Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Live Your Passion And NEVER GIVE UP With Professional Bass Fisherman Mike Iaconelli

Episode Date: May 20, 2022

Mike Iaconelli (@mikeiaconelli) is a professional bass angler, television host and podcaster. He joins Chris Van Vliet to talk about how he got started as a pro bass fisherman, how important it is to be true to himself, why he lives by the advice "Never Give Up", his favorite lake to fish on, moving from the Bassmaster Elite Series to Major League Fishing and then qualifying to fish for BASS again, what his current goals are, the biggest things he has learned from fishing and much more! For more information about Mike Iaconelli visit his website: http://mikeiaconelli.com If you enjoyed this episode, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast/iTunes? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests.  For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://chrisvanvliet.com Follow CVV on social media:  Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

All systems are gathered. Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Blitz! All right, my friends, welcome back to another audio adventure here on Insight. It's me, it's me, it's C V. I'm Chris Van Bleet. Thank you so much for being with us on this episode. And if you haven't yet, please take a moment right now to click follow or subscribe wherever you're listening. It helps so much more than I could ever explain.

You know, I talk quite a bit about it. And if you follow me on Instagram, you know it. I love bass fishing. I started fishing in bass tournaments when I was 14. I'm now the co-founder of the bass fishing tungsten weight company called Woo! Tungsten, W-O-O-exclamation Mark Tungsten. So this conversation today is extra special for me. Mike I Canelli is one of the best professional bass fishermen to ever do it.

and it was an honor to be able to sit down with him and pick his brain about everything. You can find him on social media at Mike I. Canelli. If you're not following me, you can find me at Chris Van Fleet. And we get into how professional bass fishing even works, but at the heart of this message, whether you know nothing about bass fishing or whether you are a seasoned pro,

at the heart of this conversation is the idea that anything you want to do in love, life is possible. Like anything, I was talking about if somebody's doing the thing that you want to do, that just means that it's possible for you as well. And I think this sums it up best. This is a clip of Mike I Canelli winning the 2003 Bassmaster Classic. This is like the Super Bowl of Bass fishing.

And he lands the winning fish and he knows it's going to be the winning fish. And this is what we hear. Passion, right? The passion there. I love it. Never give up. This is so good. Please welcome.

Mike, I Canelli. Iish. Chris. Thank you so much for making the time to do this. Oh, man. Thank you. This is, honestly, this is an amazing thing for me. It's an amazing opportunity.

I follow a lot of what you do. And you get to talk to and interview and meet, like, actual famous people and celebrities. And I'm just sort of a scrub from Jersey. So thank you for having me on. Stop it. Stop it. In the fishing world, you're like Tiger Woods. You're like Kobe Bryant in the fishing world. Yeah, I don't know about that. I do love to fish, though. I'm very passionate about it.

It's been something I've loved since I was a little kid, like literally like little kid. It's just something I've always wanted to do. So all these years later, I'm 50 now. I've been doing. doing it professionally for almost 30 years. So all these years later, it's still kind of like not real to me. Honestly, like, it's still amazing that I get to do this like as a job. It's, it's mind blowing, man. It's crazy.

Well, my audience will know that I'm really passionate about fishing. And like when I'm passionate about the things that I'm passionate about, like I dive all the way in. So I fished in a lot of the tournaments that you have fished in. You were on the pro side. I was obviously on the amateur side. So, like, we've definitely like our power. have crossed. I was actually at a tournament on Lake Erie that you won. I was living in Cleveland

for five years. So the fact that we now get to sit down and chat about this is it's a huge honor for me. So thank you, Mike. Well, the honor's mine as well. And thank you for having me on. When you explain to people who maybe don't understand the world of professional bass fishing, what you do for a living? How do you explain it? Yeah, it's, it's an easy explain and it's a hard explain at the same. time. So I'll try to navigate right in the middle here. Our sport, professional bass fishing, is set up a lot like other sports. So, you know, you come into the sports realm as, you know, an amateur, as a young, as a young participant. You work your way up through the very grassroots

level. And as you work your way up, you know, your level of skill increases, but your qualification increases. So if you follow golf or tennis, very, very similar, right? So I started as an amateur angler, you know, co-angler, did that for a few years, advanced to like the regional, like, semi-pro level, did that for a few years, fish some qualification tours, did that for a few years. And then finally, I accumulated enough points to fish professionally. So, you know, that part's, that part of it's easy. So, you know, we travel around the country. We fish tournaments. There's rules, regulations, just like other sports.

The hard part to explain is our sport has a little bit of other sports in it like NASCAR, even a little like wrestling, where branding and marketing and promotions are just as important part of the sport as the actual competition. So, you know, so that part. is a lot of what I do as well. And I work with companies to help sell and promote their products. I work really hard on my social outreach, TV shows, things like that to help build my brand and fan following to then in turn be able to help companies help them market and sell their products. And there's real money in this.

Like when you look at your career earnings of over $3 million, I think that that blows a lot of people away. There's real money in it. And, you know, to be honest, if you strip. away all of that, I would still be doing it because I love it. And, you know, our sport, when you look at it, it's very young in terms of other mainstream professional sports. Right. So, you know, you look at baseball and hockey and soccer. They've been around forever, forever, you know, 100 years plus. Fishing, we started in the early to mid-70s. So we're a young

sport. And because of that, you know, our our income isn't at that mega sport level yet, but it's for sure getting there. Like I said, I'd be doing it if I was, if I could break even. If I could get by, I'd be doing it. But there's a lot of money now in the sport. I think the average event now, pro event that we fish for, you're talking 100 to 150,000 for championship events, quarter million, half a million dollars in some of these events. And they've That's for the winner, by the way. For the winner. And they've even had some million dollar tournaments.

But, you know, the real thing, and I'm proud that our sport has gotten there is the amount of money that you can make above and beyond your winnings. And that's a real important part because it's hard to win. It is hard to win. It's so, I mean, I know it's like this in other sports too, but I've been doing it 30 years. I've won like 12 tour professional tour events. In 30 years, it's that hard to win, right? So I'm really proud that the sport's gotten to a stage where a young angler, an angler just getting into it can actually make a really, really good living through endorsements,

through other pieces of the fishing pie and make a living, right? I mean, I can remember getting in the sport where most of the guys didn't make a good living. Most of the guys lost money. Most of the guys were in the red. I remember dreaming about the day that I could make a million dollars without ever cashing a check in a tournament. I dreamt about that day. And, you know, it's here. Those days are here now.

And it should be. I can tell you, I follow a lot of other sports. And, you know, the athletes in our sport, the participants and professional. fishing work just as hard. They're just as passionate. There's as much involved physically, mentally. And I'm proud. I'm proud of where the sport is in 2022. You know there's going to be a lot of people listening to us going. He keeps calling it a sport. He keeps calling them athletes. Don't you just go out there and if the fish bite they bite? Oh, yeah. Yeah. It's great. I've been fighting and I don't mind fighting this battle because I've been fighting it for a long time. I'm sure. And, you know, I can see,

Because fishing definitely has a lot of stereotypes attached to it. And some are well deserved. Others aren't. But, you know, fishing should be a fun, relaxing sport. It should be that. But it's also very competitive. And to get to the top level, you have to obtain those same skill sets and traits that any top athlete has. And, you know, it's a little less physical in fishing.

And I think that's where maybe the confusion is. You know, people say, oh, well, you're fishing. How physical can that be? Maybe a little less physical, but just as many mechanics. And from a mental side, I would argue that our sport, fishing, is more challenging than a lot. You know, we deal with an environment that's not controlled. You know, we're out on a boat, eight-hour days. We have that eight-hour period in all conditions.

whatever's thrown at us. So sun, wind, waves, rain, calm, dirty, clear, reservoirs, rivers, lakes, west coast, east coast, north, south. We have to deal with all those things that change, not month to month or year to year, but minute to minute, hour to hour. The environment's changing. And you have to be a study of the fish. And you have to be able to change and adapt and outsmart. and outthink what that fish is doing to catch the five biggest every day to win the tournament, to win angler of the year, to win the classic. It's a lot. It's a lot.

And I love defending fishing as a sport because it really is. It really is. I think one of the biggest things people don't understand is how many different skill sets you need to be successful as an angler. Because you need to know how to drive a boat. You need to know how to like read charts and read graphs. And then you need to know how to catch them, whether they're in shallow water, deep water, tidal water, and everything else that you just listed. Yeah. It's a lot. For a lot of your listeners and viewers, if you're old like me and you remember the Rubik's Cube from the 80s, fishing, I always described fishing as like the Rubik's Cube.

And to solve just a side of that, I've never solved my life, believe me. But to solve a side of the Rubik's Cube was a big deal for me. And, you know, that's like fishing. And it's all those elements. And you have to get them all right. You know, you have to make the right decisions. And you have to keep adjusting and tweaking and churning. And then finally, you solve that side. And that's fishing.

And, you know, the Rubik's Cube side being solved and fishing is you catching the fish. When you actually start figuring out and the fish come in the boat. And that's solving the puzzle. The one great analogy, maybe a lot of other people watching that participate in other sports, the one thing you can probably understand really well is something called getting in the zone, which you hear talk about a lot in other sports. And in fishing, that's what you strive to reach, you know, when you're out there and all of a sudden, like, everything you do is right.

Your decisions are perfect. Your timing is right. It's almost like you're out of your body watching yourself fish and things just start happening. And I've been really fortunate in my career to have that happen a couple dozen times. That's it. And it's easy to talk about it's easy to talk about how to get into the zone and what you've got to do and think. But it's hard for it to actually happen. But when it does, it's magical.

You win trophies. You catch fish. You make money. It's great. What do you think is the biggest lesson about life? Mike that fishing has taught you. Oh, man, there's a lot. I would say from when I was a kid and I was real fortunate,

I grew up in, lived in Philadelphia until I was seven, grew up in New Jersey. I definitely didn't have the background of fishing that a lot of people have in different parts of the country, but I loved it. My family got me involved in it. And I can tell you that fishing has taught me

tons and tons of life lessons. for sure, you know, patience would be one, you know, dedication would be one, concentration, you know, effort. There's so many different life lessons. But, you know, the one is, and it's become my tagline. And I know you've had other people on the show that have also talked about the same thing. But it is to never give up and push, to keep pushing. I'm a huge advocate of that in fishing and in life. You know, we've all had moments in our life and in fishing.

I've had moments in my fishing day where everything is failing and everything is bad. You know, you don't have a fish and you're down and you break a big one off. And I've had those things happen in my life. I've had, you know, deaths and failures and, you know, things I've done wrong and all those things. And there are times in fishing in life where you want to. your instinct is, man, this sucks. I don't want to do this anymore. I didn't want to give up. I can't do it. But that something from within that keeps you going, that drives you, that keeps pushing you, that never give up spirit. I've had that in my life. I've had that in my

fishing career. And it's been the biggest one, Chris, for me. I've not just, not only have won tournaments because of that, but I'm still here because of that. And I've had a few parts in my career where I was, I thought it was over. I thought I was ready to be done. And I just kept pushing and and work through some hard times. And it's a great, it's a great fishing motto. It's a great life motto. Yeah, I love it so much because you're right. It applies to literally anything. Yeah. There was a VHS tape when I was growing up that I wore out with the Bassmasters. It was the Vermont Tomp 150. Yes. On Lake Champlain. And I watched this so, so much. I got ask you, the guy that I'm talking to right now

feels so different from the guy who fished in that tournament. Where did the shift happen? Yeah, there was, and man, I love that you brought that example up because it was a long time ago. It's almost hard to remember, but as you were saying it, little flashbacks were already

coming back, and I love that. All I remember is the net, and you were cutting the jerk bake out of the net, and then you tried to net the next fish, and then the fish went through the net. Oh, it was a disaster. Well, you know, there's two parts of this. So putting in context, this was my first year as a pro.

I had worked really hard as a semi-pro, as an amateur, to get to this level. I finally qualified. And you're 25 years old at the time, right? Very young. A young man in our sport. And a lot of sports is 25-year-old already. Been ours, it's very young, especially at that time. So late 90s, just qualified for the pro tour.

It was only my second event ever. And going into the last day, I was in the lead. and I was beating some of my heroes by just a little bit. Rick Klan, David Fritz, Ron Shuffield, guys that I have read about since I was a kid, you know, icons of the sport. I was in the lead as a pro, my second pro tournament ever. Dude, I'm flipping out.

And, you know, like a lot of young athletes, a lot of young, you know, young professionals, you're green and you're nervous. And, you know, I had never really had like that kind of pressure or that kind of even national exposure, a camera guy, you know, breathing down your back behind you the whole time. And I remember I had a sort of a one-two approach to catching fish. And one was large mouth, one was small mouth. The large mouth pattern died. I was like three hours in without a fish. And then I land it on the mother load of small mouth. and it was just mayhem. It was a mess.

And it was a small mouth every cast for about 40, 45 minutes. I'm not kidding. And it was so crazy and wild that back then we were allowed to use nets. And the net I was using was not, it was like cloth. And the hooks were getting tangled. I was fishing a jerkpink. I was cutting the net. I was landing fish.

But then the hole was so big that the small mouth were falling out. I had a fish grab the bird. bait off the surface. So I was fishing jerk bait and then I have a follow up lure and I had one follow it and it didn't get it. So I put the rod down. The jerk bait's laid on top. I went to grab my other rod. A fish came up and ate it right next to the boat. Like that's how good it was. And it was a crazy disastrous day, but I won. I won. And it was such a critical tournament for me. I think you could talk to a lot of people and look at their professional life, their career, and say, this was the moment that made it for me. And that was one of them because when you're a young angler in our sport, there's so much pressure, not just from the standpoint of wanting to perform because of the financial end.

But, you know, it's the time, the dedication. My family was supporting me. I had all this pressure. And, you know, when you're that young in your career, a major win changes your career. It sort of gives you a little bit of stability in a time of total flux. And it was a big deal. Winning that event sort of put me on the map a little bit. $100,000 at 25 in that stage of my career as a freshman was a big deal.

I needed it financially. I was carrying some debt, you know, from those hotels and gas. and entry, all those things total up. So it was a big, huge moment for me. But it was also, you know, I think it was still a stage in my career where I was trying to be a little reserved. And I can look back, and I've looked back at that same tournament, and it's awesome looking back and watching it.

But I also can look back and see where I didn't totally let out who I was at that point. You know, I think for a lot of people, when you first get in something, you want to fit in. You know, you feel almost this burden to assimilate to be like the other guys. And back then I could look back and see I had patches on my vest and my shirt was tucked in. And I got excited. Don't get me wrong. But I didn't totally let it out. And, you know, I could see a reserved kid, young green kid.

that, you know, when I when I look at sort of what I had become later as my career advanced, definitely have changed a little over the years and opened up to be in myself a little more, which is nice. When do you think was the first season where you were really able to be yourself? Yeah, it was. So it was a few years later. It was 2002. So that was that was 1999.

And for sure, I think the first couple of, yeah, I was like 97. I'm sorry. No, that's okay. It was actually, I take that back. It was the fall of 98. It was September of 98. That year, it was the season ran in two seasons, 98, 99. So it was the fall of 98. By 2002, I sort of started letting my guard down. And that was happening sort of on its own. I was sort of getting sick of trying to sort of be someone that I wasn't, but also happened with a big life event for. me where in 2001 my uncle, my uncle Don, who my uncle Don is like, you know, and I know some of your listeners and viewers have uncles that are like dads to them. He was, he was my dad. My dad passed

away when I was super young when I was two in a car accident. So my uncle was sort of my father, my father figure and a guy that introduced me to the sport and just he's my guy. He's my man, right? And he was 2001. He was gone through stage four, Hodgkin's lymphoma. You know, his diagnosis actually wasn't real good. He was pretty far along. And, you know, as he was going through that fight, my mindset really changed. And I sort of said, you know, I got to, man, you got to enjoy life. You got to be who you are. You got to let go. Nothing's guaranteed in life. So that came out. The never give up thing definitely came out. I got to watch him fighting this thing, you know, battle it. By the way, my uncle's still around today. He beat it. We love Uncle Don.

Shout out to Uncle Don. But by 2002, I was like, man, I had enough of this stuff. I'm going to be who I am. And that meant, you know, letting go a little. And, you know, that's in dress in the way, in the way I acted, in the way I talked. And, you know, just not being scared to let people know who you are. And the interesting thing is that when I did that, I instantly noticed like, almost like a roller coaster going up that. that my brand and my fan base and my sponsors, everything, everything in my life and business

started to just boom. And, you know, I think it was a big year for me because I realized, man, you can be who you are. You can be different. You can, you know, you can be odd or strange. You know, you can be that and people will accept you, you know, and it feels a lot better because you're not sort of hiding behind something that that you're not. So much of your story is about being this outsider and, you know, kind of finding your way into this world. Like you grew up in the north, a lot of the anglers were from the south. You were younger.

A lot of them were older at the time. Talk to us about what it was like kind of finding your way in that world. Yeah, it was, it was, you know, a different world back then. I'm trying to think of a good way to explain this. but for sure, professional fishing in the mid-90s, early to mid-90s, when I was really working my way up, was not a sport that catered toward non-traditional southern anglers. So it was a little bit of a struggle. And, you know, definitely I experienced things and had to work through things that I think,

had I been from Alabama or Georgia and had a southern. accent and did things a little different, I don't think I would have went to those struggles. In saying that, I am so glad I did, right? Because, you know, looking back on some of that stuff, it created, it made me who I am today. Not just in my professional career, but in my life, right? In my life, I'm the person I am today because of those things that I went through. So I wouldn't have it any other way. I would never go back in time and change any of that. But there were for sure moments where, you know, you questioned, you know, should I be doing this? You know, these guys don't want me out here.

You know, it's at some points, you know, it was even the league that didn't want me there. I was an outsider. I was different, strange, you know. So everything was tougher. But as I broke those barriers down and it happened first through fans, I think maybe second through spy. And then, you know, lastly, you have to gain the trust of the other anglers. I think at some point eventually they look and they realize that, man, this, this dude, yeah, he's strange.

And I still don't like this guy. But he's here for the right reasons. He's here because he's working his ass off. He loves fishing. He's passionate about fishing to the core. You know, I think eventually people saw that. And so it did become easier. And time passed.

You know, I can tell you that as our sport became more mainstream, as our sport gained more national visibility. And, you know, of course, the advent of the internet and social media and live TV and stuff like that have helped tremendously. But as all that happened, you know, I think those barriers started to break down more. So it wasn't just me. There were a lot of other anglers coming up in the same period that we're dealing with the same thing. Aaron Martins, Skate Reese, Ishmaunro, definitely there were other young anglers that were gone through the same thing and fought the same fights. But the fishing world is definitely different today.

I'm so happy. I'm a participant and a fan. So I love when I watch other leagues and even events that I don't qualify for the finals. And I see a Japanese angler. I see a black angler. I see, you know, a young kid from Minnesota who's like 22. Like, I love it. I love it, you know.

And it's, I think it's great for the sport. You know, you cover enough other sports and enough other pieces of entertainment that that's a critical piece, right? It's like if the sport or that segment of entertainment, if it's all the same, man, it's stagnant. Your fan base is stagnant. Yeah. But as you get different characters and different personalities, people want to watch. People relate to that more.

So I think it's great. I think the sports come a long way from, you know, 96, 97, 98 to 2022. We definitely come a long way. You know, you mentioned wrestling earlier. And you're right. Like that has a certain element of pro wrestling of these like larger than life characters. And, you know, now you've got Dave Mercer, who's a good friend of mine. announcing you guys, like at the boxing match.

Like, I think all of that tied in together makes this so exciting. Yeah, it's great. And it's, it's entertainment. You know, part of it's entertainment. I think no matter what sport you follow, you know, yeah, there's a piece of it that's about the competition, right? Your favorite team, your favorite athlete. But there's also a part of it that you're watching because of the excitement and the energy

that that event puts off. And yeah, for sure, I think today you're able to see that a lot better through the participants, through the MCs, through the coverage. Lives been great for our sport. We need it live to happen, you know, because of our arena is so big. We needed that live thing to happen. And it's exciting. I can tell you this, Chris. I remember fishing my first club tournament.

I got a John boat for my high school graduation president. I was 18 years old. I got a John boat in June, and I remember fishing my first ever tournament, small boat tournament, probably 20 boats, a fish with my good friend, Brian the carpenter, who now produces my podcast. And we didn't catch crap. Zero. Well, I think we caught a keeper. We bombed.

We finished last. But I remember that feeling, the butterflies, the excitement, the emotion of just launching. And I still have that today. And, you know, that's my gauge for me. of how long I'm going to keep competing, you know. And I'm not old in my sport, but for sure, I can tell you that I'm in sort of the fourth quarter, you know, the last couple chapters of my career.

But as long as I feel that, I still feel that, man, I'm going to keep going, you know. You know, and it's interesting that you bring that up because I remember reading your book. And you talk in your book about how if you hadn't won the classic in 2003 that you were done. Like, that's how the book starts, right? Like, I was done.

Oh, yeah. I feel like, Mike, you were put on this earth to catch large mouth and smallmouth bass. Like, I'm not calling you a liar, but I'm saying like, I don't believe that you were done. Yeah. That may be true. I mean, you know, here's the thing, whether, you know, you're philosophical or you're religious or whatever your background is, I do believe that things happen for a reason, you know. And I think I can look at moments in my life and in my career. where, you know, I don't say weird things, but things happen that probably shouldn't have happened.

You know, the classic win for sure is one of them. I was at the lowest point in my life. I had sponsors that were getting ready to leave. I mean, it was pretty much a dead end road for me back in 2003. And then I win this classic with all these strange things that happened, catching the winning fish with a minute to go before I had to make a two and a half hour boat. run back and get back to make it in on time. I do believe that. I believe a little that destiny, there's destiny, there's fate, that things happen when they're supposed to happen. I'm a believer in that. And I'm also a believer that, you know, you'll know when the next thing is, it's time to move to the next thing. I've had a few of those happen in my life. I've had a few, you know, things that have popped up that I had to go do. I've had, I took a small hiatus in my career back when COVID came around and

a lot of the national tournaments were shut down, just like a lot of mainstream sports. I took a bit of a hiatus. Even when the sports, a bass fish is started to come back, I took a year off. And it was such a good thing for me. And it was a, it was a reset for me mentally in my life, for my family. it was a reset. And I needed that. I needed that. But I think you know when you're ready to stop. And I think you know when you're ready to keep competing. And at 50, 30 years in, I still have some time left in me. Chris, I want to win again. I mean, that's the bottom line. I can, I know you hear you, you interview a lot of people and they tell you, you know, they're driven by wanting the win. And it's the same for me. I want to win more. I want to win more trophies. I want to win again, you know. was that reset that you took? Was that like kind of saying goodbye

to the one chapter of your life when you were fishing for Major League fishing and then hello again to going back to Bass? It was. It was. It was a reset in a lot of ways. I can tell you that when you do something a certain way for so long, you forget about some things that are important.

You forget or maybe you don't forget, but, you know, they're just misplaced. And that year and a half I had off was a time for me to say, there's other things in life besides that top competition level. And, you know, so like, man, getting to see sporting events for my kids, getting to see graduations, getting to see things that I missed, you've got to remember for your listeners and viewers, the life of a professional fisherman, you're gone a lot.

You're gone 250 plus days a year. You are not home. You're a traveling gypsy. So, you know, it was a great reset for my personal life. But I think you're right. I think from a competitive standpoint, it made me realize that I missed it. I missed the competition. And I made me realize that I missed the style of tournament that is what I grew up on,

which is over at bass. I for sure, I love professional bass fishing. And we have two major tours. Major League fishing has a slightly different format. I'm not bashing that. I like it. It was fun. I spent a couple years there in that league.

I liked it. But for me, my heart and soul and sort of who I am is based on the tournament competition that I watched as a 12-year-old, that I watched Rick Klan win a classic, that I watched, you know, Roland Martin and Gary Klein and Denny Brower and those guys. the five fish limit. And so when Becky and I, and we made a family decision that I was going to come back and tour again, it was sort of a no-brainer for me to go back to bass,

to end my career in a place where I started it. It feels good. It feels natural there. It feels like being home back at that league. So again, you know, was it fate? Was it destiny? I don't know, whatever you want to think, however you want to think about it.

I'm glad I ended up back at bass. And I want to ask you this question as a fan. Yeah. So many people were going to Major League fishing. And it was like one name after another, after another, after another. I imagine it wasn't an easy decision to make at all. What was the final straw that made you went, okay, I am going to do it? Super tough decision.

Super tough decision. And this is, I'll try to give a little context to it for, you know, listeners of viewers that aren't hard. We've gone into the weeds here. Yeah, we're going on the weeds, but that's okay. So our sport had a bit of a shakeup where a new league was formed and a vast majority of the big name participants. So the big name athletes in the major league defected to this other league. It was huge in our sport. So, you know, PGA golf had it happen way back when NFL had it happen. So other sports have had the same thing happen. And the reasoning was almost identical. And really what happened is leading up to this sort of new league being created, the only real professional league was sort of, there were things going on there where the anglers felt like they weren't the priority, right?

You know, there were a lot of things in a league that happened. And the anglers really started, a lot of us were feeling like we were down on that ladder on what was important. And so that new league and the move, you know, those 80 guys, 80% of those guys, it was 80 anglers, including myself, a lot of that move was based on a feeling, a unified feeling of the anglers saying,

hey, we got to help change this. If we don't, you know, we got all these young guys coming in. Do we want them to come into a league where we're eighth or ninth on the list of 10 things. No, you know, it was about our own destiny. It was about the anglers having more of a say. It was about the anglers having more control of their professional life,

a little bit of income, right? Like things like that. And again, you've seen it in other sports. You see strikes in sports all the time, right? You know, so and I really feel like people are going to probably listen to this. And I might get hate mail after this, but I'm going to say it. I'm just going to go ahead and say it.

It's all right. I feel like it needed to happen. I feel like, you know, it's still fresh, right? So maybe it's not a universal feeling, but. Well, there's still a lot of guys that want to do what you did. And there's still a lot of guys, right. There's still a lot of guys that are maybe there that want to be here or vice versa. And it had to be done.

And I think years from now, 10, 15, 20 years from now, we're going to look back and say, yeah, you remember the year. the major league fishing was created and there was defection and this and it was an important thing because what happened is it i think it made both leagues wake up a little bit and realize that hey man the anglers are an important part of this thing like there would be no league if it wasn't for the anglers like our fans are here our money is generated because of these anglers and you know i think it was a great wake up call but to bring things full circle and for me again for me especially,

Major League fishing didn't necessarily pan out to what I thought it would, you know, and it started to feel a little like where I was before that. And those same problems and things started to creep back. And so, you know, for me, it was a no-brainer to go back to bass because I feel like it's a better environment there. And it just felt more comfortable to me.

And it was time to go back. Here's the thing, though, you know, it's not, you can't just go back. You know, you can't just get back. You have to re-qualify. So there was a Legends rule in place where past, if you want an angle of the year or classic, you could sort of get in line for this Legends exemption. And I didn't want to go back that way, Chris. I was like, man, I made a decision to leave.

I want to qualify to get back. So I had to go back last, the year, before this year. So last year, I had to go back and I had to re-qualify. I actually had to go back and fish the semi-pro tour. I had to get in line like everybody else. I had to work hard again. I had to get dirty. I had to re-qualify. And I ended up second in points, re-qualified, get back to the Bassmaster elites. And it feels good. This is where I belong, for sure. It feels like you're back home. Yes. That's what it feels like. Yes. and present the U.S. Soccer Podcast.

My name is David Goss, and I'm joined by my co-host, Megan Klinemberg. And now we're giving people an inside look at the World Cup. Time's ticking. I think you can feel the intensity. All the guys are wanting to really stake their claim, and they want to be on that World Cup roster. There's no doubt about it. Hosting the World Cup on the home soil comes with its pressures,

but we're just really excited just as the people are. The U.S. Soccer Podcast, presented by Henco. Follow and listen on your favorite platform. you think it's been the biggest change. It could be technologically. It could be anything else. What's been the biggest change you've seen in your sport in the last 30 years? Yeah, there's, man, there's a lot.

I think I'll just give you the top couple. You hit one. Let's start with that one. Technology is so big in our sport. The change has been so big. And I think, are you even more than other sports? So, yeah, in other sports, you know, you've got the materials, right?

You know, the bat, the stick, the ball, you know, the things that the materials get better, lighter, stronger. We've had those changes. But the technology when it comes to sonar and GPS and the boat and the motor. And that's really helped the anglers become so much more efficient. And so, you know, so that digital technology in our world is just, crazy. It's hard for me to keep up. I'm just being honest. I can't hardly figure this thing out half the time. But you have to. To be able to compete, you have to keep up with those technology

changes. You have to learn forward-facing sonar. You have to learn side imaging. You have to be able to see a fish now and know what it is out there swimming on a graph. Yeah, to explain this to people. People might be familiar with fish finders, which traditionally looked down. You could see what was directly below the boat. And they came out with side imaging where you could see what was to the side of the boat. Now they have 360 where you could see everything around the boat. Yeah, 360 forward facing.

The best way to describe that is if you've ever been involved, if you've ever had a baby or if you've ever saw ultrasound, it's a lot, side imaging and forward facing sonar 360s, a lot like ultrasound. You know, when you look out there, what you see is what's really out there, right? So like traditional 2D, you always had to sort of decipher it. But side imaging, Ford faces sonar 360, you look out there and you see a boulder and it looks like a boulder. It's a boulder. Yeah. If you see a sunken boat out there 80 feet to you're right, that's a sunken boat. It's not, you know, there's no, there's no gray anymore. And another way to describe it as like a flashlight. So forward-facing sonar is a huge new technology.

And the best way to describe it's like having a flashlight beam when it's dark. And you're able to shine it out there. And whatever is in the beam of that flashlight, you see. And it's good out to about 50 or 60 feet. It's totally changed the way we fish. Some people argue that it's become unfair. And there's even been arguments made that we should get rid of some of these technologies. I don't see that happening.

The bottom line is today's young angler that understands those technologies and can grasp them, they're good. They are so good. It's just, you know, there's no way to say it other than these guys are being, they're dominant with these young anglers are being dominant using these new technology. So that's a new change. And the other change I think is just how important having a brand. and having digital content has become in our sport. And, you know, I think new young anglers, some of them are really good at it, and they get it like that.

And other new young anglers don't want to be bothered with it. And that's going to hurt them in the long run in their career. Very, very hard in our sport to make a living just catching fish. You know, you almost have to have a brand and you have to create a persona for people. And so that's become really important, you know, social media, YouTube, you know, Chris, you know, you're a master at it. Those things are critical and are sport now for our anglers. Well, you are like a marketing wizard. And you were one of the first who really figured out what their brand was and you latched onto that.

What are, what's some good advice for people who just want to build their personal brand, whether they're in fishing or not? Yeah. It's, man, it was, you know, when I look back on. my career, I did a lot of stuff wrong. I like, you know, a lot of stuff totally backwards and like, you know, bashed my head 20 times before I figured something out. But the, that part of it, things sort of worked out, you know, looking back. We did it. I say we because my wife, Becky, got to, got to say this is a big part of my business and the brand. And, and, you know, she's really a key part of it. But I think the biggest thing when I look back, the biggest thing I did

right. And I mentioned a little bit of it earlier in the conversation was being you and, you know, creating a brand that is authentic. And that's, that's, you know, when I look back at other brands, other athletes, other sports, wrestling, NASCAR, you know, whatever, pick, pick anyone you want. The authentic ones are the ones that really shine. And people can relate to that. You know, people, you know, when they're gone through that social media feed, when something's not real, when something's canned, when something's forced, it's, it's hard to hide that. It comes through loud and clear. When something's real, when something's from the heart and that passion and the energy, when all

that's, it's, you can feel it. Man, you could almost touch it. And you're like, you know, it's real. That was probably the biggest thing I did right. And, and, you know, you have to be like, I look back on it. And yeah, I got a lot of criticism, too. a lot, a lot. And, you know, I don't know, and I'll just say it.

There might be a few new young guys that have some of this, but I don't know if there's been an angler, it's been more hated than me. Well, so hated that you were like, in GQ magazine is one of the top 10 most hated athletes in the world. Yeah. That's also great branding. It's great branding.

Yeah. You're a publicist who came up with that. Yes. Congratulations. Exactly. Yeah, I'm the worst. But, you know, but what I found and, people will probably hate me for saying this, but having those haters, those naysayers,

are very important. It's so critical. And I'm telling you, like, I love my true fans. They are the most important. But without those detractors, without the haters over the years, that brand wouldn't be as strong. And, you know, I think when you're true to yourself and true to your brand and your brand is real, that's where you really can grow your brand and your fan base in leaps and balance. And it's authentic. People relate to it. And that's the biggest one is just, you know, I still, believe it or not, I still am doing a lot of stuff myself. I don't want to lose control of social media or digital. I still very active. 95% of it is me to what I'm doing. And I read the comments.

I meet the people. And I love when you meet people and they say, man, I can relate to that. This happened. You remind me of this. I'm just like you. I did this because I kept going. You know, there are the stories that make you feel good and make you look back and say, man, you know, I didn't okay job.

Like it worked, you know. And I'm just as proud of that as the trophies and the accolades and all. I'm just the point are they right over there? Are you pointing at them? I'm in the office and it's a weird spot because you tell your camera, will we see all these? So these are like the, they're the ones there are, there are a couple of ones there. There's a couple of leads, couple of FLWs, but there's the classic trophy. Oh, yeah.

Angler of the year. And in the middle there, this might throw people off, but there's a professional kayak tournament that I won last year. That's right. I'm a kayak fisherman too. Wow. You may be the perfect example. of that old cliche of like, I don't care if they love me or they hate me, if it's good news or bad news, as long as they spell my name right. Yeah, I think there's truth to that. There's definitely some

truth to that. You know, you want to be in the public eye. You want, you want your brand. You want to be out there all the time. And, you know, I think it's a little easier now with with social media and digital content to do that. But you want to be talked about. You definitely want to. I can tell you that my, when I look back, I did it to go on to college. I got a degree in public relations and advertising. At the time, I was honestly in that program because the only thing I was ever good at was writing copy. So I honestly, as a freshman in college, I thought, well, yeah, I'll still get the fish and, and, you know, but I'll be working at an ad firm or a PR firm. That's really what I thought, you know, but when I look, you know, look back.

all these years later, man, that degree helped me tremendously. Just from the standpoint that I was aware of certain things happening, I think I was maybe more aware of certain opportunities, you know, and was able to seize that moment better. And, you know, it doesn't happen. Just like I told you, it doesn't happen a lot. Just like I told you with that tournament when you have these little openings in your career, for your brand where you have to attack.

You have to hit it. You have to realize it and you have to push. And, you know, I was able to have a couple of those in my career that really helped tremendously, you know, whether it was, you know, you mentioned some of the print that GQ was a great one and the, you know, did some talk shows and, you know, those things. Jimmy Kimball. Like, if those things don't happen and if you don't take advantage of those things, then it's an uphill battle.

When those things happen and those little cracks in the window open up, dude, open that freaking window quick because it'll happen all the time. Trust me. You've done a lot of unconventional things in your career, like a lot, right? We could spend the next five hours talking about that. But I think one of the biggest ones that I thought was so fascinating is you hired a publicist. And I think from the outside looking in, like, why would a bass fisherman hire a publicist? but it makes so much sense.

Yeah. You know, it's again, I think a little bit was from maybe the schooling I had, but a lot of it was from looking at other sports, looking at other athletes and looking at other professions, looking at the entertainment world, right? And, you know, you look at them and you say, oh my gosh, shit, they're at this level because they hired people that are good to do that job.

And, you know, it was a big thing for me at the time. Because it was, when you're a young fisherman and you're clawing, you're doing everything yourself. And to be honest, like up to that point, everything I did myself, like my mom was helping me with stuff. Like my mom was helping me like mail T-shirts out to like fans and like insane stuff. But, you know, at that point, you know, I think I realized that, man, this was an opportunity for me to get to the next level. From a personal standpoint, right? like, you know, from a personal standpoint, you want to grow your business and your brand. But also from the standpoint that I, and I'm not just saying this, I really feel like I was

lucky that I was involved in the sport in that error where it was getting all these eyeballs and never had. And I call it the ESPN error, which is basically, you know, 2001 to about 2007 when ESPN owned the organization. And it was a time when I was a time when I was, able to get places through a publicist and through some other professionals that I would have never ever in a million years got to. And I felt obligated to help grow the sport. You know, honestly, that's honestly a part of it. Like I felt like this is the chance to put fishing in front of people. And I've had some amazing opportunities through, through the tournament fishing, through some of the TV shows, city limits fishing, fish my city.

my world, some of this, you know, podcasting, you know, this stuff. Like, get to people that don't normally see fishing. Get to those people that we joked about earlier. Fishing is a sport? Nah, you crack a beer and you throw a bobber out and watch it. Get to those people. Get to people that have never held a fishing rod. Make them feel the excitement, the energies.

Get them to know what I feel, you know. And it's been awesome. It's been fun. It's been, you know, it's been a journey. But I feel like we're pushing it in the right direction, you know. How many more years do you think you have doing it at the level that you're doing it at right now? That's a great question. I don't know.

Because you could be Rick Klan and do it until you're, you know, as ever old he is. You can be. That's the beauty of professional fishing. Rick Klan is one of the best anglers ever, if not the best angler ever. He's, I don't know. is he, Kristen, it's late 70s, mid-70s? We're going to look because everyone's going to be like, come on, how did you guys not know? I got to say mid-70s. I'm going to guess. I would think you're right. He is 75. He turned 76 this year.

76. He was born in 1946. 46, born in the 40s. You know, you, and he's competing at the highest level right now, right? So the great thing about professional fishing as a sport is you don't have that physicality thing where, you know, you age out because physically you can't compete. It's such a mental sport that it takes away a lot of that. So you're right. I can compete till I'm 80. But let me tell you this. I think I think that I will spend the rest of my life working in the fishing as my career, working in the sport of fishing. I think the tournament, piece of that pie is is not as long, but the other stuff, man, I, I cannot wait. Like, I, I really do envision myself fishing, creating content, doing TV shows, doing podcasting,

working with sponsors till I'm in a walker, like, till they're pushing me around. I see that. I honestly can tell you that. But, you know, competing, I'll give you a rough gauge. I would say five to 15 years, five to 10 years. That's a big range. That's a big range. I want to win again for sure.

That's a bucket list. I have to do that. I want to win at the highest level again. Let me stop you right there. When you look at the remaining schedule this year, what's your most likely win? You know, for sure as we get north, as we get into more home territory, I feel better.

So when I look at when I look at Thousand Islands, even though I have to try to beat some of the Canadian anglers that are just world class on that fishery. When I look at Bousal and Island. You've got to beat the Johnston brothers. That's it. Man, they're amazing up there. Oh, crazy. Lake Oneida, as I look, the South Dakota, the Upper Chesapeake Bay, which is the last open here.

You know, they're the ones where my eyes sort of get a little bit bigger. But, you know, here's the thing, man. The winds sneak up on you. And some of the biggest wins in my career happened in places that I've probably. probably shouldn't have won. And you know, you're competing against the fish. You know, you're not competing against the other 90 guys. You know, you have to outsmart them. You just got to be the best angler over three or four days at that moment in time. If you can do that, you win. You hoist the trophy. What does your morning routine look like?

Are you talking about fishing days or regular days? I'm sure they're vastly different. Yeah, regular days would be waking up about six, six, six, six. 30 in the morning because I have a big black dog and kids jump on top of me in bed, wake me and Becky up at the same time every day. In fishing, it's a lot earlier. You know, the days are really long and tournament week. And I would say, you know, most of the wake-up calls are 4 to 4.30 a.m. They are, you know, a quick breakfast, you know, a shower, get dressed and get prepared for the day. And they are literally practice days for me are dark to dark. And so, you know, it's hard to wrap your hands around that because, again,

stereotype is not a lot of physical activity, but it's a lot. You know, I'm buzzing all over the lake. I'm making a thousand, two thousand cast. I'm lifting the troll motor a million times. And I'm thinking, you know, the amount of calories you burn is incredible. But dark to dark, I get off the water. I hit a gas station. I refuel the boat.

I get back to the room. I throw something down my throat. I pull out maps, whether the paper maps or digital maps, I start, thinking about the next day, making notes on what worked, what didn't. And there's three full days of that. Then you're thrust into the tournament. And it's basically the same thing. So I can tell you, after seven days of that routine, you're war out. And we, a lot of us have to fish back to back events. So we have a few this year. They're tough. As I get older, I am definitely, I can feel the difference, you know, from when I was 25 or 30. It's definitely,

taking more of a toll, but I still love it. I still, I still don't mind getting up at 4, 430 because I'm, I'm excited. I'm excited about every day, you know. And you were like passion like embatt, like you are the personification of passion. I love it. I love it. I love it. And here's the thing, you know, not every professional angler has that routine or that pace. For me, I think a little of it's the passion. I'd rather, there's nothing I'd rather be doing than fishing. Part of it's that. But part of it is honestly, I feel like I have to work like that. And, and, you know, I think, let me, let me say it this way. I think there are a lot of anglers currently on tour that are naturals,

that have a natural ability inside of them that makes them one of the greats ever. And, you know, it's almost like you can put a blindfold on them, spin them around 10 times in the middle of the lake they'd never been on. And within an hour, they're on the winning fish. I am not like that ever. I really, it's like my whole career, I've had to claw and scrape and work and try to dig in. But I wouldn't have it any other way. I love it.

I love that that's how I operate. You know, I love that a lot of my wins and my success has been because I just, I worked my ass off, man. I just put a lot of time in, you know. Anyone that follows you on social media knows how good of an angler, your son, Vegas is. Is he going to be better than you? I think so. I think Vegas has the things that I wish I had that would have made me one of the true true. Do you mean a father who's one of the best of all time? You know, I don't know if it's that. I think he's got what I just talked about, which is some of that natural ability.

But he's got the things that he's got, he got rid of the negatives in my biological makeup. So, you know, the passion that I, I'm very passionate person. And that's good when things are good. When things are bad, I think there's been times in my career where it's hurt me because I tend to be up when I'm up super high and low, super low, lower than most. And Vegas is very even keeled. I got to watch it as a boat captain for him in the last few years. I got to watch him lose a big one where I would have been devastated.

Critical fish at a critical moment in the tournament breaks him off or jumps off. And as a boat captain, I can't say anything, can't do it. I don't want to disrupt them. But inside, I'm like, oh, God. It's like somebody stab me with a knife. And I watch him just very cool and collective and not let it get to him. He gets that for my wife, Becky. He's very even keeled.

That's going to help him if he decides to do this, especially. It's going to help him in life, period. And the other thing he has is a tremendous amount of patience. And same thing. I look back in my career. it's being a thousand miles an hour all the time has helped me in tournaments but it's for sure hurt me a lot and I can look back and think of times when I wish I could have slowed down and settle down more and took my time and he's got that he's got the ability to slow down and

recognize when you have to fish slow and he's got the makeup of a great professional angler if he does it you know Becky and I are very careful to let him be a kid and let him find things that he loves and love them for the right reason. So, you know, I think as a parent, it's a tricky rope to walk, you know, and we're trying to walk it. So, yes, I mean, deep down the side, I would love for him to do it. It'd be great. I love watching him fish. I'm already a proud dad.

But at the same time, you know, he loves soccer. He's a huge soccer player. And he loves building, he builds model rock. and model airplanes. Like I love that he has an engineering mind and he's building and I can't do that stuff. So we we want them to do what they're passionate about. We want them to be successful in life because it's what they want to do. And we're advocates of that for all our kids, you know.

I love that so much. I want to selfishly ask you some fishing questions here as we back this off. If you could only, if you were showing up to a new lake and you could only tie on one bait, What would it be? You know, if I was to show up at a new lake and only tie on one bait to catch fish, period, like numbers, it would 100% be a soft plastic. So, you know, to dial it in even a little more, you would have asked me this 10 years ago, I would have said a shaky head worm. But in today's age, I would say a soft stick bait, a soft plastic stick bait. People know them as Senko's.

People know them as generals. people know them as Yumdingers. But a four or five inch soft plastic stick bag has so many rigging options. You know, jighead, Ned rig, weightless, wacky. And it just does magical things in the water. The action is so realistic that it's my go-to for catching numbers of fish. Now, if that question was catered toward big fish, like one bait to catch big ones, it would be a jig, a skirt-it jig.

I've caught more big fish in my life on a skirted jig. than any other baby. Large mouth or small mouth? Man, small mouth. People definitely, you know, people down south probably hating on me right now again. They never caught one. That's why. They never call one, right?

A small mouth. I was lucky enough to grow up in, even here in South Jersey, we have some small mouth fisheries and I spent a lot of time in the Great Lakes and upstate New York. Gosh, there's nothing like the fight of a small mouth. And you talk about a small mouth and current or a river small mouth. small mouth. The thing's two pounds, maybe, maybe 14, 15, maybe 14, 15 inches. And it feels like a seven or eight or nine pound large mouth. Like that's the fight. And it's incredible. Some of those fights as a kid, you know, I was nine, 10, 12, 11 years old, catching no small mouth. It's why I fish today. So small mouth.

Yeah. What is the largest small mouth and large mouth that you've ever caught? Not in a tournament, just in general. Yeah. So here's the amazing thing on the small mouth. The biggest small mouth that ever caught in my life, I caught practicing for that Lake Erie tournament that we fished. No way. I caught my largest small mouth ever in that tournament. Wow. That was six eight, six nine. That is a giant. Especially in a tournament. Yeah. So I think I had a four four day practice period in that one. I think, uh, and I think it was like the second day of practice out around the Bass Islands, Peely Island, just famous area out on Lake Erie. And I hooked into what with the drop shot with what I thought was a sheep's head.

And that was a fall event. There were a lot of sheephead biting as well, fresh water drum. And I had just caught like two or three big ones. And I was like, just getting ready to get off of this area. And I'm like, let me catch one more. And it just didn't move, fought it forever, horsed it because I thought it was a sheep's head. and it was a 7-1 small mouth on the Rappala scale, which was giant. It didn't look real.

It looked fake. I've never caught anything. Everything else from there down has been like six, a little over six or down. So I think a small one that ever caught. The biggest large mouth was again practicing for a tournament. Lake Amistad, the first year that the tour started going there. So way back in like the mid, mid-2000s, 2005, probably six. a 14-3 on, you guessed it, soft stick bait on a spinning rod of all things in practice.

So, you know, just the fish of a lifetime. You know, I got, I have, you know, like old school pictures of it. And this is how long ago it was like an old school camera flip phone that I was able to transfer. And, you know, now I haven't. It's like sort of blurry. You look at it. You're like, man, is that even a bass? It's like a car.

But the one thing I can vividly remember is the size of the eyeballs. And I'm not kidding you, when I tell you that the eyeballs on the thing were like the size of a half dollar, like they just giant eyeballs on this fish. But two years later at the same lake, Lake Amistad, in the tournament, I caught a 1213, which is the biggest bass I've ever caught in professional competition. Wow. Yeah. What is your favorite lake to fish?

Favorite Lake, I got to go ahead and just say what we mentioned earlier, Lake Champlain. Lake Champlain. I've fished it for the first time in 1991. I joined a local bass club right out of high school. And they would go there every year for their club trip. I fell in love with the lake as a young guy. I still love it. It's to me, the most scenic, serene lake that has the perfect mix of large mouth and small mouth. Like literally 50-50 right down the middle in one day to be able to catch a 20-plus pound limit of large mouth and a 20-plus pound limit of small mouth from the same code, the same bay. Yeah. That can happen there still.

Yeah, you turn the boat one way, small mouth, turn both the other way, large mouth. Very special place. Have you seen Champ? I've never seen Champ. You know, I-F is like the locked-ass monster of Lake Champlain. It is. We joke about it all the time. A lot of those early club trips, none of us had basketball.

boat. So we were in rental, you know, 14 foot V-holes with like 15s on the back. And we, we'd always joke about it. And there honestly been a few times I've been out there in the middle of the lake. Like, I'm crossing the middle of Lake Champlain, south of Alberg. Like, I'm in, I'm in the freaking, you can't see land. That's how far out in the middle of lake you are. And, you know, you start looking around a little bit. You're like, man, you're getting a little nervous. I hope champ's not real, you know, looking around for it. But that lake is terrifying. Terrifying. It's terrifying. It's frightening. It gets scary big, you know, like, of course, all the Great Lakes do. But they roll. At least the Great Lakes roll. Like something about Champlain. I had a terrifying run back from Taekondoroga with Bernie Schultz and I thought I was going to die. Well, Bernie, yeah, I don't know Bernie's the best boat driver, but I hope he doesn't hear that. But yeah, he'll remember this story because I feel like we both thought we were going to die. If I see him, I'll try to remind him to that. But yeah, that, that ride is halacious.

I think it's 80 or 90 miles, which is a giant piece of territory to go in the water. And then you're right, you know, the way that Lake Champlain is situated, it's basically a north of south lake. So, you know, you get a south wind or a straight north wind. There's no easy way to go 80 or 90 miles. One final fishing question. And then one final question question. Who's the goat? Oh, man, who's the goat?

You know, I still have, I'm going to have to say, you hear a lot of names thrown around. You hear Kevin Van Dam, you hear Roland Martin as, as, you know, the old school goats. There's some modern goats, you know, Jacob Wheeler, for sure, Jordan Lee. There's some modern goats out there. But I've got to go with the guy that we talked about, who's Rick Klon. I think when you look at his career, the fact that he's still fishing, the fact that he's still winning. Like he won like a couple years ago. He won beat everybody, beat all these young guys.

Like I think that plus he for sure is what I, what I consider the like grandfather, the forefather of mental fishing. You know, he was the first guy to me that looked at the sport and said, why am I catching this fish? You know, why is, why am I able to do this pattern this? Why does this bait work? And he patterned fish. And he really coined that technique and that mental side of the sport.

He's probably one of the first ones, maybe a few other ones, but he's one of the first guys that developed that. So Rick Klan is the goat, in my opinion. And to think he's a professional athlete who turns 76 this year. And he's still fishing, still fishing hard. Love it. Mike, I have thoroughly enjoyed this as both a fan of yours and a fan of bass fishing. And like this has been, the show is called Insight,

but this has been so insightful, not just into your life. but look into the world of what professional bass fishing really is for people who may not understand this. So before I ask my next question, I just want to acknowledge you for everything you've done for this sport, for the incredible career that you've had and that you are continuing to have. Thank you. I'm very, very grateful to you for that. Thank you. That means a lot.

I appreciate you saying that. Definitely, you know, you look at what you've done in your career. And when you hear that, it means a lot. coming from you, it means a lot. I appreciate that. Thank you. I end every conversation talking about gratitude because I wake up every day and I say out loud three things that I'm grateful for. I do it before I go to bed too. Awesome. Mike, for you, what are three things in your life that you're grateful for right now? Yeah. At the front, for sure, is family, you know, and we talked a little bit about it in the beginning

of this interview was the hard times, the tough times. You know, I think, for me, you know, family has kept me going. It is the most important thing. I'm so grateful for my kids. I've got four wonderful kids. I've got a great wife. I've got a great, you know, father-in-law, mother-in-law, my mom, my uncle. I mean, it made me who I am.

And it keeps me going through bad times. So family, for sure, is number one. By the way, all three of these are going to start with F. And not one of them is going to be the FU work. So second is fishing. I am really, really grateful for it. I know this is going to sound cheesy and corny and maybe cliche, but Chris fishing saved me.

It really did. Like, I'm telling you, I can absolutely 1,000 percent tell you that looking at where I grew up and the kids and the names and what happened to a lot of them saved me, man. It saved me. You know, there were definitely different paths that I could have went down. Maybe probably should have went down. And I think for me, my family introducing me to the sport and falling in love with fishing, just fishing, not even professional fishing.

Save my life. It changed for good. It changed who I was. So fishing is number two. And then the last one, and we've been talking about it a lot, is the fans. You know, it's the other thing that keeps me going that definitely when I, when I having tough days or bad days or a shitty event or, you know, whatever, man, the fans keep me going. I've got, I know you probably have interviewed a million people that say it.

But I think I've got the best fan base in the world, man. And it's so diverse. It's so diverse. I've got, you know, fans that are 70, 80 years old and fans that are seven or eight and everything in between different walks of life, different races. religions, different parts of the world. Man, I love my fans. They're the best.

Most of them are crazy and odd and strange and weird like me. A lot of them yell and curse like me. And it's okay. And I'm glad that I have that fan base. So I'm very grateful for my fans as well. Well, I'm one of them. And you will not remember it, but I've shaken your hand and I've met you a few times. And you've always been so incredibly kind to me.

And, you know, you've treated me. so nicely and you didn't know who I was and I know that you treat all of your fans that way. So it's awesome. Thank you. Thank you for being you. You're welcome. You're welcome. And I just got to say one more time. Thank you for having me here. This is great. This almost this does feel a little surreal because, you know, I'm just a regular dude. So I really, I really appreciate it. You were the one of the best to ever do it. I appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for spending your time with us. I I know we went way over what we had planned, but I appreciate you spending this time with us.

My pleasure. Thank you a million times over having me. There we go. Mike Ike Nellie, what a true honor, a true pleasure. Be able to chat with him. One of the all-time greats in the sport of bass fishing, and he's someone that I've looked up to for years and years as a bass fisherman myself. I mean, what an inspiration both on the water and off the water as well.

He's also a big reason why bass fishing is as excited. as it is when you watch it on TV. And like, it's on network TV. You can watch it on Fox and FS1. Like, that's pretty amazing. Also, this is the first interview I've ever done with a pro bass fisherman, which I feel, this is just long, long overdue.

So I'm so glad that it was Ike, that was the first one that we did. I'm sure you know somebody who fishes, so please share this episode with them. I promise you that they'll thank you for it. And take a screenshot. Tag us. Let us know that you were listening.

Mike is at Mike Ike and Ellie. I'm at Chris Van Fleet and tag us so we can repost it. And I will leave you with the words of Theodore Roosevelt, which is along the lines of that whole never give up attitude. Courage is not having the strength to go on. It is going on when you don't have the strength. Be great. Be grateful.

Have a great weekend. We'll see you on the next one for some more. Insight. The Hammer Alley podcast, an 80s flashback mockumentary. Back in the 80s, there were a thousand bands trying to make it in the world of rock, but there was one band that had it all. Hammer Alley. Whatever happened to Hammer Alley?

How did they go from top of the rock? I'm looking for a music video. They're a band from 1987. Hammer Alley. Ever heard of them? To Rock Bottom. Dude, I was born in 1987. I can't believe he's doing this.

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