Insight with Chris Van Vliet - Nunzio: Little Guido, ECW, Slapping Brock Lesnar, Undertaker Last Ride, Cruiserweight Title

Episode Date: August 25, 2026

James Maritato is a professional wrestler best known for his time in ECW as Little Guido and in WWE as Nunzio. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in New Jersey to discuss which name he is better known as, how he was able to make it in wrestling despite being undersized, slapping Brock Lesnar in a backstage segment, his iconic Last Ride from The Undertaker, winning the Cruiserweight Championship at a house show, still wrestling today, briefly being a WWE referee and more! Please support our sponsors: HELIX SLEEP: Flash sale! Go to https://helixsleep.com/cvv for 27% off sitewide! COZY EARTH: Go to https://cozyearth.com/CVV for up to 20% off! BEAM: Go to https://shopbeam.com/INSIGHT and use code INSIGHT for up to 40% off Beam’s Dream Powder DELETEME: Use the code INSIGHT to get 20% off your DeleteMe plan at https://joindeleteme.com/INSIGHT FACTOR: Get 50% off your first box, plus Free Breakfast for 1 Year with the code INSIGHT50OFF at https://factormeals.com/INSIGHT50OFF PURE PLANK: The future of core fitness! Use the code CVV to save 10% on Pure Plank designed by Adam Copeland & Christian: https://gopureplank.com/cvv SEAT GEEK: Use my code for 10% off your next SeatGeek order*: https://seatgeek.onelink.me/RrnK/CVV Sponsored by SeatGeek. *Restrictions apply. Max $20 discount NORDVPN: Exclusive deal! https://nordvpn.com/cvv Try it risk-free now with a 30-day money-back guarantee! PRIZEPICKS: Download the PrizePicks app today and use code INSIGHT to get $50 bonus credit in lineups after you play your first $5 lineup! For more information about Chris and INSIGHT go to: https://chrisvanvliet.com If you have ever enjoyed any of these episodes, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast or Spotify? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests. Follow CVV on social media: Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Vlee! Thank you so much for having me. Thank you for bringing us here. Thank you for having me. This is where it all started. So where are we right now for people that are watching? We're in Pursipone, New Jersey. East Coast Professor in the Wrestling School, run by Gino Caruso right now.

Back in the day when I started, it was run by Mike Masters. God bless him. He passed away. Jerry Fazio and Gino Caruso. So this is where you trained? This is where I trained. 36 years ago, I walked in those doors over there for the first time ever. Wow.

So how does it feel being back here then? It feels good. You know, I've made some appearances in the past 36 years for Christmas parties and stuff like that. But it's always great memories, even when I'm driving from home, you know, so since day one, just, you know, like, I couldn't even find this place. Because back in the day, you know, there was no signs. It was like everything was Kay Faye with wrestling schools and stuff. So there was no, you know, the thing that gets you there, MapQuest or anything like that.

So it was like, I had to find this place. And there wasn't a sign outside because this used to be called body dynamics. So when you come in, if you made a left, it was a gym. And if you go to the right, that's where the wrestling school was. But it wasn't advertised because back in the day, now you could hit a button and 80,000 schools come up. And I like that anymore.

So how did you find it? So I grew up in Rockland County, New York. My whole family's from Howard Beach. When I was very young, you know, we lived in Howard Beach and they moved up to Rockland. I was always a huge wrestling fan, always a big wrestling fan. I wrestled in high school. I was captain of my wrestling team for Nanuette. And then in the summer, before we graduated, our coach always wanted to send us to wrestling camp, you know, just in the summer.

So we don't lose our, you know, because sometimes in the summer you don't wrestle for three months or whatever. So they sent us to Strasbourg wrestling camp. All my friends knew that I was a wrestling fan. my life. My father used to bring me to the garden. 10, 11 years old. I was really the only one. So I was the guy that loved professional wrestling. So when we went to the camp, I was a senior. And word got around that there was a counselor on the third floor or this other thing was a professional wrestler. So right away, everybody came to me. They said, oh, the professional wrestler. Oh, who? And at the time, I know this now, somebody came back to like, oh, the executioner. And I'm like,

holy cow, I know who that is, not knowing there was 80,000 of them. I'm thinking it's the one executioner. You know, so I found out who he was, and I went up and started talking to him, and, you know, I basically spilled my guts to him about wrestling and stuff, and I told him I would love to be a wrestler and everything. And he's like, well, I can't talk to you right now because, you know, you're in high school. He goes, when you graduate, you call me. He used to run this school here with Gino, like I said, Fazio.

He goes and I'll point you in the right direction. So I finished off the school year. And actually, we're in July right now, right? So June, it's 36 years at a month. As soon as I graduated, I called Jerry Fazio, and he told me about this school was only open six months at that time. There was only a few students. And he told me about this school. And I came down here and met Gino.

And that's how it started. Did you have people that time telling you that this was possible for? you because if we're thinking back to 36 years ago, it's the land of the giants, right? Everybody's huge. Not one positive thing ever. Crazy. You're crazy. That's not going to happen.

And I got that too, but it was just like it's something I had to try. So, yes, I mean, and that's the truth. No idea of them. I used to tell my mother I did the same thing. Like every other wrestlers used to be ripped the shirt off and tell my parents, I'm going to be a wrestler when I was 10, 11 years old. And they were like, no, no, no, no. And this, that, the other things, though.

So I think typically of every parent that there's a son that I want to be a pro wrestler I look at you like, you're crazy, especially at my size. But you must have had something in you that said, I can do this. And what do you think that was? Just because I was a fan. I was a fan. And I think if you're a wrestling fan, those are the best professional wrestlers. I'm not saying guys that were never wrestling fans, like a Kurt Angle.

He never cared about a professor, but he became a great professional wrestler, you know. And sometimes people can't adapt. in that world. But, you know, I did and I just always loved it. And when the opportunity came, you know what's funny, actually. I always wanted to be a wrestler. And when I was in high school, it kind of faded off a little bit. And then when I went to that wrestling camp and met Fasio, it kind, now I had a connection. Because it's not like it is today. Today you hit a button in 82 schools pop up. Back when I was 96 years ago, you had to know somebody. And I knew nobody because I went to that camp that one year,

somebody cued me in, and I went to talk to Jerry, and that's how it all came about. You also got a character, I feel like, is just so perfect for you. Like, where does Little Guido slash Nunzio end, and where do you begin, or vice versa? Well, it all started. The Codiac Bear actually gave me my name, Damien Stone.

So I did Damien Stone for a while on the Independence, and one of my first matches was down at Parsipone Smithfield, which in my Wikipedia says that's who I wrestled against, but I wrestled against Eric Fox. We wrestled at Parsipi-Smithfield. We'll get that fixed for you. Okay. Somebody watching this will fix that.

All right. So that was a story there. So you go from that to like this character that's just so perfect for you. Okay. So Paul Heyman gave me a little weird character. So I did Damien Stone for a couple of years, and I wrestled for actually Tommy Cairo got me involved with Eastern Championship Wrestling with Todd Gordon back in the day before everybody else was involved, you know, and so I was

wrestling there for a while, and then I did go to Japan. I left Eastern Championship wrestling, went to Japan, and when I came back, ECW was just getting going with, you know, becoming, and this is 1996, the team championship wrestling and stuff. When I came back, I already knew Tommy Dreamer and Taz who helped me tremendously, all those guys with IWCCW. So I had a connection. So when I came back from Japan, I went to Puerto Rico for Carlos Colon, and that's where I met Pablo Marquez. I don't know if you know who that is.

He's the extreme rookie from ECW. So we were wrestling, and he's like, oh, man, this ECW thing. Now, I was in Japan, so we didn't really get the TV. So I didn't know what ECW was actually doing. I know I was there before. I didn't realize what was actually happening with it. So he's like, oh, yeah, Taz is there. I said, oh man, tell those guys I said hello.

I said, hello. I know them, I said hello. I know them for many years, blah, blah, blah. So I went home. We went back. I think I saw him in Puerto Rico again. We went back the next month to Carlos. And he's like, oh, I talked to Tommy Dreamer and stuff. He's like, hey, give him a call.

He wants to talk to you. He said, okay. So come back from Puerto Rico. I gave Tom a call. And he's like, hey, what's going on? Nothing. And we just bullshit for a minute. And he's like, hey, dude, he goes, I want you to meet Paul Heyman.

you know, I want you to come down. I was like, oh, okay, good. I actually met him before, but didn't really know even knew who I was. You know, I knew who he was, you know. So I believe it was Lost Battalion Hall that he could, the show that I came to, because it was before the Alps. Wasn't the Elks, because we did Lost Battalion Hall first. And he's like, hey, come down.

I want to introduce you to Paul Heyman and stuff like that. So I said, okay. So I went down. I'll never forget. I go up to Paul. And I introduced myself. I said, hey, how you doing? I'm Damien Stone.

He looks at me. He goes, I know who you are, which, you know, and he probably did, but he knew everything, you know. Yeah. So they put me on that night. So I wrestled as Damien Stone for at least three to four months before the little widow thing. But as those three or four months were developing, Paul Eudow was like, you remind me of a Joe Pesci, you know, small, but you could beat everybody up. You know, you can't take no crap from anybody. You're high-strung.

And he kept bringing this up, this type of character. And then one day, believe or not, we were in Lost Battalion Hall, and I came there, and he came up to me, he goes, he goes, you're going to be J.T. Smith's cousin. I'm like, what? J.T. says his cousin. He goes, yeah, you got hit the head with a frying pan. He was rambling this stuff off. I don't know if he heard about, you know, Paulie was on the fly book. You know, you know.

And he's like, you're going to be little Guido. He goes, you're going to be little Guido. And I'm going to introduce you tonight as J.T. Smith's cousin, even though, obviously. but not cousins. That's actually the same night the Dudley boys came together. Devon, Dudley, and Bubba. They introduced Devon,

who beat that, they beat the hell out of me and, me and J.T. Smith, that same night. So, so that was it. So I went out there and they introduced me as Damien Stone. Joe Gertner was the ring announcer. And that was before Joe Gertner had his spot with the Dudley's. He was just, nobody knew who Joe Gertner was.

And that's how it started. And we did that gimmick right there. And they introduced me as J.T. Smith's cousin. and he got hit with a frying pan and we became cousins. And then we went on from there with that. If you were watching Backlash, you might have seen a face that you recognized sitting behind Michael Cole and Wade Barrett.

Not only did I have those awesome seats, I also got an impromptu interview with the Miz and Kit Wilson. Check it out on my Instagram. Shout out to Seat Geek for the great tickets and shout out to Seat Geek for sponsoring this episode. With over 35 million downloads, Seat Geek is the number one. rated ticketing app. There are more than 70,000 events listed on Seekek

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Big shout out to Seekkeek for sponsoring this episode. The U.S. Soccer Podcast. I'm your host, Megan Klingerberg. And after interviewing so many dudes during this men's World Cup, I'm so happy to be back with my U.S. women's national team players. I know the U.S. men's national team has changed how I think about myself, how I think about being an American, how I think about being on a team.

It's one year out from that World Cup, and we're going to talk about the brightest prospects in U.S. soccer. You ready? I'm ready. Let's do it. The U.S. Soccer podcast, presented by Henko. Follow and listen on your favorite platform. Do you think people these days know you better as Little Guido or as Nunzio? Well, it's weird because everybody that ever says,

Nunzio to me know me as Little Guido. I think Nunzio is on a bigger scale, but the thing is, with the internet, people who only watched me in WWAS Nunzio and hear about Little Guido, obviously if you Google it, you could see. And everybody's watching the archives because the WWE network helped a lot too because they put everything out there. So there's so many people that when they saw me at 15 in WWA, never realized that it was

in ECW because in the internet, they can go back and see it. Sure. So WW fame, I think, was a lot bigger. But because they bought ECW and then everything became one. and I was there before, but I would say ECW was a bigger, bigger name because it was on a bigger scale. Why couldn't you be little Guido in WWE?

Well, when I got there, you know, Paul Heyman, you know, again, got me a job there. So he called me one day, this is when I didn't have a job, because when all the companies closed down, you know, ECW close, WCWCW, all within like a month. We all lost their jobs.

I was a smaller guy. I wasn't a smaller, you know, in character. I wasn't a top guy. I was an RVD. It wasn't. So now I'm going against WCW clothes. You got all the top stars in WCW.

You got all the top stars in ECW. The Van Damns, the Dreamers, all the big guys. Yeah, the talent was. Massive. Right. Yeah. I kind of got pushed to the side,

you know. I was trying to keep in contact with Paul and stuff. But, you know, he was on the verge of getting his job. He was starting with WW8. So I kind of like got put on the side, you know,

doing this whole thing and, you know, the invasion angle, and I was just a smaller guy. So once everything faded out and they, they push people aside, I got a call one day from Paul Heyman. He's like, hey, he goes, so I was calling him for a while. Let me backtrack. I was calling him for a while, and finally nothing was working, you know. So I let it go. I just let it go.

I didn't want to bother him anymore, you know, a lot going on. And one day, me and my wife was sitting in a restaurant and my phone rings, and I look at it. And it says, Paulie. So I haven't talked to him in a couple of years. So I answered the phone. I go, hello? He goes, congratulations. I'm like, hey, Paul, what's up?

He goes, congratulations. I said, what are you talking about? He goes, I told you I'll get you a job. I go, what do you? Okay. He goes, John Lionette would be calling you in a couple of weeks. Answer your phone. Okay.

And he hung up. I was working for Snapple at that time. I was working with Snapple. I was in a CVS or whatever I was. What were you doing for Snapple? I used to, yeah, my dad was a big shot in Snapp. I used to work for Snap. I mean, where I said, work,

this is the ACW closed, because for that two years, I didn't get a job. Yeah. In the Independence washed up quick because of that, so I had to get a job. So what were you doing with Snapple? I was a salesman. Oh.

I was a salesman for Snapple. This is, you know, way back 2000, 2000. 2000. And I remember that came, so I thought I was getting a call. And I remember I was in a CVS or something fucking, I don't, can I curse on this? You can say whatever you want. Take it in order. And I go back to my car and there was a message on my machine from John Ironitis who I didn't know.

I knew who he was. I didn't never talk to him. Give me a call. So right there, I called him back. And he's like, hey, you know, we would like to give you a tryout, this time. You know, he called it a tryout. You know, he didn't know Paul already called me. So I think I was in her ready, but I didn't know.

I was just, I was happy that he said it. He goes, what are you doing now? And I said, well, I'm working. And I work for a night. He goes, can your schedule open up? We want to bring you out. So they've cleared up the schedule, flew to Texas for my tryout. I worked with Funaki one night.

And as crazy it is, I worked with Istanbulie one night, even though we became partners. I don't think they had that idea at that time. And after that night, I remember Jim Ross was kind of getting out of town relations because Johnny was there. So Jim Ross comes up to me and he goes, he goes, Johnny wants to talk to you in the office. And I went in the office and he offered me a deal. So why weren't you little Guido in EC, or from East, why weren't you little Guido in WWE? Right. Well, when, well, from when I talked to Paul, he was talking to how I got it, something like you were talking to Vince and he's like, oh, I got this guy, nunzio, small guy, he's going to be a limousine driver. He was

saying something, but he came up with the nunsy old thing. So I never questioned it. I was just happy I was getting a phone call. So where Paul got the nunsy old thing, I can't really, I don't want to sit here and say it. I really don't know. I don't know why he didn't keep it a little Guido. Because I think Paul owned ECW, so it wasn't like a trademark thing because Paul's given a consent. And fans already knew you. Right. They knew, but yeah. So I don't know why, but that's what they did. Do you look at them as two different characters, or is it the same character with just a different name. I think it's the same character with a different name because I did the same thing in ECW, you know? Yeah. So you played up the Italian stereotypes like so much. How much of that is actually

you? Well, I am Italian. I'm full-blooded Italian, obviously. Oh, I see what you did there. Yeah. But, you know, I grew up like in Queens and Rockland County. Like I'm not, I'm not for Italy, you know, so. And that's a character, you know, so. So that's, it's not, it's not, it's not, I am Italian, but I'm not like from Italy. I don't speak Italian. And that was a problem I remembered. I'll tell you a quick story. Then we go backtrack.

They were sending, when I was going to Italy, you know, fans watching on TV, they started booking me on appearances in malls and stuff. So, and in the WWE, you're getting like 2,000 people. It wasn't just me. We're a couple of other guys too, but, and everybody's coming up to me and they're speaking to me in Italian. I don't speak Italian. I'm America, attack.

And they're looking at me like, oh, now I'm losing my credibility. So I went to Johnny. Listen, you can't. Like, they'll book Ray Mysterio in Mexico, but he speaks the language. You know, if you speak the language, it's different. When you don't, and these people watch you on TV, and they think you're that guy, which I am a time for anybody watching. I'm still a time.

I just don't speak it. So they were getting down on me. You know, they were like, oh, you know what I don't know. I'm like, Johnny, you can't book me on appearances. I can't talk to anybody in Italy, you know, book me in the United States, but they wouldn't book me in the United States because there was no need. Yeah. But I feel like, like, the, like, doing this, like all these things you did were just perfect for that character.

Yeah, they were all that, this, this, you know, that's all, like, natural Italian stuff. It's the way we grew up, as you see, I'm talking with my hands now. That's, that's what we do, you know. And that was my little stick. It gave me something to do when you're walking out there. You know, you want to walk out there. No, I come out and do this, you know. Bad guy, a good guy.

Even when it became a bad guy, a good guy, people would do it back to you. It also, so it was good. For people that don't know, what do those mean? What is this? What's this? Well, this supposedly means like, ah, go to hell. Go to hell. This could mean a few different things, but mostly negative. Sure.

You don't know what you're talking about. Well, go to hell. It's a negative thing. But, you know, it depends who you do it to. This is like, oh, come on. What are you crazy this guy? Like, is it, what does it really mean? I don't know, but that's just what we did.

The double meaning of FF. FBI, I think, so smart. FBI, full-blooded Italians. Who came up with that? Well, that was Pauli. He came up with, you know, and I'll tell you something quick since we're on that. Everybody always thinks I'm the founding member of the FBI. That's not true. I'm not the founding member. Do you know who the first member was? No. J.T. Smith. J.T. Smith was the first in ECW. Paul, Paulie made him think he was Italian and all this stuff. He was doing the FBI. That's when they brought me in, lost Battalion Hall and I became his cousin. But I wrestled, like I said before, as Damien Stone for like three months before Paul,

he actually, I was doing jobs for everybody, whoever, they needed, you know. And then Paul came up with that with me and J.T. Smith. I'm a huge ECW fan. One of my favorite chance of all time is, where's my pizza? How did this become attached to the FBI? Very easily. So when we were in ECW, we were wrestling at Revere. It was a wonderland dog track.

And inside the arena, not arena, it was not, I want to say arena. It was like a place you wrestle. The place we wrestled. Had a pizzeria, like a little pizza oven and stuff like that. And Pauly had me, Tracy, I don't know if you guys saw it. You can Google it. Me, Tracy, Tommy, making pizza. And at one point, I threw the pizza up and it ended up coming down on like Tommy Rich's head.

So ever since that promo aired, which, you know, it's funny, Paul did not air that promo for like six months for whatever reason. And I was wondering, because any time you do a promo, you hope it airs. I'm like, I guess maybe he was the shit. I don't know. He never aired it. He ended up airing that promo. And ever since that promo, that's where the chance are.

Where's my pizza? And that was because me, Tracy and Tommy did that thing in Revere, threw up the pizza, fell on. I think Tommy's head or Tracy's head. And then after that, that's where the chant came from. What was your reaction when you first started hearing the chant of, where's my pizza? Well, you know what? I didn't even understand first.

I'm like, where's my pizza? You know, I'm like, I didn't get it. I didn't get it. And I figured out on my own, the only reason I would think is because of that promo, nobody ever told me that, but where else would that it came from? You know, I mean, we did the promo,

and it came out after that. After that promo aired in ECW, then it started very mild, and then everybody catches on, and that's it. I think there's a old generation of wrestling fans now that are too young to have been there when ECW was in its prime. It was so special. What made ECW so special in the 90s? You know what? I don't know. Obviously, when I started doing it

in 1996, whoever would have known it would have come out like this, but, you know, we'll come out like as iconic as it was. But you know what? We had Paul Heyman who was looking for a change. You know, he was with WCW. You end up quitting and everything. And, you know, Paul came and wanted a different product, you know, and he changed the product. He made it different, you know, so I think he's credited to a lot to do. What made it special, you know, the fans were included, you know, we did things in these small arenas compared to these big places. We involved the fans, you know, in WWE, they're so big, it's hard to involve the fans,

you know. In the very beginning, we used to have fans give us weapons to hit each other with, and that ended because the fans ruined that because they started giving us pies with shit in it and hit each other, trailing pans with little thumbtacks, you know, you grab it, you hit the guy. So we stopped doing that because of that when the fan, you know, because they got, you know, for whatever reason. Now we want to be killing each other, you know, so. If it's not for ECW, do you think you have the career that you have? No, absolutely. It wasn't for Paul E.CW. And guys like Tommy, Dreamer and Taz. I credit a lot of

people because they brought me in front of the right eyes. And that's, that's really what it is, you know. Well, back then anyway, there was no internet. There's no internet buzz. Now it's different. I can't compare it the same. But no, if there was no ECW, I don't think I would ever done anything. I also don't think, with great respect in the mid-90s, a guy your size is going to be given a shot anywhere else. Yeah, no. That's ECW was a land of the misfits and the smaller guys and stuff like that. And that's another thing where Paul saw that vision in the early, you know, 95, 96 with the cruiserweight thing and bringing, he brought Ray Mysterio over and psychosis and all those guys. And ECW was showcasing the smaller guys, but the few of the bigger guys too. Sure.

You know, so, so, you know, again, ECW let the smaller guy shine, even like the Jerry Lins, who was not a small guy. But, I mean, he should have made it in WW. He was in WW. They didn't use them the right way. But Paulie used him the right way. He had what it takes, you know. There were a lot of tough guys in that ECW locker room. Who do you think was the toughest?

The toughest guy, pound for pound? Sure. I would say Spike Dudley. Spike Dudley would go out there and get his ass kicked and thrown in the stands and brutal matches, fire matches, with Balls Mahoney and all these guys. And he never complained. Spike is a small guy, small. Well, he's probably my name.

size, but I would say Spike Dudley. And it's funny because when you talk to Spike and you bring up these crazy spots, he just kind of shrugs it off like, oh, that was nothing. Yeah, no big deal. I never went through a flaming table, honestly. That's one thing I never, I got hit with a flaming ball bat, you know, but I never went through a table. So he did, you know, so I give him a lot of credit.

There's a spot at the UCW arena where New Jack jumps off something so high onto you, double stacked on tables. It's a crazy spot to watch. I'll tell you a story about that one. So if you watch that back, which you can, we were doing whatever, doing the ring, and then we had to fight into the aisleway,

and Devon, you know, was getting the tables and with a couple of other people, and they were setting the tables up. And when they set the tables up, and New Jack was already on there, because if you remember, Bubba Ray Dudley was taking like an escalator up. He was like a hydraulic lift.

A hydraulic lift or some shit. And then, you know, and of course, we put the powder in the, in the guitar. That's what made the whole explosion. And I remember laying there, and I'm looking, I'm like, holy shit, he's fucking far, man. And I see after he hit Bubba with the, if you watch it back, after he hit Bubba, you see him take that guitar and he's slamming on the ground. He's going to come in, bring him in, because he didn't think he could reach me, you know. So he was freaking out if you watch it back. And then all of a sudden, I think they tried scooting in a little bit and they couldn't

do it because I was already on the tables and New Jack just said, fuck it. And all of a sudden, he just came flying. And I, honest to God, he landed chest to chest. I went right through. It was nothing. When you were looking up at New Jack, did you think he was going to be able to make it? No. I was like, and if he didn't make it, it might have been better because he would have just crashed on the floor and that would have been alright, you know? But he made it. But he made it safely. He made it safely. Is New Jack the craziest wrestler you've ever been in the ring with? You know what? 100%. He's crazy. One hundred percent. I always got along with New Jack.

He hung out of my crowd. I hung out with Tommy Rich, Tracy, and they all know each other from like Smoky Mountain back in the day. And I was the young guy in the group. So, you know, I became friends with Jack, you know, and he always treated me good. But yeah, if he didn't like you or, you know, he was nuts, you know, but I never had an issue with him.

Was it your idea to come to the ring on Big Sal's shoulders? You know what? I got to be honest. I don't know whose idea that was. I don't know because in the very beginning I didn't because it was me and Tracy in the beginning and me, Tracy and Tommy and then when those guys left

and they brought Big Sal and Mama Luke in, I started riding on his shoulders. I don't want to just say, oh, was this guy's idea of this? I don't remember exactly who came up with it, but it was a great thing. Well, what a memorable entrance. Right, something different than everybody else. And that's what makes you different.

You got to be, especially being smaller, but I don't want to take the credit for it. because I honestly don't know who came up. I've heard you refer to Big Sal as your limousine. My limousine driver. Carry me in the ring. He's going to try that in the bars afterwards, but he never would do it. I'm like, can you carry me in the bar?

Or, as a matter of fact, maybe you have to carry me out of the bar. I love that you mentioned Tony Mommeluke. I feel like he is so underrated. 100% he is. Why do you think that is? I feel like he didn't have much of a career after ECW. Yeah, well, he did the WCW first. Yeah.

And then after, yeah, after ECW, you know, they brought them back for a little while. I don't, you know, I don't know, I don't really have answers. It's not like somebody came to me said, we can't use them because it is. Well, you know, I don't really know. What a worker, though. Oh, great worker. Yeah.

Great worker. Great worker. Were you concerned when ECW went under? Were you like, what am I going to do now? Sure. Sure. I was concerned because I knew I was in trouble with a job. I mean, ECW from 96 to 2000 was my only job.

Because in ECW also, I think some people know about this, I used to work in the merchandise office. So we were running like three shows a week. When we would come home during the week, me, Tommy Dreamer, DeVon, Bell and a couple other people, we used to work on White Plains. And we used to sell the merchandise. So we used to get phone calls and fans never knew they were talking to Little Guido. We all had fake names and we were taking the orders and we were mailing the shit out.

And me and Dreamer were going and Devon with loads of tapes and shirts to the post office. and we would have our own line because people, it would take like an hour because they would have to scan all the packages and we mailed out all the merchandise. So I had a full-time job there. So I got paid during the week and then I got paid for wrestling too.

So I, you know, and then at that time, yeah, it was us. And then in the wrestling school, it was Bubba Ray, Mikey Whipreck. They had a Taz, Perry sat and they ran the school in, it was in Long Island. You have a pretty distinct voice, though. I feel like if someone was calling to, order some ECW merch, they would know they're talking to you.

Nobody ever said anything. Did you have a fake voice? Oh, we always fucked them out with voices and stuff. Oh, we had such a great time. We're like, how good I hope you? You know, no, they would never know. What was your fake name? Well, everything was different.

Every day. You could say, hey, Harry speaking, Fred speaking, you know, it didn't make, it wasn't one name, you know. You know, but then after that, for a while it became, they didn't call the office anymore. They called the fulfillment house or something. And that's how the orders came in. And then it came to us.

So then we didn't speak to anybody. Because in the beginning, it was a small operation. You know, we were just doing it ourselves. It was kind of like, you know, make it up as you go. You know, in the very beginning, all the merchandise was in Tommy Dreamers' mother's garage. That's what we were doing at him. And then we got a little bigger. And then we moved to this place in White Plains because Tommy lived in Yonkers.

Paul lives in Scarsdale. I lived in Rockland County. We're all like within 20 minutes of each other. So we ended up getting an office in White Plains. And I used to work with. with Paul's mother, too. She had a lot to do with her too. And it was good.

In the last, say, six to 12 months of ECW, could you see that there were issues? Yes. I saw those issues. And so towards the end, I knew that last show, where was it? I forget exactly where it was. The last show that we had,

you know, we all knew it was over. We all came to the ring. But we knew it was over like a few months before that. And what was the reason for that? That you knew, like, the writing was on the wall that it was going under. And we didn't even do the paper because I knew. I knew with Tom.

And Paulie didn't come to the show. Paulie comes to every single show. He did not come to that one that night. I think he stopped coming to the last few. And I think that was the writing on the wall. Like, where's Paul? He's, you know, where is he, you know? And then that was it.

Then it closed down. And then he showed up on Raw. Right. But hell is all right with me. When ECW comes to an end, are you thinking, man, this is maybe the end of my wrestling career? Well, I didn't think that at the moment right. because I was, you know, hopeful something will happen for me, you know.

But the Indies weren't what they were, you know? Yeah, the Indies, they're not like, it wasn't like it was today. Yeah. They're all over the place. So, no, no, I was very concerned. And I knew I was in trouble because there was so many top names on the market. You know, WW at the time took all the contracts for some of the guys. And then, like the nashes of them, I think, were sitting home at that moment because they had

guarantee contract. Then we had all the ECW guys that needed jobs. And, you know, I, as, you know, I, as much as I was trying, I finally came to realize that this ain't going to happen for me, or at least right, not now. So after like eight months, nine months, the Indies dried up for me a little bit because my name was hot from ECW for a while, but when you're wrestling in front the same Queens crowd, Long Island crowd, Massachusetts crowd, eight, nine, ten times without being on TV for a while, they stopped booking you. So once my book had started going down and

then I wasn't, I didn't have contact with Paul anymore at that moment, because maybe you couldn't anything for me. And I just went out and got a job. What's your own personal highlight of your time in ECW? I have so many good times. That's a good one. But like I'm going to say, you say anything with WW. It would be winning the ECW tag team championships, of course, you know, versus New Jack and Coronas. And we won them twice. You know, one time was at the ECW arena. And the one time I think was in Minneapolis, first Tegiri and Mikey. But that ECW would be special for me because that's where it all started for me. Well, this is where it all

started, but as far as actually ECW taught me how to learn how to be the cameras and work on TV and be on TV. It's the first time. Once I started with them and being on TV, it was so weird like I would walk outside and people would know who you are or your music hits in the locker room and people start know know who you are before you come out. I was never used to that. So it was a lot of good learning experience that made you feel good.

It's like, wow, you know, your music hits, boom, people are popping for you because they know you compared to your music hits and everybody's just waiting to see who comes out. You know, so it was a great learning experience for me, you know. What's your favorite moment from your time in WWE? My favorite moment, well, I would say WrestleMania 20, you know. I mean, I was able to perform in WrestleMania 20. My father used to show going back a little bit. When I was 10, 11, 12 years old, my dad, at the time, they used to do the garden every month.

It used to be televised every other month. So it was a house show, televised, house show. In the beginning, my dad used to take me to all the non-televised ones, because we used to have MSG channels so I could watch those from home. So my father was taking me to Madison Square Garden at all time. So, and he brought me to the first

WrestleMania 1, which I know Tommy Dreamer was there. I think Cactus Jack made me there. No, he was there with the snook a Morocco thing, which I did that too. Wow, you're at WrestleMania 1. But Ray Dudley was there. So my father brought me to WrestleMania 1. And then whoever knew I would perform 20 years later.

Now, I wrestled in the garden in a bunch of times before WrestleMania 20 because I was with WWR ready and we did shows there, TVs and stuff, but just because it's WrestleMania. You know, so I would say that was like the biggest highlight. And then my mother and father came, of course, because, you know, my mother never used to come when my father was to bring when I was a kid, but that was a big thing, you know, so. What a beautiful full circle moment. Yeah.

To be at WrestleMania 1 20 years later, you're performing in front of your family. WrestleMania 20. Yeah. Yep. That's amazing. Yeah, it was a good time. What did winning the Cruiserweight championship in WWE mean for you? That was great.

The first time I won it was in Italy. One time I wanted it versus Paul London in Connecticut and then Hovingtoove in Italy. Honestly, I think they gave it to me in Italy because it was Italy. You were so over in Italy. I only had, well, Jesus, if you can't get over being Italian in Italy, pack your shit and go home. So it wasn't like I did it. You could have put it on some Joe Schmo and they would have popped for him probably. Not that I'm discrediting myself.

I'm just being honest. But I went there and I remember them coming to me and it was a house show too, which the belt never changed. Very rarely, I don't want to say never. But when does a belt change hands on a house show? You know, when they came to me and they, you know, John, I think it was Johnny and said, hey, we're going to put the Cruiserweight title on you. They didn't tell me I was going to drop it eight days later in England or Ireland. So I never made it back to the United States with it.

I went at the first night on a house show. 10 days later, I lost it, wherever we were, Germany, wherever it was, London. I lost it before we came back to the United States. And then they showed clips the next week of me winning it and then losing it, of course. But then I won it with Paul London. I had it for a few months. I think that was more of a creative storyline that's to have it for a while. I think Italy was more like, hey, let's just give it a nuncio, just because we're in Italy.

That was an unreleased match, though, until pretty recently. Yeah, yeah. Once I did the NXT thing, I think they took it out of the vault. So I never seen it. Well, how would I see it? Sure. It was never on TV. They never showed it.

It's like, it's a one solo camera at ringside shooting the whole thing. And when I watch it, the one thing I hate is no announcers. The announcers make it. What I'm watching it, it looks like you're just watching, you watch a dark match. It ain't as good. The announcers, especially the downtime, they start revving it up. So I do hate watching it. I'm glad I saw it, but I hate watching it when it's no, no,

announcers because they really do make it. But what a pop when you win. Yeah. Yes. Yeah, there was 20,000 people there, whatever there was, you know, and being from Italy, I mean, being Italian, not from Italy, I'm not from Italy. Um, you know, yeah, it was a great feeling. It was a great feeling. And then you got on the mic afterwards and you said probably the only words you know how to say in Italian. Well, no, I had to, I had to practice that. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I had to practice that. I don't even know how it came out. I don't even know if they understood it. They cheered. They cheered. That was all they did. So, yes, yeah, that little bit I said, I did, I did, I don't want the Italians getting mad at me. I love you guys, but I'm American Italian.

What's your favorite Italian food? A lot of them. I love chicken parm. I love lasagna. Not the meat. I might be the meat lasagna. I like it. It's just very filling, you know, more the cheese lasagna.

Okay. What if you're ordering a slice of pizza in New York, what are you getting? Sicilian Corner. Okay. That's my favorite. I like regular pizza, too. but my first choice would be cornered Sicilian. I love a good New York slice.

I had some actually right before we came here. No pizza for me today. Yeah. Maybe we'll get some later. Maybe get some afterwards. How did you get into this role in WWE where you were making all the top talent look like a million bucks?

All right, so I'll get into that. And this would make, I think I was in WD, I think, well, 2002 to 2008, close to 2009. I got very lucky. You know, I was a smaller guy. For whatever reason, I was doing, I was not on TV at all, and the cruiser waits were doing their thing. You know, Shannon Moore, you know, all the guys, Shane Helms, all the, all the guys.

And Stephanie, I remember coming up to me and saying, listen, we want to put you, Chuck Palomo and Johnny Stamboli. We're going to bring back the FBI. I was like, oh, okay. And she's like, gave me these things. And I was like, you know, just telling me these little things. but I'm very lucky. If it wasn't for Chuck and Johnny, you know, I had a job for two, three years

because of these two guys, I was able to work with Brock Lesner, The Undertaker, APA, because I was with them. If I didn't have them, why would I be working with any of these top guys? And that's what you're asking me, how did I end up working with all those guys?

It was because of the fashion that I was in. So for two years, maybe three, I was doing that whole FBI thing, whatever was, two years. And it gave me a little, longevity because then when they broke us up, they put me in the cruiserweight division. But at least I was fresh in the cruiserweight division now because, you know, that was for the first two years, I really didn't do much with them because I was managing

Chuck and Johnny most of the time. But the first year and a half, I came out with a leather jacket on. I didn't even wrestle, you know, very rarely, you know. So I think by having Chuck and Johnny with me gave me a few extra years on my career, and I was able to work with all those top guys because of them. But not only were you working with these top guys. You were making them look great. You're selling for them like nobody else.

Well, that was basically my job as much as, you know, if I wasn't making them look good, they ain't going to work with you. You were kind of in a, you're kind of in a Spike Dudley position where like, hey, I'm a small guy, do what you want with me. Yeah, well, I never complained.

I worked with Chris Benmore many times. I worked with Eddie Guerrero. I worked with all those guys. I were actually going for titles, but in tag matches too, because it was Eddie and Chavo versus me and Johnny or me and Chuck or Chuck and Johnny. So it was all like, there was so many different combinations they could have used with us, you know.

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Follow and listen on your favorite platform. Kurt Engel said that you are one of the toughest SOBs he's ever worked with. Well, that's an honor coming from him, you know, but, you know, I mean, Kurt Angle kicked my butt at any given moment. But I got a chance to work with Kurt a lot. And you know, it's actually funny, Kurt, that thing in ECW with the crucifixion and everything, that's the first time I haven't met him because I wrestled Taz on that show. Sam Man and Raven. Sam Man and Raven.

So I wrestled Taz, Kurt Angle announced, was announcing our match as we were doing it. So that's the first time I ever met Kurt. And then that stuff happened and stuff like that. And Kurt was like, I want nothing to do with this. Nothing to do with this product. I said, great, my match is not going to air now. But thank God they took the crucifixion thing off. And they kept him on.

But no, I appreciate that. You know, I took everything Kurt wanted. You know, I never said anything. I appreciate those words. I don't know exactly what I never had a. I never, I got to be honest, I never wrestled against them, like seriously, which I'd tell you a great story, whereas one time we were down by the ring and Kurt Angle, and I know other people told the story, but I was there too, started playing around with

Brock Lesnar and, you know, they were feeling, playing around the very beginning. And then things got a little tense and they started to really go out of it. I don't mean like not liking each other in a professional way of amateur wrestling, amateur wrestling, Not like hating each other. Sure. Just seeing who was better. Now, as time got on now, and all the boys are watching, all the eyes are watching. And all of a sudden, things started getting, like, tense.

And I remember Vince McMahon coming down yelling, cut that out, cut that. Because these two top guys are fucking shooting trying to fucking, and Vince has millions of dollars in these guys. He's like, cut that out, cut that out. You know. Since you were there, who was winning that match? Well, as soon as it started going, he came out. So it wasn't like nobody was winning.

You know, they were just going at it, started to get, like, nobody was giving up any. You saw it getting tense. Isn't that crazy? Like, Brock's so much bigger than Kurt. And Kirk could not only hang, but who knows? Maybe he'd win that. Olympic gold medalist, yeah.

Well, I don't know if he could beat him. I mean, size does a lot to do with it, but technique too. You know, I think technique could override size a little bit, but it depends how much size difference. Yeah. You know, I wasn't the best amateur wrestler, so I don't know. So what makes Kurt say this about you? Was it the way that you were putting together the match?

I don't know. You know, I did hear him say that. I never really talked to him, so I don't want to, like, make up something right now. But I did hear that. But, like, we never went at it. Like, I never said no to him, you know. But also when we did our matches, too,

we did amateur style, because we did a lot of house shows, too. Like, we didn't just do the, we did a TV match in Albany, I think it was, because it was like I was the hometown boy. That's when I did the TV match. So, so, you know, I don't know. I never really went out.

I mean, he would wipe me up, you know. But I, you know. But like in our matches, we would wrestle, like amateur style in the beginning, but it's given to, you know. I want to go through. I appreciate that. And I heard that from before. Yeah.

I want to go through some of these top stars that you worked with. This moment with the Undertaker, where he kind of does this and you run out of the ring? I jumped out of the ring. You jump out of the ring. That moment goes viral all the time, still. It's always the things that you don't plan on doing. It wasn't a plan, you know, it was like I was in there. We weren't going to tie up.

I think we did that on a house show first or some. I mean, it was 20-something years ago. And I was feeding him my leg. And I was feeding him my leg. And then he just, he oofed at me, and I just dove out. I think it was a house show first. And then when we started doing the TVs, you know, once you do it on TV, you can't do it anymore, you know. And so that was just a natural.

It just happened. It just, I did it, and he reacted, and I jumped, and then we made that a spot on the house shows, you know? That's a spot that still, to this day, 20-plus years later, people love to bring that up. Yeah, I never heard that. I know the sign of the cross thing. I see all the time. Pat Patterson loved that.

That was another thing that was, I had not that plan. Until he hoisted me up, I just did it. I didn't think it. It's something I did that I never would have known but been told. talked about forever. And when I went back to the dresser with Pat Patterson, I was like, oh my God, that was great about it. I was like, what? What was great? Imagine. I like, I didn't, I didn't realize that that was such a big deal. Did you know how long take her was going to have you up the last ride? No, no, no, no. I just, like you were up for maybe 10 seconds. Yeah,

yeah, yeah, no, I didn't know how long. But I did take the last ride from him a couple times already on house shows and stuff like that. But no, I didn't know how long. But he stretched down my trunks. I couldn't use him anymore. Really? No, yeah. That's a lot. But he did stretch him out. You see my head. Yeah, of course. You're also falling like eight or nine feet. Yeah, yeah, we had a little bit like.

But you know what? It was good. Yeah, that's, so you're telling me that when you were up there, you just thought about it in the moment? That was it. It was a spur of the moment thing. I never did that. I just did it. I just did it.

I didn't plan it. It just happened. And that's the things. Things happen, you know, and that's like, even like the ball's thing, whatever, balls, balls. Yeah. Things that just happened end up being great. When you try to push it on the people and make it happen, sometimes it don't work.

What was it like putting together a match with The Undertaker? Well, I just listened. So I did what he wanted, you know, whatever he said, we did. That's all it was. So he was very easy. He was very also, you know, my thoughts. You know, Undertaker is awesome like that. He'll listen to you, you know.

And I was very respectful. And I had a good relationship with those guys, you know. I would, after shows and stuff, you know, especially overseas, I would hang out with them, party, never had to like an ass, I don't think. Kept my mouth shut because I knew better and just kind of, you know, watched. Watch everything go on, watch everybody else act like crazy moron sometimes. And I just kept a low profile and I like to drink my beers. Who were you traveling with in WWA? For a while, it was me and Rhino at one point for a while because I was there like seven years.

of guys left. You know, as a thing, once your partners get released, you're on, you know, you got to find new partners. So for a long time, it was me and Rhino for a couple of years. Then me, Teddy Long and Nick Patrick traveled for about three, four years. And then after that, or three years. And after that, it was like sometimes whoever, whoever you can get. But most people, you had, you know, the same partners, you know. You shared a really interesting spot in the Royal Rumble with Goldberg. Goldberg spears you in half. It might be one of Goldberg's best spheres ever.

He did mention that in an interview he was doing. Somebody asked him about some of the best ones, and he mentioned me in it, you know. So, no, it was just the regular, you know, I knew it was coming, you know, and, you know, I didn't know how he was going to hit me because I never took it before. So I just, one thing I knew,

I didn't want to keep my feet planted. You know, I wanted to try to, as he's coming, I wanted to kind of jump a little bit to get off my feet so he could take me into the air, compared to me, having my feet planted, and just going back. So I didn't know how to take it. You know, I just took it.

You went flying. Yeah, it looked brutal. I tell you, I got to be honest, it wasn't horrible, but you knew he was there. Sure. You knew he was there. It was stiff, but what else? I'd rather be stiff than it looked bad.

Tell you the truth, you know what was worse when he pressed me over his head and threw me out when I hit the floor? That was actually worse, because that's how he eliminated me. He speared me, then he pressed me over his head and threw me out. It's a long drop. Yeah, it was a long drop.

If you watch it, I was a long drop. So that hurt more than the spear. But everybody talks about the spear. You worked with a young Brock Lesnar, and you're cutting this promo on him, and you're like poking him like this. I slapped him. You slap him, yeah, that too. How did that all come together?

We were doing something with the big show and stuff. And at that time, I think, they had the FBI going after everybody because we were a little group that's coming back to what I'm saying. Good thing I was in that group because it made me do all these different scenarios that if I was in the Cruiserweight Division

I would never been able to do. And we were doing some shows with him and I stole, I forgot exactly how it came about but that promo came up and I don't know what it really led to and I was poking him and they said slap him in the back of the head. I was slapping the back of the head.

I didn't slap it back. I slapped him in his back. That's what made the loud noise. I didn't slap him in the head. And I knew Brock, but I also, like, and he was very good to me. But I'm like, because the writer was telling me to do it. I said, no, I'm not slapping him in the back of the head, you know. So I went for the back and I hit him hard and it made a huge noise.

And he was okay with it. And that's when we locked him in. Another story, if you watch it, when Chuck drove the high low, he fucking broke the wall. Well, we had to, this had to pay for that. Chuck don't know how to drive a high loke. So we were trying to lock him in, and he drove through the wall. He broke that wall, which Vincent McMahon unfortunately had to pay for. Yeah, like the idea was he was to just park the forklift in front of the door.

Well, yeah. He just kept going. To lock him in, but he didn't know how to drive it. They didn't fucking went through it a little bit, you know. So those are good times. Also around that time, you were selling your ass off for Batista. So you have this match with Batista. And he is like, he's working you hard.

Yeah, he was great to work with two. But that was fun. That was a champion versus champion because I was a cruiserweight champion. And I think we were doing an angle leading up to that. And I was like, I beat all the cruiser wades. Who can beat me? And I kept saying nobody could beat me. And as a rib to me, not a real rib, but like Teddy Long made that match.

Like, everybody could beat you? Well, it was you versus Batista. Something like that. And that's when, you know, then it became champion versus champion. So that was funny. But he's like, I feel. like he's doing stuff to you because he can do it to someone

that's your size. Like he's throwing you around like it's nothing. Yeah, but I like that. I always got thrown around. That was part of my job. You know, I mean, I can't throw him around. You know, and he was very open, because I got some offense on him, I think, for a quick second, you know, a couple little things.

But again, thank God for my partners. Having these two big guys with me put me in a position. Otherwise, I would never wrestle Batista, Undertaker, none of these guys. You know? Didn't you have early matches with a young John Sina? Yeah.

Oh, yeah. We did a six-man tag with John when he was John Sina. We did something versus Rino. It was me, Chuck. No, I think I was managing, actually. It was Chuck, Sina and Palumbo versus somebody. So, yeah, we did some matches with him earlier on. I remember, actually, I remember we were, I was on, I started on TV before.

Actually, John did. He was doing a bunch of house shows. with us, which is stories out there. And the whole rap gimmick came because he used to rap in the back of the buses when we were doing tours and stuff. And one day, Stephanie McMahon was on the bus. And John was rapping on all of us, just out of his head, just, blah, blah, blah, and going down, all the guys that were there.

And that's, Stephanie heard it supposedly. And all of a sudden they started giving him the rapper gimmick. You know, that's how they brought him out. Because I don't think he was even on TV yet. I don't think he started on TV. This is like 2002, 2003. I could be wrong, I could be off by a little bit. It's a long time ago.

Yeah, he was like, he was wearing the hometown colors as like just John Sina. We're in the hometown spandex for how many months that was. That was in the photo type or whatever he was. I think he was John Sina because it was after the Kurt Angle debut. Okay. But he told me like, if it wasn't for Stephanie McMahon hearing him freestyle, he would have been fired. So the same story I told you. That crazy?

Yeah, yeah. And Steph comes up to him and goes, how did you remember all that? How did you memorize all those words? And he's, yeah, and he's like, oh, that was freestyle. She's like, you think you could do that for us? That crazy. And that's how it all became. Yeah, he never memorized anything.

That was his thing. I don't know how you do that. I mean, that's a talent. You can't learn how to do that. You can't be able to do that. Wow. So you're still wrestling to this day. I am.

I do some independent shows and stuff like that. You know, it's a lot harder. I mean, I'm not old at all. I don't think I'm 54, but I don't act like I'm old because, you know, anybody in their 50s and it's not old. anymore. But for wrestling, you know, you got to be careful. It's not my full-time gig, so I do some part-time stuff. I have other stuff going on, so I'm doing. Yeah, what have you been doing since leaving WWE? I, well, a few different things, which led into right now, I'm running a security

company. I'm in charge of a security company. I've been doing that 14 years now. Oh, wow. So, yeah. So, and that was because, like, after wrestling ended, you know, I wasn't afraid to go out and, and and use my wrestling. Certain people I met were fans in a good position and were able, wanted to help me and gave me a couple of opportunities that let me meet some other people that ended up giving me another career

and I've been here 14 years now running a security company. And I still do the wrestling on the weekends, but that's it. Do you still love wrestling as much now as you did 36 years ago? Always. I'll always love it. And I still watch it. Like a lot of people say,

I don't watch that anymore. No, why? Why wouldn't you? You know, I watch it because I love this as I was 11 years old. Just because I'm not there. I'm not on TV anymore. Why would I not watch it? It's what I love. And you know what I do love?

And now the guy, it's a lot different. But like 10 years ago when I was watching it, a lot of the guys that are stars now were like on the independence when I left WWE. I worked with so many of these guys on all these independents. And now they're stars today, you know, certain guys. I'm just saying, you know, it was cool because I'm a lot older than a lot. a lot. I'm at all, a lot of those AEW guys I worked with before they were ever needed ADW, you know, even, you know, T&A too. Some of the, well, a lot of, there's a lot of older

guys in T&A now, not older, but. You're at the point of your life where you don't need to take wrestling bookings anymore. So what is- If I never wrestled the day in my life, I'll be totally fine. But I'll always take it because I love it. And it is extra money. I'm not rich in anyway, sure, you know, but no, if I didn't wrestle another match, I sent myself up, and I did saved my money. I didn't make millions, but I was cheap. I saved my money. So what is it that makes you But I still have to work. I would need a job. Don't get me wrong. I have a job. That's why I don't need wrestling. What is it that makes you say yes to a booking now? Because I love it. You know, I don't. But is it like, it needs to be against a certain opponent or needs to be drivable. Well,

100% driveable. I really don't do flights anymore. Okay. I don't want to do those. Only because we're travel nowadays. It's lucky you make it to one destination, you know. I imagine it has to be a Saturday or Sunday. You've got a full-time job during the week. Weekend stuff. I mean, I just did Tuesday. I did a Tuesday the other day, but that was the Jersey Shore. You know, that was.

War at the shore. War at the shore. War at the shore. A lot of fun. So. That looked fun. Yeah. What a venue.

It was a tiki bar, right? Yeah, it was a tiki bar. It was outside. There had tons of people. The beach right behind you? Yeah. That was a good time. That was a fun time.

So now it's just like, you're saying yes to the bookings that make you feel good about them. Right. And I love seeing the guys and, and, you, you know, given my advice, if they ask, you know, helping people out, you know, but yeah, as far as now is, you know, I just can't see my, you know, I just can't do it, you know, but I do seminars, stuff like that, you know, trying to give back a little bit. There's a great story in 2010 where there's a snowstorm and you get called to be a referee for a WWE show.

Yes. How does this all come together? So there was a blizzard, you know, and I live in Rockland County, as you know, which is literally 30 miles from Madison Square Garden. But on paper, it's going to take you an hour and 10 minutes because of traffic you're going into Manhattan. So there was a blizzard, and Tommy Dreamer called me at like two, three in the afternoon, you know, and he's like, you know, what are you doing?

I'm like, nothing, you know, the blizzard, he goes, hey, you know, because I talked to Tom anyway. It was like he called me out of blue, but I was friends with him anyway. Yeah. And isn't this Christmas time, too? December 26th. Day after Christmas. And the weirdest thing is I was there December 26th when the Iron Sheet beat Bob Backlin.

I was in Madison Square Garden, December 26, because my father used to bring me almost every month. Wow. And then I was there January 23rd when Hogan beat the Iron Sheet, which was the following month. Wow. So getting back to our story. So you get this call in the afternoon. Oh, yeah. So I get the call and Tom's like, what are you doing?

I'm like nothing, you know. He goes, well, he goes, you think you can get to the garden. And at this time, there was maybe like three, four. You know, not that bad yet. I think I was out actually in the city earlier before it started snowing and came home because I think I was doing security or something. I forget exactly what it was. He ended up calling me and he's like, can you get to the garden?

They need a referee. I'm like, all right, I'll try, you know, okay. So I end up driving there and I got there. I parked in the garage and I went in there and I was the only guy that showed up. Now, I haven't been in WWE in a couple of years. So I haven't seen anybody. DeMalanko was one of the agents. John Laronitis was there,

and Vince McMahon was also there. He was there, and he never really comes to house shows. Even all the times I was in MSG when I was a wrestler, he very rarely came to any house shows. And I remember doing it that night. I think I was the only referee. So you reft all the matches? I'm pretty sure I did.

I don't mark my words. I'm pretty sure I did. It was a house show. Pretty sure I did, unless there was one other referee, I think. So I remember coming. back to the curtain and then he said, man, you know, thank me for everything. And he's like, what are you doing now? And I think I was doing, I think I was, maybe doing security. My dad may have kind of been Snapple. I'm like, oh, I'm just working, you know, doing anything. He's like,

oh, okay, you know, thank you very much, blah, blah, blah. And then I was looking for Johnny and everybody and everybody left. So I was like, I guess I don't get paid for this. It was fun. I had a good time. Sure enough, I go home, like four days later, John, Johnny Ace calls me up. He's like, hey, thank you very much. And I said, oh, you know, he's like, he's like, he's I appreciate. He goes, how was it? I said, yeah, it was fine, I guess. He's like, how were the fans?

Were they heckling you? I said, well, they were, I heard them saying. Is that Guido? Was that Guido? Like, you could, you could hear it. Not that place was chanting my name, but people were like, and then they started yelling my name a little bit. I said, but nothing terrible.

I said, I didn't put it over. Like, anybody that called me, I didn't look at them. Yeah. I didn't react to it. I acted like they weren't even saying who I was. And he was like, would you think you'll be interested in, in refereeing and blah, blah, blah. He goes, we'll put you on the road for three weeks, see how you like it, see if we like it.

And if you're interested, and I was like, yeah, yeah, I'll do it. So they put me on the road for three weeks. I went home, John called me up, and he's like, how'd you like it? You know, he's like, we'll sign you for a year, you know, see how it goes and blah, blah, blah, and that's what we did. So you were a referee in WWE for a year? For a year. And then it didn't work out for both parts. You know, sometimes me, it just wasn't, it wasn't my thing.

You know, I didn't, I didn't feel comfortable at times. I mean, that referee is refereeing. You know, referees are very important. They're the third man in the ring. They're super important. You don't actually realize their duties. I always realize their duties. They're given a lot of time cues.

They have so much responsibility. Relying a lot of things from the back. And you don't realize it until you're actually, yes, before that, I refereed some independent shows and stuff, but there's no pressure. Sure. There's nobody yelling in your ear. There's nobody saying anything. When you do it for them, it's a whole new ballgame, you know. So it was fun, but it just wasn't my thing.

It wasn't my thing. Even financially, money wasn't the same. I was also on the road six days a week, paying for your own hotel. Yeah. You know, they pay for your flights and stuff because the referees at that time were doing for TVs. The referees did raw and Smackdown. So I was going home for a day. I wasn't making nearly the much money as I was making in,

when I was wrestling. And also, I was making just a little bit more than I was making before I even went to referee. Take out all the expenses. Not just what they're paying you. Taking out the expenses is what killed you. Do you remember any of the matches you refereed? I did.

Well, the guard in that first night, I think Cina was in a cage. I think Cina did a cage match, if I remember. I remember doing Wowwood, would all those guys. Whoever was there in the 2010, you know, I did, I did Mysterio because he was there.

I told you we did Sina. He was there. Yeah. Whoever was there. Yeah. I don't know. How did you get the call to make your WWE return and do this match in NXT in 2024? Which is so funny because I was going to a Broadway show with my wife, almost the same situation.

We were sitting in a restaurant when Paul called that first time. Yeah. And before W1 told me I was going to WWE. So we were going to see, I think it was the Jersey Boys. We were in Manhattan. We were walking in Manhattan on the streets. And my phone beeps. I look at it.

It says, Paul Lee. So he goes, you'll be getting a phone call in a little while. Answer it. Same type of fucking thing. And I go, Doreen. I said, Paul Lee just called me and said that I'm getting, my phone's ringing, you know, to come in. And so I forgot who actually called me

and they asked me to come down for, for NXT and this time. the other thing, it was a one-shot deal and stuff like that. The hardest part was going to get a physical. I had to get all this stuff done to me within like five days, which it takes months to get the appointment. So I had to go to my personal doctor, who knew what I did for many years. And I said, listen, I got an opportunity to go back to WAB for the night. I said, if I got to get this shit done, I said, I can't wait.

I need an EKG. I need a stress test. They made me do all this stuff before the match. And if it didn't get done, I would have never been able to do it, you know? So it came through and I went and did the match and everything. And it was kind of like it was in the ECW arena and stuff like that. And, you know, it made sense. And I'm glad Paul thought of me, you know, and I mean, Bubba was there and a few other guys.

So that's how it really came about. I credit Paul Hemelholy stuff, but I do because he's the one. It also helped from, like, Tom of Jim and Tad's back way in the day who put me in front of the right eyes. And then when Tony DeAngelo gets you up for his finish, You bring it right back, right? You do this again. Now that, they told me to do. Okay.

I was told to do that there. I don't think it had the same feeling, but... But everybody knew. They knew exactly what you were doing. Yeah, Matt Bloom actually said that. He goes, hey, do that thing you did with The Undertaker when he picks you up for the choke slam. Yeah. I was like, okay.

So I was told to do that. I wasn't the first time just happened, you know. There could be a story here. Tony DiAngelo, they're very proud Italian. You, obviously, very proud Italian. Could be something there. Well, I think he's on his own now, right? He was doing his thing.

I think we had our thing already. It was a one and done. Could be fun, though. Could be fun, listen, I'm open to anything. Do you have an idea, a number in mind, of how long you want to wrestle until? Well, at this level, you know, I mean, the shows are fun. You know, I love it. I don't kill myself, you know, and, you know, I only could do an X amount of things,

which everybody understands that who works with me. You know, still give the people what they want. I'm not lazy. I'm far from lazy, but I got to be safe. I don't have people power bombing me or doing anything crazy. God for you, God forbid I break my neck. If I don't go to work, this ain't paying my bills.

This show and participating in New Jersey. Where I go Monday is what pays my bills. So I won't do anything that's crazy or anything like that. I don't want to take any dangerous bumps. I don't take power drivers. And it's not that I have a big head or anything. I can't get hurt.

Safety, yeah. Safety. That's all it is. If I get hurt now, I can't go to work. I'm fucked. But you're not wrestling like one or two matches a year. You're wrestling like 20, 30 matches a year. Yeah, I would say I get like one or two a weekend.

This past weekend, I actually had four because of a Tuesday show, but my Sunday one got canceled, so I did three. But usually it's like three, four a month. Honestly, I'm very lucky. I don't call anybody for it. I don't call anybody. It's just where I live is a great place because I live in New York. There's so many Northeast.

There's so many shows in New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, Boston. So many people are running. That's why I get a lot of work. I bet you if I lived in Arizona, nobody's going to be flying me. And, you know, there's not that many independence out there. So it also depends on where you live. So where I live, I'm very lucky. And it's extra money. You know, it's extra money. And I have fun. It's, it is fun. As much as, you know, I complain sometimes and stuff like that. But, you know, but once you get there, it's good. The U.S. Soccer Podcast. I'm your host, Megan Klingerberg. And after interviewing so many dudes during this men's World Cup.

I'm so happy to be back with my U.S. women's national team players. I know the U.S.S. men's national team has changed how I think about myself, how I think about being an American, how I think about being on a team. It's one year out from that World Cup, and we're going to talk about the brightest prospects in U.S. soccer. You ready? I'm ready. Let's do it.

The U.S. soccer podcast, presented by Henko. Follow and listen on your favorite platform. You've been around for a lot of eras of pro wrestling. What do you think is the biggest difference between when you see? started out versus where we're at right now. Well, the business changed, I think, like, three times over. You know, when I first started out, you know, I'm used to the guys like the Greg Valentine's, the Don Maraccos and all that stuff.

So when I first started training here and stuff and going on the independence with Gino and Kodiak Bayer and Fazio, I was wrestling against like Valentine and the Iron Sheik and Jimmy Snooker. And it was those methodical matches that they did back then. And then as time was getting on and we're going to. getting into 96, 97, when ECW started, that's when the cruiserweight things started going and things started changing. The business changed, you know. And then, you know, even now, like now, 2000 or in 26, but even years ago, the business changed again in the middle,

you know, and it's always going to change. So no matter what it is, the business is always going to change. You know, it's hard. It's never going to stay the same. There's so many guys who got they're starting ECW and went on to have Hall of Fame careers. You think about guys like Ray Mysterio or Taz or Eddie Guerrero, Stone Cold Steve Austin, the list goes on. Who do you

think was amazing in ECW and didn't get a chance to showcase their skills elsewhere? Jerry Lynn. I would say Jerry Lynn. Yeah, he was in WW4. And then he went to ECW. And then after that, I think he may have went back for a little while, but that he was

a great talent, which I just never understood. I'll never forget that match. And that's what's great about Paulie. You know, he did, he did, he wrestled as something, Jay Lynn or something. He wrestled before in WW. He was in a cruiserweight division. And then they did nothing with him. Paul, he basically made him a star in ECW, you know, and did everything, Paul did everything

he could do. And then, you know, and then with WWE, you know, didn't work out. So I feel, you know, he was one of the best that didn't get, the full chance, I think he's, that's what I think. I think he deserved a lot more than what he got. I'll never forget that match with Steve Carino, where he takes Steve Carino's blood

and writes, die on his stomach in it. Oh, I forgot about that. Where was that? I don't know. It was in ECW. I don't know where. I do remember that. I totally forgot about that.

But then you think about... I used to see Bubba take Tommy Dreamers' blood and sticking on his tongue every other fucking night. That guy's a maniac. But Jerry Lynn, RVD, man, those matches. were so good. They were great. And I love wrestling Jerry. I'll give you my answer. Mike Awesome. Mike Awesome was a beast in ECW. And they ruined him in WCW. They made him like a 70s guy. And then the fat chick lover was his other gimmick in WCW. And then the-Tick lover? Yeah,

that was it? Was that after the 70s thing? Right around the same time. Right around the same time. So you want to talk about Mike Awesome? So I was traveling with Mike Awesome the day that he no-showed. I was waiting at the airport for him. So I traveled a little bit with him and some other guys and, you know, that's how it happened. He no-showed the show. He no-showed. I think he was even the champion. He no-showed and went to WCW. Wow. Yeah, yeah. I'm surprised you never heard of that. I think I'm correct on that. He didn't come to the show and he went to, with the belt. I was there also when Taz came in and beat him. Paulie didn't even let Mike in the dressing room. Taz had to go to the hotel when it time for the match they drove mike to the match they brought him in a back door tom

all he didn't even want him in the dressing room he came in taz choked him out he went over the guard rail and out and gone man that's how he went so yeah so mike uh yeah that was his time when he know showed us and he was just a nice monster nice guy though loved him beast in the ring so athletic and he could do so much yeah that's a thing you see how big he is uh it's a shame what happened to him yeah absolutely Yeah, they didn't do the right thing with him. Yeah. Who were some of your favorite opponents to work with?

I have so many of them, but of course I'm going to have to go with Tijiri and Super Crazy. You know, I think I was lucky enough to learn different styles. You know, I mean, even though I worked in Japan, when I did the Japan, I was like that shoot style. So, you know, I learned how to do that. So with Tjiri, with all the kicks and stuff, like I was used to, I was, you know, with Super Crazy, that's like Luchador. basically all I do is catch him. You know, I was never a high flyer. You know, so like in the three-way dances, I said this before,

you know, Tegiri would light me up with his kicks, you know, super crazy would just do all his flips, and I would just sell stuff. And that was my job, basically. But a little kicks and stomps in some offense. Your biggest strength for sure was your selling. Did you realize that from the beginning? No.

No, I just did. I just did. I just did. sold the way I sold. It wasn't like, I'm like, I have to sell good. I just, that's just what I would have done to the best of my ability. And, you know, and then it just shows, I guess, you know, I don't know. It wasn't like I said to myself, I got to be the best seller. You know, it's like anything.

If you go out, you're going to do the best you could, whatever it is, you know. Well, what a career. And you're still going. I appreciate it. And you look great, too. We're getting there. I look good. I do appreciate that.

Congrats on an incredible career. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Of course. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. Thank you for bringing us. This place has a lot of character.

Yes. Look at this. This is the first, 36 years ago, I walked in this building, right, as we're looking at. Wow. I sweated a lot of times in here. There was some good times. I'll ask you the question I ask everybody at the end. Gratitude is a huge thing for me.

I focus so much on the things I have, grateful for, rather than being upset about the things I don't have. What are three things right now as we sit here that you're grateful for? I say I'm grateful for my family and all. one because, you know, my wife's been with me way before ECW. My wife used to work for ECW. She used to sell the merchandise. I got her a job because I was traveling around. She wasn't my wife at the time.

She was my girlfriend. How long have you guys been together? We're married now 26 years. We're together about 30. Wow. Yeah. So I got her a job in ECW because I was never home and we were traveling and she got a merchandise job.

So she stuck with me through this. You know, she was with me before I was on TV. She let me try to make it, you know, right when I, matter, I just started with ECW. So I would say that, I would say my parents, of course, very grateful for my parents. You know, they were the ones that my father brought me to the wrestling and stuff like that. That was a question, right? Yeah.

Right. And what was it? Who was the third thing? What was it? You tell me. So your wife, your parents, what's the third thing you're grateful for? Well, her A friend didn't be number three, but my son. They're not in any order.

They're right, right. Yeah. They're all together. And my son's doing great. He's going to be a, he's going to, well, he graduated college. He's going for his master's degree. He's going to be a school teacher. He's going to be a gym teacher.

So he's actually teaching a little bit now. He's got one more year of school. He was a big fan of mine. I used to bring him here when I would bring him when he was like five, six years old. He would come, jump around the ring. I'd come down when Gino had classes and stuff. They were bouncing around the ring. Came to all my independent shows.

I never force him in the wrestling because I prefer him to get a regular job and do his own thing. Does he have interest? Yes. I think if I pushed him a little bit, I could have got him in, but I think his career path

is the better career path that he's doing. Well, again, thank you for doing this. Thank you very much. I appreciate you. If anybody wants to follow me, you can follow me on Instagram, Nunzio underslash Guido, or Guido underslash Nundio.

One of the two. Come say hello. Thank you very much. The Dan Bonjino show. Folks, it's not my job to sit here and try to stir you up for clicks. I think I've been very level-headed. I've had to tell people a lot of things they didn't want to hear. So let me tie together into a bullet point storyline.

This information warfare against your mind is very real. Be careful where you're getting your information. Do not gaff this off. I'm telling you, like, this is why I've been so passionate. This stuff is real. Now does it make sense? The Dan Von Gino Show. Follow and listen on your favorite platform.