It Can't Just Be Me - Living by your own rules with Nadia Almada

Episode Date: November 13, 2024

In this episode of It Can’t Just Be Me, Anna Richardson sits down with the trailblazing Nadia Almada. At just 27 years old, Nadia made history as Big Brother’s first transgender winner, transforming her life in the process. Nadia shares her journey with Anna, recounting her experiences before, during (when only the audience knew her true gender identity), and after her time in the Big Brother House. They discuss her desire to embrace her life without labels, how she captured the hearts of the British public and reflect on the current landscape for the transgender community.If you or someone you know is struggling with any of the topics discussed in It Can’t Just Be Me, you can find useful resources and support here: https://audioalways.lnk.to/ItcantjustbemeIG.Every Friday Anna, alongside a panel of experts, will be addressing YOUR dilemmas in our brand new episodes ‘It’s Not Just You'! If you have a dilemma or situation you'd like discussed, reach out to Anna by emailing [e-mail] or DM her on Instagram @itcantjustbemepod Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Calling all music buffs. Hey, hey, turn the volume up, yeah? Make Me A Mix Tape is back. I'm Jordan Stevens. I'm Clara Ampho, and this is our weekly music show. A celebrity guest picks the theme. We select the tunes. And we battle it out to create the ultimate mix tape.

May the best music lover win. Oh, it's about to go down. Let's go! Make Me A Mix Tape. Listen only on BBC Sounds. Hello I'm Anna Richardson and welcome to It Can't Just Be Me. If you've listened before, hello and if you're joining me for the very first time, it's great to have you here. This is the podcast that helps you realise you're not the only one. It's a safe space where nothing is off limits as we try to help you understand that whatever you might be going through, it's really not just you.

So each week I'm joined by a different celebrity guest who'll talk through the challenges and hurdles they faced in their own lives in order to help you with yours. I want to know about it all. The weird, the wonderful, the crazy, because these conversations are nothing if not open and honest. So let's get started. Today's guest is someone who, 20 years ago, made TV history.

Even if you didn't watch the show that she was on, which was, by the way, groundbreaking in the history of television, it's likely that you saw her image in all of the national newspapers. And if you did watch the show, then you may well have been one of the four million people who voted for her to win. We are talking about Big Brother. And it was a victory that's been described as a pivotal moment in the public recognition of trans identity. Since then, she's become an activist, a hair stylist, and she still has that instantly recognisable laugh

that we all fell in love with in 2004. It's Nadia Al Mada! Hey! Hello you! That was a beautiful intro! I know! I mean when you listen to an intro like that, what do you think? It's the last 20 years. It's extraordinary isn't it?

And you've come so far. Yes I have. Thank you. Thank you for saying that. It's it's very humbling to me when I hear those sort of kind of you know glorious sort of statements of me but actually it is a matter of fact, isn't it? So I must rejoice in my own glory. In my own fabulousness. Now, before we carry on, I want to know, what is your It Can't Just Be Me dilemma idea? Gosh, I have like a list. And I did. I do have like a top five, but I'm going to say

the 100 mil limit on on flights and TSS, ground, security, airport people and their menacing attitude. I don't, it triggers me. I hate it. I hate them and I don't really like it. Actually, hate is a very strong word. What are we saying? So is it the 100 mil limit at airport security? It's all encompassing. Or it's the attitude of the staff? It's all of it? The attitude of the staff, the 100 mil,

because it's also a lobbying mechanism. So we have to buy a six pound bottle of water after we just pass through. So this is a third trigger for you. Yes. It's in fact, it's just sort of flying. It's just flying. I love flying.

I love hanging around in an airport. I love the whole experience. I love to people watch. I love to see what the enthrusiasm of people coming and going, if that makes sense. I always get put through the scanner and then always my bra goes off. Ah!

Because your bra go off. I'm always getting packed down. I don't actually wear... Do you know what? I am so mindful these days. I don't wear any jewellery and I don't wear any wire bras anymore. I don't think anyone should really because it's quite uncomfortable really but... But that's because you don't want the aggression of the security staff.

Yeah, I just don't want... I don't want that beeping noise. It's very triggering. I hear you. I hear you. So listen. Yeah. I don't want that beeping noise, it's very triggering. I hear you, I hear you. So listen, let's go back 20 years and to the summer of 2004. Before you went into Big Brother,

just describe what your life was like. Who were you 20 years ago? I was very young, young lady working in Barclays. Walking for a bank? Yeah, and I used to say, I always try to kind of... Do you remember that Mrs. Bucket, Mrs. Bouquet? Yes, Hire says Bouquet, of course. Yes, I am so a lady of the house, Kelly Mrs. Bucket. But every time I used to go out,

or when I was kind of asked, what do I do for a living? I used to say, I work in the financial sector. LAUGHS So, is that...? Do you understand what that means? Of course it is. So, that's what you were doing. You were a bank clerk working for Barclays. Yeah, 95 and had an extra part time and doing anything that needed to be done to pay the bills.

So what made you want to apply for Big Brother Series 5? It's a good question. I was a fan of the show from day one. I remember watching the original pre… But then you must have had an idea of what you were letting yourself in for. Did I? Well, good question. What was it like when you were actually there?

How difficult, I mean, just describe it for all of us, because most of us would have seen Big Brother. What was it like being a housemate and having to live in that situation? Maybe at this point in time in my life, where I could perhaps look back in a much more kinder sort of lens. I had the best time ever.

For me, it was extraordinary. It was liberating. It was formidable just to be myself. I wasn't an alter ego. It wasn't anything other than just pure Nadia. I just wanted to be exactly that. It was the safest place in my whole entire, for my whole, of my whole life. So it was a chance for you just to be Nadia?

Yes, thank you. To be safe? Yeah. To be a trans woman. Yeah, actually, I'm in a new era, which I think is important, because I'm also, as a feminist, you'll be disingenuous of me

not to put myself first as a woman and trans identity second, because that's secondary to me. I've never been anything other than a woman. But it's only semantics. I'm comfortable with either both. I think we are in a much better place in the world where we can accept those. But for me, I prefer... I'm not, I'm a woman. It's like an evolution, Anna. It absolutely is. And in 2024, we can talk about the fact that, hang on a second, no, I'm a woman I've always been a woman yeah I'm a trans woman second yeah but if we go back to 2004 oh tell me what was that conversation like it was I'm still triggered by it I think there's a little

like what you call it PTSD yeah yeah there is because I've gone through the evolution of being called also transsexual at the beginning. I don't even think transgender was a name that was coined for us as a community. It was still the sex versus gender at that time, whereas gradually by the time I came out of 2004, I was still kind of called that, which I'm not comfortable with that time because so What conversation did you have with the producers at the time? Because you're saying well, hang on. I'm a woman

I've always been a woman but you must have had the conversation with the producers at the time about what hang on I'm also a transgender woman Yeah at the time about, well hang on, I'm also a transgender woman. Yeah. And how did they react to you? Even under the trans umbrella of a woman of trans identity, I never allowed it to be perhaps as a way of protecting myself, not to open those doors of conversation. So it was just at the time, it was kind of like, I'm Nadia and I'm a woman.

Yeah. And that's the end of the conversation. My friends knew, my whole community knew, because they saw me going through the transition. And obviously, whatever, it was a small town. It wasn't easy. I was called everything under the sun by every person that existed.

They're still my neighbors to this day. Oh, really? Well, because I haven't moved. I'm still living what I am. I'm still live not in the same address, but in the same facility. This is in the UK. Yeah, yeah. Even in my work, actually before working for Barclays,

I worked as a fragrance counter girl. And I remember this group of, quite often actually, group of people, boys and girls, teenagers, would come in and shout horrendous vulgar names inside the department store where I was working. That is horrific. It was horrific. But it was a time that I actually thought

the two married one another. you know, to accept my trans identity Would mean that those things also Everything about me was wrong and I brought that on myself essentially. Oh, I see. Yeah, so there's that kind of self-blame. Yeah. Yeah Sad really to think that I believe that it was I brought it on myself Absolutely. I mean Nadia I've heard this from a lot of my trans friends, that kind of self-loathing that trauma and believing that somehow this is our own fault. Yes. That's extremely difficult to deal with. I couldn't put it in a better word. That's exactly how I felt. And I'm guessing it is a general consensus

amongst anyone that experiences any sort of objectification, discrimination, all sorts of things. Bullying, harassment, anything that's been a victim of that will understand exactly what I'm saying. Yeah, totally. With anyone that might be a little bit different, you know what I mean? Even women before being women, wearing a miniskirt or you know, we've all been there. So it was the same thing, but I guess it was a little bit more extreme.

Yeah, the hatred. And sort of hatred towards you, but the blame, the self blame. Yes, somehow I'm the shame the shame Yeah, do you think that people now 20 years later? Understand that trans journey any better. I think so you think they do. Yeah, do you think there's a probably slept with some of them? But for those people Nadia that that just don't have to bring humor. Of course you do. Into the pain. And I do use laughter perhaps because I grew up with great comedian geniuses and I especially

woman that was my refuge, my safe place. It was just pure laughter watching the golden girls. Do you know what I mean? Those sort of like moments of pure joy. That was my safe place. So, and also we see Nate in me, I love to laugh and I do bring a lot of humor into it, but it was it was

quite painful at times. But for those people that don't understand how painful it is to be trans and actually particularly when you go through the surgery journey how would you what would you say to people that don't understand what it means? Can you describe just how hard it is? Contrary to popular belief, surgeries, whatever you want to call them, it doesn't happen overnight. It doesn't happen within one year. It doesn't happen within two years. It doesn't happen within three years.

It happens within five years plus, if you're lucky. When you actually manage to get a consultant and you are being seen by the medical professionals. But for me, it was excruciating, waiting for it. It was a hard time. But I just continued to believe that it was imminent, it was going to happen. And it did come, it happened. And I don't like to talk about this, I like to keep some things to myself as private.

But I'll have something close enough to you as an analogy, which perhaps not many people know of this, or actually haven't shared it at all. And I remember this conversation of this, another lovely friend of mine, someone I knew that was, you know, like Gapier traveling and she went to India and she's having goosebumps. Oh, and she said that one of her most memorable, joyous experience of her life was to see the sunrise in the Taj Mahal. Right? And I stood that in awe looking at her. And you know, she was such a beautiful storyteller that I almost like I was reliving that moment with her.

And I stood back and I thought to myself, what is my Taj Mahal moment? And going back to your question that it has the logic it was waking up and looking up and see the light the fluorescence light in the hospital room. Oh really? Oh wow. Do you understand what I'm saying? Do you understand what I'm going with it? Absolutely. So I had a sunset in the Taj Mahal. For you it was the fluorescent light that was my Taj Mahal, looking up. If I was to do an autobiography,

I would chapter that as my Taj Mahal moment. My son said... And you must do your autobiography. I don't know. It will open too many... Too many Pandora's boxes. However, Nadia, I'm just going to pull you back to the moment with the producers. Oh yes, of course. We're talking about that. Because we knew as an audience, we knew that you were a woman, that you were a trans woman, but the housemates didn't.

So who made that decision? I did. You did? I don't think anyone else could have. I don't think thus far from my understanding from the history of Big Brother that anyone could make such demands. And why did you decide to make that decision? Because I'm a woman, so I don't need to explain myself to everybody else. Because I've never lived anything other than just in my life. Yes. That's how I've lived from day one. So were you concerned about the public response on the outside when you were in the Big Brother

House? Did it worry you at all about... Yes. Tell me why. Tell me why. Tell me why. Because of the previous experiences, how, you know, unvalid and unworthy of a human species we were. And how from other sort of brief sort of interactions of seeing other trans representation in media or in general in public,

it was very insular you know there was never sort of group sort of because you do we didn't want to be associated because you don't want to bring even more attention to yourself well there certainly wasn't a great a great deal of representation was there yeah or a huge movement at the time in 2004 and it was always portrayed in the sort of underground see these sex sort of sex work kind of thing it was always portrayed in this sort of underground, see these sex, sort of sex work kind of thing. It was very, I didn't have, I don't think I grew up with any positive representation of what a trans woman

is or should be. I don't know, perhaps. Yeah. And so you... So I was horrified, but I think I was in this moment in time that very selfishly perhaps, I wanted to do this for myself. I needed this moment for myself. So you needed that moment for yourself. Why? Because I needed an escapism. I needed to just live my authentic self without any labels or anything. You have to understand this path,

journey, whatever you want to call it, it's not for the, it's not a choice, it's not for the faint hearted. You know, you have to understand, you have to go through, I went through it all before even before I knew it myself. Everybody was telling me what I should be or shouldn't be and how I should behave and how I shouldn't behave. So I didn't know any difference. So I think that was my retaliation. But I needed the diascapism. That's why it's almost like there were so many trials and tribulations in the Big Weather House. It was a lot of moments, you know, and but it was so freeing for me. It was so liberating.

So then for you, when you won and you won by the largest margin in Big Brother history, how did that make you feel as a woman? Well, the question is, people saw a human foundation, humanity, someone that made them laugh, entertained them throughout the summer, gave them great TV goals, sometimes good or bad, that's open to interpretation, but that's the pure essence of reality TV. And I think that's because of that.

And to this day, I get the same messages where I get people from cisgender sort of community where they grew up believing how a trans woman should be treated. Now they realize I was participating in something that was quite unpleasant but they've understood confidence towards women in general and also advice for the trans community and the LGBT community as well because you know it was important for them, it's important. So looking back, being caught up in that media machine, being shot to fame like that

and particularly as you say sort of representing the LGBTQI and trans community as well, were you treated well? No. Oh you weren't? No. Oh, you weren't? No. Winning Big Brother, it was a tremendous validation, but it was momentarily. It's the understanding that the outside,

see, this is what I mean. Big Brother, that world within the world that I was living, I was in pure bliss. Because there was no shame I was carrying. If any shame would be about personality traits versus anything other than that, you know. Or people who just don't like me will like me. That's fine too. But I was pure bliss. But the outside, winning Big Brother, I thought, okay, this is it. No one ever is going to mistreat me again because I've just won the

show. So people must like me. Four million people voted for me. But I forgot there's another 65 point something million. It was a very false sense of security. It was momentarily. So what happened, Nadine, when you say it was momentary? No one knew what to place me, what to do with me. And also the media didn't. We didn't have any safeguards and we didn't have any sort of protective rights, as we call them these days. It was 2010. Even like, can we just go back same sex marriages, civil partnerships? Those things were nonexistent. That didn't exist.

This is exactly how momentous my women, you know, the show. It was huge. This representation, the visibility, you know, for the first time. It was phenomenal. It was a huge achievement for the community, for my understanding. And I saw the press clippings and all of those things, the sensational achievement for the community. From my understanding, and I saw the press clippings and all of those things, the sensationalism of the media and the derogatory comments, you know, the dead naming

and all those things and the befores and afters and always, you know, you know, will be nausea. Now, now, actually, they're like, you know, they're much kinder. They call me a trans woman. Whereas before, they would call me something completely what an acceptable. And that was a public domain. You'll find this everywhere you would go in that time, in that space.

20 years ago. Yeah, it's exactly that. It was momentarily moment of joy. But then it was and also gave me a false sense of security and I became a little bit sort of like, okay, this is not going to happen to me. This what happened before it is no longer serves me. So now it's a new chapter in my life. 90% of the time there was a lot of there was those people that would come to me and say oh my god, you know, and I got for the first time affirmation, positive affirmations of love and how

amazing I was and how funny I was. All those things that I never had before. I've never had those positive reinforcements growing up. I've never had that. Everything, prior to Big Brother was wrong or bad or ugly or shameful. Right. So after Big Brother, it gave me a lot of that. So I never knew how to accept a compliment or a positive sort of, you know, thing. I always...

So suddenly you've got all of these... Sorry, I'm going all over the place. No, no, no. Suddenly you've got all of these people that love you. Yeah, yeah. And they're giving you that positive affirmation. Which I couldn't even handle myself because I haven't had it before. So it was another learning experience for me.

But you've also got all of these people that are showing you hatred and an awful lot of ignorance. So how for the next few years did you cope? What have you relied upon? You haven't paid me enough to say or to go all the way down to this rabbit hole. But you are clearly an incredibly resilient woman Nadia. I hear that all the time but yes I am actually. But you don't believe that? No I don't think I am. Nadia you really surprise me. Do I? You surprise me with that. Because clearly, anybody who has been on the journey that you've been on, you're resilient.

True, true. Absolutely. And that's just the surface, a facet of where I come from of my history, I guess. Because there was other sort of monsters in my life growing up, domestic violence, alcoholism, all of those things, which no longer serves me, but it's important for me to share.

Yeah, so it's part of your background. Yeah, exactly. I don't carry that anymore, I can't. It's really important. So there was a lot of those things, though.. Yeah, exactly. I don't care that anymore. I can't you know Yes, so there was a lot of those things though. It was a very other. Yeah, so resilience I when I hear that it's like I Am actually quite I would like to be less resilient and be a little bit more vulnerable So we're two decades on yeah Nadia. Yeah, and yet there is so much controversy still

misunderstanding it well exactly, around trans identity and what it actually means to change gender. Now you are an activist, how does that make you feel in 2024 to still have to be fighting this? I was hearing this conversation about, you know, public crestrums and the use of this and the use of that. And I was like, I'm not even going to entertain this. This is so like banal. I called it banal. I don't even know what that means, but it sounds like sounds good. It's just meant to mean that it wasn't worthy of my attention.

So this is where I became a little bit more. Okay. This is not okay. This is not cool. If this is happening 20 years still. Exactly, on. Yeah. That I need to kinda.

Explain myself. Yeah, I need to kinda, yeah, bring back the humanity that once perhaps we've lost it throughout the last 20 years. Cause I think there's a lot of, you know, we don't see people anymore for being just human beings with their conscience. We see people as for being just human beings with their conscience We see people as a worthy or unworthy of your time. Do you know what I mean? I I so you so you've you've been invisible and yeah come back and become which was important for me to do

And then I sort of come back and I said, okay, let me Talk about this a little bit more. Let me try to convey it in a more Less sort of political, but I'm not politically well-versed, but it's always very politically motivated. Yeah. Let's take a break here, but don't go anywhere because in a moment I'm going to ask you to pick a question from my little box of truth. The only rule is that you must answer and you must be honest. And you're an honest woman.

I think so. I am actually too honest. Okay. Okay. Are you up for it? Go on. Let's have it. We get it. Life gets busy. Luckily with Peloton Tread, you can still get the challenging workouts you crave. Only have 10 minutes? Take a quick Palaton workout. Wanna go all out? Chase down your goals with 20 to 45 minute tread workouts. No matter your goals or time, Palaton has everything you need to become everything you want. Find your push, find your power. Palaton. Visit onepeloton.ca. Calling all music buffs.

Hey, hey, turn the volume up, yeah? Make Me A Mix Tape is back. I'm Jordan Stevens. I'm Clara Amfo, and this is our weekly music show. A celebrity guest picks the theme. We select the tunes. And we battle it out to create the ultimate mix tape. May the best music lover win.

Oh, it's about to go down. Let's go! Ha ha ha ha ha. Make me a mixtape. Listen only on BBC Sounds. Welcome back to It Can't Just Be Me and I'm here with one of Big Brother's most notorious winners Nadia Almada and it's time for my favourite bit of the show which is the It Can't Just Be Me box of truth. So Nadia in front of you you'll see a little box of cards and I believe that we're losing the art

of authentic conversation. So these are just little conversation starter cards. Pick one at random, read it out. And the only rule is go for the middle, go for whatever you want. You've got to answer honestly. Oh my God, what are your best qualities? You see this is the thing we were talking about this earlier on you're so resilient but you tell me what

are your best qualities? This is almost like when you try to define yourself in a bio or something like that oh gosh my best qualities I think I'm kind, I'm very compassionate and I'm very accepting. So kind, compassionate, accepting. Yeah. Those are your best qualities. And humorous. I think I'm quite humorous as well. Definitely. You're not going to laugh like that? Yes, I think so. I think, you know, it serves me and it will continue to serve me as such. Humor is a good use. I think also it's like the funding of youth, I think. That's true. You know what I mean? I think laughter. It's like yoga laughter.

Have you seen those? Oh, I've definitely I've been a part of yoga laughter. It gets me going every time. Laughing on my own at anything random. And one thing about Big Brother that's positive about it, when I look at some of Big Brother, sort of, you know, like, especially with the TikToks and social media and YouTube, and when I see this woman, you know, Nadia,

in the Big Brother house, she makes me laugh. She's hilarious. I want to be her friend. Well, she is you, Nadia. Yeah, but that's the thing, isn't that why sort of... 20 years ago to now, how have you changed? I'm none the wiser. On that note, Nadia, thank you so much for being with us today. But before you go, I always ask my guests what one piece of advice would they give to listeners?

It could be something that a sort of mantra that you lived by that's helped you get through life what one piece of advice do you have for us for me it was rejoicing in pure laughter I think that's the only thing I can say because that was my only form of survival yeah and you know what No one can take that away from you. That's it for today, but I'll be back next week with a brand new episode of It Can't Just Be Me. But in the meantime, I also want to hear from you,

because this Friday, you can hear the next episode of It's Not Just You. In these special Friday episodes, I'll be joined by different experts every week and we'll be answering your dilemmas. So please, if there's something you want to talk about, doesn't matter whether it's big or small, funny or serious, get in touch with us, we're here for you. You can DM me or email hello at itcan'tjustbeme.co.uk. And if you want to see more of the show, remember you can find us on Instagram, TikTok and Facebook. Just search for it can't just be me because

whatever you're dealing with, it really isn't just you. We get it. Life gets busy. Luckily with Peloton Tread, you can still get the challenging workouts you crave. Only have 10 minutes? Take a quick Peloton workout. Want to go all out? Chase down your goals with 20 to 45 minute tread workouts. No matter your goals or time, Peloton has everything you need to become everything you want. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit onepeloton.ca. Calling all music buffs.

Hey, hey, turn the volume up, yeah? Make Me A Mix Tape is back. I'm Jordan Stevens. I'm Clara Amfo, and this is our weekly music show. A celebrity guest picks the theme. We select the tunes. And we battle it out to create the ultimate mixtape. May the best music lover win.

Oh, it's about to go down. Let's go! Make me a mixtape. Listen only on BBC Sounds.