Investigate Earth Conspiracy Podcast - Idaho Student Murders Podcast | Potential Suspects & Updated Timeline | True Crime Podcasts

Episode Date: December 7, 2022

We have an updated timeline of the Idaho Student Murders and the talk of who the suspect or suspects could possibly be. We dive deep and uncover the latest information of what could have happened that night in Moscow Idaho and who may have been involved on this Idaho Student Murders Podcasts True Crime Podcasts episode.

It's just for a minute, I'd fall asleep and wait my death. I don't know what the times I think of. When it's chivalve- On November 13th, 2022, four Idaho students were found stabbed to death, a case that has gripped the U.S. and attracted legions of true crime, amateur detectives from around the world. No arrests have yet been made, and no suspects have been identified by police. Tonight, we're going to talk about part two,

of the Idaho murders. We're going to talk about some speculation, what we know so far, what the investigators know or don't know. And all of that right here on Invest the Earth podcast. I'm your host Chad alongside my wife, Sherry. Welcome to the podcast, guys. Welcome. Hope everyone is doing fantastic out there this evening.

This is part two of our Idaho Student Murder's podcast episode. We have been just kind of digging in, Sherry more so, on just everything that is involved in this case. where are police what do the police know anything more than what the public knows did the police botched this investigation so far this murder scene and what is the most likely possibility of who may have murdered these students in Idaho it's a very very crazy story but I will say you know if you watch shows like the first 48 and shows like that it makes

you think that all murders are just solved in the first 48 hours and that's just not really the case. But as brutal as these murders were, it is strange that someone could have got in and got out and it's almost a month later and we still don't have someone in custody. What is your thoughts on them? Absolutely. I totally agree. And they say within the first 48 hours, if you don't have a suspect, your chances of finding

that person goes down to slim to none, and it's harder to find somebody that is a person of interest or a suspect. So I think that's a lot of worrisome things for the parents of the victims and friends and people that, you know, our detectives, our sleuths on Facebook is everyone's starting to get really antsy, I guess, because we don't have a person of interest and we don't have have a suspect in custody. Yeah. Yeah, and you're right.

I mean, it's not just a Facebook people, the family, the Goncaves, or Goncaves. Goncaves. They, you know, are getting antsy as well. The father has come out in recent interviews, which are talking about here in just a little bit. He is getting pretty frustrated. I guess the latest news on the Goncaves family is that they are hiring an attorney. and even possibly a private investigator to potentially aid in the case. But keeping in mind, private investigator, for one, is going to have a very tough time doing anything

because they don't have access to any of the evidence that was collected at the crime scene. And number two, hiring an attorney, I don't know what that will do. I know they want access to evidence, right? They want access to what the police and law enforcement have. but the reality is is that, you know, there's a lot of speculation. There's a lot of theories out there that say the police are not doing their job or they did botched the investigation. I know Nancy Grace herself went on Fox News and said, hey, you know, the police are possibly botching this investigation. And look, that's very possible.

I don't know that the police would have botched it as much. And we're going to go through as fast as we can here in just a minute, the timeline again. And we're also going to go through the new speculation. and just, you know, I don't know, I guess just our opinions just would gather in everything on the internet we possibly can of who could have committed the murders. How were the murders committed? Are they tied to anything?

Is it a serial killer? Is it a student? Is a stalker? We're going to talk about all those things. But yeah, it's a very interesting thing. So just to talk briefly about the botched murder or the botched crime scene, for example. You know, when 9-1-1-1-1, was called, it was the students downstairs that were unharmed that found or, you know, at least

witnessed Ethan's body in the floor. They freaked out. They went outside. One of them passed out. The other was hysterical. The other was hysterical. From what we understand is the person that actually first talked to 911 was a bystander or someone outside. And I believe it can. came from one of the downstairs students' phones. So as they were reporting, it was a unconscious person because they saw one of the downstairs roommates unconscious. And so they did not see what had happened in the house at this time. They did not see Ethan bloody and whatever.

And so from what we've kind of read and followed is EMS and fire department and whoever, the emergency responders at first came to the house. house, they were coming to the house for an unconscious person. And so as they arrived at the scene, they were arriving for an unconscious person. I mean, that's, you know, in a college town, stuff like that, that can happen. And then as they went into the house, they didn't realize it was a crime scene at the time. And there were probably many first responders in the house. And that alone is going to taint the crime scene in a lot of ways. And I believe too, a lot of the students or pastor buyers or whatever was at the house.

I think they also went in. And at the same time of the 911 call, there were so many other people giving bits and pieces to the 911 operator. It was very confusing and hard to understand from what I've gathered and what I have read. That, you know, they saw these girls. They were hysterical. One had fainted. One had passed out. They were telling what the girls were saying.

and then the 911 person is listening to several different people on the call, but it was made by one of the girls' phone. Yeah. So we know that for sure. Now, let's just briefly and as fast as we can. Guys, we do have another episode, you know, I believe we kind of touch on the timeline, but we do have another episode of that. So if you guys want to go and check that out, go find it.

But let's briefly talk about the timeline. So Madison and Kaylee go to a bar downtown called the Corner Club at 2002 North Main Street between 10 p.m. and 1.30 a.m. Zana and Ethan go to an on-campus party at the Sigma Chai House at 735 Ness Perce Drive to at least 145 a.m. According to this timeline, right? Now, we don't know that for sure because no one has come out and said anything. Yeah, there's a missing like four-hour gap between the times they went to the fraternity party. and coming home. We know that Zana talked to her dad at midnight,

and she said she was home, but we don't know how long they were at the party. That's a critical piece of information that is missing at this time. Yeah, and also keep in mind that, you know, if she talked to her dad at midnight and said she was home, the fraternity house is literally right across the road. So did they decide to just walk across the road,

go to the paternity party, you know, that was the deal. We don't know. But, you know, that, there is a large time gap, especially Zana and Ethan. So Madison and Kaylee, now they are seen at the grub truck

that is located on 318 South Main Street at approximately 141 a.m. And they use a private party to get home. They were all home, supposedly, by 145 a.m., located at 1122 King Road. And this is according to Chief Fry. Kaylee's sister states that Kaylee tried to call Jack six times, starting at 226.

a.m. to 244 a.m. and Maddie called him three times starting at 244 and ended at 252. Kaylee made one last call for the seventh time at 252. Now Jack is Kaylee's ex-boyfriend. But, you know, according

to police, he has already been cleared. And also according to family. Right. According to that he is... They were on and off again and that they were probably going to get together and be married and Kaylee's family is 100% on his side at this time.

Yeah. So, now, a 911 call, as we were talking about earlier, came in 1158 a.m. This is on November 13th to report an unconscious person. The 911 call originated from inside of the residence that was made from one of the surviving roommates' phones. According to an Idaho state police spokesperson, the roommates were not the ones that made the call, which is what we're talking about. One of the roommates passed out, and apparently bystanders are someone that

came to the scene were actually the ones that that ended up talking to 911 because the other roommate could not even function to speak. And also, police had also said that they had called some of their friends and there was a lot of friends that were there going in and out of the house. So that is a little bit of a conflicting thing right there. Was it standard, you know, people just passing by or did they actually call people and people came to help and went in? the house and came out of the house. Now, there were, according to police, there were no signs of forced entry. And the chief of police said the door was still open when they arrived.

There were two other roommates in the residence at the time of the murders that were unharmed and were present when the police arrived. And according to the corner, all victims were inside. Most were in bed. And she states that she believes they were sleeping. Some had defensive wounds. They were all stabbed multiple times. There was no signs of sexual assault.

The victims were found on the second and third floors. Now, to this medical examiner's report or coroner's report, we don't now believe all of them were sleeping. I mean, yes, they may have all been sleeping at the time when the intruder entered the home, but we do, I believe, believe that Ethan was fighting off in Zana, right? Ethan and Zana, we believe we're fighting. And this was a, and do we believe that Zana, just based on everything we've kind of said, do we believe Zana was stabbed first? No.

Or Ethan. No. Sorry, I know that's like a really... Yeah, we're getting way off there, but I don't even believe they were stabbed first. A lot of people do think they were stabbed first, but I think that the perp came in, went straight upstairs to their target. They're going to either Kaylee or Madison, one of them was a target. Maybe he went to the wrong room.

There was not in there. He found two girls in a room, stabbed both of the girls. according to Kaylee's dad she got the brunt of this stabbing saying that maybe she was the one that was being stalked because police did know that she felt like she had a stalker

but they had confirmed the two people that were stocking her were cleared. Yeah. And you know, Zana was, Zana's father came out and said that, you know, Zana was fighting all the way to the end

because she had bruising and probably defense wounds on the, you know, forearms or hand, obviously from, you know, someone just trying to stab you. And so Ethan was not found in the bedroom, though, right? Exactly, yeah. He was found close to the sliding glass door somewhere in that area outside the bedroom. Okay. Now, there was a November 20th press conference, and they set on the press conference,

they seized and searched three dumpsters on the King Road. Nothing was recovered. They still believe they were targeted but cannot say who the target was. and then Ask Chief Frye is the killer Was the 911 caller and when he responded No There were other friends that showed up

To the residence as we spoke about At the time of the press conference 646 tips Now there are thousands of tips Digital and otherwise And they have processed, vetted Investigated and cleared They have conducted

At the time of the November 20th interview I think there was over 90 interviews And the two surviving roommates went out on the town the evening of November 12th, and we're both home by 1 a.m. and slept until the late the next day. Right. The agencies involved are to Marcoskaw Police Department, Idaho State Police, Lottah County Sheriff's Department, and the FBI. So people the police believe do not have any

involvement at this time are, A, surviving roommates, B, the food truck guy, which we're going to talk about all these scenarios, because these are very important that we're going to come into. And then, C, the private party that gave Kaylee and Madison a ride after leaving the food truck. So, we had talked about the press conference. Now, there were multiple people that spoke to 911 operator during the call, and the police said that none of those people were suspected. They have not released any of the names of the callers from 911 call, and they have not released a 911 call itself because it is part of the investigation, they say.

The mail that Maddie and Kaylee called before the call. they were not, sorry, before they were killed is not considered involved, which is Jack. That is the ex-boyfriend. That's Jack D. Yeah. They collected 103 pieces of individual evidence, and since then they've collected more because they, which will talk about that, they went downstairs since then. I think this is a couple days ago. So today is December the 6th, and police were seen in the very bottom floor, which is the surviving roommates.

They were seen inside of the bottom floor collecting more evidence. evidence and putting evidence markers down, which we don't know exactly where. So the 103 pieces of evidence is probably far exceeded that now, just to be clear. They took approximately 4,000 photos, conducted multiple 3D scans of the residents. They have hundreds of hours that are used by technicians and investigators including forensic teams, detectives from multiple agencies, and they processed thousands of tips and conducted hundreds of interviews. and during the interviews conducted,

the people stated that Kaylee indicated she may have a stalker. Now, the detectives had investigated his claims and had been unable to corroborate the claims, but they did recently say that there was a particular situation in a public building. Public building that I guess there was guys that were apparently at a grocery store trying to meet girls. And so the police have since interviewed them.

And this was according to Fox News today. on at December 6th. They have interviewed these guys and they have apparently cleared them, at least according to what they are telling to the public. And these are the guys that they think Kaylee was talking about stalking. But an interesting point to me is I'm not so so sure they have the right stalker because in the very first interviews with Kaylee's mom, she came out and said she was very diligent of her surroundings. she knew everything around sorry what is that word diligent diligent gosh diligent she was very diligent about her surroundings knew everything that was going on and one day

while she was driving around that town she called her mom and said mom i think someone is following me and mom said cayley pull over and call the police and cayley said oh wait they just turned into another parking lot. But I think that is a big piece right there because I think she knew someone was following her. And I don't even think it was these guys. I think someone else was stalking her. Yeah. So right now, if we want to see kind of how this scene and how much, I guess, resources that the police, FBI and other agencies are, I guess, devoting to this murder. Now, this is assigned resources at this time. There are six to the three of three. There are six to detectives, five support staff.

There are 46 investigators from the FBI that are in Moscow. And two behavior analysts that are investigating as well. 13 investigators in Moscow from the Idaho State Police in Moscow, sorry. 15 uniform troopers assist in the community patrols, communications teams, ISP forensic teams, and many others. But this is kind of the core of this investigation team. Right. And this is definitely a priority. for all of them. It's this case.

Yeah, now FBI and the Federal Bureau of Investigation, CIA, you know, just anything federal, they have the latest of the latest and the greatest, you know, crime scene analysts, forensics investigators, technology to be able to figure out whose blood is not roommates and whose isn't. You know, that's the thing that they're starting to talk about is depending on who was killed first and so on. the likelihood of a killer with a knife that stabs people like he did

not having any evidence like you go in this house you kill four people brutally and then leave this house with zero evidence would be extremely rare and it is I mean that that is rare to do if I came into this house and there's four people I killed and I walk out of this house with zero evidence

it would just be rare especially considering the concentration of where the murders took place, right? So you don't necessarily, even though you probably should, but you don't necessarily have to search the entire house to try to find the killer's DNA or something that is left behind. You have to, the killer gives you where you need to search, you know, primarily, and that is at the scene of the crimes, each individual crime, each individual murder. So that's where they're looking, and that is,

But it still is like a needle in a haystack. It's not as easy as people think it is. But you do also have the FBI, but then also you have, you know, how many people came into the house before police or anyone got there. How many people partied at the house before that? How many people's DNA are actually in the house? Considering these are college students. Yeah.

You know, I know they said Zana was the one that was very clean and none of the other ones were very clean. So you mean clean like she wanted the house clean and none of the other girls in the house really cared about it being clean. So it was kind of dirty and they had, you know, a lot of gatherings there. So there's got to be a lot of DNA in this house. Yeah. Yeah, there has to be. So there have been numerous requests about the dog found in the residence on the morning of November 13th.

And arriving officers entered the residence and found the deceased victims. during the search of the home, a dog was found in a room where the crimes had not been committed. Officers did not find any evidence on the dog, and there was no indication that the animal had entered the crime scene. The dog was taken to animal services, and then obviously it was released to family or friends or whoever. Jack. While the dog was in the house when officers arrived, there has not been determined whether a dog was physically located when the murders took place, which I believe that the dog was. I mean, I don't know why that is a thing that people are talking about, but yes, the dog, obviously. was probably there when the murders took place.

Yeah, and I don't think they're saying that. They just don't know if the dog witnessed the crimes or not. Was the dog with Kaylee, which is the owner of the dog of Murphy, or was the dog downstairs with the surviving roommates? Yeah. That is the question right now, because that is a big thing right now too. But I still remember reading about the dog barking between 3 and 4 o'clock. there was a neighbor that was getting really aggravated because the dog was barking between three and four.

I don't know if you remember that. Yeah, yeah. So we don't know for sure if the dog was in the roommate's rooms downstairs or was he in another room or was he with the victims. Yeah. All right. So we went through the timeline. Now let's talk about some of the stuff that we've, we're not going to reference off anything. We're just going to reference off of memory of everything we've been talking about.

So forgive us if we do not get everything 100% correct. And if I interrupt Chad, please don't say anything bad because I have a habit of doing that and I think he does too. Yeah, we both do. But we're married and that's what happens. That's what happens when you're married. Just wait until you get married one day. Yeah. All right.

So here we go. So let me talk about, I guess, the most interesting thing. Even though we're not going to talk about who could very well be a murder. in this case. First. We're not going to say names. Well, we'll see how that goes. But let's talk about other murders that are possibly connected to this.

Okay? Even though police are going to come out in public and say that, well, we don't find any connection necessarily, blah, blah, even though they really have not said this about this. There actually has been some talk throughout sources that say that this could very well be connected to these murders. Now, if this is an actual targeted attack, right? If this is someone that went to this house, had an issue with one, two, or all of the people there, you know, then probably the likelihood of these other murders happening in Washington and some of these other places in Oregon, would probably not be connected.

But it is very strange on how these other murders are very eerily similar to this murder. Sherry, what are I guess, just some similarities with the murders? So this is one theory that people are thinking about is they've gone back and looked at other murders around the Northwestern area and have discovered that there have been murders. I don't even know that it's the police that did this. No, these are sleuths that discovered these murders were, they happen in a very similar way. and there's a lot of weird stuff going on with it. For example, all these murders, they happened on the 13th. All these murders happened at 3 a.m.

People have gone as far enough to say that there were the first two murders, Oregon and the Washington murders, were four months apart, I believe. And then the second murder to the third murder was five months apart, but they were all on the 13th, which that number just stands with a lot of times. of people that believe in this theory if it was a serial killer that he does this on purpose and with purpose with the numbers 13 and 3 you think about the house address 1122 well if you put the 1122 it could be 1 3 13 so all these numbers have something to do with it if they think it's a serial killer. The police have ruled this out, but, you know, it's that's still like going around

on the internet. Well, I don't necessarily think the police have completely ruled it out. They've actually kind of avoided a lot of saying whether it's connected or not. And also, I also want to keep this in mind is that police a lot of times, and especially from a public relations perspective, they're going to rule things out to the public that they may not be ruling out in private. Right. And so, but also the other murders were stabbings. Exactly.

They were... These were... Same date, same time. These were brutal murders. And what's really weird, too, is the first murder was one person. The second murder was two people, and now the third murder is fourth. four, I'm sorry, four people.

So now people are predicting that the next murder will be eight people. Or six. Yeah, because of the numbers. And they're also predicting a certain date, January 13th, 2003, I think they said, based on what happened in the past. If this is a serial killer, they're looking at the patterns. That'd be nuts. And saying this is, they predict, this is when the next one's going to happen.

They kind of know the area. where it's going to happen if that is the truth. Yeah. Now look, guys, for those of you that do not typically listen to us, because we're probably pulling a lot of people that do not listen to stuff that we talk about typically. And you may not, some of you guys may not listen to or believe or whatever, a lot of the stuff we talk about. But, I mean, you know, we talk about subjects such as the government's involvement in UFOs. We talk about subjects such as just the world economic form, new world order, all of these. crazy things that used to be conspiracies, right? Now you hear New World

Order. Now you hear all these things. Now you, now the media is talking about aliens and UFOs. And there are things that may sound like crazy and off the charts right now, even with what we were just talking about, the murders in Washington, Oregon, and these. But, you know, I would say that like even the Jeffrey Dahmer thing would have sounded like some big, weird conglomerate conspiracy. If he would have done what, which there were murders. It just, it was, it was weird. They knew they were chasing a serial killer.

In many cases, serial killers like to make their self known or they like to play a game with themselves to do things. Yeah, in authorities. Oh, sorry. To do. No, to do things that, you know, they want to play a game with themselves. They want to feel like they're smart. And even though they're, it's almost like they're committing this heinous crime,

but they want some kind of little game intertwined in it. And that's why they'll connect numbers, dates. You know, there were serial killers that put pennies on people's heads and just weird stuff, right? All right. So let's talk about, so we talked about the possible serial killer theory. If there is one, it has to be somehow connected to these other murders that do line up with dates and times, which it could very well be just a crazy coincidence. But it is, it is very interesting.

Now, that's a serial killer thing. Now, that's if these people are not targeted. Now, these people could still be targeted because a serial killer could have been playing this game for a little while. They could have, you know, got into the environment and the social circle. They could have, which tells me then that they're not that old if they were getting into a social circle. And by the way, you don't have to go to a college to go to college parties.

You don't have to go to a college to do this. If this is this person's mental state and this is what they do, then whatever. Cereal killer can be someone that's 30 years old and look 18 or 20. And we have to mention, too, all these murderers have happened on a Friday and Saturday, which is very important because the murderer has to have time off of work or time away from people where they're not going to know where they are so they have some type of alibi or they can get away with it, right? So all of these have been Friday and Saturdays, not. any other days.

Yeah. And, you know, and before we get into the next part of this, the potential suspects, right? It is interesting to me, though, that, you know, the way the police portray it in the media is they want to, they want the media or the public to believe it is a college student or someone that is kind of intertwined with them. Now, because it's targeted. Yeah. The targeting thing, they first said targeted to where the public believed, you know, it was a college student, someone that they knew, had been in the house, a friend, an ex-boyfriend, whatever.

And then the police a couple weeks later went back on that and said, well, we don't know that if the public is understanding what our definition of targeting is. almost meaning like it could still be a serial killer or someone we don't know they've just been stalking them or they could have been this or that they wanted to like redefine the term targeting

but now they're going back to the targeting thing they're trying to say again because a large part of the police and for the economy and everything around a city such as Idaho and Moscow Idaho and the college and university

which, by the way, there is a lot of students that are not even going back to campus right now. I mean, and I don't really blame them because you're looking at this situation. I don't know if I'm safe or not. I don't know who I'm sitting next to in class is the murder. And if I go to my dorm room or whatever the case is, am I going to be the next group of people to get murdered? And then it's not solved. But this is a very interesting. But what I'm saying is I think the police can, part of their job is to not,

scare the public. Exactly. But when they were talking about targeting, this is where they're so conflicting. They first said a person in the house was targeted. Then, like you said, a couple weeks ago, or a couple weeks from then, they said, well, maybe the house was targeted. Now that Kaylee's dad came out and feels like maybe his daughter was targeted, it goes back to an individual. And that's where all the people are having issues, like, what's the target? Who's the target? Who's the target? What do you mean by targeted? Because they've not really told because they don't want to hamper their investigation. No, I get it.

All right. So let's talk about some things. Now, I said on the first episode of this that we've done that there's something weird to me about, I still go back to the food truck video. I still go back to this. And this is when Kaylee and Maddie had left the corner. bar and they went to the food truck to order food. Right before they were leaving and going home.

Right. By a private party. So in that video, there was a guy, hoodie guy, right? Hoodie. There's a guy in the video which has, according to media and police, has been cleared, right? But there's a big, there's a whole thing about this cleared, right? There are experts, there are law enforcement guys. or people that are close to sources and so on, including the parents,

gon coves or gone calves, that are saying that some of these people, they believe are being cleared too fast, which is one of the reasons they're hiring an attorney, possibly a private investigator, so on and so forth. But I, for whatever reason, and Sherry, you told me this, and I don't want to say this, but you did tell me this earlier, so I want to say it.

you know, you had seen an interview with a law enforcement, with a ex-investigator, whoever it was, that said oftentimes it's the most, I guess, it's almost like your gut filling. Like if you say you get with a guy or a girl or whatever and you have a gut feeling that are just not right, there's something not right about the situation. And that's basically what this law enforcement officer was saying was, typically it's the easiest or the simplest thing. Explanation, yes, is probably. the explanation.

And I, from the very beginning, when I saw this food truck video, and I'm not saying it's the hoodie guy. But I did say on the first episode, and if it does turn out to be the hoodie guy, there's something weird about that situation. And we're going to talk about this. Because the hoodie guy, although has been cleared, supposedly, according to law enforcement, you know, he said that he was just making sure. they got home okay.

Okay. And he was talking to, I'll just say, Jay about that. And that Jay is the one that told everyone on certain internet platforms that he was talking to them. And he said, yeah, man, I'm just, I know they're drunk and I just want to make sure they get home okay. That's what he was talking about. Yes. During the food truck interviews. Now, Sherry, I don't know if you know this.

Is it, has it been official of who the hood? guy is? I don't think it's not even official. I think people are just coming out with his name, but it's not officially been stated. Every time the police talk about him, they talk about the, I think it's hooded foot or the food truck hoodie guy or whatever. Yeah, yeah. He's got like initials, but they've never come out with his name.

But everyone else on the internet has come up with who this person is and they have, you know, they feel like they've confirmed him. Yeah. Okay. So that, yeah, so let's go to this then. Now, this is all speculation, guys. We're not blaming anyone, and we're not probably even going to say this person's name on this episode. Because the normal one thing, we have a responsibility.

There are many of you listening, and we don't want to direct hate or anger towards someone that is innocent, right? And that is already happening with some of these people in this case. Even the neighbor that came out and spoke on mainstream news, mainstream media. And now he's getting death threats and whatever. And so we don't want to be the reason for that happening. But this guy, the hoodie guy, according to our sources and groups and people that are very close to Moscow, Idaho, students, so on. They know this person. They know who this guy is.

They also know that this particular hoodie guy, apparently, if it is the guy that we are seeing across the board, if it is the guy had an issue with these girls or the girls had an issue with him and kind of were blatant about it to a lot of ways. It was almost like these girls were I'm not going to say had

declined him or shot him down or whatever the case is but even in, was it in the video where they flipped him off? They flipped this dude off in the video. Now listen, this is all speculation. As far as the, just you guys got to hear us out with the food truck guy. So they flipped him off, whatever.

If that is true, which many people say is if this guy is who we're thinking is, and these girls flipped them off, they kind of had an issue. This guy also could have been potentially kicked out of a fraternity, which was the fraternity across, that Ethan was in. And that was across from their house. Yes, that was across her house. And Ethan, the murder victim, was in, yeah. But going back to the video, people have slowed it down.

They've tried to read their lips. They've tried to do this. They've tried to do that. From what I have discovered, it sounds like, you know, obviously they're drunk. But somehow, Maddie had his jacket, and he's like, I just want my effing jacket back, dude, our bro. And she was like, F, you know, she said the real word. Real word. F you.

But she, you know, said that. So the dude that was talking to the hoodie guy said he felt like it was a playful thing, but we don't know. Yeah. So there was the guy with the hoodie guy. Well, he wasn't with the hoodie guy. The hoodie guy was standing in the background. He was acting creepy in the background, following them, watching them. He said he just wanted them to get home safe.

But it's just like to me, I felt like he was the last person that saw these girls. He was watching them. They didn't want anything to do with him. They're flipping them off. whispering, even taking selfies. I don't know if Kaylee was trying to take a selfie to get him in the picture, if they felt uncomfortable with this guy. I'm not really sure because the video is not very clear because you hear people in the front

background and in the background. So it's really hard to decipher what everyone's saying. And we have to go based on Joel's accounts, which is the other guy that was in the video that happened to talk to this guy. The hoodie go. Yeah. Yeah. But listen, when I first saw this video, it was weird.

It was weird to me. His actions, the way he was standing back kind of outside of their circle. And the fact that if he was so concerned about making sure they got home okay, right, why the hell did they go home with another private party? Right. And they just like took off without him. They did not talk to him. And as soon as they left, he retreated to his vehicle is what it looked like.

He just walked in another direction. But it was going to his car. Right. I believe he was going to his car. And even the Joel guy was like, hey, those girls are leaving. He's like, oh, whatever, you know. Now, if this is the guy that the internet and many people are saying, right, if this is the guy, you guys, listen, we want your opinion.

Go to our Facebook, Invest the Earth podcast. Go to our Facebook, Twitter, whatever. Tag us, talk about it. We will have a post up about this episode. I want you guys' opinion. Go to our Facebook and Best of the Earth's podcast, like us, comment on our post and say what your thoughts are on this. Just say if this is weird. If this guy, then this guy was potentially kicked out of the fraternity, which Ethan was a part of, right?

Which there is hearsay that Ethan got him kicked out of the fraternity for having anger issues. Yep. This guy also had had a connection. with someone that he worked with a female in the past that he called a bitch

and like a dumb bitch basically because she just over something stupid and he was very abrasive very anger you know tormented type person

I guess you can say also this person the night of the murders and I want to make sure I'm right on this fled not fled but was driving

to Boise? Was it Boise? I'm not sure if it's Boise, but I know that he was driving like six hours away from where he lived. That was his alibi, right? Right. And his house just happens to be, or his apartment happens to be within walking distance of the girl's house. Okay. And he was driving just so happened to be driving as a quote unquote. That was his alibi. Yeah. And some people say he was driving to the hunting cabin. Yeah. Now this guy, supposedly, is in Africa.

Right. With his family on a trip. Well, we don't know if he's with his family, and we don't know if he's on the trip. Yeah, we don't know. There is speculation that this guy has gone to Africa now. Yeah. Now, also with this guy is that he, if this guy is legit and these connections are legit, which we cannot 100% connect. We've tried to do that. I mean, we have to some degree, but it's just, you know, With things like this, all we're saying is attorney general of Idaho or whatever, this person is possibly connected with that, with him.

I guess they got a lot of prominent people in their family. If that is the case, right? If this is true, then this particular person being cleared so soon could make more sense, right? Right. And this goes back to the dad, Steve, I think feeling like people were cleared. too soon and maybe he's thinking because his family was intermingled with important people in Idaho that have a lot of what's the word um well just a lot of uh a weight i mean a weight in the system and a lot of stature and a lot of power you know and and this leads me back to we talked about

this before but it leads me back to the murdoch murders uh in south koreland this is the murdog murders he was a district attorney, a solicitor. The whole family was involved as the solicitors or district court judges or whatever for like five, six or seven states in South Carolina. And the guy I'm referring to, Paul Murdoch, or not Paul, but Alec Murdoch, he was a very prominent attorney and his whole family was very high in the legal system in South Carolina. This just recently happened. His son got into a very prominent attorney.

a situation where he got drunk and killed and ended up a lady or a girl was killed in a boating accident. He basically didn't get anything done about it for years. And so this kid, the son, which is from this very prominent family, was also involved potentially in other murders. There was a guy that was just how it happened to be gay that was murdered, even though it was classified as a hit and run, but now that we're starting to see they've opened the investigation back up, they think that is, and they're all connected. But the more power and the more influence you have, especially in small towns in Moscow and that whole area, it's very small town. You know, if you think corruption is bad in the higher ups, corruption is even worse a lot of times in

smaller areas or smaller states. Now, I'm not saying this is the case, but I'm just playing this out for you that if this is true, it could just be this very simplest reason of why this person may have been cleared if this is all true and connected. And we don't know that. We don't know for sure. We cannot see her and say, this is 100% fact. We don't know. But it's just so weird that they've cleared the hoodie guy at the truck, but we don't even know who the hoodie guy is. Like they have not identified this person. And why, how, yeah, how did they clear him so fast? But the weird thing is, well, I mean, apparently he had an alibi. But if, you know...

An alibi driving six hours away? But listen, what I'm saying is, too, is we have to understand as much as we've done and talked about on this podcast on so many things as far as corruption, right? I mean, and not just corruption. You know, when you clear someone so fast, so soon, that doesn't always mean any... That a lot of times doesn't mean anything. I mean, the Murdoch case. I mean, Alec was cleared for a while. No, he's cool.

He's got a great alibi. Yeah, he was at his dad's house, dad's nursing home. Yeah, and guess where he's at now? In prison for murder? Because it finally came out that he did this. And so when the police come out... We're speculating he did this. Yeah, and the Murdoch thing was as big as these Idaho murders.

It was in mainstream media. It was everywhere. And so a lot of times when law enforcement, FBI, or whoever, have a lot of pressure on them to be like, what do you have? what do you have, what do you have? They'll just clear people. And sometimes they have to in some cases, because they don't want danger to these people that they can't right then say that, hey, they're a suspect, or we believe that they are a true, genuine threat to the community or suspect or whatever the case may be. So they also kind of have to protect, you know, protect people that may be around

the situation or involved. And I get that, right? I mean, you would rather clear someone, even though you internally may not have actually cleared them, but for their safety in the event that they are not at all involved in this, you have to protect those people. Right. Because it's going to really come down hard on you. If you didn't protect these people and they weren't, they had nothing to do with it, and you were, you know, you let on that they possibly did and then they got shot, killed, whatever, their family got tormented.

So there are things in that situation. You have to protect them. And believe me, this guy's family is all over the internet. now, their Facebooks, their friends, everything's all over the internet. Like, these people are being tortured pretty much on the internet from these internet sleuths, which I'm saying, you know, people want to know answers, and that's why they're digging into everything. But going back to, let's just say it is the hoodie guy from the truck.

The theory, to me, makes sense if this dude was out there looking, he looks suspicious. The girls, like, say, F you, get in the car, drive home. he leaves at the same time they leave, right? And then everyone's home. He goes home, gets his weapon, comes in. So that's telling you that one of the girls had to be the target. If that's the case, and he's been at the house because they know each other. They party before.

And Maddie supposedly has his jacket on, right? So he knows where they live. He's watched them. Oh, and by the way, they have no drapes. They have lights all over the place. Anyone can look in their windows, see where they are, what they're doing at all times. So this is just a theory that if this is the truck guy, the food truck guy, he goes home, gets his weapon, comes back, comes in the sliding door after anyone wants to sleep. And his target is either Kaylee or Maddie upstairs.

People tend to think it's Kaylee because she got, you know, more of the brutality, I guess. And which one was at the food truck? I'm sorry. I always get this confused. What do you mean? Oh, Kaylee and Maddie. So that makes more sense? So he comes, he goes, gets his weapon, comes in the sliding glass door.

Who had his jacket on supposedly? Maddie, Madison. Okay. And he's like, bro, I just want my effing jacket back is what people are saying in the food truck video. Yeah. So anyways, he goes home, gets his weapon, waits for them to sleep, goes through the sliding glass door in the back on the second floor. I think at this time, this is just a theory. Zana and Ethan are asleep.

He goes upstairs because he knows Kaylee or Madison or whoever he's after. Dad thinks it's Kaylee. He goes after Kaylee and finds both of the girls in one bed so has to kill both the girls, right? Kaylee gets more of the brutal attack for some reason.

Maybe she's the target. Maybe she fought back harder. We don't know. He goes downstairs. Ethan hears commotion. Ethan goes out of his room to confront whatever's going on. There's a struggle. There's a fight.

Ethan's killed wherever he was close to outside the bedroom, right? Zana, the whole time, is freaking out because she's probably asleep. You know, she was asleep and then woke up the same time Ethan did. You know, it's just like when we thought we had intruder, Chad. Yeah. You're like, I'm like, Chad, I heard something. Yeah, I'll wake you up immediately. Yeah.

Something's going on. blah blah, blah. But I know from my experiences, if I thought somebody was breaking in, there's this fear that comes over here, over you where you can't even move. Like, you're just so scared, you can't move. Not me, though. So I'm like, I'm at the gun. Yeah, so the dude is coming out to protect the girl, basically. That's Ethan. The girl stays in the bed because she's freaking out. She's scared. She doesn't know what to do. The guy kills Ethan, then goes to Zena because he knows. And then she's defend herself. And she defends.

And that tells you, like, how she got all the defensive wounds. It's because she had to try to fight back. But she was so scared. She had nowhere to go. She had to, you know, that's, to me, a really good, plausible theory. Yeah. So this guy comes in, or guys. Probably, it's probably, I mean, I know I hate to say.

I mean, I think it's probably one person. I mean, God, to have two people in there and not nobody. get caught. There's theories of two people. I know, I get it, but it's just... There's even theories of Ethan being involved in it. I mean, there's all kinds of theories. That's just nuts.

But, you know, we do, you know, there's definitely some things, some rabbit holes, and we're not saying this is true at all because I don't want to bring any more trauma or any of that stuff, but I'm just saying there is theories of people that are very close to them that could have possibly been involved. And I'm talking about very close. Like, you know, I'm not. saying. And I don't even know if I want to say like... No, I don't think we should even go there. I don't. But we may, we may do it next episode. I don't know. We got to be careful, guys.

I mean, and... But in the reason why we really think this is, again, it goes back to Steve. Um, Kaley's dad. He's very suspicious of people that are acting very differently after the murders and that he said were cleared way too fast. And he doesn't even really know their alibis. Yeah. Which makes sense. And I get what this dad is doing. He wants answers for his daughter's murder. I get it.

And a lot of people are saying he's interfering with the investigation. He's harming the investigation. He's not doing good. But then other people are like, you know, if he feels like the police are botching it, he wants to stand up and find this person on his own because, you know, he's a daddy, a fearless daddy that did not get to protect his daughter that night. Yeah. I mean, listen, the gone calves, and I hope I'm saying that name.

right. What the hell would you do, man? If you're a dad that your daughter got brutally murdered like that. I mean, I would be doing the same thing. And he has balls and he wants this shit to be solved. And he's going to do anything for his daughter. He couldn't do anything to save her that night, but he's damn sure has a way or a mentality now

that he's going to do whatever he can to make sure this happens and goes, you know, is solved. And people do the right thing to solve this. And I get it. I mean, there's no question. There's no one that can discredit him or talk shit about him. I would be doing the same thing, period, and probably worse. I mean, I would be, you know, I don't know.

I just. But you have to say, too, I know daddy is, you know, daddy bear. And he wants to get justice for his daughter. But there are some people saying that he is hampering the investigation and also harming the investigation by giving too much that the public does not know. For example, we did not know that the two girls weren't in bed together. We did not know that Kaylee got the brunt of it. And we did not know some other things that the parents have come out and told, despite the police not giving that information.

Listen, now, I want to say something. I've been in law enforcement. I know that a lot of this stuff, that when the cops are like, oh, yeah, you can't, we can't say a lot of We can't say this. We can't say that. There's a lot of just political BS right now. There is a lot of upper echelon politicalness that has to get approval from this department.

Or not the department. Well, yeah, because now you've got FBI on there. But I'm talking about from this level of detectives and this level and this level. And it's so politicized now that is, you know, are you really going to harm an investigation right now by coming out with information? Probably 95% of what they have right now.

If they came out with it to the public, would not be harming anything. And I think it goes back to what you said. They don't want this fear through their town. And they're trying to keep everything calm where people are not fearful of what's going on. And if they don't tell the whole truth, people are not as fearful. But I don't think that's working. Well, yeah, it's not working.

But given the fact that if the police did come out, right, and they said, just say, for example, Moscow police came out to the public on national media and said, hey, guys, we actually have no idea, literally. That's pretty much what they say. They kind of say that, but they're still trying to make the public think is targeted. So we get all this evidence and we think we're zero and in. You got to remember, in the very beginning of this, they said the public's not in any danger.

Don't worry about it, right? And then they had to back off that because they had no clue what this was about. I still, I personally think, and I could be wrong and I hope I'm wrong. I just think they have zero clue still. And getting back to the hoodie guy at the food truck, this is kind of weird that I saw on the internet. Is that if it is the person that people think is the person, he had a red, I think Mustang or a red car. And they saw police at that car at a different location searching it. Are you talking about the food truck guy?

Yeah, the food truck guy. Potentially. Yes, they were searching the red car that he supposedly owns if it's that guy. Yeah, if it's the guy. Which we don't know. But, oh, that's what I was going to say earlier, and I actually forgot. One of the things that we have learned over four, five years of doing things that seem to be a conspiracy or whatever, or especially something that is something that really gets a big push on social media and not just social media,

but people that all these sources are coming together and they're putting together all this information. The narratives that tend to really break out from all the other BS narratives, because trust me, guys, you guys, and I hate to tell you guys this, you guys are very brutal. Like, if you know,

because, I mean, we do podcasts and all kinds of stuff, but when we do murder stuff or we do whatever, you guys are brutal. If we don't get something right or we don't say this particular thing or whatever the case is, you guys let us know, we know. And we get. Get the ratings.

But you guys let us know. And what I'm saying is that because of that is why these main narratives of these large amounts of people, the ones that do break out have weight. And you have to understand that's the same thing with so many conspiracy theories that have been, you know, come along over the years. JFK. You're talking about Martin Luther King murder. If you guys actually look that up or go listen to our podcast episode about it. these things are very legit. I mean, it's almost like, you know,

the government don't want to talk about, no one I was talking about, but if you actually look at the evidence, it's pretty freaking evident that this is what happened. And so the main narrative that comes out of these large groups of people that are sleuths, that are,

that's all they want to figure out is this, and they will connect anything and everything. And by the way, you have, you have these, well, we named how many law enforcement officials were involved in this case, right? But think about the amount of people that are involved in this case, even though they don't have the evidence, but they have the

internet. And they can connect any and everything together. And you're talking about a few hundred at the most, it's not even a hundred, not even a few hundred, law enforcement officials versus millions of people that are trying to figure out this narrative. And I just want to quickly go back to Nancy Grace's podcast or whatever show. I didn't actually really say. I didn't actually really see, I just kind of read about what she was talking about. Yeah, I saw it. Do you want to go? Well, go into her details.

They basically watched it she thinks. Yeah, and that she was saying that they had confirmed that Zana and Ethan had been killed first. Yeah. And then the perp went upstairs is what she was saying. But there is no confirmation of anything. So even Nancy Grace does not know the truth. I think that she is using her. what do you want to call it?

Well, maybe sources. I mean, I do think Nancy Grace probably has sources, and I'm sure she's talking to family members. There's a lot of stuff that the family members, especially Steve Gunn Cobb is his name, Steve Guncoves, or Goncabas, whatever. You know, one of the things he has come out, he wants to say so much more that he kind of knows.

Yeah, they know. And that's probably a reason why the police are not really giving them any more information because he is a very big face on the media. But I'm sure Nancy Grace and people like this are talking to him, and talking to this family. And by the way, anybody that knows this family and wants to reach out to us,

I mean, we're not going to try to pull any other information, but I think there's some things that we could ask or at least try to figure out from this family that maybe we could just help

the situation. I don't know. But if anybody wants to talk about that, let us know. But getting back to Nancy Grace's theory, that's where another theory comes in. A lot of people believe that Zana and Ethan were the target.

Yeah. And I think that part of those theories goes back to the hoodie guy because the hoodie guy was in the same fraternity as Ethan and Ethan supposedly told on this guy for the anger issues. So he could have been. If that is true. If he could have been targeted and they, you know, and there was supposedly a fight at the fraternity that night, the same night that the murders happened.

The same night. We don't know. I mean, this is just. And then keeping in mind, Ethan, them, we have a large amount of time that is lost. So we don't know exactly where they were or who they're with or whatever. But I'm just saying that's another theory or a possibility is that Zana and Ethan could have been murdered first and then they go upstairs. It still doesn't make sense to me if Zana and Ethan were targeted. Why would they even go upstairs?

Well, some other people are saying, well, what if Ethan and Zana brought somebody home with them? That changes the whole scenario, I guess. So these are just the theories that are out there. I think all the theories, you know, are valuable. I think hopefully they're helping law enforcement piece things together. Because like you said, Chad, there's so many people trying to solve this case on the internet. So many people that are at home, they can't work, they don't work, whatever. They have all the time in the world to go down all these rabbit holes, figure out things.

Or the people that do work. Yes. That's what they're doing from time to get home. Oh, my gosh. When I'm not working, I'm on the internet trying to read up to the latest stuff because I want to know too. Because I want this solved. I really care about these families and I just, I'm devastated

that these children, they are children, were murdered the way they were. It's just devastating to me and I wake up thinking about them, I go to bed thinking about them. Absolutely. Guys and girls, go to our Facebook, let us know your

thoughts on this episode. Let us know about the hoodie guy. Let us know about just everything. Let us know your thoughts on this. Give us any information that we have not covered. Any theories you guys have? Let us know. And if you want to be recognized or don't, whatever, we'll talk about that in the next episode of this. I mean, hopefully that this case is solved before our next episode.

But, I mean, I don't know. I keep waking up every day's praying. It's going to be solved. But so far, no go. Yeah, we don't know. But guys, listen, thank you so much again for listening to Investor's podcast. We do pray for all the families that's involved in this. We want this to come to a close and for justice to be served

and whoever this asshole is to get justice in burning hell. But anyways, until next time, guys, we love you. Peace out. Peace out, guys.