It Can't Just Be Me - 5: Sharing my fertility struggles? With Izzy Judd

Episode Date: May 24, 2023

When Izzy Judd and her husband Harry decided to start a family, they had no idea what kind of journey lay ahead of them. They battled through miscarriage, IVF and some very dark days to get to where they are now - a happy family of five. In this week’s episode Izzy joins Anna to tackle a dilemma from a midwife who’s going through IVF. She wishes her friends and family could understand what she’s going through and stop suggesting she should ‘just adopt’ instead.Anna and Izzy are joined by Anne Bracken for this episode. Anne is a specialist fertility counsellor and author of Mind Body Baby.We’d like to thank The Fertility Network and The Fertility Foundation for their help and advice for this episode. We encourage anyone struggling with their fertility journey to access their resources online. …Have questions about sex? Divorce? Motherhood? Menopause? Mental health? With no topic off limits, Anna’s here to prove that whatever you’re going through, it’s not just you.If you have a dilemma you’d like unpacked, visit itcantjustbeme.co.uk and record a voice note. Or tell Anna all about it in an email to [e-mail] podcast touches on adult themes, including miscarriage and suicidal ideation, that may not be suitable for children. Listener caution is advised. Please note that advice given on this podcast is not intended to replace the input of a trained professional. If you’ve been affected by anything raised in this episode and want extra support, we encourage you to reach out to your general practitioner or an accredited professional. From Podimo & Mags CreativeProducer: Alice Homewood with support from Laura WilliamsEditor: Kit MilsomTheme music: Kit MilsomExecutive producers for Podimo: Jake Chudnow and Matt WhiteFollow @annarichardso and @podimo_uk on Instagram for weekly updates Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

My name is Brini Lee and I invite you to listen to Pep Talk, the podcast designed to help you overcome any situation you may be facing in your day-to-day life. Every episode is an empowering conversation where I cover issues such as self-worth, self-esteem and relationships, challenging you to become better and crush your limiting beliefs. I'll warn you though, I don't hold back. This is unfiltered. If you want practical tips to becoming the most glorious version of yourself with straight talking advice, head to Pep Talk podcast on all podcast platforms. Hello there, this is It Can't Just Be Me. Every week on this podcast, I sit down with a celebrity guest and a genius expert and get stuck into a dilemma sent in by you. Now

in today's episode, we're learning how to talk about fertility and of course, infertility. If you've ever had issues with this yourself, or you know someone who has, you'll know just how all-encompassing it can be. From a personal point of view, I've had a very long and very difficult journey with my fertility, which means that now in my 50s, I don't have my own children. And that's why I'm so keen to make sure that this episode is as comfortable and useful for everybody who's listening to it. Just a quick note that we do touch on the subject of miscarriage and also suicidal ideation in this episode. So do bear this in mind when deciding when and how to listen. Now, let's get stuck in. This is It Can't Just Be Me.

Hi, Anna. Hey, Anna. Hey, Anna. Hi, Anna. Hey, Anna. Hi, Anna. Hi, Anna. Hi, Anna. It can't just be me. Hi, Anna. Hey, Anna. Hey, Anna. Hi, Anna. Hey, Anna. Hi, Anna. Hi, Anna. Hi, Anna. It can't just be me who's really struggling with staying faithful. I definitely got menopause brain. I really want children and he doesn't. I had feelings of jealousy.

It's just all around the middle. I feel like a Teletubby. And then I hated myself for feeling that way. If you've got any advice. I would really appreciate any advice. It can't just be me. It can't just be me, right? My guest today is the delightful Izzy Judd. Izzy is a brilliant violinist and author of two books, including Dare to Dream,

which is all about her journey to motherhood. Now, Izzy and her husband, who's the drummer in the band McFly, had a fairy tale engagement and wedding, but when they decided to start a family, they struggled to conceive. What followed was a difficult period of fertility treatment, and very sadly, they also lost a baby along the way. I'll let Izzy tell her story in her own words, but spoiler alert, they did eventually have three gorgeous children. And now Izzy is passionate about sharing her story. So I can't think of a better guest to tackle this topic with.

Izzy Judd, thank you so much for joining me today on It Can't Just Be Me. How are you? I'm good, thank you. It's lovely to be here. It's lovely to have you here. And can I say you're looking very well. Oh, thank you very much. Was there a trip to Portugal this weekend?

There may have been a trip to Portugal. Oh, I can't bear it. Did you have a wonderful time? We had a great time, thank you. Well, listen, I'm thrilled that you could join us for this episode today because we've received a dilemma on the topic of fertility, which I know is something you are an expert on and something very close to your heart and also mine as it happens as well. But before we begin, I ask every guest that comes in to bring in their own

It Can't Just Be Me mini dilemma. What's yours, Izzy? Okay, here goes. It Can't Just Be Me that checks the back doors locked more than once each night. It's got to that point now where I have to, as I'm doing it, say to myself, Izzy, the door is locked. I just, I don't know what it is. It's this compulsion. I was going to say, what is that about? Because my other half does that and it drives me nuts. Before we go to bed, he has to check that all the gas is off on the hob. He has to check the front and the back door at least twice, even though they're bolted. I'm going, Simon, Simon, it's fine. Come to bed. So he's obsessed

with it. What is it about? There must be some sort of, I don't know, is it, does he like control and like, does he like things to be just so? Yeah, I think there's a lot of anxiety there. Yeah. Is that yours? Yes. I mean, I've always always had anxiety when I was talking to Harry my husband about coming on and I said that you know they're asking me this dilemma it can't just be me and he was like suffers with anxiety I was like no I think I'll go in a little softer straight in on the heavy topic just the back door yeah exactly but no I will go off I'll be halfway somewhere and think did I lock the door or did I turn off the hob? Anyway, there we go.

I hear you. I hear you. The front door is locked. In the meantime, we are here today to talk about all things fertility. And of course, to give some excellent advice to our listeners. We're also joined today by Specialist Fertility Counsellor Anne Bracken, who's dialing into the studio today. Hello, Anne, and welcome. Thank you, Anna. It's great to be here. It's such an important topic for so many people.

Thanks for inviting me on. Now, listen, your expertise is going to be incredibly helpful for this particular dilemma because you're a cognitive behavioural therapist and accredited fertility counsellor. And not only that, Anne, you're also the author of Mind, Body, Baby, great title, which helps couples navigate fertility struggles. So I'd say, Izzy, we are in very safe hands today with Anne. I think we are. I think I could have done with Anne a few years back. We all need Anne in our lives, I have to say.

Okay, it's time to hear from Kate, who sent in this voice note dilemma via the Fertility Network charity. Now, just to give you a little bit of background, Kate is 37 years old, and she and her husband have been trying to have a baby for the last four and a half years. Gosh, it's a long time. They've had three rounds of IVF so far,

but sadly, all have been unsuccessful they're now planning on having a frozen embryo transplant later this year I think Kate's story is especially interesting because of the nature of her job but I'll let Kate explain in her own words I absolutely love my job as a midwife, but I have actually made the real big decision to transfer my mental health because I found IVF really, really difficult to navigate. I think partly because we don't talk about it enough and I could absolutely be that person. I was very closed off about my IVF journey to my colleagues when I did my first and second rounds of IVF and I wish I'd been more open with them at the time. Also something that we probably don't talk about enough is people's perceptions of when you tell them that you were doing IVF. So this was a big barrier to

me because even my really close friends and family said, oh, you should just adopt because they thought that that would help. And of course, if that's in your journey and in your plan to do those things, how fabulous. I'm not sure it's in mine, but I haven't figured that out yet. But I haven't figured that out yet. What I think makes me frustrated about this is that people don't understand the process going from, I've met the person I want to grow my family with, to trying to grow your family, to being told that you're biologically unable to grow your family. And you're being told by people, well, well it's okay don't worry about your body just go and get a baby. I had that a lot from very close friends and family and that also was linked to my job being a midwife. There was a lot of discussions around well how awful is it for you who support women in pregnancy to not be

able to have a child and didn't think about their use of language and their words and how that kind of came across and I that has also scarred me and then potentially made me not want to discuss this with people being open and honest about what you're going through so that people can support you when you need support is so vital, but only when people are kind, considerate and supportive back. And that I also find really difficult to kind of navigate. Well, this is fascinating, isn't it? There's a lot to unpack here, I think, with Kate's dilemma, not least the fact that she is a midwife, which I personally find really interesting. Izzy, if I come to you first, what was going through your mind when you were listening to that? I could see that you were very

deep in thought. Yeah, I mean, huge sympathy, having gone through my own fertility journey it made me think about how everybody's situation is so unique and something that resonated with me with Kate is that challenge of do you talk to people about it don't you talk about it and I think in hindsight had I been more open about it and had the courage to say this is where I need the support this is what I need you to say this is helpful this isn't helpful it would have made it easier for those people around me because so often if you haven't gone through it or experienced it you don't know what to say and then people get nervous and try and fill in the gaps. And inevitably then get it wrong. Yeah. Just thinking about Kate a little bit here and the fact that she is a midwife. I mean,

imagine that, that you are dealing with women's fertility and their fecundity and, you know, their joy and their trauma every single day. Yeah. I mean, again again having not been in that situation you would think gosh that must be really tough but then maybe for her she's thinking now not only am I battling my own fertility struggles I've now got to think about my career and you have this feeling that infertility problems take things away from you the ability to be happy for others who tell you they're pregnant. I went through a scenario with my brother, which I can openly talk about, and where he and his wife got pregnant at the same time as I did with my first round of IVF that I then went on to miscarry. And I was so angry that it had been so simple for them and angry that I had just been told I was going to be an auntie for the

first time and that I felt angry. And so it's that feeling of it also shaping you in a way you don't want to be shaped. So I can imagine for Kate that feeling of, I love my job and why is this now taking that from me? That's how I could only imagine I would feel. I think I would probably feel more angry. Yeah, I do wonder whether that anger is playing in there with Kate. I mean, we don't know why Kate currently is unable to conceive. So we're making some assumptions here. But I wonder how much the fact that she is a midwife and deals with women day in day out, having their children or not, has played into some of her difficulty. Does that sound reasonable, Izzy? So I'm going to be very careful about how I answer this because my situation is unique to me and my

personal setup may be different to other people. And I'm not suggesting that this is right for everybody. But in hindsight, I truly believe that my mind had been my biggest block. And that is probably very difficult to hear when you're going through fertility struggles. And I remember people saying, actually saying to my husband a lot, Izzy just needs to relax. But to tell somebody that who has had anxiety from the age of whatever, that is really difficult. But if your body has been in a state of fight or flight for a very long time, and you've been having lots of cortisol and lots of adrenaline running around your body, the last thing your body is going to think it's safe to do is reproduce because all your energy is going into keeping you alive.

When you say that you had the anxiety and that fear response, that fight or flight, where does that come from? Was that playing into your fertility journey? your fertility journey? Yeah, I mean, if we go sort of deep into it, I had a family trauma at a young age. My oldest brother had a very serious car accident when I was 12, right as I was going into puberty, basically. I do wonder what emotional part that had to play on that development. That's something that I can identify with myself. I had an ectopic pregnancy when I was 20 and it was extremely dangerous. I nearly died. And I absolutely believe that that trauma has impacted me so much that that's informed why I've not gone on to have children, even though I now have regrets around that.

Because I think my body, after that trauma, subconsciously, I was being told, subconsciously, it's not safe. It's not safe to be pregnant. It's not safe for you. It could kill you. So I just wonder that subconscious drive, if there is some trauma around some women's experiences, does that make sense, Anne? Absolutely. With anxiety, anxiety is there for a reason. It's usually to keep us safe. It's just that when anxiety reaches a level of escalation where it's almost like a house alarm being triggered all the time by reminders. So a feeling that you may have reminds you of a feeling that you had during the trauma. And naturally, you want to suppress that feeling. So you might make a decision based on the past. And with that, it can really cause a re-triggering of that trauma. It's not helpful for any medical condition,

naturally, to have escalated anxiety to the point of what Izzy talked about, the fight, flight, freeze response. Then that's a lot of adrenaline. It's a lot of cortisol running through the body. And so having techniques, having ways to identify how am I thinking about this fertility treatment that I'm facing in combination with exercise, nutrition and whatever it is that's going to help your physical, your physiological experience to reduce those stress levels. CBT is one way. Acceptance and commitment therapy is another way. Bring some self-compassion towards yourself. Understand it's normal to have stress. Helping yourself to change those as well

is certainly going to help you through what is a physically demanding process as well. That's such good advice, Anne, because Izzy, you've talked a lot about your circuitous, difficult route towards becoming a mum. It wasn't straightforward for you. Would you mind sharing a little with us today about your own experience? Sure. So my husband and I got married, it was the Christmas of 2012. And I think it was probably about six months later, I said to Harry, come on, let's start family. I've been with you long enough. I know what it's like hanging out with you. Let's get going. I came off the pill probably about a year before I got married. And I now understand

that my cycles were not really proper cycles. And that first month of trying, my period didn't come. And we went and got the pregnancy test and Harry even filmed us waiting for that. We just, we just assumed, well, there we go, month one, we did it. And that was the beginning of a very long series of investigations into what was going on. I was diagnosed with polycystic ovaries, so I was not having any cycles. So not only did I want to start a family, we couldn't try because I wasn't having a natural cycle. And very quickly went into medication to try and help. My body seemed to resist everything. And after many, many months of disappointment and really feeling quite depressed, we went through the route of IVF. A bit of advice that somebody had given me who had been through it was to allow myself to be completely selfish.

Okay. And to put Project Baby first. And I worked really hard on mentally preparing myself because I thought, well, the doctors are going to take over physically. There's nothing I can control about that. But I do have control of how I deal with this. And so I did a lot of mindfulness and walking. I was making sure I was taking care of myself for the first time in a very long time. And not because I thought if I do that, it's going to work, but more about a protection of getting through it as happily as I could. I want to talk more about that. And Anne, I'm going to bring you into this. How much do we as women and our partners actually have to prepare themselves

mentally for what they're going through? Well, it's really important to really work on your psychological, emotional and relational health because it is a medical problem at the end of the day. And like any medical issue that you're going through, it impacts on so many areas of your life. You know, I'm listening to Izzy and it's not selfish to put yourself at the centre. It's as Izzy said, there are some things in your control and then there's some that's outside of your control. But, you know, you have some influence of control on your psychological, emotional health and that plays a big part in your fertility journey. thinking about Kate, she also talks about the fact that people were incredibly insensitive towards her. You can really hear that, can't you, in her voice note about the insensitivity of people around her. How do we find the right language to talk about fertility, infertility, struggle? What do you think, Izzy? What should people be saying? I think it's more about what we say to others to help inform them, to help them understand a little bit. And that can be

very difficult to do. Not everybody might want to talk about their fertility struggles. But I think people want to naturally help people that love you around you. Yes, there are the people that come in and they say something insensitive and you've got to just sort of bat them off with that. Poor you, actually, for being so insensitive. I remember once I was wearing some dungarees and someone said, oh, you're pregnant, you know, and it was just, and I was right in the thick of treatment at that time. But I think it's our responsibility as well to communicate with our loved ones, as well to communicate with our loved ones, to help them understand because it's a marathon, it's not a sprint and you're going to need them. So I think as speaking in hindsight,

I wish I had had more courage to say, this is what I need. I wonder whether Kate should have been more open with her colleagues. She expresses a little bit of regret there about not talk to them about her vulnerability and what was going on. So in a way, the people who are trying to help, they can't win. They can't win. Does that make sense, Anne? Absolutely. I think what you said a little bit earlier about identifying needs, you know, that's important. So what do I need right now? And it is important to be discerning around who you shared with, because if you think about it, when we're going through a big, life-changing problem in our life, do we need people to come forward and give us lots of advice about how to fix it? what lifestyle changes they think we should

make, what their answer is to fixing a problem that you probably at this stage could, you know, write a thesis about. So in other words, most people going through fertility problems have done all the research. They have the awareness. The issue is maybe listen, be empathic. A hundred percent. I think it is about identifying, isn't it? Whether you need somebody to help you fix it or whether you just need a listening ear. And I know myself as somebody that's been through a difficult fertility journey

and also somebody being on the other side, talking to people that go through difficult fertility journeys. I tend to try and fix. So I am that person that would ask a million different questions and then say, well, have you tried this? Have you been to see this person? Which can feel incredibly intrusive, but we're just trying to help. So it is important for that person to say, I don't need you to fix it. I just want you to hear it instead. Izzy, how much did you decide to share your IVF journey with friends and family? And

ultimately, what were their reactions towards you? I was very private to begin with, mainly because I was trying to digest it all myself. And I think I felt a bit ashamed, actually. And it took me a long time to not feel responsible for the fact that I wasn't able to have a baby. And it was like my body wasn't working. So trying to explain that to others when I was trying to digest it myself was really difficult. But when I did start to open up to the people I felt safe to open up to, like my best friend and family, obviously their support was what I really needed. I remember my friend saying, it was amazing, she said, would you like me to take you to one of your appointments? You know, just take me there. And I remember just

thinking, that's exactly what I actually do need. She knows me well enough to know that actually for me, getting from A to B is quite anxiety fueling, going somewhere new. And so she knew that by being with me would give me that comfort and that support. Obviously, my family were incredibly supportive, but I think also not quite sure what to say. One of the things that had been on my mind was wanting to give mum a grandchild because she had gone through so much pain with my brother and everything we've been through I felt it was going to give her the next chapter of joy and the fact that I wasn't able to do that and it was really hard to say and my mum said to me Izzy I just want you to be happy. You're all I care about. You know, but had I not voiced that feeling, I would have carried that weight.

And I think that's the thing. It's trying to identify what it is that's perhaps, you know, that you're really struggling with and talking to the people that you know are going to fill your tank back up. That is so important, isn't it? Because I would go back to Kate and say, I think you need to identify what it is you need and what it is you're so sad about and just get that self-knowledge. Because in your sense, it sounds as though, Izzy, you were trying to fix your mum in a way by saying, I wanted to give her a grandchild to fix her grief around her own son. And how lovely that she was able to turn back to you and say, darling, I just want you to be happy. And then that gave you the permission to put the focus back on you. It's a wonderful thing.

Let's talk a little bit about, again, this sort of fixing mode that people go into and the fact that people just say, well, you should just adopt, just go and adopt. How did that impact you, Izzy? Yeah, I had a few of those moments. And again, from very well-wishing people who actually I love dearly, but, you know, there is zero just in adopt. You know, that is a completely different conversation, actually, that is quite separate to fertility struggles and something that someone might individually choose to do anyway, regardless. So I think we have to get rid of that language.

We have to know that that is just not something that we should be saying to people. I love the fact that you say that because you're quite right. I'm doing baby steps towards the adoption process and I've done podcasts around adoption with Adoption UK. And it isn't just going and adopting a child. It is a huge thing that parents are undertaking. It takes a long time and it is intrusive and it is difficult. So in some senses, actually, there's a parallel with IVF and infertility that you have to go through a process that is very, very difficult

and can be very painful. So I think the language around, oh, just go and get a baby is incredibly disrespectful. I can completely sympathise with you on that. Is this something that your clients say to you as well, Anne, that people will say to them, just go and adopt? Yes. And, you know, the thing to be aware of for listeners who maybe have a friend going through fertility problems or a family member, adoption is not a cure for infertility. Infertility problems are in and of themselves, their own issues, their own processes, very unique to that patient, that client, that individual woman. So meet her where she's at rather than thinking, oh, actually, here's the

answer. You know, essentially, people come to adoption for many different reasons. And it's important that those reasons are supportive of healthy attachment and all of those things that are involved in a really positive outcome for adoption. So it's a very separate issue. And it's important not to enmesh them. I think earlier what you said about being, as you say, you know, it's also important as an individual to think, okay, what's the intention behind this? So a lot of the time, the intention from the other person is a positive intention, but delivered inappropriately. So just being aware of that as well means that we're probably not going to feel as frustrated and angry when we hear those things being said, what's the intention behind it? And there are so many different stages

to fertility treatment and different processes that people go through. And it's honouring that person where they are and not kind of jumping ahead, years ahead and telling them what they should do as well. That's important. I wanted to share a statistic actually with our listeners, which I think demonstrates why it's so important to support people through their journey if they are struggling with their fertility. Studies from the Fertility Network UK and Middlesex University show that 90% of people facing long-term infertility said they'd experienced depression and that 42% experienced suicidal feelings. I mean, that is extraordinary. Izzy, does this resonate with you? Did you have dark moments during your journey? Absolutely. I had long days in bed under duvets. I felt so far from myself. I lost confidence to go out because I dreaded, are you thinking about having a family? And just

not being able to know how to answer that. In the end, Harry and I just set up a sentence, which was, we're working on it or something. It was something like that, working on it. But also the impact of the hormones that I was taking made me feel very bloated. So none of my clothes really fit. My skin broke out. I just felt so uncomfortable within myself physically and mentally. And I think looking back, I'm sure it was a level of depression. So I'm not surprised that that rate of depression is so high. Did you seek psychotherapy or support during your journey? No, I don't think I did enough talking therapy.

I did a lot of research in terms of looking after my mental well-being through yoga and walking. Mindfulness has been a big anchor for me with anxiety anyway and continues to be. I also did a lot of visualization, especially through my IVF treatment of the embryo grabbing onto the lining like roots of a tree. And I did a lot of that. And I found that incredibly comforting. And obviously that might not be something for everybody, but by visualizing what I wanted the outcome to be, I found hugely supportive. I think probably looking back on each of my pregnancies and each of my experiences, there was actually a lot going on that needed addressing that I wasn't addressing at the time. So Izzy, you have been on a hell of a rollercoaster ride with this. It's been incredibly difficult. But here you are some years later with three beautiful children. You're a mum,

it's everything you wanted. So life in a way seems perfect for you. So it's interesting. I still feel if I pass somebody pregnant in the street, I still get that pang of jealousy. It's really strange. It's not, I can't describe it. It's like it never leaves you. And I just get that little moment of she's pregnant. And then I think, I wonder what she's been through. Was it easy? Was it, you know, and these things go through my mind and it's sort of like when you go through infertility or you go through baby loss, you're never fully healed. You always carry part of that grief with you. And through my pregnancy with Lola, my first, I hadn't really thought about becoming a mum. It had all been about having a safe pregnancy. And actually, I hadn't really prepared

myself mentally for motherhood. So I think there's also something in pregnancy and women who have gone through fertility struggles to actually allow them to grieve that and process it in order to then move into the next chapter. And looking forward, do you want any more? the next chapter. And looking forward, do you want any more? So Lola was a frozen embryo from my first round of IVF and then my two boys came along naturally. But I still have one frozen embryo from that round and that does pull at me. I find it really difficult to know. It's probably a call-in dilemma. And I'm sure I'm not the only one who has these embryos sitting there wondering what to do because that that's that's my baby that I haven't met that I want to meet and yeah and that it could have been Lola that I hadn't met yes you know but then you

know maybe by looking at Lola that is my my, the figure of that journey. And she was the result of that. And that's more than I could have ever hoped. And then to have gone on to have had two more is even more than I could have ever thought of at one stage. So I hope that that gives others hope that, you know, trust the process and believe, believe that it will happen. the process and believe, believe that it will happen. I want to leave Kate and our listeners with some concrete next steps to help improve her situation. Izzy, you've been through the process. What would you now advise Kate? That's a big question. I know. I think I would ask Kate if there is something else that she loves that she's not done for a while. Like, did she used to paint? Did she like, I don't know, going to the theater? Does she like playing football? I don't know. Is there something that she has lost connection with? Is there something she could go back to that she loves to remember who

she is? Because fertility can become, you know, the definition of you. And that is, that is tough. I think that would be my, my suggestion to her. Just maybe have a think. Is connecting back to herself, some other loves and passions that she had as well. connecting back to herself, some other loves and passions that she had as well. Well, Anne, I'm going to ask you as well, because ultimately, Kate says that being open and honest about what you're going through so that people can support you when you need support is so vital, but only when people are kind, considerate and supportive back. What concrete steps would you suggest for Kate? If she had a magic wand and she could visualise the best, most supportive way of getting through this fertility treatment journey, what would she need more of? So if it is

that she needs more emotional support, it's about, you know, that two way street of I need to be a little bit more open if I want to receive that support. So being discerning about who she opens up to, but identifying what are my needs here going through this? Do I need more support from management? Do I need more support from colleagues, from family, from friends? Identify what she needs. Or would that be more professional support? That can help her in terms of the

emotional, the relational, the psychological and the communication piece that she needs to avail of in order to build on that resilience to get through this next steps. Izzy, thank you so much. And Anne, your input has been absolutely invaluable today. Thank you so very much indeed. Thank you both. Now, Izzy, before we end the show, I have a couple more short dilemmas to share with you. It's kind of a quick-fire advice round,

and I want you to speak from the heart. Right. Are you ready? I'm ready. The first one is from Emma. It can't just be me that's struggling to know how to plan the timing of a baby with the other half. I want one now, he's not ready yet, but it's my body of my career

that will be impacted. So surely my vote counts more than his. Come on, what do you think? I mean, you've been through this with Harry. this with Harry? My immediate feeling is just leave it up to the universe to decide. Have fun, you know, it would be nice to go through a period of not trying for a baby and to actually just enjoy it. So I think she could maybe, you know, just say, come on, let's have a bit of fun. And you never know. And you hear so often, don't you, about couples that are trying, trying, trying to have kids and there's so much pressure and it just doesn't happen. And then they kind of go, you know, F it. And off they go on holiday, they relax and they get pregnant. And then you hear about it and you go, oh no, not another story of the person that went on holiday and got

pregnant. But there has to be some truth in that because we hear it okay here's the next one Izzy this is from Nicole hi Anna I've completely ground to a halt at work I used to really love my job and I think I still do but I just feel so burnt out that I don't jump for opportunities like I used to I really really need to find my energy again because Monday mornings are just making me miserable. Do you have any advice? Oh, now you see, I've got quite a lot to say about this. And there's a lot of research around at the moment about how anxious people feel on a Sunday and that that then bleeds into their whole weekend and they start to dread Monday mornings. So what I would say to Nicole is perhaps actually

to go and have a conversation with her manager around what's expected of her when she goes into work on a Monday. Perhaps they could just ease her in with a little bit of gossip and a bit of fun before she has to then go into the hardcore grind of work. What do you think, Izzy? I think it's hard, isn't it, when you lose that mojo for something. But I also think it's part of life, isn't it? We go through those moments where something just feels amazing and then you just have these lulls and it's just determining whether the lull is actually, do I need to step out here and think about something else or is this just a bit of a moment? So maybe put a time frame on it. Maybe go, if I'm still feeling like this in, I don't know,

three months, six months, then I'll address it then. Izzy, thank you so much. It has been an absolute pleasure to have you in the studio today. And from my heart, I want to say thank you for being so open and such an open book. I welcome honesty and openness like that. And I know that you will have helped so many other people. So thank you for sharing your story. And thanks again to the brilliant Anne Bracken for joining us remotely today as well. We'll leave her details in the show notes for all of you who are listening. I also want to say a big thank you to the Fertility Network

and the Fertility Foundation for their help and advice for this episode. And you can find out more about them in the show notes too. I'll be back next week with another episode of It Can't Just Be Me. So if you have your own dilemma you want some honest advice about, please leave us a voice note at itcan'tjustbeme.co.uk or you can email itcan'tjustbeme at podimo.com. Whether it's about love, sex, ageing, friendship, kinks, parenting, it doesn't matter. Nothing's off limits in this studio. And remember, whatever you're dealing with, it really isn't just you. whatever you're dealing with, it really isn't just you. Producers for Podimo are Jake Chudnow and Matt White. Don't forget to follow the show and to listen ad-free. Subscribe to Podimo UK on Apple Podcasts.

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