Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Edge's Impossible Royal Rumble Return, Christian Cage, Leaving WWE For AEW, WrestleMania Moments (Interview From May 2024)

Starting point is 00:00:00 Chris. As a fellow Canadian, this is an honor. This is an honor. A long time coming here. Yeah. I mean, I've seen some of your stuff and I've been seeing it for a while. Likewise, I've seen some of your stuff. For a while.

Starting point is 00:00:36 What a career. Unbelievable. Yeah, I mean, as we kind of were briefly touching on before, I don't really think about it a whole lot until. I sit down and kind of do an interview and we start going back and then it starts to refresh my memory on just how long and, you know, all the different things. And even like the, so sometimes I'll forget who I wrestled, you know, and it's, I did, I saw a clip on Instagram of Gangrel and I wrestling with Road Warriors in Puerto Rico. And as soon as I saw it, oh, yeah. Wow.

Starting point is 00:01:15 But I just kind of forgotten. Yeah. How do you forget you wrestle the road warriors? You know what I mean? And it was no commentary on the match or them. I loved working them. But it started to come back to me when I saw the clip. And, yeah, so there's certain things that, you know, through the fogs and mists of time, you know, I'll be reminded of eventually.

Starting point is 00:01:34 But I don't sit and think about it. It's pretty incredible that you're in the best shape of your life now at 50. Yeah. I mean, I'd like to think I am. And you look at. But, you know, but it's things that I took for granted before I can't now. And I have to work harder now than I did before, which is a good thing. Because by working harder than I really dove in, and I was like, okay, it all started

Starting point is 00:02:02 with just being around for my girls. And then it led to this. And then I led to that. And then here we are, you know, four, four and a half years into a comeback. that I never thought would happen. But it really just, it started with wanting to be around for my girls. You know,

Starting point is 00:02:23 I've already, you know, come to grips with the fact that I'm going to look like Gandalf when I take them to their high school dance or whatever, but at least, at least they'll still be here, you know, knock on wood.

Starting point is 00:02:37 How much has this helped? Pure plank. So this was, this was really fun because, literally from the ground up. Jay and I, Christian and I put this thing together. I had gone down to Jay's and he had noticed, you know, I was starting to get back in shape. He goes, what are you doing? Honestly, planks. I started with planks. I just started planking. I thought, okay, I'm about 260. Dad boughtish-ish and not really watch my diet, just kind of live in life.

Starting point is 00:03:14 you know um but i i took them up the stairs one night probably 60 pounds combined and i was pretty tired i was like whoa okay got got to do something about this what can i do what can i do let's let's start with planks body weight let's just go there build up my core so i don't throw my back out you know as i start lifting again um more seriously and then uh so i started planking really difficult at first um when i talked to j he goes what just planking Yeah, man, planking. I just started with planking. So he goes, I let's try it.

Starting point is 00:03:50 Do 30. And by 20, he was starting to shake. He was like, oh, man. So then he became an accolade as well. And then we started planking. And then I would go down there while we were doing kind of the residency at Tropicanne Field had to just stay at Jay's place. And then he had the idea.

Starting point is 00:04:11 He was like, listen, what about? like a planking mechanism because we were finding with our elbows with all the floating debris in our elbows, the shoulder surgeries, the peck surgeries, the wrist surgeries, all of those things. It was kind of painful on our joints, you know, and we just thought if we could come up with something that could make sure your form was strict, but take some of the stress off your joints, that might be interesting. So we started talking about it. it and then I put a sharp beat of paper and literally drew a diagram of some of our ideas. And fast forward, you know, to a couple of years later. And it was like, oh, this is actually

Starting point is 00:04:56 going to be a thing. And now we're starting manufacturing. And this was during the pandemic. So everything had slowed to a crawl. But once, once we cleared the pandemic, that's when it got serious and it got real. And, yeah, but we were involved in every stage of it. The, you know, you know, picking the logo, geez, I'm dangerous, man, picking the logo, picking the color, you know, testing the padding on it, the handles for stability, you know, all of those things were involved in the app and the software. It was really just kind of fun to be involved in, like, literally drawing this thing on a piece of paper to now seeing it sitting here. It's, it's still odd to me because usually in terms of creating things, it's,

Starting point is 00:05:44 always been story related or character related or it'll be our you know my gear you know things like that but i've i've never been involved in an actual product um so so that's been it's been kind of fun honestly it's a great workout too i've been doing it since you guys sent me one that's a great workout it'll get you yeah um i you know Dustin actually came up to me go so what's the deal i was like well it's planking but it'll make it easier uh to maintain your form because it's not going to hurt as much on the other areas kind of thing. And we have apps and timers and different exercises you can try. So I said, you know, it's going to help with lower back. That was honestly the thing I noticed immediately when I started planking. I was like,

Starting point is 00:06:29 okay, the core got stronger. Oh, my lower back feels a lot better. Yeah. And then diet falls into line because you're feeling better, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. So it's been really fun, honestly, to just be involved in it and just see this thing grow, like I said, from a diagram to sitting here between us like that. You guys set us up with a coupon code CVV if people watching this or listening to this, want to save some money and check out gopureplank.com. And you can work out with Adam and I because that's what we're doing. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:07:02 And, you know, more than anything, I just thought when Jay and I looked into the market, we saw that there was really nothing. And the couple of things that I saw were pretty dangerous. And we tried them. And just to test and see, like, how's this going to work? And we're crushing our fingers. And it was, you know, the stability was difficult. And I thought, okay, if you've never planked before, how are you going to get on this thing?

Starting point is 00:07:26 Sure. Whereas this, you can never have planked a day in your life. Yeah. And you can hop on here and do it. And really more than anything, we're thinking of, okay, a mom who's coming out of pregnancy, whereas how to C-section wants to get the core back, you know, because people don't really talk about what women go through post-pregnancy, whether it's postpartum, but also the splitting of your abdominal muscles.

Starting point is 00:07:50 I mean, it's hard to get that back, you know, and I've watched Beth, you know, work through it. And her work ethic and her workout, you know, it's part of her life. But for someone who maybe it isn't but still wants to get it back, this feels like a way to dip your toes in and start getting there. Or just the dude working on the assembly line and in Boise, you know, and he's standing on concrete all day and his lower back's jacked. So is he going to want to do deadlifts?

Starting point is 00:08:17 Yeah. Probably not. Yeah. I feel like you guys are going to be on Shark Tank with this. This feels like a Shark Tank product. Yeah. I'm not good with the possibility of dismissal. Two of them are Canadian.

Starting point is 00:08:31 I feel like we'd, you know, good company. Robert Hershevik and Mr. Wonderful. All right. So I just kind of, you know, wear Maple Leafs. They'd be like, hey, one of us. Yeah, our team Canada or something. That's how it is with Canadians. This is so funny.

Starting point is 00:08:43 Yes. Like, ah, you too. Well, you know, and I've talked about it. It's like, what, there's 37 million people in Canada, but landmass-wise, it's bigger than the United States. Right. So when somebody makes it, it's like the whole country is behind you now. You know, I've always loved that.

Starting point is 00:09:01 Like, whether it's St. John's or Victoria, I feel like a hometown kid. And I've always loved that about Canada. There was something about growing up outside of Toronto for me, knowing that you and Christian had made it. I wanted to be a pro wrestler. Like, that was my dream when I was in high school. Knowing that you guys had done it from about the same area made us go, oh, it's possible. Because if you think back before that, wasn't really anyone from that area. And not from our area, no.

Starting point is 00:09:28 And if someone had kind of broke through, it was, you know, the Rujos, who their family, you know, had history or the hearts or it was rare to have like a Paterson or someone kind of make it, I guess, from Canada. It's a lot of Calgary. A lot of Calgary, you know. And just having no real inroads to getting into the industry until Carl DeMarco, who ended up being the Canadian president of WWE, he was the one that started opening eyes and kind of turning a spotlight as to what was going on up in Canada. And that's, you know, that ended up

Starting point is 00:10:11 being me and Christian and Valvina and Gail Kim and Tristratus and it ended up being, you know, quite a little hotbed. Yeah. But if no one had done it before you, and of course, in your high school yearbook, you're most likely to be WWF champion, what made you think you can actually do it. Maybe stubbornness. I'm pretty stubborn. Once I latch on to an idea, I at least have to see it through. And then if it doesn't work, okay, it didn't work, maybe it can work a different way, and I'll try it this way, and then I'll try it that way, and then I'll try it that way. But I just, it's all I ever wanted to do. So to me, if I would rather try and do everything that I could to make it happen rather than go, I wonder.

Starting point is 00:11:10 I didn't want to be that guy. I didn't want to be that guy and there's nothing wrong with this, but I worked on an assembly line building car seats. And I didn't want to be that guy at 60, you know, getting ready for his gold watch. I wanted to go out and chase it. And if it didn't pan out, okay. But that was just, it wasn't an option to me. I just knew. I was like, I'm going to do this.

Starting point is 00:11:34 I'm going to get this. However long it takes, I'm going to get it. And I won't have a family until. And I won't really set roots until everything was geared toward this. and doing this to the point where like I stopped playing hockey. I didn't ski. I didn't do a lot of the things that other kids did because it was like, I can't risk a broken like.

Starting point is 00:12:00 I can't this, that or the other, whatever that is. So yeah, when high school yearbook, I think they kind of knew by that point, but I don't think anyone actually thought, oh, okay, if we say this, it'll end up happening. I don't know. But for me, I knew it was going to. It was just no matter how long. You're like, I have to now.

Starting point is 00:12:21 They think I'm going to. I have to. I don't live up to this. With all that said, how difficult was it when this is your dream and you lived it? And then it was taken away from you. Yeah, I mean, I had to pretty quickly wrap my mind around the idea that this was, I was being told I could never do this again, right? Do you remember that day?

Starting point is 00:12:43 Yeah, because we had done WrestleMania 27. Atlanta? Yes. Me and Del Rio, you know, world champ. So I'm thinking, okay, we'll get to the next pay-per-view. It's a ladder match. I'll drop the title there. Then I'll take a little break because, you know, I was sore.

Starting point is 00:13:03 And but I'd been sore for a while. And did Charlotte, just did commentary in a quick little spear. But even that single spear is like, ooh, got a bit of a zinger there. So I drove up here because I just bought this house, drove up here. It was sitting on my deck and I got a call from Vince. And he told me, you know, we're told you got to retire. And I went, oh, right. Were you even thinking that was an option?

Starting point is 00:13:34 I always told myself by 40 I'd be done and I was 37 at that point. So I assumed I had, you know, a few more years with a bit of a break in there. But you're probably thinking my neck hurts. Maybe it's surgery. Maybe it's, yeah. Yeah. And that was my thought. It's like, okay, well, I have a double fusion in my neck. I came back, wrestled 10 more years after that double fusion, and I'm wrestling Sina and Batista,

Starting point is 00:13:57 and Undertaker, and Kane, and Big Show as a heel champion who's taken most of those bumps. Yeah. You know, that's part of the job. And I knew that. So I just assumed, okay, well, the discs on either side of this fusion are slamming off of that fusion. I know that's short in my career.

Starting point is 00:14:18 I didn't know to what extent, you know. And I finally had the second neck surgery in 2012. So I'd been retired for a year. And Beth will remind me, she goes, when we were out running errands or whatever, it'd be two hours, you'd have to go get flat. And then we could go back out again. But it was to the point where, like, I'd turned my head and it felt like I always said, like a hot water bottle would just being released inside my head.

Starting point is 00:14:44 And I'd feel it run down. I'd be driving. And she goes, hot water bottle. I was like, yep, just got to give it a few seconds, you know. So that that's the extent that had gotten to. But again, before that, I just assumed that was normal because, yeah, I have a double fusion. I'm getting thrown around by extremely large, strong men.

Starting point is 00:15:04 And that was the case. It just, I didn't realize I'd develop stonosis and, you know, all of the things that were going on. So when I got the triple fusion, when they fused me up another level, the relief was instantaneous. I woke up in the hallway and I was like, wow, man, I don't have a headache. And that's when it dawned on me, I'd have a headache for like a decade. Wow. Because it just became the new normal. And it's amazing what you can put up with when it just becomes part of your day.

Starting point is 00:15:32 So what was your immediate reaction after that phone call when Vince says you've got to retire? Well, I was surrounded by my four dogs. and I just kind of sat down and felt sorry for myself for a little bit, you know, had a, had a cry, you know, because it's the only thing I ever wanted to do, right? So even though I assumed I was close to retiring, it still, at least initially it didn't make it, it wasn't easy. But fairly quickly, I realized, okay, if I don't have a choice in this at all, then I have to wrap my mind around this. pretty quickly or this is going to be an unhealthy emotional climate for me yeah um and then luckily

Starting point is 00:16:18 the executive producers for haven um saw my retirement speech and they were looking for a tie-in with haven because smackdown aired before it they wanted something um to coincide with lead in and they they asked for me because i guess they they were almost in tears watching the retirement speech and that was an acting ability at all. That was just me retiring from the only thing I ever wanted to do, right? What a monologue. Right? I know. And that was my addition, essentially. And then, you know, I flew to Tampa. And then Jay and Del Rio had their ladder match as part of that. And then I took off for Nova Scotia. And one episode turned into 41. Wow. And then from there, about halfway through the second season, I was like, I really enjoy this. I better show putting some work in instead of just

Starting point is 00:17:09 showing up you know and that's when i started taking classes and diving into you know pulling apart movies and and why certain actress made certain decisions and what were they doing and then going back and studying okay like tom hardy studied apes you know for for this role okay interesting and denaro studied cobras for cape fear um just little things like that yeah okay interesting and and it tapped into the creative vein still and i realized that was really important to my makeup. If I'm not creating some form of story, it just feels, I don't know, I get antsy. And so that still kept that alive.

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Starting point is 00:19:53 It's guaranteed. Prize picks run your game. Do you have moments on set as an actor? Because when you're a wrestler, you have an immediate feedback, right? It works or it doesn't work. When you're an actor, you can watch it back on playback and you can go, looks like good take to me. Are there moments where you're kind of like,

Starting point is 00:20:14 was that, was that okay for everybody? At first, initially, yeah, for sure, because not really having much on my idea of what I was doing, you know, and I had to get used to pulling things back from wrestling,

Starting point is 00:20:30 which is, you know, I guess the same with theater. Everything has to be big. Sure. And acting's here, right here. They can, they can see your, your, you know, nose hairs. Like, you've got to pull it back.

Starting point is 00:20:44 Micro expressions. It's a big term they use it. Yeah. And it's real. So once I kind of started to wrap my mind around that, I started to feel more comfortable. And then I could start to feel like that felt pretty good. All right. It felt like myself and that other actor were, we got to that place.

Starting point is 00:21:04 But initially, it was strange because like you said, it's that instant gratification. knowing instantly if it worked or not with wrestling. And I equate it kind of to stand up or maybe a band or a singer and knowing, okay, this song's really connecting more or my set is killing or it's not in having to switch up paths. With acting, you could have the take that you feel was the best, but for the totality of the scene, maybe it isn't. So that's not the one that you're going to see in the edit once it's edited.

Starting point is 00:21:34 But also the aspect of, you know, I filmed the last season I was. was involved in Vikings. I didn't see it for two and a half years. And it's like, oh, yeah, okay. I kind of forgot what that scene was almost. So I had to get used to that and wrap my mind around that, like, once you do it, you just got to, it flies away. And you'll see it when you see it. And it's dumb. Did you have hints during your nine years off of like, I feel good. Maybe, maybe I could come back. I honestly, no. You know, I felt good. But I didn't assume good enough for that, you know, because that's just a different beast entirely. It's a, there's nothing I've found that that can prepare you for having a pro wrestling match, except just having one.

Starting point is 00:22:25 You can train. You can do all those things. But until you factor in adrenaline, getting the wind knocked out of you, and then having to get up and run. And how do you train for that? Okay, you can get in a ring. but if there's no audience, it's not the same. It's not the same endorphins. It's not the same dopamine.

Starting point is 00:22:44 It's not that same adrenaline and the adrenaline dump. You're probably just working, but going through the motions and training. Getting out there is an entirely different thing. I didn't know. I didn't think that was ever possible because I was told it wasn't. I started doing, you know, stunt scenes. And I was doing my own stunts and I thought, I feel okay. I feel good here.

Starting point is 00:23:07 Huh. Okay, but it's still not that, right? It really truly wasn't until I wiped out my mountain bike with Seamus, because that was uncontrolled. And that was the first kind of uncontrolled fall that I had taken, you know, because on a set, everything's very controlled and maybe you have padding, this, that, and the other. The mountain bike was going downhill, wiping out off a jump, on clipping in midair and essentially taking an arm drag on rocks and rolling up to my feet and going I'm fine oh I'm okay interesting that's that's kind of when it all started the light bulbs

Starting point is 00:23:52 where did it go from there from there a week later I was at summer slam in Toronto and um and you gave a spirit of Elias yes and it gave everyone so much hope Well, and, you know, it was one of those deals that I was out there and I just felt it. And I knew what I'd been going through. Nobody else did. So it was really cool looking back. I haven't watched it back or anything. But you can see the moment where Elias realizes, oh, oh, oh, like you can see his body makeup change.

Starting point is 00:24:30 And mine does too, because I'm like, oh, I'm going to do this. And he just, he saw the switch. And luckily he's a, he's a great enough performer that, that he picked up what I was putting down. Yeah, when you pulled the hair back, everybody in the audience went, oh, there's a chance. There's a chance. You know, and even at that point, I didn't know if there was. But I thought, I'm here. I can feel this crowd wants it.

Starting point is 00:24:52 I'm going to do it. Were you under contract with WWB at the time? It was just a one-off appearance. Just a one-off appearance. Hey, look, hometown crowd. It's get a nice little hometown, you know, moment for them on the pre-show, you know. That's all it was. But then after doing that, I was like, man, come on, I can do this.

Starting point is 00:25:12 That's when I started visiting doctors. And I went on my own and I just started checking off all of the doctors that needed to sign off on this thing. And yeah, and then that was it. Then the ball started rolling. I've heard you say that you had an offer from AEW before you went back to WW. How close were you? to signing with A&W instead of making that return at the Royal Rumble in 2020. Really close.

Starting point is 00:25:39 You know, we had great discussions. What time would this be late 2019? Yeah. And you were cleared? Yes. So I got cleared. Were they aware you were cleared? I got, so when I first started talking to AEDW, I wasn't yet cleared.

Starting point is 00:25:53 I'd made it, we'd talk about it like the bosses of each video game level, you know. But I still wasn't cleared by. company doctors, right? So once all of those clearances started to come, I was like, oh, this is, this is real now. Okay. So before I did anything, I had to go kind of get the final clearance needed for either company. And so I was, but I negotiated with, with everybody. I was like, okay, here's where I'm at. Here's what I've been told I can do. And, and started the, the, the And then in going to WWE and sending down with Vince, he goes, well, it's got to happen here. You know, and at that stage, I looked at the equity built.

Starting point is 00:26:46 And, you know, it felt like having to start over was, especially having to start over after having been gone for nine years, felt really daunting, if that makes sense. It felt like at least with WWE, that's one thing off the table that I don't have to worry about. I can come back and walk into the history of this character. And I do feel like it needed to happen there initially. I really do, you know, if only for that Royal Rumble moment, you know, right before the pandemic hit and just feeling and experiencing that. I'm happy the way it turned out. Can you put into words that expression on your face when you came out of the smoke? I can't.

Starting point is 00:27:33 Not really. There's so many things going on there. So many things rushing through my brain, through my heart, just, I'm dumbfounded. This is happening. And the smoke almost felt like made it feel like a dream sequence. Like I was there, but I almost wasn't. I was almost watching myself. I don't really know how to explain it.

Starting point is 00:27:56 There were so many things going on in my body at that point. you know again dopamine endorphins that that be adrenaline like you can't you try and explain it to people but you can't you know if you can bottle it you'd be a trillionaire um but it was it was very uh surreal uh but yet real it's really hard to explain those moments um but that one was it was really special, you know, just to get back after nine years. Because nine years, you know, I've said this before. It's not like the ship had sailed. It was like, it wasn't even on the horizon. It was on the other side of the world. Like, it was gone. Nine years is a long time. I think Sean was four. And Dana Bryan was two. Nine years. Yeah. You know, and then the questions, okay, can I do this?

Starting point is 00:28:55 All right. How's this going to be? And, you know, I'm, taken a deep six before I know it. And then I'm taking the magic killer before I know it. And I'm like, okay, all right. Okay. I got this. But it took those first few minutes to kind of get that under my belt and realize, okay, yeah, I can.

Starting point is 00:29:16 There are so few surprises in wrestling anymore. That was a genuine surprise. Yeah. I mean, you know, hindsight, everybody else said they knew. Oh, yeah. There was actually a sign in the crowd. Have you seen that? No.

Starting point is 00:29:28 When they go to the wide show, There's like, it says rated R. Rumble. And I'm like, how? Did they just bring that sign every year? There was, there was one. I went up to Pittsburgh to meet with Dr. Maroon. And he was the final boss, right? So that was the final clearance.

Starting point is 00:29:43 And I'm like, I can't have anybody seen me in Pittsburgh at the airport. So I'm wearing a hat. I'm wearing a hoodie. And sure enough, I'm walking by this one coffee shop. And dude goes, son of a bitch. And sure enough, you start to see little things here and there kind of thing. Just in town visiting Kurt Angle. Yeah, I just came up to see the Steelers, I don't know, penguins.

Starting point is 00:30:05 So there was a little bit of rumblings, but like the amount of people that said they knew, no, you didn't. When you showed up to the arena that day, I'm sure you shocked. Nobody saw me. Nobody saw me. They took me right to the Astros manager's office, and that's where I was all day sequestered in there. Beth was, you know, heating up my meals and bringing them to me, like, and even she had to be. a little bit clandestine even though she was in the woman's rumble that night. So it was a weird day because I didn't come out of that room until about 10 minutes before

Starting point is 00:30:42 I was supposed to go out. And that's when I got up to guerrilla. And I think in the documentary, you start to see people going, what the hell is going? Oh, shit. Yeah. Yeah. How do the inner workings of that return compared to the surprise debut in A, So with AEW, it was easier in the fact that, like, it happened so quick.

Starting point is 00:31:11 So my contract was up with WWE. I want to say it was September 21st. That's when I started talking to Tony. It was September 22nd. And Russell Dream was October 1st. So it all happened. You got a week. Within like a week.

Starting point is 00:31:27 And so we got it. done. I flew out there with Tony. I got in the night before filmed the opening video with Darby and Jean-Carlo, who works with us, and we just guerrilla shot that thing at night in Seattle, but like there was nobody around where we were filming because Darby knows all the nooks and crannies. And then, you know, I'm sitting there and holding on to Jean Carlo at the back of an SUV while he's filming this muscle car being driven behind us through this thing like gum alley or whatever it's called. And I was just having such a blast because, you know, I was involved. I was like, this was the vision I had and I was helping create it instead of here's the vision,

Starting point is 00:32:19 go crazy with it and then seeing it after the fact. Like, it was fun, really fun to. be involved, you know, flying drones. Darby's out tagging roads running out in between traffic and tagging rated R on this road that we're flying a drone over while I'm driving across rated R. And then the Mariners just won. So fireworks are going off, serendipity. Like, it was, it was really, really fun. If you had both contracts in front of you in 2019 and you chose WWE, you know, fast forward a handful of years later, what made you choose AEW this time around? It felt like I'd done everything that I was going to do with WWE. I'd worked the people I'd wanted to work, you know, 95% anyway.

Starting point is 00:33:06 And it really just felt like they were on a direction and I was on a direction and they were kind of going in separate ways. You know, I wanted to be with this limited window that I have. I wanted to be involved. You know, I wanted to to be there kind of on a weekly basis in order to tell proper stories, in order to, you know what I mean? And it's tough to do that popping in and out every three months or so. And I also get the idea of, well, but that keeps it special. And I understand that.

Starting point is 00:33:42 But again, I'm working with such a limited time frame here that I got to go while I can go. and I looked at the roster and I just thought, man, so many people that I've never laid hands on and been in the ring with. You know, and the one that seems to blow people's mind is Samoa Joe. Like in all the years that him and I have both been wrestling, we've never touched. You know, and then I see Moxley and I see Claudio and Brian and I have never had a proper solo, you know, singles, swerve and hangman. And then if you look at the tag teams, FTR, young bucks, like Penta and Phoenix, and, man, that's just the tip of the iceberg, let alone all the young guys that have already wrestled since I've been there. It's just, it's really exciting. And almost feels, I don't want to say I feel like a kid again, because I think that sailed. But I'm just having fun. Like, even with each match, I'm like, I'm going to try something I've never tried before. I was against Brody King the other night. I've never done Blockbuster.

Starting point is 00:34:49 I'm going to try a Blockbuster. Why not? Never done a Davey Boy Power. It's like, eh, let me try that. You know, I just, it's fun to get out there and, and just try anything,

Starting point is 00:34:59 especially at this stage of the career. But I think in working new people and a whole roster of new people that, I don't know, it's just opened up my brain to all the different possibilities. You keep saying there's only a certain amount of time you can keep doing this for. You're clearly putting that expiry.

Starting point is 00:35:17 date in your career yourself. Yeah. Why are you giving yourself only another year and a half or two years? You know, I just, a lot of it will depend on how I feel, how the body's holding up. You know, I can't kid myself. I have a triple fusion of my neck. You know, and no one has come back to wrestle with a triple fusion on their neck. You move your neck pretty well, though.

Starting point is 00:35:41 I do. I do, you know, and, but I put a lot of work in. and, you know, I got iron neck over there. Oh, that's great. And, you know, so the work doesn't stop. And at a certain point, you know, I'm 50. You know, by the time I'm 52, I don't know, I might just be really tired and just ready to call it a day.

Starting point is 00:36:04 I don't ever want to get to the point where people, talent, look at a run sheet and go, okay, might be some work. I don't want to be that guy. You're going to get to a point when this contract is up where there's going to be a contract renewal. They're going to put one in front of you and you're going to have to make a decision. I mean, maybe.

Starting point is 00:36:25 You never know. Why not? I don't know. I mean, if I can keep performing at a level, but more importantly, a level that I can feel proud of. You know, I just don't want to get to a point where I'm like really struggling and just, it's like pulling teeth to get it done.

Starting point is 00:36:45 I don't want to do that. And thankfully, because of my career, I'm at a point where I don't have to do that. I'm doing this because I just, I love it. And I also think, and, you know, I've talked to the girls about this, and I'm hoping, you know, they see the work ethic and the work that I still put in to do this thing that I want to do, even though I don't have to do it. I'm hoping that they see that in. and rub off and they pick up some lessons from that too um but by the same token i want to be here

Starting point is 00:37:20 for everything for them and and i've been able to manage it and and be around for the shakespeare plays and be around to run drama club with beth and and take lyric to her audition tonight and you know i'm still able to be there for those things i haven't missed a birthday um so it's just a matter of being able to balance both so far as possible. This stuff you've done with Christian and AW has been so much fun. And the go-f-yourself moment, I'm sure you knew it would be a big moment, but my goodness, that became something way bigger than what it was. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:37:57 And looking back, like, I guess I was just used to not being able to do things like that. So suddenly there's that freedom, and it was like, oh, wait, what, we can let? He's going to say the F bomb on live TV. Huh. Okay. Knowing that eventually there's got to be the rebuttal. And that one, the button would be a little off. But yeah, I mean, it set the tone for what it needed to be.

Starting point is 00:38:25 And honestly, one of the major reasons on top of the roster was, you know, he's there. And we never got that single solo story that we wanted. You know, we had opportunities. with WWF, but we weren't the right place. You know, we weren't the performers that we needed to be to pull off what we would be proud of. It was fine, but it wasn't what we thought it could be. It really took being at this stage of our careers, having gone through everything

Starting point is 00:38:57 that we've gone through, becoming the performers that we've become mentally, to really feel like, okay, now is the time to do this. He's there. if I'm going to do this, I got to go there. And then, okay, let's do it and let's do it right. When you started having your singles runs individually, I mean, you were doing your own thing and then Christian went to TNA. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:39:25 Do you remember the conversations you had with him at that time when he started even talking about, like, I think I might go do this other thing? Honestly, he told me the day that he told everyone else. and he said, I'm going. I was like, whoa, okay. But I get it. I get it. You know, when when people put a limit on you and they won't really allow you to go past that limit, it's frustrating.

Starting point is 00:39:54 And he needed to. I think he really needed to just to show himself that he could. And I think that was part of the reasoning for going to AEW was, okay, I'm going to get an opportunity to do. what I know I can do over there. And as you can tell, he's totally done that and completely recreated himself. And it's fun to see him performing at a level that I always knew was there. It was just a matter of, again, the opportunity. Is he doing the best work of his career right now?

Starting point is 00:40:29 I think so. And that's only because I do feel like he was limited beforehand, you know, throughout the years, I think, again, you keep hitting a glass ceiling. And some will break through, but I don't think it was ever meant for him to break through. And that's got to be frustrating. I mean, the stuff with the dads. And I think that was a happy accident. I really, I think like so many things that end up working, it just ended up being a happy accident. And then you start to like go, oh, well, if this person would be that and that and that and I'm like, and I am a virgin territory for that, like, never met my dad. Are you kidding? Like, he's going to have a field day with this.

Starting point is 00:41:22 Your legacy was already well cemented in WWE. And I think that the way that things ended in WWE was so perfect, right? You're in Toronto celebrating 25 years, bang of a match with Seamus. What does this add on to your legacy now with what you're doing in AEW? You know, I think the legacy thing, I don't really buy into it. I think legacies are created by the people that make the videos packages and the people who book. And they decide whether you have a legacy or not. So I don't get wrapped up in it. You know, it's not like, it's not like I'm the New York Islanders in the early 80s where you're legitimately winning four Stanley Cups in a row.

Starting point is 00:42:03 That's a legacy. Okay. This is entertainment. You know. is there really a legacy? I personally don't look at it that way. I mean, of course there's a legacy. I don't buy it.

Starting point is 00:42:15 My legacy, to me, and this is how I look at it, am I raising good human beings? That's my legacy, not what I do in spandex. It's just so interesting that time we're in right now with wrestling, where there's a lot of WWE fans that just won't watch your current work. And vice versa, right? There's a lot of AEW fans that may not be familiar with what you did at WWE. as a performer when you're in there,

Starting point is 00:42:39 how do you react to the tribalism that's going on? I think silly personally. You know, only because when I was growing up, I wanted to watch everything I could. If I could get my eyeballs on Continental or Mid-South or NWA or BC All-Star or Internet, like I wanted to watch it all because I wanted to see what was going on, You know, at that stage, it was you, you got what you could get from the after magazines.

Starting point is 00:43:10 And that was it. Yeah. So, wait, now I can watch Porosin plus with Ed Whalen and maybe get a, you know, get my eyeballs on heading and lollar. Okay, right. I want to, I want to see what's going on. So I never, I don't know, I don't understand the, the allegiance to initials. But then I think about people with their feelings. favorite teams or this or that, but I've always been the same with like hockey. I love the Maple Leaf,

Starting point is 00:43:41 but I love hockey. So I'll watch the Boston Bruins against the Florida Panthers because I know it's going to be a great game. Yeah. Just the way I look at it. Yeah. I mean, you had this promo where you're basically like, you know, kind of like rallying up the audience, rallying up the, the, locker room, basically saying like, we've got a great thing here. Like, let's keep this going. Where did that come from? More than anything. It was like, I felt like our locker room, which is a pretty young locker room. I felt like they needed to hear it because there's so much negativity that gets thrown out there. And I know social media is a thing that I never really had to encounter before that these young talent have to.

Starting point is 00:44:26 They don't have to, but they do deal with it. And I would imagine that could be a little demoralizing. So being someone that's done this for as long as I've done it, I just thought it would be good for a locker room to hear like, no, it's a great thing. This company being around is an amazing thing. And also within the industry, if you ask, people are going to be happy that there's companies flourishing, not just one that has a monopoly. Even when I was with WWA, I always said, this is no good. There's no good for the industry to just be one place. And I still believe that.

Starting point is 00:45:05 I believed it all through the years that we were the only place. And I was world champion. I was like, one place is no good. You know, imagine just going to one restaurant for the rest of your life. You get pretty old. Yeah. Even if they've got a great menu. Sure.

Starting point is 00:45:21 Yeah. Sure. Eventually, you've hit everything on the menu. And it's like, okay. Well, maybe I feel like I'm Mexican tonight. Yeah. You know, I don't know. So I just, more than anything, to me, that was for the last.

Starting point is 00:45:33 locker room. Was that a you idea or was that a Tony idea? That was a me idea, just because start to see or hear, and I try not to pay too much attention. So admittedly, I'll just see little clips here and there. But even just in little clips, I'm like, man, we got to, we got to try and throw some positivity around because there's so much negative crap out there. And I do feel like it's it's a small outlier of fan base that that really gets wrapped up in that. They're very loud. Yeah, yeah. And then I also think like, man, if you're taking the time out of your day to just put that out in the world, then probably aren't that happy in your own life.

Starting point is 00:46:20 No. You know, and I'm very happy in my own life. Do you have the coolest entrance theme of all time? I mean, I'm biased, but I'd like to think so. Yeah, I mean, music has always been so important to me. I love music. I always have. You know, if my brain to finger could have allowed me to play guitar well, you know,

Starting point is 00:46:46 that would have been the second career choice, you know, because I wanted to be ace really, as well as, you know, wanting to be Hulk Hogan. So music has always been very, very fundamental to me in building whatever character I'm trying to portray. Because to me, it sets the tone, it sets the mood with the audience, it, I mean, that first note, and a crowd either comes up or they go, hmm, you know,

Starting point is 00:47:12 so for me it's always been very, very important. I've always been really hands-on with it. You know, probably to an annoying point, I've been very hands-on with everything, you know, whether it's my gear, whether it's my merchandise, whether it's the music, whether it's promo, stories, you know, I want to be in on it. Metalingas is chef's kiss.

Starting point is 00:47:34 I mean, and it was just, again, it was happenstance. I met Mark. I'd gone to a Metallica show at the Citrus Bowl, Summer Sanitarium tour, and I met Mark Tramonti's brother Michael at the concert. He goes, you know, I want to come to Marks? I was like, sure. So I get to Marx. He hands me a beer.

Starting point is 00:47:53 I drop it in his foyer. I'm like, right. Nice to meet you. I got a neck collar on. I'm just like, oh. So, but then, you know, throughout the night, he goes, hey, I got an album. I was like, okay, right. Let's hear it.

Starting point is 00:48:08 So it was with him singing with scratch vocals. And man, can I get track for when I come back? He was absolutely. Wow. And that was pretty miles singing on it. And the rest is kind of. to history to the point where when i was coming to a w i was like hey what you think you was just yeah it's wherever you go it goes with you wow yeah which is i'd like to think there's

Starting point is 00:48:35 certain talent that when you you hear a song or when you you just know it's that person like when i'd hear real american you know or i'd hear you know lOD's music when they came to wf or uh you know brets or you know, flares, you just knew, right? I wanted that kind of experience for a fan, where they knew. And then also the lyrics have kind of grown with me and become more important as the years have gone on with my actual story. So it actually, it means something to me. Fellas, do you want your grooming routine to be a one-and-done deal?

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Starting point is 00:50:55 just efficient, effective grooming, wherever you need it. In the week when you signed the AW contract before making your debut, did you have to track down the woman who says you think you know me and have her re-recorded as you think you know him? So it was actually, I got Beth to do it.

Starting point is 00:51:15 That's Beth's voice? That's the best voice, yeah. Is she the original voice? No. No, the original voice, it was some girl when we filmed the vignettes in New York City and I'm wearing a trench coat randomly attacking people for your original debut way way back wow so um I was like okay well how do I what do we do here we switch it up a little bit you think you know him okay that'll be fun and then I

Starting point is 00:51:40 just say hey Beth I think you should do it there's an extra layer of meaning yeah well so yeah it's Beth. I think we did it in here on our iPhone and then I sent it to Mike Bansuri and before you know it. Wow. Yeah. What is the backstory behind you think you know him or you think you know me? Honestly, that was when I first came in and I really had no idea how everything worked, you know, or how much voice I could have. So it was initially, we want you to be like Jim Morrison and you just recite poetry. And I was like, what? I don't get that at all. Like, what is that?

Starting point is 00:52:20 But they had this woman do the voiceover and essentially read the poetry that they wanted me to read. But when I read it, it just wasn't working. So that's really all there was to it. And then you think, you know, me was just something that was in there that they tacked on at the beginning. And what I really came to appreciate over the years is that was a female voice. because so often with wrestling, it's so, like, testosterone-fueled and so aggressive and almost masculine,

Starting point is 00:52:53 I love the fact that I had a feminine element to my entrance. I thought it added a different dynamic to my character than just kind of being a rar guy all the time, you know? And I really, really wanted to keep that. That, to me, was important. You know, it's a kick-ass, heavy song, but you have this kind of beautiful voice that leads into it. I thought that was, I always, you know, I always enjoyed that.

Starting point is 00:53:18 And I've always had like a good female fan base. And I think that might be part of the reason why, honestly. I think also, you know. Well, when the guy liners days, sure, but those days have flown. That's a great entrance and the brood entrance is so good. Yeah, I mean, been been very lucky with some great entrances over the years. And, you know, that brood music that coming up through the flames. And before we knew it, like, we didn't even realize we're all, like, kind of grooving to it and then bouncing to it.

Starting point is 00:53:48 We didn't know until we'd see it back and go, oh, okay, well, that's a pretty cool element that we just naturally all did. Then it was just a matter of not getting burned. Did you ever come close to getting burned? Yes. Yeah, like a bunch of melted jackets because I'm wearing PVC trench coats that I'd like get at hot topic, you know, and I'm like, as we're coming up and like, oh, they feel so hot. And then I'd get to the bag and be all bubbled. Gangrel said he stepped on it, burnt his foot? So it was coming up and he went to step off.

Starting point is 00:54:18 His foot got stuck between the elevator and the stage. Well, it's an elevator going up. So his foot's jammed in there and he's over top of the flames. Yeah. It was a little sketchy at times, you know, and then it was built for one person. Now you have three all crammed in there. And it's not like, you know, we're small men. It was interesting.

Starting point is 00:54:39 When you talked about coming back as brood, edge at WrestleMania. You know everyone was expecting to see gang grow. Yes. How close were we to get a man. I tried. I tried and I just got shut down. Every every person shut it down. Wow. Why? So and this isn't a knock on WWE, but I'd always get the, well, nobody remembers. Like people remember. Wrestling fans remember. And I think wrestling fans want to be rewarded for remembering. And that's a way to reward them. That's what I've always felt. You know, and I think, you know, you fast forward to me and Matt Cardona doing a cope open.

Starting point is 00:55:19 And his music hits and he comes out, I mean, they remembered. And so I've always been a fan of pulling in things from the past and, you know, kind of integrating them into current things. But yeah, that was one I just, I kept getting shut down. I realized, okay, that's not a hell to die on because it ain't going to happen. That would have been such a cool moment. I agree. I agree. But again, you know, it's not my sandbox.

Starting point is 00:55:47 So I just got to, you know, do what I can with what I'm given. Can we settle this once and for all? How tall was the ladder at WrestleMania 17 that you speared Jeff Hardy off? Because JR calls it a 20 foot ladder. Right. It's clearly not 20 feet tall. 12 or 15? I mean, if you're 6 foot 4, you're about halfway up the ladder.

Starting point is 00:56:10 when you go to climate. So 12 feet might make sense. Yeah. I think I'm like four rungs down, I think. And isn't each rung one foot? And there's 12 rungs on this? I mean, it probably felt very high. All I know is I was up there and I was like,

Starting point is 00:56:26 okay. You know, when you're up that high, the crowd still looks pretty tiny down there. You might have been 20 feet in the air. You know, the ladder on top of the ring. That's no idea. but I know no one had ever done it before. So, yeah.

Starting point is 00:56:43 And you hadn't even done it before, right? Because you can't. Could you practice it? I think we did it. We did it on Raw once when they decided that us on the ladder match on Raw was a good idea. And that was kind of the first time we ever did it. And I think, I think that predated that. I'm still not entirely sure.

Starting point is 00:57:00 Like I said, it's kind of where did it happen, when did it happen? But I remember doing it on Raw. And we hit it. but I landed like weird with a leg underneath me and really just trying to to make sure Jeff landed flat. So by the time we did that, I think we'd done it once at least, I think. Rhino tells this story of like the night before WrestleMania 17 and you guys were going over the match. And he's like, oh, what you got to do is Bubba will just grab the ladder as Jeff's, you know, on it. And he'll start hanging, which will give the momentum into the sphere.

Starting point is 00:57:37 That was the wonderful thing when you get so many different talent and so many different brains. And there was, you know, myself, Jay, Bubba, D, Matt, Jeff, Amy, Spike, Rito, Michael Hayes. So you got 10 brains, which can also be difficult because everybody has an idea of how they think that should go or what should go here, what should go there. But for the most part, we all would come to the same agreement usually. And if we didn't, it was only because we all really cared about this thing and wanted to make it the best we possibly could. And I think that happens with creatives, where like whether it's a director and an actor, whether it's a writer and a director, whatever it is. There's going to be times where you bump heads, but you always have the knowledge that it's just to try and put out the best product you can. And we want to steal the show.

Starting point is 00:58:31 there's been so many moments in your career that you can point to and go, that's a highlight, that's a highlight. Even if it's a promo, that's a highlight. Did you try things that you thought were going to be big? You thought would be moments and didn't work? I mean,

Starting point is 00:58:47 generally, for the most part, it kind of worked out the way I thought it would. That's fantastic. But the judgment day aspect, I knew it was going to be a bit of a struggle. And it was. but it was also a challenge because I'm like okay at this stage can I be a heel with the fan base

Starting point is 00:59:12 knowing the real story being retired for nine years working to get it back all of those things can you erase that from people's minds for this time frame and you know it was starting to maybe work but then Cody got hurt Randy got hurt. And I got to call and said, well, we got to flip you. You're a baby face now. And it was at hell in a cell, I think. There's Ria, priest and I. And that was the first time where I was like, okay, they're starting to think they're starting to come around. And then the next night, we split it up. So, but I also understood like, okay, it's baby faces are depleted. You know, I'm the utility batter, you know, where you just felt like it needed more.

Starting point is 01:00:02 time it did it did because it was very abrupt you know and then also in looking back you had me trying to turn heel on a j who had just turned baby face should have just let us be double baby face and let us do our thing yeah and then from there then if i lost at rasselmania now we can start to do the turn and now it can make a little more sense instead of feeling so abrupt but you know you get your marching orders and you go okay let's let's make it work just off camera, but it's WrestleMania 24 behind you. You've got Undertaker's gloves and there's an inscription on there. What does the inscription say?

Starting point is 01:00:43 I think it's, you're the man, I think. And he has my kickpads. You know, we had a lot of fun working each other. There was a lot of trust, which, you know, to get Mark's trust, because he was the undisputed locker room leader, you know, and to get him to trust you and know that what you're trying to do

Starting point is 01:01:10 is for the betterment of the company, for the match, for the story, all of those things. That's big, right? And then, you know, to get the main event, WrestleMania,

Starting point is 01:01:20 and then to get the main event, WrestleMania with him, with the streak on the line, you know, and I'm coming out last. A lot, a lot of really, really big moments that I got to check off at RestMania 24.

Starting point is 01:01:38 And that's also, a lot of people may not remember this. That was supposed to be Flair's retirement match that night. Yeah. And you're on, I think it was four matches later. Yeah. That's a heck of a match to follow. Yeah. Sean and Flair.

Starting point is 01:01:51 I purposely, I didn't watch the show. I just stayed in my locker room and just from my tent because we're all in tents. And I could just smell that Snoop Dog was around somewhere and really just focused on what I needed to do that night, which was going to be a completely different story. And two performers at different stages of their career than what those two were. So I couldn't worry about that. I just had to focus on, okay, we're on last. There's a reason. How does that WrestleMania match, that WrestleMania moment, compare to a few years earlier, that incredible match with Nick Foley?

Starting point is 01:02:30 The one with Mick, I had a giant chip on my shoulder, you know, because I felt like I was being, at least in my mind, kind of pushed back from the main event scene. And I felt like finally I'd earned my stripes in my spot there. So that was a chance for me to kind of show everybody that's where I belong. And I knew Mick was the perfect person to help make that kind of fruition. And we both had agendas that night. Mine was I really wanted Mick Foley to get a WrestleMania moment. That was true. I felt like he deserved that, and he'd be the first to say that he hadn't had that.

Starting point is 01:03:15 So that was important for me. And when I have a mission to accomplish, I work better. And his mission was to solidify me as a main event guy, and also to solidify me as someone that people might. start looking at in a different light like oh he is tough oh he like even through all those tlc's and ladders it was still like oh you know long long blonde hair you know all those things and um so it felt like we both needed something out of that when you get two maniacs both working toward goals um some brutal things can happen uh so the the the tone the mood was far different

Starting point is 01:03:58 than it was with with taker was the flaming table always part of the plan? It was part of my plan. And I've always said this. If you see something stupid that I do, chances are it was my idea, whether it's the A off of the ladder through two tables, whether it's the flaming table, whether it's chances are it was my stupidity. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:04:25 I don't even have like a good answer as to why. I mean, obviously I'm a masochist on some level, but I think every pro wrestler is. But that's not something you can plan for. Like that's something you can rehearse. Well, so. Yeah, you don't rehearse that at all. And like to the point where I didn't even fully dawn on me until I was running toward the flames, I was like, I don't have a shirt on. And I'm diving face first into this thing.

Starting point is 01:04:58 You know, Mick's got three layers on. He's going through back first. I mean, that sucks too. Don't get me wrong. But it wasn't until like I was making that leap. I was like, oh, man, I've just got to bury my head into Mick here and hope for the best. You know, and still burned my arm, you know, burned a bunch of hair off, burn my knuckles. It just, you know, all I could smell was like burnt hair.

Starting point is 01:05:21 And then as I'm crawling over, I looked at my arm was bubbling. All right. Not the wisest choice. But again, at that stage of my life, I was all about like, that was it. It was that job and it was getting to the top of that job. And yeah, yeah, that's usually when you're really hungry like that. That's when you can catch lightning in a bottle sometimes. There's a moment where you're on the receiving end of a big move, a big moment.

Starting point is 01:05:51 It's the cage match with Matt Hardy and there's the leg drop onto you. And I don't know how you can prepare for that one either. like I know how much that hurt Matt. He said he couldn't walk right for weeks after that. How do I mean, he's way up there and you've got to hope that he's going to land it, right? Well,

Starting point is 01:06:10 and even with everything that him and I had been through, that was never a doubt in my mind. You know, we'd all worked each other so much. And we all had just natural chemistry with each other. And your pros, you know, so you just,

Starting point is 01:06:26 you got to have a lot of faith in a person. You got to have a lot of trust in a person. and generally speaking, those moves are usually worse on the person doing them. Yeah. You just got to lie there and just, okay. There was so much emotion leading into that program with Matt, with everything that had gone on in your professional or your personal life. I remember ordering that pay-per-view and being like,

Starting point is 01:06:50 Matt Hardy's going to kill this guy. Like, Matt Hardy might actually, like, we might witness a murder. Yeah. Television. How did you put that aside? and just work. Well, you know, we're here, right? Okay.

Starting point is 01:07:04 So how do we try and pull some positives out of a lousy situation? And a lousy situation that I made the bed, right? And that was really all you can do. It's like, okay, we're here now. Let's try and, you know, and also the companies wants to run with this. Well, let's try and make a good story out of this, a good program. out of this. Let's try and make some money out of this. Because at that stage, what else are you going to do? So that's really what it boiled down to is like, okay, right, put the personal aside and

Starting point is 01:07:41 try and make some business out of this. And hopefully, hopefully on the tail end of it, we can both come out of it better in a perfect world. That doesn't always end up being the case, though. How long did it take till you were good again with Matt? I mean, honestly, it wasn't that long. I think kind of once we went through that, and once we both realized, oh, okay, still the same guys, and still have the same chemistry, still have the same everything. So, you know, I feel like the fan base took a lot longer to come around to the idea that we were okay than we did. It was pretty quickly. And then you just got to move on. And then you fast forward and then you're in a new relationship with Beth and then it ends up, you know, look at the life you have now.

Starting point is 01:08:31 That I feel like for fans makes it go, oh, okay. Like, yeah, this is a different thing now. Sure. And I mean, I'd like to think that everybody at a certain point can look back and go, man, I dropped the ball there. Everybody's made mistakes. And mine just ended up happening on national television. What was your first date with Beth? Um, so we, we had, uh, it was, it was edge appreciation night in Toronto. Um, and it was,

Starting point is 01:08:59 it was kind of like, this is your life. And it was, I was almost embarrassed out there. But earlier on the day, we had sort of talking, but, and we had talked before, but we actually sat down and had a really nice conversation, just randomly, you know, sitting at ringside. And then I started realizing how many similarities that we had. She had trained in Toronto and she had trained with Ron Hutchison and wrestled the same dive bars in Parkdale that I wrestled in. I had no idea of that. She just did it seven years after me. And there's a seven year age gap. So we started talking and then I reached out to Natty. I was like, what's like I didn't know Beth was that. You know, what's her deal?

Starting point is 01:09:45 And that was really the start of it. And then she was still on the road. So we just end up talking like half the night. And then she came up here one day and then we hit it off and kind of the rest of history. And then fast forward, gosh, 13 years later, whatever it is, two kids. Yeah, a lot of life in that time. Did she feel in her heart of hearts that you could return to wrestling? No, no, I really don't think until I got that final go ahead from her room.

Starting point is 01:10:25 Because she was there for the surgery, because she was there for all over the prognosis. And we both had to wrap her mind around the idea like, no, this is done. And then also, like I said, she was there when we would go out and for two hours, get flat. You know, like all of that. So she was there for every bit of that. So she didn't think it was a possibility until I think she saw my mental shift. I went, uh-oh, I think he's going to try this. And I don't think there's anything that's really going to stop him.

Starting point is 01:11:02 But with that being said, no way I'm doing it unless she signs off. Yeah. And unless she feels comfortable with it because I'm a father and I'm her husband. and I, you know, I got to be there, you know. So if there were any doubt, if there were any lingering, is this, you know, she wouldn't have signed off and I wouldn't, I just wouldn't. I think your biggest strength is your mindset. Like you're, you have this mindset of like when you set your mind to something, you do it.

Starting point is 01:11:30 But for whatever, I, I think that is probably my, my strongest asset, too. You know, I just, I always feel like you can work toward what you want to work toward. and you can get bogged down with all of the negatives because they're always there, or you can focus on the positives because they're also always there. And I'll use those positives to help get done what I want to get done, instead of getting bogged down with, you know, the negative, I guess. So I got to tell you this story. In high school, I was the vice president of my student council,

Starting point is 01:12:02 which meant I would host fashion shows and I would host talent shows. I just loved having a mic in my hand, which has led to what I got to do now for a living. Now you don't have to hold them. That's right. Look at me. We have stands now. Moving on up. So I was such a big wrestling fan.

Starting point is 01:12:18 My best friend of the time, Mark was as well. I remember we were hosting a talent show and we got everyone to take their cameras out and we stole your line. We said, for the benefit of those with flash photography, we got everyone to take a photo of us on stage hosting a fashion show or talent show. Where did that come from? So that was a lot of what you saw Jay and I do with that. It was me, Jay and Brian Gorts, just sitting down and having a similar comedic sensibility and really just throwing stuff at the wall to see what would stick. And if the three of us laughed, we'd go, let's give a shot.

Starting point is 01:12:58 Again, our sense of humor is a little different. And if you watch The Edge and Christian show The Tolleryks of Austin us years later, you start to realize where are, oh, SCTV, I guess, maybe a little kids in the halls. So, Bonte Python. Great Canadian reference. Yeah, I like that. Right. But Brian was very, very similar to us in that regard.

Starting point is 01:13:20 So we, again, we just sit down. If it made the three of us laugh, we'd try it. And that was one of the things we came up with because the start of it was, I don't think we should come through the crowd. If we're heels now, hey, who knows what somebody's going to do? You know, you might catch a left and what just happened, you know? So there was the safety aspect, but also, like,

Starting point is 01:13:48 it just felt like we're not of the people anymore. We think we're above that. So how would we show that? And that was really the genesis of that. It was just, okay, but we'll still, because, okay, we get it. still give you an opportunity to get a photo of us. And then it turned into, okay, how can we rag on the local sports team? How can we, you know, just have some fun that way?

Starting point is 01:14:15 And then it just took on a life of its own. Playing entrance themes on the kazoo was one of my favorite things ever. Yeah. Again, just stupidity. And basically creating our own vocabulary, like, suckitude and, you know, tool shed or do what? I mean, jump stane. Ramification, ramma percussion.

Starting point is 01:14:37 Ramap percussion. Ramap percussion. There's a lot of that stuff where we'd just be on commentary and it would fall out. I just said it. But we had so much fun. That's probably the most fun that I had in WWF. I think you're also part of the most unintentionally funny moment in WWE history when Ray Mysterio is doing the pull-ups behind you guys.

Starting point is 01:15:03 Yeah, which, you know, didn't see the light a day until I guess they aired, you know, erred it at some point. And I mean, man, I just, and the way he went down with it. Like he didn't try and stuff. He was just like, oh, boy, here we go. You know, and he kind of in slow motion goes down. There was, I couldn't hold it, you know. And then I think, what's Sina say? Like, golly G or something.

Starting point is 01:15:32 I had like something so, so like howdy duty. I just would like, so you throw that on top and it was just comedy of errors. It's hanging behind you, but I know that you don't like the rated R spinner belt. I just, I don't know. Again, I think for me, I come from that, that, that timeframe where the designs meant something, you know, and I just, I understood the, you know, the commercial appeal. but I feel like that was truly done just to sell titles. And it worked. And it worked.

Starting point is 01:16:09 But I don't know. I just, as a World Heavyweight champion, you walk out and something's spinning on you, it just didn't, I don't know. To me, it just didn't fit.

Starting point is 01:16:17 You would create a drone design. Yeah. And when you presented that design to them, what was their? They said, well, we got another idea. And it was that.

Starting point is 01:16:28 Well, what are you going to do? Then you're like, but I don't like this. So, again, not my sandbox, right? So you just go, okay, well, cool. I still have, you know, an edge championship. And I think Rocky and Steve and John were the only three at that point.

Starting point is 01:16:48 So yeah, still pretty damn cool. Do you know what the one piece of merchandise that you've made the most residuals off of is? No idea. It might be that. It might be. Maybe it's a T-shirt, I don't know. I don't know. I mean, there's so many.

Starting point is 01:17:00 You have so much merch. There's a lot of stuff out. You know, when I saw bed sheets at one point, really? Like, what kid is buying edge bedsheets? I mean, what kid isn't? Come on. I was the heel at the time and everything. I'm like, nobody's buying this or like box or shorts.

Starting point is 01:17:17 Like, come on. But, sure. Yeah. Were you surprised that WWE hadn't trademarked right at our superstar? They had tried, but you, it's, it's, you can't trademark. because the Motion Picture Association owns it. Oh, wow. So I can use it.

Starting point is 01:17:36 Yeah. But we can't, we can't trademark, can't copyright it. So that I thought, well, that's great because that can come with me wherever I go. And I love that nickname. You know, even if my character isn't portraying those things, to me, it doesn't matter. Like, macho man's always going to be macho man, no matter what he's doing, right? Yeah. To me, the radar of superstars, that same thing.

Starting point is 01:18:00 And it just rolls off the tongue and it just, you know, when I started having people come up to me and say, hey, right, it are. I'm like, okay, it hit. Yeah. Okay, people now equate me with that. And the way Tony Chimwell announced it. Yes. Also added another layer to it. Absolutely.

Starting point is 01:18:18 When you heard that for the first time with the voice cracker. Well, so I was busting his chops, right? Because John and I are working every night, right? And be, you know, World Heavy Champion, egg. And then John would come in a year, John, and like just a giant ball of phlegm for this John. And I looked at him,

Starting point is 01:18:38 I went, seriously, man, give me a little treatment. I want to hear it. And that was it. That was the voice cracking. And then it just became a thing. So the voice crack was intentional? No.

Starting point is 01:18:52 Oh, no. It happened by accident. You know, every once in a while, the voice would crack. And I would, I loved it. it was hilarious. And then the fan base, you know, picked up on it. And they would start to say it too.

Starting point is 01:19:05 And it just became its own thing, another happy accident, right? It felt like he should have been there for that final match in Toronto and WWA. Yeah. Yeah. You know, and we threaten we're going to do it at some point here. And we will. We will at some point. Does Tony know this?

Starting point is 01:19:21 Yeah. He's ready to go? He's ready. He's ready. Yeah. He's waiting. It's like, so what about? Yeah.

Starting point is 01:19:27 Not yet. Well, what about now? not yet. When you look back on everything and the injuries you sustained and triple neck fusion, would you have worked in a different style? If you could go back to the start of your career and give that version of Adam some advice. Well, you know, when I started, the climate in the era that I started, it was different. You know, it was, you know, there was, like, everybody was massive. you know, it was just giant human beings doing this. All right.

Starting point is 01:19:59 And I'm six, four, I'm two 30, right? Okay. So I was kind of considered kind of in between or maybe a small guy, right? So I had to figure out what it was going to do to get noticed. What did we have to do? What did I have to do? I didn't feel comfortable on microphone. All right.

Starting point is 01:20:17 So that's going against me. What do I got here? And I thought, okay, well, if I, I always kind of looked at my style similar to Barry Windham's. And I just thought, okay, well, I can do some different things that maybe guys are going to be doing. And is that the style of a main eventor? No. But I'm not going to be a main eventer unless I kind of kick open the door.

Starting point is 01:20:45 And then we found the Hardee's. They found us. And we knew that we would bring something that nobody else was going to be bringing. And with the first tag team ladder match, we had a blank canvas to create whatever we wanted. And it felt like, okay, there's our foot in the door. And then when I went solo, I realized that I needed to change my style and I needed to make it uglier. And I needed to, I still needed to be the guy, though, that took some crazy bumps, you know, especially when I turned heel because that's part of the gig.

Starting point is 01:21:22 That's part of the job. I don't think I'd take it back. But, you know, it'd be interesting if I started my career now, because now I'd be one of the bigger guys. So maybe I could take less risks and maybe just be more of the catch. I don't know. The ladder matches with, you know, the Hardys. Yeah, that gets you, that gets you the foot in the door, like you said.

Starting point is 01:21:46 But what's the moment for you that makes you the main eventer? Honestly, I feel like the match with Mick. I feel like that's the one that kind of solidified. Oh, he's not going anywhere. Right. I think that was the one. You know, I think that if there was any doubt going into that one, because I had that little taste of it and they saw that it could work, but they had their plans.

Starting point is 01:22:14 And that to me was, okay, now we got another guy. And then you fast forward throughout the years, and I became one of their go-tees. is if, okay, well, we can give it to him and everything should be okay. And that's a great place to be coming from because, you know, you can be dependent on as one of the, one of the soldiers that's going to pull a cart. When you look ahead to whenever the end of your career ends up being, it's got to be Christian for the final match, right? Man, there's so many people, you know, it's like, gosh, you know, or is it him and I teaming against an FTR or a young bucks? Or is it Kenny Omega? Or, you know, or is it Kenny Omega? Or, you know,

Starting point is 01:22:52 is it Will Osprey or is it John Moxley like there's a lot of different opportunities um you know and also who might get the best boost out of you know I have to look at that too this could be a whole storyline it could who retired Adam Cople yeah you could you know and and when I retire this time that's it you know I'm there's no there's no coming back I won't be of an age that I could come back you know it's I when I retire this time I truly I'm I'm going to to come home and be dad and occasionally act and walk my dogs. There's still going to be rumors, though. Yeah, yeah, I guess that's, well, plus every year the Royal Rumble comes around.

Starting point is 01:23:38 Do wrestlers ever really retire? Right. And I always told myself, well, I am that guy until, again, fast forward and wait, it's possible. I got to give it a shot then. You know, there's the challenge of that. I got that out of my system with this because I did it. I fought to get this back. I got it back.

Starting point is 01:24:00 Now I can end it on my terms instead of being told how it's going to end. That was big to me. And that was part of the reasoning for making this happen was, okay, I want to be the one that calls that. I don't want to be told that. Yeah. You have a date in mind? I don't. I don't. I think I have about a year and a half left right now. A lot of business trying to get done in that time. A lot of people I want to work in that time. And, you know, I look at it already. And I think in the six months I've been there, I think I'm close to 20 matches already.

Starting point is 01:24:37 And I think in my entire time with WWVE on this last one, I think like 27 or 28. So I'm getting some stuff in and challenging myself. If I look at this and it's like I worked Suzup, Minora Suzuki, word Penta, we're Griff Garrison, like Daniel Garcia, Lee Moriarty, obviously the run with Christian. Like it's been all over the place, which is really fun, really, really fun and challenging. And again, challenges. That's what gets me up in the morning. is there like is there something you go back to i mean what a career it's been is there something

Starting point is 01:25:16 you go back to of like if it wasn't for this then this doesn't happen and if it isn't for this then this doesn't happen i i don't i don't put that much thought into it you know i really just kind of once it's done it's done it's it's in the rear view and and you know i want what's happening right now that's what wrestling kind of has to be because if you're you're not you're not you're not living in the right now, you're going to get hurt. And it kind of forces you. I think any, you know, whether you're a loser, whether you're like a downhill ski jumper, I don't know. Like if you're not in the moment, things could go really, really wrong. Now, it's not to say that I don't have ideas going forward, but the ones in the past, I just, we're dumb. You know, I have what's a sense

Starting point is 01:26:05 of dwelling on them, you know? It's the same with a role on a TV show. I'll watch it back once. Okay. What's the next one? You may be the first W.W.E Hall of Fame where I've met that doesn't wear the ring. Yeah. I mean, wearing the wedding ring makes sense. Yeah. I'm not much of a jewelry guy, you know, and Beth keeps track of it for me. What's the inscription on the inside of your Hall of Fame ring say? Because I think you can put whatever you want on the inside, right?

Starting point is 01:26:35 I don't know. Wow. I don't know. I think I've looked at it a couple times. but I don't know. I don't know. And it's an honor. You know, don't get me wrong.

Starting point is 01:26:45 You know, I complete, you know, it's awesome. And it's amazing that they thought of me in that regard. And it's pretty cool to be able to say, but I don't, I don't, I don't know. I don't know. I just, I don't really put a lot of energy into that kind of stuff. What's the biggest thing you think you miss from Canada? There's two Canadians hanging out here and these United States. Let's see.

Starting point is 01:27:12 I always say Swiss chalet. Swiss chalet is pretty big. Harvey's. Harvey's. I love chalet sauce. The chalet sauce. And, yeah, I mean, Tim Hortons. Oh, of course.

Starting point is 01:27:26 Yeah, you know, Timmy's double, double. Nobody knows what we're talking about unless you're from Canada. And it's two cream, two sugar. Yeah, double, double. Every time I go back, Jack Aster's. Jack Aster's. Boston pizza. Oh, Boston pizza.

Starting point is 01:27:43 Boston pizza in Canada. But, I mean, I guess more than anything, it's just, it's just a feeling. Yes. You know, when I, when I land in Canada, I still feel like I'm home. Yeah. And this is home. But I think, I don't know if you're an American and you live in Argentina. Sure.

Starting point is 01:28:00 Probably still call yourself an American. Yeah. And I still consider myself a Canadian. I always will. Anytime I go to a sporting event and they're playing a Canadian team and they sing the national anthem, they sing a national anthem. They sing okay and I'm like, oh, I don't hear that that often anymore. Like it means a little bit more.

Starting point is 01:28:15 And I think it means more as you age too. And you start to understand the importance of certain things and how it connects with you and how you connect to it and how all of those, the blueprint of where you grew up is ingrained in you and the sensibilities. And just like I remember my some of my first memories were watching the leaf with my uncles and my grandfather in the basement. And so when I watch hockey now, it kind of brings me back to that place. And then I'll watch the Canadian feed because my buddy Mike is the voice of hockey night in Canada.

Starting point is 01:28:52 And I want to see Ron McLean. Yeah. And Kevin BX and Kelly Rudy and Elliot Friedman and hear those voices. And we just lost Bob Cole. Bob Cole was the soundtrack to my childhood along with, you know, mean Gene and Jesse Ventura. Yeah, yeah. There's something about those moments, right? Like, all the time I talk about being at WrestleMania 18, seeing Rock Hogan, you were there,

Starting point is 01:29:18 WrestleMania 6. Yeah. Yeah, in Toronto. And then fast forward all these years, your main eventing WrestleMania. Like, there's something about being able to, like, when it zooms out to that wide shot, you can go, that's the section of a city. Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Starting point is 01:29:31 That day, I remember looking down at where I sat for WrestleMania 6 and going, huh, wow, 12 years later. Wow. Not bad at them. It's pretty cool. So I have moments like that still, you know, or now with AEW, it's usually when I get in there with somebody like a young guy and I just, I can feel their tension, you know, and understand where they're coming from. Because if I got in with a, you know, I don't know, Rick Martel or a bad news brown, I'd always be like, oh, those first couple of times, that'd be a little tense. and like, I want them to think I'm good or I'm okay at this.

Starting point is 01:30:11 And that's really fun to get in there and also see a young talent's eyes start to like, oh, oh, wow. That to me is just that that's part of the joy of this is helping a younger talent. And it doesn't even necessarily need to be a younger talent. You know, it could be somebody who's been around a little bit, but they still experience something different when they're in there with you. That's super cool to me. You're also wrestling people who might have been in diapers when you started your career.

Starting point is 01:30:42 Yes. Thank you for that reminder. I mean that in the kindest way. No, you know, over the years, I'd have guys come out to the airport and they go, man, I grew up watching. I'm like, how old are you? Like, I'm 33. I'm like, well, I'm 33. So did you really grow up watching me?

Starting point is 01:30:59 But then I had to start accepting that fact. And what was really strange this year, as I started having teenage girls come up to me again. I was like, what is it going on until it was like, are you Aries? And I was like, oh, oh, oh, yeah, I played Aries, right. It's a whole different fan base that it has, you know, and I've had grandparents and full families come up and go, we watched it together.

Starting point is 01:31:27 And so that took a little bit of getting used to again because it hadn't been since like the late 90s when I'd have teenage girls come up and say, are you um so yeah yeah that's that's been uh that's been fun too this has been fun and thank you so much for making the time yeah and for inviting us here to your beautiful house and inviting us in here i end every conversation talking about gratitude because it's such an important part of my life what are three things in your life adam that you're grateful for as we sit here right now my family um you know healthy girls uh and then that my marriage so those those all go together uh my mom and how she raised me and and um what she instilled me and

Starting point is 01:32:15 and what i saw her do to make sure that i could chase what i wanted to chase and and was always supportive of it and and in turn instilled in me that if my girls want to try this that and the other i'm going to support them how can i not after doing what i did and had that support um And my friendships, you know, and how supportive my friends have been of this whole path that I've chosen. Just so happens that my best friend is also doing it too. And I think we've helped keep each other sane over the years in a lot of insane instances and climates. So I think, I guess more than anything is just the relationships. And it's the relationships that I have in AEW.

Starting point is 01:33:11 It's the relationships that I have in WWE. The support system. I love that. Because you don't do it unless you got a good support system. So we started the interview talking about it, but this is one of your secret weapons, pure plank. That code CVV will save you a few dollars on it. But this has been one of your secret weapons to look like this when your age begins with a five.

Starting point is 01:33:32 Yes. Impressive. You're a better shape than I am. I just hit 40 last year. used a 50 last year. Yeah. I would aspire to look like this when I'm 50. Yeah, it's, you know, it's just

Starting point is 01:33:43 keep moving, right? As long as you keep moving, then, then I don't cease up. When I stop moving, that's one body goes, hey. Motion is lotion. Yes. That's what they say.

Starting point is 01:33:53 Yes. I've heard that quite a few times. I've said it quite a few times over the years, especially through my 40s and now into my 50s. Just keep moving and keep finding those things that inspire you. Because just because you're 50 doesn't mean that those things run out. It's just new things. It's just different things.

Starting point is 01:34:09 Hence, AEDW. With the amazing career you've had, just, like, thank you for still being who you are. Like, thank you for, at the end of the day, at your core, still just being a good Canadian boy. I mean, you know, I, again, back to my mom, right? I was taught, have manners and work hard. And I tell the girls the same thing. If you got manners and you work hard, you know, blow the doors off the world. You really can.

Starting point is 01:34:37 and leave a good track record behind you, you know, and there's going to be mistakes. You're going to fall flat in your face. I certainly have. But you pick yourself up, right, okay, I learned something. And if you put that in your bat utility belt going forward, you should be okay. Thank you.

Starting point is 01:34:56 This is great. Thank you. Thank you so much. I appreciate it. Jim Rome takes on sports. Why? Because I have a job to do. With rapid fire takes.

Starting point is 01:35:18 So I don't want to hear from you, Lava Pig. on this notion today. No idea what you're talking about. You're complaining more than you like to breathe air. It's like you get up in the morning only to complain and cry and moan on social media about things that you don't even understand. He's the spitfire of sports smack.

Starting point is 01:35:36 Take advantage of it, but get up in here. The Jim Rome Show podcast. What's your beef? Follow and listen on your favorite platform. You've been warned.

Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Edge's Impossible Royal Rumble Return, Christian Cage, Leaving WWE For AEW, WrestleMania Moments (Interview From May 2024)

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