Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - Psych’s Maggie Lawson: Love Lost & Pressure to ‘Make It’

Episode Date: June 8, 2021

Maggie Lawson (Psych, Santa Clarita Diet) stops by this week’s podcast for an in-depth and emotional discussion about relationships, divorce as a child and adult, and the anxiety that comes with starting out in Hollywood. Maggie discusses her wild journey of moving from Kentucky to Los Angeles and becoming an actress. We also discuss the difficult process of ending a marriage, how much the cast and show of Psych meant to her, and her desire to just ‘want to be a kid’ early in her career. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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tables, or join a live dealer game to feel the thrill of real-time action, all from the comfort of your own devices. Why settle for less when you can go for the gold at Golden Nugget Online Casino. Gambling problem call connects Ontario 1866531-260. 19 and over, physically present in Ontario. Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. I hope you're having a great week, weekend. Whenever you're listening to this, I hope you're subscribed. And if this is your first episode, because you're a Maggie Lawson fan, which we all are,

I hope you'll subscribe and listen every week because we've got a lot of great guests coming up and I've had a lot of great guests. And we really get into it. We talk about life and anxiety and stress and work and just real stuff. We don't bullshit too much here. We have fun, but we don't bullshit too much. And I have a new segment. We have a new segment here in the show called How You Doing?

How you doing? It's a mental health segment. Just how you doing it? It's just how you freaking doing? How are you guys doing out there? Hey, I had a stressful week. Are you worried about something? Are you not being good to yourself?

What is it? Ryan, how are you doing? How am I doing? How you doing? We recorded a lot this week. So that was fun, but at the same time, I had to go home and do my other work. Right. So it has been a little bit stressful.

Right. That's true. But we do have weeks off where we don't do anything, really. We had a lot of weeks off. We did. I didn't do podcasts for a while because we had a lot, what they call it, in the can. In the can. But you're saying it was stressful.

All of a sudden, there's five. You're here every day. We're doing all these podcasts. You've got to get them uploaded. So it is stress. And it's stress for me, too, because I hadn't done them in a while. So I was like, oh, shit, do I still have it? it's like not acting in a while and then you just go can i still act and uh i found out that

that i could still do it i could still do it we had some really great interviews and uh i i've been a little stressed i've been you know worried about things and um but i try to you know and i and i think it to myself why are you feeling this way well you haven't really exercised this week oh go figure you're drinking you're eating like shit oh what it's so there's reasons behind everything And so for me, I'm just like trying to get back on track, trying to eat better, trying to stay off the sodas, staying off the Carvel ice cream sandwich flying saucers. Oh, my God, what are you, 10? Got to stay up the pot of the ice cream. That's a trick question, my friend.

But how are you doing, guys? I hope you're doing well out there. I hope you're hanging in there. I know we're seeing the light at the end of the tunnel here with the pandemic. And I hope you guys are being responsible and good to yourselves and loving yourself. So that's how you doing. So we just checked in with me and Ryan. check in with you. We're also going to check in

eventually with the guests, even though this was pre-recorded. So we can't do that. It's a new segment. If you want to subscribe to the podcast, it's easy. You just go to the, on YouTube, ryan. YouTube.com slash inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum. That's correct. And you can go on Apple, you can go on Spotify, Stitcher. What else? There's all sorts of things. Apple. Yeah. You can listen to the show. Watch it on YouTube.

I think you'll enjoy it if you're watching YouTube and spread the word. We really encourage you to spread the word. The handles on Instagram are at Inside of You podcast on Instagram and Facebook and at Inside You pod on the Twitter. You could also go to the merch store, the Inside of You online store, and you can get not only inside of you mugs, autograph mugs, hats, but you can get Smallville stuff. You can get a smallville lunchbox. I think I have some Funko Pop, Lex Luthor's left, some Lex Luthor pictures, just a bunch

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This guest, Maggie, is such a sweetheart. And I talked to her co-stars from Syke. And they adored her. So I always wanted to get her on the podcast. And she's not like me where she's just, is an open book. likes to kind of keep things close to the vest. So I get it. I understand it. But she did open up. She talked about a divorce. She talked about life. She talked about psych. She talked about a lot of things. And it was really interesting. And she's a very likable person. Wouldn't you say?

I would agree. I mean, I thought this girl's marriage material. That's what I was thinking. Sometimes my guess I'm like, wow, this girl's awesome. This woman is awesome. Not this girl. This woman is awesome. She is really, she's really great. What did you find most interesting about I mean, she's just super nice, and it was a nice way to open up about a lot of stuff. Yeah, I like when people open up. You know how I like that. Let's just get right into it. Let's get, oh, by the way, before we get into it, make sure you join Patreon.

Patreon.com slash inside of you. I'll write you a message. It's a great big family if you want to help the podcast. And otherwise, if you're really digging it and you want to give to the podcast, fine. If you just don't, that's fine too. But Patreon, P-A-T-R-E-O-N dot com slash inside of you. And let's get inside of Maggie Lawson. It's my point of view

You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum Inside of You Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience Okay first of all Maggie Lawson, Margaret Margaret, that is my Marge, Marge, Marge Margaret Cassidy Losses.

Did you say Marge? Have you ever heard Marge? Yeah, but I've never been called that. Do you remember in Pee's Big Adventure when he says, Tell him the Large Marge sent you? You never got that shit in high school? Never got that shit in high school. Thank God.

That would be terrible. No, no. I always said if like I became a doctor, a lawyer or something, I might go by like Dr. Margaret. But, um. Dr. Margaret Lawson. You know, I want to congratulate you. I've never done a pre-interview before.

and you're the first. Well, you know, sometimes, sometimes you've got to do a pre-interview. Yeah, sometimes you got to just. Look, I get, thank you, by the way, for doing that. Just because I get, I have, I get a lot of anxiety talking about myself. You can probably already sense it, so. Well, that's probably good in a way because you're not so self-involved, maybe. Is that true?

I don't know. I think I'm just painfully private. Really? really until today yeah yeah i mean i think i'm very social and i like being out i like you know i like being with people and i like sharing but i'm also um very very very very private were your folks private you know yes and no i mean i think i think in our family actually no when i think about it there was a lot of like very open talking very open feeling talking um so i'm not i'm not really sure where it comes from it's really interesting like i have it's something that has sort of

developed later um because when i was younger i was i was such a like i was doing musical theater i was singing i was dancing i was acting i was like you know i was pretty pretty out there but i as i got older i don't know i've i've been working on this it's like um it's like i'm really comfortable when I have lines and a character to play but I get really uncomfortable if I'm just not uncomfortable

it's probably not the right word but just I just get really anxious when I just have to sort of I think a lot of people get like that you said something a minute ago you said there was a lot of open feelings in your family what does that mean open feelings it was like I love you Margaret

I love you too mom what was that? No but I guess what I'm trying to say like there really wasn't like a moment or a thing you know I remember when I say open feelings. I just feel like all topics were sort of up for discussion. Like there was nothing off limits.

So my mom was always so, so great about that. Like she was such a, I could literally come home from school and ask her a question about anything. Sex? I could literally walk in the door and be like, hey, I heard this word orgasm today. What is that? And she would do her best to sort of scientifically explain what that is in a way. that I at nine years old or eight years old or whatever could understand how would she do it how would she put that I remember in health class we had health class in seventh grade and you

had to take it and I didn't know what was going on in fact I didn't get laid till many many moons later and I remember that my mom asked me something now my parents had a different way of raising their children they would humiliate them my my dad mom was like what did you learn in health it's like I know what's going on and they're like what do you mean I go sex and she's like, what about it? I'm like, a man and a woman, they have sex and the guy has an organism. And she goes, and she started laughing at me and I ran upstairs and she, then I heard her friend telling her friend's organism. He said, organism, isn't that the cutest? Oh, that's so, it was very private. It was very private in my family. Like, I never saw my dad.

I saw, I never saw my mom naked or my dad. I saw my mom's boobs by accident, but I never, you know, everything was private. It was really weird. One time I saw my dad's balls, and it was like it ruined me. And he got, that would be a bit, sorry. Well, he got upset. He was like, I was, you know, I remember we're sitting there watching TV. And I just turned. And he was wearing these little blue shorts because he went swimming.

And I go, and I just go, yeah. I go, dad, I think your ball is hanging out of your pants. He goes, what? You're a pig. Get out of here. Get out of the room. Go upstairs to your room. Like, well, I'm in trouble because your balls are hanging out of your shorts.

but that's what I remember so my family was different yeah yeah yeah but your family you could talk about orgasms you could talk about anything with your with your mother not so much your father well yeah I think my mom sort of took the lead on on most of that stuff um yeah for sure she was like it's interesting we weren't like a super affectionate um family like it wasn't in a way of like physical touch or a lot of i love yous or any of that but there was this like openness about what what like what could be put on the table and and up for discussion which I I have friends now who have kids and they'll call and they'll be like oh my god like he's asking me about sex or he's asking me I'm like just be I don't know if this is the right way but I know I greatly

appreciated it is like just be direct and as honest as you can be my mom I don't know she probably said you know it's a really excited feeling and something happens but it was never like talking down to or being condescending it was always like just on the level you can handle it trusting me with the information and so so it created like a that's what i think i mean in like the sort of sense of openness like my mom was so so good about like not being shocked at a question or something like great in a crisis wow now did she was she like very protective in high school like teaching you about sex and saying hey i don't want you having sex or was she like it wasn't a religious family they were more like open like they knew you were going to have sex use a condom sweetheart no it wasn't necessarily like that I have two brothers and it was it was a bit um I think she because I and by the time I was in high school my my parents were divorced and I think she really tried to protect me even more so than my brothers like they could get away with a lot more and yes I think more of the I

won't say it was it was more like expected like whether it was getting in trouble or like I was such a responsible mom like figure in high school really yeah like I was always

the designated driver or yeah and I was so for me what I wanted to like I'd already started acting I already kind of knew what I wanted to do so for me the idea of like possibly having something come up such as you know my mom was just great at putting all the

risks on the table around sex so it scared the shit out of me to the point where it's like I cannot mess this train I can't mess up this this this train I'm on right now so and that was all sort of like career driven driven even in high school so she knew exactly what to say to scare the living shit out of me into never doing that. She mentioned the hurt. So it wasn't really anything that was like a possibility. I know she would have been great if I, if something had happened or if I, you know, all that. But like, no, I think it was just sort of, that's, that's off limits. If I want to go do this, that can't, that risk can't be at play. So you were a good girl. You were the one that designated driver.

you were the were you a cheerleader in high school you're popular no i mean i was not a cheerleader new i was uh i was already doing plays and sort of uh you know it's really interesting i started i came out to la my sophomore year of high school what yeah so i it's so wild wait a minute wait a minute wait wait wait wait wait as a sophomore in high school i mean i didn't even start puberty to late like probably 14 or 15 years old i could i'm i'm so immature as a 48-year-old dude that if I go back to that I it was a timing thing I I think everything kind of fit like I didn't I didn't become really successful till you know I was in my mid-20s which was even early for for me I was very immature so I can't imagine being a sophomore in high

school coming out from Louisville Kentucky and starting an acting career did you did you so your parents both approved of your acting and your mom took you out yeah it's such a wild story tell me the wildest story um the wildest story well you know it went back years actually so when i was like i think i was 12 do you remember showcases do you remember the showcases that used to happen yeah there was one that happened in louisville and i went and i met these showcases were these weird things I think you paid to go to, and there would be, like, agents from Hollywood, maybe casting directors, producers, or whatever. So you got this opportunity to go to this seminar and learn about L.A. and Hollywood, and maybe read

a scene, and they'd give you feedback on whether or not you, like, have it. So I'm 12. I don't know any better. I've been doing plays for a few years, and I did this. I hosted a little show, but we'll get into that. That's another thing. But I hosted this little show on a Fox station and Kentucky. And everybody was like, oh, you should go to this seminar and see what they say, you know, or whatever.

If there's a chance to become a star. So I go to the seminar. I read the scenes. I'm 12 years old. I'm like, okay, this is fine. And I get like a lot of feedback from these people, because this guy gives me his card. I'll get to him in a second. I don't think anything of it.

My mom and I, we like, we have this discussion. Now, keep in mind, we don't have, like, money. This is not a situation where it was like, sure, we can go to New York and see about a career. That's actually the first place we went, but, or L.A. This was like, it felt impossible, but these things kind of popped up that made us talk about it. So I get this card.

I have this real. with my mom and dad and it's like, no, man, I'm a kid and I want to be a kid and I don't want to do that. And I like my life here in Kentucky and I like my plays and what I'm doing. And so we just dropped it. And a couple of years later, I'm doing a play. And the director of the play was this guy John Huffman, uh, who had done a lot of work in L.A. Like I knew he went back and forth and he had a lot of like connections. It's great, great director. and was a great friend. And I tell him this story about this showcase

I went to a few years prior. And I tell him about this guy who gave me his card. And I'm like, he's like, do you know, I said it was an agent. And he's like, do you know who the agent was? And I said, yeah, I think. And I get the card. I'll never forget.

My mom kept the card for years in her metallic gold cigarette holder. And it was like, it had this like clear little thing on it. And it always, I don't know why. She just kept it for safekeeping. I don't know why we even kept this card. Probably because at that point, it was a moment where my daughter's talented and this agent gave her his card. And it was a moment.

She didn't know that you'd be as successful as you were. So maybe she kept it around. It was one of the first mementos or whatever. So John says, John looks at the card and he's like, do you know who this is? I'm like, no. And he's like, this is like one of the biggest agents, this guy, Jeff Witches, who still, I believe, is an agent at William Morris. And he loses his mind.

I have no idea what any of this means. And he's like, you should call him. He's like, you should call him. If an agent from William Morris gives you his card, you should call. And so I make this phone call one day. Now I think I'm 14, 15. Oh, boy. And this woman at William Morris picks up.

And, you know, I say, can I please have Jeff, which is office? And somehow I'd get through to him. And I tell him the story. I'm like, hi, my name's Maggie Lawson. You gave me your card three years ago at a showcase in Louisville, Kentucky, and said if I ever came to L.A. to call you, you'd take a meeting with me. And he was like, okay, well, if I said I'd take a meeting, I'll take a meeting. When are you coming?

And that sort of put the wheels in motion for, I didn't realize that was just a meeting. meeting. I didn't know what any of it meant. I just knew I had a lot of people around me telling me this was a really big deal. And so I was like, oh, I guess we should take this seriously. So we start making the plans to come out here. And while we were doing it, this is just a side part of this story that's very, very funny. My little brother reads this article about they're doing a Clueless TV series, and they were looking for at least a Silverstone lookalikes. Well, you, there's a... And my brother's like, Maggie, you got to go.

Like, you're going to get this. You got to go. So I know, I know we now have in our heads that I have to get to L.A. Or at least get myself somehow auditioning for this series, because we just didn't know any better. And I have this meeting, if I want it, with this guy at William Morris. And I took, it was, I believe, my sophomore year's spring break, every single penny we had. And my mom and I came out and I met him and I met a guy in an elevator. I'll never forget it.

And now I'm forgetting his name, but he said he was a manager. I was with my mom. Probably, probably creepy. But he put me in touch with this woman, Rode. Diamond, who is an agent here, and I call Roe Diamond off this guy's, this guy had already called her and said, this girl's going to call you. I think you should meet her. It was so bizarre, Michael, how these, all these things sort of happened. Wow. I meet Roe, and she's like, I can't, well, first, I have my meeting with Jeff Witches, who is so sweet, but he's also

just like, you're so green. I'm not going to take you on. Come back to me in a few years. Did you mention the Clueless series to him? Of course I did. Which, by the the way, it was already cast. Oh, that wasn't even a possibility anywhere. Yeah, I'm coming into these rooms like, hi, hi, I hear they're holding auditions. Where can I get my audition for this clueless TV

series? Anyway, I meet with Roe, who's a smaller agency. She sends me to read for a friend of hers, Fran Baskam, who is the casting director of Days of Our Lives who has since passed. This woman calls Roe and says, you know, the scenes went well,

whatever. And Roe's like, I'll represent you if you want to come out. And Roe was my agent for 10 years. She actually got me a holding deal at Warner Brothers when they gave those out. Yeah. They used to hand them out, give you some money and put you on hold. Yeah. It was like 30.

I mean, I don't know if you can say it was like 30 grand. Which, by the way, just to give you a clue of where my family was, that was double what my parents made in a year. 30 grand. So we were literally losing our money. like what is happening anyway so with the holding deal they put me in a show in a pilot and meanwhile I'm going back and forth between Louisville and can in uh in L.A and trying to do school work or whatever anyway and I do this pilot that they told me was sold for 13 on the air so my family makes this huge decision to to come to Los Angeles only to have us learn when we got here they decided to not go

forward with the show. So now we're in LA. You moved out to L.A. to do a show that got canceled before you started filming it. Yeah, pretty much. I mean, there were other things that play. Like, luckily, during that time, I got to do, during the back and fourth time, I would, so while I was in L.A., I would read for other things. And I got to do, like, a guest spot on something here or there. I ended up doing this movie Pleasantville, which was, like, such. an insane experience for like three months. That was a big movie. Yeah. It was crazy. It was wild.

Like I had no, I had, it was such, it's so wild. I think back on the story now. Anyway, yeah, we literally packed up a, um, we packed up a Woody station wagon that was not even ours. It was my grandparents. We didn't own a car. And my brother and my mom and I drove to L.A. Anyway, that's how we got here. Inside of you is brought to you by Rocket Money. I'm going to speak to you about something that's going to help you save money, period. It's Rocket Money.

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forget and now we owe $200 by the end of the year yeah they're there to make sure those things don't happen and they will save you money you know rocket rocket money's five million members have saved a total of $500 million in canceled subscriptions with members saving up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features. Get alerts if your bills increase in price, if there's unusual activity in your accounts, if you're close to going over budget, and even when you're doing a good job. How doesn't everybody have Rocket Money? It's insane.

Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter my show name inside of your. with Michael Rosenbaum in the survey so they know that I sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from my show. Were you a star now in Louisville to the people in your high school, to people around? You're like, she's in L.A. She's got a show.

Did you embellish it? Come on. No, I don't think so. There was this part of me that was almost like a little shy about it. Like I wanted to just go home. Like I would go back and forth. I mean, through my senior year, I got to graduate with my senior class in Louisville by doing correspondence.

And so when I went home, I wanted to just be like I almost didn't want to talk about that all the time, even though it was the topic. It was like, no, I just want to go to the game or, you know, see my, see my boyfriend or, you know, whatever. So it was weird. I was really, really shy about it at first. So the show doesn't get picked up. and you decide, which is crazy, you decide to stay.

We did, yeah, yeah. My brother was already in, my younger brother was in high school, and he found a school out here. And, and, wait, your whole family moved from Louisville for you to Los Angeles. Pretty much. What? What? How much?

I mean, to me, that. It was a family decision. That's a lot of pressure, though. That's a lot of pressure. If you don't succeed, dad doesn't have the $30,000 job. 15,000. No, there was no safety net. There was no safety net. Oh, my God, they went all out for you. That is love, sweetie. It was a lot. It was a lot. It was a lot on us. It was a lot of really, I remember the conversations being like so, yeah, it was a lot of love. But, and also, I think,

in a way, I think all of us were looking toward a better, life just and I don't even want to say that it was so bad in Louisville it was just that there was this opportunity there was an excitement yeah and we had struggled a lot and we'd been through a lot at that point as just as a family and my mom working you know three jobs just to keep us in our house and you know we were on and off food stamps for a bit like it was it was just it was a time and so there was this you know um yeah well what did your dad do my parents were divorced at that point and he stayed in louisville he stayed in louisville yeah oh man yeah so that was the other thing that you know we were all it was it was it is just so wild to think about all of that now

and how many people helped us along the way and how many like i think about row now i think about this holding deal from Warner Brothers now, I think about just everything that aligned for all of us to be here. It was, it was, um, it's really nuts. Kind of a miracle. I mean, the chances of survival in this sound like we're going to the Arctic. The chances of survival here in Hollywood. It is like going into the Arctic. Also, my mom was like a single mom. She was like, you know, I think I'm 40. I turned 40. You look, by the way, not hitting on you. I'm just saying you look fantastic i would have thought 32 oh michael no you look great is that now is that really good lighting because you you do look great oh god thank you so much i feel i feel great

that's good but was it a divorce hard for you as a kid yeah divorce is divorce is awful yeah i don't divorce is awful yeah i went through it too i went through divorce uh in fact i've been through, let's see, my sister has been divorced four times. My dad's divorced twice. My mom's divorced. Anyway, I, you know, I get that. But how old were you when they, when they split up? 12. Well, that's got to be incredibly hard. Yeah, it was, it was. I, it's really, really hard. Divorce is just really hard. I went through myself a few years ago and I

I think as a kid there was a sort of pressure that maybe you want to be I know for me I kind of wanted to be everything to both of them. I wanted to help them that was my feeling was like oh I want to help you heal and I want to help you heal and I want to help you heal

and I want to like everybody's hurting and this yeah it's just a it's just a really complicated hard thing to go through and and but also I think sometimes for the best as hard as it is it's it's not necessarily the unhappy ending um always do you see signs as a 12 year old because I saw signs when I was a kid and I was like these people should not be together I knew that my parents shouldn't be together. So it didn't shock me, would shock me as they were together as long as they were. So was you shocking or was it dysfunctional? Not shocking at all.

I remember, I think I remember sort of thinking, like, I was surprised it hadn't happened yet. But I think there was, like, I remember they separated once when I was about eight. And I was so devastated that I don't have a time. of memory from it. I just remember like my brain exploded. And I remember just being so overwhelmed at that thought. And I actually think my reaction is one of the reasons that they were like, okay, we need to, uh, we need to maybe, we need to smooth this over for now. You are so devastated that your parents probably got back together. That was probably the reason. I was probably the reason that they were unhappy for four more years. My God. Yeah.

I mean, that's tough, but they both supported your endeavors. They both supported you going out to Los Angeles. Yeah, I think, for the most part. They were both always, I mean, I always felt that support. I mean, I did plays from the time I was eight years old. And that was always the one thing. And I'm so grateful, I look back on it now. I just think about it.

It's so wild when I think about. my mom being my age and having like teenage kids and making a decision to go to Hollywood with them I it's so wild but um yeah there was this feeling that even in everything my family went through in the struggles that we had that we we could still do anything like dream big um and and and so I for that I'm just incredibly grateful like nothing was off limits that's it's sort of that same thing Yeah, do they talk still? Were they friends?

Did they, do they talk? No. Nothing. Yeah, mine don't either. In fact, I always have this fear at my wedding. I'd have to have two different weddings because it'd be so uncomfortable to have them both in the same room. And I really have, I've, my therapist is like, why are you talking? You're not even in a committed relationship, let alone married and you're fucking worried about your wedding and your parents being there.

This is anxiety out the ass. I was about to say, Michael. I know. That's not level anxiety. I have it too, though. I think about things like that all the time. And it's like, oh, my God, wait, this isn't even a real scenario. I don't, yeah.

Do people think, because I think, you, when I get married, it's going to be forever. And I'm not going to meet someone that I'm not going to be in love with. And then I'm, is this how you felt? Obviously, you got divorced. But, like, most people do get divorced. A lot of people, it's not like the 40s where everybody stays together because society says you should. Did you feel like this is forever? this is that how you feel when you get married yeah it's amazing how things just turn turn can turn

around so quickly though yeah yeah it is that's and how do you how do you do that what do you what is it certain things you just see as you go and you go wow I was wrong this isn't wasn't as right maybe I had blinders on whatever it is what is it I don't I I I kind of wish I knew I guess maybe there are, in hindsight, always, I think we can connect some dots that maybe we didn't want to. And I'm not just speaking about in marriage. I would enter any relationship hoping that it's forever. So it's not even just in the marriage, it's sort of, and I think that is probably just, a part of, you know, we, our situation happened very fast.

But I think in the getting to know process that, you know, we all have, I don't know, I think we discover, you peel back layers and we show our, you know, all of our sides, I guess. And I don't know, I think you just have to hope that wherever that person is on their journey, and the tools they have in their toolbox, you know, that you can sync up with where you are in your journey and the tools you have in your toolbox. Yeah. Because it's not necessarily anybody's, I don't know,

it's sort of, I don't know if that totally makes sense. But like, we are just sort of where we are, and we just keep growing. And I think in the growth, maybe that's where it can get a little tricky. This is very educational for me. Because, you know, I always think about, oh, well, I ever get married. And then, you know, then I see, I jump ahead. I'm like, well, I got to, you know, if someone isn't, you know, if I marry someone who doesn't

have anything, which is fine, I usually, I've dated a lot of women who either don't have it together or have it together. It's not one of us has it together. I never have it together. But financially, you might say, you know, how do you ask for a pre-nup? And then I think, here's how I would do it. I would say to the person, I think we should sign a pre-up. pre-nep. What do you mean? So you're, no, this is because it's not that I'm worried about me

falling out of love with you, but what if you fall out of love with me? And that's more likely to happen. That's funny. I mean, but I, look, I also think at this point, I mean, we're not babies. We're not like, you know, so I, I, and we've both, wait, so you've been divorced. No, no, I haven't. I haven't been married or anything. Oh, so you do have a lot of anxiety. I do. My foot's shaking as I talk about this. I just think, you know, there are realistic and honest conversations that sometimes

are not so romantic, but yeah, that needs to be had. And I see what I understand what you're saying. It's sort of like not putting some weird stamp on the way you think things are going to go. But it's kind of like, I don't know, wanting to. wanting to, I don't know, wanting to protect yourself, remove, I guess it would be removing some anxiety. It's sort of like we do these things, right? We all to protect ourselves to do, to make us feel safe. Yeah. And it really has not a lot to do. I mean, sometimes it does maybe with the other person, but I feel like sometimes it doesn't, it mostly doesn't actually have to do with the other

person, anything they've done or whatever. It's sort of our, our. Well, think about this. I've worked my whole life for what I have. Now, for whatever that is, I don't think it's really asking that much for someone to say, hey, if this doesn't work out, which a lot of marriages don't work out. So if it doesn't, I don't want to lose everything that I've worked so hard for my whole life because you've decided to go cheat or you've decided to go, you fell out of love with me, or my farts are just enough for you. It's so awful. It's so heartbreaking. But it's, but I understand what you're saying, and it's true. I don't know how you grew up, but like, I'm, I'm with you.

I didn't grow up with a safety net. I didn't grow up with some, there's some trust fund or some other thing back there that I can lean on or whatever that, you know, it's just me and what I provide for myself. And the threat of losing that is, is, is, is, that's, that's a lot, that's everything in a lot of ways. Like it's sort of my, I'm not saying on a material level, but just on this sort of emotional, you know, you've worked your whole life. Yeah. And you've built a certain life for yourself. And I, so I understand that feeling. Was your mom the first person you went to when you were like, it's over?

Oh, I think so. No, actually, I don't think so. I think I went to my friends. And I have like, these like friends were like sisters. My friend Brooke and Rebecca, I think I told first. And I remember I saw, oh, no, I take that back. The first person I told was my brother, was my little brother. And how did he respond?

Also a great person in a crisis. Very, very, very calm and protective. It's funny. He's my younger brother, but I think he's always had a bit more of the like older brother protective thing. We're 13 months apart. We were raised basically like twins. So, yeah, he was my first phone call. I remember. You know, marriage feels like it's something that no matter whose fault it was or whatever, it's you probably feel like a bit of a failure, right? Totally. And it's like, how do you deal with that? Like, how do you bounce back? I mean, you're resilient. I don't know. I think. I don't know. I think everybody's again on have their own experiences in our own journey. I think for me it made me look at myself like hard and be like I had to I've I've had a lot of I've been very um what should I say like tiptoe or timid I feel like I have been very careful and and maybe a bit more like take your time check in with you make sure you're not missing anything like in entering

into other relationships or whatever since it just made me really look at myself um you know it's interesting I was in a relationship pretty much from the time I was about 22 until the time I was 36 it was like I had this one relationship in my early 20s I had a long relationship with for a day who you know and then i went into this relationship that i got married um so the last you know five years four years um have have actually been the first like time that i think i've really been just with me wow how great is that that's a blessing that it in a way that it happened you're you're young you're still very young i mean you have at least 60 years left you'll live to a a hundred queen elizabeth is but like honestly aren't you don't you feel like in a way you're

like hey i'm glad this happened now so i could find my forever you know or or maybe if there is it forever but you you took the time all that pain and all that hurt and all those things of the introspectiveness is that the right word i like the word i like it interest goodness that's i think it's a word um but that probably was unbelievably healthy it wasn't in the in the moment it happened and all this shit was going on but after you got through it you probably thought oh my god this was really fucking great for me yeah yeah for sure um i don't think i ever really stopped i've i worked or and and between working and between being and uh relationships uh for my whole life uh it was a time to focus on me which i think is

in a way was what I was being called to do anyway. So, yeah, it was, I hope, for every party involved, it's good. And that there is some sort of, you know, this was a learning experience. I see why this had to happen or I, you know, whatever. I wish all of it well and everything. But I have been really grateful to have this time over the last few years. And honestly, in this pandemic, which is probably very weird to say, because it's been such a horrible time to sort of pause. Yeah.

And maybe it's good stuff that I. Enlightening. Enlightening. It's tough to be alone. It's tough to be. I mean, you're someone who's been in relationships most of your life. And, you know, I've been single a long time. been in relationships but the pandemic as much as you know it's been terrible for so many so many

people and so really bad obviously i say that earnestly but you know for me it's really been a time like oh tom and denean can't come over and hang out with me oh rob you know so it's just it's a it's a tough time but like being alone has helped me uh deal with my anxiety deal with a lot of these things that have been weighing on me for a long time and um so it's it's been good in a bad, a bad in a good way and good and a bad way. I have had the exact same experience. I mean, having to really maybe deal with some things that I have just been, I've been working and I don't need to deal with that and I don't need to do with that.

And it's just you kind of, I feel like I went into like a forced like, oh, yeah, okay, we got to look at some stuff now and deal with it. Do you clean out a storage unit I had for 15 years and years and years? why did you keep a storage facility you're probably paying 200 bucks a month for that thing really that's a lot you're spending a lot of money on storage why i mean in most of that shit you probably forgot about am i right yeah i think most of that shit i didn't just didn't want to deal with or look at it was like 15 years of life i mean the storage unit was like the size of a small apartment in new york it was crazy oh my god and i have i've i've been living

in a building uh for the last you know for the last few years or had been um And when lockdown happened, it felt crazy. It's a really fun building, but it was just not safe. And I'm completely paranoid. And I was like, all right, so I Airbnb for a bit. I've moved like four times during this last year. But this isn't my house. And someone else's house I'm renting.

But yeah, I was like, why do I still have this thing? And I hired this like really safe company to kind of help me go through it. but it was, it was kind of, that was like a symbolic, I feel like. I was like, okay, I just, I've had a lot of shit in here. I've had a lot of shit. Away with the old. Away with the old. On with the new.

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this you've all and maybe that's sort of like you know what I gather I'm not a therapist and boy I need one more than ever but I have one he's great she's great I have two um but do you think maybe your whole life that you've almost been that maternal figure in a lot of ways to so many different people and been the strength that no one's really been the strength for you and you've never really collapsed into someone's arms and really been vulnerable in a way that you know because I feel like in a lot of ways I'm always helping everybody else and then it's me who's kind of like drained it's me who's kind of like you know hurting at times and I'm like fuck man everybody thinks I'm just happy as a clam all the time and I'm the light of the party and

whatever and do you get like that do you feel like that yeah I you talk about like smiling happy like life of the party i think uh i think that that is something i know for me over time that i feel has become like there's this expectation that i show up that way which at this point in my life i'm sure as i was younger or whatever i just got a lot of positive feedback for being happy and smiley and nice to everybody and you know pleasy or whatever but you know now I'm really really working I'm trying to like to drop that because I think what I'm realizing as I get older yes that feeling of sort of wanting to be strong and be there for for other people so I keep it together I still have that like maybe there this responsibility feeling almost of like I can be the safety net that we didn't have I can be the but we're all adults it's that's a lot of that is like left over and i can drop it it's just sort of me getting used to not thinking that way um but it's really hard for me because i feel

an expectation or maybe i've made it up in my head that i i come off a certain way i i need to be a certain way to maybe be uh accepted or whatever that's just the way that's just the way I'm expected to show up that it almost sometimes is like unless I can show up that way I'm not going instead of just showing up where I am um so that's my shit that I have to that I have to drop because nobody's asking that of me right and the people of my life you know now but I think it's part of the reason like I have a ton of social media anxiety I have a lot it just like even I talked about sharing sharing my life or talking it's and i think a lot of it kind of comes from that um yeah i asked james rhoda i text dulae and rhoda that rhymed dulae and rhoda so i just said hey anything i should

say to maggie i'm interviewing her she goes no just have fun she probably won't get too deep or personal not really her jam but she's awesome yeah so that's what you just said so he knows you and then dulae says just seeing this tell her i love her i miss her and i can't wait for us to all suck it again. Wow. So there was that. Yeah, I, uh, I, uh, I was, I think he was talking about the acting thing. Let's just suck it again. Let's rock this shit. We say that it's a thing on side. Oh, it is? Fuck it. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I should know that. Suck it again. But, uh, yeah, they knows me really well. Sorry, was that me looking like I, I, I don't talk or something. No, do it again. Say the suck it line. I'm not doing it again. Suck it. No, that was, no, that was

just a a that was an off the cuff one-time thing that i cannot i love that it's so cute though i got oh yeah no but your anxiety love that rhoda said that wait did you reach out to tim tim would have omensen i should have done that tim it was a magnificent guy and uh boy did you listen to another podcast with us it was really if you guys haven't listened to timothy omensen uh just an amazing man amazing story amazing actor you should go back and listen to that he talks about how he had a stroke and talk about how he's a very brave man but also just really let go and was so pure and honest and it was beautiful it really was yeah that was really good do you you were so great with him oh well you know what he was it's it's it's easy when people like yourself it's just it's you're

easy to talk to it's we learn a lot from this i i i'm very interested in this like you're very good at it well i mean thank you i i love doing it so uh i appreciate that so thank you maggie um What do you do? Do you deal with anxiety? How do you deal with anxiety? And what kind of anxiety do you get? What gives you anxiety? Oh, everything. This podcast. This podcast gave you anxiety. Totally. I turned down podcast. Just so you know, I don't do them. I've had people reach out. Like, I, it is a big deal. And so I, I get very nervous about it. So I sometimes, but I wanted to do this. And you, you know, I've known you for, I haven't seen you in a long, long, long, long time, but I've known you for so long, and I've listened to your podcast. And, you know, this was to be honest with you, a little bit of a, like, just do it, Maggie, step into it, Maggie, you can, you can do this.

I'm so glad you did. Just so you know, it is really hard for me to, to talk about myself or to sort of reveal these things. But, yeah, I, um, how do I deal with anxiety? You know, I think this pandemic has really helped me. I paint. I'm actually in my, I paint. So, so, but you mean like just, like, I don't take anything. I haven't done.

I haven't gone. Good for you. Painting gets you, it's an escape for you. I mean, a complete and total escape. I have, years ago, a friend of mine came to stay with me for like a few days. And as her, like, parting gift when she left, she left me the set of like acrylic paints and some brushes. in a canvas and I haven't stopped like I just love painting but I don't share it it's just for me it's something I kind of do for love I'm getting a little better at it now but see that's great that you do

that I was having art nights at my house because the worst thing in the world I'm I'm the worst at art there's no question about it I can't draw I can't paint I can't and so I said then this is my therapist like this is perfect for you it's so you don't have to be great you go in not knowing you're not going to be great and you just enjoy it and let go. That sounds so fun to me. I'll invite you when this thing's over. I love it. I'm, yeah, I'm getting, I'm getting more comfortable sort of sharing it, but it really was

like a really private. It was almost like writing in a journal for me, just my, but it became that. And I also started taking, like, voice lessons. Singing? Yeah, I sing. I sing my whole life. This is another one of those things, like stage fright. things that happened to me later in life. So it's something I do myself. I play a little

guitar. I play a sing. But I have really kept it to myself. I know. You're in a band. Yeah, we got a jam. We got a paint. And the thing about these voice lessons has been really interesting. It's almost been therapeutic beyond just like getting me singing again. It's sort of, he always says, you know, you're, you're not open. Like we're trying to open your voice. We're trying to get your voice back. So I have been taking these like voice lessons and I've been painting and a lot of this has really really helped to uh i don't know maybe it's just a feeling that you're working on something or i'm i don't know but it has helped me sort of channel a lot of that anxiety that i have well i love this i love this are you is that a painting behind you that

you did oh this is not mine this is a painting bob dillon did okay i was like actually a gift from roday let me see it let me see it is it right behind you can i bring Should I bring it? Yeah, bring it over. Let's see. This is a gift from James Rodei Rodriguez, correct? Let's see if I can get it now. Oh, shit, no, she's going to break something.

Oh, my God, look, look behind you. That almost fell. What's it? That white thing. It's fine. It's paint. Bob Dylan painted that. You can't see it.

Yeah, I can. I see it right now. Here. I want to, yeah, there you go. I see it perfectly. Yeah, it's a sidewalk cafe in New York. That's great. And when I bought, I bought this house years ago,

but a house I lived in years ago and I fell in love with this painting. I saw it in London and yeah, I didn't buy it, but I had told Rode about it and then it arrived. Did you cry? Yeah. That's a nice. See, that's, yeah, that's sweet. A good gift. Good gift.

I mean, so when you're on set, do you ever get anxiety with like lines and things like that and like I have to be good or you get, you know, or. that's something you've been doing for so long that it probably doesn't affect you like that's your world it depends I mean it obviously depends on the scene but no I feel like I that is where I kind of my anxiety leaves a little bit it's weird that feels like

I don't know like comfort or something work I mean obviously depending on the scene or what we're getting into but like yeah I I love working so much that that just it's it's a it's almost like a comfort zone wow yeah i think i've always with work and everything i associated with anxiety i have to be anxious i have to be so disciplined i have to be great that it's just like it drives me crazy to the point where i and i work so hard that that's what happens so i really would like to um eventually let that go more and just try to enjoy it more like i'm trying to enjoy like i like enjoying these podcasts like being able to put

these headphones on and just talk to someone and enjoy it and not think about oh and all these other external things that i can't control it's always about things you can't control that give you anxiety right absolutely yeah you're you're this is this is great you're very good at this are you saying i should quit acting you know no you're a great actor as well what are you saying You've worked forever. Well, I don't know about that. This is called shit-talking with Maggie Lawson. This is from my patron.

You can join Patreon at patreon.com slash inside. It's a wonderful family. Leanne wants to ask you, this is, how did you begin your work in animal advocacy? How did I begin it? I met Jude. Well, my gosh, it goes back to when I was 16. I volunteered at the Humane Society, even as a kid. But I met Jude, my partner in my foundation in 2014.

We both shared this dream of how. having a sort of animal, I guess a rescue, a bit more animal healing, animal therapy. And we had so many things anyway. And we just did it. We just started doing it. I mean, there's a lot more to that story of how it sort of came to be what it is now. But yeah, that's how it's feel. You could find that on Margaret's blog on Wednesdays.

No, it's not true. Jason B. Was Syke really as fun to shoot as it seems from the outtakes and behind the scene stories? Really. And more. It was that fun and more. It was the best, the greatest experience. We had so much fun on and off screen.

We partied. We played. We love each other. It is good. We're not overstating how wonderful of it an experience is. Wow. We couldn't possibly put into words. How wonderful.

I could never say that about anything I've done. Although I've loved everything and it's been amazing. What you just said is like an anomaly to just absolutely. oh my god it's like we're all like love me i mean that's seldom that's seldom jane oh what was the most useful thing you learned while working on psych oh gosh uh oh my gosh useful thing probably um for what i do uh it would be uh learning lines quickly or um that's a really tough question i learned to run on heels But yeah, I would say it's sort of thinking on the fly. Rode was always improvving.

There was always like line changes that were happening quickly. So I think it just kept us on our toes. And yeah, I can memorize and absorb faster because of it. Wow. That's not the greatest. Actually, that is because that's. That's pretty useful. The fact that, you know, that's very useful.

When you're always on your toes and things are always, changing. That would drive me crazy that things are changing so much. I like to improvise in things, but I don't know. I don't know. When you're on a set like that, it seems like it warrants that whole, that whole feel. Like it just makes sense. It just is a fun, let's try this. Let's try that. But Lisa H. What was it like acting with Jason Priestley on True Calling? Your episode was definitely a little different than others. Such a great concept for a show. It was actually a really great concept for a show. I love Jason Priestley. I haven't seen him in so long. Oh, man, I have known him from, yeah, it was like true calling, then I run into him places. Then he did psych. And we still

like through social media have like supported each other or whatever. But I loved it. It was a, it was, I didn't do. I feel like that was one of the only dramas like I had done at that point in my career. There weren't that many. And he was so great. So, so, so, so, so great. I just love he was a hoop we got we got a long break josh a what was your experience working with ashton cutcher on two and a half men and then again on the ranch awesome ashton was uh was so great so great um he is like super professional um but also like he was so fun and so welcoming and i felt i don't know i i there was a there was a there was a there was a that was a crew like that was a bit of a crew. And I, um, I felt very welcomed into it. It was really, really nice. Bob Kay, what superhero role

would you enjoy taking on? Super, superwoman. Superwoman? Supergirl. But there should be. Wonder Wonder Woman. Why can't there be superwoman? Why I just went to superwoman? Who's superwoman? Isn't it degrading though? Why, what? You think in this time, it's supergirl? Why can't it be superwoman now? They've never had a superwoman. I think that's what was happening. No, Wonder Woman. But the hell um yeah superwoman do is it tough because i've had this happen to me and i ask when series like outmatch with jason bigs when it gets canceled were you guys really disappointed did that bother you or it is a heartbreak that i it's weird i've had shows get canceled and it's like hey i could see that coming or or we were done um this i i i'm still not over it in fact jason and i

We're just texting yesterday. It's, it was, it was such a, it had the same feeling of, like, the way I think Syke felt in the beginning of like lightning striking and everything worked. So it was like, okay, this is the first time I've had that feeling again of like every single thing here works. I love him. Do you know, Jason? I've met him a couple times.

He's really sweet. I just love him so much. I loved everybody on the show so much. And, yeah, that was a, that was a, uh, uh, uh, news we got, you guess like last May. Yeah. That was very shocking. That was not what we expected to hear. So we, I'm, I'm, I'm still still still still, still, still healing from.

Yeah. Um, you were on Smallville. I was a long, long time ago. Yeah, we didn't have any scenes. No, we didn't have any scenes. What episode was it? Do you remember? No.

I just remember. remember my character, I would kiss boys and through kissing them, the youth out of them so that I could stay young and they would age and die. And yeah, so it was great, great character. You worked with Tom, right? Yeah, I worked with Tom. I had such a good time on that. I had such a good time. I had to do this whole prosthetic thing because I had to age. In the end, I had to age and die. And I'm claustrophobic. That was one of my first experiences with something like that. It was, it was really, really, really intense. I remember that. It was just, it was so fun, though. That show was fun. Yeah, it was. It was a long show. We had a long run. It was a good run.

Long good run. Maggie, this has been awesome. I really, I cherish this time I had with you. And I hope we keep in touch. Yes, we will. We absolutely will. Your art parties. Yes, art parties. And I wish you the very best. And where can people find you on social? Oh, I'm my Instagram that I'm trying to get better at using. Mags Laws Lawson. And my Twitter is my name. All right, Maggie Lawson. That's it. That's all I have. Is that what I? Yeah. Follow her. She's incredible. I know you've probably seen psych if you haven't even seen the show. Plus, she's done tons of other shit. Pleasantville, smallville. This has been great. Thank you. I love you and I'll talk to you soon.

This is honestly been great. Great. Thank you. All right. Okay. Bye. I really enjoy that episode. I enjoy the episodes because I don't listen to them.

I could do whatever I went with them. You can do whatever you want with them. It's what you're telling me. Right. But then, you know, on the days that were recording, I listen to some stuff. And again, like I said, said in the beginning, just a likable person and she really opened up. So if you guys really like the podcast, I encourage you to subscribe. Again, you go to YouTube and type in Inside of you

with Michael Rosenbaum and subscribe to the podcast. That would be great. And also, the handles are at Inside You podcast on Instagram and Facebook at Inside of You pod on the Twitter. I'm on Instagram, the Michael Rosenbaum. You can get great stuff at the Inside of You merch store, like I said. Just go to the inside of you online store or the Sunspin where you can get my band stuff. You can get the CD signed. We got vinals coming, t-shirts, hats, lunch boxes, a bunch of great stuff. And thank you, everybody, for coming to the last stage it to watch my band. I really appreciate that.

I love playing music for you guys. And I love doing this podcast. So thank you, Cumulus. Thank you, Ryan. Thank you, Bryce. It's been a real treat. And my patrons, those patrons who give back to the podcast, they don't even need to. just subscribing is enough, but they give a little more by going to patreon.com slash

inside of you becoming a patron and there's all sorts of tears and behind the scenes and Q&As and you get to ask me questions and the guest questions and you get merch and it's a lot of fun. So thank you for that. Right now we're going to get right into it and we're going to shout the names out, Ryan. Let's do it. Let's shout the names out to all the top patrons. These are the top patrons that give the most and they are very loved. And very, I'm very appreciative of them, Ryan. Let's see if Ryan remembers any of these. Nancy.

D. Mary. B. Leah. F. Tricia. What? F. Sarah. S. V. L. L. L. L. Brian. H. Lauren. L. Nico. P. Robin. S. Jerry. W. Robert B. Jason W. Apophian, Kristen K. Emilia. O. Allison O. L. Lucas M. Raj C. We got Joshua D. We got Emily S. C.JP. Samantha M. Jennifer N. Jackie P. Stacey L. Carly H. Carly S. Jen S. Jamal F. Janelle B. Tab of the 272.

Not to be confused with. Tab of the 273. Ashley Ryan. Kimberly E. Mike E. Eldon Supremo. Dan. 99 more. Ramira. San Diego M. Sarah F. Sarah F. Chad. W. Leanne P. Ray A. Maya P. Matty S. Kendrick F. Ashley E. Shannon D. Matt W. Belinda Carlisle. No. N. Belinda N. James R. Chris H. Dave H. Samantha S. Spider-Man Chase. Sheila. Easton. Sheila G. I know it's G. Ray H. Tabitha T. Tom and Suzanne B. Lillianna A. Michelle K. Marcos. W. Hanna B. Michael S. Talia M. Andrew T. Betsy D. Claire M. Liz J. Laura L. Chat L. Rochelle or Rachel. Nathan. E. And here's the last, last of them. Taylor K, Marion, Meg K, Janelle, P, Trab L, Dan L, Diane R. Ojetta. Lorraine G. Corey M. Veronica K. Stevie, Big Stevie W. Kendall T. Carol D. Sandy M. Angel M. Eric C.

Rian C. Stephen M. C. C. Super Sam. Emily C. Sherry S. Coleman G. David C. Michelle A. Matt, W. Liz L. Jeremy C. Andy T. and Chris E. Those are the wonderful, lovely patrons. Thank you for being my top tier patrons. Thank you for listening to the show today. We've got great shows coming up. We really sincerely do a lot in the can and a lot of really good information. A lot of people opening up about their darkest stuff. And, you know, I like that. So thank you, Bryce Ryan.

For myself, Michael Roosevelt, you're in the Hollywood Hills of California. And myself, Ryan Taylor, is over here in the Hollywood, California. Oh, yeah. We wave to the camera up there, right up there. How are you? And you guys, thank you so much. Just please be good to yourselves. Learn to appreciate yourselves, like yourselves, and be good to others.

And thank you for allowing me to be inside each and every one of you. So, all right. I really appreciate you. Make sure you subscribe. Damn it. Football season is here. Oh, man. Believe has the podcast to enhance your football.

experience from the pros one of the most interesting quarterback rooms to college Michigan is set at eight and a half wins to fantasy if you feel that way why didn't you trade them become a better fan and listen to the football podcasts from believe just search believe that's B-L-E-A-V podcast follow and listen on your favorite platform