Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - RUDY MANCUSO: Art Imitating a Synesthetic Life in ‘Música’ & Pushing Past Influencer Stigmas

Episode Date: June 18, 2024

Rudy Mancuso (Música, Awkward Puppets) joins us this week to share the drive and passion behind his directorial film debut: Música. He talks about the lived inspiration of synesthesia, why stopping listening to other was the smartest thing he could do, and how Camila Mendes was the only feasible option to star in the film. We also talk about being disengaged from non-quantifiable social media statistics, his Brazilian/ Italian upbringing, and his evolution from Vine to directing major motion pictures. Thank you to our sponsors: ❤️ Betterhelp: https://betterhelp.com/inside 🚀 Rocket Money: https://rocketmoney.com/inside 🏈 PrizePicks: https://prizepicks.com/inside 📞 Mint Mobile: https://mintmobile.com/insideofyou __________________________________________________ 💖 Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/insideofyou 👕 Inside Of You Merch: https://store.insideofyoupodcast.com/ __________________________________________________ Watch or listen to more episodes! 📺 https://www.insideofyoupodcast.com/show __________________________________________________ Follow us online! 📸 Instagram: https://instagram.com/insideofyoupodcast/ 🤣 TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@insideofyou_podcast 📘 Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/insideofyoupodcast/ 🐦 Twitter: https://twitter.com/insideofyoupod 🌐 Website: https://www.insideofyoupodcast.com/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When you're with Amex Platinum, you get access to exclusive dining experiences and an annual travel credit. So the best tapas in town might be in a new town altogether. That's the powerful backing of Amex. Terms and conditions apply. Learn more at Amex.ca. This.c.com. This episode is brought to you by Defender.

With a towing capacity of 3,500 kilograms and a weighting depth of 900 millimeters, the Defender 110 pushes what's possible. Learn more at landrover.ca. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. What a great guest. It's been a good, strong couple of weeks. Thanks, Ryan. You've been good?

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. In terms of the podcast, great. Yeah, everything's been good. We've had some great guests, you know, Kevin Smith and a lot of great guests coming up as well. And then there's some on the horizon. I think I'm going to get Zach Brathen studio and Pat and Oswald's coming on. And very exciting stuff. Listen, I appreciate you guys listening.

And I'll just say a few things before this just to make you aware of. And we'll get into this awesome interview. I really loved Rudy Manusco, Mancuso, Rudy Mancuso. Yep. If you don't know him, you will know him. He's fascinating. Just, just fascinating. Trust me on this.

He's, boy, I wish I had his drive and his passion. He's one in a million and I really like the guy. But just so you know, if you, want to support the podcast at inside of you podcast on instagram and facebook at inside of you pod on the twitter please follow us write a review it really helps if you want to support the show this little show and you want to support it go to patron p a t r eon dot com slash inside of you patrian dot com inside of you and support this podcast so we can keep it going we have candid open conversations about mental health and and so much stuff and it's become popular with a with a certain demographic

a certain but it's really for everyone i noticed that not really a certain demographic i think everyone from all walks of life and ages have have approached me about how much the show is meant to them and i just uh i really enjoy doing this so if you want to support us patreon dot com slash inside of you you can go to my instagram and support me at the michael rosenbaum and my link tree has cameos upcoming cons with me and tom welling potential live podcast shows my new uh product rosy's puppy fresh breath, which you've probably seen the commercial, or you will. But it's just a cat full of in your dog's water and goodbye, bad breath. That's it. They don't taste it. It's odorless. It's great. People are loving it. I hope you'll support that. Rosie's puppy fresh breath on Amazon. You could order the book, my book, The Talented Fartter, which comes out in October. You could pre-order it. It's a fart book with fart sounds, but it's it's touching. It's beautiful illustrations. And I'm very proud of it. And I'll be promoting that as we go on. And, yeah, I'm on the cameo.

And we have a Smallville con coming up in October. I'm trying to get Ryan to go to. And we'll have a lot of Smallville people there. It's the first Smallville event in New Jersey. So go to my Instagram link tree with that. And my band, Sunspin. Sunspin.com, support us, follow us on Spotify, all that. Yeah, we're making our next album.

So if you haven't heard of Sunspin, take a listen. it's the intro song for talkville and last but not least on the inside of you online store we've got tons of merch signed lexmus scripts and signed ship keys from smallville and awesome tumblers and shirts and small the lunch boxes and all that stuff so that's about it but thank you for listening and supporting the show um ryan anything this week no man i mean you know we're wrapped on on talkville until season which will start airing on July 17th and for the first two episodes of that Tom came to the house and it was fun having him it was nice it was good to see Tom in person for once that was yeah it had been a long time coming yeah it was really good it was really good to hang out with my boy my boy all right Rudy Mencuso he has a movie called musica musica or musica and uh I loved this movie he directed it he wrote it he choreographed he did the music he acted in it it is phenomenal and he is a talent that you want to keep your eye on and he came in and talked with us and he's so humble and so smart articulate and uh i really enjoyed having him here so listen and learn something as i did and ryan did let's get inside of rudy mcuso it's my point of You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum was not recorded in front of a live studio audience.

And I started, I watched the trailer for Musica. Musica. Musica. Yeah. Musica. I started watching behind the scenes. I started like, I'm being 100% transparent. blown away by you wow blown blown away like very nice thank you know because sometimes you feel like

you know oh maybe an influencer or maybe internet and how you know how did this and then you're like you're the real deal though dude you are that you're an actor you're a director you're a writer you're a composer try musician it's it's it's pretty it's pretty freaking cool to see and you're how old i'm 31 right you could easily play 24 wait 31 are you don't ask me i genuinely forget sometimes that's how that's how uh foggy i am these days if i was born 92 i'm 31 right uh that's uh 8 28 28 29 33 1 32 i'm 32 you're 32 unless you're turning 32 when's your birthday February so you just turn 32 right are we sure yeah i've never had this out right now i've genuinely never had this happen

before really i don't know what age i am that's because you don't have time to think about I got so used to saying I was 31, looking forward to 32, that I think I forgot that I actually am 32. First of all, I'm so overwhelmed that I'm like, where does it all come from? This, like, you know, this mind of yours. And I thought like this, you call it, what is it? It's like, it's not a disease, but it's a condition, if you will, synesthesia. And that's real? It's very real, yeah.

And I think I discovered that there was a name for my experience a little too late in life. I quickly realized what a fantastic backdrop for storytelling. What is it that you hear? How do you describe what that is, synesthesia? At its core, it's a neurological condition whereby an individual's senses are somewhat intertwined. So they experience one sense through another involuntary sense. There's over 100 different types of synesthesia and counting. Simply put, a lot of synesthetes can perceive sound.

as color, for instance. That's probably the more popular version. Wow. Which is known as chromesthesia or sound to color synesthesia. And then there's other synesthetes who can taste numbers, who can smell days of the week, who can personify or, you know, ordinal figures. There's so many different types and it's kind of just a cross-wiring. The kind I have is a musical synesthesia known as rhythmic association where my brain, involuntarily, tries to turn everyday regular sounds into some kind of musical construct or rhythmic. So if I was doing something like, you know,

all of a sudden a beat goes in your head, if I start tapping. Yeah, I mean, look, it's not quite like musica where it's not as grandiose, where things will turn into this elaborately choreographed musical piece. But yeah, like even what you just did, I'm trying to dissect the cadence and turn it into a musical that music that's correct, more correct. Does that, I mean, obviously there are advantages because

you have this wonderful mind, but are there disadvantages where you feel like you can't focus a lot? It's hard to listen to someone. Absolutely. Relationships. They're like, you're not with me here. Where are you? Exactly. Very much a blessing and a curse. Now, you know, I'm 32 and I've lived, I've lived with this for so long. I've figured out how to manage and control it and balance it and channel it through creativity. But there was a time when I didn't have those creative outlets. I wasn't making videos. I wasn't filming stuff. I wasn't composing. It was all in my head. And that's when it was at its worst. And that's that's around where the film takes place. And so you grew up in New Jersey, but were you born in Brazil? No. I was born in New Jersey. My mother's born in Brazil.

And your father's Italian. That's right. And I spent a lot of my childhood in Brazil, but I was born in Jersey. Do you think, you know, spending a lot of time in Brazil shaped you? to be the way you are, how so? Well, it's vastly different culturally. The ideology is completely different. The smells, the taste, the sounds. It was a completely different universe, specifically huge genre of Brazil, Rio is where I spent a lot of time

in a town called Copacabana. It's where my mom's from, it's where all my family's from, my aunt lives there. and yeah, it's literally and figuratively to completely different languages. So growing up with that is a little bit confusing, ultimately very rewarding. They're very conflicting ideologies and stances,

and I try to explore that in the film, the experience of being a child of an immigrant, which a lot of people can relate to. But I think everyone can relate to an identity, a bit of an identity search in their youth. I'm still. I'm still, I'm 501, I'll be 52 and I'm still... You look great.

Well, you know, I'm trying. What's the secret? Horror films. Secrets horror movies. I think connection friendships, that inner child, letting it come out, having fun.

Trying to create an element of fun to me is, I don't want to lose that. And I think if I do, I'll lose myself. And so I just try to, because there's work, there's work, there's work, but you've got to put time into just enjoying yourself and trying not to always think about work. Like saying, hey, that was successful, that was good. Let's celebrate. I'm looking at you and I'm thinking it's hard for you to unwind and do nothing. Yeah, but no, I mean, achieving that balance is the most important. I often find it hard to find the distinction between where work ends and, you know, life begins because they're also intertwined for me.

Yeah, yes. It's like I'm, you know, this is fun and it's life, but it's also work. Making that film was obviously work, but it was quite literally. recreation of my life and it's what I love. So where does passion start? Where does the work end? And where does life? So you're saying it all just intertwines. For me, it's like a convergence of all those things. It makes sense. It does because, you know, uh, you know, I'll do this. I'll write. I'll write a script. I'll write. You know, and I think I'm having fun in the moment. Right. You're working still. Absolutely. Which is a dream come true. Yeah. If you could

enjoy it. But man, it's even like going at dinner with a friend who's also a creative and having conversations. In a way, you're working, right? We're writing. We're creating. We're, we're ideating. I have a hard time compartmentalizing things and scheduling things. Like, I'm going to work until five, then I'm going to go to dinner and then take a break. That's not really a break if you're talking about work. That's true. Do you find it hard to, do you have someone who schedules all your things? Do you have someone who like, I mean, are you able to, you? Are you able to, you? to compartmentalize when it comes to like dating like all right we're going to go to dinner at seven so i can't just you know forget about that or yes yes no i i i do have someone who who

tries to schedule schedule my life um my sister who i work with um they always say never work with your family i know i know but uh on the other end you know no one knows me better than her and um i don't trust anyone quite as much as i do her so she's very creative so uh it works out and um and she'll tell you you if something's good or not, won't she? Exactly. If I don't have her approval, I can't get past it. Are there some things where you look at her and go, how do you not think that's good? I don't understand. All the time. What is it about that? Yeah. And she'll say, it's just not real. I don't think that's that funny. Yeah, because she knows too much. And you'll listen to her. I will. She's my older sister and I look up to her very much.

And now we work together. Even on set, she was after every take, the first person I would look at is her. And if I see any hints of disapproval, we're going for another. So she'd look at you, I don't believe it. When you get hit with the fish, it didn't look real. You were expecting it. Yes, you wanted way too many takes of that bit.

Well, I mean, I don't, it's, I got so many thoughts. It's like growing up. I mean, you're obviously really bright

where you, did you excel in school? Nope. It's terrible students. You're so articulate. Am I? I think so. You've used three words

that I don't understand. I'm just a bullshitter. Are you? Are my last curse on this? Yeah. Okay. I'm a fucking bullshit. You're a fucking bullshitter.

No, I, really hard time focusing because of all this stuff we're talking about. Yeah, a massive learning disability focus issue. You know, if an exam was, if an exam wasn't standardized and it was just talk about this event in history and what it meant to you, I'll give you 100 pages. But as soon as you give me A, B, C, or D, you lost me. Can't do it. Can't do it. I flunked everything. Yeah, I was, I was terrible too. Unless I find something, if the teacher makes something interesting, right, and almost you're forced to listen because, not forced to listen, but you want to listen.

Yeah. Like there's some teachers along the way. I don't get it. Like, why did you get an A that semester? Right. Then you got a D the next semester. Or you got this. And my grades were never good. And I always felt like I wasn't smart. And, but, you know, we have, there are other qualities. smart doesn't just mean you're good at getting good grades or you take tests well or there's wit and there's there's certain street smarts and there's so many different variables and uh were your parents uh would you have good parents great parents i mean they i'm the product of them uh my father's from italy my mother's from brazil they there's a huge like clash of cultures they met in newark new jersey they had my sister and i did your dad have that italian accent um yeah you know it's odd it's like he Italian is his first language

obviously and he has an accent but it's a strange hybrid of like the Jersey American but also but also an Italian but he also lived in Venezuela so it's this kind of it's hard if you were to hear him speak you would not guess that he's from Italy it's a there's an ambiguity

to his talent to his accent right um and his talent um is he talented what does he do he's like an insanely good athlete really yeah um and has a an incredible ear but uh is not musically inclined and my mother an incredible ear not musically inclined um and uh and you know music just always made sense to me it's and it's not attributed to my parents uh or grandparents even but i think somewhere in

the lineage there there musicians and when did you know you wanted to get involved in like you wanted to be a personality you wanted to direct or write was it young yeah right away right out of the womb got a camera really documented the whole experience um i knew i wanted to tell stories i was obsessed with music when i was five i walked over to piano and started playing just playing yeah just made sense to me it's like you know that's seen in goodwill hunting yeah why not that i'm comparing myself to a genius but you're our prodigy but what the way he explains being smart yeah and having this quality about him he didn't ask for it's not something that he developed, it just kind of is, and he explained some people, Beethoven would walk over

to piano and it just made sense to him. And he says, that's the best way I can describe it. It just is. And for me, it just is. Like, music just made sense to me. I looked at a piano and I just knew how to emulate the sounds that I was hearing, the music I was hearing. And yeah, I try to get the lessons and I try to go to band class. None of those things worked for me. No. No, I had to just I never practiced, but I play a lot. Can you read music? No. So someone says C sharp to an F minor seven or whatever.

Yeah. You're like... No, so I understand music theory, right? Like, I can break down chord progressions, and I know how to read music, but I don't know how to sight read. It's like it would take me a very long time to tell you what note that is.

I'd have to go each line. E, it would take me that long. Whereas most classically trained musicians, it's uh it's like uh second nature right did your parents notice something about you that they're like we've got to let him he needs help we're in trouble no not need help but like we've got to give him the tools that he needs to to be to do what he's capable of is but they're quite traditional although they love music and they supported it and they love creativity and film it was never realistic i always say there's there's people along the way you don't need a

lot of them, but you need a few that believe in you, that say, I know you're going to do great things. I know. Were there people like, they're like, you have something special. There's something special here. Yeah, I didn't have a ton of those. You didn't? No.

Did they think, what was their perception of you? Weirdo, big hair, all kinds of crappy things. Really? Kind of. Not charming. Nah, not so much. You weren't that charming or popular? No.

No, no, no. I mean, when it came to junior, senior, senior year of high school, things started to change. But for a lot of my life, I was very reclusive. I was bullied when I was younger because I was very heavy. You were heavy? Yeah, extremely. I can't even imagine you being heavy. I'll show you a picture, man.

I'll show you a picture. You were heavy and you were picked on. You had a kid in Matilda who eats the whole chocolate cake. Kind of like that. Big. And short. So just, you know. And what would they say to you?

I just call me all kinds of names for being heavy, you know. Did you ever cry? Were you? No. So I quickly realized that using wit and comedy and bits to outsmart the bullies was the best defense mechanism. That's what I had. Yeah. I just would say something smart ass or like make everybody laugh and they would take the attention off of what my hurt. That's right. Reflect the hurt. Or disarm them by being self deprecative first. Yeah. It's like I'm a fat piece of shit, but I'm strong and I'm smart. what are they going to say yeah yeah that's what you did yeah uh so i guess your mom was a good cook growing up fantastic so you were eating you were eating italian and Portuguese like a Brazilian

meals yeah there was like Brazilian Italian culinary hybrids growing up um but yeah and then and then eventually I had I lost a bunch of weight as I started like growing and being more conscious of my lifestyle um and you definitely definitely had an effect like there was a there's a fat boy syndrome that's very real i always say that i was just talking about you know when you're young and someone calls you dumb and you keep hearing it you could go to therapy and you could you know say oh obviously i'm not dumb how could i be but there's always that dummy that you're feeling which motivates you a lot of ways hopefully and doesn't make you more of a recluse and impedes you from doing the things that you want to do exactly right yeah um i mean you went on

to like direct big videos and things like that how did that start how did like that that world begin friend of mine while i was attending ruckers newark told me about this app called vine inside of you is brought to you by quince i love quince ryan i've told you this before i got this awesome sixty dollar cashmere sweater i wear it religiously you can get all sorts of amazing, amazing clothing for such reasonable prices. Look, cooler temps are rolling in. And as always, Quince is where I'm turning for fall staples that actually last. From cashmere to denim to boots, the quality holds up and the price still blows me away. Quince has the kind of fall staples you'll wear nonstop, like super soft, 100% Mongolian cashmere

sweaters starting at just 60 bucks. Yeah, I'm going to get you one of those, I think. I like to see you in a cashmere. Maybe a different color so we don't look like twins. Their denim is durable and it fits right and their real leather jackets bring that clean, classic edge without the elevated price tag. And what makes Quince different, they partner directly with ethical factories and skip the middlemen. So you get top tier fabrics and craftsmanship at half the price of similar brands. These guys are for real. They have so much great stuff there that you just have to go to Quince. Q-U-I-N-C-C-E. I'm telling you, you're going to going to love this place. Keep it classic and cool this fall with long-lasting

staples from Quince. Go to quince.com slash inside of you for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash inside of you. Free shipping and 365-day returns. Quince.com slash inside of you. Inside of you is brought to you by Rocket Money. I'm going to speak to you about something that's going to help you save money. Period. It's Rocket Money. It's a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions, monitors your spending, and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. This is just a wonderful app. There's a lot of apps out there that really, you know, you have to do this and pay for and that. But with Rocket Money, it's, they're saving you

money. You're getting this app to save money. I don't know how many times that I've had these unwanted subscriptions that I thought I canceled or I forgot to you know the free trial ran at Ryan I know you did it that's why you got rocket money I did yeah and I also I also talked to a financial advisor recently and I said I had rocket money and they said that's good this will help you keep track of your budget see see it's only we're only here to help folks we're only trying to give you really know things that will help you so rocket money really does that rocket money shows you all your expenses in one place including subscriptions you forgot about But if you see a subscription you no longer want, Rocket Money will help cancel it.

Rocket Money will even try to negotiate lower bills for you. The app automatically scans your bills to find opportunities to save and then goes to work to get you better deals. They'll even talk to the customer service so you don't have to. Yeah, because I don't want to. Press 1 now if you want to. Get alerts if your bills increase in price, if there's unusual activity in your accounts, if you're close to going over budget. And even when you're doing a good job, Rocket Money's five.

million members have saved a total of $500 million in canceled subscriptions. With members saving up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features, cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter my show name inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum in the survey so they know I sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from my show inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum.

Rocket money. And he said that the parameter is you have to tell a story in six seconds and then the video loops. And I was kind of off the grid. I didn't really understand social media. Still don't. But I was attracted to that challenge of telling a story

in such a short amount of time. And then it looped, which was perfect for music. The nature of the loop is perfect for a joke. Six seconds is all it is. seconds yeah so essentially if you think about it story structure perspective it's two seconds per act um so you kind of have a setup and you have the punch and then you have a payoff and um and then a loop so i'd do music stuff i do little characters i do bits with my mom the puppeteering the puppet stuff and then you know the videos started getting traction and quickly took off and i got a just a bunch of an audience on vine

that translated to other social media to youtube got directing gigs scoring gigs were you surprised by all this, that you were being able to do this on Vine? Was it something that you looked at like, I could do this, I could do something special, oh, this is going to be great, but you had no expectations, really. Correct, yeah, and neither did Vine. They didn't, I don't think they

realized what they had, the, the niche community that was to follow. It was just meant to be a kind of a fun tool, and it turned into a phenomenon. And it was the first time that had ever been done. This was before there was TikTok, Instagram video. It was

The only time, the only places you could create were YouTube. And then this thing came about and kind of changed the ecosystem, the digital ecosystem of online creation. And I was surprised, of course. It was not intentional, but I wanted to make movies. And I wanted to make music for my movies from very young age, as long as I could remember. I think it was like six or seven. What's your favorite movie? Or what inspired you?

As a kid, I watched a little too young, but I would, I, that's another thing. It was such a cultural, eclectic clash of films and music and TV. First film that I watched was probably Central Station, Centrado Brazil, that I can remember. And then shortly after, because they came out in the same year, his life is beautiful, Roberto Benini. What a beautiful movie. Jesus, yeah. I cry every time I see that movie. Tell me about it.

I cried thinking about it. And both films came out in the same year, in fact, competed against each other in the Academy Awards. awards. And my mom's a patriotic Brazilian. My dad's a patriotic Italian. So you can imagine, Italian won that year. My dad still talks about it. I think my mom made a move out for like two months because of it. Every time it was a World Cup, by the way, and it's Brazil and Italy. Big. Divorce. But they get back after. So yeah, you know, films like that. Films like that. Right. But then also, you know, my sister made me watch Pulp Fiction. I was like, what the hell is this shit? Did you like it? And not the first time. I was too young. I was like,

This is weirdish, like, what the hell is going on? What's the gimp? Yeah, gimp, like, this is too much. And then I rewashed it, and I rewashed it, and I rewashed it, and reservoir dogs. And then all of Scorsese's work. I watched taxi driver, Goodfellas. Do you quote anything? Do you quote any lines from any movies?

And, yeah, all the time. Harry your names. Mr. Blue, Mr. Black, Mr. Purple, Mr. Brown, and Mr. Pink. That's a really good... What do I got to be Mr. Pink for it, Joe? Because you're a... Exactly, exactly. Isn't Mr. Brown a little close to...

Mr. shit, these are your names. There's two ways you could deal with this, Mr. Pink. My way on the highway. What's it going to be? Mr. Pink, it's beneath me. Move on. I used to love that. Very good.

Yeah, yeah. That's almost word perfect. He used to watch it religiously. And I like it when Harvey Keitel interjects or someone interjects. No, excuse me. Will you repeat that? I didn't hear that. That part?

No, no, no, no, no. interjects during this whole uh uh color name and he's like yeah it's like yeah it's easy for you to say you mr brown that's a cool sounding name mr white mr white it's a cool sounding name he's like uh you want to trade he's like no trades he ain't gonna be no trade dude hilarious that's such a great movie have you seen that oh man it's been a while yeah who hasn't come on when he's in the back seat and he's i'm dying larry i'm dying are you a doctor are you a doctor then you don't know what the fuck you're talking about uh so anyway like you started doing this vine stuff, you're putting things together,

you're already by this point, early on in your life, you're thinking of making movies, you're thinking to make it, like, this is all in your head and had it started really off Vine? Yeah, no expectations, just a cool place to create. And then I started getting a following. And then that's when the light bulb came. And I was like, if I could somehow use this as an avenue

to get to where I really want to be, which is making movies, wouldn't that be something? So the audience came, Brands started getting interested. You were making good money. Yeah, yeah, making good money enough to move out to, actually, I moved out to Los Angeles because of a friend that I went to college with named Rami, Yusuf, who now has a show called Rami and is a great actor and creator.

And he was on a Nickelodeon show at the time, and he was like, dude, you got moved to L.A., like, Ruckers, Newark, like, this stuff is not, like, this is where we belong. So I followed his footsteps. And then I started doing the Vine stuff while he started, his TV stuff started taking off, and we lived together for many years. And when we moved into a house together and we were both making solid money in different ways, that's when he started writing Rami

and I started writing Musica. What year was that? 2015? 2015. 16? Something like that. Is it something, music like you had in your head,

like it was easy to write? Or did you really have to? Like, how many drafts before you got it right? I imagined it at first as a serious, series. And I quickly realized that I had to stop listening to others, you know, agents, producers, and producing partners, opinions of what it should be and what the market is requesting. And I said, this is a feature. Like, movies is what I know. I know how to structure a movie just because I've watched so many. And they were thinking, oh, this naive young kid,

he doesn't, he doesn't know. I'm sure they were getting that. I said, I want autobiographical experience because I feel like I've never seen cynicism. Depicted on screen, I feel like I've never seen Brazilian culture represented in this way on screen. Certainly not the Brazilian American experience. Can I take something as formulaic as a rom-com and counterbalance that with some complex ideas, which is Brazilian culture, the Brazilian American experience, and synesthesia? And that was the vision. And everyone was like, dude, just make a movie about a guy who moves to Hollywood,

It got and getting famous on the internet, like a modern day digital entourage. I was like, I don't know if I'm passionate about that story at all. That's the key. You got to be passionate about it. So that whole series idea fell apart. Year later, I met Dan Lagana, great writer, a collaborator. We have a very symbiotic relationship and process. And, yeah, I shot a sizzle.

I took that sizzle out. Amazon loved it. How much did the sizzle cost? cost about 15 grand 15 to 20 grand yeah it's like the most and you told the story in a way in that 15 minutes yeah it was essentially a poor man's version not a poor man's version a version of the opening scene um so I self-funded the thing and um I just put my friends in it and I saw a show called stomp in New York um and the the director and choreographer of that and he's in it as well Marivalda Sontas, who was a stomper for 20 years, I was like, this is what I need.

This is what I need a bunch of paupers or street drum corps, people who can turn items into instruments. So not really a dancer, not a musician, a stomper. We called them rhythm performers. We invented a job for the film. Marivalda came and we shot the sizzle about a kid who was just getting distracted by music. And you pitched it just to Amazon? That was your first?

I think it was a very first pitch And they loved it And the next day we got a really A really good call And they said we'll finance this They did They said that was one of the more interesting pitches We've ever seen

I mean I brought a puppet to the pitch I brought my keyboard to the pitch I was running around the room Like it wasn't your typical movie pitch How long was the pitch? I want to say like a tight 40 minutes And they were entertained the whole thing

Yeah That's a long pitch Usually people want you in and out in 15 No me and Dan We broke the whole story But as we're breaking the story, you know, because I'll tell them about, you know, a double date where you go on a date with one person and the other girl that you are kind of seeing is on the other side of the restaurant and you've got in a misdoubtfire type of way flip between both tables while having a conversation with the musician, the lounge musician, through music. And yeah, it's one thing to say that. It's another thing to do it.

So I performed that piece live with the keyboard. What? Did you mess up at all? Yeah, but that was a part of it. That's the fun part is messing up, you know? The imperfection. Right. And they were like, we don't know what the hell just happened, but we'll make the movie.

Never before directed a movie. Just some videos. Some big O-A-R? Yeah, I directed a video for O-A-R, did stuff for Bieber, Alesso, Anitha. Is that big money direct videos, music videos? I guess it depends on the artist and the scale of it. Right. Yeah, it was fine. I was making a lot more money making a six-second video for Coca-Cola

than I ever would. I made more money on some of those vine endorsement deals than I did this film. I got lost money in this movie. That's unbelievable. It definitely wasn't for the money. How many? What's the biggest vine you ever had? How many people watched? Ah, man, I don't know. Something like 50 million views or something. 50 million. 50-60. I think is maybe more. I actually remember. Were you obsessed with it? We're like, oh my God, 30 million, 40 million, 50 million.

At first, and then I quickly got bored of, you know, it's weird. It's weird. There are numbers on a screen. Like 50,000 people in a stadium is massive. And for some reason, 50 million views doesn't feel like that much because it's almost unquantifiable. It's not a, there's no way to, what's the perception of 50 million? Yeah, what's the difference between a million?

50 million might as well be a billion. Um, but when I, I opened up for Justin Bieber to a purpose tour and I saw 50,000 people, it felt like the entire universe. That was way more exciting than a million views. Were you nervous? Not even a little bit. Not even a little bit nervous. No.

And you played music. Yeah, I was, I did like that one man band stick on stage, um, 50,000 people. If I had actually queued one note wrong, the whole thing would have been a disaster. But that's the fun of it. No. It's great. That sounds terrifying. Are you saying that if you messed up once, it would ruin the whole thing? Kind of, yeah. If I played one instrument at the wrong time, then it would have messed up the whole loop yet because I set up a whole...

Can't you redo that and erase that one? I guess I could have stopped the whole thing and... Start it over. I started over and make a joke about it. And, you know, that's the fun of it. But you weren't nervous. You had fun. It was the most thrilling experience in my life outside of making musica. People loved it. yeah because they're like they didn't expect that you about to see you know the biggest pop star

in the world and the opener is like running around playing different instruments and and playing songs that they know and are you friends with justin yeah um he's really sweet he was I played in this charity hot NHL charity game um in Los Angeles a couple years ago and he played in it with me and he just because I was on a show called Smallvone he looks at me goes what's the girl like what's Lana Ling like I go she's really sweet he's oh cool he was really cool um how did justin decide or when how did you hear about he wanted you to open for him man what was shooting smallville like how crazy it was crazy it was long hours man it was 10 hours a day for every day for 10 months a year for seven years for me and uh you know shaved my head every day and it was a lot

i was younger i was like you know you're you know your age you know and so it was it was cool it was social media wasn't crazy like it is now and we weren't really a part of that we weren't around instagram or vine or any of that yeah so i think it helped us not get to you know unfocused i kind of i feel like it's cool in this world of uh uh superhero universes and multiverses comic book multiverses you were before all of that right yeah um i wonder had smallville existed a decade later if they would have intertwined it to the cinematic universes. And in a way, it's kind of cool that you didn't have started out. It was like the first show that really everything else took off, the superhero world. If you think about it, we were that

show that, I mean, I don't want to toot my own horn, but that show kind of dictated the rules. Yeah. Then all of a sudden you got the flash and the arrows and all this. And then Marvel started and it's just like we could do this. This is not only big on TV. Look how. you know the scale of things especially in tv do you think about it this is turned we flipped the switch here you're interviewing i hope you don't mind no um but i'm so curious do you think about uh the differences between how superheroes were portrayed and how those stories were told then versus now uh i think there was more of an innocence in a lot of ways with us with our show and because they were sort of figuring it out as they went along and i thought it was a really

interesting story. It was a story before the story. It was before Lex is bad, before Clark has become Superman. So they're friends in this little town and they become enemies. And it was just something that no one had ever seen. And I thought, so in that regard, I think that it was really, it was a cool thing. And I don't know, I think some of the innocence might have been lost, but I think there's some great movies. I'm not a huge superhero fan. I'm just not like I've never been. And people are always surprised by that. But anyway, back to you. Well, given that you, played one of the most iconic villains in comic history. I know, I know, and I'm grateful and I, and I love it, but I just, I'm not like everyone

else where they're like, did you see the new Marvel? Did you see the new see me? Did you see, I got to see this? Did you see that? I don't know anything about it. You could ask me 10 questions about I would fail the test. I would fail the test. Fair enough.

I don't know anything. I just did my job. And I tried to do it the best I could. Inside of you is brought to you by Rocket Money. If you want to save money, then listen to me. because I use this, Ryan uses, so many people use Rocket Money. It's a personal finance app that helps find and cancel your unwanted subscriptions. Crazy, right?

How cool is that? Monitorers your spending and helps lower your bills so you can grow your savings. And you know what's great? It works. It really works, Ryan. Rocket Money will even try to negotiate lowering your bills for you. The app automatically scans your bills to find opportunities to save and then goes to work to get you. better deals they'll even talk to customer service thank god so you don't have to um i don't know

how many times we talk about this but like you know you got it and they helped you in so many ways and with these subscriptions that you think are like oh it's a one month subscription for free and then you pay well we forget we want to watch a show on some streamer and then we forget and now we owe $200 by the end of the year yeah they're there to make sure those things don't happen and they will save you money. You know, Rocket Money's 5 million members have saved a total of $500 million in canceled subscriptions with members saving up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features. Get alerts if your bills increase in price, if there's unusual activity in your accounts, if you're close to going over budget, and even when you're

doing a good job. How doesn't everybody have Rocket money? It's insane. Cancel your unwanted subscribe subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter my show name inside of you with Michael Rosenbaum in the survey so they know that I sent you. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about them from my show. Bombas makes the most comfortable socks, underwear, and T-shirts. Warning, bombas are so absurdly comfortable you may throw out all your other clothes. Sorry, do we legally have to say that? No, this is just how I talk and I really love my bombus. They do feel that good, and they do good too.

One item purchased equals one item donated. To feel good and do good, go to Bombas.com and use code audio for 20% off your first purchase. That's BOMBAS.com and use code audio at checkout. Now, how did Justin get you to do the direct, first of all, to go on tour with him? I met J.B. shortly after moving to L.A. He was working with Shot Studios, who was led by John and Sam Shihidi, these very incredible and clever brothers who I ended up working with and they ended up managing me. And that's where the whole YouTube thing kind of MCN came about. but met J.B. through Johnny

and he was a fan of the stuff I was doing. And, of course, I was a fan of his. And we started hanging out. Before we knew it, we had this on Hollywood and Vine, for lack of a better street name. But there was this building called 1600 Vine. It's where all the influencers moved into. It was like a college 2.0.

I mean, for me, Logan Paul, King Batch, Jake Paul. Christian Del Grasso. They all moved into there. Everyone lived there in a unit. And eventually Johnny and Sammy bought a unit there. And J.B. was there all the time. And we were hanging out all the time. We would have parties every week.

And it was a lot of fun. And it just naturally kind of came about. There was one night where I was hanging out with Justin at the W. Hotel. It was just me and him were chatting and we were having a drink. And I didn't know where he was like, I would love to do something with your puppet. And I was like, oh, cool. Like what? Like an interview or something?

like almost in between two friends like yeah I was like cool yeah we should do that it's like how about now I was like now yeah can we film it now so I was like yeah so I was like got on the phone I was like I need some cameras and some awesome some love mics and I guess we'll do it in my apartment we kind of dressed it

and we went to the corner and we winged it and my puppet Diego interviewed Justin Bieber and that was the first collaboration we did and it was hilarious it's pretty funny we were both kind of tipsy so it's interesting Interesting experience. And then after that, we shot some, like, vines together.

And then we did this, actually this Superman sketch together where he played Canadian Superman. And then the conversation came up of opening for him on Purpose Tour. Were you like, what? Yeah, of course. Absolute dream come true. Is that a good pain gig, too? No.

No. It's all about the awareness and the people and, like, your names on the people know who you are now. That's right. After that. And how long did you do that tour? I was there for three weeks to a month, something like that, different cities. It's mostly in South America. I didn't do the whole world.

How long did you rehearse to get it right for that show? I rehearsed with my producing partner for like a good, a solid week, 10 days. Hard. Every day just rehearsing this like 30-minute bed of music where I got to play every instrument. like what are you playing keyboard you're playing guitar you're seeing there's some singing um there was a moment where i was just playing um like microphone stands and like bottles um so it's like yeah percussion guitar bass synthesizer um drum set um yeah it's all over the place are you very specific about how you want things to sound

so you work with them and going no no no no no it's coming out too loud here i need this to be you're so on point with that stuff. Yeah, very, very meticulous when it comes to that. They probably got annoyed. Yeah, I'm sure. Especially when it's just me out there. I mean, you're like, and this isn't the U.S. These aren't people that we know,

and a lot of them don't even speak English. So you're in Brazil trying to make the sound work, and I'm communicating with my guy Jamie, and Jamie's communicating with this guy who can't communicate in English. So it's all kind of a mess, and it's all chance. That's stressful. Yeah, but it's a, it's a something.

the stakes are so high. It's something really fun about that, you know? Did you realize what you were getting into when Amazon said, great, we'll give you all this money. You're going to go make this movie. You love it. And then you realized, I'm directing. I wrote it. I'm starring in it. I'm composing it. Because I, on a smaller scale, directed this little raunchy comedy that I wrote and starred in. And honestly, it was 17 days and no money. And I honestly thought I was going to die. I really, I was so tired that I thought, I'm going to die on the set, and that's what's going to happen. And it wasn't even joking. I was that tired.

Yeah. So how did you, how are you able to do that? And can you sleep like that? Can you fall asleep like that? No, no. I didn't sleep for a few months. Certainly not during these five and a half weeks that we shot. But it's a lot, a lot more facility when you have a budget and a supportive studio.

of course. However, I think the feeling of thinking you're going to die remains consistent, whether it's a $100 million blockbuster or a $500,000 indie. It's really, really hard. And I severely underestimated just how hard it is to make a film and satisfy producers in studio and make sure you have enough time and the constraints of budget and end time. And for me, I signed up to wear a lot of hats. I was in the film, and I wrote it, and I directed it, and I made the music. So, yeah, I didn't get to, you know, I didn't get to, you have a couple hours to go to your trailer while we set up lights. No, no, I was there setting up the lights, you know?

Right. I mean, did you ever hit a point during the filmmaking where you're like, you feel like a failure? Or you feel like I'm dropping the ball? I feel like I don't know what I should. I feel like I'm not competent. Did you ever feel like that? No. Not once.

No. No, I, I. That's the difference between me and you. That's the fucking difference. There are obstacles. I have doubts, but I was very confident walking into this film and in my team because because it took, I was in development for so long. You know, we had a years worth of writing and rewriting, different drafts.

Right. two years of a pandemic world plus another six to eight months we're talking three to four years of this film just being in limbo that limbo was very frustrating in retrospect it was exactly what I needed

because I had so much time with the material when I got to the day nothing was left a chance I knew every I had the whole edit in my head before we started shooting you're like Hitchcock Hitchcock that's what he did he'd have the whole movie in his head

or maybe that was Kubrick. Sounds more like a Kubrick thing. I've heard this fact and I don't know who it is. I think it's Hitchcock. I think a lot of film, I mean,

a great filmmaker is an editor. You have to think about the editing when you think. I always think when I'm writing, I imagine the scene. I'm in the scene as an actor where I'm looking, how I'm feeling,

what's happening around me. That's what I try to do. Exactly. And things inevitably change depending on performance and some things that you find in the edit. But man, 90% of this thing was locked.

locked. Like these set pieces, I knew exactly where the camera was going to cut and on which beat it was going to cut. That's crazy. But you have to. You have to be that scientific, I think. But at your age, I mean, you're not, you're not like a seasoned vet who's done this a million times. This is your first movie. Yeah, but I got to tell you, like, Vine was quite the film school. And social media creation was quite the film school. And I didn't think people tend to stigmatize the power of that? Yeah, yeah.

And, you know, can an influencer really cross over to traditional? That's the big question. Sure. Right? And I don't know. I don't believe in that. I don't think they're, to me, it's just all creating. Just go create something.

I don't care what you think you can or cannot do. If you want to do it, do it. Yeah, I wasn't doing dances on TikToks, right? I was not, there's anything wrong with that. That person could be an incredible filmmaker, actor, performer, for all I know. But the difference is. if you watch musica almost every scene and set piece in the film has been auditioned on the internet by me at a certain point in my career the oneer the diner scene the the montage where the

the backgrounds are changing crazy the double date i've done versions of that in my work you can find i can pinpoint you know each one so you just elaborate on that you 14 takes 14 take how long is it um almost five minutes four and a half minutes did was it something that you were nervous at all about no not that one i was nervous about some other set pieces that wasn't one of them because the water has so many things where you're moving things and backdrops are falling and all it's it's astonishing it's really incredible thank you thank you so much it really is i watch it and i'm like man this guy's a filmmaker this guy is a filmmaker i would have never thought about something like what was written as a montage uh different locations you know

the tribulation and the chaos associated with somebody lying to three people that he cares about in his life, his mother, his ex-girlfriend who's starting to rekindle things, and a newfound romance. And he's balancing and juggling these three people. And we called it the rhythm of lies. And it was a traditional montage. And I said, man, like, we've got to do something a little more clever than a second act rom-com montage. What if it were a theatrical montage? The whole thing were on a stage, and it was a oneer, because what's more reflective of chaos than a oneer?

So that's where that idea... There were people on board with you right away? No. I was like, why? All my producers were like, we've seen this before. It's going to end up on the cutting room floor. And I was like,

not the way I'm going to do it. I promised. I took a lot of convincing. They let me do it. Was it expensive? Yeah, it was pretty expensive. But I worked with an amazing DP and production designer

who just believed in the vision so much. They made it work. And I wanted sets moving in and assembling and disassembling. Actors knowing when to leave right out of a Q1 a backdrop falls and changing their wardrobe off screens and dancers and dancing to the beat yeah and like all these things music all these cues cue cue cue and everyone was like you know

are you just doing it because it's cool i was like i promise i'm i'm not like this is the chaos of this oneer is exactly what this character is going through um we got to do it and they said all right but make sure you cover it from the front and have because you're going to have to cut it we're 99% guarantee you're going to have to cut this thing or at least cut around it in the cutting room you're going to have to lose stuff and this is something that you lose. And you didn't lose it. And I said, no, and not only that, but I'm not going to cover it from the front. So you have no choice but to use it.

And I delivered a 90-minute cut, director's cut. So there was actually the note from the studio was, we need more, not less. How long was the prep for that oneer? I mean, you didn't just go there and film it. You had to rehearse it for. Half a day rehearsal and we shot it. There was one day allotted and we shot it in half that. so you rehearsed it one day and shot it the next yeah we rehearsed it the day prior for half a day

and then we shot it for half a day so in full rehearsal plus shooting it was a day's worth of work when was the first good take that you're like ah i think we got it the one that i used which i believe was nine or ten everything before that i would never use were you worried on take eight like fuck no no because i knew that take one was good enough actually to be in the movie not good enough for me and would never be done. But I was like, if that, if take one was that tight, we're okay. Who was the worst take? The one I used.

No, I'm just kidding. The absolute worst take was probably the last one because everything was too tight. Too tight. Everyone was so locked and everything was so perfect. And I was like, this doesn't feel chaotic. No. The film has been named one of New York Times critics' picks. They said, Mancuzzo?

You say Mancuzzo, right? Yeah, Mancusa. Mancouza? You gave the S a Z. It kind of made it more interesting. Mancuso. Mancuso. It's Mancuso.

Mancusa's phenomenal feature debut. 98% Fresh and Rotten Tomatoes. Harold's the arrival of a filmmaker and actor and a musician worth paying attention to while also delivering a winning and visually inventive musical comedy. It's that. It's like, could you imagine having it, having the response like this? Were you expecting this? you know what to answer your earlier question at any point did you feel insecure the most insecure

and scared and nervous i felt was um ahead of the reception of the film because i was happy and i was proud of it studio was happy studio was happy a team was happy but who knows people are going to like it who knows a rot tomatoes is going to say i see films that i love get butchered yeah and it's like, oh, man, I don't know if I could live with a rotten score on rotten tomatoes. Rotten tomatoes, though. Oh, yeah, totally. I don't really. I know. You can't. But how do you ignore it? As much as you can say, like, who cares what they say? I mean, one part of me does not care because I've been through

the internet. I've been called every name under the sun. There's nothing someone can say that will offend me, truly. On the other hand, this is my first feature. The reception dictates the rest of my career in a way, right? Who's going to want to finance the next one if people hate the first one? It's that scared the shit out of me. Now, are you getting offers to direct another one? Yeah. Yes. But I have, I already know what the next two or three are going to be, and they're all original. I'm reading scripts. I'd be sent stuff, you know, in consideration to direct. Some of it is shit some of it is pretty cool but i think i'll rather just do my own my own things does amazon want to work with you again uh yeah in fact we're working on something right now really so you're

gonna do you want to direct and star in something again i don't i don't think i'll ever lead a movie again too much too much and i don't love it man i don't love it you don't no i love directing but acting is um i'm not as passionate about it i'm not as good at it i leave that to people like you who are more proficient. What do you think of Camilla Mendez? She's cool. What do you think of her? Awesome. I mean, she's more than cool. She's the best. She's the best. How many actresses did you go out out to? Almost none. I want to say none. I think she was the first and only. There were a couple of other ideas. You know, this actor had to be Brazilian, American, had to speak Portuguese, had to speak English, had to be charming as hell, talented, and have some kind of presence and have

some kind of influence in order to justify the size of the film. Who ticks all those boxes? All those boxes? Only Camille Mendez was quite literally the only only choice. If it were someone else, they would have to slightly change the role. She'd maybe have to be a Brazilian native who moved to the U.S., but not a lot of... She checked all the boxes. Not a lot of us out there, not a lot of Brazilian-American actors

who are working. Right. And that was important to you. Very much so. Yeah, so she ticked every box. She was the dream. I just didn't know if she would have responded to the material and if she was available.

Riverdale was, you know, TV scheduling. And we met, and she met on the, with the intention of probably passing. She was like, first-time director. Is that really what I want to do? hiatus. But you charmed her. Charmed a hell out of her like I'm charming you right now and she and she jumped at the opportunity to be a, this is the first Brazilian American rom-com ever and she came on as a

producer and an actor. And you started dating. Started dating. Did you start dating while you're filming? Yeah, pretty much. Yeah, I was, I was playing myself and she was playing a version of herself. So as our characters were getting to know each other, so we're really. Are we? So the line's blurred. There's some scenes that I still watched today, and I don't know if we're acting or if we're just talking. And you enjoyed the whole thing. Like, it was great. A little too much. A little too much? Yeah. No, that, that chemistry, thank God, was real. Because what if you started fighting? What if it ended? That's what I'm saying. I don't know that I'm a good enough actor to pretend that I have chemistry with somebody. So I'm very lucky that the chemistry was real. There's a familiarity. We also spoke for like a month to working on the pages and rehearsing. And, you know,

It was very natural. Really? Are you still friends? Are you dating still? How long now? Five years, three years? No, nearly two years. We've been in each other's lives for nearly two years now.

This summer, it will be two years since we shot the movie. That's crazy. She's fantastic. Yeah, she's really talented and inspiring. You ever kiss someone in the morning and you wish you hadn't? It's a real turnoff. Bad breath, that is. And that goes, for everyone.

Yes, I created a product called Rosie's Puppy Fresh Breath. Just one full cap in your dog's water. And wow, it's odorless, tasteless. You'll be kissing your dogs all day. My breath is delicious. Yeah, mine too. It's awesome. Rosie's Puppy Fresh Breath. Get it on Amazon today.

The weight is over. The gold standard of online casinos has arrived. Golden Nugget online casino is live. Bringing Vegas-style excitement and a world-class gaming experience right to your fingertips. Whether you're a seasoned player or just starting, signing up is fast and simple. And in just a few clicks, you can have access to our exclusive library of the best slots and top-tier table games. Make the most of your downtime with unbeatable promotions and jackpots that can turn any mundane moment into a golden opportunity. at Golden Nugget Online Casino.

Take a spin on the slots, challenge yourself at the tables, or join a live dealer game to feel the thrill of real-time action, all from the comfort of your own devices. Why settle for less when you can go for the gold at Golden Nugget Online Casino. Gambling problem call Connects Ontario,

1866531-260, 19 and over, physically present in Ontario. Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. Do you want to direct what kind of movies? Do you ever want to do an action thriller? Do you ever want to do a horror?

Do you ever want to do paranormal or just stick to comedies or romantic? Or do you just want to do it all? I want to do it all. Without giving away anything, the next thing I'm working on and I'm most excited about is a psychological thriller. A musical psychological thriller. So I have a. four ideas I'm very excited about. One of them is sci-fi. One of them's a thriller. One of them is romance. Although the genres are vastly different, there's one common denominator. Music is

a character. So that's the question I asked myself. I've ever seen a film where music is the villain? It's not a masked killer. It's music. And then I started coming up with the concept and that's an idea I'm excited about. What was that movie Whiplash? Music was kind of the villain in that, in a way. It was certainly a contributing factor. It was very much a character. Black Swan, it's another one. I love those movies.

Those are rarities. Agreed. So I'd like to, yeah, in the same way, I combine synesthesia with rom-com, I want to combine synesthesia with horror. I want to combine it with sci-fi. I want to combine it with action. Are your parents proud of you? I think so.

Do they tell you? My mom does. mom does a lot. What does she say? I'm proud of you. You're a dick. She's in the film. She plays my mom. That's your mom. Yeah. When you're like, mom, what? She's good. Oh, by the way, that wasn't meant to happen that moment. The idea was I say mom and, you know, she's listening in to see what I'm doing. And as soon as I say mom, she scurries away, pretends like she wasn't there. And my mom, I don't know her, I just said, what? Did you not break?

I tried my best not to break. People were breaking on, and we had to design their audio out. But she said what? Because she genuinely forgot that she was meant to walk away. I was like, you can't say, that doesn't make sense if you say what. You would be revealing that you're listening on the other side of the door and ended up being so much funnier. How did you, how hard was it to direct your mother? It was hard.

It was hard. I realized that she wasn't really directable. So I had to find another way. So what I ended up doing was just cross-shooting, minimum two to three cameras on all our moments. And I just have a conversation with her in a curb enthusiasm style. And that worked. And it worked. I started guiding her through the beats until we hit the beats without her realizing it.

She couldn't memorize lines and she didn't understand blocking. What did she say when she saw it? She was over the moon. I think I didn't think she realized we were like making a movie. I think she thought we're just like goofing off. This isn't real. My son can do something like this. Now she's over the moon.

She's very proud. She's very happy. And she's my favorite part of the movie. What about your dad? Yeah, dad. Dad. Is he one of those tough Italians? He's toughies.

It's like, it was okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You did a nice job. Yeah, he had some criticisms. But what were his criticisms? I could tell he's proud. I can tell he's proud. Yeah?

Yeah. Well, you know, one of the criticisms was, are you, are you villainizing? American, the stereotypical white woman and ideology, you know, are you falling too much into the stereotypes? Are you doing predictable? And I was like, yes, it's the point. But he went to South by, he was in the room. He felt it, you know. People cheering. Yeah, he's proud. But I think secretly he wants me to honor Italian culture. Um, you're going to do that maybe in another movie? Yeah, I'll make the exact same movie, but about Italian family instead of Brazil. Italian family. Or another godfather with music. There you go.

a musical godfather a musical it's like a musical godfather and it's called oh hey hey no and you beat your shit uh this is called uh shit talking with rudy man kuso that's right i didn't say kuzzo because i was thinking italian mucus moogu macuso uh patron dot com slash inside you support podcast uh love you quick questions these are uh leanne who inspires you or what inspires you What inspires me? I think more than anything, my culture, my background. Brazilian and Italians are very unique cultures and they're movies without intending to be movies.

Do you feel like you could only date another Brazilian or an Italian girl? You can't go out with a whitey? No, but I was certainly led to believe that growing up. It's like the safest, smartest thing you could do is keep it within the community, within the culture, because anything outside of that is scary, is dangerous, you know. And I think that's... West Side Story shit.

Exactly. You know? That's a product of, you know, my parents' experience as outsiders in America. My mother was very mistreated and there was a lot of racism against her. So naturally, her response is, we should keep it within the family. We should keep it within the... Just as a protective sort of thing. That's how she, where she was coming from.

Yeah. Little Lisa, what is your favorite midnight snack? Oh, man. I bet you love candy bars. No, I don't. I don't like candy bars. I feel like you like candy bars. I try not to eat them.

I like popcorn. Popcorn's a good one. Popcorn's good. Midnight snack. You know, I crave savory more than I do sweet. So, like, I'll go in the fridge and I'll just try and find, like, can I, like, heat up a pasta or, or, like, some leftover rice and beans and just make it, like, really healthy. homey. I think it's just like trying to replicate homey.

So you eat healthy for the most part? Yeah, very much so. Really? I do it every other day, very strict. And the days in between, not as strict. Because I love going out to eat and lots of wine and olive oil and breads. But the good shit, like the good quality stuff. I'm going to Italy for the first time. Where are you going? I'm going to Florence, Roman, Pasatano. Am I going to love the food there? How can you not? But, you know, don't go to the gentrified areas and eat the tourist food. You know, go to the real shit. Find the real shit.

mom and pop. Do you know some places? For me, it's mostly southern Italy. Um, uh, you know, Napoli, Saladin. For me, it's Napoli. Yeah. That's a controversial statement. Some, you know, Sicilians love Sicilian pizza. Romans love Roman, Roman pizza. But to me, Napoli style pizza, you know, the soft, slightly crisp, um, dough. Huge difference between pizza and America and there. Oh, yeah, of course. And the New York slices should be celebrated as well but um but to me it's it's napoleton style pizza you can eat three pies and feel fine feel light i was eating six course meals over there and three bottles of wine would never feel a hangover and uh lost weight you do that here you're you know hospital ben says hindsight is 20 20 but

what advice would you give your younger self oh shit sounds like you wouldn't give yourself any advice keep doing what you're doing kid keep doing what you do i know it's a It's a cliche to answer, but I would try to change as little as possible. Maybe, maybe if anything, just don't overthink. Just do it. Nike. I think you do that. I don't think you think too much.

You probably think about things too much that are really trivial. I think about thinking too much. Do you? Yeah. Do you meditate? No, I should, huh? Do you go to therapy? I do.

You do? Yeah. What do you go to therapy for? Why I should be in therapy. I'm constantly trying to find the break it down, you know. I'm trying to figure out the source of it. It's good to just talk to someone though, right? Yeah, I really want a therapist to convince me that I need therapy.

That's another thing that, um... Wait, you go to therapy. Yeah. But you want that therapist to convince you that why you're here is for the right reasons. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And like the very, the very nature of that question actually warrants you being in therapy. I don't know.

I do need, I need something. No, no. wine i mean yes we all need to talk to someone i'm pretty what fucked up are you i think so i think you're you're not i think you're pretty good if i gave you my brain for an hour you would you would differ i look i i i i sense this i'm a good judge of character i think you're incredibly charming you're you're incredibly bright articulate passionate talented um driven but I think the only thing is you probably sometimes inadvertently not to me but your only thing like I think people think of me is you could be a little exhausting probably not to me

but maybe to people around you like Rudy fucking chill chill calm down definitely I don't feel that on my mother's life I don't feel that from you but I'm just thinking do you think maybe that's what it is is like just chill just be able to relax because you're always thinking of shit always thinking of ideas yeah yeah definitely even when i'm reclusive and quiet like the wheels are turning and they're turning fast i definitely am exhausting that's for sure i am i'm exhausting i'm exhausting but i'm also i i have good qualities i'm giving and i listen and i i help and i i you know i think i'm a good i try to be a good person yeah me so i'm a little exhausting we're all exhausted yeah i um i'm i'm perpetually exhausting and exhausted yeah me too

I'm tired. I'm tired. You tired right now? A little bit. This conversation has given me some caffeination. Yeah, it got you full of life? Is that a word? Caffeination?

Hell yeah. Now it is. You used some other words today that I was just like, I don't even know those words. Made them up. How do you, I mean, you just, you're very, uh, you take word power in high school? No, I just like. You're a reader. No, no, no.

I don't like reading. I can barely get through a script, man. I'm either. I hate reading scripts. Ah, man. It takes me forever to get through a, script. I actually, it's actually, it's really, uh, debilitating. Yeah, especially my own. I'm a bad reader, a big part of why, I don't know, I'm a bad reader. If you gave me something

to read, I would read it flawlessly. I'm bad at retaining the information and processing the information in real time. I have, I can't, it's hard to find the distinction between a good script and a bad script for me. Truly, I can't tell. I really can't tell sometimes. Oh, I can't within writing. The first, the first couple of paragraphs in when people are talking, I'm, like oh boy it feels written no i i i could tell it a table read if it's bad writing i could tell when i'm watching the movie if it's bad writing but reading it like a few few words in i'm like shit they say a bad script can't make a good movie i don't know if that's true man i don't know if that's true i'd be willing to bet a bad script can make a good movie with the right filmmaker

I'm trying to think of one. A bad movie. My movie. Like a terribly written movie. Like, look, if you read, there's certain movies, I'm thinking, did you ever see the airplane?

I was just talking about airplane. Of course. But if you read airplane the script, you know what I mean? You might be like, I don't know how this could work. And then the actors get on there and they're all so perfect

that every joke sells. That's what I'm talking about. It's not campy. It just works because they make it work. You know, So I understand what you're saying. Yeah, there's something about the anti-formula or the deconstruction of a structure of what you should be.

I kind of hate that like by page 10, you got to hit this. And by 23, you got to be doing this. And the second act low, make sure you do that. Fuck all that, man. Can I just put a bunch of words and then structure it later? Yeah, what's your inciting incident? What's your, what is it, the, um, kill the cat. Yeah, save the cat.

What's your save the cat moment? Where's your, your twist? Where's your, just fuck off. I know, there's always a thing. Those things are important.

They're important. But, I say right and then find those things. Yeah. Don't worry so much about those things when you, because I just wrote a 30 page. I came up with an idea and I wrote 30 pages. And then I looked back and I go,

some good dialogue, funny, but this isn't the story I want to tell. Yeah. And I just scrapped it. And I go, but it gave me inspiration for another story that I want to tell. Totally.

But you watch, you know, I watch films like, what did I watch recently? Triangle Sadness. You're watching this moment between these two, between this couple, one of the opening scenes, arguing over a very uncomfortable conversation about who picks up the check and the reflection on gender roles. I want to say 80% of that conversation, I'm willing to bet is not written. So it's like, wow, that was brilliant writing. Was it writing? because it felt like they were just saying things in the moment. And then in some cases, that's true.

In other cases, it actually is the writing and relentless rehearsal and that made that scene feel like he was all improv. It wasn't all improv, you know? Yeah, makes you feel like that because they just know it so well. They know it so well, and it feels so natural. And you're like, there's no script there. There is. Well, dude, this has been a joy.

You're like, I can't wait to see what you do next. I'm like, I really can't. I can't wait to see it. Your mind is a mind that I don't come across very often and your talents. And you've got to go see Musica. Musica. How do you say it? Musica.

Yeah, but you can pronounce it however you want. Musica. You already butchered my name. This is a disaster. Rudy, I'm not going to mess up again. It's okay. Marcoso. Did I fuck it up?

Sounds like something you'd order at a pizza room. By the way, I just saw your shirt and I love it. overthink this how appropriate that should be your shirt it's so good right so good yeah you dress too nicely you dress a lot nicer than i do me do i'm wearing a tank you can't say what you can't use the other word of what this this used to be called right oh a wife beater yeah how i can't call it that anymore it's so hard to not call it that even though it's so obvious why you shouldn't i know there's so many things you shouldn't do now because you're going to get fucking you know shouldn't even say that yeah I don't want to say that.

Why don't we just not talk? Yeah. But I'm sure there's a community of people who would be offended by that. I offend people on a daily basis. Inadvertently. I don't even know I do it. How did I offend you? You just looked at me.

Likewise. This has been a treat. I wish you all the success. Thank you. Likewise. Follow him with your Instagram. It's my name, Rudy Mancuso. I know.

I was just trying to fuck it up as much as possible. Successful. Yeah. I want to work with you sometimes. Let's do it. What do you got? Send me the 30 pages. No, I destroyed that.

I didn't destroy it. I have it. But I have better scripts than that. Yeah? Yeah. So you wrote 30 pages and you got rid of it because it wasn't good enough? It just, it, I felt like it's sort of been done and there's no way around it. There's no way to make it different.

And I really thought about it. What about the shelf method where you just put it away for a year and come back to it? I have a lot of those. I have a lot of shelves. shelves full of that's what you do i mean then you somehow make something and then then you sell something and it doesn't get made then you but uh i i am for the first time of my life enjoying the process and not worrying so much about if it becomes successful or if i get it made i'm trying to get it made that's the goal but i'm trying to enjoy the writing i'm trying to enjoy

the creative part every every time i see a script get better i'm like i'm improving it i'm um and that i find for the first time of my life enjoyment. Maybe that's because I'm on Lexa Pro and it's kind of like the anxiety is kind of... No, but that's so interesting. It's liberating, isn't it? Yeah, I'm not so stressed. This is making the movie.

It's like everyone's trying to get it made. This is enjoy the process. Yeah, I think that's absolutely right. And if you get it made, great. And then you, you know, hopefully people like it. And if they don't, well, look, I did it. I had fun. I made it.

I had fun. It didn't succeed. Sucks. But what am I going to? do. I'm going to write another one. It's hard. I'm going to do another one. It's incredibly incredibly hard. But, you know, what else do you want to do? Yeah, there is no other option. That's the question. What else can you do? Nothing. I mean, yeah. No, there's nothing. Don't even try and come up with a pitch because there's nothing else that either of us could be doing in this.

No, this is it. Except being happy. Well, I think being happy. It's overrated. no i think that it's happiness i think is is they're moments right it's just it's just moments it's like it's if you could be in a moment and enjoy this moment which is terribly difficult easier said than done if you could just you know i enjoyed you like i enjoyed this conversation same you know and so that was an hour of my time that i enjoyed and i was present and i wasn't thinking about other things about this or that or how it's so hard to be present isn't it oh increasingly it is And, you know, like, I even said it last night. I said, you know what?

Tomorrow, you're not going to be on your phone as much. You're allowed to check it like every hour. And you're going to, and I just making adjustments to make your life better. Because you can be just totally consumed by just looking at this thing. Totally. I mean, I honestly can look at it and then all of a sudden it's an hour. Yeah. And I'm like, wow, my neck hurts.

I'm tired. And I didn't accomplish anything. I just watched some funny and mostly. unfunny shit and I'm not inspired. And I'm upset with myself that I just did that. There was no reason for it. Good for you to recognize that. I recognized it. Now the question is, do you do something about it? Probably not. Probably not. Nice having you.

Thanks so much. This is it. The day you finally ask for that big promotion. You're in front of your mirror with your Starbucks coffee. Be confident. assertive, remember eye contact, but also remember to blink. Smile, but not too much. That's weird. What if you aren't any good at your job? What if they demo you instead? Okay, don't be silly. You're smart, you're driven, you're going to be late if you keep talking to the mirror. This promotion is yours. Go get him. Starbucks. It's never just coffee. Love him. That's all I could say. All I'm going to say is

I love this guy and I hope you enjoy the interview and you'll go watch Musica and support him on all his endeavors he's a fantastic um eccentric human being yeah eccentric is the word he's just got a he's got a lot of ideas in his head and he's very good at producing them and yeah he just realizing it's yeah talking about him and justin beber's relationship and how they just would shoot stuff and beber's like oh the puppets get your puppets let's make this thing yeah just all sorts of cool stuff um so bravo rudy uh we'll be in touch we're going to supposed to have some lunch soon Oh, Rudy. Thank you for listening.

Follow us. Listen to us. Write a review. Join patreon.com slash inside of you. Let's go to the top tiers now. If you didn't listen to the intro, go back and listen to it because there's a lot of cool stuff. I'm not going to do that again. But let's start out with the wonderful patron names that you hear.

And these people are top tiers. And they support the podcast a lot. And there's a lot of cool perks to being a patron. If you want to join Patreon, there's, um, you get your name shatted out every week. You get packages from me with notes from me, um, every couple months. There's, uh, YouTube lives where I go on and ask, answer questions and occasional zoom here and there for the top tiers. Um, and on and on and there's so many. And more, more so it's, it's about community and a lot of friends have, uh, um, people have made,

friends on this podcast. Yeah. A good friends. And here we go. Not in any particular order. Nancy D. Leah and Kristen, little Lisa, Yukiko, Jill E. Brian H. Nico P. Robert B.

Jason W. Sophie M.Rosh C. Jennifer N. Stacey L. Jamal F. Janelle B. Mike E. 99 more. Santiago M. The L. Mattie S. Belinda N. Dave Hall. Love my Dave. Brad D.

Ray. Haada. Tab of the T. Tom and Talia M. Betsy D. I miss Betsy. Riannon. Rianin rings like a bell through the night. Corey K. Devnexon. Michelle A. Jeremy C. Mr. M. Eugene and Leah. The salty ham. Go ahead, Ryan.

You want me to continue the Fleetwood Mac? But I'm just going to keep going. Mel S. Chris, Eric H. Oracle. Amanda R. William K. Kevin E. Jor L. Jor L. Sorry about that. Jammin J. Leanne J. Luna R. Mike F. Brian L. Jules M. Jessica B. Kyle F. Caley J. Charlene A. Marion Louise L. Romey the band. Frank B. Gen T. April R.M. Registered Mers. Is that what it stands for? Randy S. Rachel D. Jen Carolina Girl. Going to Carolina with Jen, the Carolina girl. Nick W. Stephanie and Evan or Stefan Steven

Charlene A. Don G. Jenny Brown. Jenny B. 7. 6. Jennifer R. Tina E. N. G. Tracy. Keith B. Heather and Sweet Gregg or vice versa. L.E.K. Elizabeth L. Beth B. Jammann. I knew a girl named Beth Benjamin. Maybe that's what it is. This is Ben B. Jammon. Sorry. Ben B. Jamin. Ben B. Jammin. P.R. C. and Sulton.

Thank you guys. I love you from the Hollywood Hills in Hollywood, California. I'm Michael Rosenbaum. I'm Ryan Tayes. I'm here, too. A little wage with the camera. And we love you. Please be good to yourself.

Get in a healthy routine. Go to better help. Get therapy. Just do it, man. Do it. We've got so much life ahead of us. Let's roll. Be good to yourself.

Football season is here. Oh, man. Believe has the podcast to enhance your football experience. From the pros One of the most interesting quarterback rooms To college Michigan is set at eight and a half wins To fantasy

If you feel that way why didn't you trade them Become a better fan And listen to the football podcasts From Believe Just search Believe That's B-L-E-A-V podcast Follow and listen on your favorite platform