Inside Conan: An Important Hollywood Podcast - Kevin Dorff Revisits Old Timey Baseball

Episode Date: February 18, 2022

Writer Kevin Dorff joins Mike Sweeney and Jessie Gaskell to discuss how a newspaper clipping inspired the fan-favorite Old Timey Baseball remote, the key to filming a great remote piece, why Bob Newhart was perfect for Conan’s running gag at the Emmy’s, and the inside story of Kevin’s appearance on The Mandalorian.Plus, we hear from Nell Del Giudice, the scene-stealing colonial wife from the Old Timey Baseball remote!Got a question for Inside Conan? Call our voicemail: [phone] and e-mail us at [e-mail]

And now it's time for Inside Conan, an important Hollywood podcast. Hello, welcome to Inside Conan, a very, very, very, very important Hollywood podcast. Oh man, I can't emphasize that enough. We cannot overstate the importance. I'm Mike Sweeney. I'm Jesse Gaskell. And we're going through Conan's illustrious television career. Without his permission.

Without his permission. Pretty much. The unauthorized biography. Yeah. This is like the Ryan Murphy version. Yeah, I just started watching that Pam and Tommy show. I think I had assumed that that was a Ryan Murphy joint. Oh, it seems like it would be. It's not, weirdly.

Is that a multi-part? Because you can't, there's no way you could do their story in one episode. In just one episode. Oh, my God. No story in one episode he does a lot of drumming she does a lot of running that's multi-seasons at one point my boyfriend and i looked at each other and we were like wait what what band was he in i mean i know that he's in a band but i just don't know any of their music at all. All I ever think about him is he wrote a memoir, and we got an advanced copy back at late night, and everyone zeroed in on, it might have been the first chapter

where he talked about the importance for men who are sexually active to eat a ton of celery. I've never heard that before. Yeah, because he said it is critical to to prodigious semen production oh okay production of semen which is a good thing um for him it was well he knew he'd be it would when it's going to be in movies with your wife quantity over quality it sounds like he was and so i learned a lot. I learned about the celery and I learned that there was supposed to be a lot. I didn't know about the quantity aspect.

No, I didn't either. I would assume everyone would be happy with less. With less. Exactly. That's kind of, yeah, that seems ideal unless you're really into impregnating people. I'm sorry to veer off into that area, but... Why would you ever apologize... You're right. ...for giving people life tips like that? It's true. I guess my big question is, how do they cover that in the show you're watching?

They haven't gotten there yet. Really? Uh-huh. You don't? Just go back and watch... But I'm sure they will. ...the episode and see if he's just chewing he's eating celery yeah he drinks a lot of bloody marys yeah do i sound different though um

because i'm i'm somewhere else right now yeah where are you well i mean you like to know okay okay nice try i'm not just gonna let it slip out like that. All right. Okay. No, I'm in another hotel room. And you're working on the same movie. I'm working on the same movie, but I'm in a different place now. A different city. All right. So I'm going to start a new set of clues.

Okay. The last place. So I don't think you gave city hints. You gave. That's a good point. But now you're in a city. So that's a clue. Well, yeah, maybe that's enough of a clue. The city speaks for itself. Well, I'll give another clue. Here's another really helpful clue.

Okay. This city has a river. Oh, okay. The city was built on a river, unlike most other modern cities. So that narrows it down to 400 4 890 i think just about every city yeah every metropolis even la which is on the ocean has a river la has a great la was built around a river which they cleverly filled in with cement they did but then there's this spot of the la river that where the cement didn't take and it eroded away and now nature has reclaimed it. And it's very beautiful.

Right. And now they're trying to extend that. Yeah. When I saw Terminator 2, there's that crazy chase scene down through the culvert. Yeah. I was thinking of Grease. They do a car chase through the culvert too.

Oh, they do? I never saw the movie grease what yeah oh wow okay yeah yeah i'm sorry hard to believe i know you're such a rush out musical head yeah yeah i love musicals um i don't mind musicals but yeah and then i move here and i'm like wait that's the la river yeah what were they thinking now there's this yeah there's this gorgeous stretch i went kayaking along the la river oh yeah you can do that yeah was it worth it or was it it was so worth it it was really fun and um there were actual like little rapids it was kind of thrilling yeah okay there were rapids there was white water yes for real it was, I'm not kidding. You have to do it. Do they have a fan or something to make the wrap?

No. Okay. It's a rushing river and it's trees and you see a lot of egrets and herons and stuff. I'm talking about Los Angeles. Yes, that's what I'm talking about too. Down in Frogtown. Oh, Frogtown. It was awesome.

Yeah, I saw that. I guess I remember doing it on the guanus canal in brooklyn so i thought yeah did you see body parts floating no i didn't do it my wife did it and uh she literally i think they went in the back of like one of those italian social clubs and all the all these guys were out in the back kind of just glaring at them like, what the fuck? Yeah. Gentrifiers. Our canal. Kayaking.

Right. Oh, yes. You're in a city on a river. I'm in a city on a river. Well, I'm going to keep giving hints about my location. Okay. The nearest dry cleaner to me has a signed headshot of Kate Flannery and Dee Schneider. Oh.

Yeah. So that's a hint. See if you can figure out where I am as well. I love that that's still a thing because it's such a cliche, but people are still- The signed headshot? Yeah, the signed headshot thing. Yeah, I know. Well, especially in, well, the name of the cleaners is, I think it's called Celebrity Cleaners. Oh, there we go. So yeah, showbiz is their thing. I think their thing

is everyone who works there was a former celebrity. So that's a good place to go after. Yeah. You know what? This has been great. Let's get to our guest. Yes, please. Let's get to our guest yes please let's get to our guest he was a writer for conan yes from 2000 to 2008 and uh a big part of the show he's appeared in so many different sketches played a lot of great characters on the show and he came up with ideas for some of the iconic sketches on conan yeah and he was the writer who went along with Conan for the classic old-timey baseball remote. So we're going to get to talk to him about that. Because people are always asking about that remote. It's so many people's favorite Conan remote, including Conan. Yeah. And our next guest remembers all the details of how that came about and how it was made.

So we're excited to talk to him and catch up with him. Please welcome the hilarious and talented Mr. Kevin Dorff. Well, it's great to see you again. Hello. Right on. Thanks. Yeah. Kevin, when you hopped on, you immediately had a Sweeney impression that I hope will come out at some point during the podcast.

See if I can do it, if he's into it. Oh, my God. If you do it, I won't even have to talk. It would be fantastic. It's not like none of our, whether it's Sweeney or me or whatever, like, or any of us really, like, we don't really have impressions. We just have versions. Yes, I know. They're not impressions. It's an homage. Right, right, right. And it's not the way the person sounds.

It's the way we hear them. Exactly. So that's the important part. Yeah, because your impression only comes out when it's bad news is being broken. I don't have a Sweeney giving good news. I don't have a chunk of Sweeney congratulating me. I don't have one. Just Sweeney telling you it's cut.

We've been talking about Conan's 28 years on Late Night, and you were such an integral part of the aughts. The aughts. I believe you started in 2000, right? Yeah. So we'd love to talk about your time at Late Night, starting with how you came upon the job. I started on September 11th of 2000. Wow. A date that means nothing.

I've been working on trying to be on the show for probably about a year, written a few submissions, because there had been a little bit of turnover in 99. There was some changes. People were moving. Andy had gone off the show. And Tommy Boccia, I think, also left the show around then. And there was just some turnover. And it was just a quick period of like that. So I had a chance to write more than one submission. And I think the third time I had that chance I I got farther than I

expected and after uh maybe just not very long by me a week or two after I left Second City I'd already I had been there for about four years that's where I knew John Glazer from because we had both been in the same cast a few years previously so me and John Glazer were already really good friends and that's also where I knew brian stack from and stuff so i had left second city and then just just so happened that that there was an opening and i my submission was successful and i was hired and like i said just to write about the beginning of september of 2000 and it wasn't very long after that that that the head writer uh Mr. Groff, was moved on to do other stuff in LA and then became our head writer.

Well, Kevin, you brought something up that I don't know if we've talked about on the podcast, but I remember at some point finding out that I think most of the Conan writers when I was there had submitted more than once. So we didn't get hired the first time we submitted and kept trying and i think that that's kind of important for people to hear because sometimes people get that first rejection and they think okay well never mind it wasn't meant to be sell insurance yeah you just gotta keep trying if yeah if there was anything i could say that would be to sort of adjust it for people who who are listening to think about submitting the shows i do have one thing i would think which is you it won't it likely won't happen the first

time you submit to a show but if you care about the show and you think it's relevant to you and you see a way into it if you get that first submission doesn't work for you you just you could kind of in a way double down on your own voice and see if you can still uh try another one later on where your your voice is even more present and maybe even and this is a weird paradox but more more of your voice more of the show at the same time yeah like try to match see if you can match the key that they're in. And also like, this is, I think an important thing, which I think helped me, but I don't know, was also make that whatever your submission is, try to make it a little funkier than what they do.

So maybe not something that they would put on, but something that is aspirational. Okay. We pull back from that. We won't do that in particular thing. Yeah, I think maybe adding a new flavor, but something that still is going to go well with the dish. So it's not going to totally throw the show off to have you, but it is going to bring something new that they don't already have. And by new, maybe it'll surprise them. Yeah, we might not use this, but I could see this being pitched or tried or whatever.

It'd be cool in its best version to see that happen. That would be funny and made them laugh or whatever. But to the submitter, I would say one more thing is like, yeah, you want to be more you in the next one and more them in the next one at the same time. That's not easy-huh that's not easy to do but that's it's just not an easy process so no i had read that you're one of your favorite pieces kevin to produce was old timey baseball which is a sketch that a lot of people still really love and has gotten a ton of views online and has had a life beyond when it aired i think that's like everyone's favorite like when everyone says their favorite remote has gotten a ton of views online and has had a life beyond when it aired.

I think that's like everyone's favorite, like when everyone says their favorite remote piece, field piece from Late Night, that one is at the top of the list. And I, including, I believe it's Conan's favorite. Oh, yeah. That makes sense. And people really would love to know about the genesis of that bit. I don't remember the details. Amazing, because you were there the entire time. Well, I know. More than one thing to know about the genesis of that bit. I don't remember the details. Amazing, because you were there the entire time. No, I know. More than one thing to think about. Exactly. But how it came to be?

Some fella had reached out to me, you, and some other writers, Mike, about two years ago, and asked us to write about the different bits and stuff like that. I wrote an email to him, and they published it without correcting for grammar. Well, that sounds like the internet. But I wrote it quick because I wanted to get it exactly as it was coming out of my head. And I just sent it off without proofreading it too much. And he left out all the parts about who gets the credit for this idea. So I want to hopefully do not, please do not edit this bit.

Our brilliant stage manager, Steve Hollander. Edit. Hold for edit. Yeah, sorry, go ahead. Brilliant, hyper-competent, incredibly patient, kind, wise, funny, Steve Hollander. Yeah. Brought a news clipping in

from some Long Island newspaper about the Beth Page baseball recreation 1860s 1867 baseball 1864 baseball recreation he brought that

in he showed it to me and I immediately took it to my and pitched this idea of Conan going out to play with them. And it happened really fast. Mike went into Conan's office about it within an hour or so, and probably less than an hour after Steve had showed me the clip, and we were already talking with Jason Chal your way about yeah yeah about what how we could get this to happen because we had a sort of a monday off or something coming up where conan was going to be available for remote it was coming up soon too within a week or less than 10 days or something so it came together quick and the people who were really great about helping getting started

were of course hollander because it was it was just helping getting started were, were of course, Hollander. Cause it was, it was just clipping. That's great. And then of course, Sweeney helped by pitching it to Conan and Conan went for it. And then Jason Chalemi really took,

put things into gear, talk to the people at Beth page. And he was our field producer. He's great. Yeah. His name hasn't come up yet in your, Oh, we talked about it.

Yes. But okay. Each episode needs to stand alone. You're right... Okay. Each episode needs to stand alone. You're right, man. It's got to stand alone. No, but yeah, sorry. Yeah, I didn't mean to interrupt, but Jason back then was producing all the field pieces.

And then Mike asked me who would be a good person to take along. And I was like, well, an avid baseball fan would be a good thing. And so Mike picked Michael Gordon, who, if there was an avid baseball fan on the show, he would be the most. Yes. So that was a really great choice, too. And of course, the experience, again, I wasn't, I think we did this in 02 or 03, maybe? Ah, maybe 03? Something like that.

I wasn't, I was still fairly new. So having someone like Michael to help me do it was great. Because we produced a lot of stuff. Very organized, very much a list maker, and very thorough. Very organized. In a way that I wasn't, and that was a good mix. And when we got to Bethpage, things really, I can tell you more about that in a minute if you have questions. But it started with Steve Hollander bringing in

that clip. Oh, that's great. Yeah. Michael Gordon is so baseball obsessed. He's an Astros fan because he grew up in Houston, but he actually follows all of their farm clubs and keeps track of players who they draft and who are moving up through the ranks. So I'd say fairly hardcore baseball fan. Yeah. And a staff that had a lot of baseball fans that he was the superlative. So yeah, it was great. Yeah. Hollander is a big baseball fan too. Giant Mets fan. And it's just great to see that that was going to happen. Yeah. There was a feeling going in that we were going to have a really good time because here's another bit of,

this is deep background. Welcome to deep background with Mike Sweeney. With Kevin Dore. There had been a sort of a long time. There'd been this circulating concept, a civil war recreation. Right. And that had circulated forever.

And Conan's very oversubscribed to the civil war in general and that had circulated forever and conan's very over subscribed to the civil war in general so yeah i think he had a discomfort with it you know kind of in a way because it was sort of like well it's a gigantic catastrophe like the civil war is a huge catastrophe and it's not easy to be funny about right especially if you kind of like know about it he eventually got over that but yeah i know but this was a long time ago yeah no i know yeah tender about the thing i think that there was reluctance to do anything that was just centered on that but this brought the unholy matrimony of baseball and the civil war into play which ended up being a huge boom. And on the subject of costumes, you know, one of the first things that came up in when

me, Michael, and Michael spoke about it, and Chalemi, was that he would make a transition into being one of the players. And that was brought about, that costume and the hair and makeup was brought about by Deb Shaw and Bruce. And it was done very well. Oh, yeah. All the departments were fabulous. Yeah, perfect. I like when you go to hair and makeup and it's like, we need mutton chop, sideburns, and mustaches, some choices.

And then they would bring in literally 30 different mustaches to choose from there was no exaggeration they had the great choices right away easy to make the baseball uniform was fantastic it was just it came together beautifully and like i said we it wasn't like we weren't sitting on this for a month like we got out pretty quick within three or four or five days the second like you're saying it was a you know, combination of the civil war and baseball. And the second Conan heard the idea, I think he pictured himself in a ridiculous costume like that. It was just like, let's do it immediately. Like he's already channeling the character. I was just making reference to that. I think it was before we started,

but it's when that person, when the principal feels prepared, or even if they're not, but if they feel that they're prepared, then they are. Yeah. The Dick Nixon quote is when the president does it, it's legal. And I think that's true of these remotes. If Conan is feeling it and can see his place in it, and this is the thing that I told the guy a couple years ago when he was writing that article, that retrospective piece, was if he can see himself working in it, if he can see himself arming himself with something to do, then you should be fine. That's all you really need to go. And then, as it turns out, we discovered someone there that really made that work. Yeah. And I was wondering, had Chalemi or anybody talked to any of the people there in advance?

I mean, did you kind of have an idea of who the characters were that were there? Pretty generally, Chalemi had done most of the, I mean, all, let's get serious. He had done all of it. Sweeney didn't do this. No. Chalemi and i didn't because i wasn't given anyone's name or phone number so so let me really uh kept his cards very close to the vest and he spoke to the people at beth page and he had a lot going on and then he scored their glossary which conan uses in the remote a glossary of of of 18th century terms and and slang and he scored a copy of that

and uh he kept that one in his pocket didn't bring it out to the last minute i never knew of its existence and it was great we had all these surprises that's great yeah it was it was really great and um and you know it was just kind of good because everybody was working in their own way, in their own, you know, well-motivated way to, like, make it good. And, oh, meanwhile, I was working on something that went nowhere. Oh, no. Yeah, it was great. I asked Pierre Bernard to come up with some big art cards that had complicated Thomas Nast-type political cartoons on them.

Uh-huh. That would have been really topical in 1864. Pierre is one of our graphic artists. Stand-alone. Pierre, for everyone. Stand-alone episodes. Stand-alone episodes. So Pierre, very patiently and very artfully,

recreated all these incredibly top heavy, you know, complicated, indecipherable things, you know, of 19th century politicians, you know, boss tweet, putting a bag that says, you know, bonds inside of a machine that says, you know, whiskey ring. Right. You know, like, it's just like all that stuff. Right, right. And super complicated. And I was like, oh, this is gonna be great. You can ask the baseball players what these cartoons mean. Make them stick to their pretense that they're living in the Civil War era. Can you explain what's going on? Right.

Can you explain why Clement Vlandingham is standing on top of a snake that says liberty? Or whatever. And I brought the art cards with me to the ballpark and everything and they just stayed in the van this is like you didn't want to derail everything to be like hold on hold on oh no i wanted to do it oh but kona was like no we're not stopping off for your dry fest. We're doing this. Interrupting all the mojo we've got going. I know.

I guarantee the first person you saw when you returned to 30 Rock was Pierre going, how'd the cards go? How'd the cards go? How'd it go? You know what I said too. We never used them because that's like, why lie? They never left the SUV. But it's a really also a great example. I'm doing my thing and I'm really motivated.

I'm like, I've made art cards full of Thomas Ness cartoons. This is going to be great. And no, like, again, because Conan already saw his route into this. And then we came up with this incredible happenstance of this person. Right. Yeah. And that would happen on a lot of remotes where we'd prepare all this extra stuff.

It was almost like to shore everyone up, like, well, you know, we can always do this with the art cards or we can do, you know, I don't know, we made a 20-foot baseball batter. Depending on what the remote was, I always remember literally, it was like shedding an exoskeleton as you went like just

like what about this couldn't be like no no he just battled these props away for a moment you'd think about all the work that went into making them but it was just like but that but that relates to the general the kind of the modality of the show at the time which is we weren't right really comedy writers were option writers right and and we would load up with all these options yeah and that gave conan the security to make the choices he wanted to make like i don't right that didn't give him the skirt right it supported it well no but knowing that those cards were in the car i'm sure helped him he was perfectly secure without my art cards but knowing that those cards were in the car, I'm sure helped him. He was perfectly secure without my art cards. Right.

But knowing that they were there and being able to say, no, not that, this is part of the success of that bit. But then you met a pretty girl. The big surprise. This is Stand Alone Jones says, here's the biggie. When we first encountered the ballplayers and spoke to them for a while, it wasn't long before we noticed that there were people there. Some of them were interns and college students that were working at the historical society. Some of them were not. Some of them were locals, but there are people that are dressed as baseball fans from 1864, and they were hanging out watching the proceedings.

And when that got noticed, that's when Sweeney and Conan went off to have their own conference. And the rest of us, including me, Michael Gordon, and Jason Chalemi, and the others, were left standing there wondering what was next. And then we came back and we're like, we're going to go talk to those people now. And that's when Conan discovered Nell, the quiet, consumptive widow. Consumptive. Who would not break character. Oh, wow. And was so fantastic in character it was just yeah it's just shocking

because i mean she was somebody that you would have written as a comedy writer to be there but she had just pre-written her own yes bit she knew what we needed more than we did yeah and he you know conan's eyes just, you can literally see it on camera. His eyes just lit up. She kept, like, you know, he started faux hitting on her. Yeah, he didn't really know right off the bat. But once he started talking to the women. Right.

And then he got down, just luckily at the end of the line was her. And it just built up naturally to this person. That's a really, you're right. She was at the end. It was just lucky placement. It just took off into hyperspace because he saw the lane he wanted to use, which is I'm going to hit on this woman now. And that motivated almost everything else that came after. Right.

Well, she started talking about being married and. It just got, every time she said anything, it got better. Yeah. Because he's like, I want to go out with you. And she's like, I'm married. Yeah. I was like, well, where's your husband? Yeah.

At the war. And it's just like, oh my God. And then, and this is, you know, this is. It's like, I heard he's a coward. Yeah. Extraordinarily inside, But we're laughing. I'm trying not to get picked up on audio laughing so hard because Conan is literally character assassinating her husband for being a coward at the war. And it all seems so unbelievably real.

It's so plausible that he would really do that. He either knew someone that did that or he had done that already because it was so plausible that he would really do that he either knew someone that did that or he had done that already because it was so natural for him to attack this guy it's like he's belittling him to her his ancestors were doing no it's so great i was like this is so much more this is now so much more realistic and it isn't conceptual anymore. This is how he works. And were you kind of like, I was like, this is all great. And they haven't even gotten to playing baseball yet.

No, I don't. I was just like, okay. Right, right. All the kinetic stuff was still ahead. Right. Like when you're a writer, you're kind of, you know, you're kind of, and you know, you have to edit it. Yeah. You kind of stand there and you're kind of counting.

It's like counting beans. It's like getting the funny moments and trying to get critical mass where you're like, okay. Well, especially when you knew you had to get Conan in the costume. It was like, okay, there's got to be a certain amount of business we lay down and then we're going to, he's going to change clothes. I'll never remember this, but he had a great quote about this very phenomenon, which is on a remote with conan you have to know how much gas you have in the car without a gas gauge it's like your gas your thing on your car is broken it doesn't work yeah you have to know how much gas is in the tank yeah many times we called triple a we ran out of gas yeah but when you run out you get to go home so well that's true that's good

and bad it's a long long ride home going home when you know you didn't score is not a great ride home it's very quiet in the van especially when there's like actors and everyone knows right someone tries to make a joke shut up well so how much were you then finding in the editing room? Did you kind of have it laid out in your mind ahead how it was going to cut together? The first version was long, and there was big gaps in it as far as laughs and stuff. And that was just because Liz Gross was the expert editor in this case, and Michael Gordon and I come up with a version that was very long. It was very gappy. And Conan gave us a really good, and Mike did too, Sweeney did too, gave us really great notes about where to look on that second pass.

And then, I'll just get this out of the way real quick. It's super dry. Sorry. But we did our second version and showed it on, I think, a Wednesday night after the show. We asked the audience to stick around and we showed them about a maybe 10 minute or so version or something of it. I was wondering when that practice started, honestly. So it's interesting to know that you were already doing it. I was grateful to have it happen because that- It's a great sounding board.

Yeah. That Wednesday night was very valuable. I think Michael and I went back, went straight back to work on Wednesday night, stayed very late, and then worked on it a bit more on Thursday. Then we showed it to Conan in his office, or in the edit bay, one or the other, I can't remember which. And then we never showed it again,

even in rehearsal on Friday, because Conan didn't want anyone to see it anymore until the show. Yeah, he gets superstitious sometimes. It's just like, you know, it's going to lose some of its soul. He doesn't want to drain the laughs. Yeah. And Tracy King, our producer, asked,

can't we see it in rehearsal? It'll be fun. And he said, no. No cookies until Christmas. That's funny. You know when he really loves something. Yeah, he must have known. That he was getting protective of it was a good sign of his enthusiasm for That's funny. You know when he really loves something. Yeah, he must have known. He's like, yeah. That he was getting protective of it was a good sign of his enthusiasm for it. But also, it just ratcheted up the stakes.

Yeah. Right, Sweeney? Right. It just really ratcheted up. But it was really quite a winner when it showed. Oh, God. It was really good. Well, I remember going to Jesse's question about finding stuff in the edit room. There was one moment or one real highlight of when they were actually playing the baseball game.

And if I remember correctly, I think we're all like, oh, God, I hope we got that on camera. Like, there's a lot of those moments, don't you think, when you're editing? Yeah. That was really funny. But is it on the... There's a lot of those moments, don't you think, when you're editing? Yeah. That was really funny. But is it on the... Sometimes there's things you didn't even know about that are on the footage that are great. Those are fun discoveries. Oh, I got details aplenty on that.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But the one I'm thinking of is involving the airplane. Definitely. And we, our crew that day was Jason Munoz and Gene Heelsman, and they caught the plane, the low-flying plane coming in or out of JFK or whatever. They caught that. And it was in the middle of Conan haranguing the players. So his reaction to it was really priceless. And he, you know know he got terrified and screamed and ran away yeah but he was in the middle of an object right he was really in the

he was in the middle of delivering a another haranguing to the player it's all all that stuff was really funny but this just it was incredible that it happened an incredible piece of luck that happened and we had like i said a great crew there and they caught it yeah yes well and conan's instincts too to stop what he's doing and and immediately address the yeah yeah it was just wonderful and there was never any doubt that that was going in it's just a question of how much harangue right do we want to have before the airplane so right right there was an a longish speech type harangue thing where they're sitting down and he's giving them the what for. I think we kept the joke about you guys play like veterans from the Spanish Civil War, which hasn't even happened yet.

Which is a hysterically funny line. But there was redundancy in the speech because he had called out more than one anachronism so we had about three maybe four anachronisms in the version we were working with and we decided that two was the maximum because we knew one of them was going to be the airplane so we went with the spanish civil war one and the airplane and the others were all cut and there was like incredible like just incredible bits of technical success too like they were because of our proximity to some airport there were a lot of audio problems which were fixed by the editor by Liz Gross and they were really it was great it was just really something yeah people don't think about that. There's often hours and hours of time spent just syncing up cameras or fixing, a lot of times fixing the audio. We were getting frequency hits on the wireless mics at the time, and I think that's been addressed now since 2003.

But at the time, those were a real issue. Oh, wow. We got a very bad frequency hit in the middle of a crucial interchange with now and we needed liz to find conan saying the word red somewhere else and we found and liz like stayed up all night or whatever and found another moment where he said the word red and it was clear and we use that to mask the bad one oh wow yeah these are such big victories when you're down in the trenches in the edit room like it makes or breaks a joke and it's like a zero sum game you know what i mean and that's incredible when you're up against it it's like that we used

another trick if conan if word got garbled or something on air, we learned a trick to go like in a sketch, a live sketch, or we'd go back and look at the rehearsal and find a lot of times we'd find the word there and drop it in. We could probably just create a whole remote out of existing Conan footage. We've got another winner in there somewhere. Yeah. Of just the stuff. Of just drop-ins. Yeah. The whole thing is so great because, again, Conan's investment in it was really high.

And his own vision for how to get through it was really clear. Luckily, these ballplayers had a great sense of humor about it. They were serious enough without being offended. Right. And the vibe was very congenial there. And his insults were so stupid stupid no one could take them seriously right so that was great and nell was a godsend of course and yeah and you know so conan had this love story to yeah pursue right right really funny right and we even there was for one brief period uh you know again before the first pass

and second pass there was a song in there oh john rao our fantastic uh property manager went to a nearby music store and found up and picked up a banjo in the middle of all this and came back with this banjo is exactly what we needed wow and conan composed an improvised ode this really is every it's all the elements of conan's personality so he's screwing around the banjo singing a love song to now we didn't use it but you know got shot oh wow wow it's somewhere in the bowels of nbc i'm sure they destroyed those tapes so years ago our card stayed in the van, banjo, you know, like, banjo got you. I mean, it was really, like, again, everybody was so on top of their game,

but no one was more on top of it than Conan, who's great. He just had a great time doing it. It was just a blast. And Sweeney has a long-standing superstition about saying, we've got it on the way home.

And oh my God, never more than that day was he not saying we've got it. He was like, I don't know. It was pretty cloudy out there. Like he was putting out everything you could think of. Hopefully they hit record. You never know. A lot of those mics don't work sometimes. Like he brought up anything he could think of.

Like there could be, you know. There could be Civil War widows that are still alive and offended by this piece. There's a lot of things that can still go wrong, guys. He was so not saying it was going to work. Well, I learned to lowball things, certainly to Conan. Like, if I thought something was really funny, like, you don't ever go to him and go, don't ever say you're going to love this. Yeah, yeah. things certainly to conan like if i thought something was really funny i learned like you don't ever go to him and go don't ever say you're gonna love this yeah yeah yeah this is funny this

one's for sure like he oh boy and so i talked to him and i got out of the van eventually you know uh when we got home but i was like boy sweeney's really not confident about uh whether we got anything and gordon goes oh no that's not how it works at all and i was like, boy, Sweeney's really not confident about whether we got anything. And Gord goes, oh, no, that's not how it works at all. And I was like, what are you talking about? He goes, he's talking it down because he thinks it's a winner. I was like, all right, I'm too tired to figure these people out anymore tonight. I'm going to bed.

It's probably because Conan was in the van. Yeah, he was. Yeah, so I just would always temper. So he was just kissing during Nixon the whole way home. Exactly. It was all a whole psych op that I didn't understand. And I was like, man, I'm really bummed. I feel like we struck out.

And he never resigned. And Gordo was like, oh, no, no, it's good. That's why Sweeney was leaning on it so bad. No, sometimes it's scary when you have something where like, I think that went great. Editing it, you're like, you've got to get all the good stuff out. Yeah. I hope we put it together right. Like, that's scary.

Editing is really tough because one thing could be misordered and that would change the whole tenor of the piece. Screening stuff for the audience. I think now I remember Robert Smigel was like, why don't we screen? Because he would edit Triumph remotes, Robert and whatever writers are on the bit. And I think sometimes it would be like, you know, Conan Wantham, oh, you know, maybe it could be a little shorter. But Robert likes to really try everything out. And so I think he came up with, let's just show it to the audience. I think it was an old SNL trick that they knew or something. I didn't know about it.

Oh. Pretty sweet trick. Oh, like maybe you show something like the week before. Or show it to dress or whatever. Right, right, right. And all that stuff. I don't know. know but yeah like it all predated me but i was like hey i was happy for the you know for the gimmick of showing it to them because oh yeah no it's it's such a great a lot of times if the audience doesn't laugh at something we'd all love you go let's give it another chance on the show

you know like you don't want to be a slave to whatever the audience likes or doesn't like but um it's such a great helping tool uh can i mention one of my favorite door victories and i'm curious about the disposition of a particular item the 2006 emmy awards conan challenged all the writers conan hosted emmys in 2002 and then he got asked to host them again in 2006 okay and so i guess having one under his belt he was really attacked writing the show with gusto and he's like he's like you know what i'm gonna give just to motivate all the writers i'm gonna give a gold coin to the writer who comes up with the best bit for the emmy awards and um and we're like what is this a game show yeah okay i'm gonna tell you a little bit about

that we were already the writing process for conan hosting the emmys was underway right and the difficulty that was emerging was we couldn't find a live thing for him to do in the show in the run of the show like we had a lot of pre-taped little bits pre-tapes up the yin yang but no big live but nothing live, you know, the word had gone out. Come on, guys. Live stuff. All right. So we'd had one meeting.

Nothing. We had another meeting. Nothing. Then we were called into Conan's presence. And Ahab, like, for Moby Dick fans out there. Right. Ahab, like, he said, I now have a gold a 50 gold cougar coin which he showed us yeah u.s mint gold coin he'd gotten and it was still in its wrapper and everything so

it's like a fifth you know 50 gold coin and he's like i will give it to the person that comes up with a live thing in the for me to do so that's how it started it started. It wasn't just for the best thing in the show. It was for a live thing. And it was an intentional Ahab. It was an intentional thing about Ahab. He made a big dramatic show. He was being funny about it.

But at the same time, it was also a real challenge. Yeah. Like his baseball manager, it was real and funny at the same time. Yes. Yes. The way he talked to those baseball players was pretty much the way he was talking to us. Right.

Right. Yeah. That's not, that wasn't unreal. You're sending me out there with nothing. Yeah. I pay you for top chop and you give me chump rump. Those are things that were said to us indefinitely in earnest. Repeatedly. So, yeah. rump you know those are things that were said to us in definitely in earnest repeatedly so yeah so so he says there's gonna be a gold coin in it for you if you can come up with a life then

i pitched the idea of someone likable or even lovable and i said likable but love we everyone i pitch a thing to do with will ferrell like that had happened a lot. Because it was just a thing at the time. Will Ferrell does this. Will Ferrell does that. Right, right. Because he was very useful, and they were always game. So his name's coming up. So I pitched, we have a person, not Will Ferrell,

who's very well-liked, but not Will Ferrell, who has to sit in a booth that only has two hours of air in it. And then that will be the basis of our keep it short speech for the winners. Keep it short or that person runs out of air. And dies. Oh, that's so funny. Because I had said not Will Ferrell, I didn't have the right answer for where that person would be.

But the room took it from there and everyone started throwing out names. And I'm pretty sure Dan Cronin said, Bob Newhart. And the idea of Bob Newhart with two hours of air and keep it short of Bob Newhart dies completely and instantly seemed like the right way to go. Sweeney left the meeting, went 20 feet over down the hall to talk to C to Conan about it and came back within a few minutes and said, that's where we're going. So it was a yes right away. And then Conan, like, I'm pretty sure he drafted a letter on bonded paper and like FedExed it to- Did he type it? Yeah. The whole, like, it was really very, very official. And he like,

he put the request in like bonded letter form and sent it to bob newhart and uh and yeah he wrote a personal letter it was really really neat and then newhart said yes that's great and so that's how that came to be and then i believe sweeney and gordon just dealt with it at the emmys i wasn't there for the production week but did you get the gold coin i did yeah i was given the golden coin. Did you have it appraised? Well, you could look up the value of the coin every day. Because the value of an ounce of gold was well known to me.

Turn it into an NFT. And we lived, you know, our office was like two streets away from 47th Street. You could go turn the coin in for cash at any time. And I kept it for several, several years. Because that was a great show, the 2006 Emmys. Yeah. It was rock solid, and that really was... I just watched someone put together

all the Bob Newhart bits, because then Conan introduced the bit and Bob Newhart's rolled off and looking panicked. It's like, it's funny because Bob's learning about the bit while Conan's describing it. And he has that great Bob Newhart face of like, oh shit, wait, what I'm going to.

And then Conan, like, you know, an hour later does a bit where he goes, oh, I'm sorry. That was a waste of everyone's time. And then it just hard cuts to Bob Newhart backstage in the booth.

You know, just panicking more and more. We were hoping they'd go back to it. Right. A couple of times. And they did. Especially if someone was going long. Instead of just playing the music off, just show Bob. Yeah.

It'd be a funnier way of getting it to happen. Yeah, yeah. But also, sometimes you dip back into the well one too many times. It starts to lose. This is the Sweeney I'm talking about. The guy that... No, seriously. Like, he's...

He's the more you use, the more you lose. You know, he's that guy. I never rhyme. And if you know that's true, that's my whole thing. Oh, Kevin, what was Conan's riff on you? Oh, yeah, we ask writers. Pretty easy. Pretty easy. Pretty simple.

My face is the kind of face you see on a kid on an old picture of a kid from a street gang that threw rocks at Lincoln's funeral train. So that was me as a kid. And then when I grew up, I was a man eating lunch on a girder high above New York City. Yeah. In the 30s. In the 30s. So I was a kid that threw rocks at Lincoln's funeral train, and I grew up to be an iron worker in the golden age. So he thinks you're a classic beauty.

Yeah. So my face was that, which is kind of good because it helped me to do things like I would play Jesus on the show sometimes. Yeah. And Conan would say, just be that guy, like be that exact. That's the Jesus I want, the construction worker. I got to say. Pug ugly. Jesus was always on our show.

And everyone who's played Jesus is great. But yours was kind of like a tough guy Jesus. Well, that was just really funny. Blue-collar Jesus. Conan said, I love Jesus as a pug ugly. So I keep doing it. Like as a pug ugly. Keep doing that.

Keep doing that. And I was like, okay. You want Bowery Boy Jesus, you got it. Oh, man. Well, Kevin, we have to wrap up, but we have time if you have any other favorite memories that we didn't get to if you're listening to this to find out what it was like to be on lane i just assure you that it was incredibly collegial and we had a very sympathetic host that wasn't like you know gosh darn it sweeney go talk to those morons that i never talked to and right you know and tell them

to bring back gold you know like this is junk right put this stuff under my door and i'll see you at the christmas party right he was extraordinarily involved yes he would wander in and out of our offices he'd check with you on and i don't mean in a goofy you know like matronly way he would check with you on the same level that anyone would check with you you know like not how's it going or do you have my jokes ready right but he would check with you the way another any other writer would check it he was like oh my god this that and the other thing and it just sort of like it was great because like you knew that the person you were going to be giving the comedy

to was also a writer and understood right he had been in your position and he's literally coming in to commiserate with you yeah and he would and he would been in your position and he's literally coming in to commiserate with you yeah and he would and he would commiserate and then he would sometimes know that he wasn't going to use what you did and he knew that that sucked and but he also you know he knew what that felt like that's when i showed him right but that's when exactly that's when the undertaker no i'm kidding soon he would come in as the funeral director and say hey right right but like it was it was it was great because it made not getting on fine and it made getting on fine and then it made when something would really work like we a couple things that we talked about it made it sublime it was really it was wonderful

he's a great just a great person i work for and with oh well that's nice it's very nice i wish he would hear this this is no i that's why i'm telling you because he doesn't know about this podcast i'm not naive about this i know for a fact he won't which is what he makes it easy it's easy to do sweeney's sweating bullets right now because i'm being complimentary about yeah about conan but it's like there's no doubt he's not gonna hear it he'll never hear about it it was great well thank you so much kevin it's great you know we could have gotten into your great career you've had since conan too but yes do you want to know what's going to be on this spring what what i'm going to be um i'm going to be playing a a character

in um white house plumbers oh oh fun uh which is going to be on hbo and i think they're probably going to show it in the spring oh great, great. Right around the anniversary of the Watergate break-in. Oh. So, and this is about the people that- Amazing. Is this a dramatic role? It's a comedy. It's kind of a comedy done by some of the people that did Veep. And it's about- Oh. The break-in to the, it's about G. Gordon Liddy and Howard Hunt.

And who are you? I'm playing Fred Jessup, who was a career foreign service agent, you know, foreign service officer in the United States. Oh, that's great. I'm playing Fred Jessup, and my friend Dave Paschese is playing James Jesus Angleton. Oh, my God. We have to deal with Liddy and Howard Hunt for a minute or two in this movie. It's kind of fun.

Well, this sounds great. Oh, that's fantastic. Is it a lot improvised? No, no, it's scripted. No, it's all scripted tightly the veep people write great uh right yeah in general they just write great stuff it feels right like great improv but it's really already right it's just brilliant writing wow oh that's great you have a great scene in season two is it season two of the mandalorian but oh my god so many people are like have you did you see dorf did you see dorf and then i like i was like i don't have disney plus

just can you tell me what happens they're like i can't it's too good no one will tell me what the scene is they're like it's too good you have to see it so so you still haven't seen it i haven't seen it he's never gonna see it but he's excited that it's good. You don't understand what the win is. It's a climactic. It's a guy I've been told it's a climactic scene and you're fantastic. I'll tell you something, sweetie, that Jon Favreau and I have known each other an awful long time, like 30 plus years. We were literally in acting classes together way back when. And he gave me the note, which I thought was great for the scene,

which was, it's Colonel Klink meets the 101st Airborne Division. And that was our operating idea there. Oh, I like that. It was a lot of fun to do. Okay, I'll get Disney+. Well, Kevin, thank you so much. Yes.

A pleasure, thank you so much yes a pleasure thank you thank you kevin dorff for joining us thanks kevin man does he remember i just love all the detail yeah of all the bits he talked about remember that stuff are they journaling a lot i mean seriously i don't remember anything i don't either and he had all these great details about um the emmys and of course about the old time baseball remote holy cow that was a great walkthrough yeah i know that was fun and speaking the old time baseball remote yes we have a special treat we do from someone i have to, we've been trying to track down. A lot of people have tried to track down for years now and just hit a wall. And she was as elusive as you would expect.

I think, you know, she's honestly been in character this whole time. Apparently. Yeah. Yeah. It's a great way to live your life, I guess. I don't know, but. Yeah, I'm thinking about doing it. Our producer, Sean, tracked down Nell and spoke with her.

And it's actually her. It's the real Nell. So without further ado, here's Nell. So do you want the long story or the short story? Let's take the long story. Okay. You might regret that, but we'll see. I went to art school. I did, you know, writing and acting and drawing. And then I had to graduate and like figure out what was happening after that. So I went to the career office at that college and they said, you know, what do you want to do?

What career do you want to do? And actually nothing appealed to me. I wanted to be close to life, I think, in some way. And they said, well, that's not a career. But maybe think about things that you would like to do for maybe six months. Come up with a list and bring it back to us. So I did. And I wrote down things like adopt a child, live by the sea, write a novel, time travel.

A lot of really practical things. And then I graduated and there was no careers in any of these things, but I started looking on the internet as one does for time travel experiences. And I came across an internship at Old Path Page. And part of what was promoted was that you could do this history internship. There was a history internship and an acting internship. And the history one was you could live there for a period of time and kind of become a character in the village, which very much appealed to me. I applied to both of them and somehow got both of them. So that's how

I ended up there that summer. So you were living there during that experience? Not at the time that Conan came, but later on. Yeah, we got to stay there and like stuff our own mattresses with straw and milk the cow every morning and build fires and bake bread. And yeah, it was very, you had to do it like you couldn't do anything that wasn't in accord with the time. So like the outhouse was the outhouse. No way. It was wonderful. Yeah. And were you the same character throughout the whole experience or were you switching off? When you guys came, it was the very, very beginning of the internship. So we hadn't even started doing the research to develop the characters.

So that character was just improvised for that day. And the character that I ended up working on was kind of a riff on that character. Yeah, who I was, who I got to be every day. And were you aware of Conan at all prior to that shoot? Not much. I knew his name. I knew he was on television. I don't think I'd ever watched the program. I still don't on the TV. So yeah, I knew he existed. But I didn't know much about him. What did they tell you when they were actually coming to the village? Like, were you aware days ahead of time? I think it was just the night before, like the evening we were told that he

might be coming and that we might be like background. And what was the energy at the village that day? Oh, very much excitement. Yeah. People were very excited. And I, do I say this? I'm not sure. You have to say it. I don't care. I don't know if that was a like, I'm going to not care, like strategically not care because I don't want to care or if I really didn't. I don't know.

So did they just come take over with cameras? I can't remember at what point in the day it occurred. I think it was towards the end of the day. I remember there being a buzz about it. And then at some point we were asked to come over because they were possibly going to film the baseball team. And what were your first thoughts of Conan when you saw him? It was marvelous. I mean, brilliant. Just so in tune with everything that was going on and able to respond to it.

Yeah, I had no idea what to expect. So that was just such a pleasure to watch. And you have experience as a performer. What was it like performing with him like that? I'm uneasy with the sentence that I have experience as a performer, but I love theater and I had, you know, studied it as a student. The sense of play and responsiveness was just very joyful. Yeah, I mean, you killed it and you felt so perfectly like in the character. Was that difficult to stay kind of in that reality? Yeah. I mean, I think you can see there are moments that it's like, oh, that's... I'm laughing.

I'm laughing because he's very funny. And then try to get back. Well, you can tell he immediately was like, he got that you were on the same wavelength and kind of got what they were doing there. Have you gone back and watched the clip? I watched it this morning because I thought, well, maybe Sean's going to ask me something and I should know what happens. I have watched it. I've watched it a couple of times. I will say

that my family members have all watched it significantly more than me. And how did it feel watching it? It's very funny. When I see myself, of course, there's this like, cringe, but he's very funny. Uh, when I see myself, of course there's this like cringe, but he's very funny. And I mean, you were so funny in it as well. Are you able to see that now that perhaps I have a blind spot in that particular area? What is your, uh, you said your family has seen it a few times. What do they think of it? I think they get a lot of joy out of it. My mom occasionally will quote it. What does she quote from it? This one's for you now. Yeah, that particular line. That is. And did you ever get to play baseball with them? No, but that's probably for the best. Did you have any other favorite like

things you would do in character? Like you mentioned, obviously the outhouse. Yeah, I wouldn't say the outhouse was one of the favorite things I did in character. I loved baking bread. They have this big beehive oven. You kind of have to crawl in. So it always made me think of Hansel and Gretel. You have to crawl in to light the fire. And I love milking the cow.

And I love the lamplight. I don't know how to describe this, but I'm right in the fire as is reasonable. So it was a little uneasy at first, but we have oil lamps and that's like that. It's night and dark and you carry around the oil lamp and the shadows are amazing. During the daytime, the guests would come and I was often in the general store. I can't remember the name of it, but I was the character that came out of that

was this woman from Ireland who cleaned the general store. So I would spend much of the day cleaning, but then sometimes people would come and I would, I had this little tintype of, of my son who, you know, came from that story. And I would, I would tell them about him. And then I would tell them that I missed him because I wasn't with him. And that I used to tell him these stories at night and did they want to hear one? And I would tell this story called The White Trout, which I can't really recall, except I think it was a woman who turned into a trout.

And then there was lots of blood involved. And I just, yeah, I loved being able to tell them that story and draw them in in that way. And it was fun. It's nice to be in another world. Was that something that attracted you to that whole experience? No, it's what I love about everything. I mean, about writing and about acting just getting to be other people and build other worlds with other

people there's nothing like it did you watch when the remote aired on tv did you watch it that night I think I did I was staying with like very distant relatives and I think they wanted to watch it and I watched it and then like very distant relatives and i think they wanted to watch it and i watched it and then like very quietly went upstairs and said nothing did they did they like it that night they did they did did you like it that night i can't recall i suspect i was self-conscious yeah yeah well i mean it is so great and you see in all of the comments are people saying like now stole the show everyone is saying you're the MVP of it. Yeah, I don't look at comments.

Probably for the best. And did anyone ever recognize you from being in it afterwards? I think at the bus stop, I would take the bus to Old Bat Page, part of the way, and then I would walk part of the way. Yeah, I think people at the bus stop recognized me. And then I don't know how many years later, but I'm a twin and the man that my twin ended up marrying recognized me or recognized her from that. No way. So it's kind of cool. Wow.

Well, I mean, it was so, so great. And we're all so happy that you agreed to do this. It sincerely was like the best part of that sketch. I have no language to respond to that. Thank you. Thank you. There's a bow that I would make. Well, I mean, is there anything else,

any other memories that stuck out to you from that day that you want to make sure we hit? I remember the song, which I think is not in there really. So when he plays the banjo, there was a whole song that he just improvised that includes my name many times, I think, when the camera wasn't on. The thing that stays with me is how gentlemanly he was,

just really kind. Did you have any interactions with him or any of the producers out of character? I think Conan asked me what I'd studied in school. I don't know if I was entirely out of character, but there was some small conversation. Thank you so much for doing this. Such a fun story. And you did such a good job. You're very kind. Thank you. Okay. That was awesome. Thank you, Nell, for doing that. That was great. I am so glad that our producer,

Sean, was able to find her. Yes. Thank you, Sean. He did some detective work. He did. He had to time travel. Yes. Apparently to find her. And instead of killing Hitler, he decided to get the outro of the show. You know, killing Hitler is a tall order. Well, you kind of figure someone else is probably going to do that if they find the time machine. Right. and so then you go to you know plan b which is fine now yes which is fine now yeah yeah but i love i really do like imagining that she's you know she's gonna go back to i guess churning some butter and right tending to the chickens yeah following the baseball standings for 1868 now.

Mm-hmm. Talking about who's going to succeed Grant as president. It's a great, great time to live. Be alive. But hey, if you all want to leave us a voicemail... You can leave questions from Civil War up to the Gilded Age. Any questions about that period of time. Yeah, maybe Nell can answer them. So yeah, you can call us. We've got a hotline. Civil War up to the Gilded Age. Any questions about that period of time? Yeah, maybe Nell can answer them.

So yeah, you can call us. We've got a hotline and it is hot. Let me tell you. 323-209-5303. Or you can always send us a regular old email, insideconanpod at gmail.com. And hey, if you like the show, you can support us by rating Inside Conan on iTunes and leaving us a review, which we love to read.

Yeah. When they're nice. Our producer, Sean, just pulls out the nice ones. Right, of course. Yes, we live in a bubble. Because I cannot accept criticism. Oh my God. Which one of us is more fragile?

That's a discussion for another time. Well, thank you to Danielle Del Giudice and Kevin Dorff. One place we're not fragile is when it comes to expressing our emotions about you. That's true. Right? As long as they are reciprocated. Yes.

And Sean carefully goes through them to find them. And it's them out, yes. Only the reciprocated ones. So on that note, we love you! Inside Conan, an important Hollywood podcast, is hosted by Mike Sweeney and me, Jesse Gaskell. Produced by Sean Doherty.

Our production coordinator is Lisa Byrne. Executive produced by Joanna Solotaroff, Adam Sachs, and Jeff Ross at Team Coco. Engineered and mixed by Will Becton. Our talent bookers are Gina Batista and Paula Davis. Thanks to Jimmy Vivino for our theme music and interstitials. You can rate and review the Conan on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Stitcher, Google Podcasts, or whatever platform you like best. It's the Conan Show. Put on your hat. It's the Conan Show. Try on some spats. You're gonna have a laugh. Give birth to a calf, it's Conan!

This has been a Team Coco production.