Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum - Sons of Anarchy’s THEO ROSSI: Letting Go

Episode Date: September 20, 2022

Theo Rossi (Sons of Anarchy, Emily the Criminal) joins us this week to share his unique perspective on life and how he’s been able to let go of the nonsense and worries that plague people day to day and focus on being a good person. Theo shares the life changing moment that helped him make the decision to leave drug dealing and pursue a career in Hollywood. We also talk about protecting your time when it's finite, the weight of Sons of Anarchy, and the lovable complexity of villains. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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tables, or join a live dealer game to feel the thrill of real-time action, all from the comfort of your own devices. Why settle for less when you can go for the gold at Golden Nugget Online Casino. Gambling problem call connects Ontario 1866531-260. 19 and over, physically present in Ontario. Eligibility restrictions apply. See Golden Nuggett Casino.com for details. Please play responsibly. You're listening to Inside of You with Michael Rosenbaum. Thank you for joining us and sticking with the podcast. If you're here for Theo Rossi, it's a great interview. I'm really excited about it.

If you like it, all I ask is you subscribe, maybe write a review, follow us on our handles. But subscribe and listen to the podcast. I hope you enjoy it. Ryan, good to see you. Good to see you too. Yep, you had a great weekend. You saw a friend. You needed it.

I did. A little Ryan time. Went to Washington, D.C., saw a friend of mine who lives out there and had a great little weekend. saw the red hot chili peppers which I was not how were they awesome was flea naked uh flea no he was shirtless and wearing a kilt and he did a handstand uh when he came out for the encore he walked out on his hands yeah he's turning 60 this year did underwear underneath yeah were they all ripped up with the underwear no they're frames they're their frames yeah they're all in great shape all the arms were showing really yeah they're all turning anthony keats nice chest nice chest great yeah uh great body

but he came out in like a mesh shirt and uh we took a bad we took a bit like how how many songs before it's off i said three songs tops was gone by the yeah three songs exactly three songs boom this is when i take my shirt off it's done i recommend it they're they're torn around all right i was never a massive like a like a like a super fan but uh great show great rock show i like that i hope you guys are doing well this week um thanks again for watching listening uh you can listen anywhere apple podcast Spotify uh youtube you can watch make sure you're right review our handles are ryan At Inside of You pod on Twitter, at Inside of You podcast on Instagram and Facebook. That's exactly right.

Check out the Inside You online store. We've got great stuff. Smallville, Lexmus script signed by me. We've got Funko Pop Lex Luthor sign. We've got Inside You merch hats and mugs and tumblers and all that stuff. So the Inside of You online store. Also, a reminder, if you haven't, check out the new podcast, Talkville, Tom and I, Tom Welling. We talk about, we watch every episode of Smallville from the beginning and we review it.

So that airs every Wednesday. You can watch on YouTube or listen wherever you get your podcasts. And Ryan, we have a lot of fun doing that as well. We do. I'm learning a lot. I'm learning a lot about your past. You are learning a lot. I'm learning a lot about my past.

Yeah. Man, well, let's just do it. I think we can get right into it. Also, just a quick reminder to join Patreon. If you want to support the podcast, we need you, we love you. Top tier patrons get chat. outs and boxes of merch sent to them every couple months there's different tiers anything you want to help support the podcast it really helps i'll send you a message after patreon dot com slash inside of you

and without further ado let's get inside well you know him from sons of anarchy but he's done a ton of stuff he's got a new movie coming out we talk about that but we really talk about mental health and boy he opens up i love this interview i remember it distinctively distinctly either either let's get inside of theo rossi it's my point of you you're listening to inside of you with michael rosenbaum inside of you inside of you're doing all these interviews you're all popular and shit so silly and the fact that i'm like third on your sons of anarchy list is even more funny third what do you mean i know you had flanagan coats i know you had these people on well i know those guys i know those guys it's irrelevant

it's irrelevant in the grand scheme of things i've already talked to honum he's banning your show he's already said it's not happening that's hilarious i like that you do the research on me yeah i have to i got to do the research man the lightning is crazy you look good though i think you're a natural beauty That's what I'll say. You know, I'm a cover girl. Yes, I have the natural take-me-away Calgon look. Dude, I remember the kid. How old are you?

How do you remember Cal-Gone? Well, I remember everything. I'm an 80s freak. I watch in my downtime, like, when I'm filming, this is like one of the weirdest things that I've started to do over the last couple of years. I just watch old commercials from like the 80s and 90s on four-hour streams. What's your favorite one? What's your favorite commercial? Or one of you think, one that you think of. Anything to do with Toys R Us is like so absolutely uplifting. It's incredible. Like when they're talking with Jeffrey the Draft,

and they're just having so much fun. Max Hedrums commercials were free. What was the Toys R Us theme song? I don't want to grow up. I'm a Toys R Us kid. There's a million toys of Toys R Us that I can play with. Yeah, it's amazing. I mean, how does that not uplift your spirits? It really does. Because I'm playing. playing these dark characters all the time. And they're always in this horrific place. I try to balance it out by watching commercials from the 80s and 90s. I like watching old theme songs from the 80s. There was a show called Give Me a Break with Nell Carter.

Give me a break. Yeah, I'm thinking a kick hat bar, but yes, I watched that show all this time. You watched, give me a break. Of course. Do you remember? We're probably around the same age. I'm 50. Oh, okay.

So I'm three years younger. Holy shit. You look really good or you have a filter on. I don't. This is it. I swear to God, this is exactly the way I look. How do you look this young? I think I've asked this question a lot because, you know, I look at, I used to look at

Ralph Machia when I was younger and I'd be like, how does this guy look young all the time? I said, yeah. I think now, now that I see my mom, because I was raised by my mom and like, she always looked young. She's in her 70s now and she looks like 50. And then I think. Easy. Easy there. She looks 50. What are you saying?

No, definitely. A hundred percent. My mom looks super young. Wow. So I think that it's because, and she's Middle Eastern, right? And then my dad was like Spanish and Italian. And I think that somewhere along the line, the genetics have to do it. Like the Mediterranean thing or something. But also, remember, I completely like I don't, I guess I'm not like actively trying to kill myself. Like a lot of people I know, like, you know, drinking and smoking. You know what I mean? Yeah. You don't do any of it. that stuff? I don't do any of that. Yeah. Wow. You don't drink. Do you drink caffeine? I drink caffeine. Yeah. I do. I have two coffees in the morning. That's it. I read that you've been a vegan unless you're not a vegan anymore. I started when I did True Story. I started eating eggs because I was doing only like 600, 700 calories a day. I was doing this weird thing. And I started eating eggs, but I'm off that again. So I did eggs for a minute. But no, I don't eat anything like that. Maybe that's what it is. Maybe the fact that

you don't eat meat, you don't eat, you know? No, no, I, you know what? I, no, I don't think any of that. I think that, okay, this sounds weird, but I think that, like, to each his own, right? Like, what some people can do, other people can't. So you kind of can't, like, look at what other people do. Like, I drink a ton of water, but some people don't like to do that. It doesn't mean that it's healthy. It just means that it works for me, right? Like, I happen to, when I'm not working, possibly partaking psilocybin a lot, right? But that's just my thing. What's psilocybin? What's so?

I should know this. It's a mushroom. Shrooms. Yeah. Do you micro dose or macro dose or what is it? You know, I kind of, I might, I might, I might, allegedly might partake in a lot of it. Who knows? But the thing is I, I, the maintaining of it is the micro that you might call.

And it's something that, uh, I enjoy. But I think it makes me better, right? Like as in the way I, I exist in this whole. thing, right? Not to get all metaphysical and weird. But it's like this whole shit is like a minute. So when I get back to the health aspect of it, it's like what works for me, I don't think would work for someone else. Like I run every day, seven days. How far do you run? Between five and eight miles. At 47 years old, you're running this many miles. Seven days a week. I don't miss. Is it an addiction? They say it takes 21 days to create a habit. Is it something that that or is it

just something you just know now. I couldn't do it. Like I, oh, my camera just got buzzy. Hold on. Let me fix this. Now you look even better. Jesus. I know how to do it.

Okay. So here's my thought. I need it. So whether it's an addiction, however they might put a label on the thing, I need it. It's the only time I'm alone. Crazy. It's not crazy. This is part of this podcast is to sort of dissect and like get to know someone of what works for them.

You know, maybe someone out there is listening going, you know, I'm going, you know, I'm going to try running five to seven. I don't know why you'd ever want to fucking run five to seven miles. It sounds fucking awful. But if it works for you. Yeah. It works for me. And here's why.

I have two kids. I have an amazing wife. We live on a ranch in Austin. It's incredible. We have a bunch of animals and do all the things. But I get that time early, early, early in the a.m. to kind of reset and contemplate and figure out all the things that, because your time gets bastardized the second you get around.

to a bunch of people, right? Like, it just gets, things happen, right? That breaks or this happens or someone comes here or I have to talk to this person. So in that moment, whether it be five, six, seven, eight, whatever it is, the weekend I run longer, I know that I'm going to get 40, whatever, if I'm doing an 830 pace, whatever that is, eight times five or six, like 46 minutes of pure peace for myself. That makes perfect sense. It really does.

it's like you need that to check into your day to get through the day you need time for you that's my meditation that's my that's my so i figure out my roles when i'm doing that i figure out my characters i figure out how i'm gonna like the things that i need to take on in the day and and i'm also an extremely extremely routine person that i've been for a long time what do you do when you wake up so besides what's the first thing you do when you wake up i can tell you the first thing I'm in I can tell you almost basically my entire day for the last I guess if I'm thinking about time almost like 13 14 years even when I'm working I will do a version of it when I'm filming so the second I get up um second I get up I handle the dogs or you know whatever

is going on the kids are back to school so I usually have to wake them up and I do that by playing like a song really loud and turning on the lights so it's like either I or the tiger or or something that's just 80s. 80s. Something might be, she's a little runaway by Bon Jovi. You never know. How old are your kids? Five and seven. Two boys. So they're hearing rising up back on the street. Dad, turn that. That's that's me coming up. And they usually are turning over. One sleeps in a tent. He's been sleeping in a tent for a couple of months. I don't know why. I think I've been sleeping. The other sleeps in the bed in his room. So there's a full empty room. Um, and then, uh, I play I at a tiger or today it was, uh, when I play today, something by journey. I think it might have been the one from sharing your things. Um, so I was playing

something. It gets them up. Then on a day like that, either my wife will take them and I'll pick them up because I'm home from filming. I just got back. So we'll split. Either I'll pick them up or she'll take them. And then point is I go right to run. Now, flip that some days, because I just got back, I'll go run at 5.30 in the morning or six. So I can get back and then wake them up, right? I'll try to do it before it. That's, that's preferable to me. What time are you going to bed at night? 10.30. I'm out. So you don't have that much sleep, six, seven hours. No, I try to get seven or eight. Yeah, six seven. Yeah, 10.30, 10 o'clock. I'm finished. All right. So you go for the run. Go for the run. Okay. Back, whatever happens with the kids, wherever we're at that part of

day. And then do you really want to go through all of it? Do you want to be how nuts? Do you want to see how nuts I am? I mean, kind of, go, go, do it. Okay. This is going to get weird. So then I fill up, I have like a half a gallon of water that I fill up. I put in these minerals, trace minerals and some lemon. Then I fill up two other glasses that will be used later. One is with chlorophyll, one is with a little apple cider vinegar and water.

It's mixed. And then I get to work that I'm doing outside, whether it be like right now we're building a new chicken coop, we're building an enclosure for the donkeys. So I'll do something around here with who's ever here with me. Right. And then I'll take the dog now I'm back from the run. So me and Juno, who's right next to me sleeping. She's wild. She's like a hundred pound Shepsky. She's always with me. She follows me everywhere. Nice. Shepherd Husky. We go on a giant walk around the property, like all around the ranch. And we just checking on everything, seeing what's going on. Then sometime around

noon, I'll eat something. Same breakfast every day. Complete insanity. I eat the same thing. I eat the same thing every day. What? It's two pieces of Ezekiel toast with almond butter. One, one apple, a bunch of different berries, potentially some watermelon. When I was doing eggs, I was doing three eggs, right? And that's it. Inside of you is brought to you buy quince. I love quince, Ryan. I've told you this before. I got this awesome $60 cashmere sweater. I wear it religiously. You can get all sorts of amazing, amazing clothing for such reasonable prices. Look, cooler temps are rolling in. And as always, Quince is where I'm turning for fall staples that actually last. From cashmere to denim to boots,

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from my show. The new Mitsubishi Outlander brings out another side of you. Your regular side listens to classical music. Your adventurous side rocks out with the dynamic sound Yamaha. Regular U owns a library card. Adventurist U owns the road with super all-wheel control. Regular side, alone time. Adventurous side journeys together with third The new Outlander, bring out your adventurous side. Mitsubishi Motors, drive your ambition. I mean, how do you have enough energy just like with what you're eating?

That gives you enough energy for the day? Yeah, I'm weird like that. I've read this thing many, many years back that said, you know, eat to live or live to eat. And I just, I'm good. Even after I've done, like, I'm good. And the truth is, then I'll just like snack on like some nuts or like, raw nuts, you know, uh, throughout. I drink a lot of liquids. And you feel great. You feel

great. All day. Every day. Yeah. I feel great. You never get any kind of, I'm taking it. You never get any anxiety or anything, do you? No. You don't deal with any anxiety. No, the psilocybin helped that a lot. It did because I was thinking about, I actually am going to start microdosing on on shrooms. Yeah, I can tell you everything about it. What do you need to know? I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm, well versed well i deal with a lot of anxiety and i want to get out of my head i want to be able to relax more i want to be able to function more than always in fight or flight mode and everything's overwhelming and i want it to stop i want those things to stop so some people have recommended that my friend jessica and she made some capsules for me and they're very very low dose and you take one

every three or four days does that sound about right uh there's two different protocols i do my own protocol. There's a fatamine protocol and a stamets protocol. The fat of them one, I believe, is two days on, one day off. Stamets is five days on, two days off, mixed with some different vitamins that you mix it with. I do my own, meaning that there's different strains, right, for different things you want out of it. But really, it's all about the intention. Now, the first time I ever did, because I'm not counting when I was an idiot kid, right? When I was an idiot kid, and I think this is where a lot of people get tripped up, you'll do like a macro dose when you're, you know, when I used to go to limelight and I was like 15 and you do like four grams of mushrooms

and you're like out of your mind, right? You're just like playing echoed a dolphin with your friends at like four in the morning and feeling like you're in the game and you're like, what's happening here. That's not it. That's not what it's intended for. While might be fun when you're a teenager, it's definitely not what it's intended for. So for me, as someone who doesn't drink, doesn't smoke, you know, never really had a great relationship with weed. I tried. It wasn't for me. To go on the microdosing journey was like frightening because I was like, wait a second. I don't know. I don't know how this is going to be. And I don't know. So I researched it for a good two years. I started listening. I read a bunch of books.

Michael Pollan has a great book out. I should say I listened to books. I'm not sure I read any anyone. Yeah, let's stop. Let's stop trying to fool people. So I listened to a bunch of stuff. I would go on these YouTube benders of like seeing it. And I was like, well, maybe, maybe, right? And then someone gave me some stuff that I was like, okay. And like you said before, super minimal amount. And I did a, and a minimal amount is anything under 0.5.

So anything under 0.5 of a gram is a minimal amount for me. Right. And that, after I did it, I took two months off where I went, I need to just process what just happened because my entire earth was like off axis. I was like, what just went on? Where did my, why did I feel all these amazing things? Why was like questioning all these amazing things? It was almost like the way I explained it to someone recently was it was almost like someone

woke me up. Like they tapped me on the show and like, hey, by the way, take it easy. It's okay. And I was like, what, what? And then for two months I had to process it. That was probably about, I don't know, time is irrelevant. with the way the world's been the last two years, but probably about two years ago. And since then, whenever I'm not filming, and for no particular reason, people are like,

oh, why don't you do it when you film it? I just don't. It's just one of my weird habits. When I'm not filming, I probably partaking it five of the seven days a week. And you feel like it calms you, it relaxes you, it opens your, what are you feeling when it's working? It's changed my whole life. Change everything. Nothing. Without getting all weird, because people get so weird about that stuff. It's like it's not the things that you are worrying about, while they're valid, they're ultimately irrelevant. Like, you know what I mean?

Yeah. Like we're like we're, I've had a lot, a lot of people die and most horrifically in my life, whether it be through suicide drug overdoses, you know, I had a lot. My birth father died when I was super young. My uncle who was big part of raising me. My thing is that we're going to die. And in a hundred years from now, no one's going to really know much. Right.

you know, it's going to happen. And we're stressing about things that the anxiety comes from a lot of these things and these pressures that we put on ourselves or that I could say I was putting on myself. And the truth is, if you look into any type of really great literature like Albert Camus and you study Stoicism and Marcus Aurelius and like all these different deep rabbit holes, go listen to like 17 hours of Alan Watts, you're going to understand that it's just, it's kind of pointless, right? Like, you can't control the world. I can't control the world. All I can do is control myself. And for me, where I'm at now with these two amazing kids, an amazing life, an amazing life that I'm trying to build upon, you know, of course there's still demons around.

There's still like egos and people that are trying to, you know, make my life harder and people that are having a hard time and all that. But what am I going to do? Am we going to go to pieces about it? am I going to go to pieces if I didn't get the job that I wanted or if it did, I just have to keep moving. And what it taught me when you say, what did it make me feel? It just made me kind of make it all more granular where I was like, this is silly. And life is absurd. And I just, there's nothing I can do about it. The only thing I can do is take care of myself. And meaning like, I can only be the best version of myself for you. I can only be the best version of myself right now for for my kids for my for juno my dog next to me and i can only worry about that i can't control the rest of me

wow that really that's what happened by doing this this is what opened your eyes changed everything changed everything because look this is obviously you said it this is not for everyone some people might go oh come on you mushroom much there's there's a science now there's there's this is something that people are really talking about in the world and microdosing and helping people with anxieties and you know there's there's there's the meds that you can take there's the microdosing there's you know there's many different ways to help with things. And I think it's just a process of elimination or seeing what works for you. You know, um, 100% do the research. Watch the, watch the, watch the documentaries on Netflix. There's a couple of great ones, right? Um, a fantastic fungi and, and, and watch them and then

make your own assessment. But if you, I'm, I think we're in a weird part of like, I guess this is something that I've never done and I just don't do. I don't give opinions on anything because opinions create adversaries, I always say. All I can talk about is knowledge for me. And whether you agree with that, I don't give a fuck. It has nothing to do it. You know what I mean? Like, I just give you my knowledge for me. If you say, well, that's not true. I'll go, okay, it's true for me. So what does it matter? What, like you think? But we have come to this weird place where everybody feels like their thing is the right thing. So that's why when people ask me, I go, no, no, no, let me just tell you what I do and what works for me. Someone might,

here, you eat the same thing every day and go, that's not enough nutrients. That's not enough this. And I go, okay, it works for me. Right? Like, I'm okay. Like, I don't, again, I've never been one to seek out, like, I like to listen to people and I like to hear their thoughts. And then, but like I had to, as I get older, and you and I know this, it's like I started shedding away the things that don't work for me and the things that work for me. So right now, you're saying, you have anxiety that you'd like to get past okay what avenues are you going to try to do that you can't just go one way you've got to try it a month oh i'm trying a lot of different things you're right you're right i'm trying hypnotism i'm about to start i'm trying energy therapy i'm trying

microdosing i'm trying meds and try and just trying to do everything that i can to live the best life i can and then you're going to find the one and it's going to be the thing for you and then someone's going to go what the fuck would you do that try this instead try this go jump out of a plane wearing a fucking furry costume and you're going to like be way better and you go what i know this works for me and that's everybody has their thing and they think they want people to come and believe in it so it reassures that their thing is the right thing and this is why would i say i don't know people go oh you're a vegan i go sure right now maybe not tomorrow i don't i don't know Right. And I think that when you start, we want to box people so bad on things, on everything. And I'm just like, I always say this and it gets people weird. I'm like, I don't even exist. Like, I exist as in when I'm a dad, I'm with my kids. When I'm with my dog, I'm Theo with the dog. I'm Theo as the dad. I'm Theo talking to you on this amazing podcast. I'm, I'm Theo when I see you at Comic Con. Like, I'm that, but I'm never, who am I? I'm just someone playing the role.

than I'm in. So I don't fucking have. I'm not I'm not my feet aren't in concrete on anything. It's a one thing. Just don't be an asshole. Simply. Don't be an asshole. It's so much work. It's so much more work to be an asshole, isn't it? And there's so many of them. Have you worked with a lot of assholes? Fuck yes. And it's not their fault. It's the it's the system we that was built upon what we've what we've created. What and I say we not that I was maxed. Senate or Charlie Chaplin or Daryl Zennick. But I'm saying like the system that has been created has been, if you're talented, you can do no wrong.

Get away with murder. You get away with murder. If you sell box office, who gives a fuck? Yeah. Do what you want. And they, that has gone on. And then what happens is we give awards to actors when the actor is, is silent. If there's no words from a writer, if there's.

there's no directions from a director, if there's no lighting from a gaffer and there's no camera turned on. So it's like, how about just give an award for the entire project? Right. Because once you start singling out who's more important, that starts bleeding into the work environment. Yeah. And it's completely ludicrous when you think about it. Because if an actor was the most important, he can go stand alone on a stage with nothing happening. I like how your mind works. I'm definitely microdosing. You know, we got deep a little bit. We started talking about microdosing everything. And there's a lot to talk about. And, uh, you know, you got sons of anarchy and you know, you were in Luke Cage and you've done

tons of movies and tons of guest stars and you've been busting your ass and working. But I, by the way, I want to mention it. This new movie you have. Emily the criminal. I watched it. Now, listen, when they, when your publicist was like, here's the link. You want to watch the movie? I'm like, oh, fuck, I don't have time to watch a fucking movie right now. What the fuck? And I just started it. I played it while I was looking at some emails. I'm being honest with you. And I was sucked the fuck in. I was sucked in.

It's so intense. And Aubrey Plaza is brilliant and you're brilliant in it. And it's such a, just this crazy relationship that happens between the two of you. And the movie is just like you feel for, I like movies when you feel for the lead character who's doing the wrong thing, but you understand why she's doing it. And it's just this.

weird journey that I was honestly at times like in the room I won't say give anything away with the clock ticking yeah the beginning I'm just like oh my god and those characters you're just like it's kind of it's a heist movie it's it's it's much more than that but I was really impressed with this and people could watch emily the criminal where everywhere or is everywhere it's in theaters everywhere yeah Aubrey and I were just together we did our two premieres in LA and new york we were both kind of flying from other jobs in and we got seen on the big screen because we debuted at Sundance, but Sundance went virtual last year. And really cool. We were the highest rated film out of Sundance. You know, it was this little movie that, you know, I mean, we shot in 21 days

that we just didn't, not that we didn't expect anything. Aubrey produced it. It was kind of this thing that I was doing this other movie in Atlanta and her and I zoomed. And it was like, yeah, like when I see, because I've produced some stuff, like when I see someone putting it all out there and I read the script. It's a 90-minute movie, you know, it's a fast read on the script. And I like movies that I call like replacement theory, like where I can watch it and go, what would I do if I was that person? What would I do if I was in that situation?

Those are my favorite movies. It's like the game with Michael Douglas. Oh, yeah, yeah. You know, what would happen here? And it's when I watch films and I read films like that, I'm like, that's what I want to do. I want to go on that ride. It's like a Six Flags ride.

And her and I just, you know, when it debuted at some, Sundance, it had a ton of buzz. You know, like I said, highest rated one. We were just waiting for it to come out. Roadside's amazing. We're in, like, I think we're in like 500 theaters now across the country, which is really cool. It did really well. It's the highest critical thing I've ever been a part of in all ways.

She's extraordinary in it. Yeah, extraordinary. Both you guys. Yeah, and you just want people, you know, John Patton Ford, first time director. Great job. Yeah, just amazing. So it's been a really cool, like, run the last few years, and I feel like this was the one that I was, I'm really excited about this one because it's, again, a wildly different character

than I've been playing. Yeah, you guys have to say it, Emily, the Criminal. I mean, it really is good. Trust me, I was, if you could write into me, you could write on the Patreon, and you can tell me what an asshole I am, but you're, I'm not wrong in this one. This was a movie that I was just emailing while I'm listening and watching, and then I just got sucked in. I'm telling you, and there was no turning back.

It was just great performances, intensity, just a really good story. And you care about the characters, which is hard to do. Yeah, I mean, you know, it's that anti-hero thing we've been doing since, like, you know, Vic Mackey and the Shield and, you know, obviously a bunch of things where you start to like the villain. I think we've probably been doing it a lot longer than that. It's just been, you know, kind of more amplified with television, right? You know, speaking of, we were just talking about this, the other.

the day, my buddy and I, it's like, and you, you know, you obviously taking on one of the most legendary characters in history in Lex Luthor, but I talk about Gene Hackman. And when he played Lex Luthor, it's like, I liked him way more than Superman when I was a kid. I knew I did. I don't know why. I just did. Like him better. He was better to watch. Yeah. That's not supposed to happen. But then if you look at the Godfather and stuff like that, we identify more where we go, oh, because they're, you know, they're, I'm probably going to say the war wrong, but they're, they're fallible. Yeah.

Where with superheroes or good characters, I don't mean in the literal sense of the cape, when you're the good character, the straight, you know, lace, you can't have anything wrong with you, where the one who's a little ambiguous has more things going on. There's, and that's life. We're all, you know, the yin and the yang of life. So I think that with Emily, that's the service of what John created. where you go, I know these people are doing something wrong, but I got to tell you, I kind of like them. I know. It's just so weird. When that happens, it's a little magic because usually, you know,

films, a lot of the movies I watch, I just feel like, you know, if you don't start out with them in a movie, at least liking someone or someone is engaging or there's, you just, it doesn't matter how good the movie is in terms of like, you know, story and whatever you've got to somehow connect with these characters if you're going to go on this journey. I feel anyway, a lot of And that it doesn't happen. Do you ever find, let me ask you a question because you've met a ton of people in this business. Do you ever find that like if you don't like someone, you can't watch them anymore?

Yeah. I'm not going to make any say any names, but there's some people, I'm like, I just can't look at that person. I can't look at that person. I can't hear that person. I know. And it's probably shallow of me, but it's just, it's a gut reaction. It's a gut reaction.

It's a gut reaction. Don't you ever meet somebody in person in real life? and then just go, I just, I don't like that person or I would never hang out with that person. That's the same thing. I equated to like the animals that I'm around all the time and like especially my dog, like she just either likes you or she doesn't, right? She knows. She just knows.

Like she'll be like, wait a second. Or she just goes bananas and like rose it at you and like she's on you, right? I feel that way around certain people. I'm like, and you can call it energy. You can call it whatever you want, but you go, uh, not for me. And then it's on the flip where if I meet someone and they're like, amazing, I can't wait to watch their stuff. I'm like, oh man, I'm going to watch everything that person's in because they were such a great person. And that's the weird thing about this business

because you meet some people in stuff that you used to like and you're like, oh, I can't watch that anymore. I know. It's, yeah, I know. It's a shame. It's a shame. Sometimes you meet people and they're just not what you thought. And you're like, oh, my God. And then, yeah, you can't go back and watch them. We don't have to get into the names, but we're sure we want to. But, you know, look um awesome on the movie emily the criminal you guys got to see it please check it out it's really freaking good but you know we were talking about all these good things how you have your shit together how you have this routine you get your family you love your family and you got this ranch and it seems like life's going great for you knock on wood i always knock on wood

i don't know if that works where's wood well it works for me see it works for me you're just talking about that theo okay hold on there you go we're in yeah thank you um But it wasn't always rainbows for you. No. I mean, you grew up with a single mom. Your dad wasn't around. Explain that story like growing up. Super weird, I guess, in the 80s of, I was the first person that I knew that their father wasn't living in the house.

Like, he was gone. And like everyone was aware of it. And again, this is probably around 19, I mean, totally aging ourselves here. Let's see. I was 9. So 84. 84. 84. And I remember thinking like, huh, but I was, you know, and again, they tried to like pull the, you know, oh, he's just moving closer to work. I was like, he works like a mile and a half away. Like, when he wasn't going to move closer for it, it takes five minutes to get there. But I was more rational where my sister was like, oh, that makes sense. That'll get there in a minute. And I was like, okay. But I knew, you know, you always knew, here's the thing. Everybody goes through it. He was, he was a person. And I could see. say this now that, you know, I found out he died on the internet in 2010. And I only found that out

because I went out and searched looking for him after the success of Sons of Anarchy. Because I'd been written up in the local paper in New York. And I was like, maybe the time is now, because the last time we had a conversation was when my uncle, his brother, had killed himself. And I had to call and tell him because he didn't know. And I hadn't talked to him in years. and the conversation did not go well. And here's the thing. He was a guy who was not supposed to be a father. There's a very big difference, right? This is why I always tell people if you're contemplating having kids. Once you have children, it's them. Your whole existence is into them. It doesn't mean that your life stops. It means your life changes. And if you still are embarking on an ego

journey and it's all about you, well, you're doomed. Because now you're going to become resentful. You're going to start acting out of character. You're going to do things. Now, this is back in the time when they didn't have the resources, the tools to talk like we are now, to have conversations. It just was, well, I don't want to do that. I'm doing, I'm doing this. I didn't fulfill these things I wanted to do. He had gotten around some unsavory characters. He was an unsavory character himself. and he just wasn't meant to be a father. My mom was super young and he was gone. And that was it.

And what that did for me, now that I can look back on it, while it was hectic, it brought everything in my life because it gave me like a bit of a chip on my shoulder. And it kind of made me, it put me in scenarios of like working and different thoughts and like what I, that I needed to succeed and I needed to do something different. and I want to turn out like him. And there were times where I was going to be like him. And there were all these different things that I had learned from that lesson. So as I grow older, I look back on it and it was tumultuous.

I mean, I remember at a young age, there are a lot of weird things that happen now that I look back on. I talk about it with my mom sometimes. I mean, there was a time where the FBI came and raided my house and they were looking for my dead grandmother because everything was put in her name. um there was all these strange occurrences of like you know waiting sitting on the stoop where he's supposed to come and get you for the weekend and he never shows right and it's like it's like out of a movie i was just going to say that that's like wow it's like out of a movie that they don't show and then when they do show there were times they did show when he was hammered and like you know

you're in this car and you're like i'm going to fucking die on this thing and all of that stuff starts to play into who you become and you're going to go one way or the other and i've definitely gone all the ways you know as as the as the macho man randy savage once famously said i've sword with the eagles and i've slithered with the snakes and everything in between right yeah but you got to keep moving forward it's like all those things leave impressions on your brain and you start to grow up really fast so i started doing things at a super young age that i'm happy now because they made me who I am, but as having two young kids, I'm like, whoof, that was too young. That was too young to do those things, I think. But again, I don't know, right? It just, I know life is what it is.

So I was around, I was all women, right? My sister, my mom, my Nana, you know, I was around all women and it was amazing. It's an incredible way to be raised because I was able to have the toughness of where I grew up and have the, I should say, the smarts, the fragility, the smarts, and the intestinal fortitude and tenacity of the women who were around me. And I think that that prepared me for life. And I think that I, my mom was an artist. She's a dressmaker. My birth father before he, even though he led a extremely criminal lifestyle, was a really wonderful artist. A great designer was was very smart but again never almost like yusuf in emily the criminal never he wanted more but he was thrust into this life right um and that was just the beginnings but then i went through you know

i did all the typical you know hectic stuff of figuring out who i was i just got really fortunate that i figured it out uh before i was too old did you get pretty deep into things because i know you came out with openly to say that you were dealing drugs and things like that were there times where you could have died many times? I've been in some really precarious situations. Let me fix this camera. I was in some precarious situations, meaning that I didn't know any better.

I was not equipped for, I was not, okay, so if you're from a family of lawyers, you kind of, yeah, you're going to be a lawyer or military families.

A lot of guys follow or women following the footsteps of their father and join, you know, and go down range and join. So you're kind of raised by, the thing around you. So when there's no one there, when the goal is survival, you figure it out. And for me, when it came to, you know, hustling and dealing drugs and doing whatever I was doing,

it was just because it was the only thing I knew how to do. I always say that no criminal wants to do crime. They just do it because they don't really fucking know what else to do, right? No one's giving them another avenue. And then you go, well, you can go work here. I remember that. I remember when I went to go try and work at Blockbuster, my freshman year in college, and they were like, okay, so you have to wear tan pants, go get those. I was like, I don't have any money to get tan fucking pants. And then they were like, okay, and you're going to get, I think back then it was like $2.75 an hour. And I was like, $2.75 an hour. I can flip an ounce and make $600. Why would I do that? It sounds ridiculous. Because again, I just always thought of life

in time. So this scenario was never like, oh, yeah, but you're not going to go to jail for fucking put in away fast times in Richmond hide the wrong way. I wasn't thinking that when I was doing it. It was just, it was just, I can do this and that seemed more reasonable. Yeah. And there was no one there going, it's not reasonable. Let me tell you why. It was just me and my own brain and the people who were around me who had the same mindset as me who were going, yeah, fuck it. Let's just, let's just flip some, let's go grab 20 pounds and do this. And you go, oh, cool, because it made more sense. So, again, I think it's what you're, your, what's in your toolkit? What do you have for you?

And I didn't have, I had different set of skills, as they would say. I didn't have the right set of skills, maybe I guess in societal terms. But I learned them. Yeah. What got you out of it, though? What, what happened that life took a different direction? Because a lot of times you go down that path and that's, a lot of times people can't get, can't come back from that there's always a moment everything's a moment there's always a moment like when

i stopped even drinking and doing anything there's always a moment there's a moment that something happens someone says something that you go oh and for me when that happened i had been in a situation where i basically got brought in by the cops for something and when i and i got let go for a reason, might have known a few people. And when I got home to keep this story as shallow as possible, when I got home, I realized that I could have been in a lot more trouble for what I might have had on me. That wasn't found. And I realized, like when I jumped out of a plane once, that I'll never do it again, you can only spit in God's face so many times, right? So it's like, I knew at that moment I had to make a decision that I was like,

Okay. I'm okay. I'm here. If I do this again, I might not be. So what's, what's the choice? What am I going to do? Am I going to go again and roll the dice? Or am I going to stop and figure out something else? Most people can't make that decision. It can't stop. You think that that's a hard decision to make that you were, you had enough foresight or whatever that you sort of just understood in a mature way, weirdly mature that I'm going to, this is not going to end. well it was it was the first time i'd ever really looked at the ramifications of it right it didn't mean that it fully stopped then either it means that at that moment that was a stop to the next part right and it was like every and then even when i got to l.a i only knew certain skills right so like i only

knew certain things i didn't have skills beyond labor right like i just and and and i consider that you know, hustling like labor. I just only knew, I was either going to go work a construction site or bartend or bar back or deal drugs. Like that was it. I did. That was the extent of my resume in life. Like I just didn't, if you told me, oh, we're going to go, you know, lay rugs in a building like I used to do on the summers. Sure, I can do that. But I only had a limited, I didn't have many skills. So when I looked at that one skill at that time and when I can't do this, I got to figure something else out. So I figured something else out. So I figured something else out at that moment. But then sometimes you have to revert back to the only skills you know

have. I remember in 2000, oh God, you were probably in L.A. In 2002, 2003, 2003, 2002, I was working in a restaurant in a bar. I booked a co-star recurring. I didn't know the difference. I thought once I got a recurring on the show, Boston Public, that I was going to be, this is it. See you later. Rob Lowe, here I come. I'm coming for the cover of People magazine like, this is it. And then, and then, uh, that ended after three episodes. And I was like, wait, I just quit my job. Like I was like, wait, I thought this was it. Again, I didn't have the skill set. So I had to figure it out. How was I going to keep pursuing what I wanted to do? Because this was a time when back in the day, you used to have six auditions a day. You'd have commercials. You'd have guest stars.

You'd be running stuff in the car. And I had to figure it out. And my buddies at the time had opened up an after hours. And it was in Liberace's old penhouse on Beverly Boulevard. And it opened at 11, 2 in the morning, and he closed at like 11 in the next day. Oh, my God. And I was the only bartender in there. And I saw some shit in that place. What did you say? Can't talk about it. It was wild. It was wild. I want you to imagine this. It was only like word of mouth. And it was in Liberace's old penhouse. And it was all famous people. doing and i was the only bartender and there were like two waiters so you saw snorting and

drugs and sex and boobs everywhere and dongs wild this shit i've ever fucking like i would literally go to my friends and go did you fucking see who's in that room you see what's going on over there did you see this did you see what's happening by the pool like it was insane as a young kid who was so enamored by Hollywood, it was, it was like someone brought you behind the wizard curtain. And I was like, what the fuck? Who is this? Big actors. You're talking big A-list actors. I'm talking like Oscar winners. I'm talking like, I'm talking like the biggest of the big from music to acting to everything. And I was like, holy shit, this is the craziest shit I've ever seen. this is like I don't understand and and all through the night right two days and

and how much are you making are you how much you making it a night like tons tons of money because I was I was so I had such a like a hustle attitude when my thing was if you now remember most people are geeked out of their face if they want to get a drink from me they have to give me a lot of money because I'm the only one working so they're peeling off like hundreds just because the alcohol is free which they use to, you know, do that shit where they'd fill up the great goose bottles with like the, you know, the, the, uh, whatever pop off like the shittiest rock around the planet. Yeah. And then, and then you, they would say, oh, I want, I want the great goose. Here's

300. And you're like, okay. Sure. Sure. It's great goose. Let me just put a lot of soda in it. And they would get, so I would make, uh, I was making a couple of thousand for two days. Wow. At least. Yeah. That's insane. And then I'd have my whole week off for auditioning. that's beautiful what a treat what a damn treat you know last two years um i look at your like resume and like you did so many guest stars mm-hmm i mean law and order hawaii five o the unit jericho bones without a trace dronica mars my pd blue c s i mean it goes on and on how lost don't forget lost that was my last i love lost yeah i mean you you you're in everything i mean was it so this is what i guess this is like during the 2000s early 2000s and so what was the the big

break was it was the big break sons of anarchy that was the big first i'm a regular on a show yeah i did i did two pilots that never got picked up one was a sitcom and one was uh one was i guess like kind of like a gray's anatomy rip off they didn't go and i was mr guest star there was a there was a time where i was doing a movie in new orleans and there were three guest stars airing at the same day, three different networks that I had done on like a Wednesday at 8 p.m. And my mom was like, which one do I watch? I was like, I don't know, CBS, ABC, NBC. I was on all three. And it was one of these weird things where I was doing a lot of guest stars and a lot of commercials. And when Sons came, Sons is a strange story. I audition for every single role in Sons.

Like when I say every role, I started with Jax. I went down the line and I didn't get anything. and Wendy O'Brien, who was the castner out there, had just cast me in two things. One was a show medical investigation with Neil McDonough that I did like a guest spot on and she loved. And one was this Chris Carter movie that never came out called Bellflower, Chris Carter, creator of the X-Files. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, she was championing for me on Sons, but I didn't get it. And I was like, and it was a weird time in my life. because my uncle, who is the single most biggest influence on me, to this day, he moved to Northern California when he was 21 when my grandfather died. He left New York. And he became like a bit of like a biker. He was a rockabilly biker. And then he worked at St. Quentin.

And then he got caught dealing drugs. And he went into St. Quentin as a prison. Like it was like this whole crazy story. And he was the most colorful human being I'd ever met in my life. And he would sit there while we would go for walks when I was in New York. And he would just talk to me about these motorcycle clubs. And he would give me like the history of him. And this is years before.

So I was under the impression that Sons was like my destiny because he died in 2004 when I was doing this movie in Toronto. I'd found out he died at the rap party. So I was like, oh, I'm supposed to do this show. But I didn't get it. And then about a week later, I got to come. call from Wendy O'Brien. She said, hey, Kurt, the creator wants to talk with you. And I was like, okay. She's like, just talk to him. He has an idea for something. I was like, okay. And he's really short with the way he talks. And he goes, listen, I don't know if you'll be in one episode or

100. I don't know if you'll have one line or 100. I don't know. I just want you on the show. And I was like, okay. He's like, but we don't have any money. And like, I just want you on the show. And I was like, okay. So I went back and I was testing for another pilot at the time. And I told my manager at the time, they left me after this. I said, I'm going to do that show. And they're like, no, you're not. It's like zero dollars.

You're testing. I said, no, no, no, I'm going to do that show. And I did. And I got made a regular in the second season. And my entire life change. I met my wife through it, my whole life and my whole existence. You made your wife on set? No, when I went over to a regular show.

Iraq and Kuwait, Baghdad, like we did all the U.S.O. Tours. Right. My wife, she was a former news anchor and she was doing PR for military charities. She started with Marcus LaTrell and then she was doing stuff for the boot campaign. And we met through that. And a couple of years later, we kind of met, you know, again. And now we have two kids and we live in a ranch in Texas. So again, it all came from like everything else, like all my other jobs came from.

sons and came from that moment of like Wendy taking a chance and Kerr taking a chance and me taking a chance. Yeah. How would you sum it up? Like if you had to sum up sons of anarchy for all those years you did it. I mean, it was probably grueling schedule and a lot of work, right? Absolute chaos, but I have it no other way. It was like Charlie and I just said when we did that Reaper review thing with Kim and I, it was like going to college. Like for me, I had been around, I was around these, for me, again, I'm like a, I love character actors. I swear because I would think all actors are characters. But whatever, I love character actors.

And I think it's like when I saw Ron Perlman and Kim Coates and Tommy Flanagan and Katie Seagal and like, and I did the original pilot with Scott Glenn, like who I had done, who I had done a movie with prior to that, I was enthralled. I was also a giant fan at a shield. So I was like so happy to be there. chaos it was absolute chaos i when i did luke cage right after it i had the same executive producer writer who was on that show with me and it was a also the showrunner had done this movie i did lowriders he wrote that i was almost like um i rescue all my dogs and so i know what it's like i was like a dog who just got rescued but they were like hey hey it's okay it's okay they just need you on set like it's okay because it was like i was like i was like i

was so tense all the time from sons all the time really just tense with wanting to be great wanting it to work what was it it was like a heavy show like it was heavy in all aspects it was i could talk about the positives for days like i don't know what it's like to be in the rolling stones or the beetles or being like a rock band like even a a minimal one but like when we were together and we were together all the time on our bikes, going to Comic-Conn's, going to restaurants, going to bars. It was like being rock stars.

Like you would just roll up 11 deep and everyone was in the show. And people were like, well, what the fuck is happening here? So it was that where it was like, I'd never been exposed to that. It was a guest star actor. And then at the same time,

it was the schedule of the amount of we were filming on the budget we were filming. It would be compared to like a low budget indie now and we were filming at an accelerated pace and then the emotions were running so high so we would we had no other choices but to well i know for me and maybe it's because i'm not nearly as good as an actor as all the other people i had no other choice but to exist as that character all the time because of the schedule wow so and juice was like a really fucked up character So I was kind of fucked up for like eight years.

Really? It messed you up for eight years. You were just kind of like not quite yourself. I tried to turn it off, but it was like we were always all together. So our dynamic was shaped from the show. Wow. So it was like you were, you were emulsified into who you were. So it was like you, you almost had to take it on because it was so all the time, all the time.

you were always reminded like all the time right you have a much especially when you have a mohawk and tattoos on your head like you can't you're that guy you can't get away from it you can't get away from it which is an amazing thing and it really i think like charlie and i said the other day i don't think you can ever do that again it was like a it was like a moment in time right it doesn't exist anymore it's like the sopranos i talked to those guys and they had a lot of the same exact kind of deal where they were just together all the time, they go to dinners all the time, and their characters kind of acted like their characters.

Do you still talk to all the guys? All of them, all the time. All the time. Just, what a brotherhood. That's crazy. I just got off with Kim. I just got off with Coats. I was texting with Paralman.

I love them. It was like, it's like we went, now we can reflect on it. Like now, but it was like we went through this thing that we were, all unsure of at the end and we just needed to get away from each other and then we came back around i think that happens i think that happened even with me my co-star tom uh we were we were you know were really cool but the last thing you want to do is hang with people that you're on set with all day

for for all those years and then a couple years passed and then it just sort of a friendship evolved you know and a respect and a respect a mutual respect it was really weird and like we we do things together we you know it's it's nice um this is called shit talking with theo rossi uh this is my top tier patrons they ask questions you answer rapidly if you'd like if for some reason you want to talk about you can't but you can't be working let's go to patreon dot com slash inside of you i appreciate all the love i'll send you a message if you join it thanks for the sport of the show here we go sophie m what is something you wish you knew now that you didn't know when you started acting uh don't give a fuck what anyone says hmm god i wish i could live by that

Dana S. What is in your music playlist besides I have a tiger? My music taste is all over the place. Usually it's mellow folk music at this point. That's what I hit on the Amazon. But I've become rapidly obsessed with this Elvis movie and the soundtrack that Bass put out. I love Elvis. That movie was good.

But I like the movie. He was extraordinary. He was extraordinary. Extraordinary. Baz's mind is extraordinary. The soundtrack, if you get the one that he did, he explains the songs and it's in a certain order and it's curated the right way is extraordinary. But I listen to, to answer more specific, I've been listening to a lot of John Prine lately. I haven't listened to enough for him.

It's really good. All right. Danny what attracted Theo well what it attracted you to Emily the criminal fantastic chemistry with Aubrey Plaza well you told it you pretty much told us yeah I had never seen her in anything I tell her this all the time I had not seen her the only film that I had watched her work in without even knowing it was this Christmas film that I think was on Netflix but I had not watched Parks and Rex I had not seen Black Bear I'd seen them all now I had not seen Inger Goes West I and it's just for the lack of like the last seven years with kids has just been, you know, I watch, you know, wreck it Ralph every five minutes. So it's like, I know what I mean? Ask me about Coco, I'll tell you everything. But I just didn't know about the other stuff.

So, but when I got on the Zoom with her and John, that she was easily the reason. Really? Yeah, she's a legend. She's, I tell her, she's, I've never seen it. So, you know, we're in such a. weird time, right? 650 television shows, 950 movies last year. We don't, like, what she's doing is extraordinary. She's hysterical. Yet, I can just name three movies that is some of the best dramatic performances I've ever seen, Emily being the best of them, maybe Black Bear.

That's such a rarity. I can only name very few actors, Phil Hoffman comes to mind and Robin Williams and people that do drama and comedy seamlessly, you know, and she is doing that. There's just a very few. And I know, of course, everybody's going to like, yeah, but not at that level. Of course. Give her a moment. Yeah. Just, you know, but it's like when you're doing that seamlessly, when you're funny and

you're knocking it out of part dramatically, I mean, we've got to stop and pause for a second and say, that's a rarity. Yeah. There are certain actors that I absolutely, I love Daniel Day Lewis, but hasn't made me laugh recently you know what I mean that doesn't mean you laugh ever well no I actually did find him pretty funny as build a butcher who's pretty fun oh yeah yeah for sure what was I called in New York gangs of New York gangs in New York you know Megan T says what type of character do you love to play and on the other hand which one do you hate to be type as in other words I would say

what do you want to do what would you like to do what kind of role I just want to at this point I just want to work with good people. Like I, like to me, like the character I'll create whatever's in there. I'll make it something, whatever, because you could always find something in a character. You know what I mean? Like obviously you want great writing, but you can find something. At this point, because I'm so aware of how short life is, I just want to work around good people. I don't want to be in those like tense, weird situations of like, fuck, I got to avoid this

person or this person shows up three hours late or fucking this is how like it's like I just don't have time for that shit like I'm I'm to you know to quote Brian Cox recently like you know the great Brian Cox he said uh I'm too old I'm too tired and I'm too talented fuck off like I just it just don't have the time so it's like I just want to work with really great people characterize um you know uh you can make anything three dimensional you can make you know that's point when people say, oh, did you play a lot of bad guys? I'm like, bad to who? To the viewer? Not to me. I don't think they're bad guys. Right. You know, or if you say, don't you want to play like good guys? Sure. Sure. Whatever. I love it. It's got such a good attitude. Damn you, Theo. I need to listen to

the morning. I need him to make a recording for me that I could listen to every morning. And before I go to bed, give me some confidence. Give me some perspective on life. Hey, you know, I'm going to ask you, I hate to end on a downer but I keep thinking about it that when you when you were looking up your father yeah uh you know because you had all the success and then when you found out he had passed what kind of emotions happen I mean have you have you have you have is that yeah yeah yeah that's a great question it's not a downer either at all I mean um when it I'll never forget it was 2010 it was my last year of smoking cigarettes I was smoking an American spirit on this porch on Los Tilos, the Toppa Outpost. I had this really cool. I called it the

Batman House. And it was like overlooking all of Hollywood. And I couldn't sleep. And I went on the computer. And my cousin who was a cop in New York, I had written him and said, how do I find this dude? Like, what do I do? And he's like, oh, man, it's all public records. And I was like, yeah, just go on this, you know, pay $40 or whatever did you get everything you need to know. I was like, oh, cool, because his number's not working. He was out of service or whatever. And I'll never forget. I was sitting on that porch.

I had three dogs at the time. They were all with me. And I was smoking an American spirit. And I was scrolling on the computer. And I had paid for whatever it was. I don't even know if it still exists, public records.com or whatever it was. And I was scrolling through and it showed all the addresses and the arrests and this. And I was like, oh, yeah, it's definitely him.

And I got to the bottom and it said, died. September 29, 2009. And I was like, oh, fuck. What? No. And I refreshed. And I was like, wait a second. Maybe I got the wrong one.

But then it was his birthday. Everything was right. So for a minute, I kind of like, it's, you know, it's a gut punch in the beginning. But then it was like, oh, fuck. Okay. Okay. And it was a test for me because I had just got. in my life to a certain place where I was either going to go that way and I was going to go back

that way. And this was one of those things I said, which way are you going to go now? Where are you going to go? And I was like, okay. And here's what I'll say about the whole situation. Not just have I, I've never had to forgive him. I don't need to forgive anyone. I don't need to forgive anyone. And it's not part of my thing. People do what they do. I'm close. to him now than I ever was. However that is relatable to other people, it might not be. It might be. It only matters for me. I speak to him, see him, talk to him, and have a way better relationship than I did in the, however many years we didn't talk, however many the little things that I remember from when I was young. But now, in the research, in the going back,

i got it all that's amazing that is truly amazing yeah this has been eye-opening i really love your your attitude i mean you've been around the block you've kind of been you've experienced all these different emotions and and what life throws at you and you've ended up in such a positive great place and i couldn't be happier for you it's uh it's tremendous man it's tremendous dude it really is and uh well what you're doing is tremendous i i really do i appreciate so much what you're doing and i think that you know at the end of the day what i love about everything that's happening and more importantly what you're doing is like conversation is the key to all right like at the end of the day being able to just speak and talk the one thing that it shows everyone is how

similar we all are exactly we just let people speak we start to realize how similar we all But when it's happening in 140 characters, faceless, no, you know, whatever, that's when it shows more differences. And I think that conversations like this, even if you relate to one, two, three things, it just shows that we're all part of this thing. And more importantly, like, it's all going to be over in a fucking blink. So what you're doing, it's just cool. Like, you know, whatever, whatever everybody wants to think. It's just really cool. So I appreciate it more than, you know.

I appreciate you, man. Thanks for coming on the podcast. I'm going to ask your publicist for your email because I have to, everyone's to watch. Whenever you want to talk, whatever you need to know, I will give you whatever ridiculous knowledge. Remember, I'm south side of an idiot on most things, but some things I have some knowledge. I love it. Hey, thank you so much for coming on the podcast.

Thanks for allowing me to be inside of you. You were so much better than Kim and, I know. I'm kidding. You guys were great. You guys were all great. This has been awesome, dude. Have a great day. And thanks for,

thanks for being here, man. I appreciate you, really. Enjoy your day. All right, buddy. What can you say? I want to hang out with that guy. I think I've actually text him since the interview.

Just say, hey, what's up, man? Just thinking, you know, and he responded. Just loved, loved him. And how open he was. I was so surprised. You never know when you don't know someone and you interview them, Ryan.

You're like, how deep are they? going to get how open are they going to be are they going to be talkative are they going to be are they going to be a dud and he was more than anticipated let's just say that so uh thanks for supporting the podcast guys thanks for everything thanks for joining patron if you're a patron patron patreon dot com slash uh inside of you i want to say talkville because we have one there too but uh patron really helps the podcast so much we wouldn't do this without the top tier without all the patrons who back to the show i don't care if it's a dollar or whatever it's like something that you know

helps pay for shit and uh thank you for listening hopefully um you'll listen uh continue to listen here are the shoutouts for our wonderful patrons top tier patrons get a shout out here they are nancy d lea s s sara v little lisa yukiko jillie b robert b jason w sophy m christin k Raj C. Joshua D. C.J.P. Jennifer N. Stacey L. Jamal F. Janelle B. Kimberley. Mike E. Eldon Supremo. 99 more. Ramirez. San Diego M. Chad W. Leanne P. Janine R. Matty S. Belinda. Belinda. N. Correct. This is a random. Chris H. Dave H. Sheila G. Brad D. Ray H. Tabith. T. Tom N. Lilliana A. Talia. C. No. M. Okay. Betsy. D. Correct. Chat L. Marion, Dan, N, Big Stevie W, Angel M. Rian, C. Corey K. DeBnexin, Michelle A. Jeremy C. Andy T. G., Andy T. Camille S. The chief. Joey M. Design. O.T.G. Eugenian. Leah.

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Katie Red and Stephanie K I don't know what I would do without you patrons thank you again and thanks for listening um you know i'm trying to get over the the anxiety i'm still dion with it i feel like it's a little better you just have to keep trying you have to keep trying different meds and you have to keep you know exercising i'm doing hypnotherapy i'm really trying to battle this you kind of have to do a lot all at once it's not just one easy fix isn't no it's

not an easy fix it's uh it's the toughest thing i've gone through i think a while a long while i think the biggest thing i've gone through it's just like trying to get back on track and i feel like you know you just got to keep working therapy therapy therapy exercise and uh be good to yourself most like most importantly um thank you guys again for listening uh from the hollywood hills and hollywood california i am michael rosenbaum i'm brian tayans Ryan, Tayas. We love you guys. Thanks for tuning in.

And always remember to be good to yourselves. I will see you very soon. Thank you. Hi, I'm Joe Sal C. Hi, host of the Stackin'Vetjean podcast. Today, we're going to talk about what if you came across $50,000. What would you do? Put it into a tax-advantaged retirement account.

The mortgage. That's what we do. Make a down payment on a home. Something nice. buying a vehicle. A separate bucket for this edition that we're adding. $50,000, I'll buy a new podcast. You'll buy new friends.

And we're done. Thanks for playing, everybody. We're out of here. Stacky Benjamin's, follow and listen on your favorite platform.