Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Is Lio Rush Returning To WWE? Why His AEW Run Was Cut Short, Working With Bobby Lashley, Tony Khan

Episode Date: February 21, 2023

Lio Rush (@iamliorush) is a professional wrestler, musician and actor. He is known for his time with WWE, AEW, MLW and NJPW. He joins Chris Van Vliet in Los Angeles to talk about coming out of retirement, the recent matches he has had in MLW and NJPW, why his time in AEW was so short, what he thinks of Tony Khan, whether or not he thinks he will return to WWE, his music career, what he learned from working with Bobby Lashley in WWE and much more! For more information about CVV and INSIGHT go to: https://podcast.chrisvanvliet.com If you enjoyed this episode, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast/iTunes? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests. Follow CVV on social media:  Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

All systems are going. Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Bleas! All right, here we go. Welcome back to another audio adventure on Insight. I'm CVV, Chris Van Fleet. Thank you so much for being with us on this one. How's everything going in your world, by the way? Is 2023 off to a good start?

If not, just know that you've got 10 more months to get things back on track and headed in the direction that you want them to go. Mm-hmm. Great conversation on the show today with Leo Rush. He was first on the show when he was with WWE. This was in April 2020, and it was right before the first round of the pandemic releases that happened, which, of course, he was a part of with a bunch of other people. And a lot has happened for Leo since then. He was in AEW as the Joker at Double or Nothing 2021 in the Casino Battle Royal. He ended up getting injured there. And he announced his retirement. from wrestling. He healed up, rehabbed, got better, came out of retirement, had another injury, and just a lot going on in his world. Now he's 100%. He's been making appearances for MLW, New Japan, GCW, and a bunch of other places. He's also focused on creating new music and doing some acting as well. So really interesting conversation with him because one of the best things about Leo, one of the things I love about Leo Rush is that he

always speaks his mind. So snap a screenshot. Let us know that you're listening to this. Let us know what really stands out for you and make sure to tag us. He's at I am Leo Rush. I'm at Chris Van Vleet. If you happen to be on TikTok, I'm Chris Dot Van Vleet on there. And thank you to Dominic 29, who left this review on Apple Podcasts. Longtime fan of CVV. I've been a fan going back to your days on the news in Cleveland, always entertaining and great interesting interviews. Keep up the great work, and I'm looking forward to all of your interviews. Chris is the man. Thank you.

That is very kind. Please keep leaving those reviews on Apple Podcasts, and I'll keep reading them out on here. Or if you have Spotify, it takes, like, I think three seconds. That might be an exaggeration. It might even take two seconds to just go in and click those stars on there. The ratings are super important. And if you haven't yet, please make sure to follow the show wherever you listen to this. Actually, follow any of the shows that you listen to regularly,

because it's such a simple, easy thing to do, and it helps us creators so, so much. All right, let's get into this. Ladies and gentlemen, the man of the hour, Leo Rush. So the last time I saw you, we were actually in the ring together. Yeah. Which is funny because I didn't think I'd be sharing the ring with you,

but it was MCW, and I was doing like a little bit of guest ring announcing. You came in and cut a great promo like you always did. It was great to see you then. Even better to see you now. Yeah, yeah. I'm glad that that first interaction happened. It was such a cool surprise. It was like, oh, man, it's Chris.

It's funny because, like, I'd seen you at wrestlecon very briefly at Tampa and, like, I think it was a weird wrestle con. Yeah, I think I know exactly which one you're talking about. And it was just, you know, the weird interactions with the way the world was at that point. And we, like, briefly said hello, and it was good to actually spend some more time with you in a wrestling setting. Yeah, yeah. It's good to see you in a wrestling setting.

Yeah, yeah. No, it's good to be back in a wrestling setting, really. I feel like I've been away for so long on and off. But I'm glad that I'm here for a good chunk of time without any really distractions or things pulling me away from the wrestling scene. So, yeah, I'm having a good time right now. Are you fully back in as a wrestler? Are you a full-time wrestler now? I'm a full-time wrestler.

but I feel like I'm also a full-time. I'm full-time and a lot of other things, too. I know. You're full-time. Dad, you're full-time. Musician. Yeah. You're full-time.

I'm traveling a bunch. Yeah. Yeah. It definitely feels like I'm back full-time. With the schedule that I'm on, how often I'm wrestling. The amount of matches. Yeah, the amount of matches that I'm having is kind of, you know, blow me away, really, with the schedule that I was able to, to,

kind of pull together and be full time. Yeah, you're working in a lot of places right now. Yeah. Like most notably, like you're in town for GCW. You're doing some stuff with MLW, some new Japan stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then a thousand other places, it sounds like. Yeah, yeah, very exciting.

You know, there's a perception about you of like, you know, when you decided to retire and then come back, I think there was a lot of people that were like, what's going? Why would you retire and then come back, you know, not that long afterwards? Yeah, I was going through a lot in that time period. I think personally, I was going through a lot on top of the physical injuries that I had. And it kind of just made me put a lot of things in the perspective, just wanted to figure out what I needed. to prioritize in my life. I definitely feel like I grew up with a lot of responsibility

that someone my age isn't really, I wouldn't say, supposed to go through. But it's definitely an interesting situation with me being currently 28 years old. Yeah, do you mean like being a father so young? Yeah, being a father so young, being a husband, having like these pretty adult responsibility. at such a young age.

And I was all in with wrestling. I sacrificed a lot of my personal time and space and energy to do what I love. And I feel like I missed out on a lot of things that are kind of hand in hand with being in my early 20s. I feel like I skip a lot of things. Did you find like you'd have time? especially when you were with WWE, where you would be on the road and you'd come back

and your boys were already bigger, they'd done some milestone and you're like, I can't believe I missed that. Yeah, yeah, definitely some birthdays, definitely some moments that I probably would have liked to see in person. You know, a video is cool or, you know, a photo of them doing something that's cool, but to actually be there and experience it and feel it in that moment.

Always kind of sucked. I think it sucks a little more now that I'm older, now that I'm a little bit more like aware that these are some of the times that I've missed. Yeah, it hits a little bit differently. But, you know, things like, you know, eating something with a fork for the first time rather than using your hands or, you know,

saying a certain, like, word fully rather than kind of like slurring it a little bit or dragging it out and not saying, it completely. Just like little things like that that, yeah, I wish I was able to see. So if all that thought went into, I don't want to do this anymore, then what does the thought process look like to go, you know what, to open that back up and go, you know what, maybe I made that decision a little bit prematurely. I am ready to rest it still. Yeah. Yeah. And it, it had a lot to do with my physical injuries too. I think a lot of people see me as this young, fiery kid.

I kind of look like a kid to a lot of people. And in the wrestling world, I mean, you still are relatively young. Yeah, no, for sure. You've just had so many life experiences. Yeah, I think with that. Did you feel like there was unfinished business? Is that what it was? Unfinished business.

And I also realized, you know, I want to step away from wrestling. to be with my family. But at the same time, I'm currently doing wrestling for my families, for their futures, for... Yeah. That's an interesting catch-22.

Yeah. Because that's the thing where you can make the most money. You're able to maximize that. Yeah. But it's also something that could cause injuries and did. Yeah. Something that takes you away from your family and has. Yeah. Wow. So it's kind of like, I want to do this thing, but all,

because it affords me the lifestyle that I want. Yeah. But also, on the flip side, takes me away from my family and could get me hurt. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm a little tired of getting hurt. I'm 28, but I've been playing sports since I was four years old. I haven't taken a year off. What are your main sports when you're growing up?

My main sport, so I've tried a lot of sports. But I would say, I would say my, My main sport before I got involved in amateur wrestling was baseball. I was heavy into baseball. My dad had me in a lot of baseball camps. Hey, me too. Yeah, yeah, I was playing all year round. I was playing basketball when I got to high school.

Yeah, it didn't work out. The height. Yeah, didn't work out. It could be like mugsy bows, you know. Yeah. I played football, but it was around the same time as wrestling season. And I wanted to focus on my amateur wrestling. But yeah, since baseball, I would say amateur wrestling either or.

Yeah. So was that ever a path for you or was it always wrestling? I don't want to, I always wanted to be a wrestler. I never knew that it was really possible, honestly. I didn't know about like the independent circuit. I didn't know about wrestling schools or anything like that. I just knew that I wanted to be a wrestler since I was five years old. I know a lot of people probably say that kind of like cliche.

I was a wrestling fan since I was four or five. But yeah, it started for me when I was about five years old. I started playing baseball since I was three. Started on the tee ball, hitting the ball off the tea, coach pitch. So at what point did you realize wrestling was a possibility for you? I started getting really burnt out in baseball. Like I said, I played since I was three all year round every single year. I was really good at baseball.

I would say I was probably a lot better at baseball than I was at amateur wrestling. And I was an All-American at amateur wrestling. So that definitely says something. I feel like my path was supposed to lead me towards being like an MLB baseball player. But yeah, I just got really burnt out and I didn't really feel anything emotionally for baseball anymore. Found wrestling and kept, you know, continued on being a fan or like professional wrestling watching on TV, stuff like that. I was getting older, being in high school, you know, having that heavy amateur wrestling experience and feeling like I can actually. take these scales and do something with it.

I was big in film, too. I went to Full Cell University because I wanted to be a cinematographer. I wanted to... Wow. Yeah, which explains my... I'm a pretty, like, I'm a pretty, like, artsy, creative, like, person right now

with, like, videos that I, like, producing myself. Yeah, the music videos you shoot, you know, like many films. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I actually just wrapped up doing, like, a short film the other day. Oh, wow. I show T. I can't wait to see it.

Yeah, yeah. It's funny when you come out to L.A. I mean, you lived here for a while, but when you come out here, there's something in the air where you're like, well, so many other creative people here. Yeah. We've got to create something while we're here. It feels like, and I was talking about this the other day, I feel like, obviously, accomplishing something is possible in other states other than California. Of course. I feel like when you have something that you like doing or that you're, you're not.

that you love doing. It can be a hobby in other places, but I feel like coming here in LA, like really anything is possible. I think as soon as I moved out here, I started to realize, like, it doesn't matter what business you have, what idea you have.

People are so consistent out here. And that consistency can turn into opportunity and that opportunity can turn into a career. Yeah. And yeah, it's amazing to see. It's inspiring to be around and to witness and to see everything and, you know, say to yourself, like, man,

this is possible. It might not be easy. Yeah. But it is possible. There's something about, like the best of the best live out here, the best directors, the best producers, the best actors, the best cinematographers. I mean, it's crazy to think where we're sitting right now, Brad Pitt lives like five miles away or, you know, Jennifer Anderson. I don't know why I'm naming just those two, but, you know, some of the biggest names live within five, 10, 15 miles of here. Yeah.

And to think that that's, I don't know, That's here. Yeah. It makes you feel like anything's possible. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's really, um, one thing that definitely tripped me out moving here is I, I mean, I used to watch, I don't watch as much TV as I used to. Nobody does.

Yeah. But when I, when I was heavily watching TV, I mean, it was shows kind of like based out here in L.A. Yeah. And then moving out here, um, and having, uh, that opportunity of being on a reality of being on a TV show being in front of, you know, other celebrities within the entertainment industry and not just so much, like in Florida, whereas, you know, majority like wrestlers or like musicians and like actors and stuff too. But like I said, like the hub is. Yeah, they're not filming as many movies there. Yeah. Yeah. So being able to be around those people and then like meeting those people,

I'm like, man, I just started watching the show that you were on about like two weeks ago and now I'm talking to you face to face. I'm able to pick your brain. I mean, able to actually develop like a relationship with you. There's so many people that I watched on TV came out here in LA and now I'm like so close with them. Yeah. They're like to my friends now. It's interesting when you go to an event here and you're like, oh, like I went to the premiere of Jayla's new movie, Shotgun Wedding. Yeah. And I was just like, oh, that's Ben Affleck right there. Yeah. And then I turned and bumped into Michael Bisbing in the bathroom. Like, what are you even doing here? Like you're a UFC fighter. Yeah, my daughter's into movies. I'm like, this is awesome.

Yeah. And that type of thing happens here all the time. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So going back to what we were talking about, did you wanting to wrestle again come from, I want to provide for my family and this thing can make me a lot of money? Or was it just, man, I miss wrestling? Both, really.

And family has always been there for me. It always will be there. It always will be my number one priority. And the reason why I do what I do. Having more experience in wrestling and, you know, having my kids get older, I always say, like, I do this, I do this for them now. This is my reason for doing it. You know, before that, you know, I was a fan of wrestling. I wanted to become a professional wrestler for me. It was a goal for me. It was what I wanted to do for me. But now with so many people that I love and care for and provide for, I feel like I'm doing this for them. But there was, a rare switch in me recently that I feel like I haven't felt since I wanted to get signed to WWE. And it was feeling like this is what I'm meant to do.

You know, I grew up being a fan of wrestling. I grew up dedicating, you know, my athletic skill set to, you know, morph myself into being a professional wrestler. Like, I became an amateur wrestler so that I can be a professional wrestler. Oh, wow. You know, I was an All-American and amateur wrestling, but I never wanted to wrestle at a collegiate level. I didn't want that. I wanted to take that skill set and use it to have a strong foundation in professional

wrestling. But it was definitely that switch that went off that said, this is what I'm supposed to do. This is what I worked so hard for. literally blood, sweat and tears to get to where I am at the age that I'm at. And yeah, it feels like this is what I'm supposed to be doing right now. I feel like I could, I'm not going to say I feel like I can. I feel like I am the best wrestler in the world. I feel like, but with me saying that, it always sparks.

So you know what people are thinking right now. But that's how much I believe in myself a lot. I feel like I've shown myself a lot. And I feel like I can't afford to say that to myself. And when I say that... But you're not just saying it to yourself. I'm not saying that just myself. I'm saying that to everybody.

Because if I don't say it, and if I don't put it out there and make people think like, oh, is Leo the best wrestle in the world? Why is he saying this? Let me pay attention to some of his matches just a little bit closer than I was before. Let me try to see is what he's saying. Is it true? Does it have some kind of, you know, truth to it? But what do you think about, like, what is, you know,

people that are widely considered, quote-unquote, the best in the world? Like, what does Daniel Bryan think of you saying you're the best in the world? What is Will Osprey think of you saying you're the best in the world? or John Moxley or Cody Rhodes or Roman Raines. I would hope that they would say the same thing that I would say. I hope that they would say, good for you. You know what I mean? Like, I feel like if you're not saying that you're the best in the world,

like, you know, what are you really working towards? Why are you doing this? What is your drive? Where is your motivation coming from? I feel like, Will Osprey is. the best wrestling in the world. And he should think that he is the best wrestler in the world. I feel like he's definitely...

He's pretty incredible. He's incredible. But I feel like he's incredible at what he does. You know, I don't want to, you know, still a quote from from Chris Jericho or Triple H of, you know, saying, you know, I'm the best wrestler or I do what I do best, better than anybody. You know, something around those lines. and I feel like I have my own style and my own way of doing things,

and I'm the best at doing it that way. There's certainly this mentality of like if you are going to go somewhere and your goal isn't to be the champion, what are you doing? And I feel like that's what you're saying. Like if your goal is not to be the top guy, what's the point? Yeah, but I understand that a lot of people don't want to be in that position. A lot of people, you know, there's some people that choose to be in the position that they're in. And they don't really aspire to reach any higher than that, which is completely fine.

I feel like I'm kind of in that stage right now within my life. Like, my perception on life is so different than what it was when I was 16, 17, 18 years old, of saying, I want the most, you know, I want to be rich. I want to be, I want to have this or have that. And right now, like, these things will be nice, but I realize that these things don't, these things don't make you truly happy. You know, being a top guy doesn't make you a happy guy in wrestling. You know what I mean? It's not the same, it's not on the same, like, playing field. I feel like whatever makes you happy, you know, makes you happy. It doesn't have to be the ultimate success to to make you feel like you've accomplished something.

Yeah. And that's what I'm, that's what I'm kind of figuring out right now, learning how to celebrate my wins and not move on to the next thing, you know, so quickly. Yeah, I'm happy with where I'm at right now. But I also want more for myself. I want more for my family. I feel like I have earned. more for myself.

I don't like using the word deserve anymore. I feel like nobody really deserves anything. Yeah. If you talk about not wanting to be injured anymore, the role you were in in WWE was a pretty good role to not get injured anymore, like to be a manager. Yeah, but I was also 21 years old. I had a different brain back then.

I had a different kind of drive. Would you want to go back? back into that role. It's an interesting, you know, it's an interesting scenario because you're like, I don't want to get injured anymore, which means less wrestling would probably reduce the risk of getting injured. Yeah. But then maybe you don't want to be in a managerial role. Well, it's like, well, then that increases the risk of possibly getting injured. Yeah. I, I, um, when I got put in that

role, it was very confusing for me. It's very confusing. It's very frustrating. Um, But you also get the rub of a top guy then. Yes, yes. There's a lot of pros to it. I think it was confusing for me. I didn't really know how to wrap my head around what was actually happening. Things were just moving so quickly. I feel like I didn't really have a chance to think to myself or just have a grasp on, you know, why I feel so upset.

And I think getting older. and not being in that environment anymore, just realizing, you know, I just got signed to WWE. I'm 21, 22 years old. I was able to get signed here without, like, really a tryout or anything, but I got noticed because of my wrestling. Yeah, in Ring of Honor.

In Ring of Honor. And then when you get told to be in a speaking role, and mainly just like a speaking role, yeah, I'm still so, I feel like I'm still so hungry athletically. And I feel like I just got to this place where, you know, I've always wanted to be, I grew up an athlete, my entire life feels like I should be an athlete, feels like I should be doing something physical, and I made it somewhere, you know, at the top of this mountain, doing something physical and being the best at doing something physical. So when that physicality kind of got like chopped from underneath me at 21, 22 years old, you know, I didn't grow up like four or five, six years old saying that I wanted to be a manager in WWE. So I feel like I also got a little scared and nervous that, okay, this is going to be my legacy in WWE. Like I worked so hard, so many years,

to try to be a professional wrestler in WWE. And then that stamp of like, okay, you're a manager. And I didn't really know how to sit with that. And I was making decent money. I was out there with Bobby Lashley, a guy that I grew up watching and admired still to this day. What do you think is the biggest thing you learned from Bobby and spending that much time with him in WWE?

I think the biggest thing that I got reminded of, I give all the praise and props in the world to my late trainer, R.J. Meyer, the bruiser who passed away, unfortunately, to leukemia. But he used to tell me all the time, as well as another trainer mine, that this business is a marathon, not a sprint. And I would always play, like, replay that. quote in my head. And I knew what it meant, but I feel like I needed to go through something within wrestling to make me truly understand what that meant. And I think being with Bobby, seeing the things that he accomplished, seeing that he left, you know, WWE came back, is still, you know, flourishing, still has, you know, a healthy career and everything showed me that, uh, um, That it's a marathon.

Yeah. He's 15 years older than you. Yeah, yeah. So think of what you could do between now and 43. Yeah. Like, it's all about longevity and getting the most out of what you're presented because it might not always be like that. I feel like I definitely made the most out of being a manager for Bobby.

I feel like it helped me in so many ways that I just wasn't even. thinking about or going into it, not realizing that this is going to help my talking so much. Yeah, you cut a great promo. No, I appreciate it. And I was never a promo guy on the independent circuit before getting signed. You know, I was just always that young kid like, oh, this is Leo Rush, it's the new kid. Look what he can do in the ring, stuff like that. I mean, I can talk.

I wasn't like stumbling over my words or anything like that. But I wasn't making people feel anything. I feel like I didn't really have a voice. And I feel like being in WWE, being so attached and invested into a specific character, helped me find a voice or showed me how to find a certain voice. I thought it was interesting when you mentioned in a different interview that Kevin Hart inspired that character you had in WW. Yeah, yeah, he really did. there was

a point in time in NXT right when I got signed to WWE when I was doing some house loop shows around the Florida area Kevin Hart Chance would break out

like in the audience and you know nobody ever wants to be called somebody else but for me it was a huge compliment and I was really enjoying it you know

I if I could give off that feel that Kevin Hart gave me, like, watching them on screen or watching them on a stand-up special or whatever. Yeah, I just wanted to be a small, loudmouth, you know, such like a big presence for, like, a smaller guy. Yeah. Like, that's what I wanted. You know, that character was supposed to be, like, loud, brash, arrogant, cocky. and I feel like it worked like really well.

It did. Maybe a little bit too well. People started hating me, really. I feel like people started to believe that's who you were. Yeah, no, for sure. Look, I know you've got goals and Factor is here to help you achieve each and every one of them. Fuel up fast with ready to eat nutritious meals delivered straight to your door, leaving you time and energy to tackle everything.

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there was a certain part of like you got a lot of stuff really early in your life. And I'm not saying that you didn't earn it at all. Obviously you did. But do you think there was a point where people were like, man, this guy's only 22. And he's already signed to WWE doing these things. He's on raw with this big storyline going on right now. Man, I wish I had that right now. Do you think there was some jealousy there? I really don't know. You know, I don't want to say, I don't want to say yes, because I really don't know. You know, it's not like people were coming up to me and saying these things.

But there were definitely people that were like, like, there were times in WWE where you would ask for something and then they would just take you off of TV. Yeah. Do you feel like in hindsight, maybe you should have just rolled with it? I always say that I don't, I rarely regret anything. Because I like learning from experiences. I like learning from, you know, whether those are good or bad or from my own doing or somebody leading me in that path or direction. I just like learning from an experience because I feel like it just makes you a stronger person. Builds character, builds personality, whatever the case may be.

Going through that in WWE. And I don't think I would have handled it. handled it any differently. I don't regret, you know, I wouldn't say like acting out, but I don't regret reacting to certain situations the way that I did because now I know not to. You know what I mean? Like, I'm glad that I got it all out the way. When I was 20, 21, 22, I'm glad that, you know, and these are, these are stories, you know, at the end of the day, like these are stories that I can, you know, either tell my kids or my kids are going to grow up reading about it or listening to it in some way. And I think the overall story here is that Leo fights for what he truly wants.

Like, I feel like I'm a fighter. I feel like, and in a respectable way, too, I feel like I really believe in myself. I feel like I feel like I, I feel like I, I feel like I, I have a lot. have a necessary confidence to continue to push forward. Yeah, I feel like I'm my own motivation, I'm my own drive, on my own inspiration. And I don't really like settling for things if I truly feel like the next thing is in reach. But sometimes you don't know how close you are to that.

I know. You really don't know. And I've heard from many people that in WWE, it's your mouth shut and your ears open. Yeah. But then on the flip side of that, it's the squeaky wheel gets the grease. So it's like, well, which one do you go with? Right. Do you just keep your mouth shut for a year, two, five, ten? Or do you go, hey, I actually think that I deserve more here.

There's that word again. I can't say deserve anymore. I can't say deserve because I feel like a lot of people if you work hard you know I feel like a lot of people deserve some some fruits for their labor

but I also understand that it doesn't work like that Maybe they earn it? Yeah they can earn it I'm the kind of person like you said like the the squeaky will against the grease I kind of like to have the squeaky wheel but also make my own But it's made a lot of people feel that you're like controversial because you're like, I will say what I think right now.

And maybe you do it in a respectful way, but it's like you'll put it out there. I'm a lot more reserved than I used to be for sure. You know, everything doesn't always need to be said. And that's from learning. Yeah, exactly. So like right now I'm just doing what I'm doing. What are you doing right now? What's the main focus is wrestling?

Main focus is... You would split up between wrestling and music. Is it 80, 20? Is it 6040? It's 50-50? I think my main goal right now is to just be happy. I like that. Yeah, it's not really a wrestling thing or it's not really a music thing.

I feel like I'm just doing things that truly make me happy. Like right now, wrestling is making me so happy, making my music is making me so happy. Being healthy makes me happy. You know. Do you think the path that you're on right now will lead you back to WWA? Things have changed a lot since you left WWA.

I think that it potentially could. I think it, yeah, I think it potentially could lead me, back to WWE. I think at a certain point, it would ultimately be up to me, whether I want to go that route again or not. I realize that nothing is forever. So being presented certain opportunities, I truly want to make the most out of them. And I want to do my absolute best to make sure sure there's no, you know, wasted time, no wasted movement, no wasted effort. And every little thing that I do needs to be a building block to, you know, a bigger legacy or a bigger, whatever the case may be to continue to do the things that I want and to continue to create opportunities

for my kids to be able to do what they truly want. So if, you know, spend, you know, spend in another three, five, ten years in WWE to build something bigger than me. Then I'll take that. And I feel like me going through that process and me already knowing what that system is like and how things are ran. I mean, who knows if it's ran the same, I have no idea. But I think already having that experience and having that. that showing on their television network could work out of my favor.

I mean, I see it all the time. I think a great example of that, and obviously he's not the only one, but I definitely, I mean, I've seen in real time, you know, Drew McIntyre getting released coming back. I wrestled him when he was back on the Indies. And I think I'm not mistaken, I think I was his very last match on the Indies or second to last match before he ended up going back. Yeah, there's a few that stick out in my mind of like leaving WWE with one perception. Yeah.

Reinventing yourself completely. Yeah. And then coming back. So Drew's obviously one. Cody. Cody. Yeah. And then what Matt Cardona is doing right now.

Yeah, yeah. Matt's so smart. Yeah. Right. And I feel like that's possible really for anybody. Yeah. Like you can either rest on the laurels of like, all right, you knew me for this because you saw me on Mondays and Fridays as this character.

Or I'm doing this completely different thing now, and if you haven't seen one of my matches recently, you should probably check them out. Yeah, yeah. I, um, yeah, it's just so, it's so, it's, life is just so, uh, interesting to me right now. I just feel like I'm, I'm going through a lot, but I'm also learning a lot, uh, um, at the same time.

Going through a lot personally, professionally. Both, yeah. Personally, professionally. I feel like people have literally seen me grow up on TV or on screen or on social media or anything like that. The difference between 22 and 32 and you're not even there yet. Yeah. He's massive. Yeah.

And I feel like even the difference between your early 20s and your late 20s is a big experience. I really feel it. I truly feel it. But I also feel that I still have so much more learning to do, so much more growing up to do. I'm just glad that it's happening. I'm glad that I'm making the right strides. A lot of it's happening pretty publicly, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's got to be difficult. Yeah, it is difficult. I think it's, I struggle with. this new social media era. In a lot of ways, even like simply using TikTok, I have no idea how people use it as well as they do. And I'm 28 years old.

I should probably know how to work this app and everything. But I just don't. I feel like I've gotten taught by kind of like old souls within wrestling and, like, just in life, I feel like I had to grow up very quickly. As a teenager, obviously, there was some kind of slow growing up process in my 20s. I think a lot of that had to, you know, deal with processing my success at a young age. Yeah, on top of, you know, being a dad to, to, my now three boys. Yeah.

I'm, um. Is there any part of that being a provider of going, it was pretty cool having a steady paycheck in WW. It was pretty great having a steady paycheck in AEW. Like, is that something that you want to do? Like, sign a contract somewhere and go, all right, at least every two weeks, I know I'm getting X amount of dollars. I think, I think, so being signed to WW, being signed to AW, you know, working for New Japan, working, you know, everywhere, just having different, you know, working experiences at different levels.

I think it's just helped me, you know, grow a skill set to work towards success. like what needs to be done in order to obtain this. And I feel like I have a pretty good grasp on what needs to be done. Do you look at a calendar and go, I need this many bookings per month in order to pay all the bills? Not really. Not really. I think me wanting probably a contract has a little bit more to do with freeing up.

some time so that I can do something else. It's not that I don't know how to, you know, do certain things. I don't, it's not like I don't know how to make, you know, money within wrestling. It's just to properly do it, you know, it takes some, some time, some investment. Yeah. And I really think it needs a platform, too. Yeah. You know, there's a giant portion of wrestling fans that don't watch anything that's not

WWE or that don't watch anything that's not AEW and you could be a massive thing on the Indies and you're missing out on a big sector of people that aren't watching one of those other shows. Yeah. And the independent circuit is so unpredictable when it comes to either money, like guaranteed money that you're making from like merchandise sales or whatever the case may be. You know, every independent is different. Every state is different. And it's just kind of like a, you know, you get what you get, where you get it. Yeah. And it's so kind of like unstable in that sense as well as physically, you know, you get hurt on the independent circuit.

It's not like you have your performance center. It's not like you have your trainers checking up on you, like literally every single day. Yeah. You know. So I think the more experience you have in wrestling, I feel like you want that stuff. At least I do. I want to do things in a professional way on all aspects. I want to train professionally. I want to heal.

I want to rehab professionally. I don't want to just, you know, go back home, put a band around my leg and, you know, hope that's going to do something. You know, I want, you know, if I'm going to be the best of the best, like in wrestling, I kind of want those other things to trail, you know, behind that so that I can keep up at a certain level. Do you think that any of this will lead you back to A.W? Like, was the door left open when you left there? I think so.

It was so quick that you were there. Yeah, yeah. I know you've spoken about that, you know, in other interviews, but it just feels like you showed up there. And then less than a year later, it was done. Yeah. No, I think anything is possible if you have, like, the right intentions. If you're coming from the right place, one thing that I've learned from out here in L.A. is, you know, people do business with people that they like.

You know, it doesn't really have much to do with, with talented. You can have the most talent in the world. But if your attitude is poor or if you're, you know, if you're not, if you don't have the right intentions towards that person that you want to, you know, work with, and things aren't really going to work out the way that you want them to. But I feel like if you're a decent human being, you're hardworking, you're respectable, your focus, you're determined. I feel like anything can kind of lead back to, you know, any door can truly be open.

Was the hatchet buried with Tony Kahn? Because, like, you know, you called him out on social media. Yeah. Pretty publicly. Yeah. And I know that you guys did speak about that. Yeah. But did you feel like there was still some animosity after that?

Probably, a little bit. I mean, how can there not be? But I think Tony, I like Tony a lot. I really, I really, I really, I really like Tony. I think that's the first time I'm saying that out loud. Can't take it back now. Yeah, I can't take it back now. But I do like Tony.

And I like, I, um, I, um, that was one thing that, that, that made me so willing to give A.W. A chance because I feel like I was scarred, um, from my WW run. I feel like I was, you know, traumatized a little bit. Obviously, Tony liked you a lot. Yeah, Tony. Tony, Tony, he doesn't bring people in. He's not interested in. Yeah.

Yeah. I feel like we connected pretty quickly. And I feel like that's why things probably. there was a lot of emotion involved. And I probably shouldn't have brought the emotion out. But I'm glad, again, I'm glad that I did. I'm glad that I, you know, I'm glad that I'm glad that I'm glad that I show people that I stand for something.

I'm glad that I show people that I care about. myself, I care about others. It's not always about a paycheck to me. Yeah, I, I, and I'm sorry, I'm kind of, I mean, this is huge for me. Like, really, because this is the first time that I'm really, really speaking on it. Like, you know, I've talked about it, but I haven't really, really talked about it in that sense. like with my actual like relationship with Tony and stuff like that. Have you talked to him since you left AEW?

Yeah, yeah, I've talked to him a few times. Yeah, yeah. We've talked a number of times. And it's always great. It's always, you know, how you been. Good to hear from you. You know, if a show is in the area, I try to like pop out and see it and stuff like that. So the love is still there.

The support is still there. Yeah, I think. There's just other factors into me actually being there. I mean, I'm doing so much right now. I'm happy with what I'm doing. It's not really like I'm trying to force something to happen. You know, if it happens, it happens. But I love the direction that I'm going in right now.

I love what I'm doing. I'm glad that I feel like I don't really have any true, like, bad blood within wrestling. I feel like with me being so active right now and being in front of people, it's a lot different when you're in front of somebody. You can see them. You can kind of feel their energy. You can see why they're doing what they're doing and stuff like that. So I think a lot of people with me popping back up like this so consistently and so on. Kind of like making a pretty big splash with any show that I, that I, that I,

I do. I feel like people are starting to see me and see my characteristics more in, you know, who I am as a person, as a performer, maybe respecting my work a little bit more, realizing that I'm 28, but I've been doing this for almost a decade now. I think people are just kind of come into terms and just really starting to see me. Yeah, it's a nice, it's a nice, feeling. Do you have goals for, you know, 30? 30's right around the corner. Do you have goals for like, by the time I hit 30, I want to do this, this, this?

I really want to be a world champion. I feel like I am, I feel like I'm more than capable. Where do you think that's possible? Is it MLW? I think it's possible anywhere. I think there's probably some more steps. that need to happen in order to get to to to to to that in certain places like it's not going to be the same process in like an MLW than like a WW or a new Japan than a AWW just just different systems different fan bases different you know ways of going about things but I feel like I I feel like I have the the work ethic to be a world champion.

I feel like I have the story to be a world champion. I feel like a lot of people can get behind me. I feel like me being as open as I am sometimes works out in my favor just because, and I don't like using the word like a influencer or anything like that. But I feel like I have influenced a lot of people. whether they're like fans or current wrestlers like this new generation of wrestlers. I feel like I've had like multiple times where wrestlers would come up to me and say like, man, I was like 15, you know, watching you when you were in Ring of Honor.

And I'm like, man, that's so it just kind of like blows my mind. Yeah, you definitely fall into that category of like guys who got signed really early, talent, they got signed really early. So someone who's just getting into wrestling school now at 18's going, well, man, If Leo did it at 21, 22, I'm only three or four years away. Yeah, yeah. I definitely feel like it's possible. So if there's someone who's only seen your work in WWE,

what match do they need to go watch right now to see what you're really all about? What match do they need to see right now? What match should they go back and watch that you're really proud of that shows what Leo Rush is all about? I would definitely have to pick one. that I, man. I love how careful you are with your work. Because I'm thinking about the matches that I've had since I came back for my injury. I feel like I've done some pretty cool things.

And at first I was going to say, oh, you should watch, you know, you should watch my matches in the Super Junior Tag League. and then but my instinct you know I'm like well these aren't singles matches these are these are you know tag matches and but I think anything that I'm doing right I feel like you can you can you can see what kind of performer in person I am through my through my wrestling I think a good example is my my wrestle kingdom match being split open literally 30 seconds into the match like really badly um and And me continuing to, you know, push forward and push on and have a strong showing. I thought that that was pretty cool. I feel like it showed my fight, my will to win, my hunger, my desire to push past all of the, you know, things that may stop me or stop, you know, a quote-unquote normal man.

But I want to say watch my match with Dustin Waller. Okay. And it's crazy to say that because I haven't wrestled for Beyond Wrestling in years, like seven years. And it's not the, you know, you're not going to Beyond Wrestling and you see the big lights and you see the stage and you see thousands and thousands of people. No, you're in, you know, Worcester, Massachusetts. You're in a building with 200 people, a curtain to come out. But I feel like I've never been so passionate and hungry in those matches. So wow me saying this.

I'm just really glad that I'm wrestling again. I'm really glad that I'm able to show people my progression in wrestling, being able to work a lot smarter than I used to. But I think anything that I'm doing right now, really, like, watch every match that I'm that I, that I, watch tonight's match at GCW. Watch tonight's match at GCW. Watch my IWGP junior title match with Haramu. I feel like that matches That's a match that I feel like It's like one of those moments And like where I feel like

Everything happened for this reason That's the kind of the feeling that I have Going into this match Like this match is happening for a reason On this platform, on this stage At this specific time It's for a title And it's really

right is coming right off of the most adversity I've ever had like in my life. You mentioned Drew and the transformation that he made when he went back to WWA. A lot of that was he put on a ton of size to mass. I feel like Ray Mysterio did a similar thing where when he put on mass, he was viewed as a main eventer. You ever thought about, like, what if you put on 20, 30 pounds of muscle? I put on about 20 pounds. So really, I think you weigh right now.

this turtleneck. Right now, man. I've also put on some masks. Yeah, I see it. I see it, man. That's why I'm wearing these t-shirts and just sit here like, yeah, it's a good question. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What do you weigh as you sit here right now?

Right now, I am probably legitimately 165. Okay. You used to weigh in the 140s? I used to weigh 140. When I was in WWE, I was probably about like 140. Wow. Probably on a really good day. if I was good diet, working out consistently,

I'd come in like a lean 138. Whoa. Yeah, during a match. And after my surgery, because I separated my AC joint, my right shoulder, had like a six-month, a four-to-six-month recovery for that. And then I was wrestling for about five months. And then I ended up tearing my labrum and my bicep and my left shoulder.

had to get surgery for that was out for 11 months. And so now I'm walking around with kind of two bat shoulders. You need some stem cells from the sounds of it. I got some stem cells. Okay, good. Yeah. Bio accelerator? Yeah.

Yeah. So I'm up and moving. I'm like the Terminator now. Everyone talks about how like a big of a change that is for rehab. Yeah. Without turning this into a stem cell commercial. No, yeah, yeah. But I mean, I avoided surgery with my right shoulder.

So that's amazing. My left one was just way too messed up to. to I needed surgery for that one. But yeah, I put on, I put on some size. You ever think about what would you look like at like 190? 190. 190. Oh, my goodness. I probably would look like Otis.

No. You look like Ray, I feel like. Really? I don't know. I'm scared. I'm always scared. I'm scared to get too big. You don't have the frame to look like Otis.

I don't know, man. A mesomorph. Yeah. Yeah. That's the term. I think so. Yeah. You're more of an ectomorph.

Yeah. Oh, man. Do you think you could put on that with 30 pounds? The highest I've ever been was 176 or like 177 or something like that. I feel like I would lose. I don't want to lose my speed. Yeah, you can't lose the abs either. Yeah, I can't.

That's a mental thing. I feel like those would be pretty hard to get back to like 190. Yeah. But if I do that, then I feel like I'm going to have to do a whole bunch of other things. I'm going to have to grow a beard. I'm going to have to, like, cut my hair and be bald. But I'm sure you've seen the transition that, so there's that nutritionist that's worked with,

like Johnny Gargano, Tomaso Champa, Moose, EC3, Apollo Cruz, his name is A.J. Sims, cement factory on Instagram. I just started working with him. And it's amazing what's possible. Yeah. So just saying that, you know, those guys went through some massive,

Tomaso Champa looks unbelievable right now. Yeah, yeah. He's so inspiring to me. You know, when I was in WWE and at the Performance Center, I was there at the same time as Tomaso. And I've seen him go through injuries and rehabs. And, you know, I don't know how he's still. I think I asked him this, you know, probably,

About a year ago, it was when I got hurt. And I asked him, just how do you continue to push forward? Like how, you know, he's gotten so many procedures done and surgeries. And now he's in the best shape of his life. Yeah, yeah. And he looks incredible. He looks amazing. And I feel like he is continuing to look crazier.

Yeah. I don't know how. It's that diet. It's down right in. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So that's really inspiring to see in itself. Yeah, yeah. So what are the goals for this year? Do you have anything specific? As, you know, it's February as we sit here right now, you've got 10 more months to, as a clean slate, to do whatever it is

you want to do. Yeah. What are you, what are you focused, what are you focused on? Right now, I'm super focused on remaining healthy so that I, I can continue to wrestle. I think that's a pretty big one. I think a really big goal that I'm setting for myself that I've always wanted to do. I've never really pushed for it. I've always said it would be cool. And, you know, if it happens, it happens.

But I think I'm going to physically try to push for myself to, I really want to be in a Marvel film. I really do. I really do. I really want to make my way into becoming an actor, becoming, being able to, you know, do my own stunts if possible. Are you taking any acting classes right now? I'm not, I'm currently not taking any acting classes.

I feel like with my on-screen, like, experience with, like, WWE and having, like, such drastic character shifts and changes and stuff like that, writing out my own promos, having that TV time to remember scripts and stuff like that. I feel like I would have natural talent. I do want to remember the Rock, though, saying there's something in wrestling about doing something so the last person, the person in the last row can see and feel what you're doing. Yeah. And something in acting where it's right here. That like, you know, it's right here. And it's right here. And it's, It's small and it's subtle. And that was like, oh, I didn't even think about it.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I think I'm really inspired by what Batista is doing right now. It's really cool. I'll show you a clip after this, but he said that one of the biggest things he did to be taken seriously as an actor was he didn't have one foot in the wrestling world still. It's very, it was a show. There's The Rock told him this. He said wrestling's kind of like quicksand.

Yeah, yeah. And he said, once you get in it, that reaction from the crowd, you know you're making good money, and you can't have the other foot in the acting world because wrestling's pulling you back. That was really, really interesting. And look it, I mean, look what he's done. Yeah.

And not to say it in a bad way, but I think it's just what wrestling is, like really what it is. I think you can truly be addicted to it. Sure. I think you can be addicted to, you know, coming out and and experience that energy, you know, through the curtain and having that, that short time to, you know, paint your picture. Yeah, you've got the crowd on the palm of your hand.

Yeah, yeah. You know, you can do this and they'll cheer. You'll do this and they'll boo. Yeah. That's pretty cool. When you're on a set, it's kind of like this. You know, we're in a vacuum here. Yeah. You're just kind of doing it. Yeah. That's the end of it. Yeah. Yeah. I definitely want to work towards that. Yeah. I think it's, I think it's, I think it's, I think it's, it's very possible. I feel like you being in L.A. Even if it's just for this weekend is making you go, ooh.

Yeah. Creative stuff happens here. Well, I've always, I've always wanted to be in some kind of superhero type of, type of role. You know, I was supposed to be a, man, it's kind of emotional talking about it. I was supposed to be in The Legend of the White Dragon, the new Power Ranger movie produced by Jason David Frank, rest in peace to him. But that was my first little spark of excitement of,

man, I can really see this for myself. Every time that I wrestle, people always get excited about just like my movements and my mannerisms and my moveset and stuff like that, saying that I look like a superhero, like, in the ring. And, yeah, I see myself. I see Leo Rush being either like it's... You're allowed to use that name, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You were Leo Green for a little while. Yeah, yeah. That's a whole other story. Okay. I'll save that for another time. Yeah. It's just so good to catch up with you. No, for sure.

And I'm happy to see that you're back in wrestling. Thank you. And it's exciting to see all the things that you're doing. Yeah. And continuing to grow both as a wrestler and as a man. Yeah. And as a father. Thank you.

And as a husband. Yeah. I end every conversation talking about gratitude. It's such an important part of my life. I wake up, I say out loud three things I'm grateful for. And I think that everybody should do this. Yeah. So what are three things in your life that you're grateful for right now?

I'm extremely grateful for my family. My wife, my kids, I can put all this in one, right? Sure. It's your list. I'm extremely grateful for my family. I feel like I truly feel like I wouldn't be alive without my family. I feel like a really good support system is good and necessary in order to truly get to where you want to be in life.

So I'm extremely grateful for my family. I'm grateful for all of the people who aren't blood relatives, but love and genuinely care about me just as a person. They see me. They know what my story is. They see what I'm about. And they want to help. So I'm extremely grateful for, you know, all of my fans and my friends who I've developed close relationships with through the entertainment industry.

Really, I truly feel like the entertainment industry has changed my life. It's taken me out of a situation that I probably don't have to go back to. So I'm extremely grateful for. for that. And I can never take for granted the fact that I am still living right now. I've struggled so much in the past and still to this day with anxiety, depression, just PTSD, just trauma from my past, and working, you know, to... learn how to navigate my days without going too far off in the deep end. Because I mean, I have, I know this is pretty serious.

But yeah, I have had, you know, a suicide attempt. I have thought about, you know, times. And I'm sure it's, you know, it's a very serious thing. And I know there's a lot of people out there that go through similar things, but don't really touch on the subject personally or out loud are people who, you know, we've only met a handful of times, but I feel like for me to be able to sit here, realize the things that I've gone through and being able to verbally say, I've gone through these things that have made me want to, you know, in my life and

have attempted this. I feel like shows a lot of growth within me. And I love being able to inspire people. And I like being able to inspire people like unintentionally. I don't really try to, you know, be the person to say things to help people get through something. You know what I mean? Like I'm so, I'm very focused on myself and what my, mission is and what my path and my goal is for myself and for my family that I rarely realize how much of an impact that I have on people saying certain things like that but I'm really grateful that I'm that I'm still pushing through and pushing forward and able to accomplish things in real time and and currently while at the

same time having more goals and more dreams and looking towards the future. So, yeah, my family, I'm grateful for, genuinely grateful for my fans and my, you know, friends that I've randomly made over the years. And, yeah, I'm grateful to be a lot. I'm grateful that we're able to see, you know, the rest of this story. Yeah, for sure. Dude, thank you so much.

I appreciate you always being so open, so honest about everything. Yeah. And just good to catch up with you again. No, thanks, man. I enjoyed this very, very much. I'm excited. I'm excited to be in the studio. I know we had to do this last time on Skype in front of my little banner and my room.

No more of that. I want to do these in person all the time. So thank you for coming by. Thank you. No, really I appreciate it. Well, there we go. I feel like this conversation is the definition of the name of the show.

Insight. So much insight there. And so good to catch up with Leo while he was here in town. And thank you to him for making some time during his very busy trip to L.A. And as always, thank you for being with us on this one.

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