Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Jeff Jarrett On Creating TNA, Being Fired From WWE, Chyna, AEW, Taylor Swift Babysitting His Kids

Episode Date: July 2, 2026

Jeff Jarrett (@RealJeffJarrett) is an AEW wrestler, WWE Hall of Famer and the founder of TNA Wrestling. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Nashville, TN to discuss him and TNA being featured on "Dark Side of the Ring", being fired on WWE TV, where the six-sided ring came from, his current relationship with Dixie Carter, wrestling Chyna in WWE and TNA, his favorite guitar shots, being inducted into the WWE Hall of Fame, Taylor Swift babysitting his kids, and more! Please support our sponsors: HELIX SLEEP: Flash sale! Go to https://helixsleep.com/cvv for 27% off sitewide! COZY EARTH: Go to https://cozyearth.com/CVV for up to 20% off! BEAM: Go to https://shopbeam.com/INSIGHT and use code INSIGHT for up to 40% off Beam’s Dream Powder DELETEME: Use the code INSIGHT to get 20% off your DeleteMe plan at https://joindeleteme.com/INSIGHT FACTOR: Get 50% off your first box, plus Free Breakfast for 1 Year with the code INSIGHT50OFF at https://factormeals.com/INSIGHT50OFF PURE PLANK: The future of core fitness! Use the code CVV to save 10% on Pure Plank designed by Adam Copeland & Christian: https://gopureplank.com/cvv SEAT GEEK: Use my code for 10% off your next SeatGeek order*: https://seatgeek.onelink.me/RrnK/CVV Sponsored by SeatGeek. *Restrictions apply. Max $20 discount NORDVPN: Exclusive deal! https://nordvpn.com/cvv Try it risk-free now with a 30-day money-back guarantee! PRIZEPICKS: Download the PrizePicks app today and use code INSIGHT to get $50 bonus credit in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup! For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://chrisvanvliet.com If you have ever enjoyed any of these episodes, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast or Spotify? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests. Follow CVV on social media: Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Jeff Jarrett, great to see you. How about it, my man? We're doing it. As I was making way over here to our studio here, I broke back memories. I don't remember what year that was, but it was Baltimore at a convention, and we ended up right beside each other. Yes. I don't know. You remember that?

Of course I remember that. That was probably five or six years ago. Yeah, yeah. MCW. Yes. Yep. And I was like, this guy's good. Yeah.

And I have. I've respected your work, no BS. But I was thinking, that's probably the first time we really officially or formally met. So, congrats to all your success. Oh, thank you. That's very kind coming from you. No, all kidding aside. It's a dog eat dog world, and it's a grind.

And I'm sure you are well aware of the wrestling industry. It's not easy. You know, personality is all over the place. So, kid, you've done well for yourself. Well, thank you. And I'm glad we finally got to sit down in person for this. How about that? And do it.

This dark side of the ring, season seven is coming out on July 7th. There's three episodes about you and TNA and everything around that. And it's crazy because I feel like they're just scratching the surface, too. What's bizarre is, and you know, Evan Husney, I have been a fan of the show, but I wasn't out of the gate because, look, being a third generation guy, it was, you know, it has told stories that don't reflect maybe the best light on the industry. But as you kind of dig in season after season, a member Dutch Mantell enlightened me, and then of course the Owen episode

and just different episodes, and I've done a few in that it's done in-depth, very respectful way. And so it's, when they approached me, Chris, it was like, oh, wow, I'm being approached about a dark side of the ring, and I've watched plenty of episodes,

And a lot of folks candidly don't get the opportunity to maybe talk about the light side. There's a dark side. But, you know, my story, as it sits today, it went through some dark components. But, man, coming out of it, I'm very grateful. So when they approached me, I thought it was really interesting. And, you know, we're going to do, you know, just assume one episode. and we got into, hey, we may end up doing two episodes, and then, hey, we may end up doing three episodes.

And, you know, I first thought it was all me. And then when you hear, I'll call it the other part of the story, the backstory or whatever it may be that kind of came to light, is that, you know, evident plan to kind of do a T&A story. And then maybe a Jeff story. And then as they got into it, the network was like, hey, man, this is the story. Well, you can't tell the story of TNA without telling the story of Jeff Jarrett. And even say it in Dark Side of the Ring, TNA was built out of desperation.

Because at that point in time, you'd just been fired from WWE. There was nowhere else for you to go at this point. Well, it's funny how even, you know, we were talking before the camera's rolling about being misunderstood. being fired, and I've been let go fired numerous times. But the reality was Vince did quote unquote fire me on TV, but, you know, I was still going to have a contract for the next seven or eight, nine months. So that was a storyline that has grown that Jeff got fired and started TNA. The reality was I was paid through the end of October.

And when that was over, I kind of sat back and, said, okay, I never made a call to say, hey, man, J.R. Vince, you got a job for me. You just kind of look back and know your place in the industry and go, you have no leverage. None. It was a man, it certainly wasn't a wrestler's market. Vince, you know, without a number two, there is no number one. It was Vince owning the entire game. And so that is, really the thought process that went through my mind is that, man, there's a real opportunity here. And so it's just one of those things that, you know, TNA, just the narrative that is out there, as you say, it built out of desperation. I believe it was built out of an opportunity. Do you feel

like you're misunderstood? You know, one of the things in sobriety that you really have to drill down on is that I can't control how other people perceive me, whether they understand me or not. But I will say this, my podcast partner, Conrad Thompson, who obviously I've done a podcast every week for five years, he said when he first approached me, he said, Jeff, you are the most misunderstood wrestling personality, I believe, in the history of the business. that kind of hit me like, that's interesting that, you know, I see the, for better or worse, I see the wrestling business or I see life through Jeff's eyes, obviously. But the misunderstood part kind of struck me in that I can see where Conrad or you or others

would say that being, and it started before I went national, and I say going to the WWF, you know, in the territory days. There's some folks that knew back then. He's the promoters kid. He's got everything easy. If you talk to the ones that were really around, they would tell you different. And, you know, me and my father's relationship paid for that.

And he went out of his way. As I sit here today, I'm very grateful. But he made it a point to make it harder on me than any of the other boys. and I know now why it was based off of the promoter he worked for Nick Goulis. Nick Goulis had a son named George and Nick gave his son George any and everything he wanted and kind of saw how that wasn't good for George and certainly wasn't good for the promotion. So that's, you know, part of me being misunderstood started kind of from day one. And so it's a part of my makeup that I just know you got a role with it.

it is what it is. Is it also the balance in TNA of being the owner of the company and also being the top guy? Do you give yourself the championship? If so, how many times, right? That's a balance. Yeah, man. And that is something that, you know, internally, even Dixie, you know, weighed in as we got going along in that I would always stop folks when it really got into a discussion. That's been tell, Vince Rousseau, Jeremy Bolle, Jeremy.

Borash, Scott DeMore, folks that were in the room, they were well aware. But when I had to really have that conversation, when I knew that it probably needed to be said, I would look at somebody and say, do you really think that Jeff Jarrett, you know, that has the most money at risk is going to make a decision based on ego rather than dollars and cents? My money's at stake. I'm the single largest shareholder of the promotion. I have a fiduciary responsibility to my investors. It was such the nonsense and the thought process that he's making himself champion for glory is laughable, especially me being a third-generation guy and being around the business since a little kid.

it was always so laughable, but again, it was something I couldn't control, so it was what it was. Do you feel like, do you have regrets about the way you booked yourself in TNA? None. My track record, I'll say this, our track record speak for itself. We went from a Wednesday night pay-per-view only to Fox Sportsnet to one hour on a Saturday night off-prime on sports. Pike TV to a one hour on Thursday nights off prime to a one hour of prime time to a two hour of prime time under my leadership. So during that build and knowing, and this is what Conrad always gets fascinated about, like

the numbers and the budgets that we worked under, we worked under shoestring budgets. And so, you know, whether it's Conrad Thompson or Jim Cornett, or Dutch or others that were, you know, in the middle of it, they understood that the only person that I can guarantee will not walk out and go to the WWE is myself. And I'm also, you know, my philosophy in booking is the baby face chase. I think you have to look at the landscape and WWE has always had, for the most part, that baby face champion, a touring champion, it's a baby face.

I didn't necessarily think that it fit our model. We had four distinct divisions, and I wanted a heal champion where the baby faces were chasing, namely, an AJ Styles as we were developing talent. Scrolling with Haley. I'm Haley Karene. I scroll with the homies here in the live chat because there's a lot to scroll through on X, on Instagram, on TikTok. Cutting through the clutter, one hot take at a time.

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I'm a huge TNA fan. The first show I ever sat front row at was a TNA show in Oshawa, Ontario, Canada. Get out of here. Yeah. The Canadian loop. That's right. Yes. Wow.

I loved the X-Division, and I love the fact now that you can see the fingerprints of the X-Division on modern wrestling. Do you realize how much the X-Division just changed the course of wrestling? I probably wouldn't realize how influential the X-Division is in today's modern wrestling. Had I not done interviews and podcast, and I'll say this. A conversation I had with Will Osprey. Will Osprey, back of Greensboro Coliseum, Stings final match, and we're just kind of catching up. But he watched Joe, AJ, and Daniels.

Unbreakable 2005. My man, Unbreakable 2005. And him and his mates, as he said, and he looked at me, he said, Jeff, he said, I watched it and says, not only do I want to do that, I can do that and I can do it better. than them. Well, look at the results. Unbelievable. Yes. But, you know, this is, and again,

talk about being misunderstood. The entire X-Division concept and creation was, I knew starting the company that there is a lot of unbelievable talent on the independency. The independence in 2002, compared to the independence in 2026, radically different. But they were a lot of talent out there, AJ Styles, among others. But there was a lot of guys out there. And I knew that they didn't have TV experience. And I'm not going to say they didn't have experience in telling stories and angles. There was never a platform.

So they knew an independent wrestling, go out and put on the absolute best match you can. It's what they had been trained to do. So I wanted to give them a real platform. And I knew that Lucha Libre was beginning to really, you know, based off the 90s, influence American wrestling. Obviously, I knew the strong style was beginning to influence the European mat style, and he's kind of a melting pot. And I can remember about, literally Chris, about a half a mile from here.

I had a conversation with my father specifically about the exhibition. And he was very negative on it. Son, they don't know how to tell stories and there's no money in this. And I'm like, Dad, yes, there is. this style is where the industry's head. It's just that simple. And so as it's progressed along, and now that I look back on it,

the X Division style of wrestling, now is the main event style of wrestling. Who do you credit for Ultimate X? The creative room. There was a number of us in the room, and I don't want to sound completely self-serving, but I knew that the latter match was so influential in, I'll call it the 90s.

Super, you know, goes with a sand, Sean and Razor. Sure. And multiples. But, you know, tables, ladders and chairs. But, you know, the ladder being, and just the, I'll say just kind of the picture and the story that a ladder match can tell, not the high spots, but the drama, that a talent is climbing literally wrong by wrong a ladder to achieve a championship. And so that was my thought in TNA often. How do we be innovative? How do we be different?

And so my thought evolved around to, I want to have a ladder match without a ladder. And I want it to have the ability to have all their high spots and do all their stuff and tell their story that they were going to, you know, have to figure somehow some way to get up top. The six-sided ring was incredible. And I love the idea that if you're flicking channel, and you see the sixth side of ring, it makes you stop. What's that? That's different. Where did that idea come from?

Antonio Pena was a, he is a big double J fan. God bless him, God rest of his soul. But he, we had done a talent exchange, ex-devision in the asylum days, and he came up, and he kind of laid out, Jeff, I want to bring you to Mexico, and, you know, obviously be the antagonist, be a big heel down the American businessman. I couldn't remember him.

explaining and someone there that was completely bottling, well, he went into, Jeff, we want to portray you as not only the king of the mountain wrestler, but also American businessman that is coming to take over. So he really laid the ground floor. And so it brought me down there, became red hot as a heel, but I can remember showing up for one of the big shows, and there's that's the six-sided ring. And this is where timing in our industry, it sounds so clichéist, but timing's everything. thing. I was down there and I knew that we were in a transition period that about to go to Orlando,

just all the different moving parts. And again, the MMA world, we're now 20 plus years into, if you go back to those days where MMA sat, it was red hot, really hot and really coming on the scene. And so the octagon was this cool looking vibe and these warriors get in there and battle it out. And then I just looked at the six-sided ring and said, okay, this is going to differentiate us from the WW. It's going to differentiate us from every other promotion, certainly WCW back in the day.

It's going to be different. And so when I looked at that from that perspective, I immediately knew I'm taking this back home. Man, fans were so upset. So upset. when the six-sided ring went away. They're even chanting. They're chanting.

We want six sides, you know. And you got Hulk Hogan in the ring, tell him you don't want six sides. This is a real wrestling ring. Folks, stay tuned to that little snippet of Darkside. But, you know, we were talking about Dark Side. There's so many things left out. Yeah, what do you feel like was left out? And I'll tell you, this is, for instance, like, I think I did a total of 18 hours,

18 hours of being interviewed for Darkside. Wow. I think Karen did seven, six or seven. That's a lot. I mean, so when you have that, me and all the different folks that are in it, that's why respect to the Dark Side and the executive producers,

it's in depth. They tell the story. But I can remember as they're this and that, but, you know, as it will appear. But I can remember there that night when the impact zone was Channing, we want six, very loud.

And I could remember that I did not hear from Dixie or Eric or Hulk. Nobody told me, hey, Jeff, this is the direction we're going. You're coming to Orlando. Just, hey, FYI. Because you just showed up.

It was a four-sided ring? I'd got in the back channel, and I just went. And this is kind of, you talk about like maybe a misunderstood part in that I knew that if I would have gone to Dixie or Hawk or Eric or anybody and said, hey guys, you're really screwing up here. I would not take the six-outer away from the ring from the fans.

It would have been self-serving. It would have been perceived as self-serving. And then when they chanted, you know, then it's even worse for me to say, yep, told you so, you idiots. But it was one of those things. But I can remember being in the impact zone that night. going. This is just the beginning of Hogan and Dixie destroying the brand.

So what years of TNA do you take credit for? As a part of the team, 2002 until September of 2009. And those are the best years. No one's going to argue that, right? Well, I'll say this. And what's crazy, you know, we talk about often on the pod, the what ifs. When you look at January of 2009 through September,

because we had had Kurt, Kevin Nash, Booker, Sting, Steiner, they'd been individuals and singles, but they came together as the main event mafia. And, you know, the qualifications to get in the faction, you had to be a former World Everywhere Champion.

What we were telling without coming out of early saying is, hey, these are the guys that are from the WW or WCW. And Nash is a guy, most famous faction of all professional wrestling NWO, Sting, the face of WCW, Kurt, you know, the wrestling machine. Those five guys together collectively as a group were super powerful in the storytelling presentation. And we had been around seven years. So AJ was obviously coming under his own.

Chris Daniel, Samoa Joe, Eric Young, Bobby Rood, James Storm, Chris Harris. We could go through all of the T&A originals. So, you know, it goes without saying you look at McMahon Austin. There was the boss employee employer. That's a real story that the fans can relate to. NWO is the WWE guys invading the WCW brand, the north versus south it was organically there when you had the you know we called on the front line but when we when you had the t-na originals against the mafia it's by far uh and you can go look it up

i don't care what people say uh the sustained ratings the momentum we were building off of that and i always thought what if that that would have kept going that's such an underrated faction i was actually just talking about this in my podcast like a month ago such an underrated faction really was yeah and and when you kind of throw in there as we were going another like real life and it's cool that we you know Mick is now with A.A.W and we're chatting about it but Mick was on board and Mick was always and always has been a huge supporter of I don't want to say to the young guys but giving guys opportunities he knew that had it not been for certain chess pieces being moved he wouldn't have an opportunity and he got the opportunity I was

the promoter. My role was the founder, but I had, you know, financial risk, everything going together. So that storyline played off to, you know, me and Mick made our names outside of TNA, both of us with both different companies on that. So when we were playing it down the middle, the people could relate to that. They bit into that. So that story never got the final, even close to the final payoff. There's a lot of momentum. But, yeah, 2002 to 2009. How's your relationship? How's your relationship with Dixie Carter now? It has always been strained. Gosh, I don't know.

Since before my first wife's passing, I would say it's been strained. But I had so much respect for her position. That is the investor's daughter and the investor, Bob Carter, and Janice played a huge role. And that's where, talk about stuff being misunderstood, that you often hear about Bob Carter, but very few people really understand what a role Janice. They were a team. They were a husband, wife, but also a team. But I respected Dixie and knew that, okay, that's, that's my bosses. That's the financial partner's daughter. I've got daughters. I respected that. So I always handled that situation and despite what she thought, tried to look out for her over and over and over. But, I mean,

we were talking about Darkside. The producers had tried to. to get Dixie to be a part of the dark side. To my understanding, multiple times, and she said no or didn't call back or whatever it was. We were on a phone call, and they were kind of him and all around. Hey, guys, do y'all want me to call Dixie and try to get her on the show? Well, yeah, we weren't going to come out and ask you. Yes, I mean, Dixie's kids and my sister and brother's kids, and before my dad's passing, they live in South Nashville, kids went to school together, they saw each other socially.

So, you know, I had no problem. And I've seen Dixie occasionally. But I just texted her and I said, hey, have you got a few minutes? I'd love to chat. She said, yeah, give me a couple hours. There was something. She said, okay, so we jumped on the phone. And I told her, I said, Dixie, I know you've been asked, dark side.

All I really want to say is I'm encouraging you to sit down and tell your version, tell your truth. she's like, well, I'm not real sure. She kind of indicated, I'll paraphrase that, you know, that part of her life is behind her and all this. And I said, Dixie, here's the real reality in this industry. You know, there's your truth. And they will say there's multiple people that are on the show, their truth. And then somewhere in the middle and there, you know, there's truth. And I wanted her to understand that I thought it was in her best interest.

and she didn't tell me no, but she never came through. Well, the way it's shown in the show is like, you've got TNA going, and then Dixie comes in, which then leads to Bischoff and Hulk coming in, and she's kind of painted as the villain, and the villain of TNA, and I think a lot of TNA fans would agree with that. I guess they booed her at that last appearance, but, you know, it's today, I'm grateful, for everything as it relates to TNA.

Do I wish things would have gone differently? Sure, but that's life. I mean, we're not brought into this world for all things to go right. And I've said this so many times, Chris, that, and I believe it wholeheartedly, it truly is impossible to have a mountaintop without valleys on each side of it. They just don't exist. And so there was some dark times. I know Karen mentally and physically exhausting.

It was hard on her to kind of relive some of those. You know, you paint her as a villain. She's not a villain in Dixie's eyes, you know, but the story, and that's where when you, there are so many things misunderstood, my role in even Hogan and Bischoff coming in. That, you know, that's where the producers, shout out, Stu, I mean, they really pulled the layers of onion back over and over and over and from multiple points of view, which I respect. It's interesting because if you don't meet Dixie Carter, TNA probably dies years ago, right?

And see, because where are you going to get the funding? So this is where the narrative, if you will, in that I hadn't even begun to look for money. So, Hell South, and that's another thing that, I mean, you can only touch on it, and they did go from two to three hours, but you can only touch on so much in this. The Hell South story in and of itself, Richard Grushy, a personal buddy of mine, you know, basically started the funding and said, let me know if when you need more type conversation. He was all into it. Well, six weeks into that, the business, things go south for him. I never once picked up the phone and say, hey, Richard, I know you're in trouble, but let's figure out something for a bridge.

There's so many different avenues that I didn't chose. When I knew the funding quit and Richard, okay, I probably need to really think through that. So I immediately, out of respect for every one of my vendors, I didn't want them, A, to hear it from somebody else. B, I wanted to be a straight up and honest. That's straight from my grandmother. Look somebody in the eye and tell them bad news before you tell them good news and they will respect you immensely. So I went to every vendor, anybody that was in that sphere, and Dixie was one of probably 15 calls I made and, I mean, stops that I made around town, the production company the pyro folks, all the different folks that I knew that, okay, we're retooling this thing quickly.

I went to her and she sat back in her chair. I'll never forget it. She's like, what are next steps? I said, I'm going to go raise capital. And she said, do you have any materials? I said, nope. She said, could you put something together? I said, I sure could.

And you saw in the screener. I had no idea who Bob Carter was or Janice Carter or Panda funds. PANDA Energy International. I had no idea of that. We had had a couple of conversations, but one serious conversation with the folks from Don King. Me and my father were going to go look for money.

Banking, that would have raked us over the coals. But that's another thing that's misunderstood that if it wouldn't been for PANDA Energy International, TNA would have gone away. I'm not saying that's a possibility, but it's not fact. Can you believe the TNA is still around now? You know, it is something deep inside of me that I come from this industry.

I grew up on stories of, hey, man, how are they doing out in San Antonio? Not Fritz. You know, people don't know that there was the Dallas territory, San Antonio, Paul Bosch, and Houston. The Crockett's in Carolina. Eddie Graham in Florida. Georgia, the Welch's in Florida, just 22 different regions. And so the business thrive in a unique way, cable television, the whole story goes. And so I know that the business only can get more successful with more promotions.

And so for TNA to still exist, to give folks a platform to learn their craft, learn how to connect with the audience, change lives. It does. This career of professional wrestling can change so many lives, some for better, some for worse. But here we are in 2026, and it started kind of as an idea in my head on this lake over here on a jet ski running up down the waters in the summer of 2001. It's pretty cool to think about it that way. when tn a rebranded in 20204 when it went from impact wrestling back to tna do you know if there was any

talk of bringing the six side of ring back i have no idea i have i've i've told multiple people this story hey what do you think about that and i immediately said about damn time i uh yes it it it is something that i believe and this is where kind of a confirmation in that um and look i i need to debate it, but when they went from TNA wrestling and the name of the television show to call Impact to Impact Wrestling as a promoter or a marketer, you talk about the old adage, confuse them, you lose them. It just went south there. And so 2017 going back, I had, you know, longer term plans. Obviously, that didn't work out. But when they finally went back, my gut told me And who knows?

And I don't think I've even asked more of this. But bringing the name back, I thought for sure the next thing that would follow would be a six-sided ring. I thought for sure. I was at that show. Okay. And I walked in fully expecting to see a six-sided ring. And I went, okay. Yellow ropes.

Okay. That makes sense. Okay. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Interesting.

I just think that when you think of TNA, you think of the six-sided ring. I think you also think of like 05 to like 09. For me, those are those are the prime years. You want to comment on that? You know, there is something about the freshness, the newness, and I won't do this part of the conversation, any, I'll do a disservice because there are so many components that kind of go into that little time, that, that, that, 05,

to 0, 0, 2 to 09, but I'll say 05 to 09 in that, the X Division, huge. It was by far what set us apart. But then all of a sudden, the tag team wrestling that came on so strong and the six sides of steel and the in a skipper. But, you know, the cage match with six sides, gave the tag team division a little bit of the look. And then all of a sudden you've got, to this day, one of the most amazing female talents, I think the industry has really ever produced, awesome calm. Like her presence, it's like it was so far from bra and panties, and that was the era that it was coming out of.

And then the athleticism of Gail Kim, and so, you know, the emergence of the knockouts division. So, you know, you put the heavyweights, the tags, the knockouts, and the X Division. Those kind of formative years, to me, put a real stamp on the industry. How did you get Kurt Angle to say yes to T&A? Man, oh, man. How did I get Kurt Engel? I, you know, I retold this story. But I'll, Chris, I could take you in Orlando Studios backlight.

in my office where I dressed every trip, my bag, and how I was leaned over it. And Dave Hawke is his business manager. And he said, yeah, Jeff, Kurt is going to be available. And I turned around and looked at him. I said, Dave, I know you wouldn't bullshit me about this. He said, no, I'm not. And I just really could not believe it because we had to begin to have, it was a, you know, is a grind. I mean, we, you know, we talked about the investor. We talked about

moving from the asylum to Orlando, the grind and one step and spike. You know, just the uphill climb. But man, we were having success after success. Our Saturday night ratings. You just signed Christian. Yeah. And I just, I used to love to get the spike email or calls. Kevin Kaye. Hey, bud, this is one I got to call you on. This is what we did in the demo. Like, they were super happy. So there was positive momentum. coming. And when when Dave told me that, I was just like, got to be kidding me. And then I'd put on my thinking cap said, okay, we're going to get him. A, I want him long term. I don't, you know, want him to, because I had known Hogan had kind of flirted with us off and all multiple times.

And I get it. I've been a talent. I get, hey, man, if I can use TNA as a leverage to get Vince to up my dollars, I'm going to do it, I didn't fault anybody. But when I knew I had the opportunity and knew that we need to get him five years plus, and we did a five year with two options. I knew that was going to be a challenge, specifically with Bob Carter. I mean, it was going to be, okay, how are we going to do this? And so we had started the process,

and Kurt was gung-ho and everything that went with it. And at the lake here, I was at the marina. and, you know, voicemail, call me. So I left the marina and walked up in the parking lot, music blaring and all this. I had to get way away. So I could talk to Bob and Bob goes, essentially, hey, Jeff, sell me on Kurt Angle. I don't say caught me off car, but I'm like, okay, here we go. And I said, Bob, what's the name of our company?

Oh, total. I went through that. I said, if you want a talent that truly personifies a total nonstop action wrestler that is, in my opinion, Bob, no BS. I think he is the best wrestler in the world today. That's who we're talking about. He said, okay. So, I mean, he, he believed in me.

And like I said, we had begun to have stack up a few, I'm not saying major blowout wins, but small wins after small wins after small wins. And then Kurt Angle's a game changer. It was in so many ways, huge for the brand, huge for me personally as far as, okay, I'm out of the ring, he's signed long term. And I don't know if it's talked about enough, but Kurt Engle wrestled more years in TNA than anywhere else.

Yes. Had his best matches there. He'll even tell you that. Buddy. And when Kurt was on, I mean, incredible. AJ Stiles, Abyss,

about as far dynamic. I always use those two guys because AJ is High Flyer X Division and Abyss, the Monster Abyss, it goes without saying it's, Kurt could have the best match on the card with either guy and if he needed to wrestle both guys and the same night he could. Unbelievable cardio condition.

And so, yeah, Kurt took our brand at the right time. And again, timing's everything. We had this guy that was on a winning streak named Samoa Joe and that was being built into this killer. And he arrived on, there was so many positives that went into it. Me and Sting had that match built for months, bound for glory. And I was going through with my wife's personal situation. I knew that, okay, I need to figure something out from my personal life, that, you know, we knew it was we were switching the belt to sting uh at bound for glory but in the middle of that

whole storyline art here comes this curt angle opportunity and then we make kurt the special enforcer of that match so he was on the scene when sting won the title it just it was it was a really uh magical not just night magical time in tna we've talked a lot about tna but you're still doing this You're still wrestling now. And you're in phenomenal shape. How much longer do you want to wrestle? You know, I have no idea. I mean, it's something that, you know, the, the, I've been asked that.

Like, and I know I did Rick Flair's last match. And so that last match. com mentality, hey, Jeff, when is the final match or when is, and it's, you know, you look at NASCAR drivers and they go on their final lap and, you know, this athlete's going to retire and this athlete's going to retire. And look, we can talk about Terry Funk and a number of folks of retirement. The way I look at the industry and me being able to get in the ring and perform, I've always looked at it to me, again, may be misunderstood, but through a different lens in that what is the one constant that I've had in my entire life, you know,

hadn't been family, businesses come and go, friendships come and go, business relationships come and go. But the business has really been good to me. The longest relationship you've had. Yes. This is a pro wrestling. Yes, 40 years. And so I don't ever pretend to say, oh, yeah.

Even the Toby Keith song, good as I once was. I ain't as good as I once was, but I was good once. As I ever was. I'm not even going to go there. What I will say is I enjoy it. When I do step back in the ring from time to time, I enjoy it. I look at the people's faces and know that, you know what, they know where I'm at in life. And so I'm not trying to pull the wool over anybody's eyes.

I enjoy it. I want to continue to give back to the business. You know, my run at AEW, especially when we came right on the scene, you know, all kind of moving parts. And I heard the arena. I knew the heel reaction that I was getting. I knew the heel reaction that Karen was getting. I knew, you know, when FTR, Mark Briscoe, special referee, Karen on the scene, that was good content. My single with Orange Cassidy in Winnipeg, the Wembley, me being in the gauntlet, walking out on stage, the reaction I got there.

There are, you know, me and Hangman in Arthur Ash having a strap match. there have been so many highlights at AEW at this stage in my career. I'm very grateful. But it also tells me that with the right style and the right timing, I'm different than today's wrestler. I'm not saying it's all positive, but I am definitely different than. And I think when I hear the people respond,

it doesn't surprise me because I have seen this generation after generation, after generation in that it all relates back to the emotional connection you have with the audience. Do you think it's because if you call a match, your last match, that you're not going to be able to walk away? This may sound crazy. Conrad got me emotional talking about it. Kind of my relationship with the business, it's been really good to me. I don't want to shortchange it.

I don't want to bullshit it. I don't want to lie to it. Is that like ending too soon? Or is it staying in it too long? I think that the answer will come at the appropriate time. It's interesting because when you look at your career, wrestling has given you so much. Wrestling has also taken so much from you.

Yet still you sit here with me and you go, wrestling's given me so much. Life. I mean, I'll say this. You know, when I know the story, story in depth. And that's something that when I'm given opportunities to really drill down on the human side of the Jarrett family in professional wrestling, 1946, if I could just stop there for a moment, in 1946 where women were at in this country, a single mom of two

took a second job selling wrestling tickets. That to me is emotional and it's heavy. And Christine Jarrett, my grandmother, my dad's mom, that's how she started into this business and knew she's one of five kids. Her father was an alcoholic and all of her siblings, abstract poverty, and they all lived at home. and she made up her mind that she was going to work her way out of poverty. And so she worked to a fault, and I've worked to a fault as well,

and my dad damn sure has as well. But dug herself out of poverty and worked her way up into the regional promotion, Goulderswurst Wrestling, to what Chris Me and you would call the CFO, chief financial officer. She was the back end, the business office. and a teenage kid who got a hardship license by dad and was driving a car and promoting small shows and putting out window cards

and doing all this long before he had his first match. That's how he got into the business. And then he promoted shows and then found a love with my mom and went off to college and then came back and had two kids and then he gets into the business. So I got a ton of respect for the industry. because I have lived through the ups and downs, but I have a perspective on this industry

that I know what it takes to succeed and you absolutely have to have a passion for the business. When we talk about wrestling, giving you so much and taking from you, you were so close with Owen Hart. And I don't know if it's talked about enough, but you were the match after. he fell at over the edge.

Talk to us about the emotions you had as you were going out there. And I've covered this a couple of different times. I can talk about it so much more clearly now, Chris, than I could in that Kansas City that afternoon. As Owen would always do, he would find a little nook and cranny. You know, back in those days, just anyway, we were dressing in. in kind of a makeup room connected to a bathroom, a little area. And he had done the rehearsals,

and I was after him, and they called him, Owen, you got to go up, get up. And so I'm in the dressing room by myself, doing what I always do, tape and getting,

stretching all this. And the, you know, the scream came, Jeff, you're up now. And I knew that wasn't right. I'm just like,

Owen, there's no way he's even at time to get to the ring. I was right. And, you know, I just knew. And so, you know, Matt Miller. Tell you at this point. Matt Miller busted in and said, you're up.

And I'm like, Owens up. He goes, no. I said, well, what happened? He said, he fell. I'm like, but I'm thinking knee. Like, he felt, okay, they had to stop the match. Not good. He fell.

Okay. So then, you know, I, there's a T-shirt. Grab my T-shirt, run down there. I knew how to promo beforehand. And as I'm walking through the backstage area, is the heaviness. And I've processed this, Chris, so many different times.

I can live it. I can, I have visualized it. I can visualize it. Kevin, you know, Kevin Kelly, we get in front of the,

me and Debra, and have the interview. And, you know, Owen's being wheeled by 10 feet apart. And, I mean,

crazy emotions and hollering and screaming and, you know, 15, 20 people following a gurney and all this and three, two, one, and whatever I said, the heaviness was, which I had no idea, but it was on me. And then leave there, like the format process goes, go straight to the ring. And I remember walking out, doing my stuff, and getting up at the ring, and, you know, feeling the top rope. And it was, like, super, super loose.

and at the time, and again, none of that really processed. And then I walked through the ring. I'm like, damn. But I didn't really understand that at the time. And went through the match and came back through the curtain. And Matt and a cop were there, and I said, let's go. And cop said, you want to get your stuff? And I said, give me 30 seconds.

I literally threw my stuff. got in the car and the cop is driving really fast and he didn't answer my questions two or three times and i said officer please can you let me know anything and he just kind of looked over his shoulder and said it's not good job i'm like anyway so um again i've processed this uh i didn't grieve it at the time. In 2017, I went through a deep process to grieve it in really understanding what I went through then because, you know, we went, we went to the service in Calgary, you know, stayed up all that night, went and did it all the next day.

It was go home, change of clothes, pack, go to Calgary, service. back at work. You guys had a lot in common, right? Both the son of a promoter, both living in the footsteps, the shadow of your father, right? So were you guys traveling together too? All the time. And, you know, but again, Owen had his network of free rides. He's notorious for that. But yes, a friend to anybody, but yeah, we traveled off often, um, especially during that time frame all the time. But you touched on something, and that's where I think, to this day, I kind of carry so much of him with me in that,

man, maybe this theme of this whole interview is misunderstood, Chris, because me and Owen understood things about the industry and being sons of regional promoters. and that was you know we're talking mid-90s the territories were it was still you know nowadays nobody can relate to the territories and and I'm glad so you know it's the business is evolved and it's bigger and stronger and healthier than it's ever been but coming out of the that era me and Owen had lived through so many experiences and we would laugh and cut up about it but that was a real bonding point in 91 when we first met in Memphis and that you know

Brett and Owen are coming in, and yes, they're big WWF stars, and they're coming down to a tear to worry. But they understood, you know, Brett hated our Memphis campus because it had a couple of tears in it. He's coming from WWF and pristine Matt covers. But there was an appreciation this. This is a family business. Hey, we get it. But me and Owen bonded over that and understood over that and discussed that. and we were also at a point in our lives that, you know, he had two children.

I had one, married, you know, so many different parallels. He left his house, flew to Chicago. That was our show. And we had talked about, and I told this story the other day, that New Orleans, Louisiana, ironically, I was on a pay phone. when I got the word that my dream home, I got to purchase. We got to close on it. It was going to be on the market on a Saturday morning. There was going to be 11 showings.

I knew the realtor. They knew we'd been working with me. It was a Friday afternoon. I met the price and closed on it. The first person I got to experience that with was Owen, smiling. At the exact same time, he's building, building though, his dream home. And in between trips, he had left. land, go to the site, they're at this stage. They're putting the windows in. They're putting

the granite in. They're putting this in. So we live that parallel life. And so he left home, headed to Chicago. And when he was supposed to return home, he was going to spend his first night in his dream home. And so so many things like that, I carry with me to this day. There's a really interesting through line with you and China. China has Your last match in WWE is with China China's last match ever is with you in TNA

What was it like working with China? Oh man God rest her soul You know We were just talking about Owen But you know In his wit China had a unique wit too But she's a funny girl

Great personality But man oh man You know Goes without saying Attitude era maybe the height of it. But when you look at DX, Rodol with his intro and his braids and his look,

and when you look at the group, China with her build and her look, and again, the things that we were doing during the attitude era to push the envelope, it didn't get much more than a push to have a female fight a male for the belt that Randy Savage had, the belt that Ultimate Warrior had. You know, the IC title is the working title. It's the number two that's going to take you to number one.

It was a, the belt was well positioned, the way my character evolved in a lot of ways organically because, you know, had not China had all of her momentum with DX and we want to do something there. And then here's this guy over here and he'd come out of the double J character and all of a sudden he's got Miss Deborah and then he's got Kitty and all that. And then all of a sudden he knocks the hell out of Mula. It just was storyline and kind of step after step after step.

So everything was built right before me and China really ever quote unquote touched. But man oh man, there was some magic that night and all the drama going on backstage. and she was anxious and how are we going to get through this, but she delivered like the champ she was. But it was cool. And that moment, you know, being a first on that platform, you know, China obviously kept her career going, but to kind of knight her into that I see title run,

you know, we're still talking about it today. Yeah. How did it come full circle to wrestle with her 10 plus years later in TNA? It was to me so bizarre that, you know, me and Kurt and Karen had worked the storyline. And that's another thing about Darkside. There's going to be things revealed out of all that. People are going to go, what? Yeah, I feel like you guys touch on the relationship there for the first time really ever.

Yes, definitely. Kids involved. I mean, we chose and will continue to choose the high road. but the real story comes out. And that's another, you know, I wish Kurt would have, he didn't want to do Darkside. I wish he had had done it. But, but that being said, China, we had worked that storyline, me and Karen and Kurt, we'd had our singles and, you know, to me, a real trilogy, a cage match in Cincinnati. And, man, if you've been in a match with Kurt Angle, you know you've been in a match with Kurt Angle.

We did that back alley brawl. But, you know, we had our trilogy of matches. match against him in 09 as well. But we had come to a point that we had faced each other multiple ways, but the opportunity came up. And it just spent, but, you know, we couldn't put Karen in a handicapped match against Kurt. But to have somebody that was going to be on the opposite side of the ring to face Karen and me, it just clicked with me and China's history, obviously with me, Kurt and Karen's history,

It just absolutely fit. And, you know, the match, we won't ever call it a five-star, but boy, oh, boy, talk about delivering in so many ways. And, you know, China and the look, and it for one night is a blast. You have delivered some iconic guitar shots. I want to go through a few of these. Oh, boy, okay. Okay. You already mentioned it earlier, but that guitar shot to Mula.

wild. Yeah. And again, I like to bring up my grandmother because she's integral, but I'll never forget. Mula had worked for my, obviously my father, but also my grandmother.

And so the story's laid out at SmackDown. I'm going to hit her with the guitar and all this, and she comes up to me and she grabs me like a grandma would. And she does. She pitched me. If you don't knock the shit out of me, when you come through that curtain, I'm going to beat the hell out of you

because that's what your grandmother would want. But no, it was, Kevin Nash was working for WCW, and he texts me the night at air, and he said, Double J, I've seen some shit in my time, but that was absolutely the Chris Farley awesome.

He loved it. But it's not just the chair shot on Mula. It's then slapping on the, The figure four. Yeah, the guitar shot with Mula and the figure four on May is a fun segment. And, you know, when you think back the era and the time with the Smackdown, new program, a lot of fun. I think the most violent guitar shot you ever delivered was one to Molly Hawley.

Man. Chris, that still gets talked about to this day and I got to tip my cat to old Molly. The flat back bump she took, the timing she took. the timing she took. It looks like you killed her. Well, and that's something that, you know, a lot of guys that will swing a guitar will, we'll say kind of take it easy.

That's the worst thing you can do. It can hurt worse and look a whole lot worse. You've got to swing it. And I always say bat speed is the most important thing. But boy, oh boy, I must have really been feeling good that night because my bat speed was good on my way. I see the clip of you giving the guitar shot to Beetlejuice all the time. What's the story for people that don't know of him even being involved in that?

And how did he end up taking a guitar shot? So, you know, you just got to say WCW 2000, Mark Madden's outline on it, yeah, still is a funny clip. But the whack pack, Howard Stern, and this is something that when people, when I'm asking about this, you know Howard Stern you know for those that don't know Howard Stern in the 90s I mean they were the envelope and they were stern and Howard Stern and others I mean he was so far at the top yeah and his whack pack with high pitch Eric and his group of miss bit of the whole group yeah and so they were on nitro you know we were in nassau long island so wasn't a far trip and they were there and they were involved in different things and an in ring and all this.

And somehow, some way, he's like, yeah, I'll get involved. And that was an era that they had me swinging guitars every Monday night on Nitro. And that whole thing came up and I'm just like, oh boy, this is going to be interesting. And his line, that's Mr. Slapnuts to you. Oh, but it was good. It still talked about old, old beetle. His social media plays always fun. But, yeah, it, and, you know, the things like the Beetlejuice and even the Gary Coleman.

Yeah. Several years ago, I remember Vine, the platform I hear it's coming back anyway. But, you know, there was clips on all this. And my kids come home from school and like, Dad, what are you doing? He's hitting this little guy. And I'm like, what are you talking about? Like, and I'm like, girls. and it's before they were born, you know, and I'm like, that goes, like, why would you do that?

I'm like, do you really think I did it? And the guy didn't know, like, anyway, they didn't, they didn't like. What's the story with Gary Coleman? Oh, boy, the Gary Coleman story, guitar shot, you know, in this business, the story behind the scenes is sometimes so much more entertaining than what you see on camera. But both instances there are pretty entertaining. but Gary agreed to be a part of Nitro. He knew he's getting the guitar shot, gets to the building like around noon and catering.

He's like, I want to get out of here. I want to go to a toy store. A toy store. Okay. Well, my good buddy, Jeremy Borash at the time, got elected to be his chaperone for the day. And I guess he had the run of car. And so they go off to the toy store and spend all afternoon.

And he's taking him to shops and this and that. They get back to the building. And we had kind of gone through it. and how we're going to do it and all this. And he'd ask a few questions, but he's an actor. So he's cool and all this kind of stuff. But little did I know that in his little ball cap, he came up with the bright idea that I'm going to get a lot of sharmine.

And so if you see he stuffs a bunch of sharmine in his ball cap, puts it on, he comes in from behind, hits me and the balls from behind, gets up on the second rope and he's shaking and bouncing in that hat, pops off in slow motion. He's got to run. over to it. I'm selling my nuts and we've on robbing around. I'm going, what in the hell is he doing? So I have to let him

have time. He's scrambling, putting the toilet paper back in there. And he's doing this for padding, right? Yes, for padding and puts the hat back on. When he turns around, I crack him. The building exploded. They loved it. And people at home did too, and I did too. And Jeremy,

I think I got a standing ovation from Borash that night. When you're going to give someone a guitar shop, what do you tell them? Um, bat speed. It's coming real fast. Uh, close your eyes. Tuck your chin.

That's it. Are they worried about splinters? Oh, sure. And look, I, most of the time, you know, of all people, there was, it happens, uh, from time to time, uh, things happened. But of all people, uh, there were two consecutive TV tapings in Orlando that I got, and Kurt's got a ball head. So he doesn't have hair for it to, you know, blend in and all this.

But I gashed him. back-to-back tapings one time. So it happens. You know, it's part of it. And it stings. People like, yeah, it stinks, but it's not a chair shot for sure. How did you start saying slap nuts? Oh, the slap nuts story. Again, kind of an organic thing. And yes, this does get some credit from my grandmother that she used to call people slapies. And slapies are people that know more and more about less and less every day, and all they do is slap their gums. People that just talk a lot about it since.

That sounds like a great southern term. Yes, just a slappy. And so Attitude Era and WCW Nighttrow, and I wanted to take a dig at somebody and set it. And, you know, it was, I think I said it one week and maybe the second week. And then we were at the palace at Auburn Hills, and I can, the best kind of slap nut story that really gets behind the curtain is that maybe week three or four after I'd said it, Bals Alvern Hills and you look up in, I'll call it the cheap seats, and there's eight folks, eight guys, the demo,

and they had signs, S-L-A-P-N-U-T-Z, and they had it up. And so it was shot on camera, and I come through the curtain, and standards and practices from TBS, TNT, call me in and say, hey, we need to talk with you. Okay. What's it about? Because I'm thinking, I know I didn't cost it on camera, you know, a handheld ring mic or what happened, you know, what am I getting called to the principal's office for? And they said, we need you to tell us or explain us about slap nuts and should we blur it and beep it? And I just cracked up. I said, no, you don't have a thing to worry about. They were like, is it in the urban dictionary, is this slang?

No, guys, you're in the clear. So slap nuts lasted and you can still buy a slap nut shirt today. You went through this evolution of you were double J, right? You were the country star into the pissed off guy. How did you know it was time to evolve into what was next after that? After what you ended up becoming in TNA. Oh, okay. Yeah, well, just kind of the evolution of,

of everything that you know you go from the territory the boy next door i was the number two baby face behind jerry lawler and the people knew my last name was jarrott and there had been two jarrots before me um so go to the w w f i'm a heel double j j j jep charrett as you just said the transition because the attitude era of catchphrases and different looks and pushing the envelope and then when t and a started um it was where am i going to kind of find my my groove and without, you know, King of the Mountain is what it worked into. And the world, for the most part, knew I was boss. So let's not call myself the boss.

Let's go with King of the Mountain and the match that went with it. And, you know, everything that went with that, the evolution of that. Then we called myself the founder. And that was, you know, a different role. But I've always tried to look at my ring personas as I am the last outlaw in that I know, you know, you look around the dressing room, yes, it feels like yesterday I was the kid,

but no, I'm not. I'm the oldest, you know, I'm the oldest guy on the AEW roster and very proud of that fact. But from double J to slap nuts to king of the mountain to founder,

to the last outlaw, I just kind of always have, I've lived by this and I've tried to be creative from a, if I'm booking, creative process, write TV, executive producer, talking with,

a talent at a seminar, whatever it may be, play an extension of your personality that's real. And so that all of those extensions of my personality were truth-based, fact-based. Not only are you the last outlaw, but are you also the last Jared, the third generation in this? Are your girls going to be part of wrestling? You know, the thing is, I'm only five kids. And so I'm the only one that dove into the business. And, you know, it's not like my dad held a gun at my head and said, you're going to do this.

wanted to do it. So I'm not going to push my kids into it at all. If they choose to go down that road, great. If they don't, I understand. Do they have interest, do you think? They do not at this time at all. You know, that is something also that as, as a, you know, look around and big pop a pump, you know, to get him to talk on camera on the dark side was amazing to me. But, you know, our history that goes back, you know, I knew him before he's married and now his son. Brock is signed with the saints. Yeah. But, you know, you can just, when you see him with that headdress on, it's like, man,

there's a young Scott. But second and third generation people now, it's interesting for me to kind of sit around and observe because this generation of guys getting in, it is a different transition. and, you know, a guy like myself, I know I'm lucky and blessed and super grateful to have a career, you know, I'm active after 40 years. Now guys, careers, and, you know, you look at the Japan scene and the Lucha Libre scene and hear the American scene. And then what is that shelf life? You know, I don't know. when you look at this industry from a career perspective, to me, it's because there's a TV component,

there's a marketing and creative component. It's just not the same industry. And I'm not saying that's a bad thing. It's just a different industry. What's the story behind Taylor Swift being a babysitter for your kids? Oh, Taylor Swift stories. You know, born and raised, I lived in Hendersonville since I was a kid. But Scott Swift, Taylor's dad, and the financial services business could work out of his house. And his daughter,

and Taylor's got a brother, Austin, but she wanted to be a country music star from a real early age. And so they packed up and they moved to Hendersonville. They moved from Pennsylvania, right? Yep. To Hendersonville, Tennessee.

Yep. Moved down here. And, you know, She went to the same high school that all my kids went, all that. And so my first wife, Jill, had gotten real sick. And so just friends among friends around town and Taylor, that album, Tim McGraw had just come out. So she was just breaking, not on tour or anything, is around Christmas time. And so a friend of a friend asked her to come over and play for the girls and my wife.

And so that's where the relationship started. You know, in that time, TNA, so much going on with their wife who's sick, daughters, just a real challenging time. And so in this community, one thing led to another, and it started out with seven or eight of us, and Taylor just kept playing. And, you know, and I've said this. It turned into a couple hour concert.

She played everything. But that's when the girls and her bonded. And then, you know, tough time. And a couple of months later, my wife passed away. And Taylor was with them through it all. And then, you know, she would call from time to time, hey, what are the girls doing this afternoon? I'd like to come over and make cookies.

I'd like to just spend time with them, which, you know, come over and there's a picture floating around playing the piano. know, but that's the side of Taylor people don't see. The little girl's grown up, gone to the Big Apple, time of not. But she just became what you call the family friends. So, Chris, I can officially say she's never been on the Jarrett payroll. So she never did a paid gig.

Never paid her. Okay. Never a paid gig as a babysitter, but very, very good to the girls. Did you guys still keep in touch? I mean, with the dad, I mean, Taylor's, you know, the girls were in a video of her. first mind. And that was just cool, went up to Maine. And that was a real cool thing. But, you know, as far as day-to-day, she, she's got other things going on. But if she's playing at Nissan

Stadium, could you get tickets? You are really setting me up for a disaster. The answer is clearly yes. Yeah, that's great. I'm sure that would be a great show. 40 years into this business, when you look back on everything, what do you think is your legacy. That really isn't, that is something that it's, it's just not up to me, you know, it's, it's people are going to have opinions about Jeff, good and bad. I'm just so well aware of that. But my hope is, um, there's no gray area in that Jeff loves this business, uh, sacrificed a lot for it. Um, perseverance in the industry, a student of the game.

Um, you know, when you, you, you look at, legacy to me is a heavy word. Because, you know, 40 years in, you can think through, okay, entering a conflict, a copaccomplishments, um, man, I've been so, so blessed, you know, I'm a, I'm a Michael Jordan, I'm a basketball junkie, and for me to win the world title, a kid from Hendersonville, I'm not the biggest, the strongest, I don't check all the boxes, but for me to win a world title in the United Center was pretty special to me. It really was. Carry on the family tradition. That's a lot of weight on my shoulders that I gladly want to carry. It's important to me, because I just, I don't lose sight of what Christine Jarrett did.

And she changed my family's life trajectory radically and her son and obviously mine, all because of professional wrestling. Had she not taken that second job, you know, I can't, it's, you know, who knows. So legacy is a heavy word. The business side of things. I take a lot of pride a lot in helping folks. You know, Karen thinks, in her opinion, and her, you know, she's obviously my wife,

but she says, when I watch you help other talent, she said, I know that's what brings you the most joy. Look, I'll get emotional. Because that's what she witnesses. I love it. I absolutely love when I think of, back through the years, whatever talent you want to plug in, giving guys opportunities. To me, it's, it's maybe, maybe that's one of the things I want to be at the top of my legacy

is, he's really caring about giving guys opportunities. How much did your relationship with WWE need to be mended before getting inducted in the WWE Hall of Fame? That is, oh, Chris, that is a, that is a, that is a, that is a, that is a, that is a, that is a, truly to me a misunderstood kind of narrative in that you mentioned earlier oh jeff got fired no his contract ran out uh Jeff started TNA in the early years of TNA I had multiple conversations with Vince McMahon he Vince is there any way that we can work together is there something there there was nothing he knew that we were in all that um we were we were

Certainly not in competition, but as time went on, it was very apparent he viewed us as competition. We were the number two. Whatever the gap was, we were definitely the number two. Two hours on network television, the network that he used to be on, and we were successful two million viewers a week. Anyway, so that kind of relationship. And then, you know, the call came first week of 2018. seeing, hey, Jeff, and the words were, not WWE wants you in the Hall of Fame, Vince wants to put you in the Hall of Fame. You know, it's, and again, another misunderstood.

My dad and Vince McMahon talked every Sunday afternoon as before Vince had his trial and while it was going on. So Vince knew that my dad and his father were peers, so to speak, Vince senior. you're being the older statesman and my dad being the younger of the promoter territory. So a family, again, me and Owen had a connection. I think Vince and myself have always had a promoter connection. And so mended fences is, I just don't think that's probably the correct phrasing. No animosity throughout that time.

I think that's what it's perceived to be. I think you would have to ask him, but you know, read your Redits and, and, and X and whatever in online blogs. It's a fun story to tell. Vince McMahon was held up by Jeff Jarrett. And I'd love to sit here and tell you, oh, yeah, it's exactly what I did. No, really what I did was I got the money that was owed to me

in the best position of leverage. And truth be known, Vince knew that when I went out, dropped the title to China, he cut me a check from Gunned Arena. I was off his radar. He don't even have to think about Jeff Jarrett. And look, he can blame Jim Rawls. She can blame whatever it may be.

At the end of the day, we went our separate ways. It was what it was. It was a business deal. It's like, you know, we've joked on the pod and all this. Jeff Jared held Vince McMahon up. Does anybody in their right mind think if Vince McMahon did not want to pay Jeff charret. He didn't have to pay Jeff Jarrett. Like, that's

the real story. Not only that, as we're sitting there conversation and he's got his three-piece suit on, and this is another blurb that probably won't make it. I don't think it makes the dark side is. As he's pulling that check out, Chris, he's sitting there, and I'm going to like, screw it, I'm going to ask

him, hey Vince, because the company was going public two days later. This is Sunday, public company's going to public. Do I still get those stock options? pal of course you do call beth in the morning just make sure so a he could have stopped payment on the check yeah b he didn't have to give me stock options but it's fun and i'm appreciative of the industry people love a good story and a heel and a baby face and jeff screwed vince and

viz screwed jean i mean g o double n e double r gone on tv all of that kind of stuff it's fun we're chatting about it, but man oh man, you talk about totally misunderstood, yes. Don't let the truth get in the way of a good story. That's exactly right. Since I'm such a huge TNA fan, I love asking this question, there's no better person to ask it of than you. Uh-oh. Who's on your TNA Mount Rushmore?

Oh, I knew you were going to come up with this when we first laid it down. And folks, me and him have, we've got to connect. I wanted to do his show. He's wanted me and be on the show. and I kid you not. I'm like, he's going to ask that. Okay. We all know the first spot.

Come on. AJ Stiles. Oh, I was going to. You can't have a T&A. Mount Rushmore about AJ Stiles. But I was like, because the fourth one I think is one I have. You have trouble with?

I don't think you can not have one without AJ. And I know from a business perspective, Steen was a. massive get early and then when he signed and you look at kurt and that so those three almost are kind of givens but when you get into that fourth one you have to me um you know in a lot of ways you could say knockouts division i think it you know long before the women's evolution and And, you know, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, you know, the narrative that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that this man took professional wrestling out of smoky bingo halls and put it here. Well, TNA took the broad panties and put it into, you know, competitive women's wrestling.

But anyway, that four spite, Chris, to me, it's, it's, it's, you just have to, there's, there's a, there's a lot of, you could put ex-devision there in total of it. you could put the knockouts. I think when you look at the OGs that really came along, I mean, Abyss is in that conversation. Man, you just, to me, the fourth one's always a tough spot. Yeah. Especially when you talk about homegrown talent. Oh.

Right, like Abyss is TNA and TNA is Abyss. Yes. Same with A.J. Stiles. Yes. Yeah, yeah. I mean, Jeff Hardy has that same. sound bite in the dark side, you know, about that, about myself and TNA and all this. And then when I just kind of look, the six-sided ring, it, when you, you know, if we look at, you know,

Mount Rush Moore is like, I guess that's coined as the most four most successful things or humans that come out of a brand or whatever it is. Ex-devision, knockouts, Abyss. There's, you can make a real case for you too without you it doesn't exist well i mean that that's to me that's kind of a given because uh when i look and and again when you really you know my dad had no interest none especially in 2002 he had gotten into the construction business and then getting it got he got into kind of the oil and gas part of a construction business and was really weird dealing and dealing. Very successful at the time. That was my old man. I mean, he had been in so many different kinds of, I mean, wrestling was his main business, but he had been in multiple business. But at

that time, really successful. My little brother, you know, that's when he was really breaking in. But he had no interest. And so when I think back over, you know, to me, God's had a hand in every bit of my life in that something pushed me, an inner drive in me to go, you know what? Because that's a big step. I mean,

hey, as opposed to, you know what, go back and whatever, work for peanuts for events or go to Japan or whatever a wrestler, Mexico,

or whatever, make the career out of it, you know, or whatever it's going to be. But for whatever reason, I'm like, you know, in the different conversations.

But I was, kind of driven in a lot of ways to go, I'm going to carry on my family tradition. You know who doesn't get talked about enough in the early days of TNA? Mike Tenay and Don West. There you go. They absolutely, I'm glad you brought that up. I believe the positioning of those two, and by design, with the X-Division and the lineage of the NWA, Mike was my guy in that the professor.

his cadence is, to me, his professionalism as his delivery comes out. And his encyclopedic knowledge. And that's what I wanted. I really wanted that as a brand. When we came out and I did the deal with NWA since 1905 and whatever Mike didn't know off the top of his at, I knew absolutely he was going to go study it. And I wanted something different. Yes, he had been with WCW.

Chivani was the lead horse. I wanted something different and unique that would immerse himself. And Mike, I am so grateful for the efforts that he put in, especially during the early asylum days, because when you listen to his calls, buddy, you talk about passion. And then Don, I mean, a freaking shoe salesman

to a baseball card salesman who was nervous as hell used to throw up before every show. He had anxiety and all that. kind of stuff and that, you know, whether it's Jerry Jarrett or Jeff Jarrett or Vince Russo or whoever Dutch Mantel that would say, Don, you got this, Don, you got this. Because we just wanted him to respond like a fan. And that was something that I got pushback from folks. Hey, man, that's because again, you come off the attitude there. You have Chivani and Heenan, Lawler and Ross, you know, you had some real iconic duos that we're going to go a different direction.

And Mike took the company from an announcer point of view and put it on his shoulders. And he nurtured Don and Don once he hit his groove. Goes without saying the merchandise records that he exploded. To this day, we went to a venue. Oh, no, no, no, that was in arena football. We went to a venue. A guy's still talking about the first time they ever saw Don. Don West, and they said, perform.

I said, you just say performed. They said, don't you remember the meet and greets? Before it started, before I'm like, okay, that's his sales pitch. No, he's great. It's great. But when he really got in his group, those two at the desk in Orlando calling pay-per-view matches, you could tell Don was exhausted in a positive way, but he came through like we wanted the viewer, especially those current matches.

You know, 25 minutes into a current A.J. match you you're exhausted from watching in a good way. Yeah. And Don was a great narrator for those. Are you freaking kidding me? That's it. That's it. It was all of us.

He was. Because that's exactly what everybody's thinking when they're watching it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, so good. That's good. Is there a particular match that you're most proud of in your career? Um, you know, gosh. Now I'm going to have to get into recall and I'll leave something out.

I will say my series of matches with Kurt. at a stage in my career that I, Kurt, but I pushed myself and Kurt pushed it, that, you know, there, we had, we had some really knocked down, drag out, good storytelling matches. The match was Sean in Nashville under those circumstances, a lot of political stuff going on.

And me and Sean had had so many single matches, but, you know, we pieced it all together and that, that series of tag matches that I've talked about before, me and Sean versus Diesel and Razor, Scott and Kevin, with Road Dog as the second. The five of us would go out, Russell,

35, 40 minutes on loops. The Garden was my favorite match out of that tag match. But those, by single title wins, the DDP match, I'm going to say, you know, he came in with his stylist, but prepared to go to work.

There's a couple of, you know, WCW matches. And then, you know, I mentioned the TNA days. My early matches against AJ styles, when I really think through those and be being an executive producer and the show and the business component, the stress, and then putting together, man, AJ named himself right, the phenomenal one,

his athleticism, especially the bounce that he had in those early days. And he had it throughout his career, but especially in those early days. So those and then I'm not, you know, I don't, I just mentioned them a little bit earlier, but me facing hangman in the Owen was an organic. And I'd been a heel ever since I walked in AEW. And we had me and Jay and the group and Sottenham and Karen and Sanjay. We had some steam on us, had some good matches with the acclaim and FTR.

and, you know, we wrestled on that dynamite anniversary show against Kenny and the Bucks. And we had, we'll call it the heel momentum in a lot of ways. And in Chicago, in the Owen, and I, you know, it basically kind of gave an interview on Owen, my real raw emotion about him. and the people organically got behind me, that's to this day really special. Really special. What an amazing career you've had.

What an amazing, and you're still doing it. There you go. Thank you so much for making the time to do that. Oh, this is great, man. I'd said it at the beginning, but I'm very respectful of your work in that, man, I feel like this word is beginning to be overused, but it's a very appropriate for you.

I think your authenticity comes across in that you want to sit down with a wrestler in a respectful way and just say, hey man, let's talk. And if I got to ask you, maybe a tough question here or there, I just want a good story. I want your voice to be here.

Anyway, the authenticity part that you bring out, I think that is, here I go playing executive producer, but I think that is a huge part. of your success. And I can tell you that is the main reason I'm sitting down today. Well, thank you. It means a lot to me that you're sitting down with me today. I'm going to ask you the question. I ask everybody the end because gratitude, Jeff, such a huge thing for me. Wake up every day. I say out loud three things I'm grateful for. Sets the tone for the day. The end of the day,

my wife and I will both rattle off three things we're grateful. Okay. Now we're talking. So, Jeff, what are three things you're grateful for right now? Buddy, about six and a half, half hour ago, I went through this. I do it every morning. I love that. Yeah, it just, um, yes, sobriety has radically changed my life,

and you didn't ask me that, but the, the mindset of gratitude, and it says, um, and Thessalonians, you know, he specifically says,

rejoice always, give thanks in all situations, and pray about everything. Those kind of three things, check every box for the day. But the gratitude I have, and this may sound, I really mean this, it may sound vague, but I am very grateful to be alive and sitting right here in this chair talking to Chris at 212 on June the 16th. The present, there's a reason they call it at the past.

not the future, but the present. It is a present. So I'm very grateful to be alive today. I am very, very grateful. When I look back over my life and really understand the valleys that I've been through, you know, the simple thing to say, I wouldn't wish that on anybody, some of them, but at the end of the day, it's the only way mountaintops are formed. I truly believe that.

So I'm grateful for the present. I'm very grateful for my past. But my future in this life and eternal, I'm very grateful that I have the mindset. And right now I'm a part of an arena football team that I didn't go chase that. They came to me. I'm a part of an ownership group of three, going to be four baseball team. very grateful for that.

I'm an active member on the AEW roster. I got a wife, five healthy kids, different opportunities. I really am. I don't, I try not. I fail often, but I try not to lose sight of that. That the gratitude of, we all have bad days. but like you just said in the morning when you wake up saying that three things oh boy it is almost

the fancy sauce of life gratitude i love this quote of no amount of anxiety will change the future no amount of regret will change the past but any amount of gratitude will change the present and it's so true wow i just if we're going to get into that i just if we're going to get into that i just heard the other day. What's the middle letter in anxiety? X? I.

When we're anxious, when we got anxiety, we're worried about ourselves. You can change that in the heartbeat. Live life, trust God, and help others, and it all goes away.

Jeff, this has been amazing. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. You really enjoyed it. Thank you. The United States Soccer Federation presents the U.S. Soccer Podcast. The place where I, Megan Klingerberg, a World Cup expert, teaches you everything that you need to know for this summer's World Cup.

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