Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - MARTIN KOVE: Softie Bad Guy, Mystique of Karate Kid & Leading with Vulnerability

Episode Date: August 20, 2024

Martin Kove (Cobra Kai, The Karate Kid) joins us this week to share the vulnerability and soft side behind over 50 years of onscreen villainy. Martin talks a lot about the depth added to his character in the Cobra Kai series, while recounting crazy stories during the audition and filming of the iconic Karate Kid franchise. We also talk about going out on a ledge to win over an audition, laugh out loud stories with Sylvester Stallone, and the dangers of bringing home your work went portraying a bad guy. Thank you to our sponsors: ❤️ Betterhelp: https://betterhelp.com/inside 🚀 Rocket Money: https://rocketmoney.com/inside 📞 Mint Mobile: https://mintmobile.com/insideofyou ⚕️ Lumen: https://lumen.me/inside __________________________________________________ 💖 Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/insideofyou 👕 Inside Of You Merch: https://store.insideofyoupodcast.com/ __________________________________________________ Watch or listen to more episodes! 📺 https://www.insideofyoupodcast.com/show __________________________________________________ Follow us online! 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/insideofyoupodcast/ 🤣 TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@insideofyou_podcast 📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/insideofyoupodcast/ 🐦 Twitter: https://twitter.com/insideofyoupod 🌐 Website: https://www.insideofyoupodcast.com/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Thanks for joining me today. Thanks for choosing this podcast for your day. Ryan, I hope you're having a good day, Bunny. I'm doing all right. We just finished a couple of episodes. Yeah, finished a couple of good episodes. And look, man, we've been doing this for a while.

And those of you who are here from Martin Cove, it's a great interview. I know you'll appreciate it. And if you do, just ask you to follow and give the podcast a chance. You'll learn a lot. We talk about mental health and facing adversity. and really open candid conversation. So I hope you give this podcast a chance. Yeah, there's a lot.

The handles, follow the show or at Inside of You podcast on Facebook and Instagram at Inside You Pod on the Twitter. And, you know, a lot of things going on. I got my book, The Talented Farter. It's on Amazon, guys. You can pre-order it now. I'd really appreciate it. It's a sound book.

It's a great tabletop, great for gifts, great for kids, great for adults, great illustrations, great story about a kid with his only talent is farting. I think you'll like it. And Rosie's puppy fresh breath for your dog's breath, cat full in the morning or whenever in their water, tasteless, odorless, and your dog's breath will be so much better and delightful. Also, you can go to my Instagram at the Michael Rosenbaum,

and I have a link tree, and get cameos. You can go to the inside of you online store and get Lexmascripts signed and ship keys and a bunch of stuff. Sunspin.com, if you want to listen to our music, we're getting ready for our next album, and we're doing a stage it. So you can watch us virtually on Saturday, September 28th. You can watch us, Ryan, watch us jam, and there's prizes and we see your

shoutouts and we acknowledge you. And we really appreciate it. And of course, joining Patreon to help support this podcast and keep it afloat. Patreon.com slash inside of you if you want to support the podcast. It means a lot. And we had a great episode today. I really enjoyed this. I was a little intimidated by Martin Cove. I thought, yeah, he could, you know, it could be old school. And he was a sweetheart. His son came on. We talked about Cobra Kai. We talked about Rambo. We talked about Rambo. We talked about so many different things, and he was really open and honest, and I think you're going to really appreciate this, especially if you're a Cope or Kai fan. So let's get inside of Martin Cove. It's my point of view. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum.

Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience. watched smallville yeah i i did i watched i watched the first season smallville i loved it um yeah i used to watch with my daughter all the time it's cool how cool is that i forgot you know i mean it was a well-done show it was just you know well-done show and and um you know i i didn't watch a lot of stuff my daughter at that time was a buffy freak so she was stealing and the walls and everything had nothing but Buffy Pictures, you know? Oh, my God. You know, she was just a

delicious little 12-year-old, played heavy soccer, was great soccer, scouted for the Olympic development team, and, you know, but went to Beverly Hills High School and went downhill from there. Why, did she want to be an actor? No, you know, the peer pressure

in Beverly Hills High School, deadly, deadly. You know, my son didn't suffer from that much. he's going to come on in a little while and you'll love him because we've done like four Westerns together and he's got one coming out that I produced about it. He makes

a deal with the devil, you know? I've always wanted to do Westerns. And you've done, how many Westerns have you done? A lot. I've done a lot, you know, Wyatt Earp and, you know, when I did Wyatt Earp with Costner, I cried when I left the set. I did not want to leave.

I just worked a week on it. And it was such a great like Kazden and Kastner and all those people. And we all, and everybody loves to make questions on the set because unfortunately they don't do them enough anymore. And Taylor Sheridan has opened up, thank God, a new avenue. And I've got, you know, a comic book that's, you know, we're working on as a series.

And it's great. It's really good. Did people see you cry on the Costner set or did you keep it to yourself? No, I kind of like, when am I, you know, it's a good question. That's a long time ago. I think I cried when I, after I left the set, you know? And then again, I cried at supermarket openings. Nobody knows that about me, you know?

They all think I'm a hard ass, but I'm a romantic, you know, and I just enjoy, my favorite picture is Casablanca. Oh, yeah. I cry every time I see that. Yeah. can you not you know how can you not i mean you've been in this business for a long time how many years have you been doing this 1970 54 years yeah holy shit yeah and and it's it's fascinating because you know jo montana called me last night and he invited me to this event in l a that he does at lakeside

and for his for autism and all this you know and i live in nashville so i wasn't going to come, but I'm going to go. I think I'm going to go. And he just revived all the things that we all had done and met together and, you know, when shooting together and Charlton Heston celebrity shoots and all this great stuff that we did together. And I did criminal minds for a while. It's really interesting is we as actors never look back to see what we've accomplished. We always look forward to see what's the next gig. That's really important that you say that. I think that's You know, that's part of like trying to, they always talk about being in the present and like just enjoying what you have and like looking at your body of work and saying, hey, I've done a lot. I've done enough. Look what I did. And we're not, you know, we're always focused on what's next and being relevant and this. And you know, I know I'm victim of that. You know, I've done that a lot in my life. And it's hard not to. How do you do it? I'm just learning, man. These characters came to me about doing a book. And they want to do a book on me. And I said, I'm not book word. I said, you know, Mal and Brando, you know, Mal and Brando, Peter O'Toole, you know, Sean Connery, they're bookworthy.

I'm not bookworthy. And they said, we're not doing a book on Cobra Chi. We're not doing a book on Karate Kid. We're doing a book on Marty Cove coming out of Brooklyn, New York as an only child, you know, learning in the fourth grade that he wants to be an actor. I said, really? He says, we want to know about tenacity. We want to know about how you. you did it and didn't get to have to take another job in 50 years.

I don't, you know, I just tell every young actor be tenacious. And if they don't hire you, it's their problem. It's their mistake. And I guess I've always followed that, but I don't know. You know, these guys, to answer your question, these characters have done so much research on my background that it unearths so much information that, And I don't even consider it anymore, you know? But isn't it nice to kind of go back and then sort of forced to relive it or kind of,

you know, think about the certain moments in your life and because otherwise you probably wouldn't pay as much attention unless somebody told you to do this. You're right. You're 100% correct. It takes other people when Montana was telling me yesterday, do you remember this? Do you remember that? And I didn't. And then after a while, I remembered all these.

I mean, his first gig was hair on Broadway, right? Then he did, you know, he grew up with David Mamet. So, Glenn Gary, Glenn Ross, and American Buffalo were all second nature to him. And those are my favorites of all time, you know? And favorite, you know, theater pieces. And, you know, he just brought up all this stuff and the accomplishments and not to toot my horn because I never think about it. but these writers the same thing i meet with them twice a week for two hours and they bring up stuff i never even thought about it personal stuff too personal stuff dark stuff everything

everything you know the dark stuff he's just kind of you want to like suppress that but the theatrical stuff i mean you know the first movie i ever did alan arkin directed me little murders with Elliot Gould in Central Park, 1970, my first speaking role cut out of the movie because he was a pacifist and he couldn't kill anybody and he killed me with a camera. And Alan Arkin wrote me a letter and said, your performance was wonderful, but I'm sorry we have to cut the piece out. And that was my first speaking part. So I got depressed for a couple of weeks, but then I realized I did my best and I'm just going to move forward. And that was. was 1970.

So, you know, you don't think about those moments. And these writers make you think about that. What's this book called? As of now, the title is Merciful. The Memoirs of Martin Cove. And when do you think this is going to come out? Who knows? Sometime next year.

You know, they're still writing it. But Ralph wrote a book. And I said to, you know, Ralph Machio, I said, tell me about the experience. And his book was good, but he wrote it himself. So the thing is, and Matthew McConaughey, I'm reading his book now, Greenlights, and he wrote it himself. It's a lot of work. It's a lot of work, man.

I mean, you know, you think trying to mount a movie or a TV show is work. Try writing. I mean, you need the discipline. I have the highest, I have the highest respect for any writer. because they can shut their world off, shut off their life, and discipline themselves and put things on paper. Yeah, it's pretty incredible. And it's hard, you know, especially when you're writing a book. I mean, if it's chronological of your life, maybe that's a little, you know, easier. You kind of, you know, segue. way, but when you're kind of bouncing all over the place and kind of coming up with an actual story, you know, it's just, it's, it is an immense amount of work that you have to really

dissect and take the time to do. At least, you know, you're meeting with them a couple hours and you're able to think about all these things and let them kind of put it together. And then do you get the okay? You get to say, all right, I like this. This is, or cut this out. You get to say that. Yeah, oh, there's some stuff I have to say, listen, we don't want to talk about that. You know, we were, you know, I remember a time when, you know, and I remember a time when I had to be very unpredictable. And it was a movie while I was doing Cagney and Lacey. And the director, the writer said to me, he says, we want you for this part of a rapist in this movie. And it was a movie of Czech Norris going to Fiji, Finland, and New Zealand.

And I really wanted to do it, even though I was doing Cagney and Lacey. And the guy said to me, I wanted the other part. And the producer says I wasn't unpredictable enough in the interview. So I took a 357 magnum, was a prop pistol. This goes back a long time. You could never do this now. But I put it in my suitcase, my portfolio, and I walked, and I said, get me another interview with these guys.

So the writer was there. I think the writer forgot his name. Jerry Jameson was the director and the producer was my biggest fan. And then there was a writer. There was someone else. Anyway. So I didn't know when I was going to pull this gun, but I really wanted the other part. So my biggest fan was the producer.

And he says, we want you to play the part of this rapist. like you did in Karate Kid I said a little click happened and I pulled the gun out of my portfolio put it under his chin raise him out of his chair and I said don't ever tell an actor to repeat a role

ever put the gun back in my bag and left turned around the door and I said gentlemen I hope we can do business 10 minutes later I got the part that I wanted my God I You would think that the director, right, would be sitting there going,

oh, my God, was that real? What the fuck? This guy's crazy. He's unhinged. They were laughing and giggling because the producer was a smaller guy. And I raised him up right under there. And they were cracking up. And I don't know why they were laughing so much, but they were.

And then I did it once, months later, when my best friends were producing a picture, or the godfathers of my kid, Jim Green and Alan Epstein, Green Epstein Productions. And the director kicked me out of the room. I did the same thing. And the director said, get out of this room.

I never want to see your face again. And he was a big macho guy, belt buckles, cowboy boots. And I've ever done that again. Were you always a tough guy? Did you grow up in a tough side of town? Did you have to kind of have thick skin and just did you fight a lot when you were younger?

I didn't fight a lot, but I held my own. I grew up in Brooklyn in Crown Heights, and, you know, it was, you know, it was tough, you know, but it wasn't like Beth and Stuyvesant. It wasn't really gang-oriented, you know, but you had to hold your own, and I got into fights there. We used to play touch football on the gutter, a tackle football on the gutter, you know, on the sidewalk. And, you know, you just did it. And it was fun. Wow.

But I was never really a fighter. You know, I held my own. I fought a lot, but I wasn't really, I didn't pride myself on being a tough guy at all. I really enjoyed, I really enjoyed the arts. I enjoyed movies. I used to, you know, make sure I saw everything. And I was the only child.

And my father was a retailer. My mother was a bookkeeper. So I was by myself all the time with my imagination, you know? Yeah. And that was it. And I lived a fantasy world, in a fantasy world. But before, before like karate and all that, you were doing martial arts before that, right? Yeah.

We were going to do a movie called The Lion of Ireland. It's the story of Brian Baru, the first king of Ireland, who unified all the tribes against the Vikings. and this circa 1180 and we were all doing Kendo working with swords and that was the period where Arnold had just done Conan so all the sword work was pretty much samurai work you know but bastardized into medieval times and we you know we all have a reasonable foundation of karate but we really worked with swords and wagasashi's and you know um die toes which is the wooden in a sword and it was great i found swordwork more elegant i found it more noble holding a sword and and working out with with the swords were just to me

more exciting than karate but the and then helped you that helped you get the role did they want somebody who had experience no they didn't care they didn't care that jerry want job and john alison they just wanted people who can act and um i went in there with the foundation just like a couple of other people ralph didn't know karate and miagi didn't know karata i know parameda and so you know now in cobra kai we you know we work out we would you know a lot of fighting and so we always go with the stunt guys who were great and you know i can't tell you what goes on in the second set of five and the third set. But there's a major fighting and major comeuppance and good stuff coming up, you know? Yeah, you look like you're

really enjoying it. Do you think you're, were you hesitant at first when you, when you, they called you about COBRA Kai? Were you like, yeah, I'll do something like, or did you have to sort of get convinced to do this? The only prerequis that I had was when we met, we met in Dan Tannis in Beverly Hills and the restaurant. And the three riders, they wanted me to come in episode 10, season one. And I said, why can I come in episode five, episode six? He said, no, because we want you to set up season two. And I said, well, all right.

But I want you to write this guy vulnerable. I don't want him to be a villain. I really want him to be misunderstood and have you write flashbacks constituting why he's such a beast. I don't want to play him like I didn't. Karate Kid won the movie. I don't want that single dimension only with this character. We have eight, 10 hours to do, to develop him. And they said they would. And they did, you know. But I later found out on my kids podcast, we had a podcast a year ago on podcast one. And it was,

I think it was called kicking it with the coves. Is that Jesse right there? You know what's great is that you both are wearing boxer briefs right now. Nobody knows, but you both are. I have shorts on, thank you very much. Your father, on the other hand, I think he might be just wearing boxers. I am. I am, no, I'm wearing.

I'm wearing. This is what my son gave me. All right? He gave me this and the matching pants. This was his retirement gift after Cobra Kai season six to go down to buy a mansion in Florida to live in. Inside of you is brought to you by Quince. I love Quince, Ryan.

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so they know I sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from my show inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum. Rocket Money. Jesse, you like working with your dad. We have so much fun. It's like we always want the best for each other. It's sometimes funny it's when my dad's on set you know i'll do a scene or something and then they'll be like jesse come over here and i'm like what's what he's like try try this and then that and i'm like looking at the director he doesn't know he's talking to me and i'm like all right and then i'll try something he'll be like that was great jesse let's let's let's move on it's fantastic really so he'll give you a little coaching every now and then like you know i love discussing this stuff with my dad you know we always

try to find the the the greatest pieces of the characters we're playing and so you know it's fun to be able to have that dialogue with him. And we have it with each other. I've had it with him for John Crease, you know, throughout some of the, some of the seasons and, you know, figuring out different nuances to the characters and vice versa. I did this Western and they wanted me to jump on this horse. And my dad gave me the suggestion in this movie called Farhaven to fan the revolver as I'm running. And the director was like, oh, my God, that was amazing. I want to get a special on close up on Jesse doing that. And then that made the cut. And it was like, you know, it was all my dad who suggested that. So funny stuff like that happens. I love it. You know, I talked to,

I interviewed Colin Hanks a while ago and just like talking to him about what it's like growing up as a kid and having your dad as like this actor, this, you know, but for you, what was it like, you know, as a kid, knowing your dad was this known actor and, you know, just had, you know, was it, was it difficult at times? Was it fun? Was it cool? Were you the cool kid? Did you get picked on? I didn't get picked on. I think there was, you know, the, The vision was I had a tough dad, which my dad is tough. But, you know, he wasn't like some, you know, dandelion character or something. But it was always, you know, to me, he's always my dad, just like every other dad, except, you know, I would go on these crazy adventures around the world and be on movie sets.

I never like being in school. So he was like, Jess, I'm doing this movie in India. Do you want to come? I'm like, yes, I do. And it's always been a really wonderful experience to share that with him. You know, it's kind of like, for me, it was like going to Disneyland all the time. And, you know, but it is, it is a different world to grow up in that environment. I'm sure Colin and I would have a very similar understanding of each other.

You know, it's, it's just odd. You know, it's just a very strange dynamic. It's a strange life, as you know. It's not a normal thing. And so you kind of just have to adapt to the way that the, you know, Hollywood revolves around normal life. Yeah. Well, you think that, you know, of course, people because they don't know, they're like, is he like the character and karate kid to you as a father is he really hard on you

is he really that mean to you and i'm like yes he's lit that's exactly what he is i'm sure people ask you that i'm sure growing up they do they 100% do and i'm like i'm like my dad is a marshmallow until he gets stuck in traffic or if he bangs his toe on the side of the bed and john crease comes out or if he's on the phone customer service that's something he doesn't really like to do very much but how bad is this temper when you've seen on rare occasions? I mean, I would say my dad and I both can get out of hand with our cameras. And we've clashed heads before, which is a really big, a big match to see is when my dad

go head to head. But all in all, we hug it out afterwards and, you know, lessons learned. But, you know, like, you know, he talks about, there's a bit of him in John Crease and some of those characters that he plays, especially that, you know, that comes up through there. But, yeah, we've had a blast dissecting characters and learning about, you know, these characters over the years. And like you asked earlier about what was it like when we heard about

Cobra Kai coming to YouTube. At first my dad and I were like, what the hell are they doing? Like a YouTube show with Karate Kid? I'm like, is this like a prank show? Like, what are they, what are they doing? This is before they kind of had all their originals. So, but obviously it was a magical experience.

And how did that happen for you for Cobur Car? I was very lucky, you know, I got to audition for a character in season three that auditioned like everybody else. I was sitting there in the waiting room with a bunch of other guys. And, you know, I went in the room. And I didn't really know exactly who the character was for. We had an idea. It was something around Crease's character. And I don't know if it was for

young him or someone else. And so I went in there and I played this bully. And I joked around. I was like, oh, you know, playing the villain like runs in the family. And so, you know, we can kind of turn it off and on. And I did it. And I was like, they wanted one more take. And I was like, well, how much of an asshole do you want him to be? And they're like, we want the worst. And I was like, okay, so I gave him that. And my dad was already filming season three in Atlanta. I got the call like a week later that I booked it. And I was like, and they were talking about housing and all this stuff. And I was like, I was like, well, I'll just go stay with my dad. Well, he's, and then, you know, when he's filming, he'll just come visit me on the day that I'm

filming. And it was just kind of this really weird back to the future moment. Like literally when my dad came to set, we were already rolling. We were like halfway through the day. He had the day off. And he was watching this actor named Barrett Carnahan playing. young him bullying his son in real life from 1967 it was this total back to the future moment it was just crazy and it was just

so surreal and such an honor for me to join that universe I'm very lucky and appreciative and it was just so cool you know I have to say Martin I mean when you knew he was auditioning for it right yeah I knew but I didn't know when didn't know I didn't

put any words in I didn't put the word in you know I just walked on the set. I don't know why I didn't. I don't remember what, it happened so fast. And so many things, as you know, on a TV show, it's hard to get friends in because you get the script the last minute. So you don't know who's appropriate for what.

I remember on Cagney-Lacey, I never could get friends in because the scripts would come two days before we shot. Right. You know? Never did them only goes so far, and then hopefully talent takes over. yeah but jessie you know i walked on the set i literally walked on the set and you were doing a scene in the diner and i was going to go over to them and say how's my boy doing and um all three writers came up to me and said the kids killing it i didn't even ask he just said the kids killing it

and he was killing it he was just how good does that feel as a father Let me tell you, it's a three-picture deal right there. I mean, it's just right there. It makes you feel like a million bucks. And the greatest thing about my son is he plays himself. I was trying to be Steve McQueen for 25 years of my career. Always trying to do Steve McQueen. Jesse uses his own instrument for all the roles, different characters.

And it's heaven to see. see that maturation because I didn't have it. I was trying to be somebody else until maybe 15 years ago, 20 years ago. I was always trying to do the great escape, magnificent seven, you know, I was always trying to do this guy. I think everybody does that. I think everybody does it. They want to emulate. They want to be someone like their icon, their hero. And then there's always that saying, uh, we already have one of those guys. We want, we want you. We want actually you. And so becoming your own, you know, that's, you know, figuring out who you are and what you're capable of. But, you know, the cool thing I will tell you, Jesse, from experience,

I was an executive producer and lead actor on a show. And I remember I wanted to get my friend hired. And they're like, well, he can audition. And he auditioned with a lot of other people. And then they called me and said, your friend was the best. We're going to, we're going to hire. And I guarantee that's sort of what happened with you. You had to go in there and get it. They weren't just going to give it to you. You earned it. You know what I mean? Yes. And the stakes were even higher. I joke with my dad was like, can you imagine if I went in there and I bombed it? Like how embarrassing that would be like for you, for me. Like I really, I worked my ass off because even if I didn't get it, I at least wanted to make an impression,

you know, at least, you know, even though my dad's on the show that I went in there and I did a good job. Yeah. Like it was a look or whatever. It didn't matter. But yeah, so that was, you know, wild. And just by the way, a funny Easter egg for you, growing up when we were growing up and I was watching movies you were also in our television every week my sister and i'll be watching on tv so you're you're part of the family as much as i appreciate that well this is awesome i know you guys have you have done you've done you've done four westerns jesse i think i've done like yeah four of them yeah crazy with your dad uh two two of them are with him two of them were we're not you're living my dream man i've always wanted to do a western i hope somebody cast me in a western someday i just

i know the character i want to play but we have a western in development right now so Well, let me know, man. I grew up in Southern Indiana. I could pour it on, dude. Let me tell you, if you read well, we'll just cast you. Don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. I could turn on that Southern charm.

Boom. Well, Jesse, is there anything else you want to talk about before I go back to your dad for a minute? Yeah, it's just so fun to chat about this stuff. You know, the father's son dynamic is always great. It's cool to see, you know, I love, I think people enjoy seeing when my dad and I work together. It's always like a fun angle for people because it's like, I think it is cool for people to see, you know, a Hollywood family, father and son getting along on screen together and maybe even at odd, you know, at odd ends with each other, which is I think is always kind of a more interesting

thing. But, you know, I'm grateful to be in this business and to, to have the work that I have. And I appreciate my dad, all the, everything that he does for me and, and, you know, that we get to work together. And, you know, it's definitely still not easy, even though he's in the business, you know, I've, I still got to continue to work hard just like everybody. And, and that's, that's a great part of it is you, you earn it, you know. Is he a bit of a sap? Does he ever cry? Have you ever seen him cry?

Oh my God. You want to hear a good one? Yes, please. I'm in, I'm in Nashville at his house visiting him. I'm on the other side of the house. We have this side of the house. And I hear him at the other end go, oh, my God. This is just terrible.

And I'm like, dad, what's going on? He's like, oh, I'm watching the Titanic and just these people. can't believe that this happened to these people look at this and i go in there and he's like in his underwear watching the titanic and he's just having an emotional moment at the end when the ship is going down and everybody's dying and it was just it was a beautiful moment but uh yes he's definitely emotional that's amazing i love it well thank you for sharing that with me i hope to meet you someday man you're an awesome guy just just knowing you for the last 10 minutes i want to hang out with you so one day well i'll get your info before this we'll chat you guys enjoy and uh

Thanks so much. Thank you, man. You're awesome. All right. Bye, guys. Love you, Jess. Love you, Dad. Inside of you is brought to you by Rocket Money.

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into the twisted, the terrifying, and the true stories behind some of the world's most chilling crimes. Hi, I'm Ben. And I'm Nicole. Together we host Wicked and Grimm, a true crime podcast that unpacks real-life horrors one case at a time. With deep research, dark storytelling, and the occasional drink to take the edge off, we're here to explore the Wicked and Reveal the Grim.

We are Wicked and Grim. Follow and listen on your favorite podcast platform. you know with all this it's like how you know you're growing up in brooklyn and you know playing football or whatever in the gutters as you say how did you get into acting like why was it what inspired you were you like someone who always loved to go to the movies what what was it that you said i got to do this well it was fantasy i mean the fourth grade was the first time i did a play called the Golden Goose. And I just fell in love with being on stage.

And back in those days, you know, acting was acting, you know, like a kid acting, indicating, you know, not really being the character, just acting, you know. And I loved it. And it was just, you know, every year I would, I would, I fell in love. I remember in the seventh grade with a Christmas carol, the Alistair Sin, 1951 version. And I remember Jacob Marley. And we ended up doing this play in the seventh grade. And I played Jacob Marley.

And, you know, in the movie, he goes, he has a line fed to him by Alistair, Sam. He says, but you always took care of mankind. And then Jacob Marley goes, mankind, mankind was my business. And I just love that moment. So when I got to do the play in the seventh grade, all these other kids are just saying their lines, you know, and all of a sudden I come up with mankind and I do this whole line like that, like Shakespearean monologue, and the kids all laughed and giggled that. And I didn't even care because I knew I did it like a professional that I saw on TV doing a Christmas carol. And the teacher came up to me and he says, you did it the right way. They're all just saying, the lines, you did it the right way. Stick with it. Wow. And I just, you know. And that was it.

It was it. You know, I just liked it and did a lot of plays and, you know, in college and, and and worked with LaMama and Lincoln Center and did a lot of, you know, a lot of did street car. I guess three weeks later after doing street car in Detroit, I had enough. confidence to go and come to Hollywood, you know? And what was the big break in Hollywood? What was the one thing that you got that year? And it probably wasn't easy, right? You know, I did a lot of, I did a lot of guest stars as tough guys.

I don't know when people say big break, you know? I don't know. Big break to me is when you're starring in a really vulnerable movie that's a blockbuster. That's a break. You know, and everybody loves it and loves you. Karate Kid, yeah. Rambo, yeah. Wyatt Earp, you know, working with Tarantino is a break

because I did once about a time in Hollywood with him. I had a ball, you know. Al Waxman, who played Lieutenant Samuels on Cagney and Lacey, he directed me in a movie called White Light, about a cop who dies in the first 10 minutes and has a vision of a woman who gives him unconditional love in the dream and then spends the rest of the movie trying to find out was she a reality or was she a dream that movie never made a nickel came out the same weekend ghost came out but I loved it

it was what it's what I wanted to do so to me that was a break yeah you know I don't I don't you know I don't I like how you put that because you think oh what's the one thing that you know but it's it's all the little things that get you to the big thing yeah you know it's a culmination of the work and the moments and someone giving you a chance on cojack or rockford files or you know building your way up to cagney and lacey to movies to you know it's it's just sort of it ebbs and flows but i think you know when you get paid as an actor maybe that's the break when you get paid as an actor you're actually a working actor and you're making a living And when was that when you could say, hey, I'm making a living now?

I could actually afford to live by acting. I think, you know, I think it was 1976. I was in town like two, three years. And I got a series called Code R about a lifeguard, a policeman, and a fireman. And it was $2,500 a week. And it lasted one season. But to me, it was heaven. That's that joy that comes in, like when your kid is, you know, your kid gets an award or he does something great on the ball field or whatever, and you feel like a million bucks.

Yeah. That was the feeling. And that joy doesn't come that often. As many accolades as one could say, oh, you've done this and you've done that. That feeling of happiness and joy, I feel, doesn't come as often as it did in the early days. when I didn't have the responsibilities I have but I didn't have the big house and I didn't have the making sure

the PR people do their job and making sure the manager does the job those those gigs in the 70s and 80s they were a guess you're a free spirit in a way yeah yeah you're like a free spirit exactly yeah and and I don't know I kind of relish those days

more now than I did before because they come up with what we were talking about earlier. People unearth them and talk about cojack and they talk about I mean I did I kidnapped Sammy Davis Jr.

On a Charlie's Angels and I went back into his motorhome and there he is standing opposite his mirror with a double rig holster one piece of leather, double rig a western holster and he's drawn fast draw

And I said, man, I didn't know you were that fast. And he says, I hear you like Westerns. And I said, yeah, you know, I just finished the white buffalo with Bronson. But, I mean, he was fast. And he gave me his holster, carved on the back. It said Sammy Davis Jr. and his initials. And Arvo Jala, who made all the Western holsters for all these guys in the 60s. And in the 60s, we had 35 Westons on primetime.

TV. So this cat, I knew his name and everything. And I said, thank you. And of course, I can never use it because he had a 29-inch waist. And I never could put it on. Did you keep it? You still have it? Oh, I kept it for 25, 30 years. I kept it on my saddle. And then one day I said, you know, I know who would appreciate owning this? Quentin. So I said, if I have a good time on once about a time in Hollywood, I'm going to give him this holster. What? And sure enough, I put her in my car. I went, did it, you know, I went and work on a movie. So by the end of the time I was there, I said, I've had a great time.

I'm going to get this. Took it out of my car, gave it to him. He, of course, knew of Arvo Jala, the leather maker and knew, of course, Sammy Davis Jr., and put it hanging behind Al Pacino's head in Al Pacino's office in the movie. so when we saw each other at the premiere he says well did you see it did you see it and i said see what he says the holster i put it up on the wall in appellito's agents in the agent's office i said oh yeah sure i didn't see it i couldn't i didn't know what you know i didn't i didn't realize and then i saw the movie again and i did see because it's just a black blob behind his head

But that's the kind of guy that you think making it. When you work with a guy like that, that's making it. Because the cat is just right there, you know, for you, knows enough about movies that you can talk to about anything. You can talk to you about anything. To answer your question earlier, I did see every movie. I did watch Ten Commandments. I did watch around the world in 80 days.

All those spectacles that came out in the late 50s, El Cid, all of that stuff, you know. And I wanted to be part of it. And I just, you just live it. And that's what kept me in the business this long, you know. Did you remember the day, did you read for Karate Kid, your audition? Oh, God, yes. Here's another good story.

You got time? Sure, go ahead. They give me the script. I go to see the casting woman, Carol Jones was her name. And she says, okay, you, you know, she, read with me and she liked me and it's a Monday. She says, okay, oh, it's a Friday. And then she says, don't worry. They won't call you until next Friday. I said, okay, great. Monday morning, I get a phone call at 9 a.m. They want to see you at 12. I said, see me at 12. I haven't even

looked at the script, really. She says, it's now or never. I'll never forget that. She said, it's now and never. John Avelson wants to see you at 12. So I'm so angry. And I'm on a break from Cagney and Lacey. I don't need this job. It read like another heavy anyway. She says, my wife says, take all the venom you feel for these people and put it into that character, that scene. And the scene was marching up and down the dojo. Mercy is for the week here and on the street. Somebody confront you, they are the enemy.

And I did it with such a venom and hate. I got into the, but I had to get pumped up. So I go into the meeting. John Avelson's there. The casting woman's there. I said, I said, you know, John, you're an asshole. We wait for years to meet directors of your quality. And we fire our agents.

We fire our managers. And here, you don't give me any time to prepare. You're an asshole. And so are you, Carol Jones. Mercy is for the week. I go right into it. They love it. Sends me to Jerry Weintraub.

Jerry Weintraub comes four days late to the meeting. he was in Europe I do the same thing you're an asshole Jerry I can't I can't believe you're four days late to this meeting I'm on pins and needles

mercy is for the week stops me halfway through the audition says I love it I love you you're perfect sending you to Guy McElwain the head of Columbia another one another read but so I

did my prep in the bathroom I came out read with with Pat Marita and a video camera and I got the part that day. So it just goes to show you that I didn't need it. I was, a month later, I was going to start Cagnia Lacey again. And, but it was a great lesson and a great story

that these guys were confident enough, not to get uptight, not to say, who is this actor telling me I'm an asshole? You know? Yeah. They didn't care. They just, I love it. Aveltsin and Weintraub were just solid guys. What was, were you a dick to Pat Marita in those auditions?

Because you didn't, he knew you were supposed to be. Like you didn't want to say, oh, nice to meet you. How are? You just went into it. Yeah, that was it. No nice words. Because in the movie, we never mingled. No.

Pat hung out with Ralph. John Avelson wanted that. The cobra kai stayed by themselves, and I was alone. And that's how the mystique and the respect was always kept. And John was a visionary. So, you know, he took a movie that we all thought was another Bruce Lee movie. We hated the title and he turned it into a religious experience because everybody loves it. Could you, I want you to recall, if you can, the first time you watched it and what you're feeling, how you, what your heartbeats like, what you're feeling inside as you're watching this movie.

I was in Eugene, Oregon, doing another picture, a movie of the week. And my wife saw it with my stepson. She went to the opening. And I said, well, how's the movie? She said, the movie's great. The movie's great. And I said, well, Vivian, how was I? And she said, you're okay.

What? She said, you were okay. And I said, that's it? She said, yeah, you were okay. So I realized I better look at this movie. And I looked at it. And the guy was a one-dimensional tough guy, and he was good. It was good.

But I wouldn't say, you know, everybody else is a feeling of that performance was I made so many people frightened and hate me and all that because it just rang true. The TV show, I at least have colors. So I know I did my job well. I don't know where the venom came from. Venom for John Crease in Karate Kid 1 was harsh and I must have called upon all the forms of rejection I've had over the years

and just called them up you know and it was it's thrilling to still see that from 1984 the the emotionality of it it's fascinating to me the you know the art

is fascinating. Yeah. You know? With Amex Platinum, access to exclusive Amex pre-sale tickets can score you a spot trackside. So being a fan for life turns into the trip of a lifetime.

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The ultimate off-road challenge. Learn more at landrover.ca. When you compare a karate kid, your character, now to Cobra Kai and getting to do all these different things and talking to the riders and say, I don't want him to be one-dimensional and all this, how has that sort of arc or journey, any been? Has it been a fun experience? Have you liked working on the show? Do you like seeing what

's happening with your character and him going to jail, all this stuff? To me, I get a chance to do a lot of emotional work from personal experiences that I can call upon relationships. You know, John Creece, a lot of, you know, doing the character for so long, a lot of it, you know, sort of veered off into my personal life and I became impatient with my relationship with my my ex-girlfriend I became angry at a drop of a hat a lot of that character came right up into my personal life and I had to like I had to back up you know I had to really re-evaluate some things and talk about it in therapy and all because it just came up the venom came up, the anger came up, the impatience came up, the hostility came up. And once I got used

to it after I think season three, season four and five and six was terrific because it was emotional. They wrote me some very emotional stuff. Wait, wait, what's that music? I'm hearing music play. Yeah, that's basically for a few, that's the good, the bad and the ugly, that's tells me i have a text oh okay well i don't want i don't want it to be over what you're saying because it's so intriguing that i was like wait what is that i've got for a few dollars more that plays as my ring and then i've got good the bad and the ugly which plays as my text you know the good and the bad and the ugly is the the poster in my uh in my living room right right when you walk in the house you see the good the bad and the ugly but go go ahead about what you were saying you went to therapy and you

kind of got all this out of your system but over the over the last couple of years it's allowed me to I think improve as an actor, all this pain. You know, you think about Brando and you think about a lot of these people who suffered in their work to get to a place. You don't really understand it until you do it yourself, until it happens to you, where I could go back and, you know, have emotional personalizations in a relationship and bring it right into the work, you know. And that happened a lot.

It happened a lot to John Crease. And being in jail, working with a prison psychologist, I would often call upon my personal experiences. And some of the personal experiences were not happy ones. And most of them weren't. And so I grew as an actor by doing this show because I would never pick up a script and say, and breeze through it.

like I did in the early days, trying to be Steve McQueen and kind of figure out how cool I could be. I wouldn't do that anymore, you know? Yeah. And so I think corporate kind of helped me develop my, my emotional stature for myself as an actor. Yeah. I mean, you know, that was kind of my question, was really, what have you learned about yourself and how have you evolved in the business? And that was, you kind of answered that in so many ways.

It's like, and, you know, I think we all try to be something. We always, we all try to be, we want to be relevant. We want to be appreciated by our peers, by the people around us. We want to, you know, and, you know, we have to get that validation from the inside, you know, because my whole life was, you know, if I heard applause, it's like, okay, I'm doing something right. But that applause isn't always there. You know, it's like, how could I be genuine? and how can I work on myself? And a lot of stuff, I mean, did you have tough parents?

I mean, were they loving? Were they like unconditional love? Good to you? Like, good relationship? Yeah. It was unconditional love. You know, I was adopted at four days old. And my parents were, you know, my father never got past seventh grade.

And he was a retailer, a hardware retailer. My mother was a bookkeeper. And they loved me unconditionally. So I was the only child. and, you know, they supported my imagination. Didn't contribute to it. But I could never, I could never, because they didn't have imaginations,

they were Depression-era people. And they didn't have a lot of imaginations. So they never, they validated me to the point, well, it's cute, and it's fun, and you know a lot about movies. But it was never stimulation. And I suppressed that lack of stimulation in my home because I knew how much my parents loved me. So that affection was in the winning circle versus the anger and frustration. Oh, why can't they have a conversation with me about this movie?

Why can't they talk about the Ten Commandments? Why don't they know anything about El Cid? I never went there, you know, because they were simple people. And they loved me a great deal. But my imagination is what kept me going, you know? Yeah. It just, my mother would, I'd see the horses gallop across the TV. And I would go around the back of the TV as a five-year-old to see where those horses went.

You know, that's how wrapped up I was in the Western, you know? That's amazing. I love that. Let me ask you this. What was it like working with Stallone? Because I worked with him on a couple movies. and I just want to see what your perspective was. Well, you know, he and I had the same German clockmaker

as a personal manager in the early 70s. He would get sly jobs as Usher and the Barronet on 3rd Avenue. He would get me a job as a Santa Claus in Abraham and Strauss, right? And at the Palmerston. So, you know, none of these jobs ever lasted for anybody. And we ended up, you know, came out pretty much the same time. And we did Capone together. a movie with Ben Gazara and Susan Blakely.

And Death Race 2000, we get together a couple. I love Death Race, 2000. I love the theme. You're a madman. You love dating baby carriages and all that. Oh, man. I had a ball with Death Race 2000. I was like, oh, my, they just ran over that guy.

I know. I know. What a strange movie. Oh, my God, but go ahead. And we talked a lot, and he lived nearby and came over, you know, for dinner a couple of times. And I remember, remember, it was February, 1975, while we're making Death Race 2000. And I went in the trailer, and he had this red script with him. And I remember saying, what are you doing with that?

He says, well, it's this boxing movie I'm trying to get made. And it was Rocky. Wow. You know, a year and a half later, he had invited me to a couple of screenings and I couldn't go because I was doing that series, Codar. And we never talked again till seven years later

when I was invited to come play do Rambo too. You know? And he's very talented. It's a lot of fun. One-on-one? A lot of fun. You know, we had a good time together.

We hung out together in Acapulco doing the movie. And I'll tell you a really funny. Here's a quick, funny story. So about Three years ago, they're casting Rambo, the new one. And they asked me to read. So I call up sly.

I call up sly and I say, Sly, I've done this movie with you. I'm in the middle of doing Cobra Kai, a hit series. Why do I have to read? And he says, Mardi. Marty. Marty. Marty, I don't think you should have to read. I don't even think you know how to read.

I think you're like me. You don't read. We don't read. He says, and then he said, Marty, I haven't even finished Act 2 yet of this. I don't know what they're bothering you for. But don't worry about it. You know, I don't think you know how to read, so don't worry. You know, and I died.

I died. I think I kept that message, you know, on my outgoing message forever. because it was so funny Marty I don't think you know how to read you know I mean he's just that kind of guy he's so funny I walked on set I didn't I hadn't really met him and I had all these dots for CGI for Guardians too

and the first time I met him he looked at me he goes who are you supposed to be pippy long stocking that was and then we just started just laughing he was I had a blast I had him sign my Rambo lunchbox I've told this story, but he's like, you got to ramble lunchbox, how old do you? You got to read him to sign, you have a lunchbox, you're a grown man, how old do you?

I mean, it was just, he's like that. He's just like he loves to play with you. Yeah. Oh, sure. Of course, of course. What can we expect from Cobra Kai? Well, there's a lot of, you know, there's redemption and there's arc to the character. And the second five is very exciting, which is in November.

or the third five episodes will be in February. There's something for everybody there. Characters get wrapped up. And it's very exciting. It's really, we're number one in the world now, you know. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. It's exciting because they took, the writers were good.

And it all goes back to the writing. You know, when I went to them, I think it's season two or season three, and I had all my notes that I met with mercenaries, and I knew how I wanted to have them right the justification of why he's such a, you know, a tough guy. They had all my notes. They had everything that I put on yellow paper. That's respect.

A heads. A year and a half earlier. They said, we talked about this. We figured out, Marty. You want to do this, this, and this. And I said, yeah. And they said, we figured this out already. We figured it out last year.

they were so far ahead of the development of the characters that they knew exactly what you wanted to do a year and a half earlier. That's beautiful. That's rare, man. That's rare. They're like, yeah, whatever. We'll get to it.

And then they never get to it. Or they do some sort of something you're like, no, it's just not. But it's respect. That's what that is. That's respect. Absolutely. Or the show runners run off and go off and do another show. well the writers run off and do a showrunner and you know leave the show yeah i mean

three seasons of a show so many times the top writers split and they go and they go to play showrunner you you know and it's a drag because that's when a lot of shows go bad game of thrones final season the creators wanted to get out of there and you know it was like i think they half asked it but that's just my opinion do you how long do you think cobra kai can go and how long would you do it Well, this is the final season. Are you sure? Are you sure? By sure?

Well, I know they wrap up. I mean, there are some very emotional stuff that happens at the end, which I really can't talk about. But it's really the chronicest stuff that you and I love to act with, you know? And I'm pretty sure because the guys are going on to a different project. You know, my comic book, which is about a, you know, an old. gunfighter and a 12-year-old kid bonding and sharing moral fiber between them, I mean, my whole legacy is I really want to create some heroes for kids. And I don't think we have any heroes or kids have any heroes now. And I don't think Marvel are the heroes for the kids

because it's all special effects. I think we need some vulnerability and feelings for our heroes like you and I have with Eastwood or tough guys, even Brent, even Bronson or John Wayne, there was that vulnerability, there was a moral fiber, you know, and I think kids are missing that. And I'd like to

just leave, you know, you just get on one of my horses and sit on the rocking chair and read a novel and have a cigar and not worry about it anymore because I know I did it. Yeah. And I'm in the throes of trying to do it now. I love it. So I could leave,

that in the Western genre, because I think that's the heritage of American cinema is the Western, you know, from 1903 when they made the Great Train Robbery by Thomas Edison producing. You know, there was a reason why the American Western was the first genre we made films about. Right. And it's our heritage, and we deserve, the kids deserve to see what we saw and what we grew up. Yeah, no, I absolutely agree. You know what I can't wait for is this book i can't wait for the book it sounds like it's going to be pretty great like you dug up some good stuff i'll send you you'll be one of the first when they do this these things seem to take forever i mean i i i get knocked out talking to this guy for two hours oh yeah i mean and who

would think it'd get tired talking about yourself for two hours you would never think as an actor i know well hey this has been glorious i mean you're awesome it's funny because you know i've met you a few times but briefly and uh you know you always have a perception of like how they're going to be in an interview and you're so giving and up front and just you are who you are and what you see is what you get and you and i just love i love the relationship with your son and i i just see how important it is to you and your family and uh i appreciate you being here so thanks oh my pleasure this was fun it's always great to talk to It's like, you know, you ever go on the red carpet and the person hasn't done their homework?

Oh, yeah. They screw your name up. Right. They say you, excuse me, you are. Yep, I've had that. Who are you? And then they want me to just start talking because they don't know what the hell to ask me. Oh, nothing's worse.

And you're the exact opposite because you're an actor because you know what it's like. It's like actors who are directors. I think they make the best actors The actors make the best directors Because they know what it's like For guys like you and me To have a hack up there Who came out of editing

Or came out of being an ADD And don't know how to talk to us And get what they want Exactly 100% I love talking to actors I love talking to you today So we'll be in touch

Are you based in L.A? I'm in L.A. Yeah, so I think I'm going to go to Montana's thing Right before Labor Day So maybe we'll do some laughing. I'd love that. That'd be great. All right.

All right. Take care of yourself. Thank you. Tim's new scrambled egg loaded croissant. Or is it croissant? No matter how you say it, start your day with freshly cracked scrambled eggs loaded on a buttery, flaky croissant. Try it with maple brown butter today at Tim's,

at participating restaurants in Canada for limited time. What a treat. Sweetheart. An unexpected treat. plays a very scary villain. He does. Just got a soft, new giddy center. He's got a good outlook on life.

You know, you get something, go with it. You get a part, your typecast, whatever. He made the most of it. And he does what he loves. And you can tell he's got a great relationship with his son. I really love seeing that. So thank you, Martin, for coming on the podcast. Cobra Kai, man.

Cobra Kai. It's a show that just keeps on kicking, man. People love that show. Now it's time for the, well, You know what it is. It's time for our top tier patrons. These are the folks that really give a lot back and keep this podcast going. So we can't do it without you. And go to patreon.com slash inside of you.

If you want your name, shout it out every episode. You get boxes from me and letters. And there's so much more. And the community's amazing. You build friendships. So join patreon.com slash inside you. Let's do the names. Nancy D.

Leah and Kristen. Little Lisa, Yukiko, J. Jill E. Brian H. Nico P. Robert B. Jason W. Sophie M. Raj C. Jennifer and Stacey L. Jamal F. Janelle B. Mike E. L. Dun, Supremo, 99, Moore, Santiago M. Lian P. Maddie S. Belinda and Dave H. That you mean Dave Hall? Dave Hall. Dave Hall. Brad T. Ray H. Tap of the T. Tom and T. Tom and Talia M. Betsy D. Rian C. Corey K. Dev Nexon, Michelle A. Jeremy C. Mr. M. Eugene and Leah

Sweethearts the salty ham Mel S Eric H, Oracle, Amanda R William K. Kevin E. What's up Kevin? What's up Jore L and Jammin J and Leanne J? Luna R Mike F, Jules M Jessica B, Kiley J, Charlene A, Marion Louise L. Romeo the band, Frank B, Gen T, Nikki L R, oh boy, April RM.

Yes. I almost missed that one. Don't miss her. Randy S. Rachel D. Rachel. Jen, Carolina, girl. Oh, yeah. Nick W.

Stephanie and Evan. Or Stefan. Stephen. Charlene A. Don G. Jenny. Gen. Gen.

B. 76. Jennifer R. Tina E. N.G. Tracy. Keith B. Heather and Greg. And Ellie K. And Elizabeth L.

Ben B. Jamin. P.C. Sulton. Ingrid C. And Brandon C. We can't do the show without you. It means a lot to me that you give so much back to the show and you keep it going.

So let's see how long we can do this. I can't believe it's like six years or something, isn't it? So it's amazing. I thought this would last maybe a year and I'm still doing it. So if you want me to keep doing it, continue supporting the podcast and listening every week and spread the word. We love you from the Hollywood Hills in Hollywood, California. I am Michael Rosenbaum. I'm Brian Taylor.

We'll wave to the camera. We love you guys. Thanks for all the support. And always. Be good to yourself. We'll see you next week. Hi, I'm Joe Sal C. Hi, host of the Stacking Benjamin's podcast. Today, we're going to talk about what if you came across $50,000. What would you do? Put it into a tax-advantaged retirement account. The mortgage. That's what we do. Make a down payment on a home. Something nice.

Buying a vehicle. A separate bucket for this edition that we're adding. $50,000, I'll buy a new podcast. You'll buy new friends. And we're done. for playing everybody and we're out of here stacking benjamins follow and listen on your favorite platform