Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Baron Corbin Deserves So Much More, Retiring Kurt Angle, Happy & Sad Corbin, MITB, The Rock

Episode Date: October 26, 2023

Baron Corbin (@baroncorbinwwe) is a professional wrestler with WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Tampa, FL to talk about his recent move to NXT, how he went from the NFL to being signed by WWE, his friendship with Pat McAfee, the highlights of his 11-year WWE career so far, being select as Kurt Angle's opponent for his retirement match, being in the ring with The Rock and John Cena, what "burn the ships" means to him, his new theme music, winning the Andre The Giant Battle Royal, the original plans for his Money In the Bank cash-in, his run as King Corbin, his Happy and Sad Corbin characters, being Constable Corbin, his love of cooking and BBQ and much more! Sponsors: MYBOOKIE: Bet on WWE! Get up to $200 cash bonus when you use the code CVV and sign up at http://mybookie.ag FITBOD: Get 25% off when you use the code INSIGHT at http://fitbod.me/INSIGHT ZBIOTICS: Get 15% off with the code CVV and have a better morning after you drink at http://zbiotics.com/cvv GHOSTBED: Get 40% of your purchase with the code CVV at http://ghostbed.com/cvv MIRACLE MADE: Upgrade your sleep with Miracle Made! Go to http://TryMiracle.com/CVV and use the code CVV to claim your FREE 3 PIECE TOWEL SET and SAVE over 40% OFF BLUECHEW: Use the code CVV to get your first month of BlueChew for FREE at http://bluechew.com PLUNGE: Get $150 off your Plunge with the coupon code CVV150 at http://plunge.com BONCHARGE: Go to http://boncharge.com/CVV and use coupon code CVV to save 15% Quote I'm thinking about: “Change is inevitable. Growth is optional.” -John C. Maxwell For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://podcast.chrisvanvliet.com If you enjoyed this episode, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast/iTunes? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests. Follow CVV on social media:  Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

All systems are go. Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Blele. How are you, my friends? Welcome back to another one on Insight. I'm CVV. Chris Van Fleet. So good to have you with us with Baron Corbyn.

And I feel like he is underrated, underutilized, and underappreciated. And it's been going on for far too long. So is this. I just figured this out. About 75% of the people who listen to the podcast, on Spotify or Apple haven't yet hit the follow button. So if I could ask for a favor from you, if you've ever enjoyed any of the interviews that we've ever had on the show, could you just please go hit that follow button on your app? It helps the show more than I could possibly

explain. And the bigger the show gets, the better the guests get. Like this one today, we dive into Baron Corbyn's entire career from being a division two football. player to going to the NFL, then to WWE's been there for 11 years, and he's been so good at making other people look great. And I think that people forget how good he is. It's almost like the Dolph Ziegler's syndrome here. And I don't feel like I'm alone here in thinking that Baron Corbyn deserves more. I mean, he won the Andre the Giant Battle Royal. He was Mr. Money in the bank. He retired Kurt Engel. There's been so many amazing moments, but I just feel like there's more to come. So I hope you appreciate this interview. I hope you enjoy this conversation. It's a deep dive

into who Corbyn is and what he's all about. And if you do enjoy this, I know you're already hitting that follow button and I appreciate you. Look, I get there's a lot of people that listen to the show all the time and it pops up in your recommendations and you just never thought to hit follow or you didn't know that you hadn't hit follow. So, please, if you have a second today, and I'm sure you have one second at some point, maybe when you're pooping or something, just hit follow. But if you enjoy this, this specific conversation, snap a screenshot and share it on social media and tag us so we can share it out as well.

He's at Baron Corbyn. I'm at Chris Famfleet, and here we go. Please enjoy this conversation with Baron Corbyn. We have been wanting to do this for so long. Yes. It's finally happening. I know. I think it's more out of, like, not only do I just want to sit down and chat and hang out

and have fun with you, but like I said before we were talking, like, we get some awesome guests on this show. I feel very lucky. I'm a little jealous. You get to sit in the, you know, in the chair and speak with like, again, Margo Robbie, like we said, the movie. Margo Robbie loves wrestling, by the way. It's crazy how many, like, big-time Hollywood actors do.

Mm-hmm. I mean, I think it's because they see the performance. And I think the main difference for us is, like, we have instant gratification where they have to wait till their films out. And so maybe there's a little jealousy there that they get to go, oh, these guys are getting to do what we're passionate about as well with the acting and we get to do the live sports action and physicality. But we get that instant gratification.

We can go, hey, that was really good. Did you hear that? That was kind of rough. Did you hear that? And if you're an actor, it's not like you're going to the theater to hear the laughs. Yeah, no. Yeah, you're just going to read a rating. Yeah, and you're like, oh, I hope people like that thing I made 14.

months ago. Yeah, I guess. But yeah, I know I feel very lucky. But you and I've had some short conversations. Yes. Royal Rumble 2019. Yep. And then this past. In Detroit. At SummerSlam. Yeah. But I'm like, man, let's like sit down and have an actual conversation. Yeah. That way it's not just all pointed at wrestling, but life and whatever it is and hobbies and we could just talk stuff. We could talk for an hour about watches. Which one do you have on today? I'm wearing the skydweller today. This is a new one. It's a Rolex? It is. It is a Rolex. It's just a Rolex.

It's funny because... Just a car on my wrist. Triple H has probably the greatest watch collection of anyone known to man. And he always gives me so much trouble because I'm always like, hey, what are you wearing? What are you rocking? And he's like, I don't even know. And I'm like, how can you not know? Like, what is going on?

And he's got funny stories with him. And it's like my jealousy level for Hunter in his watch collection is just absurd. And he always wears this one. And I've always secretly wanted it. And I finally got it and was like, man, I feel cool. Like me and Hunter have the same watch. This is cool. Yeah.

How do you decide which watch you put on every day? It really kind of depends where I'm going, what I'm doing. You know, I have like a GMT Rolex that that's like my everyday kind of, it's sad to say a Rolex is a beat-up watch, but it's a beat-up watch. Like if I'm jumping in the ocean or jumping in the pool, I've even worn it in the gym one time when I was like in a hurry. And I was like, I don't have it. want to put it in my bag because I don't want to put my bag down and have some stuff. I worked out in a Rolex. Like, you're a big dummy, really.

But it was the first one I bought with my own money when I was in the NFL and it was like a big thing for me. So I've had it a long time. I mean, I've had it close to 15 years. Wow. So that was cool. So it's kind of been, it's been through some wear and tear. So it's beat up. It's looked like it's been mourned for 15 years, which I think is great.

But then I have other ones that, you know, it just depends. So I'm going to dinner, what I'm wearing. This is such an awesome watch because it's our gold watch, but I'm wearing it with a t-shirt and a hat. And it still looks cool. Or I can put it on with a suit. It's like, yeah. But my collections, my wife's like, no more, please. And you're like, oh, just one more.

Yeah, I'm like, but honey, the value of this one, if we have to sell. She's like, but you're not selling them. Like that's my argument every time. I'm like, Rolex. It's like a 250% markup if I ever have to sell it. She's like, but you don't. You're just overflowing. I was like, I know.

It's a sickness. How money are in your collection? High end, probably 14 right now. Wow. Which is, and like, it's been a cool process because, like, you know, you always start with like that holy grail piece. Like, what is your holy grail piece? And then I got it.

And I was like, oh, man, I got it. What's next? Like, what's next? And then you start going, well, I would never, ever spend that much on a watch. And then, you know, you see the value of two or three that you're not wearing anymore. And you go, I could sell these two and get that one. So it's like, it's been a process. trade up like my collection is is really stellar like i got three paddicks i think i've got four or five

rolexes an omega uh wherever were you sobrino uh i've got some really cool panorize and stuff and it's like the value i'm nowhere near that in what i've spent because i've either traded and sold at a great time and then was able to purchase something else that you know i never thought so like you know Like it'd be like a 20 if you say it's $20, but I bought one for, you know, six and sold it for 12. And now I only had to come out of pocket, six bucks for this $20. So I'm only in it eight bucks and it's worth 20. You know what I'm saying? Like, have you seen that process?

Have you seen that thing on TikTok girl math and like women are justifying like, oh, if I do this, it becomes this. So that's me. This is what it sounds like doing girl math right now. You're doing Rolex math. I do it. I justify it that way all the time. I told my wife with one I bought. She's like, are you kidding me?

And I was like, honey, if we sell it, we can pay for my daughter's college. And she's like, again, you're not selling them. I think I saw a video where you were like, I have a watch collection that you could buy a house with. And I'm like, while that is a great flex, it's also like these are just watches. I know. But to me, it's art. Like I look at a Rolex. I look at a paddock.

I look at some of these really nice brands, AP. And then you get, I mean, it goes up from there to watches I could only dream of. But to me, it's art. It's no different than buying something that hangs on your wall or a car. I'm not into cars that much. I have an old school car, but I'm not a guy who's buying Lambos. I'm not buying those kind of things. Like, these are my things that are like that.

But to me, I can justify it again with Girl Math is like they retain their value, their investments. Whereas if you buy a Lamborghini, you buy it for whatever, $300,000 or however much they cost. You drive it off the lot. Now it's worth $250. They drive it for a month. Now it's worth $200. Like, I don't have that problem.

If something ever came to my life where I had to go, uh-oh, I have the ability to sell them. It's no different than buying stock in an Apple or whatever in my opinion. I've always wanted to buy a great watch, but I just can't justify spending the money. It's absurd. I really like the panirai. I think they look so nice. They're awesome. I have three.

Wow. Can you help me justify this just to myself? I feel, I mean, we can just find you. The Rock's a big Panarai guy. They're what? Like $8,000? I mean, you can, it depends what you want. I mean, you can pull, the nice thing about Panarai is, is you can, those watches are just

stellar in how they hold up. And, you know, you can wear them in the, I wear them in the ocean, I wear them in the pool again, whatever it is. And they still look brand new. But you can buy one on the secondary market for less than retail. So you can, you could get into like a Panterize submersible for six grand. And you're not going to lose money on it. Then that's the way to do it.

You just got, like, my knowledge for, watches is just dumb because again, I have to justify it to my wife. I like the shirt you're rocking here. The old school. Yeah, that is old school. The old school chief's t-shirt. It's so comfortable, too. That's like that nice soft material.

Yeah. I was in Kansas City for a charity softball game that we do for Children's Mercy Hospital called The Big Slick with the most amazing group of people that are part of it. I made good friends with Eric Stone Street, who's just, such an incredible person. And he invited me to play in this game. And then, I mean,

you have people like Paul Rudd, Heidi Gardner, Rob Brigg, like all these people that are involved. And they put this game on in Kansas City. So I get to go back every year. And we raised, you know,

four million bucks for Children's Mercy Hospital. But when I was there, I stumbled into this, this t-shirt store that had all these old chiefs and Kansas City barbecue shirts. And I was like, I went crazy. I was like throwing luggage away

that I brought with me to fit these in my bag. Because I always want to rep, you know, that home, home state and home cooking and football and sports and the royals and all of those things. But I was like, this one's dope. And it's just a massive cheese fan. Does, did being in the NFL make you more or less of a football fan?

I mean, honestly, it made me less of a football fan for a long time, oddly because I grew up going to Chiefs games. You know, tailgating it at 9 a.m. You're waiting in line to haul ass into. the park and you're jumping curves in your truck and uh my dad's truck i was a child but um you you know you're doing that to get in there and tailgate and that atmosphere and kansas city is so amazing with that uh atmosphere that they bring to the games into the parking lot and all of those things but then playing in the NFL and college as well you spend like just an absurd amount of hours breaking down film i'm processing where's the safety where's the outside backer who's the mic what's our front Is it three, four, is it, you know, four, two, what are we facing?

And where's the depth of the, and it, like, kind of fries your brain and watching football. And then being a salty, a whole offensive lineman, I'm protective of what we do. And, like, when I was done playing football, like, if you go to a bar to watch a football game, I'm breaking down the film. So that's not fun. Yeah. Because I'm just like, oh, the safety's role. And, like, that's not how you watch football.

You're like, dude, I need chicken wings and beer. Like, let's go. Right. And then there's some idiot at the table behind me when like a sack happens. And he's like, oh, their O line sucks. And I'm like, hey, buddy, they brought seven. There's five O linemen. You don't know what you're talking about.

Shut up. Like, it's that kind of thing. So it kind of ruined it for a while. Sure. Because I would just let's hear idiots or not be able to enjoy the game because I'm breaking it down. And I think a little bit with wrestling now, like I'm so in. Like, it's hard to sometimes sit back and just enjoy a match. Like you want to process it.

What are they doing? Is the timing right? All of those things. So it made me less of a fan for a while. And then I was able to, I guess, forget all that. And now I can just sit and enjoy and watch. How close were you to actually taking a snap in a game in the NFL? I mean, I played in seven or eight, nine, ten, ten preseason games, probably.

And I was the number two guard. It was practice squad for like 95% of my career, and then I got activated for a game in Arizona. But they carried seven active offensive linemen or eight at some times, and then two practice squad guys. So you're the backup. So if the guy in front of me goes down, the very next week I'm going to plug in there.

That's where I'm going to step up and be the number one. And so I was pretty close a few times, but I was behind, you know, Alan Fanica, who is going to be a Hall of Famer, you know, these offensive linemen that were just incredible, and they stayed healthy, and that was just great for them, unlucky for me in a sense.

And, like, Deuce Latuey was another just unbelievable offensive guard, Levi Brown playing left tackle, so I wasn't going to, you know, these guys are all pro players. They're high draft picks. I came from a Division II school, one percent of college athletes playing the NFL. And I made it out of Division 2.

So like when you look at that, that's an unreal achievement. And I was essentially on an NFL roster for three years. And to do that as a Division 2 football player who is undrafted. I thought I was getting drafted to Kansas City for sure. I was like, they had the last pick that year. You were going to be Mr. Irrelevant? I thought for sure, because it was so funny because I did a workout for the Chiefs. When you do your combine, you do all that stuff, then the Chiefs brought me in for a private workout.

And then the draft week, they called me like 17 times. Like, hey, you know, we love you. The O-Line coach is calling me. Everybody's calling me. I'm like, dude, I'm going to go to Kansas City. Like, what a dream come true. Yeah. Arizona is calling as well in Philly.

And I had a ton of teams with a ton of interest. And Indy sold me. I was like a preferred free agent. So technically I committed to Indy before the draft was over that if I didn't get drafted, that's where I was going. They sold me because they were like, we're huge. John small school guys. Here's a whole motivational video on small school guys that make it. And Philly offered me more money. And I should have gone there. In retrospect,

is what I thought because they had two O-Lyman go down like the first week of training camp. And I was like, ah, I would have been like the mix. But the draft was going on. And Kansas City was calling me during the draft. And my O-line coach, like, dude, you're going to be Mr. irrelevant. They have last big. And then they took Ryan suck up the kicker, who, you know, Hall of Fame career. He's having, you know. So they made a great. good choice there. But yeah, my career was great.

I had fun. I played in preseason games. And it got me to where I am now. Like, if I played in a game, that would have been awesome. Obviously, it's more money when you're on active roster versus

practice squad, but you're still making one heck of a living, working practice squad. Now it's all changed. Like when I played, like an old man here saying, ah, back in my day, they only carried eight practice squad guys on a team.

Now they're up to like 15. So your chances are better because you have a longer time to try to make it, essentially. There's more opportunity for guys to make it when you're running 15 practice squad guys. And now there's more injuries, it seems like, in the NFL, I don't know if it's the turf, I don't know what it is. I don't know if the game has just progressed that it's more physical, guys are faster. I have no idea, but you know, you look at the first couple weeks of the season already. There's been dudes that have been taken out for the season. Yeah.

And it's crazy. So these other guys are going to get a chance to step up. And, you know, when I played, it was that same O line in Arizona for nearly three years that I was stuck behind. But if it's 1% of college players making it to the NFL, way less than 1% of aspiring wrestlers get to go to WWA. Yeah, it's crazy. It's crazy how many, you know, guys out there are trying to make it. It's a grind. And I got lucky, man.

Like, I just coming out of the NFL, it gave me a platform when I met with WDWAWA. and they were just like, yeah, hey, you got to lose a little weight. You're humongous. What did you weigh at your peak? Peak 3.30-ish, a little over 330. And what are you now? You're lean now. Well, I've been leaning up even more.

I rocked about 280 for a long time, but I think this morning I was 254. I'm trying to lean out and see what I can look like. I mean, you're so tall. I know. At 250s, like, lean for you. It's very lean. But I feel good. I'm moving well, but like, you know, I'm doing all that NXT stuff now.

And those guys move at a different pace. So I'm like, hey, I got to keep up and show them that I can do what they do and do it even better. So I was like, I'll lean up a little bit. Let's see what it looks like. See how it feels. I've been having fun. Did WWE come to you originally? No.

Yeah, so at the time I was on a cruise, how I kind of got linked in. And the person I was with, they were interviewing managers for their band. And one of the managers was like, oh, man, what do you want to do? like if football doesn't work out because I had just been released from Arizona with a little bit of a shoulder injury and I said I either want to go to UFC and fight or I want to go to WW. I said I've always been a fan of WWE and and he's like go to WWE. He said it's a better career, more longevity.

It's just, you know, and so he put in a phone call to WWE and was like, hey, this guy's interested. He's, you know, six foot seven, three hundred and thirty five pounds. He can move. he's an NFL offensive lineman. And I think after he put that call in like three days later, Johnny Ace called me. It was like, hey, we want to bring you for a tryout. So it was one of those things where that's what I wanted to do.

And I just had opportunity and timing there. It was pure luck that this guy knew Neil, who's in charge of the music for WWE. He knew Neil, and he sent my name to Neil and Neil passed it on. And that's how I got there. Dude, I love these stories of like you were on this cruise at this exact time. you met the right person that led to this, that led to that led to the career you've had in WWA. Yeah, and it's funny.

There's a lot of things like for me, wrestling Pat McAfee at Somerslam and NFL Stadium, you know, we were on the Colts together, and we just clicked instantly as buds, and we played golf, and we went to Howl at the Moon, and we just did all these fun things while we were in India and just really became tight, and we knew of this impending lockout in the NFL. And we clicked over wrestling was one of the things. We were both massive wrestling fans. you know, me being from Kansas City, we had, you know, Harley Race's whole territory that ran Kansas City. We've gone to shows as kids, seeing Kamala, seeing flair, all of these

amazing people. So I've been a fan, and Pat and I were like, well, like, if we get locked out, let's go train to be wrestlers. And so we were looking at, at the time, OVW is the only thing, the only way I knew, because I was naive to the whole independent scene. Like, I knew of wrestling in Japan, and then I knew of WWE. Like, I was very naive to, any other company that was out there. And we knew OVW was where, you know, Sina, Batista, Lesnar, all those dudes came out. So, okay, well, if that's the funnel, like, let's go there if we're locked out and train. And that was the whole plan.

And then I got released and went to Arizona and Pat had an amazing NFL career. And the lockout was short, you know, when we did get locked out. How was your roommate? I stayed at his, he was a draft pick, so he had good money. and we, you either stayed at the Candlewood Suites, I think, was just the hotel that Indy put us in, or you, you know, like for him, he got an apartment. And he had, so I hung out and slept there for a little while

instead of just staying in the Candlewood Suite. So we were roommates for a hot minute. There are legendary stories about Pat. Like, there are. As an animal. Yes. They're not for air here, but I have quite a few good ones with Pat. So that was a cool, like, culmination in my career of,

Like, we talked about becoming WW superstars training together and then to wrestle each other in an NFL stadium. Like, what a full circle kind of cool moment for myself and for him, I think. What is this X factor that he has? Like, you plug him into WWE and it's like he's been there forever. You plug him into anything. That's true. I don't.

There's just special people in the world. And I think there's a lot that goes into it. I don't think it's just a personality trait. I think you've got to be a good human. I think you have to have a positive or a vibe, energy, all of these things. And it just creates this special entity. And he is one of those special entities where, you know, despite things that he's done, like whether it was the one time he got jumped in or decided to allegedly jump in the river behind

and, you know, got in trouble a little bit. But like people didn't care. Like that's just Pat McAfee. Like whatever, who cares? where other people that could have ruined a career. But he had a successful NFL career. Then he went into comedy and he went into barstool sports and those things and was super successful like his comedy.

And he did that himself. He would took his money and he would rent out an arena or amphitheater or whatever he wanted to perform in. He would sell the tickets and then he would do the show and he had massive success in that. And then, you know, he decided to take a chance on himself with his own show, the Pat McAfee show and the success is obviously you see him now. on ESPN every day. Like,

the success is unreal. And it's then come to WWE and be a competitor. Like, how many people can do that? Not just, you know, he's not just an average guy walking in there. Like he's been in the ring with Vince.

He's been in there, you know, with theater, like, WrestleMania moments, myself, he's with Ms. With all these people.

He was just in the ring with the rock. The rock. And that was amazing. And like, um, there's just something about him that I think people gravitate to. And then, I think because I don't want to say the term blue collar because he's anything but that,

but he is like relatable to anybody and everybody. Yeah, he's like that Midwestern guy. Yeah, whether it's a dude that's worth $500 million, he can have a conversation and they find common ground or it's a guy that, you know, is struggling to get by. He's like, man, I see myself in this guy. And I think that's what Pat has that makes him special is any room, any situation, any group of people, everybody's going to be like, man, I like that guy. Yeah.

There's just something about it. And I don't think it's one thing, like I said. And he's such a great human to his employees, his friends. You know, the text messages he sent to me today was just like, this guy is as pure as they come. And he will help out his friends. Like when he signed a big deal, he dropped backpacks of cash off to his employees. Wow. Like who does that?

Yeah. He's so giving it. His wife, it runs a nonprofit dog thing, like, you know, raising money for elder dogs. and stuff like that. Like, they're just, just quality people. And I think if you have that, if you're not that, if you're an a hole secretly behind it, you're not going to have the success that he's had.

So it's, I don't know, it's just he's one of those one in a million people. That's you too. Like the legends you just listed off, you've been in the ring with all of them and then so. It's wild, right? When you look at what I've done in the ring with some of these guys,

with being with the rock, like the last, aside from last month or Friday, the last time the Rock was in the ring, It was with me and Becky, and I was eating a rock bottom and an arena's chant, STD at me, because he's calling me a super tough dude. And, like, you know, that's where we're at. I still get STD chance every once in a while. Thanks a lot, Rock, real cool.

But, and then, you know, seeing an angle, like, I think some people forget that I've accomplished those things. Oh, people definitely forget that. I mean, keep listing them off. Whatever it is. You know, yeah, it's just the massive things, you know, singles matches at WrestleMania, how many people get those opportunities? Singles matches at SummerSlam. I've had several.

I had a single match against John's team to open SummerSlam in New York. Like, what? And I think people discredit it because I don't win those matches, but, you know, somebody has to lose, and I'm fine with being that guy. Like, if I can elevate somebody else, awesome. That's my job. That's what I take pride in, you know, as a bad guy, I want to go, how do I make this guy the absolute best?

And I eat a lot of crow for it, man, when I think, I hope, I guess I hope that when I'm done, and hopefully that's, you know, a few years from now, people go, man, I didn't realize it at the time. That dude was really, really good. I really appreciate it. I think Ms. is getting into that right now where people are like, dude, if you look at our win-loss record and like, you know, Dolf, another guy, like, if you look at our win-loss record, it's abysmal. I mean, that's terrible. but we've elevated some certain people to a level and I want to go, hey, man, like part of your success is mine.

Nobody's going to give me credit for that, but I know it is. You know, whether it was, I spent three years running the main event. I went, Seth Rollins, Ron Stromen, Kurt Angle, Roman Rain. So it was like three years straight. And I was the constant. Every main event, every show, every pay-per-view, every Europe tour, running the main event. I was the constant. Yeah.

I think you've got to have a lot of pride in yourself to be able to do that to and I think that comes maybe from the grunt work of an offensive lineman never the glory all the blame like in a sense and I think it's the same thing in wrestling like I'm never going to get the glory at least I don't think and I'm okay with that because I take pride in what I do and I love what I do and I love laying flat on the mat with my back down and hearing a crowd erupt for Seth Rollins when he stands up and holds a title up or Roman ring and those guys are obviously on a whole other level with themselves, and they could probably do it on their own. But I like to think that I played a part in helping elevate those guys. Oh, yeah, the last few years, the word that keeps getting attached to you is workhorse. Yeah. And that's got to feel good. It does.

And the whole COVID, like, I think I was, aside from Bailey getting injured at the end, I was the workhorse for that. Like, I was pulling both shows. I was doing Raw on Monday at the Thunderdome. Then I'd come back and do Smackdown. And there was a show where they had a whole show written and I think everybody was out. And I pulled eight sags of a smackdown where I opened with a promo on The Undertaker and it went into a brawl with Jeff Hardy. And then it ended up with like a three seag.

Like eight segs during COVID, like I was the constant. Everybody else was come and go and things happened or people have never taken time off. I've never taken six months off television. I've never had a break or any of those things. And I take pride in that. And I think so when people say, yeah, workhorse. I am and I'm all about that. That's what I take pride in.

And you being in NXT now, I feel like it's the company's way of saying you're so good at making other people look great. Absolutely. Can you go help out some younger talent? Yeah. And they gave me that opportunity. And I love that. And I love getting to work with Sean and Rousseau and Baldwin, like their minds. And it's fresh for me.

Like, it's fresh for them to get me back after so many years. I've been on the main roster for eight years and we've done multiple characters. We all know that, most of which were really good and really awesome. The lone wolf was awesome. The king was awesome. The constable had so much hate. It was crazy. Like I think, you know, Dom's at that level right now where just arenas won't even let them talk.

And it's amazing. And there'll be people like, oh, no, it's going. It's not a real thing. Go away. He does not a real thing. If they're not making noise, that's go away. Like if you're going out there to silence or your music hits and there's nothing, that's go away. People hated me.

And I think it was a lot because they saw me first seven segs in a show on Raw, you know, changing rules of matches, things like that. And then, you know, sad Corbin and then to happy Corbyn. And then this stuff with JBL, like that just didn't click. And that was the kind of what I feel like the first thing I've done that just didn't click. I don't know why. I can't explain why because I love JBL. I think he's one of the best in the history of this business.

He's one of the best heels in this business. He's physical, believable. he has that face that just makes you go, dude, I cannot stand that guy. And it didn't work. And then after I think I was kind of in a weird place of like, well, what do we do now? Like, where do we go? And I was offered to go to NXT. And I was like, yeah, absolutely.

Like, let's go. And I see everything as an opportunity. And I saw that as an opportunity to go back. And I go, maybe I can reinvent myself down there. And plus, it gives the WWE audience a break from me. Again, I've been a constant for eight years on main roster television. television every week. I haven't been gone.

Everybody takes breaks. I never took a break. And I think the audience may have needed that break. And so being in NXT is giving them a couple months away from me, I think, maybe, but I'm still grinding down there. And, you know, Sean has grabbed on and like, what do you want to do? Like, we want you to work Carmelo. What do you want to do, though? And so we explained it.

And I said, man, I would love if we can just let me build what I want to be. Like let me have control one time coming out of the happy Corbyn stuff. And it was just into the John thing with the modern day wrestling God kind of stuff. It just, again, didn't click. And it was like, not me. And maybe that's what it was. I just don't know. I can't explain that one.

But I got down there and he was like, well, what are you? I said, man, we have had all these characters. Like, let's burn them all. And then we got the idea for like the furnace of throwing the things in the furnace, which was, by the way, it was like 14. 1800 degrees. I was, I think I was actually wearing this watch and I was nervous. It was going to melt that I was so close. Yeah. Because I was so close to that thing. It's where they burn bodies. It was a cremation thing. It's like, yeah, you were burning your, you know, the old versions of your cell. All the things and going, hey, man, I'm doing this as me. And that's what we've got to do. Sean has let me just be me. And I think that's why, like, we did the show in Austin and they were cheering for me. And I was like, oh my God, this is weird. Like, people are chanting like, go Corbin. Yeah. And booing Gable.

And I think that's because they're like, man, we're finally getting the Corbyn we've wanted for these last few years. Like this dude is just doing him. He's having fun. Yeah. We can connect to this character because it's real. It's him. It's what he wants to do.

And then they let me, like, be a part of making the music and the geese. Like, I'm designing my own gear now. Like, it's 100% me. Like my first gear with the ship and the burn the ships. Like, that was the whole philosophy was, you know, it's an old thing where I've always loved this phrase by the way. I've always loved the phrase burn the ships. It's the best because it's like, hey, man, we're abandoning everything.

It's either going to work or we're going to die. We're going back on their ships if we do it. The full phrase is if you want to take the island, you've got to burn the ships. And the idea, like you're saying, is like there's no turning back. Yes. It's we're taking the island and then taking their ships. Yep, exactly. And so that's where I was at.

Like, you know, I've been around a long time, 11 years now. And it's like, man, we can make one more like real strong run. And we got to burn everything in the past. And it's all or nothing. And I think that's what people are seeing and feeling and connecting to. And it's a great entrance theme. Oh, it's so good. I love it.

It is so good. And it just, it gets me in that mood. I think it came out on iTunes this week. And people are like, dude, it's so awesome. And like, it feels good to hear that hit and then walk out. It just has that vibe for me. And it was really cool because Neil like really made me a process or part of the process of making the music. Hey, can we slow it down?

Can we speed it up? Can I get more drums? Can I get more drums? I'm sending them bands and songs and vibes. And then they had a guy to do the vocals. It's like, I need a little more grit, a little more rasp. And then like, so it's really been built to what I like and what I enjoy. And then like I said with a gear, like I did a bam bam gear for that one episode of NXT.

I was like, he's one of my favorites. It's like, I'm going to rock it. And then like when I'm rocking next Sunday at No Mercy is going to be so sick. I'm so amped for people. But it was another thing that I just called my buddy. This is my idea. He designs it and we do it. That's a cool feeling to have again.

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People like clamor for that. Bring it back. I know. They want it constantly. Yeah. It's so cool. But I'm like, man, if we're going to do this and reinvent myself, it has to be all new. It could have been easy to go back to that.

We'd have that nostalgia. Go back. Like, we did the lone wolf entrance for the match with Carmelo and people, like, it was massive. It was real did like a couple million views, like within an hour. It was crazy. Yeah. I was like, I don't want anything nostalgic. I want all new, all fresh, because, you know, the goal is to get back to where I feel like I can compete with a Seth Rollins, a Cody Rhodes, a Roman Reigns, a Randy Orr and AJ Styles.

Those guys back in that main event picture. And, you know, when I go back to the main roster, I was like, I want it to feel fresh, feel new, and feel different. It feels like Carmelo's being set up to be a huge star in the next year or two, whatever it happens to be. what's it been like working with him? Oh, he was great. There's a lot of people down there, I think, that have just an immense amount of talent and personality and drive. And it's fun to get there, too, because we all get jaded in a sense, sometimes like eight years on the main roster. And maybe that was my problem.

You know, like I try to rack my brain. And maybe I just kind of became complacent. And at the end with the JBL stuff, and it lacked emotion or something. I don't know what it was. Again, we just keep going back to that because it puzzles my brain. rain some days. But you get down in NXT and you go, oh yeah, this is what it's like to have

the passion, the drive, the hunger, because these dudes haven't made it yet. They're grinding, they're chopping at the bit. They're dragging their knuckles going, hey, I want to be the next guy that's brought up, that makes a difference. And it was good for me. I think it

sparked something in me again to get me back to that place of like, oh yeah, don't be complacent. Don't be a pile of crap. Like, go walking that building, whether it's Raw Smackdown, whether you're the opening match, middle match, and whether you got two minutes, you got 25 minutes and put everything you have into it. Like, it's got me back to that level. It's brought that emotion back, that drive, that passion.

But you look at a guy like Mello and he's got all of it. And a guy like Braun, he's got it, Ilya, there's another just absolute special entity there. Ilya is like, to me, is a complete package with his physicality is emotion, his promos. And Braun is just a wrecking machine. There's so many guys. And then there's other guys like Joe Coffee. Like I'm a huge fan of his. I think he has so much talent.

And it's fun to watch guys like that compete and try to elevate themselves and get to the top of the car there, which eventually will get them to the next level. And then what they do with it is on them. But it's cool to be back working with those guys. You talk about the people you've been in the ring with. But you've had like these big moments that I feel like the payoff just wasn't there. Like when you won the Andre the Giant Battle Royal, was there plans for that to turn into like something? Yeah. I mean, there's always, there's always plans.

Like when I worked with Kurt Engel, like Vince had these ideas of now I have the gold medal. I'm the gold medal. It was super awesome. And then it just didn't happen. Like something changed and we went a different direction. But same with Andre, like the next week, you know, you work with Dolph. You're new on the roster. You work with Dolph.

Dolf is one of the best on the entire planet at elevating guys. And I did that. And then, you know, the lone wolf did well. Had money in the bank, was U.S. champion, all of those things. And I think there's been a few times where there is that moment. And it's like, but how do we capitalize? And then, you know, things change. I don't know.

Somebody gets hurt. Like, I've had moments I'm supposed to have a match with somebody that's going to lead. And, you know, they get dinged up and they got to, you know, we got to go this way now. And so it kind of, you know, hurts that flow. but that's the nature of the business. That's the nature of the beast. And, you know, they've got a lot of really talented writers that write these shows. And maybe it's something idea that they think is better than what they had.

We go with that. And maybe it doesn't work. Maybe it does. It's just, and it's random. I mean, sad Corbyn was random. I think we could have ran that for another six months and just really looked horrible. My hair would have been so bad. When they were like, grow out your air, you're like, have you seen it?

Yeah. Yeah, you know it doesn't grow right here, right? And as Vince was like, I know that'll be hilarious. I was like, all right. And I always tell the story, like having to visit private school. It's like looking terrible. But, you know, Kevin and Owens and I had a really awesome pitch to run as a tag team with the sad Corbyn. And they were like, we love it.

We love it. We did it like two weeks. And then Kevin had to go a different direction. And I was like, okay. But like, it was turning me baby face. And I think Vince didn't want to go that route yet with me. So that's why we shifted gears and switched. to Happy Corbyn, winning all my money in the casino after SummerSlam.

Happy Corbyn could have been great if you had a better entrance theme. You're like, I know. That one was interesting for sure. But, you know, the point of that character was to really annoy people. And I think that that music did. That music did. And the shirts and the hats. I love all my fedoras.

Don't get me wrong. It's like the right to censor theme. Like, oh. Yes, exactly. So, I mean, that was the task at hand. I think it accomplished its goal. I had Kurt on the show a few weeks ago. He had very nice things to say about you and his final match.

And he's like, look, of course I wanted John Cena. Everybody wanted John Cena. And he's like, it sucked that John Cena was in that building too, and it couldn't happen. But he's like, but Barron was so good to work with. And, I mean, that's pretty cool for you. Like, you retired one of the greatest of all time. I know. And people even asked me, like, if he came back from one more match, would you been?

No. He's one of the greatest of all time. Did we make something of me retiring him? Yeah, it's awesome. It's something I'll have in my belt forever. But I would love to see Kurt competing again. It's one of those things. I was listening to him on Rogan's podcast today.

And I'm like, I love that guy. He's just so good. And the things he's done and fought through and accomplished and changed his life around to be a better father, husband, wrestling, everything, competitor. And I mean, that was a huge moment. That's something I have like a six foot poster in my house of it. Like, because it was just such a cool thing.

And to get the win, like, I thought for sure going into that, I was like, man, we're going to send Kurt out on a high horse, hand raised, me laying flat on my back. I was like, that's going to be awesome. And then they're like, hey, man, you're going over. And I was like, huh? Did you? Huh?

Can you say that one more time? And like, for Kurt to do that. like Kurt could have said no. Yeah. And I would have respected Kurt for that. And it would have made sense. It would have been, you know, I would not have been any bit upset for that. Like, I'm working Kurt Angle at WrestleMania.

Yeah. A guy who was in the Hall of Fame. A guy who has been in the ring with every superstar you can imagine, from Taker to Brock to, me, just the list goes on and on and on. And I'm having a singles match at WrestleMania with this person. Do you remember a moment backstage before you guys went out? Was there a conversation that you're like, wow, that's pretty cool? All of it was. I mean, it was even like when I was doing the constable stuff and he was the GM,

even just getting to do the promos with him, I was like, man, this is so cool. And I've had a lot of that, like you said, with Rock, we're seeing a Taker, a wrestled Taker at his last live event probably when we wrestled at MSG in a tag match. And it's like, I'm standing in the ring or on the ring. apron just looking over and going, dude, that's the undertaker. Like, what? But like, that was the whole thing with Kurt.

I had six, seven months with Kurt. What? It's just, it's surreal. And like hearing his music hit and the crowd and them, them chanting all of his things. And it's like, aspiring. You hear them going, you suck. Like, man, like, I want that. That's the cool thing about being around those guys is you see that.

And you go, dude, I want that. I need that. I need that reception that he's getting. So how do I get there? Like it's motivating. It's driving. Dude, rock's interesting. See the night.

When his music hit, that pop was insane. And then when they saw him, the pop went another decimal. I was like, what? Yeah. Like, that's when you know you're over in a sense. We all know the rock is over. But anybody is when the music hits, there's a reaction. And then when they see them, there's a reaction.

A lot of guys have to do something to get that reaction, you know, where when certain people's music hits, when a Johnson, scene with music or Roman rains, or Seth Rounds, or Cody, there's a reaction to the music, and then there's a reaction when they see them. Like,

that's where you want to get. That's what I always say to people. You know you're doing something right when your music hits and there's a reaction. Because some people's music will hit, okay, and then when they see them, they're like, cool.

And then when they do something now, they get their cheer or whatever. You're like, I love when I'm standing backstage and I hear that music hit and I just hear the gutteral booze. And I'm like, dude, yes. Got them, got them already.

and they haven't even seen me yet. Yeah, yeah. And that's when I was the causal when I was the king like that. Even happy when that music would hit sometimes, you'd hear it like just the booze. And it was like, man, I'm doing something right. Like I'm on a level.

And people want to like discount the things. Again, because sometimes it's, I'm getting beat in 30 seconds. Sometimes I'm getting beat in 20 minutes. And they're just like, you know, they want to discount that. But I'm like, no, dude, I'm getting reactions from thousands and thousands of people in an arena every night,

whether it's live events or pay-per-view, or PLEs and, you know, Raw on SmackDown or WrestleMania. Like, there's that reaction. And I'm going, dude, I'm doing something right. Like, that's all the reassurance I need. What was so great about the Rock's return is it wasn't advertised. I know, right. Like, and it would have been so easy for them to say this Friday on Smackdown

pop the rating. Yeah. But instead, it was like, it felt like a throwback. I'm curious if they even knew he was going to come. Oh. Because he did Pat McAfee and the game day. that morning in Denver where they were

and I was like man that'd be cool if he just drove over to the building and then it happened. I just, I feel like that was the first show under the new ownership. Yeah. I feel like that was somehow

factored into all of us. Very well could have been. Right? Like, but you also had Cina on the show too. Like what a, what? That's a Smackdown

people are going to be talking about for decades. Like they're going to go back to that. Like, remember that time the Rock came back? And Cina was on the, you know, the writers.

strike and the actor strike and he was there yeah yeah and now you even got batista like whispering hey man i got nothing to do right now you know part of me he's like hey guys come on we're all trying to work here just because you guys are taking a little breather and obviously not by choice but you guys are you know then they're going hey let's go let's go back to this thing that's so amazing i'm going ah oh you rascals you know it's but it's amazing for the business it's amazing for the superstars for a Grayson Waller like I don't think he ever sat there and like man I'm gonna be in the wrong ring with John Cena

like that's just not something you think about this day and age because you don't seem as a movie star now yeah what he's doing is incredible and what what the level he's reached is amazing so you're like oh he's not gonna come back and wrestle and if he does it's gonna be Roman or it's gonna be Seth but he's like

John is so giving back to this industry this business because he loves it with every bit of what he does and I've soaked up an immense amount of knowledge from John. And I see John on a regular basis because I, you know, go to his gym and we talk or we've been to dinner.

And his mind for this is just leaps and bounds above 99% of the people in this, in this industry. And so when you soak up that, now he's passing it on to guys like Grayson Waller and, you know, stepping in the ring with solo and all of these guys, they're getting an opportunity to be in there with greatness, where they may never have thought they were going to do that.

I never thought I was going to stand in the ring with The Rock on the very first Smackdown on Fox and do a eight-minute segment and take a rock bottom and a spinebuster. That was never my wildest dreams. And then it happened. And I was like, then I spent the afternoon talking to the rock. Like, how do I capitalize on this? What can I do about this? How do I get in better?

Like asking information that I can apply and use that will benefit me. Do you still apply or use any of the things that the Rock's told you now? Absolutely. Just with, like, there's the ability that those guys have, which I take a lot of pride as a heel, is listening to the crowd for my timing and where John and Rock are the absolute best. And you can hear it. They look up and they just listen.

What am I hearing? And then they can dictate what they're doing to that and amplify it where some people don't hear it and just run over it. And you could have made a moment out of, you know, you hear these rumblings and you're going, okay, man, for me as a heel, like, if I'm in the ring with Cody Rhodes and I'm starting to hear that rumble, and I'm going, okay, man, they want to see him do something. So what can I have him do? Okay, he beats me up, does something.

And then I cut him back off and go, not this time, you know. But that's, I've learned that ability from Rock and from seeing it. Like, listen, don't, don't rush things. Take your time. And then you can do the same in promo. You start to, you have to be able to. the multitask and some people just don't and they miss out on an opportunity to get a better reaction or those things i'm trying to implement that some with the guys in nxte like slow down like

it is a faster-paced show and that's what's cool about it it is different if it's the same product we're just going to watch we're on smackdown it needs to be different it needs to stand out in its own way and it is that fast pace it is that exciting physical constant movement thing but i'm going hey, you can still listen while you're doing these things. And if you hear that, you can take it from a six to an eight. And now all of a sudden you're going from an eight to a 10. You can do that. And that's two things I've just learned from those guys, you know, to listen and take your time.

John Cena's been doing this really cool thing lately where he's aware that this isn't going to last forever for him. He only has, you know, however. We all do. Right. You need to be self-aware. But he comes into the ring. and you can see him looking around, taking in the moment. And it's just, I think it makes us all realize as fans watching it,

of like, oh, we now realize there's not too many of these left either. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think that's what makes them both so special. It's like for John, when he gets out there, like, again, he loves this with every bit of his being. And he wants to pass that on to future stars. And so he goes out there and he soaks it in. And I think if even younger guys did that more often, because we're all one injury away, we are one thing from happening

that we can never get in a ring again. I mean, unfortunately, you know, guys' careers are ended in injury, or they're just let go, or something's not working. You never know when it's your last, whether it's your first day there or 11 years down the road. I don't know. So I'm even doing that where I'm just really taking every time, am I getting that ring and taking it all in and putting all of myself into it.

And I think again, that's where I'm getting this weird, mixed people like me thing. But when you watch John, it's the same, like, that's where I see it as well as a fan, because I love this business as a fan first. That's why I'm here, you know, watching guys grow up. And, you know, if you asked a guy like Edge, you know, when he got injured and had to retire with injury, he was like, I'm not done. Like, I don't want to be done. But his body said, hey, man, you're done at least for a little while, which we now know.

But maybe if he'd have thought, hey, this could end tomorrow, would he have done things different? And I think for certain guys, they need to do that as well. Because you just, we never know, man. And John's saying, hey, look, I know it's going to end. I just don't know if it's this week, six weeks or a year or two years because he's going, Hey, my body just can't do it. Yeah.

And so I think we should all take that and use it. How did you come up with the end of days? By accident. Not a joke. Same with Deep Six, too. We were playing around, at the performance center, we have a crash pad ring,

and we, you know, can go in there and try things. And a kid named Sammy Callahan, I was playing around with him in the ring, and he does this thing where he springs off the bottom rope and catches you for a DDT. And I was just messing with him and he jumped and I caught him and I did the end of days on him. And we both sat up and looked at each other like, wait a second. What was that? Yeah.

Like that's something cool. And then I just did it. And I was like, dude, and I filmed it. And at the time I sent it to Billy Gunn. I was like, yo, I think this is my finish because I was really trying to find a finish at the time. He's like, that's awesome. I'm going to use it tonight against the shield. And I said, don't you dare.

I will fight you when you come back. And he didn't. He was just messing with me. But so it was a complete accident. And it's just been something that really kind of put me on the map. It's a cool, unique, first time ever seeing this finish, finish. And then I protected it with every bit of my might. I talked to Undertaker one time when he came, and I was just asking him questions.

And I think I stumped him on one when I asked him, like, how did you know when it was time to evolve? and it was like he was perplexed he was like uh like he's like that's a good question like and he's talking to all of us and i felt real good that i asked that awesome question i was like yeah um but i was genuinely curious like especially because i've had to evolve several times in my career and i can feel that to the american battles yeah yeah or or you know and then back to take or whatever it is he's doing it and then afterwards because i asked that question he pulled me aside and was like dude what you know da da and then i was like well give me some other just little tidbits and he's like protect

you finish. Don't let people kick out of it. He's like, there'll be a right moment sometimes for you to do that. Hopefully it's 10 years into your career. He's like, that's what I did. And so that, I took that at the heart. I mean, obviously when Takers's telling you something, you listen. Sure. Same with all those guys that we've listed today. So I did. I protected it. I mean, when I worked John Cena at SummerSlam, he said, what do you want to do? And I said, well, I can tell you the one thing I don't want to do. I don't want to kick out of your finish. and I really would appreciate it if you wouldn't kick out of mind. He said, done.

And I said, then let's have an awesome opening show match. He's like, can we keep it all in the ring? I said, absolutely. And we did. And so I take a ton of pride in that match because I like the old school mentality of building the card. And that night we built the card. Like, we kept it in the ring. We didn't kick out of finishes.

We put on one heck of a match that was on first. That was a first match. And so with the end of days, that was something I took to heart. Like even with Roman with Seth, with the shield, that was always something. I was like, hey, man, I just want to protect it. We can do whatever you want. That's the one thing I'm asking it. We don't do.

And Roman's like, yeah, we don't need to do that. We don't need to kick out of it. Seth, same thing. Like, those guys are so talented and so creative that we can get the reactions we want without doing that. And I've never kicked that of anybody else's finished because I'm not going to ask you to not kick out of mind. but hey, let me kick out of yours. So that's just something I've always done. I've never kicked out of anybody's.

Even when someone is like, hey, man, let's do that. I go, hey, let's find a different way. I don't want to kick out of your finish. You know, and so to me, I'm not going to ask somebody to do that, not kick out of mind and be like, hey, man, you know, it's just, I think to me a respect thing. So that was what in the days was built. We've only had one person in my career kick out of it. We talked about it a little bit when I saw you in Detroit,

but you giving it to Becky? Like, shocked people. Yeah. Because that doesn't happen in this day and age of WW. And that was Vince's idea. I was shocked when I got to the building. And it was in Philly, which I knew they were going to go nuts for. That was Vince's idea.

And it was just like, what? Like, it's crazy. And like the death threats after, all worth it. Totally worth it. Death threats. Oh, dude, you have no idea. No, my Instagram, messages and

Twitter and all of those things people were like, dude, I'm going to stab you the next time I see you for what you did to Becky. We should arrest these people. Yeah. I mean, if I get stabbed, then, yeah, if I get stabbed, yeah, definitely arrest that guy. But like, yeah,

because people, man, like people buy into what we do. That's the art of what we do. Can we suspend disbelief? Can we make people think what we're doing is 100% real? And that people bought into that moment. They're like, a grown man put his hands on a woman. I want to fight that guy.

Like, it invoked this rage in people. And it was awesome. You, I mean, you gave it to back in. Oh, yeah. Full tilt. Full tilt. Look, I think that, you know, we have such an amazing group of women on our roster that can compete with any of the guys out there. They're incredible athletes, their physicality, their drive.

and Becky's at the top of that list. Like what she brings to the table is so special. And I knew she could handle it. And when I told her to, she's like, yeah, just give it. And like, she's going to be fine. Like she is a badass, period. I mean, what made her an icon standing at top of a stairwell with a bloody face holding her hands up saying, give me some more.

Like that's the attitude she brings to the table. And so I know she could take it. And we did. And it was awesome. I think people thought that was going to open the door to like that happened more often. but really, really doesn't. I think that's what made it special. Yeah.

It wasn't something we over did. Yeah. It made it a moment. And that was a moment forever. And then turn it into Seth and calling him, I think I called him a SOB, I'm not sure, or POS, one of the two. And then he beat me to death with a kendo stick and some curb stomps. Still worth it. But yeah, I mean, when you don't overdo those things, it makes them really special when they do happen.

That reaction from the crowd was really cool to say. It was weird. It was weird because it was like, silence for a second? Like, did we all just see what we think we saw? What? Then there was like a massive pop because it was like that holy shit moment of like, and then just gutter roll booze. So it's like a three and one. I was like, man, that's hard to get. Like that's pretty cool. And in Philly of all places. Right. The wrestling audience in Philly. Yeah. Do you think about life after wrestling?

Give me, you have to. I mean, my NFL career obviously ended before I want to. it to end. This will end, I'm sure, before I wanted to end. I hope it doesn't. I hope there's a day where I can retire and walk away on my own accord. I hope that's a few years from now at least. It's a tough thing you ponder and question because I've lived this life now 11 years. I'm accustomed to a lifestyle that I've created with the income I'm. lucky enough to to earn from WWE. And I have young

kids now too. I'm a four year old and one and a half year old and I'm going like I want them to see me wrestle and remember it too and then I'm going well if it ends tomorrow like that's it's an internal struggle for sure because I love what I do.

I love traveling like even my wife is like you know would you stay in NXT for the rest of your career? And I'm like maybe because I love traveling and performing in front of these different audiences and experiencing the different cultures and the different cities and countries and places throughout the world from performing in Philly to Texas to Seattle to Toronto to Japan to China to South America to Mexico to Saudi Arabia like all of these countries I've been to and experience the food and the city and the people and the appreciation for what we do.

Like, it's going to be a very hard pill to swallow at someday when that is gone because that's what you appreciate is for me, those things. And so to think about it, life after it is bittersweet at times. I know I'm talented and have a lot to offer in a sense of like, could I go to? ESPN and commentate or do I go to Food Network and start slinging some food? But like, it's going to be a different sensation than what I do now. Like, I love what I do. And it's even hard to just talk about it a little. Like, because you go, that people lost their job yesterday.

That could have been me. So you go, I don't know. Yeah. So it's weird because it's such a large chunk. of my life. And you go, how do you go to the next thing? And it's not like acting

where you can do it until you're 110. Yeah, exactly. You know that there's an expiry date for sure in this career. Whether it's your body or or WVE is just, they have a new person

that is going to replace you. And that's not good on them. Like, I want somebody else to live this dream. Yeah. But it's like, you've got to take it from me. And you're like, you only get to do this

for whatever you're fortunate enough to do it for five years. years, 10 years, 25 years. And I've had 11. Like how many people get that? So that's super cool. But I'm not done yet. Clearly.

So it's one of those things I try not to think about, but logically you have to think about it. Because you go, okay, well, now I have to replace income. Now I have to replace. Or sell the wines. No. Take it out of my dead hands. But yeah, because, you know, we all make very good livings. And so you have to maintain that.

You can't go from this. And I'm lucky that I think I've experienced it before with the NFL where I'm making six figures of really good money and going from that to zero and going. Oh, shit. Yeah. Like how do I replace that? How do I do that? But I'm a grinder. Like, I've never been someone who can just sit around and not do anything.

Yeah. I've got a lot of hobbies that I go, okay, well, how can I turn one of those hobbies into, you know, of financial gain in a sense and still love it and make it fun. So whether it be food or, you know, who knows what coffee, fighting, you know, I've got back into boxing and jiu-sitsu lately and I'm going, man, there's a tournament in December. I might compete in the jiu-jitsu tournament in December. Like, I want to choke some dudes out.

Like, you know, it's fun for me. Are you training with carrying cross? He seems to be doing a lot of stuff. He's doing it at same gym. We just go at different times. Okay. So I train when I'm up in Orlando for NXT's, and then I'm going to start here at Jim.

in Tampa because I used to do it. I used to compete and did really well. And I'm like, man, I can still go. I'm having to like reach into the old memory banks and trying to remember like, I get into positions and I'm going, okay, I know I'm in a good position, but I don't know what to do next. Like I can't remember.

I know where I want to get to, but how do I get there? So yeah, you think of all of those things. Like, what are we going to do when the curtain closes for this? And I think, again, And this is a weird business too, because you just never know, like, Edge came back after so many years.

A lot of people who were released two years ago were back competing. I mean, you saw Niagara Jackson's back. Like, people think that their careers are over, and maybe they're not. I'm just getting to a point. I don't think, I mean, you have to be on a level of, like, Seth and Roman and John Cena and that, to go away for five years and come back and do it in your late. 40s or early 50s for some guys who come back. You have to be on this certain level of magnitude, I think.

Now, I've been in the ring with all those guys, but am I on that level? Humbly, I like to say I'm not. So, you know, six years from now, do they call me back, hey, we want you to come back and make a big run. I don't know if I'm going to be that guy for them to do that. Yet. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's the goal.

The goal is to continue to cry out, like to grind. And like, that's what I'm doing next to. I'm like, man, Hunter has challenged me to reinvent myself, and I'm doing that. And I feel like I'm doing it really well. And so it could launch back to where we go back to Smackdown or Raw. And I have a nice couple months where it really, they're like, oh, man, it's catching fire, like randomly. And then next thing you know, you're in the ring with Roman Raines or Cody at WrestleMania or whatever it is. And that could elevate me.

And I put a button on my career of, no, he really is that guy. Now you were in that position. A lot of people, again, refused to call me a main eventer, but for over three years straight, I was in every single main event. I believe that is by definition, a main event. Exactly, exactly. But there's a, I feel like wrestling fans have a short memory sometimes, so they just, whatever you've done recently, that's what you are.

And it's like, let's look at the whole thing, dude. You don't look at a football player and go, ah, he's not a Hall of Famer because his last season wasn't very good. But the eight seasons before that, he was a, you know, a pro, all pro player, or, you know, he rushed for 2,000 yards. And then all of a sudden he had a bad year. Like, they don't go. He's not a good football player. Like, let's look at the whole thing.

Let's open the book. Let's see what I've done, who I've been in the ring with. And I think when you look at that as a whole, you go, huh, yeah, maybe he is a main event. Yeah. I may have hated him, but dude could go. I'm glad you brought up food. What do you love to barbecue? I'd love to cook all of it.

I grew up in Kansas City. My dad was a barbecue guy. We would have the smoker running all weekend, whether it be ribs. And that went all the way through college where my roommates and my buddies on the football team like, hey, is your dad bringing ribs up? My dad would like spend all night smoking ribs and bring them up. So I learned at a young age, like true barbecue. He ran an offset. Everybody nowadays is using Traeger pellet grills.

I'm like, that's not a. Come on, dude. That's easy bake oven. Like you're not, it doesn't require talent where like mine I'm putting wood on and chopping wood and going, all right, I need an hour's worth of wood. And I'm out there with an axe chopping the wood and throwing it in there. But I love to throw down a brisket. I'm a Kansas City guy. So brisket and we do some burn ends.

I love doing just different things with different cuts of meat. Like take a try tip. Turn to cook a try tip like a brisket, chop it up, make it a brisket sandwich. But it's not a brisket. So you're now, instead of spending right now meat. prices are crazy instead of spending 200 bucks on a brisket, you're spending 19 on a tri-tip and getting pretty close to the same exact thing, but it's special in its own way. Like, you know, people want to do a fillet.

I'm like, well, give me a hanger steak, dude. Like inexpensive cut of meat that is just unbelievable. But I love to barbecue everything, man. I'll barbecue steaks, briskets, pork ribs, I'll barbecue desserts. I'll do like a peach cobbler in the smoker, like brownies in the smoker. That sounds incredible. Dude, it's. Why are you opening your restaurant?

I've got one here in Tampa if you want to go eat, but it's vegan. Don't tell anybody. Yeah, I lost a Tema Club down the road. I own part of that. It's a vegan natural wine bar. Pretty cool spot. But, you know, like I love doing that. And I just don't want to open my own restaurant.

I actually, before I came here to meet you, that's why I was running a few minutes. I was putting a dether a pop-up menu. Me and a buddy are going to do a pop-up restaurant at one of the spots here on a Sunday for football. We're going to make like a three item menu with like three sides for a football Sunday and just sling some food. Like that's when it's fun for me or, you know, cooking for friends and, you know, stuff like that. Like a buddy of mine, Aaron May invited me today. I couldn't go. He invited me at the event today, but he's cooking for Travis Kelsey's charity event today.

He's like, come cook with me. I was like, that'd be so awesome. But I have a charity golf tournament tomorrow morning for my daughter's school. So I couldn't go. But like I love doing that kind of stuff where I can go and it's like a one time thing. Like I'm going to sling some steaks for everybody or, you know, my wife's got, my wife is Puerto Rican. So we have that big, you know, Spanish family and Latin food. I'm learning to do a lot more Latin food and putting my barbecue twists on it or whatever it is.

And I love cooking for them because it's like 14 people. Like that's what I love doing. I don't want to have to do the 90 hours in a kitchen and dealing with food. deliveries and all of that. I just like, I like slinging really good food for people. And I've always, again, been a barbecue guy. That's what I've done. I can do some insane things with barbecue. But then when COVID hit, I was like, man, I really want to elevate my food game. I love going to restaurants and eating, fine dining to, I don't know if I should eat in this place. It's kind of dirty, but food is so good. Like, I love that whole aspect of eating. And I was like, I want to be a

able to cook some like fine dining. I want to know how to do like a cherry reduction with a you know perfectly seared duck breast and uh I don't really eat fish but I want to learn how to cook it. So I ended up meeting this guy, Nate, who's now a good buddy of mine who I'm going to do this pop-up with. Um, and I essentially hired him and he was one of the top chefs in Tampa Bay and, uh, his restaurant had closed because of COVID. So a lot of these guys don't have a job now. And I'm going, okay, well, how can I help them and help myself at the same time? Excuse me. And so I said, hey, man, I will pay you to come teach me the basics.

I need a sprint through culinary school. So I want to learn how to do all the things I don't know how to do. And then I want to learn plating. And he's like, done. And so I hired him essentially like two days every other week. He would spend a day prepping food and then a day cooking food. And like the first day he shows up and he's got these big bins and he's like, all right, we're going to teach how to break down a chicken. And I want you to be able to do this with your eyes closed.

And then we're going to work on flavor pairings and what goes with what and like how do we do an airline chicken breast? What goes with it? What kind of sauce goes with it? Here's how we plate it. When you think of a plate, we have to conceptually visualize and draw out how we want the plate to look. So that will pertain to what we're cooking a little bit because you can't put this side with this. if you want it to look like this. And then we did like the next week.

He taught me how to break down fish, de-scaling fish, by the way, it's disgusting. Scales are flying everywhere. I'm hitting me in the eye, and I'm just scrubbing these scales off. And he just, and he really taught me the foundations of food.

And then he got me hooked on a book called the Flavor Bible, which I travel with it all the time, because I will sit on the plane and just, I'll go, okay, I'm going to do my wife wants scallops. So I'm going to do scallops. Now, what do I want to put? And I'll look up scallops in the flavor Bible,

and it will tell me all, all the flavors that go with it. Now I've got avocado. And I'm like, okay, now how do I transition this into like a really cool sauce? So I make this all avocado crema for scallops with micro greens and radishes shaved on it. And the plate looks like it's a $100 plate and it tastes out of this world. And like a lot of times my wife's like, you got to make that. And so that's what I just, I love the conceptualizing, constructing and pairing things together.

Like I was telling my buddy this morning, I said, we should do this. this smash burger that I do. And he's a chef, mind you, a very, very high-level chef. And I was like, we need to do a smash burger. And I said, I know you're not going to like this, but cream cheese, whipped cream cheese with shishito peppers, chili crisps and onions. And he's like, sounds crazy. I'm telling it it's the best. And so I got to cook it for him this week. But like, you know, I sat and went through that book and made it. And then I made that dish. And so I'm like inventing these recipes and doing it. It's just such a fun, creative process, especially when COVID, we weren't traveling.

I was lucky to be here in Tampa. So it was in Orlando. Then it was in St. Pete. And then it was in Tampa. So I had all this free time. So I really just, that was my creative outlet, was cooking because I was home seven days a week. And I've got an awesome kitchen and a beautiful outdoor setup. And I'm throwing things on the smoker like a, like I said, like a peach cobbler.

Like, who throws that on a smoker? I'm going to. I guess in a big cast iron. And it's so good. Great. I'm super hungry after all this. That's the goal. This has been so great, man.

Thank you for taking the time to come over here. And I just want to acknowledge you for the career that you have had. Thank you. And I like the fans are coming around and realizing and appreciating the work that you do. It makes me feel really good because I've always had it behind the curtain. I'll never forget when I was in Europe. And Matt Hardy stops me and pulls me to side. And he's like, dude, I just want to say thank you.

And it's like, for what? And he's like, dude, you are a heel and you want to be a heel and you get heel reactions. And you don't care that people say whatever they say about you. He's like, I just want you know, I appreciate that. And I think you're awesome. And I was like, dude. But like, I would get that from a lot of guys from Arne Anderson, Matt Hardy, Vince, Seth. Those guys, they're like, dude, what you do is a thankless thing.

And I want to, and like, that's always been. But now it's really cool to get it from outside that circle. Yeah. It's gratifying. It's going, man, like, it was all worth it. Yeah. So I end every interview talking about gratitude. I wake up every day.

I say I allow three things I'm grateful for. I do it before I go to sleep. And it's how I end every interview. So what are three things in your life right now that you're grateful for? I mean, my wife and my kids, number one, they are everything to me. Like that family, my wife being supportive of whatever I want to do. Like, she manages two kids by herself at home. And my wife owns her own company.

So it's not like she's a stay-at-home mom. She has her own company, own business, and it's not a little business. It's a very big business. So she does that, comes home and does mom when I'm gone. Like, you have to have that behind you. So I am so grateful for that. I'm grateful for the opportunities because I've just been reflecting a lot on my career. I'm grateful for the opportunities that, you know, Vince and Hunter and Sean have given me.

Because I wouldn't be where I am without those opportunities and without those guys being supportive. And so they have played a huge role in my success in life, not just in WW, but in life. Like my kids get to enjoy the fruits of my labor to a sense. So I am grateful for that. And then right now, man, I'm grateful for the opportunity to be able to sit down

and just have a conversation and, you know, tell people things that they may not get to hear from me or appreciate or maybe I put something out there today that will aspire someone or will motivate someone or make them reflect on their own journey in a sense of them be like, man, I'm doing it. Like that guy did it. I'm doing it.

So I'm grateful for this opportunity. I'm grateful for you. And I think there may be people that listen to this or started this episode and they went, I don't know how I feel about Baron Corbyn. They are Baron Corbyn fans after listening to this. I hope so. I appreciate that. Appreciate you, man.

Thank you. All right. That was awesome. That went on way longer than I expected to. I was like, I will talk for like 45 minutes. And here we are, whatever, this is an hour and 10 minutes later or something like that. And if you go and watch the YouTube version of this, you'll be like, ooh, I recognize that room. Well, you'll say that if you watch the Rick Flair interview. So I was so fortunate. That trip to Tampa was incredible. But I interviewed Rick Flair in that room. It was my hotel room. I interviewed Baron Corby in there. And I also interviewed Mike Keota. So those were three of the six that we did in Tampa over a two-day span there and also Hulk Hogan. Natty and T.J. are added on on top of that. So you'll be seeing these interviews with T.J. Wilson and also with Mike Keota coming up in the next handful of weeks here. But Halloween Havoc is right around the corner and I had the opportunity to sit down with Carmelo Hayes. That'll be our next episode. But I just feel like, speaking of NXT, I just feel like there's so much more for Baron Corbyn.

And I feel like that could happen in NXT. On top of him already making everybody else look good there. So if you enjoyed this, please snap a screenshot, share this online and tag us so we can share it out as well. He's at Baron Corbyn, WWE. I'm at Chris Van Fleet. And the legendary John C. Maxwell said this. It's the quote I'll leave you with.

Change is inevitable. Growth is optional. Be great. Be grateful. We will see you on the next one for some more insight. The Hammer Alley podcast, an 80s flashback mockumentary. Back in the 80s, there were a thousand bands trying to make it in the world of rock, but there was one band that had it all. Hammer Alley.

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