a lot of sketches. Yes.

He's a great actor. But he's a great actor, right. Great actor. A real actor. We used him all the time. And he was a Second City guy. And he moved out to LA and we were really bummed out. Oh, yeah.

Okay, so great. Because we lost him. Right, but you know exactly who I'm talking about. Yeah. So I call Todd and I go, he played my brother in a pilot. And I call him up and I go, how did you learn to really act? And he just went, Leslie Kahn. Oh.

So I go, okay. Yeah, she's an acting teacher. Yeah. So I go to Leslie Kahn and I sit and I go, all right. She goes, let's do this scene. I get up on a line and goes I'm gonna stop you right there and she said you're gonna be really

easy to fix because you're doing everything perfectly wrong oh that's great we're just the mirror opposite and you'll be

you'll win an Oscar but she just went like what she did to me in terms of it was like a sock like she reached into the bottom of the sock grabbed the toe

and pulled it back and then it was it was no longer inside out. Oh, good. How close was this pilot you had to shoot coming up? Oh, no. I'd shot the pilot. Oh. Oh.

Okay. It had gone to series. Okay. And I had to do some real acting. Yeah? Yeah. Guy got shot and was in the hospital bed and had to be upset. You have to pull on those personal memories from your childhood.

And it was, yeah, and there was, you know, John Bernthal was in that cast. Oh, wow. And that was a real cast. Everyone who was killed off from The Walking Dead. Yeah, everyone who was killed came up. Yes. Yeah.

Yes. And I'm blanking on his name. The old gentleman. Oh. Yeah. Yes. And I'm blanking on his name. The old gentleman. Oh, actually, no. The old. With the beard. Yes. The man with all the gravitas.

Yes. He played my boss on Mob's Hand. Oh, my God. He played my boss. And there was a scene where he had to visit me in the hospital and I thought I was going to die and I didn't die. And I had to be emotional. And when I was done, he looked at me and goes, what do you know?

The kid's got it. So I felt like, yeah, it was really great. Well, you know the Seth, I know we need to go, but you know the Seth MacFarlane story. I don't. Oh, well, it's thematic. Seth MacFarlane had to get from Boston. He is from, yeah, Massachusetts. Right.

He had to get to LA for a table read for the family guy. And he was late for the flight. And he said, I got to get to LA for a table read for the family guy. And he was late for the flight. And he said, I got to get on that plane. Can you bring the jetway back? And they go, no, it's pulled away from the jetway. He goes, I know, but I have to. He said, can you bring the jetway back? He said, I got to get on that plane because it hadn't taxied out yet.

But they pulled the jetway back. And he went, I'm sorry. Once the jetway's done. But I'm a TV producer. I have a table read. I have to get back to LA. I'm sure that worked. Yeah.

And they're like, I'm sorry. I can't do it. And as a result where you have to get back to LA. I'm sure that worked. Yeah, and they're like, I'm sorry. I can't do it. And as a result, he didn't get on flight 11. What? Oh, man. And I said to him, like, do you think about that every day? He went, no. Oh.

It's just numbers, math. Oh, my God. He would have been part of your 9-11 party. Yeah, he could have been. But to him, it's like he doesn't – and I know him. He just has this high-functioning mind. And to me, I still like – I'll think about that and I'll just go, I don't know. Oh, God.

I would have so much guilt about it. Yeah, no, I know. I know. Yeah, no, I know. We'll be back with more hilarious 9-11 stories. Well, we do sort of joke about how – I mean, we end up at 9-11 on most. Oh, as do I. And this is our second season.

So it's exciting to see that it's carried over. It's kind of a through theme. Oh, yeah. It always comes up. It always comes up. And organically. I mean, it's not. Well, here's a weird thing.

Okay. So this is the thematic. This is really a weird through line. So I wanted to do a book. One of these – it's one of those things I've always wanted to do. I'm never going to do is of comedian set lists, just pictures of comedians. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's great.

Back to the bullet points. And I'd like to get – like I know like Rainn Pryor and Kelly Carlin. Like, do you have any of your dads? That would be amazing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, I was with Stephen. I used to open for Stephen Wright a lot. And I used to have a bit in my act where I would say, like, you can joke about anything. It's not what you're laughing at.

It's not the subject. It's what you're laughing at. Right. You know, and to prove my point, I'm now going to tell some jokes about AIDS, rape, and 9-11. So my set list started with AIDS, rape, 9-11. And Stephen Wright saw it and he goes, what is this? I go, it's my set list. And he just picks it up and he looks at it and he goes, that's amazing.

He couldn't get over it. I'm so glad you're opening for me. He couldn't get over it. It's the trifecta. Yeah. It was a little like AIDS, rape, 9-11, get over it. It's the trifecta. Yeah. No, it was, yeah, it was like a little like AIDS, rape, 9-11, suicide.

Wow. It was like this terrible time. Those are usually closers, not openers. Yeah, no, I wanted to get right, I wanted to get right in there. But the whole point of it was, it was not,

it was inoffensive jokes about everything. Yeah. It was like, I'm not going to do my act, but. Well, people can get your album. Yeah, you can hear it. That's right

well and okay so you have the Dana Gould hour yes your podcast is there anything else

you're promoting right now well there's a couple things Bobcat Goldthwait and I just did a tour together and we shot it

and we're and it's we were we were going to film a special we we did this tour where we would go on stage together and each of us do our own acts.

But it was like a duet. Like I do a thing and it would lead to something that he wanted to do. And I would literally step back and he would step forward. And we developed this thing very organically. We just wanted to go on the road together because we'd make some money and we wouldn't be alone. Not even on stage. Yeah, no, it was great. It was really great.

And we were very close. He's a great guy, and we had a blast. And so we were going to film it last August, and we were quite literally pulling into the theater, and we got T-boned by a guy doing about 55. Oh, so that accident yeah we were both in the back seat uh this car and we were only going a couple of blocks so we weren't wearing our seat belt and we get thrown into each other and we broke our ribs on each other oh my god um and uh so the the now you're really best friends uh yeah no no, we really are. And then we went, we shared an ambulance ride. Wow.

And then, so we did just film it. We did Atlanta, Athens, and Asheville, North Carolina in these small theaters. We filmed us going to the gigs, talking about our friendship, talking about how we used to hate each other. Exactly. Because when he met me, I was an 18-year-old sociopath. Right, right, right. And we were too much like each other to not hate each other. And we have since become incredibly close,

and we have footage of us in the hospital together. Oh, wow. So we're cutting it. I'm not a filmmaker. He's directed a lot of stuff. Yeah, he. So we're cutting it. Bob's a – I'm not a filmmaker. Bob is. He's a director and a lot of stuff. Yeah, he's a brilliant director. And we're cutting it into a weird sort of like road documentary special. And I'm –

Cool. It sounds really good. Yeah. You know, I'm writing a couple of things. Great. Well, oh, and one other thing we always ask our guests is if you had one piece of advice for someone who might want to do what you do. Who's starting out.

Who's starting out. Now. Yeah, I have. In this day and age. Well, it's the same advice I always give to people, which is, you know, do what you like. Do what you think is funny. Yeah. Don't chase the market.

Right. The only time I have gone out with a show, and I've had a nice career, the only time I completely whiffed with everybody, like when you pitch it to 10 places and you don't get a nibble, was when I was cynically chasing the market, like, this is what they want. I need a vampire show. It was like, yeah, blue collar animated. There it is. Right, yeah, blue collar animated. Yeah, yeah. There it is. Right, right, right.

And you have to do it because they don't know what they want until you tell them what they want. Yeah. That's good advice. And things lead to things. Do something. Do a podcast. Do an open mic. Get out there.

Yeah. Get out of your goddamn house. Don't wait to be asked. Yeah, and just, yeah, go do stuff. And I got on The Simpsons because I performed it on Cabaret. Right. I got on Mob City because I did my friend's short movie that Frank Darabont was also in. Right.

And, you know, it's just. Almost as a favorite of yours. But you did this movie. Yeah, no, I did it. My friend Greg Nicoteroero who's a big guy in The Walking Dead as well did this short

horror movie that I'm in and Frank was in and we hung out for the day and he thought of me when he was doing Mob City

things lead to things things lead to things things lead to things things lead to things thank you so much Dana thank you I've had six I've had six panic attacks

all of them on cards. Ah, that was fun. That was great. That was a nice trip down memory lane. It was, too, a few weeks ago when we could all hang out. And he, again, has had just a really cool comedy career. Oh, yeah. I mean, he's been a successful touring stand-up comic for decades.

That's really hard to do. Well, we hope you have a good week. Yeah, have a really good week. I mean, just go for it. You know, just grab life by the... Dance like nobody's watching. Because nobody is watching. Tomorrow's the first day of more of the same.

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