Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - Ep 9: Chris Hardwick

Episode Date: June 5, 2018

Chris Hardwick (Nerdist, ID10T, Talking Dead, @midnight) opens up about his alcoholism, his anxiety attacks and how he copes with them, and how he got his start in the 90s with MTV. Chris tells the story of meeting his wife, and how he thought she was blowing him off when they first started dating...about doing Talking Dead episode after episode and how he really feels about the show, and how he really, really wants to direct a horror movie. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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I mean, I think they're all pretty great. I mean, some are better than others. But this one, I got to say, this is a guy who usually interviews everyone and has interviewed everyone. So starting to interview people and then having this guy as an effing guest is a little nerve-wracking just because fucking, you know, it's like, what do you ask a guy who knows everything? I mean, it's one of those guys who really knows everything.

It's amazing you talk about any subject and the guy has some point of view on it. And somehow he's incredibly humble and sweet and charming. I think you've heard of him. And it's Chris Hardwick. As you know, these are like therapy sessions for me. And this guy really, I don't know, it's one of those guests where I just feel like, oh my God, I should be paying you for this conversation. I'm a big fan of Hardwick's, as many of you are.

he's pioneered nerd culture over the last few years he's made things uh finally that i think are cool or that i love and you love cool and uh we first met on a show i did zoe duncan jack and jane one of the shows that i did that lasted a year i've done many shows that lasted a year or under his alcoholism in his 20s how he handles his anxiety tax which is phenomenal uh it's really interesting the bizarre and amazing start to his relationship with lydia hurst where he tried to let her off the hook because he thought she was blowing him off and so much more. I could have talked to this guy for hours, but there's just not enough time in the day.

He doesn't have enough time. He's always off to something else. How does he do it? Rob, it's hard not to like the guy, right? I mean, he's handsome. He's funny, smart. Yeah, he's like a better-looking version of you. Yeah, maybe.

Maybe you're right. Yeah, he has good luck. You're an asshole. I think we should get inside of Chris Hardwick. It's my point of view. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience. Well, how many, you did 100 episode?

More. At midnight? How many did you do? 600. Okay, I was a sixth percent off. What the, I mean, isn't that enough? Yeah, I mean, I missed the show, but it's. I feel like we did what we set out to do. I mean, you did 600 episodes. I don't know. You did 600 episodes.

600 episodes. Yeah. So, I mean, but do you still feel like I'm already talking to you? That's fine. This is what I like. I mean, you know, I actually saw an interview where you were like, I don't even do any research on people. I want to do a little research on you, but not much. I just wanted to talk shit. No, because I just, I mean, you should be familiar with people when they come on, but I like to discover people. Like, if I know exactly what I want to talk about, I don't. Then it becomes an interrogation. And then I don't think. Why did they cancel at midnight? I can't talk about it. You know, I think people don't mind being interrogated at like seven minutes, you know, like on a couch or in a junk situation, but you can't interrogate someone for an hour, hour, and 15 minutes.

They'll just feel uncomfortable. No, are you uncomfortable yet? No, I got a pillow, but am I the small of my back? Really? I feel, you look really, I want to say, I'm not, I'm not hitting on you. Okay. I'm comfortable with my sexuality. We're in my living room.

I mean, we're just one story away from having a real fun. But you're in great shape. Oh, thanks. I mean, what do you do? I've had the same trainer guy for 12 years, and we meet three times a week, but I don't really ever take breaks. Do you like to get pushed? No, I mean, you know what I mean? Yeah.

Oh, yeah. I mean, yes. What did you think I meant? I just thought, I'm like, hey, do you like it when people just come up and shove you? Well, I don't know about that. You know, when I go in, I don't really. I've never questioned anything he's told me to do. And if he tells me, I can do something like,

okay, I can probably do this. And so I just, uh, oh, like today we did a fucking, this is not going to be like, let's talk about getting Jack podcast. But today, when I walked in, he, he set up a mat next to the pullup bar and he goes, okay, do one push up, now do one pull up. Now do two pushups. Now do two pull-ups. And then we had to go all the way up to where I couldn't do pull-ups anymore.

How many was that? And then it was 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, all the way up to 9. But then I had to go back in reverse. So it ended up being like almost 50 fucking pull-ups and like 81 push-up. It was something insane. And one thing I found out, I don't want your trainer's number. You should have it. I'm sort of weird.

Like, I just feel fulfilled if I just have him come over a couple of times a week. We chat a little bit. We do a couple of push-ups, maybe a couple of things. You just run in a circle. you break a little bit of a sweat yeah and i'm like uh well that's good today he's like well we still have 20 minutes i'm like yeah we should probably stretch well i was such a i was such a a bag of booze in my younger days and i and i think i got to a certain point when i quit drinking where i said you know i don't want to hit 50 and then be a guy who's like oh how do i fucking turn this boat around you

know because i i had a bad back and i too i had bad posture and so i just uh i was like you know i'm just going to do this and see how it goes and i just found i happened to find a guy named His name's Tom Dieter's great guy, and we just clicked, and I've been seeing him ever since. Does he work on the core? We said we weren't going to get into this. You know, he's great. He's great, because when I go in, he goes, how are you feeling? And I tell him, and he goes, okay.

And then he sort of improvises a workout with the understanding that he wants me to leave feeling better than when I got there. He doesn't want me to leave going, fuck. Yeah. Oh, my God. What's the point? What's the point? So I, you know, I leave happier and- Do you need to work out?

because of all the shit you do if you don't work out what you go crazy i do i get really sore and i get cranky and i start to get tight and yeah now i'm at a point where i can't not do it do you have a temper because you you seem like the i interviewed henry winkler like last week the nicest guy in the world well that's what i said and then i said chris hardwood if you say chris hardwood people say the nicest guy in the world and we've met because we met it uh where james guns white elephant party probably or i'll tell you the first time we met attack of the show it was even way before that oh my god what was it was a little show it was dating a great at the time who did a guest spot on a little show called

Zoe Duncan, Jack, and Jane. Who are you who? Oh, Jacinda Barrett. That's right. God, yes. Justinda Barrett. She was hot. And, um, and that was, uh, that was, but it was very brief. We met very briefly. Right. You came on set. I came on set, said hi. Was I nice? You were nice. I was a kid. We were all kids. We were all kids. Yeah. Yeah, we were all kids. So you need to work out to keep all the stuff going if you stuff. You think that it just really helps you. You were asking if I had a temper. Oh, yeah. I want to hear that. I do, but at dumb things.

When there's a real crisis, I'm surprisingly grounded and good. I get mad at traffic. I get mad at electronic devices. Are you a honker? No, no, I'm not a honker. You know, as I'm driving through traffic and then commenting on and really critiquing everyone else's automotive performances, it occurred to me a couple years ago that the internet is essentially shouting in your car that other people can hear. That's mostly what a comment thread is.

I realize. Yeah. And then when someone goes, you can't say, I go, I didn't think anyone was listening. I didn't realize anyone came a shit about anything. Have you yelled at someone on the road, like literally pulled over or said pull over or anything like, are you, are you a physical guy? No, no, no, no, no, no, you're not an altercation. No, no, no, no, no, I'm not, I'm not a physical guy at all. You know, I was, it's odd that I ever sought fitness as an option because I was such a nerdy, unpopular kid.

And I hated kids who were very physical because it just wasn't. It was so far from everything that I was into that I, for a long time, I had a very negative association with anyone who, you know. Well, tell me about that because I want to go back to Louisville. Sure. Because that's where you grew up in Louisville. I mean, yeah, I was born in Louisville. I grew up in Memphis primarily, but yes, I did.

I spent the first few years of my life in Louisville and then Memphis, Memphis, Tennessee. Because I went to college at Western Kentucky University, all right, in Bowling, and I only went there because I think you needed a 2.2 grade point average to get in. I was not a smart kid. I'm not the brightest guy in the world. I have a personality, I like to say. But, you know, as a kid, I look at, you know, I look at things and I'm like, oh, you were winning chess tournaments in junior high, and I'm like, and I'm jerking off into a sock.

I did that, too. Oh, good, good, thank God. Yeah, just in between chess matches. Good. Yeah. Did you see how I got the chess board up here? Nighterick for, yeah. I mean, you've really set up in everything.

You have, I'm just setting it up. I just put the pawn. You have, you have an honor. Autographed C-3PO head. Yep. And you also... That's actually autographed by Chubaca. That was Peter Mayhew?

Yeah. That was Peter Mayhew signed. Remember, we ripped his head off. And then you have the melting Nazi from Raiders of the Lost. I have the same candle. Have you actually let one burn? No, I don't want to burn it. Me neither.

I want to know how fast it is, but you probably can go online and see that. You probably go online and see that. Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah. There we go. Oh, you just went one space on the pawn. We're playing a little chess game. We'll see how long this lasts.

So back to high school or even earlier. I mean, you had a good family, right? I had a great family. Yeah, my parents were fantastic. So doesn't confidence stem from, like, parenting and, like, things like that? Yeah, but, I mean, it's just that, you know, my parents, I was around adults more than I was around kids, and I was into things that other kids weren't into, like, stand-up comedy. I mean, I was into things that a small group of kids at the time were into, like, chess and D&D and shit like that. But I was also very much into comedy and stand-up comedy.

At what age? I mean, from as long as I can remember. I mean, I remember when SNL started, and my parents just had no content restrictions for some reason. They just were like, oh, he likes this comedy stuff. And so they noticed right away, oh, he loves Steve Martin.

So they bought me Steve Martin albums. Oh, he loves Richard Pryor. So they bought me Richard Pryor albums. And so they just didn't, I didn't relate to other kids because other kids, most other kids, didn't really relate to comedy, you know. I didn't like other kids. I just didn't like them.

Did you think in a way you were just, I'm smarter than these kids? Or they just don't get it. I thought they didn't get it, and they certainly didn't get me. And so I was, you know, very much socially ostracized into the chess. I was very fortunate to go to a school that had, there was a teacher who was a math teacher. He ran the chess club. So there was a chess club, which was also like a room where kids played D&D, a handful of played D&D. And he also had a bank of Apple II E computer.

And so it just, that, I spent most of my, I would go there before school, during lunch, after school. And then after that, I would go, my dad owned a bowling center. And then I would go there and play video games and then bowl at night. Now, come on. Are you a good bowler? Yeah. Are you really good? What's your average right now?

If you went and bowled right now, I'll give you the first game as kind of like getting into it. But what's the second game? I have not bowl. I'm, okay, I haven't bowled in probably a year, but I could average low 200s. That's amazing. But I've been bowling since I was three years old. Did you work there? Yeah, yeah.

My dad was a professional bowler. I grew up on the pro bowlers tour. How many, how many calls did you get saying, do you have 10 pound balls? How many times did you get that? More often, you know, you get a call like that. You almost want to go, I'm not upset that you're prank calling me. I'm upset at the hacky nature that you think I haven't received this call before. Shame on you.

Sir. Sir, I've heard this joke. I don't say it's in the refrigerator's running. It's fuck off. Was your first kiss in a bowling alley? Uh, yes. Really? Yes.

Yeah, I think it was, actually. I want to hear about this. What was her name? Oh, I don't remember. You don't need to. I mean, I was probably 12, 12. 12. Was it tongue?

I don't think there was tongue. There wasn't tongue at 12? I think I had tongue at 12. I'm not sure. I didn't have sex till 18, so something bad happened the next six years. Talk of 12, Spaltz out 11. I don't, yeah, I can't, I sort of remember it. You know, it was a bowling center, to grow up in a bowling center was a great playground,

especially at a time when the video game revolution was happening. Oh, yeah. And my mother's father was in the bowling business as well, and he loved technology. That's where I fell in love with technology. He had, you know, he had a laser disc player in like 1979. he had a beta max he had all these video game systems at home he had like Atari 2,600 and Intellivision and then so he put video games in his bowling center and when my dad opened his bowling center you know I made him copy that and so I games were there well it was just every classic you know

Galaga Pac-Man Defender Gallagher Tron Robitron I have a Gallagher machine original in my base Oh you have the original yeah if you ever come to our house we put an arcade in in our house and I just got two I have two multi-cades like like one's all 90s and ones all 80s. Come on. And there are fucking games, and they're like Japanese versions game games. Dragonslayer?

Dragons Layers. Well, Dragon's later is not, I think the, I think it's, the chip is in there. But, I mean, I think the program is in, and if you're, by the way, when you open the cabinet now, it's like the electronics are the size of a, of a P. It's hilarious. Yeah, it's just a big empty camera. But I don't think we have, I don't think I have Dragonslayer. No, because it runs off a different, that was a, it was basically a CD-ROM game.

And as opposed to like the space cadet games, Space Ace. Space Ace. Yeah. Thank you. Of which I collect animation cells and I have cells from Dragonslayer and Spaces. Come on. Yeah. You really do?

I really do. How will I find those? The man was a master. Wow. Yeah. So you really, you really nerded out as a kid. You really, it wasn't, you know, nerd is cool now. And I was a nerd, but a different way I watched horror movies.

And I was locked in my room and I played Kaliko Vision, the Smurf game. all that shit. You know, I was, I wasn't really, but I, I, I sort of played sports a little bit. Yeah. But you didn't, you didn't like sports at all. No, I mean, unless you count bowling as a sport. Well, yeah. Yeah, it is.

Yeah, it is. So going through like school and everything, so you were just kind of, you had your few people that you kind of hung out with. Yeah. Who were these guys? Who were this little, who was a little circle? What did they do? They were all just, I'm sure you remember the movie, Revenge of the nerds. Of course.

It was very accurate to the extent that. Gilbert was your friend, Lewis. All these people who were not really a part of any other community were sort of shoved in this house together. And that was kind of my group of friends. It was a, it was a smart. And in a pre-internet era, it was, you know, it was maybe like three people, three or four people. But there wasn't really a type of person. It was just, we were just sort of in the nerdy reject bin socially.

Were you picked on? Of course. But, you know, oddly, I wouldn't trade any of that experience because I think when kids are popular young, they peak early, and they fail to develop any meaningful internal monologue because everything comes very easily to them. So they don't really learn how to be introspective because they don't have to be. And so I'm not sorry that, I mean, I never got beaten within an inch of my life. So if that had been the case, then I probably would not be super keen on the whole situation. But I was really, you know, I was happy, you know. I mean, I know I always wished, oh, I can't I be popular.

But I also, I had the same thing that I assume you had, which is that sort of comedy defense mechanism. I could be louder than anyone in a room. Right. And I could have a comeback. I could roast kids. Right. But, you know, but without, I mean, I, of course, I couldn't fight. So it wasn't a smart thing.

She had a smart mouth and everybody would laugh. And all of a sudden, like, now what do I do? Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So it was always finding what that line was between how smarmy can I be to defend myself without getting my face smeared across the pavement. But in general, like, I'm not sorry at all that I was, you know, relegated to the dark corners of the math lab. But it seems like you had like almost like a vision. Like at my age, at 12 years old in Indiana, Newburgh, Indiana growing up, I had no clue what I was going to do.

I had no, was I going to work at Wesselman's grocery store? I was going to work at Sonoco, pumping gas. It seems to me... Wesselman's grocery store. I almost got fired for stealing frozen bar, well, they weren't frozen, but I went in the freezer and I put them in there, these little mini butterfinger bars.

And I remember Chuck, you know, I would say... Fucking Chuck. Michael, Rosenbaum, please come up to the front desk, please. How did Chuck find out about that? Well, Teresa said something. And I love Teresa, but Teresa worked here. Were there cameras?

No, no back then. So you almost got away with it. Well, I would have, but, you know, and I love Teresa. And all of a sudden I just said, you know, well, what happened was Chuck? I came up to there and he said, he said, hey, what were you doing in the freezer? I go, what do you mean? What were you doing in the back freezer?

I go, nothing. You weren't eating frozen butterfinger bars? I go. That was your first mistake. The answer that you always give is masturbating because then no one asks a follow-up question. I didn't think about that. What were you doing? The freezer?

Masturbating. Oh, well, hey. Go back to work. Carry on. Yeah. Ultimately, he just gave me an ultimate. He said, I'm going to ask you one more time. Did you eat frozen butterfinger bars?

This is the last time I go, yes, I ate the shit out of them. I was back there. I was grubbed down. Did you fire you? No, he said, get back to work. If I ever hear about this again, I remember stock and shells next to Teresa, and she looked at me, and she looked at me and she wanted to raise. I think she wanted to be a manager. So she just didn't like, she didn't lie me out.

She ratted you out. Yeah. What are you going to do? Well, I think it worked in your favor because it... I didn't end up working there for the rest of my life. You got to come out and, you know, be Lex Luthor. Well, it closed down. There's a really good pillow matter.

happening on this couch over here right do you like the pillows i'm very you know there's a lot of different textures there's a lot of different uh pillow density i mean it's yeah it's it's the cushions could be redone they're a little uh loose i'm a pillow guy like i sleep my wife's really funny because if she's doesn't if she doesn't want something she just hurls it as far away from as possible so if there's like a pillow in her way she'll just chuck it across and i'm like no give me that like i'll just build like a weird little crevice of pillows do you like to be touched while you're sleeping? Yeah, but I just, I can't, uh, well, are you the cuddler or do you get cuddled?

Let me just let us back up there. Do I like to be touched while I'm sleeping? There's a lot, there are a lot of ifs around that question. Oh, uh, is do I know the person? I mean, I know, no, no. What I meant was when you, when you've had it, you've watched your whatever. I'm going to wake up with just a wiener, just like, just right across the bridge of my nose. No, but, uh, uh, I don't mind being touched.

I like spooning. But I like being spooned, too. I also like the reverse spoons where you're both facing another way, but your, your backs are touching. Because then you're, like, touching, because I'm so, I'm so worried, you know, like, my wife can just, like, lie in one position all night, and I'm very fidgety all night. So I try not to spoon too much because if I'll move around too much and wake her up. Are you not a good sleeper? No, I'm a terrible sleeper. Me neither, but how this becomes therapy.

It always becomes therapy for me, Chris. Because listen, I'm more, I don't sleep well, and I try to, I'm doing a lot of stuff, and I look at you who's doing way too much stuff, and if you don't sleep, how are you getting by? You know. Xanax. No. Ambien. Nothing. You don't do any of you, you just are fidgety, you don't take any drugs to go to sleep.

No. Melatonin. I take a melatonin. Does it work? Obviously doesn't. Yeah, well, it works. Melatonin makes me sleep for like four hours, four and a half hours or so. And then, uh...

How are you in a goddamn good mood? all the time. How do you not flip out? I was flipping out a minute ago. What were you flipping out about? There's a hole in the ceiling and the water was dripping out of it. And the guy was like, oh, well, this is where the leak is. And he just, I don't know.

I didn't flip out. Rob, did I flip out? Not to him. You were a little angry. That's Rob. That's my engineer. No, but I flip out over dumb things. Give me an example of what Chris Hardwick flips out at.

I misplaced something and all of a sudden, even though I hadn't, needed it in that moment. It became the most important thing in the world to find. Were you just mad at yourself? Is that what it was? I was mad at myself and mad at the situation. And Lydia kept saying, well, did you leave in the car? No, I would have checked there.

Stop yelling at me about this. I got so frustrated that I didn't know where this thing was. Turned out it was in the car. She was right. Wow. I think it is very part of the package of folks who are recovering alcoholics or recovering addicts do tend to, to obsess over non-essential things

from time to time. So would you consider yourself that you were a real alcoholic? Oh, yeah. Because I, you talk about this. So when? What age did you start drinking? It was pretty much through my 20s.

I didn't drink in high school. It would have helped the beatings. Probably would have ruined the chess game. Yeah, the chess game. But, uh, might have helped bowling. But, uh, but I, yeah, it wasn't really until I was like 19 or 20. I started drinking in, then it just slowly degenerated into just became an all the time thing and then you know by the

time I was 31 it was bad I mean I was I and I knew but I knew it was bad I knew I mean did it give you confidence is that why you drank you know it just it just became a coping mechanism because if you if you have a very active internal monologue and you have an obsessive personality It's very alluring to dampen those things and to silence the monologue and to numb yourself from any feelings, really, from not having to take responsibility for really happy feelings or really sad feelings. It just sort of, you know, just sort of staying in the middle and numbing any experiences. And so when you first quit, it doesn't solve all your problems, but it just sort of, it gets the thing out of the way so you can start discovering who am I? How do I react to things? Because when you drink for a long time, you spend so much time avoiding reality that you actually don't entirely know how you deal with reality until it's not there.

And then you have to learn how to do that. Did you not like yourself? No. No, of course not. I mean, because I would think that that's, you know, you were afraid of failure. You weren't happy with what you were doing. Even if you had success, you didn't think it was as successful as it should be. You're insatiable.

and the drinking sort of escalated. Is that sure, sure, sure. And I'm sure some of it also had to do with not feeling like I fit in. And, you know, and even as cavaliers I can be about like, oh, I didn't mind being shoved in the corner by the, I mean, there is, there are psychological effects to other kids shitting on you pretty regularly that it just, I believe that you and maybe science believes this, I don't know, but you develop this picture of yourself in your head.

right around the time you hit puberty. So whatever's going on when you're hitting puberty, I think is kind of the identity that is your fallback identity. So a lot of... Until you start trying to figure it out. You know, if you just let it go, then yeah. I've been trying to figure it out too.

Well, yeah. I still have that image of that little fucking kid that kid who's trying to prove himself, who's stealing butterfingers, who's getting his... And so when you react to things and you take a step back and go, well, that's weird. My reaction to that didn't really match

what that situation was, and you start digging around, you go, oh, okay, well, that's probably because I felt this way when I was, you know, 13 or whatever it was. I mean, you always think of, you know, a lot of us, too, a lot of us in this business, which is ironic that this business attracts insecure types and then exploits and praise on every insecurity. And so, you know, you spend a lot of time trying to sort through that. But when you go back and look at it, you go, yeah, that's, you know, there was stuff going on when I was. was a kid and I still feel like I'm a kid but you know we have to at a certain point go that's

not the situation I'm I am an adult these are the things that I've done it's okay a lot of therapy I go to therapy tons yeah right and I'm still working on that I'm still working why am I so damn hard on myself all the time why is everything such a big deal why can't it be hey go just have fun what happened to the old days when you can just go do something and just have fun and not think of like if I fail the worst thing's going to happen to me and I still have those thoughts sometimes and it drives me but it drives me fucking crazy i mean even doing what we do is it's kind of a weird thing you know like to be performers and it's dichotomous in a way because on the one hand you will you say oh i have something important enough to say then everyone should

listen to it i'm a performer you know right but on the other side you go i'm a piece of shit why would i think i have anything to say and so uh you know it's just constantly you define for whatever reason what you think you deserve in life, and then you will either bolster yourself or beat yourself down to sort of hit that, whatever that comfort zone is. The interesting thing about it is the comfort zone is really defined by you, but a lot of times you feel like you're defined by it. Does that make any sense? A hundred percent. Even though you really do have more control over it than you think you do. You have a really good therapist, and you've really worked on yourself. Do you still

like when we were joking around and I think we were rolling, whatever, we were talking about at midnight and you're like, you know, people still say it got canceled and I'm like well, you know, I did 600 episodes. Do you still think of yourself as a failure when something fails, which is like, seems ridiculous to other people who look at you

with so much admiration? No, not in the At Midnight case. I really do feel like we succeeded. We did 600 episodes. We put stand-up comedians on television which there's not a lot of stand-up on television and as a comic that's very important to me to put more stand-ups

on television and a lot of comics were able to use the show to help their ticket sales on the road like that makes me so happy and the show won two Emmys like maybe like 10 years ago me would have been like oh but I really feel like hey I don't know

what else I could have achieved with that show like we you know other than doing it for 10 more years but it is it was a tremendously the show took an enormous amount of energy and when I was sort of at my when I was doing everything at once you know I was posting three podcasts a week

which meant recording five or six podcasts a week and doing at midnight and doing Nerdus the company and doing the AMC stuff and you know like I was doing everything at once and I kind of had to start going oh yeah you can't do that because your brain will just give

out at a certain point. Do you ever turn to your wife, Lydia, and say, I can't fucking do this anymore? Honestly, honestly, has that been said? I mean, I have said things like, I don't know how I'm going to. No, have you ever said, I fucking can't do this? I am so tired right now. The melatonin didn't work last night. You're back.

I'm sure I've said a version of that. I'm sure I said it's like, can't fucking, you know, especially if I've had to, I did a thing where I finished that midnight, got on a plane, flew to New York, and then when went right to the ABC studios to host live with Kelly and that kind of stuff. I go, but what was I going to not do it? Like, it just was a fun thing to do. So I felt like it. Do you drink a lot of coffee in the morning?

No, I can't drink coffee. Why? It makes me sweat and I get really nauseous and I get really bad anxiety attacks. It makes me feel like my heart's ripping through my chest. I would love to be able to drink coffee. So what do you drink? Nothing. I was drinking chai lattes until yesterday, but I got to quit those now.

So no caffeine. No. No caffeine. Who the fuck are you, Chris Hardwick? You're taking a melatonin. You're not sleeping. I want to drink coffee. It looks so cool.

But you can't. You get anxiety. What is an anxiety attack to you? What happens to Chris Hardwick when he has an anxiety attack? Well, there are a couple types of things. Because I have had them. And I didn't know what I was having them. I thought I was having a heart attack.

Yeah. I described an old stand-up bit about it where I said, if you've never had an anxiety attack, imagine being fucked in the heart. just what it feels like. It just feels like someone's mounted your chest and just jamming something into your aorta. But someone described very succinctly that anxiety is all future questions and depression is all past questions. So anxiety is more like what if, what if I, what if everything fails? What if I fail?

What if I suck? Depression is, I'm never, I didn't. Why did I, you know? And if you have both of them? those your fuck well I'm not you get help yeah you should definitely you should definitely get help but it but it's very normal I feel like especially now especially now it's normal because everyone's so overloaded with stimuli between internet and media and everything else and having to be connected all the time I don't think I think we're shorting our own brains we're just shorting

out I was on I was on this show that lasted two years and see it didn't last 600 episodes the last 20 two seasons of a show called impaster and I remember being on set and I was doing push-ups and I was running and I was in this pre-scarb and all of a sudden I was talking to the other actor my hands are tingling and I'm lightheaded and I'm going to pass out and I feel like oh my God I don't know what's going on yeah and then I just started I got I had explosive diarrhea too much information and then the doctor came on set and I go what's wrong with me well I'm checking everything and you're fine Michael have you ever had an anxiety attack and him saying that I go I'm not crazy what do you mean what do you sent like crazy like like and

And I realized, shit, I almost wish he didn't tell me I was having an anxiety attack because now that he said that, and I covered it, I didn't let anybody know. I would just take deep breaths. I'd go in my trailer. I would take a quarter of his annex if I had to. I just got overwhelmed with shit. Yeah, deep breaths are good because it is a physiological response. And so you cannot, you can only focus on one thing, your brain can only focus on one thing

at a time. Even though you think you're multitasking, you can only focus on one thing at a time. You cannot be simultaneously anxious and relaxed at the same time. So if you slow your heart rate down, if you can focus on slowing your heart rate down, it will help diminish your anxiety. Because there are certainly psychological ways that you can talk yourself down from it, but it is a physiological response. And, you know, I think my first one was in, I think I was 19 the first time I ever had one,

or maybe younger. And I didn't, I had no idea what it was too. It was the same thing where I just, your body is telling you to run, but you don't know where to, you just feel like a barnyard. chicken. You don't know what the fuck to, so I just didn't know what it was. And I had it for months before someone goes, oh, that's, this was, you know, there's was pre-internet. So, so it goes, oh, it's a, it's a panic attack. You're just having anxiety. I'm like, what, what? And they explained it all. I was like, oh my God, that's a thing. I didn't know it was a thing. But when did you finally get rid of it?

Well, I mean, it kind of stays with you. It comes out of nowhere, right? It does. It does. But now I know what it is. And it's very tricky because anxiety symptoms, mimic a lot of other symptoms. If you look up symptoms that anxiety can mimic, it's literally the symptoms for everything. Tightness of chest, shortness of breath. I'm getting an anxiety attack thinking about this. Diarrhea, blurred vision, head fought.

Like, it can mimic so many different things. But now, you know, when it's coming, I go, okay, I know what this is, and I sort of take a deep breath and I can, you know, you just get rid of it immediately. You just take your mind away from there. For the most part. Have you ever had it while you're performing?

like some kind of anxiety well no i i know i for some reason performing to me and maybe it's the adrenaline or i don't know i don't know maybe it's not the adrenaline i don't know what it is but if i were having a full-blown anxiety attack and i had to go to stand up i'd be fine like i would just go out and once i got on stage i'd be fine it's funny to be to feel sort of socially awkward one-on-one but i could do stand up for 100,000 people and i would feel fine but one-on-one at parties i'm like hey how are you like i get weird i mean Do you feel that way? Sure.

Because, you know, when I meet you at parties or, you know, at the, you know, James Gunn's White Elephant Party or, you know, you're so nice, but you don't really like being at these things. Well, that's a different story because I know most of the people at James's thing. It's a little bit more of a safer environment. Yeah, exactly. But if I'm at, if we go to a premiere or an event or something and there's other people around, we're doing what I assume everyone is doing, which is saying they're going, I don't know the fuck to say anything. I don't know what to, I just feel so out of place. I feel the same way. I always feel like I don't belong.

I pretend that I belong. But what you find is that most people 100% feel that way. And so then it really takes a little bit of the edge off. I mean, I've had people on the podcast that is shocked to me that they've gone, oh, yeah, I'm uncomfortable with, I didn't, I thought I was an imposter. I thought someone was going to, like Paul McCartney said, oh, it was only until a couple of years ago. It was good. that he thought someone was going to tap him on the shoulder

and be like, you're an imposter. I'm like, come on. I absolutely understand that. And it really affects everyone. So when you realize how common it is, then you can weirdly find community and commonality in not feeling like you fit in because you know that that most people do feel that way.

And especially the sort of senior events around Los Angeles, to me, just feel like this. I think everyone's just doing that. Everyone's just doing that. It's nice to know that, to think, that everybody else is not as comfortable as you think they are. Of course. I mean, there are a few people that I think are just, yeah, they're just together people. But for the most part, I think most people, even when you see them strutting down a red carpet, you know, there's a good chance that inside they're doing.

I hate this. Why before they do the duck lips? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, what is that? The duck lips are the face's way of making a defensive posture because you're not comfortable. Yeah. When will the duck lips go away for good?

I don't know. Why does anyone think the duck lips are attractive? Why would anyone think this is sexy? But if I, but I don't know. And another thing that I think that needs to stop happening is don't take mirror selfies, making a kissy face and a peace sign. Please don't do that anymore. Not you. I just mean generalize.

I didn't mean I do that. Okay, I won't do it anymore. Oh, fine, Chris. Yeah, it just, I don't know. When I see that, I just think like, oh, there was, you had nothing else going on in your head. That's what you have to do. That's what you have. So I'm going to go, I want to go back because, you know, when you were younger again, you were thinking, I love stand-up comedy.

Like all these weird things, we're going to go back to that because you eventually came, became your own entity. You became, there's no one really like Chris Hardwick, which is an amazing thing to achieve inadvertently. I don't know about that, but I, but I, but I think my. I think it was only because of intense rejection by the established entertainment industry that I felt like, you know, oh, fuck you. I'll just make my own thing, you know, like that. What was the first thing you sort of did that you remember, hey, I'm going to, you know, because at what age did you get up and go? When I was in college, I got this weird fluke audition. I didn't have an agent or anything at a time.

I was a contestant on a game show in college. And then about a year later, they tried to recycle. They'll recite, like, networks recycle contestant pools. Like, oh, you were a good contestant on this show. Let's put you on it. And I didn't want to be a contestant on a game show again, but. Wasn't remote control, was it? It was all.

I wish it had been remote control. Oh, my God. Remote control continues. Colin Quinn. I know. Ken Ober sadly passed away a handful years ago. Oh, man, that was sad. But remote control was, you know, the definitive game show when I was growing up.

But, yeah, and so I said, well, I don't want to really be a contestant. And they said, you know, I know a guy he's casting this show for MTV. You're funny. You should just go, I'll connect you guys. And so I auditioned for a show for MTV called Trashed, which was MTV's attempt to remake remote control. What year was this? 93. I auditioned in 93 and the show started in 94.

And that was it. I didn't have an agent or anything. I got the job. the show we did 50 episodes they canceled it after a couple months but they plucked me out of the show and made me a VJ and then put me unsingled out and by the way I was going through that to a 95

when I moved to New York I got a pilot for MTV it was like with Leslie Bibb and Jackson Brown's son and we did this pilot and it was called Working Stiff but it didn't get picked up and then they asked me to do my own show and Ken Alterman who runs Comedy Central ended up producing it with Louis Thoreau

who did TV Nation or something and then that didn't get picked up and it tested well but that didn't get picked up and they offered me to be a VJ and I was like I got but I went to college for an actor I don't and it was so hard because they were offering me money which wasn't a lot of money MTV never really paid anything no at least for me yeah it was not it was not a lot of money at least compared to the I mean it was a it was a good job compared to what you were making because I yeah I was broke good job if you're a five thousand dollars was a lot but but but but by entertainment standards but you're very lucky that you

did not do that because at the time television was very compartmentalized and so it was very difficult to work after MTV because the rest of the business was like yeah they're VJs and it's very similar you know what's happening with the internet now is very similar to what happened with cable before where people go oh they're oh they're an internet kid they're they don't you know they're like well don't discount them they got an audience they know what you know they're doing something right yeah and so uh but at the time if you had been a VJ it would have been it probably would have been tough for you to go on and do doing it there were only really a couple people that for acting i mean there were only couple of people actually went on to do

acting yeah i would have done like 80s on eight with nina blackwood right after nina blackwood went on nina blackwood oh my god didn't she date that guy who's saying um not corey hart the other guy which one yeah i think she dated cori heart she dated cori heart i think she banged corey heart well he wears sunglasses at night and she was nina blackwood and it's night time he's got sunglasses. By the way, you do a lot of impressions, don't you? Listen, because you whipped out one a few minutes ago, and I go, wait a minute, wait a minute. And I always like to you, they always say, I do a couple weird ones. Anthony Hopkins always said, you know, I'm not going to do an impression of Anthony Hopkins, but he always said that every actor should have at least one impression or every good actor. Well, I don't know if I don't think I really have a good one, but if you're a fan of kids in the hall, I can do a little bit of Kevin McDonald.

That's great. Hey, everybody. There's a cat on my head. That's good. Yeah, it is. For, you know. Not if you're a comedy nerd. Right. But I, but I, I don't know if I really do any other impressions. Oh, I saw you're a big Rodney Dangerfield fan.

I mean, I always do Rodney Field. Yeah, oh my God, huge. I can't, I can't do it. I'm not going to do it. Everyone, most people have. I tell you, Chris, what a joy it is having you on the show. You're amazing. You do it all.

The wall, huh? That's fantastic. I'll tell you, 600 episodes. I couldn't last 600 seconds on the show. I'll tell you. They don't get canceled. That's a very impressive danger field. Like, that's not even just, because everyone, a lot of people have a characterization of

Dangerfield, but that's legitimate, you have the legitimate tonal quality of Dangerfield. Thank you. I never left the house. I was always trapped up in my bedroom, dubbing movies as I've talked about, you know. Stealing Butterfingers and masturbating into a sock. And doing Rodney Dangerfield's impression. That was it. That's fantastic.

Hey, Wang, it's a parking lot. Sorry, that's from Caddy Shack. Anybody, any, you know, anyway. So, okay, so you do this show trashed. That gets canceled. Then I do single that. Which people just love. That goes great.

That makes you a star. That, well, sort of. It made Jenny a star for sure. And I think it just... Did you ever hook up with her? No. No, no, no. We were just friends.

What do you mean? No, like you would have. I just wasn't attracted to her in that way, and she did not feel that way about me. We started that show together and we had a very sibling-like relationship. Sure. We're pals. Like, we just, I don't know how to describe it, but there was no, there was no, there was a good chemistry between us, but

I don't feel like any of the energy was sexual anyway. And that's very hard for some people to understand. They go, oh, come on. You're saying you, I can't believe you wouldn't. You know, wow, come on. I would have been. And I'm like, no, you wouldn't have been. But we were just friends, you know.

And I had a girlfriend the whole time during the show. Who was your girlfriend then? Justinda. Oh, yeah, it was Jacinda. Of course she didn't hit on her because she had hot Jacinda. Well, but I also, serial monogamous. Yeah.

I mean, I, you know, I would go through periods of, of dating, but I was not a good dater. I didn't, it felt very weird to me that you could go out with someone and then the next night be like, now I'm with you. Like, I was never any, I just never felt good. I was never good. Well, I can't remember a dysfunctional family. My sister's married four times. My mom's married three times. So I was just like, I've never had, I tried to through therapy. So I have relationships. I'll have a three year. I'll have a year and a half. I'll try. Now I stay in relationships longer than I probably should. because I'm trying to prove to myself that, you know, but I don't know, it's tough. I just, I don't want to make the same mistakes, but I'm getting old now. I'm 45, so I should probably, but you finally got married. I did get married.

You're married. I wasn't sure whatever. I wasn't sure I would ever get married. Why? You're a nice guy. You're smart. You're serial monogamist. Because I never really thought like, oh, I'm, I need to have kids and I want to.

Do you want kids? I mean, I do now. I didn't ever. And then Lydia, when we were dating, you know, know, and she said, oh, you know, kids are really important to me. When I get married, you know, someday I really want kids. And I was like, oh, okay. Like I never, I didn't recoil at the idea, which I know sounds weird, but I, but I was

always, I always just thought, oh, no, I don't want to raise a child and bring a kid into this world. Did you think you were going to be like 60-year-old Chris Hardwick hosting shows, doing all these things and not being with someone or just always just dating someone years at a time? I don't know. I don't know what I thought. You know, like I, I, was this a surprise? This was a surprise how you had.

How'd you meet her? We had a mutual friend, and she came to a taping of Talking Dead, but we were both in other relationships at the time, and my dad had just died literally the day before. And so I wasn't really... Not there. I mean, like, I did the show, so I felt like it was important to go to work, and so we met briefly, and then, like, nine months later, and we were both in other relationships, and nine months later, our same mutual friend said, oh, you should go out with Lydia Hurst.

He's Australian. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hi there. Those Australians, those few Australians listening going, those fucks. Oh, no, that's not how we talk. That's pretty good, man. That's not bad. See, I can't do that. I have a tough time. Unless I say Melbourne. Melbourne. Melbourne. If I could just say that word over and over, I'm all right. Oh, yeah. It's all in the back of the throat deck back down in there. But the Kiwi one's really hard to do. You can do that too? Not well. Oh, yeah.

I just go, Britt, Germain. Germant. Were you immediately attracted to her? You said, this is a gorgeous girl. She's, well, we went out. So we went out and... Bowling? Did you go bowling? We didn't go bowling.

We just went to dinner. And she, this was the, it was the most amazing first date I've ever had. And it's going to sound very macabre. But her dad passed away a month after mine. My dad dropped out of a heart attack. Her dad had a long bout with cancer. So they both had, were totally different situations. and our entire first date was talking about our dead fathers and the whole process and everything.

And it was so- Was it emotional? It was special. Like, I don't, it just, there was, we just, like, got right into it. There was no, like, so, what, what are you like? No bullshit. Just right into real stuff. It was, yeah. And it was great.

And we had dinner. And then we went and got ice cream. And did you go bowling after that? We didn't go bowling after that. Actually, there was a... You had to impress her at some time with your hook. There was an... I know.

Someday. You haven't yet? I don't think we've gone bowling together. That's ridiculous. But we, uh, I'm not fun to bowl with, though. Because I just take it so seriously. I'll bowl with you. I'll take it too seriously.

Okay, we'll go. I'll bowl a 140. But we had gone downtown for our date and we were leaving downtown and there was a, there was a checkpoint, like an alcohol checkpoint, because it was a Saturday night or something. And I was so personally offended that they were even asking, because I'd been sober for so long, but of course the cop doesn't know. He was like, what do you have to drink tonight? Alcohol? What do

you? None. What do you mean? I don't drink. I haven't had a drink since, you know, since 2003. Got out of the car, Mr. Hardwick. Like, the more in defensive I got, you know, and Lydia was laughing the whole time, because I just sounded so guilty. We're like, October 8th, 2003.

I have not, you know, and and so, and she saw that side of me and still was like, yeah, I want to go out with this guy again. So yeah, that's how we... Did you go home that night? You ever get that feeling like, please God, just the second date be half as good as the first? Well, it was interesting because we had a lot of stopping and starting. Why? Because she was work, my schedule sucked and her schedule sucked. She was working back to back to back to back. She was doing a bunch of movies

back to back to back to back. And we had a difficult time setting up the second date. And we did. And then the third date I thought she was blowing me off because we would schedule the date and then a day before oh I got to work I can't meet up okay or the day of Oh I'm so sorry I get a text And so this happened like four or five times

Or do you play like are you the guy who plays a cool guy? No problem or do you go like really? No I am totally no problem guy I am way low pressure guy Because my feeling is like Well if someone's not into me They don't have much pressure them into me Right

But after like five times I finally And then there was a period where I just didn't hear back from her for like a week And from her side of it She was like, I was really busy She said I was I was someplace where my phone didn't work And I was like, okay

So I sent her a very long But in my mind a very respectful text Where I just said, look, I really like you It seems like this is very difficult for us to get together I understand you're busy I am also very busy And I'm still making time to see you Listen, if you don't want to do this, that is completely fine.

But I'm starting to feel like I'm chasing you and I don't like that feeling. And so I'm just going to bow out. And this is what I think you actually want. You wrote this before the third date. Yes. Well, because it was literally like four or five, six, I think five, six times. It's just an honest, sincere. It was very sincere, very honest.

Just to say, like, I feel like I'm, you don't want this because my feeling is people do what they want to do. When someone says to you, like, I'm too busy, maybe once or twice, but if they say it a lot, people will make time for whatever is important to them, in my mind. It's like when I was in college, I was broke, but I always found money for beer. You know what I mean? I was broke, but somehow I always found a way. Right, right, right. Because that's what was important to me at the time. So I felt like I was letting her off the hook and bowing out of this thing gracefully. And I said, listen, I, you know, I have all the respect for you. I like you. No hard feelings, but this seems to be the writing on the wall.

And I'm, by the way, I just cut you off real quick. Please. Most people in L.A., most girls will go, oh, my God, look at this crazy guy. He wrote this full email before we even went on our third date. And I was, but obviously. But see, I have done that before. I like someone. I'm like, hey, I'm trying to.

I'm busy too. And I want to see you. And I really respect that. But then you know, a lot of girls. I'm an over-explaner. But also because we had had, you know, such an intimate. So we had such an intimate first date.

And it was, and it was really sweet. like we had like a really nice good night kiss and then I left and it was really nice but I also am an over-explainer and I also wanted to say like I don't blame you it's okay you don't you know but I just don't want to keep chasing after you kind of want to know you want one reaction that says she's still in or she's not I actually I actually was bowing out it was not really you were bowing out I did not do it as a move okay I was being very honest and so I was bowing out because I felt like that's what was important to her. I didn't hear back from her.

What? So I was like, okay, well, so then I guess I wasn't wrong. And maybe, I don't know, a month later, three weeks or three weeks or a month later, I get a text from her, a long text from her. Look, I really did like you. I really do like you. I really was working. I really was busy. You know, I had gotten you

I just moved into a house at the time She said, I had gotten you a housewarming present And it just arrived And I still would like to give it to you If you don't want to talk to me ever again That's totally fine But I feel like you should have this thing And I wrote back immediately

And I said, no, I really liked you too I just was letting you off the hook I just felt, you know People who treat people shittily Drives me nuts You know, you date someone Yeah, fuck you, you didn't write me back I hate that

It's like you can be respectful someone doesn't have to like you you can you know can your ego not survive if one person isn't into you so i i took what i thought was you know a much better road and it turned out she really was busy we really did reconnect was the next date better than the first the next day was great but here's what happened i she was in new york he punched a cop he punched a cop what the fuck how fucking dare you how dare you think i was drinking i don't need to be drunk to fucking take a swing. Your first swing

in life. Ever. Oh, I wonder why that didn't go well. And so she was living in New York. I happen to be going to New York the next week. So I said, hey, I would love to go out with you next week. Do you still want to go out? She said, absolutely. I would love to go out with you. So

I go to New York. The day of the date, I'm getting ready to go on the date. Almost. I get a call from her. Hi, it's Lydia. Listen, given our track record, I felt like it was really important. And I start going, here we go.

This goes, look, I just want to give you the option of backing out of this date if you want to. This is what happens when two people are trying to be so too nice. Oh, my God. So I want to give you the option of backing out of the date if you want to. I just got a phone call from Eli Roth. I'm going. I booked a series. I'm moving to South Carolina.

in three days and I just want to give you the option of not going on this date. I would understand. She said, I hope you still want to go on this date, but I understand if you don't want to go on the date. And I go, we're going. I absolutely want to go on this date. So we go on the date. It's fantastic. To make love.

No, we did not make love. There's a little bit of making out. But we were riding in this Uber from the restaurant to her apartment. and I she just like I was holding her hand and she just put her head in my shoulder and I was like oh here we go like I just I felt it going to South Carolina I was like I think this is happening

this is definitely happening and then you just start it was such a sweet romantic simple moment and so the best thing that happened was that she went to South Carolina because for the next six months we actually had to get to know each other we still had not slept together at this point. The relationship was not that physical. We had to get to know each other as people,

FaceTiming and talking on the phone. Do you think if you had sex before that night when she went through, do you think it could have been different? Who knows? But the fact that we had to get to know each other first and then around Thanksgiving, this was beginning of November, maybe, end of October, beginning of November. And then Thanksgiving was coming up. And I said, why don't you come to L.A. and spend Thanksgiving with me? Holy hell. And she did. And that was it. You know what? You're sounding, we're sounding like our parents.

This is how it used to happen. You got to know someone before you effed. It was the best thing in the world. Or finger bead. Yes. In a bowling alley. I always love the, I always love like, I love the dirty word juxtaposed with the clean version of that.

Someone like, look at those fucking gams. Like, why would you say gams? The same guy says fucking and gams? But, but, but I, but yeah, so I highly recommend it because, I mean, I'm not 22, so it's not like, you know, like it was important to me to not, I was fine not rushing into physical stuff. I didn't feel like I needed to do that. I just wanted to be with someone that I cared about who was nice to me and that I. If you rush into it, I get all like nervous and stuff the first, but if you really get to know someone and you're like, hey, I'm already, then maybe it's not as. You know what's dangerous.

What's dangerous for addict types. This is dating with Chris Hartman. And anyone out there who's an addict type is going to know what I'm talking about. There is one school of thought that says if you see someone and you feel your heart sink into your stomach and you feel you sort of feel that shortness of breath and your brain starts getting crazy, you turn around and leave. Because that person, that is lust and it is a type of addiction that makes you do crazy things. things. It makes you... And you believe this. A hundred percent.

So if I walk into a room and I see someone that just is phenomenal and just glowing, like a young Nicole Kidman. You can have a sexual relationship with that. You can have a sexual relationship, but there are certain types of people who try to turn those situations into relationships. And the problem with that is that when you are so consumed by the. lust and the oh my god i just i just need to be so into this and i need to be consumed by it you're not really thinking clearly so you're not really getting to know the person you're right and so that was not an option with lydia and i because we didn't we had to get to know each other over the phone right so but did you look at it when you first met or you're obviously very

attracted to or you're yes but there wasn't that i got a turn around thing no no no no it didn't i don't know how to i don't know how to say it any other way it didn't feel unhealthy it felt very healthy it felt like a healthy attraction it helped felt like a healthy relationship budding because you know when you when you're addicted to stuff you tend to crave the ups and the downs like the high highs and the low lows and sometimes you can mistake drama in a relationship for passion you know and it's like oh that's just drama and it's not healthy and you don't have to have it it took a long time in a lot of therapy and and going through different relationships to understand that, you know, for me anyway, I can't, I'm not going to make a universal statement,

but for me, a healthy relationship was a very, I think when I was younger and I might have considered it boring because it was, it's because things weren't happening. Right. You know, like, we were just, we just were really kind to each other. How long before, how long were you dating, getting to know each other before you asked her to marry it? A year, almost a year. There's some conventional wisdom that says that part of the key to a successful relationship is

kindness. I mean, if you can be kind to each other for an extended period of time, and the problem with those all-consuming relationships is that they're so, ah, you know, it's just so emotional up and down that you can't that you can't really get your footing. I don't like fighting. I won't fight. If you want to fight, I'm, I don't want to fight. I don't want to yell. I don't want to do any of that. That's good. Honestly, I look at someone and say, I'm wrong, even if I know I'm not just to fucking end this conversation. That's not the worst thing in the world to do, especially because, you know, no matter how right you are, you think you are, there's probably still a percentage of what you're doing that is probably wrong. Yeah, I think that's true. You know, you asked me to be on Talking Dead. It wasn't you. It was probably one of your producers.

You probably never even knew, but I couldn't do it. And here's why. I did know. By the way, because it's a great show and you just really make that so interesting and fun. And it's because if you look at the basics, it's just a simple show talking about a successful show. Yeah. But I love what you do with it. I was nervous to come on.

Really? I felt like I think I missed it. I felt like I didn't know enough and I looked like an idiot if I came on because I didn't know enough about the show. I just had Emily Kinney on the show on here on the podcast and she was amazing. Oh, she's great. Yeah. She cried.

She cried on your podcast. On the show. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because, you know, it's like it's a, it's a great, it's a wonderful, emotional job to have. And it sucks when, you know, and everyone knows that it's like ever. You know, a lot of people on the show die. Like, they know that's a possibility. And it's, it's sad to, it's sad to walk away from a few years of your life that were very emotional and very, you know, and they're, they're all living together like a family in rural Georgia.

And it's, it's a very unique experience. And, um, but she's great. And I didn't do it because I was like, I'm going to sound like an idiot. I won't remember names. I won't remember that, you know, and I just was like, oh my God, these people will hate me. If you were worried about that, then I think you made the right move only because the only time the audience really gets cranky on. Talking Dead is if they think the person sitting on the couch

doesn't, is not a dog He's not a fan and I was but I was like You know what I'm not even with Game of Thrones and don't tell me what the Fuck happens. Oh, I'm behind three seasons on. Oh my God. Oh yeah. But I,

I'd watch it and I know it and I would enjoy it But I wasn't like they're the the hardcore fans who I love and appreciate and they're just so they know everything And I didn't want to go up and just to say this guy's a fucking idiot. He doesn't know what he's talking about. Right. He doesn't even, you know, yeah, yeah, you don't want to, so I did the right thing. You don't want to, you don't want to step in poop with a, with a passionate fandom. No, because they will, they will let you know.

Now, let me ask you this, is it hard, I don't know if you've ever been asked this, you watched every episode. You have to watch every episode of the show. You can't miss an episode. No. Every episode afterwards, you have to look as though you love the show. I mean, is it hard to, not to say, pretend. because there's, look, there's episodes I'm sure you're not crazy about.

There's episodes. Is it hard to be so passionate and show so much when you're like, oh, is it difficult to keep that going? I don't know if it's, you know, maybe it's because I'm so close to the show.

Right, close to the Walking Dead. I'm only a season behind them in terms, there was no Talking Dead for Season 1. Right. So we're going into season 8 of Walking Dead, season seven for Talking Dead. I legitimately feel like it's part of my family. And even when there are things in the show,

show that people don't like and they go, how could you say you're just stuck in the network's dick and they're just making you? Like, first of all, the network has never, ever said anything to me about how I have to be on the show. There's never been an edict handed down. Sure. And they go, well, you're not critical to the show. Like, look at my body of work. Nerdist is very supportive and positive. Talking Dead is very supportive and positive. At midnight was very supportive and positive. It's just a different way of looking at things. Like, I could shit on things. Not that you want to shit on things. I'm just saying, like, for instance, people say, smallville and i was on 160 episodes would i say they're all good no somebody asked me i'm like yeah

there was a freak of the weeks yeah i agree yeah it didn't it but i would also defend it and say do you know how hard it is to write tv good tv every week of course there are some episodes that i think are better than other episodes but i also feel like i'm there to sort of cheer lead for the fans and talk about what we love about the show exactly and if you want i feel like there's um there is a deluge of negativity in our culture and for some reason a certain sector of, you know, hipster types only think that negativity is authentic. And that's just not true. That's, that's not true.

It's, it's as real as, you know, you and I could look at this chessboard and I can tell you 10 positive things about it and 10 negative things about it. And we'd probably both be right. I'm missing a pawn. That's one of them. You are missing a pawn. Yeah, you got a bolt there. And I shouldn't have made a move with the, you know.

But I just sort of feel like I'm there to be a positive cheerleader for the, show it's called the talking dead you're supposed to be talking about the show and everyone who loves it and watches it if they don't love the show they won't be watching the talking dead but again but there are so many places if people want like a tear down of the show there are so many other places they can go to get that because there is no shortage in our culture of negativity of negativity in the um actually guy and the well the thing about this is or here's nine things that are wrong with just like fuck all of it oh my god i'm so over the Nine things that are wrong.

How do you deal with that? How do you deal with that? Because you probably at some point let it get to you a little bit, right? Was there a point in your life where you were like letting certain things get to you? It still gets to me. It still gets to me. I mean, when people, it just, what gets to me is the level of entitlement that people have. And the lack of sensitivity and the lack of sensitivity and the self-importance like entertainment is something more than entertainment. It's like it's not a political movement.

It's entertainment. Right. You know, and I understand fandom as much as anyone, but I still don't feel like I need to go try to shut someone down because they don't like something or like something differently. It's like, but everyone just, you know, social media has conditioned us to believe and algorithms have conditioned us. We've been kind of spoiled. And so we think our opinions are universal. So people speak when they speak their truth, they kind of speak like it's the truth and not their truth. So they go, you need to stop this or this.

needs to or this show needs to oh i don't know why this show had to do this it's like right well you don't know because you haven't seen the whole series yet when you see the entire series then retrospectively you can go back and go oh they didn't need to do x y or z but you still don't know what's happening even like on game of thrones i don't know what's happening but people go oh they didn't need to do this it's like but you don't know that yet because you haven't seen the whole series that could play out you know it's like look at breaking bad there are things that paid off you know seasons later than when they were first introduced and at the time you might go well you need to do that And then later you go, oh, my God, that was the greatest thing in the world.

If you would just fucking, but everyone, there's, there's so much demands to put content up all the time. And attention span. Attention span. And we're all victim. We're all guilty of it. Yeah. And it's like, but I think it comes down to also, it's like when you're writing episode after episode and you're not, nothing's going to be perfect. There's going to be things that don't exactly work out on an episode that doesn't work or an actor that you don't like or people just think that with whatever.

The culture that we're in now is that a lot of people. people think that whatever small piece of information they have, and this isn't just entertainment. It's politics, the world, the environment, anything. They see a headline and they think, oh, I got this whole story. And not only do I got it, I'm going to have to weigh in on it. And it's like, first of all, you don't got the whole story because you see people on any topic talking, you know, Reddit's notorious for this. I love Reddit, but it's notorious for this. It's notorious for like the fake expert of someone who's like, well, here's the thing about this. And you start reading and go, I don't think this person actually, and if you dig a little

deeper, you might find like, oh, yeah, they actually don't work in this field that they're referring to. You know, it's just, it's the Dunning Kruger effect. It's the fact that the less people know, the more inclined they are to claim that they know more. And I don't know if it's a psychological protection or survival mechanism or something. But we are, we are conditioned now to just see a snapshot of something and then think we have the entire picture. We know all the pieces that are in play, we know all the reasons why these things happen. If people go, well, this happened because X, Y, or Z. And you go, no, it didn't happen because for any of those reasons.

And people will often assume the worst. Oh, this person probably did this because they're a fucking piece of shit. Right. Well, maybe, but it's also possible that there were factors in play that you weren't aware of that influenced how this thing played out, you know? What I do now is I sort of like, you know, because you get that, you see something and you want to just be like, oh, this fucking more, this piece. And you just, and you just not send the tweet. Just sit back for a second and go. Let your emotion settle. Let your emotion settle. That's it. You should never. Just think about it for a second. Is it that important? You should never text or social media about not. I mean, there are important issues that of course, social issues that people should absolutely be rallying attention behind. But, particularly. Particularly with entertainment, I just feel like it's good. If you're emotional, just take a beat because it is, social media is becoming an extension of the emotional part of our brain where we're just not having a filter anymore to really process anything. It's just like, we're reacting and putting it out there.

And you might look at something you wrote last week and go, oh, I'm not even sure I feel that way anymore. And it really is just sort of a snapshot of, you know, of your emotional brain. Or I'm an angry person. Right. Right, right, right. I've written things before and go, what the fuck, dude? Why do you even so care? Yeah. How important is this in your life?

I just, I would encourage people to, and this is just, and this is something that I'm, you know, I've only really, as I've started to get older, really started to appreciate. But, you know, before you feel like you've got to take some motherfucker down on the internet, just ask yourself, am I doing this from my own ego or I'm doing this to try to understand the situation? Because if you want to succeed in anything, you should really try to understand the nature of the thing first. I mean, like, true power is not knocking everything on to the floor. I think true power is wanting to knock everything on the floor and taking a step back and going, well, I'm not going to do that because that's not going to solve anything. How do I solve this problem or how do I understand this issue? Or educating yourself as much as possible.

How do I learn? Exactly. I feel like that is a true exercise of power, not coming going, look how fucking, fucking. I'm smart. I'm so smart and I'm so mean and I'm so mean. so acerbric and I'm so with it and I get it. You know, like, that's not, that's, that's someone crying for attention. That's not solving a problem.

So, I don't know. You have a fucking great therapist, man, you are on it. I'm gonna top, this is called, this is the first time we've done. This is called top me. Okay. Beat me. Uh-oh. I have an autographed jerk poster.

Okay. Oh, shit. Steve autographed the jerk poster? Did a movie with him. I wore a bad wig, but yeah, he autographed it. I met him Saturday night. He taught me. I went to Vegas.

I took my mom to see Steve Martin and Martin short perform in Vegas. They do a show at show that they travel with. And they do songs, and he brings out to Deep Canyon Rangers and they play. But what do you have in your house, Chris, that you're like, I think that's cooler than a jerk poster autographed by Steve Martin. I own Rick Moranis's Dark Helmet from Space Balls, autographed by Mel Brooks. I forgot about that. I saw that on the internet. You fucking asshole!

I got to delete that tweet. I also bought it. I didn't mean it. I also bought Gene Wilder's credit plate from Young Frankenstein. It's that it's hand-painted on glass in that gothic. Okay, stop, because you already got me. You beat me with the helmet. Okay.

I have a Rambo lunchbox signed by Sylvester Stallone. That's pretty good. That's pretty good. That's right. You were in Guardians, too. Hey, you really have a lunchbox? How old are you? You're 45 years old.

I wonder what would happen if Sylvester Stallone ran into Rodney D. Dangerfield at a car wash. Hey, Rodney, hey, what kind of car is? Is that a Benz? Hey, I don't know what it is. They just give me, I drive it. I tell you, I drive it. Hey, hey, what are you doing later?

Maybe go get an in and out. Hey, I'll tell you, I had an in and out this morning. Your wife. Hey, it's me, Kevin McDonald's. Who drives a blue acura? Sorry, just had to jump in there at the end. I love it. Ramble Lunchbox.

That's pretty good. Rambo Lunchbox signs by Sylvester's son's pretty good. I what do we have what do I have I have a lot of original Disney cells Snow White Snow White's Okay that's original original original those worth Yeah you know 100,000 dollars stuff Okay we're even we have a couple we have a couple of gremlins original gremlin my wife collects horror props

So we don't I'm the biggest horror movie fan ever Yeah I was just really upset about Tobe Hooper passing He signed my Texas chainsom, mask, your poster. I'm just a, yeah, I'm a huge, huge hornet. We've talked about this. Yes, we've talked about that. I have a Adam West signed Batmobile. I, not a real one, a small Batmobile.

I don't have one back. Okay, okay. Well, come back to me when it gets bigger. Well, Adam was on the podcast, and he did sign an action figure for me. You know what? Too hard. Okay, wait, I have an awkward prom picture with Adam West. What?

Yes, we took an awkward prom picture at Comic Con a couple years ago. Have you ever posted that? I think so. You could repost that. I could re post it. I could repost it. I have a Robert England signed Freddie doll that you pulled the string and he goes, fucking, I'm Friday Kirk. I'll fucking slit your cunt off.

I'll fucking slay. As far as prime time, bitch. I don't know. Oh, I don't know. That's pretty good. Tina. We have, Lydia bought the dummy from Dead Silence. We have that.

She really is a hard nut. Yeah. But I don't know. The Robert England signed, that, that one's pretty good. But I feel like I would need to have like a pinhead mole like head. Oh, that would be good. But I don't. Yeah, they are real.

Lastly, Carrie Fisher did give me her set chair from Force Awakens in the office. She goes, Michael, take that. I go, what do you want me to put? She goes, I don't want that shit. You know, I don't like that shit. Take it. Oh, what do I have? Do you cosplay, by the way?

Yeah, I do. Do you dress up? I do. Do you ever like with Lydia dress up? Oh, we have, yeah. Privately? Privately? Do you ever do something

A special marital moments Yeah, I used to I would cosplay at a Comic-Con Quite a bit Do you ever like to be incognita Do you ever like to dress up And like no one knows me I could just go around

And well if I want to walk the floor I'll put a You put a mask on I'll put a mask on Yeah Although it's kind of funny And they go We'll get security to walk you around

You go you know that just draws more attention Right With security going Excuse me That doesn't work Yeah You know I had some fan questions Okay

Real quick and this is at at Ian Sue, Emily Sudall. Who would you bring back from the dead on the walking dead if you had that power? Oh, that's a great question because there's so many great, it'd be really interesting to see how Shane would. Ooh. Because, you know, Rick has really been on the sliding Shane scale. Rick was at one diametrically opposite pole.

When he started, he thought he could reason with everyone. And Shane was like, hey, man, you can't. in that's in that world anymore. And then Rick has far surpassed where Shane was at that moment. You're just to see where Shane comes back. But I love Dale. Dale was such a...

Oh, yeah. But you never want to be the moral compass on Walking Dead. The minute someone's like... No, it never ends well for the moral compass. As soon as someone's like, Rick, you really need to take a moment and factor...

Like, once you start doing that, hey, Rick, you need to... Then it's probably... It's probably not going to end well for you. If Chris could be on the Walking Dead what he wanted to be on Rick's side or Negan's side or a Walker um oh that's I don't I don't know Walker's too hard too much makeup that'd be you know you're in the dead of summer in Georgia fuck uh that would be really really unpleasant a physically unpleasant experience

you know if I don't know if I could ever be on Walking Dead but I feel like you know if Rick and the gang came back to Alexandria after a rough day of fighting Neegan's gang or the walkers or whatever then i could sit and talk to them about their day like on the couch in one of their houses i could be like hey like i could just do talking dead on but in their world but i don't think i would be a good because i wouldn't be good in a zombie apocalypse have you gone to Atlanta have you hung out on yeah yeah well but i have i don't want to know what's going to coming up on the show so when i have gone down there really you have a big of a fan where you just can't well part of it is that and part of it is also just response being responsible like i if i don't

know what's going on. I never have to worry about spoiling it. Right. And none of my reactions on talking dead are faked. Like I, because I don't know what's happening. So if I'm really questioning something, I really don't know. So like, I didn't know who Negan killed that whole summer. And, uh, and so it was nice to not know that. And then I can actually have real conversations with fans about who I think, you know, is doing what. Do you have any desire to like act more to be like two serious roles. Would you take three months and do a serious role? And could you I would? I would. I

yeah, I just audition for a movie. But no one ever asked me to do movies because I do so much television and I do so much hosting and stand-up that. I don't think anyone ever thinks, like I have so many friends or directors and no one has ever said, hey, do you want to be in the, I'd be like, yes. I think you could play a good serial killer.

I think I could too. And I bet you could be because you're so nice, you're a handsome guy. I think the dark side would surprise people. And I You bet you could do it. You bring back those alcohol days, dude. I have a lot to draw on. You know what I mean? No, I would love to.

I think, I'm just for the fuck of it. I'm going to audition for movies. But I want to make, I want to make horror movies. That's what I would like to do. I would like to make them. I would like to produce them. I might want a direct one. I don't know.

I'm sending you this freaking script. I was thinking you as an actor. You want to produce horror. You love horror. I do love horror. Yeah, I love it. It's pretty much all Lydia and I watch. We get the shutter app.

we watched martyrs did you see martyrs uh did you see the loved ones i'm sure we did the loved ones where it's like a you know where he she killed her and her father kidnap the the guy who she asked to go to prom with her and they torture him in the house no but i have you have got to see that yeah we see pretty much and what's interesting is that i we watch on itunes and we watch on shutter and netflix but most shutter is the only thing that knows how to properly categorize horror films. It's like iTunes will throw like everything in there, thrillers and they're like, that's not a horror movie. Right. But Shutter, if you're not on it, is insane. Yeah. I just want to be scared. I don't think anybody scares me anymore. I mean, there's a few movies like insidious,

two-thirds of that movie scared me. Right. It follows scared me. The strangers scared me and paranormal activities. You know, it follows didn't freak me out as much. It didn't freak me out, but it was cool. It was creepy. It was really cool. But everyone I talked to about it, follows they're always like the music was awesome oh yeah that was amazing it was so original it brought us back to the 80s it was such a cool idea it was such a cool idea but i think i was so front loaded with it's so fucking and it's the same thing like i wasn't yeah i saw it before all that i wasn't devastated by the witch either the movie the witch right the witch was beautifully shot gorgeous music composed directing acting everything's phenomenal all i wanted to see is that fucking witch for a couple

more times. All you wanted to see was something. It's just like the movie and it's a gorgeous movie. It's hard to say it's a bad movie because it's a good movie. It is not scary. And the end is cool. The end is really cool. Yeah. I want to be scared man. I want to, it's scared or the thing about being a horror fan is you know

out of 20 things that you watch 19 of them are probably not going to be great. There are going to be things about them where you go oh! Oh, that was almost but knowing how hard it is to make something I am a very forgiving and I go, you know what? maybe they lost light or that day that's really forget or maybe they didn't have the budget to train to buson train to buson was great fucking phenomenal to be able to do like a zombie movie nowadays and keep your attention and have a great story and keep it it blew me away did you see the girl with all the gifts i did not good good good good good take on that i should see it yes it's fantastic glen close it's great i we loved it did you hear did you Did you not, did you hear not good things about it?

I, yeah, well, Rotten Tomatoes gave it, like, 90%. I was, like, way up there. And I was just like, okay, I just put it when I watched the trailer. I was like, also with horror, you cannot trust Rotten Tomatoes. For some reason. I agree. I always say that too. Yes, that's true.

There are some movies that have a high rating where, like, really? And there are the movies that have a loader and go, this wasn't that bad. So I don't, I think horror, I don't know, I don't know what it is about horror, but it's just, you know, horror is such a personal experience for people. Yeah. Because it plays upon whatever you're afraid of, and that's a very unique to you. And so if something isn't, you know, so I just feel like it's, it's so subjective, but...

The new alien didn't scare me at all. Covenant? Well, no, because there was not a lot of alien in it. Well, not only that, but it just was like, I mean, you have Danny McBride, who's supposed to be the Bill Paxton character from aliens, and he's so incredibly funny. I love Danny.

Danny's, like, one of my favorite comedians ever, and he's not in it enough. But it really was Fastbender's movie, and Fastbender's, like, brilliant, breathtaking to watch. Of course, but it's just like, again, you're like, I want to see more aliens, I want to see something.

I thought you said it was going to be more like aliens. Not you, proverbial you. Right. But I also, but there was also, and this isn't that big of a spoiler,

but there was a fundamental problem with one thing in the movie where they, they land on this planet that they're not supposed to land on where there's a distress signal. And they're scientists. And the one guy, like,

he takes a piss. He takes a piss. And then he leans down to smell a flower. Like, what are you doing? You know you're not supposed to do that. You know better than that. Well, I didn't read somebody, you think somebody on sets,

looking at Ridley going, Ridley, really? Come on, Ridley. Somebody say something. Really? No one wants to say anything to Ridley. Don't smell the alien flowers, ever. I would have been the guy. Ridley.

Why would he smell the flower? You're fired. Get out of here. You fucking, I can't tell you what a real treat this has been. I mean, you know, you do so, so much. And, you know, I like to say that we have things in common. Sure. And that commonality was, like, growing up and not feeling like you fit in and still feeling

like that. But I like how you've evolved and how you've evolved and how you. you've sort of grown up, even though you're the inner child still fucking pounding inside that anxiety. I have a weird thing, which is, I just, I don't know. Like, when I get knocked down.

I get up again. Sorry. You fucking... Why would you put that in my head? Because you had a pause. You never going to move me down. You know what? I'm going to say something.

You were right to do it. Would you have done it? I would have done it. If it had been in reverse, I would have done it. The other night, we were on vacation with a bunch of friends. and we were sitting outside, and it was the most beautiful starscape. We were in far northern California, and it was quiet for a minute. And I, just on my phone, I just hit, it's man, one week?

Like, I couldn't help it. Couldn't help it. So, yes, you always got to drop. I'm the idiot. I'm the idiot. I got to do it. But, yeah, but it's like, I like doing stand-up because I like taking responsibility for the whole thing. I like that no one can tell me whether or not I can do it.

And I started nerdist and I started doing podcasts and stuff because, like, no one would hire me. And so I was like, well, fuck you. I'll just make my own thing. I don't, I have the internet now. I don't need you. I can just make it myself. And I can just give it directly to people. And so it really just was a reaction to, you know, I guess one, in one parallel universe,

there's a version of me who's just stewing me like, no one ever, God, I can't get any breaks, you know. But for whatever reason in this one, I'm like, okay, fuck you. I'll just make it myself. I don't need you. And as long as I'm enjoying what I'm doing, it kind of, you know, as long as I can survive and I enjoy what I'm doing it doesn't really matter and you're doing great stuff in the wall I I text you the other week and I was just like this is I'm so glad you like I just I got emotional why do you make me emotional in a game show why did you do that I know I know it's just nice these touching

stories and what's great is I feel like you're rooting for them I really not only funny and but you're actually I want them to win NBC's money yeah they deserve it and I get that and I like that about it and it's a bummer when they don't win oh I know what I want to ask you real quick was you're always just talking off the cuff, right? Do you ever, do you ever read off teleprompters? Do you ever like, oh my God, what am I going to say for an hour? Do you ever, is it never, it never occurs to you of what you're going to talk about? No, I mean, like the top of the show is in teleprompter, which has all the information about the contestants.

You can't possibly remember all that shit. But otherwise, having done 900 podcast episodes, the podcast has really taught me how to listen to people and talk and, and I even feel like it helped me on my date with Lydia. because I it just it just taught me how to engage with people in a way that I don't know if I I did before you know I don't know if I really knew how to do that very well before I think I think that's what's happening with me is I just started this podcast like you know a little while ago and the first guests are all my friends and in the entertainment industry and and I have a propensity for sometimes you know I get excited about something I want to my mind's always thinking of another thing and this and like like real people talk yeah and so that's the more I get into it I'm like getting and I'm I'm really finding out you know you know inside of you with my growth i'm really getting inside of you like i really get to know you and i feel better about myself after hearing stories like from your stuff like it wasn't always easy and it wasn't like you had anxiety and you suffered from alcoholism and you did all anxiety depression all of it and it just makes me feel like there's hope you know i don't just just keep it at bay it's always there and i think recognizing it is good and going okay i know

you're there that's fine you know well listen this has been honestly a blast for me you're a dynamic intelligent, insightful, just a friendly good guy. You're one of the good guys in the business. Oh, thanks, man. There's a lot of, you know, I mean, look, I hate to paint the picture of the, you know, the industry is so bad in this, because there's a lot of great people in it. And we've met through a lot of great people. Like, James Gunn's a great friend of ours. And he's just one of the most honest guys I know.

And I know this was, this was one of my favorites. You know, you just, thanks for opening up. Of course. Allowing me to be inside of you. Ah, thank you. What's your, by the way, just your Twitter and your Instagram. I'm just like. At Hardwick. At Hardwick.

Yeah. I'm both. Facebook, Instagram, Twitter. This has been Chris Hardwick. Thank you for listening to Inside of you. What else should I do? Oh, should I do it? Believe has the podcast to enhance your football experience.

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