Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Impact Wrestling's Moose on Why He Left The NFL to Pursue His Pro Wrestling Dream

Episode Date: October 18, 2021

Today's guest is Quinn Ojinnaka better known to wrestling fans as Moose. Moose is a former NFL player and a current professional wrestler signed to IMPACT Wrestling. He joins Chris Van Vliet to talk about getting drafted to the NFL, playing 7 seasons with the Atlanta Falcons, New England Patriots, St. Louis Rams and Indianapolis Colts, pursuing his dream to become a professional wrestler after his football career, how he was given the nickname "Moose" from teammate Michael Vick, starting from the bottom in the wrestling industry, making a name for himself in Ring of Honor, becoming one of the biggest names on the IMPACT Wrestling roster, bringing back the TNA World Heavyweight Championship and more! If you enjoyed this episode, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast/iTunes? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests.  For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://chrisvanvliet.com Follow CVV on social media: Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

All systems are good. Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Bleas! All right, here we go, my friends. Welcome back to another audio adventure here on Insight. How are you? How is the weekend? I'm Chris Van Fleet. It's so good to have you back with us for another episode.

And if it happens to be your first time here, please make sure to hit subscribe so you don't miss out on anything that we have coming up for you. Impact Wrestling star Moose has such a different character. in the ring than he does outside of the ring. And it was so great to be able to dive deep into his story about him growing up in a rough neighborhood, then getting a scholarship to Syracuse University to play football, then getting drafted in the fifth round to the NFL, then playing seven seasons in the league before finally leaving to pursue his real dream of becoming a pro wrestler.

It's an amazing story that I'm sure is going to inspire you. You can find him on social media. He's at the Moose Nation on Twitter, and he's at Moose Nation 69 on Instagram. And don't worry, yeah, we find out why he's called Moose. And if you're not following me already, I'm just at Chris Famfleet. Nelly Fresh, 1994 is our fan of the week. He says, love this podcast. It really is the best podcast around.

My girlfriend gets jealous sometimes because I listen to you more than I listen to her. keep up the phenomenal work. You really know how to listen and talk to your guest. You definitely got me thinking about starting one myself. Well, you should start one yourself. Nellie Fresh, thank you so much for taking the time to leave a review. And I always say this. Instead of like talking about starting a podcast,

instead of dreaming about, instead of like spending weeks and weeks and weeks figuring out the right name and the right equipment, just start. Just hit record, start, and put it out there. and you'll be so much further ahead if you do that. And by the way, leave a review on Apple Podcasts for your chance to hear it read out on the show. I read one out on every single episode.

Okay, let's do it. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome Moose. Moose, so good to see you again. What are we eating here, by the way? I have some skinny props. Well, you are the opposite of skinny these days. But I saw you last. It was about a month ago.

I'm like, man, you've gotten huge. And you're like, no, everyone keeps saying that to me. I'm not huge. I've lost all this weight. I remember that. I was like, yeah, I've lost like 50 pounds, but everybody keeps saying I'm huge. Well, your, like, your body fat is definitely in the single digits now.

Like, you're looking more jacked than ever. Yeah, that's, I honestly, I need to find a place that could, where I can get my body fat track. Because I really want to know everybody else, like the guy that helps me. me, all AJ Sims, the buddy in my eyes. I was like, hey, what you think my body about it is? Just by looking at me, he'll be like, between 8 to 10. But we don't know.

He's just going by looking at me. Right. It's not really any valid source of checking what it is, you know. I know when you look at that guy's Instagram, and I think we should give him a shout out. It's a cement factory? Shout out to cement factory. Jay Sins because without him I wouldn't look and be where I am right now.

And I mean, all of the guys that he's gotten into incredible shape, we're talking like EC3 and Drake Maverick and Jackson Riker, Apollo Cruz. Cruz, yeah. I mean, he knows this stuff, man. He literally knows this stuff. I mean, I remember when I first started. And it could get very addictive, too, because. It's like one of those things like when you're trying to lose weight on getting in shape.

Like a lot of times, like it's very, very, very hard because of what he has you eat. But the diet he has is on is like you eat a lot actually. It's like obviously you're not eating a burger on fries and pizza and all that. But it's actually healthy food, but you're actually eating a lot of it because you have to eat like five days. Yeah. Do you have your TV on, by the way? Could you turn your TV off? Oh, yeah, I'm sorry.

Oh, no, it's okay. I'm sure whatever you're watching is great. Maybe you're scouting for your Bound for Glory match right now. Barely, like, it's weird. I'm such a weird because all I watch on TV is sports channels. So, like, for instance, my TV will be on FS1 or ESPN literally all day. And I watch all the talk show sports channels. Like, because honestly, I always saw my wife, I was like, man, this is something I want, I kind of want to do.

I kind of want to have my own sports show and debate for people all day because I'm really big in the sports. Well, I mean, maybe after your wrestling career, maybe that's what you'd end up doing. Yeah, maybe we'll see. And maybe, you know, maybe sometime in 10 or 20 years, that's your new job. Yeah. I'll bring you on a little debate about some sports. Okay, it's done. Are you a big sports guy?

I am, big sports guy. I mean, obviously didn't play it at the level that you did, but grew up playing baseball, hockey, of course, because I grew up in Canada. I was an amateur wrestler. I played a ton of sports. What's your go-to sport? To watch, now it's football.

Football, oh. And I am a Browns fan, which up until about last season was super embarrassing to admit. Yeah, I mean, they went to the playoffs last year. Like, I mean, that's good. I mean, I think they're, where they're two and two this year, maybe, two and three. I think they're three and two now, yeah.

It's kind of weird because I don't watch, really watch a lot of football. Oh, so what's your go-to sport now? When big basketball, guys. Actually, I'll take it back. I'm not really a Lakers fan. I'm a big Westbrook fan. So whatever thing he goes to is who I generally follow.

Yeah, fair enough. Did playing football make you not like football as much? No, I never was. a big football guy. Like, even playing, I never really was a football guy. It was just one thing that I luckily was good at. But as a kid, I, it's funny story. It's like, when I got drafted by the Falcons in 2006,

I remember the first day of the building, I ran into Warren Dunn. And stupid me, I didn't even know who Warwick Dunn was. I didn't watch football. I remember meeting my meeting. I was like, hey, my name is Quinojanaika. What's yours? He probably looked at me like,

you're freaking serious? I'm freaking work done. It's like, that's kind of, and for the people who don't know who are done, that's kind of like meeting, who would you say, sting. And not know who sting is.

It's like, hey, my name is so-and-so. What's yours? And it's like, I'm freaking sting. That's equivalent to meeting the war done. You know, so I didn't watch football at all. Like, I mean, I just luckily was good at it. Did basketball ever cross into your world is something you thought you might have played?

Yeah, I actually played. I remember me and a couple of my friends. We tried out for our varsity team in basketball. I want to say it was a sophomore junior year. I remember the coach, we getting cut like the second day. And the coach telling me, like, maybe he wanted to stick to football, like, you know what I'm saying? It's just one of those things like this, sports, because it was a way to hang out with my friends.

I came from a strict parenting background where my mom, we lived in a kind of like a rough neighborhood. So the only time I can really hang out with my friends was after-store activities, which would be sports or sorry to say detention. And I didn't get, I mean, obviously he wants to get in trouble just so they can hang out with their kids. They chose the more positive aspect of the wish of sports. And my friends played football, so I decided to play football too. So growing up in a rough area, did you start to, when you were getting good at football? Did you start to see this as, oh, if I get really good, I can get out of this town? I honestly, that really didn't cross my mind at all.

It was just, I didn't really think about that aspect of them to when I was in college. For me, it was always like, okay, I'll play football, hang out of my friends. And then it was one of those things, like, I got a football scholarship. And as a guy who didn't really care much for football, I got to go to school for free. So what kid would tell their parents or to tell their mom be like, hey, I don't like football. So I'm going to turn down this scholarship. I mean, what kid would do that, you know? So I get to go to school for free.

I get, honestly, I get to go to college for free. So when I was in college, I remember my junior year, after the end of my junior year, me receiving a lot of phone call from agents. And honestly, it didn't really even hit me how good I was, like in football. I just thought there was something that was normal that the end of your junior year going to your senior year or agents are going to start hitting you up with the possibility about going to the NFL. Well, it was one of those things where every agent that hit me up would be like, oh, so after this year, like, if you was to come out next year, I mean, if you come out next year, you could be a third round draft. And every agent that I spoke to literally pretty much said the same thing.

Some of them said third round. Some of them said second round. Some of them said fifth round, like six round. But all the agents I spoke to said that I was going to get drafted. And that's when it hit me was like, man. I know I always want to be a professional wrestler, but if I get, I could be rich, you know what I'm saying? I don't know what wrestlers make, but I know what the first round of an NFL draft pick

make or the second round of an NFL draft pick, make. I know how much money these guys make, so my plans kind of like got derailed a little bit, you know. It's not like you went to just any school either. You went to a pretty grade school. You went to Syracuse University. Right, yeah. So, I mean, you've got a lot of eyeballs on you there because you're going to a good school, which I imagine is going to help you as a prospect in the NFL.

Right. Yeah. So it's like, that's when I started thinking about it. That's why I really started taking football serious. And I was like, man, I need to have a really good senior year because I have what these agents calling me. And there's a chance I can get drafted here. Like, and not only get drafted, there's a chance I can get drafted high. You know, so that's when I really, really took.

That was the only time my whole life of playing football where I actually took wrestling, I mean, football serious, where I started grinding and doing the extra work and working on my speed and doing extra stuff after breakfast, you know. So, I mean, you're great at high school with the goal of, I want to get a scholarship. Then you get the scholarship with the goal of maybe I want to be good enough to get drafted in the NFL. Where does it go from there? You get drafted in the NFL. What does the new goal become?

I get drafted in the NFL. Honestly, there wasn't really any goal. It was like I was making a lot of money. I was a kid who came from nothing making literally half a million dollars a year for the first few years, three, four years in the NFL. So it was like, I really didn't have a go. I was set, you know. I mean, I wasn't really thinking about when am I going to enter this wrestling journey because to me it was known about how much money can I make at this level.

Like I get to buy things I only dream of having as a kid, different cars and different clothes and different jewelry and buy big houses. And it was like, so life was great. Yeah. But it comes to a time when you're making all this. money, but you're really not happy with what you're doing. You know what I'm saying? So, and that after I left the land, after I got traded away from my land,

and that's when they kind of struck where I was like, like, I've made the crap load of money. I have all this jewelry. I have all these clothes. I have all these shoes. I have all these cars. I'm really not really happy because football is not what I set out to do. You know what I'm saying?

It's like, it's like right now, I have. I'm pretty much living alive because I'm not happy with what I'm doing. I'm just happy with what I'm doing right now, like the money is giving me. So it got to a point where after my seventh year, I was like, you know, I have to give. It was one of those things when you're not happy doing something, it definitely shows. The way you play, my play started going down. I started playing really bad. And it was one of those things I was so stressed out.

I wasn't playing too well. But I didn't care. You know, because it's like I didn't really enjoy what I was doing. So I didn't care how bad I was playing because the paycheck was still coming. But still, I didn't want to do it. I didn't know what will be a good time to let it go to start to start this journey of what I really want to do. So long story short, I got released in 2012,

about November, December, 2012, and had an opportunity to go play for other teams, but I turned it all down to start this journey at pro wrestling. And the crazy thing about starting your journey in pro wrestling is now you've got to start at the bottom. Right. It's like, yeah, you go from, I remember the last paycheck I got from the Rams,

because we get paid every Tuesday, I believe, about Tuesday, Wednesday, every Wednesday. Okay. I remember the last page like I got, before I got released was like $60,000. And that's after taxes. So it's like I got paid $60,000 after taxes. And I remember the first match I ever got paid for in professional wrestling was like $25.

So I go from making $60,000 a week to $25. So it was like, but it didn't really matter because it was like I loved what I was doing. It was like, and that's what I'm saying. The first time I got paid, I did a bunch of shows for free that I just had to drive up. And as long as I drove up and they would give me a spot on the car. But the first time I actually got paid was $25. So those other shows were actually costing you money. Yeah, it was actually costing me not only money, but time because I remember.

Like, I remember I drove. One time I did a show in Dreamwave. I think it was Dreamwave in Chicago, Illinois. And I remember, I forgot the guy's name. He told me as long as I would get there, he would give me a spot of the show. So I drove, and I had the money to buy my own flight to fly to Chicago and LaSalle, whoever the heck it was in Chicago. But to me, I was like, you know what?

This is what wrestlers do. So I kind of want to do what wrestlers do. So I remember a month before that, I bought another electric, a hybrid car, a tiny hybrid car paid for a cash. I think it was like $18,000. Pay for it cash because it was great on mileage. And this was going to be my road trip car. So I remember I took this car and I drove, at the time I was living in Atlanta, I drove

12 hours to dream to LaSalle, Illinois. I was in Dreamwave. I forget who my opponent was that night. And I was so stoked. The guy did get me a hotel because obviously it was a 12-hour drive. He got me a hotel, but I was so stoked that I actually wrestled in this hot show. At the time, Dreamway was a real hot promotion. I probably had like 3, 400 people there in a small building, and it was actually hot.

You know what I'm saying? So I was really excited. I still had the momentum from wrestling this match. I was like, you know what? I'm not going to take the whole time. I'm just going to drive back. So I drove back. So I drove 12 hours, wrestled 12 minutes maybe.

And after the match, drove 12 hours home. You know what I'm saying? Which in my mind, now I'm thinking about. I was like, what the hell? What I think was I thinking about? Like, I drove 24 hours just to wrestle for free for 12 minutes. Where did the real love for pro wrestling and wanting to be a pro wrestler begin? As a kid, I mean, just like with everybody, as a kid, as a kid, I was a huge wrestling fan.

Like, I watched everything, like WWE, WCW, ECW, I watched everything. Everything that was in TV, I'm not going to lie, I didn't know, as a kid, I didn't know there was such things as like New Japan and other wrestling companies or indie companies. I didn't know that was the thing. I was just into the big three that was on TV, which at the time was WW for the longest, and then WCW came around, and then ECW came around later.

So, yeah. And then when did you decide, all right, did you choose football over wrestling simply because it was the free education and then a chance to make some money? Yeah, pretty much. That was it. 100% it. Was there any point during your NFL career where you were like, maybe this wrestling thing is never going to happen?

Honestly, I didn't really think about that. When I was playing football, I didn't really think about when am I going to start wrestling. I was just enjoying the money I was making. I still did watch wrestling righteously every time it came on. In fact, it got to the point where I had enough money where I made it like a kind of like a routine where me and some of my friends from high school who loved wrestling as much as I did would fly to whatever the rest ofmania site is. We'll get a hotel. We'll make a weekend out of it. Then we'll go to WrestleMania.

So every year I did that. There is no... NFL, WrestleMania always lined up during the off season. Right. So I couldn't do it. You know what I'm saying?

I actually could do it. I wasn't missing anything because it was April and April's off season because the Super Bowl was, what, February? So we didn't have to get back to work until late May to start OTAs or whatever. So every year it was like

a thing with me and three, four of a guys, buddies, teammates, would fly to whatever WrestleMania was. There's no better image than a man the size of you petting a cat right now. Who is that cat that was just here? What's his or her name?

Lopee. We call it peep. And then we've got it, is this a dog right next to you? Yeah, it's a dog. And we got a moose. So we got all these animals here. When did, what was the first time that someone called you moose? Michael Vick actually gave me the name my rookie year. So it stems from all the way from my rookie era when I was in Atlanta.

So Michael Vick gave it to you just because of the way that you played? No, there was a guy that was called Moose a few years before I got there. And I guess I've looked like him. So that's why I got the name Moose. And I remember you telling me in our last interview, which, man, I can't believe it was years ago. you hated the nickname i hated it yeah like um and it's one of those things i actually wanted to be called tank because in the high school everybody called me tank so but there's a rule in the NFL you don't get to pick your nickname oh that's the rule so that was a rule that was the name that was

given to me i just stuck with me i think that's just a rule in life you can't give yourself a nickname yeah right yeah so it did so the name obviously stuck then what What part of you went, all right, this is going to be my wrestling name then? It was just in when I was in training with Mr. Hughes, because we would do this Thursday night free show for the fans. And that's when you were trained for a while. And if he thought he was good enough, he will book you on the free Thursday night shows at the same school. and some of the town, some of the local fans that live

in a five-minute radius from the school, what comes to the school. So we used to have at least about 30 people in this tiny building. Like, this building was so tiny and small that 30 people made it feel like WrestleMania, you know? So I remember when he told me,

yeah, I'm going to book you for a match Thursday. Think of a name. In my mind, I was like, man, what can I call myself? Like, I sat there for hours thinking about what my name would be. And I forgot who told me, it was like, how about you just go with Moose? Like, that's what everybody called you. And it was like, and all the rest of the time called me Moose. And, you know what I'm saying?

So it was like, oh, yeah, maybe that's easy yet. Like, it's very easy. And I had a teammate that I played with, his name was Loy or Malloy. I don't know if you're familiar with him but he was a big time Patriots and I played with him with the Falcons and every time he got introduced

when they did the so you know the NFL before the games a lot of people don't know this but before the games in the NFL they were either introduced the home team were either introduced

the starting offense or the starting defense and you get the person and all that stuff with each person coming down so Loy or Malloy every sign they introduce him, he would do with this thing right here.

And it would get a huge reaction for some reason. So I kept that in my back, my back pocket as, if I ever do become a wrestler, there's something towards that haunt the whole thing that Loyal Molloy does and everybody does it with them when they introduce him. So at that moment, when I was thinking about what I was going to do for an entrance, I was like, maybe if I said moose and did this, as I said, moose, maybe the people would do it. So I had a buddy at the time he was, he made music.

And I told him, I was like, hey, can you make me an entrance music? I got an interest song. I have a match at my school and I need an entrance music for it. And he was like, so what do you want? And I was like, I just wanted to say moose the whole time. And he was like, be sure? I was like, yeah, I just wanted to say moose the whole time. And he was like, okay, cool. And that's where my entrance music. came from. And I actually got over because I came out. The song was saying Moose. I was doing this whole thing.

The 25, 30 people in the school was saying Moose. And that's how the Moose's on pumping became a thing. And that's become like such a big thing. Like you're so over because of that song. Yeah. So was that really the first thing in your career, like the first step where you're like, all right, this is my first break? But then what's the next break?

after that? I don't think it was really my first break because I didn't really think when I did that song, when I came out to that song in the school and WWA full, I'm not thinking big picture yet. I'm not thinking, man, I'm going to be just over professional wrestler. I'm going to be as popular as I am now. I'm just thinking, man, I'm excited to wrestle on this free show on Thursday because this is my first match ever and I get to wrestle for seven minutes against this dude named Axel Ross

which Axel Ross he was like the head he was one of the trainers at Curtis Hughes School so the days Curtis Hughes felt lazy and didn't want to train anybody Axel Rose would take over the class pretty much so I got to wrestle him

so I'm not thinking about man this is going to skyrocket my my career. I'm just thinking, man, I'm nervous as hell. This is my first match. I have seven minutes. Let me not screw this up. When I started thinking big picture was when me and a couple of buddies who also wrestled at the school, one of whom wrestled at the school, and he had a tag partner that lived in North Carolina. And we were all pretty close. They hit me up and was like, hey, man, this ring of honor. to tryout in Philadelphia. Actually, no, I'll take that back.

Apollo Cruz, good friend of mine. He wrested at school heart nation at the time. He hit me up and he was like, hey, I currently do shows with this company called Dragon Gate USA slash Evolve. I think he was signed there. Maybe he was, maybe he wasn't, but he hit me up and was like, hey, I'm going to be driving to Tampa.

We have a triple shot weekend. For people who don't know where the triple shot is, is when you have a show in one city. You have a three, you have a show all weekend, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, it's called a triple shot. So he was like, yeah, I have a triple shot. I'm getting picked up by somebody and we're driving to Tampa. We're going to do a show on Tampa Friday or showing Orlando Saturday.

And the show in Jacksonville Sunday. And he was like, I think you should come because you're athletic or whatever. And you know what I'm saying? You're pretty athletic. You're still green as hell, but you're pretty athletic. He was like, I think you should call it as a guy there named Gabe. And he's the booker for Evolve slash Dragon Gate. So I was like, oh, yeah, sure.

I'll have nothing going on. Like, I'll definitely come. So I jump in a call with him. I think the Provido brothers was one of the guys were out. I think one of them wrests for NXT right now. He's the one that wears a Chase U, the university sweater or whatever. He was the guy that was driving. So we go to, we get to Dragon Gate USA and Gabe sees me.

Uh-huh puts me in the good words to Gabe for me. So Gabe was like, okay, cool, I'll give you a practice match. They didn't get to use my music, just which, me coming out there. In fact, it gave me generic music. So, it still wasn't thinking big picture yet. So, um, I come out, I was like, okay, I don't have my music. I'm just going to say moose and do my own pump thing. Yeah, yeah. Because I'm doing it. People are looking at me like, what the heck is this that I'm doing?

So quiet. And trust me, it was a packed house too. It was probably like 200 people at the, and I forgot the name of it was the spot in Tampa, though all fee in my I think it was in Tampa. 200 people and they're dead quiet. And it's just me, this big black guy, chanting his own name and his entrance, Moose, moose, moose. And everybody's just like, okay, what's this guy talking about? And it was so funny because by the end of the match,

the trial match that I had, all 200 people started chatting, moose, moose, so crazy. But I didn't think nothing of it. So did those shows for free because it was just tryout matches, didn't get paid for it. Did those shows for free, wrestled or whatever. And then, like, a couple of weeks out, I did it.

Gay told me, he was like, yeah, every time we have a show, make come to the show, and I'm not going to pay you, but I'm going to have a spot for you. So that's where the connections started coming. Okay, I get to work for Dragon Gate USA. And I'm not going to get paid, but I'm going to. do the show. So I end up not signing the deal, but a verbal agreement working with Gabe, with dragging a USA. And I remember after one of the weekends we did the show, he offered me a

contract, which the contract was probably like a three-year deal or whatever, but I was only going to be making like 75 bucks a show. It wasn't that much. It was maybe 50 bucks a show. In my mind, I was like, why would I sign a three-year-a-deal only making $50? That doesn't make sense. So Dave, I was like, hey, man, I don't know if I want to sign a deal. Let's just keep it as what we have, the working relationship, but just still pay me the $50. I'll take the $50. But I don't want to sign any contract, but I would happily take $50 a show.

And it was like, okay, cool. So we had to work an agreement, which I agreed to getting paid $50, $75, whatever it was. So a couple of weeks after that agreement I had with Gabe, a buddy of my that I trained told me about the Rangavana

camp that was coming up and he was like man Rangovana's hot and I knew about Rangovana because at this point when I started training to become a professional wrestler I actually heard about Rangovina

I started watching Rangana it was so different than anything else it was so different since CNA and it was so different from WWE and it was just a different style of wrestling. It was kind of more of a young school type of wrestling where people did a lot

of crazy stuff. I was a huge fan of that. It reminded me like ECW. So I was like, oh, hell yeah, I would go do Ringavana and do the trial. So we took a megabus. We bought mega, megabucks tickets. And once I could afford to just fly to Philadelphia, but my friends didn't have that kind of money. So I was like, you know what, I'll do whatever you guys do. So we all paid. I want to say like 20 bucks for round-trip megabucks tickets from Atlanta to Philadelphia, which was the most miserable ride I've ever had for my life. But once again, it was fun because I was going with my boys and we was all going to do something we all love, which is professional wrestling.

So I remember we doing the tryout. And at the end of the tryout, what Ringavonda typically do, they will pick a few guys and they'll have, have practice matches. So I had a practice match with this guy's name Wildman Kong. I think that was his name of Congo, Kong, or whatever it is. I remember Jay Lee DuBan there, the Briscoe Brothers, Truth Martini, Hunter was there,

and I remember doing this match, everybody just popping and going crazy. And all these guys I just mentioned, all these legends in my eyes. eyes just met guys I see on TV and I was a big fan of especially Jay Lethar, which I was a huge fan of Jay Lethue because of his stuff in TNA, you know what I'm saying?

With the whole class of Woolworth with Rick Fletz. I was a big mom Jay Leitha and I'm saying him he's going crazy over my match with Wildman Congo or whatever. So after the match, they pulled into the room that was like, hey look man, you freaking killed it.

We don't have any spots to sign you right now, but man, if you come to our show. If you find the way to make it to our show, we'll definitely give you a dog match and we'll have something, we'll try to get something for you. So I was like, oh man, this is, I have a chance to possibly work for Ring of Honor. So I made it a thing to go online, find their schedule of all the shows that they have, printed out. And at this point, I was like, okay, I have enough money to fly myself to whatever shows they're at. So whatever shows that the ticket wasn't too expensive, I would buy a flight, buy a hotel room, go through the show, help out with the range,

help out with picking some of the boys up, help out with like picking up Steen and Adam Cole and all these guys from the airport, do whatever I can. And every time they paid me back by putting giving me a dog match. Still, I couldn't use my, on all these dog matches we talked about, I could still couldn't use my music. I would just use my generalized music that it gave me with the Moose thing. So I was just going off talent at this point. So I remember when I forgot who told me this,

but there was like, maybe you need to tell Hunter that Dragon Gate, because I was doing both at the time, I would go to Ringgavonda get a dog match or whatever they could offer me, and then I would go work and get paid $50 for Dragon Gate USA Evolve. So I had those two shows in my back pocket, and then as you know, professional wrestling, when indie promoters see that you're working with Dragon Gate USA and you're working also doing dog matches for Ring of Honor,

they think, oh, man, this guy's good enough to get attention from both of these places. They start booking. So I was getting a lot of bookings too, not making a lot of money. By at the most, at this time, I was probably getting paid like $80 in the Indies. So I forgot who told me this. I was like, man, then Dragon Gate offered you a contract. I was like, it wasn't a good contract.

It was a crappy contract. And he was like, well, you have leverage. And I was like, I understood what they was talking about, but I didn't really understand where they were talking about. But it was like, maybe you need to hit up, you need that next time you go to Ring of Honor and let them know that Dragon Gate offered your contract. Don't tell them the contract was,

but just telling that they offered your contract. So I was like, actually, I'm going to do that. So the next show I did, I grabbed Hunter, poured him a sign, and tell him. I was like, hey, Hunter, Gabe offered me a contract. And he was like, you didn't sign it, did you? And I was like, no, I mean, it wasn't the best contract, but I'm thinking about doing it. It was like, no, no, no, no, don't sign it. Give me a week and we'll present something to you.

So I was like, okay, cool. Literally a week later, they presented me with a contract, which the contract wasn't that great, but it was like, To me, it was like I was watching Ring of Honor. Like when I left the NFL, Ringavonda was like the first non-WWE TNA TV company that I knew about. And I was watching it and I was a big fan of a lot of the restless on the show. So first contract, Rangovina offered me. I don't care because, to me, Monday is not a thing.

It was a one-year deal making $125 a show. And to me, that was like a million dollars. This coming from a guy who was making $60,000 a week, getting offered a contract to wrestle for $125 a show. You know what I'm saying? And I remember when they made my debut, the world looking for music to use. And I was like, I have a music.

Just try it out. Tell me what you think. And I gave it to a hundred fell in love with it. It was like, you serve this is your song? This is badass. And I remember the first match, debut match I had, I wrestled Hakeem Zane, which is Roheed at Impact right now. And as soon as that music came on,

the whole arena went eight shit. And I didn't have to do the most thing. Because they all remembered me when this dog match is doing this. And now they can hear the music. there was pretty much telling them what to do when I did this and the whole place went crazy. And I mean, I know it was a long story. But now I love this. And what I think is great, what's at the heart of this story is you keep mentioning you had money.

You had the money to fly yourself and you didn't want to. Like you wanted to do this the, I guess, right way or the way where it felt like you were earning it. Right. Yeah. Yeah, that was it. I think coming from a football background helped me in that aspect because I know in football as a rookie, you always want to prove yourself.

And I knew if I didn't do it the right way with wrestling, I was going to have that stigma that, oh, he only way it came this far because he's an ex-football player, blah, blah, blah. So I already knew that. I had that mindset. I already knew what people was going to say if I didn't do it the right way. So I erased that right away by making a long road trips, drive it everywhere I could drive.

And you know what I'm saying? Good doing shows for free and fly myself to every Ring of Honor show without getting a dime for it. And people don't realize this. I did the try out with Ring of Honor, I want to say, in 2013 maybe. Like, I want to say it was November 2013, and I got signed with Ring of Honor in July of 2014. So it was almost a full year of me flying myself to different Ring of Honor shows and hoping out and setting up the ring and doing airport rides and picking the boys up and getting the boys food and taking them to go get food or whatever kind of needed me to do at this point,

you know what I'm saying, before I got signed. So, yeah, I did my young boy, my young boy stuff for about almost a year. Man. Then how did you get on Impact Wrestling's radar? I don't know how I got on Impact Wrestling's radar. That's the funny thing about it. I remember I signed my first deal with Ring of Honor, which was, like I told you, one-year deal in July for making 125 a show, which was nothing.

And then my deal, my contract was so up, and they offered me, they offered me like a salary to second one to my second year, which wasn't really much. It was by like 20 grand maybe, which to me, like I said, I got to do what I love doing. And they were using my right. And I was wrestling, some of the best wrestlers in the world, which I kind of used as a learning curve because I would get to wrestle Jay Briscoe.

I would get to wrestle Adam Cole. I would get to wrestle Roger Strong. I would get the tag with AJ Styles. I was dressing all these great wrestlers, you know what I'm saying? Most of these wrestlers now are working in New York or working in AEW making boat loads of money. You know what I'm saying? And these were guys that I was working with on a weekly basis in Ring of America. Because we were running like pretty much every week or every other week or something like that.

You know what I'm saying? So, yeah, I signed a second contract. I remember once my second contract was up, I got a call from, but once my second contract was like a month out for my second contract with ringing the bond to being up. And I knew I was getting there in wrestling because I got an email from WWE. And it was Cain and Seaman.

And he was like, hey, man, I know you did a tryout with us a couple of years ago. and you had your situation with injury or whatever because I actually did a trial with WWE before I even went through wrestling school and I didn't know what the hell I was doing I had never taken a bump

I got this tryout because my teammate James Lorenitis his dad is rest of peace animal and his uncle is John Laurennites for WWE

so he got me a tryout with WWE, like, after I was done with football. And during that trial, I hit my head on the ground doing the headlock takeover and kind of got like real loopy or whatever. So that happened. So I remember after my deal with Ringabana was coming up, my second year, my second deal with Ringabweilwai was coming up, they hitting me up and asking me if I was interested in coming into doing another tryout, which I was.

I was like, heck yeah, it's always been a dream of mine to work for WWI, why wouldn't I be willing to do it. So I remember doing a tryout and they told telling me that, hey, man, like, we really like you, but the only thing we have to offer you is a spot on tough enough, I believe it was. And for me, I was in a position where Moose was a household, at least I felt like Moose was a household name or Moose was getting to be a household name that I wouldn't want to stop

everything that I've built and moves, which it wasn't much because we're only, we're talking about Ray and Bonnet here. It's not like I was in New Japan or like impact wrestling at the point at the time. And it was like, so I didn't want to start a freshman doing tough enough and going in there as probably, I don't know if they give you a fake name or that you get to use your real name. I don't know how that works. Probably just be Quinn. Yeah. I didn't want to do that. So I was like, no, I think I would just stick with what I was doing. And I, after the, that I remember once my deal was coming up, I remember, but it was maybe a week before my deal was. And I was set to sign back with the rang of honor.

And I forgot the guy who was working with Impact Wrestling at the time. I can't think what his name is. It wasn't Biggs. It was, yeah, I think it was. I think it was John Gaboric. I remember him hitting me up and was like, hey, we want you to bring you in and we'll pay you this much money if you come in. And to me, I was like, are you serious? Because it was like four, five times more than what impact,

like three times more than what impact offered me for my third contract. So I was like, impact wrestling is awesome because I remember watching all these epic matches with. Oh, there's so much history there. Yeah, it was TNA at the time. It wasn't, we hadn't switched over to impact wrestling yet. It was still TNA. And I remember watching all these great matches with TNA. to me, I really only looked at Ring of Honor as like,

and I'm not trying to, I don't mean this by any disrespect. At that point, I only saw Ring of Honor as a big name Indy that happened to be on TV. But I saw TNA as an actual wrestling company, you know what I'm saying? Because of all the history it had, I mean, at the one point they had Hogan, they had Sting. Yeah, was your, sting was the thing. Kurt Angle was there.

So to me, this was my chance to, okay, it's time to go play with the big boys, you know what I'm saying? I've learned, Ring of Honor has taught me what I think I need, but now I'm to actually take that next step. And so I came, I joined TNA, which is now Impact Wrestling. And now you're one of the big boys there. Like, you can't think of Impact Wrestling now without thinking about Moose. Yeah, I mean, and that's one thing I proud myself.

I worked so hard to make that a thing, you know. And people ask me, why did I sign back with Impact Wrestling? And it's like, it's easy because I want to show people that, that WWE is not the end-all or be-all. Like, yeah, if you care, if all you do is care about making tons of money, then go there, it's most times to say that you're probably not going to be happy there. But everybody has a different experience.

But there's a lot of things I set aside of the impact that I and goals I've set aside that kind of hit that I haven't really hit yet. And I want to be one of the guys that in two years from that when impact is up here,

they could be like Moose helped impact get up there. Eric Young, Eddie Edwards, Josh Alexander, Dion, the Parada, all these guys. that we have around our roster now, bust in their ass,

help impact get to the stage of this yet because I don't think we're there yet. Like, I don't think we're nowhere there. But I do think in a couple of years we're going to be up there where we used to be 10 years ago when it was CNN. The United States Soccer Federation

present the U.S. soccer podcast. My name is David Goss, and I'm joined by my co-host, Megan Clemenberg. And now we're giving people an inside look at the World Cup. Times ticking. I think you can feel the, intensity. All the guys are wanting to really take their claim, and they want to be on that World

Cup roster. There's no doubt about it. Hosting the World Cup on the home soil comes with its pressures, but we're just really excited just as the people are. The U.S. Soccer podcast, presented by Hencoe, follow and listen on your favorite platform. I love when you brought back the TNA World Championship because I've been a TNA fan and impact fan pretty much since the beginning. So bringing that belt back was like such a big nostalgia factor for me. Was that your idea to bring that back? I wish I could take credit for that. But we do have a right-in team, a great writing team as well with Jimmy Jacobs and Robert Evans and Tommy Dreamer and Scott DeMore and pretty much right the whole show.

And it was pretty much the idea. When they presented it to me, I loved it. I thought it was a great idea because it took me back to when. Rick Flair went back to WWE and he had the NWA title and he was telling people that he's a real world champion and people was like, look at it and what the hell is that title

you have on your waist? You didn't win that here. So it kind of gave me that same vibe where like I'm the Rick Flair and I'm bringing this title back and even though this title is a real title I actually never won it. I just saw it in office and picked it up and me being a dick head.

I'm the greatest champion of all time. And I think that definitely helped my character development because it was one of those things where I bring this fake title back that I never wrested for, I never won it. But on social media and when you

talk to the fans on it, they really think I'm the real world champion. But I never won it. So it was like, you guys, it was so fun to see how some fans actually believed in me and believed me when I said I was a real champion they would say yeah he is a real champion he's missed the impact wrestling he should have a champion and that that definitely that whole

storyline definitely helped with my development and my momentum yeah I think your promos have gotten so so good over the time that you've been in an impact wrestling and I'm really curious to know did someone specifically help you with your promos or did you start to study something or do something to make yourself get better? A few people help me with promos. First of all, a lot of people don't know this. I think Jimmy Jacobs probably has one of the best promos in wrestling. So I think with him working with Impact Wrestling, it helps out everybody because he is a ball of knowledge walking around. Sometimes you think he's a psychopath, but with him being a psychopath, because his mind is always thinking, his mind is always all over the place.

He's a genius, and he has definitely a lot with it. And I hate to give this guy props because every time chance this guy has, he buries me. But Don Callas, before he left, was definitely instrumental in the development of me. And he made cutting promos so easy because some of the things he would tell me. And I know this character, I'm playing now, this Moose character, I remember having a conversation with Don when we was thinking about how to present this character. And he told me about, have you ever watched No Country for Old Man? the assassin in that movie,

how he doesn't really, he's really monotone and doesn't really show any emotion and he doesn't laugh. He's not pissed. You don't know when he's, he shows the same emotion when he's happy with when he's pissed. And you really, I remember Don bringing that up to me.

He was like, maybe this new character should be more like this. When you cut your promos, you should never yell, or you should never be sad, or you should never be angry. you should just be always monotone. And I thought about it. I was like, man, this would probably be very hard to do.

I went home and started practicing it. And it was actually easy. He was like, I know, monotone promo is the easiest promo ever. Because, like, you're not showing, you're not really given any emotion. Like, people don't know how to read you. They don't know if you're pissed. If they don't know if you're angry. But one thing they do know is you look like a killer.

because you're not giving them anything. And I played with it for a while. I did some promos in front of my wife, and she was like, yeah, like, you're just talking, but for some reason you look like you're menacing when you talk that way. And I was like, that's what I'm going for. I want to look medicine.

I don't want to, I don't want people to be like, oh, he's pissed, or he's happy right now. Oh, I can read him. I don't want people to be able to read me at this character. I just want to be able to talk and nobody could read what emotion is going through my head because they just are scared, you know. And so thanks, shout out to Don Callas for helping with that.

And definitely a big shout out to Jimmy because he definitely showed me ways to not only stay monotone, but to show some emotion without showing a lot of emotion. Which match would you say you're most proud of in impact wrestling? Oh man, that's hard because it's a lot of matches, man. I'll tell you a few that... I can't tell you what match I'm most proud of

because there's so many matches and sometimes it might not be that long 30-minute match that you'll pick. It could be like a 5-60-minute match that I did something different or I did something that I've had issues with and I actually fixed it.

So to answer that question what match is my most proud of it's kind of hard, but I do know a feud that I'm

very proud of. I would say it's two of them. My long year feud with Eddie Edwards, that definitely brought out

a side of me and with wrestling that I think that was a match that made me understand what wrestling really is.

Coming from a guy who used to be a spot monkey and just want to do stuff and do

cool flips and do all this cool things and think about what spots should we do and what spots what spots could we do that would be cool and that feudal Eddie taught me more about being a storyteller

about story to talk instead of what spots to run you know what I'm saying and so that was definitely very instrumental in my development and somebody else

just recently my mini-fewed with Chris Saban because Chris Saban I think he's somebody actually asked me this question in a podcast I did earlier if you was to pick a Mountain Rushmore for Impact Wrestling,

who would it be? Oh, now we need to hear this. We'll get into that right after I like, so they asked me that question and I was like, man, Chris Saban has to be in there because he's such an underrated wrestler that people don't give him the credit that he deserves because he's one of the best wrestlers in the world. But he's so quiet and so humble and doesn't put himself out there that fans don't put his name in the list because he's not so outspoken. You know what I'm saying?

But yeah, my fuse with him definitely helped because he taught me a lot of things that I still use. used to this day after our feud with him. You know what I'm saying? But yeah, somebody asking this question about if I also named my Impact Mount Rushmore, who would be in- So is this a TNA slash impact wrestling Mount Rushmore? Yeah. I mean, this company is still, it's TN.

It's always going to be known as TNA. You can't say impact wrestling and just forget about TNA because the company or TNA. And it was hard. It was hard because my, I picked my original four and then I kind of switched it, but I did it. So my original full was Asia. Okay, so there's a thing.

When I'm picking my Mount Rushmore, I'm not going to pick people who made their names somewhere else. So with that being said, Jeff Jarrett, even though he created a company with his own money and probably should be in a Mount Rushmore. I'm not going to pick him because he made themselves in another company. He didn't make himself at TNA. You know what I'm saying? He was already a superstar in WWE and WCW and then create a day. But he should be, I mean, obviously he should be number one because without him, it wouldn't be a TNA.

But that was for me. My standpoint was I'm not going to pick anybody that made a name outside of TNA. So that removed. Oh, man, I'm so curious who's on this. That removes Jeff Jarrett. That removes. Kirk Engle. Jeff Hardy, Matt Hardy.

Hardy, all the Hardy. So I was going to only name guys who made themselves in TNA. Okay. That removed Joe, Samoa Joe, as well, because Samuel, Joe made them name in Ring of Honor. And when he signed the TNA, that's when it was a big deal that TNA signed this guy in Samoa Joe. So he didn't make my... Oh, wow. Okay. So my four is A.J. Stiles.

Of course. Gail Kim, Eric Young. Uh-huh. Even if I could pick a fifth person, which probably should be the first person who would be in the Mount Rushmore would be a Bist. Oh, yeah, what about Daniels?

And that's another thing. That's a harder one, too. Daniel should 100% be in it. Like, Ketharian should be 100% be in it. It's like, Bobby Rood, EC3, all these guys. But for me, if you're looking at accomplishments, you have to play EY because he's like the Sean Michaels of TNA. He's literally won every single title in the history.

So you have to put him in there, right? Chris Saban, same thing. He's literally won every single title in the company's history. also has won the exhibition title more than anybody in the company's history. So you have to put him in there too, right? If you're talking about accomplishments.

And crazy to think, Christopher Daniels never had the world championship and impact us. And that's what I thought about it. I was like, man, Christopher Daniels were all the epic matches he had with AJ Styles. But if you're talking about accomplishment, he never won the work. He was putting so

many people over, though. Right. He never won the world title, though. So that's the thing. Um, same thing. I mean, Bobby Rood, like Bobby Rood had, was a great tag team wrestling. We won a lot of,

we weren't the tag team championships a few times, but never won the exhibition championship. Um, like, and then he didn't have a really long run as the guy at TMA. He did, but he didn't. Um,

so for me, so hold on. What do you, what do you need to do to, you know, throughout the rest of your impact wrestling career? to be one of those faces up there? I mean, obviously, there's, there's, I've only, I've been here, what, for six years now?

Um, still haven't technically one, though, I haven't done anything if you think about it. Um, I'm like, one of those guys that, if you mentioned Impact Wrestling now, I'm probably one of the first names that come up that you think about, but if you really think about it, I haven't really done anything. It's just off of, it's off of looking scary. And, yeah, but you're also a guy who doesn't need championships to get yourself over. Right. And that's, and that's one of the other stuff.

I think right now is a different, it's a different, um, era of professional wrestling where now you're in the era where certain guys don't need world titles to get themselves over. Like, and I feel like I'm, I'm in that class where, like, I'm such, uh, and I hate to say this guy, I'm, I'm proud myself on being humble. But I'm such a big guy and such a presence that, like, people are going to remember me regardless on if I have a world title or not, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, I mean, you know, you don't need to say that. It's something that we're all thinking, and we know.

Right. So I appreciate that. So, but if you think about it, like, I haven't really done anything in impact. I've been there for six years now, and I really haven't. I know. I mean, that's not true. every shit that Josh Matthews also won

so I mean is that really a big deal like you know what I'm saying so I mean at the great if you're looking at on stuff that you'll read on paper I don't I haven't really done anything more of the stuff I've done is for fans who actually watch the product and be like

oh man that's a moose was a huge presence in impact wrestling but if you let's look at my stats on paper yeah I mean you wouldn't be impressed to know. Well, if we bring this full circle to how this conversation started, you look more like a champion now than you ever have in your career. Appreciate it. Yeah. And that's one positive I took with COVID was to work on the way I looked. And I mean, there's obviously COVID effect. It's everybody in this world. I mean, it's stuck. But one thing I told myself I was going to do, I was going to find one thing to, to one positive thing to take out of COVID and working on the way I looked and working on my body

and working on my skills in the ring with something I was going to do because I had, I couldn't do anything else. Well, I think that these accomplishments you're talking about these championships, maybe it begins. Maybe it begins at Bound for Glory. Yeah, I mean, that's what the plan is. And then I think as we look towards the end of this year and then into next year, I bet if we had this same conversation next October, it might be a little bit different.

Yeah, I mean, I'm hoping. I mean, I made a promise when we started back shows after COVID in an empty arena, but that I will be world champion by 2021. So I know Bound for Glory is the last pay-per-fue of the year. And if I don't get it done by Bound for Glory, there's still, we still have two more months before the end of the year, three more months before they ever, to get that goal to fruition but i mean i i think bound for glory will be a good start yeah i uh i've really enjoyed this deep dive into your career and into your life and i think that

a lot of people are going to be really inspired by this whether their goal is to be a pro football player or a pro wrestler or whatever it is that they're chasing after i think the the thing it's so great about your story is this idea of you're never too big to start start over again. Yeah, definitely not. I mean, and I'm a living proof of that. I mean, I went from a guy making so much money to starting over and professional wrestling making literally nothing, losing money, paying my money, paying to go wrestle, you know.

And I would love to say it was humbling because it wasn't because I loved it. Humbling something, you do something and you hate that you're doing and you're learning a lesson from doing it. It wasn't even the humbling to me because I loved it. I loved being in the car for 12 hours, driving to Chicago to wrestle in front of 300 people because I wanted to be a professional wrestling. And I was so excited to get there. And after wrestling, that 12 minutes, driving back, I had to adrenaline rush into my body for at least the first five hours of the ride until I pulled over and got a hotel. Because I was about to kill myself from like sleeping on the road. But I loved it. It wasn't a humbling experience. It was

I thought and loved and still in love with professional wrestling experience that I would do that. And your passion just like oozes through the screen. I love this so much. I end every interview with the same question talking about gratitude because for me, I start and end every day, saying out loud three things that I'm grateful for. And I really think it sets the tone for. you. So what are three things that you're grateful for in your life right now? Three things. Definitely my wife. Because with this lifestyle that we live and always being on the road and always catching flights and she is perfect in the sense that she supports me through it all. She doesn't complain. It's been times where we've made plans to do something at last minute.

I get a book and I have to cancel it. And she understands because she knows that this is what I love to do. And then she helps me out with everything. It still be times where she would leave little surprises in my bag or candy or a card or something that I forgot that I wasn't thinking of and she'll put it in there and write a note. So I'll say her first because she is a blessing. my 11-year-old son, because I do this part for him, hopefully to build up enough of a legacy

that whenever I leave this earth, he could look at it and be like, man, my dad did this, this, this, this, all for me. And the third thing, third thing is, and this might be more selfish, it's for myself. because as a kid, this is what I wanted to do. So me waking up every day and getting the opportunity to live a life that I dreamed about living as a kid. It's awesome. You know what I'm saying?

Yeah. I mean, you're living proof that literally anything is possible if you're willing to work hard enough. Right. Yeah. Moose, I guess I should do this. Moose, thank you so much. It's been such a pleasure to catch up with you. Oh, thanks, man.

I hope to see you in Vegas, bound for glory. Definitely be there. I mean, I'm booked on the show, so I have to be there. Well, of course, you're going to be there, yeah. And hopefully you're leaving 2021 with some gold around your waist. Hopefully, I'm leaving Bound for Glory with some gold around my waist. That's the goal. So, but we'll see.

Hopefully I see you there. Thank you so much. Thanks. Well, there we go, my friends. Thank you to Moose for the great conversation. Thank you to you for being with us on this one. Bound for Glory is this Saturday night, October 23rd, live from Las Vegas. And you can find Moose on social media.

He's at The Moose Nation on Twitter. He's at Moose Nation 69 on Instagram. And you can find me. I'm at Chris Van Fleet. And I'll leave you with one of my favorite quotes ever. It's from Helen Keller, and it seems so fitting after hearing Moose's story. life is either a daring adventure or nothing at all. Be great, be grateful.

We'll see you on the next one for so much more insight. Jim Rome takes on sports. Why? Because I have a job to do with rapid fire takes. So I don't want to hear from you lava pigs on this notion today. No idea what you're talking about. You're complaining more than you like to breathe air. It's like you get up in the morning only to keep.

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