Insight with Chris Van Vliet - UFC Legend Chuck Liddell On Becoming A Total BAD ASS, Unlocking Your Potential & Finding Your Passion

Episode Date: October 27, 2022

Chuck Liddell (@chuckliddell) is a retired mixed martial arts fighter and a member of the UFC Hall of Fame. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet inside his home in Los Angeles, CA to talk about his legendary UFC career, his podcast called "Icebreakers" with comedian Adam Ray, his fights with Tito Ortiz, Randy Couture, Kevin Randleman and others, what it feels like to knock someone out and how it feels when you get knocked out, the career path he was on if he didn't become a fighter and much more! If you enjoyed this episode, could I ask you to please consider leaving a short review on Apple Podcast/iTunes? It takes less than a minute and makes a huge difference in helping to spread the word about the show and also to convince some hard-to-get guests. For more information about Chris Van Vliet and INSIGHT go to: https://podcast.chrisvanvliet.com Follow CVV on social media:  Instagram: instagram.com/ChrisVanVliet Twitter: twitter.com/ChrisVanVliet Facebook: facebook.com/ChrisVanVliet YouTube: youtube.com/ChrisVanVliet TikTok: tiktok.com/@Chris.VanVliet Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

All systems are going. Ladies and gentlemen, Chris Van Bruny! Thank you so much for invite us into your home. Oh, thanks for coming. This makes it a lot easier. But there's also no better way to have a conversation than this. Yeah. In person.

Yeah. I've always been that way, though. Like, even before all this, like, Zoom and I like, I'm like, I do a radio interviews. And I'm like, oh, you don't have to go in. You can just call in. I'm like, I'm here. Like, I'll come in. Which I think works out better for everybody.

Well, does, I mean, you go in, especially if you've never worked with somebody. Yeah. Go in and you're going on a radio interview, right? Yeah. And you get in there and it's just cold from the first thing you do is you start talking to guy. Yeah. I mean, and I go over with him the day when people had no idea what UFC was. Sure.

You have no chance to get any kind of rapport with them. You have no, they don't know anything about your sport. And you're like, and you're trying to have a conversation and make it interesting, right? Yeah. And promote something while you're in a short period of time. Yeah. So, you know, I always felt there was always better to get there early, talk to the guy, you know, when the guy's off for me, you have a conversation before you actually decide to be on the radio for three minutes and try to promote something. But I think that says a lot about you because there's a lot of people that would go, no, I want to put in like the least amount of effort possible.

I'll just call in at 817. We'll make this thing happen. Well, yeah. But, I mean, I don't want to be overworked. But I also, I think product over. over laziness, I guess. I don't know that. I'd rather, I'd rather have a good, like, I want to get out of here on time.

I can tell the guys are doing things. I want to get out of time, but I want to make sure you got what you need. Yeah, right. I'd rather have a good product. Yeah. We're done than have me get out of here an hour early. Yeah. You know, so.

When did you become Chuck? I mean, your name is Charles, but when did you become Chuck? That's actually funny. I, no one ever asked that. I actually didn't like the name Chuck. I fought it for years. My family called me. me Charlie. Like I actually had in high school, I had buddies would call up. Hey, is Chuck there?

And my, and this is back, you know, we had this phone. Sure. So my grandma has the phone. Nope, no Chuck here. I'm like, I'm like, oh, is Charlie there? And she, oh, yeah, he's right here. Oh, wow. Yeah. Like, it's like, it was not allowed. But, you know, eventually I just got used to it. Now, now I tell me my name's Chuck. Does anyone call you Charlie now? My family's still. My mom, my sister, my brother. Yeah. And then some friends from, like, I, it's, I, I've said this before in a couple of

interviews a while ago and now it changed it a little bit. But I used to, if I heard someone yell Charlie when I'm walking through, because I'm walking through a crowd, I try not to look a lot if I'm trying to get somewhere fast. I just, too many else my name, I just keep going. You kind of stand out, yeah. You have to kind of stop me to get me to stop because otherwise, if I turn around and and I go, come here.

I'm like, okay, hey, I'm coming here. I'll take a picture. So I'm trying to walk through. but I hear Charlie, and you know, give me, you know, oh, I'm thinking, oh, it's somebody from high school or someone from one of my family members or somebody. So, yeah, for the most part, yeah, everyone calls me Chuck now. Did you have a moment after you retired where you're like, you know what, I could grow my hair out now? I could live like, you know, everybody else now. You know, I never really, it was always that, even when I retired, I started doing right away.

It was like I did a lot of appearances. Yeah. And I've shown up a couple times with the shaved. or grown out. I grew out for a couple movies and stuff. And people like, they kind of expect you to show up in character for your appearance.

Even like shaving my face, actually my funniest story was shave my face. First time I shaved my face after my daughter Gwen Rivera was born. She was like, I mean, she wasn't three, but she was horrified.

I didn't tell her I was shaved. I came down without it on. It's like, who's this man? man in my house. Put your lips back on. Daddy, put your lips back on. I'm like, oh, sorry. This is Daddy. I'm okay. She was like, I'm scared. I was like, oh, man. But yeah, I look so different with that, without facial hair. It's funny that you describe it as a character because, sure, it's a character, but it's so very much who you are. Well, yeah, but it's like, you know, really a long time ago

when I was kickboxing, this is a long story. But anyway, I was going, I was going to, I was going go fighting strong boar arena and um bikersfield and um the guy er as he's erred nolan was his name was a guy that you know used to run the um or run the fights he was the promoter and i showed up and i fought and i got a knock i second around knockout nice and afterwards he goes man you can't can't put the mohawk back bring mohawk back next time i mean you can't come here like that everyone's thinking you never showed up and fought i'm getting people mad at me that you never came Oh, that's funny. I'm like, I'm like, oh, well, I'm, I had a court case I had to go to.

There's a bar fight and I got, I had to go to record. And they said, well, can you, can you shave your head and go, can you, can you go your out and shave your face for the court case? Your lawyer said this. Yeah. So I did that before the fight because I had, I had to grow up my hair. So I grew up my hair out. Because I had, I'd go to the court case the next week.

You wanted to look like a good guy. They wanted me to look, well, because, yeah. But the guy, it was a BS thing. The guy was throwing the guy out of the bar. I tried to throw, I was picking him up, carrying him out of the bar. I tried to throw me. And, you know, I tried to roll me through. And I just, and I just hip tossed him.

And he landed on his head. So, and when it was one of the things, it was one of the thing, I actually, my lawyer got him real good because he was up. I didn't, we didn't know he did wrestle, wrestling, wrestling high school. I said he, he obviously wrestled in high school, just not as good as me. Because he tried to do like an arm spin thing. And he, and I just countered it. And he asked him on the stand. So, so how, he wrestled in high school, right?

He's like, yeah, I was, yeah, I wrestled all four years. Yeah, so you knew, you know, this, this movement. That's what you did. It was, like, it was pretty funny. Jeez. But it was, it was, it was easier to win that case. But was there ever a point in your life when you were going to have a quote-unquote real job?

Well, yeah. I mean, honestly, I went to school for, for accounting. I got an degree in accounting. I can't imagine you being an account. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, honestly, I started kicked by. when I was finished wrestling and I was finishing up school. Yeah.

And I decided I really want to do this. I was having a lot of fun, but I wasn't making any money. And right around 97, I was kind of, I went to John Hackleman, my trainer, and I'm like, you know what, man, I love, I'm having a great time. I'm bartending and kickboxing. It was a blast. You're having a good time. I love fighting.

I love what I was doing, but I'm like, you know what? My family's giving me a lot of pressure to get a real job. go out there and I got an accounting degree go out. My grandma wants to brag. I'm working for some big firm. You know, and I'm like, you know, I told my, we're not, if we don't start making money soon, I really got to get a real job. I mean, I love this, but I can't just, I can't just do this.

Yeah. And he's like, yeah, well, I don't know, you know, it's, it's hard to make money kickboxing. And right after that, Nick Blomgren, the guy actually who kind of really got me, started kickboxing, comes, came, called me up and said, hey, Alfie says you're a pretty good wrestler.

Do you want to do a mixed fight? And invite me, I did this, like, open-hand striking fight in, in Vegas, actually, at the Orleans.

I think was the first one of those ever. It was on a kickboxing car, but it was an extra fight on there. Oh, wow. I went up kicking the guy in the head, knocking them out,

and some guy from the stands comes out, and do you want to fight in the UFC? And now, back then, I don't know, I don't know how to get a, in the UFC. We are like, I, I know, and we've been talking about me, my friends are like, man,

you need to fight in the UFC. Yeah. I'm, I don't know if you know, Lorenzo Nio, I always come up to me. He's like, you need to fight the UFC. You're a great fighter and you're a wrestler and you need to go fight in EOC. Like, I'll get you in there. We just got to figure, how do we get in there? Yeah. I don't know how. Right. So, yeah, it's like, guy asked me, you want to win, and they offered me UFC 17.

Uh, uh, would be an alternate to a tournament for $1,000. A thousand dollars. I was like, okay. and I was back in. I was back in. Okay, now I'm not going to get a real job. I'm going to go back to fighting again. It got me, and I fell in love with the sport, and that just been doing it ever since.

I think timing in life is everything, though. And had you been coming up just five years before, you had to get that real job because UFC wouldn't have really been a thing. Right. Yeah, yeah, if it had just been, yeah, five years, it was just, you know, it would have been just starting, and it would have been anything. Yeah, it was, it was, I still think I would have found my way there

somehow. I would have been got the real job and then been doing it on the weekends. I always would have been doing martial arts and fighting of some sort.

Yeah. But, um, you know, it's just, you know, being the right place or right time

and being prepared when you're in the right place at the right time. Yeah. It's a big thing. You know, you know, I got a lot of,

I think some of the opportunities were lucky. Some of the opportunities were, hey, you got to, but you have to win. Yeah. You know,

I asked for some of the breaks. I mean, like, Randleman. Yeah. He came down from the heavyweight and he was going to fight. They offered me a different fight.

I'm like, I don't want that fight. Can I have Brandloman? I want him. Oh, man. I'm like, if you beat him, you have to fight your friend Tito.

I'm like, yeah, I want the title. I'm not, he's still got the title when I get there where he's, we're going to have to fight. Yeah. I'm all that close.

We weren't even close. I mean, we were training partners, really. And I didn't, I didn't dislike the guy at the time, but. No.

Are you still close now? No. I don't know. We never. You could have mended things later. No, we know. We were never, he tried to build it up that we were really close friends because we, he didn't want to fight me.

Because when we trained together, I beat the hell out. I beat him at wrestling. He's a style of restaurant. I like to, I just styles make fights in wrestling too. Yeah. He couldn't do anything to me on the ground. He couldn't stay on top of me on the ground. when we're just doing ground stuff,

he couldn't, couldn't, he started on top and he still couldn't stay there. And he definitely couldn't take me down when we're striking at all. And I just dropped him with body shots at the time he hated it. But, and then, so when I came time to fight, he's like, I can't beat this guy.

You know, I'm not going to fight this guy. So he created this storyline. Yeah, as this whole storyline. I mean, if you, if you looked at the whole storyline, if you, from the old days, like, if you listen to what he was saying, he basically took me out of the street, fed me, and taught me at a fight

and I turned on him. Yeah, he used to sleep on my couch and my wife fed him. I'm like, that's because you're too cheap to get me a hotel room. I was your sparring partner. I came down to be a sparring partner as a favor to you.

Yeah. And people asked me to do it. And I'm like, you know, I came to be, I came as a favor to you to be a sparring partner. And I stayed at your house as a favor to you so you didn't have to pay for me to get a hotel room.

Yeah. I'm like, how is that? And you didn't have a bed rush. So I slept on your couch. Yeah, that's me being night. I mean, I had nothing to do with, you know, it's not like. And we, I mean, we trained together here and there. But I, and I, he's got some friends of his that became friends of mine that I, I'm still friends with today.

But. But you're not friends with him anymore. I haven't been friends with him alone. But that's another thing, too. I think people get, get it mixed. And they think, I'm, I hate him. Yeah. I got no will will towards him.

Like, I, I, I, you're doing business. Watch yourself. Yeah. You know, but, you know, hey, more bad. I hope he's happy. I hear he's a good father, which, I mean, that's a big thing for me with people.

If you take care of your kids and you're good for your kids, great. You know, that's a great thing. You know, his girl, I like her. I mean, I knew her from the past and she's a really, really nice person. She's always been cool to me. And I hope they're happy.

Yeah, I just want to, I want nothing to do with them. Yeah. I mean, I don't want to do business with them. Sure. Definitely don't want to do any business with him. But, I mean, I don't, I don't like the guy, but it is what it is. Was he hard to work with behind the scenes as well? Like, you know, I'm doing business with him?

Okay, yeah. He's not one of those guys. Like, like a Chale Soarna, yeah. Jail Sonnet goes out, you know, we were doing, we were both going to be on the same show, but he was filming his episode, and I was the next day, and they did the same place. Yeah. I'm in the green room talking to his mom. And so I'm a big fan of you who we're talking.

He's out there, and it was right around. the 2018 fight stuff when I was fighting again. And he was out there just, and he talked trash and talked out there about me. Yeah. And he walked in the back and he was, all right, man, I teed it up if you want to do it, man. But how are you doing? How are the kids? That's funny.

That's a guy that's just doing it for business. Yeah. You know, Tito's not quite that way. Yeah, I got you. Obviously, the Tito fights were, you know, something that people will remember you for. But what was the fight before that? put you on the map. Well, I think what really launched things,

I mean, as far as people going, oh, well, this guy can really go. Yeah. Was I knocked Kevin Randleman and Guy Metzger out in the span of three weeks. And the way you knocked out Guy Metzger. Yeah. I mean, I knocked out right. And I knocked out Randleman, who just came down to light heavyweight.

It was supposed to be the new dominant force in light heavyweight because he was a heavyweight champion. Yeah. Came down and I knocked him out in a minute 18. Yeah. Caught him a left hook, boom. out and then I went to went to Pride three weeks

later and knocked out guy. It was a great, good fight got me. I think he won the first round. The second round, I knocked him out. I mean, you slept. I slept. Oh, he went, yeah. That was one of the with a couple of fights when I actually got nervous in the corner because he didn't move for a while. Yeah. I mean, it ended up being fine, but I was like,

you know, that's what was, oh, oh, oh, no. Yeah. What does it feel like? Do you know, do you know when you've landed that knockout punch? You can see him when they sleep like that. It's like I did one in the IFC where Steve Heath's hit with the right hand. He might have been going out with that by car with the right kick right after. I was way back.

I'll bounce on the cage. And he went straight down. And it was like, well, I was on. Like I went straight. I didn't even, I was walked over to the corner like because he's going to be okay. Like, I hope he's okay. So that killer instinct turns off immediately? Oh, immediately.

Look, I am truly trying to kill you when I'm across me in the ring. That is my job. I'm going to try to hurt you. Within the rules, I'm going to try to do my best to kill you. But as soon as it's over, I hope you're all right. Yeah. You know, for me, it's a competition. And I'm not an emotional fire, so I'm not angry at you.

I'm really just trying to pick you apart and trying to. And when I see, when I see, I can, you can see in guys' eyes when they're hurt. You know, you can see, it kind of gloss over a little bit. You know, I get that, you know, that shit. I'm going to get him. Yeah. But, yeah, it's actually a funny thing when I saw Randleman on the way on the train to go back, to fly back from the knockout guy Metzger. Yeah.

And Kevin, I like Kevin. He's a good dude. I actually cornered him for one of his, where he knocked out Crow Cop. But he looked at me. He's like, man, I was really bummed out. You knocked me out, but, man, you're pretty good. Okay. Okay.

Thanks, man. Thanks, brother. On the flip side of it, when you've been knocked out, what's the least that you remember? Oh, I mean, the thing, like, like, what's the name? Yeah. Rich. Rich Franklin? Rich Franklin.

Yeah. Richard's fight I got, well, I don't, after I took a shot and we had a headbutt, right?

Headbut him, I don't remember anything after that for that fight. Wow. After I put my head open, like, I don't remember anything after that.

And you broke his arm in that fight. I broke, yeah. If I'd baited it six more seconds, it was over. Yeah. And,

and, you know, I think if I hadn't headbutter him, I think it would have been over because I, if I saw that, I would have just,

if I mean, if I hadn't kind of black, blacked out when we'd go on to fight or flight, survival mode. And that's the thing with me. When I went to survival mode, I just went after him.

Yeah. You know, it's like, I went straight at him and he caught me coming in. But I mean, if I, if I hadn't done that,

I probably would have backed off and just kicked him in that, I would have just kept kicking him in that arm. So what's the next thing that you remember then in that fight? I remember being in the locker room. No way.

Yeah. I don't remember anything to locker room. Wow. Yeah. That was a, that was a, that was, I mean, or like, I think I might have remembered.

I remember getting waking up in the ring a little bit when they woke me up, but I just don't remember. I remember being in a locker room trying to figure out what, having people tell me what have you look up. That's why sometimes I don't understand why people, they talk to people after, and they go, they're like, and they're asking them, like, I was looking at it. So what happened when this happened when you got knocked out?

And they're like looking up at the, like trying to figure out. Oh, no. Wait, oh. And I've seen guys go, I haven't got, I didn't get knocked out. Actually, I look back at, like, I did, this is a long, an old story, but I got, I got a fight at a bar, this big fight broke out of a bar, and this guy hit my brother in the back of the head, grounded by the back, I threw him out of the door and he went down the, part of tumbling down the awkward way and I was coming after him. So I'm really protective of my little brother. Sure. But even though my brother, I was, everyone last when I see my little brother, he's like six, four, three hundred pounds, but he's still, he was my baby brother. He had, he had an open art surgeon was eight. And ever since then, he was my baby brother.

You know, I just, you know, we, I protected him no matter what. Well, I, people are, why are you so protective your enormous brother? Right. But, yeah, but I, so I, and I was chased out to the guy, and he went and he went to pull his gun. He had a gun, and he got about here, and I kicked him in the head, knocked him out, when I went down to get the gun, and the cops came up. Oh, no, the tons up. Oh, not me. Not my gun. I knew all the cops at the time.

They're like that way. And you want to press charges? This guy was going to pull a gun. I'm like, I'm going to pump on. And the guy actually wound up, Internal Affairs came up and asked, you know, like, or asked about the story from me,

and they asked six different people got six different stories, right? Which is normal. Sure. Because when everyone sees things different, but every one of them said he grabbed his gun. Some said he pointed at me, some said he didn't.

Some people said he, you know, And he said it must have fell out. I never pulled it out. And so he lost his job over that. And I've always thought about that looking back. And, man, that really sucks because, you know what? He didn't remember. Like, he probably, he probably lost that time because he was out out.

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I kicked him in the head. He was out. And, you know, he lost, he didn't lose his, he lost, he was going to be disciplined anyway, but he lost his job. Yeah. I mean, it was scary. He was trying to, you know, I don't know.

But I felt bad. Looking back, I always think, man, because when we asked that question, that's the first thing that comes on mind is that guy, poor guy lost it because I didn't know. I told him, no, I don't want him to lose his job. It's like no fault. Well, he's not losing the job over you. It's because he's lying to, he lied to us. Yeah.

But see, I don't think he did. He thought he really didn't lie to him. He just didn't know. And I didn't, at the time, didn't know. Like, right now, someone said, I would let him know. You got to know, he got knocked out. Yeah. So he probably doesn't remember the, he definitely doesn't remember the, he definitely doesn't

remember the tense five seconds before you had. I mean, it was two seconds, seconds before he got kicked in the head. I mean, I, you know, if he had to get him was pointing at me, I wouldn't have been kicking him in the head. Like,

I was, I was running up on him. He's just, just, he's trying to get it out. And I got it. Do you have moments in your life now, where maybe being kicked in the head,

punched in the head, knocked down is affecting you now? Not that I know of, no. I guess I wouldn't know. But, you know, but I did, I did go, I went down to, down to Columbia and I got to bioaccelerator.

Yeah. They do stem cells. They're doing everybody. They do a lot of the wrestlers we've talked to. I do, I did both my shoulders and amazing results, by the way. Yeah. But they also did the one for your brain, I guess. Like, they're doing for CT and stuff like that.

And, I mean, I said, like I said, I'll tell you you know, I didn't notice, but my wife said she did. She's paying more attention. Yeah, she probably noticed more than I do. And, you know, I, I've been doing some stuff with brain training. And I, like, they, we did an EEG, like, Brain Performance Center here in, like, Westlake I go to. But they do it, did an EEG in my brain. And I did have a lot, I do have a lot of, my, I'm stuck in, it's kind of, I don't know how to explain it exactly. I'm stuck in, like, fight or fight most of the time.

Like, it's always, my fight or fight or things are firing all the time. And I have, like, the different places where I'm not using it. But they have a training method to help me get it back. So, I mean, I get, it makes sense. I mean, a lot of stuff. I'm, and we'll see how it goes. I mean, I'm almost, I'm about 16 sessions. And I had 20.

They're supposed to, they're hoping to be back to normal. And we'll see. Is there anything on you right now that hurts? Like, as you walk around? Um, oh, you know, I, you know, I had a partial knee replacement. Uh, not long ago. But, but honestly, um, it's, better like my wife asked me after after i got excited to get that and i had a neck fused um

because actually for my last fight i probably should have my neck fused it was um it was i was fighting tapping my spine so they had to fuse it um because then you lose your balance you don't have the balance like and if you like i close my eyes i would have no balance like i couldn't do a i couldn't pass a drunk test of my eyes closed before the surgery um but then i got surgery and everything's, and that's all back to normal. Everything, all that doesn't hurt, everything's good. My knee, she asked me two weeks after, I said, look, my knee feels better two weeks after the surgery than it did for three years before.

Oh, my gosh. I'm like, and really, the motivation of even getting it was, like, I mean, my son, I was running with my son. I was playing soccer with my son, and he comes up to me afterwards. He's six at the time. It might have been five at the time. And he's like, Daddy, you don't have to play with us. You don't know how to because he's like, because I had limp after him.

I'm like, limp in the whole way. And I'm like, I'm like, oh, man, I don't have to fix it. I don't have to fix it. And he's like, man, you don't have to, Daddy, you don't have to do that. It's okay. I'm like, no, it's fine. Why, why did you leg hurt? I'm like, well, you know, I fought for a living.

It's kind of just kind of wore out one of, some of the house wore out one of my knees. Yeah. And he goes, sit there, saying, dad, I don't want to be a fighter. I'm like, um, did you just listen to me? Like I told you, that's why I'm limping.

Not because, but I was a weird for me. It was kind of, really, okay, we'll see. I'm going to teach him in a fight. We'll see what happens.

Well, I think he's got the right genes. Well, um, as, and his mom's genetic freak. So, well,

then there you go. We've got a future light heavyweight heavyweight champion in, what would this be? 15 years? Yeah. 14 years? Yeah. He's a tough kid.

Geez. You know, obviously, you've been a trailblazer in UFC. And I think there's a lot of people that can now follow in your footsteps and go, look at the career Chuck had in the Octagon and look at what he's built afterwards. So I'm curious to know, who was the person that you looked up to as you were coming up? You know, in the fight game, I really didn't have one. You know, I really just kind of, we were all kind of just trying to figure out how to make this sport. you know how to

anyway I was trying to figure out how to how to train it work and how to grow it you know because it was like back when we started before Dana and Lorenzo came in and turn it around

I mean a home run would probably be fighting three times a year and making 150 grand a year you know like that's not much there's not much we're trying to retirement there. Yeah. You know, I think, I mean, I had over $150,000 sponsors

my last, my last fight. So, I mean, there was a big difference. Sure. After they took over on the ultimate fighter and everything. Were you able to maybe talk to some of your fellow fighters who were coming up at the same time and going, oh, oh, yeah, what we're doing here? We collaborated with a lot of guys. I think there was a real tight community, you know, like a lot of guys, like,

all the guys from the Militich team you know those guys like Matt Hughes and those guys and I was real close with BJ Penn and his team you know John Lewis out in Vegas we just we all we all you know we all hung out together and it was kind of an interesting time

sure you know because we were all you know there's five fights big fights a year and all the teams like we all kind of hang out the same place it is and all the same you know everyone's traded you know look what they're doing look what they're doing It was one of those things, too, at the time. If you're not evolving, you're dying.

You know, everything's passing you by. So you had to keep evolving and learning and doing that time. There was that drive for the guys that, I think, that had a long career was the guys that were able to adjust. Yeah. Make those adjustments. I mean, I feel like UFC still has such a long way to go to catch up to boxing in terms of paydays. Do you think they'll get there? I'm sure they'll get there.

I mean, I don't know that there's a lot of boxing. But there's not a lot of boxers that get the big paydays, though. I mean, there's not anymore. There's not that many of them. Although the home runs bigger than, it's definitely huge. Yeah. But, and that's one thing with fighters. Fighters like that home run.

They always think I'm going to get there. Yeah. Real fighters, most real fighters, like, they're not worried about. They want, they want the home run. They want to be, they want to shoot for that homeowner because they're going to be world champ. Yeah. And then they're going to get, they're going to get that big money. Yeah.

And that's, you know, a lot of them. I mean, obviously you can't speak for all, but that's a fighting mentality. I'm the best in the world. I'm going to show it, and I'm going to make the big money. Well, and they all come hand and hand. I'm the best in the world. Then I'm going to start to make a bunch of money because I'm the best in the world. Right.

And I mean, now we're two weeks away from the Connor McGregor fight. So it's Connor Dustin three. How do you see that fight going? I'm expecting Connor to come in and have made some adjustments. He's a very smart. martial artist and I think he'll have made some adjustments and

we'll see what happens I mean I I mean Paray is tough and yeah and and he showed it but you know he's got to be he still always got to be careful like his you know

I think if he does if Connor's not ready for that leg that leg kicking in and stopping the leg kicks um he's going to have a lot of trouble but if he is then he's dangerous all the time and, you know, he's, you know, you got to be careful and not get caught.

I think Connor won that first round. Yeah, I thought he won the first round too. And then, but you could see at the end of it his leg was hurting already. Yeah. And I was like, oh, that doesn't look good. If that keeps going on, it's getting in trouble. You know, so we'll see what happens.

And then Dustin started that flurry and he just caught him. Like, that was it. Oh, yeah. I mean, but I think that had to do, it had a lot to do with the leg, with the leg being hurt and not being able to move right. Yeah.

Not be able to, you know, and then, and Dustin finished them the way he should. You know, he got hurt and went and went and went. Yeah. That's how he put something on the way. Your name keeps getting thrown around

as an opponent for Jake Paul. And you, what a reaction. Well, look, man, I don't mind messing around, joking around for that stuff. But I'm too big for the kid. I mean,

it makes no sense for, them to fight me, but they're not, he's not going to fight. Even if they, even if his camp thought he could beat me, they have to be worried the whole time. Because the last thing I go for, for a fighter, especially in boxing, is power. So the guys he trains with know me and they know, no, I can still, I still hit as hard as I, as I ever have. So, um, even if they think he could beat me seven out of ten times or whatever, they're going to be worried that, oops, he makes one mistake anytime during this fight, it's over.

Yeah. So, I mean, it just, it doesn't make any sense. I don't think, I don't think it'll ever make any sense for them to do it. And he's small for me, you know, and, you know, and they're, they're moving them along slowly, like, they should. The problem with the lot of guys is making a big name of themselves. The back of the old days, when the UFC guys had come over from other sports. Yeah, yeah. It's a big wrestler, and all of a sudden, they're fighting top-end guys.

Yep. Like they got they get thrown to the wolves, right? And it's like, they're not ready for that. They need to get a few warm-up fights and build their way up, and they need to learn a few more things as they're going and get better and better and then fight the top round. And then maybe they could have got there, but if you don't, like, if you don't, if you just jump right in, sometimes now you might get caught by some of them

that would have never caught, you have five fights down the round. I can only think of it working once in UFC, and that was Brock Lesnar. Right. And it didn't work for everybody else. Yeah. And Brock was a national champ wrestler, and he was, they put him up against the wrestler. Yeah.

Or a guy or a guy that wasn't really good against wrestlers, too. I think it was, I think the first fight he was with, these guys didn't have a really. Well, then, I mean, Frank Muir kind of, you know, put him in his place. Right. In his next fight. Right. 100%.

Now he gets in there with a guy that's a great jihitsu guy. Yeah. And you've got to try to deal with that and you haven't trained for. Right. It just feels like with the excitement that, Logan Paul and Floyd Mayweather had for this last fight. Feels like celebrity boxing is like, it's a thing again. You were just part of a celebrity boxing event.

Yeah, I mean, that was interesting. I mean, it was an interesting matchup. I mean, a guy, you know, really big and really, really small. Yeah, this was Lamar Odom and Aaron Carter. Aaron Carter, yeah. And you were the referee. Yeah, I was a referee. And, you know, I tried to, I actually tried to get Aaron to get back up after

getting knocked down the same. I think it was a second time. And he's, uh-uh. Like, I was in the accountant slow. And I'm like, come on, man, get on. Let's go, let's go, let's go. He's like, no, I'm done. I mean, you know, he figured out he wasn't he going to do anything.

I mean, if he was, he hit, I think he hit Lamar like eight or nine times unanswered at the beginning in the head. Yeah. If that's not going to do anything, I think you're in trouble. Yeah. You're in a little bit. I think that's when you go, oh, no, he says, this isn't working. Yeah.

I just, I think that there's maybe an opportunity for you. Are you interested in doing a celebrity match? I mean, Shaq was the name you threw out. Someone else threw out Shaq, and I said, well, if I'm going to do a big basketball guy, what about Barclay? He challenged me again in golf. He brought me, he was, I played in the Tahoe tournament. Okay. With him a long time ago.

We were joking around about it because I actually wound up beating him at the last, like, in the 17th or 18th hole of that thing or something. I took the lead to be second to last. So I'm a terrible golf. But you weren't last. But he tried to, he was trying to, the only reason I even came to my mind is because I'd just seen him right before that interview. And he said, man, you're coming back out to Tongue anytime? I think he just wants to get that win. He wants to beat me.

They got that golf. I mean, he, he's out here he's playing good again. He just had that weird swing for a while. Like a hiccup in the swing. Have you seen it? Have you actually seen it? I heard about it and saw it. I mean, it was really like he would start going to swing and he'd start going to swing and he'd go.

I'm like, what? Like, what was that? Like, is he really doing? Like, how did he? I mean, how was that even possible? Like, I thought he was kidding. Like, you've got to be kidding. Yeah.

It's got to be a joke. Like, you can't be doing that for real. But he was. It was some mental thing and mental blocker. I don't know, weird. Speaking of unorthodox, I always wonder, because I grew up playing baseball. Did you play baseball? Because the way you throw your overhand right is almost like a pitcher throwing a fastball.

Yeah, I played baseball. And I actually explain it like that a lot of times. It looks like that. That's what you want. You want to throw the overhand like you're throwing a fastball, but now you're going to close your fist at the end. I remember the first time I saw you because I was playing pretty competitive baseball the time I went, that's a baseball throw.

Yeah, and it's an overhand. Most people will throw that overhand this way. Yeah. I threw it over here. I throw it over my head because I want to come this way. You come this way, it's a lot easier to block. This is getting scary with these. Fists of Fury right from my face here.

It's a lot easier. So I always try to come, I want this angle. And you do it with your left as well. Yeah. Well, you have to, if someone's, you could do, like an out, I feel a different, it's a, it's a different one, but it's a whip with my left. Same, same, same concept. It's one of my, one of the left hooks I throw. Yeah.

It's kind of like, it's more of a, it's like a, almost like a, over and right left. But it's like a, it's just a, it's just a whip throw. And it's just a. I'm getting nervous with these being thrown around here. It's right. It's a really, at me, but it's a really loose power,

power punch. But it's not, and I, I use a lot of different hooks. Like, there's a little short ones. I lose different hooks, but,

um, I, I, I pride myself on throwing things from different angles and in different ways. And I had different, a lot of different tools to use

when I was fighting. If you could go back and do one of your fights over again, which one do you think it would be? Win or loss? Um, Okay, now, that's hard to choose. It would have to be, I would want to, I want, I want, I want, I want, I want, I want, I want to go back. Yeah, I would like another shot at Rampage is really who I'd want to shot at.

But other the fights for the fans, I think, um, the Vanderly Silver fight, I wish we had two more rounds. I wish it was, nowadays, if it was like more, if they could make a non-title fight, five rounds, yeah. That would have been really cool. Yeah. Yeah. I think, I think we both deserve two more rounds. Do you think you would have done anything different if you fought Randy again? No.

No, actually, the first fight, I made my adjustments after the first fight. Obviously, I could go back and hopefully made the adjustments I made for the second and the third fight for the first fight. But I didn't. But, you know, I made the adjustments that I was able to, and a big thing with him was I just keep turning corners. and not letting him, like, push me against the cage. So I was just pivoting off and hitting him. And I think that was the biggest thing was being able to move in it and having them just being able to pivot out and hit him.

He was trying to close the distance. Because he can't stay outside. He can't just stay outside and outfuck. He was more of a boxing wrestler. Yeah, yeah. Dirty boxing and boxing. So if he stays too far outside, I'll just kick the hell out of his legs. Yeah.

But when he saw he's got to close the distance, And when he closes the distance, I just kept turning the corners and keep making a sharp turn so we can, so we go past me and then I hit him. I'm like envisioning this in my head. I'm like replaying the fight in my head as you're saying all this. Yeah. Makes perfect sense. Yeah. And it's hard to take a guy down for wrestling when we're always side moving, moving sideways.

Yeah. Are you still training now? Not as much as I used to, of course, but I still, I lift and I try to hit the bag. It still look like you're in great shape. So I still try to get in for wrestling. I haven't done a lot of wrestling lately, but I try to get in, helping the kids wrestle a little bit,

but they're not big enough to wrestle with me yet. Can't wait until my son's big enough to wrestle me. What's the best advice that you have for someone who's trying to get in, follow your footsteps? You know, train hard. Train hard is the biggest thing. I mean, but you've got to find a good coach,

find good people, on a good gym. I always say for people like if you're a kid, if you want to get your kid into it, wrestling is a great base. You know, just straight regular wrestling. And then, you know, and it's a good time to learn everything. You know, you learn, you know, good karate school, good, good, or boxing or boxing school. Or, you know, it's more the, for me, it's more the coach than, and, and jihitsu.

Like, I, it's a good time. But if I had to have one, if you're bringing me a guy with one skill, then I would always choose wrestling. I just because you give me, say you bring me a kid at 21, 22, there was an All-American wrestler, Division I, All-American Wrestler. I know he's tough. I know he can cut weight. I know.

And I know I knows how to get in shape, and I know he knows how to wrestle. I can teach, and there's a lot of skills that, there's a lot of skills that we won't have time from there on going to fighting to teach you for wrestling from wrestling that you would inherently have from being years of mat time. There's a lot of mat time we'll never get. And don't get me wrong, that doesn't mean I can't teach you good enough to be a good, M.A. wrestler from scratch.

I can't, that's not a problem. But if you're really out there trying to become, you know, it's, it's, you get a lot of, a lot of stuff, you get a lot less hurt when you're more flexible when you're little and you're kind of, you get to learn it for free a little bit more. Yeah. And, uh, and trying to get down there, busting, busting people's heads. Yeah. Bustin people says. Are you enjoying life after fighting now you're a podcaster? So, like, you're on the other side of this a lot.

Congratulations. Oh. It's called Icebreakers. Icebreakers, yeah. So wherever people are listening to this, they can find your podcast. Right. And, yeah, it's fun. I actually, I'm having a really good time with it.

I didn't know if I would. You've had a lot of great guests, too. Yeah, and that's part of it, too. I love talking to people. Dana White was an early guest. Matthew McConae was just on the show. Yeah, and those are great. And for me, I'm getting used to getting a little more used to being on the other side of it,

like where I'm asking questions. Yeah. I think with some of the people, looking back now already, some of the guys I know real well, that I've talked to. I think I didn't, I could have pulled out a few more stories that were, that I already knew that I really wasn't that interested in hearing.

Yeah. But my, but people listening were probably, I'm very interested to hear. Yeah. You know, I have to remember that this is for them, not necessarily just for me.

Yeah. Whereas, like, guys I don't know, I'm sure I'm asking, I'm hoping, well, I get a little selfish with guys I don't know because I just want to ask them questions.

I want to know what they're doing and whatever, but, Yeah, I'm getting more used to it And I think it'll keep getting better And I'm having fun That kind of stuff like I mean, I was able to do things My career where at least now

Like I'm at a point where If I don't like doing something I really don't have to do it Yeah, which is kind of nice Yeah, I think you should have Stepe Amiochich on the show And I'm sure you've heard this People think that you guys sound the same

Oh, I've... You haven't been told that yet? Yeah, no, I have... Yeah, you know, I've heard that before But you know, that's the thing the problem with that is that we'll start talking to each other. No one's going to know. And no one to understand what we're saying.

Because I was at with my trainer, Hackleman, John Hackleman, and he started going, he's like, huh? Like, people are like, people like, me and him start talking. And people are they saying? Like, we understand each other. But it's just funny. I think that would be funny. I'd be fun.

I mean, if it was audio only, you might not know who's talking. But the funny thing with that, too, like when I was talking to Anderson, man, you were talking really clear that night. day you did a really good job. I'm like, well, he doesn't speak the best English. I mean, he understands it really well, but I was trying to be, I was trying to talk really clear so he can, you know, make sure he got it and could read, can understand what I'm saying. I mean, he understands really well. He just, you know, it's, because he has, kind of has the translator a little bit, too, to make sure, you know, but it's like, he's been living here forever.

Well, yeah. And when we talk, you have, there's no, when you're talking normal, like, you have no problem, like having a conversation with him. I think that's kind of funny, too. I saw Glover Texera, they were, they were doing a, they were doing a translator for him after a fight. And I was like, what the hell is going on?

I called him up like, why do you have a translator? Like, because he should be my training partner, sparring partner for years. I'm all, he speaks perfect English. Like, I mean, I mean, better than some of my friends, at least, that are from here. Yeah. You know, so he's probably clearer than I am sometimes.

But anyway, but yeah, like, why are you not saying? But they just like doing that because he's Brazilian, so, you know, for the crowd, I guess. I feel like you were so goal-driven throughout your whole career. Now that you're not fighting anymore, what are the goals that you're striving after now? That was the big struggle, I think, right after retiring, you know, is what drives you now? because, you know, I have a bunch of things I could do. I had a lot of opportunities more than most when I retired. Yeah.

And the amount of guest appearances you've made? Simpsons, Entourage, movies. I love doing that stuff. And the movies now, I'm taking more serious and trying to get more serious roles and more roles and doing some more stuff. I mean, the COVID thing kind of screwed it up for a little while. But we get back to that a little bit because I enjoy it. I figured out I like trying to ask. But I loved a lot of those cameos and was a lot of fun.

I mean, Altarage, I was my favorite show. It was my favorite show, and I asked everybody I knew to get me on it. Everybody knew had any connection to the show. And now, every single one of them took credit when I got on. Sure. But it's fine. It wasn't like it wasn't like it was a money thing anyway. So I'm like, yeah, cool, thanks.

Thank you. Thank you. whoever can be contributed to getting me on the show, thank you. Yeah.

But I mean, it was really cool because I was told they, because I just asked, I just want to be on the show. I want to wave high to Vince or something

and walk on it because it was my favorite. It's the last show that I actually watched every week. Yeah. Like I make a point to actually make it to a theater

or make it to somewhere that had like if I was traveling, I got to get some, oh, who's got HBO. I got to watch the, it's live and it's the first, first, first show of this. I might even go see it.

um there's the last show where i i cared to get there and watch it the first when it aired right so i that's why i'm like i want i just want to be on it i was wondering i think he's not all these cameyles people walking on i want to be on it and they i guess uh the right they were doing a that skit um with uh the gut that you got got got skit yeah yeah yeah they had their version of punks yeah yeah and they had a different prank originally but they're like oh we got chuck on and we might as well make him the prank they rewrote it so i i thought that was really cool. The reaction from Johnny drama was so great. Oh, hi Chuck. Yeah, it was awesome. And those guys

were great. They made it really easy and they tried to help me out. So now that COVID is hopefully behind us, more acting for you? Yeah, I would like to just start doing some more stuff. But we had they had one, we had one, I was going to actually be the main guy. I was playing a

Secret Service guy, Guard and the President. It was a cool little script. Hopefully, maybe maybe I get that rebooted or whatever and get get it going, but yeah, something will come up, so we'll see.

Yeah, yeah. Thank you so much for inviting us into your home. It's been great. Thanks, thanks for coming on. Thanks for coming over. I'm happy to do it. And again, Ice Breakers is available

wherever you're listening to this podcast. I end every interview talking about gratitude because I think that if you can be grateful, you'll live a great life. So what are three things in your life that you're grateful for right now? Grateful for right now. You know, I'm really grateful for my kids.

They're probably the brightest thing in my life. You know, I'm, you know, if I'm grateful for all the things, all the people that help me get to where I'm here. You know, like I never forget anybody that helped me get, you know, I got to do everything I wanted in a fight world. You know, I became world champion, became, you know. And then I'm still, you know, able to live off that career. You're still one of the most recognizable UFC fighters ever.

You know, and I'm really just grateful to be alive, man. I'm here. I'm living, you know, enjoying, be able to enjoy my time and be able to help other people. Like, I've been, you know, I never wanted to be anybody's role model. I never wanted to be. I was just, I'm not, anyone's role model, just me. me, but you know, they kind of realize that at some point

you accept the fact that, you know, people look up to you or they, you know, and I've had quite a few fans come up to me and say that I've helped them through things or help them, you know, that inspired them to do things or do be better. And I guess I'm grateful that, you know, I was,

I'm able to help people, even though I didn't know I was helping them in the past and I can still help people, um, you know, do better things or be, happier or get through difficult times if I can do any of that for anybody yeah you know it's great i mean i actually had a guy come up to me the other day because i you know hey man my my dad just died

and you know i it's kind of an asshole but my best memories with him are watching you for me wow and i'm like okay i'm like uh that's a little though different but okay you're welcome i'm glad i could be that but i glad you know at least he's got that's the positive memory he has with his dad. So, you know, it's a good thing, you know, and that makes me happy, you know, like the things that being able, I'm really grateful for,

for those kind of interactions with fans, too. Like, people come home and tell me, hey, you know, you help me get through, you help me walk again. You help me, I've had crazy stuff. And I'm like, wow, you know, and that really, that's probably one of the most gratifying things I have from my, left,

like, from my career. Yeah. You know, people that, that I was able to inspire and help. Well, the amazing thing is you inspire people, whether they're a fighter or not. You inspire people no matter what their occupation is. Yeah, yeah, and that wasn't, yeah, that was, I was, I was talking more about people that weren't fighters.

I mean, there are quite a few fighters that have come up to me and said, you know, hey, man, here's a picture I had with you. Someone posted it, but not even the corner one, a different one where a guy posted a picture and he said, like, hey, there's a picture of me with Chuck, with Chuck. He's the guy that got me in the fight and I fight in the EOC tomorrow night. Damn. You know, so that's pretty cool, too. Yeah.

So that really wasn't the one I was really thinking about, but that one, that one's really cool, too. Yeah. The fighter, fighter, one, whatever. Yeah. This was really cool. So, Chuck, thank you so much. Thank you. Appreciate you.

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