Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Karrion Kross On Meeting Jesse Ventura, Scarlett Bordeaux, Final Testament, Triple H

Episode Date: October 17, 2024

Karrion Kross (@realKILLERkross) is a professional wrestler currently signed to WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Ontario, CA to talking about meeting Jesse Ventura and doing his impression of him, his new character in WWE and where the inspiration came from, having Snoop Dogg call his matches at WrestleMania 40, the idea behind The Final Testament, rumored heat with Bobby Lashley, if he sees a return to NXT in the future and more! Quote I'm thinking about: “You either quit or keep going. They both hurt. Choose wisely." Sponsors: VUORI: Get 20% off your first purchase! Get yourself some of the most comfortable and versatile clothing on the planet at https://vuori.com/cvv MANSCAPED: Get 20% off plus free shipping when you use the code CHRISVAN at https://manscaped.com ZOCDOC: Instantly book a top-rated doctor today at https://zocdoc.com/insight BONCHARGE: Use the code CVV to save 15% off your infrared sauna blanket at https://boncharge.com/cvv MAREK HEALTH: Get a 10% discount on Marek Health's Optimization Package with code CVV: https://marekhealth.com/cvv BLUECHEW: Use the code CVV to get your first month of BlueChew for FREE at https://bluechew.com ROCKET MONEY: Join Rocket Money today and experience financial freedom: https://rocketmoney.com/cvv PURE PLANK: The future of core fitness! Use the code CVV to save 10% on Pure Plank which was designed by Adam Copeland & Christian: https://gopureplank.com/ PLUNGE: Get $150 off your Plunge with the coupon code CVV150 at https://plunge.com For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://podcast.chrisvanvliet.com If you have ever enjoyed any of these episodes, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast or Spotify? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests.  Follow CVV on social media:  Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

What a theme song by Downstate. What an intro by Samantha Irvin. Welcome back, my friends, to another one here on Insight. I'm CVV, Chris Van Fleet, and it means the world to me that this is the podcast that you've chosen to listen to out of all the many podcasts that are out there. And thank you for making Insight,

the number one wrestling podcast on the planet. Hit a frog splash on that follow button. Don't just hit it with your thumb. Put your phone down, climb up on something, not too high, but climb up on something. And then come down on that follow button on Spotify or Apple podcast with a frog splash. Eddie Guerrero style, Rob Van Damme style. Hey, you can even go with the DeLo Brown lowdown. It's your call.

But hit that follow button so you don't miss out on anything that we have coming up. Jesse Ventura is back on the show. Sorry, I mean, Carrying Cross is back on the. show, his fourth appearance on the show, by the way. And I was telling him, I feel bad that that very brief Jesse Ventura impression that he did during our workout video two and a half years ago, I just feel bad that that's become like a thing. His name will now forever be attached to a Jesse Ventura impression for the rest of his life. The rest of his career may be the rest of his life. I don't know. It was just a fun moment where he was trying to get me to crack up while I was doing

tricep extensions in the Gulf of Tonkin. But beyond the Jesse Venture impression, yeah, you hear a little bit of it during this conversation. And we talk about that whole day where Jesse and Kerry and met and we had that episode, crazy. There is so much more that Carrying Cross has going on. He was released from WWE in 2021, along with his wife, his real life, wife, Scarlet Bordeaux.

Less than a year later, both rehired by WWE. and people are sleeping on what this man is capable of, both in the ring and on the mic. Just look at the work that he did in Impact Wrestling or in NXT, and you'll see what he is truly capable of. There's a reason why he's a two-time NXT champion, and I feel like they're building to something here. He's being put into something right now,

and I'm very excited to see where this goes over the next few months. Take a screenshot. Let us know that you're listening to this and tag us so we can share it out with the world as well. He's at Real Killer Cross. I'm at Chris Van Fleet, and I hope you enjoy this as much as I do. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome back to the show, my friend, carrying Cross. Good to see you again. You too. Can you believe that day we had in Minnesota? No, I still can't. I can't either. Like, that was insane. Yeah, it really was. I was telling you. I was telling you.

I was telling my brother, there's something about him for me personally that's refreshing because he's like, he's like authentically unapologetic. Yeah. And especially like with media nowadays, being in front of a camera is sometimes for a lot of people like walking through a minefield. Like to just be honest and just to say what you're thinking and to say what you're feeling, you're not sure. There's always like this like dark cloud.

that it's going to bother someone, Jesse Ventura does not care. He doesn't care at all. There was something I asked him, and his answer was just, no. And then he stared at me, and I'm like, all right. That's Jesse Ventura.

What was amazing about that is his son set this up. His son was the one who set all this up, Tyrell. And he was basically like, wait a second, if Raw's in town, is carrying cross on Raw? then we put the pieces carrying crosses on raw. So I reached out to you, I'm like, any chance you're going to be in St. Paul, Minnesota, because I'm interviewing Jesse Venture.

And you're like, yeah, I'm going to be there. I'm like, do you want to come with me to this Jesse Venture interview? Like, a thousand percent. And then what was so funny is I picked you up from your hotel that morning. You're like, what are we doing? And I'm like, I don't, I don't know. I don't even know how this is going to go. I don't know.

Yeah, it was nuts. Tyrell's asked me to do his podcast with Jesse for a really long time now. Hold on. What? Yeah. You're going to be on Jesse Ventura's podcast? I should be. I've been waiting to get the green light for a long time. And I think with the playing field changing and everything, now it's all good. So hopefully, at some point, I promise you one way or the other I'm going to be doing it. Well, there's just be an hour of you doing his voice to him.

I was concerned he was going to feel like it was patronizing. Like, if I had a guy sit in front of me for two hours doing me, I'd be like, do you want me to throw me down the stairs? What's quite on there? You know what I mean? Like, I lost the nerve to do it longer than I did in front of him. But then like I also, like the little kid of me was like alive and well, like being in front of him. Sure.

So I was like, ah, I was a business to see if you want a year. And like he's not, he doesn't use the internet frequently. He makes it very clear. he doesn't have a cell phone. Nope. He didn't know who Will Saso was when I mentioned his name. I don't understand that. I couldn't believe that either.

Who's that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. His comedian does his impression of you? Oh, okay. So when you started doing the voice, like I wasn't sure how he would react to it. Me neither. Me neither. I would like to see Will Sassow's old school Stephen Seagall impression was one of my favorites.

So good. I would want to see instead of him doing. Jesse Ventura with Jesse Ventura. I want to seem to do Steven Seagall interviewing, you know, like Jesse Ventura, but like all the mannerisms of Segal. That for me would be like a dream come true. He really respects you because you're a worker. You're, you know, you're in that world with him.

So I think that you're doing the impression to him. He was just kind of like, this is fun. Like he's smiling. It's one of the few moments in the interview. He smiles. Yeah. Yeah. It was cool, man.

It was really, really cool. I legit could have. I could have talked to them all day. We had like a lot of strange things in common, like life path stuff. You know, like I'm also the governor of Minnesota. That was the first thing that we had in common. No, but like bodyguarding like celebrities and rock stars and stuff like that. I like can't talk too much about it because like it was always on NDA stuff.

But like a lot of people who know me like over the last 10, 15 years have known I've done that. I can say I've done that. But like there were just certain things and like certain issues that he's had. with over the course of his wrestling career that he ran into. I've seen similar things as well. So I don't know, just his approach to life and the way he observes politics, philosophy, all of that stuff. I really relate a lot with that.

He's not somebody you can put into a fixed small box. And I've always felt like that since I was a kid. I've always had a contrast of opinions that really, I've never really felt like I kind of belonged in one particular thing. And when I was young, that drove me insane. That drove me crazy. Just the social dynamics of everything. I was like, but why do we all have to think like this exact particular way?

But as I got older, I actually felt relief because I was like, oh, this is like, all of that is so trivial. And when you're young, it's such a big deal. And I like, from conversations even that I had with him before that, I don't know, I just, there was a connection there. I wish I could have explored it a little bit more. One of my favorite things about the Jesse Ventura interview is you can see you in the background and you've got the biggest childlike smile on your face. You're like, and there's a screenshot of it, which I think you shared on Twitter. Somebody snapped it.

Yeah. I can't believe this is real. I can't believe either, man. I wish you had been able to have more time with him. And I apologize for that because our interview went a little longer than expected. You had your call time at the arena. So you didn't get a chance to like, you know, kind of put a button on it and like say goodbye. I have a, his son gave me his number.

I'm going to reach out very soon. So you're going to call a landline is what you're going to do. That's right. Radio. The Baja. Yeah. Can you say the Baja like him? The Baja.

How did you even learn you could do a Jesse Ventura impression? Watching wrestling as a kid. My friends and I were all. all sit down in front of the TV and we would just do impressions of everybody whenever they were on TV. And there was just like a thing we put into practice just to like pop each other in the room. And it was something we were always able to do. I've like always notoriously been the guy like with my close friends. If you happen to not pick up my call, you're getting like an insane voicemail from somebody.

It might be macho man. It might be Jesse Ventura. It might be, I don't know. It's not planned. It's just there. You know what I mean? So Paul London could tell everybody about that. He probably has voice mails of mine saved over the last 10 years.

Have those four seconds from our workout video just completely ruined your career? Yes. I'm sorry. It's all your fault. It's funny. When you type in Carrying Cross into YouTube, the very first suggestion is Jesse Venture, then it's Jesse Venture impression. I'm sorry.

Look at you did, you little jerk. Honestly, I don't actually mind it. And the reason being is like, it's like I've talked to you before. Like, I don't know whether it was with this or whether it was like just a personal conversation we've had. My natural disposition is to be relatively closed off. And like it takes me a while to warm up to people and talk to people. That's not good for the entertainment industry.

Like people do want to get to know you. They want to get to know what you're like. And if you're working in the entertainment industry and you're on a very fixed and controlled format of a character you're playing, people will never really get to know what you're actually like. They'll only get to see sort of what the script shows them of you. You know what I mean? And I think just that little bit that we did serendipitously kind of brought more people kind of into my lane to see what I'm about and what I do. So all in all, it's a good thing that happened, I guess. But I felt like that you weren't with WWE at that point in time.

And I would run into you at conventions. I was off the rails. Yeah. I'd run into conventions and you'd be like, yeah, 17 people asked me to do the Jesse Ventura voice. That was a rough day. Thanks. That was a rough day. That was a rough day.

The conventions were always cool to do because you'll meet thousands of people in two or three hours. and you have one-on-one time with them, and you really get to find out and figure out what your work has, like, done for people. For a lot of us who go out there, and you're telling your story, and you're hitting your high spots, and then the day is done,

and you move on to the next thing. You know, you're always, for like a lack of better words, you're rapping and you're going to the next scene. And for people to bring up stuff that I wasn't even thinking about, that I didn't even think it was a big deal, especially at that time. It was immediately post-COVID.

It wasn't something that was immediately at the forefront of my thoughts of, like, being a source of entertainment for people during, like, one of the darkest periods of the world. And that was a really, really cool, it was a really cool, like, period of my life. even with all the people asked me to do Ventura. At the time, my social battery is pretty dead. I was like, oh, here's another one. That's great. All of the tables next to me get to hear this for the, you know, 15th time.

I'm sure they're really looking forward to it. It's still hilarious. Don't tell me. I was doing it now all in behind my teeth. Don't tell me it didn't happen. I was there. Happy. All right.

Let me sign us. Take it. picture, you know. But what you're saying there reminds me of something that Sylvester Stallone told me in an interview, that like he was just reinforcing the idea that what you do in film, what you do on set that day isn't just happening that day. It lives on forever. Oh, yeah.

And I think you must be reminded of that all the time in a wrestling ring. Like some throwaway thing could end up becoming something that you're known for. Or some throwaway move could be the thing that people talk about. a decade from now. Oh, yeah. And I don't think I realize it in the moment when he was talking about it, but we're still talking about the work he didn't, Brock, year, Ramba, or whatever it is, decades later. And that's what you guys do every single week. Yeah. It's pretty awesome. It's a, really cool thing. It becomes, in a good way, it becomes something you didn't even intend it to be. it's like a it's out there for people to have so I don't know I don't know why I I never realized that

because when I was a kid it was like that for me like I I just I ran into WrestleMania week I ran into Ernest the Catmiller and um unbeknownst to him I've been doing I was doing a promo on the indies that he did one time I think on a nitro and it stuck with me my friends and used to say to each other all the time. When I was young, I watched it. He got on Nitro and he was trying to talk. People were bullying him. And he was like, if everybody doesn't be quiet in here, I'm going to lock all the doors in the building and I'm going to whoop everybody. Like, he's going to lock the doors in the arena and beat up every single person, man, woman, and child. And then he's going to say what he has to say. All 15,000 people in the arena, we couldn't stop laughing.

And when I saw him, I was, oh, my. My God. My uncle used to be a chef at the WCW Nitro Grill. This was like a restaurant that they had in Vegas, 1999, maybe 2000, 2001. I had met tons of people from WCW and some that are still working at WB right now as a kid. Like I saw them with their guard now. And I met him and he was one of the coolest people. And I told him, I did the promo back to him.

And he was like, oh, my God. He's like, you remember the whole thing? I go, yeah, and he goes, that's awesome. I was like, you don't realize that, but like, when you're in the business, like you're doing that for people right now. Like, I may meet somebody who was a kid from something that I said on TV that's going to come up to me in 20 years and be like, that was hilarious or that was awesome or that terrified me. It's cool.

Like, reverberates. I think your promo work is so underrated. Thank you. And especially when you're really able to get some time on the mic and lean into it as a heel, like some of the stuff you've been doing recently with Xavier Woods. It's kind of mean. And that's what makes it work so well. Yeah.

Yeah. This rendition of the character that we're doing right now, for me personally, is the most repulsive to bring the life. Because it's a bit of Sean O'Hare, who was one of my favorites. Oh, I love Sean O'Hare. Yeah. May rest in peace. Yeah.

And also Kevin Sullivan as well, who doesn't get the love and credit he deserves. There's another one, yeah. And a lot of what I'm doing with this character is like the opposite of a love letter, it's kind of a hate letter, to all of the terrible things people, they just kind of say to each other the way they behave. Like being a deceptive person is probably the most rotten thing you can possibly be in life. And if you're looking to create a heel that can play off of anyone and do anything. and functionally in a television format,

someone who can reward the viewer for watching the show episodically and paying attention to the stories that they've told for 10, 20, 30 years, this is the perfect character as a heel because I can talk about Woods has passed, I can talk about Kofi's past, and at the same time,

I can also bring up vile things that, you know, maybe toxic fans have to say about, you know, oh, one, this guy's better than the other, And I was trying to do this with Dawkins and Montez, and it's a fine line to walk. But it was funny. There was one thing that a fan had said, I don't want to say who it was about because I don't want to bring it back to life. But there was something online a fan said about someone I've been working with while I've been doing this version of the character. And I read it and I went, oh, that's disgusting.

I'm going to use that. I'm going to use that. It's so vile and so untrue. that, of course, when I say this, it'll actually put the fans on the side of the baby face, which is ultimately what I'm trying to do. I cannot win people over doing this. This is the opposite. And then I said it, and I just had a curiosity, I couldn't help myself.

I had to go online to see because they're one of the people that do the thing on Twitter every week. And then he went and said the total opposite. And I was like, who's the psychopath here? This is this guy's tweet. He said this two weeks ago about him. I mean, he's pretending he didn't say it. And I was like, wow, that's crazy. I should be this guy in wrestling.

I should, what to look like a lunatic. I should be this guy. But some things that I've said to the baby faces while I've been doing this character, I've heard people in this business and other businesses kind of saying to each other. And I'm drawing from real places. And I'm just kind of reformating it to make it become sort of a conversation piece. and it's an effort to add depth to the people that I'm working with and for people to say, well, I know what he's trying to do. He's trying to conquer and divide. This is the dividing part.

He wants to weaken them. But he does have a point. And there's a story to build from there. It creates an obstacle for the baby face to overcome in that story. So do you have to run this stuff by the person you're working with? Oh, yeah. I'm not an ambush artist. I don't like people who do that. If I've ever had to deal with people like that, I usually throw them down the stairs. I find the nearest staircase. And for some, somehow they wind up doing like a Logan Paul back flip down the stairs. I don't know how it happens. It just happens.

But yeah, I'm not one of those people at all. I will get with the people and I'll say, hey, is there a period in your career that we can highlight in this particular realm that we can bring to life? You know, I think it's very carny. And it's sort of like a, I don't know, like, if you're secure with, what you're doing and you really believe that you're worth it, you won't try to ambush somebody you're working with. It's like weak guy shit. But nobody wants the, their worst moments being pointed out. No. No, they don't. So it's a bit of a, it's a bit of a negotiation, you know. So that's, that's typically how I would approach, kind of bringing that type of stuff in life. Since you're so

inspired by films and cinema in general. What are the cinematic inspirations for what you've been doing with the Final Testament and this version of your character? I don't necessarily know that I have one, but I will say that Jeffrey Dean Morgan's Negan, his character from The Walking Dead, when he was a villain, was some really evil stuff. He had a particular way he would kind of stare through people and smile at awful stuff. His name is at the tip of my tongue. There will be blood. Daniel Day Lewis's character?

Daniel Day Lewis. It was a minute where I was doing the mustache over the top lip. A lot of people thought it was like an ode to Jake Roberts. But I think I've told you this before. I'll look up film study and workshops from actors that'll be online. And I'll always kind of study that's. stuff and converted to wrestling. And there's something about when you grow a mustache or if you're, if you have any sort of beard that's an obstruction over the over your mouth, people read body

language and they read facial expressions. And when you conceal what your mouth is doing when you're talking, it makes people sort of uncomfortable. It's not a natural read when you're talking to them. So if you have that over the top lip and you smile and it's a closed smile, there's something off putting about it. So I literally did that on purpose just to lean into. the presentation of the character. My wife couldn't handle it anymore. She was just like, I was like, please, just put up with it a little bit more.

And she was just like, you just, you look so awful. You look like an awful evil scumbag human being. I was like, yeah, but it's for the character. She's like, yeah, but there's another six days of the week where I have to see this character walking around the house. And I was like, okay, I can't handle that anymore either. So we got rid of it. This episode is brought to you by Timeline.

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Timeline.com slash insight. The United States Soccer Federation present the U.S. soccer podcast. My name is David Goss, and I'm joined by my co-host, Megan Clemenberg. And now we're giving people an inside look at the World Cup. Time's ticking. I think you can feel the intensity. All the guys are. wanting to really stake their claim,

and they want to be on that World Cup roster. There's no doubt about it. Hosting the World Cup on the home soil comes with its pressures, but we're just really excited just as the people are. The U.S. Soccer podcast, presented by Henko. Follow and listen on your favorite platform. Why do you think this version of your character works better with long hair? I don't necessarily know if it adds or takes away.

I go back and think of Javier Bardem and No Country for Old Men. He has like one of the strangest haircuts in film history. I think he even mentioned it. That was one of like my go-to favorite movies. His performance in that was really, really good. It was awesome. It was very off-putting. If you were to just look at that character and not taking into account like that dead stare that he has,

like the whole film. If you were just look at him, there's nothing necessarily intimidating about him, but it's what he's doing in the film. It doesn't take long for the next scene when he comes on. You feel sick to your stomach almost because you know that this guy's walking death. So if the script complements what the person's motive actually is doing,

it doesn't necessarily matter how they look. It's about what they're about to accomplish. Like if you took Freddie Kruger completely disfigured, he's burned, you know his whole story and everything. But like if you didn't know his whole story and you saw him and he's running down the hotel hallway, you're going, you're just like you're going to run. Maybe Anton Chigar are chasing you down the hallway. You take a slow turn, give him a nod and be like, something's wrong with that guy. But point being, if Freddie Kruger is haunting kids in their dreams and then finally when he gets to the kids and he goes, hey, Freddie,

and they just kick him in the ball. and then they wake up, Freddy's not scary anymore. So I feel like there's a middle ground where what the character is doing in the film or the TV show, as long as it's meaningful and he's able to get his victims, it doesn't necessarily matter what you look like. I see a lot of people online that want you to shave your head again. And they thought you were just menacing when you were shaved head, clean shaven. And there is something about that that's just off-putting, I guess, for a better word.

I knew what I was doing. Oh, yeah. I've considered buzzing my head, shaving my head, doing all that stuff. But we would need a story, in my opinion, that supports it. It's a throwaway to do it for no reason. To just show up on Raw one week and you've got a new haircut. Because what a lot of people, it's an underlying subconscious thing. What they don't necessarily realize is what I was doing.

in the show at that time was just running through people. I mean, I was showing up and just decimating everybody. So the run that I had at that time that was delegated to me for the purpose of the show. In NXT. Yeah. If I had had long hair at that time, people would be like, he needs to, and I had a shaved head now that,

he needs to grow his hair long and do that again. Like if I were to just show up and shave my head and I've been doing what I've doing, people would feel like, oh, I think it would become more evident. But there are a lot of carrying cross fans that go, I want that NXT version of him back again. I feel like they're not doing enough with him. They could be doing more with him. What do you say to people that remember you from your last run in WWE? Have patience. Bear with me. I'm trying. I'm trying. Again, the minefield that is, being in front of the camera and trying to be as open and honest as possible,

I could say exactly how I feel about it, what I'd like to do. I'm sure people could imagine. And they could also imagine it will hurt people at work for me to be like, hey, I'm aware of what you want to see out of me, ultimately, truly what you want to see out of me. I'm always trying to find a way to make both parties happy. You know, I'm the wrestler, not the writer or the director, you know, for like a lack of better words. I know, believe me.

There's only so many spots, right? You've got two world championships and you've got two mid-card championships and you've got the tag team championships. You're not a tag team wrestlers. You've got four spots, essentially, four championships that you could be vying for. There's only so many people that can be in that conversation that can be in that picture. If you're not in that now, how do you find your way into that? Yeah. That's, I could tell you, but then someone would throw me down a flight of stairs.

It's, so when you watch a wrestling television show, not anyone in particular, just a wrestling show. And there's one on every day of the week. Yes. Best way to put this would be the real. the rhythms of what people like in pro wrestling, in my opinion, have never changed. They haven't changed in the last 40 or 50 years. It's not a, to me, it's not a mysterious science of trying to figure out what works and what doesn't. Everybody knows what works to some degree and what doesn't work because it's never really changed.

We have our champions and then we have our contenders. and the show to some degree is, you know, should be built around creating contenders going up to fight the champions. When you're building contenders, the contender has to win and the people that are competing against have to lose so they can make it to the big dance and they fight the champion and either they win or lose. if there's a champion who let's say on any wrestling show could be any show is a heel the functionality of the heels in the program are going to wind up more than likely being shining up that contender so he looks as domitable and formidable as possible to go face that champion whatever happens happens if that champion was a baby face well the contender that they're creating is more than likely a heel. He's going to start chopping up all the baby faces and the way to go up. So a lot of people like online will say, oh,

they're pushing him finally or they're pushing her or, oh, they're burying him. There's only two people getting pushed in a wrestling program. I don't know how this has become lost upon people. The only two people being pushed in a wrestling program are the champion and the contender. So people think someone gets a few wins. they're being pushed, someone thinks they get one loss or a series of losses they're being buried.

It's not true. I don't know where that, how they got lost in everything, especially too, because like, even with our company, we produce a lot of behind the scenes stuff. People love it. They get to see how we're preparing and what the ideas were behind things and stuff like that. There's so much access to behind the curtain. I don't know how that whole thing got lost in translation. So I think people see it as like, I haven't seen this person on TV in a while.

And now I'm seeing them every week. And they're winning a lot or they're getting a lot of TV time or a lot of promo time. I think that they say that that's a push. Yeah. You're saying that's not a push. It's not. It's not. How did everything come together with the Final Testament?

So for quite some time, I had several people and created, telling me that there was an idea being entertained of me leading a group. And they had a bunch of people that they were interested in putting together with us. I had a certain set of people that I was interested in bringing in. Maybe at this time I don't say who, but one day I will say who. Because I don't want it to be taken the wrong way. And then those people wind up getting disappointed and whatever. But someone had mentioned to me that,

AOP was on the roster with Paul Ellering. And I was like, wait, what? I was like, since when? Apparently they'd been there for a while. They were looking for the right time to bring them into the fold. And I said, okay, we can try that for sure. So we all meet at the Performance Center and we start shooting these cryptic vignettes of, it was almost like Iron Man 3 with the Mandarin when he had all the TVs behind him, Ben Kingsley.

Yeah. And he's like, oh, now. see me coming. Like these propaganda videos, you know. It was really cool. I loved the setup. And initially it was supposed to be the direction we're going and was sort of like almost like a militia, a cult group.

And I've always been one to try to stay away from reoccurring archetypes. Like there's nothing wrong with reoccurring archetypes and professional wrestling and films and movies and all that. they just, they are what they are. There's reoccurring archetypes and the little of the stories in the world relating to now. But I wanted to kind of present something new to people, something fun with some nostalgia callbacks.

Yeah, that's kind of how it started. We've gone in some different directions. At one point, they were like, we kind of want you to be like a mixed martial arts group. That's not a good idea. I was like, that's not a good idea. Like when you think about the times were being given to work, like a mixed martial arts type of wrestler would be good in a 20 to 30

minute format because now you have time to get into the holds and stuff. When you put people in holds and you're doing submissions and stuff, it's a lot of flat time. So if the show's moving quick and we want to keep the action going, what am I going to do? Put on a knee bar for three seconds. That doesn't, you know, all of us can do all of that stuff, but we, um, we, we, all of us, thought leaning more into the character direction rather than that would be a better thing to do. I wish we had 20 or 30 minutes. I would have put on, you know, I would have walked down to Ken Shamrock's theme music and build the lines down.

Give you the whole thing, you know? I love that. That is such an underrated theme song. So good. With your background in Jiu-Jitsu, how did you find out that you could break a baseball bat with a submission? So I remember in my early 20s, the guys in the gym were trying to do that. And the very first time I saw it, the guy broke his arm. Yeah, he broke his arm.

We all went, yeah, because we heard it. We just looked away. It was so loud. It was so loud. Broke his arm. And I was like, God, I'm never doing that. What an idiot. Like, what was the point of that?

They filmed it and everything. And then another time I heard somebody else tried it. And he got like a spiral fracture in his arm. And then I don't know. I was just sitting at home. And I was like a day after I did deadlifts. And I was like just thinking to myself, well, maybe they're pulling with the, I understand the functionality of it. Like you have a base, fulcrum.

You have a lever. He's like, you should be trying to drive your hip through it. You shouldn't be trying to bend it over your arm. I was like, oh, whatever, I'll try it. And like I had like some relatives over and they had left like, they have, kids and they had like some equipment that had been sitting in my garage for a while and there was a baseball bat there so I just grabbed it and tried it filmed it and I was like oh I was like that's easier than I thought maybe they just didn't have their hip through it I couldn't visually remember

and yeah that's how that kind of happened they just thought it be kind of funny to I don't know post it maybe I was going to post a video breaking my arm oh it's savage like you're a lunatic like watching that video is like I do not want to be caught in the dark alley with this man yeah master of the dark alleys. It's the fact that you even think that that's possible. Then you're willing to go, you know what, I know that the downside of this is I break my arm. I'm going to try it anyway. Yeah. Yeah. I just thought, I was like, well, if I feel like my arm's going to explode, I'll stop. But just be safe. I took my sweater off and I rolled it up and I put it right on the arm just in case. And I don't think it would make a difference, though, like if you're, if the point of leverage is not on your

hips and it's over your arm, whether you have a sweater or a towel there or something, I think that's a wrap. And then somebody told me they were like, that was a type of baseball bat that's for kids, hence with my relatives with the kids. I forget the name of the bat. I haven't played baseball since I was little. That was like the very first one I broke was like, I don't know what it is. Someone will tell us in the comments.

But then they were like, you need to get a real baseball bat. And I was like, I'm pretty sure I could break a real baseball bat. But I broken somebody's leg before. Like it's way easier to break somebody's leg than that whatever bat that I just broke. I don't see the point here. Like it's pounds per pressure. I was doing the math in my head. I was like,

I could probably do this. So I bought an expensive baseball bat like an idiot. It was like, $130 because I let this person get under my skin. And I was like, okay, fine. I'll break the real baseball bat. So I broke the real baseball bat. I scared my wife.

She was on the other side of the house. And I was like, babe, you got us. Look. here. She comes over. She's like halfway. She's like, what do you do?

You broke another baseball bat. What are you doing? What are you doing? So I think people, like I saw in the comments that people thought it was a fake bat. Like, yeah. What? I mean, some people think wrestling is fake. What?

Yeah. Are you serious? I'd throw him down the stairs. If I ever met those people, I'd throw him down the stairs. We should have a counter at the bottom of the screen of how many people you're throwing down the stairs. I love that that's your go-to. That is my go-to. down the stairs i invented that move throw him down the stairs yeah come over here sir staircase over here

no security cameras okay what did russolmina ford him into you that was amazing um hard to put into words man my biggest takeaway from that was walking onto the stage and just looking at a full house The setup. I'm with my wife. Everything her and I have been through. Me growing up as a kid, I got Akem and Razor are next to me who, and I don't warm up to people very easily. They're like family to me now. We have the same sense of humor about stuff like Paul Ellering's next to me. Grew up watching Paul Ellering. Like, I just couldn't believe it. I was like, we finally made it. finally did it. And it was such an uphill battle. And I'm so glad it was because that made it even more like, wow, we really earned this. And I remember looking at my wife and like always going

through the curtain, I'm like in character mode. I like hypnotize myself, almost like dare I say, possessed myself to become somebody else for that performance to bring the cross character to life. for that one moment i was just like Kevin keezer on the stage looking at his wife elizabeth i looked her right in the eyes and i just said i love you and i've never ever done that ever and uh for me that that was the moment like

i wanted to take that in as me i wanted to just have that brief second just for me and for her to remember um it was awesome It was so, so awesome. That's such an understatement. I wish I could find better words, but like it really, like, especially after everything, her and I, together had been through too.

Like, I remember getting a call from one of my relatives after the show. And he was like, you know, what happened to you when you got called up from NXT and when you went to Raw? And they gave you the weird outfit. And he got booked into oblivion. And then you got released. And then you got called back. Now you just did WrestleMania. He was like, you know how many people would have folded from that?

You should wear that period and time of your career as a badge of honor to, like, virtually have been sabotaged and driven off. You knew what you were doing and you just went back to the Indies and you got over and you got called back and then you did WrestleMania. That doesn't happen. That doesn't happen to people. And I never looked at it that way. I remember, I don't even know if I went to bed that night.

I was in such a good place after the show. And I had my mom and dad on the crowd. It was a really, really, really good day. The fact that all of that stuff's going on and you were able to be present in that moment, that's pretty incredible because it'd be easy to get overwhelmed with, okay, I've got to hit this mark and I've got to do this thing, and I've got to get to the ring, and then I've got to remember the match. you were able to be present in that moment and take it in and be grateful for that moment

and also from what you're saying grateful for everything that had happened before to lead you to lead you to this moment yeah yeah I was just so grateful I really really was and uh again I I just it's such a great thing when everything goes your way um when somebody passes you the golden ticket and they say proceed forward everything is laid out out, everything is working for you and everything just clicks. But I've always also been kind of terrified of that because I won't know once it's all said and done if it really earned whatever it is that it's being given to me. Was it just completely situational? Was it because I knew somebody? Was it because I was, I don't know. I have a relative or I've always been, I've always

wanted the hard road subconsciously. Even before wrestling, I was always like, I want to to do things in order, you know. I really felt like I earned it that night to be on that show. Of all the people that get involved with professional wrestling, not even just WW, but professional wrestling that want to be on WrestleMania. So like what is it, one percent of people, maybe even less even do a WrestleMania show. I was able to do that. I was able to travel the world on the way there with my wife. A lot of people don't get to do that. Their families are at home. so all of it was just very serendipitous and very grateful, I guess.

At what point did you find out Snoop Dog was going to be calling your match? The day before at SmackDown, I was told about that. And the very first thing I thought was like, oh, I am going to attack Street profits and Bobby Ashley and I'm going to look at Snoop Dog with the can and go bow wow wow yippio yippe yi bow wow see how much heat I could get and then I thought that would ruin the entire match so I decided not to do it. I decided not to but maybe it should have you had some hilarious calls during that match yeah yeah I had a list of insane weapons that I wish got approved for that match oh man dude because

it was Philly I grew up I was in love with ECW and Heyman got inducted into the Hall of Fame. I had all kinds of crazy stuff. One of the weapons on the list was Al Snow's head. I would have loved to have hit Snoop Dog right in the head with head. That would have been my move. I would have done a flying Topay out of the ring with head, flying at Snoop Dog over the table to hit him with head. That would have been great.

But were you told? Like, Snoop's going to be there. He's going to be calling your match. But you do not acknowledge that he's there. Something to that effect. I just thought, okay, Snoop Dog's calling the match. And I heard that Bubba was going to be there. And I was like, oh, they're jazzing it up.

Okay. I thought all of it kind of just added to the vibe of mania. Throw as much as you can at the audience, give them all the bells and whistles on everything. It makes the actual night in the segment even easier for fans to engage in, give them as much as you possibly can in the time allotted. Do you remember any specific calls when you watched it back from Snoop? and you were like, this is hilarious.

I laughed at the whole thing. There was something that the girls did that night. And I think you went like, oh, damn. I don't know what I was about that, but I just couldn't stop laughing. I think it was maybe I don't know. I think it was when Scarlett hit Bree with the garbage can. It was such a natural reaction.

You just knew it was genuine. You know, what do you do? Do you see that? Another girl hits another girl with a garbage cat. It's funny. How legitimate were those comments? How upset were you were you about what Bobby Lashy was saying about the program you guys had? He was looking ahead to something else.

And you're like, no, this in front of you, this is the thing you should be focused on and talking about. I hate that I'm saying this, but zero. It was a work. Zero. He knows I feel this way about him. It's not the first time I'm saying it. And unless you would have asked me about this, I would have never said it. I love that dude, to death.

After the match, and I wanted to tell him afterwards, so he didn't think I was trying to butter him up before we went out. I told him after the match was done, expressed how much I love him, how much I've looked up to him, what an honor it was to work with him. I remember when they brought ECW back, WW did. People can say whatever they want about it. I thought his section of being ECW champion was awesome. I loved it.

I was a bit of an ECW snob growing up. It was a bit of a snob fan. I was like, oh, ACW originals. I didn't care. He was like, no, he's awesome. He looks like the fucking Hulk. And he's diving out of the ring and doing crazy stuff. He's putting people through tables and stuff.

And then for me personally, fast forward. Now I'm working a mania with him. I told him all that at the end of the match. On the way to that mania match, Bobby and I were constantly trying to find ways to intensify the conflict. And respectfully, we just felt like there were certain things on the way there that felt redundant. And it's not me like, you know, being salty about anything.

It's just him and I want to give. We want to make this as intense and as crazy as possible. And he had an idea to try to blur the lines on the way there to make it feel as real as possible. It was even one time, Bob was like, he was like, you know what we should do? He's like, all these guys, they like to talk and they like to run to the dirt sheets and stuff. dude, we should fight at the beginning of the show. We should get in a fight because all these guys are going to go and they're going to call all the dirt sheets and tell them that we actually had a fight

and it's going to stir people up into what we're doing on TV. And I was like, Bob, hold on a sec. I was like, first of all, what happens if nobody breaks up the fight? And he was like, damn, I didn't think about that. I go, yeah. And also, what happens if we get fired? Because what are we going to do? like Hunter's going to pull us aside and be like, what's wrong with you guys?

Or like, oh, it's just a work. And he's like, you guys are bleeding. Like, what are you doing? And then we, just the whole logical process of having to explain like that it was a work and hoping that the office would have been okay with it that we did that. And then it's spilling. I was like, I was like, let's hold off on this idea. I said, I love crazy stuff like this, but please let's hold off on the idea.

But like him and I were. every single week trying to make this as insane as humanly possible. There was like he wanted me to, and I would have done it, I'm glad I didn't in retrospect. He wanted me to power bomb him out of the ring through a table at mania. He wanted me to give him a running power bomb out of the ring through it. Like he was ready to put his neck and everything on the line. I was like ready to do thumbtacks. I said, if they let me, set a table on fire.

Like, we're ready to do barbed wire. We're ready to do all kinds of crazy stuff. And maybe it is a good idea that we didn't do it. I don't want to promote that that's like the best thing to give to people. It's not always, you know what I mean? There's a lot of things that could go wrong. You get a barbed wire in your eye. What if you get a barbed wire in your balls?

Think about that or a thumb pack in the nut. So I don't know. Yeah, there's zero. There was zero issues. I would hurt so much. Yeah. It could happen. It has happened.

Not to me, but it has happened. I've been on indie shows that's happened. So I yeah I there's zero Him and I were just trying to stir things up weekly And I was doing my absolute best to do Extra media on top of that to pull people in No man wants to lose his hair But for men it's actually pretty common

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who will determine if a prescription is appropriate. Restrictions apply. See website for full details and important safety information. When you got released and you were back on the Indy, was the goal to just get back into the WWA? No. Some days, sometimes, I'll tell you the truth.

Sometimes I had good days and sometimes I had bad days. I was like this all the time. Anyone would ever ask me if I was okay, I would say yes. I'm doing great. I was not doing great all the time. I didn't want sympathy. I didn't want people to worry. I knew no matter how things were going to land, I was going to be okay.

I was going to be able to provide for myself, my family, my wife. I knew that. I believe in karma. I believe in like all things being energy, positive and negative. Align yourself with good karma. Align yourself with positive energy and positive things happen. It's not magic. It's not going to happen immediately overnight.

But I never let that belief leave me. And I'll be careful how I say this, man. There's a story that's never been told. I'm not going to tell it today. I don't feel inclined to tell it because I don't want to stir up something unnecessarily. But I was in the right. And I just knew that if I proceeded forward and I went back to practice what I had perfected. which was being a professional wrestler for the people and knowing,

being self-aware of myself, what I'm good at and what they want to see out of me. Once you know what this is, you can just go back out there and you can get them. You can get them. And I was happy being on the independence. And I became okay with not being in WWE. And my wife every day was telling me, they're going to call back. They're going to call back. And it was just something I didn't even really want to think about

because we were developing a life outside of WWW. and creating like a new foundation of how to support our lives and stuff. It was just something that I had kind of put in my rearview mirror. And that's a beautiful thing about coming up in the independence. It's like when you start on the Indies, you don't get paid because no one's paying to see you. You got to go out there and you have to learn your craft, make everything clean, look smooth, believable in the ring. then you learn how to get the crowd, which is essentially, in my opinion,

is more than anything, it's self-exploration. You need to know who you are. You can't go into the ring and perform as something that you're not because they pick up on it and something doesn't connect. So you learn how to wrestle, you learn how to connect to the crowd, and then the promoters and people that you're working for, they're able to see like, okay, now we can start paying him.

I can justify paying him this much because this is who I believe is coming here to see him in relation to everybody else. Those are the foundations that I came up with. When you're not formatted to be something or trapped in something or be a certain way, you know what to do. So I just knew once I went back out there, I was going to do that. I was going to get him and I got him. Everybody was chanting cross. It was going to kill you right away. And I had it all the way through.

And so I just stopped thinking about it. Do you think about, you were so successful. in NXT. Do you think about going back there and doing what you did back in NXT? Sometimes I do, but the truth of the matter with that is, in my opinion, NXT is a program where they're attempting to build new stars. They want to create stars for the future. Somebody could encourage me to selfishly say yes and try to pander to an audience listening and make them feel like that's something that they want. I know what it's like being someone coming up trying to get something you're after. And it sucks when somebody comes in who's already

had their shot, who's already been there, who was already basically given everything you could possibly want, undefeated with a championship. And you got the whole thing. It's like they're coming back in here. Now that spot is unavailable for someone who really needs it to move into. I'm so grateful. and so proud of my work at NXT, but for the sake of everybody else down there, like, I don't think I should be down there doing it. I really don't. If I were to come back for a match that people would want to see, like a one-off, some sort of program that would be fun to watch, that's different.

But to go back down there and chainsaw through everybody, like, that's not going to help them. It would help me, and people would love it. I'd make sure they love it. There'd be a body count. There'd be bodies everywhere. There'd be people flying down the stairs, Chris. Down the stairs. Down the stairs.

But like for the, for the functionality of the program, there's new people coming up and the business needs those people. They're learning and they've got all the best minds down there. What's the advice you have for somebody who is on the Indies? Wants to be in the spot that you're in right now. I'm sure you get asked this all the time. What's the advice you give them? Everyone always tells these young kids coming up about wrestling. So like when they ask for advice, they talk to them about what they need to learn about wrestling.

And I always think, like, they know that they're supposed to learn how to wrestle. That's all you can give them. No one wants to be, like, really honest. And I've had people reach out to me over the last 10 years on the Indies and some people in the company that are young about how to proceed with things and stuff like that. And I kind of always tell people the same thing. It's like whether you're on the Indies or you're working for a television show, like wrestling television show, you have to learn about what the nature of the operation is that you're

working for. So to give you an example, on the Indies, someone coming in, they want to, you know, success to them is defined by becoming champion of this independent promotion they're working for. So I would sit there and I tell them, well, who's in that position right now and why are they there? And you need to understand from the promoter standpoint, what is the benefit of having this person as their champion. You know, I would tell them, look at what the promoter wants, look at ticket sales, look at who is able to draw, and look at how it is that they're able to draw that. Because if there's no money coming in, then the wrestlers can't be paid.

And if you're not drawing, then reasonably you shouldn't be moving up the card. In a lot of ways, it works the same way for television. but I always tell people, no matter what anybody says, you learn whatever it is that you think you have to learn, but really learn on the Indies how to be a good baby face. From a business standpoint, if you want to go from Indies to television, a baby face is always going to sell more and be utilized more in media. Superman's a baby face.

Lex Luthor's a heel. How many people do you see walking around wearing Lex Luthor shirts? He's a great heel. without Lex Luther. I mean, it's, you know, Superman versus a green rock? How many people do you see wearing green rock shirts? Nobody's wearing Krepanite shirts. They wear the Superman shirt because they love Superman.

Superman sells, you know? These heels are accessories to Superman. If you really want to, you know, if ultimate success is defined by becoming champion to you at this present time, the best way to become champion is to really learn how to be a great baby face. Because one day when you go to TV, if it's afforded to you to be that baby face on TV, you want to make sure you've really got that down pat. You want to know your voice. You want to know how to build up your opponents, not just cut them down on the mic.

You want to know how to, you want to understand sympathy. For me personally, it's like a self-exploration process. You really need to get to know yourself. Like a question people are always afraid to ask themselves is like, like, am I really a good person? How do you define what a good person is? If you're a rotten person in real life and you're on TV playing a baby face, there is something that people pick up on, that there's something disingenuous there.

They may cheer and clap, but there's still something there when you look at somebody. It's the way their face is or people hold things that they should not be doing or should not have done in them. It's a weird, it's an energetic thing. don't do things that you know you're not supposed to do. I wonder if a rotten person, terrible person, knows that they're a terrible person. Because there's this whole idea,

like when you think of movie villains, they're all justified in their actions. They don't think they're a villain. And you think about any Bond villain or any villain in any sort of superhero movie. They're always justified. Like Thanos had a reason why he wanted to, you know,

get rid of half the world. Yep. Every Bond villain also has their reasoning. I wonder if in real, life. A terrible person is able to justify it to themselves and go, you know, that's, that's why I'd do it. Yeah. I think there's a, I think there's a line, yeah. Like, people need to feel justified and why they're doing things that are wrong, like in general. Yeah. That's why characters are written that way. That's why heels are written that way. They need to feel like, oh, I know that,

they know the difference between right and wrong, but there's a reason why they're doing it. You know, whether that's the right reason or not. There's a lot of that in the world. Yeah. You just produced a movie. How did that all come about? Once, well, once I was released from WWE, I was interested in speaking with certain parties involved with filmmaking and stuff like that.

I was getting emails. I had put a booking email online. Scripts were coming in. Some things came up and then something's folded. It's the whole nature of, we're going to do this movie, say yes, and something goes missing and then it just disappears off the face of the earth. It happens a lot, right? Yeah.

Talked about that. This, I kept, I mean, I've always been getting scripts and things being sent to me. And this one particular script, actually, a good friend of mine sent it over to me. And it really spoke to me. I grew up in a family where we were always doing things. things for like Salvation Army and homeless shelters and almost all my relatives were always people that were giving cash to homeless people. Like I grew up seeing that.

So it was kind of like in our family culture. And the script that I got for this film was about a guy who was homeless struggling with drug addiction. A lot of people don't know this. But prior to wrestling, I was a family mediator. So I went to school and studied psychology, sociology, substance. abuse, identifying power imbalances and relationships and all different kinds of stuff. And so I had worked with people who were suffering with substance abuse and all different

types of issues. And there was just something on paper that really kind of jumped off and felt very real. It felt like a very authentic story. And I wanted to bring it to life. And the person who wrote the script is Jet Janssen, I wrestled a super panda. I just gave his identity away. please don't tell anybody, throw you down the stairs. But yeah, he nailed it with this.

It felt very human. And it was also, I don't want to, I'm not ruin anything, but there are a lot of feel-good moments in the film as well. And I think that's missing in a lot of, in life for people. So when can we see this? I believe right now. Because you didn't just produce it. You're also in it.

I have a supporting role in it. Yeah. It's pretty much done. being edited. We got a color treat it. We're going to sound mix it. And it'll be in select theater is actually in Los Angeles, probably late October.

Oh. Yeah. So it's way sooner than I expected. Yeah. And you were talking about all this post-production stuff. I thought you were going to say like sometime in 2025. No. Oh, soon.

Yeah. So it's a short film. And learning the whole process of how you could submit it to like awards and film festivals. Film festival, some of that stuff. Yeah, it categorically had to be in certain things. And I learned about all that. Spoke with WGA, PGA, learning a lot this year. Yeah.

The first of many then? I think so. I fell in love with it. Like being on set to, it's like jazz. You know what I mean? You have a script and whatever. And everyone comes together. And you have a great crew and bringing something to life like that.

It's just so fulfilling. I love to create. Like, I'm always. painting or drawing or writing or playing music and stuff like that. This was like a breath of fresh air just to like kind of capped in a ship. You know, I've always have all these ideas and concepts and I know they're going to be good. I'm positively going to be good. I know and by good I mean I know people are going to enjoy them and it's going to work. But if you're not the captain of the ship, to some degree your hands are tied. It felt really good to be able to create something like that

with people. So yeah, end of October, it'll be in select theaters in Los Angeles. It's called blue evening. Blue evening. When you were on with us last time, you talked about your book. Where are we at with your book now? That was an evil laugh. All the things I can't say. So it's good to go.

A publisher picked it up. It's going to be, pre-sales are going to be going on at the beginning of next year. Yeah. So we're good to go. Yeah, it just took a really long time. I had a conversation with a publisher and he told me, he said, if you had shown this book to me two years ago, I would have published it immediately.

And I went, so where's the butt in that? I just, it could have, it could have been out way sooner. I see. It could have, it's been ready to go.

It's been ready to go. I just, I had this, I had this publisher's number before I came back. And I was this close to calling him, but I was like, oh, I'm doing the right thing.

But now you've got the WWE machine. Yes. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like, you saw what they did. for Becky's book. Yes. And I'm very, very excited about that. You know what I mean? Like any chance I ever can have to foster the relationship, I mean, that's what I wanted to do, you know.

But we could have, the book could have been out right now if we, if we moved a little bit faster on getting it to the publisher two years ago. So it's a little frustrating, you know. And we'll have another conversation when the book comes out. Yes. To push that at that point in time. Yes. I can't wait. Oh, me too. Yeah. It's always so good to see you. You too much. And I appreciate you always just being so up for doing this whenever. Absolutely. And also up for just hanging out with Jesse Ventura and all of the silliness that that turned into.

Almost through myself downstairs after that. I couldn't believe it. Couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe it. How's Scarlett doing? She's doing very good. I felt my phone ringing, so that means that she probably just woke up.

She has no idea that I'm here. This is early morning, by the way. She's a vampire. She's a vampire. She does not go to sleep early. She's up all night. She's flying around the room, talking to ghosts and shit. Like, I know you said you didn't want to do it, but somehow, some way I'm going to get you to some place that's not as haunted one day for the paranormal show that she's doing. She asked me if I'd be interested. And I said, I need to be honest with you. That stuff scares me. Yeah. And I don't want to bring that home. We've got a little one at home and another little one on the way. Kids start speaking Latin to you. Oh, everything's fine, honey. Everything's fine. I don't think my wife, if I explained what this was, I don't think my wife would be okay with this. Maybe I will do an impression of you. I will be Chris at the paranormal thing.

No one's going to believe that, okay? You're going to chop your knees in half so you're significantly shorter. Is she going to not eat for a year? Oh, man. Yeah, I, I, that, like, haunted houses still get me. I'm that guy. Yeah. Yeah. There's a, like there's a really scary haunted house in Niagara Falls called Screamers. And they have a counter outside.

Oh, I know. It scared the shit out of me when I was little. Okay. There's a counter outside of how many people have chickened out. Yeah. And it's in the like hundreds of thousands. And I actually did make it all the way through. But apparently if you get too scared, you just say, screamers.

So you probably don't say like that. You probably. Oh, see, get out of here. And they will like come and grab you out of a like a side door and like get you out. The chicken exits. Yes, the chicken exit. And they're very proud of how many people have chickened out of this. I was 12 who went there and there was a guy.

12. Yeah, I was 12 years old and the Dracula guy who was in the house. I don't know if he's still there. I don't know. He was banging on the walls and screaming on everything. I don't know, man. Maybe the next time I go, I bring AOP and they just beat this shit out of him. Like they're not allowed to touch you, but they come real close.

Yeah. Like there's a guy who sounds like a, like he's snarling like a dog. Yeah. And he's right in your ear. It's pitch black. And you're like, ah. I wonder if they trained a new guy to do that or he's been doing it for 20 years. Yeah, I wonder if it's the same dude.

Imagine the people putting that together. We need the snarler. I mean, we need to swirzy. Imagine that job posting. Can you snarl like a dog? Can you snarl. I will end this with the same question I ask you every single time. And perhaps your answer will be the same.

And if not, that's great. What are three things that you're grateful for right now? Well, I'm grateful to be traveling the world with my wife. It added such an insane, intense aspect of romance to our relationship that is very much like a fairy tale movie. Most people don't even get to leave their local cities because of the realities of nine five are working 50 hours a week. I came from that. I've never forgotten it. Sometimes we'll just be looking around going like, how are we in France right now? Or like how are we in Switzerland? It's unbelievable. Very, very grateful for that. Very grateful that a particular relative of

mine is doing well. The whole reason I actually joined WWE to begin with was because I thought he was very ill and I thought that he was going to pass away. I thought I was going to have to take over somebody's mortgage and he's still with us. I don't want to put him on blast because his friends are watching us. He's pretty protective over that stuff. But I spoke to him this morning and I'm glad he's still here. And the third thing, honestly, dude, I'm, I'm grateful to be here talking with you. I enjoy our talks. I really do. Me too. I want to just tell you this too, like, and I don't mean this in a condescending way whatsoever at all. I'm super proud of you, man, because I remember when we met and the things that you've done since the time that we met and

we're still doing these. I love seeing you doing stuff with big people. and your work getting recognized. Because what you do, people will not understand. It's not just sitting in front of somebody and asking questions. It's bringing something to life for people to see. And I really sincerely do appreciate that. Thank you for the kind words. I appreciate it.

And right back at you. When we met you were at a very different point in your life. Oh, yeah. Very different point in your career. And I know when you got let go, it was a surprise to everybody. And also, that must have been so tough to deal with. And here you are on the other side of it. doing all of the things that you want to be doing with even more stuff on the way, I'm sure.

So congrats to you on all your success. Thank you. And always good to be able to spend some time with you. You too, man. Always. All right. What a guy. And I appreciate the very kind words that he said there at the end.

Kevin is a good man. And I'm honored to be able to call him a friend. And I'm just so excited to see what these next few months have in store for him. Because I feel like they are building a friend. up to something. They are building up to something. And I just can't wait to see exactly what it is when all the pieces kind of fall into place here. Snap a screenshot and tag us so we can share it out. He's at real killer cross. Very active on Twitter. He's really good at responding to tweets with get like the most perfect gifts. I was just going to say gifts, but they're the most perfect gifts. Like he will respond

in a gift that basically is an entire paragraph of thoughts. If you've ever received a tweet reply from him, you know exactly what I'm talking about. But tag him, Real Killer Cross, tag me at Chris Van Fleet. And here's a quote that I saw on Instagram. I shared it to my story, but I'm going to share it here as well. You either quit or keep going. They both hurt. Choose wisely.

Be great. Be grateful, my friends. We'll see you on the next one for some more insight. We'll see you back here tomorrow for Ask CVV number. 53 if you've got a question, send it in on social media or shoot me an email, CVV at chrisfamily.com and we'll see you back here tomorrow for that one. The Hammer Alley podcast, an 80s flashback mockumentary. Back in the 80s, there were a thousand bands trying to make it in the world of rock,

but there was one band that had it all. Hammer Alley. Whatever happened to Hammer Alley? How did they go from top of the rock? I'm looking for a music video. You're a band from 1987. Hammer Alley. Ever heard of them?

To Rock Bottom. Dude, I was born in 1987. I can't believe he's doing this. Hammer Alley. Follow and listen on your favorite platform.