Investigate Earth Conspiracy Podcast - Our Interview with Phil Lyman | Nearly a Year Before the Charlie Kirk Assassination

Episode Date: October 16, 2025

This interview with Phil Lyman was originally recorded in September 2024, nearly a year before the tragic assassination of Charlie Kirk. At the time, Lyman was running for governor of Utah. In this conversation, he opened up about what he believed to be deep corruption within Utah politics, his time in jail for standing up to the federal government, and why he suspected Governor Spencer Cox may have cheated in the race. We’re reuploading this episode now because recent allegations from Candace Owens have put Phil Lyman back in the spotlight. This is the original interview, unedited, for historical context and transparency. Subscribe and follow Investigate Earth Podcast for more unfiltered interviews and deep dives.Also Check Out Our Fall Merchandise Here

Hey guys, wanted to break in with a quick little note before this episode. This is a re-uploaded episode from one year ago. This is when we had Phil Lyman, the governor candidate for Utah, on our podcast to discuss the corruption that was going on that he believed was really going on leading up to Spencer Cox being elected governor of Utah. The reason why I think this is an important listen and just a re-listen is for a couple of reasons. Number one, Candice Owens has been speculating or consistent. spiritualizing, I guess you can say that Phil Lyman and his family somehow had something to do

with the Charlie Kirk assassination. Oh, we had covered that probably a couple of weeks ago. But and I think on that episode, I said, look, you know, we kind of know Phil. He's been on the podcast. We know people to know him. And so I do want you guys to re-listen to this because regardless of whatever Candace says on that particular episode where she calls out Phil Lyman and she speculates all this stuff. It is also very interesting to me how Phil felt like he was screwed, essentially in that election, and he also covers in this episode the corruption and how corrupt it was in Utah. I find that interesting, especially considering that, you know, a year or so later, you have Charlie Kirk assassination in Utah, conveniently in Utah with Spencer Cox,

the governor, not saying Spencer Cox has anything to do with it. All I'm saying is, this governor is the main one that came out and gave this, you know, this, this glorious speech. I think it was probably a couple of days after the assassination. The other reason is we're traveling. We're kind of doing a lot of things right now, but we will have a brand new episode out in the next couple of days. So I just wanted to check in, say, we miss you guys. We're going to be back very soon. But I do think this is an important episode for you guys to listen to.

Give us your thoughts on what you think about, Phil, what you take from this interview. And we will talk to you very soon. Peace out, guys. Hello and welcome to Investigator's podcast. I'm your host chat alongside my beautiful wife, Sherry. On tonight's episode, we got a very special guest by the name of Phil Alignment. He is the governor-candidate of Utah going up against Spencer Cox, although there has been some funny business, it sounds like maybe over there in Utah.

Phil, welcome to the show. Thank you so much for taking the time to do this with us. Oh, thank you. It's great to be on. Appreciate it. Yeah, so Phil, you have been a representative of the state of Utah for how long now? Six years. Six years.

And so you are a Republican candidate in Utah. And just first tell me what made you want to run for governor of Utah to begin with? Well, it's kind of what got me into politics. Early on, Ramford County Commissioner in 2010 in San Juan County. and it was in response to some serious bad policy on the part of the Bureau of Land Management and some damage that they did to people in my community. And so I ran for County Commissioner and did that for eight years and saw the same thing happening. I thought maybe I could have an impact the legislature.

It got to the legislature. Saw the same thing happening there, just a lot of backdoor dealing and to the detriment of the people that were supposed to be serving. and so I decided I was going to run for governor. I felt like our governor was very weak and very vulnerable. And so I decided to run for governor. Awesome. And so before we even get into the Utah saga and kind of some of the stuff that has went on in your situation,

which is primarily why you're on. But tell our listeners, what is your stance on Donald Trump and kind of what's been going on, especially in this election season? obviously you have Kamala Harris that has now been placed into the position to be the candidate, whereas Joe Biden was basically forced out, which obviously there were many people that did not think Joe Biden was doing anything because there was many times that Joe Biden was seem like maybe he had dementia, whatever the case was. And everybody was like, look, you know, who was actually running our country? And then Kamala Harris, which was extremely unpopular, the entire presidency, she had one job, it seemed like. as borders are, which she did not do. And now all of a sudden, it's like she's the most popular presidential candidate in history.

What is your stance on all that? Well, it's so interesting. Without a convention process, nobody voted for Kamala Harris. And there she is, you know, in that spot. Because I guess because President Obama tapped her as the next, as the go-to person. So, so strange. But as far as Trump goes, I've been an unashamed supporter of Donald. Trump for a very, very long time. Before he ever ran for president, I thought he was just a really

great business person. I admired him a lot. And then going back to my county commission days and kind of standing up to the federal agencies, I ended up getting prosecuted in a real ridiculous, you know, politically motivated case and spent 10 days in jail and, you know, hundreds of thousands of dollars in attorney's fees. But anyway, I ended up getting a pardon from, from Donald Trump. My loyalty was already there before that, but I have a little bit of a connection with him through that whole process. He came out to Utah, reduced to the Bears Bears Year's National Monument that was really an onerous thing that the Obama administration had put on us. So lots of reasons that I'm, that I'm, you know, kind of have an affinity for for the man

himself. But going forward, he is absolutely my choice for president. So were you politically prosecuted? Yeah. Yeah. Federal court, it was a, they charged me with conspiracy to trespass, a misdemeanor charged for conspiracy to trespass. And no one's ever heard of it before or since. But we had a, we had a demonstration.

And it wasn't a protest. It was an event about, about, you know, 600, 700 people showed up. And then four months afterwards, they'd be. They charged me with conspiracy to trespass, and it was really ridiculous. And you spent 10 days in jail for that? They wanted to put me away for two years. Wow. Had four federal judges recused to the eviction.

They recused because we pointed out, hey, you've got a conflict of interest. They're very tied to the environmentalist groups that were pushing this whole thing. and my attorney at the time said, you know, you'll never get a federal judge to recuse. You're going to end up going to jail for five years. And I said, well, he's got to recuse. He clearly has a conflict. So we made the motion to recuse. He recused and then three other judges after him recused before we went to sentencing.

And by the time we got to the sentencing, fortunately, the judge had a little bit of common sense. And he actually had a prosecution. I thought he should have, you know, just out the whole deal. But instead, he said, well, you were convicted. And so he sends me to 10 days in federal jail, the purgatory correctional facility to be exact. Wow. That is unbelievable. And so what was your demonstration about, Phil, if you don't mind this asking?

Well, we had, it was on a road closure, but it was not about the road closure. It was about the BLM essentially. taking over all of the industry, the productive industries in San Juan County. We're roughly 90% owned by the federal government in my county. And so we watched as the logging industry was shut down, the extractive industries were shut down, the cattle industry was being under attack. And we knew this national monument was being proposed,

the Berger's National Monument. And I had a town hall meeting, and I told the people, I said it is going to happen. The federal government, when they decided they're going to do some, it's going to happen, but the narrative will be that we wanted it and that we were okay with it, unless we make a little bit of noise. So we had this protest. And we did it on this little canyon, about a mile from my front door on a road that they said was, that the area was closed to off-road travel.

So we stayed on the road, did everything in order, BLM had a long conversation with them before, and I had it on record. They said, oh, yeah, don't worry. No one's going to be arrested. We're not going to do anything like that. Have a good celebration. They thanked me afterwards for keeping everything on the up and up. And then it was the environmentalist group five months later.

Got a big petition going. And I'm sure you don't know who Tim de Christopher is, but he had gone to jail for protesting the BLM on the environmentalist side several years earlier. and their thing was, well, he went to jail, so Phil has to go to jail. And the U.S. attorneys just prosecuted me based on their petition. So it's crazy. Phil, that's interesting because, I mean, obviously, a lot of our listeners, you know,

and we've actually even talked about Bureau of Land Management land. And, you know, if you live out west, there are massive swaths of land that you can do a lot of stuff on. I mean, you can go camping on. You can go hiking on. You can do all these amazing things. You can even land airplanes for the backcountry bush. Yeah, the bushcraft flyers. And but also you don't always think about it as a way of maybe government control of land.

You know, they want you to believe, hey, guys, look, you can do all this fun stuff. You can go hike in. You can go camping. You can do all this. But in the end, it really is a control of land by the government. And as you were saying, I guess to you, maybe it seemed like the government was trying to take over land. shutting and killing out industry, which is what the Democrats have done so very well since, especially, you know, obviously the Joe Biden administration came in, but even under Obama as well.

Yeah. Well, that's, you know, and that's what I've said many, many times in these meetings is they come in and they say, hey, you don't need oil and gas drilling. You can replace that income in your community with recreation and tourism. And they're not wrong. Recreation is a huge industry. So that goes away. Then they say, you don't need logging.

you don't need grazing. And once they've shut down all of those productive industries, then they come back and they say, you know, we really don't like recreation and tourism either. And you've got nothing to fall back on, and they shut it down. And that's what happens. I mean, they're closing over 1,000 miles of roads

have been closed just this year by the Biden administration through the Bureau of Land Management. And that's, it's honestly, it's mean-spirited. It's kind of a Marxist flex on these communities. that, hey, we can and we will. And that's the scary part about it is that they have not only the ability to do it, but they have the inclination to shut down your economies of these rural communities. Yeah, for sure.

Phil, and as we get into kind of the conversation with what your situation is now in Utah, how bad do you think things are in America right now? I mean, you know, obviously you have two separate parties and you have two, very distinct set of people in this country that are so divided on so many issues. Whereas obviously you have the left and a lot of the people on the left on platforms like X. They're saying, oh my gosh, if Donald Trump gets in, we're done. That's the end of democracy. And obviously, you know, obviously you have the right, which has demonstrated, in my opinion, many times that if they are actually back in and continue to get into office, that it actually

will be the end of our freedoms. How important, number one, do you think this 2020, election is for America. Oh, I think it's so important. The fear that I have is that the election itself is kind of a front for their whole process. I've got a big seminar I'm doing this week on elections. And Greg Stenstrom wrote a book called Parallel Elections, which really speaks to me. It's like you have the election that people see. And then you've got the actual election that's taking place, or if you can even call it an election.

And so the election, I honestly believe, is a little bit of a front for a whole separate process that the elites have in place to make sure that their candidates are the ones that appear to have won the election. So, but yeah, it's huge. 2024. I think if we if we lose, if the people lose their hold on that process, I don't think they're going to get it back. Yeah, I agree. And I've actually been saying on this podcast for six or eight months or maybe even, I don't know, a year and a half, two years, whatever. It just seemed like 2020 was strange, without even going into crazy detail, but you have someone like Joe Biden that, you know, apparently. The most popular president in the world. Yeah, history. 81 million votes, which

is insane and yet he, you know, was going to campaign rallies where there were 20 people. And, you know, obviously they blamed on COVID. But start to tell us a little bit about your situation. So you got Spencer Cox, which is the current governor of Utah. And what has been your process? I have heard a lot of stuff kind of leading into this show about what I think is just crazy. But how do you think that this process of you running for governor, in Utah has went.

Well, yeah. So I guess how it's gone is that it has really shined a light on things that had to come to light in Utah. Spencer Cox, he campaigns as a conservative right up until he wins the primary election with the Republicans. And then he switches and he campaigns as a liberal. And he's flip-flop back and forth. When he, right after he won the election four years ago, he signed a compact. to implement DEI as a policy in Utah. And everyone thought, well, that DEI was kind of a new thing,

diversity, equity, and inclusion. And people were like, well, I don't know that that makes a lot of sense, but okay, he's got this big heart, apparently. We'll find out after the fact that it was COVID money. He received roughly a billion dollars to the governor's office. One of the conditions was that 10% of that would be used to promote DEI in Utah. and that the kids would remain masked throughout the school year. And that was never, it was never disclosed.

We thought that we were keeping the kids in masks, you know, to save grandma and grandpa. And that was what the kids were being told, you know, scared to death. And then, and then we find out, no, this is all, it's just such a money game with Spencer Cox. And he's very involved with the National Governors Association. He's the president of that. He joined the Biden climate, American climate. Climate Corps, the only Republican governor to do so. He's basically a Gavin Newsom 2.0 type of guy. And then for me, the real rope came to the public lands and the, you know, swapping out what we call our state school sections.

In the West, we have these sections of land that are controlled by the state. He was swapping those out to the Bureau of Land Management, basically to appease the environmentalists and kind of give up our birthright there. So very much, you know, he uses his pronouns with grade school kids. He vetoed the bill that would have kept boys from competing in girls' sports. All of these things that you would expect from a far left-leaning Democrat governor. And yet he's got an art by his name and expects, you know, to be respected for those things. So all of that's kind of come to light over the last four years. He's very unpopular in Utah, except for those that are kind of on the receiving end of this syndicate.

that promotes big development in 15-minute cities and controlling all the water, things like that. So it really is kind of like this, the elites versus the, you know, the common man. Yeah. The common man, yeah, exactly. Yeah, it's so weird how you speak about a lot of this stuff because we talked about, we have talked about so much of the stuff. Yeah, we talk about all that. And you don't normally hear a politician using those kind of words like that. Well, the ones you do, though, they go after.

and they want to shut up and they want to destroy. Oh, for sure. And, you know, those are the people that you need to be following. And, you know, back to your point, he vetoed a bill on banning transgender girls from participating in girls' sports, you know, which is insane. That is a far-left movement, his response to COVID-19. Talk about the immigration policies that Spencer Cox has kind of been a part of. I mean, obviously, many conservatives have accused him of turning Utah into a sanctuary state for illegal immigrants.

obviously if you look at what's going on in Aurora, if you look at what's going on in Chicago, although they're trying to downplay what's going on in Aurora, Colorado, and basically everywhere that's, I mean, you look at Colorado, you look at, you look at Oregon and Washington. There's so many places New York has become just a cesspool of violence and crime, and a lot of this is contributed.

Some of this is at very least contributed to immigration. I think they said three out of four crimes in mid-town. New York just over the past year has been in the hands of immigrants. So regardless of however, you know, you look at this, that is a actual stat. And it is happening. What is Utah, like, how do you see Utah as far as the immigration? Is it, you know, Utah has always been known as this state that everybody loves. It's a beautiful state.

You know, you got a place to go skiing. Yeah. Well, it's just a very vibrant thing. And I think it's been known for quite a while as a Republican state. what happened? How is it in some ways become a sanctuary state, I guess? Is it because of Spencer Cox? Yeah, yeah. And it's interesting. Utah is kind of a unique state because we have this really kind of dominant culture in Utah because of the LDS church. And I'm a member. And it's, you know, I understand all that. But I believe that Utah is a little bit of an experiment for the for the globalist to say, hey, Utah seems like a place we could implement some of these things.

And we have a reputation for being really, you know, compassionate, big hearts. And so the immigration thing is one of those is like, well, we're going to, you know, they're going to come in and they're going to implement these really aggressive immigration policies and tell the people all the while that they're doing it in the name of, you know, opening up to new Americans. And that's, you know, Spencer Cox throws that around, you know, talking about the New York. Utah and new Americans and getting driver's licenses to illegal immigrants and providing health insurance to illegal immigrants and all these things that have been really pushed through

him and through the legislature. And then when ICE comes out and says that we're a sanctuary state, then he gets all offended. You know, we are not a sanctuary state. It's like, well, it's not something that you, you know, fill out an application. You're designated by ICE as a sanctuary state because of your policies and those policies have been really, really friendly to illegal immigration. And what I say is, you know, states are going to have a certain amount of illegal

immigration no matter what they do, but we've had, we've created policies that make us not only a magnet for illegal immigration, but for illegal immigration by people with criminal intent because of our no detention policy for illegal immigrants. And, you know, we've got people, a guy was arrested here a few weeks back with 30 pounds of fentanyl, and it was like his 20th, 20th arrest for illegal drugs, but he was, he was a non-citizen, and so he's, you know, just catch and release, basically. And Phil, explain, you know, sanctuary states essentially, don't they basically have policies in place that ICE can't really do anything about immigration? I mean, is that what a sanctuary

state or city essentially is? It's interesting because ICE, ice, it's the federal regulation, that say you cannot detain a non-citizen for more than 72 hours in a facility that's not ICE approved. And then they give you all this list of qualifications that you have to do to qualify for an ICE facility. And we don't have any in Utah. Salt Lake County has like 13 beds or something like that. And they're the only ice facility in Utah. So if somebody commits a really serious crime, they're going to, either go to that Salt Lake facility or ICE is going to come and pick them up and take him to a

federal facility. But other than that, the counties are saying, well, we can't keep them. We're violating federal law if we detain them longer than 72 hours. So the officers that arrest him, take him to the court, the judge sees what he's dealing with, and he signs an order that that they're going to be released. We had four non-citizens that, you know, viciously, sexually assaulted a 14-year-old girl, videotaped it, and they got four years of probation. And people were like, why would they get probation? Why would they not be in jail? It's like, well, they're non-citizens. We can't detain them or will be in violation of federal law. And my mantra all the way through the election was, if they live in Utah and they break a law in Utah, they can sit in a Utah jail. tell the federal government to pound sand on their, on their, you know, saying that we're violating federal law. It's like, all right, we're still not letting him back out into our communities with our kids. And that's where I've differed from Spencer Cox because he stands up and proudly says,

well, in Utah, we obey federal laws. And it's like, you know, we're also a state and we also have an obligation to the people that live here. And if there's a federal law that is unconstitutional, such as that, then we should violate. And it's weird because we've said, no, we will not violate that law. And so I says, oh, well, then you're a sanctuary state because you don't have ice facilities and you won't put in ice facilities and you're going to release these people after 72 hours. Sorry, that was a long explanation. That's great.

That's what creates the sanctuary state designation. Now, Phil, I've heard about some signature stuff, right? I mean, how do you feel like that you have been kind of screwed over in this process for governor? When I heard this, I about died. I cannot believe what's going on in Utah with this. Yeah, it's not even that too, which we're going to get into also other, will the real Phil Lyman please stand up? Oh, yeah. But no, it just keeps getting weirder and weirder.

Yeah, so start with the signature aspect. Yeah. So a person can qualify to be an honest. the ballot through getting signatures versus going through the convention and the caucus and your local precincts. I went the convention route. I won the convention with 67, well, I guess rounded to 68%. And by the bylaws, if you get over 60%, you don't go to the primary.

You go straight to the general. But because Spencer Cox had gathered signatures, needed 28,000 valid signatures, then he forced a primary and then he wins the primary supposedly. But the problem is we said and in the past, and I mean like a couple of weeks before

people were saying can I see the signature packets of this candidate or that candidate? Yeah, come on in. Here they are. You can thumb through them. You can see if you see any problems. And when we asked to see Spencer Cox's, the answer was no, you can't look at these.

And the other twist on this is that the lieutenant a governor is over elections and they're on a single ticket with the governor. So essentially, the governor is in charge of his signatures, you know, safeguarding those. He's in charge of verifying whether the signatures passed. He's in charge of the election, counting the votes, all of these things. And then he's saying, no, you cannot look at my signatures. And we're saying, well, this is a new twist because, of course, opposing candidate. can look at the signatures. And anyways, we were denied that. So we sued. Went to district court. The district court kicked it down the road. We're still in district court.

We're going to appeals. But yeah, so we've not been given any access to the signatures, which is really, which is, which is a new twist. And so I've said, I don't believe he's got his signatures. I don't believe he got his 28,000 signatures. He only reported 28,0006. And that was after that, you know, vetted him and done whatever. And so it's not like he's got much of a buffer there. And please explain, Phil, who are these signatures from to our listeners? Oh, yeah. So it's a petition.

It's a public petition. They call it a nominating petition. And so signature companies, signature gathering companies hire these kids. and they hire these kids to go out and gather signatures and pay them money. The average cost is around $10,000 signatures, so $28,000 is $280,000. And anyway, they just go door to door, and the people that sign have to be registered Republicans, citizens of Utah, over 18, that kind of thing. And so that also goes back to what. what do you believe Spencer Cox's popularity?

I know you mentioned this earlier, but what is your consensus on the citizens of Utah? What do they think about Spencer Cox? Well, I mean, probably like anywhere else, there's a lot of ambivalence with people. Spencer is very unpopular with the conservatives. And he's actually quite popular with the far left with the Democrats. and they jump on to the Republican primary so they can help to keep them in office. But then in the middle, you know, it's just a bunch of people that are probably, you know, feeling okay about the incumbent.

But this last four years has been really, it's been a real challenge for people through the COVID, through the COVID years, and then our property taxes, average increase of close to 40%. People are not happy about that. So I guess it's a mixed bag. Again, it comes back to those people that are kind of in favor of the syndicate are really, really powerful in messaging that Spencer Cox is a popular and a, you know, and a great governor. The people who actually, you know, use their powers of observation are not happy. Yeah, so the 28, I mean, and that's funny because, you know, if you don't have any cross-reference for signatures here, how do you verify whether they are legitimate? Well, they won't even let them see the signatures.

Yeah, so who was responsible to verify 28,000 signatures in Utah? 28,0006 signatures. Yeah, is it the election board that does this supposedly, or how's that work? It's supposed to be each county clerk, but since this was a statewide race, typically it would be the lieutenant governor's office that would do that. They delegated it to the Davis County clerk's office. So one county that did all these. And this is an interesting thing because the same company gathering signatures for another candidate within a county,

they just qualified over a quarter of their signatures. And it was like I say, same company, same gathering. And they had a quarter of their signatures disqualified after the fact. And so we said, well, we want to look at Washington County signatures because it's the same people that are gathering for Spencer Cox. It's going to be that, you know, the guy goes out and he, you know, has a petition for. three or four people and you sign each one of those. So we thought, well, that's a good cross-reference. I'm a CPA, so I'm always looking at, well, how could you verify this?

So you say, yeah, we'll take, basically they counted the same batch of signatures, at least for this local race. And this guy had all of his disqualified, a huge amount of disqualified. Did those get disqualified on Spencer Cox? Easy cross-reference. And no way could we do it. In fact, when we asked to get the packets from Washington County, they initially said, okay, yeah, you can come and you can, you know, take what you need.

And then they came back and said, oh, sorry, there's a criminal investigation. You can't look at these signatures in Washington County. So we start digging into this, well, what's the criminal investigation? They said there's alleging fraudulent signatures, forged signatures, things like that. That's a pretty big deal. It's like, oh, we should definitely cross-reference this. But because it's a criminal investigation, you can't look at the Washington County signatures. It's what it was is it's just obstruction.

It's just another, it's a tactic to say, oh, guess what? Normally you can look at these, but because it's a criminal investigation, now you can't look at them. And then after we were denied, then they come back and they say, well, there's no, there's no criminal investigation. I don't know what the Limey campaign's talking about. It's like, well, you're on record here. It's just, it's like hide the ball. It's just a constant game of hide the ball. So your next option, obviously, if you get screwed this way, which it sounds like you are, I hate to say it.

I mean, if someone is not going to allow you to at least cross-reference the signatures for its validity, okay, fine. So what is your next option? Is it right in, you know, hey, let's get as many people to write us on the ballot to where maybe we can actually get elected in this election for governor? And how's that process turned out so far for you? Well, that's what we're down to. And it just becomes a matter of principle of saying, well, you know, we're not just

just going to be intimidated into a corner and slink away. We have options and we're going to use all of them. I told, I had a debate with the governor at the beginning and afterwards one of the reporters asked, you know, are you going to accept the results of the election? And I said, I'm going to, I'm going to verify the results of election no matter who wins. And, and, you know, importantly, I, you know, I had 68% at convention. The governor on the election, on the election night, he declared victory 23 minutes after the polls closed and was criticizing me in his speech for not conceding. And I'm saying, hey, come on, at least have a little bit of a fair sportsmanship. Let's wait until the election is a little further along.

But it's very orchestrated. And so, and then the, it's like when they deny our request for records, it's never just a, you know, like a friendly denial. Sorry, you know, losses, we can't give you these. it's always, you know, what idiots, you know, you didn't even do this and you didn't even follow this. And it's like, so it's really hard, you know, it's not a dignified approach to say to all the people that have supported me and still support me to say, you know, well, we're just going to quit. They've been, they've been really mean, so we're going to go away. And so we're in the middle of a rioting campaign. And it's got a lot of traction.

And the one thing it absolutely is doing, it continues. to shine a light and expose some of the practices. All right. So what about some other linens on the write-ins? Is that true that there are other alignments, potentially, that are, I guess, kind of in play for people to write in now? So, yeah. So all you had to write in, and we, you know, as of last week,

it was just Lyman. You could just write Lyman. And that's you, we've advertised that name, spent a lot of money, you know, get name recognition for the, for the, just the Lyman name. And it's, it's legal for another Lyman to put in. Yeah. What happened is last Tuesday, I get a message on X from a person that says, hey, my, my coworker named Richard Lyman just came and said that the Cox campaign offered him a thousand dollars if he had put his name on the ballot. It's like, oh, well, that's weird.

And I thought, I'm not going to, I'm not going to respond. to that or publicize that until we see something. Well, sure enough, on the day of the deadline, Richard Lyman puts in to run, and he has to put on a lieutenant governor by five o'clock the next day and ends up putting on Carol Lyman, his mother. Oh, my gosh. And again, if Richard and Carol want to run for governor and lieutenant governor, more power to him and then that we have to write Phil Lyman, I said it's just lineman. But the fact that if we can verify that he was offered this $1,000 or paid $1,000, that's a felony. That's not a campaign contribution.

That's paying somebody to interfere and obstruct an election. And that's exactly what I believe happened. Happened. You know, do I have faith that a judge is going to hear the case? Because judges are all appointed by the governor in Utah. Yeah. So they're a part of the system. I mean,

and the system, yeah. Yeah. And I want to explain to people, too, if they don't understand if, you know, the amount of money that you guys have spent to just write in linemen. And then when you have other linemen coming on the, you know, the ballot or the chance to be governor in Utah, this is obviously a campaign from the governor to distort, confuse and make it to where there is. going to be if someone writes in Lyman, whether they say, well, we don't know if it's Phil Lyman or not. That could be, you know, Richard or his mother, Carol.

A lot of times when people go vote, a lot of them will just do like straight Republican. They'll push the button. It says straight this, straight that. You know, unless you have a, you know, I guess what my point is is a lot of people are just going to push the button. They're not going to take the time to write any names down. And I just don't think this is a fair thing at all. I think he is so scared to have your name even on the ballot because he knows you'll win.

Yeah, and that's true, too. But also, you know, Phil, and by the way, when I go on X and I looked up Utah governor, one of the first posts I actually saw was Utah needs to write Phil Lyman. And that was the hashtag. Oh, yeah. Yeah, do you want a governor who won't use pronouns with school kids? Do you want a governor who won't push DEI hiring in schools? Do you want a governor whose education advisors aren't restorative justice cheerleaders?

And so now obviously this new hashtag is hashtag right in Phil Lyman and not random Lyman. And I actually did this research a little bit yesterday. And I was looking at our top states. We often do that. And surprisingly with the topics we talk about, California is our number one. But Utah. There's our popularity with our podcast. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Our demographics. California is number one. I think Utah is our number four. So Utah, there's a lot of people listening right now that are in Utah. And I want you guys to understand that if you want someone that is not a rhino, which is Spencer Cox, and you want someone that's actually going to have the same type of policies that are pro America. Phil Lyman sounds like he's your guy. Phil, I do want to get into this a little bit as well because we've talked about a little bit of globalism and elite. and kind of the system at play.

I want to ask you kind of just a topic that probably not a lot. I mean, there are some politicians that are talking about this. And like I said, most of those politicians are being canceled or silenced or whatever. And the only place for some of those people to talk nowadays are platforms like X, which is really the only where, I mean, sorry, the only place that you can speak freely if you are on the right or are pro-America, how bad do you really see this global issue to where they are affected in politics around the world? Because I don't think this is just happening, obviously, in the United States.

I mean, if you look at Europe, if you look at South America, Brazil, especially with the battle between X and Brazil and freedom of speech, do you really see that this globalism issue was a big, big issue to America and a big threat to our democracy, an actual threat to our democracy? Absolutely. And it's so well, it's so well organized and has the, you know, it has the, so much money behind it. And for example, the United Nations, they came out a couple years ago and said that they want to measure every drop of water. And that, you know, we've already got a carbon footprint. Now you're going to have a water footprint. They're going to have a protein footprint. And Utah, I'm sitting in my, as a legislator, I'm sitting in these meetings last October, a year ago, roughly.

And eight water bills come to the committee meeting. And they all say, you know, these come from the UEOC. I'm asking, well, what's the legislator? What's the UEOC? I've looked it up before. So I knew they didn't know what the UEOC was. And I said, well, it's the Unified Economic Opportunity Commission. Still nobody knows what that is.

Well, it's the governor. It's the executive branch and the executive agency leadership colluding with the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate. So it's a top down. It's this stuff is coming. It's like nobody knows where these bills come from. But what they do do is centralized control of all the water in Utah. Well, if you want to be the king in the West, you control the water. And they know that.

So it's like, well, who's behind these bills? And when you should start digging into it, even the people that are most passionately pushing them do not know what the source of it is. They just know that the Speaker wants it or the President of the Senate wants it or the governor wants it. And you reverse engineer that and you say, this is absolutely coming through the National Governors Association right from the United Nations down. And Utah wittingly or unwittingly is passing laws that play right into their hands of locking up all of our water resources. And it's going to have really negative impacts on people. before they realize what they've done, they're going to, it's going to be too late. Have you seen, by the way, have you seen all of the, I mean, obviously the Democrats for quite a while have

been talking about, you know, we want to limit our meat consumption, red meat in particular. Let's eat bugs. Yeah, let's eat bugs. You know, that's definitely the world economic form approach. And then you think about also, you know, it used to be a big conspiracy theory, right, that George Soros and and some of these big names, globalist elites that are pushing all of these prosecutors in these big cities like Los Angeles and Seattle and Portland and in all these places to essentially let people out of jail that commit violent crimes in a lot of cases.

And how much do you see this just in, I guess, local government or judges or prosecutors? Do you guys see that right now in Utah? Is that been an effect that you know of in your state? Yeah, in a really, in a really large way, we've got, well, I'll just, I'll just use the names. The Kim Gardner Institute, one of the biggest think tanks in the state has just grown and grown in influence with the state of Utah. Well, you get into it, you find out, you know, 30 years ago in the 1990s, you know, Governor Levitt at the time put together, basically a plan and it was and it was lined up with the world economic forum with the United Nations with Klaus Schwab in their in their offices they have you know Utah cradle of

the fourth industrial revolution which is Klaus Schwab's description of what we're going to have where we eat bugs we have our protein limited we have our carbon limited we have our water limited we live in 15 minute cities and Governor Cox came out so you know Utah you know we we were planning this big 15-minute city. We're going to be the first 15-minute state, whatever that means. Oh, my God. And you're saying, why? Why are we doing everything that Klaus Schwab wants? And you tie it back to this InVision, Utah and some really powerful people. And that's what running for governor, I told my supporters early on, I said, look, they've got billions and billions of dollars invested in it. They're not going to let somebody like me come in and become the governor of Utah. They're just not going to do it, no matter what it takes.

So winning the convention and then getting 46% in the primary election, you know, their heads are kind of spinning because no incoming governor loses the convention. And then comes that close to losing the primary. And then the people are, you know, people are just awake. They're just wise to it. And you start naming names like Kim Gardner Institute and like the Envision Utah project. And it just people's eyes open up and they're like, um, Yeah, they're not happy about it. I do got to mention this because, you know, our good friend Nathan Jones and Clear, you know, we've, we've had Nathan on this podcast quite a few times.

Yeah, he's fantastic. Yeah, we love Nathan. And, you know, he is a Utah resident. And, you know, one of the things he had, he and I had talked about before this episode was, you know, I think they had offered, what, 250,000 bottles of Clear during COVID. And I guess Utah turned it down on the who it was that did it. they essentially said, hey, well, that's not FDA approved, so not going to do it. And he was like, well, we're, you know, we're willing to offer this to citizens or people or, you know, places, especially considering all of the data that was kind of backing clear as far as what that showed with COVID-19, not just COVID-19, but also the flu virus. And there's very, you know, various things.

But during COVID-19, too, I mean, you think about Spencer Cox and, you know, you know, how he was kind of pro lockdowns in a lot of ways. He was going to pro-closed-nown schools. Pro mask. Masking children. Basically everything Spencer Cox did was like a Democrat governor. How did you think that Utah responded to COVID-19 in particular? Because I think that's kind of a good, you know, I guess starting point where if you want the same again, we'll look at what you had at that time.

How do you think you guys did on COVID-19? I mean, we were locked up with the Biden administration. And this was a huge financial play for Utah. Probably received more COVID money, definitely more COVID money per capita than any other state. But it goes further. So you declare a state of emergency. That gives the governor the ability to do what we call no-bid contracts. So they don't have to go through a bid process.

and then his own company, Nomi Health, ends up getting all these contracts nationwide to go and do testing. And so it's a bunch of tech companies that have no idea about viruses, but they get this to make several hundred million dollars on Nomi health. And then Nomi Health gets disparaged. And then at the beginning, some key players, including the governor, said, oh, hydrochloroquine. That seems to be really effective against COVID.

We're going to order all of this. Well, as soon as Trump became, you know, castigated for mentioning hydrochloroquine, then they pulled all of that and basically tried to prosecute the pharmacist for ordering hydrochloroquine. And that's the same era that Nathan found himself in with Clear. is like, okay, we don't want something that works. We want something that the left puts their stamp of approval on and Clear, you know,

being a company that actually had a product that was, you know, safe, effective. I mean, there's no downside to using Clear and it really, it really helps. But they didn't, that's not what they were interested. They had a business model and Clear was not one of the, But, you know, when you're picking winners and losers, clear was not on the winners list. Yeah. And, and Phil, how do you kind of classify that? Like, how many Republicans are also responsible for say that if you see a product like Clear or if Clear or a similar product gives evidence that, hey, this is safe at the very least?

It's not going to hurt you. And how many Republicans would vote against that? Or is there even votes on stuff like that to where they say, well, this is not. not FDA approved, so we're not going to use it, even if you're going to give us 250,000 bottles of it free. Yeah. So you've got, I always say schemers are always 10 steps ahead of people of goodwill. So most legislators are people of goodwill.

They're trying to do the right thing. But they just don't see what's, they don't see the scheme that's being laid down in front of them. So somebody like Claire, say that it was effective in preventing COVID. Well, if your business model depends on people getting COVID, then you're going to figure out a way to create legislation that bans people having access to clear products. And I'm not saying that's what happened. That is the mentality where people, I mean, and really with COVID,

I don't think anyone could deny that, you know, millions of people died because of policy. And they didn't need to. You know, Fauci was conflicted, and we did all this policy that ended up, you know, depriving families of their, of their dad, of their breadwinners, of their, it's so sad. It's so sad that we did all that. And I don't think anybody's going to, you know, any legislator knowingly, I shouldn't say any, maybe there might be a son, but they're not going to sit there and say, oh, I want to see. people die, they're just not, I don't know, you're being duped. You're being played by people like Spencer Cox who does know what's going on and has huge financial stake in these things. Yeah, and it goes back. I mean, like I said, I don't necessarily blame, you know,

individual legislators necessarily during COVID. I mean, it's very similar to, I guess, how you could say the war machine. I mean, you know, you know, the military industrial complex where it's like, you know, they want to tell you, hey, guys, we got to protect America. And so we must, we must vote for this and we must make sure that we have weapons for this and all this. But in the meantime, you know, these military industrial complex companies are making billions and billions of dollars. We saw the vaccine companies, you know, Pfizer and Moderna. We saw them making billions and billions of dollars, if not trillions.

It was the biggest wealth transfer in history, I believe, during COVID-19. and that's the scary part is like people are scared right and the citizens of America are scared and we've talked about things on this podcast that you know are conspiratorial although we do not go crazy on conspiracies most of basically everything we've talked about has been true and comes true yeah I mean and yes I mean we've entertained stuff here and there that's just kind of you know a little crazy but we always make sure that we tell people hey look we don't believe this, but let's, you know, let's let this guy talk. Yeah, let's let him talk.

And then I will say definitively on the podcast, well, I don't necessarily, I mean, look, look, we've had Bigfoot guys on this podcast. And love these guys. Don't necessarily believe in Bigfoot, uh, necessarily, but who the hell knows it is 24. Yeah. Getting back to, you know, what, and I'm going to ask a dumb question because I'm not from Utah and I don't know.

So I'm thinking Utah is usually a Republican state. And do you think? think that's why Spencer Cox pretends to be a Republican? Oh, yeah. Yeah, in Utah, except for Salt Lake City, which has some really strong Democrat precincts and communities, you almost have to be a Republican to get elected. So a lot of people just put an R by their name and run as a Republican, even though they have really Democrat or left-leaning, you know, ideas and policies.

Phil, let me ask you this too. You had mentioned Latter-day Saints. Obviously, Utah is very Mormon. And I talk to Nathan about that quite often. How much does your faith play into your outlook and vision on what's going on in the world today? Well, I mean, the scriptures are really important to me. So, you know, I read revelations. I read the prophecies.

I try to see what is happening on a biblical level. and I believe it. I believe in those things. So I'm looking forward to, you know, kind of end of times type of things. I don't think that that's conspiracy. I think that's real. Yeah, for sure. So definitely, definitely a religious person.

I believe in God. I believe that he's in charge ultimately. And, you know, person of faith with all of those things, which, you know, clearly that's, that has a dramatic effect on your Alec and things. But for me, I believe that, number one, you know, People are endowed by their creator with unalienable rights. So we have those just by virtue of being born. So personhood is important to me. Parenthood is important to me.

You know, communities, counties, I think, are better level government to take care of most of the on-the-ground things. So very much like disperse the power out as far as you can get it down the pipeline to the people that are most affected. And that is, I think that's so in line with who we are as Christians and believers. in, you know, free will and it's the American, it's the American dream. So ultimately, I think it really bolsters the whole idea of what it means to have a Republican form of government, to be an American. Yeah. Yeah, because we are, we are American.

I mean, and that's the thing. I think, yes, I mean, we're obviously accepting of other people for sure that want to contribute to our values and our culture, just like any other country would want you to do the same, you know, 10 years ago anyway. How dangerous do you see this election for America? And, you know, I don't want to ask too many more questions. But how dangerous is this election on either side if Kamala wins or Trump wins? Because even if Trump wins, I feel like the system in place, very similar to what we've

talked about with what you're going through. Right. To where they have this either mentality or ideology or. or global, I guess you can say influence to where they have to have. And listen, I've always said this. I feel like the globalists have to have America. It's like the last piece on the table. If you do not take out America, you don't have anything.

I mean, America has always been the beacon of hope, the beacon of freedom. It has been the lighthouse of the world. you know, if you're looking at how democracy actually should be for people, for government, America has been that light. And now we're looking at it to where that light is fading. And depending on what happens in 2024, we've already seen, I believe, in the past three and a half years under Biden. I mean, look at how the world has been affected by this administration.

And I don't think a lot of people realize that. But, you know, the Biden administration has affected the entire world. world in so many ways. And how dangerous is this election on both sides? I mean, and what happens if people, you know, Kamala Harris wins, landslide, some weird, crazy stuff happens? How dangerous is that? And then how dangerous is it if Trump actually wins and somehow, which is.

Yeah. I don't know. Yeah. No, it's such, it is the question of the of the day. And, you know, we. I was talking about the unhelea noble rights. I love the Declaration of Independence. And, you know, to preserve those rights, governments are instituted, deriving their just powers from the consent of the government.

And that's really an important thing because what we saw with Biden, yeah, he's the president. But did he really have the consent of the majority of the people to do what he was doing? And I don't think he did. And it became really an ineffective president. And I think that same thing is going to happen to Spencer Cox. I think he'll end up, you know, blaming the victory of the election in Utah. and I think he'll be very ineffective because so many people will be looking at him saying, you know, kind of like the emperor's new clothes, it's like you, you may have the title,

but what did you do to get that? Did you actually have the consent of the governed in Utah, or did you obtain that in some other way? So people, so on the one hand, yeah, the elections are huge. On the other hand, I'll say this too, social media, I told my people, social media is God's gift to our generation, and we don't really appreciate how powerful it is that we can still go out and on our own, sit through all of the falsehoods and all the truths

and come up with what we believe is right. But programs like yours that are out there, people can listen and they can say, you know what? I'm just not buying it. I'm just not going to believe what the World Health Organization comes out with next. So all of these people who have power, when people decide that it's an illegitimate power,

I don't know. I'm not a fan of anarchy, but something big is going to happen, and I think people are going to take control of their lives, I think responsibility for their lives. And I do think to what you just said, I mean, I think when you bring any sort of power to people, that is the biggest threat to,

especially tyrannical governments, but governments that want to go tyrannical. and government want you know the government so want to be like a North Korea or a China or a whatever maybe you can say Russia as well but regardless of the fact I mean given power and information information I believe is 100% power if you give people the actual information on all sides you give them complete power because then they can make up their minds to make up their decisions and you know it's one thing I saw during the Trump administration to where you had you had you You had social media companies that were bolstering groups like Antifa, like Black Lives Matter,

like all these groups that organized, you know, made sure that they were able to coordinate, do all these things. But then anyone on the other side of the ticket or other side of the party or ideology, I guess you can say, they silenced. And that's what they want because they believe, hey, here's our soldiers, if all hell breaks loose in our country. and here's the ones we're going to silence and that is our biggest that's our biggest win because I mean if you look at military you look at wars

around the world communication is everything if you can take out communication from a from another country or whatever the case is you have a massive advantage and it almost just seems like you know there is a system in place that they know that there's a war or some something weird

coming to where they want to set all this up to where they silence one side, make sure they are not able to communicate or, and that's why you have massive issues with platforms like X. But in the same sense, there's so many people that, you know, you look at what's happened over the last four years. Do you want another four years? And, you know, even in Utah with Spencer Cox, do you want another four years like that?

Do you want your property taxes to go up another 40 percent? Do you want this again? And there's so many people that are just on board because I don't know if it's because I hate Trump and they just will vote for anyone else. I don't know what the reasoning is, but I don't understand why anyone would want to vote Democrat. Which is also why Spencer Cox, which I don't think we mentioned this, but Spencer Cox has distanced himself very far from Trump. He does not want anything to do with Trump because he is on the left side, basically. I mean, he is a rhino.

That is what Spencer Cox is. Yeah. Well, and he's done that for, you know, the last eight years. A Trump hater, a never-Trumper. But he did come out and endorse Trump here a month or so ago, which lost him all of his respect from the left. Because it's not genuine. It's a fake thing. So, yeah, people are getting much harder to fool.

And I do think there's going to be a showdown. I think it is going to be information. I mean, we see what's happening in Great Britain right now. I had a young kid contact me just yesterday, and he said, hey, I'm a computer science major. I want to move back to Utah. I'd love to be involved with you and your campaign. If you're still doing something, have any advice for me?

And I said, yeah, pay attention to Elon Musk. He's going to go down in history as the person that saved free speech. And what we're watching right now, you know, with Brazil, so it's not just America, but what's happening worldwide is people are saying, you're not going to take away my ability to have free speech. It would be really hard for them to do what they did during the Gugulag archipelago days because people just have information. I'm not saying they couldn't do it because I think they're going to try. But yeah, it's really interesting time, really a fantastic time for people to get involved and take responsibility for themselves.

Well, Phil, to close this, I want people to help you in any way they can. What is the best way? Tell everybody where they can follow you, how they can help you, and how they can support you. Yeah, we're on Twitter. I think it's Phil underscore Lyman, and we're on Instagram and Facebook, of course, a little bit on TikTok, trying to get more there. Social media platforms, I think, are the best place to go and just engage and be heard. We have a website, Lyman for Utah. It's Lyman, F-O-R, Utah. We're not in full campaign mode where we're like trying to buy ads and stuff, but we are spending money on lawsuits and things like that.

So if they want to donate, that's great. Or really, if they just get involved and speak out on social media, follow us, you know, follow what's being said. That's huge. Absolutely. Well, Phil, I don't know if you have anything else to say, but, man, I think that it's refreshing. to hear and I hate to even refer to you as a politician because that's such a bad word nowadays.

Yeah. Thank you. But regardless, I think that you are one that people need to look out for, support people like Phil. You've got to get behind people like this because the system is going to fight against everything that you're going to do to prop up people like Phil. And whether you guys understand it or not, you are fighting the system every single day. whether it's the gas prices, the grocery prices, inflation, all these things that affect your life, whether you say that, oh, the president does affect my life?

Yes, they do. And not only does the president, so does your governor. So does your legislative branch in your states. All of these actually truly affect your life. And I find it always so funny when people say, oh, whoever the president does affect me in my life, yes, it does. Like directly. And I think we've never seen it more clearly than the past three and a half years. And so if you want to go to the governor side of things, the Spencer Cox guy, listen, he's really bad for Utah.

I don't know what could possibly be done to avert to what is probably coming for Utah, considering it sounds like a sham anyways, just in my opinion. Well, like Phil said, we have to get the word out and we have to spread it on social media. If anyone is around Utah, lives in Utah, or around even the state of Utah, share this podcast with people. Well, it doesn't even matter if you're in Utah. Yeah, shared this podcast. We got to get the word out. Go follow Phil, share his information.

And in the very least, I mean, think about these things, guys and girls that are listening to this. Think about the signature thing that we talked about earlier. It sounds like corruption to me. Think about the fact that you now have other linements on the ballot. that people can write in. It's ridiculous. And this is your system. And this is not just Utah.

This is, if you think, you know, a state is like this, obviously, think about how our actual presidency is going to be less than 60 days from now. It's a scary time to be alive, but it's also a very enlightening time to be alive. And Phil, we're glad that at least we have people like you that are in. or at least a part of the system, not the bad system, but a part of the system that you're trying to fight. Yeah, and you're speaking for the people. What we really need and what we want is our freedom in our country. Yeah. And you know, would you rather have people like Spencer or Phil?

You make that a similar. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it is the tactic of the left to cause a lot of fatigue, a lot of pain for people that want to engage in and that are people of goodwill. And so, yeah, most, you know, intelligent people say, I'm not getting. involved in politics. It is so dirty. So, yeah, we do need to find, if there's somebody that's willing to honestly engage to try

to change the system, they do need to be supportive wherever they are. So, yeah. Absolutely. Well, Phil, thank you so very much for coming on. We really, really appreciate your time. And, you know, we'll, thank you. We'll follow you. We are actually doing a live stream.

I want to announce this right now. I told Chad that, too. Yeah, go ahead and tell Phil. Well, Phil will probably be busy that night. more than likely. But yeah, we're going to have a live stream on X, which, by the way, our live streams on X, our live video streams that we do on X usually get, what was our last one, like 19,000, 20,000 live viewers.

Nice. Wow. It was pretty good. But we cover, we like to cover these debates. We're definitely covering the Trump and Kamala debate, which is Tuesday, I believe. So we're going to cover that. Phil, if you are free and have nothing to do, just let us know. Yeah, you can always commentator.

All right. Yeah, you can always come on and share your thoughts, even if it's for 10 or 15 minutes. Yeah, just jump in and jump out if you want to. But yeah, our live streams are usually pretty big. But Phil, thank you so much again for coming on. We really, really appreciate it. Thanks for what you guys are doing. Thank you so much.

Yeah, not a problem. Guys, that was Phil Lyman. We hope that you guys just understand what his story is here. And the reason why we wanted to bring Phil on was because when we started hearing about this literal corruption. I believe in Utah. This is like a petri dish, sorry, a petri dish of what is maybe to come in America less than 60 days from now in the election. And I've been saying this for a long time.

Will we ever have another conservative pro-American president in office? I don't know. Will we ever have a fair election again? It's a question, too. That's the truth. We don't know. But we're going to close with this song. It's called Hard in.

America because that's what a lot of people believe. We started the podcast with this song. We're going to close it with this. But guys, we love you so very much. Listen, if you're an American, we're going to fight. We're going to fight for our freedoms. We're going to fight for a culture, our American values. And we have to fight with votes. We get to fight with our voice. And we get a fight in ways to get the message out to make anyone understand. what is really a stake. So guys, until next time, we love you very much. Until then, peace out, guys.