Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - Reacher’s ALAN RITCHSON: Finding Your Identity

Episode Date: February 8, 2022

Jack Reacher himself, Alan Ritchson (Reacher, Blue Mountain State) joins me this week to bravely discuss his battle with bipolarism and the struggle in finding his true identity in Hollywood. Alan and I talk about being a better fit for Jack Reacher compared to past actors, hitting rock-bottom mentally, and the intense filming schedule of Amazon Prime Video’s Reacher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Yeah. I have to have you. I couldn't do it without you. You could do this all on your loan. No way. It'd be boring as shit. You had fun. It's nice to have you here.

I'm fun? Yeah, I think you're fun. Thanks. Yeah, I don't like to be alone. I think you know that about me. I think that's the main thing. Yeah, I don't like to be alone. No.

Do you? I could be alone, yeah. All right. Well, fine. I could do this I think what we're saying is I should do this I don't we switch around

Yeah I'll just do this And then I'll just hang out I think that works Guys thank you so much For listening to the podcast today If you enjoy it today If you're here for

Alan Richon and you enjoy it I hope you'll write a review You'll follow us on our handles Which are at Inside of You podcast On Twitter and Instagram At Inside of You pod on the Facebook Right, Out Inside of You podcast on Facebook.

Oh, Instagram and Facebook is At Inside of You podcast and at Inside You pod on the Twitter. And write a review and listen. You can watch it on YouTube. I hope you're with us. I hope you listen to us weekly and not just for, you know, intermittently. You want people to listen to you and hopefully like the interviews that you're bringing. Yes. You know what I mean?

I know what you mean. I'm a little slow this morning. A little slow. It is 2 o'clock in the afternoon. Is it 2 o'clock in the afternoon? It is when we're recording. for you we got a great guest today uh jack reacher is coming out jack reacher uh it will be out when this airs so check out jack reacher allen has worked incredibly hard uh my guest today some

crazy stories i couldn't believe how open honest uh alan was it's great it's good one i mean he talks sometimes where i just looked at him like holy shit dude this is yeah i mean he really got deep and you're gonna learn a lot and i think you're going to respect him for his uh his sincerity his vulnerability is uh just being down the earth and real uh guys i want to thank all my patrons if you're listening and you don't know what a patron is you go to patreon dot com slash inside of you p a t r eon dot com slash inside of you um people who give back to the podcast without patrons i don't know where this podcast would be but you guys really keep it going and um those that give back you can look on there

There's tiers. There's a top tier where I send packages to you every four months. I do YouTube lives. It's a family affair. It's a lot of fun. I really love it. I just did a, what you might call it?

A Zoom with all my top tier patrons. Cool. And we had a Zoom. We had a nice chat. It was really lovely. Also, the inside of you online store is open, is around.

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just edit this out i'm getting a free cameo yeah you got a free cameo um I want to thank everybody for coming to see my band Sunspin. We did a live virtual show. We do one at the end, the last Saturday of every month. I really appreciate it. We'll be informing you on upcoming shows. But again, listen to the show, write a review. I really hope you do.

And without further ado, why don't we just get inside of Allen, Richland? It's my point of view. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience. I mean, you're doing a lot of press right now. Jack Reacher is a huge show. It's going to be a huge show on Amazon. Well, we hope.

You hope people watch it. Yeah. Yeah, I hope that 200 million people that have read the books, you know, want to watch the show. I think they'll probably give it a shot. I think the movie was a big success. You got to be intrigued. Yeah, I think so. Yeah.

I mean, and it's good. It's faithful, man. It's very faithfully adapted. For those that don't know, I play Reacher on the TV series. It was a film. It's also, there's 26, 7 books. Are there 27 books, really? A lot of books.

Holy shit. How do they write that much about Jack Reacher? What's so interesting about Jack Reacher? Have you read the books? I'm not a big reader. Frozenbaum. Have you read the books, Ryan? I'm not a Jack Reader, no.

Guys. Not Jack Reader. This is like the second highest selling book of all times. Do you read Harry Potter books? I did read some Harry Potter books. Of course you did. You nerd? I'm a bit of a nerd.

I read two of them. I read the first one and the second one. Unbelievable. Yeah, I'm more into nonfiction, but for watching a television program. Like self-help books? Well, sure. I'm trying to work on myself nowadays. I do the same thing.

Do you, you know, on your Instagrams, you're very open, very personable and welcoming. And I really appreciate that. You're very humble. Like, I see your Instagram lives that you do that. What inspired you to do that? What are you doing? Yeah, that's a good question. Thanks for that, by the way.

You know, I had an, I guess like an early midlife crisis. Really? Yeah, sure. Because how old are you? I've been very open about it. I'm 39 now. You're 39. Yeah.

How old are you? I'm 49. How old are you? 33. A baby. What of infant. Take your diaper off and change it. Change his diaper right now.

But wow. So you had a midlife crisis. I think I'm having one of those now. Are you? In the past four years. Yeah. In what way? Just overwhelmed, anxious.

Had a little bout of depression. Had a little, you know, there's a lot of things that just kind of escalated. So depression, though, this is something I dealt with for the first time. And, you know, I have an understanding of what I think. I personally, this is not like I'm not a scientist here, you know, I think I understand where depression comes from. Talk about it. But what is it for you?

I just curious where are you thinking? I think it's these, these, I think, you know, they always say the past is depression and the future is anxiety. When you're thinking into the future, you're thinking of anxiety and you're thinking to the past is sort of depression. I think with me is when I get anxious or when I am in pain, I almost feel a sense of I'm not whole. I'm not complete. I'm not perfect. I'm not all these things. And it gives me anxiety thinking, how do I get back to normalcy? And what is normalcy? And well, when I was 30s,

I could, and I think when I, in my 20s and 30s, I could deal with high levels of stress and get through it because I was young and everything was, you know, I was more, I don't know if I was more athletic, but I was just younger. And then at a certain level, the same stresses were there, but my body wasn't taking it in like it did. It wasn't, uh, it was kind of wrecking me right so you know I'm like why am I always fucking tired my friend tom's like because you're fucking 49 dude I'm like no that's not it I'm I'm always tired though I'm always people are you okay you're a little tired I'm like fuck you I hate when people do that I hate when people say you look tired especially for somebody like myself who's you know I regenerate

alone like that's when I'm you know I can go you know people see like the characters that I do they're so high energy but when I'm when I'm by myself I'm not like I'm like doing mountains of off the coffee table you know I'm just I'm retreating into myself into my thoughts and right and so people see that in and they think that kind of isolation is like there's something wrong with you right drives me crazy as a performer people expect you to sort to be on and if you're not something wrong with that's exactly right that and I feel like that's you and I are uh we share that that people always think of me as a hyper or you know always on and being funny and the second that I'm not something's wrong with right right and

And, you know, that's, I've had to deal with that my whole life. But also, and I think when you talk about depression, depression can, you know, really be the past. It could be things that have, like, sort of happened in your childhood, things that have happened that you haven't addressed. Trauma. And trauma, certain trauma. So there's, everybody has their demons.

And, you know, I'm, you know, I work through mine with therapy and, you know, try to exercise. And, but I'm just, I expect more out of myself. And that's a lot, a lot to handle. I always, like, you can't be tired. You're not allowed to be tired. You can't be, you, and I'm like, well, what's wrong with me that I can't, you know, and I'm just, I have to, I do have to put things into perspective. Like, you aren't 38, 39.

You are 49. You're going to get more tired. Right. You're going to deal, you know, but not only that, but we live in a culture right now that, right now. We have the Western culture, you know, as long as capitalism has been around, that feeds this idea into our minds from a very young. age that says if you aren't grinding yourself down, you're not, you're not working hard enough.

And if you don't work hard enough, you won't be successful. You know, this correlation between hard work and fatigue and success. Elon Musk, you know, I think tweeted recently something that was just sort of, you know, if you're not working 80, 90 hours a week, you're not, you know, you don't deserve it, whatever it is you're after. I don't know, you know, that's a lot. Not quoting him. But, but, you know, and it's, you know, the fact that we should feel like, you know, deserve poverty or somebody deserves poverty because they decide to rest their body a little bit is a ridiculous idea when you think about it. I mean, yeah, that idea that like, you know, we should be, we should be going all the time is crazy. It's crazy. It's good. That's really,

I think it's what kills us. That's crazy. I think what's what tortures us is that we just don't take a break from it. We don't give ourselves a moment. Right. Yeah. And I think that's kind of what it was for me. I mean, I think it's a couple of things. You talk about trauma. Certainly regret and shame has something to do with the present state of feeling depressed, you know. But I think, I think really for me, I think at its core, the deepest tap root of depression has to do with purpose. And when we stray from purpose or we don't understand our purpose, meaning why we're here and what we're supposed to be doing with everything that, you know, is within our orbit,

I think, you know, that's just one red flag, you know, depression. Um, you know, but also like a very, you know, from a very realistic standpoint, a scientific standpoint, brain incoherency is a very real thing that nobody really talks about. What is that? You know, we've got these five brain waves, right? That the alpha, the beta, you know, they're all fighting for supremacy at any one time, you know, and we are very good at remaining in the, the one brain wave from the time that we wake up in the morning, the time that we go to sleep, that is the most high energy, most demanding,

most sapping. It's the one that we feel like we can problem solve present in the moment. It's almost fight or flight. But that's not how we were made to exist. That's something that we should be able to tap into and then turn that gear off, you know, switch the transmission a little bit. And we're better in a brainwave state that's more calm and reflective and meditative. And we find that our high creative, you know, the most creative versions of ourself is usually expressed in that brainwave state, which we have to force ourself into, you know, especially with all the noise that we have in culture. And how do we do that through meditation, prayer, surfing? Things that they just don't really embed in your psyche and growing up.

Slowing down and meditating is not part of the conversation. That's not part of the, you know, successful equation. If you know, if there's a formula for success today, like we were, you know, it was just saying, it's not, it's not slowing down. down and thinking or finding ways to just move, you know, um, you know, like, you know, there's, uh, there's these adult swing sets that, that are, that are being built that are just about creating a motion for your brain that actually can help trigger a response with your brainwaves that are, you know, really? Yeah, like surfing is, is also, but, you know, there's certain ways to create a flow for your brain that actually put it in a certain state, you know, um, but that when,

when we're in this frenetic brain energy that's taxing all the time and, you know, the body really wants to be somewhere else, that incoherency is detrimental to our spirit, our body, all that, you know, so I think when we're, when we are incoherent and everything sort of all are battling at the same time for some healthy state in us, we might feel or express that as like this feeling of depression, I think, like, I can't handle this. How old were you when you got this, when you had this so-called midlife crisis, what you call it? Yeah, probably, I think it was maybe 36, 35, 36. So you've already at this point, you have three boys.

Right. So you have three kids. You're married and then, I don't want to say you decide to have a midlife crisis. You have a midlife crisis. Yeah, I mean, but, you know, I think for me it was a matter of, you know, you think, I think when you have kids, there's a part of you that thinks there's no way it can ever go. wrong for me. I have to find a way to make everything go right because look at what I am responsible for now. Oof, scary. You know, like, there's no, you know, there's no luxury of making mistakes anymore, you know, or bad decisions or whatever. And unfortunately, you find that like, you know,

like all things, you know, marriage, you know, people sometimes don't, don't use marriage to fix your relationship, you know, those problems will follow you. Same thing with kids. Like, I think some people think, I didn't go into having kids thinking this, but, you know, there's a pressure. you know, as any decent human being, I think would have to go, like, I have to provide stability. Yeah, I don't want to fail and I don't want to like fall apart and I don't want to it's, you know, another way to say it is like, I no longer have the luxury of discovering who I am. I have to just know that moment, this instant, now I'm a father. I better know who I am. If I don't, there's something terribly wrong with this situation. That's going to be out of.

That's terrifying. You know, yeah. And I don't even have to deal with that. And I'm getting anxiety thinking about it. Yeah. Well, and these are thoughts I think that maybe we have with ourselves like on a subconscious level. At least I did. It wasn't something I could vocalize at the time. I didn't, I think I knew somewhere deep down that there was a bit of panic. But you're also, you know, you do what you do

especially when you're young where you're like, I'm like, you know, there's no problem here. I can do this. I can do this. And I'm going to have to do this. I have to have no choice. Get up, Alan. Yeah. You got three kids. Get to fucking work. Let's go. That's it. That's what society and whatever. everybody's telling you sort of like and you are kind of falling apart at the same time right trying to be this man that you can't possibly be or are trying to be right inside of you is brought to you

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It's insane. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter my show name inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum in the survey so they know that I sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from my show. So do you feel like there's a pressure of you're trying to be the best dad, trying to be the best husband, trying to do all these things? and that's what part of it was. Yes, and then trying to reconcile that with reality, which, you know, there were moments

that I, were very difficult, you know, and, you know, keeping my marriage together was very difficult. You know, I was, you know, as my career was accelerating and I was working on bigger films with bigger stars and, you know, and then realizing, you know, not everybody that you work with cares that you're married. And, you know, there's a lot of friction because some people would rather you not be married. And then you're like, maybe I shouldn't be married.

Right. You know, it's very, you know, it's a difficult, it's a difficult place to be. And, you know, so there was a lot of growing pains, you know, for somebody who grew up very blue collar. In North Dakota. And yeah, I was born in North Dakota. I was raised in Illinois and Florida. You know, I have a place in Florida now. I live there now. you know, being confronted with, you know, starlets and, you know, films and the press and what people often, you know, attribute to celebrity, like the, you know, the red carpets and the picture, you know, and I mean, you know, there's like the glitz and glam of it all, which is not all it is at all. It's a very small part of it.

And a part of it that doesn't matter. But, you know, being confronted with that and going like, oh, there's this whole other side of life that I had no idea existed and now I'm being exposed to it but I'm also married and I forgot the young kids and who I who am I did I jump the gun here you know I mean you have to right you start to second guess yourself you have to be lying if I didn't say that you know I've been very open with my wife about this you know and you were enticed there was more yeah sure there's moments where like I don't know if you know I don't know if the life I chose is a life I want right now you know and then you and then you feel a huge amount of guilt and shame for even thinking those thoughts you know

So there was, you know, that was, there was sort of that thing, like, under the cauldron a little bit. But then, you know, bizarrely, for me, it was I had a very good year, like a very good year. Wow. But it was too, it was too much. You know, I took on every, you know, I wrote, you know, I write down my goals at the beginning of the year, put it on paper. Let me put it out into the world. I want to direct a film. I want to sell this script.

I want to sell a manuscript for a book. I want to do. And everything that I, every, I took to. every box you're making it happen yeah dude it was a good here and um you know reap the rewards from that financially you know and uh but servicing all those monsters that i was creating was becoming too much and so i had to force myself into this brainwave state for nine months i like made myself manic to deal with this you know so i've got identity issues issues steel dealing with that sure i mean i think you know um you know not like i was talking about it every day

day, but just knowing that there's something behind the veil there that's like, I'm not sure who I am or what my purpose is here in my marriage or in my life or career. And then I'm manic for far longer than I should be to service all these masters. And then I had the straw that I think broke the camel's back was I had a business partner who I had done everything right for. You know, I had, you know, honored faithfully all our contracts, like, was doing a great job making a successful business for us. You're honest. Very honest. And multiple audits by some of the biggest auditing firms to prove that because there were like false allegations when there was retribution for me deciding to walk away.

But I was confronted with a business partner who gave me an ultimatum, you know, well into our business dealings together. like if I didn't provide this quid pro quo relationship thing that she was going to destroy my reputation and our businesses because she didn't care she had so much money anyway and uh you know you know needing being confronted with this sense of like well you know I know I'm not perfect and I have issues but when you do it all right and this is where you end up anyway in a in like a long drawn out legal battle just trying to um you know protect your reputation because You got somebody making these false acts. You know, I mean, I had lawyers calling me up going, you're dead meat, buddy.

And I'm like, who is this? And they're like, we know that you've been buying houses with, you know, Bitcoin and you've been stealing money from the company and you've been buying cars. I'm like, what are you talking about? Like, I've never audit me then. There's nothing worse than being innocent or not having done anything wrong and being accusing you of it. That's a terrible feeling.

This person looked at me and I said, if you don't come up to my hotel room and give me what I want, I'm going to call TMZ and tell them that you are, you, you was sexually assaulted me. tried to rate me and by the time you clear by the time you clear it up everybody will already think that you're that you know like it won't matter the damage will be done that like that's to my face that threat and I was like you you're making a huge mistake like this that's not I mean and you're feeling this yeah you're feeling the stress you're feeling the anxiety dude all that man so um so so so so you know I flew I flew home after that conversation and a guy lawyered up you know to protect

myself and thankfully like nothing ever happened you know that came of it but um but uh you know that coming coming out of that season of busyness and and all that the manic energy for far longer than we should ever have to sustain that kind of energy this i you know this this this crisis of like faith in humanity you know um a little bit of uncertainty of like where i should be right and identity crisis a little bit yeah it all dude and you you came to your wife And you told her honestly, this is what I'm feeling and this is what I'm thinking. And I don't want to ruin this marriage, but these are kind of what's... I came to her and I said, I think it's better if I'm not here.

Really? Yeah. And what she say? Please don't do anything crazy. You know, it was a very real conversation. Like here, meaning like if you weren't alive. Yeah. You were that bad.

You were dark. It was very, I could not pull myself out of it. You know, because once I got settled down back in L.A., after all of it, after all the dust settled, I was like, I couldn't. couldn't get up in the morning. Like, you know, the things that you talk about with depression, like I could, you know, only wanted to sleep all the time. It felt so foreign to me. Somebody with like this zest for life and this energy that's, you know, I mean, this drive, this work ethic. Like it's, it's insatiable. And to feel like I don't, I can't get out of bed. I didn't

understand why I would want to anyway. And then feeling like now I'm just a burden to my family that my kids are seeing me like this. I can't let them see me like this. This is, I'm like this shell of myself and they see me in bed all day, it would just be better if I wasn't here. And, uh, wow, uh, yeah, man. And I know what that's like. I know it's like just waking up and going, I just want to go back to sleep. I just want to lie down. Yeah. I don't have enough energy for the day. And that's depression, huh? Yeah. Yeah. But that, but that depression is a red flag for something much deeper, which for me was about purpose. And I didn't know. I, so I've been open about this. I've talked about this publicly on my little channel. My, you know, trying to help. Um, you know,

trying to help people who maybe have felt like this and don't understand it, hold on just a little longer. Because if you do hold on just a little longer and you felt like this, there is hope for you. There's hope for a better day where we can remember why we're here, remember who we are and take time to find our purpose. And sometimes that means a big shift, sometimes a little shift. For me, it still sort of fit my understanding of the world, but I needed to make a choice about who I wanted to be and what that, you know, the consequences of that would be in my outward life, you know, and I didn't know that at the time. I couldn't speak to that at the time, but I, I went up in my attic. I had a big house with, you know, second story that I turned into

movie sets. Right. And I went up in this movie set that I'd shot in. It was such a weird, it's still such a weird thing to think about. But, and I don't know why I went up there. I just felt like the only place to do this, the best place to do this. I don't know. And I, I, uh, I strung a green extension cord around some rafters in my set, you know, that's like there's no roof. It's a flywalls and stuff. And, um, and I hung myself. And you hung yourself. Yeah. Yeah. And it's still hard to think about the fact that like, like, I would do something like that to myself, especially with kids. But I, I, I, I now understand what it's like when people are like, I don't understand why they would kill themselves. And I,

I'm like, I can tell you from experience, they thought they were giving the world a gift. That is the saddest lie that we could tell ourselves. But I thought that I was doing my family and my community a favor because I was such a mess mentally. Like I, in nobody ever tells you that like when you get to the top, there's nothing there. There's nothing there. There's just more of that. If you want it, you know. I had ground and scraped and fought to make movies and to make the things that I wanted to make and to sell books and sell scripts and I was doing all those things. And then I get there and I'm like a broken shell of myself with this relationship that threatened to sort of like truly like wreck my life. And I had done nothing to deserve that. And, you know, I'm like, what is life? Like what, you know, I'm so backwards.

Or you thought everything that was going to make you happy didn't. Yes. Everything you wanted to do you were doing, but you still weren't. happy. But I was, you know, but I'm, I'm a victim. I'm, I'm, I'm a product, I should say, of these systems that we all survive in, which is, you know, this sort of capitalist driven corporate, corporatocracy kind of driven way of, of merchandising and commercializing every thought and fear and moment that we have in our lives and never giving us a chance to slow down. And, you know, when, when I was able to, I was on my way out and I saw my kids and I saw them grown up and you really saw that. Yes, I did. And I saw them asking me just like a mature grown adult would say something very calmly without emotion.

Like, please don't do this. It was such a startling image that, you know, them saying, we need you. that I climbed up out of that I pulled myself up and I I got out of that and uh was it hard to get out of that I mean thank God I work out because I mean if I didn't you wouldn't have I wouldn't have the strength to get out you know but I did and um and uh you know so I got up there and did you just get hysterical after that yeah just like kind of lost your mind for a second yeah like this is where I am what is wrong and this is after a good year this is after making making tons of money. This is after like this is after accomplishing all the goals. How

how can that be? Like that's not something we talk about that that that there's nothing there at the top that like you know that life isn't about you know Jim Carrey said it before. You know, I hope everybody gets what they want and gets the riches at their heart's desire so they realize that there's no that's not what life is all about. That's not what will make you happy. You know, some people have discovered that truth. And so you talk about what inspired me to start talking about something more meaningful on my channel. And it was this realization. When I came out of that, I called a doctor that I'd never talked to.

I know a shrink in L.A. Who seemed to be able to help people like this, you know. It was advertising that kind of thing. And I said, I need help immediately like this hour because I don't know what's going to happen. Right. I'm out of my mind. And, and I, he, you know, he sees me. And, you know, it was the first time I ever heard the word bipolar in my name in the same

sentence. He goes, we took some tests together. And he goes, okay, you're bipolar. And bipolar one, and a little bipolar two, you know. And I was like, I go, sorry for custody. A lot of me, you know, I try. I know a lot of young people, but, you know, you follow me because of the stuff that I talk about on my channel.

But I was so pissed. I was like, fuck you, man. And I'm still a little. I'm like, fuck you, man. I'm not. I'm not. you and he was like okay like he's probably done this a thousand times with people right but i almost thought you'd feel like a relief like no man you know what it is you want to put me in a box

you want to put me in a little category especially a category of like basket cases like fuck you man that was your initial thought right yes dude i no i resisted i resisted and then he goes i think there's medication and like fuck you man i'm out and i left i left and i like go down to the parking garage and I'm like sweating and pissed and I know he's right you know he's right and I go back and I'm like I'm a little I'm having a hard time dealing with this but let's talk about what you know of this and then and he goes we don't know a lot about bipolar and I was so he goes but let's get you on this medication Lomotrogen and I'm like what's Lomotrogen and he's like well it was used for antis seizure you know for epileic epileptic people with epilepsy right and

and and and they find that it kind of you know it works for some reason um with uh bipolar and i'm like how does it work like what does it do and what is it what is it what makes me feel like and he's like I don't know I don't know you're prescribing this stuff you know everybody's different you know and I started I started a journey of like really studying this stuff and I I've read every book on bipolar I wanted better answers and now I understand a little bit more about it and I definitely got a lot more out of my research than that conversation gave me but it's also helped me sort of reconcile

with the fact that you know this is actually you know in a lot of ways it's a gift the way that a bipolar mind

works you know I think we have the ability to tap into emotions immediately that and the range is

you know it's like having a 2000 key keyboard and I can I can hit both the highest and the lowest almost without

a delay you know between and most people can't swing that but I think being able to feel those things things gives us an advantage in understanding people.

But the highs and lows are too much. You need help with those. But that's dangerous, right? That's dangerous, right. And if we occupy one space for too long, especially high energy space is too long, that can be very dangerous. You know, there's also, you know, the danger of like reckless behavior, which is something it's, you know, I look back in my life in the past and we start to go like, oh,

it actually makes a lot of sense. Right. The things that I've been dealing with and the seasons of that. And, you know, it's like, okay. And then having a language, having a way to, to. to talk about that makes it so much easier to confront it and you know you don't feel like a freak or like you're a psycho you know like you just it's it's something that we can name and and there are you know we don't understand everything about it but we can understand how to best craft

rituals and routines that help us avoid some of the more dangerous aspects of that kind of brain chemistry right you know and so um you know like my wife and i she have been amazing. I mean, she, we talk about this kind of stuff. We talk about suicide. We talk about bipolar mania. We talk about hyper, you know, we, we deal with these things. And she talks about it like, it's like, I'm going to get butter from the store. Really? Just so, such an open forum for it all. I'm like, yeah, I feel like I fucking want to go into machine gun. Everybody, you know, she's like, okay, let's talk about it. You know, like, that's white bread. I'm going to go get the, you want sourdough or white bread, you know? So had you gone to therapy before this doctor

with bipolar? You were dabbled in it. Yeah, but. the kind of therapy I'd gone to was not for this. It was it was marriage there. It was like marriage counseling. Right, right, right, right. How do we, how, you know, how do we, who were married very young, I've known my wife since high school, we weren't exclusive since then, like she lived a life, I lived a life, and then we found each other again. It was like, where

was this the whole time? Right, right. You're wonderful. You know, how do we now navigate this world that's so foreign to what is, you know, I mean, the life of a public figure or somebody that's like working in TV or film is just it's not something there's no textbook on how to you know manage that and there's so many landmines there are so many landmines

you know and you constantly step on them sometimes you run to them and jump on them yeah with both feet exactly exactly you know so um you know learning how to navigate that together you know um and for her to learn how to deal with that you know realizing that both people out there can say heinous terrible things to her and she's done nothing to deserve that you know like suddenly she's this piece of conversation you know fodder and

and also that there are people out there that don't care that she's married don't care she's a she's not part of the equation you know like you know it's you know it's just she has to let go of a lot you know a lot of fear a lot of anxiety a lot of questions was she kind of freaked out

when you first told her I have bipolar I think it was like of course. Oh, well, that makes sense. Yeah. Oh, okay. You're manic and then you're really, yeah. Would you always, can you tell like that's what, that's what you'd be, you'd be either really manic or really depressed? You know, for her, yes. High and low. But I hadn't really experienced the depression. It was more a retreat from all of life, which has just always been my MO. Like, and it's not me. It's not because I don't like people. I just live in my head. And that's where I recover. And that's a, you know, that's something like the textbooks will talk about. Like,

there are people, especially like high creatives or highly sensitive individuals, a lot of them rejuvenate, regenerate alone. And that's just always been my thing. And so that's sort of what it looked like, you know, the depression was new and it was savage when it struck. It struck so so hard. So it just hit you out of the blue. And what is an overall feeling? Do you feel like you're just you just, you just, tired. Oh, tired. All the negative thoughts, um, not understanding how to get motivated. I mean, somebody who's worked out forever and, you know, my livelihood and. And just have the energy to do it. Energy or wherewithal.

Like, I literally was saying to myself, how does anybody even get up to go to the gym? Like, I'd never want to work out again. Like, there was no motivation to do anything, anything. I could not get my feet on the floor in the morning. When I did, I didn't care. And, you know, and there's also this cynicism to life. You know, like, why are we even fucking here? You know, like, look at how much pain is in the world.

Look at how violent we are to each other. You know, everybody is. out for blood, you know, and everybody's out for themselves. You know, it's a tough thing to reconcile. And so at the end of the day, learning, finding routines and rituals, you know, even something as simple as like making tea at night, you know, it's like something so kind of serene and meditative that it helps pull my brain out of this like feisty place that it lives 24-7, you know. And you're doing medication. You are on medication. And that really has changed your life? Sure. And, you know, I don't know that I'm on it until I stop taking.

it. And then my wife goes, are you on your medication? Don't you talk to me about medication? I don't need medication. She's like, you're off. You're off. Because I keep thinking, I tell myself, like, you know, it goes six months without missing any. And I'm like, I'm fine. I don't need to do this the rest of my life. I don't need to do this. I'm fine. I'm totally fine. Yeah. And then, and then the wheels start coming off. You know, like, I just can't. Like, everybody's so loud. Everybody's so loud. So once you start, you got on this medication, once you started going to this therapy once you had the realization that hey my brain chemistry is different than everybody else's it's just and it just takes a different kind of effort to all of a sudden

you had the the the thought the wherewithal to uh i want to go work out again i had the desire the motivation all these things came back yeah i well i had to force myself to work out it was uh i hired a trainer which i've never done you know i never needed to i you know i mean i think about it now and i'm like i can't believe that's where i what you know um i'm one of the first businesses I ever invested in was a fitness franchise that I run. Like, I'm the guy that runs that stuff. I don't need a trainer. And I had to hire somebody because I was like, this is the only way I'm going to get in the gym. And I told him about where it was. And he, his name is Justin Falah. He was incredible, very patient with me and helped coax me out of that, you know. So I needed to, I did what,

I threw whatever I could at life to help me sort of pull through. But, you know, faith is a big part of it for me. You know, some people, I think, you know, I almost envy people who feel like they can, they're fine going through life without any thought of what's beyond, you know. Right. If that works for you, then great. I have to have faith in something. I'm deeply conflicted if not, because otherwise, like, I don't understand what the point of this. I mean, there's no, there's no way to reconcile the pain in the world without an ultimate sense of, like, hope and justice happening, you know, for myself and others. I mean, there's so many reasons why.

I, you know, but it also makes sense to me. It just makes sense. And it makes me want to be a better person. But I dove into, I dove into that life and started reading everything I could, studying theology, trying to understand, like, is there a deeper meaning and purpose here? And how does that have a real impact on my life? And for me, it's about other centeredness, you know, which is not something I'd ever thought of before. You know, I guess so ambitious, still so ambitious. Still such a. product of my industrial era style education that's like you go be a good worker and that's what you're contributing to society a good thing and to turn around and say like actually rejecting a lot of those ideas and not making the material accumulation that we strive for the most important thing in our lives and finding ways to think about other people and give back to that is actually a more fulfilling and purposeful and eternal kind of way of thinking that maybe I'll do that. And so, um, you know, there was like, altruism, a big part of it. Yeah. So there was a simplification in life. Like so,

you got rid of a house, sold all my fancy cars, you know, that I was accumulating and loved. And, um, and it was less about that and more about like, how can I find a way to get involved in community, involved in other people's lives in a meaningful way, impact the world through like effective charities or, you know, like, just how can I? And that changed you. Oh, yeah. I mean, is that not something. Is that not something. Is that not something, you can do forever and not. I mean, you scientifically, the scientifically, scientific studies have proven that that kind of altruism actually has a true meaningful impact on our state of well-being, that there is nobody who can give of themselves purely and not feel better because of it.

How is that not something that can eternally rejuvenate us? Like forever and ever, like people talk about like, I wouldn't want to go to heaven because I would just get bored or whatever. It'd be so boring. It's like, no, that idea of heaven is a world where everybody's giving of themselves. and that cycle of love is, it's, it's something that continues to fill us up as we give it away. It's this almost paradoxical kind of, yes, it's this beautiful cycle that never ends, you know, and that feels good. And you can start that now. And that's what the whole message is all about, I think, you know.

And you weren't doing a lot of that beforehand. No, I was, I was, I was, giving back or going to hospitals or help me. I used to call my agents and be like, you understand who, what is this audition for? I'm building an empire. here. You know, I'd say words like empire. I'm like, oh, so ashamed now. But I would have those like thoughts. What is that the delusions of grandeur and all that shit? Totally. That's part of bipolar, right? It is. Yeah. It is. But, you know, I mean, when you're having the delusion of grandeur, it doesn't feel like one. It feels very possible and very real. And when you accomplish

most of those, then people start to question like, well, maybe is it? Is it? Is it a delusion? Could he actually pull that off? Like, Well, he's going to doing it here. Maybe he could, you know. Reading, playing, learning. Stellist lenses do more than just correct your child's vision. They slow down the progression of myopia. So your child can continue to discover all the world has to offer through their own eyes.

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No matter the stage of business you're in, visit TD.com slash small business advice to find out more or to match with a TD small business banking account manager. that's pretty incredible it's incredible that you were able to overcome this because you hit rock bottom as rock bottom as someone can hit and you pulled you literally pulled yourself out of it well I would say am overcoming this I mean it's sort of like like yeah a style right like I don't think I don't think I'm ever through it you know and honestly like if there's anything that still tortures me the past tortures me not being able to modify it at all um but But the other thing would be reconciling the fact that, like, there's possibly a lot of, a lot of years left to continue on a path that is, you know, that is fulfilling, you know. And, like, it seems daunting at times, you know. It seems daunting to think, like, oh, I haven't overcome that. That's still very much a possibility or a part of me.

I have to continue to overcome it day by day, you know, taking those steps. You know, there's thousands of them left in front of me, you know, possibly. you know it's uh that sometimes is overwhelming you know well what's over overwhelming as well what could be daunting is taking on a role like jack reacher i mean to get back into that a little bit i mean that's that's a big you know it's tom cruise big time movie blockbuster and then they're doing a series how many auditions did you go on how many times did you meet with these producers for this role yeah you know there's always going to be a chip on my shoulder for this because uh you know i'm also i'm just always going to feel like I have something approve, no matter how many times. Yeah, I just went to dinner with

a lot of people involved with the show. And they were like thanking me because it just shows, you know, it's not out yet. I mean, I don't know when this will air, but, you know, when we're talking about this right now, it's not out yet. When does it come out on Amazon? February 4th. So, so it's being seen by some people, media, you know, industry insiders, test audience. And it's like, everybody loves it. You know, people that have read the books, people that haven't. Everybody's enjoying it. So, like, thank you for all your hard work. and what you've done. And if you didn't work as Reacher,

this whole thing wouldn't work, but it worked. And I think back to my time during the process, they passed on me the first time. And they passed on everybody the first time. You know, but, you know, I've put a tape together. You know, I was approached about this as was probably 2,000 other guys.

And I put a tape together. But the sides that they gave us were probably not the most conducive to an audition because it was all about capturing that sto is. quite, you know, Reacher said nothing is something sort of famously involved in every book. Reacher said nothing. And the sides were basically Reacher said nothing. So there's like an interrogation where he's

just sitting there the whole time. And I was like, I don't know how to play this. But in my mind, I was like, I has to, you know, it's got to have some energy. And so I was channeling, you know the guy from Waterworld who's like, give it a paper, give it a girl, give it a paper. He's trying to trade the paper for the goods. Give it a paper. Give it a paper. Give it a paper. Give it a paper. Kevin Costner's like, all right, don't put the knife to.

I was like trying to channel that guy. that give me a paper, give me to paper, give me to paper, guy. So I'm sitting there in my mind, I'm like listening, you know, imagining this guy trying to just generate some inner, something, yeah, and they hated it. They hated it.

Yeah, they hated it. So they just said, okay, no, pass. No, I went to, you know, the tape went to producer. I got a call that, you know, it was interesting. The Senate to producers and then it just never went further. And like months go by.

And, you know, I've been doing this a long time. You hold very loosely to this stuff. Like, ooh, love the idea of that. That'd be cool. And then nothing happens. You're like, okay, that was meant for somebody else. And it was sort of that. It was just like, all right, I guess meant for somebody else.

And then like, I don't know, four or five months after that, I get a call that, like, they're thinking about redo it, you know, sort of coming, circling back. New casting director, whole new sides. They're kind of reimagining this, the process. And so they were like, I was like, oh, I got a second chance. And so, Minnie Marin, who cast the show, she's a phenomenal casting director. she had gone back to look at the tapes after they reimagined how to approach finding this guy and looked at the tapes that had gone to producers.

So, like, thank God they sent it to producers that time because I never would have been seen again. And she saw something. She saw something in it. And I think with some adjustment, you know, I think with some adjustment, we could, you know, get this to work. But I, when I saw the new sides, I was like, oh, this I can do. You know, and so, yeah, it was probably. seven or eight other auditions. Seven or eight other auditions.

There are so many cooks in the kitchen in a good way. Like not in a bad. I mean, there are so many people who have a vested interest in delivering something that works to the fans as they should. You know, a lot of people taking this very seriously and want to make sure that they get it right. And, you know,

I only owe Mr. Cruz a debt of gratitude for the visibility that he's brought to this role. There are people who comment on the fact that he's not exactly the size that Reacher should be. And that's a large character in this, it's its own kind of character in this. Because you're a bigger guy than Cruz. And that's true. That's true.

But, you know, and, you know, suffice to say that he also still carried those franchises into the hundreds of millions of dollars without that. So that's a testament to him and his talent and craft. Right. He's incredible. But, you know, a lot of fans weren't happy. And so, you know, there's obviously. probably a level of anxiety from the executives going like, we don't want to mess this up

again. And so there's a lot of that energy coming at these auditions, you know, sort of a little bit of trepidation. And it, you know, it kept going, but it was just like, well, now we want you to read for, you know, the Amazon executive, the Skydance exec, this exact, this exact, that exact. Were you getting frustrated? We're meeting people along the way? No, not at all. It was like, okay, as long as this is happening as long as this conversation it's happening like then this is still good you know and it's just another opportunity for me to win somebody over this is the job you know I mean you know how it is like I think as soon as you get cynical I was there was a point in my life where I was like very cynical I came

off a comedy and uh I felt like I mean if you know they should be throwing rolls at me like what I just did on this show that nobody saw delusions of grandeur delusions of grandeur and I was like frustrated that like you know there weren't just like 50 film off you know it was and I you know I got very bitter for a little bit until I had this, this perspective shift, you know, through the loss of a role. But, you know, so it just, I was up for it. I was up for it as long as it was working and it was, you know, but it was, it took a lot of educating Amazon on who I, you know, who I am. And then there was also a lot of questions about hype because this is during the pandemic, so we can't do this stuff in person. And in fact, they flew me out once to test in person. And, uh,

and I get to the hotel in L.A. and they're like, they're going to have to take a blood sample. This is like before, you know, the swabs that we have now, and they're like, they're going to have to take blood sample. And I was like, blood sample. I'm like, this is serious. Like, this is what kind of world? Are we really got to bleed for your craft these days?

I guess that's the world. That was fine with it. I was like, all right, that's fine. And they're like, all right, they're talking to lawyers about it, seeing, you know, how that whole thing works. And I guess eventually they got cold feet about taking blood to secure a test audition. And so I went back and we did it over Zoom. But, you know, I wasn't seeing these people in person.

And that's a big part of this, you know, knowing you can feel somebody's energy and their presence and see their size. So they actually had me measure myself on tape, you know, like head to toe. And I couldn't, you know, I couldn't do it. So I had my kids on a step stool and they were up there like measuring like strip down to your shorts and bare feet show us exactly where that tape is. We want to see how big you are. They saw you without a shirt on and all that stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so there was just, it was a lot of that. It was a big process of like all this stuff. And you were in really good shape at this time. Well, I was, yeah, I was, I walk around at like, you know, if I'm not working out, I run a lot. And I walk around at like 205, which is like still big for a lot of people. Right. And, uh, 2005. I think I thought you'd be bigger than that. Well, I am now. Oh, you are? Yeah, I'm 235. Oh, okay. Yeah. I was like, Jesus. Great.

Yeah, that's, I'm 185, I'm like, hey, you know, I'm like, yeah, yeah, I put, I put on, I put on about 30 pounds for this, you know, but, uh, yeah, I wasn't at the time, you know, I wasn't that big of that. But, you know, I still, I'm just a large guy, you know, guy. A large man. It was just, anyway, but it just, it was a process. And they were convinced that, you know, I guess I was a right guy. So there was a lot of, there was a lot of apprehension when the executive's producer started showing up in prep when I was actually there. Because I was like, now they're going to see me in person for the first time. I hope I'm big enough. And you were.

And thank, thank God. Yeah, didn't get fired. Here's a serious question. Yeah. how honestly how demanding was the shoot that's a good question i mean you filmed this entire 10 episode series you did 10 episodes for this amazon series jack reacher which comes out february 4th the demand on your body and your mind i mean you just talked about in your mid 30s overcoming you know deep depression and figuring out you have bipolar getting on meds getting

healthier finding purpose you book this part i guess it's the right time because you're now on the up what are you going through that's a good question um i think i think uh you know and also for anybody watching who maybe is struggling with a lot of that stuff bringing all that stuff to the light can only help you know i feel like we live in a world where it's you know i'm trying to destigmatize normalize these conversations so we could just let's just get it all let's talk about it you know Talk about it. This is only, it can only help to talk about it. But, you know, I had an assistant on the show, and she's well aware of all of that, you know.

And so it was like, help me pay attention to you, because it's hard for me to see those changes, you know, you know, am I, am I, how am I doing mentally, you know, like, and, you know, and she's like, if, if you need to slow down, like, let's just slow down at any time. Of course, I never said I needed to, but, but you should have. But you can't. I mean, that's, you know, there's like, you know, so the toughest thing, I don't ever want to complain about, I have nothing to complain about. I live a privileged life and I've, I've always, I'm living the dream that I said, I've worked for, you know, I mean, it's a dream come true. You know, what I do for a living, I enjoy, it challenges me, it keeps, it holds my interest, nothing else can, you know, I'm just, I get bored easily. I love what I do. I don't want to

complain, but it was the most challenging shoot I've ever had to endure. and it just about killed me. Really? Yes. And I mean that, I mean that I'm going to, you're going to get some info that no other, I haven't given any other media or whatever, but I'll just get into it with you because I really care. I've watched your show for a long time.

I care about what you do here. Thank you. So I think it's also important for people to know this stuff that I now know. While I'm going through the show, they asked me right out of the gate before we start shooting this. Are you okay shooting seven days a week? I'm like, seven days. a week.

Fuck off. Is that even legal? Where's my union? It's exactly what I was like, yeah. Guys, is that allowed? Like, and they're like, yeah, you know, we'll figure it out. But we need to, we need to shoot that fat. And I was like, why?

The show's never been on. It's not like we're trying to hit an air date. It's never been on. We finish when we finish, you know? And they're like, no, we've been given a date where the money shuts off if we're not done by then. It's July 31st. That only gives us this amount of time.

It wasn't enough time to shoot the show. And so they're like, that's the way we can fix it. just shoot round the clock. And I'm like, when am I going to sleep? When am I going to eat? When am I going to study? When am I going to rehearse the fights? Like, all that. All those questions are like, we'll just have to figure it out. And they go, okay. So I was like, no, I'm not. I mean, just, you know, just for practical reasons, I think seven is a foolish number. Like working seven days a week. It's an impossibility. For a lead actor, it is an impossible. It's an impossibility. They have no idea. And I was like, you know, but I also like, I don't really

I think I should be working on Sundays, you know, for a lot of reasons. Let's just say no. And I just say no. And they're like, all right, well, there's a couple we'll have to have you. And I was like, I don't know, man. And I like, but it'll be six days a week then. And I was like, all right. Six days is a lot.

That's still a lot. You know, but I was like, all right. My last contract, I was lucky enough to go, weekends off. No six days. Every other Friday off. And it was a comedy. And it was like, oh, man. It was just a life.

It was a dream. But like, I couldn't imagine working every day as the lead actor. I'd just, I'd fall apart. up too old. Yeah, and I felt that. Yeah, I felt that. And so I was like, all right, you know, I'm a team player. I guess if that's what we got to do, that's what we got to do. I don't understand it, but okay. And they were like, you know, the way that they solved that problem, because the crews can't work six days a week. They can't do that. So they get their five days. So what we ended up doing was they were shooting something, basically, seven days a week.

And I was on six of those days, but I was swinging both crews. So I would, I would even leave the first crew on like a Tuesday when I'm like normally oh my one scene for the day it's not actually I only have one scene today holy cow and they're like actually

we packed in the second you're actually gonna go shoot some stuff with the second crew today so I was like never ending and if there was a day that was naturally like one or two scenes that was filled there was no time

I was doing stunt fight training in parking lots of sets that we were working and like between takes like okay get back out to the thing we gotta learn the you know the stairwell fight or whatever I'm like all right and I come back into the scene

Sweating, the makeup artist. Like, what are you doing? Why are you sweaty? I just, oh, we got to, we've got to blow dry his hair, you know? We're shooting here. And like, you don't look anything like you did on the other side. I'm like, I'm sorry. I was fist fighting the block of life.

It was nuts, man. I was like, there was not. Talk about like finding a place to calm that brainwave down. I mean, there was not. When did you hit a wall? Um, it was when my, you know, I started getting injured. I started getting injured. And, uh, I started to vocalize about halfway through.

I think this is too much. Like I even for me who I can push myself through like I only need like two more months of this, but I I'm falling apart like I can't do it. I'm sleeping three hours a night. Even on nights when I could get six or seven hours of sleep, I would wake up at three hours. It was like my body was whacked. I was, we were shooting night shoots because I was six days. Usually your night shoots are Friday night. And then you get home at like six in the morning on Saturday. And you have Saturday night to sleep and then Sunday night into like a 5 a.m. call on Monday. You start back on days on Monday. We were shooting six days, though, so I would actually go home at like six or seven in the morning on Sunday morning, and then I'm back into my 5 a.m.s on Monday. That doesn't work. Like, when does it?

No, I was out of my mind. And so I started getting injured. And, you know, we bring these doctors in. And I'm like, just get me through the shoot, whatever it takes. And so they get me these super powerful ensets that are ibuprofen on steroids, you know? Right. Not opiates or painkillers or anything. Right.

is like, you know, I'm thinking, this is great, this takes, and I'm like, I can't lift my arm and I'm like, major issues of my shoulder. I've torn oblique. I was like, there was a working hard. There was a scene, there was a scene where, um, I can see this in the show. I'm going to, I'll tell you, I'll tell you this now. I guess I'll ruin it for you. But there's, there's a scene where, um, I'm in a prison and I have to eat a sandwich. And I could, I was having trouble breathing. Like, I couldn't get enough oxygen. And I know, I know, I, I know, I know, it is now and I there's a medical diagnosis now that I'm getting fixed but I could I was suffocating just living right and so then I do the fights and I was like oh dying you know so I'm going I'm eating a

sandwich like how easy is that and I was I felt like I was going to pass out I could not breathe and I couldn't and the food was in the way so I was like and so you can see if you watch the scene closely I'm trying to deliver my lines and breathe at the same time and it sounds like I'm I just ran a marathon like I'm 500 pounds I'm like I was dying all those ensets that they were given me killed testosterone. I had no testosterone in my body. I got a blood panel later. After I got back, I had surgery on my shoulder to fix whatever was going on there because it was broken from that shoot.

And the reason everything was tearing was because there's no oxygen getting to my muscles because there was no hemoglobin. Testosterone helps form hemoglobin in the body. Hemoglobin is what brings oxygen to your cells. I literally was suffocating to death because of all the powerful pain meds that were helping me get through those fights. I was helping myself push through and doing, I was doing a lot of damage, no sleep, all the physicality, no rest, and then all those pains, medications lowering my testosterone to nothing. I couldn't, I was dying. I was dying.

You can hear it in some of the scenes. That's crazy. And people don't know the kind of drain that it had, you know, the kind of what you put your body through to survive that kind of stuff. But this was intense. So what you're saying is, if this is a huge hit, which I hope it will be, then those will be some adjustments for the next season that was already agreed upon yeah oh well there you go yeah i told i was like guys i can know i can't do this again and like if you think we're going to do this

for seven eight 10 years however many books we want to do which i want to do them all this is unsustainable you know and they're like we agree it was just this arbitrary date one time now that we know what it takes to get this done we'll never do this to you again if you finish the season the way that you have we promised never to do it again and i was like deal um And did you think you weren't going to be able to make it through? Yeah, there was, I had questions. There were times. You know, and I had people going like, just two weeks left.

You've got this. You've got this. But you're like on your like, oh my God. Did you have any anxiety as well from being so fatigued or being so. It was more of frustration. Like I was just mad. I'm not mad at anybody. I just like, I had such a low few.

I had no fuse, which is like I. You had no fuel. Can you fault me? I don't know. I had no. I wasn't sleeping. I wasn't. Oh, so you were angry.

Oh, yeah. People would come over, like, we need to switch your boots out. I'm like, fuck, God, damn it. I had no, I couldn't tolerate humans or sound or anything. And I'd get myself, you know, I would study. I didn't have time to study because I didn't, you know, I'd shoot all day. It's like major, huge scenes. So you just had to learn those scenes on the fly.

So I set up a system on my computer where I had headphones on set in a little office that they would bring around for me. And between takes, I'd learn next episode's side, you know, scenes, you know. And so I'd be doing, I'd go do like a five page monologue. And then in the off, you know, in between takes, I'm learning like a five-page monologue from the next episode. So it was like this never-ending. You have big monologs? Oh, dude. For a reach or said nothing, this guy talks a lot.

For a guy that has nothing to say. I was like, guys, can we just have a narrator? Can we have me narrate like, like, you know, Dexter or something? Like, can I just say? Like, no, we need you. But now, you know, this, people listening to this are thinking, man, this must be an intense fucking action pack series. Yeah, but then you, but I watch it. I'm like, I don't see any of the.

the feeling that I had in my body. Like, I don't know. That's because you're rehearsing constantly, your fight choreography here. He seems laid back and cool as a cucumber on screen. So I'm like, I don't know. Hey, it worked. Maybe I'm just a baby.

I don't know. But, but, you know, this is worth talking about the insides, ibuprofen and that kind of thing. Now I understand having gotten a blood panel done and realizing it was all about low testosterone caused by the inseds. You know,

maybe there's like sort of an extreme fatigue attached to that because of the nature of our work. But ibuprofen, Ns, destroy your testosterone. And if men are out there feeling tired or fatigued or wondering why, you know, it's a mood stabilizer, feeling like you have a short fuse, you don't really, you know, you can't get motivated to go to the gym, it might be that you, you know, like me, take ibuprofen every day because you feel like a back pain or neck pain or whatever. And you don't have any testosterone.

And maybe you need to get on testosterone therapy, which is super easy to do. Yeah. And, you know, do the patch or the shot or whatever, you know. And, and, you know, since, you know, so I started taking testosterone to get my numbers back up. And night and day, I feel like, oh, God, like, this is how I felt before the shoot. And this is how I should feel all the time. I didn't know that. I mean, did anybody ever tell you that ibuprofen will kill your testosterone?

No. No, of course they didn't tell you that. They just want to siphon your money away. And, you know, so you take away the pain for whatever you're feeling at the time. But, man, like, nobody tells you this stuff. Jesus. you know I this has been incredible because you have just opened up so much that I love when guests we had a guest last week that just opened up and at the end I'm like fuck that's it's so

refreshing oh thank you so nice to see someone in the business who's doing really well talk about how hard what they've been through right and how to overcome it and just really but breaking it down not just you know because usually people look at us and they're like oh actors come on you guys get spoon fed in this but to hear your story and to hear all these things that you went through and you're a human being and to not realize to your 36 that you had bipolar is just that's tough yeah yeah that's some tough times that you've had to overcome and this has only been a couple years you've gone through all this right the role of a lifetime

that the chance of a lifetime to kind of rebound and and you know you know save yourself right it's just it's just extraordinary um this is called uh shit talking with allan rich and um these are my patrons these are lovable patrons who they give back to the podcast they i couldn't do it without them uh they're amazing people and they have some questions that's kind of rapid fire michelle k yay yay love alan how does he manage to keep such a positive mindset in such a unpredictable industry what's the secret formula well we've talked about that. Yeah. But what would you say in a nutshell, if you had to say in one sentence, what would that be? I think it's about identity. So my identity is no longer my career, my work.

My identity is something that's far more palatable. Like, like I said, serving others. Like, how can I even, you know, just people I pass in the gas station, you know, like can I open the door for them? Would that make their day better? Can I, you know, are they having a hard time? Can I, How can I approach the world and seize every opportunity to make somebody's life better? That is where I want my identity to be to be found and in serving others. And, you know, if I lose a role or I don't get an audition doesn't go my way or I don't, whatever, that doesn't matter. I've got my identities rooted in something else. That is beautiful.

Leanne, if you could only put one thing on your bucket list, what would it be? I mean, I've done a lot. I've lived a crazy life. But I think now my bucket list is all about travel with my kids. My entire goal for my kids is to open their worlds up as big as possible. And they started, you know, so we talk about travel and we talk about exploring the world and having adventures. And they started, they said out of nowhere, they said, I want to give up my birthday next year and travel instead. And I was like, what? What a mature, wonderful thing to hear out of your young, you know, nine year old, you know, seven year old. And they're all like, yeah, I'm like, where do you want to go? Like, I want to go to Australia. Why do you want to go there? Because they have like the bearded dragons and I want to go see this. And like, this is what? That's wonderful. You love this. Yes. That's what I live for now. You know, so my bucket list is all about my kids my kids bucket list David H. Did you meet Tom Cruise before taking over his

Role and Reacher? Um, no, we've never, we've been, you know, we've, he was, we've never met. I'll just say that. All right. I met him before a couple times. He's incredibly nice. Right. Right. Incredibly. Right. Like, hey. I go, hey, good to see. We met. We met. Hold on. We met at Mike Binder's house. And I'm like, oh my God. Why would you remember? remember me. Oh, and you had. Yeah. I was hoping you'd say, like, we met at, uh, the Paramount party and you'd never had. No, he remembered me from meeting me at another party. Incredible. That's incredible. Dave P. What was it like to have the, uh, BMS boys back together at Mountaineer Khan, Blue Mountain State boys. Yeah, Blue Mountain State will always, uh, take up a,

um, memorable part of my, uh, mind. But I love those guys. You know, we, um, it was, you know, fun college football comedy and the chemistry that we had on that show will never be replicated on any other show. I just know what we had was special. So anytime we get to hang together, it's fun. Danny, yay, when did Alan realize he had a flare for comedic roles? He's got great delivery. Oh, thanks. Oh, guys.

Well. Yeah, tell my wife that. She was like, how many eye rolls I get at home from my one-liners. You know, I'm not going to let you answer that one. Yeah. You don't even need to fucking answer that one. You probably realized it as a young kid. No, man, I didn't, you know, I was an idiot and people hated me when I was young.

I was Ace Ventura, like six Halloween's in a row at school. You know, I'd go to school as a year. I just was enamored with Jim Carrey. I was enamored. His physicality and how funny he was. And nobody else thought it was funny. And so I'd like walk up to kids at lunch and like talk out of my ass in front of their plate of like Cheerios or whatever.

Excuse me, may I ask you a question? you know and they're like get the fuck out of here rich then they hated me i was so annoying oh i love that i love that so i didn't uh i didn't know that it had some you know it's redeeming qualities sebastian k how pissed were you and justin hartley played aquaman in the spin off and you didn't because you were aquaman on fucking smallville with me yeah that's right no i wasn't mad at all why would i be mad well because you you know like why didn't they consider you well they did but they uh people don't know you know what i went through with that but you know, I didn't, I hadn't done anything at the time.

I didn't, I hadn't done anything. Smallville was your first. This was my first gig. First gig. Like you, seeing you want a set, you know, making jokes and whatever. I was like, God, he's so relaxed, you know? Like, you're the first thing I ever saw. Like, you're my mom, basically.

I'm like a little dinosaur coming out of the shell. Let's see you first. Son. Yeah. Jesus. Yeah, because it was your first role. It was my first thing. I didn't know what I was doing.

I was so overwhelmed. I was like, how many people are so many people on this set? I never knew that was your. your first role. I never knew until I read about it. But I remember on set, I was like, he's just great. He did a great job. You were fun to be around. I've always been good at faking it, you know. You were faking it. Oh, wow. Yeah, I didn't know what I was doing. And so the, you know, I was told that the episode that I, I was on season five, the first one that I came on, it was a well-oiled machine at that point. It was, uh, it was like a ratings record,

that episode, you know, which was like astounding having been on for that. Like, it did really well, apparently. So they wanted to greenlight a spinoff. And, and, And they were like, congratulations. And I was getting calls from people at the studio. Like, I'm the guy who's just here to make sure you keep your head on the ground. So you call me day or night. If you're in trouble, I'm like, you know, I was like, why does it go out? Oh, yeah.

These people were like prepping me for like the biggest show on TV. I'm like, okay. And we start working on a deal. And at the time, UPN and Warner Brothers had merged to create the CW and the president of the UPN had taken over. And he's looking at this roster of shows, the slate and going, who the hell is that guy? Which is the same thing I would do. I mean, I was sitting there going like, I can't believe it was this easy.

I've been here three weeks. I got my own show. Oh, my gosh. So they just, he just axed it, exed it, whatever? He can't be. He can't have his own show. And so they called me and they're like, we're trying to fight him on it because we looked for so long and we love you.

But he doesn't want you to do this. We have to go back and find people, but maybe we won't find anybody. And they didn't. They went back and they didn't find anybody. And so they came back again. And they're like, so he said, fine he'll give it a shot you know we'll do the pilot together and I was like great okay great like I give my own show you know I'm sitting cool but I you know but again like

like like with Reacher there's this asterisk bite for me where I'm like I guess I'm not really wanted but maybe I'll run with it is you know so it's like it'd been taken for me and then like a week later they were like actually Justin Hartley just came off passions and he's available and we're going to go with Justin Hartley and I was like I don't know who that is but a great you know. Good for you. And, uh, and I, I learned the best lesson I could early on to hold loosely to this stuff because nothing is guaranteed and nothing's owed to me. And if I hadn't to learn that lesson early, I would have been an entitled asshole. Um, I probably still am, but, uh, much greater degrees. Um, you know, so, uh, it, it taught me to hold, you know, to hold real loosely to this

stuff. And I think that's a great lesson to have right out of the gate. So I'm grateful that I didn't get in. And I also, you know, if I would have gotten that show, I never would have learned, really learned the craft or studied myself. I would have just floated on whatever shows that gate, you know, that would have had some answer. You're going to get this movie because you were on that show. And I've had a very different experience where I've had to like really, you know, find my voice, you know, and studying the voice. Lastly, I'll let you go after this. I had no idea you were a singer. You were like, you were like 80. seventh on American Idol you you did a strip tease in front of what's her name paula paula abdul uh i didn't

know you where you went to school for singing like you're a trained singer yeah it was i was a music theater major until i quit school because i was like what i mean what degree would i use like walk into a broadway audition and go like here's my degree from do you still want to like sing do you want to have your own album do you want to ever do anything with it no not my own album no no um but uh i do love writing i sometimes i'll write for people but um but i my goal is to marry you know um like la la land i think is one of my favorite movies of all time to the you know the the way that they so effectively married music in theater and film is my goal yes that's my secret passion is yes i got to find the newsies was my favorite movie growing up as a kid every year we we would get if we got straight a

the network video would allow you a free rental. And so I was always like a very studious little academic. I want straight A's just so I can go rent the Newsies. And every time I walked in there, Newsies is over there. It was never checked out. You know, like it's over there. I walk with my report card.

I walk out with it. I watched it a million times on VHS when I was growing up because I just, I thought it's just the coolest, you know. What do you sing in the shower? What's the one song you sing? Oh, I don't know. The Newsies. Santa Fe.

Are you there? Do you swear you won't forget me? Say, look at that. Just hit something just like that. What about any 80s classics? I don't know. 80s classics. Duran Duran? I don't know. How about a Duran Duran song? I don't know any of those. I was into N-Sink. I was into N-Sink. Yeah, I was a 90s kid. What do you sing from In-Sink? Oh, what's that song that they had that, like, Justin? Oh, yeah, yeah. God must spend a little more time on you on you on you are you you remember that one yeah yeah that one I used to sing I'd like serenoyed like every sixth grade girl I was interested in I just be I like on my knees I started

saying oh you I yeah is your wife love when you sing to her I don't see I don't sing to my wife you don't sing to your wife why when I sing to my wife I don't know it's kind of cute I already bagged that one I don't have to get on my knees and sing and sick and sick dude this has been this has been a real treat I can't express to you how much I enjoyed this i didn't i didn't know how much i enjoyed you i know i like you i know you're a good guy but i you just opened the hell up and it it means a lot to me it means a lot to the people listening in this show i know they're gonna they're gonna they're gonna just grave about you because you were open up so i appreciate and i appreciate and look i wish you the best of luck

with drag reacher february 4th it takes off you guys you don't want to miss it there were 12 fucking books that ryan and i didn't read one and uh you were also ryan says you were hilarious on Brooklyn 9-9, one of the funniest scenes he had seen, right, Ryan? Yeah, it just connected the dots today. But yeah, that was so good because, yeah, there's these two characters, Hitchcock and Scully. They're these two slubs who just sort of mainline meatball subs at the precinct and they'd take naps. And but then like season six, they decided to do like just open with this cold open of these

two hot young cops doing like an 80s cocaine bust and you were Scully and it was just so gratifying like at the end of it, you're like, like, you're like, you're like, you're like, deal that you were Hitchcock and Scully, but then, um, but then, yeah, their downfall at the end is they do a drug bust at a chicken, uh, restaurant. And they just, they discovered discovered chicken wings for the first time. And then, like, that's when it just stops. But it was just so funny. Like, it was just like, having watched the show, it was just such an integral part. It's like, it's a, you impressed Ryan. It's, that's not easy to do. It's for sure my favorite cold open in the entire show. The 9-9 fans are a sophisticated bunch. That's saying, thank you very

much. It was so great. It was worth of such a payoff. So good. This has been a real treat. Thanks, man. Thanks for having me. Thanks for doing this and allowing us to come open up and hopefully connect a little bit more. Thanks for having me. When he talked about like almost ending his own life. I think about that weekly. Isn't that something how impactful that could be that he was so forthcoming? Well, yeah, I mean, he comes in here with his muscles in his face. Beautiful, beautiful guy, talented guy.

And then he opens and then he drops that story on you. We go, holy fucking shit. Yeah. it really it puts a lot of things in perspective i was just going to say that it certainly does you just kind of go what brings a person to that dark place and i've been in some dark places and you know you just have to realize that there's a light at the end of the tunnel and hey if you're feeling those feelings get some help you can get some help and uh therapy called crisis center like hey if you're feeling that low man say shit you know i have a close friend who checked himself

into the psychiatric ward at the hospital. He says, I'm not well. And good for him. To have the wherewithal, yeah. Yeah, we want to live. What the hell? If we're only here at one time,

it's just like, it's going to be hard. It's going to be tough live. And to clarify the light at the end of the tunnel, not like the light of stand alive, not the one you see when you die. Yeah. I think they got that.

Just though for me. Oh, for you. For me. It was for you. Okay. Okay. Well, that makes more sense. Okay.

I appreciate that. Thank you for, you know, bringing that up. Thank you again. If you like the show today, follow us on our handles. Ryan, what are they? At Inside of You pod on Twitter, at Inside of You podcast on Instagram and Facebook. That is correct. And we await your messages. You could write a review on Apple, Spotify. Please write a review on Spotify. Cumulus has asked me to mention that a few times. And it really helps the podcast. So write a review on Spotify. If you're listening right now, we'll take you a minute and follow us. And I'd love you to join patron. patreon.com slash inside of you if you want to give a little more to the podcast. I'll message

you right after you do so or right when I see the message. I'm on cameo. Uh, the inside of you online stores open. We've got great stuff there. I've talked about that. Um, really great podcast today. I was really impressed with Alan and, uh, well, that's all I could say. I just was a sort of taken aback a few times by his honesty. Yeah. And I thank you, Alan, for doing that. Uh, we're going to talk. We're going to give shoutouts right now. to the top tier patrons. These are people who give back, like I've said a million times.

They give back to the podcast in more ways and you can imagine they keep the show going. And I love them dearly. Here they are. In fact, patrons, I hope you saw the video that I put up on Patreon. I put a video up thanking everybody was for the 200 episode.

Congratulations, Ryan. 200 episodes. Jesus. 200 fucking episodes. Wow. Yeah. Huh. 200.

Huh. That's something. I didn't think I'd pass two. I almost quit. it many times here we are you're just kind of like no one's listening no one gives a shit let's just let's just get out of here and you

keep me going here the top patrons here we go nancy d lea s sarah v little lisa yukeko jill e b b b bryan h neko pete robert b jason k amelia o alison el c josh c jennifer n stacey l just like that uh gen s jamaul f

jenn b roger s kimberley e Mike E. Eldon Supremo, 99. Moore. Mira. Santiago M. Chad W. Leanne P. Janine R. Maya. Maddie S. Belinda N. Chris H. Dave. H.

Correct. Spider-Man Chase. Sheila G. Brad D. Ray H. Tabitha. T. Tom N. Lilliana A. Michelle K. Talia M. Betsy. D. Chad L. Rochelle. Marion. Marion. Marion. Marion. Name a TV show with Marion. as the character. Happy days. Remember happy days? The mom. Totally. Meg K, Dan, N, Angel, N. M. Angel M. Rian. C.

Nice. Corey K. Super Sam. Coleman G. Dev Nexon. Yes. Michelle A. Jeremy C. Cody R. Gaviner. David C. John B. Brandy. L. D. D. Daum. Yeah. Boar. Camille S. The C. Joey M. Willie F. Christina E. Adelaide. Omar. I. Lina N. You Gene and Leah, Chris P, Nikki G. Who else we got here? If you left, Corey, Patricia, Heather L, Jake B. Is that a Jake B? Bobbitt, Ed A, A, A, A, A, A. Able, we said Able, right? A B-E-L.

Yeah, Abel. Able. F. As in Canaan. Kane and Able. Joshua B. Tony G. Sean R. and Megan T. Without the patrons, again, I don't know where this podcast would be, so I thank you dearly. And, you know, thank God for our sponsors. You know, sponsors are here. And hopefully people react, respond, you know, to a lot of these sponsors that, you know,

because what happens is they buy a spot for your show. And if they see that people are using the codes and things, then they stick around. And if not, they're like, see it. And you can't really control that other than trying to sell the product that you believe in. Yeah. So you spend a lot of time saying, Yes, I'll read endorsements for this because I believe in this company or I believe, you know what I mean? It's, it's not easy.

It's not easy. You can't expect your listeners to always not be fast forwarding through shit and you hope they don't. So thanks for putting up with me. Is there anything else we need to talk about? 200 episodes, Patreon, you know, all that stuff. I think we've got great guests coming up. I really have a lot of great guests coming up. And the last two months of guests have been awesome.

You know, we had Jensen and. Tom Welling and Brandon Routh and Angie Harmon and Chris Diamantopoulos. Yeah. You know, he was a great guest and a lot of people don't know him and he's not on social media. And so it's hard. You think who's going to watch this, who's going to listen? And I urge you to listen to the last podcast with Chris Diamantopoulos because you're going to love him.

His impressions. He does uncanny. Uncanny. Johnny Carson and Robin Williams and Three Stoges. Mo and his story about the Three Stooges with the Fairley brothers, how they paid him nothing to do the lead role in that movie. So I urge you to listen to some podcasts that you may not be interested in Christy and Metopolis, but I'm going to let you know about that. Thank you for listening today. Wherever you are, thanks for spending an hour with us. It really means a

lot to me. And I can't wait to give you some big news that's coming up. I can't really talk about it yet, but it's really fun. And I think you're going to dig it. But until I am Michael Rosenbaum from the Hollywood Hills of California I'm Ryan Taylor's from the Hollywood Hills of California Hey baby All the way to the camera

We love you guys Be good to yourselves Alright be good to yourselves I heard a good quote It's very simple But it was effective It was Yesterday is history

Tomorrow is a mystery Today is a gift And that's why it's called the present yesterday is history tomorrow's a mystery today is a mystery today is a gift that's why they call it the present i like it was that martha stewart no but i dig it i saw it and it kind of put a tear in my i'm like you know sometimes you need to pay attention to the to the obvious we're here right now stop worrying about the future stop worrying about the past we're here we're in this moment so just remember that i hope you have a glorious day and come visit us next week we'll keep the light on for

I'm allowed to say that. Yeah. All right, great. See you guys. Football season is here. Oh, man. Believe has the podcast to enhance your football experience. From the pros.

One of the most interesting quarterback rooms to college. Michigan is set at eight and a half wins. To fantasy. If you feel that way, why didn't you trade them? Become a better fan and listen to the football podcasts. Believe. Just search Believe. That's B-L-E-A-V podcast. Follow and listen on your favorite platform.