Investigate Earth Conspiracy Podcast - Mysterious National Park Disappearances | Scary Unexplained Circumstances

Episode Date: July 28, 2022

There have been thousands of people disappear from National Parks across the country. Some of these cases can be explained, while others sound like they come out of a horror movie. All of that and more on this conspiracy podcasts

Hello to things I notice How she practices piano on her thigh Imagining the keys inside her mind Does she notice things I know As wander the room when it gets quiet Searching for solutions in the silence But I'm here Hello hello and welcome to

another episode of Investigator podcast here 10.23 p.m. We're doing a late episode tonight, but we figured, especially considering what we're going to be talking about, is best to do it at night. Yeah. Make it kind of...

Late at night. Spooky. Well, you know, I'll be honest with you. Sorry, I'm just moving this screen here because it's literally in the way I couldn't bring my mic down. This episode is going to be a little creepy because, you know,

I've been in the woods a lot. I used to spend a lot of time in the woods. And so when I kind of started researching all this, it just hit home to me a little bit because I have been in weird and creepy situations before that was kind of unexplained. I've also been in situations where it was explained and was scary as hell.

So the woods is a very mysterious place. But I think what we're going to talk about tonight, unfortunately, you know, it may make you never want to go into woods again. Yeah, that's why we're going to take that tent back that we used a couple days ago. Yeah, anyways. So, yeah, guys, this is going to be a good one.

We're going to talk about these very mysterious and strange occurrences of disappearances in National Forest. And we're specifically going to talk about National Forest. We'll touch on some other things along the way, but we're really going to focus on a national park. And especially, there's actually one national park in particular that has more disappearances than any other, which is the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. And the Great Smoky Mountains National Park is about an hour and a half from here. And so where my mom lives, that national park is not very far at all. So we're going to talk about, you know, we're going to talk about some of the cases, seven, eight, nine of them. And keep in mind, there are thousands and thousands of.

of people per year that disappear in national parks. It's not just, and I'm not talking about people that disappear just anywhere. I'm talking about there are thousands of people that either get lost or disappear in national parks on a yearly basis. Or camping or whatever, yeah. Now, some of these things can be explained, and some of these occurrences do get solved. Many of their occurrences get solved, but there are a large portion of these cases that never get solved and actually have zero.

I mean, more unexplained than can be explained in a lot of these cases. And so there's been numerous books published on this. There's been actually documentaries that have talked about these strange occurrences. And there's actually been documentary

series that have talked about not necessarily the National Park scenario, but there have been areas out in the southwest. For example, I think you and I watch this. Do you remember what I'm talking about? Like the feral people? No, no, no.

It wasn't feral people. These were just extremely strange distant. No. In the southwest, these people would go hiking on these like either Bureau of Land Management areas, which is publicly on land, whatever. But a lot of these people that would hike would be within certain mile radius of each other. And there has been hundreds of people that disappeared in these areas. and the weird thing about those areas over there,

well, number one, they're not national parks, but it's just really hard to get lost because especially in these particular areas in the southwest, like, it's pretty open, you know, I mean, and... And I'm sure they have trails and trailheads. Yeah, they do, absolutely, yeah, it's all trail. And, you know, everything is kind of... You can see the trail.

When you're camping, you can see a trail in front of you. You're not just walking and brush, like, aimlessly going nowhere. Like, there's usually a trail that will take you to point A to, point B and then you'll have a fork or whatever and you follow whatever trails you want to follow. Yeah. Yeah, like and I guess the reason I bring up to Southwest is because I'm going to set the stage at least for the Great Smoky Mountains. And some of these things we're going to talk about do occur in the Great Smoky Mountains National Park. And then some of them occur in Yosemite

and some of these other ones. Now, there's probably a reason why the most disappearances happen in the Great Smoky Mountains. Now the Great Smoky Mountains, especially for the, those of you that do not live in the United States or, you know, know about the Great Smoky Mountains. The Great Smoky Mountains is made up of this mountain, very extreme mountainous, very heavily wooded area. And it stretches from most of the Great Smoky Mountains is in North Carolina, Tennessee border. And it is part of the Appalachian Mountains. and if any of you have ever heard of the Appalachian Trail, which is definitely the longest through trail in the United States.

It goes from Georgia to Maine. This is a trail that thousands and thousands of people put on their bucket list to do before they die. I mean, and I'm talking about especially people that like hiking, like outdoors. This is something that is like the ultimate challenge to people. And it's a challenge. It doesn't just take a couple days. It takes months and months. Yeah, it takes some.

I mean, like a fast hike. There is a record, I believe, and I think it, I can't remember the record, maybe four months or three and a half, four months. But most people do it in six months. So, you know, it's a long, drawn-out hike. Like I said, it goes from Georgia to Maine. It's this computer that's going crazy. Okay, got you. I've got a computer tonight for notes.

And so if you hear something in the background, that's what it is. But anyway, so. Well, it gives you a little mysterious. Yeah, mysterious hard drive sound. So the Great Smoky Mountains, I believe the reason why most of the disappearances happen in the Great Smoky Mountains over many others is because of how heavily wooded it is. Now, I'm not saying that that's the reason why the cases we're going to talk about tonight happened. I'm just saying that, you know, when I say disappearances, some of these people are found, but many of the people we're going to talk about tonight. never are found. And there are still hundreds, if not thousands of people that have disappeared

never been found in the national parks. And it's not just because they disappeared. It's either how they disappeared, their circumstances surrounding it is witness reports and even investigators slash police reports as far as their investigation into these disappearances and the creepy and odd things surrounding these investigations. And I mean, everything from, you know, on most... And I was in the fire department for many for 12, 13 years. I know that during search and rescue operations, which I was a part of many of those,

especially up in North Carolina, and I actually was with a fire department that handled some of the national park. I mean, not Great Smoky Mountain, but a park that connects to the Great Smoky Mountains. So we did a lot of search and rescue stuff. And a lot of times we would call in dogs. You know, and dogs, bloodhounds, so on and so forth, would help tremendously.

They, if it wasn't whoever was lost that was able to actually reach out on their cell phone to guide us to them. But there were cases that people had zero cell phone service. Their batteries died, whatever. And we had no clue where they were. And in those cases, bloodhounds and dogs are extremely beneficial. and they can usually track right to a particular person or at least in the general vicinity if the terrain is, you know,

if they are able to navigate the terrain. But a lot of these cases, a lot of these cases of these people that disappear under really creepy circumstances, when they try to use dogs or things that usually work, it's just the dogs. There's like no scent. No scent. There's no trace.

Even exactly where. some of the people that may have been hiking with them or witnesses say where he disappeared, they will take the dogs right there. Some people even have pieces of clothing of theirs to where they'll let the dog smell. That's a huge thing because dogs are great if they know what they're searching for. And so there have been many cases of that to where they had pieces of clothing or pieces of gear from the disappeared hiker. And yet the dog would smell right where they all, all the people said where the person

disappeared and then it would almost just be lost. And you can tell as a dog handler, especially in a search and rescue type environment, a dog handler can tell when a dog has no clue about where he's searching. And this, speaking of dogs, there's our bloodhound right there. He's done our bloodhound, but he's a beagle. Sorry about that. In the same family. In the hound family. But yeah, so dog handlers know when their dog is not on assent. And a lot of times, this would happen when dog, would, they would smell where the person was last. They would track it, you know, a couple, two, three, four, five feet, and then they would completely lose the scent.

Like, is almost as if it vanished in the thin air. So we're going to talk about that. By the way, guys, before we get started, we want you guys to go and make sure that you like our Facebook page. Reach out to us on there. We do have truthworldorder.com. That is our paid platform for all of our members, where you can get exclusive content.

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It is different than what typically we hear because I think we just let people more in our lives a little bit, got a little more personal. We're a little more laid back, I guess. in some circumstances is fun. And we want it to be fun, but we also want it to be, you know, informative and entertaining and all that. And we want you guys to be able to be a part of this

and be a part of what we're building in the future for this podcast and for us to get a truth out there. And we're really going to utilize our members there. And we've talked about that pretty extensively. So let's get into it. So the national parks and forests of the United States, I mean, there's no question. They are some of the most beautiful land.

find anywhere in the world. They are serene places that showcase the natural beauty of America. But among those vast wild parks, there's definitely a dark, often untold secret. There are thousands of people that have mysteriously gone missing within these areas and no official explanation has ever been given. Even worse, there's actually no official account is available. We don't even know 100% how many people have went missing from national parks and how many have not. There have been a lot of people that have disappeared and never came home that were either planning on going hiking, planning on doing things like this.

But there's a lot of those families that don't know whether they disappeared during hiking or before or after. So we don't even know an official county. And this is probably a lot of people that went camping, hiking on their own. Yeah. And not with a partner or a group. Yeah. The other part is the National Park Services, they have a hard time keeping track of missing

person. So what we're going to talk about and what we're going to kind of theorize here is what happened to these people that went missing. We're going to talk about some cases of especially some of the famous cases of these National Park disappearances. But when you think about it, when you go hiking and you go on these trails, there is like a little welcome center, I guess, and there's a little pencil. Sometimes. Like they'll have a pencil that looks similar to a golf kind of pencil. You know, those half pencils. And half of the time they're not even like barely sharp.

But that's only on a few parts. Yeah. And then they'll let, you know, there's a card where you can put where you went in, your license plate when you're planning on coming out, just getting some information. But this is just information on paper and pencil. And like you said, it's not everywhere where you go into the parks or, you know, into the forest. But I'm sure that's even hard to keep up with when it's paper and pencil. Yeah. Well, and the problem is national park services.

they have a tough time keeping track of missing persons. I mean, that's literally how many people go missing across the National Park Services or areas of jurisdiction in any given time. And we also have to think, too, is this is something I've always said as well. Like I said, some of these things can be explained pretty easily as far as, and I've told my friends this.

When my friends have come to me and said, you know, what do you think the thing you have to look out most for in the woods is, especially if you get a national park. Well, I would say people. Because, you know, yes, you have issues with bears from time to time. I've had a major issue with bears. I've told that story before.

But most of the time, if you go camping or hiking, you're not going to have a bear encounter. Or if you do, it's going to be very short-lived, you know, because bears are typically scarter than you are of them. They're scared of you than you are of them. And yeah, in certain circumstances, like if you're in Alaska or Canada where you deal with grizzlies and you are in their habitat, just go watch the show alone, you'll see if they put you right in the middle of grizzly habitat, yes, they are more aggressive, they can be. But even in those circumstances, you know, these alone people are not getting killed. They're not getting ravaged. But there are people that die from bears, and there are people that even go missing in National Forest that get eaten, whether it be after they die or whatever the case is.

There was actually a case, before we get into this, there was a case up in the mountains of North Carolina. And I actually think it was in the Great Smoky Mountains. And by the way, the Great Smoky Mountains is full of bear. I mean, if you look at the bear population in America, there is massive bear populations in the Great Smoky Mountains. And besides the Great Smoky Mountains, you have out west like Montana, you know, once you start getting in Montana and that area, like Wyoming and up north towards Canada, you start getting into grizzly country. But even down south of those areas in the national parks, Yosemite and all that stuff,

you have a lot of black bear as well. But there are a ton of black bear in the Great Smoky Mountains. Well, even when we were just day hiking one day, and I got ahead of you and your mom and stepdad because I wanted to get some exercise and I was really going up those hills fast. And I get up to the top of the hill and I saw a black brown bear, whatever it was.

I was like, whoa. Yeah. I mean, just hiking during. the day I ran into a bear. Yeah, you run into him quite a bit. But, I mean, it didn't come like after me or anything. Yeah, but yeah, you're right. I mean, and typically they don't.

But there was like one case up here, and this was like a year or two ago, up in the mountains, and I believe it was great smoking mountains. But there was this hiker that went missing, and it was a couple days after he went missing. The searchers actually came across a bear eating a body that happened to be this missing hiker. This bear was eating him. Well, they put the bear down. what they can't determine is whether or not the bear killed him or he got lost, died, and then the bear ate him.

And I don't know. I don't know what the case would be for that. The deal with black bears and grizzly bears, and there's a difference. Grizzlies are massive and they're very dominant. They're very, like, if they're coming to attack you, they're usually coming to attack you to get you away from whatever their situation is. They usually do it in defensive manner.

Especially when they have babies. Yeah. I mean, and they're the worst as far as getting in between. Now, they always say, like, you can play dead with a grizzly bear, but you can't with a black bear. They always say, like, your best bet probably with a grizzly bear, if you have no choice and he's coming after. And you know you aren't getting away is to play dead. And a lot of times they will leave you alone. Sometimes they won't, but a lot of times they will.

Black bears, on the other hand, if they're coming after you, it's best to fight back or to do whatever you can. Because black bears, if you play dead, they're still going to mess you up. It doesn't matter if you act dead or not That just gives them the power and the incentive To bite you in the back of the neck And rip your dang neck out I mean they're just They're not as aggressive as grizzlies

But once they are they're like They're gonna keep going until they eat you basically I mean that's just kind of the way it is So it's kind of weird a lot of people are like Oh black bears are not as dangerous as grislies But they are they're actually more dangerous In certain situations than grizzlies And but yeah there are more grisly

attacks than black bear attacks i believe so anyways so like any unexplained um phenomena i guess you can call this um everyone has a theory on kind of what has happened in these people i mean these are extremely creepy stories um many are unsolved and mysterious and a lot of them have the same patterns and some of these are rational and some of these almost seem paranormal or alien like or something is going on other than just people disappearing. These are very spine-chilling type events that happen and naturally inspire speculation. I mean, a lot of people that, you know,

there's been people that have written books and documentaries on it. And these are not just random people that wrote books about this. These are L.A. County investigators that have worked with police departments forever. I think it's called Disappeared 411. We're going to talk about that. He was an L.A. County Sheriff, I believe, that wrote a book about all these disappearances, but he was one of the top investigators in L.A. And there are actually quite a few cops that have written books about this. And we're going to get into that in just a minute. But some of the theories are missing people may have been eaten. And as we talked about, this does happen.

The national parks of the U.S. were established partly to preserve plants, animals, and ecology. So, I mean, it makes sense that humans stepping into these untamed areas should be careful of bears, mountain lines, buffaloes, everything else is in national parks, and other dangerous animals. And the thing about it is, and we talked about this briefly before, and this is something Joe Rogan said a little while back on a podcast, and I agree with this. And this is also something I have felt many times in the middle of the woods. When you're 10 miles back in the middle of the wilderness, there are times that you have this thought. all the sudden like, you know, I'm not in my comfortable normal life now, and I am at the mercy of these creatures that live here, which are the bears, the mountain lines. And they don't give a damn about your life at home or whether you have kids. I mean, you know, we look at people that are criminals, for example.

And if you watch a video of these criminals that come in and they have to hold a gun to somebody and somebody's like, I got kids. Sometimes that might work on criminals because they might have a reality check for a minute and say, oh, yeah, you're right. I'm not going to shoot you. We've even seen these mass shooters that would like go into some and for something someone would say he would make them not shoot this person. And it's like a life or death thing that you say. And it's just like Joe Rogan was saying, it doesn't matter if you're a celebrity. If you have a ton of money, you have no money.

If you own, you know, half of Texas, they have no discrimination about who you are. Yeah, absolutely. And they don't care. They don't have empathy. You know, that is one thing that animals lack in wild creatures, especially creatures that, you know, we always have this, we've always heard. You can take a wolf as a pet, you can, and there are people, I've had a wolf hybrid animal dog before, animal dog.

I've had a wolf, I've had a wolf hybrid. This mofo was like the damn skin walker. Like, that is how crazy this dog was. And when I got it, he was like very cute, right? I mean, and I named him Thunder. And he lived up to that name, for sure. but like he when I got him looked like a German shepherd at probably like it would be the size of a German shepherd at four months but the thing was he was like I don't know two and a half months old so you know but I didn't think of it I didn't think of it that way I was like yeah his dog's really pretty and so I got this dog and like probably about when he was seven months or eight months old I mean it was a nightmare to try to have this dog and actually I mean he was very protective he he loved me very protective of me,

but the thing was, is like you couldn't get him around other animals because he wanted to eat all of them, and he could have. I think at seven months old, he was 130 pounds or 125. And by a year, he was like, I mean, it was ridiculous how big this dog got.

It was somewhere around there. He was 100 pounds, seven months, like 125 or 130, about a year. And then a year is when I had to give him up. But it was only because he attacked neighbor's dogs, he got into a fight with a pit bull one day. And so there was a neighbor two doors down that had a pit bull,

which is a mean pit bull. Well, this pit bull got into our yard, right? And he, Thunder was like on the side of the yard. I was like kind of chilling in the yard. Pit bull got in the yard. And Thunder went and like made this pit bull look like he was a bitch. Like he was about to rip his throat out. And like I was trying to get Thunder.

and I was more afraid of the pit bull because I was afraid like if I pulled Thunder off him the pit bull was going to attack me because this was a like vicious pit bull and anyways that that pit bull had like gashes all down his freaking neck I mean he had no chance against Thunder and then like a couple days later

Thunder like walks into the yard carrying a freaking deer and the deer was a full grown deer and Thunder had him and his feet weren't even touching the ground he was holding it up with his mouth carrying it from the back Now, I don't know if he killed this deer

Because he went missing for like Four hours that day And I don't know if he killed the deer Or the deer got killed on the road I don't know But he freaking brought it in the yard This full deer And was eating it in the yard

Yeah, it's kind of like cats bringing mice But this is your dog bringing a deer Yeah So then so So I really got the first hand Of like, you know, how vicious How predatory even though he was bred With a German Shepherd, right?

Supposedly. I don't even know if that's true but I got the firsthand knowledge of like you can't take away the wild instinct no matter what you do and it's like that's what I'm saying they lack empathy and they are dominant they are protective they can be protective but that doesn't mean they're empathetic and you know if he was and that that was when I had to get rid of him was he was like I thought maybe he was going to be vicious to other people because he showed signs of that So I had to get around it. But anyways, the point is, animals are not empathetic.

So the Bears and Mountain Lines thing, but that's one thing. But other people speculate that paranormal or crypted creatures, people have even talked about Bigfoot, for example, could have been involved. And believers often claim the missing people could have been used as a food source for these creatures. and that's why so few of them are found. So that's one possibility. I mean, we got to think about the animal side of this. Some blame an evil spirit, and they actually call it Wendingo. Wendingo.

Yes, it's a big thing. This mysterious nature of the disappearances have led to paranormal theories, blaming everything from cryptozoologist creatures to aliens. One of the less common theories is that the missing people were taken by an evil spirit called Wendingo. to those who haven't watched a famous supernatural episode, the Wendingo comes from an Algonquin folklore and is an evil spirit who terrorizes woods and forest. The U.S. National Parkland was taken from the same Algonquin tribes

who believed in the Wendigo. And so a lot of the tribes used to believe heavily in the people that disappeared within the woods. It's almost like skin walkers. Kind of. Yeah, but these tribes, they would always reference if their children or just, Some of the people in the tribe disappeared, they would say it was the Wendingoes that took them.

And they believed that Wendigos were an evil spirit within the woods. Now, what was that evil spirit? We don't know. Well, if it's anything like a skinwalker, like I was saying, they take the form of an animal. Yeah. And attack. Well, I mean, it's the same thing as like UFO, alien type thing. Reptilians, you know, if you want to get into that stuff.

All of that. I mean, all of the paranormal. normal UFO things could be connected. Who knows? Some of the weird things about these are sometimes people are found far away from where they actually disappeared. So if a missing person does

turn up deceased, some of the strange circumstances they're found in generate more questions than answers. Like occasionally people have been found unbelievable distances from where they went missing. And though it's possible a person could wonder, I guess, great distance after becoming lost, there are still some circumstances that are more complicated.

A toddler once went missing and turned up 12 miles from where he vanished. This is 12 miles. And it's a toddler. Between those 12 miles were two mountain ranges and three or four creeks. Much too far for a toddler to venture on his own. No way. There's no way. I mean, you just put in perspective what a mile is.

Yeah. It's four laps around a track. and you times that by 12, that's a long way. Yeah, you're right. It is. A lot of times in these circumstances, autopsies rarely determine the cause of death when they are found. In the rare event that a misdemeanor person is found, the autopsy does not often communicate the very conclusive information

as far as how they died. In fact, most of the reported autopsies come back inconclusive and pathologists aren't able to determine the cause of death. Some people use this as evidence for paranormal activity, but no one actually knows what really happened to these people or why they died. And that's, that is a strange thing. There's also a weird connection. And this sounds crazy, but we're going to tell you all these connections before we get into some of the cases.

There's a connection between missing people and berries. I know it sounds weird. But there are several clusters that Paul Leeds is found in common with disappearance. Now, Paul Eads is the, he's the writer of the book, The 411, or missing 411. He is the investigator. He found that there's something in common with berry patches and missing people. Like people disappearing around bodies of water are easily explained as the number of the, well, the number one causes that are usually drowning.

And actually, one of the number one causes of death in National Parks period is drowning. And that's been over the past few decades. But others make way less sense. I mean, there's one such cluster appears when looking at the amount of people who have gone missing near berry bushes. There's actually quite a few people that have disappeared near berry bushes, and they are found sometimes in the middle of berry bushes. So that's another strange thing. Are they poisonous berries? Are they berries? Are they berries where bears eat? I don't know. That's a good question, though. Paul Eads says they go missing while picking berries,

and some are found while eating berries. The connection between some disappearances and berries cannot be denied. So it is strange. Don't know. So do not go around berries when you're camping. Yeah. Stay away from it.

Now there was an Army veteran that actually reported a strange experience on a hiking trail. While going for a walk with his two-year-old son on a well-maintained high-control an Army veteran noticed that trail markings all around him

were disappearing. When he looked back, he reported the trees and plants were different than he remembered. Then he heard a snap and sound. So this is, quote, my eyes started to fixate. on a particularly unnerving dark section of the forest.

For whatever reason, my entire body started locking up, and every single alarm bell in my head was pinging. No matter how hard I tried to focus on the dark patch, I couldn't see shit. I had the weirdest sensation of being able to see each individual branch and plant in high detail, but I couldn't focus on the scene overall. It was super blurry.

I also felt my internal fight or flight mechanism flipping between the two decisions faster than a coin in a coin toss. And so the interesting thing about this Army Rangers, or I believe he was an Army Ranger, I'd heard this story before, but the strange thing about his story, as far as things completely looking different all of a sudden on the trail,

was that there have been many people say the same thing. And it's not saying that you're just in the middle of woods. This is literally people saying that... They're on a trail and all of a sudden it looks different. Everything changes. And it's just... And he heard snapping. Yeah.

And it's just, it's almost like you walk through some kind of parallel universe or something. And everything is different. Now, this also goes along with some of the things we're going to talk about in a minute. But as far as missing time, there are a lot of people that have went missing. Oh, yeah. You hear about that all the time. Especially with people they're abducted by aliens. Or they say they are.

Or they say they're abducted by aliens. That they are missing time. Mm-hmm. A lot of this stuff has also said that. So there was one encounter, and actually there's a few of these like this. One man returned after missing for 15 months. Oh, wow. So in 1979, a student by the name of Stephen Kubaki went missing for 15 months after going skiing in a national park.

At the scene of disappearance, investigators followed his footprints until they mysteriously stopped. And this is in snow, keep in mind. So 15 months later, he woke up in a physical. 700 miles away from where he went missing and only 40 miles away from where his father's house was. Wow. He found his father's house and knocked on his door. Kubaki was wearing clothes that weren't his and had a satchel that didn't belong to him. He claimed to remember nothing to happen, but he said he didn't suffer from psychological problems,

and he never ended up seeking help. He eventually got a Ph.D. in clinical psychology because of this. This is 15 months later. He woke up in a field. He had been missing for 15 months. different clothes on and then woke up and 15 months later without his clothes on somebody something else is closed yeah and he has no idea what happened in 15 months and by the way this is this is not just one yeah this is 700 miles away from where he went missing and this is long

way away yeah this is not just one occurrence there are many people to explain similar circumstances whether it be a week or two or three weeks or seven hours missing and then they just wake up and like, oh. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. National Park trails have known to mysteriously change, and this is what we're going to go back on from what the Army Rangers said. There's been reports by a few people that have gone missing in return. Trails within the parks have changed, mysteriously or instantly, and without warning. There's been people, there was one person in particular that told a story of having walked five feet off the trail to look at a sign on a tree. When she turned back, she said the trail was literally not there.

And another person in her son had three hours of unaccounted time while they were on a trail. In some cases, this is a fairly typical lost person behavior, but it can still be quite frightening for the people involved. There was also a three-year-old's report of when he went missing, and it sounds like a freaking horror movie. And this is a three-year-old. Okay, so get this. David Paul Leeds, which is the former police detective and the author of the missing 411, He explores disappearances with strange circumstances attached to them. In one case, he wrote about an anonymous three-year-old boy who went missing a national park near Mount Shasta in California

and was found five hours later in a thicket of trees. He describes being taken into a cave by a woman he thought was his grandmother. The boy said he eventually figured out she wasn't his grandmother, even though she was polite to him and concluded she was a robot because there was some unusual light coming from her head, he said. When he later recounted the story for his grandmother, she said she would have brushed it off if it weren't for an experience she had while camp in a year prior. She claims to have woke up outside her tent with strange puncture wounds. And this is his grandmother that she had reported this a year earlier. And when he disappeared.

And yeah, she woke up. She actually said, and we're going to get to that story. But she had woken up and had been dragged out of her tent that night. And she said she woke up outside of her tent in the middle of the night. And her neck was, she had a pain in her neck. And she had two puncture wounds in her neck. And this was this kid's grandmother. That's scary.

This is the same kid that went missing a year later and then explained this horrendous story about it. He was walking with his grandmother and his grandmother had a light glowing from her head. I bet she felt like she was in the twilight zone. No, I mean, I bet he did. there was a man reported being followed by a woman with no distinguishing features. One man came across a trail area that had strange broken branches eight feet or higher off the ground. He decided to hike it, looking for signs of Sasquatch. As he hiked the trail, he was unable to shake the feeling someone was watching him.

He turned around. The man saw a woman walking towards him, but he noticed she was somehow moving towards him quicker than her strides should have been taking her. They stared at each other, and he noticed that she had no distinguished, features or clothing. He turned back and kept walking, and when he looked back again, she was gone. So Missing 411 is the book. Author David Paulides speculates there was something suspicious going on without this.

And David Paulides is often referred to as an expert on missing persons, and especially in National Park cases. He has written a series of books on the cases. Missing 411, Paulides claims to have spent over 7,000 hours research in National Park disappearances. He says that when speaking about... to a park ranger, he was told the Park Service was doing everything possible to keep a lid

on the publicity surrounding the missing international parks. Paul Leeds, who has submitted many Freedom of Information Act request, most of which have been denied, claims that the Ranger told him that non-law enforcement employees weren't privy to all information and that the Park Service

were concerned about the numbers and certain facts surrounding specific cases. So, Mr. Paul Eads actually had requested numerous freedom of information request. And they denied them. And they denied most of them in reference to what has been happening and the missing people

in national parks. So, I mean, you know, it's kind of almost like a cover-up. Yeah. I mean, what isn't a cover-up anymore? I know. And I just think about like all the government cover-ups when they don't want you to know, they're not going to give you the information. No, you're right.

So something is definitely up with that. That's like freaking. And I've not really ever thought about missing people and these situations. that you know you're talking about yeah well there was a case of morganheimer um now there's obvious connection between sometimes rugged and difficult terrain of these national parks and misimpersons and deaths that occur many people enter into parks inexperienced are unprepared however in a disappearance of morganheimer there was this was not the case at all in fact heimer was an employee of tour west a rafting company of the colorado river heming

was regarded as an outstanding swimmer and experienced trekker. He was a strong and fit 22-year-old. On the sixth day of an eighth day, on the eighth day of the excursion, Heimer was last in line bringing the rafters back from a swim. The lead tour guide recalled walking away from the cliff they were standing on to talk to a member of the excursion group. When he went back to Heimer, he was gone. The guide mentioned that Heimer wanted to take a break, so no one was particularly

concerned at the time. Not only that, but they were confident in his sense. skills and he was wearing a life jacket and familiar with the drain and when he didn't come back to the group for dinner authorities were called this launched a six-day search his disappearance occurred on june second 2015 no one has since seen or heard from him since um and actually this this investigation i i looked into this investigation um they had everyone and everything uh a part of this investigation they searched the river and although the area where he disappeared was nowhere that he could have fell to either his death or to the river.

It was actually in an area that where they said they last saw him was, I think they said they were probably a half mile from where the river was even in question in this particular circumstance. But even still, everyone was still wearing their life jackets because they were walking up the trail to get out of where they came out of the river. Now, on one side of the river, I mean, sorry, on one side of the trail, it was a, not wooded, but it was wooded for this area in the Grand Canyon, which is where the Colorado River kind of comes through. And they did everything.

I mean, they searched the river just in case he would have went back for something and fell in the river. But keeping in mind, he had a life jacket on. He was a very experienced guide. I mean, you know, he was their most experienced guide. He was extremely athletic. He did all kinds of, I mean, he was a ripped and built dude. You know, it's something that was very strange. They did everything.

They drugged the river. They searched extensively in that entire area, and they never found him. It's just like he disappeared. And this was actually one case where they brought in dogs, and people had some of his clothing from his truck that was there at the place. And they had, from where the people last saw him, the dog could not find the trail. So he just vanished. So that was one case.

Drake Kramer is another one. Drake Kramer was another experience outdoorsman who enjoyed the Grand Canyon. He was a 21-year-old college student. His love of nature and exploring areas like the Grand Canyon motivated him to a major in geology at the University of Texas. His decision to visit the Grand Canyon would it be surprising to his family or friends. The circumstances for this trip, however, were slightly more unexpected. Kramer, without any warning, chose to take off to California.

and from there, the Grand Canyon. He arrived at the Bright Angel Lodge in Arizona on February 1st. Although Kramer had been there a few times before, it was unlike him to travel alone. His parents had seen him just before on January 29th and said he was in good spirits. They even attended a movie together. Even more jarring was a message Kramer sent to his mother seemingly explaining the reason for his trip. He told his mother that he needed to be back with his mother earth and set his soul free. Kind of sounds like he killed itself on this one.

I mean, I'm just saying, I mean, I'm not a genius. I don't know. Sorry. This is not even funny. I don't even know why we're laughing, but I'm just saying this is not that weird. Yeah, he's got, set his soul free. Yeah, I mean, what the hell? Yeah.

I mean, unless he gave it to the aliens or something, I don't know. But because this message, authorities counted suicide as a high probability after he left his car at the lodge and traveled a long. the South Rim of the Grand Canyon on his own. His family and grape hopefulness saw the message as David needing to spend some time in nature and do a bit of soul searching. The terrain of South Rim is very mixed, so it can be very difficult to traverse.

But it's very rare that no sign of him or his remains will be found in the area. Despite this, neither Kramer's body nor any clues about what happened to him have ever been found. And I'm just curious, because the Grand Canyon, you can either be at the top looking down or you can be in there,

camping. I'm just curious. I guess he was probably in the Grand Canyon, like at the bottom. Well, I mean, the thing is, like, if you're going to disappear out there. You just don't go by yourself there. Well, you don't really just disappear either. The only way you're going to disappear in a Grand Canyon is through the river. Like, or a cavern somewhere. Well, yeah. That place is, it does not look earthly at all when you're looking at it from above. It's just this huge drop. It almost, it reminds me of, And Niagara Falls in a way. Because it's just like this humongous drops. Like it takes your breath even looking down.

It's so far down. And there are like tons of cabins and just really bad terrain. Yeah. You're right. So I don't know. I would never, ever, ever like go by myself to there. No. I mean, it's not a good idea.

There's another case of Stacey Ann Arras. She was only 14 years old. She went on a guided tour at Yosemite National Park. The trip was attended by her father and six others. They were all riding mules. The area had several campsites, all within a mile or two of each other. Stacey's group was at the furthest set of cabins, Sunrise High Sierra Camp.

After settling in, Stacey wanted to go to a nearby lake to take pictures and ask her father to join her. He chose to rest instead. So an elderly gentleman, Gerald Stewart, from the tour group, went along with her. Stewart was 77 and along the way decided to stop and rest as well. The group could see Stacey and Stuart along the path as they were downhill from the cabins. They saw Stewart stop and sit on a rock as Stacey continued. And shortly after, he walked back up to the cabins from the place he had set down.

He asked other campers who came from Stacey's direction if they had seen her, but no one had. When the group realized Stacey was not along the trail at the lake or back with them, they began searching for her. A massive search party began the next day. They went over and beyond any of the searches. mentioned so far. They had three helicopters, two dogs searched, rescue teams, and close to 100 people searched in the park. Despite the immediate and immense response to Stacey's disappearance, the only trace of her that has ever been located was her camera lens cap. If she was harmed, the perpetrator was incredibly careful as not so much as a drop of blood was found. It is unlikely

that a 14-year-old at the furthest part of a mountain would have simply walked off on her own, never to be seen again. If she was injured along the trail, certainly one of the many people in the area at the time of the surge parties would have found her or something of her. And so this was just a complete vanishing act that happened to her as well.

And that's what's crazy about all these situations is it's not just like they disappeared, but they disappeared without a trace. Yeah, and there's a lot of these. Like nothing. They're just gone. Now, the same with Stacey Ann. you know, the girl we just talked about, there is not always safety in numbers. As an avid churchgoer, when George Pinka decided to visit Yosemite National Park, he did so with

80 other followers from his congregation. Pinka was not an experienced hiker, but was in a well-traveled area with his friends and tour guides. It should have been a good experience for all involved. However, at some point, Pinka was separated from his group. It has been said that he had not felt well and decided to turn back, but others said the group spilt into two, and somehow during the separation, Pinka was lost in the jumble. The last time that anyone recall seeing Pinka was 2.40 in the afternoon, as the rest of the group

expected to meet Pinka back at the campsite, he was not reported missing until 9 that night. The Upper Yosemite Falls, they were hiking as a strenuous hike rated difficult by the park itself as a difficult trail for visitors. It's also rated high on the crowd factor, meaning plenty of people used the trail. No one outside of the church group members seeing him along the trail.

No one saw him. He was carrying a bag of water and a bit of food. Neither the bag nor any of its contents were ever found. None of his clothes and his blood, any trace of his body was ever found, in a heavily populated area visible to the town of Yosemite itself in nice weather with a trusted group of church gores. He disappeared without a trace. And no one ever seen anything from him.

Nothing ever again. And by the way, this is a heavily traveled trail. It was a group of people, whether he started to turn back or not, he obviously would have stayed on trail. You know, I mean, this is to me, all these stories, it's, people don't just disappear like that. There's something supernatural going on or, excuse me, something other than somebody getting lost off a trail or getting eaten by an animal. There's something else definitely up with that. Yeah, there was another weird one. Polly Melton was not someone you expect to be an avid hiker.

although out of shape and a heavy smoker, she still loved the mountains, hiked regularly, and made the base of the smoky mountains of North Carolina, her summertime home. She had spent years visiting in this location,

and she was well known in the mountain town community, even volunteering almost daily. Melton went on a trail marked easy in September of 1981. She was with two friends, and it should have been a leisurely walk for an experienced mountain.

But according to the two women she was hiking with, she sped up ahead of them. It wasn't a far day. It wasn't a far distance, but she went up and over a knoll out of sight. When the two women she had been walking with, only moments prior got over the hill, Melton had completely vanished. They heard no strange noises indicating distress, saw no sign of scuffle.

They continued to the campsite and still, no poly. Melton didn't have any belongings with her, not even a change of clothes or her purse. She was also on medications for high blood pressure and nausea, and she didn't have these with her either. there was just no trace of her until over a year later when a check in her name was cash in Alabama police felt to say without a doubt that it was her signature there is a popular theory that Melton had decided to run off that day

her husband the third and last presumably had fallen ill her mother and had recently passed and her pastor speculated she was having an affair the day before she went missing she was volunteering at the senior home like usual however she asked to use their phone for the first time in four years that she had worked there. So did she...

The weird thing was, she was a heavy smoker, all this stuff, and then she walks ahead on a trail and then disappears. It just doesn't sound... It doesn't mean sense, does it? No one has ever heard or seen from her since. This was in the 80s.

But what's the deal with a check? There was a check in her name that was cash in Alabama. Like, you know, I mean, that was... How long ago was that? That's just crazy because it just, where did she disappear? In the Great Smoky Mountains?

On an easy trail. The check was cashed in Alabama, unless somebody was holding onto the check. But normally, you can't hold onto a check for more than three months, and it's not valid anymore. I know. So that's weird.

So that's really weird. Yeah, and so there's one story, too, that I want to talk about and it's the kid man it is weird there's one kid that disappeared and no one knows

where they went Dennis Martin this was one of the strangest ones Dennis Martin and this was in 1969 he was a six year old boy he had dark brown eyes and hair he went missing on Father's Day weekend He was playing with other children while on a family outing at the Spence-filled area of the Appalachian Trail.

Dennis hid behind a bush planning a sneak attack on his parents, so did his other kids. They were just playing off on the side. And all these kids were like, hey, we're going to hide. We're going to scare our parents. And so when he did this, he was planning a sneak attack on his parents and was never, ever seen again. All the other kids came out from behind the bush, scared their parents. This kid was never seen again ever. He vanished.

And search areas or search efforts, they span 56 square miles after this. And a grid combed by, it was over 1,400 volunteers. It was the largest search in the history of the Smoky Mountains revealed no answers, although one sock and shoe were found several years afterwards. And an illegal ginseng hunter came forward claiming he had found the skull and other remains of a small boy in the vicinity.

But they never determined whether or not that was him. They even did DNA testing on that skull when DNA testing was available about this story and never determined whether it was him or not. Whoa. I'm just in like awe. I don't even know what to say. Yeah, Teresa Gibson, she was a 16-year-old female, 5, 315 pounds with brown hair and brown eyes. she was last seen wearing a brown plaid jacket, blue jeans, and Adidas shoes.

She was on a field trip from Bearden High School with 40 other students and one teacher chaperone to hike Clemonds Dome to Andrews Bald. I've actually hiked Clemonds dome. And it's a beautiful area. Absolutely beautiful. Students last reported seeing her in the distance, bending over and taking a right turn off the trail. When the group reconvened in a parking lot to go home, she was missing. A can of beer and three cigarette butts were found near the spot where she stepped off the trail.

causing speculation that she was abducted in nearly plain view. Yeah, that's what I would say. They found some kind of evidence at least. But in these other things, there's no evidence at all. There's no cigarette butts or no beer cans or no blood or no clothes or no nothing. They just vanish. Yeah, there was another Derek Luking. He was a 24-year-old male.

And he was a fan of survivalist TV shows and bought a bunch of supplies for heading into the park maps, a Gerber Axe, a military survival manual. A knife sharpener, a Coleman combination compass and thermometer. He had all kinds of stuff. And, I mean, he had a fire starter, everything. He wanted to go just go out in the woods. And his white fort escape was found in a newfound gap where he left much of his supplies in the car, including his tent and sleeping bag. Also a note that read, Don't Follow Me, Derek's family maintains a Facebook page dedicated to finding him, which is last updated in November of 2020.

So that sounds like he disappeared before he even went out into the woods. Yeah, I don't know. If nothing was, you know, out of the truck or whatever he was driving. Yeah. And he just disappeared. Yeah, you know, the thing about it is, you know, people go in the woods for many reasons. But, you know, like even the Polly girl we were talking about earlier, she suffered Bows of Depression, all that stuff. But then there are so many cases of missing people as well that they go missing.

And it's in either plain day when people are with them, they look back and they're gone or whatever the circumstances may be. But I don't know if you heard about people going missing and then the connection with the cave systems underground. It's also another very strange thing. people are going missing and some people claim is because of cannibal caves cannibal caves now well that kind of goes to with the feral people that you know I didn't even know what feral people were I mean I know what the word feral means but I never knew that feral people even exist or do they really exist but people know of them they do exist yeah feral people yeah so what sherry's talking about and I think we did a podcast on this

an episode. It seems like we did. But feral people. Yeah. Farrell people. What feral people are is essentially people that go into the middle. They don't go in the middle. They've been there. They've been there forever. They're generations.

They're in the national forest. That's where they live. Yeah. They're in a middle of absolute nowhere. So take, for example, if you go in a national forest and you go out on a trail and you hike all these trails and stuff, you know, it's kind of, similar to what those trails show you in these national parks, for example, is almost like what earth, what land is on earth, right? So, you know, what is it, like 70 or 80% of earth

is water, right? So you can kind of make the same narrative to the trails you go hiking on in national forest, especially, I mean, because you've got to understand, these are millions of acres of national forest. So the trails you go hiking on in national forest is essentially, And I say essentially, damn it. It's basically what earth, what land is in comparison to water on earth. So you're only seeing, you know, what you're seeing 10 to 15% of what those woods are. Right. And on the trails.

Most people don't go off the trails, right? I mean, and even the people that do go off trails, you know, well, those are people that end up missing. But I'm going to say, too, we have been hiking before, and we have been on trails where new trails have been made by mountain bikers. But that's not in a national, national forest. I know, but I'm just saying that could happen. Could, because it did happen to us. We got lost in just around our house. Yeah.

Because we were on, you know, we had the map. We had everything. And we were following the trails. And somehow we got off the trail, but it still looked like a trail. because people had made new trails. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. So that is... Well, yeah, but that was in like a local state park

where their trail systems were complete shit. And, you know, mountain bikers made their own trails. Yeah. You know, even though this state park was, you know, damn, if you get lost near it. That's why I wasn't really concerned. I was concerned because I was like, well, we have no clue we're at because we went off on some other trail.

But I was like, we... Because that's what we did. We're like, we can follow the... Not on purpose, though. I know. But I said we can follow the freaking lake because we know the lake ends at the, you know, and it's a big lake. So we knew it was going to take us a while. Well, y'all, I was worried.

You had to go to work the next day. I was like, oh my gosh, I'm worried. We had no cell service or anything. We had no GPS. We had no nothing. I'm like, what are we going to do? I have to work tomorrow. So feral people.

And this is something I'm going to talk about too because I'm going to tell a story in a minute. And I've told this on the podcast before, but I'm going to tell it again because it's definitely coincides with this. Farrell people are what most people say, people that are born and raised in the woods. There is a movie, and I don't know what movie it is.

It was a great movie. I cannot remember. That was the one I was talking about the beginning. Yeah, what is the name of that movie? But anyways, there's a feral people movie. If you guys look it up on Google,

just type in Farrell People movie. It's crazy. Yeah. And it's about these people that go hiking or whatever. And they run into these. And I think that's where it's based in, I believe.

And so they run into these people that are feral people. So think of feral cats or feral dogs. Like these are wild animals. Even though they're like domesticated. Yeah, they're domestic. Not domesticated, but they are domestic animals, but they're not. They're wild. Yeah, they're wild.

Yeah. So think of that as people. Now, these people exist in our national parks. And especially the Bureau of Land Management land out in the West, all this stuff. But it's more so more so in the Great Smoky. mountains. I think it's because there's more wooded areas there. And there's massive amounts of land.

There's no wooded areas. There's no trees there because it's so high, you know, in altitude that there's no trees. And I think that's the biggest difference of why there's probably feral people in the smokies. Now there are cave systems though. Oh yeah. We got off off that topic. No. So.

Yeah, I've never even heard of these cave systems before. So this originated years ago and it's, it's. basically, look, there's one thing we've talked about on this podcast before is that when the massive amount of people around the world get on a topic and they investigate and then this thing goes viral. There's a reason things go viral is because if it can hold weight and it can be, you know, and someone can say, well, this makes sense

and let's investigate this more, let's do comparisons, let's do this, is just like if a murder happens or something like that and you have all these Facebook groups that women or men or whoever become these investigators. And it's just like a mass shooting. You're going to know everything about that person within 20 minutes of when it happened. Yeah, because everybody, it's like the Murdoch murders. Yeah, because like, you know.

You think about a investigative division in a police department. You might have 12 investigators. And out of that 12 investigators, it's them 12 people, or maybe sometimes four or five people, to have to put their knowledge together to try to figure out things. But imagine having millions of people that put all of their information, and all of their nosiness, all of their skills of whatever the hell they have together, they come up with usually the truth.

And usually they find things and they can, and it's quick. And whatever it is that leads, it's kind of like you might have 70 theories, right? But what usually happens? Well, there's a reason why freedom of speech should never be censored. And the reason for that is because the best and better speech will always beat out the faults and lies. It will always beat out the lies. because reality and just the ability to comprehend what reality is, people, even though they're trying to make a reality not a thing,

if you listen to last night's podcast, which is the World Economic Forum, New World Order podcast, it's a narrative they want to push more than data or reality. But the realities are, they're not up for contention, because reality is reality. And when you have millions of people find in the same reality, that usually means it's true. right so when things go viral you have to look at them for what they are just like for example

the hunter-biden story and all this stuff they tried to say it was conspiracy theory but it went viral because it was true the same thing with UFO stuff the same thing with the COVID things the same thing with all this stuff or even serial killers absolutely but the thing about it was this this went viral and then it went viral on social media and there were even highly skilled people geologists and investigators that started talking about this. And they were like, what, this actually could be a thing. And they were basically comparing the disappearances of people in the United States to locations of underground caves. And they used this map for comparison.

And it's assumed that all these Muslim people whose circumstances of disappearance are rather strange and who have not yet been found alive or dead actually either accidentally fell underground or deliberately decided climbing to the cave or could not be found their way back. Now, in the United States, there are a lot of long and unexplored caves. For example, the mammoth cave in Kentucky is considered the longest in the world. Its tunnel stretched for 587,000 meters and reach 115 meters in depth. But if you look at the majority of the unexplained missing people cases, you look at a map of that in the United States. You can find us online, and it will show all these missing people. and then you look at the map of the caves systems,

these massive underground cave systems in the United States, well, they follow a extremely similar area. I mean, it's like it's almost... Yeah, I'm looking at it right now. I see it. I mean, it's exactly the same. Like, the majority of all these missing people, it's going south and north up the United States.

And then when you look at the cave system, it's the exact same spots. Yeah, I mean, I'm literally even showing, like, you know, for example, if you look at Georgia United States, not Georgia country, Georgia, United States. You know, Georgia is not known to have a lot of caves, but yet they do have some cave systems. And then you look here in Georgia and they got these little groups of missing people in those cave areas. It's sporadical, yeah. So this went viral, and there was a guy named Dan the Dingbat, a researcher from... Dan the Dingbat.

Yeah, he was a researcher, yeah. He went even further and developed a theory about why so many people disappeared in the caves. According to her, well, to her version, whatever, people were deliberately dragged underground by certain creatures, something like feral people who were cannibals. And if you think about it, that's probably where these feral people would live is in cave systems because they don't want unferal people to know where they live, right? Yeah. Well, she went on to say, I know you have all seen videos where they talk about cannibals. being in the woods and they're just being feral people out in the woods. She said, I kind of think there are communities of those people, and they take people when they can.

Now, she also reckons that when people hear Bigfoot or Sasquatch sounds is actually the cannibals letting each other know they're around. Now, there is something to be said about feral people. Now, I have had, I have had, I actually talked to my brother, but my brother's in law enforcement. I had talked to him about this at my mom's house. It was, whenever it was. And, you know, the department he works in is near a lot of these, you know, national parks areas now.

But yeah, you know, he's heard law enforcement. Law enforcement believes this as well. And actually, in the fire department near where that was, I had heard of these. Even not back then when fire department people talked about these people, it wasn't feral people they called them. It was just like, I don't know. I can't remember what they used to say. But there were people in the middle of the wilderness they used to talk about that were, you know, communities or villages of people.

And they were cannibals. Well, I don't know. I don't know. They never said that. But, you know, there were villages of people out there, you know. And you think about ancient times, you know, there really were cannibals. That's what people did. They ate each other. No, they absolutely did.

Now, I'll tell you a story about when I was in a park. Well, I mean, you know, it's thousands and thousands of acres. And it's a park that borders the Great Smoky Mountains. and we had went camping up there, and it was late when we got in there because we had kind of decided this at last minute, and where we go into this national forest is what is considered, you have to drive, we probably drove to,

we were almost to the parkway, which is basically the top of the mountain range. You know, it's near where the Appalachian Trail is the spruce. of the Tennessee North Carolina border we were

probably like I don't know eight miles from there but it was like the first mountain range before you

get to the Smoky Mountains but it all kind of connects and so we had driven probably

eight to 10 miles eight miles probably up the mountain we it was at this time probably

930 in July I guess around about then and we had pulled off at this

location that was you know pretty well, first of all, we pulled off here because it was in the middle of the week. There was no cars there. And we're like, well, we're going to be alone here, basically. And it was a pretty flat area trail.

There wasn't really, there's no trails that really connect this because it's a loop. I think it's like a seven mile loop. So what we were planning on doing was camping halfway on that loop that night. And then we're just going to walk out the other side. the next day. And there are no trails that connect to this on any other side of this loop. So it's basically just forest. And then if you were to just say when the loop starts to turn, if you were to just say go in the woods and just walk a straight line as the crow would fly, as they say, you walk a straight line like seven or eight miles.

You would be in like the park center of smoking mountains. You would be in like the wilderness area of the smoking mountains. Like, you know, away from a lot of where the touristy mountains. stuff is. So we had walked back in here. It was creepy that night anyway because you know, it's always weird. Every time I get into weird, creepy

situations in woods and this happened quite a few times, there's always snake encounters and freaking bats, it seems like. Or sometimes bears, but it's usually snakes or bats. Or bees. So we had finally found this campsite. It was, and by the way, it's beautiful back

here, even though at night you can't really see anything. And it's, you know, when you're in the middle of the woods at night, it is dark, dark, dark. And we had headlamps on. And because of the headlamps, you know, the way this trail was, it was a very well-maintained trail. I mean, not even maintained. It was just, you know, I don't know, five feet wide trail.

You had these trees that were on both sides. It almost created like a tunnel effect because the trees came over the trail. You kind of followed. There were creeks on both sides of you in certain times. and our headlamps were attracting the bats, I believe, because these bats were freaking zooming our heads throughout the entire time we were walking. I mean, they were just coming down and just flying down,

like dodging, like they were going after our lights. And so, and I looked at Michael and I was like, I don't know if we should turn our lights off because I don't really want to turn lights off in here. And also keep this in mind as well. this exact same trail was where a guy named Gary Hilton, if you look him up, he was a serial killer. And I was actually camping that same weekend that he killed this older couple on this trail. He killed them on the same trail we went hiking on.

And we encountered this guy like a day after he killed. I can't remember their name. I do remember their name. But anyways, he killed this couple on the same trail. And then I guess how he escaped was we were camping the day after he killed him, probably two miles down the mountain. But we encountered this guy talking to us, and he was acting weird as hell. And we had actually encountered a campsite that was ravaged by a bear.

And like we were up there looking at this campsite because we were like, what in the hell happened? I mean, it looked like a freaking hurricane game through here. I mean, there were two tents, like brand new tents. They had shit everywhere. I'm talking about they had, they left everything. Like, and I'm assuming the bear came when they were there. Because everything they had there.

And it had to have been like, I don't know, four, five, six people. Because they had cases of beer. They left. They had bottles of wine, which we took and drank. There were toothpaste. Those people, we're sorry if you're, listening. No, but there were tubes of toothpaste that, and this is how I knew it was a bear, because

the food items, they had bite marks in them. And especially, I remember, the toothpaste bottles. The toothpaste bottles, which were like three or four of them, they brought toothpaste. These, there were bear marks. There were teeth marks in them. And even some of their food, like, had, it was ripped open. Food was gone. Packages were, like, ripped.

Their tent was like, their damn sleeping bags. are shredded. I mean, it was everywhere. And I was like... They might have been some of the missing people they're looking for. No, I don't know. It was the weirdest thing to come across that because we were camping two campsites down below them.

And we were like, holy shit. Like, these people just left, I guess. Like, and it probably happened at night. And so while we were up here looking at this shit, there was this weird guy that came down the trail. He was a bald kind of dude. He had a camo jacket on, probably mid-60s. He had like a sort of gray, like a rough, rough, like beard type shit.

And he, like, he, like, kind of came up there and walked up there. And, you know, at first I was like, yeah, of course he's going to look. But he had no gear. He had nothing with him. He had a knife, like on the side. And he was like, yeah, he's like, looks like something happened, these people, you know, and blah, blah. And he's like, yeah, it's like, I know, it's crazy. And but it was like, when he was talking to him, it was like, this is kind of weird.

But anyways, and then, like, five minutes later, he was like, we started walking down. I was like, damn, I remember saying, I will never forget this. I remember saying something. I was like, these freaking gnats are all over me. And then he just appears again.

He's like, hey, he should take one of these pine things. And he said, if you just brush him around your head, like the gnats will go away from it. He was just weird. And then, so we went to campsites down

and we get set up and all this stuff. Thought the dude was walking that way because that's the way he was walking when we saw him walking out. basically. And then it was like 30 minutes later, we saw this guy walking back up the trail this time. And by the way, we were probably, we were probably 75 yards off the trail where the campsite was by the river. We saw him walking back up the trail. And he's like just looking, walking slowly at us and just like staring at us. And I was like, what in the hell of this dude's deal? And it freaked us out, right?

Yeah, you kind of get that feeling, that eerie feeling when you know something's not right. Yeah. So then, so he kind of, so, so then as he walks up, the trees start, so we can't really see where he goes beyond there, right? And then like five or ten minutes later, we see him just peeking around the damn trees looking at us. Stopped, not even walking, just, you can see him peeking around the trees. Like he was trying to hide or just. I guess. I guess he was trying to hide, but I mean, he wasn't really hiding. I mean, we could see him. And so, uh, you could see him. And so, uh, you were. It was me, Gavin Michael, I think, that was camping this weekend. And I told, because we had a gun with this. And I told Gavin, I was like, I'm going to take my gun out. Like, I'm just, you know. Cleaning it or something. Yeah.

Just so he knows. Because, like, this was literally my thought. Because he was, like, freaky. Yeah, he was weird. And so I started doing that. And then as soon as I started, like, taking my gun out and all this shit, he just, he starts walking now and just, and never seen him again. And then that night, like, we barely had phone service that night. But anyways, that night or, yeah, it was that night, there were helicopters that kept flying over.

Like, I mean, it was like every 10 minutes. And we were like, what in the hell is going on? So then the next day, we walk out, because we still have two days in the woods. We walk out and get to a hill. I have a voicemail from my mom. And my mom's like, someone killed a couple, like right up from where you, you. you guys are camping. And so she's like, I just want to let you know.

They're searching for him up there, all that shit. So anyways, we get out of the woods like two days later. They have his picture on the freaking news. And it is this dude. And so he had got out of the woods, stole somebody's car, somewhere around the woods, went to a bank, like right down the mountain. Once you get out of the mountain, there's a bank right there in Brevard. He was using the people he killed his credit card for money.

He took out shit tons of money And it has him on the camera Like you know And I remember seeing that camera shot And he was wearing the same shit that we saw him wearing Oh my God And this was the guy That was the dude

And like We often talked about it I was like I wonder if he was really gonna try to kill us Like Yeah I mean he could have easily If he wanted to or try to But there was three of you

He didn't have a gun though I know but he killed an older couple But you had three younger guys right Yeah, and he killed a couple with, like, a stick or something. He, like, beat him over the head. But then he didn't get caught then. He made his way to Florida, killed a woman in Florida. I think he had killed, like, four or five people during this whole, like, thing.

So we can both say we've had encounters with serial killers before. Yeah. But anyway, so my story, and then we're going to go. My story was when we went camping, one of the guys that we had went on that trip where we sound, saw the serial killer. We had went to where he killed this couple. This was after the fact. And so we'd get back in there,

bats flying, weird shit, whatever. And we find this little campsite right off the trail. There's, and we find, the campsite is right before this little creek where there's a little bridge. If you go over the little bridge, there's a hill you go up. And it goes, you go up this hill,

and then you come back down the hill. And then if you look to the left next to the river, there's like four, other campsites. You remember the place we went where we put the wine in the thing. Kind of remind you that, like how the campsites are down by the river and you can, they're off the trail, but, you know, they're kind of open. They got, you know, trees and stuff. So anyways, we had set our tent up and all this stuff. And I went down to the little creek, which is off the trail, because there's a bridge off the trail and you got to go on this creek.

I went off to that trail because I was going to get water because it was easier to get water from there because there was a creek on the other side of our campsite, you know, that was just harder to get to. And so I was going to get water and there's a cop red like in the freaking creek. Like I was literally about to put my hand right next to it. And it was this massive cop red. And I was like, oh shit. And it freaked me out anyway. And I was like, a damn cop red now. And we've experienced cop reds in the middle of woods too. And you know, you just get freaked out when you see a venomous snake that you almost get bit by in the middle of freaking nowhere. So we get back to the campsite. We got the fire going, everything. And we start hearing this crazy, like, it sounds like, it almost sounds like a church or like, I mean, it's just strange.

We hear, I mean, and by the way, this is like 1 o'clock in the morning at this time. We're just drinking some beers by the campfire or whatever. The ones that you stole? No, no, no. This is a different time. Yeah, this was after the fact. Okay. No, we're drinking beers by the campfire.

and so we hear like sounds what sounds like over the hump you know which is we're camping right before you go up the hill and then back down the hill into that valley kind of like a small mountain hump yeah and so but you could hear over the hump it sounded like a damn like a choir or something or it was weird it would sound like chanting or something and you know it was like one o'clock in the morning and we're like what the hell is that and we kept hearing it we thought we were like i was like i don't know what the hell i mean first we thought it was like a animal or some weird shit so then we're like we're gonna go see what the hell this is so we get her headlants on we walk across the bridge the same place that damn copperid was which i was like i we got

look for this because like i when we were going over it was like i don't know where he went so he went over the thing started going up the hill and as you're going up the hill the whole valley is glowing. I mean, like, it looks like a freaking forest fire. And so we get over the hill and we're starting to walk down there. And there is this massive fire. Like a bonfire kind of? At one of the campsites, yeah.

This massive fire. And remember, there's no other cars in the parking lot where we came from. It's just us. And so, and no trails connecting to this. So we go over this thing. and also keep in mind that where this campfire was, we camped basically where the circle turns. The circle turns, the loop turns right where,

like if you walk past where I was talking about where the fire was, the circle starts turning back. But that's also where if you go straight from the end of that loop, you would end up in the middle of the wilderness. And so we see this fire, and then we walk down a little bit further, and they're chanting some crazy shit. And I don't even know what it is.

It's not English. It's some kind of like tongues, weird satanic shit. I mean, that's what it was. And they all had these like black robes on with hoods. Oh, my God. And it was like 15 people. Were they like in a circle and like kind of dancing? Yes, no, they weren't dancing.

They were in a circle around the fire. And they all had these dark hoods on. It was literally like, it was like, it was like a dress. It was like a one-piece black robe that they had a hood on. So you couldn't see their faces or anything. No, couldn't see shit about them.

And they were chanting all this shit. And they were all doing it perfectly in tune. Or not in tune. Like they all had the same chant. So it was like a chant that they all knew. It was like something you would hear like an African tribe would do. But it was like some kind of weird satanic type sounding shit. And it was this massive,

fire and they would like and then they would throw something on a fire for once in a while that would like create sparks up like it was just weird and it was automatically like this is some cult shit like we knew it did you guys like book out of there no so so so anyways so we uh what we decided to do was um get the fuck out of there number one because we're like hell with this like we were going to go asking what they're doing because like I mean the thing is like we knew that they weren't parked where we were. We don't even know where the hell they came from. And we did leave that night, but we didn't leave the forest completely, but we did leave. And then the next day, we went back there because, well, first of all, we wanted to go back there to see what the hell was what was up with that. And I think Michael may have left something there that day, too, so we were going to go back anyway. So we hiked back in there. It was the next day. Saw the fire. And there was like was a fire still going or is it smoking or was it out and he could just tell what the fire was no i mean it was definitely like there i mean it was like you could tell there had been a fire yeah i think it might have been smoking or something i don't remember but there was a black robe that was um left there mcuh swear there was a black robe left there michael probably still has it i need to i need to actually calm because he took it uh oh yeah he took the robe yeah and it was like a very thick like woven uh material it was like

It wasn't, it had no tags, no nothing. It was a, it was almost like it was made, right? So Michael took it. I remember that. And it was almost like a, I don't know if you ever saw this stuff that like hippies wear. I know it sounds weird, but like the, it's almost like burlap. Yeah, the shirts. It's almost like the burlap, like the thick stuff.

Well, it was made out of that, but it was all black. Anyway, so we walked, we were trying to figure out like, where the hell of these people come from? We walked kind of around the trail or whatever. like we're going around the circle. And there's this trail that kind of cuts in to the trail. And it's just a, no one goes on it, but you can tell people have been walking through there. And we walked a little bit back through there,

and we get to this, like, little ledge. And you can just see the little trail go off in the middle of nowhere. And these people had to have come from there. But then we even looked at the maps and stuff where we're just trying to see if it connected to, like, parts of other trails. It didn't. It just goes in the middle of nowhere.

And they're just vanished. Yeah. But one robe is still there. One robe is, well, it ain't still there now. Because Michael probably still has it. I need to ask him about that. I wonder if he's had like any issues since he took that robe. But he's, no, but Michael was the type of person.

He was like, I'm going to take this shit. Like, I mean. And he's probably gone through all kinds of crazy stuff. I'm having this crazy robe with him. I don't think he has that I know of. But yeah, I mean, we still, I mean, and that, that, so if we say, are there feral people? I kind of wonder if they were. Well, I think that, too, I think there's a different.

Well, I don't know if it's a difference or not, but I know there is people that practice Satanism or witchcraft and stuff. Because I've had experiences with that in Colorado. Very similar of what you're talking about, but I wasn't camping or anything, but it was by the missile silos out in Aurora, Colorado. And that's a whole different story. But it's very similar from what you're saying. But when we encounter that, they had drums with them. There was like drums going on. Well, yeah, I mean, well, it sounded like these people should have had drums, right?

Like they didn't have drums. I guess they haven't made those yet in the woods. But it should have sounded like. There's one other instance I'll tell you about, and this is, and I think I might have told you about this. You can ask my mom about this. This is no bullshit. So mom and then behind where mom lives, there's over a thousand acres of land. Well, some of that's been gone now because they put.

part of that neighborhood we went up through the other day. But a lot of that behind moms are still there, and it goes all the way back and into Etiwa and all that. And so when I used to go up there and hike, and this is a weird thing, I used to go up there. We used to spend a lot of time up on the top of the mountain. We used to hike up there, it was two, three miles back in there. And one day we hiked back in there, and we found this little trail, the offshoot, and this is the middle of the woods. There were these almost like closed lines that were tied between trees. And they had, well, first of all, they had these cloth things.

They were like one foot by six inch cloths, almost like a whatever. But they had these depictions on them that were like horses with Satan riding them. And they were like, I swear to God, they were lined up like 10 in a row. They were all lined up. And then there were these things made out of wood that was. like, look like, not even crosses, but like just different shapes of different

things that were made out of wood, or vines, or whatever to hell. And it was some kind of satanic ritual shit. Now, where that came from or who put that out there? I have no idea. Still this day, never seen anybody up there. None of that shit, but all this stuff was up there. Now, here's the weird

thing about that is these cloths had different scenes of like some kind of satanic shit on them. And when we first saw them, and we we knew we had been through this trail before, right? We had been through this trail before, but we never seen this. And then one day we'd went through this trail, and they were all here. But the weird thing was these claws looked like they were old as shit, because they were faded.

But you could see what it was. So we had went camping up in, on the other side of Pisgah National Forest, which is where I've talked about a lot of these things. We went camping back up and there, went off a trail one day. there was something very similar as far as what these shapes of like handmade vine wood things but they also had whatever these damn cloth things were were in Pisgut as well and they had these like it was like five or six of them and it always had something with horns riding horses and all this other weird symbol shit and what we did know is like the symbols in these cloth almost kind of look like the symbols that were made in the wood.

So it was something satanic. And the weird thing was we found it up on the mountain behind moms, and we also saw that in the middle of Pisgah National Forest. That's weird. Yeah, it is weird. So that makes you think that there are probably groups of these people that probably live there. Yeah, I think the night that we saw the people around the fire with the black robes, I think they were feral people.

I think that was, I think that was either a tribe or a group of people. I don't know why they would do it. Maybe they were sacrificing a human that day. Who the hell knows? The people that were in those tents that got demolished by bears. Yeah, it could have been. Yeah, who knows? But, I mean, that's the strange thing.

We don't know. I mean, we might want to say like UFOs or Bigfoot or all this shit, but what people don't understand is, like, there are people that live in the middle of the woods that have never encountered the public or never will. And I think the government knows about these people. I think, you know, there's a lot of people know about these people. And if they do encounter the public,

the public goes missing. Well, here's the thing. So a lot of these feral people, they say that, like, they have been there longer than National Forests have been there. So there is a, I think there's something, there's documents within the government

that talks about people that lived on these lands before. And so it's almost like they can't do anything with them. Could they have been like before, even like, Native Americans? Well, I mean, I don't know. I think it was just like generations and generations and generations even before a lot of these national forests.

And I think that there are actual laws or stipulations that the government can't technically take them out of their area. Well, that's part of, you know, the amendments, your constitutional rights. Yeah. You know, freedom of religion. That's, you know. Well, it's not even just freedom of religion. I'm saying I think they just can't take. I mean, it's just like squatters, for example.

If you can live long enough on a piece of land, it's yours. You have squatters rights. Yeah. It's yours. I mean, it's like if you can go somewhere and live there for, I think it's like 10 years or whatever it is, and no one kicks you out of there. Then it's yours. Then it's yours. You own it.

Technically. Yeah. And it's hard to get people out of. Even if people are squatting on your. Yeah. Even if they're squatting on your own land, it's hard to get them out of there. Yeah. If you have tribes of people, man, it would be awesome to do.

I mean, it would be also dangerous. But it would be awesome to do a. documentary to try to find these people. Oh my God. Would that not be nuts? We would have to have some security. Well, yeah, you'd have to have like dudes with like ARs and M-F, you know. I would never just go out with like V-A-U and the dogs.

No, hell no. Now, you'd have to have like an army of people that go in and find these people, like SWAT members. I know, but they'd probably go into the hiding in the caves and you'll never find them. Yeah, you're probably right. And see, that's the thing about the cave systems. There are tons of caves in North Carolina. There are tons of caves in Kentucky. There are tons of caves in the Appalachian Mountains that,

many people, you know, mostly unexplored. And so yeah, you're right. I mean, are these people living in the caves? And are they even people? We don't know. They could be half people. But, you know, but look, a large part of the disappearances could possibly be from feral people.

It could be. Or cannibals or whatever they want to call. Our Satan worshippers. Yeah, I... Scary people. Listen, I do want you guys to go and look up the feral people movie. And let me see, let me just see before we get off here.

I want to see if I can find it. Because if I see the name, because it might be, who knows what it'll bring up. Farrell people horror movie. I think it's like a horror movie, basically. It was scary to me. We need to watch it again. Yeah, we need to watch.

Maybe we should do that tonight. Well, there is a movie called Farrell. I don't know if that's it or not. Farrell? Well, the movie we watched was about this feral community, and these people come up onto this community, and they go into the community, and they won't let them leave, basically, is what happens. And their families are all looking for them because they were hikers and they were campers or whatever. Yeah. And they disappear.

And so all the families are looking for them. They just disappear out of nowhere, kind of like what we're talking about tonight. But this community of feral people pretty much kidnapped them. I'm not sure it's the, I don't think it's the movie Farrell. That's not what we watched. I don't know. We'll have to figure that out. But it was a wacko movie, but I bet you it happens.

I was just trying to find wrong turn. Is that what it could be? It might be that wrong turn. The hills have eyes. I don't know if that's, yeah, it might, let me see what wrong turn is. Let me just see that. That might be it because our, I remember it was a couple.

I thought they were camping or something, but maybe they were driving. It's a wrong turn. Oh, hold on. I think this is it. Wrong turn. 2020. Is that what it is?

Is this a movie? There is a wrong turn, and it's a 2020 movie. It's on a prime video. I don't know if that's it or not. Well, we have to go watch it and... It looks like it, though. I post it on Facebook or let people know.

I'm pretty sure it's wrong turn. You need to watch that. It's crazy. Yeah. It's the new wrong-turn reboot. I think that could be it. It could be it. Wrong-turned-the-foundation.

That could be it. Check it out. I don't know. Check it out. See if you guys can find it. But either way, man, like, just be weary when you go out in the woods. Well, there's just things going on and people disappearing out of nowhere. And these could be the reasons.

And look, if you listen to a Hollow Earth podcast, you know. Yeah, that could be. could explain some of that. And it may not be feral people. It could be something else that we don't even know about. All right, guys, that's going to do it for us on this Investing Earth podcast episode. We thank you for listening. We love you.

And until next time, peace out.