Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - Katherine McNamara Returns

Episode Date: January 28, 2020

Katherine McNamara (Arrow, Shadowhunters) joins us this week to talk about the ups and downs she’s faced shooting in the DC CW Universe. She opens up on the stresses that come with her job and how she has resigned herself to the madness in order to be an actor. Katherine talks about her deepest fears, how she’s able to remain true to herself, and her perspective on remaining optimistic.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to inside of you. Did you forget? With Michael Rosebaum. I think that was the first time. I just kind of go, wait a minute, what? Yeah, it was one of those mornings. I just did some yoga, bro. I walked in on your yoga sesh.

I know. I wanted you to meet my yoga instructor in case you needed a yoga person because you never had all the surgeries, so it's good to stretch it out, bro. It is. Yeah? Yeah, it's very important to stretch it. You don't have to worry about that. You're a very healthy, non-surgery kind.

the guy. I should probably stretch more. I mean, I'm tall. I got a lot of limbs. You do? What are you? 6.3? I'm 6. Not 6.0. Are you 6.0? Yeah, 6.0. That's like Taj 2. What is it? Tosh 2.0? Tosh 2.0. Tosh.O? Is it Tosh.0? Yeah. And you're Ryan 6.0. Ryan 6.0. Got it. Yeah. You know, last week, just to talk briefly about that, because it certainly was probably the biggest response of any podcast episode I've had. And that was Stephen Amel. Kudos to Stephen for

being brave. As I've said, I did a KTLA interview. It was just viral. I think we were number two on Yahoo. It was nuts, man. It was like, you know, thanks to Stephen for again, being brave, man. It's just like, you know, a lot of people, especially celebrities, they're always like, oh, can you cut that? I don't want to sound like that. And I've done that. I just did that with eric griffin i was on his podcast and you know i did jeff dies podcast and you know i i thought shoot man should i have said that and you know you start questioning yourself but you you're going to say the wrong things but like you know stephen he said let me hear the video let me hear the audio the raw audio and he listened and he said yeah man because i thought i think it was

important i think it's important and i could just tell and people were like good on you Good on you, Stephen. I want to make this clear. It's not like, you know, this podcast is about, this is all about mental health. This is all about, you know, anxiety. And that's not what it's pocket. The podcast really is about being honest, talking to people and just being open and seeing how they made it when they faced adversity, what they did, you know. And I, and of course, I get in anxiety and depression and all these things because I experienced them.

So I always wonder if someone else did. And then maybe they could help. me and that they have any insight i'm always looking for like somebody's going to have more information i think that's what it's about like when you talk to someone you might get something from someone so you say oh i'm going to try that do you feel that way yeah i was expecting me pointed at i had to clear my throat sorry yeah that's fine you were expected to be what pointed at did i did i yeah point you mean like like asking you the question yeah you weren't you You thought I was just going to keep rambling and not directed towards you.

I was. I was ready to sort of zone out. Yeah. Well, don't know. I got to be better about that. I didn't know you're going to talk to me. Well, that's about being present, right? The only person in the room?

That's about being present. But, you know, it's, I think when we talk to people and we, you know, people listen to this, I don't want to listen to a podcast about mental health. And it's more about, you know, sitting down with celebrities, athletes, all these different influential people. And by the way, I'm going to have other people on the show, like, um, therapists. I'm trying to get. get Dr. Drew, you know, those things are fun. But I'm just trying to improve myself. I think

that's what it is. Like, how do I feel better? How do I get better? You know, what things can I try that aren't, you know, certain things aren't working for me? So what can I do to make things work better? Like for you. You don't do yoga. You don't stretch. You don't do any of these things. So maybe you start doing something. And it becomes a routine and it helps you. Yeah. That should do these things. I just don't. Maybe because you're young. How old are you? 31. dude i could be your father i am your father ryan what like sophomore year of high school ryan tayas rosenbaum yeah that'd be weird i don't think i had sperm then i mean i did but it wasn't effective i think i was shooting blanks till probably 30 i don't know i was a late bloomer man

me too yeah yeah i didn't start puberty till late if we ever played uh uh skins and shirts and basketball i sat out if i was a skin i was like ah i just i think i twisted my ankle just now what We didn't even start playing. We just chose whose skins or shirts. Yeah, I don't want to take my shirt up. I should probably have hair under my armpit and I don't. So I want to let everybody know that I'm going to Mexico. I'm going to Richmond, Virginia for cons.

If you're interested or if you're near the area, come see me. We do a Smallville Knights, Welling and I. It's fun. You've heard me say it. I'm also on that Patreon now. I think it's pretty fantastic. I did a live podcast or live Instagram the other day. And I don't do a lot of them, so I'm on there.

And when I got off, there was like 30 people had joined Patreon in like 20 minutes. It was insane, dude. It was last night. Yeah, I was like, dude, everybody was really, really cool when people were subscribing to the podcast. And I appreciate it. I really just am blown away by it. Also, Tom Welling and I, of course, as you know, we, uh, knocking point wines, Stephen Amel's company. We made our own wine.

Again, last year it sold out. It's called Pure Evil. is the name of our wine. It's two bottles of us looking at each other. I was the evil last year. Tom was the pure. This year, I'm the pure. He's the evil.

It's knocking point wines. And it sold out last year and they wanted to do it again. So we did it again. And it's almost sold out again. So I don't know. It's a cool keepsake or whatever. Inside of you is the code. $10 off your first box bringing the total of to $29 for both bottles.

I think that's pretty fair. They're both great. We did some wine tastings. I don't know a lot about wine, but I know what I like. And it tasted good. Tom got something darker, you know, richer, you know, manlier. I'm always like a little effeminate with my wines and just my life. It's knocking point wines.com and we're called Pure Evil.

Great guests today. And by the way, Ryan, we're going video soon. We are going video soon in a few weeks. We got a couple of weeks left, maybe what we're going to see. We're trying to be strategic. But we've done some test stuff. If you're on the Patreon, you've already seen some. We've got some, right, I think we're posting some video of what it's going to look like to

show a little test and uh we did a little interview me you and jess yeah and we did a little interview talking about guests and things like that so you can get extra behind the scenes stuff on the patreon i'm excited man this room's different it's uh we got cameras we we spent a lot of money here trying to make it look good and uh you know you could still listen to it's going to sound great and uh it's going to look great and it's a work in progress so get ready in the next couple weeks right now um she's been on the show before i'm always pushing her to you know she's always working so hard this girl she's always working so hard i think they're doing a spin off she talks about some stuff because you know she's uh oliver queen's daughter on arrow but a dynamic lady

and i consider her a friend although we don't hang out but i still consider her friend is that weird no uh that's about it let's get right in to Catherine McNamara. It's my point of view. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience. Catherine Merck. I already messed it up, Catherine.

Catherine Merck. Catherine McNamara. There have been very few guests. that have come on more than once. Tom Welling, Zach Levi, Catherine McNamara. Oh, my goodness.

And maybe it's because they don't want to come back. I don't really know the whole answer, but some guests I want, like Jenna Fisher. I go, well, you come back? I will absolutely come back. And I believed her. She wants to come back. She had a lot of fun.

I think she was surprised. I think she probably was like, a podcast. But you had fun last time. We had fun. It was my first podcast ever. And I'm a huge podcast nerd. so I'm a listener of your podcast.

You do listen to it. I do. What's your favorite episode? Oh, well, it's funny because I listened to Stephen's episode before I had met him. Yeah, Stephen Amel's episode before I had met him because I knew I was going on the show. Your episode is Zach Levy are always awesome because Zach's a good friend of mine as well. He's the best. So you listen to Stephen Amel's episode.

Uh-huh. Is that because you wanted at that time, at that time you're a little sneaky. I wouldn't say sneaky. You couldn't, you withheld some information. I did, but only because I was sworn to secrecy by my employer. Which was Arrow. Which was the CW or the WB or what is it? Many other companies.

But basically, when I first came on your podcast, I had just been cast in Arrow. And if there's any podcast, I would have loved to talk about that on it. It would have been this one. Yeah, right. But I couldn't. I couldn't even breathe a word of it. Now, I get confused. I don't know.

It's not, I don't think Stephen would be upset with this. But I've seen an episode of Arrow. I watched him. Oh, good, he's good. It's a nice show. But it's not like I watch Arrow. I don't watch, you know, people assume that, you know, because I was Lex Luthor, I must love comics. I love, you know, this.

I love people. Yeah. And also, I go to a lot of conventions to sign. And I used to go to conventions to watch, you know, to meet horror legends because I'm a huge horror fan. As I know, you're a big horror fan. I'm a huge horror fan. So we'll get into that, I know, because we talked about it briefly before. But so I would meet actors at a convention.

So it was easy for me to say, hey. I was Lex. Hey, you were Superman. Like Brandon Ralph was like, yeah, I'd love to do it, man. I was like, cool. I'll have the other Superman. And maybe I'll, so it's easy to get guests. People are cool.

You get to know people being at these conventions, as you know. You've done a lot of conventions, right? I've done a lot of conventions. Right. They're the best. I love them. Do you make a shit ton of money? I don't know comparatively.

I feel like people like you and William Shatner make a lot more than I do probably. Wait. Did you just say me and Bill Shatner? That's not true. Look, first of all, I will say one thing about the conventions. A lot of people don't know this. Many people think, oh, you go to these places and you take people's money. Some people will assume that.

And I thought that for a long time. And then I actually realized, wait a minute, I am a fan. I used to come to these conventions. This is a vacation for me. It's like almost if Catherine McNamara on her week off of Arrow is like, I'm going to Hawaii. Well, these people, these fans, these friends, a lot of my listeners, they come see me at conventions or they're heroes. Why isn't that a great vacation if you're going to go meet people that you admire or

people you want to meet and you cosplay and there's events and there's I but look at all the toys I have in my house I think it's so awesome this is because of cons I love it the Star Wars thing the Imperial Walker Osama is an ad at yes yeah I think they're really cute right I do I do too they are cute you want you would you like that well I wouldn't take it it's so perfect up here but I appreciate it for sure

well I'll try to find you one okay would you really put that in your house I actually might I have a little tiny it pop doll I have a few little things around my house. It pop doll. Now, why do you have that? Is it because Isaiah Mustafa, your former co-star in Shadowhunters, was in It too? I mean, I was a huge fan of It before Isaiah was a part of it, but partially because of Isaiah and partially because I just, I love that story and that property and that film. But it was actually at a convention that I got that It Pop doll. I was in New Zealand. Some fan gave it to you. You saw it. No, I was at the pop booth and I saw a little one and I freaked out over it and bought it.

It was a little clown. A little clown. Georgie. Exactly. If you look at my backpack for work, I have all of these enamel pins on it, and half of them are it. I've got like a little SS Georgie and a balloon that says we all float. It's a little twisted, but that's who I am.

Wasn't it cool, by the way, I'm not saying that because he's a friend of ours. Isaiah Mustafa, who was the old Spice guy, and he was in a movie. I cast him as, to play one of my friends growing up, Tee and back in the day, in the movie back in the day, and he went on the shadow hunters. played my dad for four years. He played your dad in Shannon Hunter's. And he has grown so much as an actor. I love just watching his journey. And now he's married to wonderful Lisa. And I just want to give a shout out to say, regardless of what anybody thinks of the movie, if they love it, they hate it, it doesn't matter. If you look at his performance, I thought he gave a solid performance. And he should get work from that because he is, he takes good direction and he works hard. He really does. And I've, I've learned so much from watching him. And that's, that's part of how I learned how to kind of do the job. on shadow hunters is by talking to Isaiah and and you know every month or so we'd have coffee find time in our schedule and have coffee and just chit chat and catch up and talk about things did he tell you it was a long time ago so don't even think but I was like she's really she's really

pretty he's like yep I'm like I just was saying she's pretty she seems really nice and kind she's very kind she's very nice that's Isaiah I'm doing my Isaiah she's great she's great okay Good talking to you But I remember He pulled a dad on you didn't he He pulled a dad on me Yeah He pulled a dad

I'm her dad Uh huh Oh I love Isaiah No he basically is my dad At this point Between him and Stephen I'm completely covered Now

Are explained to Like Because we're gonna get into some stuff I want to get into Last time I know we talked about You know you work all the time And I said give yourself a break I think I told you

Probably I haven't done that Yeah you never give yourself a break And you think if you stop working You'll just like Completely freak out I don't know about that. For me, it's because I love work. And that's, that's part of why I do so many of these

conventions on the weekend. Like, when I was shooting Arrow, there were so many times where I'd fly back and forth to Korea for a day or to England for a day or something. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Did you just say fly to Korea for a day? Yes. You fly to Burbank for a day. You fly to San Fran maybe for a day. You don't fly to Korea for a day. I did. That's far. It's, it's only a 10-hour flight from Vancouver. So that's a lot of, you know, But do you work every day? I was at that point. And you still muster up the energy and the attitude?

I slept for about 10 hours on the plane. So it was perfect. This is an interesting guest, guys, because most of the time we talk about guests, you know, people have their insecurities. Everybody has insecurities, but people have their anxieties and their depressions and their things and the things that make them tick and adversity they face. And you're talking, we're talking today to someone who was on the show before, but maybe it's important to look at someone who, actually functions really well under pressure and doesn't let the best, you know, doesn't let things get to her like we do. The reason I fly back and forth so much is because of these conventions is because I, I agree exactly with what you were saying before. It's, I had a long

conversation with one of my friends before I did my first convention because I wasn't 100% sure about the whole concept of it and, and all of that. It was a little strange because I didn't fully understand it. But it's become one of my favorite things because, you can connect with people. And, you know, we pour our blood, sweat, and tears into things as actors. And half the time, people just go, yeah, that's, that's nice, that's good. Either they don't see it or it's shit or it's like my dad. It's like my dad will say, I go, dad, I'm doing this movie.

When's it going to be in theaters? Well, it's an independent movie. So it's not a real movie? No, it could become a big movie. So you're not filming a real movie, right? No, I'm in, it's like, it's just, and most movies, they just don't do what we hope they do. shows fall under the radar. I did a show for two years called Impastor.

People loved it. Not enough people loved it. And things go away. And that's the story of our lives. We get a job and we're working and then we're not. Exactly. Unless we're Catherine McNamey. Well, it's truly for me, it's been so special to get to actually, because I've been

a part of these shows that have such fierce fandoms, to go meet people and connect with people and hear their stories and just talk and see the people that I see online in person. Because they've, especially the Shadowhunter's fans, they have taken this, this fandom and their love for the show and taken it far beyond being fans of us or being fans of our characters or the show and created this movement and this wonderful space for people to feel accepted and loved and able to be their true selves no matter who or what they are. And I want to support that as much as I possibly can. Have you ever had someone come up and cry to you and then you get emotional? Several times, actually. Give me a good example, that one that resonates in your head, that you couldn't believe the impact you had in someone's life and in your response. Tell us about that.

I have one in particular. It was a girl that I was having a coffee with. And she sat down and said, you know, I just, I wanted to thank you for this character and this story that you've told because I lost my mom last year and have had to kind of take care of my 16-year-old sister. and this girl was 18 and my character on Shadowhunters lost her mom at a certain point during that season right around the time she'd also lost her mom and half of the season was about dealing with that loss and overcoming it and you know Clary actually found her specific powers through that grief and in dealing with that and this girl had somehow connected with that story was she emotional to you she was and we both you know shed a little tear and had a little cry

and, you know, connected on that level. So you cried, too. You cried with her. I couldn't help it. I mean, it's, when these stories are so touching and so beautiful, it's amazing. You have to take a deep breath and you have to feel it. Exactly. It's important to feel it.

I don't know if it's, you know, some people, I understand everybody has different strategies or not strategies, but sort of, not defense mechanisms, but sort of, give me the word, for God's sakes, Ryan, do something. I'm trying to think of it, too. You know what I'm saying? Like, they have their ways of dealing with things. Coping mechanisms. You know, Ryan, if we meet somebody and they start crying, maybe Ryan will go, oh, I'm sorry to hear that and he won't break down or he won't whatever.

But, you know, maybe I might just sort of like lose my shit a little bit and like feel with them. Yeah. Not always, but I'm saying people are, I'm not saying you would do that, Ryan. I'm just saying, no, but like if someone cries in front of you and they're saying, Ryan, you really made an influence of my life and thank you so much. And they're crying. Also, you have the wrong person. So I'm sorry, but you have the wrong person. I'm sorry.

This is not me. But truly, it's the big things and the small thing. So it's little things like that. But then also, you know, this just goes to show you the heart that is in this fandom. We were at a convention for Shadowhunters. For Shadowhunters. We were at a convention in Brussels, I think. It was either Brussels or Paris, I forget.

But we came on for the, you know, at the end of a convention, you go on, you're like, hey, thanks so much for coming, guys. Bye. See you later. We all walked up on stage and suddenly they turned the lights off. All the kids pulled out these giant harp-shaped balloons and started singing the theme song. Can you sing it? It's a Ruel song. People know it.

How does it go? Just give me a look. I can't say. It's the, this is the hunt. It's that song that everybody sings for our show. But they sang the whole song and all of us on stage were crying by the end of it. All of you? Guys too?

I think a couple of us. Have you seen Isaiah cry? I've seen him cry on screen and beautifully. Did he use to fake tears? I don't think so. Have you ever used to fake tears? I have, but that's after like a 10-hour day. And that's after doing it 20 times.

Exactly. My God, that's the hardest, man. When you have to cry and you just can't feel it. Or how about I remember crying in a scene. I was just emotional. I wanted them to blow the vapor or whatever in my eyes. And I had eight pages of dialogue after that. My eyes were swollen like golf balls from this stuff.

Oh, no. I looked like, I remember the episode. I remember how terrible I looked for like three scenes. I was like, oh, my God, can you guys do anything? What do you want us to do? Yeah. I don't know. CGI.

my shit. Marvel my shit. It's so funny, though, because sometimes there are days where sometimes if you're doing it 20 times, you need that by the end of it. But then other days, you'll just connect with something on another level so deeply that you don't need it. And somehow it comes every time. Do you think you're, do you worry about how you look on set? Do you want to look great or you just trust people enough to be like, hey, they've got my back. What can I do? Isn't it sort of a waste of time? I think we've all been there as an actor. You're like, like insecure, you're this.

And you gotta hope that somebody's watching you from behind the monitor and says, Rosenbaum looks like shit. He's got a huge booger under his nose. Can someone go, you have to have faith. You do. And it really depends on the character for me. Like there are some characters where you're supposed to look good

and you need to look good and that's the point of it. But there are other characters and certainly in particular scenes where you're covered in blood and you're crying and you're sweaty and you're supposed to look horrible. Right. As well, I think you should. And those are the points where I actually would rather look bad. You know, that's something that I give Arrow so much credit for is that Mia, the character

I play on there is, she's a boxer. She's a street fighter. She is. She is. And she gets hit in the face just as much as the men on the show do. And it should show that. So every time she gets in a fight, she comes out looking like she's been beat the hell out of. And as well, she should.

But some shows. me a smoke me a smoke me a queen but by the way do you feel like this is a woman question this is a woman question it doesn't sound like it's going to be a good question i'll give you a woman answer if you want well i imagine just it's like this is only you can articulate how you feel or in this room particularly in this well that's true present company but like you're on shadow hunters you're on arrow you're doing these movies do you ever feel like especially in a very i mean the lead in shadow hunters and you're doing all these scenes and it's exhausting was there ever a time because you're so kind like when i said would you do the podcast again you're like yeah but i was

like i wonder if she really wants to do the podcast do you ever feel compelled like you just say yes to everybody and you also say when they go hey we need you tomorrow morning could you wave your turn around because it will save the crew money and can you do this and all of a sudden you're realizing going you know they're not asking the guys this do you ever feel like i'm not saying show in particular, but have you ever felt like, I think they're taking advantage of the fact that maybe I'm a woman or have you ever felt like that? I've never felt like that in particularly. And I think it's because I have a perspective on it. You know, if you can sort of tell which productions are a team. And I've been very fortunate to be a part of a lot of those

productions that work as a team and everybody pitches in and everybody makes little sacrifices to make the show. Because ultimately, it's all about working together and everybody contributes their little piece. I am not above or a more important piece than anyone else on that set. And that's kind of what I love about. That's what you're saying so you go home and go, I'm the lead. No, it's honestly how I feel about it. Because our industry is one of those few left that you really can't do it on your own. You need a team around you in order to make it the best it can be. And everybody is an expert in their own field and can bring so much to that and so much passion to that. And when you get a team of people that each person is so amazing at what they

do, it just makes the whole so much greater than the sum of its parts. Let me ask you something about working on Arrow in this Arrow universe. And I'm not sure I understand it. I don't say that because I don't like it. I say it because I don't understand it. Okay. When they talk about infinite earths. Yes. And there's like part one. There's part, right? There's all these parts. Oh yeah. So let me, let me, am I right, am I around the right? So there's the show the flash, there's the arrow, there's Supergirl, what else is there? Supergirl, Legends of Tomorrow. Legends of Tomorrow.

Black Lightning, right? Batwoman. These are all on now. Yeah. So all these shows, it's a crossover. Oh, yeah. So when they say Infinite Earth, it means all these shows are like crossovering. Yeah.

Like you'll get a character from it. So it sounds very difficult. It's very difficult to keep track of. And I think the real heroes of that are the writers and the 80s because the writers had to somehow coordinate their entire seasons to build up five different shows around this week of television, basically, when you put it all together. It's a week. It's one week. So it split up. There's half of it now and then half of it after the holidays.

So how many episodes total? Five. Five episodes of crossover. So if you do, how many episodes of Arrow do you do a year? Well, this past season, I did 10 because it's 10. It's over. Yeah, it's done. So if Stephen and Mel comes over my house for some reason, he would be talking about a show that he was on.

Mm-hmm. It's done. Yes. So you're acting with people from other shows. And I know they do that with movies now, with all those Marvel movies. Exactly. So that's where they kind of got the idea. It wasn't like an original idea, but it was a fault.

Right. Yeah, it's kind of the Avengers Endgame of the CW. DC TV universe, as if you will. But what's cool about that is you not only have characters from all of the CW shows, there's other characters from from other parallel earths as well and that's kind of how they work out well that's kind of how they work out having like small super supermen exactly right you have brandon ralph you have tyler hecklin and you have tom welling who all plays superman from different earth what about the lex luther's uh they only had one who was that uh they had john cry i know they had john car he was on the podcast okay were you disappointed that i wasn't on the show i would have loved to have you

it would have been so much fun yeah of course it would i love all those people but i didn't get to work with dwelling either so there you go yeah i don't i think he worked with erika right and john i believe he worked with crier maybe uh yeah he works with crier he also worked with hecklin and hecklin's a nice guy too i love he's a really sweet guy yeah super super super cool guy um you're surrounded by a lot of guys yeah are there there do you feel like there's a lot of women and enough women i do actually you know what that's it it felt very balanced on the crossover because i had several scenes with melissa and ruby and with Katie and all these amazing folks who it was and then equally with like Grant and and Matt Ryan who plays Constantine like all Matt Ryan I'm Matt. I love Matt Ryan. He's English,

right? He's Welsh. Welsh because he's like, I can't do a Welsh Texan. He's like, oh, mate, we're talking about mental health and like meditation. He's like, listen to this guy, Alan Watts. Alan Watt, I'm doing Australian, aren't I? I don't know what you're doing, but it works. Are there enough Jews on these shows? I'm Jewish. Are there enough Jews? You know, I didn't ask. Okay. I didn't ask around to get everyone's religious. What kind of question I'm saying? Do you get excited about work every day? You know, because I know memorizing lines so easy for you.

We talked about that last time I think you can just look at it and know it pretty much, right? When I'm in the groove of it, I can read a scene once or twice and know it. Why is that? Is there a certain, like, fearless thing with you? Like you're just, you have so much confidence that you don't even get nervous at all that you can relax. Your mind can relax and you can memorize this shit? I think it's just the fact that I was a huge nerd growing up. Yeah.

Because you're a reader. Yeah. You read a lot. It's constantly with a book in my hand. Constantly, I would memorize the infomercials by accident as a kid, like the phone numbers. If there was something that, you know, I wanted as a Christmas present, I'd just write down the phone number. I know one. Which one?

5-88, 2,300 Empire today. Right? There you go. You should get them as an advertiser on the show now. Do you think they need me? I think they do. I think they do. I might need them.

No, but the other cool thing that's a bit. about the whole infinite Earth's thing is we bring in characters from other shows as well. Like we had Tom Ellis from Lucifer come in and play, you know, the devil himself from Earth 666. He had Kevin Conroy, who had the voice of Batman, come and to play Batman.

Yeah. It was kind of amazing to see all these little cameos and these characters brought in. And also to see the relationships between characters you otherwise wouldn't see. I thought it was really cool for Mia, particularly, because so many of these characters are so close with Oliver, like Katie Lotz's character and like Grant's character, Grant Gustin,

who plays The Flash. Those two characters know Oliver so well, and I had a lot of work with them. So they know those qualities and can recognize those qualities in Mia. And then suddenly they're either working with her, budding heads with her, or managing her more aggressive tendencies. Who do you love working with? Like, I know you're going to say everyone because you're such a nice person. But for a second, let's not be as nice. Tell me who, like, when you hear you're working with them today, you know it's going to be the easiest day ever. You know that it's going to be fun. You know it's not going to be a pain in the ass.

I'm not saying you don't love people equally as much. I'm saying who is that one person that you just really get excited to work with? Does it have to be just one? I'm really bad at favorites, Michael. Go with two. I'm not saying you're your favorite. I'm saying, like, for instance, Rob, my friend Rob's coming over. Yeah.

I know, I'm a loser. It's Friday night. Yeah. You know, my friend Rob's coming over. If Rob or Tom comes over, when Ryan comes over, Ryan right here, the engineer, when he comes over, I get excited. I like, I like seeing Ryan. Yeah. He's easy to be around.

Yeah. Who would you say? Well, you know what? I would say I had a lot of fun working with Stephen this year because I didn't get to work with him last season at all given the way the storylines were. And now that, you know, thanks to crisis on infinite earths, the monitor brought me 20 years in the past. And I had most of my work with Stephen this season. And it was really so much fun. Why was it fun? He's just such an impeccable actor. And I don't know. There was something about the way they wrote our scenes that it was, it put both of our characters off. of their steady ground. He was your father. Exactly. We were our characters. We were each other's biggest, biggest vulnerability. And so being put right in front of your biggest obstacle of your entire life and having to deal with that. Also, knowing the world is ending and all these other things are happening, it instantly

put such confident characters out of their comfort zone. And as an actor, that's always fun to try and figure out. How big is Stephen Amel's trailer? He has actually one of the best trailers I've ever seen. Why is that? He has an old airstream. It's awesome. He's got like a silver airstream.

Well, it's a new airstream, but it's classically designed. Did he ever ask you to come read lines with him? Do you ever read lines in the airstream? No. Not in a perverted way. I don't think of it. Actually, you thought I was thinking that. And I actually wasn't surprisingly.

Okay, good. Yeah, I wasn't going there and you were going there. I'm sorry. But if you ask a woman, if you go, hey, did you go in his trailer? That sounds weird. This day and age. Yes. Well, any day and age. Inside of you is brought to you by Quince.

I love Quince, Ryan. I've told you this before. I got this awesome $60 cashmere sweater. I wear it religiously. You can get all sorts of amazing, amazing clothing for such reasonable prices. Look, cooler temps are rolling in. And as always, Quince is where I'm turning for fall staples that actually last. from cashmere to denim to boots the quality holds up and the price still blows me away

quince has the kind of fall staples you'll wear non-stop like super soft 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters starting at just 60 bucks yeah i'm gonna get you one of those i think i like to see you in a cashmere maybe a different color so we don't look like twins their denim is durable and it fits right and their real leather jackets bring that clean classic edge without the elevated price tag And what makes Quince different? They partner directly with ethical factories and skip the middlemen. So you get top-tier fabrics and craftsmanship at half the price of similar brands. These guys are for real.

They have so much great stuff there that you just have to go to Quince. Q-U-I-N-C-E. I'm telling you, you're going to love this place. Keep it classic and cool this fall with long-lasting staples from Quince. Go to quince.com slash inside of you for free shipping on your order. and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com slash inside-of-you. Free shipping and 365-day returns.

Quince.com slash inside-of-you. Inside-of-you is brought to you by Rocket Money. I'm going to speak to you about something that's going to help you save money, period. It's Rocket Money. It's a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your sales. savings. This is just a wonderful app. There's a lot of apps out there that really, you know, you have to do this and pay for and that. But with Rocket Money, it's, they're saving you

money. You're getting this app to save money. I don't know how many times that I've had these unwanted subscriptions that I thought I canceled or I forgot to, you know, the free trial ran at Ryan. I know you did it. That's why you got Rocket Money. I did. Yeah. And I also, I also talked to a financial advisor recently and I said I had rocket money and they said that's good this will help you keep track of your budget see see it's only we're only here the pros we're only trying to give you you know things that will help you so rocket money really does that rocket money shows you all your expenses in one place including subscriptions you forgot about if you see a subscription you no longer want rocket money will help cancel it rocket money will even try to negotiate lower bills for you

the app automatically scans your bills to find opportunities to save and then goes to work to get you better deals. They'll even talk to the customer service so you don't have to. Yeah, because I don't want to. Press one now. If you want, oh, get alerts if your bills increase in price, if there's unusual activity in your accounts, if you're close to going over budget, and even when you're doing a good job, Rocket Money's 5 million members have saved a total of $500 million in canceled subscriptions. With members saving up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter my show name inside of you with

Michael Rosenbaum in the survey so they know I sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from my show inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum. Rocket Money. I mean, you're working with so many actors and it's gotta be like do you ever is there a time where you're like god I wish we'd be done with this infinite earth thing it's exhausting I don't know what I'm doing today I don't know it's it just seems like it's so much like I would have had a panic attack every day there were days of that but maybe it's just me and maybe it's because I've been a part of so many from maze runner to shadow hunters to this so many of these crazy we have so many characters and everything's happening

all at once projects you just resign yourself to the madness and lean into the fun of it because you get to go to work every day and wear a super suit and work with some really cool people and run around and, you know, I remember looking around one day on set and I was in my super suit and then there were a couple supermen and Supergirl in The Flash and everybody, and you know, Green Arrow, everybody was there and I'm just going, this is, how is this my job? This is surreal. How is this what I get to do for a living? You know what?

You know, you're one of those people like my dad where, I don't know if this is true, but I think my dad had more fun when he went to work with his colleagues and he was the boss guy and when he get home he was kind of like I was like oh fuck you know I was like dad's home because he just it just seemed happier when he was at work I don't know maybe I'm wrong I'm just saying it just felt that way in a lot of ways whereas I think you love your work that's what makes you happy I do now when you go home for the holidays I mean you see mom and dad I go home and see my grandparents my mom my friends family there. It's really... Where is that? Missouri? Kansas City. Yeah. Kansas City. Yeah. Do you let go? Can you put your work down? I do. And that's why I go home for a couple

days. Because I, I, my grandma's house has always been my happy place. They have a huge woods in the backyard that I used to just go wander around as a kid. It was like my literal and imaginative playground. And I used to just run around in the woods by myself and make up fairy tales as a kid. And I, I think that's part of why I became an actor. I think I was always a storyteller. I just didn't know that you could do that for a living. And eventually that's, you know, obviously what I ended up doing. Is it hard to be present with so much going on in your life?

Is it hard to be when you're talking, like when we're talking right now? When people talk, Christopher Walken once said this. He was on Conan O'Brien. I never forget I laughed so hard. He goes, you know, when people are talking, they're thinking of other things. even when I'm having a conversation with you. I'm thinking of a million things. And Conan says, what are you thinking of?

And he says, I don't know. Tacos. And so, you know, like when you're with your family, are you thinking Infinite Crisis, Arrow, this Christmas movie? I've got so much going on. Are you really, really, you can just separate? I can separate at this point because there are so few times in my life now that I do get to slow down and by my own doing and by my own choice

because there's, I, I'm a workaholic. I like to be busy. I like to do things that I care about. And I, if I can physically make time for it, why not? But when I'm home, that's the time that I actually do get to relax and just be with my family. Because those, those are the rare things now. Those are the special moments that I get to just catch up and sit in my grandparents' kitchen and everybody wanders in and ends up having, you know, second meal of leftovers.

or we just open a pint of ice cream and everybody grabs a spoon or, you know, little things like that. Do they look at you differently, though? Do you feel it like they're amongst or amidst someone of, is it amidst, right? Ryan, you nod your head. Amidst is the, yeah. Yeah, that's a word. Yeah, it is. But do you feel like sometimes they treat you like your someone different?

No. No, they treat you like. Absolutely not. Right. No. No, and actually, that's one of the things that I love most about my family. family and my friends from they don't care or they pretend they don't care as far as I know they don't see me any differently which is I think wonderful I think the minute they see me

differently is the minute I need to worry about what I am presenting to the world there's no reason to be anybody different because of what I do or because of the jobs that I've done that's true you know I'm still me but you're very mature like you're you're more mature probably as eight-year-old as I am now. I think I was more mature as an eight-year-old than I am now. Yeah, because you graduated high school, I think, when you were 14 or something. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, it's not, can you even imagine?

I barely graduated high school. I think because I have ADD and it was hard for me to focus. But you didn't have ADD. No. You were zoned in. I was, but that's, I also was allowed to do school at my own pace and in a way that worked for me. So it, it, I think, fostered exactly what I needed educationally. I was able to, you know, if I wanted to stand up at my desk, I could.

If I wanted to do my homework outside in the middle of the woods, I could. If I wanted to do it standing on my head, that was what I did for the day or whatever I needed. You know, and I could do math for 12 hours a day if I wanted to, or I could do, you know, a little bit of everything. As long as I got it done by the time it was due. And that's what allowed me to let my brain do what it needed. And I just kind of went at my own pace. And suddenly I was graduated before I even realized it. was graduated. I wouldn't even said that

right way. I don't know if that's the right way. I was graduated. I would have said suddenly I graduated. That's probably the proper way to say. No, it's not. I bet it's not. Someone out there is going, oh, no, she's right. She's right. It's William Shatner. Yeah. See, she is. What do you, what scares you? Missed opportunities. Stagnance. Stagnance. I think stagnance is equivalent to death. If you ever get married, do you ever think you'd ever want to get married? I'd love to. You would? I would, yeah.

Well, do you hear that rhyme? She wants to get married. Not now. No, no, no, no, not now. Not now. No, but like... Give me time. But eventually, yeah, I'd love that.

Now, what would you look for in a partner? Somebody who makes me better. Somebody who I can talk to and debate with and who makes me think and who makes me think differently than I otherwise would. You left out a big one. Laugh. Well, that's the other part. Somebody who makes me laugh.

Yeah, of course. I'm a big. I'm a huge goofball. That's how my whole family is that way. We'll laugh about a situation before anything else. My grandparents, for example, I don't think I've ever seen them fight once in my life. They'll make a situation silly and laugh about it before anything else. They're in their 70s.

Does your grandmother ever take you aside and just tell you how much she loves you? Yeah. And how proud of you she is. She texted me yesterday. She's like, I love your pink hair. Is your hair pink? Yeah. Do you know I'm colorblind?

I didn't know that. I just thought it was like a white. No, it's pink. Yeah, I am colorblind, so I can't differentiate a lot of colors. I can see colors, but I can't, yeah, I can't differentiate a lot of them. So I really thought your head was really cool, but it was white, but it's pink. Thank you, yeah. What is it about horror movies that turns you on in a good, like, that makes you just, I mean, you love them.

I do. And I love them. I have my reason for them. I think it's a couple things. Part of it for me is nostalgic because my mom also loves horror movies. and so she's the kind that'll just turn them on on a Saturday afternoon just because they're fun. So that's kind of what I grew up with.

Like what did she introduce you to? Oh God, so many things. I watched Carrie with her for the first time. They're all going to laugh at you. What else did I watch with her for the first time? A lot of the birds I watched with her. This is something I experienced with my mother. She used to make me watch Motel Hell,

make them die slowly. That's why I'm fucked. I watched a lot of those. It's a lot of like the little ones on Netflix that, I don't even know what they are. Gerald's game? I haven't seen Gerald's game. My buddy directed at Mike Flanagan.

He was a guest. Listen to me. If you love horror, go back and listen about three weeks ago. Okay. Mike Flanagan, he directed Dr. Sleep. He directed The Haunting of Hill House. Oh, my God. He created it.

He's an amazing director, and you should work with him, and I'll put the good word in. I would love that. And, boy, I mean, it's a great interview. I'm not tooting my own horn. You were there, Ryan. I was there, yeah, yeah. It was really good. It was good.

I was like a kid in the candy store. I was like, we were talking about the shining, like, I mean, everything, Stephen King. And so for me, when I watch a horror movie, it's like a roller coaster ride. Exactly. It's adrenaline. Yeah. I want to be scared. And my problem with movies nowadays, I know I sound like an old dude, but I just nothing scary.

Yeah. Nothing really scares me. The jump stuff, I want something like, like I talk about this, like insidious was a great first two acts. Oh, my God. That movie scared me so much. Oh, my God. That was one more movie that did scare me. There are very few movies that actually terrify me. Exactly. I love the suspense, though. That's what I love. It's that it's the adrenaline. It's the suspense of sitting there and watching it. And maybe it's the game of it all. Maybe it's the, you know, I've also been toying with the idea of directing. But maybe it's the director in my head. I was going to ask you about that. We'll talk about that. But it's the, the toying with that idea of the four. formulaic nature of how do you do that? How do you build that suspense properly and then let it deflate just enough so the audience feels safe and then really you can scare them. It's genius and when

it's done correctly. Exactly. Unfortunately, you know, if you think of movies like, if you guys like horror movies that aren't gory, there's a movie called The Orphanage. I've not seen that. Del Toro. That will blow your mind. Okay. You want to see a zombie movie? Want to see a good zombie movie? Train to Busan. Okay. You want to see a cool. horror movie that's really original with a great score and shot well it follows i was going to mention it follows that's one of my favorite horror films we should watch horror movies i have horror screening i i i screen horror movies with a bunch of my mormon friends i'm friends with my buddy john heater who's napolean dynamite yeah he's Mormon amazing and i love him and he's like he's very family oriented

he kind of it's just good he has me over for dinner i see what you know it's family but they come over we watch horror movies we we dig up we just really search for good ones and it's hard Yeah. But anyway. But that one I love because I love it follows because it's so simple. And it's that concept. It's also one of the best abstinence movies ever. Isn't it?

Because it's like the worst. I'm not going to have sex after this. Yeah. It's like an STD from hell. Yeah. It's sort of is. You're like, what the hell? So if you have sex with, if somebody has sex, then it goes to that person, that the guy had sex with.

Right. And then it's, it's the thing that will follow you at a steady. pace a slow pace but a steady pace forever forever until it kills you and then it goes back to the person who gave it to you unless you pass it on to somebody else and you never know when your time they should make it follows too they should but this time they could bring but they why can't they do have like gay characters because maybe you know there weren't any gay they assume that sex is just a man and a woman right in this movie but what if it's well i guess the characters just happen to be straight right right

right but i'm not saying it's a bad thing i'm just saying maybe in the sequel you know it could be anybody yeah well i'm saying you know what i was thinking what but sex that's why i was thinking that if it wouldn't if it still yeah so if you had butt sex with someone that person would get it but they didn't have any butt sex right but i know that sounded i don't know how to get to it but now it didn't sound well if you think about the story logic that's actually a valid question and you can still have butt sex with anybody yeah i mean how do we go how do we get the butt sex Me. I'm curious how you're going to dig yourself out of it, though.

Well, we could go back and just talk about, you know, other horror movies. Was that really not good what I just talked about? I think it's fine. I mean, it's not the most orthodox question, but it is a valid question given the story we were discussing. I was defending gay people. Exactly. I just want to see more gay people in a horror movie. No, but it's the one horror movie I did see this year that actually terrified me was us.

Oh. That's where we did. oh really i felt it was here's my problem with us tell me because the director the first one was brilliant oh get out get out also get out is just brilliant yeah i'm not gonna sit here and kiss someone his ass if i look great director yeah looked great right off the bat you knew none of this these family members were gonna die there's no threat and it was just like we're talking like this it just seemed like what are we doing i was just like fuck off the opening scene was scary and then it just got it bored me It became kind of funny and then it wasn't funny and it was supposed to be scared.

I wasn't scared. You were scared? I think it terrified me in the way that black mirror terrifies me. And there's just these underlying concepts in our humanity that you kind of wonder the what if of who we are as human beings and that what lies within us is scarier than anything, any monster that could be lurking somewhere. Yeah. That's kind of what terrified. And the whole mirror thing also really freaked me out. I remember I was actually staying at the Sutton Hotel at the time, which we all know and love.

In Vancouver, where everybody who's anybody, and every actor stays there. Every actor stays there. It hasn't been redesigned since 71. It's true. And you know how many glass doors and mirrors and reflective surfaces? It's like the shining. Yeah, so I get back to my hotel and I'm sitting by myself in my room at like two in the morning and I can't sleep because there's so many mirrors and glass reflective. I'm just staring at my reflection.

For hours and hours on end I couldn't move I couldn't sleep I couldn't do anything It really got to me Wow And the whole Itsy spider thing Yeah I don't even remember

Do you catch that It's the song that the little girl sing Oh yeah If you think about the lyrics I remember yeah And then I didn't realize it Until the end of the movie But the lyrics of the song

Are basically the plot of Here's that I was thinking When I saw that poster Yeah And as a publicity thing They had the golden scissors or whatever They were kind of you know Giving to random people

And I was like oh I want to pay this looks great someone's going to get like stabbed in the eye someone's going to get these scissors have some like i just was expecting a really scary movie yeah and to me i just it just fell short that one but get out was brilliant so i give get out a solid b plus and i give us uh a c minus i feel like i need to get a list of horror movies from you that aren't like the standard horror movies i will give you a good list i'm good like that i am jaded I'm jaded because I've seen so many horror movies and so fuck I feel bad sometimes saying it but I'm like I wanted to have like a horror review like my own show and I go I'll never work again people will hate me who wants to come on I don't know they just don't make a lot of horror movies anymore or they go right to the shelf and but you know what they do make a lot of Christmas movies they do you made a Christmas movie I did make it for Netflix yeah what's it called it's called spirit writing free spirit of Christmas and it's for the fan family, right? Yeah, it's a lovely animated kids film. It's 45 minutes. It's a sweet little

Christmas train ride. It's a roller coaster. And you sing. And I sing. What songs do you sing? I sing some new original Christmas songs. I didn't write them, but they're original to the show. Are you that good of a singer that you could just, you could pick it up? It was easy for you. I was able to pick it up. I'm so used to, when I was in New York, I would do readings all the time of new shows and things like that. I'm used to getting there was once I got a nine song score or I had nine songs in this musical and I had to learn them in a day

and a half. That's not going to happen for me. This is why I question acting. It's like that's too hard. How did you do it? You just do it? You memorize the songs? I didn't have it. It was script in hand. But you had to know the melodies. But I had to know it enough to sing face. But couldn't you hear it before and then redo the verse? Like if they're like, I'm swimming in the snow. Can't you

just then look at it and go oh can you play that back again oh i'm sitting in the snow yeah do you do that that's kind of what i so they would i think they either sent me tracks or i went over it with them for a day and recorded everything and then i just i literally listened to it nonstop if it's something i have to learn especially musically quickly i'll turn it on repeat while i sleep and just let it play over and over and what's a song what's a song from there that you remember just you're not going to sing it no no who's your favorite band Like, what do you like to listen to? Well, right now, I've been playing in the Heights soundtrack from the Broadway musical on repeat because I met Lynn years and years ago when I was in New York and he made a real impact on me.

And him and his whole team, seeing them have such astronomical success, it's so touching to me because they have the genuine amazing hearts and the true superhuman talent to match. And it's so rare that that happens in the world that amazing success happens to incredible people who are so phenomenally talented. It's like the trifecta of just rightness that never happens. And I had press all day yesterday, so I wasn't able to watch the trailer until I was crawled into bed. I couldn't stop crying. I watched it within 10 minutes. I was just bawling my eyes out because it's just, I know their hearts so well. And it's just a huge step for them.

And it's just a culmination of everything that they've worked so hard for so many years. And now I've just got the Broadway musical I'd repeat because it makes my heart happy. You know, Ryan, I don't know about you. But when I'm listening to Catherine, I get this sense of like, this is just the beginning for you. Like, I think I said it maybe last time, but I just, you have the very few people have this. but you have that sort of Kristen Bell feel to you. Oh, wow. You have that like, well, you just have that, you know what it is?

People like you because you're genuine. You know, they say, oh, Kristen Bell's America's sweetheart or whatever. And she's an awesome person. She came out of the podcast opening up about her depression. She's like, you know what? I never talk about my depression like this. I go, well, we could stop. She goes, no, no.

It feels comfortable. Yeah. But she is an amazing woman, charitable, beyond, I mean, like, Unbelievable. I could learn so much and have learned so much by her from her. When I see you, I just see that same kind of that pop, that personality, that just like, uh, I want her in my movie. I want her. And I know that Shadowhunters was a hit. And I know that, you know, you did the Christmas special in Netflix. And they're all great and you're doing Arrow and that's one of the biggest shows on TV. But I see like even bigger and and when I say bigger, you don't need to get bigger to be happier. I just think these things, these things are going to happen to you. That's just obvious to me. Thank you. I appreciate that. I mean, the whole goal is to continue to tell stories that move people and some things that are interesting, things that reflect the human experience in a way that makes people think and makes people kind of question the way they do things and think about things in a way that they might not otherwise have or just reminds them to feel something. Because in this world, I don't know, I feel like in this day and age with technology and with filters and with everything that we have in social media where everybody's, you know, presenting the best version of their lives. as we all do, and that's kind of what social media is, but we forget to be human sometimes.

We forget the vulnerable, ugly, weird, dark parts of who we are and of what we go through. What are the ugly weird parts of you? Ugly weird parts of me. I have a lot of them. Like what? Oh, God, I don't even know. There's a lot of them. What do you think of, like, when you think of, like, I don't really love that about myself.

I want to change it. One thing I would really like to change. I'm very directionally challenged. And it's, directionally challenged. And it's, it's kind of silly. And it's getting to a point where like, I need to be a bit more of an adult about this. Like where you're going? Yeah.

Like in a car? Yeah. This is a flaw of yours. It's one of many. But how about this is, this is just everyone? I never know where I am. Where am I now? No, it's bad.

But Michael, when it's to the point where you're close friends, you say, oh, it's this way. They go 180 degrees in the opposite direction. and they're usually right, that's a problem. But that's not really a flaw. I'm digging here. Okay. I'm not even digging. I just want to know.

Like you said there was a couple of things. Is there something like maybe like, for instance, I'm just saying this because I think you have a beautiful nose. But I'm just saying, do you ever look in the mirror and go, I hate my nose? Or do you ever go, I hate my lips. I hate my eyes. I used to think my ears were weird in photos. I like never wanted my ears to show.

Why? I don't know. I just thought they looked funny. Funny. I don't know. I can't quantify it, and I could never quantify it. You just didn't love your ears. It just wasn't great.

And then somebody pulled me aside one day and said, no, they don't look funny. They don't look weird. They're just yours. And that's just you. And I went, you know what? You're right. That's silly of me to. Did someone ever say anything to you?

Some guy you're dating or somebody who was like, hey, your ears are a little crooked. No, I think I just saw one. You know how there's always one photo that you look at? And you're like, that looks odd. Why does that look funny? Every photo I take. Okay, truly, but you know what I mean? It's like you'll be looking through social media

And there's one comment that sticks with you. You know what I mean? It's that kind of thing. And I think that's what stuck in my head. Yeah, somebody, you know, I try not to do it anymore, but somebody just said something like, somebody I look like. And I looked at them like, I'm like, in my head,

I was kind of like, fuck you, really? That sucks. I never play that game with people. But I don't care anymore. It's just like, you know, I've heard a young Chevy Chase. I've heard things. And I was like, oh, I love Chevy Chase. You know, so your ears, you thought for a while, because you are, your ears are covered

today with pink hair. They are. The headphones and the pink hair. No, but it was something that, here's one I can actually talk about. Hang on. You can actually talk about? I can actually, because I, is a good one. It is a good one.

Okay. I'm a tiny human. You know this about me. I'm tiny. I've always been small. I had completely written off having any kind of real physical strength. I thought it wasn't possible for me because I'm small. I thought, oh, I'm tiny.

I'm never going to be strong in any real way. You're thin, you're small. You're thinking, oh, I can never be strong. Yeah. Then when I started training for Shadowhunters, I met these amazing trainers that said, no, no, no, let us show you. You can do this. You just have to do it in the right way. Because growing up, I didn't know how to train properly.

I didn't know what to do. I didn't have that kind of knowledge, right? And it completely changed my life. It changed my world. It changed how I feel about myself. It changed my confidence in just being a human and being an adult. And it changed the way I live my life. So that's kind of why fitness is such a big part of who I am.

It's my me time. It's the one thing every day that I do for me. And I take a couple hours and I, you know, do something positive. Every day. Yeah. Or not every day, but I always make the effort every day because I know there's going to be at least one or two days a week where I don't have time for it. That, you know, that speaks to people who are, to me, it speaks

people that are too skinny too short too heavy to whatever and everybody always has the excuse this is how I am right this is just I have family members who are like you know this is just the way it is and I'm like if you don't take a step in the right direction and try and and it's all about routine isn't it it's all about when I stopped working out like I might you know I had a shit happen with my family so I um stop working out for two weeks boy do I fucking feel it I just feel like I'm falling apart. You know what I mean? It's for your mental well-being.

It's for all these things. You don't have to look like, God, what's the guy's name from Lord of the Rings? Vigo Mortensen. You don't have to look like him. Right. You don't have to have a body that's chiseled. You just have to feel good about you.

Feel good about you. And whatever that takes to feel good about you. So you may hate working out, but you know what? You're going to feel better once you start doing it and you get more stamina and you get more whatever. Even if it's just taking a walk or sometimes, you know, if I have to be, you know this, we often have to be at work at, you know, really super early hours of the morning. I'll go run for 10 minutes.

It wakes me up, shakes the cobwebs out, and then I don't feel like a zombie going into work. And it gets, you know, I'm suddenly open and awake and present because I've just kind of jolted myself away. What is the key to, I mean, do you feel like shit right when you wake up? Do you like, oh my God, I just feel cloudy? do you have a certain diet or there foods your adverse reactions or do you wake up and go I know what it's going to take to make me feel good I need to go work out I need to go for a run I need to take a shower or if you don't do those things do you feel incomplete a lot of times I mean obviously given the way I live my life there are times that I have to be adaptable

which is just those are the choices I make like right now being here on the show you have to be adaptable to my crazy my crazy questions no I'm this is very I actually was really really thrilled that you asked me back so thank you yeah i really i like you i think you're a good human being thank you you're genuine and that's that's why i asked you back thank you i appreciate it um but for me i i do like my mornings and people give me trouble for getting up so early especially with the schedule i keep i usually get up between like five and seven every morning what time do you go to sleep between midnight and two sometimes later you get you get four to five hours a night yeah I think that might be, like, I don't know if it's schizophrenia.

There was something my therapist said that if you feel like you have tons of energy and you only get two or three hours of sleep, you could be manic. I don't think you're these things. Maybe that's why I'm an actor. I don't know. But I've always been that way. How do you look so, so, like, refreshed? How old are you?

I'm 24. That's why. You know what's funny? I thought you were 29 or 30. No way. I think because you carry yourself a little more maturely than, yeah, I forgot. I forgot, and I probably knew this, and I just was looking at it. It was like, not because you look older, not because your ears are weird, but just basically

because of how you hold yourself. Thank you. That's what it is. Thank you very much. Maybe you'll get some more sleep as you get older. Maybe, but that's why I do love international travel or just any kind of plain travel, because I sleep. I don't, that is when I sleep.

No drugs, huh? No. You don't do any pills? No, no. Never a sleeping pill. No. Never a Xanax. No.

No anxiety. Uh-uh. Never alcohol. Not on. planes but you have an occasional glass of wine oh i love a good scotch have you ever been drunk yes okay so these are these not on planes though i don't like drinking no no who does who does that i don't you know i'm not a big drinker but like you know i'm just have you ever smoked grass in your life i actually haven't and that's because i promised a friend of mine that i would smoke for the

first time with him and we've been on opposite ends of the world for far too long i bet you can't wait for that joint i'm just going to tell you this i'm not a pothead i don't smoke much pot do you smoke pot, Ryan? No. Okay. But if you do, make sure you get the one that's the mellow stuff. Okay. It's only because it's just, if you just, either way, if you ever smoke pot, I'm not condoning and I'm not single smoke pot, but just take one small hit and wait 25 minutes and just see how you feel. You don't need to smoke a whole joint. You don't need to, because you're going to feel like shit. And make sure it's the mellow stuff. Okay. If you're going to do that. See, I'm so much, I, my thing, usually, if I'm going to go out with friends and have a drink, I just love a good scotch. I drink like an old man. Scotch. Yeah. I love scotch.

No, that's great. What kind of scotch? Lagobulan. That's a good one? That's a good one. I usually go for Lefroig, but that's me. Lefroid. Where's that from?

France? No. Lafroig? I would assume it's German. Scottish or Irish. Oh, it's another. Do you think that was the French word for frogs? Well, she said Lefrog.

Lefrog? I don't know. For some reason, it's not a French. Lefrog. I mean, I don't think so. I don't think it's French. Where have you been that you really demand that I go? Have you been to St. Lucia?

No, but that's a great ban. You need to go to St. Lucia. You heard of that ban? No. It's in the British Virgin Islands. How far is it from L.A.? It is. I'm trying to remember, because I flew from New York when I went there.

I think it was about a six-hour flight from New York, so... 16? Yeah. You probably would fly through Miami if you came from here. It's that good, huh? It's honestly. it's neverland it's amazing st lucia yes are there things to do yes there's so many things to do there's mountains to climb there's beaches to sit on there's things to swim there's crystal clear

waters it's gorgeous expensive i don't think so how much would be a trip we could get into that but uh i want to do that i think i want to do what what time of the year i went in january like right after new years i forgot it was winter after three days because i was going straight from there back to Toronto to shoot Shadowhunters, and I had forgotten it was winter, and about day three, I remembered that I was going to Toronto in a few days. I was sitting on a beach, warm, sunny, beautiful, but it's the kind of place that'll rain for 10 minutes, and then you have the most glorious rainbow for the rest of the day, and the sunsets are just unreal, or you look one direction. I think there's got to be a nude beach somewhere, but actually there's all these little coves

and things that are just untouched beaches that you can take a water taxi to and they'll just drop you off and you can just have your own private beach for however long you want. I love that. The inland is beautiful enough that you can just explore it and enjoy it

and the food's amazing and the people are so wonderful. All right, I'm going to St. Lucia. Honestly, it was one of the most magical times I've ever had. And one of the times, so my best friend, he tells me obviously that I never slow down

and I had never been on a beach vacation in my life because my family always went to the mountains. Right. So I said, I'm going to take you to St. Lucia. and we're going to sit on the beach and you're going to do nothing for a week and I said it's impossible can't be done

I won't do it I challenge you he did it and he got me to sit on a beach for a week and do nothing nothing I mean I didn't do nothing but I did more nothing

than I've done in quite a while wow I'm going to go to St. Lucia I really am going to go to St. Lucia you think I'm kidding but I'm going to go to St. Lucia I just need to have a vacation you know I haven't had a vacation

a while where I just like You know, just enjoy things. I'm going to end with this. Okay. I was really hoping Stephen Amel. He said he was going to come by. He asked me for the code to my door and he was just going to come in. Well, we can keep talking until he shows up.

I'll act surprised. I've acted surprised before when Stephen shows up in front of me out of the blue. Really? Yeah, episode 8 of 4 of Arrow. 8.4? 8.4? Why do they call it 804? Because it's season 8, episode 4.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, that makes sense. I think it was actually called something else. I don't recall. Infinite Earths Yeah It's a phenomenon It is

People are really loving it This is it though This is the last season Arrow is over Arrow is done But they still do crossovers With other shows I believe so

And I hear you're doing Maybe you're doing an Arrow Sequel They call it Potential Spinoff series So basically it's I can't really say I much about it

At this point Because I'm sworn You did that last time With Arrow I know I'm sorry But here's what I can say the crisis changes everything irreversibly so and that is what we see in this this next thing it's what's next chapter is what happens to Mia which it's me so me it's you it's what happens to you if this so you're a big part of this story

the spinoff it's yeah you yeah you'd be the green arrow maybe maybe Have you negotiated for this already? Yeah. You have? Yeah. You already know what you're making. Yeah. Are you excited about it if it happens?

It would be really cool. It's a great, I mean, honestly, Stephen has built up this character so much, and it is a legacy, and you really feel that in this season of Arrow. Every episode is kind of honoring a different aspect of what has made the last eight seasons so iconic. Right.

And you, so, you know, I've got some big boots to fill moving forward. episode what episode is aired episode 808 is the one that's next and that's the arrow part of crisis on infinite earths and how many episodes are left before stephen dies or whatever happens to him well arrow doesn't die there's no bullshit arrows never dies I mean spoiler alert if we're yeah I know he died but he didn't

really he doesn't die it's all bullshit they don't die I don't know I don't know crisis isn't over because if Batman dies it's like it doesn't matter It's like that movie Us you're talking about. When those people in the beginning die, you know, they're not going to die. These are legendary. This is Batman. This is, uh, these are, they can't kill Oliver Twist, Oliver Queen.

Oliver Queen. You can't do it. I don't know, just go, no. You're really good at, uh, what's the word, zip lining your, zip locking your mouth with these secrets. I mean, you're really, are you're a tight lip in it absolutely well here's here's my though you can't say anything i'm not trying to get anything from you no i know but but for him to die it's like do you not think you're going to see the green arrow again it's like it just doesn't come on you think people are crying out there i mean if

you're really hardcore fans which you are out there and it's great show and these guys are awesome but if you're watching it then stephen dies as green arrow are you really going oh my god oh my god knowing that he'll be back that's my take that's my take on it maybe i'm wrong maybe the dc universe has really taken uh different they're like hey when people die their dad like that marvel movie i didn't see it but end game uh-huh didn't a lot of people die oh well the one before it do you not think they're gonna come back sometime fuck you it's like you know what it is it's jason and michael meyers that's true they're always back they're coming back it follow you know why you know why because you can't

It's true. This is just my theory. That's true. Well, you never know. I mean, the crisis isn't over yet, but it'll be interesting to see things moving forward. Yeah. I am really excited, though, to see, for people to see the backdoor pilot. And then also the series finale of Arrow is really special.

And it gives as much closure as anyone can expect from eight years of a series. I'm going to watch that one. Get yourself a box of tissues before. Like I said, I don't, you know, it's not like I know what the hell is going on. It's like, you know, for instance, when I love. left smallville after season seven i came back for the serious finale that episode yeah so i missed 66 episodes oh my gosh do you think i watched any of those why would i watch any of the episodes that i'm not in well i don't know i watched six seasons of arrow to study for it before i started

well good on you but that's because i i knew i they after i was cast yeah right right i didn't know i was playing i didn't know i was auditioning for the illicity baby i didn't know that my character was going to be Oliver and Felicity's child. I had no idea. I was auditioning for a rookie cop that was just kind of adjacent to the story. Right. And then I get a call from the showrunner saying, hey, we're so happy to have you on the show. Congratulations. By the way, you're Oliver and Felicity's kid. Congratulations. Okay, great. I'm going, wait, I'm sorry. What? What did I just sign up for? This is insane because I knew I'd seen, obviously, you know, the internet explodes with elicited content. And Stephen and Emily have built up these characters so much

and given them such backstory and depth and nuance that it's a lot of responsibility to take on and I knew I had my work cut out for me which is why I watched six seasons at the time of the show because I wanted to pull as many traits and nuances that's what makes your performance so dynamic but I'm asking you this if you were on a show, Arrow years before

and you got killed off or you left the show after season four would you continue watching all the episodes? It depends. No, it doesn't. Well, it does. I might. If I really, really loved the show, if I enjoyed the show's viewer as well, which, I don't know, maybe I'm just a nerd for the thing. No, I understand that.

I don't think, I think for the first couple seasons when I was on a show, I would watch it. And then after that, I was like, all right, unless it was something like, wow, Lexmus looks interesting. I'm going to watch that. You know, it was an episode where I was good and it was like this dream sequence. Or if it was an episode that really, I mean, Christopher Reeve was on. I was like, you don't want to watch that. That's cool. There were certain episodes, but ultimately, it just didn't make sense.

Yeah. For me to watch myself anymore, I was like, okay, after 60, 60, 70 episodes, then I just didn't. No, it makes perfect sense. Yeah, yeah, so that's all I'm saying. Yeah. This has been really fun. Do you like Catherine, Ryan? I do.

It's been fun. Thank you. Yeah, she's, man, you're so happy. I'm stubbornly optimistic. Yeah, but that's the way to be. You know, I'm like that in certain ways. when i went to germany with my band rob kept saying rob and tom they're like lally especially such an internal uh uh pessimist just like supposed to rain the whole week i'm like no it's not

if you check the weather what does it say 70% i'm like it's not gonna rain why are you looking at that just getting a fucking plane and land if you need a rain jacket get a rain jacket when you get there don't start putting negative shit in your head it ain't raining or just walking the It's going to probably, yeah, it could be out for up to two days. Nah, we'll be back in a couple hours. That's the way I think. I really do when it comes to shit like that. I'm like, no, it'll be fine.

See, for me, I always find the silver lining. If it's going to rain, well, that's fun. I love walking in the rain. Oh. Or if the power's going to be out. I just shut it down. No, it's not. It's not going to rain.

Light some candles. Have a fire pit. It's going to be fun. Do you like Christmas? I do love Christmas. Do you have a Christmas tree? I haven't put it up yet, but I have one. I have a lot of ornaments I haven't put up.

Can you put this out bar? I would love to. You want to know what's funny, though? Because I've moved so many times and lost or thought I lost my Christmas tree about four times. So I have about four Christmas tree. Are you serious? They're obviously fake. They are.

Yeah, obviously. You think they'll be alive? I have a little Christmas forest. Idiot. And I don't know. I think I opened up an old storage unit that I had and realized that I had two Christmas trees. And then I had one in my storage unit, my garage, and then one in my clothes. and then one in my closet in my house.

And I went, oh, well, I'm just very festive, I guess. Yeah, you are. You know, I think I'd like you to come back at least once a year. Okay. So you've come back. This will air probably, you know, in January. Great. Perfect.

So then you'll have to come and do an episode for the following year because I feel like you're just, you're a good spirit, you're a good egg. And no matter how famous you get, you'll still come back. Always. Even if this is one of the worst podcasts ever and not doing well, your parents are listening. You'll still come back. Oh, for sure. I actually can't tell you the number of people that come up to me and go, oh my God, I listened to you on Rosenbaum's podcast. Really? And they know me from your podcast before I've met them. You know, I get that a lot where people will say, I didn't know

much about Catherine McNamara. I didn't know who she was. I wasn't going to listen. And then I listened and I really learned a lot about whatever. And that's the whole purpose. If they know that I'm going to try and get things and make people make these actors or musicians or athletes talk like human beings be human beings talk about adversity or what they love or what they're grateful for or whatever if you can normalize like you know mental health and all that shit i think i think it just helps so i like having someone who has the spirit that you do and that's just as important as those people who have faced a lot darker shit because it's you're the light at the end of the tunnel maybe Well, and it's not that it's not that I haven't faced dark shit.

Yeah. Because I've been through a lot of that in my life. And that's why I'm such an awesome stuff. Well, let's get into that. Well, maybe someday. Someday. But I got to a point in my life where I could have gone down a really dark path or I could have chosen to deal with what I was going through in a positive way. And it was kind of a turning point where I said, okay, well, I can wallow in this and let it consume me.

or I can go through it and be a better person for it on the other side and learn to turn it into a positive situation and maybe out of survival maybe out of the people that I was surrounded with I ended up on the positive route and to me there's so many things in life that are in the end so trivial

or so small or just pass you by and there's no need to make them a huge problem them or to be upset about them or be, you know, brought down by them. If you can laugh about it and if you can find the silver lining and move on and move through it, yes, there are things in life that you have to go through and you have to feel and you have to acknowledge and work through. And feel. And that's important.

That's why I do what I do is to try and highlight those parts of life. But you don't have to live in that all the time. You don't have to let that become who you are. you can allow yourself to grow from it and move on from it and use that as a way to make yourself stronger and make yourself just appreciate the good in life because you know that it's not always that way. Catherine, thank you for being here. Thanks for listening to a Catherine McNamara. A lot of fun. She's a she's pretty dynamic. A little shout out to all my patrons, my lovely patrons.

Here they are, Allison, Mark, Jason D. I knew a guy named Jason Dix in school, but Jason D. D is not Jason Dix. Lauren G. Nansen. Nancy D. She's going to kill me for that. Barry L. Barry, I want you to yell at me on Patreon. Just say Rosenbaum.

It's not Barry L. But that L looks like an I. Barry L. Lee S. Jason W. Bob B. Bortex. My good old vortex. And you Kiko. Yukiko. Nico P. Jill E. Angelina G. Tricia. Tricia. Dion K. Emma H. Kevin R. Robert B. Jerry W. Sarah V. Taylor B. and Emily. Good old Emily. Thank you for supporting patron. Thanks for subscribing to Inside of you. it's been a it's been a real treat so far we've had three great guests now on the podcast we had marina backerin we had stephen emel we had macnamara we've got some other great guests coming up

and then the videos boy do we have some great guests coming up for the videos i mean i got i'm doing five podcasts coming up next week which won't air for a little while but they're all video so that's going to be neat some big comedians we got some uh we got the guy somebody from maybe an hbo hit series coming on. I think it's on HBO. It is right. Yeah, we got somebody who has a very famous family who's also famous who I'm going to get dirty with.

Well, that doesn't sound right. Anyway, thanks for all the support. Join Patreon if you want. Subscribe. Tell your friends about the podcast. And thank you for all the messages. Oh, that's what I wanted to read. I wanted to read a message, Brian.

Oh, right. These are letters from fans. And I think, look, I get all these letters, and especially like after the Stephen and Mel episode came on. And let's see, Michael, I have been wanting to write to thank you for this podcast for a few weeks now. But this morning on the way to work, I was listening to episode 97 with Stephen Amel. And something was said that hit me like a ton of bricks. You said to Stephen that he was in mourning of his show that was a part of his life. It hit me hard because I am retiring from the Army after 22 years.

the tears started immediately but soldiers aren't supposed to cry well we know that's not true my friend the last few months have been hard I have lacked energy motivation I never thought of it in this way until you said it I am in mourning of my military career

I don't know why I'm in but I'm a little emotional right now I'm just looking at this going wow anyway I have never felt more alive as I did when I was in combat or jumping out of planes and hanging out with my brothers doing dangerous crazy or playing just dumb shit

now that is gone. I am crying again as I write this. Thank you. You and Stephen have helped me. Name this thing that I am going through. I am in mourning. Naming it has opened up the gates and tear ducks, gotten the ball rolling to acceptance and understanding.

Thank you, Bob. Hey, if I may offer a suggestion, I know you have actors, musicians, athletes on your podcast. Have you considered having any soldiers, airmen, or Marines? many are also musicians actors and all warriors athletes very few have the resources that you have been fortunate to have yet still learn to deal with and grow from them just a thought Bob you know what you just opened my eyes bob I'd love to have someone who's been through it you know protected us and um in the armed forces and somebody who's been through some stuff

and can give me some perspective more perspective because we can't imagine we could just sit there and say oh he's so brave and thank you but the the crap you guys go through women men is just we don't know all we can do is thank you and it's sort of like that gray area where you're not sure i mean you see movies and you see tv and you know you hear about people losing their lives it's tough so bob thank you and i will consider absolutely having um soldiers or airmen or marines on see these letters are they're great should i read one more sure Okay, this one is from Jose. Good afternoon, Michael, and team.

Team would be Ryan, maybe Bryce, Mia. Jess. Jess. Just wanted to give a quick insight to listener, to a listener, me, and change slash expand Rosenbaum's idea of who his listeners are. Okay, here we go. Maybe I should have read this one. My apologies, but I have never watched an episode of Smallville in my life.

And I'm sure the show is great. I just never had the time to watch the school and work. and couldn't have picked Michael out of a lineup before listening to the podcast. Well, you're, you along with others. I first stumbled the pond inside of you via Tiger Belly. That's Bobby Lee's show that I've been on four times, and he's coming back. And quickly backtracked and listened to all available episodes and have been listening ever since. I listened because the shows and interviews are real.

Michael has genuine curiosity and asks real questions that anyone and everyone would want to ask. I divorced from my wife about a year ago and found it so helpful to listen and know that other people have problems too. We all do, by the way, buddy. We all do. It doesn't matter who you are. You have problems. If you're celebrities, you create your own problems. We all have issues to deal with and that there's a path to continue no matter what life throws at you.

So I just want to thank the team, Ryan, Jessica, Bryce, Mia, for continuing to do the shows even if Rosie isn't getting rich off of them. and plan on becoming a Patreon slash patron to show how much the podcast means to me. Cheers to an awesome 2020. I swear to God, I didn't read this. What I do is, Jose Vega wrote that. I just, I get a bunch of emails that just forwards to me from the, it's hello at inside of you podcast.com. You can write the letters. And also, if you tweet something, I'm sure I'll get it.

But she forwards them to me. And I just forward them and paste them all on one page so I can just scroll. down and read randomness and I actually choose just not to read them until I'm reading them to you and I think that was pretty awesome they both were awesome these letters thank you Jose thank you everyone for reaching out taking the time to write about how you feel about the show and you know also write a review but thank you guys and continue uh continue the support try to breathe every day just breathe in breathe out try not to go through the motions like we all do and just enjoy the moment man. Enjoy the moment. Thank you for a lot of the inside of all of you.

down payment on a home. Something nice. Buying a vehicle. A separate bucket for this addition that we're adding. $50,000, I'll buy a new podcast. You'll buy new friends. And we're done. Thanks for playing, everybody.

We're out of here. Stacky Benjamin's, follow and listen on your favorite platform.