Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - RACHAEL LEIGH COOK: Haunted by Potential, She’s All That Reflection, Life Changing Motherhood & Dangerous Sets

Episode Date: February 28, 2023

Rachael Leigh Cook (She’s All That, A Tourists Guide to Love) joins us this week and shares her story of quickly moving from Hollywood aspirations growing up in Minnesota to feeling like she was playing catch-up, unable to enjoy the success of the late 90’s box office smash: She’s All That. Rachael was amazing this week!! She talks about the idea of feeling haunted by potential and the weight of the expectations she placed on herself, because of the solid upbringing and support she had behind her. We also talked about how motherhood was the ultimate life changing switch, how entertainment is a game of ‘pay now’ or ‘pay later,’ and some infamously uncomfortable audition stories. Thank you to our sponsors: ❤️ Betterhelp: https://betterhelp.com/inside 🧠 Qualia Mind: https://neurohacker.com/iou 🟠 Discover: https://discvr.co/3Cnb1V8 🧼 Dove Men Plus Care __________________________________________________ 💖 Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/insideofyou 👕 Inside Of You Merch: https://store.insideofyoupodcast.com/ __________________________________________________ Watch or listen to more episodes! 📺 https://www.insideofyoupodcast.com/show __________________________________________________ Follow us online! 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/insideofyoupodcast/ 🤣 TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@insideofyou_podcast 📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/insideofyoupodcast/ 🐦 Twitter: https://twitter.com/insideofyoupod 🌐 Website: https://www.insideofyoupodcast.com/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Ryan, Tayez is here. Hello. Te you, Tayeus. That's me. Tay it together. Tate it together. Guys, thanks for listening.

That's a new one. Hope you had it. Yeah, you like that? Yeah, sure. Oh, good. That's good. I hope you're having a great week. And thanks for choosing this podcast.

If you're here for Rachel Lee Cook, you came to the right place. And I hope if you like the interview, you'll subscribe and write a review and follow us on our handles, which are. at inside of you pod on Twitter at inside of you podcast on Instagram and Facebook I was yawning and I saved it I think You did you could obviously listen to us anywhere But YouTube if you're watching

We appreciate it and Those of you who want to give back to the podcast Like many of you do that keeps the podcast going It's a Patreon.com slash inside of you Patreon.com slash inside of you become a patron I send boxes full of merch and notes And we have zooms and there's just all sorts of stuff And you get your name shouted out

It's pretty awesome And patrons have become a big part of my life and a big part of each other's life. So it's pretty cool. Also, the inside of you online store has a lot of cool stuff. I'm getting new ship keys. You can check them out. Smallville ship keys autographed by Lex and lunch boxes and inside e mugs and all that stuff. So check it out.

I'm going to be putting up a discount code. In fact, let's just do a discount code now. I'll put it up after Ryan. What should the discount code be? Uh, tay it together. How about Tay. No, it's gonna, it's too hard. Do something easy. Um, how about all inside 15 for 15% off. All inside. All inside. 15. All inside 15 for 15% off the inside of you online store. Get it now. It's

not going to be there forever. And thanks for listening to Talkville. Ryan, we enjoy doing that. Yeah. It's a lot of fun. Today we had some technical difficulties. But Jason will handle it. We did. Yeah. Thank you, Jason. It's, thank you, Jason. But yeah, we did one today.

We did one today and having a lot of special guests coming up, which is really fun. I'm getting to see old friends from that. So check that out. And also March 4th and 5th, Tom Welling and I will be in Atlanta, Georgia at the Creation Con with Jared Pettilecki and Jensen Ackles. We're going to do a Smallville Knights event. So you have to get tickets to come see us. We read scenes.

I put the ball cap on. You read scenes. with us it's a freaking blast get your tickets for saturday night march 4th and a lot of other stuff going on what else i mean i'm going to be doing a lot of cons this year and um you know i think guardians is coming out in the summer and um guardians galaxy three and um just a lot of a lot of groovy stuff you know a lot of groovy stuff um trying to do a live podcast and inside of you one of course and of talkville podcast live we think would be fun so there's a lot of things in the works and uh thanks for all the love is there anything else oh of course my band sunspin

you got to go to sunspin.com or please um download us we're on spotify apple apple music all that stuff listen to the new album's called never is what it is and i really think you're going to like it hopefully you'll support the band and uh that's about it um rachel lee cook is the guest i love this girl yeah i mean she's so you know you know you know note it is when you're talking to her you really feel like she's listening and cares she's just she just is a good person and i know this because i know her and i've gotten to know her a little more and we've become good friends and we hadn't talked for a long time we were friends but like you know you lose touch she got she got married and had kids and i remain single and alone and you know but

anyway um she's awesome and she's had a really great career and she continually works because people love working with her and she's got a lot to say and I'm glad she came in and opened up and let's just let's just get into this let's get inside of rachel leco it's my point of you you're listening to inside of you with michael rosenbaum inside of you inside of you was not recorded in front of a live studio audience. Didn't we meet in Cabo, San Lucas? And you were with Rosario Dawson. Yep.

I was with my friend Chris McDonald. Yes. Yeah, you look at like something bad happened and nothing. It was just a fun time. Yeah, I'm just like trying to remember who else was there. Chaka Khan played on the beach. What? It was all downhill from there for us, Michael.

It really was. How, where could we go from there? I don't know. That was just wonderful. That was a wonderful vacation. It was so fucking wonderful. I vaguely remember chicken fighting some people in a pool with, with you. Yeah. And we won, dude.

Yeah, you were on my shoulders. Yes. Oh, my God, I forgot about that. Thank you. We won. Yeah, we did. Who do we beat? Some random couple. Whatever, they were trash. We won. They were such trash.

I'm glad you do remember that, though. Yeah. I was like she's not going to remember any of this, and she remembered something that I didn't remember it all. Also, there's a few things. I'm glad you finally did this because you actually listened to the podcast once, right? Oh, my God. I'm a fan. Really?

Yeah. Who'd you listen to? I listened to Zach Levi's. Oh, yeah. It was, I was so like, I'm like, I sound like an old lady again. I was so, like, proud of you guys for just like being dudes talking about feelings. And I was just so here for it. Like, I was just, I was riveted.

Like, thank you for that. Thank you for being as open. and it's yeah are you not used to guys opening up like just saying hey here's who i am no you haven't no well here's the funny thing about like i just think about being a woman just walking around in the world is that you don't know how different convert male conversations are when when you're not there like you just you don't know what ingredient you add to any given scenario right you know what i mean And you'll never know. It's like, Schroederger's cat.

You're like, you can't know. It's in facts, like, whatever. So, so yeah, it just, but it felt like, I don't know. It was just, it was very authentic. I really appreciated it. Thank you. I try, we try to make them genuine. I try to have real conversations.

I don't want to have like actor, actor. Sometimes you jump in that inadvertently tell moments, but. Yeah, too inside baseball to. Sorry, Harrison Ford. How do you feel about all my shots skis? Chotsky's, is that we call them? Chachiskees, yeah. Yeah.

How do you feel like that? all about all that. I feel great about it. Do you keep anything from your movies or anything from your TV shows? I started purging the paper of it all. Do you keep your scripts? I have some scripts. I haven't kept all of them,

but like I kept my, you know, like Guardians of Galaxy two script. Nice. I have like an urban legend script somewhere. Do you keep like the draft with, no, but like with all the collated pages,

like all the colors. Sometimes. I think I do have a few of those. Do you? Well, see, I feel like those are the ones to keep. Like the one, like the all white draft, like no, that got recycled along. Right, right. Yeah.

Did you keep like, she's all that or the babysitters club? I have one of those. Like original? Babysitters club. Yeah. With notes on it, like your markings? I kept conspicuously few notes. And if you watch the movie, you will understand that that is totally consistent with my performance.

What do you mean? Your performance is cool. right in that what no like you've you seen the babysitters club oh i haven't seen that one yeah exactly it's not a good movie thank you ryan knows right have you seen it i don't think so it's from 95 it's fine you want the demo it's how old are you right

i'm 34 okay you had to be there you've been doing this a long freaking time i mean indeed you too don't don't leave me alone out out here on that the difference is i is immature as I can be, I, you know, I, it was a progression. It was incremental. It was a high school play and then unsure and insecurity and then a college play and then get more confidence and then moving to New York and then doing plays and then some voiceover. That's the way it should be. I gradually got. Why do you hate Harrison for it? Yeah, I know. I keep hitting his rate as a

lost dark. I've never do that. Maybe you just made me nervous. Well, the first thing that happened is she walked in and I just said, oh my God, you smell really good. I wasn't hitting on her anything, but Ryan goes, I don't know what to do with this. Just be careful of your figurines. Be careful of it. You're talking about the place. Yeah. And then, so it gradually happened for me. You earned your stripes. What? I earned, yeah. I guess so. I earned it. I mean, some people, it happens later, but my, I didn't have overnight success. Like my co-star in Smallville Tom, he pretty much had overnight success. He went from oblivion to oblivious to superstar.

You know what I mean? Yeah. You started acting when you were like seven. Yeah. Yeah, kind of. Now, you can't say that I can't imagine as a little girl. You're like, I want to act at seven. Or did your mom?

Yeah, yeah. How did that happen? No, I didn't. This is, um, well, let me tell you this because you're my friend. So I think what happened was that, you know how, like, all your parents' friends are like, she's, he's adorable. But I was like, I really took that to heart. I was like, we need to, apparently, you guys, the people have spoken, like, we need to get this out there. We need to get this face out.

I am wonderful, apparently. Do you remember feeling so wonderful as a little girl? Like, I am cute. Everybody thinks I'm just so cute. No, I just, I think that I was just like. Like, you know how every, I feel like every kid with like a good upbringing is like, you know what? Maybe my parents are right. Maybe I can be whatever I want to be.

Like they gave me that sort of confidence. So even despite being a super shy child, I was just like, what if I like one of the kids who was in my grade did like print work because my parents loved to like take out the Sunday paper and like distribute sections to everybody. and I was just like my favorite because I'm an intellectual Ryan I don't know if you know this but I like the target ads I like retail I'm a moron you mean tar jay tar jay of course yeah but I was just like huh I mean those kids got there somehow they somebody's got to sell these pajamas I was like let's do this and so this was your idea this is my idea it was my bonehead idea And there's a lot of, there are a lot of Fortune 500 companies that do, like, advertising out of Minnesota. So, yeah.

Minneapolis is where you're from. Yes, Minneapolis, exactly. And I'm from right in the city. Is that because it's more of the real heart of America, the Midwest, in a sense, that they want the kids that look like, no. My guess is that it's cheaper to have factories there. And then that's way headquarters are there. And then that's, my guess is like why the rest of everything satellites. from that point. Right. But I don't know because I left high school early. So I don't know a lot of

things. You didn't finish high school. There's so much I don't know. Like not to brag, but I don't know a lot of things. He seemed pretty smart. I mean, I went to high school and college and you never know it. I mean, I'm not. I feel like you know stuff. I don't know. I remember, you know, I still have nightmares of being in high school or in college and there's a test. I just had a dream the other night. They hand out a quiz and I knew nothing. And I was just. just like, oh my gosh, when did we go over this? So you never flipped to like the not knowing your lines nightmare? Because like that, I feel like that.

Oh, that happens still. Do you still have that? Yes. I hate it. Do you still dream about that? Yeah. Yeah. Like not often, thank God.

Do you know your lines usually pretty good? Pretty good. Pretty well. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Have you ever not known them and really been in trouble? I got in trouble twice in my career. I've gotten in trouble pretty bad.

embarrassing um one yeah the second time i was embarrassed it was because like every bad you know like bad crash and blames their tools etc etc but it was an incredibly redundant speech that used the same language uh in four different paragraphs in four different ways with different words and so it involved like doing callback to things that happened in the other paragraph, but it wasn't, the writing made so little sense to me. It wasn't good writing. That's the key. I would love to totally blame the writing, but if you have any warning whatsoever, and like it read, okay, like it made sense in my mind, but I got there on the day and the collective, just exhaustion from the shoot, coupled with the fact that it was just

really fucking confusing dialogue. Yeah, I went up like a lot. And I ended up just being like, guys, we're going to piece it together. And I hate that. Yeah. I was like, I hate that moment for me. And it taught me a lot about like, you know what? If I know that my brain's not going to be able to do this on the day, then oh, my God, fix it. Fix it beforehand.

Because like, it was just very embarrassed. Inside of you is brought to you by Quince. I love quince, Ryan. I've told you this before. I got this awesome $60 cashmere sweater. I wear it religiously. You can get all sorts of amazing, amazing clothing for such reasonable prices. Look, cooler temps are rolling in.

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and tell them you heard about them from my show inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum. Rocket Money. I was just talking to my friend, I think I've told you this, but I'm like, you know, I'm 50 now. I just turned 50. Happy birthday.

What was that? Did you have a party? I think I'm going to have one next year. Oh, okay. I think I'm going to do it next year. You know, but I was thinking, you know, I know. I hear Robert Downey Jr. and other actors do it, but they do this earwig. Yeah. Yeah.

I mean, wouldn't that be a treat? Well, the two times that I've like gone up on stuff in my life, the first time was because I was working with a much, much older actor. And he had one? He had one. So the lines came out a little different and very delayed. And so it was like there was no flow to any of it. And so I was just like, I'm not in a in a scene. I'm doing this seen by myself. Wow.

So he was getting the lines. So if you don't know what an earwig is, I've talked about it once before, I think. Do you know what it is? No, yeah. I can't remember who you talked about it with, but it's been like a year since you brought it up, which is impressive, actually. But it is. I usually bring things up.

But like, for instance, if Ryan's whispering in a microphone that's going to my ear, for instance, Ryan start talking, I'll talk to Rachel. Yeah. Hey, hey, Michael. Hey. Oh, hey, Rachel. Hey, Rachel. How's it going?

Welcome to my really creepy. really creepy den with all my toys and my toys horror posters i don't know if this scene's gonna make the cut but you know what i mean that's sort of like that yeah but he was going very slowly yes exactly he wasn't on his cue no and you can't also have someone in your head sort of anticipate like they they can't dictate your performance that's also unfair so it's like that's that's scary you know what i mean like were you embarrassed um with that with that instance I was more embarrassed for him because I was sort of in a position on that one where I was like, oh dear, I'm going to have to do the scene basically by myself. And I was like when I say I went up like, I didn't go up that bad.

Like it was not that bad. But he was just in a different scene or maybe just entire stage of life. Did it work when they cut it together? Yeah, if I do say so. It does work. It did. Totally. We figured it out eventually, honestly.

but yeah so could we tell some stories where I don't look like a bad actor can we do that for a while I mean look I could tell you stories of me going up a lot I remember there was I was flying home one time flying back and forth to Vancouver

and they added a scene in this movie and I looked at it on the on the page I looked down on the plane excuse me and I landed and I went to set and I kind of I just didn't have it I just didn't have it but like on the plane are you like I'll figure it out like i thought yeah i just thought i'd figure it out and it was they wanted a oneer and i they could

have made 18 takes to the point where people were like god he was so great in the movie and what happened oh my god people are staring at me that's that's scary because you start to get you know like you get in your own head and then it's like you know you get warm you flushed you know and you're like oh my god i'm bombing i don't want to be here i never want to act again god get me out of I'll go to Italy. I'll live somewhere else. It's not right. Have you done that?

That's not fair to you. You know what I mean? Like, you didn't know who's going to be a oneer. You would have looked at it very differently if you know it was going to be a winner. I guess I would have. Yeah. I guess I would have. But you seem professional.

I've never heard one bad thing about you in your work. I never heard she's hard to work with. What a bitty. You ever hear that term? Biddy. She's a bitty. You're bringing it back. I'm bringing it back.

I'm bringing it back. So as a kid, you looked at a Target magazine. a magazine target kids wearing clothes from target is that right yeah and you said i got to do this if they're doing it i'm cute i'm adorable according to my neighbors i i could do this and your parents said okay and they went to an agent there in minneapolis and the next thing you know then yeah the next thing i know i'm like you know taking some tap shell photos at a jc penny and do you still have those photos or your mom have those photos from when you first pictures yes i have a very rough bull haircut because that's just what we did back then.

Did you have a bull cut? What's a ball cut? Never, you didn't. You would know, trust me. What is it? You would know. It was like a bowl on your head. Thank you, Ryan.

A bowl. A bowl. A bowl. A bowl. Was that your Minnesota coming out? Maybe. Maybe. You bet you have you ever had to do a Minnesota accent?

Oh, you just did my whole life a little bit. A little things. Wouldn't you love to do Fargo? Do you ever audition for the series? No. See? What a great voice. That's a great accent.

You do accents really well, don't you? I'm okay. What I think is like crazy, we're going to, we're going to tangent a little bit. And this is like something. We'll go back to Target. We always do. We always go back to Target, folks. No, but what I think is so crazy about casting, that actors, casting,

fuck, you make him so in Minnesota right now. Thank you, right. No, is that like, we think that if we're just so transcendently good, that we should be able to book anything. And that's just garbage. It's just not true because you can just cast the actual person and then it's like calm down. Like you're, that's just acting.

That's true. There's only a couple of people that can actually just like get something whether or not they're the best casting for the role. Like I think like Kate Winslet in Merrifreyfamese Town is a perfect example. Because where you cast her, even if she auditioned, you'd be like, no, we can cast this actual woman. She exists. She is there.

She is wonderful. She can probably only play that role, but she is from that region, and she will get an Emmy and maybe never work again. But, like, people, just producers, everybody, they just want that person these days. And we just blame ourselves. And then it's just like, bad. Are you hard on yourself if you don't get something? Not since really learning that, but before that, yeah. Were you spoiled sort of growing up in a sense that you were cute, you were fun, you're starting to get these target pictures.

And it was moving on. You were the kid now. You're probably the kid out of Minneapolis that was getting all the bookings. A lot of the bookings were coming from you. Is that probably true? Well, I really feel like entertainment if you stick in it, it's like a, it's like a pay now or pay later kind of situation. And I was definitely lucky up front. Like I apparently decided with the universe to like take all my lucky chips early.

And that's probably good because it like gave me enough like momentum. and I guess a reserve of finances to just keep going and somehow still believe in myself. Yeah. But other than that, yeah, it was definitely, it was definitely hard. So, yeah, I'm very good at being hard on myself. Are you? Oh, my God. Ryan, want to answer that?

Yes. Like, horrifically. I'm very, very hard at myself. Very, very hard. But, like, I feel like you know that you're a smart person. You know that you're a funny person. You know that you're an engaging person. Like, what are you hurting yourself about?

Keep going. I was hoping for handsome or charming. We were going to get there. We're going to get there eventually. We got to keep your head to the room. I'm just kidding. I'm kidding. But, you know, you hear these stories, obviously, of these child actors and they just go to hell.

They just become alcoholics and drug addicts and rightfully so. They don't have any sort of understanding about the. real world they're in this like little bubble and all of a sudden they're just pushed you know the beavers of the world and the uh what's his name i just read as uh just a geek will we'll weton will weton talks about like he never even wanted to do it but his mom sort of made him do it and you know he had his falling out and sort of like you know now he doesn't talk to his parents at all cut them off completely which is the hardest thing he's ever had to do and he was on the podcast and we talked about that. And when did you hit that spot? Did you ever hit that spot? Or were you always

like, hey, I'm lucky. I had a good head on my shoulders. I didn't veer too much that way. Well, I just, I think that I was just never like that successful. What do you mean? No, like, I feel like things were pretty good. But it was never like. You never were a superstar is what you're saying? No, I feel like there was just never this like line of people like waiting to like high five me and tell me I'd made it. Like, by the time I sort of had any awareness that, like, things were going pretty good, I was already, that was already in a way in the rear view. Like, that, that ship had already kind of sailed, and I felt like I was going into

catch-up mode. Really? Yeah. And you're saying, like, she's all that when that whole thing hit? Yeah, like, when you're, it was very strange when people are like, oh, my gosh, you're in a movie that's in the theaters, that's the number one this weekend. exactly and it made all this money and people are excited because it made money you just it feels like an accident and then you're kind of like i mean it took me probably i don't know two three years to be

like oh that was kind of neat and then i didn't book anything that was totally awesome until josie and the pussycats after that because i was just like trying to be cool and live in indiville and do like fun indie movies and like I don't know have that kind of like so called credibility because that scene was so vibrant at the time you remember you were there oh yeah so yeah so yeah by that point and then I made Josie which didn't

make any box office money and then when people think that you don't make dollars and cents you're in trouble isn't that something becomes a big cult movie and people tons of fans come out of the word work later yeah 20 quick years later here we I mean it's it is before that oh totally totally but But it's scary to be attached to a dollar value. You know what I mean?

It's like it worked for me. I've never been attached to a dollar value. No, but like, but you are in the sense that like you can like those movies that your agent, you know, calls you about that are like, hey, Michael, we got an offer. It's XYZ, you know, 100K for you to go to Bulgaria. Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan. Yeah, or Saskatchewan for, for, for, they can shoot you. out. No, no, no. They can shoot you out in two weeks. And then there's some people who you have never heard of, but who have a lot of credits in Croatia and the rest of the movie. And you're just

like, oh, okay. Like, this is what this movie is worth overseas. Like, that's, like, that's what those, those paychecks in those movies. So after you did, she's all that, which became this, you know, big hit, you never really felt the success for a long period of time. Like, oh, my God, I'm a star. I'm a movie star. I, did you? Did you? ever feel that moment of like, I made it because you said before, you know, like it wasn't very long after that you were looking in the rearview mirror. It felt like attention, but I was never comfortable with like attention, attention. You never liked it? No, no. It's weird because like I can't, like public speaking and me are like a no, I can't. I have never does, I don't like

admitting this to actress is something I'm self-conscious about, but like, I've never done theater, like, ever. And I know, but I feel, I feel like a faker. Why? Because I just, you're supposed to do it. No. You're supposed to like stump the boards, whatever you people call it. I hate that, too, because, like, I come from the theater and I am an actor.

If you're natural, if you're good, if you love what you do, don't be sorry for anything. just because you didn't that wasn't your background this is how this was your path that's not everybody's path thank you it doesn't mean you're not good enough or oh she's not trained you made it because of you and i'm trying to say that to myself too i tell that to myself all the time like i was i grew up in a small town i wasn't amount to shit no one knew me i wasn't yeah i was going to work at a grocery store i was working at sonoco gas station i was going to make five dollars an hour okay so looking at like an imposter syndrome situation of course i have that i i just felt like and if nobody's believing in you and except maybe that one along the way or two those are the ones that make get you

the confidence enough to keep going but you had to believe ultimately and you you had to do it right you could have bowed out early you could have said no not for me it's too hard too much rejection I don't want to do it But not only did you stay with it You've stayed with it Yeah Well it's kind of like I mean I don't know

I think we've all heard that Kevin Hart interview Where he's like Well no like when he's like I realized when I was failing community college That I had to make comedy work Like it's kind of like the same It's kind of the same thing I was like oh dear

I'm not good at anything You really thought like I'm not good at anything else This is the only thing I'm good at Yeah I did fine in school but like nothing else would have like popped out at me you know what I mean like did were you like oh maybe I'll be a doctor like that's Sunco Sunco somebody's got to sell the gas Michael somebody has to sell the gas I thought that's what I do I thought I'd make a living and I'd have all my friends and you know drink a little bit and I thought that's where I'd end up I didn't think

I was going to get out and everything just sort of it was almost I believe this you whether you believe it or not, Ryan. You probably don't. You're cynical. What? No, you're not. I could tell. You haven't said very much, but I could feel it. I'm a flying on the wall. I got my notes. You spelled Rachel, right? R-A-C-H-A-E-L. I did. Thank you, Ryan. I didn't. I forgive you. And you didn't even have to admit that. That's so transparent of you. Thank you, Michael. You're welcome. I told you. Very honest. Inside you is brought to you by Rocket Money. If you want to save money, then listen to me, I use this, Ryan uses, so many people use Rocket Money.

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The app automatically scans your bills to find opportunities to save and then goes to work to get you better. deals they'll even talk to customer service thank god so you don't have to um i don't know how many times we talk about this but like you know you got it and they helped you in so many ways and with these subscriptions that you think are like oh it's a one month subscription for free and then you pay well we forget we want to watch a show on some streamer and then we forget and now we owe $200 by the end of the year yeah they're there to make sure those things don't happen and they will save you money. You know, Rocket Money's 5 million members have saved a total of $500 million in canceled subscriptions with members saving up to $740 a year when they use all of

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Ever wonder how dark the world can really get? Well, we dive into the twisted, the terrifying, and the true stories behind some of the world's most chilling crimes. Hi, I'm Ben. And I'm Nicole. Together we host Wicked and Grim, a true crime. podcast that unpacks real-life horrors one case at a time. With deep research, dark storytelling, and the occasional drink to take the edge off,

we're here to explore the wicked and reveal the grim. We are Wicked and Grim. Follow and listen on your favorite podcast platform. What was I saying? You were talking about how you didn't think you were going to get out. And I had a question for you about that, which is like, but wasn't like everybody, I feel like he's got that one person in their town who there's like that lore around that person who got out or who wrote a book or who became an actor or a singer like that just that one

person from your town like are you that person who was it if it wasn't you i would just say this i will say that i feel like the hand of fate true true story i believe in fate the hand of fate the hand of fate took me in that direction just grabbed me by the fucking shirt and took me i mean Everything, if you look at my life, everything happened by someone almost forcing me to do something in a, it's not force, but leading me that way because maybe they believed in me. Like, for instance, I was taking an acting class in high school. You had to sign yourself up for that, though. But I was just taking it because it was easy just to goof around.

I didn't think I was going to become an actor. That's not easy for everybody. No, but I was like, oh. They would rather be like, oh, I guess I'll try and be on the tennis. or something like well they were like oh today we're going to learn how to mime and I go the first thing that came to me was I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna mine a guy having to go to the bathroom to take a shit and he's rushing to the bathroom I remember in drama class you could go to that I could see it so I'm miming the toilet paper and I'm like oh my god and I'm doing this as a mime and the whole

class is laughing this is where my mind goes just make everybody laugh I'm hiding behind a facade because I didn't I I didn't like me I was so yeah what's your persona at at this stage that you do that. Where had you been like more reserved? Like, it was just weird and insecure and all over the place and didn't fit in anywhere. No, I just kind of didn't fit in anywhere. And I remember going to my senior year, I signed up for, it was called advanced drama, but it was the same drama class.

It was just called advanced because you were senior. But you're with all the freshmen's. Right. Freshman. Freshman. I'm with it. Freshman. Yeah.

Freshman. Yeah. Freshman. Thank you. And so Mrs. Peter Noster said, you can't take advanced drama unless you're going to audition for a play. And I go, and I'm telling you, I was going to say no. No way.

I can't audition for play in front of these people and perform. Well, yeah, because, like, it doesn't seem like you're just playing or doing a scene where you can just relate to somebody. Now you have to commit. No, it sounds horrible. Scary. If you're coming completely from the outside, like, I have to learn all these. I have to commit this stuff to memory. Like what?

That seems almost impossible. That's what happened. And I finally said, okay, there's this one part that's just goofy and I'll just be that guy. And I won't get it anyway. And I auditioned. And I got, if I did not audition for that play, we would not be talking right now. I'd be watching you going, oh my God, that's good from that movie. Oh, my God.

I wish I could be with her. Man, she's smoking. I have another beer. I've got to go work at Sonoco right now. Tell me more about the bathroom stories. No, no. We're not going back to the miming of the bathroom. I know.

But so when I performed, I was nervous as shit. And I won't get into that. But I remember the applause. I have the videotape. I have the tape that someone set me of everybody coming up and going out. And I was not a lead character. And I came out and the applause was booming. and talk about ego boost and confident boost.

I was like, they like me, they really like me. Yeah. And then the next day at school, I tell us all the time, a popular kid walks by me, goes, you were really funny last night, and walks away. And I go, okay, not being me is the way to go. And that got me going. That got me going.

I wouldn't have gone anywhere. And from there, it was little moments, those same moments of the teacher going, do you really want to be here? Do you really want to be an actor? and just like a lot of luck a lot of luck and a lot of work but you had to say yes at every turn and then you have to and then you got to work like you you cannot trip stumble fall into a career yeah not one that lasts anyway i don't think i mean i might have been a sports announcer i might

have been like there's a line drive and right field base hit a base hit by jimmy crawls now up is Wally Beckman batting 274. I'm so jealous. You're all so good at that. I mean, I would just love that. God damn. I want to do that.

But like stuff like that, you know, that would be fun. But who makes it as a sports announcer? Not a lot of people. Not a lot. Not become famous and make a lot of money. Most work like, you know, AAA baseball making about 30 grand a year to announce baseball games. And, you know, it's not an easy thing to get to be,

what's the guy's name who everybody... Vin, Vin, Scully? No. Good one, keep going. The one that a lot of people, Joe Buck. Joe Buck. You know, people don't like, people like. I think he's great.

But to get to that level is just, that's not easy. But let me ask you this. When you're doing all this acting stuff and you're climbing up the ranks and you're doing your, this is your brain. This is your brain on drugs. That was you, wasn't it? That was you. No, the voice sound. Oh, the voice.

The voice. See, I wouldn't be the on camera. But, you know, and you're. coming up and you're doing all this acting. Were there any, were you ever, do you remember being nervous or I can't do it or anxious or just, were you just confident because you didn't know better? Funny, just side story about that actual ad. I remember, like, auditioning, like, is very scary to me, like, like, all of us because

we're human beings. But that audition was actually not scary to be because I was like, there's no way I'm getting this. Because in the waiting room, there's just. literally like 16 models there are like 510 like beautiful wafy Calvin Klein types I was like are you fucking serious like am I in the wrong room and so I was like this is going to happen so I wasn't actually scared because you said what do I have to lose am I going to get it yeah that is always the key if you don't give a shit but you I mean you'd like it well it's also

possible that they're just actual models who never acted before. True. But when you have that confidence where you're like going in there and you don't care. Yeah. And those nerves that hinder you from being your best don't come out and you can let it all out. That's a rare thing. That's so true. How often does that happen to you? Very little. What about you? It doesn't happen a lot. But I have those days where I'm like, I belong here. And I have those days where I'm like, I don't belong here. You know what I mean? I do. I do. If I, like, if the room is warm and if people are, I don't know, like really welcoming and the material is good, like a lot is possible. Have you had bad, have you had bad audition? No, I mean like where, um, you really are

embarrassed. Yeah. Yeah. I remember, um, what happened? You got to tell us. You got to tell a story. So, Michael, I thought, I thought that the scene ended when, you know, like I stopped. You're crying.

I didn't know that she was actually crying or laughing. I thought that the scene ended when, you know, both the characters stopped talking, but it turns,

they go, and then she gets shot. I was like, excuse me. Then she gets shot? And you didn't know that you didn't read the side? No, I did.

I still think I was going going to have to do it. Yeah, because it's still. You're looking like, like, such an idiot. I was like, you're like, just like, follow. You just did a little thing like that? No, like I committed to it, but like after talking about it with the,

and so like I hit the wall a little bit with my shoulder, my eye. And I just remember thinking my brain, my actual real-time thought was, I just wish they weren't filming this because then only three, of us would know this happened we'd be down to three people were you laughing about this during the moment or are you just so embarrassed afterwards after like now it's hilarious because that was like 20 years ago did you get the part no I did not get the part oh my god I think I've had those moments well I had a moment with um the guy who directed Beavis and Butthead Mike Mike Judge.

Obviously, a lot of actors have said, oh, my God, I love Evison. I love Mike Judge. He's a genius. And I went in for this audition, and I go, he likes weird. He likes off the, you know, just out there. Okay. And I came in. I wore a wig, I think.

Because you were, like, keeping it tight at the time? I wasn't Lex Luther then. Okay. But I wore this wig. and this checkered shirt and a gold chain and I had a little toy a little ceramic golden retriever dog I have a lot of questions

I don't know and I went up and I just put the golden retriever on the desk and then I angled it to him to look at him and he's just like mm-hmm okay and then I just started doing the scene and it was weird and I took these really strange beats and I was kind of doing all that little accent now and I was doing something really out there and I thought man he's going to go and he goes okay thank you very much thanks so much thanks

and then you just got to pick up the golden retriever and then I picked the golden retriever then I walked out and I go I don't know I might have done something really well there I don't I don't maybe he's just because you let my manager called me and said what did you do in there You're welcome. Did I get it? And I go, he goes, dude, Mike Judge says he's never been more freaked out in an audition than the moment when you walked in and gave that reading. That's pretty cool.

He's, it wasn't good. It was not good. I was not the part. And Mike was like, yeah. I remember the, you know what? That's on him for not giving you any direction. And he could have been like, hey, I so appreciate you putting so much thought into this. Bring the dog.

Thank you for the day. dog, thank you for your headpiece. Like, thank you for everything that's happening here. But we asked you in for a reason. And can we just, like, why don't you just, like, go, like, take 10? Different direction. And we're going to just. We're going to work this out.

We're going to just, we're going to something else. I freaked him out. By the way, I have that golden retriever still. Can you, like, can you keep things that you have bad memories attached to like that? Oh, yeah. Not bad. Pictures of my family. I feel, we're going to get into it.

Um, no, but like, but yeah, like the, um, but the, the big win for you, I think in that story is that you weren't like, oh, I did that. And then I kind of fumbled this beat and I meant to do it like that. Like, you did everything that you wanted to do. Like, I see that as a win. I did everything I wanted to do. Yeah. That's, it is. It is a win when I just didn't care and I was one of those moments and I was like, but I was just completely wrong. I was not. That was the opposite of what he wanted. Yeah. It's okay. It's okay. It's okay. It's okay. that that happened. Let me ask you this. Are you someone, do you get anxiety? Have you ever, have you, do you know what anxiety is? I've heard of it. People are talking about it a lot. Because I mean, it's, it's something that a lot of people go through. Ryan, uh, every guest probably has a little bit of anxiety, but some people deal with it, you know, have your anxiety. No, no, no, no, definitely. I, um, I definitely, when I was younger and apparently more ambitious, I dealt with a lot of like just perfectionism not that it was not that perfect was ever like really on the table but I think that I felt like I I had so much behind me I was like you have some success

you have a good family you have friends like the word potential I feel like has just haunted me my whole life I hate that word I hate the idea that if you just try to an 11 that you should be able to like why weren't like why weren't we in the Olympics Michael I don't know like I don't like that so anxiety to me came from like circular thought about like did you do everything you could

what did you do wrong what could you have done different yeah and your mind like and I didn't really realize this is exactly what it was like your mind is this like it's like a railroad, you know, like a railroad train set that like, um, just loves to run in certain loops. It becomes like muscle memory to just have these thoughts that just sort of run in a pattern, right? And yeah, and I took Zoloft to like break that pattern. And it was a total game changer

for me because almost instantly like that part of the track was gone. And it, that whole way of thinking left me. Really? Yeah. So that perfectionism, that loop perfectionism the loop of that same your mind doing the same thing you're saying that you started anti-depressant or anti-anxiety zolop that's work for you but other people yeah no other people this is not an advertisement this doesn't mean it works for you yeah because i yeah i'm you know i do something else but you know um that it just that was the key yeah it caused it it was a complete system interrupt that changed everything for me how long did it take before it would it kicked in. I noticed a difference in the way I felt after, I mean, this was a long time ago now,

but if I had to guess about four months, because everything's habitual, right? Like, even if your brain's doing something different, it takes a while for your body to process that and everything. So yeah, I guess about that. Now, is it something you still use? Or you're like, you just got out of it. And now that loop doesn't come back because of new habits. What I think is super cool about it, Again, this is not an advertisement for Zillop. Right, right, right. Once the disrupt happens, it would take effort to bring it back, you know what I mean, to run in those circles again.

And so when I went off it because I knew I was going to, like, start trying to have a kid and stuff, I never really felt the urge to go back to it. Really? Yeah. But yours is working for you. I mean, clearly you're doing great. Oh, yeah. I'm on it.

I am nailing it. Ryan? You're doing great, kid. Thanks, man. Thank you. I always pictured you as someone who, I mean, you may laugh. You probably laugh at me when I say this. But someone who just...

I love me already what? I'm scared. No, but just, I just always looked at you as somebody who just... You're sort of stoic in a lot of ways. You don't let things get to you, or if you do, you don't let people know. Like, you kind of play it off. You kind of, like, there's a thing about you where you're like, you're not going to wear your emotions on your...

on your sleeves your arms sleeves yeah yeah your arm sleeves as opposed to those other sleeves like those leg sleeves we got going on those legs in my right those pants yeah um yeah i'm i'm definitely like uh like a yeah if if something gets to me like i will wait until i am like out of the audition with the failed audition to like go to my car to cry about it for sure are you uh are you an arguer can you argue with the best of them or you're like nah i don't like loud i don't like you're yelling i don't like yelling i hate i hate loud i hate arguing which is directly conflicting it's always at logger heads with my deep desire to be right because i love being right yeah who doesn't no but like i'm not an arguer but one one thing about me that i both take pride in and that

is kind of fucked up is that if if i say something mean to you i meant it wow like i don't say things i don't mean you can't be like oh my god i was you say things mean though can have you ever said something where you're like i meant it but i shouldn't have said it no i meant it have you have you ever said i hate you no what's the worst thing you said to somebody and meant it I want you out of my life. What about you? Like, I'm literally having to think about it. I've said things by accident.

Like, have you heard of this? Okay, I'm going to sound a little woo-woo right now. No. But there's this like, okay, there's this idea that you can have thoughts that aren't yours, right? It's kind of like a ghost, but it's like a little thought in your mind. Sometimes things come out that you're just like, one time I repeated something that somebody that a friend of mine had said as a joke. It was like kind of a mean joke. Yeah.

But then I repeated it. And I was like, I'm not a mean joke person. And I felt really bad about it. Yeah, because that wasn't something you would say. Yeah, no. It was kind of like, yeah, it was like it passed from that friend of mine into my brain like a ghost. And it just came out with my mouth, which is weird because I didn't even really mean it. But why?

What's the meanest thing you've said? The meanest thing I've said is, I don't know. I feel bad about it. But I said to my mom, I said to her, you know, I love you, mom. I do. I love you. Uh-oh. I love you.

Buckle up. But I don't like you. I don't like you at all. I would never hang out with you if you weren't my mom and you were my age. I would never hang out with you. I don't like you. She, I mean, I'm a parent. So please take this in the right way.

She felt the same way about you. She's like, I love you. Don't like you right now. There was a... And I, no, and I mean, like, I love my kids, but they're tough hangs sometimes. They're small. It's fine. Like, it's not a big deal.

Well, you know, there was a wrestler, and he used to say, Hulk Hogan, his name was a brother, love. You said, Hulk Hogan, I love you. But that don't mean I like you. And it was like His name was brother love Do you like being a mom? Oh my God, yes

Has it changed your life? Yeah, it's the only game changer It's the only actual game changer What has changed? What is it that changes When you have a child for you? It's weird Because you're just like, well

I guess I can never die, great Like I gotta fucking live forever now Yeah, yeah, yeah Like I can't Um No, it's just I think that the reason that I was just like, yeah, I want to be a parent is, first of all, I was just like, I don't have FOMO about not doing that, which is a dumb reason to do something. It ended up being a great decision. But I was just like, people seem pretty into this parenthood thing. I should find out what that's about. And then, you know, and then you do it. And it's just like, I was just so ready to not, for it to not be the me show anymore. Like,

I just was, I was sick of my own bullshit. Isn't that something? You know what I mean? I was like, I'm so, so over me. Like, we've done too many seasons of this. Like, just cut it. And now I am canceled and they are on forever. And maybe someday I will exist again.

That is perfect. What you just said made more sense to me than anything you said. Thank you. I mean, yeah. Yes. And why I'm saying that I remember my grandfather and he said, he didn't get along with my mother. Everybody knew he didn't like her. And my dad resented him for not, you know, accepting his wife, which is understandable. My dad is understandable. My dad was angry. And my mom was upset. And I love my grandfather. And I thought he's the best thing in the world. And he believed in me and unconditional. love and talk to me actually had conversations just sat there and talked with my grandfather and i asked him once you know why he didn't really like my mom and he said you know mike it's um i would try i would you know you'd come to visit and i would i would see you're gonna be good this time

you're gonna just you're gonna sit there you're gonna engage you're gonna and it wasn't 15 minutes of her talking i i had to get out of there i had to take you kids to go play because i love being with you guys and i take you to go play and i go why that's tough and he says because when you're a parent he says you have to split the responsibility and you have to with your mother and father the mother the father can't just be the disciplinarian and she She used to always put everything on him, call him at work. And she said, and when you have a child, they are the center of your attention. They become the center of the attention, not you.

And if you still want to be the center of attention, you cannot have children. No. And I remember him saying this and it all made sense because it was always about my mother. It was always about her going out and always about her friends and always about her friends and always about and less about us. It really, I don't think she was capable. I think she loved us, but she did not know how to be a mother. And that is, to me, if you're ready to have a child, you have to be what you just said,

your show has run its course. It's now their show and they're like family matters. They're going to go on for fucking ever. You know, that's the only way. The child could be really healthy and have a chance. Yeah. And yet at the same time, like, there's a balance to be found. Like, your mom or a, I will say, like, a healthier balanced version of your situation where your mom is like, oh, you know, I work my job, love you kids, but you're tough.

Like, when I go out with my girls, one or two nights a week, like, I come back refreshed. I feel, I feel centered in myself. They see me. like that's that's a healthy thing you know what i mean she gets to feel yeah you still have your time you still need your time yeah yeah totally so it's like there's a a version of of that that i feel bad for her that she couldn't sort of meet you halfway on that yeah i hear what you're saying you're saying like if you don't take time for yourself if you don't exercise or have moments for yourself or this you'll go crazy you need that to be the best mom you can that that happens

But, but yeah, but the fact that from the sound of things, your mom was like, why don't you just check back with me when you're like a grown up and we can talk about grown up stuff, okay? Oh, yeah. That's, that's not, that's not cool. Yeah. It's, it's, you know, you always look back and you're like, you know, you look, I remember always going to other people's house as my friend's parents. And it just felt like their parents would listen to them and they would engage with them and they were just, it was always just going out, going to my friends. house staying there for a few days not no one's allowed to come to our house no one's allowed to spend the night it was just like it's just a weird dynamic i had a very weird dynamic and i think

that you know i've learned to forgive i've learned to just say hey you guys weren't good parents but that's because you didn't know how to be good parents and i forgive you and you know you got to let that shit go you turned out good though did i i feel like from over here i'm working on it i'm working i'm working on it i'm still um it's a it's evolution man it's a work in progress um you're still close to your parents? Yeah. They're both still alive, God willing. Have you had to deal with loss? Um, I, uh, I mean, yeah, I'm a, I'm a human, sure, but, um, yeah, no, I, I lost my grandparents. Like, that's the way, you know, it's supposed to work. What about, what about you? Yeah, I mean, sure, I've, I've had loss and it's like, you know, but as we get older now or, you know,

you're getting up there, I'm getting up there a little bit. We're still young. You look to me like, what? Still at it. Here we go. Here we go. No, but like, you know, the older you get, you know shit's going to fall apart. Oh, yeah. You know, this has to happen. It's called life. We know that this, and there's some friends I have that I'm like, oh, my God, as a mess as I'll be, it's not as close to some of them who don't even want to talk about it. My friend Kristen, who was on Smallville, Kristen Kruke, told me to read this book called

The Future Corpses, or Your Future Corpses. It's a story about how to deal with death, how to deal with. She says it's amazing I have to read it and prepare yourself and all this and it's a good read But I think that it's like, you know Can anything prepare you though? I mean, okay, I'll check out the book, but you know what I mean? I think that I think that that's a big ask I think that it's also unfair to your present self Yeah to ask that of well to think about it all the time. You don't want to do that. No, sure But if there's some way to prepare yourself to say, hey, this makes me look at things in a different light, maybe this will help me inevitably when this happens.

Yeah. You know what I mean? Absolutely. So she's smart. I feel like whatever she's doing, I should be doing. She is. She's a reader. I mean, let's, uh, right.

Are you a reader? I feel like I used to be. I feel like, like the dumb joke I tell sometimes is like I feel like I can tell the last time I read a book by roughly how old my oldest kid. is like it's sad it's not funny it's a little bit sad no I like no but um but yeah but but on loss like I am I'm I'm completely terrified of I'm and I'm just like super avoidant and that was one of the hardest things about being pregnant actually like the the weirdest thing about it for me actually was not like the physical changes it was when you're part of the inception of something you get real in touch with your mortality like real quick

Like the moment I knew I was pregnant was the same moment I realized my parents were going to die. You know, it's very weird. Wow. It was just very sort of messed up moment. Really? Yeah. Did you have any postpartum or anything like that? No, thank God.

Thank God because that's serious. That's a real thing. It's a big, yeah. That's a big deal. And those hormones stay in your body for like a year and mess with you. Yeah. I learned the hard way because one of my best friends growing up, his mom called me and said, Hey, Amy's gone.

And I go, she left Nate? And she's like, no, she will overdose on sleeping pills. She had postpartum right after the baby was born. And she passed away. And you have to monitor. If you see any changes, any depression, anything, you have to be on top of it. It's so, it's such a real thing. And it's terrifying.

And it was like, I didn't really. So I flew back and I was on baby duty every two hours, changing diapers, helping him out. and like having these deep conversations with them and it was just it was intense and it kind of made me realize like wow I would another thing a freaking woman has to go through you know what I mean that no one really pays a lot of attention to you don't hear a lot about that do we talk about that a lot I don't think we do I feel like every so often someone comes forward and raises their hands and and like talks about it and absolutely but oh my god yeah terrible story Terrible stuff.

But let me ask you this. Of all the stuff you've done, you still enjoy acting. You still love the work. I'm still worried about Aby's family and her child. No, no, everything's fine now. She's growing, Alexa, she's grown up to be a beautiful girl, talented volleyball player. She's happy with life. Nate's a great father.

He met a lovely woman. I went to their wedding. It was awesome. Everybody's doing great, but it was just a tragic moment. Yeah. So a little happy ending that everybody's doing really well. Look, you've done so many things, right? I mean, I know we're getting at this.

I'm sorry, we're just like the whiplash. It's just like, I'm still, we're on a journey. Okay, okay. But like, you know, you've done so many things. I noticed here that you did a video game called Yakuza. Yes. I was in that. Get out.

I was one of the lead voices in that. So we have worked together. And we were also in Batman Beyond and I think Return of the Joker as voices, but we didn't know it. No, we did not. I had, I don't, I've never, have you played the game? Have you ever played it? I think I've seen it. No, no.

I haven't either. Have you ever seen your voice? I mean, that doesn't make sense. Have you ever seen an animation with your voice in it? Yeah, yeah. Do you like a little bit? Like robot chicken? It's easier than, you know, watching my whole self sometimes.

Do you not like watching yourself? Do you? Jenks. Do you? You first. I can watch myself. I'm learning because we're doing it also a rewatch podcast with Tom. Oh, nice.

So we do a rewatch podcast where we have, and I never saw so many of them. and Ryan's on it and it's weird and it's hard and it's hard for him looking at me and seeing this character like was so different than I am and like... It was a deep headshake, Ryan. Oh, man. It's a different human being. It's bizarre. It's bizarre, man.

Because he's so together. He's so articulate. He's so powerful. I don't know. What is it? I don't. Whatever. Just rugged, handsome.

Just full of. evil plans evil plans and just just full of life just a real do they still ask you to do Star Wars stuff yeah

I for people who don't know what you're talking about nobody well I did some voices on Star Wars Old Republic that was just fun I literally you do it in a heartbeat

I yeah I like it I like going to the booth and you know oh my god every actor said this in an interview but yeah like where you get to just like go in and throw your voice around

and not care what you look like and whatever. Yeah, because it's true, like, but circling back to your rewatch podcast, like, I did a rewatch podcast recently of the show Psych that I worked on briefly. You did the last season, right? I can't remember.

Whatever. Those guys are great. They've been on. I love that. They're the greatest. I think I showed up in season like three and four. I honestly can't remember, which I feel bad about,

but it was a great experience. But one of the, of the scenes, I felt strange saying it, but when we were doing the podcast, I was like, I have no, like, I understand that that's me intellectually, like, I get it. But I don't know if we were on a stage. I don't know if that was a location. Like, I don't remember. Isn't that something how we don't remember those things? It's scary. I mean, it's just, I think you just do jobs, jobs, jobs. And a lot of times you're like, yeah, got to learn my lines. Got to hit the mark. You're not thinking about being in the moment a lot of times. And like, where am I? Oh, look at

this. Sat. And it's rare. You just kind of work. Yeah. And sometimes when you knock it out real quick or like your first up, like by the time you sort of wake up, like the day is done, it's almost like, did I drive home last night? Oh shit. Like is you like was I acting? Like no, I didn't. Good. Yeah. I get it. Yeah. It's it's really weird. Do you look back at like your 20s or 30s or maybe just 20s? Let's say hour. Let's just be shared in. Yeah. Let's just share it. Oh, fuck you, Ryan. You're barely 30. You're 34. You're all right. But listen. Practically still growing.

Yes. You're a growing boy. Do you ever, how often do you reminisce? How often do you think of like, man, those were the years? Do you think like that? Do you think, oh, when you're a kid and I miss this and I miss so on. So I wonder what they're doing. Do you like almost, are you, do you live in the past at all?

Or are you more of like, that's the river of mirror? I ripped it off. I live in today. I don't ever, ever look back. And if I do, it's rare. I think I'm sentimental. Like I look back on things sort of fondly. Like I'll remember like, oh, we were friends when we did that.

And sometimes you'll know that it's a set friendship and not a life friendship. And you sometimes know that like in real time. Yeah. And that's totally. okay and I'm never someone who's like I don't chase friendships or whatever but that's the only thing that I think I feel sentimental about is sometimes like the people like oh we had an experience together but what I really love about again being in the game for a really long time is that when you do get to reconnect with people like we're doing today is that like when you get to meet

someone when you're oh my god like 17 20 whatever and then again when you're in your 40 like somewhere you get to meet someone again you get to meet someone twice in a lifetime you're like hello nice to meet this version like freddie prince oh my god he hadn't seen him in how many years freddie's exactly the same he's a bad example of this story he's a bad example he's the same guy okay no freddie's always been so true to himself has he been on the show i haven't asked it but i'd love him to come on he is so candid and so funny i feel like would he come on totally all right help you'll help me you get you know you I'm sure you've met like by the I think we might have met years and years ago it's I mean I don't know he has some of the best stories

does he that yeah yeah I'm not sure he would tell some of them on record but I hope you guys get a drink someday all right this is called shit talking with Rachel Lee Cook these are my top tier patrons they get to ask questions it's rapid fire okay yeah patron dot com slash inside of you I love you guys here you go Leanne loved you and Syke and she's all that was What was it like to work with Deulay Hill on both projects? Okay, first of all, I thought you thought my name was Leanne. I'm not good at Rapid Fire right now. Okay, what was it like to work with Deulay Hill?

I love DeLay. He is hilarious. He taught me an active trick that I will never forget, which is if you're in a scene with a lot of people, get yourself into a corner of the room near nobody else so that when everybody does their coverage, you don't have to be in it. That's like an acting tip that I picked up for DeLay. It's so brilliant.

And it works? Yeah, and he also goes. If there's, if there happens to be a kid in the scene, kid has to go home. Kid works limited hours. Go stand by the kid. They'll shoot you, your close up. You get to go home. I make you dole sound lazy and it's not.

These are tricks of the trade. He has spent more hours on set than probably that almost anyone I know. So, you just got to do what you got to do. Kelly asks, was there a particular fad or trend in the 90s that you look back on and cringe? Do you wear shoulder pads? I feel great about shoulder pads. Okay, good. No, but the thing that I looked back on from the 90s, I'm like, no, is I completely took my eyebrows off.

It was a bad, it was a bad look. You what? My eyebrows were like gone. They grew back, though. I blamed Drew Barrymore. Directly. Little Lisa, how did you get the role of voicing Tifa Lockhart in the Final Fantasy franchise? I auditioned for it.

And they played the Japanese version for me, and they were just like, can you do something with this essence? tried and then yeah 10 years with the with the job was 10 years yeah yeah they rotated the cast pretty recently but it was a great time good for you thank you sophie m can you tell us about the audition process for the babysitters club did you audition for other parts in that movie also that is a very smart question i'm impressed that people know that and yeah i think all of us sort of audition for different roles sophia m i auditioned for marian and christie we talked about how you love the babysitters club i do yeah we just Jump in and I'm a super fan.

Yeah, yeah. And I did not find out if I got the part of Marianne for a very long time because they were looking to cast the role of Christy, who's a more central character to the piece. Gotcha. So the audition process was I just, I walked into a room, did my best. I guess it worked out. Maybe no one else auditioned because I am not great in that movie. I mean, honestly, it kind of. You're young. I was terrible. It was 27 years ago.

I don't understand the stakes of any given scene. Like, it is, it's, it's pretty uneven performance when I look back on. You got to look back and just smile, smile at yourself. You know what I mean? I myself. We got to talk real bond about that. By the way, I was supposed to do a movie with you. I was supposed to do this movie, Red Sky.

I was supposed to go to Russia. The guy, Dave Riggs or whatever, took me up in a mig, and we flew and felt the G-Force. And I ended up saying no, last minute. Do you know he's dead now? how did he die flying someone around in one of those planes and he took the director's assistant with him who was a young woman she was only 23 when was that when did he die i think it was around 2013 and i have like like right after the movie no the movie was 2007 or something right yes it was after that by a couple years um oh my god i flew with him he was also a career criminal who spent a

of time in Sing Sing, who didn't have a pilot's license when he was flying you because he buzzed people as a publicity stunt in his plane on the Santa Monica Pier who still had burns and were in the hospital, like when we were shooting the movie. This is all true. Oh, my God. You can look it up. I flew with that guy. He didn't even have a pilot's license? Not an active one. It was literally revoked. I could have died that day. 100%. Holy shit. The other actors fly with him, too i don't remember to honest with you it was his contribution to the movie that he was going to be flying these you know retired russian makes that was like and he did fly them yeah there was no accident scott i wasn't there for that part you weren't there for that part

you were the love interest yeah was it fun shooting in russia no you didn't have any fun i cannot talk to you about the movie really it was it was a whole um here's what i will say it came out uh I haven't even seen. I've only seen the trailer, but it seems like it came out way better than it had any right to. But it wasn't fun for you. It wasn't fun for you. It was, um, it was dangerous and completely insane. It was the most lawless production I've ever been on. Oh my gosh. And nobody could kind of like save us because we were in Russia. You have to get like a work permit to even like get into the country. Like there's no, there's no union can touch you out there. Like it's, it was really wild. Yeah. Jesus. I will tell you some stories that we'll, like blow your hair back later yeah please oh my god look this has been amazing what's what's going on next what are you doing now um i'm gonna in the spring i have a netflix movie coming out what is it it's called a tourist's guide to love i've transitioned um very much into creating my own sort of stuff so yeah your executive producing producing you produced a hallmart movie that was yes i've been

making movies with hallmark who've been incredible creative partners to me but yeah this is my second movie with Netflix and yeah I just I'm a sucker for a good romantic comedy I love that so yeah it's a travel romance called a tourist guide to love and we shot it in Vietnam for two months and that was an incredible experience and it's an absolutely gorgeous looking movie so you got to look me up for a role for something I don't think you can play the Vietnamese guy that's frowned upon these days you have range I'm sorry and by the way I'll call you next to it And your brother, but you're so close with your brother. And he's like, he's doing the new Blade Runner series.

Yeah. I see posting about him. I love that you're so close. Oh my gosh. Ben? Yes, I love Ben to the ends of the earth. He's such a good kid and he's a grown up and I still can't believe it. I'm so proud of him.

Oh. This has been a treat. Oh my gosh. I feel like I'm taking up so much to your time. Not at all. Let you have your day, Michael. This was awesome, wasn't it? Thank you.

You're so easy to talk to. I've been looking forward to this. I had all these things and I never even, I just talked. What's on the things? Will you show me later? No, no, I mean, there's nothing. We talked about it. I somehow memorized it.

I looked at it this morning and I was just like, you know, oh my God, look at this. I think we discussed everything we need to discuss. Perfect. This is great. You had fun. Thank you. I had so much fun. Thank you so much for having me on your show and your home.

Ryan? Yeah. Yes? I feel like there's a question mark at the end of that. Really? Yeah. All right. Thanks.

Wow. What can I say? I enjoyed it. I really enjoy her. She's so nice. She looks, I mean, so good. Yeah. I mean, I would never think she was even remotely close to 40 years old.

She really takes care of herself. You know, I probably look like her, you know. But you don't look 50 either. Oh, 48. Whatever. You look probably 33. How old are you? 34.

Well, with a beard. Yeah. When you shave, you're, you're 28 and that's true well anyway that's true um anyway thanks for listening guys i hope you enjoyed it um please listen continue to listen and uh support the podcast um we've been around for years this is our our first rodeo um we're not a podcast it's just we're not a celebrity here that's trying to just make some extra money i mean you want to make money i guess but you know what i'm saying like this is this is we've been doing we have over 250 guests we've been doing this

we figure ourselves out we know what we're doing here we're helping We're helping each other. You've been around. We've been around. Here are the shoutouts, the patron, go to patreon.com slash inside of you. And these are the lovable folks that give back to the podcast. And without them, I couldn't do it. What accent?

What accent? What didn't we do last time? French Canadian. Nancy D. Elias, Saraville, Little Lisa, Yukiko. And I, Jette, Jolie, Brian A. Loonie, Tuni, O Canada. I don't know what I'm doing, I don't know what that was.

Brian H, Nika P, Robert B, Jason W, Sophie M, Kristen K, Raj, C, Joshua, D, Jennifer N, Stacey L, Jamal, F, JN, B, Mike E, Lahn, Supremo, 99 more, Santiago M, Chad, WN, N, P, Janine R, Mya, P, Maddie S, Belinda, and Dave H, Sheila G, Brad D, Ray H, H, Tabitha T, By the way, I'm going to Telford, to Wales for a con. Really? Yeah. I've never been to Wales. Well, well, Wales? Whales?

Where's Telford? I'd say go with me, but it's going to be a kind of a quick turnaround. That's right. Where's Telford? I don't want to go to Wales? I'm going to love to go to Wales, but when is it? It's in May. It's in May, but it'd be like a Thursday and come back Sunday or Monday morning.

Why is it so quick? Because, you know, you lose a day when you get there. You do the con. come home. There's no reason to just kind of, you know, traveling too much to stick around. It's a whirlwind, man. Liliana A, Talia M, Tom, and Betsy D, Chad, L, Dan, N,

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I love all of you. Thank you for listening. Thank you for supporting the podcast. I want to actually spend, like, a couple of days where I'm not working, where I could just really go. and respond to everybody. It's so hard because you're doing two shows and you're traveling and doing all these things. And I just want people to know how much I appreciate them. So I feel like I want to respond to you. And sometimes I don't. It doesn't mean I don't love you.

And, um, but thank you. Thank you for listening to the podcast today. And hopefully you'll continue listening some great guests coming up. And I'm really working hard to get as many guests as I can that you like and talk about mental health, talk about real shit. So thank you from the Hollywood Hills in Hollywood, California. I am Michael Rosenbaum.

Brad has. A little way to the camera. We love you guys. And as always, seriously, be good to yourselves. Be good to yourselves. All right.

We'll see you. Football season is here. Oh, man. Believe has the podcast to enhance your football experience. From the pros. One of the most interesting quarterback rooms.

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