Investigate Earth Conspiracy Podcast - Joe Rogan Experience #2560 | David Grusch: UFOs, Aliens & Underwater Bases | Breakdown

Episode Date: October 2, 2026

David Grusch's latest appearance on The Joe Rogan Experience may be one of his most extraordinary interviews yet. Tonight on Investigate Earth, Chad and Sheri break down JRE #2560 and react to some of the wildest claims made by the former U.S. intelligence officer and UFO whistleblower. We're talking about alleged recovered nonhuman bodies, multiple alien species, reptilians, Grays, possible warfare between different nonhuman intelligences, and an enormous underwater base reportedly spanning multiple city blocks. But the conversation goes even deeper.Grusch and Rogan explore the Book of Enoch, the Watchers, ancient gods, Ezekiel's biblical visions, and whether humanity's earliest civilizations may have encountered intelligences they interpreted as divine. Could ancient religious accounts and modern UFO encounters be describing parts of the same phenomenon? How much does Grusch actually know, and what evidence has yet to be made public? Join us as we break down the interview, separate the claims from what's confirmed, and discuss what these revelations could mean if they're ever proven true. This is an independent Investigate Earth commentary and analysis of Joe Rogan Experience #2560, not the original interview.Our Merchandise

and welcome back to Investigator Earth Podcast. I'm your host, shout alongside my beautiful wife, Sherry. Tonight we're diving into one of the wildest interviews we have watched in a long time. Former U.S. intelligence officer and UFO whistleblower David Grush recently set down with Joe Rogan and some of what he revealed raises some pretty insane questions about what we think we know about our world. We're talking about alleged recovered non-human bodies, different types of beings, possible conflicts between them, a massive underwater base, and even connections to the Bible, the Book of Enoch and ancient civilizations.

Even if a fraction of these claims actually turn out to be true, what does that actually mean for humanity and our understanding of history? Tonight we're going to play some of the most interesting parts of the interview, break them down together, and give you our thoughts. So guys, let's get into it. It is October the 1st, 2026. This song is the X-Files, Neo-Geo Dubstep Remix. And listen, I'm actually really excited about this episode.

We've not talked about aliens in quite some time. And the alien conversation in general just excites the hell out of me. Number one, because I've been researching so much just historical books and books on UFOs and obviously the Bible and religion and everything over the past two years. And then I watched this Dave Grush interview and it kind of blew me away. Now, I'm sure there are a lot of you out there that have heard Dave Grush in Congress or you've heard it in the first time on Joe Rogan. But this interview was different.

This was pretty mind-blowing. And Dave Grush said more in this interview than I think anybody so far has about UFOs and disclosure. And I know this is something that a lot of us have been waiting on for a very long time. Will the government actually disclose what we know about alien life, interdimensional beings, UFOs, or even just religion, the things that we think we know or we believe or we have faith in? What does the government actually know? And I think the answer to that question is a lot. And I think the government has relationships with these things. I think there are many Intel officers that not only have seen videos or pictures, but also

literally been in the same room with non-human intelligence or maybe even human intelligence, just some other kind of human. I know that sounds weird. We're going to talk about all that. But this interview really blew me away. And so I am very excited to be talking about this with you guys tonight. We're going to break down the best parts of the interview. I do encourage you guys to listen to the whole interview.

if you just want it straight through. We're going to not try to break in like every two minutes, but we are going to start at the point where Dave Grush really gets into high detail about everything he knows. Obviously, he cannot say everything he knows because a lot of it is still classified. Although, yes, he is a whistleblower. Technically he has offered the whistleblower Protection Act, but we have seen that there have been other whistleblowers that have been under the Whistleblower Protection Act and they have ended up dead or killed.

And Dave Grush himself actually talks about that in this show how threatened his life was and not just his life, but his families. What is really insane to me with this interview with Joe Rogan compared to what he was testifying in Congress, so much more came out. But during Congress, he was saying, you know, I know about this information, but I cannot disclose it right here. We have to go to a skift. And then I can give you more details because it can't be public knowledge. So how is he able to give more details now on Joe Rogan when he couldn't do it during Congress? Well, that's pretty simple, I think. I think it's because, number one, two different administrations.

I believe when Dave Grush first went in front of Congress, it was under the Biden-Harris administration. Now you have Trump in office. You also have Dave Grush on there, kind of given Trump his flowers on the Joe Rogan interview. And I don't actually think that we're going to hear that part because we're not going to cover that part. That's in the kind of first hour of the interview. But, you know, Dave Grush does extensively give Trump his flowers and says, look, Trump is brave for what he's already doing. And I do think he said that he, that Trump will be the president that actually discloses

fully what we know about the UFO topic. So that means we'll at least have it in the next two, two and a half years then. Yeah, about two years at least. I mean, that's what he thinks. And the reality is he said Trump is in the know. He is up to speed. He understands what's going on. And it is always very interesting, though, when the media asked Trump about UFOs or alien life, he always kind of still downplays it.

Yeah, like he doesn't believe in it. Yeah. Or he says, you know, well, you know, I know a lot of very smart pilots that have seen a lot of crazy stuff out there. And that's, you know, and these pilots are very smart and they're the best our military has. And so he doesn't really ever say that like he doesn't believe it. He doesn't say that, you know, he just gives credibility to the pilots to report this stuff. Right. Now, we have not actually heard Trump talk.

talk a lot about the UFO topic in probably six to eight months a year maybe. I know when he first came into office, he was asked that question quite a few times, obviously, because that was one of the things that a lot of people in the UFO community were very excited about is we had Trump in. This was the guy that was going to drain the swamp. He was going to go against the deep state, go against the bureaucrats, do all the things that he had promised. And so for the UFO community, this was huge because they were like, hey, look, he's going to dig in. He's going to make these executive of orders to where the deep state has to cooperate with him. They have to cooperate with the administration.

And so there's a lot of stuff that Trump said he was going to do that he has not. And especially for the UFO community, if you are really, really excited, especially after the Dave Grush interview about the potential for full disclosure of alien life and UFOs, don't yet get too excited. And the only reason I say that is because a lot of people are also excited. and ready for the Epstein files to be fully transparent and released. And we saw how that whole debacle went down, mostly because of likely the power strings that are the ones pulling the strings behind the scenes.

But, you know, the same power structure, if not greater power structure, is behind the UFO and alien disclosure. And I think, you know, yes, Epstein files is massive. We're talking about child sex trafficking around the world. But Dave Grush even says on this interview that the United States, States government has operations where they traffic children. And he said it's just the most unbelievable thing to him. But you got to remember, Dave Grush was a high-ranking intelligence officer with the United

States military and government for a very long time. So he knows what operations take place and what is not. And I actually just couldn't believe that he even said that on the Joe Rogan show. I know, because you would think that with files coming out, the government would be more likely to want to release alien UFO files than the Epstein files. Oh, yeah. But do you think that David Grush got permission from the government before he went on Joe Rogen and just said, hey, these are the things I'm going to talk about. Is this okay?

Yeah, I think, and that's kind of the point I was trying to get to. I actually never made it there. But that was the point is like since this is the Trump administration and Dave Grush has been meeting with Congress and has, it seems like, been meeting with the Trump administration pretty extensively. I do believe likely, and also keep in mind, two weeks ago, it was rumored that Dave Grush was going to be back on the Joe Rogan show. And that was two or three weeks ago. And then there was a lot of community notes on X and all that that said there's no talk about Dave Grush coming back on the show. So someone leaked that he was potentially going to be back on the Joe Rogan show three weeks ago. That didn't happen.

Apparently, according to Joe Rogan is because flights got canceled. There was a lot of stuff kind of going through what I think was happening. I think he was trying to get a lot of stuff clear through the administration. What can I say? How far can I go? And listen, for those that there is two groups of people in this whole argument about UFOs and alien life. You have one set of people that believe that when the government does finally release,

you know, real details or videos or just tell you the what they say are facts about the case is going to be some kind of sci-op, right? There's a lot of people that believe that. A lot of people believe the government will use the UFO topic to get your attention off of something else and or, you know, make Trump be the greatest president of all time that releases this. There is that faction of people. And then there's also a faction of people that have been longtime UFO researchers that obviously welcome the idea that the Trump administration may actually finally be the one to go about full disclosure the right way and tell people the truth. And but nonetheless, I do think there have always been figures throughout history that have went out into the public eye. They have conversed with the government on what they should best say.

We see this on an everyday basis with content creators that are being paid by various factions, whether it's Republican Party, Democrat Party, Israel, frigging whatever. We see that, right? So this is kind of no different necessarily, although it is in a way because Dave Grush is a whistleblower. and according to Dave that he he found out about a plan to take his life and his family's life potentially because of and this was right after he went to Congress and kind of during this time and then he finds out from some high-ranking official in the I guess Trump administration that they did I guess kind of nip that in the bud and so they're like no don't worry you can live did he find out who had well he didn't exactly know but he he did know there was a plan to take him out

and obviously it was someone within the deep state slash intelligence agencies. And, you know, that's the type of stuff that happens. And then you've got to think about this too, you know, over the past two years and especially after Trump said, hey, we're going to disclose the UFO files. We're going to be fully transparent. We're going to have disclosure day. This is when a lot more of the scientists that actually worked hand in hand with a lot or on a lot of these programs from various military bases like McCaslin and others that started

to disappear, which we still don't. have any idea where the hell these people are. And we haven't really heard about that in the news lately. I haven't heard of anyone else disappearing lately that's in the science community or in the military community. No. And it's so funny too because like when the Trump administration was asked about the fact that there were so many engineers and scientists that had high level clearances that worked

on potentially reverse engineering craft. And when Trump was asked about this and he was like, well, you know, I think this is just all a coincidence. We've done an investigation and we don't really feel. find any connections to any of these people. Like there's not some big conspiracy that the deep state or some dark clandestine group of people that work on UFOs in the background or taking these people, are kidnapping or killing them.

But it's just too damn coincidental. I mean, these people work on damn near everything that we're talking about. If you reverse engineer craft, these are the people that work on it. And they work on various systems in different places. And many of them actually are connected. They've worked together before.

Right. Like McCaslin and the, the woman that was like one of his assistant that also disappeared. And their bodies have never been found. And that's what's crazy to me. How do you just lose a body and never find them? I guess that happens all over the world all the time. But people of this status is just kind of insane to me.

Well, here's the thing. And I'm going to say this before we even get into the Dave Grush interview because I want you guys to think about this. And Dave Grush is going to expand on this a little bit. These people may not be dead at all. McCaslin, the girl, all these people may not be dead. and they actually may not even be with the United States government right now. Listen, if these people, these scientists do work very closely with the UFOs, the actual alien spacecraft or the non-human intelligence craft, and let's just say these people also work closely with the actual beings that were on these craft because Dave Grush does go in to say that not only do we have alive beings, but we have had beings that we have had to kill and so on.

I'll let him explain that. But what if they are with the beings? right now because maybe they developed a relationship with these things and they knew these beings knew that shit was getting hot or whatever the case is and they came and just took them under the ocean. To save them because if you think about David Grush, he's never actually seen these beings. He just has information and seen videos and seen videos. But he's never interacted with these beings. So that's why his life was threatened and he's stuck on earth.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like that's just one actual possible. is that these scientists and these engineers might have actually been abducted and or maybe willingly abducted. Maybe they just were like, hey, meet us here and we're going to just take you. Because the interesting thing about the McCaslin thing, and we did a full episode on that. I think we've done a couple episodes on William McCaslin, which was one of the most high-ranking generals that there was that was connected to the potential programs of reverse engineering.

But out of all of the houses, you know, McCaslin left the house. He also keep in mind was feeling very weird for like a month or two prior to him disappearing. May just kind of think of Havana syndrome or something similar. But then he just walks out of his house one day without a trace. And they can't see anybody on any of the ring cameras. They don't have any evidence of anything. He didn't take his car. There's no body anywhere.

They've done infrared scans. They've done everything possible to find this guy. And he literally vanished. He disappeared. And it just kind of makes me, it reminds me of missing 411. And David Paulides talks about it, about all of the missing people, especially in the Southwest. The only thing odd to me in that situation is that they did have some workers at their house that week. And from previous cases like Nancy Guthrie, she had workers.

And I almost feel like that could be related somehow. These workers might have been undercover CIA or FBI agents or some kind of agents. Yeah, I mean, maybe they weren't agents at all. maybe there were the groups of people that actually are reverse engineering the craft and so on and so forth. You know, so and that's what you have to remember. Like, I believe a lot of who is actually reverse engineering these craft have nothing to do with government in some ways, which is what, in my opinion, makes it so dangerous. I think that a lot of these, I guess you can say contracted companies, and there's probably even companies that have possession of these crafts now that may not even be contracted at all with the government, that may fully hold the, the true power of the world.

Like we're talking about if you're getting crafts that have zero gravity type propulsion and potentially even weapons that we can't even imagine and we have private entities, whether they're contractor or not, that actually hold this power. They're really probably maybe the ones that are in control. Like whoever has this technology

and whoever can utilize this technology are genuinely to people that have full control over the world. And that's been always one of my things. about Ashton Forbes claims with MH370 is simply that if the United States government did have orbs that could abduct an airplane like what Ashton Forbes claims and like what the videos allegedly show or if China had it or whoever else, I just think whatever country had that would 100% rule the world. There would be no stopping them unless there was another nation that potentially had similar type of technology. And that is possible.

Because Dave Grush somewhat gets into that in this interview as well. Yeah, it's kind of like the nuclear weapon game. If I have a nuke and you have a nuke, we're not going to use it against each other. But if you don't have a nuke, you're in big trouble. Yeah. And you are the low man on the totem pole. Yep. Yeah.

And so the reason why we wanted to kind of break down some of this episode, and I think the most important parts of this episode, is simply the fact that we have been covering UFOs, alien life, interdimensional beings, you name it, researching it, reading books. you, I mean, everything you can imagine, especially I have been doing for, you know, years. And Sherry's learned a lot as well just over the course of years and how many episodes we've done on this. But when you really read, and especially biblically, and then you compare it to historical books, and then you read things about past encounters throughout history, whether biblical or historical. And then even like when you get into like Greek mythology and all of this stuff, which by the way, I've always said, the Greek mythology thing really connects with biblical text. And that's something that's always been interesting to me because obviously when you're

growing up and you're in school, you hear or study and to some degree Greek mythology. But those two have never been combined. Those two have never even, no one's ever said, well, Greek mythology is so closely related to the Bible. Well, and it's also related to astrology. Yeah. And when you think about UFOs and aliens, you think about space. you think about out of world experiences.

Yeah. Well, it's just like the watchers, the 200 watchers that came down. And I'm going to get into this once he starts talking about a particular segment later on. But, you know, it's just like the watchers. You had 200 watchers that came down and set foot on Mount Herman. They all agreed, made a pack that this is what they were going to do. And then out of those watchers, you had a certain set of them that were gods, what they considered the gods.

They were the most powerful. And each of these gods instructed mankind various things, whether it was building weapons or whether it was teaching them about astrology and the constellations, the moon phases, the sun. I mean, they were literally teaching them pretty much everything as far as how physical our system or planet or universes to a degree. And but there's a lot of that that obviously connects to Greek mythology that then goes biblical. And there's a question that I, you know, it's a question I've been asking myself for a while,

which I'll get into that question in just a little bit. But after this interview especially, there probably will be some questions in your mind. And you'll, you'll probably think similar to the way I have, you know, about certain things, whether it's things I thought I knew, things I thought I believed 100% on certain aspects. And the reality is I still believe a lot of what I believe. I'm just, I'm looking at things differently, I guess you can say. Well, and also you got to think about people that think you're wearing a tinfoil hat. And if you believe in reptilians, then you are a cray cray.

Yeah. And to this point in this day and age, I don't think you're necessarily cray cray if you think there might be reptilians. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. So this is what we're going to do. So we're going to listen to the Dave Grush interview. We're going to break in a win. It's the very important parts.

And it's not going to be the whole interview. So don't worry. If you've already listened to the interview, you can still listen now because we want to hammer on some of these points. and we want to talk about our viewpoints and our thoughts on these points that Dave Grush is making. And we'll start right here where Joe Rogan says, I want you to explain what you know. Let's start breaking this down. And then we'll also help you guys to, I don't know, to figure out how to think about this. I'll put it that way.

Here you go. Let's break down what you know and what you can say. Yeah. What are these things? And what are they capable of? So there's like physical and non-physical, I'll call it UAP and intelligence we're likely dealing with. So, for example, the orbs could that be sentient plasmoid? Possibly.

Sentium plasmoid. So plasma that has consciousness. Yeah. In some way, and that could be like you're seeing the other side of some sort of wormhole and it's some other intelligence shooting this. Like, I'll call it, like, plasmoidic probe into, you know, our existence. I mean, this is, of course, a theoretical framework. And once again, I don't have a PhD in asher physics.

But it's theoretical that there is a life form that is a plasma-based life form. And there's already papers on the open Internet about this. A couple years ago, what's the title of the paper? They wrote about this possibility. So this is a academic assessment of a possibility of the orbs. Now, could the orbs actually be physical craft, but they have a sheath of plasma around it? Interestingly enough, and ASAP did a defense intelligence reference document on magneto-hydrodynamic propulsion, which if you remember the movie The Hunt for Red October, that's the Caterpillar Drive on the Russian submarine, you know, back in the day. And of course, with MHD, you can also do it.

You have to use a conductive fluid, either sea water that has salt in it or you can do it in the air, but you have to create a plasma. And you steer the plasma. It's called the Lorenz force. It's basically of a perpendicular magnetic field, a large amount of electricity, and you can basically through the Lorenz force, which is like ionic propulsion sort of control it in the atmosphere as well. And you can— I want to pause just for a second. I'm not going to break in as often, I promise. But what he's talking about here is essentially what Ashton Forbes has been showing on this MH370 video.

So if you're wondering what these plasmoid type things he's referring to, we're talking about the MH370 type looking plasmoids that are encircling the airplane and then the airplane disappears. If that video is real and I just find it interesting that he's saying this about the plasmoids and even kind of if you if you understand how they work based on kind of what he's explaining here, we're talking about kind of what we saw around the MH3. That's what I was going to say. All those people out there that thought I was crazy and making crap up, we saw them and I was able to bring them because they do have some kind of intelligence. And I didn't, I didn't like hear them talking to me in my head, but I could call them from my head, like in my head space. I could talk to them and bring them to us. Yeah. And by the way, she's referring to our experiences we've had down by the river.

We do have episodes on that. And so if you go back and search that episode in particular, our experience or whatever we call it, you'll find it. But yeah, I mean, so the fact that that video came out in 2012, the MH370 orb video, and now you have Dave Grush talking about something very similar to that. And obviously, Ashton Forbes believes that those orbs are U.S. government technology that we have reverse engineered. And we are the ones that took the airplane. I've never thought that. I don't know. I've always argued that it wasn't us, I don't believe.

because if we did have the capability of that technology, like I said, we would probably be in control of a lot more than we are right now. I do think, however, if that video was real, something took the airplane, which is probably why we will never find it. They use those orbs to teleport. And even Dave Grush is saying here, he's mentioned in teleportation in and around the same topic that he's talking about these plasmoid orbs. And he's talking about scintyate plasmoids, meaning this is an energy that has intelligence. So it's not necessarily a physical body. It's not a craft. It is literally an energy of plasma.

That's how it represents itself. That's how it physically, I guess, presents itself in our world, wherever it comes from. Well, he said that it has intelligence. Yeah. Well, he said the plasma could be wrapped around some type of craft. But did you notice when he said the saltwater portion of this? Yeah. And, you know, when we really first started diving into UIPs and we're talking about how can they transfer from air to water,

Well, that saltwater thing has something to do with it too. Yeah, for sure. Let's listen to some more. Read papers on that and ICCLE and other stuff like that. And so one of the byproducts of an air breathing MHD system is plasma around it. So depending on the size of the orb, it is conceivable that there's a physical craft behind it as well, just as an artifact of the propulsion system. Once again, that's a theory. I'm sure the program knows, and that will be communicated at a later date.

But, like, you know, that's, yeah. So this theory about sentient plasma. Yeah. Is it the idea that we have a very narrow-minded view of what life can be? And that life, as it evolved in other places, in other parts of the universe. Went non-corporeal at some point. Like, the meat suit sucks. We're going to be an energetic.

This is an ultimate expression of both technology and at least enhanced evolution that eventually consciousness is isolated or consciousness may be ubiquitous and exists in everything anyway. Yeah, certainly. And I'm not the expert in. I would say the consciousness theory, I like the Penrose-Hamerov orc-O-R theory, which is the microtubials, the room temperature. Some microtubrials are in neurons of the brain. You have this room temperature quantum system that can collapse the wave function without an observer. And that's what Roger Penrose and Stuart Hammerov, and I've talked to Hamerov, crazy smart guy. He's an anesthesiologist by training.

And Penrose obviously is a very famous mathematician and physics legend. And that's how they view consciousness. I'm not saying that's the exact model. I happen to prefer it because it's very trippy and very interesting and does explain spooky action and, like, telepathy because oh well if it's just a quantum system then I'm like quantumly entangled oh that makes sense now like why remote viewing and other stuff works right yeah okay so you have some sort of plasma based intelligence yeah and then what else so obviously there has been the physical craft of all different flavors like I've talked about it you know the tic Tacs are real there's eggs there's

different types of discs there's boot heel sunfish looking things boomerangs, Crescent Moon-looking craft as well. And obviously, all those have different origins in terms of pilots and whatnot. There's a little bit of overlap. It's almost like certain people like the Portia 9-11 or a Ford Mustang. They kind of build the same shape. And that's probably indicative of the technology or the propulsion system. I'm not an expert in exactly why that is.

and, yeah, we've recovered, you know, several different types. And it's once again, it's a taxonomy where it's almost like, like, not all white people look the same, right? Same idea where you might have like a species per se, but then there's sort of like subsets. Right. Now, is there a theory or is there information based on where these things are from? And they're different ones or from different places? There is, but I never got access to that. And even if the information was, once again, how would you like confirm that as a skeptical former human intelligence officer?

You have some sort of NHA communicating to you. Oh, I'm from star system X, Y, and Z. Right. Cool. Is that denial deception, you know, activities? Are you misdirecting? You're from somewhere else. So even if they said, they told us, how would you verify?

that. I mean, there's certainly obviously ways. And, but some of it seems, once again, extraterrestrial is part of the pie here, right? There's a, you know, there's ultra-terrestrial and other things. And I, it does seem like a lot of it's been here for a while and also seems so similar to us that I have questions. And once again, this isn't rhetorical. I don't know the answer. It's like, well, is this bioengineered? Is this a break from our tree, is this some sort of other technology, like chameleon-type technology, if you will? I don't know the answer to that.

So I think that's... What are the prevailing theories amongst the people that are working on this? Yeah. Do they have answers or do they just have theories? I am not certain of that because I do not have that level of knowledge. And as the government rolls that out, I'm happy to parse that with the American people. people in public and kind of explain my opinion on things as gaps and information for myself is filled in because I'm not on I want to pause just for a second he's talking about the possibility

of extraterrestrials ultra terrestrials I'm going to assume ultra terrestrial is probably he's meaning interdimensional slash energy type of beings extraterrestrial just being somewhere outside of earth so they could be physical beings aliens the grays the stuff you kind of think about in movies and I guess pop culture. And then you think about bioengineered. So I think what he's specifically talking about here is at some point in time, in our human lineage, our history, there was something that came along and bioengineered something. They kind of grafted us together. Now, keep in mind, Dave Grush is also the same guy that has commented before about alien breeding programs.

Now, he was not necessarily the one that says that he was there or exactly knew the people. There were actually high-ranking military officials that told Matt Gates this in his office and others that they knew there was an alien hybrid breeding program where they were essentially breeding aliens and humans together. So if you're talking about bioengineered, that is possibly what it could mean. But then you could even go back to the book of Enoch, the watchers, when they came down and made it with women, with human. women that then turned into the Nephilim. And then that takes you all the way to the story of Noah that the Bible talks about that Noah was put into place to build a boat because God was going to flood the earth because of what happened between the watchers and humans. But the question then comes that did this flood actually wipe out all of the bloodline from the watchers and humans?

Because then obviously they're going to be half supernatural and they're going to be half human, which is what the tainted blood is. It talks about it. in the Bible. But then there's also a lot of, there's also a lot of contextual reading that you can read in the Bible that kind of says that not all the bloodline was actually wiped out after the flood. And so even just that section of it, that segment of a bloodline could have survived from the days of the watchers to today. And did they stay like, you know, did they stay, I guess you can say above water like the rest of humans? Or did they, they build an entire base like the hollow earth theory that so many people have talked about.

And Dave Grush is going to talk about the possibility of an underwater basin just a bit. And I think there is a possibility of two different things going on here. It could be that they have a whole race that are half human and half alien. But then also there could be a bloodline on earth where through time or through generations, it became less and less alien and more human. Yeah. And maybe those people that have that particular bloodline or are the elites, the people the alumni,

the ones that are in control of us the most, right? The ones that are in control of us today. Yeah. Well, and there is a huge theory with that. And a lot of people do believe. And it's kind of interesting if you ever go down the rabbit hole of how many of the world leaders are actually somehow connected through blood, especially U.S. leaders, U.S. presidents throughout history.

Then you got to think about just even overseas in various places. A lot of people are very connected bloodline-wise. And, you know, the conspiracy theory that like a lot of the royals and elites actually would be incest because of the fact they wanted to maintain their bloodline, I don't think necessarily is a conspiracy theory. And there's been a lot of whistleblowers from inside of a lot of these powerful families that have come forward and said, yes, I am actually a product of incest. And because of that is because of our bloodline. and we wanted to maintain that strong, rich bloodline. They always give a different reason for it. But the reason really could be because of where their bloodline actually traces back to.

And so, yeah, there's a lot to unpack here. But I just wanted to give you our thoughts on extraterrestrial, ultra-terrestrial bioengineered. I didn't have full access. And I only know what I know. And that's why I've treated this with such reverence because even me going public, I'm like, fuck, I don't know what this is going to trigger. Besides my own personal safety, which clearly I was under duress and I had to even resign my Air Force Commission, didn't even fully retire. And I'm trying to get that fixed.

I filed something with the Air Force Board a year ago so I can actually retire and have my benefits because I miss my promotional lieutenant colonel and other stuff. But I digress. But certainly there is such similarity that there was concern from a genomic perspective. And there was work on that to compare genomes. Unfortunately, I don't know the answer to that and what they found out. Work to compare genomes from biological samples? Yeah, dead cadavers. Yeah.

So that's real. Oh, 100%. So there are dead. Oh, yeah. I know that for sure. How do you know that for sure? I got to see the audiovisual on that stuff. to see what?

Yeah. So I got to be a little vague only because I want to protect the sources because it may indicate a specific activity or operation. And these people were very patriotic and they were just dead cadavers in, you know, on the ground because it was a retrieval activity. You saw them physically or you saw video of them? Video. Video. Yeah. So you saw dead cadaver that was at a crash?

Yes. So they've filmed the crash and they've filmed these cadavers. How old is this footage? I don't want to say. It's contemporary. It's contemporary. Yeah, but I don't want to reveal a particular operation because it narrows it down. Right.

But it's clear. It's not like you look in 1950s, black and white. It's clear. And do know, when I get that kind of information, I'm like, tell me what it is, what happened, and I put it out for a collection, so to speak, and then I confirm it. independently because I was very allergic to any kind of deception, right? Like in the advent of AI, SORA AI, you can create a very realistic. And so I was very anal retentive when I was given documents, audio visual, etc.

And I sat on that stuff for like years until I felt comfortable with that not being some sort of limited hangout or deception activity. So, yeah. What did it look like? Human looking. How human? Barry. Like, looked like a human or looks similar to a human? Very, very beautiful.

Beautiful. And I said this. What color was the skin? Blueish white. And it wasn't super close. No, no, no, no, no. Like someone who drown? Like a pale sort of al-Bino.

And it's interesting. And I said this in another interview that's not out yet. But, and God of willingness is my last interview for a while, hopefully in pre-disnesty. disclosure environment, you know. And General McCaslin, when he was talking to DeLong, and this is public record. Tom's talked about it on, I think, your show and other interviews, where he always told Tom, think of the Greek gods. And, and, oh, true, you look it up. And now I kind of understand what he meant about General McCaslin, who disappeared within a week of Trump giving the declassification order on UAP in February 2026. There's a lot of reasons why McCasland's disappearance

was very concerned. He walked out of his... Yeah, I want to... I got to stop here. I mean, he's literally talking about General McCaslin. It told Tom DeLong, which was Blink 182. And they're the ones that created to the Stars Academy. It's basically a public-facing organization to get to the bottom of disclosure and truth on UFOs.

But they were extremely connected to the government. And, you know, Podesta was involved. Clinton. a lot of them. And I think that he goes on to say here just a moment why that kind of is because they, you know, they wanted to connect some rock star to get the youth to kind of start slow rolling the release of information about UFOs.

But he's talking about beautiful beings, you know, and Greek gods. And guess who said that? McCaslin said this. So McCaslin obviously knew these beings, probably worked around them or with them. and then he freaking disappears. I mean, come on, guys. There's no way that's not connected some way. President in Albuquerque and vanished.

Oh, that's right. That guy. Yeah. And nobody knows. And I, you know, I have a relationship, obviously, with justice. And nobody knows what fucking happened to the guy. And he, like, he left shit home so he couldn't be tracked. I think his phone was left.

But, you know, one of his firearms was missing. It's, like, very weird. Right, he left without his phone. Yeah. That was one of the weird parts about it. Yeah, and once again, he was going on a trip with like 18 of his friends. He went to REI the day before to get like a medical kit and other supplies. And I mean, obviously his wife's discussion about him, the body cam footage is public.

And, you know, he had some mental health issues, nothing major and some aging type issues. but she didn't think he was going to kill himself or whatever. So, I mean, you never know. And I've had friends on. Well, if he went to REI the day before, he probably spent $10,000 on camp and shit, she probably killed him because R.E.I. is expensive. Passed away through suicide in the military. But it's very bizarre.

And it's within a week of Trump coming out. And just say I know a lot about General McCaskillans. Well, there's quite a few scientists that were connected to U.A.B. disclosure or UAP potential back engineering projects or mysterious projects. Possibly, I think... Do you think there was more like... To be fair was a little overblown, and I don't think there was a ton of correlation. Like, one was like a female that worked at Air Force Research Lab when McCasden was a commander.

I think that was one of them. Well, I mean, there's a lot of people that work at Air Force Research Lab. That doesn't mean it's necessarily related to the topic. The only one... Didn't she have to... Didn't that one particular lady, if it's the same person? Didn't she have some sort of research that was on material science? That sounds correct.

I'm not totally conversant on all the people that disappeared. The only one besides McCaslin that was very concerning to me was my Air Force friend that died mysteriously about two years ago. And it's an open investigation, so I won't get into all the gory detail in my assessments. I mean, it's binary. It's either a very tragic thing, either self-harm or otherwise, or it was something else. And my friend, his name's Matthew Sullivan, call sign Quake in the Air Force, him and I were on active duty together. He was on the program. And he was one of my sources.

And once again, I don't name people, but, like, unfortunately has passed, so I want to make that clear. This video, do you think this would be a part of disclosure that we'll get to see this video? of these dead bodies? Probably. Probably. So there's a lot of audiovisual stuff. The problem with the current climate, like you're going to have to wheel out the physical evidence too

because people are, the trust in government is so low right now. Like you could show a video, but people are going to be like, oh, well, that's just the U.S. government fucking with us. And you're going to have to curate a wheel out literally, like, you know, put in the Uvar Hasey Center, the Masonian, and then give the biological samples.

to Eric Weinstein, who I know who he wants it. Why would you give it to him? Well, he says he has people to test it. I have people to test it, too. Give it to me. I'm just saying that. It's all ridiculous. Give it to me fun of it.

There should be a way that human beings other than the government can look at this stuff. Well, there needs to be an independent verification process. Right. Now, is this stuff, so this is contemporary, this dead body thing. And so this is a fairly recent crash. And did these things have all the characteristics of a human being? Did they have ears and a note? Yeah, as far as I could recall.

And it wasn't like ultra- Did they have hair? Did they have hair? Yeah. Did they have? What color was the hair? It was like grayish and all that. The problem is, I don't want to give the nature of the video, it wasn't super close up.

It was like during the operation. So it's not like... They're in the operation of retrieval. Yeah. Okay. And then they had these things. So what is your understanding of what happens to these bodies? Oh, they're kept for analysis.

And how do they keep them? They freeze them? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know the exact process. I'm not a biologist, but they do put it in some sort of preservation status. Huh. Yeah.

So was that the most compelling thing you saw? Yes. because, you know, it couples with, you know, both the craft and the alleged, you know, occupants. And there was some other stuff in that, in that area that I got to be careful talking about because it's so specific that it'll easily ID the, you know, the Patriot that helped me on that. And once again, I want the public to see all this stuff. Right. You don't take my word for it. Plead with the president to make sure this comes out.

He's really courageous to do so, and I just, and I hope this all comes out. When you say contemporary, you mean last 20 years, more recent? I don't even want to characterize it, but it's contemporary. And then when you say Greek gods, like, did these creatures actually look like something special? Like, not just like a regular person. You said beautiful? Yeah, just very oddly. And it's been a while, but I'm just trying to visualize in my mind.

It was just very, very beautiful. It was just, was it wearing an outfit? It looked like it, like some kind of form-fitting thing. but I didn't get a good look at it. Like spandex? I don't know. I didn't get a good look at it, honestly. You didn't?

No. I mean, it was like a pan. Okay, so they didn't even focus on the bodies? They just like, oh, there's a body on it. No, because people had a job to do. Right. Did you worry that that's a sciop that you're being shown something that's horseshit? Well, like I said, I was very careful with that and confirmed it through other sources

and methods to make sure it wasn't some sort of hang out from some government element trying to sway me one way or the other. And I want to pause here because I already know the source he's referring to. I'm pretty positive, which I cannot remember. Is it Jason Brown maybe is the guy's name? He was a helicopter pilot that was instructed that there was a downcraft. It was an egg shape craft or something or something like that. And I remember because this guy had a bald head and it reminded me of egg, his head,

and then he's talking about the craft. but and I think his, I think his last name was Brown, but he's out there on interviews and he's talked about it. He's a whistleblower as well, but he said that, and this may not be the guy,

but I'm just saying this particular. Yeah, well, you're calling him out. Well, I'm just saying this guy, though, has been a whistleblower saying that he has worked on recovery, downed UAP, UFO. Wasn't he on Sean Ryan show?

I think he was on Sean Ryan, and then he was also on Jesse Michaels. And he's just one of, one of, I think a few pilots that have come forward as whistleblowers that said they have worked on crash retrieval programs or, I guess, expeditions where they have both seen the craft and the beings. So it's not just Dave Grush's just, you know, getting siop. If they were going to sciop, they would have to sigh up these helicopter pilots to the point

where they're going to pick up shit. Right. Seeing bodies, seeing the craft. It's just. And that too, during this mission, he felt this intense feeling inside from these beings. Yeah, you're talking about. So I'm not sure if some of them were still alive at the time. I can't remember or in they were injured because if they were dead, how would he feel this intense feeling inside?

Yeah, he said that, yeah, as he was flying, you know, this just overwhelming feeling. I think he said of happiness or just calm and love, I think is one of the big things that he felt. And, you know, keeping in mind for at least based on what a lot of whistleblowers have said is that these things do communicate. A lot of them have the ability anyway to communicate. telepathically. And so not saying that like these Greek God type people or beings that Dave Grush is talking about, we're not saying they can't talk. But we're saying that other whistleblowers have also said and referred to beings that look like humans that are Greek goddess and gods, both women and men, that not only can talk and speak English, but also can communicate telepathically,

give you these overwhelming feelings all of a sudden out of nowhere of like gratitude and love, and all of this weird stuff. And so obviously they got some type of supernatural whatever to them to where they can literally put their energy or a certain filling or things in your head. And we got to go back to the people that have been abducted to where they said these beings didn't speak at all. But they were communicating with them through telepathy.

So it's so crazy. Obviously these beings have energy completely figured out. And it's just like they've, Grush said, this is one of the reasons why we're able to do things such as remote viewing. This is probably also the reason why some people are more psychic than others or can communicate with the other side, whatever that side may be. And, you know, that's the one thing I've really been thinking a lot about lately is, especially from the Christianity perspective where they say, you know, if you're a Christian,

you should definitely not communicate with anything on that side. But I just still don't understand that because people in the Bible, they were prophets and they were communicating with something. Exactly. And actually, I genuinely think that a lot of encounters or at least some encounters that we know about or have read about in the Bible were actually encounters with beings like this. Because I'm just telling you with my personal experiences, that has happened to me my whole life.

And it's not that I chose that. It came to me. Yeah. It's like, it's like me and Nathan were talking the other day. And he's like, yeah, all of a sudden, like God didn't talk to people anymore. like even just from the God perspective and given people visions and images or messages, right? Same way with like how people in the Bible encountered angels or the burning bush or,

you know, all these things, Ezekiel's will. And it's just like since I guess modern day Christianity, they want you to not or to believe that you don't have that power. You don't have that ability to communicate with the other side. You don't have that ability to tap into that. And I personally think that's wrong, and I think that's absolutely the wrong way to look at it. Dependently verified that there was an event. Yeah, I did.

Okay. And then there's footage of this event, and in this footage of this event, how many bodies were there? I think three or four is what I saw. I don't know what the total was. Did they have gender? Looked amorphous to me, but once again, it was a pan. Really? Yeah.

Okay. Yeah. Long hair, short hair? Long. All of them? Yeah. That I can recall. The Greek gods thing is very weird.

It's a weird comparison. Like you stop and think about that. Yeah, well, why were the Greek gods so beautiful? It's funny you say that because I think about like breakaway human. I mean, once again, I'm just. Or maybe even an original civilization that existed before. There's more people are leaning in that direction when they start looking at some of the stuff that's underneath the pyramids and some of the weird structures that they're finding all over the earth. Like, how are these things?

We had a whole podcast yesterday about it. It's like, how are these things made? Who made these things? Yeah. Yeah, I mean, obviously I followed Graham Hancock and Randall Carlson just, you know, casually. And I do have, not fears, but, you know, I have questions about some sort of breakaway human civilization. And that explains some of this. Or it's bioengineer because, like, for them to develop naturally, say, off planet, say it was extraterrestrial,

that it looks almost dead ringer like us. That doesn't make any sense to me. Well, does it make sense if we're engineered, then it makes sense? That is certainly a possibility. I have questions about that, too. This is what Bob Lazar believes. I had a long conversation with him about that. He thinks that human beings are a product of genetic,

some sort of manipulation. And I think, hypothetically, if that ended up being verified in some way, perform, you know, how does that change humanity? What does it mean to be human? And I think there's a lot of deep human sovereignty and other questions on that if that ends up being the case. Well, it gets weird because we're willing to believe that an omnipotent God created us out of nothing.

That's cool. But the idea that we were visited by what's essentially almost Godlike in their powers and abilities, some creature from somewhere else or some being, some super hyper-intelligent being from somewhere else. And they manipulated us. That bothers us. I know. I want to pause here because, you know, he's like a lot of us are willing to believe in

a God, but we're not willing to believe that we could have been created by these beings. But something still had to have created the beings, right? There still has to be a creation point. And actually, to be honest with you, if you're telling me that there are beings that are this smart, this advanced, this technologically savvy or whatever it is, it has all these powers, it's even more of the case for a guy. God that created something.

I mean, you know, in a lot of ways, you can look at humans and be like, okay, if God was so powerful and so smart, like, what was he doing when it created us? Why are we only using 8% of our brain? Exactly. Like, did you forget about the rest of our brain? We're just going to give him this huge brain, but we're only going to let him use 8% of it. Like, does that make any sense? And, you know, they're going to be dumb.

They're going to kill each other. You know, this is just going to be a repetitive cycle to where we blow each other up. endless suffering of human beings in large part because of our own doing. And they're not going to be mortal or immortal. Yeah. I mean, that's just, that doesn't make sense. But keep in mind, and we still have a lot to talk about in this episode, I believe that these things that he's talking about are connected.

And I think it's connected biblically. I think it's connected in so many different religions, not just Christian and Christianity. And so we'll get into that in just a bit. Weird. My biggest regret was not getting access to like the biological assessment reports and stuff like that. I was getting enough spears thrown my way and I was, you know, in literal danger. So I unfortunately wasn't able to kind of, you know, get access to that stuff. Have you talked to anybody who did get access to it?

Not on that side of the program in terms of like the scientists analyzing the bodies. No. I just, I know people that are good friends of mine that were on retrievals. and saw them as well in person. And once again, I'm comparing like, did you look like this? Did this happen? Was it this type of craft?

Do they vary in terms of what they saw? Yes. And some of my colleagues saw them alive as well. Yeah. What did they see alive? Like the Greek God-looking ones? No. It's the pop culture.

I can't wait. I want to talk about this. Like gray's? Reptillion-looking. Reptillion. The gray's. Yes, as well. Those are real. Once again, the aerial school phenomenon in 1994, very well documented mass sighting.

Is that Zimbabwe? Yeah, near a uranium mine. Ooh. And they saw small gray beings coming out of a lenticular discraft. Once again, this is why it's almost like not that shocking. It's like, yeah, they look like that, no shit. Well, that story has been going on for a long time and that iconic. The problem with iconic imagery is that.

that now you have it in your head what to expect. And, like, that was, like, from the movie Contact. Remember the movie Contact? Like, it showed itself. Great movie. Great movie. I know my boy, Amar, I got him hooked on that movie. He watches it, like, every quarter.

He's a phenomenal movie. But there's a scene in the movie where the alien shows itself as Jody Foster's dad. I know. Because that's something that she can handle. And that's what, it's funny you say that. That's what, if they're bioengineered, then that makes sense because of that. ease of contact, ease of communication, also less ontologically shocking. It's familiar.

Right. And I think as this rolls out, I think the American people need to think about like, okay, well, if, you know, I'm presented with this reality, how would I react? You know, I just think of them personally as like it's like my West Virginia cousins. You know, it's like a different part of the family, you know, but I'm cool with them. That's a fucking crazy. I'll chill with them, you know, whatever. And, hey, I'm a nerd.

Do you know how bad I want to just like hang out with them? Oh, yeah. Me too. Like, of course. Not that I have like personal bias for President Trump to do this, but like just like any American I like, I want to know more. Of course. I want to meet them.

I want to communicate. I want to, you know, all that. It's wrong for some people to have access to this information because I think this is different than any other kind of secret information. I know. I think it's weight and it's significance and impact on the human race in general. I mean, I demand. We should know.

You shouldn't, there shouldn't be. And keep in mind what he's talking about here with Jody Foster. If you've never seen the movie Contact, you should definitely watch it as the aliens present themselves as her father because, like I said, it's less shocking. But keeping in mind, there are whistleblowers and people that are very well connected to this subject, very similarly to David Grush, that has said on record that if you passed an alien in the street, you may not know it because of how advanced that either the bioengineering has become or the similar I mean and that's what I'm saying I do think that there are potentially aliens I think freaking Elon Musk is still one of them potentially I don't know for sure or he's got a narrow link something in his brain yeah but he's definitely something not all human no and we used

to kind of talk about like you know the West Virginia cousin thing we didn't talk about it that way Right. Right. I mean, we were drunk back on those episodes. And we were with Matt, actually. And we were just talking about like, what if various spaceships are like various races, right? Yeah, what if it's a Mexican race and we got margaritas on the space. And so and chips and bean dev.

I mean, it sounds racist. Hey, we were on the right target, though. Yeah. That there's different species of these things from different places. Yeah. Yeah. And that's what I'm saying. It's like I think the biblical view or at least, I guess,

sentiment on aliens and communicating with these things or whatever i think is is flawed i think it is not correct i do think that these things are living beings i think obviously they are potentially much smarter than us much more advanced than we are they figured out probably a lot that we have not and i want to say something else you know even though this is chris bledso and i don't necessarily know whether or not i trust everything he said or or or not what i can say is like Chris Bloodso said once these orbs started to show up and he would almost like pray to these things or just talk to them kind of similar to what Sherry has done and he was going through so much medical issues with Crohn's actually it was debilitating is which is I guess what he says

part of why he lost a lot of his business and his remodeling company and all this stuff and once he started communicating with these things he was cured he believes by these orbs and we also have heard various reports through around the world that people that have communicated with beings or these craft or whatever that have begged them to cure whatever illness or element they had, these things did so in various circumstances in different places around the world. So we've heard about this stuff like miracle type things have potentially happened from these beings.

But we've also heard about bad things that have happened to people by these beings. as well. So I think that there is two types of these beings. I think there's a good and there's an evil. But real quick, I just wanted to go back to the appearance of those people. You know, when you said that you could be walking on the street and not even notice that they look so human and it's not a human. There's so many people that have gone through those rabbit holes and really went through like particular pictures, especially presidents, Hollywood movie stars, people that there's a certain picture and they're pointing out things like, look at this. They're really a reptilian.

Look at their eyes. And they'll zoom in and they do. They don't look human in some of these pictures. If you've ever went down those rabbit holes, it's crazy. And this was before AI. And there was actually videos where it's almost like some celebrities, their film would go over their eyes and they blink or some weird shit. And they look like reptilian type features, right?

And keep in mind, like the Titans and the Watchers in Greek mythology, the Titans are an older generation of divine beings who became involved in conflict over heavenly rule in enochers are heavenly beings who descended to earth and violate divine boundaries very similar to the titans and the watchers sounds very similar the way they were described same thing with like prometheus permeathus and azazil now this is pretty interesting prometheus gives humanity fire and is punished by zeus and then in one enoch eight azazel teaches humanity metalwork and weapon making and other knowledge both stories kind of basically feature a supernatural figure, transferring transformative knowledge to humanity, and then subsequently face in

punishment for it. There's a lot of scholars, including George Nicholsberg, have examined possible literary connections between the Prometheus tradition and one Enoch. Then you think about the Nephlem and Greek giants. In Enoch, the watchers produce giant offspring through relationships with humans. Greek mythology also contains the gigantes, the gigantes, extraordinary beings who challenge the gods. Their origin stories differ, though.

The Greek gigantes are generally discharging. described as the offspring of Gaia rather than children of heavenly beings and mortal women. Nevertheless, though, the traditions share imagery of giant supernatural ancestry, violence, and divine punishment. So Grush described allegedly seeing footage, right? That's what he was just talking about, about these beings appearing extraordinary human-like pale, beautiful, and potentially tall. And he also talked about Neil McCaslin telling Tom DeLong to think about Greek gods.

So that's the interesting part. I think there is a connection with all of this. And I'm just wondering these offspring, if it really is offspring that look like human, do they know that they're the offspring? Or do they think they're just one of us? I don't know. I think they probably know. Right. And I believe that Dave is about to get deeper into what you were just referring to potentially.

Well, Dave Grush says there is many types of these things. Not necessarily just one group or the other. there are many groups of maybe one side and maybe potentially many groups on the other side, but there are two, I guess, what you can say, intentions, two different intentions. Good intentions and bad intentions. That's what I was trying to think of. A group of unelected bureaucrats and defense contractors that have access to this stuff and the general public doesn't.

So they have a completely different map of the world than we do. I know, and I just think about the unfortunate lies and how society has progressed over the last several decades and where we could have been if this was handled back in the 50, 60s and 70s. Right. And once again, it shouldn't even be me doing this. Like, I saw a little bit of crazy shit. I learned some stuff. I met with some of the most senior people in government to confirm all this, you know, at the highest, highest, highest level. And it's me.

Like, I'm just a dude. Like, I was a, you know, major in the Air Force. and, you know, mid-level senior civilian in the IC. But unfortunately, I got stuck with this, and it wouldn't have happened unless the small crew, you know, honestly pushed me over the edge. And, you know, I was an unbelievable duress, and I ended up having to go public. So tell me more about these reptilians that your friend encountered. They were alive. Yeah.

So they were alive post-crash? Yes. Why these things keep fucking crashing? So some of it is NHI versus NHI. What? Yeah. They war in the sky.

Isn't that in the... You think it's like, would they get along? They're so advanced. Yeah. The, we have records of them fucking around with each other. Is that in the Mahabharata or the Bhagavagita? I don't know. Talk about sky wars in ancient Hindu texts.

Oh yeah, in the Vedic text, the blue people. And I know what's why you asked blue. I don't recall them being that blue, but, you know, I got a short little look. When they're alive, they're darker. Well, that is true. There's like a post-mortem change in their affect. Sure, like people. That's what happens with people.

That is true because, you know, as they were struggling and then died, obviously, their affect changed. No. This friend that encountered, first of all, we'll go to the Greek God people first. What did their craft look like? Um, boomerang, Crescent Moon, usually. Not all the time. It's kind of like once I go back, some people like to drive the portion 9-11. That tends to be not all the time, but that's what they like to roll up in.

They talk about them as the tall whites. Yeah. Were they tall? Were they large? Look tall to me. I didn't have like... But hard to tell because you don't... I didn't have a ground reference, really.

I would say at least human size. They could be like... Just like very similar to humans to you. Yeah, that could be my big ass of 6-6. But like the... They looked big. Similar to humans. I think so.

And there might be taller. Once again, I'm sure there's other stuff I don't know about. I'm sure there's other variants of them too that look more towards like the classic, what is it in euphology like Nordic or, you know, tall whites. Uh-huh. And that are probably even taller. If some of those experiences stories are true, which, once again, as long as that source is credible, that might be a thing.

So I think we need to be prepared to kind of that being a thing. Yeah, that makes sense. Now, the reptilian craft, what did that thing look like? That one is Tick-Tac looking. Uh-oh. Yeah. I was hoping they were the cool ones. The reptilian ones are the ones that everyone's terrified.

Yeah, and once again, like, we're doing like – and of course, it's not always a Tick-Tac once again, kind of like what I said. but that tends to be them. From what I understand, obviously, hopefully I'm not wrong, but I'm pretty good sourcing on that. When you see like malevolent behavior, right, it's like, well, that's a humanistic lens. You're seeing like an animal lash out and captivity kind of thing or they're in duress. They're having an emotional experience, et cetera.

And it's like, you know, are they actually scary or is it just because of the situations we've been in with them? And so what kind of bias and all that? Of course. Yeah. So what he's saying, by the way, is it sounds like from his information is that these things, the reptilians have not been the nice ones. Okay. And even though he's not going to go on record necessarily right now and say that, but he was like, you know, maybe because when we were interacting with these things, they were lashing out like you put a, you know, a bear in a cage or corner a bear or whatever. What's it going to do?

Same thing with a snake. But I do find it interesting. him. If the reptilians are the ones that are not so nice type of beings, it kind of goes biblically historically. When you think about what the Bible talks about, scaly beings, we often refer to the devil or the serpent. You know, the serpent has always been, and it's not, by the way, just in Christianity that the serpent has been used as kind of the evil signal or sign in various times throughout history. There are many religions that use the serpent. in their religious text.

And not only just the serpent, they refer to things similar to reptilians or scaly-like skin. And they could speak. Yeah. And also very similar in the Watchers account that there are talks of scales and just various things that could also shift in their, what they, in what their appearance was. Enoch talks about that. You know, they could have fiery eyes and scaly skin and then they could switch to look more human. to be less, I guess, off-putting, right? And that even goes to what Dave Grush was talking about earlier.

So, you know, if the reptilians are the bad ones, it kind of goes along with all of the historical text we've always heard about the reptilians or the serpent as kind of the evil side. And then you have, think about this, thinking about like Gabriel and Michael and all of the archangels, right? These were like very powerful supernatural angels that we. We call from the Bible angels. But like what if these angels, which still may actually be angels, maybe some of what we're seeing are actually angels.

But like this is the other side of what we're talking about. Or maybe the Bible just called them angels because they didn't know what else to call them. But they're really aliens. Yeah. I mean, that's very possible. So it's interesting. It's just interesting to take all of this information and then start thinking about what you know or what you've always thought you know. Well, to me, what I've added.

up is the tall whites and the Nordics seem like the upper class aliens because they drive the boomerings in the Crescent moons. They're like the Porsche, you know, Ferrari kind of guys. And then the reptilians are in the Tic Tacs. The Tic Tacs, which are like the Pintoes or the Kiyas or whatever. No wonder they're pissed. Yeah. But in our lifetime, I think we're most familiar with the Tic Tacs.

Yeah, a lot. I mean, that's what we see the most of. And that's what seems to be the one. that are constantly harassing pilots and so on and so forth, or at least, you know, objects like that. And then obviously we've also seen the typical UFO sphere, you know, even Bob Lazar and the way he described certain craft. And even when he said he was an area S4. And all of this is also connecting and kind of validating what Bob Lazar said he witnessed an area S4 when he worked there. because he said there were various bays.

The one that he worked on looked like a typical space, you know, like a UFO that you can imagine. Like a disc. Yeah, like a flying saucer. And then you could go down the bays and there were other shapes of craft. And this is what Dave Grush is saying. There are various shapes of craft depending on the being or the race of these beings. But I wonder if like the race of the tall whites or the Nordics could maneuver a Tic Tac. I don't know.

Or a different type of craft. Yeah. Or do they have specifics? You know, you think about like our jets, for example, our military jets. You know, a lot of our jets are similar to other people in different countries because they borrow the blueprints. Yeah. Or, yeah, I mean, but there's also spies that we always have to watch out for. Yeah, they borrow the blueprints.

Yeah, especially since like our stealth technology or any new advancement, they're always trying to steal it. And for obvious reason, like if you're another country, you don't want another. country to get so far ahead of you technologically. So that's why you invest so much time and effort and into spies and honeypots and all this shit to be able to go into other countries and try to steal secrets. And it's not just, you know, we always try to make it out like China is the only ones doing it to us and Russia or whatever. But we've been doing this shit for years too.

And we were doing it during like Oppenheimer days. And even before that with all of our technology, it's always been a thing. It's always been a race to see who's going to destroy who first and who's going to take over and fully win the war. But I think if you start thinking about if these beings are everywhere and a lot more than we can even imagine, I think none of us on this planet are really in control. I think a lot, whoever is some of these beings. Whoever has their bloodline or the more powerful being bloodline would be in control.

Yeah. And I also think it's interesting that we typically see these craft or these sightings around nuclear facilities. Uranium. Yeah, uranium. But I also think that they don't maybe want us to destroy ourselves because part of them also lives here. And if you destroy the earth through a massive nuclear war, then it's also going to potentially destroy their habitat, wherever that may be, likely under the ocean, which we'll get into it. Well, do you not think, though, too, that maybe they have use for the uranium or the nuclear power.

Yeah, that might be how they're actually making power. Right. It could be nuclear power. Yeah. Like maybe their base underwater is nuclear-generated power. And maybe they're using that uranium or whatever. And I'm sure they can get that probably from under the ocean somewhere as well. But, yeah, very interesting.

So these reptilians, what did they look like? Now, I've never seen that personally. Your friend described us. But it's like very almost like seven-foot-tall-plus sort of gorilla-looking, scaly-skin, though. Reptile gorillas? But there's multiple types. There's ones that are more humanoid-looking. There's multiple types of reptilians.

Yeah, and I'm not an expert on that one. That's, once again, I never saw it in person. They get the exact, you know, see if there's an artist rendition. Of course you are. Yeah, and once again, it sounds so schizo. It sounds like, as a guerrilla with scales. Ex-deep state intel officer, I'm like, I cannot fucking believe.

I'm talking about this shit on Joe Rogan. Scaly gorilla. I know. I mean, it sounds schizo, and it's like coming from somebody like me, you know, who, you know, is a credible person and has been in government, it's like, I'm going to be that guy. I'm going to be that guy. And then, like, down the road, people will review Joe Rogan. And he's like, that motherfucker, we thought he was crazy. But what do you know?

You know, it's true. Well, of course, if there are things from somewhere else, you're going to sound crazy describing any of them. Because it's so outside my experience. Because I never had some kind of woo thing growing up. or some sort of interaction with the phenomenon. So it feels so outside my personal comfort level and experience because I'm relying on the personal experience of others, you know, audio visual stuff.

And it still feels like I'm watching a movie. Like, it's like, is that, is it real? I mean, I know it is, but like I have a cognitive dissidence a little bit, you know? And how are you able to watch this video? Do they have to put you into a secret room? Yeah. I won't get into the exact way it went down, but we'll just say it was kind of sketchy, but to keep everybody safe.

And so there apparently is NHI versus NHI warfare. We've documented that. Documented it. In collection, what we perceive as warfare, so unless it's conflict. Yeah, it looks like conflict. It smells like conflict. Is this some other kind of weird shit? I don't know.

And there's maybe an assessment on that. And when this. reptilian craft crashed, the assumption was that it was some sort of conflict? Because I would imagine that they're the ones you'd have to worry about. Correct. Because there was dead gray's there too. Oh. So the grays and the rutilians were duking it out? Yeah. I guess. I guess. You know, I know the people who were there. This sounds fucking insane, David.

It sounds fucking crazy. And once again, I don't want to get in too many specifics because this is a very unique. I mean, this is crazy, though. I mean, the grays are fighting the freaking reptilians. Where are the Nordics and the Greek gods? Where are they at? Or are they like... Well, they're the higher class. They're going out to lunch.

Yeah. But I mean, look, I know a lot of you are probably, if you haven't heard this episode, you're probably like, what in the hell? Like, who is this dude? I know, but he's very credible. Extremely credible. Even though he said, I'm very credible. I worked for the government for many years.

And I was like, I wouldn't say that. Yeah. Yeah. Because, like, no one trusts the government anymore. could this all be a sci op i don't think so like i genuinely believe that we are about to finally witness disclosure i'm listen for anybody this listened to our podcast for any amount of time you know that there's a lot of shit out there i don't believe and especially what the government tells us and like to this point i don't i don't believe in what republicans or democrats

say i am literally non-political anymore i don't give a damn i don't care who's running for president i don't care because either way it's going to be screwed it doesn't doesn't really matter who is in office until they fixed the damn government and the way that our politicians get elected, which is like based on money from everywhere and their own and their interests, not ours, we're never going to have a president or a government that actually gives a damn about its people until we somehow fix that. So, you know, the reality of this, though, is that this could be extremely life changing, world changing if the government would actually be transparent about it. And one of the big.

ways, I think, is medicine and medical technology. There's no way you're telling me that these advanced beings that are able to fly around at breakneck speeds and go under oceans and do all this crazy shit. There's no way you're telling me that they do not have probably the most advanced

medical system in the entirety of obviously the world, but potentially even large swaths of the universe. I mean, they could literally, they might have machines that you could get in and you have cancer and you're cured in two seconds. Well, I think some of our medical technology has come from these biologics or what we have found and we re-rendered them to use in modern science and the medical field.

And it's the same with our weaponry. Yeah. You know, you think about the weapons we're using and how advanced they are. Lasers especially and various things. The discombobulator probably. I mean, there's all these things and potentials that if the government would just be transparent. But let me tell you what I think. I genuinely, and we got more to listen from Dave, but I'm going to tell you what I think.

I think that if the aliens came down and they made their self very well known, I do think potentially there is some type of agreement between the government and or governments and these beings. And but what I really genuinely think, though, is that the government and the powers that be and the elites and the people that are over big pharma and over big health care and and over all of these various systems that are, you know, quadrillion dollars a year companies or, you know, fields, if we were able to interact and, and, you know, have some type of life to where normalizing either relationships with these beings or, or just a clear pathway on sharing of technology

or whatever, if we were able to do that, it might make the pharmaceutical industry go out of business. It may make the oil and gas industry go out of business. It likely would, obviously, because they have very advanced technology as far as their propulsion systems and you name it. What about all the military complexes? Exactly. I mean, it would make a lot of things go out of business. And but the reality is, like, why have they not tried to be more prevalent? And, you know, that's what I don't quite understand. I mean, I think they're, I think we're seeing more signs of these things than we ever have probably. And I know that throughout history, there have been signs I think there have been encounters.

I think there was biblically. I think there was even before that. But I just think that if the government truly unveiled all of their capabilities and who these beings are and what they were capable of, then people would ask the very obvious question of, well, why the hell are you not letting, like, why are we not using their technology to, like, save lives on a regular basis, whether it's cancer or or whatever other disease that people come up with today? We got people like Bill Gates that think we're overpopulated. Exactly. I mean, and that's just, I think the government is trying to hide this information from you because it potentially makes you more powerful. Potentially. I mean, that's just my thoughts.

A couple unique retrievals out there that to protect the innocence and people that have risked their fucking lives. Because a lot of the people that came to you with that kind of information, I mean, they were physically threatened like me and all that. And so, like, me going public was taking it for the team because I was able to create this umbrella of tacit, you know, protection in case somebody got fucked with. Now, unfortunately, you know, my friend Matt, who knows what happened to him, but, you know, tragically, he died, you know, mysteriously. So now these reptilians, what was their craft like? Oh, like I said, the TikTok stuff. And was their craft crashed into the ground, like broken up? Yeah.

Okay. It was, like, wedged into a hill. Like, had it been hit with something? I don't remember exactly what happened in that regard, but it did crash. So, I don't want to misspeak on what exactly happened. And how many times has this happened if you had a guess? I don't know the total number of, like, adversarial conflict crashes, but, I mean, it seems to be at least a dozen or two. I don't know.

So at least a dozen or two adversarial crashes. and then there's the high altitude nuclear tests, right? You're aware of those, right? Mm-hmm. Okay. So there's been a lot of speculation that during those high-altitude nuclear tests, that crafts that did know it was coming got rocked. Do you know anything about that?

That's an area that I'll let the government handle. That's because it gets into vulnerabilities and what the U.S. has figured out. So that just gets a sensitive area. But that's something I'm sure that'll come out in this process. So you can't talk about that? Is that what you're saying? Because it gets into U.S. capabilities and what we figured out in terms of. Well, this is all like from the 50s, right?

Yeah, but we still got nukes. Yeah. And is what he's saying here is that maybe obviously nuclear is a big time weakness to these craft? Because if you think about it, like think about a EMP, nuke. You can have a nuke in an EMP, electromagnetic pulse. And let's just say that these crafts are weak to the nuclear power that our weapons have. And what Joe's talking about here is our high altitude nuclear test that we've conducted multiple times. And there are stories from other whistleblowers that said that when we had tested those nukes,

that quite a few craft actually came down. And then we had to go retrieve them. So then it also makes you wonder if like, is that the entire. reason that we developed nuclear bombs to begin with is because we figured out that this was a weakness of theirs, that we were maybe developing this for these things rather than other countries? I mean, could that be possible? And also then, too, why are they so fascinated with our nukes and uranium and all that

shit? Yeah. But they do at times, or we have been told at times when they're close to these military bases, they have actually shut down the nuclear capability. And they've activated them before. Yeah. So, you know, there's something that fascinates them with nukes. And maybe it's the fact that they're trying to figure out reverse engineer the nukes to come up with a plan.

Maybe we know something more than they do. Possibly. That category. I mean, it's very possible. Or they're just trying to figure out a defense mechanism against nuclear power, right? Or whatever the case may be. I don't know. But still interesting to think about.

We still got those kind of weapons, you know. Right. You're aware of those. It was, what was it, Jamie? Was it a telescope that they were taking photographs of the stars and they were doing it with, do you know what I'm talking about? All the dots popped up thing. Yes.

It was like two or three weeks ago. Right. We talked about that a couple of weeks ago. It was an observatory. And the observatory has these old plates of images that they took of the sky. Oh, is this? Beatrice's work, the Vasco. Yes.

Yeah, I read it very interesting. Yes. It's hard to make an exact conclusion if it's UAP, but it's really great original scholarship, and I applaud her for doing that. But there appeared to be moving reflective things that were outside of our atmosphere that they were taking images of. They were not static. They were not stars. Pre-Sputnik, too. That was the important thing.

Yes, pre-Sputtnik, very important, because there was no satellite. at the time. This was images that they took of the sky that showed things that were reflective that seemed to be metallic, allegedly. And if I remember her paper correctly with her co-authors, it also, there were cluster concentrations over sensitive nuclear facilities and nuclear testing. Chronological temporal correlation as well. So data shows unidentified lights and archival astronomy images were 68 percent more likely to be imaged 24 hours after a nuclear weapons test. Like I was saying.

Yeah. Right. So this is chronologically, like we have these nuclear weapons tests, including these high altitude detonations like Operation Starfish Prime. Yeah. We detonate these things. And then all of a sudden, these crafts start showing up like, hey, what are these fucking crazy monkeys up to?

It does seem like there was a heightened amount of activity once we started testing nuclear weapons. Oh, yeah. Obviously, this phenomenon's old. It's interacted with man in antiquity. you know, Jacques Valet's scholarship on that, passport to Mangonia. Yes. But, yeah.

That's why the names of our rooms at the comedy club are Fat Man and Little Boy. Oh, nice. Yeah, yeah. Because that's what ushered, because it's the comedy mothership. It's a UFO's based thing. Yeah, if you go to the Air Force Museum, they have the Anola Gay there, I think. Is that right? It's one of the planes.

Oh, wow. My alma mater is going to crucify me for getting that Air Force history wrong at the Air Force Museum in Dayton, Ohio. Wow. It's pretty cool. They have a mock-up of the little boy. and fat man bombs. So you can see how big they were. You're like, holy shit, that was big.

One of the things that Lazar said is that one of the objects they were working with was very old. And he said that it was told to him that it was retrieved from an archaeological dig. I don't know about his specific story and his exposure, but the archaeological thing, that is the thing. Are you aware of the labyrinth at Hawara in Egypt? No, what is that? Okay. Is that the one where there's a metallic object?

Yes. But What's His Face won't let people go in it from the objection? Well, it's complicated. It's a little more complicated than won't let them, but there's definitely resistance to it. So these labyrinths, this incredible compound that's underground, was documented by Herodotus, and he said it was greater than Giza. He said it was much more spectacular construction.

Wow. So now they know from ground penetrating. radar, that these cavities in the ground, these symmetrical rooms exist. They know where they are, and they know why they're flooded. So they're flooded because during the 1960s, they built a dam to divert water for agriculture. And when they did, they changed the water table, and it flooded this labyrinth area. And when they used this ground penetrating radar, and I think it's radiotomography and a bunch of the different ways of...

One of the things they found was a 40 meter long metallic object that's in some sort of, is it in an atrium? Like, it's in some sort of a large room? I've seen a video about this. You're recalling some stuff I've seen just casually online. Like, just imagine if that's what that is. It's like the movie Stargate with Kurt Russell. If these people had been worshipping this craft. And so much so that they built this incredible temple and put it in the center of their temple.

It's a 40 meter long metallic object. And the metal, apparently, is of unknown origin. Like, they don't know what the metal is. It's not registering as copper. It's not registering as steel or iron, rather. They don't know what it is. Interesting. Interesting.

It's fucking weird. Yeah, I mean, I won't be surprised as some ancient civilizations were essentially cargo cults, you know, for these visitors. I mean, that is most likely true in many cases, not all. And, of course, that gets into theological areas that are touchy, but I do think that that's probably the case. The central object is hard to classify. It appears metallic, not stone or wood.

I named a Dippy after the giant diplodica skeleton in the Hintzee Hall of London's Natural History Museum. It could be anything. Its shape resembles those Tic-Tac hard men. It might also be an upright disc or even a colossal shen ring, the ancient Egyptian symbol representing the eternal cycle of creation. The big object alone, big object alone, rather, raises profound questions. How did it get there? Why is it there?

So show him some of the artistic recreations of what it looked like underneath the ground. So this is all, you know, like I said, Herodotus wrote about this, thousands of things. of years ago, but now it's documented that these chambers and these pathways actually exist. And there had been people that had studied at least the upper surface levels of it as recently as like the 1800s. Interesting. Yeah. But that, you know, through all, like a lot of Egypt, there's water under Giza.

There's water under the pyramids. There's water under, you know, a lot of that stuff is flooded. And so this is what it looked like. This is all underground. It's fucking crazy because if this, along with Felipe Beyondy's work, where it shows using that same satellite radio tomography that there's some sort of structure underneath the pyramids that goes over a kilometer into the ground. Is there easy access or is it just like a government denial, the Antiquities Bureau, whatever they call it? Well, I think there's been some progress in terms of allowing. exploration, and I don't know the extent of it, but I know that a lot of people are very hopeful

that that progress is going to be achieved. They're opening up this research. And look, this would be a giant boom to the tourism industry. Oh, yeah. I mean, that's what they want. I mean, Egypt probably survives. I don't know what percentage of their economy in Giza is tourism, but it has to be massive. Yeah, and you always hear interesting stories.

I have an eclectic group of colleagues, and you hear interesting. interesting stories is the queen's chamber the granite pillbox and people have had interesting experiences in there too and and uh well the king's chamber that's sarcophagus yeah it's that like yeah the big perfectly cut granite box that also i think it mirrors the exact dimensions of the arc of the covenant interesting that's that's crazy but i know people who've laid in it because they have to kind of pay the guard and it's like off-hours. And they just have like a weird, transcendental experience. I mean, it's kind of woo. Once again, I've never experienced something like that.

Let me lie down there, bro. That's a thing. That's a thing. I'll let you know who to talk to offline. How much do you think it costs to lay in the box? Maybe a couple hundred bucks. Gee, jip, 20 grand maybe. 20 grand, maybe.

20 grand. Whoa. Yeah, 20 grand. You can like sleep there. Yeah. Yeah, it's very strange because the structures themselves are incredibly strange. You know, the structures themselves are so immense. and so complex, and the methods of construction are completely unknown, and just the symmetry

and the precision of the engineering is beyond comprehension for people that lived at the very most recent it could be is 4,500 years ago. And a lot of these people think it's far older than that. And we're finding that. I've been watching some of Graham Hancock stuff. You just look at these, like, megalithic architecture that's older than you think, the stuff in Turkey. in the United States as well in Ohio and Mississippi.

And it's like, and they're finding all these pyramid structures using synthetic aperture radar. So I am casually following it. And it does seem like we don't really even know our own history. And I think with all this coming out, there's going to be a huge rewriting of a lot of our ancient and modern history. Well, that's where it gets really weird. You know, Rep Paulina Luna was on the podcast. Oh, yeah. She was talking to me about the book of Enoch.

Yeah. I hadn't read it. She's like, you have to read it. And I've read it twice now. And I'm like, what in the fuck are they talking about? Like the book of Enoch, which was also found with the Dead Sea Scrolls and Coomron. And it refers to the watchers who came down and made it with daughters and created this race of giants. And it's like, what?

Yeah. And you think is like now when all this comes out, was that actually literal? And, of course, the Bible counsel. Nicaa. It was more of a political document before secular government. And, you know, they got together like, what are all the different books that we can agree upon that are good? Yeah, what gets into the canon. And that's the thing about the book of Enoch is that it was not put in there because

it didn't jive with the Torah. Correct. Yeah, that's right. Which is like, okay, you fuckers. Imagine if that was in the Bible. Like, if you go to church and you read about the watchers. Well, there's actually a lot of interesting stuff in the Bible. Like, obviously, that's another thing, like, of course, with, you know,

I'm Catholic by growing up, CCD confirmation did the whole thing as a kid. And you see a lot of outspoken exorcists and other people right now saying, well, all this alien stuff is just diabolic deception and demons and, you know, all that kind of stuff. And I respect that opinion. And I do think, like, what you perceive as a demon is a certain class of nonhuman or anomalous intelligence. And that is certainly a thing, but the whole ecosystem is not demonic. And but the Bible is interesting because once again, it doesn't discuss about other life elsewhere. Like it doesn't talk about bacteria and viruses. Those were unseen.

We cohabitated with bacteria and viruses until the invention of the microscope, whatever that was, 1800s or whatnot. But if you go into Leviticus and Deuteronomy, you will notice these like cleansing, ritualistic stuff. Also like, hey, you can't have your toilet and your living area and all that. And if you look in those books of the Bible, wait, that's like modern sanitization guidance. So it's funny that like the Bible has encoded within its kind of like best practices before man would even understand what a, you know, viruses and bacteria are. And I just find that that's very interesting based on when it was written. And it does show that there was some sort of higher intelligence kind of influencing the authorship. Either that or the civilization that was writing the Bible was a request.

creation of civilization that had been destroyed in a cataclysm. Yeah, I mean, I think that, especially when you look at the pyramids and you look at some of these other ancient structures like Lebanon, Balback, they don't make sense. And it seems to me that there was probably something super sophisticated a long time ago and it got wiped out. And I want to pause just for a second because, you know, he had mentioned Representative Luna. And, you know, when the UFO disclosure stuff first started happening, I felt like I, you know,

I was like, well, you know, Luna's pretty good and with Tim Burchett and the others that have been on this committee that have been pushing for disclosure. And then you see Representative Luna comment or talk about other things that we talk about on the podcast, whether it's Epstein, whether it's Israel, whether it's Trump, whether it's just the way that the Trump, sorry, the way that the Trump administration has handled things. And it's like you know that a lot of the things that she says seems like she is just lying to your face. And so Luna's been one that has been consistently basically trying to connect UFOs and non-human intelligence to the book of Enoch or the Bible, but more specifically also trying to paint the narrative that more than likely everything we see is demonic is kind of the way it sounds to me from her perspective. And so that's just maybe one of those things that I don't believe about what she's saying is what I'm saying. And I think that what we're talking about today is, yes, there has been people that throughout history taken certain encounters or things they don't necessarily understand and put it in through a biblical lens.

And that's just an opinion of some people. It is something I have thought about. I'm not saying that's necessarily true. I'm just saying that there are a lot of encounters that maybe people back in biblical days would have explained certain things like what we see today. or even experiences with these beings as angelic or divine. And by the way, that could be true. They could be angelic or divine and evil all at the same time.

Maybe they just didn't fully understand maybe what we hopefully are about to understand further. Right. And it's just like David was saying, we didn't know what bacteria and viruses were back then. Now we know. So we have the knowledge. More knowledge comes out. The more things are going to have to change in the way that we think about things. And even when Joe was talking about the pyramids and what's under the pyramids, I think that Joe was kind of right and kind of wrong.

I think they used the water for power under the pyramids. I don't think that it was flooded because we used it for our plants and our food. We used it for power back then. And we had maybe hidden knowledge that we don't have today. You know, you think about the symmetry of all these things under the pyramid. And you think about how they're connected. Yeah, in crop circles and all the geometry and astrology and then the geometry and the Bible is all in our, yeah, and mathematics is all interconnected in a way. But I just don't think we had the full knowledge back then and we don't have the full knowledge now.

Yeah. You know, I have thought about this too, though. You know, the same way that like the consensus among Christians or even some other religions tell you that you should not communicate. communicate or try to communicate with these things. They are, they are Satan, they are demonic. They are just trying to present themselves as good,

although they're bad. But what I do think, though, is that likely throughout history or times or periods throughout history, there wasn't overbearing governments or religions necessarily at that time that told you that was a mass consensus,

don't communicate with these things, don't interact with these things. So if you look at like structures like the pyramids, which I do believe probably was being built or at least helped being built by some of these beings or even encounters with angels or things, these visions that are something supernatural. Yeah. Or I mean, just some of the geniuses of our time, Nicola Tesla, for example, and where he used to say,

I don't know where I'm getting this information. I'm just seeing it in my brain. I am figuring this out, which by the way was like free energy. He was about to provide free energy and electricity to everyone around the world. And he said himself, it's like I'm getting blueprints. in my brain and I don't even know where this shit's coming from, but as I am. He said he did know. He said it was an alien.

Oh, he did. That gave it to him. Yes. Oh, okay. Well, there you go. But do you not think that is a prophet? Well, it could be. That's a being, not a human being, giving you information, you know, through your brain.

Yeah. Well, and that's what I'm saying. It's like in biblical days, if you were presented with information or a vision from somebody, and it was good. And this is what Christian believed. If they come with a message, then maybe they're not. demonic if but if they don't necessarily come with a message and or whatever then then maybe they are but the reality is like I think biblical times um people got these messages these visions and

they said they were angelic or they were of God or whatever the case is but that's just what I'm saying it's not a black and white subject here and and I don't and I do believe like I said back in throughout history there probably were groups of people that found ways to better communicate with these things, build relationships with these beings or whatever they are, angels, whatever, that were as able to progress them technologically. And we've seen this literally since the Watchers, although it's not necessarily a good example. If you read the book of Enoch, obviously, that's not a good example. But either way, I think throughout history, I think there have been civilizations potentially before us that was advanced, maybe even more

advanced than we are. A hundred percent. Don't know for sure. I feel it. And I have that intuition than I think that we have lost technology in those lost civilizations. Yeah, it's crazy. They're about to talk about telepathy and non-human intelligence, and then there is definitely a lot more after that. But then I'm going to skip ahead because I do want to talk about the underwater bases, and then we'll wrap it up. But we got to talk about the telepathy.

Here you go. And what we get from these ancient texts is probably oral tradition passed on through hundreds, if not thousands of years, and then people writing things down and people remembering these stories. I think one of the weirdest books of the Bible is the book of Ezekiel. Yeah. Because the book of Ezekiel is one, all the UFO people turn to. Yeah, of course.

Because there's that, a great cloud with brightness around it and fire flashing forth continually and in the midst of the fire as it were gleaming metal. And from the midst of the craft came the likeness of four living creatures. Yeah. Like, what? Yeah, exactly. The creatures darted to and fro, like a flash of lightning. What?

Exactly. Isn't that the manna machine? The cloud that called Israel's. A wheel within a wheel. There's weird shit in the book of Ezekiel. Like, that is a very, very weird story. Like, what are they describing? It sounds like a spaceship.

It sounds like a ship comes down from the sky with immense power, frightens everyone, freaks everyone out, and these entities are inside the craft. Yeah. And I think a lot of it, once again, they're interpreting it based on their vernacular at the time, their understanding. And I remember I was it two years ago. I was like Capitol Reef National Park in Utah, and there's petroglyphs there. And some of them kind of look like aliens. 100%. And you're like, well, is that literally what they're seeing? Perhaps. And I don't know the answer to that. That's not my expertise. But I feel like a lot of the stuff in ancient tradition is literally what they saw. It's not necessarily allegory or fable. Some of it may be for teaching lessons, but I have a feeling a lot of it was actually literal. I have a feeling a lot of it was literal as well because most people, first of all, A, couldn't read and B couldn't write. Yeah, that's right. And so writing fiction seems like a fruitless pursuit.

It seems like writing history so that you can remember what happened, at least a version of it that's palatable. Like ancient Sumer, Nananaki and all that. And it's like, well, why did they make up just for fun? Right. They all had cookie stories about being visited. And, you know, when you're telling me about these things that look like Greek gods. That's how I described it. And that's how clearly what General McCaslin was hinting to Tom DeLong.

And once again, I got, you know. Well, doesn't it make sense that the Greek gods did exist? Like, I mean, not they did exist literally, but that like when they talked about the Greek gods, they talked about them in this manner, looking like that. And then you actually find a craft. with these things that look like us. Which is like the conquistadors were treated like that in the 1500s, right? Yeah, right.

Literally white, Caucasian. Bearded, yeah, with horses. They rode horses. They couldn't figure out what the fuck was going on with that. Yeah, and I'm glad we talked about it. I mean, I think that is probably the most uncomfortable stuff for me to talk about, but it's also something that the public needs to wrap their mind around and understand that this is a thing and kind of start processing that kind of reality.

As much this is coming from me, but I mean, the federal government, you know, if Trump really is serious and Stephen Miller, you know, does his thing with this. I think all this will come out in a hopefully responsible way. So they have a schedule that's based on the concept that people need to have this information trickle slowly so that they can adjust. There were suggestions in the past if the president did something. I am not aware at this point what the plan is in that regard right now, though. But there is some sort of an idea that this should be trickled out. This shouldn't be like, boom, here it is. Let's lay it out.

The president truly wants it out. And obviously, Bob Bigelow met with the president as well in February 26th before he made an announcement. He told the president, hey, you need to admit that there's NHI and we've recovered stuff. and we're looking at it in a semi-formal announcement to start anesthetizing the public. And you can find that interview online that Bob did. I think it was with George Knapp on a podcast. So it's not just myself advocating for this. There's other people.

I don't even know Bob Bigelow. And he did us a solid by pushing the president to help make that decision. I mean, there's a lot of things that went on behind the scenes. And, you know, I work in mysterious ways. And I won't divulge certain relationships in certain rooms I've been in. But it took a village, and I'm proud that, you know, the time I spent with Representative Burleson was very fruitful. We did a lot of stuff behind the scenes, and I think Burleson's going to go down as a very courageous man. And I say that not just because he was my boss.

I mean, he was probably the most forward-leaning member of Congress on this issue. I mean, Representative Luna did a great job, you know, Timbershettes and others. But, you know, he actively was sending letters out. We made some of them public. That's how we got that Lincoln Labs formally classified, 1952 filmouts in the last tranche that just came out. And also, we've sent interrogatories, which are legal questions and that require an affidavit format response to different organizations. And it's public that we sent one this summer to the MITR Corporation, which is a federally funded research and development center headquartered in North Virginia. So they clearly have a duty to respond.

Their corporate counsel is working on it. And obviously, I left, but hopefully Burleson's team is able to push for a response in conjunction with whatever Stephen Miller and the pursuit team is working on, too, because they're probably going to want to coordinate all that. So this guy that you communicated with that said he encountered living reptilians and dead grays, did they, did they? have communication with these reptilians? I don't recall that. No, I don't think so. So what? Now, some people do get that kind of like that feeling.

And I've talked about that. It was on Dr. Phil, actually. There is some sort of consciousness communication, call it telepathy. Hell if I know how it works. But it is a thing, and I know sober, high-ranking, people I've served a decade and a half within the government that were on these retrievals that on occasion that. on occasion that would happen or they would have like a feeling come over them. It's almost like I wonder, this is like my own hypothesis and I would laugh if this is true,

but sometimes it's like a positive feeling, like of comfort. I wonder if that's almost like a countermeasure on the craft to prevent certain aggression or whatever. It's almost like how Air Force jets have countermeasures on them, flare, chaff, you know, electronic countermeasures as well, like jammers. And I wonder if some of that is psychotronic technology. That's just my hypothesis. I don't have any secret knowledge. Why did you come to that conclusion?

Just because, like, it seems interesting. It's like an anesthetization technique to reduce, like, the occupants risk of danger maybe. And it's like a countermeasure. Oh, well, like, if you feel at peace, you're not going to, like, rule up and, you know, do something back to them. Yeah, exactly. Shoot aliens. Yeah. Right.

So if you found them and they were vulnerable, they could placate you and calm you down with telepathy. It's like a countermeasure system. I have a feeling. Why would you think it's that instead of just communication? Oh, it could be. I'm just saying my other hypothesis in absent, because sometimes they'll get that feeling absent some sort of occupants. Now, so that's why. Is there a particular type of non-human intelligence that has this telepathic capability?

Or is it amongst all of them? I do not know the holistic answer to that question. I do not know. The gray's do, for example. But I don't know. The gray's do? Has that been reported? But I know the tall whites have been reported that they can communicate telepathically.

Oh, certainly. Or these weird, the Nordics. Yeah. There's been accounts out there in the public vernacular on that, potentially. But unfortunately, that's at the limit of mind, personal knowledge that I feel confident, you know, saying something. All right. So there you hear Dave Grush talking about just what he feels about the telepathy or especially these feelings that these people get that come over them when they are on these crash retrieval expeditions. And I find it interesting though. He says sometimes that there are no beings present when they actually extract these craft when these people have this overwhelming feeling. And that's what is leading him to his hypothesis that maybe it is a countermeasure on this craft

that just automatically makes you feel at ease and comfort and all of that to where it puts you in this mood to where you're not as you're not on the defense and you don't feel like, hey, I need to kill this craft or these beings. And so that is actually a pretty good hypothesis, although, you know, and especially considering there are no actual bodies present when this is happening. It is interesting. And I also feel like, too, you know, with our experiences, that's what I had an overwhelming feeling of comfort and peace and beauty. Like I thought these lights were just beautiful.

And especially when they changed colors for us. Yeah. I was like amazed and almost like stunned and starstruck when I was looking at them. But I had a overwhelming feeling of comfort. I was not afraid. But to David's point, could it be? You know, a lot of people on Telegram were telling me when I was feeling these things. Well, the devil will, you know, they'll make you, he'll make you feel like he's nice and friendly.

And, you know, you're really experiencing that. But is that the truth? That could be the, you know, well, it's the same thing kind of grush is saying. You know, it's like a countermeasure to put you at ease, even though maybe it has nefarious intentions. Right. Right. And that's very possible. And especially considering the fact, like he said, this tended to happen also when there

weren't bodies present. But we also know that even when the people had been abducted and they have given their experiences to where they were laying on a table and these grays especially, and we're talking about Tim Walton's one of them, you know, where these things would communicate with them telepathically. But the interesting thing is a lot of these abduction stories don't necessarily tell the story, the feeling of calm and they actually are terrified. Right. In a lot of cases. And it seems like at least the grays, don't necessarily have the greatest ability to make you at ease. More so if these abduction stories are true,

and I think the more that we're starting to hear about the UFO evidence that may be getting ready to come out, I think these abduction stories are going to turn out to be true. It just seems like the gray's in this particular or in various, I guess, abduction stories, they were there for experimentation on us. And, you know, maybe they weren't, they didn't want to kill us, obviously, because a lot of people do return, but I'm sure there's been people that have disappeared that we've never found that never did return

and whatever happened to them. Well, and think about the cow mutilations that we have witnessed or seen. We haven't actually seen. Yeah, we haven't seen it actually happening. Happening, but we see the after effect and it's impossible for what happened to these cows to happen, you know, just the precise cutting, the no blood.

Like burning. Right. Yeah, it's like they're using some type of laser device to actually extract organs and even the blood out of the cows. So they're obviously experimenting as well. And by the way, who he was talking about Bigelow when he was referencing Bigelow and he met with President Trump. Bigelow is, he was with Bigelow Aerospace.

And Bigelow Aerospace was the original owners of Skinwalker Ranch before the new owners now that own it, which obviously if you guys have seen the show Skinwalker Ranch, they actually bought the property. Nathan's actually friends with a guy that owns it. I still want to go out there. Oh, I would love to. I want to get out there. Especially because it's not just the UAPs that they have experiences with. They actually have other phenomenon. Did I say good?

Yeah, close enough. Phenomenom. That is very interesting to me because I've experienced those kind of phenomenom's my whole life. All right. So I think what we're going to get to next is him talking about underwater bases. Now, there is a lot more content that you guys should listen to on this episode. and we're just giving you the best parts of it and breaking them down. The last thing I want him to break down briefly,

and we'll talk about it on the backside, is the underwater basis. Listen. Whatever reason. Is there a consensus as to their origin? Because I know that, or do they vary wildly? Like, Timbershett has talked about the ocean. There is, yes, we know a lot about that. What do we know about that?

Well, be careful because it gets into sensitive Navy underwater things. and there's clearly some sort of base of operations in certain locations. It's large. Don't know when it got there. It's large. Large. Like multiple city blocks type stuff. Yeah.

So there's multiple city blocks somewhere in the bottom of the ocean. Yeah. And it's like, yeah. Do you know about the Baltic Sea anomaly? Well, yeah. What's going on with that? There's some interesting stuff there. and once again, I will allow the federal government to deal with that one in our allies and adversaries.

Okay. But you did say that there's multiple city blocks under the ocean. Yeah, I will tell you underwater people I know that come from that community, they're always like, you know, the movie The Abyss, Dave, it's kind of a docu drama. And I'm like, holy fuck, you know, that movie, you know, with Ed Harris back in 89. And so that kind of gives you a sense in a pop-sci kind of way for people to visualize. There is large shit down there. And it's like the origin is indeterminate. I'm sure we know a little bit more.

I'm not privy to that. And the way we know things and track that gets into sensitive national security stuff. And, you know, the government may have to reveal some of that through some sort of acknowledgement strategy. The way it's been described to you are these large city blocks or whatever the it is under the ocean. Is this a waypoint? Is this a stop-off? It looks like a fort, a base. Stuff comes and goes. Okay. Yeah. So this is like where they observe and... Yeah, I'm sure we've done a behavioral analysis on it and we probably have figured out maybe the mission or whatever you want to call it. I don't know the answer to that. I'm as curious as anybody, honestly.

One thing I wanted to talk to you about because it just... There we go. And that's the underwater our portion of it. Now, you know, a few years ago, actually, we on our substack, we had, I just wrote it down. Yeah. Well, on our substack, I did a video over there and it was probably about an hour and 30 minutes long. And one of the things that in that video I did is we examined the anomaly that's off the coast of California. It's actually off the coast of Malibu, to be exact. It's in between Malibu and Catalina Island. And this structure, this underwater structure, literally looks like a massive rooftop. And if you kind of do the measurements on Google Earth, which you can't now, because

they have blocked out that on Google Earth now. I wonder why. Yeah. But when you do the actual measurements, if I remember correctly, as I did the ruler from the left side to the right side of the top of the structure, it was about two miles long. And we're talking about two miles. So this is huge. And then if you look at like the front part of the actual structure, it looks like it has columns that comes down on the left side, comes down on the right side.

And then there is a pretty big opening right in the middle. And it looks like it's been covered up by sand on the top and whatnot. But then when you actually do the measurement or the, I guess you are essentially trying to estimate what the depth of the water is at that particular point from the front or, sorry, from the top of the front of the structure to where the bottom of the actual structure would be, we're talking about thousands of feet down. Yeah, it was further than East. U.S. submarines can go. Yeah, most U.S. submarines cannot go to this depth.

Right. And that we know of, even the nuclear subs, anything that we know of can't get down this deep. So that kind of already takes out of the equation, I guess you can say, like an underwater submarine base. Right. Or man made. But the fact is that they covered this up. Also, someone just kind of discovered it not that long ago. I mean, I think it was like 2015, if I'm not mistaken, was the first time it was discovered.

And it wasn't until maybe 2020 or 21. I'm thinking is when Google blocked it out. Now, the Baltic Sea anomaly is another one where it looks very strange, like almost a base. And obviously, when Dave Grush here is asked about this place, he like kind of freaks out. He's like, nope, I'm not answering that one. And so obviously, that's also another one. But we were watching a documentary the other night that there's actually another type place off the coast of Japan. Yeah.

Like an island off of Japan. Yeah. That looks like some kind of alien base in just the symmetry of it. And you can see it on Google Maps. Yeah. Well, and two, like, you know, we got to remember Commander Fravor where they encountered a tick-tack UFO off the coast of California. And when they said that they were orbiting down to this actual craft, which was. you know, went down to the water surface and it looked like it was communicating with like a

mothership. Yeah. And so the mothership kind of came up. It was communicating it looked like. And all of a sudden the Tick-Tac looked up. I kind of, I guess you can say looked up, it turned around, realized that it was being watched and then literally vanished like into thin air. At first it was spiraling kind of around them or near them kind of trying to figure them out or

just look at them and then just completely disappeared. And he said with an eight. seconds later, they had a dot popping up on radar like 600 miles away. And they think it was that thing in like eight seconds. Well, I mean, we've seen things out in the sky. I don't know if it was outer space or in our atmosphere. I don't know. But we have seen.

Lights. I don't know if they're orbs or what they are, but they look like bright lights. And they weren't satellites, by the way. And they were. Yeah. And it was definitely not a satellite. Yeah. But they would be in threes, it seemed like,

in triangle forms and then they go into one and then they'd split up into like three more. Well, that particular night, and we've told that story, it looked like also behind these things way up was fighter jets and like following them. Yeah, because there was a red light you could see. It was way up. They weren't on flight radar. So it was obviously a military aircraft. And then you would see these white things kind of splitting off and doing all these things.

And when all this was going on, that was when our car alarm went off, our neighbor's car alarm went off and it was as soon as I think at this time it was one light kind of zigzagging through the sky and when it split into three lights is when our car alarm went off the neighbor's car alarm went off everything and we're like holy shit like what in the hell was going on up there and we've seen various things like this before not quite like that like you remember the time on the driving range yeah where it was glitchy yeah it was glitching it was like there was a light coming in like it was almost like a light was coming out of a portal and into another one and then it would keep doing that and it would just move in various directions.

Definitely wasn't satellites and it was evening. So the sky was bright. It wasn't dark, but you could literally see this crazy bright light that almost, it looked like it just kept teleporting. I don't know if it was the same light or if it was multiple orbs that were teleporting through this freaking, it looked like a tunnel,

like an invisible tunnel. We can be walking our dog and, you know, we're always looking up at the sky. We can see things when we're just walking the dog and look up. And it's not satellites. Yeah, and it's not,

you know, the Elon Musk satellites like in the string. Starlink, yeah, no. Because the first time I saw those, I was like, oh my God, Chad, we're being attacked by aliens. There's a string of aliens coming. And then I figured out it was Starlink. Yeah, we've seen a lot of stuff.

We definitely know the difference between satellites, you know. And by the way, there are a lot of satellites in our sky now. So when you're seeing that like bright light that's going over, it's not just international space station. Some of them could be Starlinks that are now in orbit. Right. And now they're just kind of going everywhere. the difference is is when you see things that are zigzagging literally disappearing doing all kinds

of crazy shit splitting in the three coming back into one setting off car alarms i mean you know that type of stuff right is the things i think that we don't know what it is or probably the government actually does know what it is either way but i think that's going to be it for this episode there is so much more that you guys should if you have not heard the dave grush episode it's like over two and a half hours long. There's a lot more information in it than we covered, but we've already been on here for about two hours ourselves. And there's going to be a lot more about this to come.

Hopefully, we will find out what these things really are from our government within the next two years. Hopefully soon. Hopefully, it's not slow road. Hopefully they actually do what they are supposedly supposed to do. What Trump said, declassify all the files. Well, we've got some videos. We've got some files, but nothing like what Dave Grush is talking about.

about we need the real stuff and we need to put pressure on Congress and your whoever is elected in your state or your district, you should write them letters. You should send them messages to push for this because I think this would be literally the most mind-blowing thing that any civilization has ever seen. I mean, and we're living during this time that maybe a government is finally going to disclose the truth about aliens. And I think that's a, pretty insane. But that's going to do it for us. We're going to close that with the same song that we started it with. Guys, until next time, we love you. Peace out. Peace out.