Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - James Marsters

Episode Date: July 14, 2020

James Marsters (Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Dragonball) joins me this week to share his experiences with acting as an art on-screen and on-stage before his breakout in Buffy. James also opens up on what it was like to have to take in his five year old niece and having to raise her as his own after already being a ‘weekend dad.’ We also get into stories back in the day on the set of Smallville, the idea of competition in art, and James’ experience with some of the cast and crew on Buffy. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Michael Rosenbaum. My birthday was this past weekend. I'm just going to say it. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. I just heard a few of you while you're driving to work or in the house or, you know, in bed nude. Say happy birthday in your head.

I felt it. So thank you. 48 years old, man. You know, that whole thing where they always say, I don't feel 48 or I don't feel 80 I've still got my body my body feels my body feels my body feels like shit but my I don't know what I'm trying to say is what I'm trying to say is everybody always says wow wow how did I get to be this age I'm whether you're 60 or 70 and you're like I don't feel I still feel and it's true I still feel like um uh in my 20s man

I do I just feel maybe if you if you listen to me and you you watch some of the movies I do and the things and my Instagram post you're like well look at you I mean you act 20 maybe that's why you're single buddy all right everything of that but I had a great birthday my friend Harland Williams very funny comedian dumb and dumber um actually he did a little segment on my Patreon uh one of my best friends in the world we've done a lot of trips together but uh he's got a bit he's got a pool in a backyard and I haven't really done anything in months and And so me and a few friends, we all got tested before and we all spread out in his yard and swam.

And it was great, man. It was great. I was, it was exciting. I felt, you know, there's six people there. It just felt like, hey, and I got a lot of nice gifts, too. Look at this. Hold on. I got this.

This is inside of you, Pilla. Pilla? That's a Pillar. Leah and Kristen got it for me. It has all the names. of everybody that's been on the podcast inside of you look at that it's pretty incredible i really love that gift they sent me a nice and i always say hey don't get me anything i really have everything i want just um you know some you know i have a good friends and you know you guys out there

it's enough you know and um but when you get something it's still you know i'm not going to say especially when it's a good gift you're like holy graham this is uh i'm glad they decided to get me no they didn't have to get me anything these uh you know and just to talk about patreon for a second you know all my listeners uh those that really love the podcast extra and then want extra footage and supporting the podcast these folks there's like 550 of them that are just amazing and uh you know it's a great it's a great thing it's a great community but uh they're so giving they're so loving and um you can't help but i feel like it's not just uh oh this is a patreon and fans can go watch stuff i feel like it is a um it's something special for me and especially

during this whole covid time this whole virus thing and all it just uh it's just like i feel like i have something more to do and um and i know i just love the podcast and some some good stuff coming your way i can't tell you right now but uh some good stuff could be potentially great stuff um also for the podcast before we get to the gas tag you got new mugs they'll be on uh on the inside of you store shortly but uh they're different color and uh inside of you cool mugs look at that boom boom's inside of thank you for allowing me to be inside of you limited supply and of course we got the uh the masks this is the uh face mask say inside of you with michael rosenbaum so that's kind of nice kind of neat you can get those on the inside of you online store at the end

of this will uh read a fan letter like i try to always do we'll read uh give my patrons some shoutouts uh all the other patron too where have all the good horror movies gone with john heater and michael rosenbaum you can look at that a lot of fun we do zooms and all that stuff anyway you know and also a shout out to my good buddy preston preston christiansen he turned 15 on july 8th i hope he got his presence by now um bought him a bunch of cool stuff we both love Jim Croce. That's what I'll say. The singer, you know, I have to say, I love you in a song. But he's been, he's had eight surgeries for cancer. He's 15 years old. And he has, he's been through so many radiation and chemo treatments. And I love him. He's like a little brother to me. And I've

become a family member of this family, Michelle and Chris and Chandler and Renee. And, you know, thanks to Lisa Fox for 104.3 FM in LA for giving Preston a shout out. And, uh, Nico for putting him in his little video game, The Bionic Kid, that you can get the app for. He put Preston, a character of Preston. It's just nice. I definitely, when I do things for other people, I feel better about myself. I feel better. It makes me feel full, you know, or just, I don't know, better, I guess, like of a better word, better.

It's amazing how you hear gratitude can do so much. And I'm telling you about experience, you know, before I go to bed, I think I've said this, but, you know, I close my eyes. And those nights that I remember to do so, I close my eyes and think of things that I'm grateful for. I get an image of my grandfather, an image of my grandmother, an image of whatever it is, Preston. And I, if I happen to fall asleep, which I do, my dreams are better. I sleep better. I'm going into bed with a healthy mind, I guess. I call it cheesy, whatever.

I mean, you've been with me for a year and a half, so I think you're here. You're not going anywhere, I hope. Let's get into it. You know, this guy has been around. I say that in a very admirable way. He's very intelligent. Went to a prestigious school. But he seems like one of the guys.

He's very an intense actor. Somebody who has done a lot of work, has appeared naked on stage. I don't know if I could do that. I'd probably have to stretch it out, if you know what I mean. But you know him from Buffy, the Vampire Slayer, an angel, and he's just done a ton of stuff. He's a great guy.

And we had a really good conversation. He got very personal and I hope you enjoy this. This goes out to a lot of the patrons who recommended him. I always try to listen to your comments on Patreon and the guests you want. I do my best to get them.

And great guests on the horizon too. I can't wait to share with you. All right, let's get into James Marsders. It's my point of view. You're listening to inside of you with Michael. Rosenbaum Inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience.

Where are you right now? You're at your house, but where are you at? Where are you at? I'm in Los Angeles, sunny Los Angeles, and that's where I am. Have you lived at this house for a while? Yeah, I've lived here for, about 17 years. I was living in Santa Monica,

and I had a little tiny one-bedroom in a fourplex. I was on, just getting off of Buffy and Angel, and it saved all my money. And then I lived in an apartment, and then you saved all your money from Buffy and Angel, which was probably a decent amount of money. Yes, it was. By the end of it, yeah.

So it was six years. So there was a good amount of money. Then I took my niece on to raise her, and I needed a house, good school system, and a nanny. Like, I needed a four-bedroom freaking house. And I did. So I went and got a house in a neighborhood with a good public school system, and the money just went. Like gone? Well, yeah.

the money that I'd save, you know. And I had to figure out how to make house payments and, and keep the lights on without being on a regular on a TV show. Now, you've been working. But I did. I mean, you've been working like crazy. I read all this stuff. You know, I do a little bit of research. Not much because I just like to shoot the shit and find out what makes people tick and what adversity they face and all the stuff and how they keep going.

And I find that stuff more fascinating, which I like to tell my guests. It's not that I don't care about your career. and you've had a big crew and you have a huge fan fandom you know buffy and angel you've produced or been in a part of 70 plays or many many plays you went to juliar for a couple years you did all these things uh and it's it's pretty amazing but the first thing you said and you started it was i had to raise my niece yeah so how how does that happen it's the hardest thing i've ever done in my life but why did this happen uh my brother couldn't get it done you know uh my little brother uh as a dual diagnosis and and uh he's a good man but he uh was not able to to take care of her

and he asked me to uh and she was five and a half and how old were you uh 40 i want to say yeah 40 i mean that's not an easy thing to sort of uh no i mean i mean your first answer probably is uh uh wait let's think of some options here uh well i mean what your response certainly wasn't Absolutely. I'm in. It kind of was. Really? Yeah. Well, I mean, it's for, I don't know, like for a lot of families and uncles stepping in and raising a nephew or a niece is not really abnormal.

It's not, you know, it is a big ask, definitely, but it's not that weird, you know. maybe it would be maybe it's weird for a Hollywood actor to say yes I have to say honestly with all sincerity I think if my brother said hey you know I'm going to have to ask you to take care of my daughter let's say well that's not going to happen I'll I don't know what I would say I mean look to be honest I mean you know you don't know what you do until you're in that situation and then you sort of go okay wait a minute wait a minute

am I the best person for this job because I look at myself like dude come on man you live alone you know now what are you to take care of something you got two dogs did you were you worried could you do this yeah well that was the first thing is is that I was the only one in the family that was well everyone else said no so and then the second thing I guess I was the last one asked but yeah so the initial ask was no one else is willing so it's either you or she's going to go into a foster home. And I know enough about little girls in, in foster care to know that that really wasn't going to be a good outcome for my niece. Well, she's my, but she's my daughter now. And yeah, I was, I was crazy worried, man. I was already a father, but I was a weekend

father. And we would shoot, we would shoot Buffy. We shot about 70, 80 hours. hours a week and then I would get in a car on Friday night or early Saturday morning and then drive 350 miles to go to go visit my son, which is like a whole other adventure. And then spend the weekend with him every other week and come back and keep shooting. So I had I had experience being parent, but that is the difference between being the good time weekend dad and being the one, the dad who's going to be. enforcing structure is just a

is a night day Hey wait a minute You're you know you're glitching You're talking and I'm seeing your mouth But it's like glitching a little bit Let me see you now Start talking Please be good

Please be good Oh that's I think Oh yeah bro I think we have what we call Some people call And I think that my skin texture Also looks Oh yeah

Phenomenal so Yeah This is good That's good we're good now We're good. Yeah. All right. So we were talking.

My wife again. Thank you, Mrs. Marsders. Is that her last name? Yep. Yep. What was her name before? It was, um, Raman. Raman?

Yeah, she's, uh, she is half Bangladeshi and half German. Ooh, does she speak German? Does she ever speak to you? Like, Spechenzezef Deutsch? Oh, yeah, all the time. She sings in German. Does she say, hi, it's mouth? I mean, shut your mouth.

I don't remember. I don't speak German. Shut your mouth, James. enough with your boffy shit no one wants to hear this anymore I'm tired it's old news it's old

he has no discernible accent whatsoever really yeah I kind of like a little German accent I don't know I've went out with a German one before I always like the accent like Michael

you have to slow down you talk too fast I'm like I know I'm sorry no she knows in some way she knows English better than I did she'll be able to spell a word that I don't know, or in some situations, punctuation that escapes me.

I'll go and ask her about it, and she'll know things I don't know. Yeah, that's usually the case for me. I never know anything. That's right. When it comes to English, I never say the right thing. I never do the right thing. I never spell the right thing. We're Americans.

We were not really educated, really. Yeah, not as well. Not as well. That's just what are we going to do? All right. So, all right, so you take on your niece who becomes your daughter. And what's her name? You know, I'm a little, the one thing that my, my, my daughter has asked me is to keep her out of social she does not want any reflected celebrity

whatsoever uh she's really good good for her that she doesn't want to be an actor though right she doesn't want to be an actor well there you go she's a mathematician she's going for her doctorate in mathematics and uh for now she's closing in on her masters right now uh see this is see i'm bragging again, which is me, I'm talking about her. She's an amazing person. She's my Phoenix, and she, uh, uh, uh, uh, yeah. Did you, did you get good grades growing up? Were you smart?

Did you excel in math and, and literature and all these things in high school where you were a smart guy? You see, because you're a smart guy. So obviously, yeah, I don't know, you know, Mike, I grew up in a highly intelligent family and I came, I came to understand, at least in my family, that intelligence more often than not was just used to rationalize insanity or ill behavior and that that it that high intelligence often is just people spinning their wheels in the mud um and so yeah i uh that says so much to me i would yeah i guess i said i would say that i'm intelligent i don't know how good

that is really i really like the way you said that though you almost said like really intelligent people it's like almost like it's a cover for almost like they have ill intentions in a way like where they can get away with bad things because they appear to be so knowledgeable or you know is that well just yeah or just to myself you know i have a i have a capacity to to rationalize uh myself to myself and and tell myself that i'm doing doing the right thing when in fact i'm not uh and and so that my intelligence is actually a tool for me to deceive myself. And I noticed that another intelligent people, too.

Don't you dare look at me and say that. No, I was just thinking, you know, I did a play where this guy was pretending to be a person, how do,

someone with a very low intelligence, very low intelligence. He was a murderer who was going to get away with it in this way or hide and then kill people. It was a play. And so I went and hung out with a community of people of very low intelligence and they were supremely happy, good people. It was it was absolute joy to be around them. I felt good every time I was around. Whereas, I mean, when I hang out with you, I got to say, I am very happy. You're a great guy.

There you go. See? Yeah. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but oftentimes when you were talking with someone who's very intelligent, especially someone who's very intelligent and is very proud of that or really taking themselves seriously or trying to prove how intelligent they are all the time. It's really annoyed, don't you think? You know, I remember, I mean, she's not listening to this anyway, but I remember being at Carrie Fisher's party, not the name drop, years ago. And she had a couple of drinks, maybe, but I remember Sharon Stone going on and on about how high her IQ was. And I thought my friends would punch me in the face if I said that once. She's like,

oh, I have a very, very high IQ. My IQ is extremely high. I'm like, wow, you're brilliant. Yeah. I just sat there going, wow, she's really saying this out loud. And a couple of us were looking at each other like, wow. But, you know, um, you said, really, really into, I interrupt you all. No, go ahead. Really intelligent people have the capacity to explain things that might seem complex in a very simple way. The kind of intelligence that I really respect. I remember what was his name? McCulley.

This older actor in Chicago explained Hamlet to me. And Hamlet had always been this great play with big themes and all this complexity. And he was just like, no, it's just about a teenager who's wondering if he should kill himself because he finally realized that the world is totally messed up.

that's it that's the whole thing you know does he does does does hamlet give up or does he try to change things does he try to make a difference or does he just once he really learns how infinitely screwed up his his surrounding world is does he just kill himself or give up or does he try to affect positive change and that's it uh I was just stunned you know but it took someone of very high intelligence to kind of um to bring that, to be able to pair it down to, it's simple truth. I wish people would do that. I wish instructions, like instruction manuals for like fixing a lamp or things like, I wish

they would just say in one sentence, this is all you have to do. I start looking at things and I just get overwhelmed by everything. Everything overwhelms me. I don't like reading directions. I just try to wing it. You seem like a direction guy. You look at the directions. You study them.

I have been that in the past. And I got to say I'm a little bit better now. Like, I got, I got a bowflex, and I got that thing in the mail. And that was just like, oh, I'm screwed. Like this thing, I'm never, and the thing about a bowflex is if you do it wrong, it's all about tension and wires and stuff, and you're likely to just slice open your carotid artery. But you figure that out.

I was well motivated to, like, really pay attention to step one, make sure step one's done and move on to step two. And that, that went well. Do you think, do you think you were, I mean, obviously, that we evolved so and you mature but mature do you think like when you started you started to do plays and like how old were you when you started doing uh you got in acting uh fourth grade fourth fourth fourth or fifth grade fourth and you knew were people looking at you're like oh he's got something this guy's good i don't know it was i played eeyore i remember in winnie the poo and i remember being really

like passionate about getting to the pathos of eeyore like i really thought that there was a sadness and a depth to that character that I wanted to mind. So I suspected I was a little too serious for the play. So maybe... But I think then in the summer, between 6th and 7th grade, I did two plays, and then I was truly bit. And I remember one was called The Me That Nobody Knows, which was a musical written by Inner City kids,

the monologues were written by inner city kids and then Broadway people wrote songs based on the things that they wrote. And I just remember singing in front of an audience and feeling connected to them and feeling like I was doing a good job and that everyone was kind of good with it. Like we were all together in the same room.

I was doing this thing. They were looking at me and everybody, no one was uncomfortable and it was all kind of good. And I remember being really bit by that. Did your parents sort of tell you, hey, James, or Jimmy, Jimmy, you're really good. Jimmy. Did they call you, Jimmy? No.

Okay. No, not so much. I wouldn't say, like, the best thing that I got from my parents was complete apathy toward whether or not I should be an actor. Like, they just didn't really, didn't care. Like, it's up to you, you know, do what you want. They weren't really against it. They weren't really that forward either.

So you don't have to really, you didn't try to prove to them that you were good? Did you always, were you always trying to like, look at me, I'm great? Were you that guy? Were you that kid that was just like, I want everyone to know I'm great? Because look, I think I did. I think I have many times in my life. I want to be great so people think, and that's obviously not the way to be. Yeah, I definitely was like that.

There was a time when I thought that if I couldn't be the greatest actor in the world, there was no point in trying at all. And then you come to realize that there's no real competition in art. you know that all artists we're all trying to just get honest with ourselves and then express what we find and so like um like I couldn't I you would never want to do

a rebel without a cause like the remake if you get the call we're remaking rebel without a cause you want to leave you know you would never say yes to that because you cannot touch James Dean and you can't no success will be in in redoing that but I don't know if James Dean would make the greatest spike frankly. Exactly.

So I'm only trying to be the best me. And so in that way, there's no competition at all. And I suspect the same would be true with the other arts, you know, sculpture. You know, you can't, you know, if you have to ask a sculptor, you know, who's better Michelangelo or Rodan, you know, be like, well, they were trying for different things. There were different people expressing different things. So, I mean, like, I don't see. We get into that, too. And I've gotten to this on the past podcast where then you start comparing yourself.

like oh because I would do that I go I love music so much I love music more than anything in the world I'm not the most amazing singer I'm not the most amazing musician but I love it I love it I'm like but I shouldn't do it because you know uh so and so has such a great voice and my voice isn't even on I'm I shouldn't do it and that's not why you should do things and it's taking me so long to understand that if you just enjoy it you can't the whole world isn't going to love what you do no matter what just do it because you love it because if you're not doing what you're not doing what you're not doing what you're you love, then I don't even know why you're here on this planet. So, and I've been on this planet a long time so far. And I, well, it's short time if you think about it. But I feel like I don't want it to get too late in life where I miss out on things because I'm scared or I don't feel like, you know, I'm going to be great at that. Or I just want to try to enjoy things. And did you, have you always enjoyed acting?

Have you always? Yeah. You know, I primarily enjoyed being. in a group of people that were functioning more or less harmoniously, you know. That was, I think, that and then the sense of connection of being on stage. You got a message? No, I'm just thinking. Like, I think that, I think for me, art is an artist.

creating something that expresses their experience, and then they put the art out into the world to see, does anyone else react to this? Am I alone? And if the audience reacts to it or if the public reacts to it, and the public says, wow, I recognize myself in that piece, whether it's painting or a TV show or whatever,

then the artist who made it feel more connected, like, oh, I'm not alone. And the great thing about theater is that moment happens when you're in the same room with the audience so you can see it happening. And it's powerful for the audience too because the audience is, if everything's working with,

the audience is looking at the play going, oh, I felt that, I'm not alone. And then they see the other audience members react to it. And so they're not alone in the fact that they're with a group of people who feel the same way or a similar way. And there's this wonderful sense of connection

that starts to grow when a play is working on. The opposite is true when a play is not working. Oh, yeah. This pretentious piece of shit. I remember I went to see it. I'm not going to even get into it. I remember I saw, well, I saw a play with a friend and we were going to see a friend, but what are the odds of the person who's in the play's best friend or brother sitting

right next to me? Oh, no, no. So I just, you know, I didn't say anything, but I was just like, no play needs to be for it. I'm not, look, I'm not like, I just, if a movie's more, more than two hours, I'm usually out, unless it's Forrest Gump. I'm just, I'm not into it. If a play's more than three hours, fuck off. If a concert's more than three hours, fuck off.

I just, I don't have the patience for it. And I remember just going, oh my, we have, how could we have, do we have three intermissions? Is that right? I've never heard of that. Has that ever happened? I think he heard some of that. And then I, and then when I, you know, I might have caught a nap, like a little doze. And then I remember backstage, he was like,

right there with me. And I go, oh, my God. Oh, my God. He's like, hey, this is Michael. I'm like, dude, I think I'm an idiot. And I know he said so. I can do one better. I remember going to see, again in Chicago, this actor-director in town

had directed me in a really wonderful play, and I was hoping that he would use me again. He was a really good director, and he was acting in a play, and I went to see it, and the play really wasn't that good. He was at a good performance. And I thought that I owed him my honesty when I went backstage. So I told him that he was in a dog.

And to see his face just fall was one of the... Did he ever talk to you again? No. Yeah, that could ruin a friendship. You know... Because he's got to go out there and hump that thing over the hill every night. Oh, yeah, you made a mistake, James. You can't...

You can't drop someone in hope. Maybe the last night you say, hey, by the way. You're done? This is it, right? You're not extending the play, right? They're not extending the play, right? Yeah, you're sure, yeah. Oh, man, this is a dog, bro.

I did one play. It was the marriage of Figaro, not the opera, but the play. And it's comedy, right? It's a biting comedy about class. And it was misdirected, and we didn't get one laugh in a month and a half. Just absolute crickets. one laugh and about two weeks into the run it got to be kind of a relief to realize

how bad the play it was that we were doing and just revel in how bad it was. I guess that's all you can do. You got to, hey, your survival tactic is, hey, this is what we're doing. Let's just bear down and fucking do it. Oh my God. We have to do the plays directed so we're just going to do this thing

but yeah you know i read that you were in a play and they rolled you out on a wheel and you were naked that was my my professional debut yeah and where was that that was at the goodman theater in chicago how old were you 24 i think and this is whole naked this is penis balls everything's oh yeah the um the artistic director was a was like the goodman was the big premier theater in Chicago it had a much older audience subscription base um and they had just hired a new fiery young artistic director and he wanted to kick out he wanted he wanted to get a younger subscription base so he wanted all the old people to get offended and so that he could have room to attract a younger audience and he could do edgier plays and so he put nudity in every in every show in that first

season and uh the younger people come out to see you because you They heard dong was in it? Did you hear that long duck dong's in this play? I'm going to go check out that play. Or did you get more women or more guys or whatever? They came to see the show because... I could hear the clicking of the opera glasses. It was a big house.

And they would roll me out and I'd go out here. Click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, click, cook, click. And everyone was like with their little, you know, binoculars, their little monocle, what are they called? No, they're like, they're really old-fashioned. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, a little flick out and it's both... I know. It's a little tiny pair of binoculars. But I remember the, the sprites, the guys who were playing the little fairies and sprites,

who were wheeling me out, would show me pornography because I was strapped in the thing. So they would, like, shove pornography in front of me right before they rolled me on. To try and get you aroused? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Did it work? No, hell no. No. You're about to be rolled out in front of 700 people.

Like, there's no way. Well, wait a minute. When you say rolled, are you rolled upside down and up? old upside down. No, no, no. It was like on a Because a flippity flap, I was kept thinking if this is a wheel that's going like that around, it's going to flap, it's going to be too funny. People are going to be like, oh, there's this

dick flapping up and down, up and down. Thank God. So, let me ask you this, because I would do this. Did you stretch it at first? Like, hey, I don't want it to be too cold or I want to I want to pull it down. I want to make it longer than it is. You had to. I wish I would have thought of that. Or maybe you're

just fine. I didn't didn't, I didn't, I know, I didn't try. But you were quoted as saying, after that, I could be naked anywhere. It didn't matter at that point. After doing that. Yeah. I mean, that got, you know, you know you'll survive after doing that. I don't know that I would say that it has no effect on me, you know.

I don't know. I don't know that I am entirely comfortable. I guess if it's for a good cause. Like I did this play called Just Friends where it was just, it was a picnic during World War II. Apparently, during World War II, people would go out into the fields and watch the German bombers come over on their way to London, and they would actually picnic and watch this. And it was a man who was discovering that he was gay, meeting a openly gay artist, and them sitting down and having a talk and a picnic together. And at the end of the play, the artist, that I play the artist, takes off all his clothes. and there's a pause and the man who's discovering himself takes off all his clothes

and then they lay down to Sundays and it lights out and it's just called just friends like they're not going to become lovers they're just there for each other as human beings they're just talking about them and so and it's really cool and in that way I was very happy to do the nudity you know that served like a real purpose there Um, if the nudity is just for titillation, I'm a lot less comfortable. Yeah.

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had you ever really been recognized as much or or was it really buffy that did that oh it was absolutely buffy it was the night and day i mean like i would get i would get like when you're doing theater um you might have someone stop you to take a walk and someone would stop you and say i saw you macbeth last night you were very nice so you know there would be that thing kind of going on, but that was night and day from the kind of thing that happened during Buffy.

And I was afraid of being famous. I was terrified that I would lose my soul and become a douchebag if I got famous. I did this. Man, we're talking so much about theater, but it's formative for me.

So were you part of the Thespian Society in high school? No, I did a play in high school. clubs and I took drama for four years then I did a play and then when I went to college I started doing more and more plays and got involved but not there's a there's a the drama club you know the nationwide drama clubs yeah I wasn't being society right so um every other year they would go to ball state university and have a convention and for that convention they would they would have a play that was cast from all around the country um and my senior year was coincided with with this convention and that year's play was Godspell

and they cast me as Jesus in the play and within the confines of Ball State University we were like the Who in 1972 we were like Led Zeppelin in 70 you know and like we had to we had to have bodyguards we had to be shuttled around we had people like breaking into our

dorm rooms the Thespian Club the Thespian Society It was this weird thing And like after the play The audience like stormed the stage And they started tearing my costume off You know trying to get bits of the costume Yeah

And I remember thinking like I'm really glad This is happening to me at age 18 Because now I know I don't want to go to Hollywood I am I this is not what I want So I will stay in theater Where it's not you know Being super famous is not usually in the cards

I would have ran I would have just like Yeah Take me away, Calgon. This is awesome. And then, of course, you figure it out. Yeah. So you experienced that.

But, like, well, first of all, I want to go back because I know you've told this story, but I like to twist it up a little bit, if possible. So when you get Buffy, is it something like you obviously auditioned for it? Yeah. And you did any, did any, did they want English accent? They did. They asked me if I could do any other accents. I said, yeah, I can do quite a lot of different accents.

And they said, you'll give us another one. And, um, And I had, again, I had done a play where I used, let's see, like a deep, like a Louisiana accent, like deep on south, way on down Louisiana, like that. And again, I was playing a killer, and the killer was on the phone with the lead of the play. And we were getting all of these laughs that we didn't plan on having. And I remember asking the director, why are we getting these laughs? And he said, well, they can't see your face. and you're using that accent, they think you're black.

So it's playing differently than I wrote it, but it's actually working very well. And I was like, okay. And I thought when they asked me later during the Buffy audition, like what other accent, I thought, well, because he said the accent that you're using would have been a white accent, say, 150 years ago, but in modern times, it's only black people would use that accent now,

so they think you're black. So I thought, well, a vampire, that would be a funny. accent to use that, to use that one. I'm a vampire. So I did that as well, but I mean, like, Joss wanted to, uh, Josh Whedon, the guy who did Buffy, uh, who made it up, um, he, he wanted a, an English punk rock vampire. And, uh, it's not surprising that he said, no, that's cute. That other accent's very cute, but I want what I want. What did you wear for the audition? Uh, I imagine the, the character was really scruffy. So I wore this old black t-shirt.

um uh that i'd had for like 15 years most of my clothes at this point i was really poor so most of the clothes i had i had for 15 years but this black t-shirt you know like have you ever had one of those t-shirts that you wash it so often that all the cotton is gone yes and from the blend and you only have the synthetic stuff behind you know um because that was the most messed up t-shirt that i had that wasn't full of holes uh and they love that t-shirt and in fact they used that t-shirt for the first few episodes maybe the maybe all the season two we use that t-shirt and what had been like a dish rag in my life suddenly became like the shroud of turin because they couldn't double it they couldn't find a t-shirt that was that messed up so there's only

one of them so that whenever i had that whenever i was in costume they're like no be careful you're drinking coffee don't get it on the t-shirt be careful with the t-shirt did you know in the room when you're reading for joss you read for joss obviously yeah it's uh and a whole bunch, a whole bunch of people. Did you really milk it? Did you turn it on with that accent? Because that accent is surprisingly. I know you've heard it, but it's like most people think you're English.

And then they meet you and they're like, holy shit, he's not. I think the accent was not actually that great in the first bit. I think it got better as time. Like if you do anything for six years, you'll probably get pretty good at it. You know? And I think by the end of it, it was a really incredible accent. But in the beginning it wasn't that great. but I thought I was great, and yes, I was, I remember, this is great.

I remember being so proud that I was from theater and that I thought that I had much more experience than anyone else audition. So I remember being out in the audition room and facing a wall doing Shakespeare monologues really loudly just so everyone else would think, oh, that's a real actor, I'm screwed. I was trying to mess with people, not realizing nobody cares about Shakespeare in Los Angeles. no one did they hate you the people in the audition room they thought I was psychotic about that I imagine it's called the evil a most miraculous work of this good king

which half since my here remained in England I have seen him do I mean as I'm like what the fuck is he doing he's unbuffy and then finding out that that insane man got the role he's just like I quit forget it you know and you hear about this

because I'm one that can relate to you about the hair and the bleach and I had to shave my head So we could relate to it. But, like, it really burns your scalp. Like, it hurt. Oh, so bad. So bad. Yeah.

Because it was just because we had to do it every episode. We had to do it every eight days because the vampire's dead so you're, the hair doesn't grow so you can't have roots. So on the bottle, it says only do this every six weeks. It's not safe to do it more often than that. And we were doing it every eight days. So when you, when you bleach, you would get blisters. You get blisters on your skull.

because it's really heavy chemical. And so we were pouring bleach on top of the open wounds from the last bleaching, like, every eight days. Did you think that you were going to maybe not grow your hair out? Like, you're going to lose your hair. You're going to go bald. You're going to be scarred for life. Yeah, they would say, we don't know if you're going to have hair by the end of this. And I was like, screw it, pay me.

I'll buy hair. You know, like after 15 years of abject poverty, you know, the hair was my last concern. Wow. I was just trying to make money to, because I became a father. So I moved down to Los Angeles to try to buy diapers and health care and stuff like that. And so, you know, at that point, hair smear. Hair smear. But, you know.

I didn't know. I don't know how to do anything else. And, you know, like, keep paying me. I'll do. Jesus. I mean, you're acting. You're doing something you love. You know, the character wasn't supposed to be around very long.

And then, you know, they, the fans loved you. Did you feel like, uh, I'm going to renegotiate and they're not going to pay me this guest rate shit? And I'm going to get paid salary and I'm going to get paid fairly because I'm an integral part of this mofo. show? No. I was only signed to one year, and the whole idea was they told me you would be in between five and ten episodes. So my whole deal was just

to try to make it closer to ten than five. That was the whole thing. And then at the end of season two on Buffy, but the job was over. And I do remember thinking, trying to do it without me guys, I'd rock. And then I remember tuning in to season three, which I wasn't in at the time and they had a character called Faith that Eliza Descu was doing

and that was freaking awesome and I remember thinking oh my God they don't need me at all but they did I don't know I think that it was a character

that the writers enjoyed exploring You guys got along real well you and Joss No I was terrified of Joss really absolutely terrified I've never met him but he's seen it

I thought he was just such a nice guy Gentleman right yeah but the thing the thing is is that I was imperilling the theme of Buffy, which is that Buffy is actually the same theme as Hamlet, which is how do you get through adolescence? How do you see the world is screwed up and not give up? How do you take arms against the sea of troubles? How do you make a positive

difference in the world? And vampires in Buffy are just metaphors for all of the challenges that you face in that period. And so, you know, Joss felt that vampires should be ugly. They should be very quickly overcome. And they were not supposed to be sexy. He said, I don't like that Anne Rice crap. And he got talked into one romantic interest vampire. That was Angel. It wasn't his idea. And that was the only one. That was the exception. And then I came along and I wasn't designed to be a romantic character, but then the audience reacted that way to it. And I remember he backed me up against the wall one day. And he was just like, I don't care how popular you are kid you're dead you hear me you're dead dead and i and i was just like uh

you know it's your football man like okay you know wait was he was he kidding around no hell no he was angry with you he was angry at the situation i think or he was he was he ever apologized no why why should he if it had been me in his shoes i'd have killed me off just immediately so wait wait wait wait wait you're saying he resented you because of your popularity he resented a situation where he had to deal with another romantic vampire when his theme was that vampires are the problems you get, you have to get over in high school.

In season two, when he's trying to hold on to a really good theme and it's getting corrupted by a surprise character. And I, like, evil is not cool. You know, evil, and I think that a lot of,

a lot of what we do in Los Angeles in Hollywood when we portray evil as cool I think that we're really lying I think that evil is stupid and laughable and it should not be portrayed as cool and I really respect Joss

that he is not interested in portraying evil as cool and yeah I mean if I had been producing that show and I had been in control and Spike was getting romantic thing I just would have slid his throat right away.

Right. We just protect the theme, yeah. What's your favorite? I don't think I'm as brave as Josh. Josh decided to like deal with it, you know, and try to try to find a way to explore that. Who did you love working with most? Like if you remember, like off the cuff, like right at top of your head.

Tony had, Anthony had played Giles, the older guy to let me are in. He was hands down the best actor on the show. He, uh, I remember. I did my first scene with him, and I remember thinking, oh man, would you wake up? I'm going to mop the floor with you, man. Because he wasn't doing anything. He was kind of mumbling.

And I didn't catch it. And then I saw the episode, and he just, there was no need to watch me. It was all about him. Because he wasn't lying. He wasn't performing. He wasn't trying to impress anybody. He was just letting you stare at him as he figured stuff out. It was fascinating. And I remember

realizing that I had to go back to zero, and I had come in so proud of all of my tools from stage and very few of them were going to be useful in front of the camera and so I would watch Tony and I would come in even if I wasn't in the scene I would just sit on an app box and watch him work and notice what he was doing and most importantly what he was not doing he was not pushing it out he was just experiencing something

that the camera could document he was giving himself an actual experience that the camera could then record. Do you have a strong work ethic? Do you, are you hard on yourself? Do you learn lines easily? Do you get nervous on set? Do you let things kind of overwhelm you? Do you, is there that kind of essence that you sort of carry around when you're working?

I don't know if I get nervous. No, I don't get nervous. In fact, when things go really wrong on set, I love that. Really? Because then I get a chance to show off. You know, like, we have to get this shot. We're out of time. You know, I love that.

Really? Yeah, yeah. You want to be the go-to guy? Yeah, because I know my lines, man. I'm like, okay, okay, let's jump off the cliff. We have to do it. This is exciting, you know? But I've learned that in order to have fun,

I have to know my lines really well. Because if I don't know my lines so well, then I'm sweating it. and then it's very stressful. But if I know my lines so well that they just come out, like I think Kubrick said, and the actor should know their lines so well that they can't say them wrong.

And I think that there's a lot to that. So, yeah, I put a lot of effort into knowing my lines, so I just can press a button and it just comes out. And so then I can start thinking about all the things, not the words, but all the things that I'm thinking, why I'm saying the words. You know what I mean?

Yeah, I absolutely. So you can sort of like talk to someone and look at something and grab something and like open a book and like do things and not think of your lines and that's what people do I'm like looking at something I'm like yeah so James and I'm drinking my club soda and I just want to have a conversation that's exactly why you want to know your lines and you could always tell when I can sneak another sip of coffee yeah I got I got my coffee over there and a lot of times I'm looking over let me know I should keep talking right now I was waiting until Michael's making a point and I'm going and you can see

the people struggling that are just like going I just want to get I've looked into the mirror last night and went over my lines and these are the lines and that's it and please don't have me do anything else and that's all, you know, whatever. What's the line that fans, when you go to these cons, because I've seen you at the cons and they love you and you play music and you, all these things. What's the quote?

Do they always say, will you say this line? Is there a line that is your favorite or their favorite or that you go, oh, this one again, I have to say. Like mine is, I am the villain of the story. So what's yours? Out for a walk, bitch. That's it.

I only have to say five words. Out for a walk, bitch. Yeah, yeah. But you said it a certain way. Yeah, but Buffy finds Spike outside her house staring into the window. She's like, Spike, what are you doing here? In five words or less. And he's all completely embarrassed that he's been caught.

He's in love with her. She's not in love with him yet. And he's totally embarrassed. And he's like, well, out for a walk. Bitch. That's true. a great long. Do you remember working on Smallville with me and Tom?

Yeah. Yeah. What do you remember about that experience? And Tom loves you by the way. Every time we see you somewhere, he's like he's like, I like that guy. He's the whole cast, man. That was such a great experience, man. I remember being on set with you

and having publicity wanting to stoke a competition between you and I. And the fact that you and I would not have it. And we would just not feed into that at all. He was like, no, this is a cool guy, man. I can't wait to act with him. It's going to be a lot of fun.

And they kept asking me questions. Like, yeah, don't you think you're going to get over on him on today? Aren't you going to, who's the better actor? Who's the bigger badass? I'm like, oh, my God. You know? I remember the humiliation of acting with Tom Willie. Because we would do a lot of walking talks, and I'm not Tom Welling tall.

So when you have, you know, the close-up shot of both of us, us in the shot if you want me in the shot you have to put me up on apple boxes and so when we're walking they would have to like tape 15 to 50 apple boxes together in a big ramp uh to you know how tall are you five nine it's that's a reasonable height but he's six five he's six five i had to deal with it too and i was lex luther and i was like looking up at him going listen me motherfucker. You know, it's like Jesus, you know, but Do you have to stand on an Applebox?

Occasionally I would, you know, I'd say, hey, guys, I want an Applebox and the director, go, well, you suddenly going to be taller than Tom? I'm like, all right, what the difference? Half an apple. Well, dude, you know, and I know that you love playing music. I know that you had a band. I know you broke up. I know you got back together and did some things. I had a band too,

and it's sort of like, every actor has a band. It's like, I just, no, what it is is, I like, I love music. You love music. So having a band is not easy. Now you hear all these stories when bands break up. And you're like, what if they can't get a law man? These hits, they do this.

I mean, there's a little band that nobody knows and we can't get it together, you know. Yeah. Was it tough? I think that you're dealing with people's inner child when you're dealing with artists. A lot of us, a lot of artists, you know, we say that we feel whole when we're doing our art. And that's because our inner child only feels comfortable enough to come out into the sunshine when there's a structure and a safety and art provides i think that for me anyway that structure and that safety and i've noticed it you know it's the same thing you know

rehearsing a play or any any mass artistic endeavor and people come in with ideas and they come up with instincts and they're they're basically sharing what their inner child is wanting to show and if if you disagree with it you're basically telling you're the other person's inner child fuck you go back go back into the darkness and and uh and it can get really passionate all right listen this is a shit talking with uh with uh with i guess it's shit talking with james margers but uh these are patreon fans so this is patron this is that they're fans they have questions they're they're my patrons they're awesome and they have some questions so this is spitfire so you go you go boom you answer them you know an a if you could add or change one thing about

spike's character what would it be Not a goddamn thing. Really, not one thing. Not a goddamn thing. How about the color of his hair? No, look fucking fabulous. You did look fabulous. It was gorgeous.

But you suffered. Oh, my God. You suffered, man. You suffered for art. I look good. And in Los Angeles, it's better to look good than to feel good. Fernando said that on Saturday Live, Billy Crystal's cat. He goes, you know, my daddy always told me, said, Fernando, don't be a schnook.

It's not how you feel. It's how you look. He'll look my... You look absolutely. Dee, dear James, what did you think of this series finale of Angel? I thought it was beautiful and epic. I just like Buffy's. Yeah, that would be the one thing I would change about Angel.

They dumped ice water on us for 18 hours because they didn't, we got canceled by surprise so they couldn't save back enough money to make a big epic ending. So they just dumped huge water on us. And they forgot to park the water truck in the sun so the water was ice cold. And I was already coughing up blood. I was so sick by the end of that season and they were just frozen I bet Borianus lost his shit

no man we muscled out none of us actually bitched about it but but we were muttering that's because I wasn't there you know because you can see your breath and then like an action Leanne Pee I mean you just said this any fun cool behind the scene moments from Smallville that you would like to share but I mean you know yeah I remember coming on the set and

finding out that the stunt man who was the head of the department and also double Tom had just taken an 18-foot fall that his wire. Yeah, everybody thought he was dead. Yeah. He fell and he wasn't all his, but they said his body, the sound that made was, they thought he was dead. Somehow he rehabilitated and he's fine.

I mean, obviously, you know, but I don't know how he lived. It was a 25 feet, wasn't it? Yeah, it was insane. And like, it wasn't the first time, like, that kind of thing that happened over on Buffy. that's like it's actually dangerous stunts are actually dangerous and uh and uh and that was that was the day that i they were going to put me in a big um mechanical arm to fly me like like uh superman had just punched me and then i have to go twirling through space or whatever right and so they had to like manipulate me and and i was just like fairly today

oh my god you know let's uh todd do you have a favorite show that you'd love to have a guest scroll in. Dark. Dude. Dark. But here's the thing. The first season was probably the best show I've seen in years. Right?

Unbelievable that show. And the thing is that this is supposed to be rapid fire. I'm incapable of rapid fire. I apologize. But I always imagine the director on Dark because he gives the same note every take, I imagine. Stop acting. Less, please. Less, less, less.

Because the actors is so good because the actors are doing nothing. Yeah, right. It's so simple, and it's so effective. What if we just did this interview, like, nothing like. So, I don't know. Are you happy? All right, Lisa H. Is your side project, Vidyets done?

You and Mark were just hilarious in that definitely a comedy duo. Oh, man, yeah. Mark became a father, and he is now got a real job. So he's not coming out with me to convention, which is where we filmed Vidyots, I'm afraid. right now it's it's on it if we can figure out a way to to to keep it going we will but for now it's it's it's iced brian h how did you get the gig to do the audiobooks for the dresden files and who's your favorite character to read i don't know why they chose me i i have no clue but

a butcher who writes the dresden files they asked him who he wanted they said me i remember thinking that it would be an easy job and finding very quickly that it was a very difficult job have you ever done a book on tape one um yeah it's a lot it's a lot right it is i remember i came back from lunch and the director was surprised he's like you tv actors you usually go out to for lunch you don't come back so good for you at least you're doing that uh my my favorite character is bob the scowl because he's got a very interesting accent and he's um a disembodied uh spirit that lives in a skull and um he can't get out and he's horny all the time so he's a pervert So he's always talking about trying to get pornography into the skull and no one will give it to them.

You are damn good with these accents. It's unbelievable. It's so funny, too, when they read, I get nervous because, like, you know, you tell me to read something. I'm like, all right, I'll read these questions. I don't think about it. And you say, all right, read. And you're like, right before they are rolling and they're like ready. I'm just like, ah, hmm.

Like, you've got to get started. Like, the first day was tough. The first time was. Okay, Thomas T, I met you at a Comic-Con. My wife and I were dressed as Lois and Clark, and you took a video of us at his table at your table. I'm curious, what's the best cosplay you've seen and taken a video of? What's the best I mean, really?

Do you just videotape other cosplay people? Yeah, yeah. It's the thing I do. If you're dressed in cosplay of any show that I've done, then I just take you a quick video where I would, you know, I would be like, hi, I'm James and I'm Spike. And that's it. That's all you got to do.

And then I just put those together into a short film and then have an audience clapping at the end. And then did I just put that on social media after the con? And what's the best one? There was a Zamasu from Dragon Ball Super. I played Zamasu and Dragon Ball Super. And it's a really wild character. He's a god. And he's got enormous hair and, you know, big shoulders and everything.

And someone just had it down to a tee. Yeah, I can appreciate that. I think you and I are a lot of like in terms of, like, the cons to me are sort of, they feel like home in a way. They just feel like, you know, I love getting toys and posters and things. And I just love it there. I feel at home. I went to those before I became anything, anyone.

I went to horror conventions and. Me too. Yeah. Me too. I was dressed as Spock. Really? I had pointed ears. I had the tricorter.

I had the tunic. I had everything in a big blonde afro because I could not control my hair when I was 13 years old. Can you do a Spock accent? I don't think he has one. I can go like that. But doesn't, yeah, the original Leonard Nimoy. Yeah, he just, yeah, I don't know. I'm not really a mimic to tell you the truth.

It's hard for me to mimic another person. He has a deep voice. I can do accents, but it's a different thing. What's the one impression you go to? Can you do one impression of someone? No. Oh, man. As soon as, as I'm walking around my house,

I'm going to be like, oh, I should have done that. I don't, nothing comes to mind. Because you do so many accents, you'd think there's the, you know, if you just, you probably do, what's his name, Picard? You could probably, if you listen to him, do Picard. Data. Make it so. No, but I'm just doing a plummy accent. That's all I'm doing.

That's not, that's not Stewart. But it's in essence of Stewart. Patrick Stewart. Yeah. Okay. What was wrong with that? Okay. I remember, I can't do James.

Mason but remember James Mason yeah yeah he had something I can't do it but I know there's one line goes hello he would do that hello Jim it's time to go now or something like that right James Mason's Salem's lot

put it down give it to the monster something I forgot what it was dude this has been so fun I'm glad we finally got to do this we've talked about it and I know you're busy I know you got a family and it's just I'm glad you opened up and you were able to hang out with me.

Totally, man. I've been looking forward to this ever since you asked me. For last week and a half, I've been telling everybody, I'm on Rosenbaum's podcast. What's next? I know everybody's sort of like, you know, I don't know what's next because we're kind of like, you can't really act, you can't do, you know, are you doing anything? Yeah, well, I'm waiting. We just finished a pitch to D.C.

for an idea for a comic book series that I've had for a number of years that I probably shouldn't talk about, but it's super. It's freaking awesome. And we've pitched it, and our contact at D.C. is going to send our pitch up the ladder and see if we get a comic book. And we're just waiting on that. I'm hoping, because it's the perfect thing to do during a lockdown is right. Oh, yeah.

And then I just finished the next Dresden file book called Peace Talks. And that'll be coming out in a few weeks, I think. So you just set up your quarter at home and do it there? no actually i went to the studio well think about it's probably you in a room that's it exactly yeah i mean you go in and wipe down the room and and make sure no one comes in adjust your own mic and you're fine would you ever do a buffy reunion yeah uh i told joss during angel that that uh if he if he called me for anything whether it's one line or 50 i'd come when no matter where i was in the world but if you wanted to film me doing spike he had seven years because i'm aging and spiked

Spikes a vampire, and I don't want to play an aged spike. You know, like, I would just spike now be like, what happened to Spike? He looks like shit. Have you seen, like, once upon a time in Hollywood, they young, I almost said euthanized. Because they young andized. You can look younger. And you look good, too. What are you talking about?

Your skin looks good, at least from my vantage point on. I mean, what are you talking about? You're younger than me, asshole. The face changes. I don't know. Yes, if there was a way, or if Spike was always in vampire phase, then that might work. So, sure, you know. Yeah.

Yeah, man, if Joss wanted me to work again, I would just really want to protect that idea that he's a vampire. He doesn't age. That's one of the core things about being a vampire. Do you still talk to him? What's that? Do you still talk to Joss or Sarah or anybody? Yeah, you know, I email Sarah. a while, we brag about our kids.

I think my kids are more impressive. So in my mind, I beat her every single time because her kids are much younger than mine. Joss, no, I saw him, last time I saw Joss was during the Entertainment Weekly photo shoot where we were, it was the 20th year anniversary or whatever, and we did a photo shoot and I got to talk with him a bit, you know. And I found he was the same Joss. Like, I thought maybe he'd have changed after Avengers and everything. like he'd be like Mr. Important guy

and he was the same Joss who's racked by self-doubt just like always I love that guy James thanks for doing this and I appreciate best luck what's your handle by the way your Twitter and Instagram so people will follow you James Marster's of as an official but just OF is on Twitter

and then the official James Marster's Facebook page well I'd love to do this again I'd love to when this is over go have a beer something I would love it talk about the old days we're getting to that age where I'm like well what you You're, like, 10 years younger than me, aren't you? No, I'm 58.

What? Yeah. You're older than me? Am I? Okay. I didn't know you were older than me. I thought you were younger than me. I swear to God.

You bastard. Mike, I have this light that my wife gave me. Look at that. You know, I have a light in there. I have a light in the other room, too. Hey. Put this light right in your face. But she'll look good.

Here, I'll turn it off for you. Oh, my God. Still look great. You know, there was a moment. I think I've talked about this, but I remember. one day, it's 5 a.m. and I'm in the makeup trailer and I'm shading my face with an electric razor

and the makeup artist Natalie goes, oh, Michael, that's Tom's razor. And I go, oh, no wonder I was feeling so gorgeous for a second. And then I went back to my old razor and I was like, oh, the horror. The horror. I'm hideous. I think I posted

that somewhere. Dude, I love you. Thank you again. And thank you. Please say thanks to your wife for letting you use her phone. She saved the deal, man. She did, man. This would have been shitty. I'll cook for it tonight. Thanks for allowing me to be inside of you. That's what I say. Oh, baby. Don't tell my wife.

Hey! All right, I want. Shut up. God damn it. All right. Well, thank you, James Marzgers. I enjoyed that. I had never really talked to him that much because he was on Smallville with me and we see each other at conventions. But it's like, hey, dude. And I don't remember really having in-depth conversations with him.

before today and it just was um i just have a brand new respect it's amazing when you just take a minute to get to know someone you could learn so much and i've done that with so many guests where i'm like wow i like this person that's why you shouldn't judge other you shouldn't say oh i heard that guy's an asshole so he must be an asshole no i heard she's a bitch why because someone heard that heard that she was a bitch try to be open-minded man i do it i'm i can judge man i am mike judge i am Judge Judy. I am Judy Judge. That doesn't make sense. Let me just to read. By the way, I just

want to say a big shout out to all the patrons who support this podcast. I love you more than you know. Thank you. Anybody who wants to join Patreon, check it out. Go to the Patreon app. And you can join. There's so many cool tiers and communities. And I do YouTube lives for

everyone where I play music and they recommend songs and you know, you just get discounts on stuff and And just so much good stuff. There's so much. Just look at the tears and maybe you want to join. If not, thank you for just listening and subscribing.

Please, please look at the, you know, please follow us and inside you at inside you podcast, Instagram, Facebook, at inside you pod on Twitter. And subscribe on YouTube. That's a big one too. We're growing. We started like 18,000. I think we have over 50,000 subscribers now or something like that. but please watch and listen if you could do both that'd be amazing wow listen and watch i would

owe you do you understand me here's a uh a fan letter i won't read the whole thing this is some candy miss candy she uh she is so supportive and loving and it seems like everything i do it's just it's just like uh it's just she's a wonderful person and she has a huge heart and i just uh i really appreciate her and i want to read something that she said Love your podcast. It's so inspiring and holds my interest. Great therapy. This is one of the best podcasts I have ever listened to. I can relate to most of the inspiring stories your guests talk about. I love that you and your guests are so honest and open about their lives and issues and can talk about it. It's hard to find people that are true to their self and can be honest and are not fake. you know thank you um candy you're so you're so amazing and it's funny because i didn't even know this was your letter i just started looking i go wow this is some candy and um candy is a cancer and domestic violence survivor and uh she has a heart of gold a heart of gold and that's

what it's like you know that's what it is that's what it's about is what i'm trying to say so thank you candy thank you for writing in and um it means a lot uh here's another one Michael thank you for creating both your podcast well one is gone now but I still have the inside of you podcast so thank you this is from uh Valerie it seems when I listen to each one that something in it is something I needed to hear at that moment you see I don't love myself anymore probably because the last man i gave love to died by suicide in june and i'm struggling every day to know why i was not enough for him to overcome his pain and stay i'm learning i couldn't have stopped him but my heart hasn't caught up anyway thanks michael

Valerie, that's tremendously sad and, you know, I think if you look, if you look at history and you look at people that have committed suicide, you know, there's probably not one person who hasn't said, I wish I could have, I, that's something that is going to happen with any kind of death from the most part. I mean, obviously, suicide, you feel, you know, like, oh, my God, I didn't know they were that sad. I didn't know this. I think when you're in a certain state of mind, like he was maybe, and again, I'm not Dr. Rosenbaum. I'm just kind of from friends and from people I've known that have committed suicide and people who have experienced it and had loved ones that, you know, I just feel like when they're in that mindset, there's nothing anybody could have said or could have done. And, you know, like the Robin Williams thing, you know, everybody was like, what, what, what, why would he do? He was in pain and, you know, things were going on in his mind that no one could understand except him, I assume. So I don't, Valerie, don't you, don't you get down on what you could have done or, you'll find love again and you deserve it.

We all deserve it. And, um, and I'm sorry. I really am sorry it's a terrible thing when someone passes especially in that manner so I could just say you know I love you

Val and I'm sure you know a lot of people love you and care about you so stay positive and you know be healthy you know he didn't want to be here obviously for some reason so you why don't you live the life that

you wish he could have had be as happy as you can be as present as you can and um i don't know probably spit bone here but i'm just trying to speak from the heart uh big shoutouts uh you know first of all uh obviously uh i just did the uh galaxy con virtual thing on sunday it was it was fantastic a lot of fun zooms with fans and i'm doing another one for informa so if you want to do zooms and autographs all that stuff we're doing a virtual one smallville informa july 30th or 27th, look online. I'll post something but Informa. Again, new inside of you masks and mugs. They're online at the inside of you store. Join Patreon if you so desire inside of you

podcast on Patreon and where have all the good horror movies gone on Patreon. It's always nice to see new people and I like to message them and say welcome. And it is me. I do not allow Bryce to make comments unless someone's looking at something that's wrong with their sight. So it is me. I always say Rosie or Rosenbaum, but you know it's me by the way I speak. No one speaks like me like an idiot. Okay, here are the shoutouts.

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I ain't going to, you know, I ain't going to yell at you. I'm going to give you love, man. I'm going to give you some love. Thank you for listening again. Make sure you subscribe. Email all your friends. Make sure they subscribe and write reviews. If I don't get back to you, it takes a couple months for the hello at inside ofupodcast.com.

If you leave a message, it could take time. I can't do this many things at this. same time. Ryan's not here. I'm missing. I don't have my wonderful. Jessica, who you've heard about, my assistant. She's wonderful. She's not with me anymore, but we're on great terms. It wasn't like that. And I love her. And hi, come on. Look at a special guest. Come here. Come on. Come on. Look at the special guest here. We've got my doggy Blanche as I end the show. He came in at the right time, didn't you? She's a good girl, and she smells good. Breathe in the microphone. You hear that?

That's her nose. I love you all. Thank you all for allowing me to be inside of you today. And another big shout out to my patrons on the horror where I have all the horror movies. Good horror movies gone. Inside of you, patron. And Bryce and Ryan, I love you. And I wish everybody the best.

Have a great freaking week, man. And stay safe, stay healthy. Do something positive. And my, what is it, Blanche? Thank you. Can you stop? I love you. Foodonfoot.org, Ronald McDonald's House of Los Angeles,

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