Insight with Chris Van Vliet - AskCVV #90 - Cody's Heel Turn, Basic "Punkanomics", Night Of Champions Review, Who John Cena Will Lose To

Episode Date: July 4, 2025

https://cvvtix.com - Get your tickets for INSIGHT LIVE in NYC with VIP Meet & Greet! Welcome to AskCVV #90! On this episode, Chris Van Vliet gives his thoughts on WWE Night Of Champion and answers questions about CM Punk's "Punkanomics" promo, who Seth Rollins will cash in his Money In The Bank briefcase on, whether Cody Rhodes will turn heel, if Naomi will cash in her MITB briefcase if/when Jade Cargill wins the Championship, what's next for Karrion Kross, who will induct John Cena into the WWE Hall Of Fame and much more!   Quote I'm thinking about: “Man cannot discover new oceans unless he has the courage to lose sight of the shore.” — André Gide   Please support our sponsors!   PURE PLANK: The future of core fitness! Use the code CVV to save 10% on Pure Plank designed by Adam Copeland & Christian: https://gopureplank.com/?ref=tibcloux  SEAT GEEK: Use my code for 10% off your next SeatGeek order*: https://seatgeek.onelink.me/RrnK/CVV Sponsored by SeatGeek. *Restrictions apply. Max $20 discount PRIZEPICKS: Download the app today and use code INSIGHT to get $50 instantly after you play your first $5 lineup!  TIMELINE: Go to https://timeline.com/insightto get 10% off your order of Mitopure!   VUORI: Get 20% off your first purchase! Get yourself some of the most comfortable and versatile clothing on the planet at https://vuori.com/cvv   ROCKET MONEY: Download the Rocket Money app and enter “Insight With Chris Van Vliet” in the survey   HUEL: Get 15% off plus a FREE Gift for NEW customers with the code INSIGHT at https://huel.comMIRACLE MADE: Upgrade your sleep with Miracle Made! Go to https://trymiracle.com/CVV and use the code CVV to claim your FREE 3 PIECE TOWEL SET and SAVE over 40% OFF   ZOCDOC: Instantly book a top-rated doctor today at https://zocdoc.com/insight   BONCHARGE: Use the code CVV to save 15% off your infrared sauna blanket at https://boncharge.com/cvv   BLUECHEW: Get your first month of BlueChew for free with the code CVV at https://bluechew.com   PLUNGE: Get $150 off your Plunge with the coupon code CVV150 at https://plunge.com   For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://podcast.chrisvanvliet.com If you have ever enjoyed any of these episodes, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast or Spotify? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests.    Follow CVV on social media:  Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Fleet! Oh, greetings and salutations, my friends. Welcome back to another one here on Inside. I'm CVV, Chris Van Fleet. Thank you for being a real one and for listening to an AskCV episode. And thank you for making Insight the number one wrestling podcast on the planet. Hit a razor's edge on that follow button on Apple or Spotify. or wherever you're listening right now,

because I don't want you to miss out on anything that we have coming up, specifically Tuesday's episode. It is one of the most requested guests. I get messages about this person every single day, and we made it happen. So make sure that you hit that razor's edge on the follow button so you don't miss out

on Tuesday's episode. They've only done. This person has only ever done, like, I don't know, three or four interviews ever. And Tuesday is their first one in, 15 years? Yeah. I know. I'm really hyping this up. So Tuesday morning, when it drops, you're going to go, oh my goodness, I can't believe CVV got so and so on the show. Yeah, we got so and so on the show. But thank you for being with us on this episode. Great to see so many

you guys at AEW Dynamite. I was there on Wednesday in Ontario, California, the 300th episode of Dynamite, and they also taped the 100th episode of collision. There's something about the Toyota Arena. That's the place where Jay Uso won the Intercontinental Championship, kind of out of nowhere, like really no build, just like, boom, he's going to win, and the place went wild. Same thing when I went to see dynamite. Just like there's something about the energy in that building that's just special. So it was cool being there. I've seen a bunch of AEW shows there. I've now seen two WW shows there. It was just so cool being there and always great to chat some rassling with you guys. If you are listening on Spotify, it was so cool seeing how many people commented pizza this last

week. Pizza was like the word of the week. There's something for me about Friday and pizza. Pizza Friday. Love a good pizza Friday. I'm definitely going to eat some pizza tonight. But if you're listening on Spotify, just comment the word, what should the word be? Comment the word sharp for very obvious reasons. Yeah, comment the word sharp. So we know that you're listening to this episode.

And we'll check that out on Spotify, one of the many places, of course, where you can leave questions for an Ask CVV episode. You can also email them in, CVV at chrisfanvly.com or leave them on social media with the hashtag ask CVV. Can't wait to see all you real, real, real ones at the next Insight Live. It's kicking off SummerSlam weekend. This is happening Friday, August 1st in New York City. I've had a lot of people ask, can I go to your show and also go to Smackdown? The answer is 100% yes. My show starts at five.

The main part of it will be done by like 630-ish. Even the VIP part, if you hang out after for the meet and greet, that should be done by seven-ish. Plenty of time to get to Smackdown, which starts at 8 o'clock. So grab your tickets while you still can because this one is going to sell out. CVVTX.com, CVVTX.com. And we'll be announcing the guest for this in the next, probably, week or so. Welcome, my friends, to ask CVV number 90, the T.J. Watt, Julius Peppers,

and Drew Gooden edition. Who comes to mind for number 91? Shoot me a message and let me know. This has been so fun. I can't believe we only have 10 of these left. Ah! I don't know. And I've had a lot of people send in ideas for what we do and we get into the triple digits. I just don't think that we can, we'll do the 101 Dalmatian episode. But I think after that, we would just be stretching it. And it wouldn't feel authentic to be like, it is the episode number 109, which on January, or 108, here, this one just popped in my head. This is episode 108.

And one, of course, stands for January. and eight stands for the eighth day. And who was born on January 8th, other than my grandfather, who I'm named after. Elvis Presley was also born on that date. This just wouldn't make sense. And I know there's like fun ideas.

Of course, when we get to episode number 316. That's an obvious one for Ask CVV 316. What? I said Ask CVV 316. That'll be an obvious one. That's also like six years away. But I feel like it ends with 99. But if you have some ideas for who famously wore,

number 91. You know how to get in touch with me. Send it over. But we'll kick things off with this one from Spotify, from Dino Chickarelli, who says, hey, CVV, real, real one here from Long Island, New York. So you know that we know about good pizza.

Heck, yeah, nothing better than New York pizza. I thought that punk coming out to basic thugganomics, basic thugonomics and his rap promo against Sina was absolutely genius. In my opinion, Punk cooked seen in that promo. And even though their match ended in shenanigans, they still delivered big time. I want to get your thoughts slash perspective

on the promo and their match at Night of Champions. Love listening to the podcast. Thank you for your contributions to wrestling Dino. When I first read this, I thought this was the Dino Chichorelli. You know, the famous hockey player who played for the Minnesota North Stars and the Red Wings, but when you said you were from Long Island,

I went, ah, okay, Dino Chichorelli was Canadian, so it can't be. Great name, by the way. I thought this was such a good main event. And I also appreciate the buildup to what happened with the Randy Orton match. It's now happened with the CM Punk match with John Cena. I appreciate the billing here of one last time. It just adds that extra layer of importance to the match.

So let's take it back here a week to the punkonomics promo. And man, punk took some personal shots there saying that, Sina's buried more people than The Undertaker. He referenced Sina's ex-fiance, Nikki Bella. And I have always appreciated that John Sina, it just feels like nothing is off limits when you do a promo battle with him. Like, if you're willing to go there with him, well, just know that he's going to be willing to go there with you as well.

The Punkinomics promo was perfect timing because the week before, Sina took a page out of Punk's playbook, his version of the pipe bomb. So then a week later, punk takes a page at a Sina's playbook with this. And it was so like, it was so strange that Sina's in the ring. And then we hear the basic thuganomics song hit.

And like Sina's reaction, I feel like was all of us going, what the heck is this? And then you see punk life come up on the Titan, Toronto thought that was so well done. The crowd in Saudi Arabia was so loud during the matches at night of champions. Like that was an all-time crowd getting the flashlights out on the phone,

chanting and singing. I just feel like, though, there were some moments during this promo that could have been so much more impactful if it was an audience in, say, Chicago or Philly or New York. I don't know, like some of these lines, like, they were like lines that cut deep. like lines that were like powerful.

And the response was just kind of like flat on some of those lines. Some of the lines, it hit. And then some of them, I just felt like the audience just missed out on them. Maybe that's just me saying that. Maybe that's just my opinion. But that's the way that it felt to me. I heard some people say that this came across as corny, that punk coming to the ring like that and delivering this promo and seeing a style

was corny. but I actually think that was the point. Like punk going over the top with the wardrobe, over the top with the walk, over the top with the delivery, I think was pointing out like, hey, Sina, you're a little corny sometimes.

And I'm going to like almost make a caricature of this. Like I'm going to go so over the top that you're going to realize that sometimes you come across a little corny, a little cheesy. But it just continued to like add fuel to this fire and fuel to this feud of like, this isn't just a rivalry that has existed for a long time.

And it's the first time that we're going to see them in the ring in 14 years. But it's like, this is personal. Like, punk said some really personal things to Sina in that promo. And a week before, during John Sina's pipe bomb promo, like, he said some pretty personal things to punk as well. I thought that main event delivered. It met all of my expectations. It actually went beyond my expectations.

That delivered on all levels. And I think that we all kind of predicted the outcome here in terms of who was going to walk away as the champion. But I feel like this now really starts to make things interesting for SummerSlam. John Sina and Cody Ruds, and we'll go through the entire Knight of Champions card. But we'll kind of one by one just like pick through these. And actually this one leads.

write into it an email from Moses and Aaron who says, Hey, CVV, my son and I love listening to Ask CVV every Friday. My question is, do you think that Cody turning heel is one of the ways that John Sina, quote, ruins wrestling? At Night of Champions, it looked like we got a little glimpse of a heel turn from Cody, right? Anyways, thank you for your show, Moses and Aaron. Yeah, Night of Champions. We definitely saw Cody getting a bit of a heel reaction from the crowd. And not only that, it wasn't just a heel reaction from the crowd.

He also started working as a heel, too. And I think when you have baby face versus baby face in a match, which is what we had here with Randy Orton versus Cody Rhodes in that King of the Ring final match there, it's inevitable that someone's going to get cheered more than the other person. And someone then has to inevitably take on that heel role. But, man, this was the closest we've seen to Cody, a heel in

WWE since Star Dust. And I think that this is a glimpse of what's to come. And we can't, of course, forget Night 2 of WrestleMania 41, Cody got a similar reaction. The crowd turned on Cody. They booed him.

They cheered Sina. Interesting choice, though, that they just stayed the course. And John Sina and Cody Rose just kept working the match they had planned, where if you think back to another very famous WrestleMania, match, WrestleMania 18, Hogan versus Rock, the crowd turned on them, and both Rock and Hogan

in the match kind of went, well, I guess I'm going to work as a heel now, and I guess you're going to work as a baby face. And they went with it and you guys know how much I love that match. But it's, I think that that was what made that match so magical. So I would have to guess, now that we know that it's John Sina versus Cody Rhodes again, this time at SummerSlam, I feel like this is going to be the same situation. Lots of cheers for Sina, lots of booze for Cody. And they would have to expect this going in, knowing that this is what happened at WrestleMania 41.

So do they plan for this now? Like, do they start to do kind of what Cody Rhodes did at Night of Champions, where Cody starts to work a little bit more as a heel? And then is this the beginning of a John Sina baby face turn? or is this actually a John Cena baby face turn? And I know I've talked a lot about like turning heels easy. You just attack the biggest baby face or you side with the biggest heel. It's like, boom, it's done it in an instant.

We've seen it so many times, right? Like stone cold shaking hands with Vince McMahon, boom, instant heel. The rock doing the throat slit to Cody Rose. And then, you know, Cody Rhodes ends up kicking John Cena in the ball. Boom. Or other way around. Oh my goodness. What am I talking about?

here. John Sina kicks Cody Rhodes in the balls. What am I even talking about here? But boom, instant heel turn. The baby face thing feels like it doesn't happen as quickly. But what could happen here? We haven't seen the rock since Elimination Chamber. What if the Rock is somehow part of SummerSlam? And then we see kind of the exact opposite of what we saw at Elimination chamber? What if John Sina turns on the rock? Like the rock is one of the biggest heels right now in the company. What if John Sina turns on the rock, which would then make John Sina baby face and then finishes the tour, the retirement tour, as a baby face. I could see that happening. But I think that if Cody keeps getting the reactions that he's getting, if Cody keeps getting booed,

no matter who his opponent is, no matter where the match is taking place, they're going to have to go with it. The biggest mistake they made with John Sina 10-ish, 15-ish years ago was continuing to push him as a baby face, even though the booze were getting louder and louder and louder. It was like, let's go Sina Sina sucks. Like it was so much louder. And we also saw the same thing with Roman Raines in the late 2010s when Roman Rains was being shoved down everybody's throats. It was like the crowd it turned on him, but they're still booking him as a baby face. Like the best thing to happen to Roman, the best thing to happen for his career and just him as an individual performer was him turning heel.

And I feel the same way about Cody. So I think we saw a glimpse of it. And Cody even said recently in an interview, he's like, I feel like my, I'm paraphrasing here, but he said, I feel like my run as a baby face is like coming towards the end. and like what more could he do as a baby face? Like who else could he feud with? Who else could he put over or could put over him? And he raises a good point.

Like it's kind of run his course. And if he's going to keep getting these kind of lukewarm reactions, although I should say, Night of Champions, huge baby face reaction when it came out, the crowd is singing along to his song, huge, whoa. And then during the match, he starts to get the heel reaction. So if this continues to happen for Cody, I just feel like they're going to have to listen to it.

They're going to have to. And I don't know if it's going to happen this year. So I don't know if it's going to be in the next six months or so. But there's a chance that we're talking about the road to WrestleMania 42 with Cody Rhodes as a heel. Like that is a real possibility. And I would think when Cody turns heel. I don't think this is an if he turns heel.

This is a when. So when Cody ends up turning heel, I think he's got quite a few things up his sleeve. Like he is locked and ready to go. I'm sure he's been making notes over the last few years of like what some of some of his competitors have said. I'm sure he's been making notes about what people online are saying about him. And when that does end up happening,

man, buckle up. This episode is brought to you by Rocket Money. With prices going up on just about everything lately, being smart with your money isn't just a good idea. It's essential, but managing subscriptions, tracking spending, and cutting costs can feel overwhelming. Lucky for you, Rocket Money takes the guesswork out of it so you can easily make smart decisions.

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subscriptions, saving members up to $740 a year when they use all of the app's premium features. So cancel your unwanted subscriptions and reach your financial goals faster with Rocket Money. Download the Rocket Money app and enter the name of my show, Insight with Chris Van Fleet in the survey, so they know that I'm the one who sent you there. Don't wait. Download the Rocket Money app today and tell them you heard about it right here on Insight. Logan Ing, it's all one word here. Logan Engelwright, there we go, on Spotify says,

do you believe that Sammy Zane beating Carrying Cross was a good choice? I was pulling for Carrying Cross. Like I just thought that, first of all, I was so happy that he was being given this spotlight. Like he has been given so little over the last few months, but has done so much with it. Like he is the epitome of that phrase you hear so often in wrestling, make your minutes count. And he has done such a great job of making any screen time that he has feel him. impactful. And he gets this incredible opportunity at a PLE at night of champions. I was pulling for him to win because it's like, I don't feel like Sammy Zane had a lot to lose here. So like if Sammy Zane

loses the match, it's like, all right, well, he's still Sammy Zane. Like, you can go on and do whatever he wants after this. A win there for Carrying Cross would have given him such momentum to allow him to catapult into whatever is next. And I think the big question now is, What is next? Like, where does he go from here? Like, we know he's talented on the mic. We know he's talented in the ring. He has a incredible aura about him, whether it's a promo or just an entrance or it's a match, whatever it happens to be. And the crowd is behind him. And I think that was the reason that he got this match at Night of Champions because he couldn't ignore the crowd reaction anymore. So I don't think it was the right choice to have him lose that match, but I think that we need

to wait a few weeks, zoom out a little bit and just like see, all right, so where does it go? Like, if this ends up turning into something bigger for him, sure, don't think it really matters that he lost the match at night of champions. But if this is it, if it just fizzles out from here and they don't have anything for him, it's like, well, what was the point then? So I'm, I've, I've, I love Kevin. I think he is so supremely talented. I'm just very curious to see where does it go from here. How does he get booked from here? And I just, I want to see something bigger for him. Will he work another PLE? Will we see him at SummerSlam? I would love to see that. Trevor Ford on Facebook says, hey, CVV, where has Otis been? Great question. I think it's been like

two months since we've seen Otis. Fightful Select put out a report this week that Otis recently underwent arthroscopic elbow surgery. So they didn't really have the full details on what's going on in there, but I guess Otis has been dealing with some elbow pain. So he's out for a little while right now while he gets that figured out and wishing him a speedy recovery. The one and only Kiza on Instagram says, Do you think we will see multiple superstars become Al Grande Americano while Chad Gable is out? Well, I think that two are completely unrelated.

The fact that Chad Gable is injured, I don't feel like has anything to do with El Grande Americano, who I don't think El Grande Americano is injured. So interesting that you're trying to make that connection there. but Chad Gable did post an update this week. It was a photo of him in a hospital bed after having a successful shoulder surgery. And he said that he would be back faster than you could say, Gracius.

So wishing Chad Gable, a speedy recovery. The timeline that I've seen online, and who knows if you can actually believe that or not, but for the sake of this sentence, we will just say that I've seen the reports that say he's going to be out for about six months. But we all know that Chad Gable is not human. Six months is probably the typical timeline for a normal human. But Chad Gable is on a completely other level and is in tremendous shape.

So real possibility here that it's much quicker than six months. But I'm sure you noticed, Al Grande Americano seems to have gotten taller, which is amazing. incredible, really. Is there anything that guy can't do? But seriously, I would love, and I feel like that they might be doing this, I would love if Al Grande Americano was someone completely different every single week.

Like, I've seen the jokes, I've made the jokes myself that we haven't seen Omas in about a year. Well, what if he's been Al Grande Americano this whole time? And what if, what if next week? What if next week on Raw, Al Grande Americano is seven foot four? I'm just saying it would be such a fun thing. If every single week and maybe the week after that, he's just making up names here, maybe it's Otis. It doesn't need to wrestle.

He just needs to show up in the mask like we saw this past week. I think that that would be so fun, a great way to continue to push this story forward. A great way to have Chad Gable be in the back of our minds because we know how much, not that Chad Gable has anything to do with Al Grande Americano, but just the fact that we know Chad Gable hates luchadors, right? So just Chad Gables in the back of our minds. We're talking about him as we're seeing Al Grande Americano and that iconic mask. That'd be fun. That'd be really fun. Could you imagine if we saw like, like, this feels like it would be perfect if like Chelsea Green came out wearing the El Grande-Americano mask.

And then we could all go, oh, wow, El Grande-American-Mircano looks quite different this week. It seems to me that this is where they're going with it. Like, I don't feel like, I've heard the crazy reports that some people thought that was Ludwig Kaiser earlier in the week. It was El Grasne-Americano, okay? But it's not like Ludwig Kaiser is out there wrestling

as El Grasne-Americano every week, or is he? It's still too early to tell, but it'd be really fun if every single week, Algrante Americano just looks a little off, a little different. That'd be a fun thing to play with. Aaron Smith, 1985 on Spotify, says, what do you think of the odds of Edge returning to be involved in Sena's farewell tour, given that his AEW contract ends in a few months? So when I did an interview with Adam Copeland last May, he told me that he had about a year and a half left on his AW contract. So at that time, he was six months in. So a two-year deal, he had 18 months left last May. So that would take him to about the end of this year, close to the end of this year.

However, he said that before he had his broken leg. Like, we recorded that interview before he broke his leg. So I think that if you take his contract and then you tack on the possibility here, I'm not saying it's going to happen, but the possibility of injury time, it just doesn't feel like the timeline would line up. Anything's possible in wrestling, but I think that if he had a two-year contract, plus he was out for a while with that broken leg, it just doesn't seem to me like it would lineup, it would be amazing to see that. And what a fun surprise that would be. If they could keep this under wraps and John Cena goes out there, like, think about this, he's just cutting a random promo on Raw or on Smackdown and out of nowhere, on this day, like that hits, it'd be crazy.

Like the place would, like the roof would blow off that place. It'd be such a fun surprise. And there hasn't been a lot of surprises on the John Sina retirement tour. There's been a lot of great storylines. I think the biggest surprise was John Sina turning heel, but there haven't been like these surprise opponents or surprise appearances. That would be huge. And there's so much history there. So much history with Edge and with John Sina. I would love to see it. I just don't know if this will time out. Adam Copeland, aka Cope's. last match in AEW was in April at Dynasty. We haven't seen him since. He posted on Canada Day earlier this week. Happy Canada Day, by the way, to all my Canadians, happy 4th of July as well as you're listening to

this to all my American friends. But Adam Copeland posted on Canada Day, so that's July 1st earlier this week. He posted that his wrestling journey won't last a lot longer. So does that mean he has a handful of matches left in AEW, does that mean that he's going to have his last match in AEW? Does it mean that he could have a one-off match in WWE? Anything's possible. And when you think of someone like Adam Copeland, you think of the incredible rivalries he had, the incredible matches, incredible moments he had in WWE. I mean, he spent 25 years of his career as Edge in WWE. Now, a lot of that was him when he was retired with the neck injury and then an amazing like unforeseen comeback which was mind blowing that he could even come back from that injury could we have a pop like that again

with edge returning it'd be awesome to see it just doesn't feel to me like it's going to line up but if there is no injury time added on he may his AEW debut on October 1st, 2023, so you would think that he signed the AEW contract. He told me it was like a very, it happened very quickly. So let's say that he signed his AEW contract. Just for

arguments sake, let's say he signed it on that same date. Highly unlikely, probably signed it towards the end of September, but let's just for arguments sake here, say it's October 1st, 2020 to October 1st, 2025 and no injury time is added on. I think that that's the big

X factor here, is will injury time be added on for the broken leg? We've seen it happen many times before, not just in A.AW, but in WWE as well. It just seems like a pretty common thing. You're on the shelf. You can't wrestle. You can't work. Well, that just gets tacked on to your contract. You're still getting paid during that time, but it gets tacked on to like your contract doesn't end because there was time when you were not able to work. So the big question mark here is, will injury time be added on? And if the answer to that question is yes, then it feels impossible for Edge to be in WWE before John Cena retires. However, if this is truly just a two-year deal, October 1st to

October 1st, again, we're just using that date for argument's sake here, then it's possible. This is like the dumb and dumber line. So you're telling me, there's a chance. And I don't even know if I'm saying there's a chance. I'm just saying that if all of the stars align, maybe we could have one of the greatest surprises during John Cena's retirement tour. Good job Cobb on Instagram says, I know that you don't have the answer, but let's talk about it making sense. When it comes to the sleeper hold and the ref's not being consistent on how the match ends, I'm with you on this. I like this already. This comes up because of how Sammy had his arm tested three times,

how it is supposed to be, and how he kept his arm raised in the third time, and how he made the comeback in the match. However, when Gunther beat Jay to get the world title back, the ref lifted Jay's arm once. His arm drops once, and the ref calls for the bell. I prefer when the ref gives the wrestler three tries, but honestly, just choose one and stick with it.

You can't go back and forth. Come on. make it make sense. I can't agree with you more here. I just, I think the biggest pet peeve I have with wrestling in general is when there's no consistency. So if it's going to be the test the arm three times, falls once, falls twice, third time looks like it's falling. Oh no, he raises it into the air and gets the crowd all hyped. I think that that's the way it should be every single time. That's the way it's been since I first saw wrestling in the late 1980s. I remember it, being like that. I remember actually looking at it as a kid and being like, well, how come his arm fell

twice? Like he was clearly out and somehow he powered through on the third time. I don't know if it's the idea of like the finish is so strong here like the ref can tell that the person's out. A finish like the Gunther J match, it makes Gunther look really strong. And that's the idea here. Like his chokehold was so strong. He's so dominant in that match. Puts it on. He's out. End of the match. But I agree with you. It's pick one or the other. If it's, if the ref just grabs the arm once and it falls and that's how we're going to call submission finishes from now on. Great. Cool. If it's going to be the test the arm three times, fine. But I'm with you. Good job, Cobb. Let's just pick one. Let's just pick one and stick to it.

And I, if you've been listening to the show long enough, you know that I have problems when wrestling starts to get illogical. I have major issues when things that happened last week or the week before are completely ignored now. If you listen to the episode I did with Sam Roberts earlier this week and we talked about the worst booked match of all time, Sam went with StarCade 97, a fantastic choice, a horribly booked match. I went with Helen a cell 2019,

The Feen versus Seth Rollins. And my biggest issue with that match was, it's hell in a cell, it's no disqualification. How can you, why would the ref stop a match when it's no disqualification? It's hell in a cell.

It's the whole point of the cell. I'm getting all worked up here. My heart rate. So I'm just saying here, just make it make sense. Give us one or the, other and stick to it. This is my issue with the draft. My biggest issue with the draft is that they don't stick to it. If this person is a Smackdown person, they're only supposed to be on

Smackdown. If this person is a raw person, they're only supposed to be on raw. And then it just gets thrown out the window a few weeks in. I got all excited on that one. Finn Radigan sent this one in on Facebook. What's up, Finn? Hey, CVV, it's Finn. My parents just let me have a Facebook and I asked if I could send in a question. I know that you love UFC and I love UFC too. Which UFC fighter do you think could make a good wrestler in WWE? Thanks, Finn. Finn, it's been great meeting you. Thank you for coming out to Insight Live. I look forward to seeing you at Insight Live in New York City on August 1st. And yes, I've been a UFC fan for a long time. I remember finding UFC in the back corner of a blockbuster, the blockbuster that I would go to in Pickering,

Ontario. I remember finding like UFC 1 and 2 and 3 and 4 and 5 on VHS and just being like so enamored. I remember looking at the back and being like, that little guy is going to fight that giant guy? And then you're reading the back, no rules. And then you find out the only rules are like no nutshots, no eye gouging, no fish hook. Like, what? Like, back then, in the early days of UFC, like, it was truly just like a street fight inside a cage.

It was wild. But yeah, I'm a big UFC fan, have been for a long time. I was at UFC 317 this past weekend. What a main event. Who's going to stop Ilya? Like, wow. The way he knocked out Charles Olivierian two and a half minutes in the first round, just so crisp. his punches are so crisp and so precise. He's 17 and 0 now. Who's going to stop him? Like seriously, I mean, after that fight, and I'm sorry if you're not a UFC fan, I'll be done here in just a minute.

After the fight, they were teasing a match between Ilya and Patty Pimbleau, which would be a really good one, but I just don't see how Patty could beat Ilya. I'llia is just so dominant. But to answer your question,

I think that Michael Chandler, would make a great WWE superstar. And we saw a little taste of this. When Raw came to Anaheim last year, they introduced him for the crowd like, ladies and gentlemen, UFC star, Michael Chandler, and then he got up,

it was hyping up the crowd. And then he grabbed Samantha Irvin's mic and started cutting up promo, which very clearly looked unplanned. And they just kind of rolled with it. They cut a promo on how he wanted to fight Connor McGregor, which was the plan for a long time. They were even the coaches on the Ultimate Fighter

and just kind of fell apart. And if we're being completely real here, Connor McGregor, ducked Michael Chandler. But I think that Michael Chandler has the look. Like he looks like a superhero. He has the personality. And he has the promo chops.

And he's also like just a freak athlete. You watch any of his workout videos. It's like how this man is not human. It's insane. He's actually really good friends with DDP, Diamond Dells Page. And I was talking to D about him recently. And he's like, look, I put a lot of people through my workout. He calls it the gauntlet. It's like, I put a lot of people through my workout. And usually people have issues at some point along the way, whether it's the

power cuffs or whether it's the, when you're riding the bike with the oxygen mask on. And I've done the workout. It's intense. And he goes, Michael Chandler's the only person who's done my workout. and like outdid me. Like he's the only one that could like really keep up. And I'm like, man, that says a lot. Like this is that DDP is just a absolute freak. Like when it comes to just athleticism, especially at 69 years old, crazy. But he said Michael Chandler is the only one that could keep up.

So I think that says a lot. Jay Mark Lucas 85 on Facebook says, Oh, this is on Spotify. Sorry, on Spotify says, do you see Randy Orton? Oh, no, this is on Instagram. My goodness, on Instagram. Do you see Randy Orden tying or surpassing John Cena's 17 championship title wins before he retires? I just think that they've made such a big deal about John Cena being the greatest of all time.

They've been calling him the greatest of all time. They've made such a huge deal. And they put such a big focus on the never seen 17. that I think John Sina is going to be the guy with the most championships for a long time. Like I think that this is going to be a record that lasts. Like this is going to be a generational record, in my opinion. This is going to be something, at least on the men's side, that's going to hold up for decades and decades to come.

Charlotte Flair has a very real possibility of having more championships. But I don't think Randy's going to do it. Randy has 14 right now. I don't know if anyone really focuses on the fact, though, that Randy's last championship was almost five years ago. It was the fall of 2020. He beat Drew McIntyre for it at Helen Assel and then Drew won it back. Three weeks later on Raw.

And this is funny. Like, our opinion has shifted so much on like what a long championship reign is or what a short championship reign is. I don't remember there being an outcry. in October and November of 2020 when Randy Orton only held that championship for 22 days. I don't remember people being like, oh, it was so short. It was a terrible rain. Like he literally did not defend it.

Like he won it. And then when he went to defend it, he lost it. And that was the end of it. It's just so funny that here we are five years later. And unless your championship rain is in the triple digits, unless you're in the hundreds of days, people just like write it off as like, oh, yeah, well, I was a joke of a championship rain. way too short. And like, I pointed this out before, but it bears repeating that everyone was

talking about Jay Uso's run being so short and it's longer than nine of John Cena's title reigns. And I would love to get to a point where the title's changing hands more frequently because I just think it throws that element of surprise in there. It makes every championship match that much more meaningful. It got to a point for a while that like unless it was WrestleMania or unless it was like SummerSlam or another huge PLE, it was like, well, that person's probably just going to retain and hold it for another few months. But I don't see, I could see Randy winning maybe one more, possibly two more. But I think it comes down to how many more years is you want to keep doing this. Is it going to be two more years? Is it going to be five more years? Randy just turned 45.

and I just signed a new WWB contract, I believe. So is he going to wrestle into his 50s? Is that something that we're going to see? When he was a guest on Cody's podcast, he said that it's basically up to his wife. It's up to his wife, Kim, on when he wants to retire. But it sounds like he wants to go until the wheels fall off. So he wants to keep doing this. So there's a possibility there of Randy Orton winning one or two more.

Maybe. Maybe. Randy Orton ties John Cena, but I just don't see that happening. I just think that there has been so much focus on this being history making and record breaking for John Cena that Randy Orton doesn't need more titles for us to go. Man, he's one of the greatest of all time. Absolute first ballot Hall of Fame. We already know that. And I think that whether he stays at 14 championships, which I don't think is going to be the case, I think he's going to win at least one, maybe two more. But whether he wins more championships or not, Randy Orton's legacy is cemented.

He's amazing. And everyone speaks so highly of him and how he's like so technically great in the ring. But I just don't see it happening, especially when we factor in. It's been five years since his last championship. So if he wins one every five years, we get one at some point in the next year or so. And then another one in 20-30-ish when Randy's 50? No complaints here. Randy's one of my favorites. But I just think that with all of the focus on John Sina and them attaching the number of championships to this idea of being the greatest of all time, which I don't agree with.

I think that there's so many other factors that go into just whoever is your own personal goat. Because there's no, like wrestling is so subjective. There's no, you can't just objectively go. That person is the greatest of all time because of this stat, this stat, this stat. Wrestling is about feeling. Like wrestling is so subjective of like, you might like the way that a certain person wrestles or you might like their style or you might like some of their most memorable

promos even. It might not even have to do with their in ring work. That, that factors in so much about what makes someone the go. But I just think that with WWB's metric here, of 17, never seen 17, greatest of all time, and them tying together that he is the greatest of all time because he won the most championships, and also because he's been the face of the company for 20-ish years. I don't see someone else like Randy Orton beaten that number, which takes us quite perfectly here into this one from Octavio Fierros on Facebook, who says,

Who inducted John Cena into the Hall of Fame? And do you agree that it was? will be next year. I don't see any other situation other than it being John Sina headlining the Hall of Fame class of 2026 next year. I think that that one is just a given. He retires in December. The Hall of Fame announcement, I'm sure happens not long after that. John Sina's headlining the Hall of Fame class. It just feels like it makes a ton of sense. As for who inducts him, it feels like it's going to carry a lot of weight. It feels like it would be similar to like the Undertaker induction, where it's like there's more going on here.

Like this is, you're trying to encapsulate someone's career in this speech. And I feel like they're going to go all out with this. As for who inducts him, I think some obvious names that pop into my head are Triple H. That would make a lot of sense. Triple H is the figurehead in WWE. And it feels like if John Sina is the guy in WWE, again, the greatest of all time, it feels like Triple H would be the right person to induct him. Could also go with Kurt Engel, it would be a full circle moment.

John Cena's WWE debut was against Kurt Angle. And when I asked Kurt Engel in the interview that we did earlier this year, he said that he would be honored to do it. And he, my bookie had a list of, they have odds for who's going to induct John Cena into the Hall of Fame. And Kurt Angle is one of the odds on favorites. And of course, when you go to my bookie, use the code CVV for a 50% welcome bonus. Randy Orton could also make a lot of sense. There's a ton of history there.

We saw that all play out at backlash. So could that one, could that make sense? sure. Yeah. And then I think a few years later, whenever Randy Orton decides to retire and he gets inducted into the Hall of Fame, could be John Cena returning the favor for him. But yeah, I think it's John Cena headlining the class of 2026 for sure. And I said we were going to talk about Night of Champions. So let's go through just match by match night of champions. We've already talked about a few of them, but I feel like there's some other ones that we need to touch on here. I was reminded about that when I was. I was reminded about that when I was. I was talking about Randy Orton because I think a lot of people were like, well, Randy Orton should win King of the Ring. And then we get Randy Orton versus John Cena at SummerSlam. Randy Orton would make a great champion. And I do not disagree with that.

But I just feel like WWE already told us that wasn't going to happen. When they said it was one last time at backlash, they can't then a few months later give it to us again. Like I think that, and I understand we had once. in a lifetime at WrestleMania 28 and then also once in a lifetime at WrestleMania 29 with Rock and John Cena. I understand there is precedent here for WWE not living up to their word, not keeping the word. I get that. But I just think in this case, there was no reason not to believe WWE. And I feel like it's the same thing. Like they have said over and over and over again,

no, John Cena versus CM Punk was one last time. And that was the same case with Randy Orton. So we've got Cody Rhodes as king of the ring. And that was, I feel like, what we all predicted with that one. Queen of the Ring, I really thought that could have gone either way. But what I think happens here with Jade Cargo winning Queen of the Ring, it's going to be Jade versus Tiffany, likely, right? Because Tiffany is facing Tristratus at Evolution. So I suppose, I mean, the winner of that match will go on to face Jade Carlin. But it feels to me like it's going to be Tiffany Stratton versus Jade Cargo.

What I really think they're setting up for here is the Naomi Cache. Like I think that the whole reason that Jade Cargo became Queen of the Ring was to set up later on that it may be Jade wins. Real quick victory. Naomi's music hits. Cash is in money in the bank. What a moment that would be at SummerSlam. And I feel like maybe it's not SummerSlam. And I feel like maybe it's not SummerSlam, but that's what the Jade Cargill win was setting up for.

How about Solo Sacoa beating Jacob Fah 2 and becoming the new United States champion? What a moment. And I said this last week, but with either of those guys, you can't lose. Like they're both so talented, so entertaining. And we've been waiting for the payoff to the I hate you solo. Oh, we've been waiting for the payoff for so long. And we got it here. And I think that this is the first of many championships for solo.

The same can be said about Jacob. Like, man, those guys are so, so good. We talked about Sammy Zane carrying cross. Ria Ripley, defeating Raquel Rodriguez in that street fight, that kind of went how we predicted it. I said that Rhea has a lot more to gain here in winning this match. and continuing her momentum. Or Cal Rodriguez can take a loss in this one,

and I don't feel like it really affects her. What I think is happening here with Ria Ripley is this is just going to continue to build momentum for Ria Ripley leading into Perth. And then when we get Crown Jewel in Perth on October 11th, I would have to think that Ria Ripley is either the main event or the co-main event here. Like that place is going to go just absolutely nuts for Ria Ripley.

So I think it's just this idea of like continuing to build this momentum for Ria Ripley. And I think we'll just continue to see this building up. And then we talked about John Sina versus C.M. Punk, which was one last time. So the reason I just want to bring this up again is because I think that there are times when WWE says something. kind of like the magician's assistant like, hey, look over here. And then they're doing something that you're not really noticing. But I do think when they say something like, this is one last time, and they're talking about a match with John CNA and Randy Orton,

like I think you can actually believe them. Like, yes, this is. In fact, one last time. Duncan C50 on Spotify says, pizza. Thank you. Don't forget to leave the word sharp on Spotify. Hey, CVV, after you, watching Night of Champions, it's clear Seth Rollins is going to cash in on the universal

title. So with that, who's left for Gunther, Gunther, to take the title on Raw? It feels like there's lots of big names getting pushed in the Sina's storyline, and not many are left for Gunther. So let's hear your take on what's next for Gunther after Goldberg. Ask CVV number 90. So I think that we will talk about the predictions for Saturday night's main event next week, but I think it's pretty clear this is, in fact, Goldberg's last match. Goldberg is going to lose this match. And that's it. Like I feel like this is just a one-off thing that's happening for Gunther.

And it is what it is. And that was something that was contractually promised to Goldberg, not just a retirement match, but a retirement match that was for a title. And that's what he's getting here. But I feel like there's a lot more for Gunther here. So I think you're right. And we talked about this with Sam Roberts. And if you haven't listened to that,

it's a fun chat of us kind of looking at the last six-ish months of WWE and giving our opinions and our takes on that and also what's to come. I firmly believe that Seth Rollins is going to cash in for the main championship. And I don't know when this is going to happen. I don't know if it's going to be on John Cena. I feel like it's more likely to be on Cody Rhodes. Like my gut just tells me we've got a month to go here. my gut tells me that John Sina's title run comes to an end at SummerSlam.

Cody Rhodes winning back the title from John Sina, who he lost it to, is a story that makes a lot of sense to happen at SummerSlam. And then is it Seth Rollins cashing at that point? Boy, that could also make a lot of sense. But in terms of Gunther, who's next for him? Where does the story go from here? I think that with the world championship, this is the perfect opportunity to have someone win it for the first time.

Like there's a lot of people who are right there, like right on the cusp of the main event, who could benefit so much by having the world championship reign, even if it's just for a few months. Like, again, I would love to get to a point where the title changes hands more frequently. We talked about last week how in 1999, the WWF championship changed hands 11 times that year. And this was also during a time when there was only one championship to be had, not two.

So that one championship changed hands 11 times. I don't know if it needs to change hands 11 times in the next 12 months, but I would love to see it change hands with more frequency. And for it to be this like building block to allow those people who are right on the cusp, like mid-ish main event card, like allow them the chance to get over. Give it to L.A. Knight. Give it to Braun Breaker.

Bronson Reed. Carrying Cross. Dominic Mysterio, when he's back from injury and when he's done with his current intercontinental championship run, like most of the people I listed are going to be future champions.

Like I think Bronn Breaker is just a matter of time. L.A. Knight has been a world champion before in Impact Wrestling. Dominic Mysterio is going to be a world champ. that's where I think it should go. And I don't think that we need months and months and months and months of story for someone to win that championship. I think it could be weeks of story.

I think it could be weeks of telling a story of like why this person deserves it and why they're getting a title shot or maybe it's a series of matches. That's what I would love to see. And then I think that if you're going to give it to someone who's been a world champion before, Randy Orton. could bring a lot of prestige to that world championship. And when I think about Randy Orr, I think about the first time he won at SummerSlam in 2004 in Toronto.

It was the big gold that he won at 24 years old. So Randy Orton, Drew McIntyre, put him back into the mix, make Drew McIntyre the world champion. That would make a ton of sense. Or how about this one? If you really want to bring prestige to this championship, What about Roman Reins? Roman Reins versus Gunther could be fantastic.

And Roman Reins doesn't need to win this championship and hang on to it for another 1,316 days. What if Roman Reins had this title for two months, three months, and like really made it mean something? And then someone beats Roman and that Roman's putting that person over, I just feel like that could really elevate this. but I think there's a lot of opportunities there, especially when you talk about the fact

that the draft really doesn't mean anything anymore. Like there's no brand allegiances at all. So like a Smackdown person could come to Raw. A raw person could go to Smackdown. Like that championship could just float around in the same way that Cody, who's a Smackdown person that was appearing on Raw, a heck of a lot with that championship. And that's what Cina's doing too. So I think the fact that both championships.

can be defended on either show. And this isn't just what's happening with the men's championship. It's happening with the women's WWE championship and world championship. It just kind of floats around. If you're a raw person, go wrestle on SmackDown.

If you're a SmackDown person, go wrestle on Raw. And I think that that's something we could see here is like, it doesn't matter what show you're on if you have that title. There's a lot of opportunities here for Gunther to have a lot of interesting feuds.

And I think more importantly, a lot of really interesting matches. could come out of this. So it'll be interesting to see how things end up going with Goldberg at Saturday Night's main event and then where does it go from there? And then where does Gunther take it from there? Sherman Culbertson on Facebook says, who is your favorite referee? I got to go with Charles Robinson. The goat in his 30th year. And the man looks like he's aged like 30 minutes since he debuted in 1995. I just love how he was such a standout referee in WCW.

And just so memorable with the things that he did and the way that he did them. And obviously his run in WWE has been legendary. And you want to talk about runs and you want to talk about Charles Robinson, the run down the ramp, the iconic run at WrestleMania 24. And I love that we got a throwback to that at night of champions. And Sina just trucks him out of nowhere and Charles Robinson goes flying. Also, congrats to Charles Robinson. He got a Tops trading card out of that.

He actually posted earlier this year. He had a trading card back in WCW. It was like the WCWNWO trading cards. Remember those? And there was the autograph spot on the side. He had one of those cards and he said, oh, it would be so cool to get another card one day. Well, here it is. So congrats to Charles Robinson on on that new Tops moment card.

So cool. So cool to see that. And I know the next question that's going to come. When is Charles Robinson going to be on the show? I'm working on it. I was actually texting with Charles earlier today. So I'm working on it trying to make this happen. Like you want to talk about my guest on Tuesday being one of the most requested guests.

And that person is. But Charles Robinson, I get messages every day. When's Charles Robinson going to be on the show? When's the goat? When's the goat referee going to be on the show? And my answer to that is hopefully soon. We're working on trying to make that happen. We might need like 14 hours for that episode.

It's underscore Dominic Zero on Instagram says, in my opinion, Randy, is the goat because of longevity and because he never left. Debate me. look, if he's your goat, then he's your goat. That's the cool thing about the greatest of all time conversation. It's personal. It's you. It's a subjective thing. It's not an objective thing of like who hit the most home runs or who scored the most goals. Like those are objective facts. Although I guess in baseball, there's an asterisk next to home runs, depending on how many PEDs

you were on. But if you're talking about like who scored the most touchdowns or who scored the most goals. Like, those are, they're facts. And wrestling doesn't really work that way. Wrestling's a feeling. Like, who, who in your opinion is the greatest of all time? And if for you, it's Randy Orton, great. But I guess that if we're going by the standards that you have set here of longevity and never leaving, well, then why isn't it the Undertaker? The Undertaker also never left. Sure, he started his career in WCW, but once he was in WWE, he never left. So shouldn't Undertaker then be your goat if this is the criteria that you're using? When it really comes down to it, whoever your greatest of all time is, that's your greatest

of all time. And we had a very interesting discussion on that episode on Tuesday with Sam Roberts about, you know, what if Stone Cold had stuck around longer? What would his career look like? Like he's already very much in that conversation of the greatest of all time. He's on most people's Mount Rushmore. And as well he should be. But like, what if his career had lasted longer?

Like, what if things hadn't started falling apart towards the end, which led to him walking out? We had a similar conversation about the rock. Like, what if the rock wasn't hungry to do more? Like, what if he hadn't turned Hollywood? And the crowd turned on him because of that? Like, what would the Rock's run have looked like if it had been like Randy Orton's or the Undertakers?

And these are all just like, what is? They're what ifs, what ifs, what ifs. But if you talk about actual, like, facts and numbers and people who stuck around, yeah, I think Randy's in the conversation for sure. No one, no one's going to go, you're crazy for calling Randy Orton your goat. Cool. No one's going to call you crazy for saying Undertakers, your goat. All right.

Great. And that's the fun thing about it. And it also reminds me that, like, when you start doing Mount Rushmore's, and I do it so often when I have TNA legends on the show. Like, who's your TNA Mount Rushmore? I asked it of AJ Stiles. I asked it of Christopher Daniels. I asked it of James Storm.

I've asked it of a lot of TNA people. It's like usually the first two are like no brainers. Like I think when you talk about TNA and you guys know how much of a TNA fan I am, when you talk about TNA, it's like, all right. So we got A.J. and Joe and then it depends on who you are. You name two other names there. That's the cool thing. About all of this is like, it's all up to you and what makes someone your favor?

What makes someone your greatest of all times? So it's underscore Dominic zero. You're not going to get an argument for me. Randy Orton is fantastic. And he's still, he's still fantastic. That's what's so great about him. Man, the dude looks like a million bucks. Well, that, my friends, is the final question on this asks.

CVV number 90, the TJ Watt, Julie's Pepper, Drew Gooden edition. If you're still listening to the show right now, you, my friend, you are a real, real one. And I appreciate you for spending some of your Friday with me and hanging out on an Ask CVV episode. If you're listening on Spotify, leave that word sharp for very obvious reasons. Of course, this is the sharpest episode of the show we've ever. done. And if you've got a question for next week for Ask CVV, number 91, or if there's a jersey number you associate with number 91, leave a comment on Spotify, shoot me an email CVV at chrisfamily.com or send it in on social media using that hashtag ask CVV. And we'll wrap this

up with a thought as we head into the weekend here from Andre Guide. Man cannot discover new oceans unless he has the courage to lose sight of the shore. I felt that one. Felt that one deep in my tum-tums. Shout out to Simon Miller. Be great and be grateful, my friends. Have an amazing weekend. We will see you on the next one for some more insight.

You do not want to miss Tuesday's episode. Should I tell you who it is? Yeah, I probably should. Blackman is on the show on Tuesday. You heard it here first. We'll see you right back on Tuesday for that incredible conversation. The Hammer Alley podcast, an 80s flashback mockumentary. Back in the 80s, there were a thousand bands trying to make it in the world of rock, but there was one band that had it all. Hammer Alley. Whatever happened to Hammer Alley? How did they go from top of the rock?

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